| 00:05.10 | mindjuju | man, what i wouldn't give for a nice porterhouse, well done and a baked potato |
| 00:05.27 | dataw0lf | that sounds tasty |
| 00:05.34 | dataw0lf | I'm calling the woman to address this issue presently. |
| 00:05.44 | mindjuju | how is your woman? |
| 00:05.50 | mindjuju | she seemed really nice |
| 00:06.05 | dataw0lf | she's doing good, it's just been hectic because she got promoted recently and we're in the middle of a move |
| 00:06.12 | dataw0lf | yea, she's pretty nice. |
| 00:06.35 | mindjuju | and she's got great taste in movies and music (if i recall, she was a big fan of the 80's) |
| 00:07.06 | dataw0lf | yea, she's 30, so it's 'her era' |
| 00:07.10 | mindjuju | ah the 80's... pinnacle of man's achievement |
| 00:07.33 | dataw0lf | heh |
| 00:08.12 | mindjuju | i can't think of a single movie from the 90's that gets quoted as often as one from the 80s |
| 00:08.53 | dataw0lf | Big Lebowski, Half-Baked |
| 00:09.00 | dataw0lf | Army of Darkness |
| 00:09.15 | dataw0lf | possibly the three most quoted movies of all time. You lose. |
| 00:10.08 | mindjuju | hmm... thought that was 89 |
| 00:10.15 | mindjuju | k, you got me on AoD |
| 00:10.17 | dataw0lf | 92, my friend |
| 00:10.27 | Kamehameha | thanks again dudes... over and out |
| 00:10.31 | mindjuju | cya |
| 00:10.33 | dataw0lf | Kamehameha: take care |
| 00:10.43 | Kamehameha | will do .. you do the same man ;) |
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| 02:37.27 | mindjuju | i am! |
| 02:37.30 | mindjuju | how did you know? |
| 02:40.53 | mindjuju | you still around Utah_Dave ? |
| 02:41.28 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dav2 (n=David@c-67-172-244-53.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 02:41.55 | Utah_Dav2 | mindjuju: I don't know that I've ever gotten into this channel and you not be here! |
| 02:42.35 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 02:42.39 | mindjuju | you going to be here for a while? |
| 02:42.42 | Utah_Dave | yeah |
| 02:42.56 | Utah_Dave | how about you? |
| 02:43.10 | mindjuju | yeah, need to tie down a project really fast |
| 02:47.20 | herlo | Utah_Dave: how's life? |
| 02:47.39 | Utah_Dave | pretty good! |
| 02:47.51 | Utah_Dave | Wife's expecting, unexpectedly! |
| 02:47.57 | herlo | wooo |
| 02:47.59 | Utah_Dave | yeah, I've been way busy. |
| 02:48.04 | herlo | thats awesome |
| 02:48.11 | Utah_Dave | I'm working a part time job in addition to my full time job |
| 02:48.12 | herlo | i can tell :) |
| 02:48.36 | Utah_Dave | it's been fun though |
| 02:48.40 | herlo | Utah_Dave: whatcha doing? |
| 02:48.43 | Utah_Dave | How have you been? Spent any time at home? |
| 02:48.56 | Utah_Dave | I'm doing IT work for a buddy who has his own little IT company |
| 02:49.04 | herlo | I will b home for at least the next two wks |
| 02:49.39 | herlo | nice |
| 02:50.07 | Utah_Dave | cool |
| 02:50.12 | Utah_Dave | that sounds like fun |
| 02:50.17 | herlo | ya |
| 02:50.29 | herlo | Im finalizing details |
| 02:50.34 | mindjuju | that's awesome news about your wife expecting, utah_dave! |
| 02:50.56 | herlo | should be free paint by tierfour and only $15 rentals for guns |
| 02:51.14 | Utah_Dave | yeah, we've been trying for almost 7 years. I'd kind of given up. |
| 02:51.38 | herlo | that's awesome! |
| 02:52.18 | herlo | I remember chatting w/u about that. glad kids are in ur future :) |
| 02:52.29 | Utah_Dave | thanks! |
| 02:52.49 | Utah_Dave | we got to hear the heart beat during an ultrasound today. It was cool |
| 02:52.57 | herlo | so, anything else cool happen while Ive been gone? |
| 02:53.19 | herlo | that's awesome. I remember hearing my sons heartbeat |
| 02:53.44 | Utah_Dave | yeah, it was a really neat thing |
| 02:54.11 | herlo | it doesnt hold a candle to being a papa |
| 02:54.19 | herlo | but still fun |
| 02:55.55 | herlo | mindjuju: u get a chance to proof that post/newsletter 4 utos? |
| 02:57.44 | Utah_Dave | how much were the tickets? |
| 02:58.30 | herlo | at least $r00 |
| 02:58.37 | herlo | 200 |
| 02:59.19 | herlo | that's my excuse |
| 02:59.23 | herlo | :) |
| 03:00.04 | herlo | Im actually on the train back from boston to the burbs |
| 03:02.13 | herlo | Utah_Dave: how far along is ur wifey? |
| 03:02.36 | Utah_Dave | 10 weeks |
| 03:02.58 | herlo | ooh, just barely |
| 03:03.36 | herlo | Utah_Dave: you gonna find out what kind ur having? |
| 03:04.07 | Utah_Dave | yep! |
| 03:04.12 | Utah_Dave | can't wait to find out |
| 03:04.15 | herlo | :) |
| 03:04.21 | herlo | no rush |
| 03:04.29 | herlo | it goes by too fast |
| 03:04.35 | Utah_Dave | :) |
| 03:04.37 | herlo | enjoy the ride |
| 03:05.39 | Utah_Dave | how is your son doing? |
| 03:05.56 | herlo | well, he comes next wknd |
| 03:06.03 | herlo | I miss him so much |
| 03:06.19 | Utah_Dave | cool. Is he still in Cali? |
| 03:06.30 | herlo | @m looking 4ward to Xmas |
| 03:06.41 | herlo | yup |
| 03:07.53 | herlo | dont get divorced. its too hard |
| 03:08.31 | Utah_Dave | I've heard. |
| 03:08.56 | herlo | :/ |
| 03:09.23 | herlo | I think I need to be home a bit more |
| 03:26.43 | Utah_Dave | herlo: how was beantown? |
| 03:41.41 | Utah_Dave | good night everyone |
| 03:41.48 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=David@c-67-172-244-53.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
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| 04:05.53 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o thebigdog] by ChanServ |
| 04:27.47 | thebigdog | why is it hard to find good help these days?!!! |
| 04:28.47 | influx^^ | $$$ |
| 04:29.25 | thebigdog | how true how true |
| 04:30.08 | influx^^ | :] |
| 04:30.14 | *** join/#uphpu Black_Chaos (n=admin@oalug/member/blackchaos) |
| 04:30.15 | influx^^ | What do you need help for? |
| 04:34.16 | thebigdog | oh we hired a jr admin and he is a lot more jr then i thought |
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| 04:48.46 | mindjuju | ~play violin for thebigdog |
| 04:49.09 | thebigdog | ty |
| 04:49.36 | mindjuju | what's wrong with the admin? windows GUI jockey? |
| 05:05.44 | thebigdog | trouble shooting skills suck |
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| 05:09.44 | mindjuju | i can empathize, bro, i really can. This guy we are canning, either this friday or next, he's gotten to the point where he takes significantly more overhead to manage than he produces |
| 05:09.58 | mindjuju | hence, me being here cleaning up his crap |
| 05:11.23 | thebigdog | man that sucks |
| 05:11.35 | thebigdog | our guy is ok...just means i need to spend more time helping him out |
| 05:11.48 | thebigdog | but today i did a wtf moment with his comment |
| 05:12.02 | thebigdog | we had a network meeting with another group to asses their needs |
| 05:12.15 | thebigdog | they are installing some vmwares on some servers |
| 05:12.25 | thebigdog | and they need some more disc space |
| 05:12.52 | thebigdog | so he asked the question....why not use a virtual machine instead of vmware...i had to laugh my a** off |
| 05:13.07 | influx^^ | isn't... |
| 05:13.10 | mindjuju | heh |
| 05:13.18 | influx^^ | isn't vmware a virtual machine? |
| 05:13.23 | thebigdog | yep |
| 05:13.31 | mindjuju | dude, you need to post that to worse than failure |
| 05:13.37 | thebigdog | vmware = virtual machine ware |
| 05:13.44 | influx^^ | i guessed so |
| 05:13.45 | thebigdog | oh yeah |
| 05:13.54 | thebigdog | i thought he was joking at first |
| 05:14.12 | thebigdog | the other guy setting it up looked at me for confirmation of the question...that is when i started laughing |
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| 05:15.33 | mindjuju | k, bros, i'm going home to get some grub and finish up. i've done all that i require my desk for, time to watch some tv and do the rest on the laptop |
| 05:15.54 | thebigdog | nice |
| 05:15.54 | mindjuju | quick question though, isn't ogden crazy far from here? |
| 05:16.04 | thebigdog | i need to spin a movie here while i work too |
| 05:16.16 | thebigdog | man i dread doing consulting sometimes |
| 05:16.23 | thebigdog | this project is chapping me bumm |
| 05:16.42 | mindjuju | i had some guy post a resume to replace this other fool, but he says he lives in ogden, can't imagine anybody wanting to commute that far |
| 05:16.54 | mindjuju | seems like it is quite adistance |
| 05:17.09 | thebigdog | yeah that is not a great commute |
| 05:17.18 | thebigdog | in a few months it might with commuter rail |
| 05:17.21 | thebigdog | but even then |
| 05:18.00 | thebigdog | man i need to get some more disc space here |
| 05:18.17 | thebigdog | i was thinking of getting 2 sata 500g drives and raiding them together |
| 05:18.28 | thebigdog | perhaps i might just lvm2 them |
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| 14:31.54 | timinator | morning |
| 14:36.36 | wps | afternoon |
| 14:36.58 | timinator | hey now, it's still morning |
| 14:37.34 | timinator | :) |
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| 14:46.41 | timinator | morning thebigdog |
| 14:46.49 | thebigdog | morning bro |
| 15:09.34 | mgeary | morning |
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| 15:32.25 | *** join/#uphpu cycokilr (n=cycokilr@66.114.120.2) |
| 15:34.30 | brasto | interesting.... I thought freenode dropped unused registered nicks after 3 months or so |
| 15:35.47 | brasto | I introduced irc to my co-workers, and they keep trying out new nicks |
| 15:36.12 | brasto | some are taken, but /msg nickserv info <nick> tells me that the names have not been used for over a year. |
| 15:37.17 | brasto | ~salute Utah_Dave |
| 15:37.18 | jbot | ACTION shows Utah_Dave how to count in binary on his fingers... then stops conspiciously on the number 4 |
| 15:37.29 | brasto | lol |
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| 15:43.18 | dataw0lf | brasto: if they go into an op channel (#freenode), they can request from the ops to have the nicks dropped |
| 15:43.48 | brasto | ah, ok |
| 15:44.05 | brasto | so, dataw0lf, it's not automatic? |
| 15:48.40 | dataw0lf | brasto: No. Read Freenode's policies on the matter (eine moment, I'll get you a link) |
| 15:49.48 | dataw0lf | http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#unusednick |
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| 15:53.36 | herlo | I just got put on fedora planet today! Yay! |
| 15:53.48 | mgeary | ~console herlo |
| 15:53.49 | jbot | ACTION gives herlo the consolation moose |
| 15:54.00 | herlo | mgeary: huh!? |
| 15:54.03 | mgeary | kidding |
| 15:54.17 | mgeary | ~wiki Fedora Planet |
| 15:54.23 | herlo | mgeary: http://my.statcounter.com/project/standard/stats.php?project_id=2168385&guest=1 |
| 15:54.35 | mgeary | ahh |
| 15:54.38 | mgeary | you've been linked |
| 15:54.39 | herlo | mgeary: planet.fedora.org |
| 15:54.40 | herlo | er |
| 15:54.48 | herlo | planet.fedoraporoject.org |
| 15:54.52 | mgeary | ~congratulate herlo |
| 15:54.52 | jbot | ACTION congratulates herlo on being a new owner of a $500 brick. |
| 15:54.54 | herlo | mgeary: no, I'm actually on it... |
| 15:55.00 | herlo | :) |
| 15:56.09 | mgeary | herlo: boy, you've got several items on http://planet.fedoraproject.org/ |
| 15:56.28 | herlo | mgeary: I think that has something to do with *how* they added me |
| 15:57.34 | dataw0lf | Factory worker now facing daily snickers from co-workers over his huge $1200 Dumbledore back tattoo. "It seemed like a good idea at the time" |
| 16:02.12 | brasto | lol |
| 16:02.22 | brasto | got a link to that one dataw0lf? |
| 16:02.36 | dataw0lf | <PROTECTED> |
| 16:02.40 | dataw0lf | oops, eine moment |
| 16:03.07 | dataw0lf | http://www.news.com.au/couriermail/story/0,23739,22640695-5013016,00.html?from=mostpop |
| 16:03.10 | dataw0lf | there ya go |
| 16:04.32 | mgeary | dataw0lf: yeah, i've stolen all kinds of django features for my own php framework |
| 16:04.44 | mgeary | 'bout time for me to do another pass-through and steal some more |
| 16:05.13 | dataw0lf | why would you prefer to work in PHP? |
| 16:05.17 | dataw0lf | that's mind boggling to me. |
| 16:05.42 | mgeary | pragmatism. it's what's on the servers we have to work with |
| 16:06.22 | dataw0lf | have you played with Django a lot? |
| 16:07.05 | mgeary | not as much as i'd like. |
| 16:07.46 | dataw0lf | want a free WebFaction account? I can probably hook it up. |
| 16:08.01 | mgeary | every ~4 months i go through a bunch of tutorials in it. it's django i have to thank for teaching me about the ActiveRecord pattern |
| 16:08.35 | dataw0lf | you should look at SQLAlchemy, it's better than SQLObject (The ORM that Django uses) |
| 16:08.41 | mgeary | well, i've got a dreamhost account; they're supposed to be django-friendly |
| 16:09.29 | dataw0lf | I've heard from a lot of people that they have numerous Python support problems. |
| 16:09.34 | mgeary | ah |
| 16:09.40 | dataw0lf | but I don't know myself |
| 16:09.56 | mgeary | my big problem is that i'm a mod_python idior |
| 16:09.59 | mgeary | *idiot |
| 16:10.16 | mgeary | i can code in python alright, but setting it up with apache hasn't been smooth |
| 16:10.36 | mgeary | well, my other big problem is resolving to actually *start* a real project in django |
| 16:11.16 | mgeary | i'd love to do it, because it'd let me have "native" connectivity to some cool python APIs in Apple's CoreGraphics libraries |
| 16:11.22 | cycokilr | i must say i was pretty impressed with a python plugin for nagios that i grabbed last week.. it checks 6 things and it's about 1/3 the size of a perl script that checks 1 thing.. |
| 16:11.28 | dataw0lf | well, webfaction, all you have to do to get Apache working is install an app on their control panel (they have an app called Django, which is 0.96 with python2.5, they also have Pylons, TurboGears, RoR apps) |
| 16:12.22 | dataw0lf | there are a couple "gotchas!" when setting up with webfaction at first, but their forums cover everything. |
| 16:12.29 | dataw0lf | after that, it's smooth sailing. |
| 16:12.39 | dataw0lf | just gotta remember DEBUG = True in Django still leaks memory |
| 16:18.18 | brasto | that's sad... jk rowling said dumbledore is gay... |
| 16:19.24 | brasto | mgeary, i thought of something, though it's likely too late now... you could host a mysql server on a different server than your vps... |
| 16:19.51 | mgeary | brasto: yeah, but latency would kill me if it's not on the same subnet |
| 16:20.05 | brasto | that makes sense |
| 16:20.58 | dataw0lf | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUH4zPdpbug |
| 16:21.09 | dataw0lf | G Love & the Special Sauce++ |
| 16:24.48 | fungus | brasto: You have a link to that jk rowling article? |
| 16:25.16 | brasto | yep, its on wikipedia... on sec |
| 16:25.38 | brasto | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albus_Dumbledore |
| 16:25.44 | brasto | search the page for the word gay |
| 16:25.52 | brasto | and look at the external references |
| 16:26.09 | dataw0lf | she's an attention wh*re |
| 16:26.16 | dataw0lf | next story, noone cares. |
| 16:26.59 | brasto | I like the harry potter series, but she's not the greatest childrens author as I see it... there are quite a few with more writing tallent |
| 16:27.13 | brasto | she just had all the elements that people were looking for in a story |
| 16:27.19 | dataw0lf | I dunno, she's a fairly good writer |
| 16:27.26 | brasto | book seven, she did have much better talent |
| 16:27.47 | brasto | she is good, I just don't think she's the best like many do |
| 16:28.00 | dataw0lf | I'm interested in whom you think her contemporaries as far as talent are? |
| 16:28.24 | dataw0lf | I'd say Dan Handler |
| 16:28.28 | mgeary | and Tolkien (the Hobbit) |
| 16:28.28 | brasto | Yes! |
| 16:28.35 | brasto | mgeary, me too |
| 16:28.38 | dataw0lf | mgeary: Lloyd Alexander is pretty good. |
| 16:28.45 | dataw0lf | Tolkien, for all his gifts, was never a great writer. |
| 16:28.53 | brasto | prydain series has so many levels |
| 16:29.00 | mgeary | i *loved* the hobbit in 3rd grade |
| 16:29.04 | mgeary | first time i read it |
| 16:29.17 | brasto | I'm actually reading the hobbit to my kids now |
| 16:29.21 | brasto | nearly done |
| 16:29.32 | mgeary | also loved the Great Brain books when i was a kid |
| 16:29.36 | dataw0lf | The Hobbit is definitely a good story, but I thought what we were discussing was pure writing talent. |
| 16:29.38 | mgeary | and Narnia |
| 16:29.45 | brasto | true dataw0lf |
| 16:29.50 | mgeary | and L'Engle |
| 16:29.57 | dataw0lf | L'Engle - excellent author |
| 16:29.59 | brasto | and Tolkien did lack some pure writing tallent |
| 16:29.59 | mgeary | and LeGuin |
| 16:30.07 | dataw0lf | LeGuin, pretty good author |
| 16:30.13 | mgeary | loved the Earthsea books |
| 16:30.24 | brasto | L'Engle got an honorary doctorate at BYU the year I graduated there, in 1999 |
| 16:30.29 | mgeary | cool |
| 16:30.43 | dataw0lf | what about Dahl? |
| 16:30.43 | brasto | Terry Brooks is a great author, but his books are not children's books |
| 16:30.52 | dataw0lf | Terry Brooks is a pretty good author |
| 16:30.56 | dataw0lf | (I've read every book of his) |
| 16:31.14 | dataw0lf | but, I dunno, writing talent? He uses the same plot devices in nearly every one of his books, and each story follows a familiar story arc. |
| 16:31.35 | brasto | pure writing tallent... I've been wanting to review some of those childrens books I read with the intent to review their writing tallent |
| 16:31.49 | mgeary | lowering the age bar a bit lower, i'm crazy about Arnold Lobel (Frog & Toad, etc.) |
| 16:31.55 | pelaofeliz | for writing talent, I'd say Orson Scott Card is among the best |
| 16:32.03 | mgeary | Lobel's books have fantastic insights, which most kids miss, of course |
| 16:32.08 | brasto | Andre Norton |
| 16:32.18 | dataw0lf | I'd say Dahl, as far as children's books go. |
| 16:32.33 | dataw0lf | Daniel Handler comes close. |
| 16:32.36 | brasto | What I look for in writing tallent, something rare to find: active voice writing |
| 16:32.40 | mgeary | what did Dan Handler write? |
| 16:32.45 | mgeary | don't know that name offhand |
| 16:32.46 | brasto | rowling is very passive |
| 16:32.46 | dataw0lf | the Lemony Snicket books |
| 16:32.49 | mgeary | ah |
| 16:32.51 | mgeary | eeh |
| 16:32.56 | pelaofeliz | Tolkien's work isn't contemporary, but he's excellent |
| 16:33.05 | brasto | except perhaps her last book, I read it too fast to pay attention to the voice |
| 16:33.48 | dataw0lf | passive has it's place. |
| 16:33.59 | brasto | it does, but far less than it's used |
| 16:34.19 | dataw0lf | well, obviously. Active voice is preferred generally in elementary fiction writing. |
| 16:34.31 | dataw0lf | (as well as a variety of other fields) |
| 16:35.26 | brasto | example: second sentence in the wikipedia article about dumbledore says: "The character had previously made reference to his brother Aberforth, and in Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows it is revealed that he is three years older than him." |
| 16:37.22 | brasto | This says the same thing: "The character previously mentioned his brother Aberforth. Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows revealed that Aberforth is three years younger." |
| 16:37.36 | brasto | there's passive in there, but its more active |
| 16:38.05 | brasto | it says the same thing with fewer words |
| 16:38.11 | brasto | and it's less vague |
| 16:38.31 | brasto | first sentence: who is three years younger than who? |
| 16:38.48 | brasto | revised sentence may be wrong, I had to guess... |
| 16:39.04 | mgeary | can anyone confirm for me that the ampersand is illegal in an email address? |
| 16:39.30 | *** join/#uphpu gibba[w] (i=gibbagib@209-253-35-21.ip.mcleodusa.net) |
| 16:39.43 | brasto | mgeary: http://www.remote.org/jochen/mail/info/chars.html |
| 16:40.08 | mgeary | so a definite maybe |
| 16:41.51 | brasto | dataw0lf: I can't give a list for quality writing at this time, but it's an intriguing topic so if I get a chance I'll let you know what I think with that criteria alone |
| 16:42.35 | cycokilr | nice, i'm so putting a tilde in my email address.. |
| 16:42.39 | brasto | mgeary: yep, but I'd say "don't do it" on all the maybes |
| 16:42.44 | brasto | lol |
| 16:42.45 | mgeary | agreed |
| 16:42.49 | dataw0lf | brastO: alright, I'll invite my girlfriend in the channel for that discussion, it's intriguing to her too |
| 16:43.03 | brasto | lol |
| 16:43.35 | brasto | k |
| 16:44.19 | mgeary | http://tinyurl.com/4k2u9 << newberry award winners |
| 16:44.28 | dataw0lf | brasto: she's a managing editor for about a hundred writers, so her input you'd probably appreciate |
| 16:44.34 | mgeary | ah, Susan Cooper-- another great kids author |
| 16:44.48 | dataw0lf | Susan Cooper++ |
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| 16:44.59 | mgeary | Robert C. O'Brien -- Mrs. Frisby |
| 16:45.05 | dataw0lf | what's your guys take on The Golden Compass? |
| 16:45.17 | brasto | I loved Andre Norton: http://www.andre-norton.org/ |
| 16:45.28 | brasto | I'm not going to watch it |
| 16:45.45 | brasto | ^comment above was for dataw0lf^ |
| 16:45.51 | mgeary | Scott O'Dell -- Island of Blue Dolphins++ |
| 16:46.17 | brasto | The atheist author of The Golden Compass has some valid points |
| 16:46.20 | dataw0lf | why wouldn't you watch it, brasto? |
| 16:46.43 | mgeary | ~wiki the golden compass |
| 16:46.59 | dataw0lf | mgeary: It's a movie about to come out based on a book that condemns organized religion |
| 16:47.09 | mgeary | ah |
| 16:47.10 | brasto | Religion has spawned some very bloody conflict |
| 16:47.15 | dataw0lf | it's kind of Narnia by atheists. |
| 16:47.32 | brasto | many, and perhaps most wars were spawned in the name of religion |
| 16:47.35 | fungus | I can't wait to see The Golden Compass. It looks so awesome. |
| 16:47.59 | dataw0lf | yea, me either, I really like the books, although I think the author can be a little heavy handed at times regarding his pointed diatribe of the catholic church. |
| 16:48.18 | mgeary | thought maybe the Golden Compass was a reference to the Liahona |
| 16:48.20 | dataw0lf | but the movie looks pretty good. |
| 16:48.24 | brasto | but all these were misunderstanding truth |
| 16:48.34 | brasto | mgeary: that's what I thought at first, too... |
| 16:48.47 | dataw0lf | mgeary: the thing Lehi used in the desert? |
| 16:48.54 | brasto | dataw0lf: yes |
| 16:49.00 | dataw0lf | or on the ocean or whatever. |
| 16:49.08 | brasto | dataw0lf: both |
| 16:49.12 | dataw0lf | Word. |
| 16:49.18 | dataw0lf | I haven't read the BoM for a while |
| 16:50.16 | brasto | politically, a king with an agenda may motivate people by using religion to disguise his greed, deceiving people into religious war |
| 16:50.49 | dataw0lf | well, anyone who uses religion to congregate people for an alterior motive, has an agenda. |
| 16:50.53 | brasto | but God is not really the author of all these things |
| 16:51.42 | brasto | so, The Golden Compass has valid points in those things, but killing all believe in God is not the answer. |
| 16:52.07 | dataw0lf | well, I'd argue differently. |
| 16:54.43 | brasto | I like this point from former atheist parents of Akiane: "It is better to believe in God and be wrong than to not believe in Him and be wrong". |
| 16:55.49 | brasto | Akiane was raised, isolated from any religion, and yet learned about Him: http://artakiane.com |
| 16:56.00 | Utah_Dave | brasto: I disagree with that argument |
| 16:56.21 | brasto | http://artakiane.com/akiane_art.htm |
| 16:56.28 | brasto | she's never had a painting lesson |
| 16:57.16 | dataw0lf | the whole argument that if I don't believe in God, then I'm not getting accepted in heaven, or paradise, or whatever, is laughable. |
| 16:57.36 | dataw0lf | as is any organized religion. which is half of the basis of organized religion (we're right, everyone else: wrong). |
| 16:58.03 | dataw0lf | the other half is just social inclinations of a socially evolved creature. People like being together, rallied behind some common belief, cause, or whatever. |
| 16:58.19 | brasto | wait, I take that back... she had one after she was already painting... she went once, and came home crying... she said: "He held my hands the whole time, that's cheating!". She ripped the watercolor painting up... By then she was already painting masterpieces: she was 8 years old. |
| 16:59.43 | brasto | actually, nearly everyone will go to some form of heaven |
| 17:00.09 | dataw0lf | oh, I just don't get the super sized BETTER heaven. |
| 17:00.10 | dataw0lf | Gotcha. |
| 17:00.22 | brasto | lol |
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| 17:01.53 | Utah_Dave | dataw0lf: can I send you a pm? |
| 17:02.01 | dataw0lf | sure |
| 17:02.49 | cycokilr | sweet, can i send you one too? |
| 17:03.20 | dataw0lf | sure |
| 17:06.35 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@208.53.47.251) |
| 17:06.35 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 17:08.55 | timinator | di.fm++ |
| 17:10.56 | brasto | wps - you've missed our conversation about dumbledore is gay according to j.k. rowling, The Golden Compass, a fictional book about killing God written by an atheist, and child prodigy Akiane |
| 17:11.11 | brasto | ~akiane |
| 17:12.24 | brasto | ~akiane is the worlds only binary child genious in realist painting and poetry, born to formerly atheist parents. http://artakiane.com . |
| 17:12.25 | jbot | brasto: okay |
| 17:17.47 | wps | wow |
| 17:17.50 | wps | that's a lot to miss |
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| 18:06.18 | *** join/#uphpu JacobKerr (n=JacobKer@72.25.165.83) |
| 18:06.22 | JacobKerr | Hello. |
| 18:06.32 | PoeticIntensity | what up, JacobKerr ? |
| 18:06.43 | JacobKerr | I am tired of looking everywhere for this so i was hoping you guys could help :) |
| 18:07.10 | JacobKerr | I want to call a function within a function that is in my class how do I go about doing that? |
| 18:07.47 | fungus | $this is a variable auto created that referenced the currently instantiated object. |
| 18:07.52 | brasto | JacobKerr: if it's a function you defined, you need to declare it a global function |
| 18:08.04 | brasto | or... maybe not... |
| 18:08.07 | brasto | listen to fungus |
| 18:08.17 | JacobKerr | Perfect |
| 18:08.22 | JacobKerr | how do I declare it global |
| 18:08.26 | PoeticIntensity | yup.. fungus is right. |
| 18:08.29 | JacobKerr | that's what I thought.. |
| 18:08.30 | PoeticIntensity | $this->function |
| 18:08.48 | JacobKerr | I called the function with $this but it's not executing. |
| 18:09.48 | PoeticIntensity | declaring something global isn't really the best option. |
| 18:11.23 | JacobKerr | k, but why is it not executing I am calling it within my function and I procede the call with $this-> so how would I go about making the function global? |
| 18:11.52 | brasto | global functionName () { |
| 18:11.59 | brasto | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:12.00 | brasto | } |
| 18:12.19 | brasto | not params... I meant to say "code" there... |
| 18:12.27 | *** join/#uphpu kingsol_ (n=kingsol@64.0.192.139) |
| 18:12.58 | JacobKerr | I got it working thanx. :) |
| 18:13.40 | brasto | JacobKerr: did you get it working via global, or did you find an error in your call to $this? |
| 18:13.55 | JacobKerr | I found an error :) |
| 18:14.14 | brasto | k, that's what I figured |
| 18:15.43 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
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| 18:18.45 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 18:23.35 | timinator | I'm jumping in halfway on this conversation.... |
| 18:24.05 | timinator | but if you trying to call another function, you need to use $this->function(); not $this->function; |
| 18:33.18 | JacobKerr | Yeah I have fixed the problem, there was an error in my code.. |
| 18:35.55 | *** join/#uphpu kingsol (n=kingsol@64.0.192.139) |
| 18:40.41 | *** join/#uphpu bradym (n=bradym@Qst4FC.quinstreet.com) |
| 18:40.41 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v bradym] by ChanServ |
| 18:42.10 | bradym | wow.. i was just told by earthlink that to move a site to one of their newer servers we'd have 24-72 hours of downtime.... |
| 18:42.27 | bradym | i burst out laughing and asked if he was kidding |
| 18:42.32 | bradym | sadly, he wasn't |
| 18:42.37 | cycokilr | silly |
| 18:47.16 | brasto | bradym you can test out a server with me if you'd like |
| 18:47.34 | brasto | no down time |
| 18:47.55 | brasto | test the site and get it working the way you want, then point dns there |
| 18:50.39 | *** join/#uphpu kingsol_ (n=kingsol@64.0.193.254) |
| 18:51.36 | bradym | unfortunately the hosting decision is not up to me |
| 18:52.05 | mindjuju | ~APB Herlo |
| 18:52.06 | jbot | ACTION summons Leland to rough up Herlo |
| 18:52.17 | bradym | i only got involved because the guy who handles the hosting for our sites asked me to join in on a call with them |
| 18:52.26 | bradym | thanks though brasto |
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| 19:02.42 | brasto | yw bradym |
| 19:09.10 | brasto | do you grep bzip2'ed logs like this: |
| 19:09.23 | brasto | zgrep <term> <filename> |
| 19:09.23 | brasto | ? |
| 19:10.16 | *** join/#uphpu thebigdog (n=bigdog@208.177.146.102.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 19:10.17 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o thebigdog] by ChanServ |
| 19:11.44 | brasto | bradym if this person mentions that he's looking into hosting options, you can steer him my way. I resell Verio servers for roughly half their own cost. I own Stout Hosting LLC, but the website isn't up yet for the business - I'm too busy... doing business... |
| 19:11.53 | dataw0lf | brasto: no, bzgrep. |
| 19:12.05 | brasto | ah, thanks dataw0lf, I'll try that now |
| 19:17.07 | mindjuju | "when you need good hosting and in doubt, don't you worry, just get Stout!" {song to catchy tune} |
| 19:17.19 | timinator | LOL |
| 19:17.35 | timinator | mindjuju: that's really good |
| 19:17.37 | mgeary | ~chastise mindjuju for subject/verb disagreement |
| 19:17.38 | jbot | ACTION Takes a lightning bolt and fries mindjuju for subject/verb disagreement. |
| 19:17.48 | timinator | LOL |
| 19:17.55 | mindjuju | don't be jealous mgeary! |
| 19:18.01 | mgeary | how about, "and *are* in doubt" |
| 19:18.11 | mgeary | 'course then your rhythm is off |
| 19:18.13 | mindjuju | no, doesn't fit |
| 19:18.16 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 19:18.20 | mgeary | well, you've gotta fix that |
| 19:18.26 | mgeary | "when you in doubt" ??? |
| 19:19.34 | mindjuju | brasto, where exactly are these servers |
| 19:20.22 | *** part/#uphpu pelaofeliz (n=ben@67.108.236.230) |
| 19:32.17 | *** join/#uphpu Kamehameha (n=prowebso@72.25.165.83) |
| 19:32.51 | Kamehameha | Aloha!!! |
| 19:33.47 | mindjuju | yo |
| 19:34.17 | Kamehameha | how goes it? |
| 19:34.24 | mindjuju | wow, anybody need a palm treo 650 for $120 unlocked ? |
| 19:34.49 | mgeary | mindjuju: maybe |
| 19:34.54 | mgeary | link? |
| 19:35.20 | mindjuju | woot - I want one! |
| 19:35.24 | mindjuju | oops, hang on |
| 19:35.48 | mgeary | already gone, it seems |
| 19:35.51 | Kamehameha | PoeticIntensity, you in? |
| 19:36.02 | mindjuju | weird, the email just came in |
| 19:36.16 | mgeary | well, i'm on woot.com, is that what you meant? |
| 19:36.51 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 19:37.01 | mgeary | i see the sansa player now |
| 19:37.07 | mgeary | appears to be a woot-off |
| 19:37.10 | brasto | mindjuju I can do servers in CA or VA |
| 19:37.17 | mgeary | but the bar isn't shrinking much/at all |
| 19:38.02 | mindjuju | VA? cool, then this will work - http://www.pastebin.ca/749554 |
| 19:38.14 | mindjuju | i found a rap and made ya an ad gingle |
| 19:39.14 | mgeary | ~throw tomato at mindjuju |
| 19:39.14 | jbot | ACTION winds up and throws tomato at mindjuju over the moon. |
| 19:41.20 | mindjuju | and no, i didn't write it lyrics, i mooched themoff another rap song |
| 19:50.06 | mindjuju | sorry to have gotten your hopes up on that treo mgeary, i guess my email is running a little slow today |
| 19:50.24 | mgeary | no worries |
| 19:50.46 | mgeary | probably shouldn't/wouldn't have done it anyway :) |
| 19:53.40 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
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| 19:54.40 | timinator | Nice job mindjuju |
| 19:56.22 | mindjuju | timinator, did you like my rap? cool huh! |
| 19:56.33 | timinator | yes sir |
| 19:57.21 | JacobKerr | You guys are funny :) |
| 19:57.42 | Utah_Dave | mindjuju: dang! I just missed your rap! |
| 19:58.21 | mindjuju | well, it was a rap for brasto 's web hosting |
| 19:59.02 | mindjuju | we're going to the TheBigDog and Snoop Dogg rap it |
| 20:01.12 | influx^^ | http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/10/22/prior-permission-from-government-to-be-required-for-each-flight/ |
| 20:04.16 | dataw0lf | influx^^: As long as it keeps me safe from the terrorists! |
| 20:06.52 | influx^^ | :( |
| 20:06.54 | brasto | mindjuju: great! |
| 20:07.13 | brasto | Utah_Dave: the rap was still there just now |
| 20:07.46 | influx^^ | I should just make a list of ridiculous things that people are trying to pass into law, print them out, and wheatpaste them places. |
| 20:07.56 | influx^^ | onto places* |
| 20:08.13 | influx^^ | :\ |
| 20:08.40 | Utah_Dave | brasto: I know, but I just logged into irc |
| 20:10.01 | brasto | Utah_Dave: http://www.pastebin.ca/749554 |
| 20:12.19 | mindjuju | brasto, while i don't mind if you use it in a commercial, some rapper named Gorilla Zoe might. course i think it's prolly different enough that you shouldn't get into trouble |
| 20:15.45 | JacobKerr | "As long as it keeps me safe from the terrorists!" LOL, what terrorist?? |
| 20:16.36 | orsonj | I discovered something strange last night. If I shine a laser pointer on the ceiling in a completly dark room, I can see a set of blue curved lines coming out of the point of red light. |
| 20:16.51 | JacobKerr | LOL |
| 20:17.26 | orsonj | I wrote a small bit and put a drawing at http://ilovemyjournal.com/?action=personal_entry&eid=3297&user=30 |
| 20:19.19 | JacobKerr | LOL that's so funny... |
| 20:19.50 | JacobKerr | What a nonsense post kind of like http://www.10zenmonkeys.com/2007/10/22/prior-permission-from-government-to-be-required-for-each-flight/ |
| 20:22.22 | JacobKerr | I am sitting here at work, working on a bunch of misc. web projects and every time I get bored I open this window... |
| 20:22.41 | JacobKerr | and there's almost always something interesting to read.. |
| 20:25.01 | JacobKerr | I need an idea a genius plan! Something I can build that will bring allot of traffic and make me allot of money. Any ideas? Anyone here into internet marketing, SEO etc? |
| 20:25.08 | mindjuju | for those of us that have seen shaun of the dead, you know how important this is - http://www.craftster.org/forum/index.php?topic=202668.msg2158872;topicseen |
| 20:26.42 | dataw0lf | JacobKerr: I'm curious as to why you'd think I'd give up any genius plans I may have. |
| 20:27.06 | JacobKerr | I do not know Bill Gates and his team does it all the time.. |
| 20:28.30 | JacobKerr | oh whisper... |
| 20:29.11 | JacobKerr | How do I whisper? |
| 20:29.29 | JacobKerr | I was just hoping someone would slip and tell me all about their genius plan.. |
| 20:30.44 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 20:39.43 | herlo | mindjuju: don't do it! |
| 20:40.07 | herlo | mindjuju: plans are for the weak minded! |
| 20:40.13 | timinator | LOL |
| 20:41.22 | dataw0lf | herlo: .... President Bush? |
| 20:42.29 | wps | check it out, Omniture just acquired their fourth company this year: |
| 20:42.32 | wps | http://www.omniture.com/company/acquisitions/visualsciences |
| 20:42.54 | brasto | cool |
| 20:43.36 | herlo | dataw0lf: you crack me up |
| 20:44.46 | dataw0lf | I know, I know. Hold your applause until the end. |
| 20:50.49 | mindjuju | JacobKerr - i've decided to give you one of my best ideas of all time |
| 20:51.21 | JacobKerr | LOL |
| 20:51.22 | mindjuju | well, this isn't a website per se, but a product |
| 20:51.25 | mindjuju | a genius product |
| 20:51.34 | dataw0lf | women? It's been done. |
| 20:51.42 | timinator | a jump to conclusions mat? |
| 20:51.53 | mindjuju | even better |
| 20:52.11 | orsonj | alcohol? done also. |
| 20:52.23 | JacobKerr | LOL... |
| 20:52.24 | cycokilr | women != genius product |
| 20:52.28 | timinator | is it something you can smoke? |
| 20:52.34 | mindjuju | k, you know how when you sleep in bed, how if somebody is in bed with you, they always wind up stealing the covers? |
| 20:52.40 | dataw0lf | cycokilr: they are if they're one use. |
| 20:52.45 | JacobKerr | woman <= man ? |
| 20:52.55 | mindjuju | your left shuddering half the night cause the person is snarfing all the blankets? |
| 20:53.02 | cycokilr | not if you punch them |
| 20:53.12 | mindjuju | well, here is the best product ever |
| 20:53.21 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@208.53.47.251) |
| 20:53.22 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 20:53.22 | JacobKerr | Yeha my wife hits me all the time in my sleep LOL.. |
| 20:53.28 | dataw0lf | that's what feet are for |
| 20:53.31 | dataw0lf | kick em out of bed |
| 20:53.33 | dataw0lf | they eventually learn |
| 20:53.39 | Kamehameha | Hey all |
| 20:53.59 | Kamehameha | cycokilr, and orsonj remember you were helping me with that custom 404 deal the other day? |
| 20:53.59 | mindjuju | it's called forever blanket. what happens is you make one big blanket that covers the top of the bed, and goes underneath the bed frame and wraps back up to the top. so that when the person who steals the blanket goes to steal, it just cycles the blanket around |
| 20:54.11 | cycokilr | yeah Kamehameha |
| 20:54.14 | JacobKerr | LOL |
| 20:54.16 | Kamehameha | the one that was making me pull my hair out... |
| 20:54.26 | orsonj | yep, I did one myself and it worked fine in ff, ie6, ie7 |
| 20:54.31 | Kamehameha | well I thought I'd share how I finally solved it :) |
| 20:54.41 | orsonj | you had already left though |
| 20:54.52 | orsonj | cool, let's hear! |
| 20:55.01 | mindjuju | i also thought of ways to chill my pillow so it'd be nice and cold, but turns out somebody already solved that one |
| 20:55.05 | mindjuju | it's called chillow |
| 20:55.07 | Kamehameha | my file size was 1 kb ... apparently IE doesn't process it right when the file is that small.. |
| 20:55.08 | mindjuju | i'm jealous |
| 20:55.27 | Kamehameha | so all I had to do was add a bunch of text at the bottom to bring it up to about 40 kb.. and it worked! |
| 20:55.30 | Kamehameha | kinda crazy.. |
| 20:55.32 | timinator | mindjuju: how would you get in and out of the bed if the blanket wraps continuously around the bed? |
| 20:55.46 | orsonj | odd |
| 20:55.49 | mindjuju | top or bottom |
| 20:56.02 | mindjuju | or install a zipper |
| 20:56.04 | Kamehameha | ya.. that's what I thought! |
| 20:56.09 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 20:56.33 | dataw0lf | http://stderr.ws/some_404 |
| 20:56.43 | Kamehameha | anyway, just an fyi .. when doing custom 404 php pages, just make sure file size is at least above a few kb :) |
| 20:56.54 | mindjuju | love the pic dataw0lf |
| 20:57.05 | timinator | that's great dataw0lf |
| 20:57.08 | JacobKerr | or have something that pulls the blankets down to the foot of the bed when your rdy to get up, but then that would really piss the wife off if she's not rdy to get up also. HMMMMM... |
| 20:57.39 | mindjuju | cool idea, huh? |
| 20:57.52 | mindjuju | forever blanket |
| 20:57.54 | timinator | it's got potential :) |
| 20:57.55 | Kamehameha | anyway, thought I'd share since you were working on helping me with that the other day, thanks again orsonj & cycokilr ;) |
| 20:58.46 | JacobKerr | Yeah I'm working on making it right now. I just called around china and found a manufacturer... |
| 20:59.21 | brasto | cool page dataw0lf |
| 20:59.57 | JacobKerr | Now I need to get in contact with my fulfillment house and start promoting it online. Thanx mindjuju! |
| 21:00.08 | mindjuju | ;) |
| 21:00.23 | timinator | dang mindjuju, another million dollar idea out the dorr |
| 21:00.31 | timinator | s/dorr/door/ |
| 21:01.02 | mindjuju | timinator, i gots better ideas! |
| 21:01.18 | JacobKerr | Sweet letz hear them.. |
| 21:01.37 | timinator | any takers? |
| 21:01.43 | mindjuju | yeah, no kidding timinator |
| 21:02.00 | mindjuju | i've got some stuff, but need to get some time to develop |
| 21:02.29 | brasto | that s/spelledwrong/spelled right/ thing does not work in my channel, and it has infobot... |
| 21:02.36 | brasto | all factoids work the same... |
| 21:02.38 | brasto | what |
| 21:02.42 | timinator | yes, and my "startup" budget is maxed out |
| 21:02.48 | brasto | what's wrong with it? |
| 21:03.20 | brasto | me too, I just need a little more time |
| 21:03.30 | brasto | ~lart lack of time |
| 21:03.30 | jbot | takes out a cattle prod and gives lack of time a good jolt |
| 21:06.02 | JacobKerr | Has anyone here got really pist off at the computer and start to pick up the monitor to throw it? |
| 21:06.15 | mindjuju | nope |
| 21:06.24 | timinator | only when working on PCs |
| 21:06.30 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:07.07 | JacobKerr | You know what really pisses me off I was working on a design and my wife was mad at me a flipped my comp off and when I turned it on my file was corrupted.. |
| 21:07.11 | JacobKerr | I lost all my work! |
| 21:07.40 | mindjuju | wow, that would require all kinds of retaliation |
| 21:07.45 | timinator | fo sho |
| 21:07.47 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:07.58 | mindjuju | like eatting crackers and chips on her side of bed and then remaking the bed so it wasn't easy to tell |
| 21:08.00 | JacobKerr | It happened last night. |
| 21:08.05 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 21:08.39 | JacobKerr | but really I lost all my work, does anyone know if I can restore a .psd that was damaged like that? |
| 21:09.00 | mindjuju | what is the file size? |
| 21:09.07 | JacobKerr | It was a complex design and I was about 1.5 weeks in. (3 hours a night) |
| 21:09.10 | JacobKerr | um.. |
| 21:09.22 | brasto | ~psd |
| 21:09.23 | jbot | Adobe Photoshop bitmap |
| 21:09.23 | JacobKerr | I'm not sure but the image was flattened and most data was lost. |
| 21:09.30 | JacobKerr | I bet it is really small now.. |
| 21:09.31 | mindjuju | hmm |
| 21:09.43 | JacobKerr | I did that but the image was still flat and small. |
| 21:09.44 | mindjuju | yeah, was going to say, i wonder if the data is there or if the comp totally freaked |
| 21:09.50 | JacobKerr | it was nothing I could work with |
| 21:10.18 | brasto | Solution: use The Gimp, don't use Adobe Photoshop |
| 21:10.28 | JacobKerr | The Gimp LOL.. |
| 21:10.30 | mindjuju | how is that a solution, brasto? |
| 21:10.42 | JacobKerr | Hmmm.. processing "The Gimp" |
| 21:10.51 | orsonj | did it get turned off right when you were saving it? |
| 21:11.09 | JacobKerr | No I saved it before.. |
| 21:11.12 | brasto | I've never seen the Gimp corrupt a file... it's a forward-looking solution, not a fix-the-existing-file solution :) |
| 21:11.13 | JacobKerr | It does not make any sense.. |
| 21:11.24 | brasto | ~gimp |
| 21:11.24 | jbot | methinks gimp is the scourge of the kompany, or an excellent image manipulation program. 2.0 is now stable and it has MANY, MANY improvements over the 1.x series. Pick it up NOW. *_GREAT_*! |
| 21:11.26 | orsonj | Or does photoshop edit the file on disk? |
| 21:11.56 | JacobKerr | Yeah it was all on my hard drive.. |
| 21:12.25 | JacobKerr | I am going to get everything going on a sever now as a WIFE MAY TURN OFF THE COMPUTER Security Messure.. |
| 21:12.38 | mindjuju | yeah, agree |
| 21:12.40 | timinator | LOL ....JacobKerr: when brasto was talking about "The Gimp", he was *not* referring to dataw0lf |
| 21:12.43 | timinator | :) |
| 21:12.54 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:13.04 | JacobKerr | Yeah I looked it up. |
| 21:13.22 | orsonj | I have had some luck recovering pictures using forensics software (can't remember what it was at the moment) |
| 21:13.25 | JacobKerr | I was not sure if it was a joke that I was not getting.. |
| 21:13.27 | mindjuju | man, i think i'd eat a can of chili beans and go in her car and rip 'em, then escape when almost unbearable, and make sure doors and windows are sealed up tight. |
| 21:13.43 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:14.01 | mindjuju | yeah, orsonj has a point. i wonder if knoppix has something? |
| 21:14.11 | mindjuju | i've heard it is extensively used by forensics |
| 21:14.12 | JacobKerr | or make here redo it all even though I am going to throw it away because she does not know anything about computers.. |
| 21:15.01 | JacobKerr | LOL brasto your the second person to send me that message.. |
| 21:15.18 | JacobKerr | if it's in red then is it a PM? |
| 21:15.39 | orsonj | ~wiki PhotoRec |
| 21:15.57 | brasto | JacobKerr: I was referring to what timinator said since I didn't catch that minor detail |
| 21:16.23 | brasto | JacobKerr: a PM? a Personal Message? |
| 21:16.37 | JacobKerr | Yes |
| 21:16.49 | brasto | you are referring to your chat client? |
| 21:17.14 | JacobKerr | Yeah.. |
| 21:17.32 | JacobKerr | if you write name then comment does it send PM? |
| 21:17.34 | brasto | it's probably configured to emphasize when someone says your name |
| 21:17.40 | JacobKerr | brasto: is this a PM |
| 21:17.47 | JacobKerr | I c.. |
| 21:18.16 | brasto | that's a pm, did you get it? |
| 21:18.49 | JacobKerr | Yeah. |
| 21:18.59 | brasto | JacobKerr: you might not be able to pm since you have not registered your nick |
| 21:19.29 | JacobKerr | Oh, OK I will have to do that sometime soon then.. |
| 21:19.49 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:20.24 | brasto | wps calls it a ping, though I'm not certain if that's the official name, but since this sentence says 'wps', it's a 'ping' for wps. |
| 21:20.30 | brasto | this is a ping for JacobKerr |
| 21:20.34 | brasto | this is not a ping for anyone |
| 21:21.06 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:21.18 | JacobKerr | Same here, I beter get back to work.. |
| 21:21.31 | JacobKerr | I am currently working for the man.. |
| 21:23.40 | JacobKerr | ATLEAST I DO NOT WORK FOR WALMART! http://www.wakeupwalmart.com/facts/ |
| 21:24.05 | cycokilr | viva la walmart! |
| 21:24.20 | beandog | heh |
| 21:24.27 | brasto | JacobKerr: we already had a walmart bash session the other day, headed by mgeary |
| 21:24.35 | JacobKerr | Cool.. |
| 21:24.40 | beandog | death to walmart |
| 21:24.49 | mindjuju | walmart rules |
| 21:25.08 | brasto | ~praise walmart |
| 21:25.09 | jbot | All hail walmart! |
| 21:25.15 | brasto | ~hail walmart |
| 21:25.16 | jbot | ACTION bows down to walmart and chants, "I'M NOT WORTHY!!" |
| 21:25.31 | JacobKerr | I like to shop there, but it is sad the lives that some people live. It's sad that so many people work so hard for nothing because they fell they have to.. |
| 21:25.48 | JacobKerr | feel* |
| 21:25.53 | brasto | it's sad they stay satisfied working in a grocery store |
| 21:26.31 | JacobKerr | true... |
| 21:28.07 | JacobKerr | I remember giving someone a lecture on the public transportation system becuase he was like 33, working for Mc Donalds and telling people how great it was. I could not take it.. |
| 21:28.08 | unum | we work for such evil people |
| 21:28.16 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:29.29 | JacobKerr | There's to many different outlooks on everything. So many people can see the worst thing in an entirely different outlook and think it's OK, so really the Walmart issue and many others like it is an endless debate.. |
| 21:30.10 | JacobKerr | is endless even a word LOL * a never ending debate.. :) |
| 21:30.28 | cycokilr | you can argure walmart sucks all day.. but the truth is, they won.. they got the biggest and the others couldn't keep up.. doesn't matter how they did it.. they win.. end of story.. |
| 21:30.45 | cycokilr | until someone else bigger wins, they'll be around.. |
| 21:31.45 | unum | but by shopping at local stores I keep my money here |
| 21:32.14 | cycokilr | they'll be out of business soon.. why bother.. |
| 21:32.16 | JacobKerr | Oh it's OK that Walmart is everywhere, that's not the issue. |
| 21:33.47 | brasto | ~dict endless |
| 21:34.27 | brasto | yep, it's a word |
| 21:35.34 | cycokilr | isn't that the same as a circle then? |
| 21:35.45 | JacobKerr | I guess what really makes huge corporation like that so bad is they thrive to make so much more every year and will do anything for it, so things end up getting pretty bad for their employees and manufacturers because they are squeezing every penny. If they just loosened up a bit a started caring a little more about their employees etc. and take a few small steps to helping them out then they would not have class action law suits all the time.. |
| 21:35.59 | cycokilr | this is why the chinese hate us.. cause we have like 10 words that all mean the same thing.. |
| 21:36.08 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:36.52 | JacobKerr | I know and what's up with the rule i before e except sounding like A, so why is weird spelled with the i after the e Hmmm? |
| 21:36.54 | cycokilr | dude, people still buy crap from the... people still work for the.. it doesn't matter what they do or did to get where they are.. we all still support them (all meaning enough people)// |
| 21:37.09 | cycokilr | they still win.. |
| 21:37.11 | brasto | cycokilr: nope, a square meets that criteria. in fact any closed shape. |
| 21:37.13 | JacobKerr | and what's up with the spelling of scissors? |
| 21:37.21 | cycokilr | scary |
| 21:37.37 | JacobKerr | except after c or sound like A sheesh.. |
| 21:37.38 | cycokilr | and why isn't sissy spelles scissy? |
| 21:37.44 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:37.46 | brasto | I have a poem somewhere called The Funny English Language |
| 21:38.28 | brasto | sweet! here it is: |
| 21:38.29 | brasto | http://www.corsinet.com/braincandy/hlanguage.html |
| 21:39.15 | JacobKerr | My morning tom: My Boss: "So what was acomplish yesterday", Me "Ummm..." |
| 21:39.22 | mindjuju | yeah, and the phrase " c'est la vie " the spelling of that phrase is so jacked up, it's almost like it was taken from another language like french or something |
| 21:39.24 | JacobKerr | Im not sure yet anyone have any good excuses? |
| 21:39.50 | JacobKerr | Working on a CSS site design and layout.. |
| 21:40.00 | JacobKerr | Browser compat. issues yeah that's a good one.. |
| 21:40.07 | JacobKerr | Damn IE I hate it! |
| 21:40.25 | cycokilr | your boss asks you that in the mornings? |
| 21:40.34 | JacobKerr | Yeah I know. |
| 21:40.41 | JacobKerr | It should be in the afternoon hu? |
| 21:40.57 | cycokilr | it should be never.. |
| 21:41.04 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:41.08 | cycokilr | i don't think my boss has ever asked me what i get done.. |
| 21:41.15 | cycokilr | he just gives me promotions and raises.. |
| 21:41.18 | JacobKerr | Sweet lucky you.. |
| 21:41.37 | cycokilr | that's why we have to hire a new Sr Systems Engineer, cause he promoted me earlier this week.. |
| 21:41.47 | JacobKerr | any avail. position for Internet Marketing / SEO / Web Design / Web Development |
| 21:41.52 | cycokilr | yes |
| 21:42.01 | JacobKerr | over 45k? |
| 21:42.02 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 21:42.12 | cycokilr | crap, it's not on the site anymore.. |
| 21:42.21 | cycokilr | i don't think they filled it.. i can find out.. |
| 21:42.32 | cycokilr | yeah, the marketing department has no budget.. |
| 21:42.39 | cycokilr | i'm sure it could be whatever you wanted.. |
| 21:42.46 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 21:42.55 | cycokilr | i'm serious man.. |
| 21:43.14 | cycokilr | the director just goes in to the owners office and cries until he give in.. she gets whatever she wants.. |
| 21:43.24 | cycokilr | she's pretty cool though.. |
| 21:43.32 | cycokilr | i just think he's a wimp and should stand up to her.. |
| 21:43.33 | JacobKerr | Wow what a job.. |
| 21:43.55 | cycokilr | it's a sweet place to work though.. i love it.. |
| 21:44.13 | cycokilr | we get a lot of perks working in IT.. |
| 21:44.38 | cycokilr | the boss just bought us Sr guys personal Cisco 2960G 8-port switches for our offices.. |
| 21:44.50 | JacobKerr | Yeah it's dif when your working for a design or marketing firm.. |
| 21:45.15 | cycokilr | where do you work now? |
| 21:45.58 | JacobKerr | WI Works, Inc. / Utah Web Services |
| 21:46.08 | JacobKerr | http://www.utahwebservices.com/ |
| 21:46.41 | cycokilr | ahh, i saw this page the other day for some reason that eludes me right now.. |
| 21:46.42 | PoeticIntensity | I've worked where JacobKerr works. |
| 21:46.55 | JacobKerr | LOL.. yeah it sux ars. |
| 21:46.56 | PoeticIntensity | There is a reason I don't work there anymore... :) |
| 21:47.07 | JacobKerr | I am way beyond this piece of crud company. |
| 21:47.17 | PoeticIntensity | man.... I worked there... ummm..... shoot... |
| 21:47.26 | cycokilr | you want i should ask the marketing guys if they got somebody? |
| 21:47.28 | PoeticIntensity | it'd have to be 6-7 years ago. |
| 21:47.54 | cycokilr | they have a posting for C# developers up still.. |
| 21:48.00 | JacobKerr | K, my resume is at: www.jacob-kerr.com |
| 21:48.09 | cycokilr | oh wait, C++ |
| 21:48.12 | JacobKerr | I studyed C# but never used it to bad.. |
| 21:48.31 | JacobKerr | studied * ;) |
| 21:49.28 | JacobKerr | LOL I was newer to programming and could not figure out how to compile my code so I gave up on it.. |
| 21:50.12 | cycokilr | yeah, that's probably why i stuck with php stuff.. |
| 21:50.30 | cycokilr | too many things to install to compile programs.. |
| 21:50.37 | JacobKerr | it's very picky, seems like everything from Microsoft is. |
| 21:50.50 | JacobKerr | You have to declare all of your data types and everything.. |
| 21:50.51 | PoeticIntensity | heh... speaking of Microsoft.... |
| 21:51.02 | PoeticIntensity | http://www.ilovemyjournal.com/?action=personal_entry&eid=3296&user=1 |
| 21:51.05 | PoeticIntensity | freakin' buggers. |
| 21:51.31 | JacobKerr | I HATE INTERNET EXPLORER! You know there's an organization dedicated to destroying IE.. |
| 21:51.45 | cycokilr | the justice department? |
| 21:51.52 | JacobKerr | No.. one sec. |
| 21:52.43 | JacobKerr | I found it once but did not book mark it.. |
| 21:52.58 | brasto | I think there's lots of orgs dedicated to killing ie |
| 21:53.58 | brasto | PoeticIntensity: lol: here and here and here and here and here... |
| 21:54.04 | PoeticIntensity | heh... yeah. |
| 21:54.10 | PoeticIntensity | and this happened *yesterday* |
| 21:55.27 | brasto | I'll have to check my pc at home for that app... |
| 21:55.38 | PoeticIntensity | I would too, if I used Windows. |
| 21:56.44 | JacobKerr | GET THIS A THOUGHT CRIME PREVENTION BILL: http://www.freemarketnews.com/WorldNews.asp?nid=50696 |
| 21:56.51 | JacobKerr | what a bunch of bs.. Pff... |
| 21:57.36 | brasto | some games are made only for windows, and I've yet to test them all on linux, or I'd have no Windows, too, PoeticIntensity... |
| 21:57.51 | PoeticIntensity | er... brasto |
| 21:57.58 | PoeticIntensity | (auto-complete... bah) |
| 21:58.30 | PoeticIntensity | I play games.... just not the ones that play on Windows... (well.. Except Need For Speed, which I play now on average of once per month) |
| 21:58.47 | PoeticIntensity | other than that, it's all ET, UT2004, and now Enemy Territory : Quake Wars!!!! |
| 21:58.54 | PoeticIntensity | (which runs natively on Linux) |
| 21:59.45 | PoeticIntensity | Heh... my bro is a Halo nut, and he said he's gettin' sick of the "same old thing" with each new release of Halo. |
| 22:00.25 | Kamehameha | PoeticIntensity, did I send you that email about the Halo tournament at Jordan Commons? |
| 22:00.34 | PoeticIntensity | yup |
| 22:01.26 | PoeticIntensity | Nexuiz is also a great OS FPS. |
| 22:01.28 | orsonj | I before E except after C, and when sounding like Ay as in neighbour and weigh, and on weekends and holidays, and all throughout May, you'll never be right no matter what you say. |
| 22:01.44 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 22:01.47 | PoeticIntensity | sweeeeet. |
| 22:01.55 | orsonj | I think that was from brian regan |
| 22:02.11 | Utah_Dave | Yes, Brian Regan. he's hilarious |
| 22:02.26 | Utah_Dave | My wife and I saw him perform earlier this year. |
| 22:03.44 | JacobKerr | Cooll.. |
| 22:05.03 | timinator | I think they should come out with a new controller for FPS's |
| 22:05.52 | timinator | I think they should take a Glock casing, and add a ton of sensors to it |
| 22:06.00 | timinator | Bluetooth connection |
| 22:06.09 | timinator | and setup a ton of blank shells |
| 22:06.35 | brasto | ~fps |
| 22:06.35 | jbot | rumour has it, fps is first person shooter (e.g. Quake) or frames per second |
| 22:06.49 | timinator | FPS |
| 22:06.56 | timinator | so, you have a big screen |
| 22:07.06 | timinator | and you pickup your Glock |
| 22:07.10 | timinator | add a clip |
| 22:07.14 | timinator | start shooting |
| 22:07.27 | timinator | each bullet is actually a casing with a censor |
| 22:07.30 | timinator | that's it |
| 22:07.39 | brasto | cool |
| 22:07.45 | timinator | so when you shoot, it pops the casing out the side |
| 22:07.52 | timinator | so, you have to load it and everything |
| 22:08.03 | brasto | jk |
| 22:08.06 | orsonj | I don't know how the typist actually completed this transcription. http://www.brian-regan.com/Regan/transcript.html |
| 22:08.09 | timinator | and it would have to have the normal weight of a regular gun |
| 22:09.06 | timinator | that's one of my genius ideas |
| 22:11.17 | timinator | what?!?! |
| 22:11.27 | timinator | what would make that a bad thing? |
| 22:11.37 | orsonj | he's thinking about making something that looks like something that might help people train to be potential airplane hijackers |
| 22:12.08 | timinator | oh heck! |
| 22:12.52 | timinator | they're busy hiding explosives in baby formula |
| 22:13.40 | timinator | I guess that could be used in a bad way.... but I think they'd hit a firing range instead of playing Halo |
| 22:14.29 | orsonj | WAIT!!!! I can see it now. It doesn't actually have anything to do with terrorists. They are trying to get population control in a very very very very very very very round about way! |
| 22:15.23 | JacobKerr | Your a freaking genius Orsonj! |
| 22:15.29 | JacobKerr | It takes smart people to see that.. |
| 22:15.37 | JacobKerr | Poor red necks... |
| 22:15.56 | *** join/#uphpu kingsol (n=kingsol@64.0.192.139) |
| 22:16.39 | JacobKerr | SMART.... Y! BECAUSE I GOTA! |
| 22:19.09 | Kamehameha | PoeticIntensity, you weren't here earlier but I finally solved the riddle of the ole 404 custom php page :) |
| 22:19.27 | PoeticIntensity | Actually, I was. :) |
| 22:19.44 | PoeticIntensity | I already read it, and ... congratulations, bud! You've found another reason to hate IE... ;-) |
| 22:20.01 | Kamehameha | totally... what a pain.. didn't work just because of file size LOL |
| 22:21.31 | brasto | chat later! |
| 22:21.40 | *** part/#uphpu brasto (n=brasto@out.lnxi.com) |
| 22:22.39 | JacobKerr | LOL all of this gets loged? |
| 22:22.41 | JacobKerr | man.. |
| 22:23.20 | beandog | http://youtube.com/watch?v=dZIBssP66lI |
| 22:23.27 | beandog | yes, and your employer checks it daily |
| 22:24.39 | PoeticIntensity | JacobKerr, yes. |
| 22:24.48 | PoeticIntensity | logged and indexed by google. |
| 22:24.53 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 22:25.21 | beandog | unless you get the bots to ignore you somehow |
| 22:25.51 | PoeticIntensity | you'd have to have control of the server containing the IRC logs, though... wouldn't ya? |
| 22:27.00 | beandog | its bots that post it, not freenode |
| 22:27.38 | PoeticIntensity | ah.. gotcha. |
| 22:27.45 | orsonj | not just bots log though |
| 22:28.14 | beandog | mindjuju keeps a mental log |
| 22:28.26 | beandog | he can instantly recall any of our bad jokes |
| 22:28.33 | beandog | or tunafart instances |
| 22:28.43 | *** join/#uphpu JacobKerr (n=JacobKer@72.25.165.83) |
| 22:29.44 | Utah_Dave | and mindjuju is in the channel for 23 out of the 24 hours in the day |
| 22:33.12 | orsonj | and when he isn't, his frenplant is |
| 22:33.24 | orsonj | s/fre/fer |
| 22:35.23 | *** join/#uphpu mindjuju (n=mindjuju@65-121-75-195.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 22:35.24 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o mindjuju] by ChanServ |
| 22:39.44 | *** join/#uphpu PoeticIntensity (n=jason@67.137.24.218) |
| 22:39.44 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v PoeticIntensity] by ChanServ |
| 22:43.27 | beandog | I love a good march |
| 22:47.46 | mindjuju | yeah, the dude calls himself a geek and sends me the following email: |
| 22:48.05 | mindjuju | some clients say they are having difficulties with one of the web pages, can you look into this and let me know |
| 22:48.24 | mindjuju | uh, what web page, what browser, what OS, is the person smart or stupid, like a million questions |
| 22:48.25 | herlo | beandog: March is a great month |
| 22:48.47 | beandog | lol |
| 22:48.49 | herlo | :) |
| 22:48.50 | beandog | you mean that was the whole email? |
| 22:48.51 | mindjuju | not only that, He's not over me, he's not near me, and just cause he's director, doesn't mean squat in the compnay |
| 22:49.09 | herlo | mindjuju: you're such a kiss ass :) |
| 22:49.28 | mindjuju | director of support is like saying king of the support geeks |
| 22:51.44 | PoeticIntensity | mindjuju, .... that last "king" comment made me spew... good timing. |
| 22:51.54 | mindjuju | :) |
| 22:52.37 | PoeticIntensity | (totally generalized comment warning) I love it how "support" or "helpdesk" people consider themselves "smarter than most" |
| 22:52.48 | mindjuju | too true |
| 22:53.06 | beandog | Its generally true. |
| 22:53.16 | beandog | I call up AOL tech support for advice with my life problems all the time. |
| 22:53.19 | mindjuju | it's 99.9899999% true |
| 22:53.20 | beandog | Just look where its gotten me |
| 22:53.22 | PoeticIntensity | "king of the support geeks" |
| 22:53.30 | beandog | heh |
| 22:53.32 | beandog | nerds. |
| 22:53.39 | PoeticIntensity | holy freak!? |
| 22:53.47 | PoeticIntensity | an NVidia 8500GT for 70 bucks!?!??! |
| 22:53.52 | beandog | whot? where? |
| 22:53.55 | mindjuju | really? |
| 22:53.58 | PoeticIntensity | pcclub.com |
| 22:54.03 | beandog | ooh pcclub |
| 22:54.06 | PoeticIntensity | http://www.pcclub.com/product_details.cfm?itemno=A9654017 |
| 22:54.06 | beandog | they have sexy deals |
| 22:54.07 | PoeticIntensity | yeah |
| 22:54.08 | beandog | is it fanless? |
| 22:54.12 | PoeticIntensity | heck no |
| 22:54.16 | beandog | buh |
| 22:54.19 | PoeticIntensity | it'd burn burn burn, baby. |
| 22:54.47 | beandog | whats so great about that card |
| 22:54.57 | PoeticIntensity | uhhh.... |
| 22:55.00 | PoeticIntensity | speed in 3d rendering? |
| 22:55.09 | PoeticIntensity | capabilities? |
| 22:55.18 | PoeticIntensity | I'm checking the stats for it now.. |
| 22:55.25 | PoeticIntensity | (3rd party stats) |
| 22:56.32 | beandog | bueno |
| 22:57.06 | PoeticIntensity | hold on... |
| 22:57.10 | PoeticIntensity | it might not be that great. |
| 22:57.36 | PoeticIntensity | http://www23.tomshardware.com/graphics_2007.html?modelx=33&model1=856&model2=722&chart=318 |
| 22:57.52 | PoeticIntensity | pretty so-so, actually.... |
| 22:57.53 | PoeticIntensity | :-\ |
| 22:57.54 | PoeticIntensity | darn. |
| 22:58.16 | PoeticIntensity | hehe.... |
| 22:58.36 | PoeticIntensity | the "disgruntled IT dude" picture always makes me smile. |
| 22:58.57 | mindjuju | ~flip timinator |
| 22:58.58 | jbot | ACTION gives timinator the .|.. ..|. |
| 22:58.59 | timinator | LOL |
| 22:59.06 | timinator | love you too mindjuju |
| 22:59.22 | mindjuju | heh, sorry 'bout that! 'twas a misfire |
| 22:59.38 | beandog | PoeticIntensity, what picture? |
| 22:59.45 | mindjuju | these middle fingers seem to have a sense of justice of all their own |
| 22:59.49 | beandog | mindjuju, so what did he say when you talked to him? |
| 22:59.57 | beandog | this channel needs some drama |
| 23:00.00 | beandog | and story time |
| 23:00.16 | mindjuju | oh, he's like dopey from snow white |
| 23:00.24 | mindjuju | duh, oh ok, that makes sense |
| 23:00.31 | mindjuju | except that i've talked to him about this before |
| 23:00.47 | mindjuju | gave him the ole' "help me help you" speech |
| 23:02.53 | beandog | that should be a song |
| 23:03.10 | mindjuju | no doubt |
| 23:04.25 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 23:07.37 | JacobKerr | Hey how much do you guys make? Just want to know what I can look forward to in the future :). What's the best thing to go after etc.. |
| 23:08.33 | JacobKerr | If I go all out PHP is there allot of opportunity or what? I have invested allot of time in study but I keep jumping from one thing to the next.. What should I specialize in.. |
| 23:08.40 | dataw0lf | over 80k, but I'm not a PHP dev |
| 23:08.54 | JacobKerr | What do you do? |
| 23:09.06 | JacobKerr | Everything? LOL.. |
| 23:09.16 | PoeticIntensity | JacobKerr, check your email. |
| 23:09.19 | PoeticIntensity | I just sent you a job op. :) |
| 23:09.23 | JacobKerr | is it best to specialize or be weel rounded? |
| 23:09.27 | PoeticIntensity | a headhunter found me and offered it to me... |
| 23:09.34 | JacobKerr | Sweet. |
| 23:09.52 | dataw0lf | JacobKerr: app and network security |
| 23:10.22 | JacobKerr | 65k is good LOL>. |
| 23:11.21 | PoeticIntensity | my advice is to specialize in something and get *really* good at it. |
| 23:11.23 | JacobKerr | I will look into that tonight, thanx Poetic :) |
| 23:11.28 | PoeticIntensity | no problem. |
| 23:11.53 | JacobKerr | Yeah, I think I like to program more then anything else.. |
| 23:12.05 | PoeticIntensity | also, it helps if what you're getting good at is in demand where you live. :) |
| 23:12.17 | JacobKerr | So I think I will get PHP down and then move onto PERL and everything Apache.. |
| 23:12.32 | PoeticIntensity | I make over 80 doing PHP / DB stuff. |
| 23:12.51 | JacobKerr | Every field is slammed with competition I think. |
| 23:13.09 | PoeticIntensity | of course! Tis the beauty of capitalism... |
| 23:13.16 | beandog | well, not every field |
| 23:13.16 | JacobKerr | Is PHP / MySQL in high demand? |
| 23:13.18 | beandog | we need a flash dev |
| 23:13.20 | PoeticIntensity | gotta get good at what you do |
| 23:13.24 | beandog | cant find anyone |
| 23:13.30 | JacobKerr | I started as a flah guru.. |
| 23:13.35 | JacobKerr | been awhile though.. |
| 23:13.41 | PoeticIntensity | Personally, I think PHP is in great demand. |
| 23:14.03 | PoeticIntensity | I get at least one job offer / announcement per week which is around 65K / year in Utah. |
| 23:14.14 | PoeticIntensity | so.... yeah. |
| 23:14.18 | PoeticIntensity | it's in demand. |
| 23:14.30 | JacobKerr | Yeah I guess all I really need to do is build something cool and get it online to prove myself.. |
| 23:14.42 | PoeticIntensity | however..... I've got a pretty good resume, too, so... that always helps. |
| 23:14.51 | PoeticIntensity | and yeah... |
| 23:14.58 | PoeticIntensity | build stuff online for people to see, and make sure they're cool. :) |
| 23:15.00 | JacobKerr | I have done a ton of misc things like build XML exports that connect to an API for carts etc.. |
| 23:15.42 | JacobKerr | small content management systems.. |
| 23:16.02 | JacobKerr | but nothing really big. I need to build something big a get it online. What do you think? |
| 23:16.56 | thebigdog | JacobKerr, or help on open source projects |
| 23:17.06 | JacobKerr | Oh yeah good idea. |
| 23:17.09 | thebigdog | sometimes it is not worth it to build something to demonstrate skills |
| 23:17.27 | Utah_Dave | or pick a sweet nick like thebigdog |
| 23:17.29 | thebigdog | working with other developers will help you in experience for sure though |
| 23:17.35 | thebigdog | that too |
| 23:17.36 | JacobKerr | Yeah, I will start looking for a good open source project.. |
| 23:17.41 | thebigdog | then you can make the big $$$$ |
| 23:18.16 | JacobKerr | Yeah I guess I need to find a company that will hire me on to do full time development instead of everything like I am doing now.. |
| 23:18.23 | thebigdog | but if its about making money then you need to have have skills outside the standard development |
| 23:18.35 | thebigdog | imo you need additional skills in other areas |
| 23:18.38 | JacobKerr | I have to do design / internet marketing / PHP / MySQL / Flash etc. etc. |
| 23:18.58 | thebigdog | JacobKerr, that is good...small companies help you get exposure to technologies |
| 23:19.17 | JacobKerr | I have skillz in allot of web design / development / internet marketing areas... |
| 23:19.27 | bradym | is firefox crashing like mad for anyone else since the last update? |
| 23:19.32 | mgeary | 6 figures, baby |
| 23:19.37 | JacobKerr | Yeah I think where I work is the perfect starting position but I need to move on now.. |
| 23:19.52 | bradym | JacobKerr: if you're interested in moving to Cali, we're looking for more PHP Devs :) |
| 23:20.03 | thebigdog | JacobKerr, imo all developers need theory too too back up the skillz |
| 23:20.23 | JacobKerr | Well I have a wife and 3 kids it's hard to just pick up and go otherwise I would prob consider. |
| 23:20.36 | mgeary | naw, calif. has too high a cost-of-living |
| 23:20.37 | thebigdog | bradym, my ff runs really good...even with all my extensions |
| 23:20.54 | mgeary | i know people in the Bay area with 10+ years of solid experience making ~75-85k |
| 23:20.56 | bradym | argh.. it's crashed at least 5 times today.. |
| 23:21.06 | mgeary | i know people HERE with 10+ years of experience making ~75-85k |
| 23:21.13 | mgeary | i'd much rather have 85k here than in SF |
| 23:21.19 | bradym | oh yeah |
| 23:21.19 | beandog | no kidding |
| 23:21.29 | JacobKerr | My bro inlaw who got me into development is making 100K doing .NET stuff.. |
| 23:21.30 | thebigdog | same that is why i dont want to move |
| 23:21.38 | JacobKerr | here in Utah |
| 23:22.13 | thebigdog | i do nothing and make 15/hr |
| 23:22.16 | JacobKerr | for ancestry.com |
| 23:22.24 | JacobKerr | LOL.. |
| 23:22.39 | thebigdog | everyone makes more than me |
| 23:22.53 | mgeary | hah. if that were true, i'd have hired thebigdog |
| 23:22.57 | mgeary | at $45k |
| 23:23.21 | thebigdog | hehe |
| 23:23.48 | thebigdog | dang that is peanuts compared to PoeticIntensity |
| 23:24.00 | JacobKerr | $45k at 22 4 years in is not to bad right? |
| 23:24.11 | dataw0lf | 4 years in? |
| 23:24.12 | dataw0lf | It's bad. |
| 23:24.21 | mgeary | dataw0lf: be gentle with him |
| 23:24.25 | mgeary | 45k at 22 is great |
| 23:24.25 | JacobKerr | LOL. |
| 23:24.44 | JacobKerr | but there's 17 old kids that r rich so I guess age does not matter.. |
| 23:24.50 | mgeary | my first real job at 25 was 36k, for Novell. course that was 12 years ago |
| 23:24.50 | fungus | I didn't get more than $35k until i was 28 |
| 23:24.52 | thebigdog | i dont even make that yet...i better start looking...but i have my own coke machine here |
| 23:25.14 | JacobKerr | but I started life early I have 3 kids and my oldest is 4 |
| 23:25.22 | thebigdog | any my company scooter is killer |
| 23:25.22 | mgeary | jeeze, yeah you did |
| 23:25.34 | dataw0lf | well I'm 25, and I'm making 89k a year + contracts, which is probably around 20-25k a year. 45k a year for 4 years of experience is bad. Find a new job or get promoted, bro. |
| 23:25.53 | beandog | or just bump off dataw0lf and take his job |
| 23:25.54 | unum | and still don't even have a girlfriend |
| 23:26.08 | thebigdog | dataw0lf has more than 1 gf |
| 23:26.11 | mgeary | dataw0lf: but how long have you been programming? |
| 23:26.29 | unum | dataw0lf: are you in utah? |
| 23:26.31 | dataw0lf | mgeary: Professionally? Since I was 16. And I haven't made under 45k/year since I began. |
| 23:26.32 | thebigdog | i got a $1/hr raise a couple weeks ago..im doing really good |
| 23:26.36 | JacobKerr | I know I am working on it. I had my first client which was throwing projects at me but last night a design went under that I invested 1.5 weeks on because my wife got pist and shut the comp off and now the .psd is corrupt. |
| 23:26.46 | dataw0lf | unum: No, I'm in Reno, which pays less for tech jobs. |
| 23:26.52 | mgeary | dataw0lf: ahh, but after 9 years you're at 89k. that's more realistic |
| 23:27.04 | unum | and the cost of living is comparable |
| 23:27.10 | JacobKerr | LOL |
| 23:27.25 | dataw0lf | mgeary: Certainly, but you don't take into account that 3 of those years I was in the Army in Afghanistan and Iraq, and unable to do contracts. |
| 23:27.35 | unum | high paying jobs on the east coast or in silicon valley aren't as nice as they seem |
| 23:27.45 | mgeary | dataw0lf: but you were still developing tech skills during that time, no? |
| 23:28.12 | mgeary | anyway, imho, $45k at 22 aint bad |
| 23:28.14 | JacobKerr | OK I have not had the opportunity to specialize for 4 years. |
| 23:28.18 | dataw0lf | But I have medium to senior level experience in system administration, security, network engineering, and development, which is one of the main reasons why I make so much. |
| 23:28.18 | unum | I was talking to a girl who interviewed with google she figured they would have to triple her salary and she would see no cost of living improvement |
| 23:28.26 | JacobKerr | So I am in 4 years on a ton of stuff all mixed up.. |
| 23:28.41 | mgeary | unum: google has a utah office, don't they? |
| 23:28.44 | dataw0lf | So I wouldn't focus on 'one' thing. |
| 23:28.51 | mgeary | thought they were going to open one |
| 23:28.52 | dataw0lf | Google doesn't have a Utah office. |
| 23:28.56 | unum | mgeary: it was to run the day care at their main office |
| 23:29.04 | mgeary | ah |
| 23:29.09 | JacobKerr | OK since you guys really know what's going on can you rate me and let me know what you think off my resume? jacob-kerr.com |
| 23:29.27 | mgeary | JacobKerr: we can't rate you unless we see your code |
| 23:29.34 | unum | $45k is better than a teach with a masters degree and ten years experience :) |
| 23:29.38 | mgeary | results are only about 35% of the equation |
| 23:30.03 | JacobKerr | Yeah that's right but I'm saying in design, CSS code on page etc. I have been doing allot of design and web development in the last 4 years.. |
| 23:30.08 | dataw0lf | JacobKerr: I'd say you could get a job in Utah at around 55k with that resume. |
| 23:30.12 | dataw0lf | probably more. |
| 23:30.13 | unum | I have no idea how my neighbor pays his mortgage |
| 23:30.13 | PoeticIntensity | thebigdog, BTW, probably makes 300K / year. |
| 23:30.38 | dataw0lf | he's in the high nineties. |
| 23:30.58 | PoeticIntensity | hrmph.... he's not even here to be punched. |
| 23:31.13 | dataw0lf | I punched him with MIND BULLETS |
| 23:31.18 | PoeticIntensity | ah.... |
| 23:31.20 | unum | there is so much contract work for development....going independent is tempting |
| 23:31.32 | PoeticIntensity | unum, you're not kidding. |
| 23:31.33 | dataw0lf | JacobKerr: That resume looks really nice, by the way. |
| 23:31.46 | dataw0lf | unum: yea, but contract work, man, the taxes kill you. |
| 23:31.47 | JacobKerr | Thanx. |
| 23:31.48 | PoeticIntensity | he's not too shabby. |
| 23:32.03 | PoeticIntensity | although, I'd personally get rid of the neon-green and blue on your home-page... ;-) |
| 23:32.15 | unum | I'm in a position right now where I could get some good references and I know a couple of graphic design artists |
| 23:32.16 | dataw0lf | JacobKerr: but, yea, off the basis of that resume, without meeting you, I'd say you could easily demand 55k for web dev. |
| 23:32.19 | JacobKerr | but that's not were the money is at, so I think maybe I should move on to PHP / MySQL and more development |
| 23:32.22 | unum | dataw0lf: the trick is to not make any money |
| 23:32.37 | JacobKerr | I know I have been thinking about how bright it is.. |
| 23:32.40 | JacobKerr | way to bright. |
| 23:33.04 | dataw0lf | unum: trust me, I know, I've been working contract awhile. |
| 23:33.07 | dataw0lf | It's still a pain in the arse |
| 23:33.28 | unum | ya my dad ran his own business and my brother still does |
| 23:33.45 | JacobKerr | Yeah clients think everything can be done in a second. They do not understand that some small thing can be very time consuming.. |
| 23:33.57 | unum | My dad was making enough that he got soaked pretty bad |
| 23:34.06 | unum | but he was always willing to buy me computer hard :) |
| 23:34.20 | dataw0lf | most of the clients I know just pay me under the table |
| 23:34.28 | dataw0lf | screw The Man |
| 23:34.31 | JacobKerr | Alright, well it's about time to go home. It was nice talking to you guys. |
| 23:34.34 | unum | s/hard/hardware |
| 23:34.35 | dataw0lf | cya |
| 23:34.42 | unum | bye |
| 23:35.10 | timinator | I've got to run too.... later guys |
| 23:36.43 | mgeary | dataw0lf: the problem with that is that your clients can't then deduct what they pay you as a biz expense |
| 23:37.12 | dataw0lf | mgeary: yea, which is why it doesn't happen during the contract period. |
| 23:37.36 | dataw0lf | See, I do a contract, setting up a network, server, security, whatever with an extended period of support |
| 23:37.40 | dataw0lf | 6 months to a year |
| 23:38.24 | dataw0lf | then I get to know them, and when the contract is up, I'm usually friendly with the guys, so they'll cut me a deal and not sign another contract, but pay me under the table for future support calls/walkins |
| 23:38.42 | dataw0lf | that's where most of my contract money comes from nowadays; previous clients who I just work support for when they need it. |
| 23:39.17 | dataw0lf | and usually I'll give them a deal after the contract is over; 150/hour goes to 120/hour, or something similar. |
| 23:46.48 | Utah_Dave | Man, it got quiet in here after dataw0lf mentioned he charges $150/hour! |
| 23:47.17 | mgeary | just shows that dataw0lf doesn't work for clients in Utah... ;) |
| 23:47.28 | dataw0lf | shoot, 150/hour is average for contract work. |
| 23:47.50 | dataw0lf | we had a discussion about this in #utah yesterday, I think. |
| 23:47.55 | dataw0lf | 100-150 is a good target to shoot for. |
| 23:49.04 | dataw0lf | you can pretty much charge what you want for network security consultation |
| 23:50.50 | dataw0lf | app sec and dev are a bit more competitive and thus more set in stone. |
| 23:51.34 | mgeary | i charge $80/hour. could get more if i pushed, but i'm too nice |
| 23:51.53 | dataw0lf | 80/hour for PHP dev or flash dev? That isn't too bad for that. |
| 23:52.07 | mgeary | for either. i figure, it's all my time, regardless of what i do |
| 23:52.20 | dataw0lf | flash dev you could probably get a whole lot more, but I'm unfamiliar with it |
| 23:52.33 | mgeary | Flex dev is going for ~200/hour lately |
| 23:52.41 | dataw0lf | I bet. |
| 23:53.19 | dataw0lf | I'll never want to do web dev on contract, unless they have an inhouse graphic designer. I'll just have to outsource for that anyways. |
| 23:53.49 | mgeary | yeah, i always start with html templates |
| 23:53.58 | mgeary | i hate everything that comes before that |
| 23:54.30 | dataw0lf | well, I'm no good at it, so that's my reason ;-) |
| 23:54.44 | *** join/#uphpu burnin (n=burnin@204-228-142-194.ip.xmission.com) |
| 23:55.03 | mgeary | same |
| 23:55.20 | mgeary | i'm fine at css/html, but i generally tell people they can save $ by having someone else do that |
| 23:55.50 | dataw0lf | Yea, I mean, I know CSS pretty well, but I can't do images or anything graphic for that matter. And I just don't have the eye for design |
| 23:55.57 | mgeary | same |
| 23:58.37 | dataw0lf | Huh. I have two hundred dollar bills in my wallet. I thought I had two twenties. |
| 23:59.04 | mgeary | 10klocs is just way too big for Flash |
| 23:59.31 | dataw0lf | wow. |