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| 01:16.02 | mgeary | ping romanovic-afk |
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| 14:03.31 | josephscott | potential for a really awesome week |
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| 14:58.20 | Utah_Dave | Just spent the last 2 weeks pulling over 100,000 feet of CAT5E. I've never looked forward to sitting in my chair staring at vim all day this much. |
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| 15:03.08 | jsmith | Utah_Dave: Lovely... |
| 15:03.14 | jsmith | (Been there, done that, still have the scars) |
| 15:04.00 | Utah_Dave | :) |
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| 15:30.01 | influx | Morning. |
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| 16:15.43 | josephscott | the default sorting order in linux is super irritating |
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| 16:16.48 | josephscott | ug, never mind, brain dead locale issue |
| 16:18.08 | josephscott | export LC_ALL="C" - life is good once more |
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| 16:37.05 | macnewbold | josephscott: like the order of files when you do .ls? |
| 16:37.14 | macnewbold | putting all the dotfiles in with regular files? |
| 16:37.21 | josephscott | yeah, can't stand that |
| 16:37.28 | josephscott | dot files belong at the top :-) |
| 16:38.18 | macnewbold | no kidding |
| 16:38.29 | macnewbold | and unless i ask for them, they shouldn't show by default |
| 16:38.37 | macnewbold | ls, ls -l, etc. shouldn't show dotfiles |
| 16:38.44 | josephscott | with my ll alias I always show them |
| 16:38.52 | josephscott | and I use ll A LOT |
| 16:38.56 | macnewbold | i have ls, ll, and la |
| 16:39.08 | macnewbold | ll being ls -lF and la being ls -laF |
| 16:39.19 | macnewbold | and ls being an alias of ll actually |
| 16:40.32 | josephscott | I'm lazy, most just us ll for everything :-)( |
| 16:40.34 | josephscott | :-) |
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| 17:32.15 | mindjuju | fungus, you around? |
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| 17:46.18 | fungus | mindjuju, i'm back now |
| 17:47.35 | mindjuju | so fungus, i was reading an article yesterday saying that in effect, centos is dead |
| 17:47.54 | mindjuju | something about a lead dev, a guy by the name of dag or soemthing like that, quiting centos |
| 17:48.04 | mindjuju | and scientific linux being the soup de jour |
| 17:48.09 | mindjuju | have you heard anything? |
| 17:49.05 | fungus | Well, CentOS is lagging very badly. I last heard that their progress on CentOS 6 is not really even started. |
| 17:49.27 | mindjuju | are you shifting away from centos? |
| 17:49.53 | fungus | I don't use centos in production. only for playing with |
| 17:51.14 | fungus | you should probably hit up goozbach about it. |
| 18:01.27 | *** topic/#UPHPU by macnewbold -> Meeting Thursday May 19th: Wade Shearer on Circle (his CMS), 7pm at C7 Data Centers (Bluffdale) | Utah PHP Users group | uphpu.org |
| 18:01.45 | carmony | man, I'm bummed I won't be there this thursday :P |
| 18:02.01 | macnewbold | carmony: me too - to what do we owe the disappointment? |
| 18:02.10 | carmony | out of state |
| 18:02.13 | carmony | in california right now |
| 18:02.14 | carmony | :P |
| 18:02.25 | macnewbold | chasing nicer weather, or there on business? |
| 18:02.30 | carmony | both :P |
| 18:02.33 | carmony | mostly business |
| 18:02.37 | carmony | with some fun thrown in |
| 18:02.40 | carmony | i.e. sea world tomorrow |
| 18:03.16 | macnewbold | sweet - i like sea world, and san diego in general. we usually go to the maritime museum there when we're out there. not expensive, but fun and educational. |
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| 18:05.02 | macnewbold | Unless there's another volunteer, I guess I'll dust off OpenOffice Impress or Keynote, and put together some PHP Phundamentals or something |
| 18:05.37 | macnewbold | I'm tempted to do PHP data structures, or arrays, or maybe strings or type juggling |
| 18:05.46 | macnewbold | any preferences anyone? |
| 18:06.11 | ninnypants | macnewbold: namespaces in PHP 5? |
| 18:06.32 | macnewbold | are you volunteering? :) |
| 18:06.53 | ninnypants | macnewbold: nope I'm not even completely sure what they are |
| 18:07.04 | ninnypants | just the first thing that popped into my head |
| 18:07.09 | macnewbold | fair nuff |
| 18:11.11 | ninnypants | interesting... can't see a real use for them though that's probably cause I've never had a problem where they've needed to be used |
| 18:12.20 | macnewbold | yeah, they're common in other langs, but php tradition is to avoid name collisions, since we had a long time of not having/needing namespaces |
| 18:14.04 | *** topic/#UPHPU by macnewbold -> Meeting Thursday May 19th: Wade Shearer on Circle (his CMS), 7pm at C7 Data Centers (Bluffdale) | BRING ID so you can get a guest badge | Utah PHP Users group | uphpu.org |
| 18:23.06 | ninnypants | yeah not sure why that wouldn't be something to avoid in all languages though |
| 18:26.25 | josephscott | I don't want to hear any more complaining about PHP, started a little tool in Python this weekend, they've got plenty of goofy stuff |
| 18:27.39 | josephscott | can't believe the hoops they jump through just to do http basic auth :( |
| 18:28.35 | macnewbold | yeah, i think a lot of other languages have some weird hoops to make everyday web stuff be anything close to as quick and easy as it is in php |
| 18:28.49 | macnewbold | but php being built from the ground up around web, has a lot of things i take for granted any more |
| 18:29.58 | jtsnow | refreshing take on why PHP gets a bad rap: http://codefury.net/2011/04/why-php-was-a-ghetto/ |
| 18:35.10 | josephscott | haha |
| 18:35.44 | josephscott | stop making things so easy for people, you need to make it harder so that only people with comp-sci degrees will even have a hope of understanding what you are talking about |
| 18:39.59 | josephscott | I'm still not a big fan of the M in MVC |
| 18:40.26 | DexterTheDragon | I'm not a big fan of SQL in my HTML |
| 18:41.26 | mindjuju | i'm a huge fan of PB&J |
| 18:42.32 | josephscott | I don't believe the only alternative to M (in MVC) is mixed SQL and HTML |
| 18:44.51 | unum | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:44.57 | unum | I have to agree with that |
| 18:45.01 | josephscott | ug, httplib2 makes some horrible assumptions :x |
| 18:45.02 | unum | that's my favorite feature |
| 18:55.39 | macnewbold | it took me a while to believe that MVC was a good thing |
| 18:56.53 | macnewbold | most things I ended up needing to add to an existing system after the fact, like adding new fields, affected the database (structure usually), the queries that used the database, the business logic involved, and the display/display logic including at least the html, if not the CSS. |
| 18:57.07 | macnewbold | so the more files that involves, the more files I have to touch to make my change |
| 18:57.25 | mgeary | hey, does anyone have a web-based large file transfer system that they really like? i've got a client wanting a recommendation, and the only one that i used much got bought and shuttered |
| 18:57.50 | mgeary | i've got some clients that use YouSendIt.com. Looking for your input |
| 18:58.14 | mgeary | google reveals dozens of options. I don't want to have to evaluate them all, if i can avoid it |
| 18:58.17 | macnewbold | with the right MVC though, where some of that is automagic, like CakePHP for example, i can change the db structure, and depending how I've done it, i may be able to get away with only modifying the V or the C, if I'm lucky |
| 18:58.29 | fungus | mgeary, I have used mollify. It's not bad. easy to deal with for the most part. |
| 18:58.50 | fungus | http://www.mollify.org/ |
| 19:01.58 | ninnypants | mgeary: I've used dropsend in the past and it worked pretty well |
| 19:04.02 | fungus | mgeary, for self-hosted, I use Mollify. For third party hosted, box.net, dropbox |
| 19:04.06 | mgeary | cool, thanks |
| 19:04.16 | mgeary | fungus: "self-hosted"? |
| 19:04.20 | wps | anyone know Brian Lacey (a local developer)? |
| 19:04.30 | mgeary | oh, Mollify is code you install? |
| 19:04.33 | fungus | yup |
| 19:04.59 | mgeary | gotcha, thanks |
| 19:17.11 | macnewbold | jtsnow: thanks for the link - good read. |
| 19:17.36 | macnewbold | wps: the name rings a bell but if i've met him or interacted with him i don't know him well |
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| 20:01.27 | DexterTheDragon | mindjuju: http://daftpunk.themaninblue.com/ |
| 20:14.25 | carmony | arg |
| 20:14.39 | carmony | I hate it when I have a bug, and no clue why it is happening |
| 20:15.42 | josephscott | ~clue carmony |
| 20:15.42 | ibot | ACTION fans out Vegas-style a stack of clues for carmony "Pick one, any one! ...and don't show it to me." |
| 20:15.47 | jsmith | ~bug carmony |
| 20:16.52 | jsmith | ibot: bug $victim is <action> places a mind-control bug in $victim's ear, Star Trek II style |
| 20:16.53 | ibot | okay, jsmith |
| 20:16.56 | jsmith | ~bug carmony |
| 20:16.57 | ibot | ACTION places a mind-control bug in carmony's ear, Star Trek II style |
| 20:18.37 | josephscott | $mindtrick jsmith |
| 20:18.37 | raifbot | (jedi hand wave) jsmith move along. |
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| 20:37.34 | mgeary | hey fungus, is there a way to see how old a connection is in netstat? |
| 20:37.51 | carmony | AAAAAAAAAAAAARG |
| 20:37.58 | carmony | I'm going to kill this Redis Library |
| 20:38.52 | carmony | some reason after including it |
| 20:38.58 | carmony | it opens up 6 output buffers |
| 20:47.45 | carmony | found the output buffer leak, patched it up |
| 20:48.37 | macnewbold | wow |
| 21:00.37 | josephscott | carmony: which one are you using? |
| 21:00.41 | josephscott | is it hi-redis based? |
| 21:00.53 | carmony | I prefer predis, but this one is Rediska |
| 21:03.22 | josephscott | well, at least it is in C, will be a gazillion times faster than a PHP based one |
| 21:06.37 | fungus | mgeary, you can only guess when it started, if it started at the same time as the process. |
| 21:07.28 | mgeary | fungus: okay. i'm just trying to figure out why a machine that has buzzed along happily for a good long while is suddenly gone from maxing out 100 concurrent mysql connections to maxing out 200 a week later |
| 21:09.28 | macnewbold | mgeary: mysql connections you can get some better info on sometimes with processlist and friends |
| 21:09.41 | macnewbold | they can tell you where the connection is from, and what it is doing |
| 21:09.45 | mgeary | yeah, show processlist isn't giving me much interesting |
| 21:09.47 | macnewbold | sounds like you may have a connection leak |
| 21:11.16 | mgeary | i may indeed. i'm now hitting 250 connections |
| 21:11.18 | mgeary | jeeze |
| 21:13.06 | josephscott | may be a switch from non-persistent to persistent connections in the app code? |
| 21:13.24 | mgeary | hitting the process list shows a ton of sleeping connnections |
| 21:13.35 | mgeary | all from the same app/user |
| 21:13.46 | mgeary | the oldest is 118 seconds |
| 21:15.25 | mgeary | so it sounds like at the very least i need to shorten the time a connection is kept open |
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| 22:21.08 | mgeary | ah HA |
| 22:21.26 | mgeary | okay, so it turns out my webserver is hitting itself (stop hitting yourself! Stop hitting yourself!) |
| 22:21.44 | mgeary | i'm getting 1+ of these every second: |
| 22:21.45 | mgeary | 209.90.125.206 - - [16/May/2011:16:21:27 -0600] "OPTIONS * HTTP/1.0" 200 - |
| 22:22.17 | mgeary | any ideas on how i can track that down? |
| 22:25.59 | mgeary | what would that request even be, anyone know? |
| 22:26.52 | macnewbold | mgeary: usually an OPTIONS request is used by things like load balancers and other monitors as a light-weight way to ping the webserver and make sure it is still running and responding reasonably |
| 22:28.40 | mgeary | hmmm |
| 22:31.37 | mgeary | so does that call not actually hit a URL? I'm wondering if that's spawning database connections |
| 22:41.57 | DexterTheDragon | mgeary: If the Request-URI is an asterisk ("*"), the OPTIONS request is intended to apply to the server in general rather than to a specific resource. Since a server's communication options typically depend on the resource, the "*" request is only useful as a "ping" or "no-op" type of method; |
| 22:42.37 | mgeary | interesting |
| 22:42.39 | mgeary | thanks |
| 22:42.45 | mgeary | so that may not be the culprit |
| 22:42.49 | DexterTheDragon | http://www.w3.org/Protocols/rfc2616/rfc2616-sec9.html#sec9.2 |
| 22:42.51 | mgeary | bummer |
| 23:17.17 | mgeary | don't we all |
| 23:23.17 | mgeary | hey, is there a good way to have multiple vhosts log to the same access_log that *isn't* the default access_log? I seem to recall that if i specify the same log file in each vhost block, it amounts to a new process for each vhost |
| 23:32.48 | fungus | mgeary, nope. if you specify the same file multiple times, apache opens the file once. |
| 23:45.31 | mindjuju | dir |