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| 15:59.37 | josephscott | carmony: ^^ |
| 16:03.43 | skinner1 | Would be nice if we had details on next months meeting posted the same week as this weeks meeting. hint hint. wink wink |
| 16:06.27 | macnewbold | fwiw, i think the main reason that we don't have details posted about a meeting a month away is that it usually takes a lot of prodding to get the next "volunteer" lined up |
| 16:08.14 | macnewbold | however, in this case, I have some inside information, unless carmony's plans have changed |
| 16:08.57 | macnewbold | the presenter for thursday's meeting is me, planning to present on Single Page Applications and Javascript MVVM frameworks |
| 16:11.29 | eggyknap | :) |
| 16:14.28 | macnewbold | eggyknap: it isn't so bad unless you're working with stupid wannabe browsers like IE |
| 16:14.42 | eggyknap | Is it possible to avoid such things? |
| 16:15.22 | macnewbold | for the most part - where I work, we don't have to worry about anything stupider than IE9, and most things we work with play pretty nicely across browsers |
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| 16:15.55 | eggyknap | Meh... if a user can see it, I don't want to work on it :) |
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| 16:52.31 | stderr- | macnewbold: what frameworks are you going to cover? |
| 16:53.54 | macnewbold | stderr-: Overview of MVVM concepts and the Big 3 tools (Backbone, Angular, Ember), but getting deep on any one of them would be a whole talk by itself |
| 16:54.04 | macnewbold | do you have a preference? |
| 16:54.47 | TuxToaster_ | macnewbold: not .NET web forms? :P |
| 16:54.56 | TuxToaster_ | ooh, ooh, Flash. |
| 16:55.02 | TuxToaster_ | that's cross browser. |
| 16:55.57 | stderr- | macnewbold: nah, just curious. I've been getting more into Ember now that I work with Ryan Florence, and I'm already familiar with Backbone and Angular. |
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| 17:02.13 | TuxToaster_ | ~rlart |
| 17:02.13 | infobot | does a little 'dpkg -P DexterTheDragon' action |
| 17:07.38 | SunSparc | Ok, I am done with Qwest, ready to switch back to ComCast. Anyone have a good suggestion for a good modem that works for ComCast? |
| 17:08.55 | SunSparc | ~Flash TuxToaster_ |
| 17:08.55 | infobot | ACTION starts a firmware update on TuxToaster_, then pulls the plug halfway through |
| 17:09.41 | TuxToaster_ | SunSparc: The one they upgraded me to works decently, though I don't know what brand it is off hand |
| 17:10.04 | TuxToaster_ | if you were in range of Vivint wireless I'd say go with that instead of Comcast... :P |
| 17:10.10 | TuxToaster_ | but they're still building out |
| 17:11.13 | SunSparc | Vivint is getting into providing Internet? |
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| 17:12.02 | TuxToaster_ | yeah, a bit. They've got a few test areas they're working on with wireless Internet, but it's pretty decent |
| 17:12.09 | TuxToaster_ | better than comcast at my house. |
| 17:13.11 | SunSparc | I have considered wireless before (read Digis) but have heard about problems with intermittent connection hiccups. |
| 17:14.59 | TuxToaster_ | yeah so far the connection at my house has been really stable. A couple of sluggish mornings but that's about it. |
| 17:15.49 | TuxToaster_ | plus it runs like 50 megs for $50 or so. |
| 17:19.32 | SunSparc | TuxToaster_: you are running Vivint Internet at your house? |
| 17:19.44 | stirlingw | any idea on areas? I need to get rid of comcast like the plague |
| 17:20.55 | TuxToaster_ | SunSparc: yup, they have a couple areas up in West Jordan where they launched in, I think Lehi is in the works, not sure where else they are looking. |
| 17:21.38 | stirlingw | Hopefully midvale |
| 17:21.53 | stirlingw | I was hoping for utopia, but that whole project was a fail |
| 17:22.25 | TuxToaster_ | yeah Utopia would've been nice |
| 17:22.30 | SunSparc | I would still love Utopia, but after promising me they would be in my neighborhood for the past 5 years I am pretty much hopeless. |
| 17:22.58 | DexterTheDragon | SunSparc: blame your city, not utopia |
| 17:26.30 | SunSparc | ~blame Utopia |
| 17:26.30 | infobot | ACTION blames Utopia (and Canada) for all the evil in the world |
| 17:29.29 | SunSparc | Dang, Vivint Internet is not in my area yet. |
| 17:30.08 | TuxToaster_ | where do you live again? |
| 17:30.16 | SunSparc | Orem |
| 17:31.34 | TuxToaster_ | kk, I'll keep an ear out, I know they are working on expanding it |
| 17:33.48 | SunSparc | Cool :) |
| 17:33.57 | SunSparc | More competition is good. |
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| 18:30.35 | SunSparc | ~rlart |
| 18:30.35 | infobot | eats herlo's liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti |
| 18:30.44 | stirlingw | ng-conf sold out in 2 minutes :( |
| 18:31.06 | SunSparc | Must be popular. |
| 18:31.27 | herlo | ~lart SunSparc |
| 18:31.27 | infobot | pours hot grits down the front of SunSparc's pants |
| 18:31.33 | stirlingw | 1st time they are having it I believe. |
| 18:32.14 | SunSparc | What is ng-conf? |
| 18:32.45 | stirlingw | AngularJS conference held in slc |
| 18:32.57 | stirlingw | http://ng-conf.org/ |
| 18:33.11 | SunSparc | Ah, a JS framework. |
| 18:33.29 | SunSparc | How does it compare with jQuery? |
| 18:34.13 | stirlingw | I like it a lot better. JQuery has a lot more features due to it being around awhile. |
| 18:37.13 | stirlingw | sunsparc: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/14994391/how-do-i-think-in-angularjs-if-i-have-a-jquery-background |
| 18:37.27 | stirlingw | Probably one of the better answers I've read to that question |
| 18:38.39 | josephscott | SunSparc: jQuery is more like a lib, AngularJS is a full on framework |
| 18:39.19 | SunSparc | Wow, that is a great SO answer. |
| 18:39.46 | SunSparc | josephscott: There is a fine line between those two concepts. :) |
| 18:40.16 | josephscott | perhaps in some cases, I don't think that is the case here |
| 18:40.28 | josephscott | kinda like comparing phpass and CakePHP |
| 18:40.48 | SunSparc | josephscott: Yeah, makes sense. |
| 18:41.09 | josephscott | granted, jquery is a rather large lib, but a lib none the less |
| 18:41.09 | SunSparc | And I can see value in using a full framework over just a lib in some cases. |
| 18:42.27 | josephscott | wow, utopia going 1GB for $65, nice |
| 18:42.42 | josephscott | wouldn't mind if comcast offered me a similar deal ;-) |
| 18:43.26 | SunSparc | Wow! If only Utopia would get into my neighborhood! Grrr... they have been at the end of my block for years now. Just won't dig my street. |
| 18:44.50 | josephscott | I'm in Sandy, don't think I'll ever being seeing a fiber connection to my house |
| 18:45.19 | SunSparc | ~fiber josephscott |
| 18:45.19 | infobot | ACTION stuffs josephscott with fiber. |
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| 18:55.57 | mgeary | josephscott: now see what Utopia will give your small business for a price |
| 18:56.56 | josephscott | mgeary: don't know, looks like they don't list those prices - http://www.utopianet.org/business-utopia/ |
| 18:57.15 | josephscott | which means they probably want you to pay $4,500/mo for the same 1 GB :-( |
| 18:57.26 | mgeary | "hmm? oh, yes, we can help you. I'm afraid we no longer offer our $99/month Silver 10mb/sec option because everyone was selecting that instead of our $600/month Gold 6mb/sec 'dedicated' option. We solved the problem by eliminating the Silver option" |
| 18:58.09 | mgeary | that is nearly verbatim what we were told |
| 19:03.16 | mindjuju | mgeary, utopia charges $600/month ? |
| 19:04.12 | mgeary | mindjuju: that's what we're paying for a 6mb 'dedicated' line, where "i swear to you, you will love this option. It's dedicated, so you'll never see less than 6mb/sec. Did i mention it's dedicated?" |
| 19:04.28 | mindjuju | weird |
| 19:04.50 | mgeary | we frequently get less than 6mb/sec. I realize that may be because the other server is bogged down, but i'm not impressed |
| 19:05.02 | mgeary | and i don't think we've ever seen more than 4mb/sec upload |
| 19:05.17 | mindjuju | really? |
| 19:05.25 | mindjuju | this isn't more of the landlord playing games? |
| 19:05.35 | mgeary | very possibly |
| 19:05.59 | mgeary | but those quotes i relayed were from my discussions directly with Utopia |
| 19:06.09 | mindjuju | oh |
| 19:06.51 | carmony | dude... I have 50mb/s down and 15 mb/s up at home for less |
| 19:06.53 | carmony | on comcast |
| 19:07.33 | mgeary | yeah. we have nearly zero other options |
| 19:07.36 | mgeary | because of our location |
| 19:08.40 | carmony | that sucks |
| 19:08.58 | mgeary | we tried a 3G solution for a while, but gave up on it |
| 19:09.11 | carmony | where are you located at? |
| 19:09.23 | mgeary | 800 North in Orem, west of the freeway |
| 19:10.11 | carmony | and no Google Fiber yet? |
| 19:10.13 | carmony | :P |
| 19:10.19 | mgeary | ^ "Orem" |
| 19:10.27 | carmony | ah |
| 19:16.59 | SunSparc | mgeary: 5mb or 5MB? |
| 19:17.08 | mgeary | bits |
| 19:17.13 | SunSparc | lame |
| 19:18.22 | mindjuju | i wonder what the throughput limit is on utopia |
| 19:18.55 | herlo | 398 |
| 19:19.16 | mindjuju | sorry, i meant a month |
| 19:19.36 | mindjuju | so not really looking for a speed, looking for a total number of bytes that can be transfered |
| 19:19.44 | herlo | I just wrote down a number |
| 19:19.55 | mindjuju | 398GB? |
| 19:19.58 | herlo | afaik, there's not a throughput limit, that is determined by the service provider |
| 19:20.44 | herlo | I mean, sure there is since you have a limited amount of bandwidth in a month, but that's probably unrealistic for most. |
| 19:20.57 | herlo | mindjuju: it didn't mean anythign, it was a joke. :) |
| 19:21.18 | mindjuju | oh |
| 19:22.06 | mgeary | i don't believe i've ever seen any limits discussed. We definitely haven't hit any |
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| 19:34.44 | DexterTheDragon | mgeary: who's your service provider? |
| 19:35.00 | mgeary | DexterTheDragon: Utopia through Integra |
| 19:38.10 | DexterTheDragon | UTOPIA is just the network. You should be able to use any of the service providers available on the network |
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| 19:42.54 | josephscott | mgeary: I wondering if an LTE connection would work better, though data caps will come into play |
| 19:43.22 | mgeary | meh. our lease is up in April, and I don't think we'll be staying here |
| 19:43.31 | mgeary | i'd love to move to Provo and get some Google fiber |
| 19:43.45 | herlo | mgeary: don't you live in Provo? |
| 19:43.49 | mgeary | yeap |
| 19:43.59 | DexterTheDragon | really you just need to talk to some of the other service providers and see who has better rates |
| 19:43.59 | mgeary | but i'm the only Treeline employee who does |
| 19:44.11 | mgeary | DexterTheDragon: can't. Our landlord won't let us |
| 19:44.12 | mindjuju | ah google fiber, expressway to nsa |
| 19:44.24 | mindjuju | ;) |
| 19:44.24 | mgeary | mindjuju: yes, because no one ELSE is handing data over |
| 19:44.45 | DexterTheDragon | so blame your landlord and not utopia |
| 19:45.03 | mgeary | oh, i blame both |
| 19:45.04 | mindjuju | mgeary, i'm just teasing ya, and of course, your point is valid |
| 19:45.18 | mgeary | like i say, DexterTheDragon, my conversation about silver/gold was directly with Utopia |
| 19:45.42 | mgeary | they apparently regulate/restrict what/how can be sold by their providers |
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| 20:40.52 | mindjuju | doesn't ham already do similar by bouncing off the upper atmosphere? |
| 20:41.31 | fungus | yes, but ham isn't that fast. all the good/fast wireless data links are line of sight |
| 20:42.34 | fungus | I have a better suggestion for HumanCell, move! |
| 20:47.40 | HumanCell | Move? Yes ... I'm looking to do that ... even further out! :-) |
| 20:48.20 | HumanCell | I was camping on a mountain top above Flaming Gorge and could see Manila, UT in the distance ... had 4G while there. :-) |
| 20:49.28 | HumanCell | Anyone else watching them raise the Concordia live? http://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2013/sep/16/costa-concordia-live-video-stream-hls |
| 20:50.11 | HumanCell | I've been watching since this morning ... it was barely out of the water ... it's WAY up now. Amazing process ... |
| 20:54.51 | fungus | HumanCell, you are crazy. Why suffer w/ poor bandwidth when you don't have to? |
| 20:55.33 | HumanCell | Suffer? Why suffer with dense over-population when you don't have to? :-) |
| 20:55.54 | HumanCell | I've got enough in Heber ... and 4G/LTE works fine for me ... :-) |
| 20:56.33 | HumanCell | My DSL in Heber actually isn't bad. I've got 12Mbps down ... 1.5Mps up ... good enough for me. |
| 20:56.50 | HumanCell | I host my servers in a datacenter in Chicago, and in AWS. |
| 20:57.47 | HumanCell | I'm looking for more places I can work from the edge of civilization ... getting my trailer ready for next summer. The Flaming Gorge spot will work for a week or two ... then on to the next. :-) |
| 20:57.55 | fungus | I personally love densely populated areas. And the bandwidth caps for LTE are totally unacceptable. I typically average 300GB/mo |
| 20:59.07 | HumanCell | I'm planning a working trip for next year ... on a boat for four weeks in the fjords at the souther tip of South America ... working out how to stay in budget on satellite links. ;-) |
| 21:01.17 | fungus | I love that kind of stuff for vacations, but to "live" there. Hell no. |
| 21:02.21 | fungus | Give me 50Mbps, Netflix, traffic, movie theaters, smog, etc. |
| 21:02.37 | HumanCell | ha ha ... netflix AND movie theaters ... |
| 21:03.00 | HumanCell | Traffic? Smog? What are they good for? |
| 21:12.27 | fungus | fast city life, bars, clubs, restaurants, shopping, etc. |
| 21:12.56 | HumanCell | Ah ... I take vacations to do that! ;-) |
| 21:13.02 | fungus | lol |
| 21:13.10 | fungus | I prefer the other way around |
| 21:13.18 | HumanCell | lol |
| 21:14.32 | fungus | lol |
| 21:31.56 | SunSparc | When I need someone to send me files (large or small) I often setup a share in DropBox for that specific user/company. I know there are a lot of services out there for file collaboration. What solution do you use? |
| 21:36.44 | HumanCell | Bit Torrent Sync |
| 21:36.54 | HumanCell | Peer to peer. |
| 21:37.06 | HumanCell | rw/ro support also. |
| 21:45.44 | mgeary | does anyone else have clients who log bugs based on the site behavior when they zoom in or out with the browser??! |
| 21:46.03 | mgeary | i'm just really not sure that's a behavior we should test to the Nth degree |
| 21:50.13 | fungus | no, but I have users that put their phone lines in "night mode" then call the CEO complaining that their phones are broken. |
| 21:51.48 | fungus | And I also have users whose smartphones "break" every year when new iPhones are released. |
| 21:52.40 | fungus | jokes on them though, they get an old Motorola Droid X. LOL |
| 21:53.07 | fungus | clients/users suck. |
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| 22:09.17 | KingMichael | howdy |
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| 22:32.52 | SunSparc | HumanCell: BT Sync is awesome. But for end user collaboration it is not a good fit. :) |
| 22:34.42 | herlo | SunSparc: why not? |
| 22:35.48 | SunSparc | herlo: Not overly intuitive for less technical users. |
| 22:36.03 | SunSparc | DropBox is challenging enough for some users. |
| 22:38.28 | herlo | SunSparc: well, okay. So it *could* be viable with a beter UI? |
| 22:38.58 | SunSparc | herlo: Sure, it is basically a private install of DropBox. :) |
| 22:40.14 | herlo | okay, cool. |
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| 22:47.18 | TuxToaster_ | ~rlart |
| 22:47.19 | infobot | slaps utahcon around with a large trout |
| 22:48.10 | HumanCell | SunSparc: I do get that it's a little tougher ... |
| 22:48.19 | TuxToaster_ | mgeary: I've seen that a lot in the past |
| 22:48.45 | HumanCell | Outside of that we tend to use the various project management tools we use with them ... Basecamp, etc. |
| 22:48.49 | TuxToaster_ | I've usually taught them the control+0/cmd+0 trick and sent them on their way |
| 22:49.06 | mgeary | well, that's the thing. They're doing this intentionally |
| 22:49.31 | mgeary | "doctor, it really hurts when i scratch my back by reaching up between my legs" |
| 22:49.37 | TuxToaster_ | lol |
| 22:49.47 | SunSparc | lol |
| 22:49.57 | T4rku5 | Yeah, that would hurt |
| 22:50.18 | T4rku5 | So how do you make zooming issues out of scope? |
| 22:51.11 | SunSparc | HumanCell: Yeah, project collaboration services are handy. But what clients who are not part of a project collab system and they need to send you a 200mb PDF? |
| 22:54.29 | TuxToaster_ | SunSparc: they have to zip the PDF, then wrap that in a tar.gz.bz2 archive |
| 22:54.43 | TuxToaster_ | repeat until it's small enough to get through most email size restrictions |
| 22:54.44 | SunSparc | TuxToaster_: LOL!! |
| 22:54.44 | TuxToaster_ | :D |
| 22:54.57 | SunSparc | Perfect. |
| 22:55.11 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v TuxToaster] by ChanServ |
| 22:56.10 | HumanCell | SunSparc: you need to write a webpage on your server with a file uploader ... :-) |
| 22:56.18 | TuxToaster | SunSparc: eventually the attachment will look like this: http://xkcd.com/1247/ |
| 22:56.34 | TuxToaster | and the recipient will get a similar warning when they try to download it |
| 22:56.59 | HumanCell | http://phpfileuploader.com/ |
| 22:58.36 | *** join/#uphpu clintberry (~clintberr@75-148-102-17-Utah.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
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| 23:00.15 | SunSparc | HumanCell: Yeah, that is always an option. :) |
| 23:00.26 | SunSparc | TuxToaster: Yeah, that one is classic. |
| 23:00.35 | HumanCell | You could add a little code and have some security, etc. |
| 23:00.46 | HumanCell | notifications ... |
| 23:01.10 | HumanCell | SunSparc: You could create an entire platform ... oh wait ... :-) |
| 23:01.22 | TuxToaster | lol |
| 23:04.30 | SunSparc | HumanCell: lol, tempting... |
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