| 00:00.37 | mgeary | ~wimp wps |
| 00:00.45 | wps | no way, man |
| 00:00.47 | wps | I do it the old fashioned way |
| 00:00.51 | wps | no snowblower here |
| 00:00.59 | mgeary | snowblowers++ |
| 00:01.21 | wps | anything exciting happened in here the past few weeks? |
| 00:01.24 | wps | I feel so disconnected |
| 00:01.49 | mgeary | well, mindjuju has promised to get rid of his guns and stop shopping at WalMart |
| 00:02.54 | wps | what? |
| 00:02.57 | wps | yeah right |
| 00:03.05 | wps | speaking of guns |
| 00:03.08 | wps | I just bought one |
| 00:03.15 | wps | swore I would never own one |
| 00:03.44 | wps | I was never against guns or gun ownership, just didn't want one in my home |
| 00:03.49 | wps | but I have changed my mind |
| 00:04.00 | mgeary | bah |
| 00:04.41 | mgeary | what changed your mind? Can we change it back for you? |
| 00:05.07 | wps | I decided to spend christmas getting more preparedâ¦Â no gifts this year |
| 00:05.33 | wps | I got a another 12 months of food storage and a gun to protect my family (and hunt with if needed) |
| 00:05.40 | wps | you anti gun? |
| 00:05.41 | mgeary | so it's a rifle |
| 00:05.46 | mgeary | not a handgun |
| 00:05.51 | wps | no, it's a hand gun |
| 00:05.53 | mgeary | psh |
| 00:05.57 | mgeary | hunting with a handgun? |
| 00:06.03 | mgeary | you got it to kill people with |
| 00:06.05 | wps | it's better than hunting with a stick |
| 00:06.09 | mgeary | that's all you ever get a handgun for |
| 00:06.18 | mgeary | yeah, i'm anti-gun |
| 00:06.29 | wps | yes, I mostly got it to stop someone from killing/raping my wife and children |
| 00:07.30 | wps | I would like to get a rifle as well thoughâ¦Â to be prepared to hunt if needed |
| 00:07.56 | wps | did you really talk mindjuju into getting rid of his? |
| 00:08.34 | mgeary | nah. i'm not that persuasive |
| 00:08.39 | wps | :) |
| 00:08.41 | mgeary | and i don't really know if mindjuju even has one |
| 00:08.44 | wps | so get this⦠|
| 00:08.56 | wps | I spent the afternoon at the credit union applying for a refinance |
| 00:09.10 | wps | and right when we are closing up and then are locking in my rate, the computer locks |
| 00:09.21 | wps | (not freezes, but the rate portion is temporarily disabled) |
| 00:09.34 | wps | â¦as markets were closing on the East Coast and the system was updating |
| 00:09.58 | wps | so I have to sit for forty-five minutes until the rate portion of their system is updated and available againtâ¦Â and |
| 00:10.04 | wps | the rate had gone up!!! |
| 00:10.06 | wps | arrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrg |
| 00:10.18 | mgeary | bummer |
| 00:10.22 | wps | so I didn't lock |
| 00:10.27 | wps | I'll wait for tomorrow to see what happens |
| 00:10.41 | wps | frustrating though |
| 00:10.46 | wps | if only I wasn't so long-winded |
| 00:11.21 | mgeary | what're you getting? 30-year fixed? having to pay new closing costs? getting about 4.5% ? |
| 00:11.32 | wps | yup, 30 fixed at 4.5 |
| 00:11.47 | mgeary | what about closing costs? |
| 00:11.53 | wps | I currently have two (an 80/20) at 6.5 and 7.8 |
| 00:12.01 | wps | I'll be moving both of those into a single 30 year at 4.5 |
| 00:12.17 | wps | the rate would be 4.875, so I'll be buying down to 4.5, so⦠|
| 00:12.28 | wps | that with the closing costs will be about 6k |
| 00:12.39 | wps | very worth it though |
| 00:12.45 | mgeary | probably so |
| 00:12.50 | wps | if I keep paying what I am currently, I'll pay it off in 20 instead of 30 |
| 00:12.57 | mgeary | nice |
| 00:13.18 | mgeary | we went for the 15-year loan, so our rate is fairly low anyway. Doesn't make sense to refi |
| 00:14.33 | wps | I'd like to do a 15. It'd increase our monthly by 200 though. I like the option of having a low minimum and then just paying extra. It gives you a safety net if you call on hard times |
| 00:14.45 | mgeary | yeah, i can see that perspective |
| 00:14.55 | wps | my new 30 will be 1200 a month. If I pay $500 on top of that each month, I'll pay it off in 15 years instead of 30 |
| 00:16.06 | mgeary | first home? |
| 00:16.20 | wps | technically, yes, but second time owning |
| 00:16.22 | wps | first place was a condo |
| 00:16.26 | mgeary | aha |
| 00:31.22 | itimber | I'm out guys.... later |
| 01:22.10 | mindjuju | k, i'm back |
| 01:22.26 | mindjuju | i didn't spend 5 hours on snow, just 2 and a half with a snow blower |
| 01:23.02 | mindjuju | wps, i did promise to not shop for kids toys at wal-mart because i want Corban to have a toy store experience, ie toysrus, where there are actually toys out for him to try out and play with |
| 01:23.11 | mindjuju | and there is an actual variety of toys |
| 01:23.14 | mindjuju | not just the cheap stuff |
| 01:23.35 | wps | sounds great |
| 01:23.41 | mindjuju | as for guns, i actually found too i'm buying, a rifle and a shotgun |
| 01:23.47 | mindjuju | but won't be buying them for another week or so |
| 01:24.04 | mindjuju | as for Christmas, we bought Corban some stuff, but just like you, everything else went to food storage |
| 01:24.24 | wps | yeah, we got a couple toys for the kids, but nothing for us |
| 01:24.38 | mindjuju | freezer packed full with meats, and we still need to finish buying some stuff |
| 01:24.47 | mindjuju | we have the money, just wating for the sales |
| 01:24.52 | mindjuju | caselot sale in january |
| 01:24.54 | wps | http://shearerfam.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/more_food_storage.jpg |
| 01:25.18 | mindjuju | sis-in-law 's dad works at a grocery store (manager) and is advising us on when to buy stuff |
| 01:25.24 | wps | very nice |
| 01:25.51 | mindjuju | that's freakin awesome |
| 01:25.57 | mindjuju | you got to feel good about that |
| 01:25.58 | wps | I canned 340 cans |
| 01:26.37 | mindjuju | that's awesome |
| 01:26.47 | wps | i'll be back in a bitâ¦Â got to go take cookies to the neighbors |
| 01:26.52 | mindjuju | i need to compare distribution rice v bags o rice |
| 01:26.57 | mindjuju | k, cya |
| 01:29.03 | mgeary | wps: did i ever ask you if you were related to someone with your last name from Provo? Matt? |
| 01:30.02 | mindjuju | for mgeary & wps - http://www.utahpreppers.com/2008/12/preparedness-humor-reasons/ |
| 01:30.11 | mindjuju | oh, sorry, language warning |
| 01:30.13 | mindjuju | sorry! |
| 01:31.02 | mindjuju | jsmith, you around? |
| 01:31.19 | mgeary | later folks |
| 01:31.25 | mindjuju | cya mgeary |
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| 03:25.32 | Utah_Dave | ~ping mindjuju |
| 03:25.33 | jbot | pong mindjuju |
| 03:32.10 | wps | no, mgeary, no relations in Provo |
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| 16:13.58 | mindjuju | wow, football ain't no weak pansy sport! - http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/When-officials-attack-Umpire-lowers-the-boom-on?urn=nfl,130799 |
| 16:14.04 | mindjuju | ref gets in the action! |
| 16:31.31 | mindjuju | herlo - this follows what we were talking about the other day - http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081222-isp-to-riaa-outsourced-piracy-protection-isnt-free.html |
| 16:32.00 | mindjuju | they may do it for a while, but i don't see the RIAA doing this for long as they slowly shift their business mdoel |
| 16:32.06 | mindjuju | err, model |
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| 16:48.43 | herlo | mindjuju: I know about that |
| 16:48.55 | herlo | mindjuju: and I agree |
| 16:55.23 | Utah_Dave | mindjuju: that dude is going to be mocked for the rest of his career! that was hilarious |
| 17:39.52 | mindjuju | ~apb eggyknap |
| 17:39.53 | jbot | ACTION hires Leland to rough up eggyknap |
| 17:41.43 | eggyknap | :) |
| 17:41.56 | mindjuju | heya eggyknap |
| 17:42.02 | mindjuju | have a sql question if you don't mind |
| 17:42.09 | eggyknap | hola. And I certainly don't mind. |
| 17:43.33 | mindjuju | k, i have a table in sql with a column, fld_example, now i need to check the contents of fld_example. So if fld_example contains "3" then do something |
| 17:43.38 | mindjuju | on a PHP level, I can do this |
| 17:43.42 | mindjuju | but i've seen it done in SQL |
| 17:43.54 | mindjuju | and I'd like to understand / do it in SQL |
| 17:44.17 | mindjuju | what is that called, that programming language that sql allows? |
| 17:45.24 | eggyknap | That depends on the database you're using. Oracle allows Cobol, Java, PL/SQL, and C, I think. M$ SQL allows T-SQL (and perhaps other stuff). PostgreSQL allows most of the languages you can think of, and MySQL allows mostly nothing. |
| 17:46.04 | mindjuju | what do you think about doing that stuff in SQL |
| 17:46.14 | mindjuju | is it good, or should i use PHP to do it? |
| 17:46.20 | eggyknap | In PostgreSQL, I'd write a stored procedure to do whatever it is that you're trying to do with those records, and call something like this: SELECT run_my_code(some_arguments) FROM my_table WHERE fld_example = 3 |
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| 17:46.58 | SunSparc | HO HO HO!!!!! |
| 17:47.12 | mindjuju | Merry Christmas SunSparc |
| 17:47.23 | SunSparc | Merry Christmas mindjuju!! |
| 17:47.25 | eggyknap | This can be a religious war, but I strongly advocate doing it in the database when the function's purposes are heavily data-related. Those sorts of tasks include things like data integrity functions, data processing... anything that either uses tons of data or whose purposes are limited to the database. |
| 17:47.49 | eggyknap | If you're trying to, say, send email to everyone in a table based on some filter, there are lots of arguments for doing that in the application instead. |
| 17:48.01 | wps | I have a screen with two views. These two views are controlled with javascript. I need two URLs, one to load the first view and another to load the second. Since you can't pass a query parameter into javascript, the only way I can see to do it is to read a query parameter with PHP and then use PHP to write out javascript to load the appropriate view. Is there any better way to do this? |
| 17:48.04 | eggyknap | But if you're crunching lots of records, or doing data validation, in the database is a nice place. |
| 17:48.58 | mindjuju | @eggyknap - this is really sql housecleaning, so was thinking it would be more efficient to do it in SQL, totally agree with what you're saying |
| 17:50.04 | eggyknap | The arguments against doing lots of stored procedures in the database generally talk about how developers don't speak the PL/SQL et al., or how they want to be database-independent. |
| 17:50.17 | mindjuju | wps, i've only done this once, and a LONG TIME AGO, but i have parsed the query string in JS |
| 17:50.24 | mindjuju | here is something quick i googled - http://adamv.com/dev/javascript/querystring |
| 17:50.43 | mindjuju | good points on that, eggyknap |
| 17:50.44 | eggyknap | Most of the time, in-house apps never have to switch to some other database, so the latter argument sounds nice but is generally invalid. The first argument can make sense, though if you're using PostgreSQL you can probably write this code in a language you know. |
| 17:50.53 | wps | thanks |
| 17:51.00 | mindjuju | and truthfully, my tsql is limited to joins and queries and updates, etc |
| 17:51.05 | mindjuju | real elementary |
| 17:51.15 | mindjuju | i've seen the advanced stuff and would like to learn more |
| 17:51.25 | mindjuju | flesh out my dba skills a little |
| 17:52.22 | eggyknap | So it sounds like you went for the SQL Server position, then? |
| 17:52.23 | mindjuju | heh, :) |
| 17:52.56 | mindjuju | that fell through |
| 17:53.04 | mindjuju | but have always wanted to learn |
| 17:53.23 | eggyknap | Understandable. |
| 17:53.58 | mindjuju | wps, one thing though, while i think about it, when I was doing the parsing with JS, it was hard, real hard |
| 17:54.01 | mindjuju | and spotty |
| 17:54.12 | mindjuju | but that was at least 5 years ago |
| 17:55.24 | mindjuju | so wps, your two "views" do you mean iFrames or frames? |
| 17:55.39 | wps | neither |
| 17:55.50 | mindjuju | or are you saying "views" as some kind of state of the page |
| 17:55.57 | mindjuju | where this div is visible and those are not |
| 17:56.06 | wps | the later |
| 17:57.03 | wps | lemony steve? |
| 17:59.46 | mindjuju | you know, wps, now that I REALLY think about it, I want to pull my suggestion back on having JS parse the querystring. JS doesn't natively process it as far as i remember, and so the various ideas that people employ trying to do it usually involve making something in JS to handle it, like http://ilovethecode.com/Javascript/Javascript-Tutorials-How_To-Easy/Get_Query_String_Using_Javascript.shtml |
| 17:59.55 | mindjuju | and for me it was a LOT of trouble |
| 18:00.10 | mindjuju | would hate to send you down the wrong path |
| 18:02.01 | mindjuju | since it sounds like you might be doing something web 2.0ish, you may want to look at an event triggered off of xmlhttprequest or something |
| 18:05.31 | mindjuju | ~apb synic |
| 18:05.32 | jbot | ACTION summons Duane Lee to spray mace at synic |
| 18:23.33 | wps | ~Duane Lee |
| 18:23.49 | mindjuju | duane lee is one of the bounty hunters on Dog Teh bounty hunter |
| 18:23.57 | wps | ah |
| 18:24.06 | mindjuju | @ synic, if you get back after I leave, then Happy Bday Synic |
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| 19:13.52 | itimber | sup my brothas |
| 19:14.08 | wps | my cholesterol |
| 19:14.18 | itimber | lol |
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| 19:38.28 | Utah_Dave | Anybody have a second to double-check an SQL query with 2 LEFT JOINS for me? |
| 19:38.37 | Utah_Dave | I want to make sure it's doing what I think it's doing |
| 19:38.43 | Utah_Dave | http://stikked.com/view/59247233 |
| 19:40.18 | Utah_Dave | WorkOrders.WorkOrderID is unique |
| 19:40.54 | Utah_Dave | There can be 0 or more rows in Production and AssignmentHistory that have a matching WorkOrderID column |
| 19:41.44 | Utah_Dave | I want to make sure any and all rows in WorkOrders, AssignmentHistory and Production are deleted if PURGE is in the WorkOrders.Notes |
| 19:41.45 | mindjuju | yeah, that double left join is a little confusing for me |
| 19:41.58 | mindjuju | i'm not sure how that'll react, i'm sure it's fine, but i'm not sure what dataset that returns |
| 19:42.10 | Utah_Dave | I think it's doing what I want, but I'm not 100% sure |
| 19:42.13 | mindjuju | maybe eggyknap can speak to it, if he has time? he is resident sql pro |
| 19:42.49 | Utah_Dave | or macnewbold or jsmith-away |
| 19:43.27 | mindjuju | hey, jsmith is here! |
| 19:43.36 | jsmith | Yeah... just got back from a late lunch |
| 19:43.36 | mindjuju | usually when it's -away, he's gone for reals |
| 19:43.46 | jsmith | Perfect timing, eh? |
| 19:43.55 | Utah_Dave | yay! |
| 19:44.00 | mindjuju | so utah_dave had that one question about his join |
| 19:44.25 | mindjuju | and if you have a moment for a follow up question, i have one about his left join on a left join |
| 19:45.16 | jsmith | Yuck... a join on a delete? |
| 19:45.35 | Utah_Dave | yeah |
| 19:45.50 | jsmith | Is this MySQL or PostgreSQL? |
| 19:45.54 | Utah_Dave | MySQL |
| 19:46.09 | Utah_Dave | I already know you're opinion on that! |
| 19:46.10 | Utah_Dave | :) |
| 19:46.20 | jsmith | Yeah, but what do I know? |
| 19:46.40 | Utah_Dave | so do you think that query is doing what I'm hoping it's doing? |
| 19:46.48 | jsmith | No. |
| 19:46.57 | jsmith | But give me a second and I'll test it |
| 19:47.21 | Utah_Dave | Was I clear enough in my explanation? |
| 19:49.20 | jsmith | Yes... but the better way to do that is with enforced foreign keys |
| 19:49.29 | jsmith | But let me try some things here |
| 19:50.30 | eggyknap | DELETE FROM is cool. I didn't know MySQL supported it. |
| 19:50.50 | eggyknap | ...but I'm not sure how it reacts to joins in general. |
| 19:50.58 | unum | I should write that down.... I keep forgetting the command |
| 19:51.13 | DexterTheDragon | the joins look fine to me |
| 19:51.55 | Utah_Dave | ok |
| 19:53.23 | mindjuju | so while ya'll are testing, here's my question - a left join returns all records from table1 that match, even if there is no match in the second table, so a double left join ... does ... |
| 19:53.40 | herlo | anyone used web keepass?? http://sourceforge.net/projects/webkeepass/ |
| 19:54.37 | mindjuju | oh wait, i think i get it |
| 19:55.27 | mindjuju | workorders is table 1 and all its records get returned, even if there are 0 records in assignmenthistory or in production |
| 19:55.35 | mindjuju | :) |
| 19:56.14 | eggyknap | mindjuju: double joins join the results of the first join with the next table in the list. In general, the database system you're using has the option of doing the joins in some order other than the one you specify (without changing the result) for performance reasons |
| 19:57.38 | mindjuju | oh curious, so it does the first operation, left join workorders and assignmenthistory, THEN those results are left joined to the subsequent statement, left join production |
| 19:57.40 | mindjuju | curious |
| 19:57.48 | eggyknap | Right. |
| 19:59.39 | unum | my brother(an oracle DBA) of course recommended hte oracle books |
| 20:01.52 | jsmith | mindjuju: The secret is to understand the difference between a right join and a left join. |
| 20:02.02 | jsmith | mindjuju: Once you understand that, it's all downhill from there. |
| 20:03.26 | mindjuju | :) |
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| 20:17.06 | jsmith | Utah_Dave: Yeah, that query worked fine... I still prefer using foreign keys myself, but your way certainly works. |
| 20:26.10 | mindjuju | ~seen beandog |
| 20:26.11 | jbot | beandog <n=steve@gentoo/developer/beandog> was last seen on IRC in channel #uphpu, 3d 22h 34m 35s ago, saying: 'and theyre going west, too... not much that way'. |
| 20:30.44 | Utah_Dave | ok, thanks, jsmith |
| 20:30.52 | Utah_Dave | thanks for the input, everyone |
| 20:32.45 | itimber | : |
| 20:32.57 | itimber | that php.net still hasn't fixed us3.php.net |
| 20:33.00 | itimber | :( |
| 20:33.19 | itimber | I've had broken redirects for >1yr |
| 20:35.48 | jsmith | Utah_Dave: No worries... always happy to help |
| 20:36.16 | Utah_Dave | I really do appreciate it. |
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| 21:59.18 | jsmith | Well if it isn't wps! |
| 21:59.26 | wps | merry christmas |
| 22:00.36 | jsmith | You too! |
| 22:01.38 | wps | how's the weather over there? |
| 22:01.58 | wps | I shoveled a foot of snow yesterday |
| 22:02.27 | jsmith | I'd love some snow now |
| 22:02.31 | jsmith | Right now, it's 33 degrees out |
| 22:02.46 | wps | and they are predicting another 12" thursday |
| 22:03.11 | jsmith | We've had quite a bit of rain... and we're supposed to get some freezing rain tonight |
| 22:03.14 | jsmith | But no snow :-( |
| 22:03.23 | mindjuju | lucky you |
| 22:03.29 | mindjuju | snow is overrated |
| 22:03.34 | jsmith | mindjuju: No it's not |
| 22:04.02 | mindjuju | yeah, i spent 2.5 hours doing snow cleaning yesterday |
| 22:04.31 | jsmith | mindjuju: I'll trade you! |
| 22:04.39 | mindjuju | any day |
| 22:06.49 | wps | I love snow |
| 22:07.33 | mindjuju | oh, that may be, but i thought you meant a Virginia Christmas v Utah Christmas |
| 22:09.02 | _psychic_ | snow @ 33 degrees isn't snow for long, jsmith |
| 22:11.20 | jsmith | mindjuju: No, I'd still rather have Christmas here... but a Christmas with lots of snow would be even better |
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| 23:38.57 | mindjuju | anybody around? |
| 23:39.57 | eggyknap | Of course not. |
| 23:40.32 | mindjuju | hey, do you happen to know why they stopped manufactoring 750g PATA drives? |
| 23:40.47 | mindjuju | seems like the largest i can find is 500g |
| 23:41.01 | mindjuju | though i do have 2 750s i bought last Christmas |
| 23:41.09 | mindjuju | ah |
| 23:42.08 | mindjuju | and then you find stuff like this that is insanely overpriced - http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Seagate-750GB-16MB-IDE-PATA-Drive-w-Warranty_W0QQitemZ150315610005QQcmdZViewItem |
| 23:42.20 | mindjuju | where newegg does have 500g for like $80 |
| 23:43.14 | mindjuju | an extra 250g for another $140? |
| 23:43.56 | tierra | and where 1TB drives have been as cheap as $100... |
| 23:44.26 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 23:50.45 | SunSparc | Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night!!!!!!!!!!! |
| 23:51.24 | mindjuju | Merry Christmas SunSparc |
| 23:51.35 | SunSparc | :) |
| 23:57.10 | itimber | I'm out guys.... catch ya'll later |
| 23:57.27 | mindjuju | cya itimber |
