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| 01:41.04 | influx | the yip yip aliens (martians) were awesome |
| 01:41.34 | influx | yip yip yip yip yip yip yip yip yip--awwww-haw. |
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| 05:50.51 | herlo | ninnypants: lol |
| 05:50.59 | herlo | and you just printed all those shirts too |
| 05:51.17 | ninnypants | yeah I thought it started tomorrow |
| 05:51.24 | ninnypants | I mean friday |
| 05:51.26 | herlo | it does start tomorrow |
| 05:51.29 | herlo | oh, yeah |
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| 05:51.38 | ninnypants | glad I didn't put off printing |
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| 07:09.41 | ninnypants | influx: ping |
| 08:05.28 | influx | pong |
| 08:05.32 | influx | ninnypants: pong |
| 08:05.39 | influx | sup brah |
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| 15:16.37 | SunSparc | ~rlart |
| 15:16.38 | ibot | beats romanovic-afk senseless with a 50lb Unix manual |
| 15:28.49 | SunSparc | ~thursday |
| 15:28.49 | ibot | "This must be Thursday. I could never get the hang of Thursdays." (Arthur Dent) |
| 15:46.33 | beandog | monin |
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| 15:51.48 | josephscott | hanging out at UTOSC |
| 15:51.54 | josephscott | the webhooks session |
| 15:54.36 | supernovia | 'morning all |
| 15:57.38 | unum | one of these years I'm going to make it |
| 15:57.40 | unum | next year |
| 15:57.45 | unum | I'll plan on it |
| 15:58.08 | macnewbold | i kinda wish i were there today, but alas, i am at work today and at the conf tomorrow and saturday |
| 15:58.15 | macnewbold | still need to get my talk ready for tomorrow... |
| 15:58.21 | unum | I won't even make it saturday this year |
| 15:58.40 | unum | I'll do some presentations next year |
| 15:58.52 | josephscott | macnewbold: just come work while at the conf :-) |
| 15:59.08 | supernovia | that's what I'm gonna do |
| 15:59.25 | macnewbold | yeah, now that i'm on fulltime on-site assignment at Skullcandy, they're not as conducive to off-site work |
| 15:59.47 | macnewbold | a lot more interacting with people than i'm used to |
| 15:59.59 | macnewbold | but tomorrow, that's my plan |
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| 16:49.57 | josephscott | tierra: wordpress/ |
| 16:49.58 | josephscott | ? |
| 16:50.08 | tierra | entirely powered on WP btw josephscott... which has let me on way more wild goose chases than I ever imagined |
| 16:50.14 | tierra | heh |
| 16:50.36 | SunSparc | beandog: dude, you could have just written a blog post about Icewind Dale and then tweeted a link to that instead of writing a freakin tweet book. ;) |
| 16:51.16 | tierra | josephscott: you guys seriously need to get support into the base functions and template tags for the custom post types and taxonomies... |
| 16:51.44 | beandog | SunSparc, heh, whoopsie |
| 16:51.51 | tierra | er, by "you guys" I really mean the WP dev team |
| 16:51.51 | SunSparc | lol |
| 16:52.06 | josephscott | tierra: there are |
| 16:52.53 | tierra | some of the functions work with them, but tons are horribly broken in one way or another |
| 16:52.57 | josephscott | tierra: before I make that blanket statement, exactly what sort of functions were you thinking of? |
| 16:53.04 | beandog | So, guys, I think I finally figured out what I was trying to find yesterday |
| 16:53.05 | beandog | well, in part |
| 16:53.09 | beandog | I think I need REST |
| 16:53.28 | beandog | Maybe not though. That makes sense for external services, but I'm still not sure about internal ones. |
| 16:53.53 | tierra | get_posts/query_posts for one... custom post type works, and custom taxonomies works, but try and put both together and you have a problem |
| 16:54.02 | josephscott | for most people REST just translates into a basic HTTP based API |
| 16:54.25 | beandog | josephscott, right, but I still have a lot of questions about it, re authentication and security |
| 16:55.10 | josephscott | auth == HTTP basic auth, security == SSL |
| 16:55.11 | beandog | I mean, if you have a JavaScript script asking for data, wouldn't that need just as much authentication as PHP would? |
| 16:55.20 | beandog | But its a separate client |
| 16:55.24 | beandog | right? |
| 16:55.45 | beandog | How do you pass authentication stuff back and forth |
| 16:55.51 | beandog | With PHP, you already have sessions |
| 16:56.21 | josephscott | XHR includes cookies, like a regular HTTP request |
| 16:56.55 | josephscott | you can use sessions, but using PHP sessions is not a requirement. for instance WP doesn't use PHP sessions |
| 16:57.47 | beandog | How would a real world example of that work? |
| 16:57.55 | beandog | When they login, it creates both a session and JS cookie? |
| 16:58.13 | josephscott | no such think as a JS cookie |
| 16:58.19 | josephscott | it's just part of the HTTP request |
| 16:58.51 | beandog | okay? |
| 16:59.16 | beandog | I dont understand, then, if you have an HTTP API |
| 16:59.21 | beandog | Where you have http://foo/get/user/13 |
| 16:59.36 | beandog | How the JS would authenticate that it has access to get that info to the server |
| 17:00.13 | josephscott | if you've set a cookie the XHR call will include it |
| 17:00.34 | josephscott | use firebug with firefox, you can watch exactly what happens |
| 17:00.54 | beandog | if who sets the cookie? |
| 17:01.09 | josephscott | so you browse to a site |
| 17:01.14 | josephscott | present a login form |
| 17:01.23 | josephscott | you set a cookie when the user/pass matches |
| 17:01.32 | josephscott | you being your site |
| 17:02.31 | beandog | Okay |
| 17:02.35 | beandog | But can't cookies be faked? |
| 17:02.46 | beandog | How would you verify it's authentic ... track the login session to a uniqid or something? |
| 17:03.13 | josephscott | there are several ways, PHP sessions use cookies |
| 17:03.19 | josephscott | it's a random/unique id |
| 17:03.32 | josephscott | you'd have to intercept the cookie to find a valid one |
| 17:03.37 | josephscott | guessing one would be really hard |
| 17:03.48 | josephscott | which is where SSL comes in |
| 17:04.13 | beandog | So the HTTP api should use SSL, then, to apply security |
| 17:04.33 | josephscott | yes, HTTP with no SSL passes data in the clear |
| 17:05.08 | beandog | Okay, now, see, I was thinking that, somehow, JavaScript and PHP would not be able to access the same cookies |
| 17:05.22 | beandog | And each one would be considered a client, in a sense. |
| 17:05.23 | beandog | Or something. |
| 17:06.12 | beandog | I'm still not sure I understand it. From my perspective, it seems like on one hand you have your browser which stores the session data, and then on another you have JavaScript which is being run, and that is sort of separate somehow, and therefore, is its own client |
| 17:06.13 | beandog | or something. |
| 17:06.59 | josephscott | they aren't separate |
| 17:07.19 | beandog | So the JS being run, is going to be from the same client, then, as the users browser? |
| 17:07.24 | josephscott | that said, there are a few browsers that support HTTP only cookies, which means the browser hides the cookie from JS |
| 17:07.27 | beandog | meaning they both have access to the same stored data (cookies)? |
| 17:07.52 | josephscott | beandog: yep, the client is the browser, the fact that the request is generated via JS is a trivial detail |
| 17:08.12 | beandog | josephscott, why is it trivial? I think that's where my big hangup is. |
| 17:08.17 | beandog | I'm not seeing the connection ... :T |
| 17:08.34 | josephscott | that's what I'm saying, stop having a big hangup, they are the same :-) |
| 17:08.47 | beandog | Okay |
| 17:09.02 | beandog | I think I'll play around with php and JS accessing the same cookies, then. That may make the light come on. |
| 17:09.14 | josephscott | now saying that, there is a trend for separating them in future browsers, but for now just think of them as the same |
| 17:09.25 | josephscott | firebug with firefox will help |
| 17:09.29 | beandog | So, on a similar note |
| 17:09.35 | josephscott | you can watch all the HTTP requests, via JS or not |
| 17:09.44 | beandog | How do things like web services work ... where you are just making remote calls sending JSON strings back and forth? |
| 17:10.06 | josephscott | work in what way, it's just an HTTP call |
| 17:10.06 | beandog | Do they just send those over SSL, and then have API keys as strings to identify users and stuff like that? |
| 17:10.28 | redroy | beandog: fwiw I'm fairly new to api's as well and this article helped me out http://www.gen-x-design.com/archives/create-a-rest-api-with-php/ |
| 17:10.29 | beandog | josephscott, how do they work, re, in authentication ... when someone isn't going to a page and logging in, and then requesting data via JS |
| 17:10.38 | josephscott | it varies, requiring an apikey is one common method |
| 17:11.01 | beandog | redroy, oh thanks man, I found that one yesterday ... awesome article, and I'm still trying to wrap my brain around it, too. thank you |
| 17:11.17 | josephscott | don't get hung up on REST, just stick to thinking about the HTTP layer |
| 17:11.35 | beandog | josephscott, is an API key just a generation of a long string of a unique identifier again, that would be hard to guess? or do they use stuff like hashed strings for username / pwd etc. |
| 17:11.52 | beandog | josephscott, why do you say that? |
| 17:12.01 | beandog | josephscott, They seem to me to be completely separate anyway |
| 17:12.16 | josephscott | because 99% of people who claim to be implementing REST aren't actually implementing REST, just a part of it |
| 17:12.19 | beandog | I'm fairly certain I understand how REST works .. it just uses HTTP codes to send back status responses, etc. |
| 17:12.36 | josephscott | that's only a portion of REST |
| 17:12.58 | beandog | josephscott, well, yah, I know its a portion .. theres more to it than that, but I like the idea of using it as the model for CRUD ... using PUT, DELETE, POST and GET |
| 17:13.01 | josephscott | that and depending on which "expert" you talk to which parts of REST are important are completely different |
| 17:13.02 | beandog | I think that's brilliant |
| 17:13.14 | josephscott | brilliant to a point |
| 17:13.21 | beandog | Well, simple. :) |
| 17:13.34 | josephscott | many firewalls block any HTTP request verb that isn't GET or POST |
| 17:13.43 | josephscott | I've been down the road with AtomPub |
| 17:13.53 | beandog | Right. Thats why you check for _method within POST though, right? |
| 17:13.58 | josephscott | people get bogged down in details that almost never matter |
| 17:14.24 | josephscott | that's one common work around, which breaks that portion of the REST module |
| 17:14.42 | josephscott | in the end you'll find sticking with GET and POST isn't really a problem |
| 17:14.53 | josephscott | so don't get bogged down in details that don't actually do anything for you |
| 17:15.14 | josephscott | the amount of wasted time discussing/arguing over the different between POST and PUT in HTTP is a shame |
| 17:16.21 | beandog | Okay |
| 17:16.57 | josephscott | the facebook graph api is a nice clean example http://developers.facebook.com/docs/reference/api/ |
| 17:17.08 | josephscott | and I don't even like facebook, but that api is a work of art |
| 17:17.22 | redroy | so checking for a method within GET is ok |
| 17:17.24 | redroy | ? |
| 17:17.57 | josephscott | ok in what way? it is not strictly speaking REST at that point |
| 17:18.08 | beandog | josephscott, I think thats a bit over my head at this point |
| 17:19.14 | beandog | but thanks for the help :) |
| 17:19.26 | redroy | I'm mean, referring to your comment about sticking with GET and POST not being a problem |
| 17:19.29 | beandog | Im gonna go see if I can figure out cookies |
| 17:19.43 | beandog | redroy, I think its only sent in POST |
| 17:19.43 | mindjuju | i like cookies |
| 17:19.49 | mindjuju | especially choco chip ones |
| 17:20.05 | josephscott | my wife makes great chocolate chip cookies |
| 17:20.08 | beandog | redroy, well, at least, in my playing with it ... if I send a PUT request, it will be interpreted as a POST one. But it'll have _method=put in there |
| 17:20.14 | josephscott | redroy: that's part of my "don't worry about REST" moto |
| 17:20.16 | beandog | redroy, same with delete |
| 17:20.41 | josephscott | beandog: probably because your webserver doesn't support those verbs |
| 17:20.47 | beandog | josephscott, I imagine. |
| 17:20.58 | beandog | but it does give a workaround to accepting them properly |
| 17:22.02 | beandog | SunSparc, cool blog, btw |
| 17:22.37 | SunSparc | beandog: Thanks!! Which one? |
| 17:22.46 | beandog | http://bluesun7.com/jonathan/ |
| 17:22.59 | SunSparc | Heh, thanks. |
| 17:23.10 | beandog | SunSparc, er that is yours right |
| 17:23.13 | beandog | :) |
| 17:23.15 | SunSparc | Yeppers. |
| 17:23.21 | beandog | lol, that would be bad .. |
| 17:23.30 | SunSparc | heh, yeah |
| 17:23.41 | josephscott | SunSparc: time to update WP :-) |
| 17:23.45 | redroy | I still have a lot to learn with that stuff⦠|
| 17:24.02 | SunSparc | beandog: On the blog topic. I have enjoyed your blog as well. |
| 17:24.03 | beandog | redroy, what are you working on? |
| 17:24.23 | SunSparc | josephscott: You could say that any day of the week and still be correct about a WP blog. |
| 17:24.27 | beandog | SunSparc, yah? Thanks man. I wish I would write more. I could see it becoming more stuff on scriptures. |
| 17:24.56 | josephscott | SunSparc: c'mon now, not that hard to upgrade |
| 17:25.04 | beandog | You know what I hate most about upgrading? |
| 17:25.07 | SunSparc | josephscott: I know I know. :D |
| 17:25.09 | beandog | That stupid hello dolly app. |
| 17:25.12 | redroy | beandog, I'm playing with an iphone app that ties into my framework⦠it's working fine but now I'm not sure it's "right" |
| 17:25.20 | beandog | I swear that thing pisses me off for some reason something fierce. |
| 17:25.26 | beandog | I delete it with a fury. |
| 17:25.27 | josephscott | well hello dolly ... |
| 17:25.52 | beandog | redroy, well, between you and me, I think josephscott is a bit biased towards some things. ;) |
| 17:26.33 | beandog | I hope my WP install doesnt have some massive security hole |
| 17:26.35 | josephscott | I'm strongly biased towards simple |
| 17:26.47 | macnewbold | it's a bias that is well justified though |
| 17:26.55 | beandog | josephscott, its all good man .. I'm well biased towards customization |
| 17:27.06 | redroy | ha ha, I like simple |
| 17:27.16 | josephscott | beandog: upgrading wouldn't hurt |
| 17:27.39 | josephscott | setup one click install, will take about 1 minute to do the upgrade |
| 17:27.43 | beandog | Great, now I have hello dolly stuck in my head. |
| 17:27.52 | beandog | one click install? |
| 17:27.57 | beandog | is that were you need FTP access? |
| 17:28.18 | beandog | Plus write access to the fs from the webserver? |
| 17:28.23 | beandog | Im guessing |
| 17:28.41 | josephscott | http://codex.wordpress.org/Updating_WordPress |
| 17:28.46 | josephscott | automatic upgrade |
| 17:28.55 | josephscott | there are several methods |
| 17:29.05 | beandog | You know what would make everything simple? |
| 17:29.08 | josephscott | if the webserver has write access it will do the upgrade directly |
| 17:29.10 | beandog | put all the code in the database |
| 17:29.10 | josephscott | or via ftp |
| 17:29.11 | SunSparc | automatic upgrade is scary |
| 17:29.12 | josephscott | or via ssh |
| 17:29.16 | beandog | then you just select it, and parse it! |
| 17:29.17 | beandog | :D |
| 17:29.34 | beandog | brilliant! |
| 17:29.42 | beandog | I can't possibly imagine that being abused. |
| 17:29.44 | josephscott | haha, simple isn't the only factor :-) |
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| 17:29.56 | tierra | speaking of automatic installs... I'm normally extremely opposed to the idea of either giving ownership of any site file to the webserver, or making the files webserver-writable through any other means, but if it's specifically requested, I'll make some attempt to set it up as securely as possible... but, I could not get WP automatic plugin installs/upgrades working at all, no matter what I tried |
| 17:30.16 | josephscott | suphp |
| 17:30.21 | beandog | ha ha!</nelson> |
| 17:30.24 | josephscott | http://www.suphp.org/Home.html |
| 17:30.37 | beandog | I actually use SuExec |
| 17:30.39 | beandog | super go awesome. |
| 17:30.48 | tierra | it didn't matter if the webserver was the owner of the files (and plugin folder) or if all of it was world-writable... it just would not work |
| 17:30.53 | josephscott | suexec is good too |
| 17:31.20 | josephscott | tierra: something probably missing then, it's worked fine for many people |
| 17:31.24 | tierra | would always give me a connection info form every time |
| 17:31.27 | beandog | Man |
| 17:31.39 | beandog | Dont you hate it when you think your ringer is turned off, but the reality is nobody wants to talk to you? |
| 17:31.51 | josephscott | gotta run, back later |
| 17:32.13 | mindjuju | beandog, everybody wants to talk with you |
| 17:32.17 | beandog | tierra, yah, giving write access to the web server makes me nervous |
| 17:32.19 | mindjuju | why, i was going to talk to you just the other day |
| 17:32.25 | beandog | mindjuju, oh yah? |
| 17:32.27 | beandog | mindjuju, thanks man |
| 17:32.29 | beandog | what were you gonna say |
| 17:32.34 | mindjuju | hai |
| 17:32.42 | beandog | o hai |
| 17:32.44 | beandog | guess what |
| 17:32.49 | mindjuju | whut |
| 17:32.51 | beandog | this weekend is the 2nd anniversary of my match w/my little bro |
| 17:32.52 | beandog | wooo |
| 17:32.58 | beandog | 2 years of fun times. |
| 17:33.03 | mindjuju | awesome! |
| 17:33.05 | beandog | man that went fast. |
| 17:33.13 | mindjuju | how is he doing? |
| 17:33.18 | beandog | He's doing great |
| 17:33.27 | beandog | He started junior high this year, and he likes it |
| 17:33.42 | mindjuju | LIKES? jr high? |
| 17:33.48 | beandog | Yah |
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| 17:34.45 | mindjuju | seems like jr high is full of angst, that era of pubescences where everybody struggles |
| 17:35.00 | beandog | I remember liking jr high, though for us it was middle school |
| 17:35.05 | beandog | I loved high school, too |
| 17:35.14 | mindjuju | oh man, high school rocked |
| 17:35.21 | beandog | heck, I loved elementary school too |
| 17:35.31 | beandog | university is pretty awesome too |
| 17:35.53 | beandog | mindjuju, were you emo? |
| 17:36.03 | mindjuju | nope |
| 17:36.13 | mindjuju | there was no emo when i was in school |
| 17:36.15 | beandog | well thats good |
| 17:36.18 | beandog | punk? |
| 17:36.32 | mindjuju | i never dressed punk, i've got to admit |
| 17:36.36 | beandog | mindjuju, if you feel like you missed out, can go emo right now. |
| 17:36.40 | beandog | its never too late! |
| 17:36.49 | mindjuju | there's a thought! |
| 17:37.22 | mindjuju | you going to UTOSC tonight? |
| 17:37.39 | beandog | mindjuju, http://www.wikihow.com/Be-Emo |
| 17:39.16 | beandog | mindjuju, me? n o. |
| 17:39.45 | mindjuju | i did spend a semester reading Anne Rice Vampire Series and listened to The Cure a bunch |
| 17:40.12 | beandog | did you run a lemonade stand too? |
| 17:40.15 | mindjuju | i can't think of what that clicke is called, but i don't think it was goth at the time |
| 17:40.27 | mindjuju | no, but i played it on Apple II |
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| 17:40.32 | beandog | Oh man |
| 17:40.34 | romanovic-afk | join #utah |
| 17:40.39 | romanovic-afk | oops |
| 17:40.42 | beandog | that game wasn't that great. |
| 17:40.55 | mindjuju | for the time it was fun |
| 17:41.01 | beandog | true. |
| 17:41.04 | beandog | I miss Bard's Tale. |
| 17:41.11 | beandog | Boy, they made games challenging back then. |
| 17:41.13 | mindjuju | that sounds familiar |
| 17:41.19 | beandog | Not to mention they would leave you COMPLETELY in the dark. |
| 17:41.49 | beandog | Oh, you're 12 levels down in the dungeon of TRAJAN and you just lost all your spells and your map, and it'd take you two hours to walk somewhere you can save your game? Good luck! |
| 17:42.00 | mindjuju | :) |
| 17:42.05 | beandog | Which is not an exaggeration at all. |
| 17:42.13 | mindjuju | reminds me of eye of the beholder |
| 17:42.18 | beandog | Ugh |
| 17:42.20 | beandog | I never got into those. |
| 17:42.28 | beandog | I dont like games where I'm perpetually lost. |
| 17:42.34 | beandog | Yet I'm constantly drawn to them for some odd reason. |
| 17:42.36 | beandog | Kind of like dating. |
| 17:43.00 | mindjuju | lately, my life has seemed a little like Zelda |
| 17:44.14 | mindjuju | i get ready to head to work and as I pick up my lunch it makes that this sound < http://noproblo.dayjo.org/ZeldaSounds/ > |
| 17:45.29 | mindjuju | and sometimes I have to get something purched up high and I need a step ladder, so i go out to the shed, fight off the spiders and spider webs, get the step ladder < http://noproblo.dayjo.org/ZeldaSounds/ > take it back to the house, put down the step ladder, grab the thing < http://noproblo.dayjo.org/ZeldaSounds/ > and then pack up the step ladder and continue on |
| 17:45.31 | mindjuju | weird |
| 17:45.54 | beandog | heh |
| 17:46.10 | beandog | ah man |
| 17:46.11 | beandog | good times. |
| 17:46.18 | beandog | You know what game Ive never beat |
| 17:46.27 | beandog | I just forgot the name. |
| 17:46.27 | mindjuju | ghosts and goblins? |
| 17:46.41 | beandog | Pools of darkness |
| 17:46.45 | beandog | Holy crap that game is BIG |
| 17:46.50 | beandog | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pools_of_Darkness |
| 17:47.10 | mindjuju | i'll have to check that out. here is ghost and goblins - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aLTQRJXzwP0 |
| 17:47.15 | mindjuju | remember this one? |
| 17:47.31 | beandog | Ive heard of it |
| 17:47.38 | beandog | good ol youtube |
| 17:47.49 | beandog | copyright scofflaws preserving our history where libraries can't |
| 17:47.51 | mindjuju | oh, my friend had Pools of darkness, i never played, but i know he finished cause he woke me up when he finished it |
| 17:48.26 | mindjuju | he's also the one that beat eye of beholder 1 and 2 |
| 17:48.33 | mindjuju | i only played a little of 2, never finished |
| 17:49.18 | mindjuju | i did beat diablo 2 using cheats :) |
| 17:49.49 | beandog | man |
| 17:49.52 | beandog | I miss those games so much |
| 17:50.04 | SunSparc | Wow, Ghosts and Goblins. I remember that one! Used to love it. |
| 17:50.09 | beandog | I dont have the same patience I did when I was 12 though |
| 17:50.11 | beandog | to play em now |
| 17:50.29 | mindjuju | did you ever play beyond zork or secret of monkey island?' |
| 17:51.32 | beandog | of course! |
| 17:51.39 | beandog | Ive solved first and second monkey islands |
| 17:51.44 | beandog | They have remakes on PS3 now too |
| 17:51.52 | mindjuju | i loved those games |
| 17:52.06 | beandog | So good |
| 17:52.10 | beandog | They dont make it like they used ot |
| 17:52.11 | mindjuju | scrumm foEVAR |
| 17:52.12 | beandog | *sniff* |
| 17:52.22 | mindjuju | did you ever play grim fandango? |
| 17:52.28 | beandog | yah |
| 17:52.35 | beandog | I never finished it tho |
| 17:52.42 | beandog | mindjuju, have you played uh .. the one with the biker? |
| 17:52.47 | mindjuju | of course |
| 17:52.49 | mindjuju | Full Throttle |
| 17:52.52 | beandog | whats it called? |
| 17:52.53 | beandog | yah thats it |
| 17:52.55 | beandog | good game. |
| 17:53.14 | mindjuju | it's hard to say which is better between secret, full throttle and grim |
| 17:53.20 | mindjuju | they are all, just solid solid games |
| 17:53.21 | beandog | pfft |
| 17:53.23 | beandog | secret, all the way |
| 17:53.43 | beandog | the monkey island games rawk. |
| 17:54.12 | mindjuju | did you see they changes lara croft inot more of a shooter than a puzzle solver |
| 17:59.45 | beandog | man, I was looking for ScummVM for android |
| 17:59.49 | beandog | it doesnt work on my version. :C |
| 18:00.02 | mindjuju | which one does it work for? |
| 18:00.27 | mindjuju | wouldn't that be cool if there was a SCUMM emulator for android? i still have my monkey island installs |
| 18:01.06 | beandog | I found the original floppies at DI one day |
| 18:02.10 | mindjuju | score! |
| 18:02.16 | beandog | 5" too :D |
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| 18:07.48 | mindjuju | curiously enough, i've missplaced my mysql sock |
| 18:07.54 | mindjuju | i wonder if it is in the dryer? |
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| 18:13.13 | mindjuju | so, if i said find / -name 'mysql.sock' 2>/dev/null , why did it only take a moment to do its thing and return nothing? |
| 18:13.18 | mindjuju | ^^ @fungus |
| 18:13.44 | mindjuju | like 5 seconds total |
| 18:13.54 | mindjuju | doubt it searched everything in that time, did it? |
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| 18:18.50 | beandog | mindjuju, I doubt it |
| 18:19.16 | beandog | what user did you run it as |
| 18:19.18 | mindjuju | where's the doc on it though? |
| 18:19.22 | beandog | it'll do all depth possible by default |
| 18:19.29 | mindjuju | oh |
| 18:19.42 | beandog | I imagine you might be getting a lot of permission denied |
| 18:19.49 | beandog | but that command should work |
| 18:20.06 | beandog | Throw in -type f for the fun of it |
| 18:20.14 | mindjuju | oh, i think i know iwhat it is |
| 18:20.47 | mindjuju | nope, i'm in the / directory |
| 18:24.29 | mindjuju | -type does nothing |
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| 18:29.32 | romanovic | ~give me tabasco |
| 18:29.32 | ibot | ACTION gives tabasco to romanovic |
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| 18:29.54 | beandog | ~hail poeticintensity |
| 18:29.54 | ibot | ACTION bows down to poeticintensity and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!" |
| 18:30.05 | beandog | Oh, I wanted the ice from t he sky one. |
| 18:39.30 | mindjuju | k, that's weird, i said whereis mysqld.sock and mysqld responded mysqld: |
| 18:39.35 | mindjuju | i wonder what that meand |
| 18:40.59 | mindjuju | k, that's uber weird |
| 18:41.22 | mindjuju | i said mysql --print-defaults and it returned back nuthin |
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| 19:03.15 | beandog | mindjuju, sounds like you got problems. |
| 19:04.14 | mindjuju | yeah, i think i'm having conflicts with versions in the mysql |
| 19:17.06 | beandog | Okay, Im still not getting this with cookies ... |
| 19:17.37 | beandog | ugh. |
| 19:20.09 | SunSparc | beandog: what is your problem? I have not been following along. |
| 19:20.27 | beandog | SunSparc, so, I'm back to the issue of fetching data using JS, through an HTTP API |
| 19:20.42 | beandog | SunSparc, fex, say you have http://foo/user/13 that returns a JSON string of data on that user |
| 19:21.04 | beandog | a JavaScript function would make an AJAX request to get that data |
| 19:21.28 | beandog | My question, though is, how would you authenticate that the client has proper access? |
| 19:21.33 | beandog | JavaScript can access HTTP cookies |
| 19:21.53 | beandog | so basically Im looking at how to securely *rely* on cookie data (i.e. logged in as this user) |
| 19:22.18 | beandog | The idea being, that, in the HTTP API, authentication is determined by what's in their cookie. |
| 19:23.34 | beandog | The only thing I can think of right now, is getting the PHP session id. |
| 19:23.47 | SunSparc | Hmmm, I see your dilemma... |
| 19:23.48 | beandog | And making sure that the user logged in is tagged in a relationship to that. |
| 19:24.07 | beandog | But, since cookies are insecure, and other stuff can read them ... that seems like poor security |
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| 19:24.28 | beandog | You can't really rely on IP addresses either .. could be a gateway, or a proxy, etc. |
| 19:24.57 | beandog | I mean, just relying on having cookie data match whatever the server has seems fallible, if others can get access to the cookie |
| 19:25.01 | beandog | Unless Im totally missing something here. |
| 19:25.19 | beandog | Oh, wait. |
| 19:25.28 | beandog | I just realized something. While the cookie could be passed around |
| 19:25.43 | beandog | The PHP session ID would still be unique to that visitor. |
| 19:25.52 | beandog | And any new client would get a new session ID. |
| 19:25.56 | SunSparc | Yes |
| 19:26.09 | beandog | That could pass off the argument to, "how secure are PHP sessions" then |
| 19:26.23 | beandog | right? |
| 19:26.42 | SunSparc | You should only store data in cookies that is security insensitive or encrypted. |
| 19:27.08 | SunSparc | Yeah, sess id's in cookies are how it works and does a decent job. |
| 19:27.29 | beandog | Okay |
| 19:27.33 | beandog | Well it seems like that would work reasonably ... |
| 19:27.44 | beandog | If the session IDs match, then grant access |
| 19:27.58 | beandog | based on the user's access level attached to that session ID |
| 19:28.05 | beandog | Which means I have to track session IDs in the DB |
| 19:28.11 | SunSparc | Though session id's can be spoofed. |
| 19:28.17 | beandog | Bleh. |
| 19:28.27 | beandog | How the heck do people do this, then? |
| 19:28.55 | SunSparc | Though guessing a session id would be difficult without gaining access to a users machine or doing a man in the middle attack. |
| 19:29.14 | SunSparc | I am talking theoretically. |
| 19:29.16 | beandog | I guess what I need to do is research web services authentication stuff |
| 19:29.19 | beandog | SunSparc, right |
| 19:29.35 | SunSparc | The probability is likely very low. |
| 19:29.38 | beandog | I'm kind of in the same boat as web services .. authorizing requests from random sources. |
| 19:30.11 | beandog | I can't believe I'm the first one to run into this .. and I'm getting frustrated not knowing what to search for. :T |
| 19:30.25 | SunSparc | I am sure you are not. |
| 19:33.19 | beandog | It feels like there must be a simpler way ... and I'm totally missing the boat on some obvious protocol or technology. |
| 19:33.26 | beandog | that's already out there. |
| 19:34.17 | beandog | Can the request headers be spoofed? |
| 19:34.32 | beandog | So that the server thinks that a request is coming from its own box? |
| 19:34.42 | DexterTheDragon | beandog: where is you? |
| 19:34.51 | beandog | DexterTheDragon, working like a dawg |
| 19:35.06 | DexterTheDragon | lamerz |
| 19:35.10 | beandog | yarr |
| 19:35.16 | DexterTheDragon | you should be at utosc |
| 19:35.22 | beandog | yarr |
| 19:36.08 | SunSparc | beandog: pretty much all headers can be spoofed. |
| 19:36.16 | beandog | SunSparc, thats what I figured. |
| 19:42.43 | beandog | Okay |
| 19:42.53 | beandog | It looks like people use HTTP authentication over SSL |
| 19:44.49 | beandog | How the heck do you do that with JS though |
| 19:44.58 | beandog | questions, questions, questions! |
| 19:45.00 | beandog | :) |
| 19:45.02 | SunSparc | :) |
| 19:45.18 | SunSparc | I would assume you just add s to http in the request url? |
| 19:45.29 | mindjuju | thats why i switched from coding in PHP to coding in lolcode |
| 19:45.33 | beandog | SunSparc, no, I mean stuff like apache digest authentication |
| 19:45.40 | beandog | where you pass a username / password |
| 19:45.57 | SunSparc | ~lart mindjuju |
| 19:45.57 | ibot | brandishes Excalibur! "With this sword, I vanquish thee, mindjuju!" and lops off mindjuju's head |
| 19:46.07 | beandog | Those are sent over SSL, though, so it's secure |
| 19:46.08 | mindjuju | o hai; skure https; kthxbye |
| 19:46.13 | SunSparc | beandog: something like curl... |
| 19:46.26 | beandog | SunSparc, yah, but JavaScript is the client, not PHP |
| 19:46.34 | SunSparc | mindjuju: LOL, I dare you to actually create that programming language. |
| 19:46.41 | SunSparc | beandog: yep |
| 19:46.46 | mindjuju | create? it already exists! |
| 19:47.07 | mindjuju | not only that, but eggyknap built a translation layer for postgres to use lolcode |
| 19:47.57 | mindjuju | sql lolcode would make life so much easier |
| 19:48.02 | eggyknap | Not so much a translation layer as a postgres-based interpreter |
| 19:48.17 | mindjuju | ah |
| 19:48.26 | mindjuju | see though sunsparc |
| 19:48.34 | mindjuju | lolcode ... it's where its at |
| 19:48.57 | beandog | Okay |
| 19:48.59 | beandog | food run! |
| 19:49.06 | SunSparc | heh |
| 19:50.18 | mindjuju | sunsparc, here is the official site for lolcode - http://lolcode.com/ |
| 19:50.50 | eggyknap | There's someone else that wrote something called LOLSQL, which is really a translation sort of thing. Not sure if it still has an internet presence |
| 19:51.12 | mindjuju | oh my |
| 19:51.21 | mindjuju | eggyknap, somebody has lolcode bash |
| 19:51.25 | mindjuju | it's under news |
| 19:51.47 | mindjuju | alias cya='reboot' |
| 19:51.47 | mindjuju | alias kthxbai='halt' |
| 19:52.22 | eggyknap | FWIW, this is by a friend of mine: http://github.com/jnthn/lolsql/ |
| 19:54.31 | mindjuju | that's awesome! |
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| 19:59.54 | mindjuju | i hera they rip people apart in #utah, maybe i'll try centos |
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| 20:35.33 | SunSparc | Umm... net split!? |
| 20:35.40 | SunSparc | ~lart net splits |
| 20:35.40 | ibot | puts net splits into a headlock and administers a mighty noogie, rubbing half of net splits's hair of |
| 20:39.38 | SunSparc | Would you vote for the mayor of Sim City? http://tumblr.com/x39kwn0fm |
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| 20:47.38 | beandog | mindjuju, beware #utah |
| 20:47.45 | beandog | actually, beware any rpm based system. |
| 20:48.09 | beandog | lolcode? |
| 20:48.10 | beandog | srsly? |
| 20:48.20 | mindjuju | lolcode is the way to go |
| 20:48.21 | beandog | alias onoz='cat /var/log/errors.log' |
| 20:48.22 | beandog | lol |
| 20:48.23 | mindjuju | way of future |
| 20:48.30 | mindjuju | isn't that awesome! |
| 20:48.40 | beandog | Im totally adding some of these. |
| 20:48.43 | mindjuju | :) |
| 20:48.47 | beandog | alias inur='locate' |
| 20:48.53 | beandog | alias nomnom='killall' |
| 20:49.12 | beandog | behold, the power of the internet |
| 20:53.43 | SunSparc | lol |
| 20:53.59 | cycokilr | lame |
| 20:54.22 | SunSparc | allz yur bases r blong to ceiling cat |
| 20:54.43 | beandog | ~lol |
| 20:54.44 | ibot | lol is, like, stands for Laughs Out Loud. It is grammatically incorrect to use LOL in the first person; use 'heh' or 'haha' instead. If you want to use LOL, do '/me lol' instead. |
| 20:54.58 | beandog | heh |
| 20:55.14 | beandog | ~grammar police |
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| 20:56.27 | beandog | ~ohai poeticintensity |
| 20:57.52 | macnewbold | ~lol beandog |
| 20:57.53 | ibot | ACTION Laughs out Loud at beandog |
| 20:58.05 | macnewbold | ~asplode magento |
| 20:58.05 | ibot | magento head asplode, k thx |
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| 21:13.27 | mindjuju | macnewbold, aren't you presenting on magento? |
| 21:14.18 | macnewbold | yeah |
| 21:14.29 | mindjuju | but you not like now? |
| 21:14.30 | macnewbold | it's going to be a no-holds-barred pros-and-cons |
| 21:14.34 | mindjuju | ah |
| 21:14.36 | mindjuju | sound good |
| 21:14.39 | macnewbold | i think it's the best one out there, |
| 21:14.45 | macnewbold | but it still has its painful parts |
| 21:14.55 | mindjuju | i wonder what an ecomm cart would look like if it were written in lolcode |
| 21:15.36 | macnewbold | but i'll take magento over any of the others, usually including building custom too |
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| 21:22.15 | mindjuju | sunsparc helmet cat > ceiling cat |
| 21:22.17 | mindjuju | http://www2.idl.dundee.ac.uk/desethno/files/2009/12/helmet-cat.jpg |
| 21:22.34 | SunSparc | lol |
| 21:22.42 | SunSparc | Yep, I see that every time I log into steam |
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| 21:22.56 | mindjuju | oh yeah! we're buddies on steam |
| 21:23.01 | SunSparc | Indeed |
| 21:23.08 | mindjuju | we do you want to get together and lose to me in TF2? |
| 21:23.15 | mindjuju | err, i mean play |
| 21:23.16 | mindjuju | sorry! |
| 21:23.28 | mindjuju | ;) |
| 21:23.30 | SunSparc | hehe |
| 21:23.42 | SunSparc | As soon as I can get over my addiction to MW2 |
| 21:25.51 | mindjuju | they've changed a bunch about the game with this latest patch |
| 21:25.57 | mindjuju | different hats, weapons, etc |
| 21:26.01 | mindjuju | it's different |
| 21:28.32 | SunSparc | Last time I logged in I got me an iPod for my Heavy because I am a Mac user. |
| 21:30.26 | mindjuju | :) |
| 21:30.59 | mindjuju | so riddle me this, how can a file cause a conflict with another file if it doesn't exist on the system? |
| 21:31.09 | macnewbold | svn conflict, or other? |
| 21:31.15 | mindjuju | no svn |
| 21:31.17 | mindjuju | yum install |
| 21:32.05 | mindjuju | @macnewbold - http://www.pastebin.ca/1957186 |
| 21:32.16 | mindjuju | they haunt me from beyond the grave |
| 21:38.53 | beandog | Now I can't find anything on doing authentication with REST |
| 21:38.55 | beandog | o.O |
| 21:39.01 | beandog | heh |
| 21:39.09 | beandog | Either this a massive learning curve, or I'm totally going down the wrong road. |
| 21:45.14 | wps | rain, rain, go away |
| 21:45.17 | wps | I need to stain my deck |
| 21:45.29 | SunSparc | It is hailing where I am right now. |
| 21:46.28 | beandog | man |
| 21:46.31 | beandog | weve barely gotten ANY rain |
| 21:46.40 | beandog | you guys are lucky |
| 21:46.40 | beandog | :C |
| 21:47.31 | SunSparc | Where are you beandog? |
| 21:47.38 | beandog | Taylorsville / SLC |
| 21:48.33 | SunSparc | ~send beandog all the hail |
| 21:48.34 | ibot | Go (.*?), beandog |
| 21:48.49 | beandog | SunSparc, lols |
| 21:48.54 | beandog | ibot, fail |
| 21:48.54 | ibot | FAIL. |
| 21:49.10 | SunSparc | :) |
| 22:12.46 | *** join/#uphpu josephscott (~josephsco@74.200.246.169) |
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| 22:14.32 | mgeary | hey, is there a way to take an HTML div and scale it to X-percent? |
| 22:15.06 | mgeary | and have everything in the div just grow/shrink accordingly? |
| 22:15.44 | SunSparc | mgeary: Command + + |
| 22:15.52 | SunSparc | :) |
| 22:16.02 | mgeary | SunSparc: heh. yeah, that's what i'm wanting to be able to avoid |
| 22:16.22 | SunSparc | mgeary: Try using em's instead of pixels. |
| 22:16.35 | SunSparc | Supposedly they scale very well. |
| 22:16.40 | mgeary | we were given a spec at ~1900 pixels wide, and now we're supposed to implement it at ~1024 pixels wide |
| 22:40.27 | orsonj | yeah, only works if everything inside it was defined in percentages |
| 22:41.34 | orsonj | or ems might work also, but then you change the font size for the div instead of the size |
| 22:47.40 | orsonj | In my perfect world, you do both. That way you can scale everything up for the optically challanged (or those who sit six feet away from their screen) and not have to use double scroll bars. |
| 22:48.10 | orsonj | Or scale things down because you have a six foot screen two feet in front of you and get tons of extra space to work with. |
| 22:51.23 | mgeary | well, in my case, ideally the browser window would dictate the size |
| 22:51.40 | mgeary | i'll need to explore using ems versus % |
| 22:51.54 | mgeary | but it's a real shame you can't just set a "scale" attribute on a div |
| 22:53.46 | orsonj | heh double scrollbars OMG It's so ugly! double scrollbars!! |
| 22:54.22 | orsonj | ok, now that I've got that meme out of my system |
| 22:55.52 | orsonj | One website I have to use for school has nested scrollbars. |
| 22:56.03 | orsonj | It's so annoying to use |
| 22:56.24 | SunSparc | ~shun double scrollbars |
| 22:56.25 | ibot | You are dead to me, double scrollbars. |
| 23:02.44 | orsonj | http://orson.tetratech.info/double_scrollbars.png |
| 23:05.28 | orsonj | That screenshot could be the basis for a game of spot the design flaws |
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