IRC log for #uphpu on 20121113

00:00.38SunSparcJust added an INSERT query to a script, checked the DB and had two entries.  Each load is creating two entries.  So it seems that somehow the script is being run twice!  A reload or redirect somewhere?
00:00.45SunSparcAny idea how to track it down?
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00:13.21TuxToastersimplest check would be print the sql to the page when it runs, or at least some kind of "inserting xxx" so you know it's doing it
00:13.28TuxToasterand see if that shows twice
00:13.42TuxToasteruse Firebug or your inspector to watch for redirects
00:15.30SunSparcTuxToaster: Yes, I was printing it out and all looked good.  Where in Firebug does it show redirects?
00:15.33DexterTheDragonSunSparc: use a debugger
00:17.02SunSparcDexterTheDragon: Like xdebug?  Yeah, want to, but currently the setup I am working on is the live server.  :(  I know, bad news all around.
00:17.12stderr-yea, use a debugger. Put a break on the line that runs the query
00:17.51TuxToasterFiredebug or inspector should make it easier to see if the page loads and then starts over in a redirect situation
00:18.47TuxToasterif you're only seeing the one print I'd be curious to see if exiting right after the insert would cause it to insert only the one record or both
00:19.23SunSparcI actually used the session to put a value in a variable and if that variable has that value in it then the script stops.  It is stopping, which leads me to believe it is reloading somewhere.  I am checking my auth scripts right now.
00:20.01SunSparcstderr-: wish I could
00:20.07SunSparcTuxToaster: Yeah, that could work also.
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00:33.54supernovia$8ball should I stay home
00:33.54raifbotsupernovia - Concentrate and ask again.
00:34.07supernovia$8ball should I stay home?
00:34.08raifbotsupernovia - Concentrate and ask again.
00:34.10supernoviad'oh.
00:34.37supernovia$8ball should I just move to my own private Idaho instead?
00:34.37raifbotsupernovia - Yes - definitely.
00:37.45SunSparcsupernovia: Sounds like you have a plan.  ;)
00:37.52supernovia:D
01:22.11DexterTheDragonhow does one get their own private Idaho?
01:25.18SunSparc~google how does one get their own private Idaho?
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04:06.14carmonyTuxToaster: is it still happening? :P
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15:28.23macnewboldfridgesm: ping
15:28.34macnewbold~seen carmony
15:28.36ibotcarmony <~carmony@c-76-23-26-107.hsd1.ut.comcast.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #uphpu, 11h 22m 22s ago, saying: 'TuxToaster: is it still happening? :P'.
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15:40.51fridgesmyo macnewbold
15:40.57macnewboldhey!
15:40.58fridgesmYes, I remember I'm presenting
15:41.01macnewboldawesome :-D
15:41.07macnewboldjust double checking - man time goes by so fast
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16:02.35mgearymorning, folks
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16:07.28TuxToaster$rlart
16:07.29raifbotblames UtahDave for all the evil in the world.
16:07.41UtahDave:(
16:07.51captbrogerslol
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16:10.46TuxToasterlatest SEO trend: mention Apple in your article, even if it has nothing to do with them.
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16:11.37mgearyTuxToaster: reference?
16:12.16TuxToasterhttp://www.businessinsider.com/starbucks-google-european-tax-targets-2012-11
16:12.43TuxToasterthat one could be an innocent typo, since they probably meant Amazon
16:13.01mgearyheh
16:13.03TuxToasterbut I've seen news feeds that are supposed to be Apple news that have little or nothing to do with it
16:13.27TuxToasterjust seems like tons of articles now mention it for no reason other than to draw in the hits
16:14.43captbrogersI'm trying to come up with a zinger involving apple and the phrase, "no substance", but nothing is coming to mind. So you'll all just have to settle with my general dislike of apple
16:15.27TuxToasterlol
16:15.29mgeary~curmudgeon captbrogers
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16:55.55*** topic/#UPHPU is Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org | November 15: Steve Meyer fridgesm on Responsive Design
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17:15.45josephscottcaptbrogers: I'm curious what your take is on the current nexus 4, I was really surprised to see the "flagship" Android device missing so many of the traditionally touted Android device features
17:16.58captbrogersDislike that it has a swipe keyboard, but that's a personal thing, the Camera should have been on the Galaxy Nexus, so I feel that is late to the game
17:17.25TuxToastercaptbrogers: you can change the keyboard, though, right?
17:17.29captbrogersPhotosphere seems pretty cool, but I don't see it as too high functioning
17:17.46captbrogersTuxToaster: It isn't an iPhone, of course you can change it!
17:17.50captbrogers...zing!
17:18.30captbrogersjosephscott: The screen itself if a marginal improvement at best over the Galaxy Nexus, but some improvement is better than none
17:18.45TuxToasterlol
17:19.03TuxToastercaptbrogers: even with it not being an iPhone, that doesn't mean that they can't lock it down
17:19.16josephscottI was surprised at no LTE, no removable batter, no sd slot, maxed out at 16GB of storage
17:19.30TuxToasterbut I figure if they are including Swype I'd hope they would include the default keyboard as well
17:19.31captbrogersI think moving to LG as a manufacturer will be interesting to see how it plays out. It almost seems like a gamble, but we'll see
17:19.34josephscottoh, and made by LG, which seems strange for the parent company of Motorola to do :-)
17:20.03captbrogersagreed, I thought they bought out Motorola Mobility so they could start making their own stuff, but maybe the did and the screen is from LG?
17:20.24captbrogersTuxToaster: Direct from Google will not lock down things like that, you'll always have a choice to change it
17:21.00TuxToasteryou can hope.
17:21.08captbrogersjosephscott: The lack of expandable memory isn't new, that is on my Galaxy Nexus, and I have to say 16GB is enough. Most of my music is on their cloud player so I don't need a ton of space
17:21.18TuxToastereven Google has a history of killing good features or not including common sense things, though :P
17:21.36josephscottbut those are all things that Google used to make fun of the iPhone for
17:21.57captbrogersjosephscott: no LTE is a bummer, but seeing as it isn't widespread, I can see a reasoning for it
17:22.10josephscottgotta disagree on the 16GB is enough, I don't think I'd do anything less than 32GB any more
17:22.23captbrogerswhat on earth do you put on your phone that needs that much space?
17:22.35captbrogersTuxToaster: such as what features?
17:22.38josephscottahhh, history repeats itself :-)
17:23.09herlolol
17:23.26TuxToasterwhat, has this discussion happened before? :P
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17:23.44captbrogersTuxToaster: I'm wondering the same, I don't recall ever having this conversation
17:24.01josephscottno one will ever need more than 640KB
17:24.11TuxToasteroh that
17:24.13TuxToasterlol
17:24.19josephscottI have 11GB free on my 32GB iPhone
17:24.37captbrogersjosephscott: Needing more space, yes, but as things become more and more connected, keeping 10GB of music in Google Music means I keep 10GB off my phone
17:24.51captbrogersI don't argue that more space isn't necessary, I'm just saying more space on the phone itself isn't
17:25.07josephscottI'm picturing every conversation about the iPhone not having LTE, removable battery, SD slot, etc. suddenly being purged from history :-)
17:25.13TuxToastercaptbrogers: as far as Google goes, they have killed a few things, like iGoogle getting axed, Wave, and on the developer side they often kill API functions that people find useful
17:25.24captbrogersThough seeing a phone now with a quad-core processor and 2GB of RAM means that it will be buttery smooth
17:25.27TuxToasteror devs spend literally years waiting for some features that never materialize
17:25.31josephscottcaptbrogers: I only have a small amount of storage in use for music
17:26.00josephscottmost apps, couple of movies
17:26.02captbrogersTuxToaster: I know iGoogle and Wave got killed, but I thought it was because usage of those was not enough to justify continued support for them. The only API function I'm aware of that they killed was their weather
17:26.05josephscotts/most/mostly/
17:26.26captbrogersjosephscott: Of all those apps, how many have not been used in the last two weeks?
17:26.33TuxToastera good example of that last one is people have been waiting for a direct YouTube upload API for literally years, while other sites have taken business easily
17:26.35josephscottlots
17:26.53josephscottbut lack of recent use doesn't mean I don't want them
17:27.17TuxToastercaptbrogers: they've also removed various features from the Maps API a couple of times
17:27.31josephscottI don't delete VLC from my laptop just because I haven't used it in the last  two weeks
17:27.47captbrogersjosephscott: I can understand that, but my personal rule is that if I haven't used it in over a month and it doesn't like I'll use it for another month, I don't really need it then
17:27.50TuxToastermostly the point is they do sometimes limit choice, so here's hoping they don't do something like that with Android
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17:28.27josephscottTuxToaster: did they ever open up development of Android?
17:28.41captbrogersTuxToaster: I wasn't aware of any changes to the maps API, but I don't use it so I'm not surprised I didn't hear of it
17:28.47josephscottlast I heard you still had to be on the approved list to even get read only access to Android dev code
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17:29.30TuxToasterjosephscott: I haven't looked recently, but I'd assume it's still along those lines to limit people finding and abusing potential security flaws
17:30.09utahconjosephscott: the WP dbDelta is crazy... just saying.
17:30.16josephscotthaha
17:30.21TuxToasterit kind of sucks in terms of being "truly open" but I think there'd be a deluge of problems if someone identified a security flaw and started exploiting it before manufacturers had a chance to patch their phones
17:30.22josephscottI won't disagree :-)
17:31.02josephscottdoesn't that happen already though?
17:31.20josephscottwhat percentage of phones can be updated to the latest Android without rooting them first?
17:31.29utahconjosephscott: very few
17:31.33captbrogersVery few
17:31.48TuxToasterheh ,yup
17:31.52captbrogersBut that is the manufacturer's problem, which completely sucks
17:32.00TuxToasterfar as I know even the Kindle Fire still uses Gingerbread
17:32.10josephscottI've found that to be a real turn off when I was looking to buy an Android phone last year
17:32.13utahconNexus for life...
17:32.16TuxToaster(could be wrong there, I know for sure the Nook tablets do though, and the firmware is similar)
17:32.20utahconI am totally jumping in this one in the middle ;)
17:32.34utahconTuxToaster: Latest kindles are NOT 4.x
17:32.39utahconso yes they are still Gingerbread.
17:32.41captbrogersI have rooted my Galaxy Nexus and put Cyanogenmod on it
17:32.55utahconcaptbrogers: why CM instead of stock Android?
17:33.07utahconunless yours was Verizon, then I understnad ;)
17:33.09TuxToastermy Nook tablet is rooted, but still with Gingerbread
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17:33.17TuxToasterI never got around to installing newer stuff on it
17:33.22captbrogersutahcon: Because I am on Verizon, so I got a battered version of stock
17:33.27captbrogersI hate Verizon crap-ware
17:33.31utahconyeah... I understand then.
17:33.36TuxToasterand I honestly didn't mind some of the stock apps that B&N had on it, I just wanted to be able to install my own apps on top of it
17:33.45utahconThat is a huge reason as to why Google and LG didn't add LTE to the Nexus 4.
17:33.53captbrogersNow that Cyanogenmod put in their own updater service, it's easy to keep up to date on it
17:33.56utahconTo avoid having to deal with Verizon and all the LTE bullblop
17:35.26josephscottutahcon: not sure I follow, iPhone doesn't have Verizon yuckware, but does have LTE
17:35.36utahconLTE is different on all networks...
17:35.42josephscottyep
17:35.48utahconso adding LTE is vendor specific.
17:35.52josephscottyep
17:36.01utahconwhere as HSPA+ is the same on all HSPA+ networks.
17:36.09josephscottso it boils down to, why was Apple able to do it and Google wasn't?
17:36.27utahconApple sells different hardware in each phone
17:36.34utahconand they are tailored to their carrier
17:36.43utahconyou can't buy an unlocked iPhone5 because of it.
17:36.45captbrogersjosephscott: Apple may have said, "make it happen or no iPhone for you" and they made it happen
17:37.35utahconThen you figure in where people really use LTE/3G (most people don't know it but they hardly use the LTE speed anyways)
17:37.45utahconor so AT&T says.
17:37.48josephscottutahcon: so Google wasn't capable of making a few different versions of the N4?
17:37.57captbrogersBut speaking of Cyanogenmod, a new stable release of CM 10 is available for my phone. Huzzah!
17:38.26utahconjosephscott: I may be playing fanboy but from what I have read it kind of made sense in keeping the phone as open as possible.
17:38.34josephscottcaptbrogers: could be, would certainly imply that Google doesn't have much pull/influence with the mobile providers
17:38.38TuxToasterthere's one for my tablet, apparently, but I'll wait it out a few weeks until I get time to really research it
17:39.06utahconTuxToaster: which tablet?
17:39.11captbrogersjosephscott: I hope I haven't been as naive as to think that Google has the same pull Apple does
17:39.18josephscottutahcon: perhaps the perception of the Nexus line is wrong then, and shouldn't be considered a flagship product
17:39.39utahconI guess that depends on how you view flagship.
17:39.46utahconThe N4 is NOT the most technically advanced phone.
17:39.59utahconIt is however the most affordable unlocked and open solution.
17:40.24utahconFind me another phone with the latest Android, NFC, HSPA+, 4.7" screen, for under $400.
17:40.34captbrogersHave to say, I'd like the processor and RAM, but I like having 4G/LTE
17:40.46utahconPersonally it is perfect for me.
17:40.53TuxToaster$8ball is Nexus the most affordable unlocked and open solution?
17:40.53raifbotTuxToaster - Cannot predict now.
17:40.58utahconI rock SimpleMobile, and so my 4G is HSPA+
17:41.07TuxToaster$8ball are you waiting for your Nexus 4 before answering?
17:41.07raifbotTuxToaster - Yes - definitely.
17:41.08utahconbut most of the time I am where there is WiFi anyways.
17:41.16captbrogers$8ball: is the iPhone completely overrated
17:41.16raifbotcaptbrogers - You may rely on it.
17:41.22TuxToasterlol
17:41.25utahconlol
17:41.31captbrogersAnd so it was said
17:41.34TuxToaster$8ball is captbrogers an Apple hater?
17:41.35raifbotTuxToaster - My reply is no.
17:41.46TuxToasterraifbot fails the polygraph
17:41.55captbrogersYes, TuxToaster is right
17:42.17captbrogers$8ball is the term 'hater' too mellow to describe my distaste for Apple products?
17:42.17raifbotcaptbrogers - Outlook good.
17:42.22captbrogersWell, there we go then
17:42.53utahconI was most upset with the iPhone5 not having NFC... was really hoping they'd push teh technology... I suspect the iPhone5S or iPhone6 to have an Apple version of NFC...
17:42.59*** join/#uphpu Skinner (~DSkinner@173.14.230.129)
17:43.00*** mode/#UPHPU [+v Skinner] by ChanServ
17:43.12josephscottnot sure how I feel about NFC yet
17:43.25utahconI think the potential for really cool interaction is in NFC...
17:43.37TuxToasterI was surprised they did Passbook but no NFC
17:43.38utahconswapping deets... stealing credit card info etc... sweetnees
17:43.40utahcon;)
17:43.41TuxToasterseems like those two go together
17:44.23utahconI have seen some great concepts for NFC... Samsungs implementations so far are nice. The Nexus 7 did it a little better (with large file transfer etc).
17:44.52utahconI think with the proper attention to detail NFC for payment is as safe as using a normal credit card, if not safer.
17:45.18captbrogersI was excited for the Nexus Q, but then I was talking with my brother about it. It's starting to look like an over-priced and under-powered media PC
17:45.19utahconYou could in theory setup "safe" stores... and anything not safe would need a PIN to work with the NFC app
17:45.27captbrogersSome nice features, but not enough to make it worth it
17:45.35utahconcaptbrogers: Isn't NexusQ dead?
17:45.48captbrogersutahcon: I was not aware that they stopped production on them
17:46.05utahconbut radio silence have never been a good sign at Goog
17:46.22utahconI know the shipped all the current units and then pulled it from the Play Store.
17:46.33utahconwith the explanation of "we need to do more work on it"
17:46.47utahconI think they realized it was basically an under utilized expensive piece of hardware.
17:47.02captbrogershttps://play.google.com/store/devices/details/Nexus_Q
17:47.07utahconThey need to make it an indepenent media device that can be paired with devices for extra media.
17:47.09captbrogersLooks like it's on hold maybe?
17:47.43captbrogershttps://play.google.com/store/devices/details/Nexus_Q?id=nexus_q
17:47.47captbrogersTry that one
17:48.16UtahDaveThey shipped everyone their NexusQ who had ordered one, and didn't charge them.
17:48.18UtahDaveThen killed it
17:48.23utahconcaptbrogers: I wouldn't be surprised if Q and GoogleTV find a path into the same product in short order.
17:48.54captbrogersutahcon: That would be awesome, and I would beg my wife to get one and put our current TV in the bedroom
17:50.17utahconIt is what I would expect.
17:50.22josephscottis Google TV still around?
17:50.34utahconjosephscott: yes... sorta
17:50.53utahconthe first take flopped...
17:50.54captbrogershttp://www.google.com/tv/get.html
17:51.01captbrogersStill available on some LG tvs
17:51.14utahconSony is taking another whack at it, I heard.
17:51.30captbrogersYeah, they and Vizio offer set-top boxes with it pre-installed
17:51.34utahconI would expect the Q to come back as GoogleTV 3...
17:52.28captbrogersWoo! Only $1330...
17:54.05captbrogersI don't think I can get my wife to spend more than $10,000 on a minivan. How can I get her to spend ~$1,500 on a TV?
17:54.33captbrogersGuess it's a ton of freelance work for me to save up and buy one
17:54.38utahcondude... your wife is weird... minivans under $10k don't have all the features that let you forget you are driving a minivan.
17:55.08utahconnot a good sign for Google or LG that the TV is available on Overstock.com... just saying.
17:55.08captbrogersutahcon: She doesn't like to spend money
17:55.20captbrogersutahcon: I used to work for them, what is wrong with that?
17:55.20utahconcaptbrogers: weird... my wife LOVES to spend money... on things I hate.
17:55.26utahconI used to work there too...
17:55.36captbrogersutahcon: I can barely get her to spend $25 on a pair of shoes
17:55.45captbrogerswhat department did you work in?
17:55.52utahconAffiliate Marketing.
17:55.55utahconran it
17:55.56captbrogersI was a front-end guy for a year
17:56.03captbrogersWait, you work at SolutionStream now?
17:56.09utahconno
17:56.19utahconthough they did reach out to me recently.
17:56.38utahconI work at SOS Staffing... err SOS Employment Group with fungus
17:57.19captbrogersutahcon: I used to work for Overstock as well, by the end of my 11.5 months there only one person was left from the team I started with
17:57.25captbrogerseveryone else left
17:57.45utahconcaptbrogers: yeah they have a horrible turn over.
17:57.52utahconEspecially in their dev positions.
17:57.56utahconThey are brutal on developers.
17:57.58captbrogersutahcon: and they never understood why
17:58.16utahconI was one of the few that lasted more than 2 years. I knocked out around 5 with them.
17:58.50utahconI started on the phones... worked my way up to Affiliate Marketing... then they did some stupid things that pissed me off... so I bailed.
17:59.02utahconnot really sad about it... I was grossly underpaid there.
17:59.37captbrogersI once spent an entire day working on a jQuery plugin to do form validation, it was extendable, flexible, completely standards compliant, and cross-browser compatible. Handed it off to a back-end dev and he whipped up some crap in 15 minutes claiming my code was too bloated. His didn't meet half the requirements needed but everyone blamed me for wasting time
18:00.11utahcona common story.
18:00.28utahconI have friends all over the place that used to work there, that have gone on to better places because of that kind of crap.
18:00.37utahconWas ... uh... Mark Greene still there when you were there?
18:01.03captbrogersMy team lead came to me a few days later asking what I did the previous week. I spelled it out, showed him upload time stamps, and emails of when I handed it off. Two weeks later I get back from a trip and they write me up for not working well with other teams
18:01.08captbrogersNot that I remember
18:01.45utahconhe was the head douche (developer) when I was there... caused all kinds of problems.
18:01.57utahconPatrick was nuts...
18:02.09captbrogersI looked at him, asked him when this was brought to his attention and he said, "Just recently". I decided then to start looking for another job. Only gave them a week notice and the let me take the week off with pay
18:02.20captbrogersI laughed so hard when I went home that day.
18:02.50captbrogersI don't remember meeting with him, but I've butt heads with many developers there because they would complain that what Patrick or other execs wanted was too hard for them to do so they wanted it pushed off on other teams
18:03.23utahconlol
18:03.28utahconwell I hope you found greener pastures.
18:03.57captbrogersI had one dev say, in not so many words, that what the user experienced didn't matter. That we _should_ put the page to redeem your gift card buried two levels deep in menus that are completely un-intuitive
18:04.03captbrogersMuch better pastures
18:04.35captbrogersI told him if we didn't offer a way to send it from the purchase form, no one would use them
18:04.41captbrogersHe looked at me like I was an idiot
18:04.47utahconyeah user experience always was a pain point there.
18:04.49captbrogersI about high-fived him in the face with a chair
18:11.30SunSparccaptbrogers: That sounds like a good lart.
18:13.44captbrogersthen add it
18:14.18*** join/#uphpu TuxToaster (~TuxToaste@69.169.182.227.provo.static.broadweavenetworks.net)
18:14.18*** mode/#UPHPU [+v TuxToaster] by ChanServ
18:14.49*** join/#uphpu Benni_Hanna (~Benni_Han@neutroninteractive-xmission.xmission.com)
18:32.19SunSparc~add captbrogers
18:34.17captbrogersAdd me to what?
18:34.27SunSparcIt
18:34.35SunSparc~add captbrogers to it
18:35.08SunSparc~lolstats captbrogers
18:35.39SunSparcibot: hello
18:35.39ibotHowdy Bub
18:37.30TuxToaster~lolstats SunSparc
18:37.31ibotSunSparc has said lol 555 times (10.7 %), ranked 4/122 (percentile: 3.3 %)
18:38.48SunSparc|a|
18:39.05captbrogerslol
18:39.10captbrogersgot to work it out
18:39.11captbrogerslol
18:39.12captbrogerslol
18:39.25SunSparc~lolstats captbrogers
18:39.25ibotcaptbrogers has said lol 27 times (0.5 %), ranked 20/122 (percentile: 16.4 %)
18:40.15SunSparcYou are behind quite a bit, but I bet you can do it.  Keep up the lol work.  :)
18:40.21captbrogerslol
18:40.21captbrogerslol
18:40.23captbrogerslol
18:40.31captbrogerslol
18:40.35captbrogersBetter stop before I'm kicked for flooding
18:40.40SunSparc~lolstats captbrogers
18:40.40ibotcaptbrogers has said lol 28 times (0.5 %), ranked 20/122 (percentile: 16.4 %)
18:40.45SunSparchah
18:40.46captbrogersWat?!
18:40.49captbrogersOnce?
18:41.02SunSparcThere is a grace period between lolz.
18:41.33captbrogerslol
18:41.37SunSparcYou need a bot or a lot of patience to do much incrementing.  :)
18:41.45captbrogersWhenever someone talks, I'll type it
18:41.46captbrogerslol
18:41.52SunSparcExactly
18:42.41Skinnerlol
18:43.00SunSparc~lolstats Skinner
18:43.10captbrogerslol
18:43.14captbrogers~lolstats captbrogers
18:43.14ibotcaptbrogers has said lol 30 times (0.6 %), ranked 20/122 (percentile: 16.4 %)
18:43.15SunSparcibot: Wake up!
18:43.15ibotACTION throws a barrel-full of ice water on up! and shouts "GOOD MORNING!!!!"
18:43.25SunSparc~lolstats Skinner
18:43.28TuxToaster$lart captbrogers
18:43.29raifbotexplains, ever so gently, that if captbrogers doesn't give the channel more information, they can't help.
18:43.36Skinneri must be broken
18:43.43captbrogerslol, you can't get stats on Skinner
18:43.54TuxToasterit only works if the lol is not consecutive and only once every 30 sec or minute or so
18:43.54SunSparcHe does not exist.
18:43.58Skinner~lolstats skinner
18:43.58ibotskinner has said lol 57 times (1.1 %), ranked 15/122 (percentile: 12.3 %)
18:44.13TuxToasterthat's why the macnewbold-bot had to announce how many times it had said lol
18:44.22SunSparc:)
18:44.37Skinnerlol, 58?
18:44.38SunSparc$8ball does Skinner exist?
18:44.38raifbotSunSparc - Yes.
18:44.43Skinnerlol, 59?
18:44.45captbrogers$8ball are you sure?
18:44.45raifbotcaptbrogers - Don't count on it.
18:44.50TuxToasterSkinner: nope.
18:44.55Skinner~lolstats skinner
18:44.55ibotskinner has said lol 57 times (1.1 %), ranked 15/122 (percentile: 12.3 %)
18:44.55TuxToasteronly lol by itself
18:45.03Skinnerah
18:45.11SkinnerlOl
18:45.14SkinnerLoL
18:45.18SkinnerloL
18:45.29TuxToasterand those don't count either
18:45.32Skinner:p
18:45.33TuxToasterlol != LOL
18:45.34SunSparc~LoLstats
18:45.34ibottotal count of LoL on #uphpu: 4.  Top 3: mahelious -- 2 (50.0%), captbrogers -- 1 (25.0%), Skinner -- 1 (25.0%)
18:45.42captbrogersLoL
18:45.44TuxToasterhaha
18:45.44SunSparc:)
18:45.57Skinner~lOlstats
18:45.57ibottotal count of lOl on #uphpu: 1.  Top 1: Skinner -- 1 (100.0%)
18:46.02SkinnerWoot
18:46.10Skinner~andstats
18:46.10SunSparcYou are #1
18:46.14SunSparcCongrats.
18:46.16captbrogersl0l
18:46.30maheliousLoL
18:47.48*** join/#uphpu supernovia (~Adium@208.64.91.46.static.utbb.net)
18:49.45captbrogersLoL
18:49.54SunSparc~lol captbrogers
18:49.54ibotACTION Laughs out Loud at captbrogers
18:50.13SunSparc~productive SunSparc
18:50.20captbrogerslol
18:50.24captbrogersI wished that worked
18:50.30SunSparcYeah, that would be nice.
18:50.51SunSparcibot: tell me to stop playing around and get back to work
18:53.54captbrogersSunSparc: You're a slacker! Get back to work!
18:54.57Skinner~say Skinner, get back to work.
18:54.58ibotSkinner, get back to work.
18:56.47*** join/#uphpu knicholes_ (~knicholes@64.122.179.21)
18:56.53captbrogersSunSparc: You're a slacker! Get back to work!
19:11.25mgearyokay, so i've got a machine that is being hammered by an IP right now
19:11.43mgeary~20 requests/second
19:11.54mgearymachine uses ipfw (os x). suggestions?
19:12.09captbrogersmgeary: switch to Linux?
19:12.17captbrogersOr use a cli to block the ip
19:12.27mgearyoh, yeah, because they never get hit by rogue machines
19:13.21captbrogersI'm detecting a hint of sarcasm?
19:16.14TuxToasterhttp://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2012/11/ios-apps-hijack-twitter-accounts-post-false-confessions-of-piracy/ <--- seems like a bad way to try combatting piracy
19:16.50DexterTheDragonmgeary: ipfw add deny tcp from <ip> to <localhost> <port>
19:16.59mgearyDexterTheDragon: did that. how do i reload ipfw?
19:18.04DexterTheDragonshouldn't need to be reloaded
19:19.12mgearythat's what i thought, too, but it's not kicking in :/
19:20.29mgearyprobably bad rule order
19:22.06*** join/#uphpu knicholes_ (~knicholes@64.122.179.21)
19:23.07fungusDtD, that looks wrong.  Outside IPs can't reach localhost.  Unless you meant the assigned IP of the host you are on instead of 127.0.0.1
19:23.08utahcon~lolstats UtahDave
19:23.15utahcon~lolstats utahcon
19:23.15ibotutahcon has said lol 127 times (2.4 %), ranked 9/122 (percentile: 7.4 %)
19:23.25utahcon;)
19:23.53DexterTheDragonfungus: I just took that from fail2ban. I don't know ipfw
19:25.27captbrogersTuxToaster: Sounds like a great troll
19:26.09*** join/#uphpu ezkl (~ezkl@155.100.168.238)
19:26.56ezklHi friends! :)
19:26.59mgearyDexterTheDragon: sudo ipfw add deny 10000 tcp from 98.175.54.205 to any
19:27.07mgearyhad to bump it before my allow all rule
19:27.30utahconezkl: hi!
19:27.40mgearysurely there is software that can detect a ddos and firewall it out…?
19:28.03utahconseems like it
19:28.14fungusThere is.  Most dedicated firewall devices use tech like that.
19:28.17DexterTheDragonmgeary: fail2ban
19:28.20utahconhey I am getting a ton of hits from this range of IPs... that seems excessive... LOCK EM DOWN!
19:28.45captbrogersezkl? In Utah?
19:28.49mgearynice. fail2ban is in ports
19:29.44fungusI thought fail2ban was for ssh attempts only, not general ddos stuff.
19:30.07DexterTheDragonfungus: it reads any log and can perform any action
19:30.13DexterTheDragonI've done some crazy stuff with it
19:30.22ezklYea I dev for the university of utah hospital
19:30.33supernoviawut
19:30.40fungusok, so as long as it's logged then.  Not bad, but won't protect against most general ddos things.  
19:30.50supernoviafor some reason I'm getting pinged every time you guys say Utah
19:30.57utahconutah utah utah
19:31.05ezklUTAHHHHHHHH HAHA UTAH
19:31.05utahconsupernovia is utha
19:31.08utahconutah
19:31.08supernovialol
19:31.16utahconhey supernovia !!!
19:31.42supernoviahey utahcon :) Been a long time!
19:32.06utahconindeed
19:32.24utahconI have been hiding...
19:34.37fungusIf you want to get serious about anti-ddos or intrusion detection you'll want a dedicated hardware device.  Cisco, Sonicwall, etc.
19:35.53utahconfungus: can a single point like a hardware firewall stop ddos?
19:36.12utahconand if so... why the heck are so many sites still hit by ddos
19:36.13captbrogersI break IP code walls
19:38.36utahconhttp://open.spotify.com/track/0jrz4ZQKCsC6h2vzqgHiEp << da tunez!
19:38.42utahconnsfw ^^
19:38.52utahconwell.. nothing bad to LOOK at... just the lyrics
19:39.10*** join/#uphpu wps (~wps@69.169.182.226.provo.static.broadweavenetworks.net)
19:39.10*** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ
19:39.21ezklI typically stick to turntable.fm :)
19:39.46utahconI have been advised to spend less time on turntable.fm...
19:39.49utahconwhile at work
19:39.53utahconand I am too busy working at home ;)
19:41.40fungusutahcon, they can prevent many types of ddos attacks, but you are right, not all.  The large organized attacks require multiple datacenters, etc.
19:42.04fungusBut they can prevent many of the bug exploit type dos attacks.
19:42.57utahconthat is a business I am glad to not be in...
19:49.01captbrogershttp://www.penny-arcade.com/comic/2007/7/16/brains-with-urgent-appointments/
19:50.24utahconI hate when each retailer has a different pre-order exclusive... argh... young marcus or young dom...
19:52.40*** join/#uphpu carmony (~carmony@199.104.95.10)
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20:00.10ezklHas anyone been to a SLC starup meetup?
20:04.53SunSparcSLC startup?
20:05.57ezklI guess it is some new meetup/networking events
20:06.03ezklhttp://www.slcstartups.com/about/
20:06.18ezklJust wondering if anyone has been to an event
20:06.30SunSparcHmm... nope, I have been to a couple SLCEntrepreneurs meetings.
20:06.59SunSparchttp://www.meetup.com/Entrepreneurs-Circle/
20:07.46SunSparcezkl: UPHPU has a TurnTable room, but nobody is in it at the moment.  http://turntable.fm/uphpu
20:10.06utahconezkl: it has been my experience that start-up weekends are shams to get people to do hard work for little or no reward.
20:10.21utahconwhich reminds me... I need to host a hack night soon
20:11.51TuxToasterheh
20:13.09ezkllol
20:13.40captbrogersWatching a short documentary on minecraft is making me want to stay home for a week and just hack on stuff
20:14.07utahconWhich is best for a hack night? pick one: Weeknight wedg.me/QEDFGA or Weekend night wedg.me/SKhLgW
20:14.10captbrogersWorkon my website and make some cool stuff in JavaScript
20:14.28utahconcaptbrogers: JavaScript is old school... all the cool kids use Dart now.
20:14.39SunSparcThe TT room currently has two spinners.
20:14.47ezklDarth?
20:14.53captbrogersutahcon: Or coffeescript?
20:14.56captbrogersOr something
20:15.30captbrogersAnd I really want to play Minecraft with my oldest
20:15.34utahconcoffeescript is just an abstraction of JS...
20:15.44utahconDart is... well it is that too, but it has natural language potential
20:15.57captbrogersutahcon: I don't know a single person who is using dart
20:16.02captbrogersMaybe that means I should learn it...
20:17.36utahconcaptbrogers: Google is using Dart...
20:17.57utahconin fact they are working the engine into Chrome, and they have the boys are Mozilla looking at including it in Firefox
20:18.00ezklhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dart_%28programming_language%29
20:18.04captbrogersutahcon: google is the real AI that has risen from the internet. No one really works there
20:18.22utahconcaptbrogers: nah... there are still humans... I hope
20:18.35captbrogersutahcon: Just holographic projections, they don't exist
20:19.02captbrogersTrue story
20:19.20utahconweirdly I am ok with that
20:19.21ezklLike Tupac!
20:19.27utahconTupac lives dude.
20:19.42utahconno one has that much "unreleased" material
20:19.57utahconthat just happens to be perfectly polished and time relevant.
20:20.07SunSparcezkl: are you on TT?
20:20.21captbrogersI was going to say, if he was singing about things that happened in the 90s, I could accept it
20:20.26ezklyeap
20:20.29ezklI'm stirling
20:20.32captbrogersBut when he talks about the Iraqi war? no
20:20.47SunSparcezkl: Ok, figured that had to be you.
20:20.57utahconerr...
20:21.00utahconyou know what I meant
20:21.03SunSparclol
20:23.55captbrogersNo, I honestly don't
20:24.33ezklwe are listening to music on turntable http://turntable.fm/uphpu
20:24.45utahconnot my day
20:24.48captbrogerstt?
20:24.57ezklturntable == tt
20:25.05captbrogershttp://blip.tv/patv/minecraft-documentary-teaser-4936617
20:25.07SunSparc~tt
20:25.07ibotrumour has it, tt is the Atari model with a 32-bit bus and 32-bit CPU.  The Lord of the Rings, Two Towers.  Two Towers Extended edition was released on November 18, 2003.  TrollTech  See also 'TurnTable'
20:25.13SunSparc~TurnTable
20:25.14ibotextra, extra, read all about it, turntable is The place where UPHPU goes to jam out together: http://turntable.fm/uphpu
20:25.14captbrogersWatch a mini documentary about minecraft
20:25.47*** join/#uphpu ninnypants (~ninnypant@unaffiliated/ninnypants)
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20:26.36ezklI loaded up all my starwars themed songs
20:26.57SunSparcI noticed.  :)
20:32.24SunSparcmacnewbold: Star Wars theme in the TT room.
20:33.22SunSparclol :)
20:34.30ezklhater lol
20:36.12SunSparcDexterTheDragon: get on that!
20:40.06*** join/#uphpu josephscott (~josephsco@104.2.233.72.static.reverse.ltdomains.com)
20:42.55*** part/#uphpu captbrogers (~brian@128.187.199.40)
20:43.31*** join/#uphpu captbrogers (~brian@128.187.199.40)
20:43.56captbrogersWell then
20:44.08captbrogersAre people still using the turntable room?
20:44.35SunSparccaptbrogers: Yes.
20:45.10SunSparccaptbrogers: Bring your tunes and spin with us.  Or just chill and listen.
20:45.49captbrogersI brought a bunch of video game remixes but the server was saying it didn't like half of them, just gave me a generic, "Sorry, can't upload that one" without any further info
20:46.17SunSparcLame.  Were they MP3's?
20:46.32ezklyea .wav's are hated on
20:46.51SunSparcAs are most other formats... :(  so far
20:47.12utahconmp3 for life!
20:47.18shalkiephp 5.5 release on thursday: http://news.php.net/php.internals/63848
20:47.41SunSparcshalkie: What are you doing posting PHP related stuff in here?
20:47.54utahconfor real!
20:48.22josephscottinteresting, I need to go back and look at what actually made it into the 5.5 branch
20:48.24shalkieSorry, my bad.
20:51.50SunSparclol
20:52.11SunSparc~uphpu
20:52.11iboti guess uphpu is Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org  Blootbot's favorite channel..  Utah Potato and Ham Producers Union, or a channel for rehabilitating programmers who have used PHP in the past
20:53.44SunSparccaptbrogers: Some of the music you tried to upload may already be on TT.  You can try searching their library and using their copies.
20:54.14captbrogersThese are custom remixes of game music from OverClocked ReMix
20:54.17captbrogersDoubt they have it
20:54.25captbrogersIt's not what you call, "main...stream..."
20:54.43SunSparccaptbrogers: Doubt not before you search.  OCRemix stuff is awesome.
20:55.38utahcontheir search is wonky at times...
20:55.57SunSparcYes it is.
20:55.57utahconI will type in the exact title... and wade through tons of almost the same thing...
20:55.57utahconthen type it in again wrong... and nail it
20:56.19SunSparcJust did a search, did not find any OCRemix stuff.  Shame.
21:01.44*** join/#uphpu supercleanse (~vagrant@75-162-215-201.slkc.qwest.net)
21:04.14utahconhttp://nikic.github.com/2012/07/10/What-PHP-5-5-might-look-like.html#getters_and_setters
21:04.18utahconinteresting
21:05.36SunSparcNice
21:06.01utahconright below this: http://nikic.github.com/2012/07/10/What-PHP-5-5-might-look-like.html#generators
21:06.05utahconList comprehensions and generator expressions
21:06.08utahconyummy!
21:06.59DexterTheDragonParameter skipping -_-
21:07.52josephscottoh please just copy Python named arguments, please
21:08.02ezklon this thread its PHP 5.6 ;) http://news.php.net/php.internals/63856
21:08.30DexterTheDragonjosephscott: might as well if they're copying pythons generators and list comprehension
21:08.35captbrogers5.5 is interesting
21:09.12captbrogersI was just happy that in 5.4 they added a method to get upload status and size so you could use a native function to find out how much had been uploaded without the need for caching or flash
21:09.25josephscottPython does a darn good job with named arguments, no reason not to copy it
21:09.28captbrogersThen the XMLHttpRequest object v2 came out doing the exact same thing
21:12.03utahconthen check if the ones I really need are there.
21:12.42SunSparcThat works.
21:13.08josephscottit works, but is still lame, I've done that myself many times
21:13.25captbrogersYou're lame
21:13.29utahconI agree it is lame... but until the language does it right...
21:13.32captbrogersSorry, knee-jerk response
21:13.34utahconwhich it looks like will be never
21:14.15captbrogersSunSparc, but I'm listening to minecraft music!
21:14.33SunSparcThat is good stuff too.  :)
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21:15.34utahconyou're welcome...
21:17.24SunSparclol
21:18.21josephscott$rlart
21:18.21raifbotpours gasoline all over josephscott, ignites the fire, and then enjoys some toasty marshmallows with the glorious blaze.
21:18.28josephscott$save josePHPagoda
21:18.28raifbotruns into a burning building and saves josePHPagoda from certain death. Is that enough?
21:18.35josephscott$save josephscott
21:18.36raifbotcalls Chuck Norris to bust josephscott out of a maximum security prison
21:19.05TuxToastermmmm..... toasty marshmallows.
21:19.35TuxToaster$8ball did that lart backfire on josephscott?
21:19.35raifbotTuxToaster - It is decidedly so.
21:20.21josephscottyeah
21:20.24josephscott$rlart
21:20.24raifbotforces josephscott to use Outlook Express.
21:20.28josephscottagain!
21:20.33jsmithNice... it's a sign
21:20.54jsmith$8ball Is josephscott having a second Monday this week?
21:20.54raifbotjsmith - Reply hazy, try again.
21:20.57josephscott$8ball will $rlart ever work right again?
21:20.57raifbotjosephscott - Yes - definitely.
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21:33.22beandog~lart mysql
21:33.22ibottakes out a cattle prod and gives mysql a good jolt
21:34.35captbrogersSadly that doesn't help it
21:34.57utahconmysql needs a shot of MariaDB
21:34.59utahcon:)
21:35.08beandogit's the syntax that I think is silly.
21:35.13beandogwhatevs.
21:35.25beandogAlso, does IE not support ftp anymore?
21:35.39beandogIE8
21:35.40utahconbeandog: not for a long time
21:35.45utahconwell.. it does for reading doesn't it
21:35.46beandogutahcon: really?
21:35.51utahconjust not the rest of the functions
21:35.52beandogutahcon: yah even reading, doesn't do anything
21:35.56utahconWHAT?!
21:35.59utahconthat is ok
21:36.05utahconFTP is a dead protocol (to me)
21:36.16captbrogersutahcon: You are dead to me
21:36.19utahconalso IE is dead to me...
21:36.29utahconcaptbrogers: thems is fighting words!
21:36.38utahconwait... are you in support of FTP?
21:36.44utahconI am sad for you
21:36.53captbrogersYes, it still serves a purpose
21:36.59utahconnope
21:37.00beandogutahcon: dude, pure-ftpd is *awesome*
21:37.03utahconsFTP is ok though
21:37.07beandogit totally reversed my opinion on FTP
21:37.12captbrogersI have tried to setup a git repo on my server
21:37.20captbrogersGave up after 30 minutes
21:37.23utahcondude
21:37.24captbrogersSetup vsftpd?
21:37.27beandogno ways
21:37.27utahcongit is the sh*t!
21:37.28captbrogers2 minutes
21:37.30beandogpure-ftpd > all
21:37.41captbrogersGit is awesome
21:38.00utahconftp in any form (besides sFTP) is evil
21:38.04beandogOh actually, I think I remember something about IE ....
21:38.04captbrogersBut let's say I need to push files to my server but it is just a dump of files, it's so much easier to use FTP than SSH or git
21:38.05utahconand wildly insecure
21:38.20beandogIt tries to connect anonymously first ... and then if it can, THEN it'll let you login as a user.
21:38.21beandogo.O
21:38.26utahconcaptbrogers: you are not well versed in SSH or rsync then
21:38.52captbrogersTime spent to learn them well enough to make it more useful < time it takes to open filezille and upload file
21:39.09beandogheh
21:39.21beandoga cold, dead, lifeless cookie, full of deprecation
21:39.23beandog;)
21:39.39beandogcaptbrogers: whatever works
21:39.39captbrogersJust because they are better doesn't necessarily mean the time it would take to learn them to make them useful is time well spent
21:39.43beandogdid I mention pure-ftpd is awesome?
21:39.49funguscaptbrogers, filezilla supports SFTP
21:39.55captbrogersno beandog, that's the first I've heard of it!
21:40.01captbrogersfungus: Yes, I use sftp
21:40.09utahconcaptbrogers: the time saved after learning them is enough ;)
21:40.25beandogcaptbrogers: check it out man, I have some favorite features: it can use it's own password database, it can use pam, unix, or pure-ftpd authentication, you can link ftp user accounts to system users if you want
21:40.46beandogcaptbrogers: it can use chroot if you want, you can set quota limits, upload download ratios, rate limiting, all KINDS of stuff
21:40.50captbrogersIs it any faster to open a command line, think about what command + params I need, type it in, and then hope it worked than to just open filezilla, click + drag?
21:41.09captbrogersbeandog: vsftpd has all the same features as well
21:41.10funguscaptbrogers, our discussion isn't GUI vs command line (this time)
21:41.14fungusIt's FTP vs SFTP
21:41.25captbrogersI use sftp, but that still requires ftp to be used
21:41.27captbrogerscorrect?
21:41.29DexterTheDragon~lart beandog
21:41.29ibotburns beandog to a crisp with a laser
21:41.32funguscaptbrogers, nope
21:41.37utahconsFTP is not FTP
21:41.38captbrogersOr do I not understand the technology well enough?
21:41.39beandogcaptbrogers: I looked at both of em, pure-ftpd still whooped vsftpd on features and flexibility
21:41.58fungusSFTP is very different, and is provided by OpenSSH
21:42.18utahconfor starters: https://www.ccs.uky.edu/machines/sftp.html
21:42.20captbrogersSo if I disable vsftpd on my server, sftp will still work?
21:42.25fungusYes
21:42.30captbrogersInteresting...
21:42.34captbrogersI may do that then
21:42.50unumya no reason to have vsftpd
21:42.57beandogI use FTP for client support ... one because it's simpler for them, and two, it's simpler for me.
21:43.14tierrap.s. there's a difference between sFTP, and FTPS
21:43.28unumif it's unidirectional I use http
21:43.46unumif it's bidirectional I use http with a 30 second php script :)
21:43.52fungusbeandog, as long as you don't use FTP by itself.  Either FTP-SSL or SFTP.
21:44.04captbrogers*estimated time left: 3 years, 5 months, 2 weeks, 8 days, 12 hours, 15 minutes, 9 seconds...*
21:44.35fungusunencrypted authentication is very very bad.
21:44.55beandogfungus: meh
21:45.06beandogpure-ftpd also has ip whitelist and blacklist
21:45.07beandogwhee
21:45.13beandogand you can use tcp-wrappers too
21:45.25beandogfungus: I agree with you, though. :)
21:45.27SkinnerI myself use IPP
21:45.45fungusYou down w/ OPP, ya you know me
21:45.50beandogI wish I were kidding.
21:45.51captbrogersI'm down with OOp
21:45.54captbrogersOOP
21:46.02beandogI am kidding!
21:46.06beandog~oops captbrogers
21:46.06ibotoh bother, I messed up and deleted captbrogers
21:46.06utahconOOP is so 2004
21:46.12beandoglol
21:46.21captbrogersI'm still in cache, it's okay. We can restore
21:47.02beandogwe can rebuild him.  make him better.  faster. strong.
21:47.04beandog~mangle quote
21:47.21SkinnerMy clients prefer us to use IPP since they like having hard copies of the files...
21:47.28Skinner...said no one ever.
21:47.41beandogwhat is ipp?
21:47.51SkinnerInternet Printing Protocol
21:47.55Skinneripp
21:48.02beandogOh
21:48.07Skinnerprotocol for remote printing
21:48.30fungusSkinner, is it exposed to the internet?  Care to share an IP.  <evil laugh>
21:48.42Skinnerlol
21:48.55captbrogersYes, yes...soon...soon
21:49.59unumusing ip whitelists sounds like a lot more working than telling them to use winscp
21:50.03SkinnerWell, we have our svn and git repo's tied to the ipp api. Now every time we make an update to the code, the client gets the new version printed right at their desk! Saves time with code review and shows the client we are working hard!
21:50.08unuminstead of wsftp
21:50.09Skinner</troll>
21:50.20beandogunum: nah, I dont want em to have ftp over ssh
21:50.30captbrogers$rlart
21:50.30raifbotwallops UtahDave with a main rotation server that needs rehubbing.  It won't take long.
21:50.30beandogpure-ftpd has SO many cool features
21:50.31beandogman
21:50.34beandogI could go on.
21:50.41beandogno way I'm changing
21:51.13fungusbeandog, that's cool an all, but still... unencrypted auth?  
21:51.20beandogfungus: I'm working on it.
21:51.31fungusok, as long as you have a plan.
21:52.23captbrogersI have a plan, and I can't wait to bring it to fruition. Then I will rule the world
21:57.20*** part/#uphpu captbrogers (~brian@128.187.199.40)
22:00.43beandogwas that part of his plan?
22:05.14jsmithI plan on having a plan...
22:05.52beandogwas telling us that you don't have a plan part of the plan?
22:07.18beandog~part jsmith
22:07.49jsmithbeandog: Part of the plan is to plan on having part of a plan.
22:07.58TuxToaster~plan beandog
22:08.08TuxToasteribot doesn't have a plan
22:09.12jsmith~plan TuxToaster
22:09.12ibotACTION wonders if TuxToaster has a plan
22:14.51beandoghmph
22:14.58beandogmysql won't let me create a database with trailing spaces.
22:15.09beandogthat was part of my plan
22:16.07beandoghuh
22:16.12beandogbut you can make databases with spaces in the middle.
22:16.48beandoglol, and you can't drop it in the mysql shell
22:16.52beandogthat is classic.
22:17.07beandogthat is great.
22:17.08beandog:)
22:17.48SunSparclol, beandog why would you put spaces in a database name?
22:17.55beandogJust to screw with someone
22:18.03SunSparclol, yep, that would work
22:18.28beandogQuotes won't work
22:18.31beandogneither does escaping spaces
22:18.33beandog:)
22:18.37beandoggotta use mysqladmin drop
22:18.39SunSparcYou would need to escape the spaces or encapsulate the name...
22:18.45SunSparcTry using ticks
22:18.50beandogooh okay
22:18.52SunSparclike:  `name`
22:19.06beandogAwwwww
22:19.07beandog:C
22:19.09beandogparty pooper.
22:19.17SunSparcWorked :)
22:19.25SunSparc?
22:19.44beandogWait
22:19.48beandognow I want a database with backticks in it!!
22:19.50beandogye!
22:19.52beandogyes!
22:19.58SunSparcLOL!!
22:20.41beandogcreate database ````;
22:20.44beandogthat worked
22:20.48SunSparchaha
22:21.24beandogOh man
22:21.25beandogThis is even better
22:21.29beandogYou can make databases with leading spaces.
22:22.33SunSparcCrazy
22:22.48beandogThis is just awesome.
22:23.44beandogI wonder if I can do space, backtick, newline
22:23.45beandogHmm
22:24.54SunSparcI wonder if you could use a pipe inplace of an L or I...
22:25.41beandogOh man
22:25.44beandogThe fun never stops
22:26.03SunSparcor an mdash for a hyphen
22:26.47SunSparcOr flipped text:  http://www.fliptext.org/
22:27.11SunSparc?oo? s? bopu??q
22:27.25SunSparcHmm, my cli cannot handle the characters.
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22:51.39TuxToasterbeandog: you could also do special spaces
22:51.43TuxToasterlike thin spaces
22:52.25TuxToaster$lart Chuck Norris
22:52.25raifbotfrags Chuck Norris with his BFG9000.
22:52.53clondonI'm sure this has been a round for a LONG time but this is the first time I've seen it: telnet://towel.blinkenlights.nl
22:54.23TuxToasterclondon: yup, there are ways to watch it without telnet
22:54.46clondonyeah like DVD :P
22:55.07TuxToasterthat too
22:55.20TuxToasterbut I meant http://www.asciimation.co.nz/
22:55.45clondoncool
22:56.18clondonI wonder how long that took to make
22:56.44TuxToasterheh, probably don't want to know
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23:17.17mindjuju_can somebody please stop the planet, i'd like to get off now : http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_southeast_valley/gilbert/gilbert-pd-man-run-over-by-wife-for-not-voting
23:18.03mindjuju_http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/nov/12/petitions-to-secede-are-filed-for-23-states-since-/
23:18.12mindjuju_http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/wh-petition-calls-stripping-citizenship-and-exile-anyone-who-signs-petition-secede_663282.html
23:18.33mindjuju_it's almost as if somebody outlawed thinking
23:34.45SunSparcmindjuju_: No kidding.
23:35.29DexterTheDragonmindjuju_: that's funny
23:35.30SunSparcThat women running over her husband for not voting, wow.
23:35.39DexterTheDragonthat's less funy
23:35.52SunSparcBeing pregnant her hormones may be whacked, but still.
23:36.33SunSparcmindjuju_: Let's pack up our families and move to Mars.
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23:40.17josephscottthese sorts of things always come up, but now they have an easier time of getting attention and being reported on
23:40.54SunSparcYep
23:42.06josephscottafter every election a small group says they are going to gather many like minded people to a small population state so that they can control the state level politics
23:42.19josephscottso far I haven't seen anyone actually pull it off
23:42.59josephscottpeople get upset that who they voted for didn't win, just to varying degrees
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23:45.07fungusI would think those people should move to swing states like Ohio and Florida.  That would accomplish their goal a lot better than secession.
23:45.21josephscottI have to admit I am a bit surprised though to see that some people believe Obama "represents all that is evil. That his master plan is to destroy America no matter what the cost is."
23:46.08funguslol, I'm not surprised.  you should read all the crappy email from my extended family.  
23:46.33josephscottI've been pretty disappointed/upset about decisions Presidents have made, but that seems to be taking it to a whole new level
23:46.43fungusNo kidding.
23:50.33DexterTheDragonbut the president can do whatever he wants. we don't have 2 more branches of government to check and balance him!!!!!!
23:50.44SunSparclol
23:50.46SunSparcPresidents are just men.  Mortals.  They make mistakes.  They may have good intentions but differ in implementation methods.
23:52.45stderr-Completely agreed.  I'd like to get away from all the rhetoric and have a sane conversation/debate about those implementations.
23:52.59SunSparcSeriously, people think the president is the God of this world or something.  He has very little power comparatively speaking.
23:53.11SunSparcstderr-: Exactly
23:54.28SunSparcDeep down, I think everyone really just wants to do the right thing and help people.  But because we all speak different languages we understand the same concept very differently.
23:55.16stderr-naw, I'm a liberal Satanist communist.
23:55.18SunSparcA little bit of patience and understandin goes a long way.
23:55.23SunSparcstderr-: lol!
23:56.17SunSparcstderr-: in that case, telling you to go to hell would not be an insult.  :)
23:56.22stderr-haha
23:56.23stderr-http://www.theonion.com/articles/obama-help-us-destroy-jesus-and-start-a-new-age-of,29478/
23:56.50SunSparcGotta love the onion.
23:58.20SunSparc"My fellow Americans and godless infidels"
23:59.42SunSparcGruesome.

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