| 00:04.27 | beandog | dataw0lf: it does suck. |
| 00:04.33 | beandog | we use CVS for our main repo. |
| 00:04.35 | beandog | oy. |
| 00:04.41 | beandog | I do cvs update and come back 15 minutes later. |
| 00:06.01 | dataw0lf | yea, well, at least your client doesn't crash Outlook and Outlook everytime you update |
| 02:06.03 | *** join/#uphpu jbot (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 02:06.03 | *** topic/#uphpu is Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org |
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| 02:08.51 | Utah_Dave | ~wpsAttack mindjuju |
| 02:08.53 | jbot | ACTION grabs mindjuju's table-based layout and starts to learn mindjuju some css! |
| 02:09.38 | macnewbold | jbot, what happened? |
| 02:09.39 | jbot | sorry, my owner was issuing a beating to me in the other channel :( |
| 02:09.53 | macnewbold | nice one, Utah_Dave, mindjuju needs that every once in a while |
| 02:10.23 | wps | but mindjuju is one of my best students! |
| 02:10.23 | Utah_Dave | :) yep! |
| 02:13.18 | Utah_Dave | yeah, but sometimes we all need a talking-to :) |
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| 02:33.51 | PoeticIntensity | howdEEEEE!! |
| 02:34.08 | macnewbold | g'day, PoeticIntensity |
| 02:34.18 | PoeticIntensity | man.... do you people do anything but sit at computers all day long? |
| 02:34.25 | macnewbold | (it's a good thing I've got tab complete in this thing, or you'd be P or PI) |
| 02:34.36 | PoeticIntensity | true that. |
| 02:34.44 | PoeticIntensity | macnewbold.... |
| 02:34.50 | PoeticIntensity | wow... I didn't know it had tab completion... |
| 02:34.53 | PoeticIntensity | that's awesome. |
| 02:34.56 | PoeticIntensity | what client do you use? |
| 02:35.21 | macnewbold | well, I spent today playing chauffeur to my wife after her glasses were broken, until they had the new pair |
| 02:35.23 | PoeticIntensity | beandog, I wish I were cool like you. |
| 02:35.29 | macnewbold | over four hours for a "1 hour" place to get them together |
| 02:35.32 | macnewbold | I use gaim |
| 02:35.38 | PoeticIntensity | gaim.... |
| 02:35.47 | PoeticIntensity | interesting... |
| 02:35.51 | PoeticIntensity | didn't know it could do IRC. |
| 02:35.55 | PoeticIntensity | I use XChat. |
| 02:36.13 | PoeticIntensity | eeeeenteresting. |
| 02:36.35 | PoeticIntensity | gaim++ |
| 02:37.01 | PoeticIntensity | I've gotta say, macnewbold, you've got the coolest fam. |
| 02:37.09 | PoeticIntensity | and it was awesome that you brought them to the flats... |
| 02:37.12 | PoeticIntensity | they looked like they had a great time. |
| 02:37.37 | macnewbold | haha |
| 02:37.40 | macnewbold | yeah, we liked it a lot |
| 02:37.49 | PoeticIntensity | any problems with your Highlander? |
| 02:37.55 | macnewbold | I'm glad they didn't spoil anyone else's fun |
| 02:37.59 | PoeticIntensity | ah heck no! |
| 02:38.02 | macnewbold | no, it's doing very well |
| 02:38.06 | PoeticIntensity | they were awesome! |
| 02:38.12 | PoeticIntensity | both Ryan and I thought that was *so* cool of you. |
| 02:38.16 | macnewbold | my wife was worried it would be a damper, but we all had a great time |
| 02:38.37 | macnewbold | I don't get to see enough of them (like tonight for example) so we try and do anything together that is remotely plausible |
| 02:38.47 | PoeticIntensity | just FYI - on the third washing, I found about a half-pound of salt in places I didn't think of the first two washes. |
| 02:38.50 | macnewbold | ryan was really cool with the kids too, which was nice |
| 02:38.52 | macnewbold | haha |
| 02:38.57 | PoeticIntensity | Ryan loves kids. |
| 02:39.25 | PoeticIntensity | He's a nut. |
| 02:39.27 | macnewbold | yeah, after two washings we found a little bit left inside the wheel wells and on a couple of places way down under that the 2nd wash (with the undercarriage cleaning) should have caught |
| 02:39.40 | PoeticIntensity | yeah... |
| 02:39.45 | PoeticIntensity | mine was up under the trunk. |
| 02:39.50 | PoeticIntensity | the tops of the mufflers... |
| 02:40.14 | PoeticIntensity | anywhompus. |
| 02:40.31 | PoeticIntensity | I'm trying to figure out what to do tonight. |
| 02:40.41 | PoeticIntensity | today felt like Friday in *every* aspect. |
| 02:40.45 | PoeticIntensity | I'm not gonna like going to work tomorrow. |
| 02:40.49 | PoeticIntensity | :-T |
| 02:41.17 | macnewbold | nice |
| 02:41.35 | macnewbold | since I didn't arrive at work until about 6pm today, I probably couldn't get away with taking tomorrow too |
| 02:42.03 | PoeticIntensity | heh... |
| 02:42.14 | PoeticIntensity | Some of the perks of owning your own business, I suppose... |
| 02:42.24 | PoeticIntensity | I *know* I couldn't get away with it... |
| 02:42.28 | PoeticIntensity | no supposition going on here. ;-) |
| 02:42.42 | PoeticIntensity | okay... I'm gonna try gaim for IRC. |
| 02:42.44 | PoeticIntensity | brb. |
| 02:43.25 | *** join/#uphpu PoeticIntensity (n=PoeticIn@c-67-177-35-60.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 02:43.41 | PoeticIntensity | hrmmm.... |
| 02:43.51 | PoeticIntensity | veddy interesting... |
| 02:43.53 | PoeticIntensity | it didn't authenticate. |
| 02:44.13 | beandog | wb phoob |
| 02:44.22 | PoeticIntensity | It's *n00b* to you, buddy. |
| 02:46.15 | *** join/#uphpu PoeticIntensity (n=PoeticIn@c-67-177-35-60.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 02:46.15 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v PoeticIntensity] by ChanServ |
| 02:46.38 | PoeticIntensity | hey.... I can now use smileys here. :-D |
| 02:46.41 | PoeticIntensity | (woot) |
| 02:46.47 | PoeticIntensity | beandog, what IRC client do you use? |
| 02:47.01 | beandog | uh |
| 02:47.02 | beandog | xchat |
| 02:47.18 | beandog | wheres bigdog when I need him |
| 02:47.21 | beandog | mindjuju: youre not busy are you |
| 02:47.24 | PoeticIntensity | were you aware that gaim could do IRC as well? |
| 02:47.29 | PoeticIntensity | or are you a n00b, too? |
| 02:47.29 | beandog | who wants to test an ebuild for me? whee! |
| 02:47.37 | beandog | real men use irssi |
| 02:47.47 | PoeticIntensity | irssi? |
| 02:47.49 | PoeticIntensity | weird. |
| 02:47.54 | beandog | I'm more like a unicorn / centaur breed. |
| 02:47.56 | PoeticIntensity | sounds too much like woussie. |
| 02:47.59 | Utah_Dave | PoeticIntensity: I use gaim, too |
| 02:48.14 | PoeticIntensity | cool beans... |
| 02:48.37 | Utah_Dave | I installed irssi and started to play with it, but I'm pretty used to using gaim. Plus when I'm in linux it gives me the same environment |
| 02:48.41 | PoeticIntensity | what do you need testing, beandog? |
| 02:48.47 | *** part/#uphpu bradym (n=Brady@c-24-5-175-193.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 02:51.14 | beandog | eh |
| 02:51.15 | beandog | nothing |
| 02:51.20 | beandog | Im gonna sit on it for a while |
| 02:53.58 | PoeticIntensity | k |
| 02:54.05 | PoeticIntensity | did ya ever get those two divs side-by-side? |
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| 03:01.17 | beandog | nope |
| 03:01.22 | beandog | macnewbold and I were just talking about that too |
| 03:02.20 | beandog | we decided tables are practical. :) |
| 03:02.40 | macnewbold | :-D |
| 03:02.43 | macnewbold | ~wpsattack beandog |
| 03:02.53 | jbot | ACTION grabs beandog's global.css and starts to learn beandog some css! |
| 03:04.59 | Utah_Dave | sweet |
| 03:05.09 | Utah_Dave | wpsattach was my first foray into programming jbot |
| 03:05.31 | macnewbold | very nicely done |
| 03:16.30 | beandog | bueno, me voy a casa |
| 03:16.31 | beandog | nos vemos |
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| 05:46.56 | mgeary | anyone still up? |
| 05:48.18 | Utah_Dave | barely |
| 05:58.59 | mgeary | heya |
| 05:59.31 | mgeary | are there any more efficient ways of integrating PHP and python than executing shell commands? |
| 06:22.35 | Utah_Dave | hmm. I really don't know. |
| 06:22.46 | Utah_Dave | You might try asking dataw0lf tomorrow |
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| 14:26.46 | dataw0lf | hidey ho |
| 14:35.25 | mindjuju | hidey ho, nieghborino ! |
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| 14:55.10 | macnewbold | ~wpsattack thebigdog |
| 14:55.12 | jbot | ACTION grabs thebigdog's global.css and starts to chastise thebigdog! |
| 14:55.57 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
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| 15:04.05 | unum | so I need to keep track of projects on an hourly basis |
| 15:04.25 | unum | I was thinking I'd set up a table with a date column and an hour column |
| 15:04.38 | unum | I guess I could do one column with a a date time |
| 15:05.20 | unum | actually I think I need a table with just dates as well |
| 15:05.36 | unum | because I need to keep track of some stuff on a daily basis |
| 15:05.41 | macnewbold | depends what you're doing with them, but be careful having redundant data, or you'll end up with inconsistencies |
| 15:06.13 | macnewbold | one way to do it would be to make a time log that stores a row for each day work was done with the # of hours done |
| 15:06.22 | unum | I was thinking I'd have a table with dates that would keeps all the daily stuf and then link those rows to the hours table |
| 15:06.47 | unum | I need to store hourly stats not just how many hours were done |
| 15:11.34 | *** join/#uphpu mgeary (n=mgeary@166.70.44.49) |
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| 15:11.37 | mgeary | morning |
| 15:11.51 | mgeary | hey, does anyone else here use cronolog to rotate their apache log files? |
| 15:13.43 | unum | I'm afraid I've just left it to the debian defaults |
| 15:16.09 | mgeary | k |
| 15:21.02 | *** join/#uphpu PoeticIntensity (n=jason@70.96.176.8) |
| 15:21.02 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v PoeticIntensity] by ChanServ |
| 15:21.09 | PoeticIntensity | mornin'. |
| 15:21.29 | macnewbold | apparently |
| 15:21.37 | macnewbold | s/apparently/unfortunately?/ |
| 15:39.35 | mgeary | aahh, but it's *friday* morning |
| 15:39.41 | mgeary | ~boggle Friday |
| 15:39.45 | jbot | ACTION stares in flabbergasted astonishment at Friday |
| 15:39.58 | thebigdog | and payday for thebigdog |
| 15:40.02 | mgeary | woot |
| 15:45.24 | PoeticIntensity | okay.... Is Wade in here? |
| 15:45.32 | PoeticIntensity | I have no idea what his alias is. |
| 15:45.35 | PoeticIntensity | :-? |
| 15:45.53 | PoeticIntensity | I know he is.... |
| 15:46.03 | PoeticIntensity | Are you mindjuju, Wade? |
| 15:46.10 | PoeticIntensity | or wps...? |
| 15:46.17 | PoeticIntensity | ahh.... wps.... Wade Preston Shearer... |
| 15:46.32 | wps | what's up? |
| 15:46.39 | wps | I, wade |
| 15:47.06 | PoeticIntensity | sorry... had to know. |
| 15:48.28 | wps | if I was here? |
| 15:48.58 | PoeticIntensity | if wps was you. |
| 15:49.02 | wps | ah |
| 15:50.35 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 15:50.45 | dataw0lf | that happens at least once every couple months |
| 15:51.12 | thebigdog | hi my name is Frank |
| 15:51.17 | thebigdog | ~welcome thebigdog |
| 15:51.19 | jbot | Welcome to the party, thebigdog! |
| 15:52.14 | wps | interesting, your whois confirms that |
| 15:52.42 | thebigdog | im mr. frank black |
| 15:52.50 | thebigdog | anyone know where that is from? |
| 15:53.00 | thebigdog | hint: tv show and music |
| 15:53.19 | thebigdog | i got a free book of my choice if you are right |
| 15:54.15 | wps | The Millennial Abyss? |
| 15:54.33 | thebigdog | what? |
| 15:54.49 | dataw0lf | PIXIES |
| 15:54.53 | dataw0lf | PIXIES |
| 15:54.59 | thebigdog | dataw0lf, you are half way there |
| 15:55.18 | thebigdog | wps might be close on the other half |
| 15:55.28 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic_ (n=psychic@66.7.114.126) |
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| 15:55.41 | dataw0lf | ahhhh |
| 15:55.44 | dataw0lf | yes, Millenium |
| 15:55.46 | dataw0lf | free book plz |
| 15:55.56 | thebigdog | ~free dataw0lf |
| 15:57.52 | macnewbold | so how does one pronounce "wps" properly? does it sound like "whoops"? |
| 15:58.06 | macnewbold | perhaps like "whips"? |
| 15:58.11 | mgeary | i think it's faster, more like "wips" |
| 15:58.13 | mgeary | yeah |
| 15:58.20 | wps | my siblings teased me growing up that my initials were "wade pees" |
| 15:58.21 | macnewbold | ~yow |
| 15:58.21 | mgeary | that gets my vote |
| 15:58.44 | wps | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:59.32 | wps | macnewbold: I always thought of it was whoops |
| 16:00.20 | mgeary | well, you'd know |
| 16:00.47 | dataw0lf | woopsie is how I've always thought of it |
| 16:05.21 | mgeary | so nyeah |
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| 16:42.34 | PoeticIntensity | is Erasure's new album any good? |
| 16:43.20 | mgeary | i think erasure peaked in 1987. |
| 16:46.16 | beandog | it is 1987. |
| 16:47.06 | mgeary | awesome |
| 16:48.23 | _psychic_ | lol the cp80 saga continues |
| 16:50.49 | beandog | /track? |
| 16:55.47 | *** join/#uphpu Lone_Wanderer (n=chatzill@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
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| 16:57.32 | _psychic_ | is a dan in here? |
| 16:58.35 | thebigdog | frank is here |
| 16:58.48 | _psychic_ | crookston? |
| 16:59.20 | thebigdog | ty _psychic_ |
| 16:59.35 | _psychic_ | :) |
| 16:59.45 | _psychic_ | thebigdog == dan? |
| 16:59.57 | thebigdog | thebigdog == frank black |
| 17:00.08 | thebigdog | thebigdog == frank black == ray |
| 17:00.15 | _psychic_ | by transitivity, dan == ray |
| 17:00.22 | thebigdog | thebigdog == frank black == ray > dan |
| 17:00.40 | _psychic_ | ah right |
| 17:00.42 | _psychic_ | hm |
| 17:00.43 | dataw0lf | Dan == LW |
| 17:00.59 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: well said on the blog post man |
| 17:01.07 | Lone_Wanderer | Thankee kindly sir. |
| 17:01.40 | _psychic_ | I think that dude, ksmias (clever!) is Justin Yarro |
| 17:01.46 | Lone_Wanderer | Who's that? |
| 17:02.00 | _psychic_ | Do you know who Ralph Yarro is?> |
| 17:02.03 | Lone_Wanderer | Nope. |
| 17:02.09 | _psychic_ | SCO chairman |
| 17:02.12 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh |
| 17:02.16 | _psychic_ | and the dude behind CP80 |
| 17:02.24 | _psychic_ | it makes so much more sense when I realized that |
| 17:02.28 | Lone_Wanderer | ahhh |
| 17:02.35 | _psychic_ | you and I might be talking bad about daddy |
| 17:02.36 | Lone_Wanderer | It's kind of sad actually. |
| 17:02.40 | _psychic_ | yep |
| 17:02.49 | Lone_Wanderer | They don't understand the 'net |
| 17:02.55 | Lone_Wanderer | except on a very cursory level |
| 17:02.57 | _psychic_ | But ITS FOR THE CHILDREN |
| 17:03.20 | Lone_Wanderer | not understanding the 'net means that they don't understand the reasons it won't work |
| 17:03.33 | Lone_Wanderer | and that means they can't intelligently respond to the arguments against their proposal |
| 17:03.47 | _psychic_ | well they sure don't that's for sure. |
| 17:04.04 | _psychic_ | The funny thing is that I had a tangle with a Matthew on another blog about this same issue. |
| 17:04.22 | _psychic_ | There is a Matthew Yarro listed on the contributors list for CP80 too. |
| 17:04.23 | _psychic_ | :( |
| 17:04.28 | Lone_Wanderer | huh |
| 17:04.32 | Lone_Wanderer | they've got the whole family together |
| 17:04.52 | _psychic_ | Its like I have a copy of non-licensed Linux at home or something. |
| 17:04.57 | Lone_Wanderer | XD |
| 17:05.10 | _psychic_ | Totally speculation, of course |
| 17:05.16 | _psychic_ | but the facts seem to line up rather nicely |
| 17:05.38 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah |
| 17:05.51 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: thanks for chiming in all the same. |
| 17:06.06 | _psychic_ | I don't imagine we'll be changing his mind any time soon, though. |
| 17:06.07 | dataw0lf | calling me a sleepy head |
| 17:06.23 | dataw0lf | and trying to infer that I don't know what the internet is all about. |
| 17:06.30 | PoeticIntensity | where's your blog, LW? |
| 17:06.31 | _psychic_ | I told you they like ad hominem. |
| 17:07.21 | PoeticIntensity | YUM! |
| 17:07.22 | Lone_Wanderer | gracewanderer.livejournal.com |
| 17:07.26 | Lone_Wanderer | it's not terribly thrilling |
| 17:07.29 | PoeticIntensity | thanks. |
| 17:07.31 | _psychic_ | lol dataw0lf |
| 17:08.21 | Lone_Wanderer | We should put together a panel and invite them to a discussion or something. |
| 17:08.38 | _psychic_ | dear goodness no |
| 17:08.39 | _psychic_ | there's no point |
| 17:08.44 | thebigdog | do a pod cast of it |
| 17:09.18 | _psychic_ | We can do that only if we have ref that can thrown down the fallacy flag penalty on the play |
| 17:09.42 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, if you could get them into a room, outline exactly why their solution won't work and why it shouldn't, and then ask them to refute what you've said |
| 17:09.48 | Lone_Wanderer | in fact, you could put together a network |
| 17:09.58 | Lone_Wanderer | set up CP80 on it, and then subvert it |
| 17:10.27 | _psychic_ | ...on accident. |
| 17:10.47 | thebigdog | PoeticIntensity you got any more pics of the salt flats? |
| 17:11.19 | PoeticIntensity | I do.... but man, they're huge. |
| 17:11.22 | PoeticIntensity | I need to get a gallery. |
| 17:11.31 | PoeticIntensity | hold on... lemme do some magic. |
| 17:11.32 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 17:11.35 | Lone_Wanderer | And then ask them to explain how, exactly, they're going to track down people (assuming they're even in the US) who are putting rogue porn online. |
| 17:11.53 | Lone_Wanderer | You could also ask them to explain how they're going to deal with issues like downloading porn off of kazaa or other p2p networks |
| 17:12.42 | thebigdog | PoeticIntensity...next time you go let me know I might be able to video it if you like |
| 17:12.46 | thebigdog | i got a new hd camcorder |
| 17:12.58 | dataw0lf | they should come up with their own solution, you're right LW. |
| 17:13.08 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: well the technical issue isn't the only important one |
| 17:13.20 | _psychic_ | They are handing the keys of free speech to uncle sam |
| 17:13.21 | Lone_Wanderer | No, it's not, but it's the one that's most easily refuted. |
| 17:13.25 | _psychic_ | true |
| 17:13.26 | dataw0lf | setup a proxy system that whitelists various websites based on their moderation |
| 17:13.41 | dataw0lf | then point your browser to it |
| 17:13.46 | dataw0lf | or, even, point your router to it |
| 17:13.49 | dataw0lf | let's see kids break that |
| 17:13.58 | PoeticIntensity | thebigdog: Thanks! We actually have video of it now, however.... the camera we used got broke, and now won't transfer anything via. firewire. |
| 17:14.01 | _psychic_ | I have a good system |
| 17:14.06 | _psychic_ | this will work for sure. |
| 17:14.13 | _psychic_ | I will teach my son to hate filth. |
| 17:14.19 | _psychic_ | endofsolution |
| 17:14.32 | dataw0lf | tada! |
| 17:14.42 | thebigdog | PoeticIntensity that sucks...let me know when you get some pics up...i would love to see them |
| 17:14.49 | dataw0lf | I really wanted to add the comment "In Soviet America, the Internet Browses YOU!" |
| 17:15.12 | PoeticIntensity | I'm workin' on it... |
| 17:15.18 | PoeticIntensity | gah... |
| 17:15.23 | _psychic_ | the sad thing with my post is that some people think I'm all for internet porn, which obviously isn't the case |
| 17:15.25 | _psychic_ | dataw0lf: please do |
| 17:15.29 | _psychic_ | lol |
| 17:16.04 | dataw0lf | I will next time he responds, and I'll also add a complete solution to their problem. |
| 17:16.07 | Lone_Wanderer | by the way, _psychic_, I had an idea based on something you wrote |
| 17:16.23 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm not sure how well it'd work but it's an idea anyway. |
| 17:16.32 | Lone_Wanderer | You could put together a p2p whitelisting service |
| 17:16.45 | dataw0lf | it doesn't need to be even p2p |
| 17:16.47 | Lone_Wanderer | that automatically adds any site that the parent browses to the white list |
| 17:16.49 | dataw0lf | you can just use a proxy |
| 17:16.59 | dataw0lf | have them setup a commercial proxy |
| 17:17.02 | Lone_Wanderer | well, that relies on someone setting up and running a proxy |
| 17:17.16 | dataw0lf | so? they should this themselves |
| 17:17.23 | dataw0lf | this isn't the U.S.S.R. |
| 17:17.27 | dataw0lf | this is America |
| 17:17.48 | dataw0lf | the federal government should have nothing to do with this |
| 17:18.00 | Lone_Wanderer | right, but isn't a free, community-based solution better than one that relies on a corporation? |
| 17:18.10 | _psychic_ | it can |
| 17:18.36 | dataw0lf | not necessarily. |
| 17:18.45 | Lone_Wanderer | so I can get all my thoughts down in order |
| 17:19.03 | Lone_Wanderer | anyway, it doesn't matter how it's implemented. The point is that people can spontaneously form and join communities |
| 17:19.18 | Lone_Wanderer | not even join, just decide to trust the community |
| 17:19.32 | Lone_Wanderer | and then a site that's on the community's white list will go through no problem |
| 17:19.50 | Lone_Wanderer | then the community manager can trust other communities |
| 17:20.23 | Lone_Wanderer | if you go a site that's trusted by a community you trust, but not directly by your community, then the site has a .9 trust rating |
| 17:20.42 | Lone_Wanderer | anything below a certain trust rating gets flagged for later review by the parent, and anything below a lower threshold gets blocked |
| 17:21.15 | _psychic_ | so what happens when you have a betrayal |
| 17:21.17 | Lone_Wanderer | that way you don't have the problem of having to whitelist Every Single Decent Site |
| 17:21.33 | Lone_Wanderer | the community manager kicks the person out |
| 17:21.46 | Lone_Wanderer | the person who added the site. the site gets blacklisted. |
| 17:22.04 | Lone_Wanderer | I guess you could have the problem of people continually joining a community and whitelisting porn sites |
| 17:22.12 | _psychic_ | I kinda like australia's take on things |
| 17:22.19 | Lone_Wanderer | I should read that, I haven't yet. |
| 17:22.24 | Lone_Wanderer | Can you summarize? |
| 17:22.40 | _psychic_ | they are providing everyone free filtering software |
| 17:22.49 | Lone_Wanderer | Does it work well? |
| 17:23.09 | _psychic_ | its still in the works |
| 17:23.15 | _psychic_ | guess we'll see |
| 17:23.17 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 17:23.27 | _psychic_ | I don't think anything is every going to be bulletproof |
| 17:23.34 | _psychic_ | there's always a lewd friend |
| 17:23.39 | _psychic_ | an unblocked site |
| 17:23.44 | Lone_Wanderer | anyway, I like the idea of several overlapping communities, each of which decides independently what it approves and doesn't |
| 17:23.52 | _psychic_ | its not something that technology can fix (though it does help) |
| 17:24.01 | Lone_Wanderer | and then you can join any community you want, and have trust established dynamically |
| 17:24.11 | Lone_Wanderer | it won't ever be perfect, but that's not the point |
| 17:24.14 | mindjuju | i think though, dataw0lf's point from the blog will actually cause isses with a community proxy. Not everybody agrees with what is bad. I'm pretty conservitive, but don't have a problem with classical art, where I know other very conservitive people do |
| 17:24.22 | mindjuju | i say, let the parent setup their own proxy |
| 17:24.31 | mindjuju | everything is black until the parent says it is white |
| 17:24.32 | _psychic_ | \o/ |
| 17:24.39 | mgeary | mindjuju: that's what i do |
| 17:24.47 | _psychic_ | or the reverse, if the parent wants it |
| 17:24.48 | mindjuju | nothing beats good parenting |
| 17:24.51 | mindjuju | exactly |
| 17:24.57 | mindjuju | how ever loose or strict |
| 17:25.01 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: the problem with that is that you have to whitelist a huge number of sites |
| 17:25.32 | mgeary | Lone_Wanderer: not really |
| 17:25.34 | _psychic_ | I like what australia is doing - they allow something for fallback |
| 17:25.37 | Lone_Wanderer | if you could share the job of whitelisting with people in your neighborhood or real-life community (who you're likely to agree with) |
| 17:25.40 | _psychic_ | in case you cant afford to get your own solution |
| 17:25.49 | Lone_Wanderer | mgeary: how many web sites do you visit in a week? |
| 17:25.56 | mgeary | i am not my 6-year-old son :) |
| 17:26.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Wait until he's 16 |
| 17:26.24 | mgeary | by the time he's 16 i may have already either won or lost the battle |
| 17:26.40 | beandog | http://allyourmedievalbase.ytmnd.com/ |
| 17:26.44 | mgeary | in any case, a determined 16 year old is going to be able to circumvent a whitelist |
| 17:26.54 | Lone_Wanderer | Anyway, some people's kids are going to be wanting to visit large numbers of sites, and having a white list in place makes managing that solution annoying. |
| 17:27.22 | Lone_Wanderer | And an annoying security feature is just as likely to get left off as it is to be used at all |
| 17:27.43 | *** part/#uphpu wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 17:27.44 | Lone_Wanderer | I suppose the best possible solution is to have as many options on the table as possible, and to let every parent pick the one they like |
| 17:27.58 | _psychic_ | I don't mind a gov't provided option though |
| 17:28.01 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 17:28.01 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 17:28.07 | _psychic_ | that helps people that don't have the extra cash and time |
| 17:28.08 | mindjuju | not really the place for the gov |
| 17:28.17 | mindjuju | come on _psychic_ |
| 17:28.21 | _psychic_ | I think it'd be great if they provided a free filter |
| 17:28.23 | Lone_Wanderer | Does this... oh, is this an animated gif? |
| 17:28.27 | Lone_Wanderer | I think I've got them turned offf. |
| 17:28.27 | _psychic_ | just not mandatory, mindjuju |
| 17:28.29 | mindjuju | if you can afford internet , you can afford filtering |
| 17:28.37 | _psychic_ | that might be true |
| 17:28.49 | beandog | dataw0lf: I think youll like this one (read down a bit) http://www.hbo.com/billmaher/new_rules/20070316.html |
| 17:28.56 | _psychic_ | but it might be a good compromise measure |
| 17:29.01 | mindjuju | it's just part of what is required |
| 17:29.09 | mindjuju | like if you can afford to drive, you can afford insurance |
| 17:29.16 | _psychic_ | yeah true |
| 17:29.35 | Lone_Wanderer | Persons unknown hath set up us the catapults! |
| 17:29.39 | _psychic_ | I don't think it would be a huge error to spend tax money on something like that though |
| 17:29.47 | _psychic_ | better than buying bombs, I say :) |
| 17:30.04 | mindjuju | "Son, if you have enough strength to watch Handy Manny, you have enough strength to pick up your toys" |
| 17:31.37 | _psychic_ | haha |
| 17:31.41 | _psychic_ | nice one dad |
| 17:32.01 | mindjuju | he's going to turn 4 on Monday |
| 17:32.20 | mindjuju | he's good at counter negotitating, but not that good yet |
| 17:33.14 | wps | it makes everything better |
| 17:33.27 | mindjuju | what kind of sausage ? breakfast sausage, brautworst ? |
| 17:33.39 | wps | ground sausage |
| 17:33.42 | Utah_Dave | _psychic_: Have you seen http://scrubit.com/ |
| 17:33.44 | Utah_Dave | ? |
| 17:34.10 | Lone_Wanderer | bratwurst is delicious beyond all reason |
| 17:34.17 | Utah_Dave | They provide free dns that tries to block porn sites and other bad stuff |
| 17:34.18 | _psychic_ | I haven't - thanks for the link Utah_Dave |
| 17:34.40 | mindjuju | yeah, i love bratwurst |
| 17:34.44 | Lone_Wanderer | I wonder if you could apply Bayesian filtering to the porn problem. |
| 17:34.46 | Utah_Dave | We use it here at work and a few of the guys here have their routers at home point to it. |
| 17:34.47 | Lone_Wanderer | I bet you could very easily. |
| 17:35.01 | wps | hallelujah for anything that blocks porn |
| 17:35.03 | Lone_Wanderer | And you wouldn't even run into the problem you have with spam |
| 17:35.14 | _psychic_ | yep |
| 17:35.22 | Lone_Wanderer | because the porn sites don't rely on getting past your filters in order to reach their audience |
| 17:35.23 | _psychic_ | its gotta be content based |
| 17:35.24 | mindjuju | i've got a problem here |
| 17:35.38 | Lone_Wanderer | -g |
| 17:35.40 | wps | sorry, dataw0lf, I know you're a fan, but it's the death of our civilization |
| 17:35.54 | mindjuju | what if that DNS server gets hacked and somebody puts in www.bankofamerica.com = bad hacker IP |
| 17:36.04 | mindjuju | you'd never know |
| 17:36.27 | Lone_Wanderer | wps: how can pictures of naked people kill a civilization? |
| 17:36.29 | macnewbold | you would when the SSL cert came up |
| 17:36.45 | mindjuju | shh |
| 17:37.41 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: it gets people to addict themselves to the fact that other people are not in fact people, but objects. |
| 17:37.43 | wps | pornography addictions lead to violent behavior… in addition to tearing families apart and ruining relationship |
| 17:38.08 | wps | it is worse than drugs |
| 17:38.13 | Lone_Wanderer | There's hard data that ties availability of porn to declining sexual violence |
| 17:38.18 | _psychic_ | Utah_Dave: I added that link. Thanks! |
| 17:38.20 | Lone_Wanderer | _psychic_: There is that. |
| 17:38.40 | mindjuju | curious, L_W , i think i'd like to see that |
| 17:38.46 | Utah_Dave | np |
| 17:38.47 | mindjuju | i saw just the opposite a few days ago |
| 17:38.47 | _psychic_ | If you've had someone in your family with a porn problem, its horrificaly easy to see how destructive it is. |
| 17:38.53 | Lone_Wanderer | There are a number of problems that being *addicted* to porn can cause |
| 17:39.02 | Lone_Wanderer | just as any addiction can cause problems |
| 17:39.15 | Lone_Wanderer | but that doesn't mean that this one addiction is going to destroy western civilization |
| 17:39.19 | mindjuju | something about male youth of france committing more rapes as increased sexuality on TV |
| 17:39.53 | macnewbold | there's probably evidence to support both sides |
| 17:40.21 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: I think its an exaggeration to say we're all gonna die, but the effect is pretty significant |
| 17:40.57 | Lone_Wanderer | I'd be surprised if it were more significant than any other addiction-related problem. |
| 17:41.00 | wps | by "death" I wasn't suggesting that it was going to cause a literal stop to breathing |
| 17:41.06 | wps | I should have said destruction |
| 17:41.17 | wps | have you been addicted? |
| 17:41.25 | wps | it is significantly worse |
| 17:41.40 | wps | I believe there to be no worse addiction |
| 17:42.04 | Lone_Wanderer | Actually, yes. I was a patient at the Gathering Place several years ago. |
| 17:42.22 | Lone_Wanderer | Rory Reid was my counselor, you can look him up. He's a great guy. |
| 17:42.22 | wps | interesting |
| 17:42.40 | wps | I am surprised that you don not consider it worse then you do then |
| 17:42.49 | synic | I tend not to agree, but I guess I might be off on my definition of addiction here. |
| 17:43.04 | synic | I haven't really known anyone personally that it has caused problems for |
| 17:43.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, there are two separate issues. |
| 17:43.15 | Lone_Wanderer | One is the existence of porn at all. The other is pornography addiction. |
| 17:43.50 | _psychic_ | other people are perfectly okay to do as they think best |
| 17:44.14 | synic | I can see it causing serious problems if you thought porn was evil and you couldn't stop looking at it |
| 17:44.24 | synic | but yeah, I don't know anyone in that boat |
| 17:44.35 | Lone_Wanderer | And the addiction problem is one that won't go away even if nobody had access to porn. |
| 17:45.05 | Lone_Wanderer | synic: Thinking it's evil and not being able to stop is actually the main driving force behind the addiction. |
| 17:45.28 | synic | ah. |
| 17:45.40 | Lone_Wanderer | look up the compulsivity cycle |
| 17:46.10 | Utah_Dave | Rory Reid is one of my neighbors |
| 17:46.11 | _psychic_ | well it has to be replaced with a realistic view on sexuality |
| 17:46.20 | _psychic_ | its like thinking that WWF is real |
| 17:46.22 | Lone_Wanderer | That is one of the problems, _psychic_. |
| 17:46.32 | _psychic_ | and trying it out on your friends |
| 17:46.34 | Lone_Wanderer | One of the side effects. |
| 17:46.38 | _psychic_ | or really wanting to all the time |
| 17:46.54 | wps | regardless of your opinion as to porn's moral or religions incorrectness, pornography physically changes a person… altering their ability to love in a positive manner… their ability to maintain real relationships |
| 17:47.02 | Lone_Wanderer | Luckily I've never been married. I've known people who are, and have problems with it, and it either destroys their marriage or makes it very difficult. |
| 17:47.14 | synic | wps: I disagree with that. |
| 17:47.24 | synic | well, not entirely |
| 17:47.24 | beandog | anyone running php 4.4.6 wants to test something for me? |
| 17:47.28 | wps | I dare you to give it a try then |
| 17:47.28 | synic | I just don't think it's a blanket fact |
| 17:47.30 | Lone_Wanderer | wps: Again, I would say that porn *addiction* has the *potential* to have those effects, not pornography itself. |
| 17:47.31 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: my wifes family has been completely rocked by it |
| 17:47.36 | Lone_Wanderer | It all depends on how you deal with it. |
| 17:47.51 | synic | wps: I have. Plus, I've had a 10 year relationship. |
| 17:48.06 | dataw0lf | uh |
| 17:48.11 | dataw0lf | inability to maintain real relationships? |
| 17:48.16 | dataw0lf | haha |
| 17:48.19 | dataw0lf | man you guys |
| 17:48.43 | wps | welcome, dataw0lf. I was wondering if this conversation would catch your attention :) |
| 17:48.47 | dataw0lf | any guy who says he's never masturbated is a liar. that's all I'm going to say on that. |
| 17:48.56 | beandog | anyone? |
| 17:48.58 | beandog | php 4.4.6? |
| 17:49.04 | dataw0lf | personally, I don't watch porn |
| 17:49.05 | Lone_Wanderer | IM me beandog |
| 17:49.13 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: you cant help me, punk. :) |
| 17:49.13 | dataw0lf | but that's because it's boring |
| 17:49.18 | _psychic_ | beandog: dude we're talking about politics, this is #uphpu, remember |
| 17:49.21 | Lone_Wanderer | Why not? :'( |
| 17:49.26 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: because were on the same server |
| 17:49.27 | wps | sorry, beandog, I'm using 5 |
| 17:49.31 | _psychic_ | 5 here too sorry |
| 17:49.32 | _psychic_ | ;) |
| 17:49.35 | dataw0lf | I go for the bigger sins, like promiscious sex |
| 17:49.38 | synic | python here. sorry. |
| 17:49.41 | Lone_Wanderer | I think I've got 4.something on my server. |
| 17:49.51 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: see if ENV_HOSTNAME is returned will you? |
| 17:49.52 | dataw0lf | 5 on mine |
| 17:49.56 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah, one sec |
| 17:50.03 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: not on tahiti though |
| 17:50.05 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't actually know the state that my server is in atm... |
| 17:50.07 | Lone_Wanderer | of course |
| 17:50.13 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: it got removed somehow |
| 17:50.16 | beandog | which is really odd. |
| 17:50.18 | Lone_Wanderer | weird |
| 17:50.24 | Utah_Dave | PHP5 here as well |
| 17:50.30 | beandog | Utah_Dave: its not in there? |
| 17:51.01 | Utah_Dave | beandog: what's not in there? |
| 17:51.05 | beandog | HOSTNAME |
| 17:51.09 | beandog | $_ENV['HOSTNAME'] |
| 17:52.07 | Lone_Wanderer | I think that's a problem with the server, not with php |
| 17:52.16 | Lone_Wanderer | although incidentally, I'm not sure what version of php I've got on my server |
| 17:52.19 | beandog | It must be, but I compiled the same version on my box, and it didnt have it. |
| 17:52.20 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: php -i |
| 17:52.32 | Lone_Wanderer | Woah buddy. |
| 17:52.54 | Lone_Wanderer | 5.1.5 :( |
| 17:53.22 | *** join/#uphpu burnin (n=burnin@hongkong.machinage.com) |
| 17:53.57 | Utah_Dave | $_ENV['HOSTNAME'] doesn't output anything on my PHP5 server |
| 17:53.59 | Utah_Dave | beandog: is that what you were asking? |
| 17:54.01 | beandog | bah. |
| 17:54.03 | Lone_Wanderer | lunchtime! |
| 17:54.05 | beandog | Still, check this out |
| 17:54.09 | beandog | nothing in phpinfo has the hotsname |
| 17:54.10 | beandog | hostname |
| 17:54.11 | beandog | nothing! |
| 17:54.11 | macnewbold | what about $_ENV['HOST']? |
| 17:54.22 | dataw0lf | I'm about to go have some beers with this saucy beerwench at the local pub |
| 17:54.23 | beandog | ~lart something funky |
| 17:54.39 | beandog | well theres HTTP_HOST |
| 17:55.13 | Lone_Wanderer | macnewbold: this is affecting more than one site |
| 17:55.14 | PoeticIntensity | ok...... |
| 17:55.14 | Lone_Wanderer | brt |
| 17:55.16 | PoeticIntensity | "ta-da"! |
| 17:55.18 | beandog | sheesh |
| 17:55.21 | beandog | I still dont know why that disappeared. |
| 17:55.22 | PoeticIntensity | PoeticIntensity now has a gallery. |
| 17:55.38 | PoeticIntensity | Would it be bad to post my IP address in here? |
| 17:55.56 | PoeticIntensity | actually.... anyone who wants to see the gallery, PM me. |
| 17:56.06 | PoeticIntensity | of the Salt Flats expedition. |
| 17:56.08 | mgeary | 70.96.176.8 |
| 17:56.14 | PoeticIntensity | LO,L. |
| 17:56.16 | PoeticIntensity | nice. |
| 17:56.21 | mgeary | that's where you're connecting from, anyway |
| 17:56.25 | _psychic_ | haha |
| 17:56.31 | PoeticIntensity | yes... however.... that's not the IP I'm gonna post. |
| 17:56.38 | _psychic_ | you have his SSN too, mgeary? |
| 17:56.43 | mgeary | heh |
| 17:56.58 | PoeticIntensity | mgeary is scary with his knowledge of the eeenternet. |
| 17:57.03 | mgeary | uh, yeah |
| 17:57.23 | PoeticIntensity | or is it called "The World Wide Web" ? |
| 17:57.56 | mgeary | i love to "surf the net". and to mix metaphors |
| 17:58.01 | _psychic_ | thar interwebs |
| 17:58.43 | Lone_Wanderer | PoeticIntensity: your IP is pretty much public information :p |
| 17:58.51 | PoeticIntensity | bah.... |
| 17:58.52 | PoeticIntensity | I refuse. |
| 17:59.10 | mgeary | here's my IP: |
| 17:59.14 | mgeary | 166.70.44.60 |
| 17:59.20 | mgeary | whee |
| 17:59.24 | mindjuju | hmm.. an xmission IP |
| 17:59.28 | mgeary | yep |
| 17:59.42 | mgeary | but don't nmap me, i'm trying to get stuff done |
| 18:00.50 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer, beandog: I'm in ##php now, about to ask about this, if you want to join |
| 18:01.14 | beandog | ok |
| 18:01.26 | wps | why do some channels have a # prefixing thename? |
| 18:01.31 | PoeticIntensity | bah... okay. |
| 18:01.32 | PoeticIntensity | fine. |
| 18:01.39 | PoeticIntensity | http://67.177.35.60/gallery/ |
| 18:01.40 | mgeary | macnewbold: what is it you're asking? |
| 18:01.41 | PoeticIntensity | don't haxor me. |
| 18:01.43 | Utah_Dave | beandog: I think what you want is $_SERVER['HTTP_HOST'] |
| 18:01.52 | beandog | Utah_Dave: tahts set by the URL, apparently |
| 18:02.56 | Utah_Dave | ok, but $_ENV* didn't work for me. $_SERVER* did |
| 18:03.26 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: nice pics |
| 18:03.32 | PoeticIntensity | thanks! |
| 18:05.00 | macnewbold | mgeary: why $_ENV lost a bunch of stuff |
| 18:05.07 | PoeticIntensity | can any of you see the videos posted? |
| 18:05.20 | mgeary | ah |
| 18:05.44 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: didn't notice that there were vids |
| 18:06.03 | macnewbold | http://us2.php.net/manual/en/reserved.variables.php#reserved.variables.environment |
| 18:06.19 | PoeticIntensity | my browser pops up a 'you need a plugin' thing. |
| 18:06.23 | PoeticIntensity | they're on the last page, I believe. |
| 18:06.34 | mgeary | what is it you're putting/trying to keep in $_ENV? |
| 18:06.38 | beandog | apache is blocking it somehow, where |
| 18:06.47 | beandog | mgeary: everything it ripped out |
| 18:06.54 | mgeary | the only time i've ever used that was when i was escaping to the shell and running another executable that needed environment vars |
| 18:06.58 | beandog | # php -i | grep -i ENV | wc -l |
| 18:06.58 | beandog | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:07.00 | beandog | apache: 3 |
| 18:07.22 | beandog | somethings not quite right |
| 18:07.37 | *** join/#uphpu bigdog_ut (n=bigdog@208.177.146.102.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 18:07.37 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o bigdog_ut] by ChanServ |
| 18:08.13 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: videos are slooow to load |
| 18:08.19 | PoeticIntensity | bah..... |
| 18:08.21 | PoeticIntensity | k |
| 18:12.57 | mgeary | nice ripped jeans. is that you, PoeticIntensity ? |
| 18:12.58 | mgeary | :) |
| 18:13.25 | PoeticIntensity | heh... no |
| 18:13.27 | PoeticIntensity | that's my bro. |
| 18:13.35 | PoeticIntensity | I'm going to lunch. |
| 18:14.10 | beandog | seeya |
| 18:15.15 | Utah_Dave | PoeticIntensity: looks like you guys had great weather |
| 18:16.22 | Utah_Dave | didn't macnewbold |
| 18:16.33 | Utah_Dave | didn't macnewbold go on the trip? |
| 18:20.08 | PoeticIntensity | yeah.. he did. |
| 18:20.15 | PoeticIntensity | we've got one pic of his highlander. |
| 18:20.19 | Utah_Dave | I didn't see any pictures of his highlander |
| 18:20.22 | PoeticIntensity | and yeah... the weather was perfect. |
| 18:20.23 | Utah_Dave | Oh, let me look again |
| 18:20.27 | PoeticIntensity | there's *one*. |
| 18:20.29 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 18:20.31 | PoeticIntensity | ok.. I'm out for lunch. |
| 18:20.34 | PoeticIntensity | bbl |
| 18:21.22 | mindjuju | Holy Crap! |
| 18:21.33 | mindjuju | No way i'm looking at homes in Orem now! |
| 18:21.38 | mindjuju | Property owners in the area are being asked not to grow vegetable gardens or harvest fruit during the next three years. |
| 18:21.46 | mgeary | ? |
| 18:21.46 | beandog | wtc? |
| 18:21.51 | mindjuju | http://www.heraldextra.com/content/view/213928/ |
| 18:21.53 | burnin | yep, that bites |
| 18:22.00 | wps | yup… japanese beetle infestation |
| 18:22.08 | mindjuju | Orem is considering using a special pesticide, yup japanese bettle |
| 18:22.24 | burnin | I hope they get it under control |
| 18:22.57 | beandog | oh geez. |
| 18:23.04 | beandog | "In an interview with the Daily Herald at his home, Lawson said spraying his property would be a violation of his property and religious rights. He said prophets of the LDS Church have issued a commandment for members to plant a garden each year and following the state's directive would "absolutely force" him to violate that commandment." |
| 18:23.07 | beandog | what a beef-wheat |
| 18:23.21 | wps | oh… gag |
| 18:23.33 | mindjuju | heh, that's funny |
| 18:23.33 | wps | if he doesn't spray… then he'll _never_ have a garden |
| 18:23.37 | wps | what a moron |
| 18:23.39 | burnin | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:23.53 | mgeary | i'm on a half acre, with 40 fruit trees |
| 18:24.16 | mgeary | i'm hoping this isn't going to be a problem. i'm in provo |
| 18:24.27 | mindjuju | wow |
| 18:24.33 | wps | it shouldn't, mgeary |
| 18:24.38 | wps | my parents and sister are in the swatch |
| 18:24.43 | wps | s/swatch/swath/ |
| 18:25.26 | wps | from what they have been told, the infestation is only certain blocks (West of state and between 4 south and 4 north if I recall) |
| 18:25.33 | wps | and they are only going to spray there |
| 18:25.48 | mgeary | huh |
| 18:26.26 | mindjuju | k, there is something EVEN WORSE in that article that I just noticed |
| 18:26.45 | wps | that guys makes me mad |
| 18:26.45 | mindjuju | what the HECK is that long monstrosity of icons at the bottom |
| 18:27.09 | wps | idiots like that that make those of the LDS faith look like freaks |
| 18:27.10 | mindjuju | are there that many digg wannabees? |
| 18:27.41 | mindjuju | well, i guess technically, Fark came first |
| 18:27.49 | mindjuju | So, Fark wannabes |
| 18:30.27 | beandog | well I like fark |
| 18:30.33 | beandog | its at least edited, it seems |
| 18:30.37 | beandog | digg just lets any old trash roll through |
| 18:30.41 | mindjuju | yeah, forgot about Fark |
| 18:30.44 | beandog | so its the sum of sensational crap |
| 18:30.49 | mindjuju | i think Fark was the first |
| 18:30.55 | beandog | BATTERY EXPLODING VIDEOS!!!/11 OMZ! |
| 18:30.59 | beandog | 1,439 diggs |
| 18:31.04 | beandog | meh. |
| 18:31.43 | beandog | mindjuju: oh, yes, they are just social / bookmarking / whatever sites |
| 18:31.49 | beandog | I hate it when people have those on their blogs. |
| 18:37.53 | wps | I don't get Digg |
| 18:43.29 | Lone_Wanderer | wps: a ## channel means that it's "about" that subject. For example, ##php is for discussion about php, whereas #uphpu is for members of uphpu to talk about anything |
| 18:43.43 | wps | thanks |
| 18:43.57 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: Yeah my dad went to that meeting, there was a lot of argument on both sides. |
| 18:44.52 | Lone_Wanderer | And my dad is a crop scientist. So I imagine he's got some good insight into the issue. |
| 18:44.59 | Lone_Wanderer | I didn't ask him his thoughts on the issue though. |
| 18:45.10 | mindjuju | yeah, was going to ask what side of the issue he was on |
| 18:46.04 | Lone_Wanderer | Based on what I overheard, I think his position is that the mandatory spraying won't fix the issue because Orem doesn't exist in a vacuum, and that instead of trying to eliminate them we need to accept that they're here and we should look at ways to manage the problem in the future. |
| 18:46.30 | *** join/#uphpu jsmith (n=jsmith@000-193-159.area3.spcsdns.net) |
| 18:46.30 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v jsmith] by ChanServ |
| 18:46.33 | Lone_Wanderer | Mandatory spraying may kill them this year, but wherever they came from, they're still going to be there, and they'll just come back again next year. |
| 18:46.38 | mindjuju | i wonder what the damage is by having them here |
| 18:46.59 | mindjuju | well, L_W, they did say spray 3 years in a row , not that i'm for it |
| 18:47.06 | mindjuju | but i think that's how they would get past that |
| 18:47.16 | mindjuju | seems pretty dangerous to me though, |
| 18:47.27 | Lone_Wanderer | I suppose they could require mandatory pesticides every year from now until forever. |
| 18:47.40 | Lone_Wanderer | But eventually they'd become resistant to it. |
| 18:48.02 | wps | my understanding is that they are not native to this area and that someone brought them in |
| 18:48.14 | Lone_Wanderer | And even if they didn't, it's not like they can crop dust the entire city. |
| 18:48.17 | Lone_Wanderer | Right, but they're here now. |
| 18:48.31 | Lone_Wanderer | Short of killing every last whatever they are, and alll of their eggs, they're not going away |
| 18:48.53 | wps | you don't have to kill them all on the planet… but you don't think that they can kill them all in Orem? |
| 18:49.08 | Lone_Wanderer | Maybe if we somehow managed to coat the entire state in insecticides for long enough to kill them all, we could eliminate them |
| 18:49.17 | Lone_Wanderer | no, I don't think they can kill them all in Orem |
| 18:49.26 | Lone_Wanderer | you can kill all the bugs in a single garden |
| 18:49.47 | Lone_Wanderer | but there are going to be bugs outside your garden that will just fly right back in as soon as the pesticide breaks down |
| 18:50.27 | Lone_Wanderer | so unless the infestation (word?) is limited only to Orem, and hasn't spread to Pleasant Grove, Provo, etc., we have no hope of eliminating them |
| 18:53.48 | bigdog_ut | pack it up pack it in...let me begin |
| 18:54.26 | bigdog_ut | ...jump around |
| 18:54.42 | mindjuju | jump up, jump up and get down! |
| 18:54.48 | mindjuju | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:55.01 | bigdog_ut | i got lyrics but you dont got none |
| 18:55.06 | bigdog_ut | i got the skill |
| 18:55.12 | bigdog_ut | jump around |
| 18:55.14 | bigdog_ut | jump around |
| 18:55.15 | bigdog_ut | jump around |
| 18:55.23 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:55.24 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:55.25 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:55.25 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:55.34 | Lone_Wanderer | ~mute bigdog_ut |
| 18:55.37 | jbot | ACTION seals bigdog_ut's mouth and says, 'What good is IRC if you are unable to speak?' |
| 18:55.38 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 18:56.04 | bigdog_ut | im comin to get cha |
| 18:56.05 | bigdog_ut | im comin to get cha |
| 18:56.07 | bigdog_ut | im comin to get cha |
| 18:56.09 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:56.10 | bigdog_ut | jump |
| 18:56.22 | bigdog_ut | ~jump Lone_Wanderer |
| 18:56.23 | jbot | ACTION scrambles up the nearest tree, screams, then leaps feet first on top of Lone_Wanderer |
| 18:56.59 | bigdog_ut | oh nice to remember the good ol days |
| 18:57.00 | Lone_Wanderer | If I were going to jump on someone, I'd do it silently. |
| 18:57.07 | Lone_Wanderer | With a knife. |
| 18:57.22 | bigdog_ut | oh yeah...top o the mornin to ya |
| 18:57.58 | bigdog_ut | im irish and im a leprechaun |
| 18:58.32 | bigdog_ut | Lone_Wanderer by the way |
| 18:58.41 | bigdog_ut | top o the mornin to ya |
| 18:59.00 | bigdog_ut | i love chongs dub in that song |
| 18:59.21 | Lone_Wanderer | I think you're tring to win the "most lines in a row with no-one else talking" record. |
| 18:59.24 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm not going to let you. |
| 18:59.33 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 18:59.40 | bigdog_ut | i might have to try harder |
| 18:59.59 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf reminds me of everlast |
| 19:00.15 | bigdog_ut | all hardcore then has a santana soft side |
| 19:00.49 | mindjuju | linux parady of the mac ads |
| 19:00.50 | mindjuju | http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9700099-1.html |
| 19:00.52 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm going to log in one night at 4 am |
| 19:00.58 | Lone_Wanderer | and win the "most lines in a row" contest for good |
| 19:02.01 | mindjuju | here is the page with a couple of linux ads |
| 19:02.02 | mindjuju | http://blog.wired.com/cultofmac/2007/03/novell_launches.html |
| 19:04.05 | Lone_Wanderer | The second one is better. |
| 19:04.15 | mindjuju | yeah, where they make fun of Leopard |
| 19:04.26 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah, it's great :) |
| 19:04.57 | mindjuju | i'm thinking about buying the wife a Mac |
| 19:05.21 | macnewbold | I cost too much for that, plus my wife would probably object |
| 19:06.56 | mindjuju | they're just so darn sexy |
| 19:07.03 | mindjuju | how can anybody resist not buying one? |
| 19:07.23 | bigdog_ut | im thinking of getting one |
| 19:07.40 | mindjuju | for yourself or for the family? |
| 19:07.47 | bigdog_ut | both kinda |
| 19:07.55 | bigdog_ut | mainly for the family and wife |
| 19:08.06 | mindjuju | yup |
| 19:10.45 | jsmith | Me loves his Mac, but he's running Linux on it |
| 19:10.52 | jsmith | Can't stand OS X |
| 19:12.51 | Lone_Wanderer | I just saw a video of a guy's computer (screen capture) that has four cores and 10 gigs of ram. |
| 19:13.19 | bigdog_ut | loc? |
| 19:13.27 | Lone_Wanderer | he just opened a ton of programs |
| 19:13.34 | Lone_Wanderer | one sec |
| 19:13.55 | Lone_Wanderer | http://blog.wired.com/cultofmac/2007/03/the_joys_of_fou.html |
| 19:14.04 | Lone_Wanderer | The best part about it is the music. |
| 19:14.16 | Lone_Wanderer | How many gigs is Windows? |
| 19:14.25 | Lone_Wanderer | You could have a small filesystem entirely in ram. |
| 19:17.57 | bigdog_ut | you could |
| 19:18.09 | bigdog_ut | can you imagine ripping dvds on that |
| 19:18.10 | Lone_Wanderer | Hmm. |
| 19:18.13 | Lone_Wanderer | I have altoids and a coke. |
| 19:18.27 | Lone_Wanderer | heh, how big is a dvd? |
| 19:18.31 | macnewbold | but not mentos and a diet coke? |
| 19:18.34 | Lone_Wanderer | could you load the entire dvd into memory? |
| 19:18.41 | Lone_Wanderer | No but I bet altoids would work just as well. |
| 19:19.52 | bigdog_ut | well i dont think you need ot load it into memory...but converting the format is cpu intensive |
| 19:20.04 | bigdog_ut | my box at home is a 3.2g p4 with 2g ram |
| 19:20.24 | bigdog_ut | which i hardly ever use that much ram...im usually just over a gig |
| 19:20.30 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 19:20.44 | bigdog_ut | my next box i want dual cpu with 4g ram |
| 19:20.50 | Lone_Wanderer | same |
| 19:20.58 | Lone_Wanderer | and two monitors |
| 19:21.06 | Lone_Wanderer | so I can play WoW with TWO characters at once, instead of just one. |
| 19:21.08 | bigdog_ut | ill take a 24" one |
| 19:21.13 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 19:21.23 | Lone_Wanderer | macnewbold: any luck with env[hostname]? |
| 19:21.24 | bigdog_ut | i need to start playing again |
| 19:21.35 | Lone_Wanderer | Alliance or Horde? |
| 19:21.36 | bigdog_ut | Lone_Wanderer what server you on? |
| 19:21.39 | Lone_Wanderer | Deathwing |
| 19:21.40 | bigdog_ut | horde always |
| 19:21.46 | bigdog_ut | bloodscalp here |
| 19:21.49 | Lone_Wanderer | Good, I don't have to hate you until I die. |
| 19:22.07 | bigdog_ut | my main toon is an undead female warrior |
| 19:22.11 | Lone_Wanderer | No words can express my disdain for those who would sink to the level of rolling an Alliance toon. |
| 19:22.16 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: still pretty baffled |
| 19:22.16 | Lone_Wanderer | level? |
| 19:22.32 | bigdog_ut | only 61 |
| 19:22.43 | Lone_Wanderer | my hunter is sixty... something. I forget what. |
| 19:22.50 | Lone_Wanderer | I keep rolling new Blood Elves. |
| 19:23.03 | bigdog_ut | i got a pally in the mid teens |
| 19:23.11 | bigdog_ut | but i got like 4 other toons i play too |
| 19:23.15 | Lone_Wanderer | Mostly 'cause they're girls and I keep deciding their hair color just isn't doing it for me. |
| 19:23.17 | bigdog_ut | i love my shammy and my mage |
| 19:23.25 | Lone_Wanderer | I never got into my shammy. |
| 19:23.32 | bigdog_ut | i love rolling female |
| 19:23.38 | Lone_Wanderer | Too much downtime. |
| 19:23.39 | bigdog_ut | most of mine are all femail |
| 19:24.00 | Lone_Wanderer | I should get him to 29 (or the top of whatever bracket he's in) and do some pvp with him |
| 19:24.03 | Lone_Wanderer | I hear they're "overpowered". |
| 19:24.21 | bigdog_ut | yes they are now...60 they can wear plate too |
| 19:24.22 | Lone_Wanderer | Of course now that there's draeni shaman around, I've had a chance to actually fight them |
| 19:24.24 | Lone_Wanderer | and I've never had a problem with them |
| 19:24.27 | bigdog_ut | which is killer wicked |
| 19:24.29 | Lone_Wanderer | are you serious? |
| 19:24.34 | Lone_Wanderer | 60 shammies can wear plate? |
| 19:24.36 | bigdog_ut | yep |
| 19:24.40 | Lone_Wanderer | that's insane |
| 19:24.54 | bigdog_ut | yeah...self heal...and your in plate...sick |
| 19:25.06 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, whatever. I've still got my ten second immunity to traps, snares, fears, whatever. |
| 19:25.22 | Lone_Wanderer | And my pet that eats anything leather and below for lunch. |
| 19:25.25 | bigdog_ut | undeads great |
| 19:25.36 | Lone_Wanderer | my hunter is a tauren |
| 19:25.43 | Lone_Wanderer | but he's got the 41 point talent |
| 19:25.47 | bigdog_ut | yeah |
| 19:25.49 | Lone_Wanderer | makes him and his pet immune to all CC |
| 19:26.02 | bigdog_ut | i got canno and will of forsaken...i love those |
| 19:26.05 | Lone_Wanderer | which is amazingly useful in pvp |
| 19:26.15 | Lone_Wanderer | I LOVE it when a rogue jumps me |
| 19:26.21 | bigdog_ut | ive never rolled a hunter yet |
| 19:26.43 | Lone_Wanderer | I just get big and red and stand around while my pet kills him |
| 19:26.49 | Lone_Wanderer | <3 playing a hunter |
| 19:26.55 | Lone_Wanderer | Best Class Ever. Period. |
| 19:27.27 | bigdog_ut | yep...warrior is good for nothing put taking damage...and i hate pvp with warrior |
| 19:27.42 | Lone_Wanderer | I've never pvped with my warrior |
| 19:27.47 | Lone_Wanderer | well, not seriously |
| 19:27.51 | bigdog_ut | sucks |
| 19:28.05 | bigdog_ut | unless you got the best armour then you rock with a good priest |
| 19:28.24 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah, on my paladin, I just find a good warrior and follow him around and play indestructible healbot |
| 19:28.26 | bigdog_ut | i love my priest for pvp though...i like to heal in pvp on a rogue |
| 19:28.38 | bigdog_ut | sweet i need to do that |
| 19:28.42 | Lone_Wanderer | it's awesome |
| 19:29.02 | bigdog_ut | i just hate pvp unless i have someone to heal me...otherwise it sucks for me |
| 19:29.05 | Lone_Wanderer | they run around and stomp the snot out of people while you heal and try not to draw attention |
| 19:29.10 | Lone_Wanderer | and if you do, just bubble |
| 19:29.42 | bigdog_ut | my pally is named bubblebumm |
| 19:29.43 | Lone_Wanderer | Lay on Hands is the Best PVP Skill Ever |
| 19:29.45 | Lone_Wanderer | lol |
| 19:30.02 | bigdog_ut | i need to get my pally up so i can pvp w/ her |
| 19:30.17 | Lone_Wanderer | because they're thinking "Yes! I've almost got him! He's got no mana and no life!" |
| 19:30.23 | Lone_Wanderer | and then DING! Full life. |
| 19:31.37 | Lone_Wanderer | Ohh, another fun thing about hunters |
| 19:31.41 | Lone_Wanderer | viper sting. drains mana. |
| 19:31.53 | bigdog_ut | sweet |
| 19:31.58 | Lone_Wanderer | a paladin can cleanse it off, but that takes a bit of mana too |
| 19:32.37 | Lone_Wanderer | so you can drain them quick. it doesn't drain enough to bother a mage or priest, but on paladins and shammies it's great |
| 19:33.40 | bigdog_ut | uh |
| 19:33.54 | bigdog_ut | i might need to roll a hunter |
| 19:34.08 | mindjuju | wow |
| 19:34.08 | Lone_Wanderer | Do eet! |
| 19:34.08 | *** join/#uphpu fungus (n=fungus@216.112.118.2) |
| 19:34.08 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o fungus] by ChanServ |
| 19:34.19 | Lone_Wanderer | I've got a group of friends that are all going to be rollling new toons with me |
| 19:34.20 | mindjuju | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6h3G-lMZxjo |
| 19:34.30 | bigdog_ut | when? |
| 19:34.35 | Lone_Wanderer | But I think one of them has already claimed the hunter slot. We could have two though. |
| 19:34.35 | mindjuju | can't believe that was made by obama staff |
| 19:34.36 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic_ (n=psychic@66.7.114.126) |
| 19:34.36 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v _psychic_] by ChanServ |
| 19:34.38 | Lone_Wanderer | I dunno. |
| 19:34.42 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: It wasn't. |
| 19:34.52 | Lone_Wanderer | It's the Hillary 1984 ad right? |
| 19:34.56 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 19:35.14 | mindjuju | that's what this guy says |
| 19:35.14 | mindjuju | http://blog.wired.com/cultofmac/2007/03/creator_of_anti.html |
| 19:35.26 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah, it was made independently, by someone who happened to be employed by a company that's on Obama's payroll. |
| 19:35.32 | Lone_Wanderer | Who has since resigned. |
| 19:35.46 | mindjuju | oh, i see what you mean |
| 19:35.57 | mindjuju | yeah, true |
| 19:36.36 | PoeticIntensity | bigdog_ut: Were you able to see the salt flats pics? |
| 19:36.51 | bigdog_ut | where did you post them |
| 19:37.02 | PoeticIntensity | http://67.177.35.60/gallery/ |
| 19:37.22 | bigdog_ut | sweet |
| 19:38.52 | bigdog_ut | nic pics |
| 19:39.18 | beandog | piccies!! |
| 19:39.36 | beandog | hahahaha that rearview mirror one is classic |
| 19:40.04 | beandog | holy cow thats some water |
| 19:40.57 | PoeticIntensity | heh.. yeah. |
| 19:41.01 | PoeticIntensity | it was a lake when we arrived there. |
| 19:41.05 | mindjuju | wow jsmith , what up with VOIP? http://www.reuters.com/article/newsOne/idUSWAT00719920070323 |
| 19:41.36 | mindjuju | is the judge saying that Verizon owns the patents to VOIP? |
| 19:42.10 | jsmith | mindjuju: No, to certain technologies used with VoIP |
| 19:42.19 | mindjuju | oh |
| 19:42.24 | jsmith | It's not clear exactly what those are. |
| 19:42.43 | jsmith | All software violates patents. |
| 19:45.16 | PoeticIntensity | ok... I changed it. |
| 19:45.21 | PoeticIntensity | it's now: |
| 19:45.28 | PoeticIntensity | http://poeticintensity.com/gallery |
| 19:45.30 | PoeticIntensity | hope it works. |
| 19:45.31 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 19:45.49 | bigdog_ut | lol..nope |
| 19:45.52 | Lone_Wanderer | lol, you have e_strict turned on? |
| 19:45.53 | PoeticIntensity | d'oh. |
| 19:45.58 | PoeticIntensity | heh. .yeah. |
| 19:46.10 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 19:46.11 | PoeticIntensity | whoops. |
| 19:46.43 | beandog | ha ha! |
| 19:47.41 | PoeticIntensity | I love the web. |
| 19:47.49 | PoeticIntensity | it's so darn easy to screw crap up. |
| 19:47.57 | PoeticIntensity | heh... |
| 19:48.04 | PoeticIntensity | and I already rm -rf * 'ed the other directory |
| 19:48.07 | PoeticIntensity | I'm borked. |
| 19:48.09 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 19:48.17 | Lone_Wanderer | Just unrm it. |
| 19:48.24 | PoeticIntensity | ah! Yes! |
| 19:48.43 | Lone_Wanderer | Mr. LaForge, status! |
| 19:48.52 | mindjuju | sleep sir! |
| 19:49.02 | Lone_Wanderer | I so want to make a Star Trek-themed TV show |
| 19:49.04 | mindjuju | i'm so unmotivated today, not funny |
| 19:49.17 | Lone_Wanderer | where two or three of the characters aren't actors |
| 19:49.31 | beandog | mindjuju: lols |
| 19:49.37 | Lone_Wanderer | Like a pseudo-reality show |
| 19:49.41 | mindjuju | L_W , you shouldn't do that |
| 19:49.44 | mindjuju | you should do a music video |
| 19:49.52 | mindjuju | for the Dr. Dimento Star Trekkin' song |
| 19:50.01 | Lone_Wanderer | where the non-actors can make decisions that affect the direction of the show |
| 19:50.13 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't know that song mindjuju |
| 19:50.19 | Lone_Wanderer | Is it delicious and amusing? |
| 19:50.20 | mindjuju | WHAAAAAAAA! |
| 19:50.31 | mindjuju | we must correct this immediately! |
| 19:50.47 | Lone_Wanderer | Indubitably, sir! |
| 19:51.39 | beandog | I wanna see something like a mashup between Reading Rainbow and 24 |
| 19:51.49 | Lone_Wanderer | THAT would be awesome. |
| 19:51.50 | beandog | WHERES THE BOOK??! |
| 19:52.16 | Lone_Wanderer | Mr. President, I'm going to need to ask you to come with me to a secure location from which you can discuss candymaking with several twelve year olds. |
| 19:52.52 | PoeticIntensity | ~lart beandog |
| 19:52.56 | Lone_Wanderer | Is the volume bar on a mac exponential or linear? |
| 19:53.04 | Lone_Wanderer | and whatever it is, how can I change it? |
| 19:53.09 | PoeticIntensity | :C No jbot? |
| 19:53.17 | beandog | Oy |
| 19:53.53 | mindjuju | Beam it up Scotty! |
| 19:54.42 | PoeticIntensity | bah! |
| 19:54.44 | PoeticIntensity | it works now! |
| 19:54.53 | PoeticIntensity | http://poeticintensity.com/gallery/ |
| 19:55.09 | Lone_Wanderer | Did you change anything or is it just magical? |
| 19:55.20 | PoeticIntensity | heh... the main storage dir for the images was still the old one. |
| 19:55.22 | bigdog_ut | magic |
| 19:55.28 | PoeticIntensity | er.... I mean.. magic. |
| 19:55.31 | mindjuju | Lone_Wanderer , sent you a PM |
| 19:55.34 | Lone_Wanderer | yep |
| 19:55.40 | *** part/#uphpu beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 19:56.11 | mindjuju | whew! that was almost serious! imagine, going this whole time without hearing Star Trekkin' |
| 19:56.25 | mindjuju | that's like not konwing the Scottsman song or the lumberjack song |
| 19:56.51 | Lone_Wanderer | _psychic_: How do you do a quote in your blog? |
| 19:57.05 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: <blockquote>...</blockquote> |
| 19:57.06 | _psychic_ | just HTML |
| 19:57.09 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh ok |
| 19:58.09 | Lone_Wanderer | heh, it's almost a showtune |
| 19:58.19 | mindjuju | yeah |
| 19:58.26 | Lone_Wanderer | I can never decide if I like showtunes or want them to die a horrible, flaming death. |
| 19:58.35 | _psychic_ | haha |
| 19:58.48 | Lone_Wanderer | It's like they're half campy, half catchy. |
| 19:58.59 | mindjuju | you should make the music video |
| 19:59.25 | Lone_Wanderer | I think I'll pass on that. |
| 19:59.46 | Lone_Wanderer | We'd need more can-canning gals in skirts than I know personally. |
| 20:00.48 | Lone_Wanderer | The "where are the cheetos" one? |
| 20:00.54 | mindjuju | yup |
| 20:01.01 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh man, now I've got it in my head. |
| 20:01.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Hopefully this isn't a terminal condition. |
| 20:01.14 | mindjuju | heh |
| 20:03.07 | Lone_Wanderer | Okay, attention Mac developers - when I minimize iTunes, I want it to not be alt-tab-able again thanks. |
| 20:03.12 | Lone_Wanderer | Or at least put it at the end of the list. |
| 20:03.25 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 20:03.37 | bigdog_ut | i love linux |
| 20:03.39 | mgeary | Lone_Wanderer: just hide it |
| 20:03.45 | Lone_Wanderer | _psychic_: You can tell someone's losing an argument when they resort to ad hominem attacks. |
| 20:03.48 | mgeary | while in iTunes, option-click elsewhere |
| 20:03.50 | Lone_Wanderer | Ohh, that works. |
| 20:03.56 | mgeary | then it will be at the end of your alt-tab list |
| 20:03.57 | _psychic_ | Lone_Wanderer: well... that's what he opened up with |
| 20:04.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Well there you go. |
| 20:04.08 | mgeary | :) |
| 20:04.22 | Lone_Wanderer | You're right, a referee would have to be present to blow the whistle at fallacious arguments. |
| 20:04.44 | _psychic_ | my favorite is the mr. smarty pants argument |
| 20:04.58 | _psychic_ | "Look, if you're so smart, why don't you come up with an idea?" |
| 20:05.10 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah |
| 20:05.29 | Lone_Wanderer | mine is "You just don't like it because you didn't come up with it." |
| 20:05.50 | _psychic_ | lol |
| 20:06.37 | *** join/#uphpu beandog (n=sdibb@gentoo/developer/beandog) |
| 20:06.37 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v beandog] by ChanServ |
| 20:21.16 | mindjuju | wow, there is a big misconception about porn |
| 20:21.24 | mindjuju | i'm on the cp80 website right now |
| 20:21.38 | mindjuju | and there is a new article titled : Iceland: Teens Say Porn is forced On Them |
| 20:21.53 | mindjuju | and that it is "virtually impossible" to avoid it online |
| 20:22.14 | dataw0lf | I don't ever run into porn accidentally, except for maybe, maybe, once a year. |
| 20:22.17 | mindjuju | i'm on a special subnet at work with no content filtration and i haven't hit a porn page yet in the 3 years that i've been here |
| 20:22.19 | PoeticIntensity | I'd have to get more info to even begin to take that seriously. |
| 20:22.32 | PoeticIntensity | exactly. |
| 20:23.00 | PoeticIntensity | how in the heck can porn be "forced" upon someone who is using the Internet of his / her own free will? |
| 20:23.15 | mindjuju | yeah, agreed |
| 20:23.35 | mindjuju | the only exception to that, is how sometimes pornographers take mispelled words and create URLs. |
| 20:23.44 | mindjuju | i did go to whitehouse.com once a long time ago |
| 20:23.52 | mindjuju | before realizing i should have typed whitehouse.gov |
| 20:24.31 | mindjuju | i hear gooogle.com is suppose to be bad, or some misspelling of it or osmething |
| 20:25.07 | PoeticIntensity | gxxxgle.com |
| 20:25.10 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 20:26.10 | Lone_Wanderer | I think the people writing the article are making it biased on purpose. |
| 20:26.27 | *** part/#uphpu mgeary (n=mgeary@166.70.44.49) |
| 20:26.32 | Lone_Wanderer | booble.com used to be a porn search engine |
| 20:29.31 | mindjuju | gosh, i hope nobody ever takes cp80 seriously |
| 20:29.38 | dataw0lf | oh man |
| 20:29.41 | dataw0lf | don't worry _psychic_ |
| 20:29.42 | dataw0lf | I got this guy |
| 20:29.45 | mindjuju | i admit, i skimmed it quick a few days ago |
| 20:29.49 | dataw0lf | saying you're not for God, Family, and Country |
| 20:29.51 | dataw0lf | oh man |
| 20:29.52 | dataw0lf | it's over |
| 20:29.52 | mindjuju | now, i just read the whole proposal |
| 20:30.01 | mindjuju | this is bad |
| 20:30.14 | _psychic_ | no I got him |
| 20:30.15 | _psychic_ | :) |
| 20:32.19 | dataw0lf | dude |
| 20:32.22 | dataw0lf | I just went on the attack |
| 20:32.30 | _psychic_ | dear god, please kill all the stupid people |
| 20:32.33 | dataw0lf | sorry if I turned your blog into a warzone with the comment I just left. |
| 20:33.44 | Lone_Wanderer | A lot of people are, unfortunately, taking CP80 seriously. |
| 20:33.54 | _psychic_ | thats why this has to get more press |
| 20:34.02 | _psychic_ | dumb people will latch on to it |
| 20:34.09 | _psychic_ | all in the name of their noble cause |
| 20:34.11 | Lone_Wanderer | I hope the free speech people don't get ahold of it. |
| 20:34.16 | Lone_Wanderer | That would seriously weaken our position. |
| 20:35.33 | _psychic_ | hey I'm a bigot too |
| 20:35.34 | _psychic_ | lol |
| 20:35.57 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh man. This Paul guy is just great. |
| 20:36.52 | _psychic_ | Paul Goodwin |
| 20:36.55 | _psychic_ | doesn't ring a bell |
| 20:37.35 | dataw0lf | Paul don't want none. |
| 20:37.45 | dataw0lf | man, he really hit a nerve when he mentioned Family and Country |
| 20:37.58 | dataw0lf | God, not so much for me, but I'm sure you guys have equal responses |
| 20:38.00 | Lone_Wanderer | maybe it's a play on Godwin's Law |
| 20:38.06 | dataw0lf | oh, it definitely is |
| 20:38.10 | Lone_Wanderer | and he's really just messing around |
| 20:38.16 | dataw0lf | "You want America out of Iraq? YOU'RE A TERRORIST" |
| 20:38.21 | dataw0lf | Terrorist is the new Nazi |
| 20:39.49 | _psychic_ | .. the new Salem Witch |
| 20:39.53 | _psychic_ | .. the new Communist |
| 20:39.59 | dataw0lf | exactly. |
| 20:40.22 | dataw0lf | you always have to have an enemy to spur your people against |
| 20:40.30 | dataw0lf | it's, like, written in political rules or something. |
| 20:40.31 | _psychic_ | lol dataw0lf |
| 20:40.32 | Lone_Wanderer | You're Yellowist, aren't you? |
| 20:40.38 | _psychic_ | "how's that for ad hominem" |
| 20:40.39 | _psychic_ | tofl |
| 20:40.42 | _psychic_ | rofl too |
| 20:41.05 | dataw0lf | see, I say what I want. |
| 20:41.07 | dataw0lf | Man, do I ever. |
| 20:42.06 | *** join/#uphpu mgeary (n=mgeary@166.70.44.49) |
| 20:42.06 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v mgeary] by ChanServ |
| 20:44.16 | Lone_Wanderer | DW: I like it. Not as inflammatory as I'd like, but it's getting slightly warmer. |
| 20:44.27 | Lone_Wanderer | Good solution though. |
| 20:44.59 | Lone_Wanderer | I think the CP80 folks have a fetish for government control of things. |
| 20:45.09 | mindjuju | yeah, that's what scares me |
| 20:45.17 | mindjuju | i HATE big brother / government |
| 20:45.19 | Lone_Wanderer | Don't like something? Outlaw it! |
| 20:46.23 | Lone_Wanderer | "traffic cameras"? |
| 20:46.36 | mindjuju | yeah, go like into provo |
| 20:46.47 | mindjuju | every street corner has a traffic cam on the street light |
| 20:46.49 | beandog | lets outlaw McDonalds |
| 20:46.51 | Lone_Wanderer | My definition only, of course. |
| 20:46.59 | beandog | mindjuju: they do? |
| 20:47.01 | beandog | stupid Provo |
| 20:47.04 | beandog | ~lart Provo |
| 20:47.06 | Lone_Wanderer | What do they do? |
| 20:47.13 | Lone_Wanderer | Do they photograph people who run red lights or something? |
| 20:47.17 | mgeary | no |
| 20:47.34 | mgeary | but they can pull the footage in case of accident or such |
| 20:47.46 | mgeary | Orem has them too on pretty much all major intersections |
| 20:48.10 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh ok |
| 20:48.30 | Lone_Wanderer | I understand the slippery slope argument with this sort of thing |
| 20:48.36 | beandog | still got nothing on the UK's surveillance |
| 20:48.40 | mgeary | yeah |
| 20:48.43 | beandog | anyone see that video posted to BB the other day? |
| 20:48.44 | Lone_Wanderer | but in general, I don't mind being videotaped while inside my car in a major intersection |
| 20:48.45 | beandog | holy creepies |
| 20:48.54 | Lone_Wanderer | what's BB? |
| 20:48.55 | mgeary | beandog: no, what was it? |
| 20:48.59 | beandog | Boing Boing |
| 20:49.06 | beandog | meh, dont make me look it up |
| 20:49.11 | mgeary | just summarize |
| 20:49.57 | mindjuju | sorry, got interupted |
| 20:50.01 | mindjuju | yeah, hate the cameras |
| 20:50.04 | beandog | I cant find it |
| 20:50.09 | beandog | there was a cool video someone did |
| 20:50.11 | mindjuju | big slippery slope |
| 20:50.32 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't buy the slippery slope argument though |
| 20:50.41 | Lone_Wanderer | not for everything |
| 20:51.02 | mindjuju | well, why cameras |
| 20:51.04 | Lone_Wanderer | although I suppose that Britain is a good argument in favor (of that argument) |
| 20:51.43 | mindjuju | yeah, britan scares me |
| 20:51.49 | Utah_Dave | When they had the subway bombings in the UK, the thing that shocked me the most was their network of surveillance cameras. |
| 20:51.52 | mindjuju | like this National ID thing scares me |
| 20:52.13 | beandog | agh |
| 20:52.16 | Lone_Wanderer | the National ID thing worries me more than having cameras all over would |
| 20:52.17 | beandog | killing my browser softly! |
| 20:52.32 | mindjuju | they'll link those babies up |
| 20:52.34 | beandog | forget that, Im not finding it. |
| 20:52.39 | mindjuju | especially with passports going RFID |
| 20:52.49 | mindjuju | how long till the national ID has RFID |
| 20:52.58 | Lone_Wanderer | yes, there were cameras all over, but it didn't feel like a police state at all |
| 20:53.00 | mindjuju | and camera to track to boot |
| 20:53.04 | beandog | how long til you need one to go across state lines |
| 20:53.14 | Lone_Wanderer | I suppose this is because I didn't cross the police at all |
| 20:53.17 | mindjuju | ugh, don't scare me beandog |
| 20:53.26 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't think that will ever happen beandog |
| 20:53.51 | Lone_Wanderer | Americans are too unruly to ever accept something like that |
| 20:54.10 | mindjuju | that is true, but these are different tiems |
| 20:54.16 | mgeary | Lone_Wanderer: unless you tell them that they aren't secure otherwise |
| 20:54.26 | beandog | mgeary: exactly |
| 20:54.27 | mindjuju | and the rights that are given up for "security" seem to be given up all to easily |
| 20:54.44 | _psychic_ | The military commisssions act |
| 20:55.35 | mindjuju | alas, it is alwasy in the nature of government to seek more power from its base |
| 20:55.54 | mgeary | hey all, by the way, i am still looking for a full-time entry-to-mid-level PHP/webdev job for my bro-in-law, so if anyone is aware of something, it'd be much appreciated |
| 20:56.48 | dataw0lf | mindjuju: really? I think the PATRIOT act has done nothing except for indict innocents and to sever our rights. What intel are you talking about? |
| 20:57.19 | Lone_Wanderer | I think the fact that we all agree that the Patriot Act has to go is a good sign that the nutjobs haven't won. |
| 20:57.32 | Lone_Wanderer | If I were the only person I knew of who was upset over this, then I'd be worried. |
| 20:57.48 | mindjuju | eh, supposedly there was an attempt on the lives of former presents that was learned about through Patriot |
| 20:58.04 | mindjuju | couple of bombings or something that again, we found out about |
| 20:58.17 | beandog | what really worries me is what is going to happen when the next terrorist attack happens |
| 20:58.34 | dataw0lf | sounds like FUD to me. Our intel (without the PATRIOT Act) is comprehensive enough to let us know about this without resorting to the PATRIOT Act. |
| 20:58.44 | dataw0lf | beandog: which it will. It's unpreventable. |
| 20:58.57 | dataw0lf | I mean, you can't attack an ideology and expect any sort of positive results. |
| 20:59.11 | mindjuju | Well, could be FUD, maybe not. from where we sit, it's not easy to tell |
| 20:59.11 | beandog | heh |
| 20:59.12 | dataw0lf | people like to compare this to other wars, but it really isn't like any war whatsoever. |
| 20:59.30 | beandog | its kind of like one of the crusades of old |
| 20:59.38 | mindjuju | yeah, terrorists != state |
| 20:59.41 | beandog | To Jerusalem! Convert the heathens or kill them! |
| 20:59.48 | dataw0lf | that's the closest parallel... what happened to the the crusaders? |
| 20:59.56 | beandog | they all failed once they pulled out. |
| 21:00.06 | beandog | or failed on taking over anyway. |
| 21:00.38 | dataw0lf | well, 'failed on pulled out' is a misnomer |
| 21:00.47 | dataw0lf | look at how many people we've displaced in Ira |
| 21:00.48 | dataw0lf | Iraq |
| 21:00.50 | dataw0lf | 2 million |
| 21:00.54 | dataw0lf | those are just refugees |
| 21:01.03 | dataw0lf | what do they think about the U.S. now? |
| 21:01.15 | dataw0lf | after we bombed their houses, commercial businesses, etc? |
| 21:01.17 | beandog | im sure theyre not indifferent anymore |
| 21:01.33 | dataw0lf | the problem is, when you attack an ideology, you spur and foster the ideology, you don't defeat it. |
| 21:01.49 | dataw0lf | and radical Islam is taking hold over the world DUE to our offensive. |
| 21:01.51 | dataw0lf | that's the problem. |
| 21:02.02 | dataw0lf | there are much easier solutions, to include diplomacy. |
| 21:02.06 | mindjuju | hmmm.. not so sure about that |
| 21:02.21 | dataw0lf | How so? |
| 21:02.28 | beandog | and oil. |
| 21:02.28 | mindjuju | WTC '93 |
| 21:02.35 | mindjuju | 2 embassaies |
| 21:02.44 | mindjuju | all prior to Iraq |
| 21:02.54 | dataw0lf | both embassies were in response to covert attacks and kidnappings on Iranian officials |
| 21:03.00 | dataw0lf | (much as we're doing now) |
| 21:03.16 | dataw0lf | the Iranians are much more responsive than the media or the politicians would like you to think |
| 21:03.36 | mindjuju | ugh, that reminds me of what i read this morn |
| 21:03.47 | mindjuju | about the 12 british sailors and the Iranian ship, did you hear? |
| 21:03.52 | dataw0lf | negative. |
| 21:04.18 | mindjuju | eh, 12 british naval troops were doing ship inspection in disputed waters |
| 21:04.32 | dataw0lf | personally, I think this country needs to get A LOT more conservative to weather the storm that's coming. |
| 21:04.33 | mindjuju | Iran war boats came along and force them into Iranian waters |
| 21:04.37 | dataw0lf | And I don't mean neoconservative |
| 21:04.40 | mindjuju | they were just realed a few hours ago |
| 21:04.57 | mindjuju | course, the first thing i thought of was Gulf of Tunkin (sp?) |
| 21:04.57 | dataw0lf | yea, the Iranians are pretty pissed. |
| 21:05.02 | dataw0lf | and that's our fault. |
| 21:05.13 | dataw0lf | I mean, we DID abduct many of their military leaders. |
| 21:05.17 | dataw0lf | Invade a neighboring country. |
| 21:05.18 | dataw0lf | Etc. |
| 21:05.40 | beandog | Just think how we would feel if, say, China invaded Canada |
| 21:05.42 | dataw0lf | The Iranian people were (maybe are?) actually pretty supportive of the U.S. |
| 21:05.50 | beandog | Id feel a bit nervous |
| 21:06.02 | dataw0lf | if we can wear out their current, crazy, leaders |
| 21:06.09 | dataw0lf | with DIPLOMACY |
| 21:06.14 | dataw0lf | we could probably recover |
| 21:06.17 | dataw0lf | but if we attack Iran |
| 21:06.17 | dataw0lf | man |
| 21:06.27 | dataw0lf | it'll be worse than Vietnam |
| 21:06.30 | dataw0lf | guaranteed |
| 21:06.42 | dataw0lf | I can guarantee you that Hezbollah has sleeper cells in America |
| 21:06.49 | dataw0lf | and they've stayed neutral |
| 21:06.57 | dataw0lf | but, well, if you attack Iran, they're going to attack us |
| 21:07.08 | beandog | whats a sleeper cell |
| 21:07.09 | dataw0lf | so we'll see a good number of American civilian deaths |
| 21:07.27 | dataw0lf | a sleeper cell is a terrorist cell that operates as civilians until they're activated |
| 21:07.32 | dataw0lf | Hezbollah is extremely smart |
| 21:07.41 | beandog | huh |
| 21:07.41 | dataw0lf | Although they don't want a conflict with the U.S. |
| 21:07.43 | beandog | thats pretty cool |
| 21:07.44 | dataw0lf | they can see the ventuality |
| 21:07.47 | dataw0lf | eventuality* |
| 21:08.13 | dataw0lf | so, obviously, they're going to place sleeper cells in our country |
| 21:08.19 | dataw0lf | like they've done with a number of nations |
| 21:08.27 | dataw0lf | and Hezbollah, man, if you think Al-Qaida is 'tough' |
| 21:08.28 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 21:08.34 | dataw0lf | Hezbollah can do some real damage |
| 21:08.38 | dataw0lf | personally, I think they may have a nuke |
| 21:08.42 | dataw0lf | but that's pure theorizing |
| 21:11.48 | dataw0lf | the thing is, we've never entered a conflict with the most powerful terrorist network in the world |
| 21:11.51 | dataw0lf | i.e., Hezbollah |
| 21:12.17 | dataw0lf | and, concurrently, at least two strong countries (Iran, Syria; if Iran is attacked, I can guarantee Syria will respond) |
| 21:12.25 | dataw0lf | so we're in a pickle. |
| 21:12.32 | dataw0lf | Unless Bush will use diplomacy |
| 21:12.41 | dataw0lf | He may, if he suddenly gathers his senses |
| 21:12.47 | dataw0lf | I doubt it though |
| 21:12.52 | dataw0lf | Thus, why I own an M4 |
| 21:13.02 | dataw0lf | so I can take out some of these bastards if/when they attack |
| 21:14.40 | Lone_Wanderer | You actually think you'll be able to take a shot at them? |
| 21:16.47 | dataw0lf | if the next major terrorist attack is in response to U.S. aggression, it's going to be concurrent, most likely, with other terrorist attacks. |
| 21:16.50 | Lone_Wanderer | Or do you just plan to hang out in public places in New York with your M4 out, waiting for an arab to start looking suspicious? :p |
| 21:17.04 | dataw0lf | Anytime I move into an area, I pinpoint areas that may be ripe for insurgency from radical Muslims |
| 21:17.08 | dataw0lf | there's a couple here in Reno |
| 21:17.12 | dataw0lf | I'll post up on a hill |
| 21:17.18 | dataw0lf | and start taking people out |
| 21:17.21 | dataw0lf | sorry 'bout your luck |
| 21:17.33 | Lone_Wanderer | Sorry about that, shouldn't have been Muslim? |
| 21:18.24 | dataw0lf | people seem to think I'm anti militant or something. I'm all about militancy. For a right and just cause |
| 21:18.58 | dataw0lf | An attack on America, whether or not it's justified (and it probably will be, with Bush in office), makes me want to start killing some people. And I will do so. To the full extent that I'm capable of. |
| 21:19.19 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm just not clear about how killing random Muslims is going to prevent a terrorist attack. |
| 21:19.28 | dataw0lf | who said random muslims? |
| 21:19.39 | Lone_Wanderer | Or keep you out of jail, if that's even a consideration. |
| 21:19.58 | dataw0lf | I don't care about jail. I'm about keeping America the strongest country in the world, and keeping citizens safe. |
| 21:20.18 | Lone_Wanderer | It sounded like your plan was just to find a high spot and start killing Muslims if there was ever another terrorist attack. |
| 21:20.38 | dataw0lf | I'm a hacker, and a soldier. I can determine, to a reasonable military degree, whether or not people are qualified targets. |
| 21:20.52 | dataw0lf | Don't be disillusioned, people can talk about the War in Iraq |
| 21:21.11 | dataw0lf | but there are many, many, many, Islamic hackers, both here and abroad, who attack our country in some way. |
| 21:21.47 | dataw0lf | The middle east is probably the strongest in hackers of any area. To include Norway, The Netherlands, South Korea, and China. |
| 21:21.59 | Lone_Wanderer | How do they attack? |
| 21:22.06 | Lone_Wanderer | Govt. servers? |
| 21:22.18 | dataw0lf | Nah. Corporate servers, mostly. |
| 21:22.51 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@72-166-51-162.dia.static.qwest.net) |
| 21:23.08 | dataw0lf | They are smart enough (I mean, they're probably the most skilled hackers in the world, so, they're pretty smart) to realize that small attacks on our economic infrastructure over a period of time are much more effective than, say, one large attack on a government network |
| 21:23.11 | Lone_Wanderer | Hmm. Out of sunflower seeds. |
| 21:23.28 | dataw0lf | check out network traffic |
| 21:23.39 | dataw0lf | most good American hackers understand we're in a war here. |
| 21:23.55 | dataw0lf | unfortunately, the type that are usually good hackers are also usually anarchist/extremely liberal/etc |
| 21:24.39 | dataw0lf | so there may be 200 hackers in America who consistently monitor American networks for the thousands that are slowly attempting to degrade our society |
| 21:24.49 | dataw0lf | may be less than that |
| 21:24.55 | dataw0lf | who knows |
| 21:25.17 | dataw0lf | I know Chicago 2600 has 5 guys who're dedicated to repelling insurgent and foreign attacks |
| 21:25.25 | Lone_Wanderer | Degrading it with porn, obviously. |
| 21:25.29 | dataw0lf | and they're extremely busy. |
| 21:25.30 | dataw0lf | yea, porn |
| 21:26.13 | dataw0lf | People don't understand that we're in a war right now on our soil, and some ineffective social attack is going to do nothing |
| 21:26.18 | dataw0lf | Porn |
| 21:26.20 | dataw0lf | gimme a break |
| 21:26.34 | dataw0lf | when the credit structure starts to break down, people will change their minds quickly |
| 21:26.54 | dataw0lf | I mean, look at our social attack on Iraq |
| 21:26.56 | Lone_Wanderer | heh, the financial networks |
| 21:26.59 | Lone_Wanderer | how beautifully ironic |
| 21:27.07 | dataw0lf | people like to quantify it as a military objective |
| 21:27.09 | dataw0lf | but it's not |
| 21:27.15 | Lone_Wanderer | financial networks were invented by the muslims |
| 21:27.17 | Lone_Wanderer | arabs, rather |
| 21:27.20 | dataw0lf | by forcing democracy on a group of people, that's a social attack |
| 21:27.36 | dataw0lf | a rather obtuse social attack, but a social attack nonetheless |
| 21:27.43 | dataw0lf | and it's failing |
| 21:28.08 | dataw0lf | people need to realize that wars aren't necessarily fought with guns, or mortars, or cruise missiles |
| 21:28.11 | dataw0lf | especially in the middle east |
| 21:28.20 | dataw0lf | where they've been repelling attacks for THOUSANDS of years |
| 21:28.27 | dataw0lf | it ain't gonna work |
| 21:28.42 | dataw0lf | and a social attack, by the enemy (Western Culture), isn't going to work either |
| 21:28.50 | dataw0lf | we have to accept them and deal with them.. for right now |
| 21:29.11 | dataw0lf | I'm not one of the guys who says those bastards have freedom of religion when they're subjugating women and enslaving people |
| 21:29.18 | dataw0lf | that needs to be fixed |
| 21:29.27 | dataw0lf | but it's not going to be fixed until we approach it the right way |
| 21:30.42 | dataw0lf | obviously, our dependency on oil has a large part in this. |
| 21:31.02 | dataw0lf | we can't economically (which, in America, is almost equivalent to socially), take over a country if we're completely dependent upon them |
| 21:31.30 | dataw0lf | And this leads back to my 'conservative' argument |
| 21:31.36 | dataw0lf | we need to start paying attention to ourselves |
| 21:31.37 | dataw0lf | noone else |
| 21:31.42 | dataw0lf | improve living conditions |
| 21:31.58 | dataw0lf | repel the Japanese, who're buying up our land like candy, and economically invading us |
| 21:32.02 | Lone_Wanderer | DW, can you explain to me why we have military bases in Japan, Germany, and other places? |
| 21:32.09 | Lone_Wanderer | Why maintain a military presence in other countries? |
| 21:32.15 | Lone_Wanderer | particularly friendly ones |
| 21:32.23 | dataw0lf | they're both deployment points |
| 21:32.42 | dataw0lf | I don't really agree with the fact that we still maintain military bases in those countries |
| 21:32.52 | Lone_Wanderer | So we're not just providing them with a defensive force for free? |
| 21:32.59 | dataw0lf | of course not |
| 21:33.08 | dataw0lf | where did the main forces deploy to Kuwait and Iraq from? |
| 21:33.10 | dataw0lf | Germany. |
| 21:33.21 | Lone_Wanderer | ... |
| 21:33.25 | dataw0lf | Japan, we have a focus on SWA |
| 21:33.29 | dataw0lf | (south west asia) |
| 21:33.45 | Lone_Wanderer | So when my friend in the Army said "I'm going to Germany for ____ months, can't say what I'm going for" |
| 21:33.49 | Lone_Wanderer | and came back with sand in his gear |
| 21:33.59 | Lone_Wanderer | he was only going to Germany as a stopover? |
| 21:34.11 | dataw0lf | you always go through Italy, Germany, for an attack on the middle east. |
| 21:34.21 | dataw0lf | beandog: none. |
| 21:34.24 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm pretty sure none at all. |
| 21:34.30 | beandog | seems kind of odd. |
| 21:34.50 | dataw0lf | back in the 70s, 60s, and before, you have a relevance in those countries |
| 21:34.55 | dataw0lf | A tactical advantage. |
| 21:35.06 | dataw0lf | Nowadays, not so much |
| 21:35.12 | dataw0lf | It's just a holdover |
| 21:35.17 | dataw0lf | it'll cost too much money to remove those bases |
| 21:35.20 | dataw0lf | it works alright |
| 21:35.22 | dataw0lf | so why remove them? |
| 21:35.35 | dataw0lf | that's the thinking |
| 21:35.42 | Lone_Wanderer | Makes sense. |
| 21:35.46 | dataw0lf | It does. |
| 21:36.05 | dataw0lf | If it wasn't for monetary expenses, we would've centralized most of our European forces in Israel a while ago. |
| 21:36.17 | dataw0lf | it's all about money, man |
| 21:36.20 | dataw0lf | that's it |
| 21:36.27 | dataw0lf | that's what war is about, when you break it down. |
| 21:36.52 | beandog | pretty much |
| 21:37.02 | dataw0lf | neocons will have you believe otherwise, but, trust me, when Bush got elected, he wasn't thinking about how he could serve the religious right. |
| 21:37.09 | dataw0lf | he was thinking about how to make money |
| 21:37.21 | dataw0lf | whether it's off oil, or contracts, or whatever |
| 21:37.43 | dataw0lf | but the religious right will support anything he does |
| 21:37.45 | dataw0lf | why? |
| 21:37.54 | dataw0lf | because of his excellent advisors (Rove) |
| 21:38.05 | dataw0lf | and because, well, religion doesn't like to be wrong. |
| 21:38.32 | dataw0lf | if you look at the Iraqi War militarily, or socially, or economically, it's an extreme failure. |
| 21:38.45 | dataw0lf | but what Bush realized is that you don't have to supply logic to his new base |
| 21:38.51 | dataw0lf | you just have to supply fallacies. |
| 21:39.13 | dataw0lf | people can call Bush an idiot all they want |
| 21:39.20 | dataw0lf | he played people like a violin |
| 21:39.32 | dataw0lf | and as disgusting as it sounds, I have political respect for that |
| 21:39.43 | beandog | you lost me there. |
| 21:39.51 | beandog | on the fallacies part |
| 21:40.23 | dataw0lf | fallacies as in 'the end of the world is coming, we must confront our enemies', or, deep down, 'they don't believe the same way we do. THEY're the aggressors' |
| 21:40.26 | dataw0lf | when, really, that's not true |
| 21:40.32 | dataw0lf | if you look at the history |
| 21:40.49 | dataw0lf | he uses religious sensationalism in a very smart way |
| 21:40.54 | dataw0lf | he makes subtle points |
| 21:42.21 | dataw0lf | and allows people, whether subconsciously or not, to make their own decisions |
| 21:43.01 | dataw0lf | I mean, noone can argue that neocons (religious fundamentalists) got Bush elected. |
| 21:43.29 | dataw0lf | or hacked election machines. ;-) |
| 21:48.16 | mindjuju | ugh, 4p |
| 21:48.16 | mindjuju | must... get... motivated... |
| 22:14.48 | macnewbold | mindjuju: it's friday |
| 22:16.25 | PoeticIntensity | dude.... I've been researching CCX's and BMW's and the specs on the new Corvette Z07. |
| 22:16.27 | PoeticIntensity | work? |
| 22:16.35 | PoeticIntensity | pffft.... It's Friday. |
| 22:16.48 | PoeticIntensity | and I successfully figured out how to work my stinkin' gallery software. |
| 22:16.54 | PoeticIntensity | and gave the world my IP address. |
| 22:17.18 | PoeticIntensity | ~lart work |
| 22:17.29 | PoeticIntensity | ~rlart |
| 22:20.01 | Lone_Wanderer | It's way past time for it to be going home time. |
| 22:20.16 | PoeticIntensity | I'm probably being h@X0r3D as we speak. |
| 22:20.20 | PoeticIntensity | by dataw0lf's minions. |
| 22:20.39 | PoeticIntensity | holy POOP I don't wanna be at work anymore. |
| 22:30.57 | Lone_Wanderer | I vote we fiddle with Daylight Savings right now |
| 22:31.04 | Lone_Wanderer | and say that it's now 6:30 MST |
| 22:31.44 | Lone_Wanderer | Give George a call, he's fine with arbitrarily redefining time. |
| 22:38.00 | mindjuju | ~ranq |
| 22:38.02 | jbot | ACTION Say hello to my little friend |
| 22:39.10 | mgeary | i hate dealing with car salespeople |
| 22:39.18 | mgeary | the whole car buying process is just broken |
| 22:39.28 | mindjuju | carmax is a good place |
| 22:39.42 | mgeary | yeah, we had a good experience with them when we sold them our car |
| 22:39.58 | mgeary | Amazon.com ought to sell cars |
| 22:40.13 | mindjuju | that would be interesting |
| 22:40.49 | mindjuju | seems like I heard a long time ago, that WalMart was going to |
| 22:41.15 | mgeary | Wal-Mart |
| 22:41.23 | Lone_Wanderer | mgeary: go read the fool.com article on buying a car |
| 22:42.57 | mgeary | CarMax in Sandy apparently doesn't sell new cars |
| 22:43.13 | mindjuju | really? |
| 22:43.19 | mgeary | apparently so |
| 22:43.23 | mindjuju | curious |
| 22:43.42 | mindjuju | we bought one that was 2 years old |
| 22:43.55 | mindjuju | that way the intial devalue had already happened |
| 22:44.20 | mindjuju | really low mileage and good interior |
| 22:44.34 | mgeary | i've never bought used |
| 22:45.07 | mindjuju | what kind of car are you looking for? |
| 22:45.10 | Lone_Wanderer | A new car is, imho, a terrible dea. |
| 22:45.15 | mgeary | truck |
| 22:45.16 | Lone_Wanderer | deal* |
| 22:45.22 | mgeary | preferably a Toyota Tacoma |
| 22:45.40 | Lone_Wanderer | You can get a certified used car (or whatever they call them) for much cheaper |
| 22:45.50 | Lone_Wanderer | and with a Toyota, they'll last forever without serious problems |
| 22:46.11 | Lone_Wanderer | if you were getting a Chevy or (heaven help us) a Ford, I'd think twice about buying used. |
| 22:46.12 | mgeary | maybe so |
| 22:46.28 | mgeary | what about a Dodge Ram? Here's one: http://www.carmax.com/dyn/factsheet/factsheet.aspx?id=3890905 |
| 22:46.32 | Lone_Wanderer | With a new vehicle, the second you drive it off the lot it loses a hefty chunk of it's value |
| 22:46.50 | mgeary | ah, but that's 2WD, i need 4WD |
| 22:47.09 | mindjuju | yup, thats why i was saying buy low mileage, 2 year old, most of the devalue has already happened |
| 22:47.26 | mgeary | i really like the peace of mind of a new car |
| 22:47.47 | mgeary | and here's the thing, the used Tacomas are *barely* cheaper than thenew |
| 22:48.16 | mgeary | check this out: the cheapest Tacoma i can find around here (with 4WD and double cab) has an MSRP of 28,500 |
| 22:48.24 | PoeticIntensity | new cars? |
| 22:48.27 | mgeary | now, here's a used one-- |
| 22:48.36 | mgeary | 56k miles, 2004, and it's $24999 |
| 22:48.38 | mgeary | jeezee |
| 22:48.40 | PoeticIntensity | heck... all I gotta say is... don't ever buy one, unless ya wanna buy new cars for the rest of your life. |
| 22:48.42 | Lone_Wanderer | holy cow |
| 22:48.51 | Lone_Wanderer | why, PI? |
| 22:48.55 | PoeticIntensity | Yeah... peace of mind is all it... |
| 22:49.08 | mgeary | here's another: 60k miles, 2005, $22,500 |
| 22:49.09 | Lone_Wanderer | PI is your name abbreviated :p |
| 22:49.12 | PoeticIntensity | because there is an incredible peace of mind knowing *exactly* what has (and has not) been done to a car. |
| 22:49.34 | PoeticIntensity | no risk.... |
| 22:49.40 | mgeary | wait, so PI, are you pro- or against new? |
| 22:49.42 | PoeticIntensity | warranty is another good reason. |
| 22:49.48 | PoeticIntensity | pro. (for me) |
| 22:49.52 | PoeticIntensity | for others, dude... I don't care. |
| 22:49.54 | mgeary | "don't ever buy one, unless ya wanna buy new cars for the rest of your life" |
| 22:49.56 | PoeticIntensity | if ya don't like buying new, don't buy new. |
| 22:49.58 | mgeary | seemed like con |
| 22:50.02 | Lone_Wanderer | -o |
| 22:50.03 | PoeticIntensity | heh... |
| 22:50.43 | PoeticIntensity | also.... the smell of a new car is amazing. |
| 22:50.47 | PoeticIntensity | and it lasts for.... looong time. |
| 22:50.54 | PoeticIntensity | (unless you barf in it, or something) |
| 22:51.56 | Lone_Wanderer | dataw0lf: you've got a bite in the CP80 thread. |
| 22:51.59 | PoeticIntensity | so... yeah... Personally, for me, I enjoy the whole experience of buying new. |
| 22:52.08 | mgeary | hold on there |
| 22:52.22 | mgeary | you enjoy *having* a new car, but you can't tell me you enjoy the *experience* of buying ;) |
| 22:52.24 | PoeticIntensity | and.... pardon my ignorance, but what the hey is a CP80 ? |
| 22:52.42 | PoeticIntensity | hehe..... Actually, I do. |
| 22:52.47 | PoeticIntensity | the exhilaration of watching tens of thousands of dollars flying out the window.... |
| 22:52.49 | Lone_Wanderer | PI: http://smallplates.johndavidanderson.net/2007/03/20/why-cp80-wont-work/ |
| 22:52.57 | PoeticIntensity | and the knowledge that I'm in financial bondage for the long future. |
| 22:52.59 | Lone_Wanderer | Read the comments. |
| 22:53.10 | PoeticIntensity | k |
| 22:53.27 | PoeticIntensity | mgeary: Heck yeah... I LOVE the experience! |
| 22:53.36 | PoeticIntensity | (woot)! |
| 22:53.55 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: you can buy my truck |
| 22:53.57 | mgeary | for me |
| 22:54.21 | PoeticIntensity | heh... maybe in 10 years, when I need one. ;-) |
| 22:54.58 | mgeary | not FROM me |
| 22:54.59 | mgeary | FOR me |
| 22:56.08 | mgeary | so Chevy trucks are a no-go? |
| 22:56.12 | mindjuju | just had some nut from our internal support tell me about this new thing he heard about from Kim Kammando about XSS |
| 22:56.27 | mindjuju | it's like, if i don't know about it before her, then the company is in trouble |
| 22:56.46 | mgeary | hahaah |
| 22:56.59 | PoeticIntensity | hehe.... |
| 22:57.05 | PoeticIntensity | mgeary: My dad likes Fords... |
| 22:57.21 | mgeary | me either |
| 22:57.30 | PoeticIntensity | they all look like fun automobiles used to carry stuff. |
| 23:03.06 | PoeticIntensity | heh.... |
| 23:06.56 | Lone_Wanderer | Wow. I just got a spam with someone's actual phone number in it. |
| 23:07.26 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm not sure if I should call him and yell at him for spamming me, or just quietly delete it as a reward for giving me a real, actual contact number |
| 23:07.43 | Lone_Wanderer | His URL doesn't have a tracking thingie in it either. |
| 23:09.12 | PoeticIntensity | Hey.... Is there a "Dan Crookston" in here? |
| 23:09.17 | PoeticIntensity | Lone_Wanderer, maybe? |
| 23:09.26 | Lone_Wanderer | That's me, yeah. |
| 23:09.29 | PoeticIntensity | not sure .... oh.. ok. |
| 23:10.58 | PoeticIntensity | holy cow.... |
| 23:11.06 | PoeticIntensity | I know you guys talked about this like 8 hours ago... |
| 23:11.13 | PoeticIntensity | but MAN.... this cp80 crap is outrageous... |
| 23:11.18 | Lone_Wanderer | Yep. |
| 23:11.20 | PoeticIntensity | are its proponents even tech-savvy? |
| 23:11.35 | Lone_Wanderer | It's funny, every single technically inclined person I bring this up with sees through it immediately. |
| 23:13.02 | PoeticIntensity | switching PORTS won't do JACK. |
| 23:13.22 | PoeticIntensity | what in the WORLD will stop pornographers from broadcasting on public ports? |
| 23:13.31 | PoeticIntensity | and how the WORLD will they trace them if they do? |
| 23:14.10 | PoeticIntensity | I like the idea of doing *something* but..... making this government (federal) level implies *waaaaaaay* too many things to even go there. |
| 23:14.16 | Lone_Wanderer | Do you have a better idea? |
| 23:14.22 | Lone_Wanderer | Besides, it will totally work. Seriously. |
| 23:14.28 | PoeticIntensity | you're an idiot. |
| 23:14.31 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 23:14.37 | Lone_Wanderer | No YOU are an idiot! |
| 23:14.41 | Lone_Wanderer | Because I know more than you and umm. |
| 23:14.43 | PoeticIntensity | nuh-uh!!! |
| 23:14.46 | Lone_Wanderer | You're just a big dumb dumb head! |
| 23:14.52 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 23:14.57 | Lone_Wanderer | Why don't you just go... like... read their site! Yeah, read it! |
| 23:15.07 | PoeticIntensity | argh.... |
| 23:15.16 | PoeticIntensity | I don't know how much more I can read and maintain my sanity... |
| 23:15.27 | PoeticIntensity | *hopefully* we'll be able to stop this before it's passed into law... |
| 23:15.41 | PoeticIntensity | and then, people realize that it's a *complete* waste of time and billions of dollars. |
| 23:15.46 | PoeticIntensity | and nothing has changed... |
| 23:16.00 | Lone_Wanderer | Yep. |
| 23:16.01 | PoeticIntensity | and we go back to actually *teaching* our kids, and implementing content-based filtering the best we can. |
| 23:16.07 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm so hungry =\ |
| 23:16.22 | Lone_Wanderer | well, time to go. later all. |
| 23:16.26 | PoeticIntensity | hasta luego. |
| 23:16.33 | mindjuju | heh |
| 23:18.01 | mindjuju | the Best thing about CP80 has got to be |
| 23:18.54 | mindjuju | that it isn't even in a legislatures hands. it is a proposal that they use it for a bill, so it isn't even far enough to say it is being considered by anybody |
| 23:22.05 | PoeticIntensity | thank heavens. |
| 23:23.12 | beandog | oy. |
| 23:23.33 | beandog | ~lart PoeticIntensity |
| 23:23.43 | beandog | Solaris 7 |
| 23:23.45 | beandog | HA ha |
| 23:23.54 | PoeticIntensity | would have been better if it was AOL. |
| 23:26.08 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 23:26.10 | PoeticIntensity | there ya go. |
| 23:26.25 | PoeticIntensity | wow... dataw0lf absolutely rips these guys up and dow. |
| 23:26.27 | PoeticIntensity | down. |
| 23:26.31 | PoeticIntensity | crazy. |
| 23:26.52 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 23:27.15 | beandog | heh |
| 23:31.48 | PoeticIntensity | oki doke... looks like I'm out for the day... |
| 23:31.51 | PoeticIntensity | have a good weekend, ya'll! |