| 00:00.50 | Lone_Wanderer | Okay, I now officially hate The Gimp. |
| 00:01.03 | Lone_Wanderer | It is retarded in every way that a graphics program can be retarded. |
| 00:01.39 | Lone_Wanderer | And I feel confident that I can say that without any risk of hyperbole or overstatement. |
| 00:01.56 | dataw0lf | I can't believe there are actually people who think that Tyson in his prime could beat Ali in his prime. |
| 00:02.17 | mindjuju | who would win? |
| 00:02.36 | Lone_Wanderer | Ali, hands down |
| 00:02.46 | mindjuju | cool |
| 00:02.49 | dataw0lf | Ali would tear Tyson apart |
| 00:02.58 | mindjuju | really? |
| 00:03.24 | dataw0lf | Ali fought a young Foreman who was considered unbeatable when he was past his prime |
| 00:03.27 | dataw0lf | and knocked him out |
| 00:03.45 | dataw0lf | Ali was just so fast |
| 00:04.12 | dataw0lf | when he was in his prime you seriously couldn't see his punches fly through the air |
| 00:06.03 | dataw0lf | "I'm so fast that last night I turned off the light switch in my hotel room and was in bed before the room was dark!" |
| 00:06.06 | dataw0lf | hehe |
| 00:07.06 | mindjuju | this looks like a cool game http://www.destructoid.com/army-of-two-the-new-hotness-30373.phtml |
| 00:07.09 | Lone_Wanderer | He stole that one from Paul Bunyan :p |
| 00:09.04 | Lone_Wanderer | Is it a two player game? |
| 00:09.10 | mindjuju | looks like it |
| 00:10.04 | mindjuju | cool, huh? |
| 00:12.16 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah |
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| 01:24.30 | mindjuju | ~chucknorris |
| 01:24.32 | jbot | Chuck Norris moves at two speeds: Walk and kill. |
| 01:27.28 | beandog | heh |
| 01:27.30 | beandog | I love those |
| 01:28.50 | mindjuju | yup, norris movies rock |
| 01:28.50 | mindjuju | i'm watching Lone Wolf McQuade |
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| 05:49.32 | macnewbold | ~zippy |
| 06:06.52 | beandog | macnewbold: dont tell me youre at work |
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| 13:43.45 | timinator | morning guys |
| 13:43.47 | timinator | BRB |
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| 14:28.43 | macnewbold | ~yow |
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| 15:35.56 | mgeary | good morning |
| 15:36.38 | thebigdog | morning |
| 15:48.11 | mgeary | soooo, any interest in restarting/resuming the discussion from yesterday? To recap, i'm interested in exchanging ideas on keeping an object-centric approach, while gaining more of the performance associated with a single, aggregating database query (specifically for list-type views) |
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| 15:49.43 | thebigdog | sure |
| 15:50.15 | mgeary | i want to make sure we're on the same starting point. So, indulge me again while i set up a scenario |
| 15:50.33 | mgeary | this is a simplification, so bear with me |
| 15:50.38 | thebigdog | k |
| 15:51.46 | mgeary | we're using something similar to an Active Record Pattern, where the sample Class is named "Client". We have a "client listing" page that, for whatever reason, needs to list, say 200 clients in a table. So, we're pulling various fields from each client record and displaying them. Basic stuff. |
| 15:53.08 | mgeary | now, again to recap, whenever i can, i prefer to fetch, in this case, 200 objects, and iterate through them, accessing properties. This gives the most flexibility. However, this results in query redundancy: one query to determine which client primary keys are to be shown in the list, and one query for *each* instantiated object, so it can retrieve it's values |
| 15:54.00 | mgeary | this is, of course, much less efficient (from a performance perspecitive) than simply doing one query to retrieve all 200 records, with all their data, at once, and not using objects at all |
| 15:54.27 | *** join/#uphpu Lone_Wanderer (n=chatzill@cg.dsl.xmission.com) |
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| 15:54.38 | mgeary | i assume this is something everyone here has faced dozens, if not hundreds, of times, no? |
| 15:55.34 | Lone_Wanderer | At least ten million. |
| 15:55.57 | Lone_Wanderer | "How to get a Gulp Cap? Well, if you know someone who's already been "gulped," they can give you one. And if you don't know anyone who can give you one, don't worry – that just means you aren't cool." |
| 15:56.00 | Lone_Wanderer | What's the problem mgeary? |
| 15:56.04 | thebigdog | im surprised you are just getting ids and then requireing |
| 15:56.11 | thebigdog | requerying |
| 15:56.24 | mgeary | well, that's the thing. per my comments last night... |
| 15:56.25 | thebigdog | is this a internal o/r mapping tool you are using? |
| 15:56.40 | mgeary | yes, a home-grown semi-framework |
| 15:57.09 | mgeary | ...anyway, as i was saying last night, i've tried "feeding" my object constructor an array of all the DB values, with the intent of saving it the re-query |
| 15:57.14 | thebigdog | yeah when you pull an object back you should be pulling the entire object or else you dont do objects |
| 15:57.33 | mgeary | and across over 4000 instantiations, i saved less than a tenth of a second |
| 15:57.44 | mgeary | on a not-too-speedy machine |
| 15:59.02 | mgeary | Lone_Wanderer: can you read up? or should i PM the original messages? |
| 16:00.48 | Lone_Wanderer | PM it, I logged on right when you said "I assume this is something everyone here has faced" |
| 16:01.38 | thebigdog | again this comes back to poor framework...you should only query the db once for all the objects defined in your criteria |
| 16:01.51 | thebigdog | you should not need to requery a second time |
| 16:06.13 | mgeary | one, sec, let me catch LW up :) |
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| 16:09.31 | mgeary | okay, now. i basically agree, thebigdog. the way i've set up my AR constructor, you can either pass an ID, *or* you can pass an array of all the DB values. What strikes me as very strange, though, is that doing this saves an incredibly *small* about of time |
| 16:09.40 | mgeary | if there are other ways to approach this, i'd like to discuss them |
| 16:11.52 | mgeary | oh sure |
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| 16:31.29 | Lone_Wanderer | http://www.haveaslogan.com/ - good for about thirty seconds of laughs |
| 16:33.56 | Lone_Wanderer | oh, and some of them are... hmm. |
| 16:34.02 | Lone_Wanderer | potentially offensive |
| 16:45.00 | thebigdog | mgeary how are you getting the id(s)? |
| 16:45.55 | mgeary | from a query. let's say something like "select clients.* from clients where clients.state_id = 46" |
| 16:46.12 | mgeary | or, using the "non-preloaded" method, i'd just retrieve the id |
| 16:46.15 | mgeary | rather than * |
| 16:46.28 | thebigdog | why dont you just grab all the properties |
| 16:46.35 | thebigdog | instead of just the id |
| 16:47.20 | mgeary | well, yeah, that's what i'm doing in the "preloaded" method, per the first query i just posted |
| 16:51.33 | mgeary | anyway, i just found it remarkable that i save so little processor time by doing this preloading. It's still a good technique |
| 16:55.26 | thebigdog | here is how i do my stuff... |
| 16:55.34 | thebigdog | i do most objects and i have an object cache |
| 16:55.58 | thebigdog | i rarely do individual property queries where i pull back properties and not objects |
| 16:56.39 | thebigdog | so for the first tier i always pull back the full object, then any ref objects i lazy load when they are access |
| 16:56.52 | thebigdog | this is only for read only queries |
| 16:57.16 | thebigdog | most of the time i isolate those in their own uow (unit of work) |
| 16:57.29 | thebigdog | this provides me with application level transaction support |
| 17:04.19 | mindjuj1 | ~lart application level transaction support |
| 17:04.28 | Lone_Wanderer | Does anyone know how to make a ul's items go horizontal instead of vertical? |
| 17:05.48 | mindjuj1 | you mean so that they are all in one line like |
| 17:06.06 | mindjuj1 | 1. something here 2. something else 3. yet something else |
| 17:07.43 | mindjuj1 | if so, i thnk display:inline will do that |
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| 17:30.23 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuj1: Indeed it did. Now, how can I get more space between two inlined elements? |
| 17:30.32 | Lone_Wanderer | They look like they're all one thing. |
| 17:32.02 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: you can add padding or margins on them |
| 17:32.17 | macnewbold | or if you're in a hacky mood, throw in some |
| 17:32.53 | macnewbold | if you want them all equally distributed or something, it might be better to use a table |
| 17:33.19 | macnewbold | or if it is a fixed width you need, you can set ul li {display: inline; width: 150px; } or whatever |
| 17:47.45 | timinator | out for a bit |
| 17:47.46 | timinator | later |
| 17:49.32 | mgeary | anyone here manage any FedoraCore3 machines? i need to apply the DST change :/ |
| 17:55.15 | macnewbold | a little late, eh? |
| 17:59.50 | wps | I do, mgeary |
| 17:59.56 | wps | the UPHPU server is running FC3 |
| 18:01.17 | wps | I didn't apply any patches though |
| 18:01.21 | wps | just updated the time |
| 18:02.43 | mgeary | how? |
| 18:02.49 | mgeary | i'm trying up2date -u tzdata |
| 18:02.53 | mgeary | doesn't work |
| 18:02.57 | mgeary | but the dates are wrong |
| 18:06.05 | wps | hmm… i used rdate -s time.nist.gov |
| 18:06.13 | wps | and thought that it had worked when I ran it earlier |
| 18:06.18 | wps | but now it doesn't |
| 18:06.25 | wps | it's showing that it's currently 11:05 |
| 18:06.26 | wps | :( |
| 18:14.01 | mgeary | how do i install a locally-downloaded rpm |
| 18:18.05 | beandog | rpm -i foo.rpm |
| 18:22.26 | mgeary | http://mirror.switch.ch/ftp/mirror/fedora/linux/core/updates/3/i386/tzdata-2005r-3.fc3.noarch.rpm |
| 18:22.31 | mgeary | that should do it, i thgink |
| 18:22.33 | mgeary | think |
| 18:23.33 | mgeary | huh. i get "package tzdata-2005r-3.fc3 is already installed", but "zdump -v /etc/localtime | grep 2007" gives me the wrong dates. do i need to restart a service? |
| 18:26.30 | mgeary | ah |
| 18:26.32 | mgeary | there we go |
| 18:26.40 | mgeary | "cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/CST6CDT /etc/localtime" |
| 18:33.37 | mindjuj1 | ~lart DST |
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| 19:12.44 | wps | so, mgeary I did a yum upgrade and the time zone data was included in that |
| 19:12.49 | wps | but my time is still off |
| 19:13.19 | wps | is there something that I have to do after installing the update? |
| 19:14.19 | jsmith | wps: You *may* have to reboot, or at least restart the program that is showing the wrong time |
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| 19:14.32 | wps | k |
| 19:19.14 | wps | ah, crap |
| 19:19.23 | wps | things did not come back up well |
| 19:23.02 | mgeary | wps: yeah |
| 19:23.06 | mgeary | no reboot |
| 19:23.13 | mgeary | cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/CST6CDT /etc/localtime |
| 19:23.18 | mgeary | sorry. was at lunch |
| 19:23.25 | mgeary | that did the trick for me |
| 19:24.39 | wps | so, after doing a yum upgrade and rebooting, my apache is now jacked |
| 19:24.49 | wps | the default install is now coming up instead of the one that I compiled |
| 19:24.57 | mgeary | doh |
| 19:25.11 | mgeary | you mean it's running the wrong httpd? |
| 19:25.19 | mgeary | or using the wrong config file? |
| 19:25.22 | wps | I don't remember what I did originally to instruct the system to use my compiled apache instead of the default |
| 19:25.40 | wps | uh… |
| 19:25.51 | mgeary | well, it should be easy to take down the current and launch the correct. What does "ps -aux" tell you about which httpd is running? |
| 19:26.10 | mgeary | you probably have custom one in /usr/local/apache, and the system one is probably elsewhere, no? |
| 19:26.30 | wps | yes |
| 19:26.56 | mgeary | so take down the system's version, and do a "sudo /usr/local/apache/bin/apachectl start" |
| 19:27.06 | mgeary | or possibly sbin |
| 19:27.16 | mgeary | i believe apache2 puts it in bin |
| 19:27.45 | mgeary | well, i see you've taken the system apache down :) |
| 19:27.59 | wps | that worked |
| 19:28.09 | wps | thanks, mgeary |
| 19:28.23 | mgeary | no prob. now you'll want to change your startup script(s) |
| 19:28.52 | wps | crap, now my time is an hour ahead |
| 19:29.24 | mgeary | oops. i gave you the wrong timezone file to use |
| 19:29.33 | mgeary | instead of this:cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/CST6CDT /etc/localtime |
| 19:29.37 | mgeary | try something like: |
| 19:29.46 | mgeary | cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/MST /etc/localtime |
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| 19:29.54 | mgeary | but not sure if it's MST, check the directory for what makes sense. |
| 19:30.04 | mgeary | you can also look inside the America folder for a city in your timezone |
| 19:31.33 | wps | hmm… still an hour ahead |
| 19:31.35 | wps | :( |
| 19:31.45 | mgeary | what file did you use? |
| 19:31.47 | wps | this is what I tried; |
| 19:31.47 | wps | cp /usr/share/zoneinfo/America/Denver /etc/localtime |
| 19:32.43 | mgeary | just for kicks, pick something like NewYork, and confirm that it then becomes 2 hours ahead, so we can make sure what we're doing is having an effect |
| 19:32.59 | wps | k |
| 19:33.08 | wps | while I doing this, do you have any idea what "MST7MDT" would stand for? |
| 19:33.14 | mgeary | that's your baby |
| 19:33.22 | mgeary | that's GMT+7 hours |
| 19:33.32 | mgeary | and uses BOTH MST and MDT (savings time and normal time) |
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| 19:33.44 | mgeary | so that'd be the one you want. is that what you used? |
| 19:33.48 | wps | badda-bing badda-boom |
| 19:33.50 | wps | we're good now |
| 19:33.52 | mgeary | hey hey |
| 19:33.57 | wps | I used the seven one and the time is now right |
| 19:34.01 | mgeary | awesome |
| 19:34.08 | wps | thank you |
| 19:34.41 | beandog | how do you get two divs right next to each other not to put a line break between the two? |
| 19:34.50 | beandog | CSS is going to be the death of me yet. |
| 19:34.52 | mgeary | beandog: have you tried display:inline? |
| 19:35.02 | beandog | yah, no workie. |
| 19:35.10 | mgeary | if that doesn't work for you, you'll probably have to use <gack> floats |
| 19:35.24 | mgeary | set them both to be float:left and it should work |
| 19:36.11 | beandog | oh, whoops. inline worked, but its killing the width I set. |
| 19:36.12 | mgeary | but that will very probably wreak havoc on the rest of your layout. i really hate floatr |
| 19:38.50 | mgeary | <o><<? what's that, a fish? |
| 19:39.03 | mgeary | _psychic_ is going fishing |
| 19:43.59 | mgeary | has anyone here done much with memory management for PHP? i've got a script that is drilling down into a lot of objects, and i'm hitting a 32MB memory limit. Can i manually purge things from RAM? |
| 19:44.40 | beandog | unset() |
| 19:44.47 | beandog | are you using php5? |
| 19:44.50 | mgeary | yep |
| 19:45.00 | beandog | do you have the memory stuff compiled in |
| 19:45.05 | beandog | get_memory_usage() |
| 19:45.22 | beandog | just drill down it, see where its sucking up lotsa memory, and unset your variables that youre not using any more. |
| 19:45.30 | mgeary | cool, i'll try that |
| 19:45.35 | beandog | or you can use it to find functions that leak memory -_- |
| 19:45.39 | beandog | which is always fun. |
| 20:01.38 | wps | mgeary: how do I check with httpd is set to start (the default vs my custom compiled one) when I use "service httpd start/stop/restart" ? |
| 20:01.47 | wps | s/with/which/ |
| 20:04.00 | mgeary | i'm a bit ignorant on linux stuff to that detail (i'm an OS X guy), but i believe you'd need to edit/replace the file something like: /etc/init.d/apache and supply the full path to your /usr/local/apache executable |
| 20:04.38 | wps | cool… I'm an OS X guy too |
| 20:04.40 | wps | edit with file? |
| 20:05.08 | wps | man I wish I could type |
| 20:05.10 | wps | edit which file? |
| 20:05.29 | mgeary | you can edit this file: |
| 20:06.02 | mgeary | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:06.48 | wps | ah |
| 20:06.54 | mgeary | on about line 33, you'll see where the binaries are located |
| 20:06.56 | mgeary | change those locs |
| 20:07.13 | wps | have I met you before? have you been to any of the meetings? |
| 20:07.14 | mgeary | hrmn |
| 20:07.19 | mgeary | might have to change other things as well |
| 20:07.49 | mgeary | be sure to make a backup, just in case |
| 20:08.06 | wps | perhaps I'll bounce it off PLUG first |
| 20:08.39 | mgeary | i'm a bit surprised that a custom apache install doesn't auto-make an init.d-compatible file that you could simply drop in. i've never checked |
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| 20:09.49 | brasto | hey guys, how do i grep all contents of a folder? just omit a file name? |
| 20:10.12 | mgeary | egrep -ri "somematchstring" * |
| 20:10.21 | mgeary | egrep -ri "somematchstring" /path/to/folder/* |
| 20:10.27 | brasto | oh, i want it to return the name of the file that has the statement i'm looking for, will it do that mgeary? |
| 20:10.34 | mgeary | add l |
| 20:10.37 | mgeary | egrep -ril "somematchstring" /path/to/folder/* |
| 20:10.42 | mgeary | that'll do it |
| 20:11.22 | mgeary | wps: check this out: http://www.activsoftware.com/apache/apache2src.cfm |
| 20:11.22 | brasto | that's an "ell" not a "one", right? |
| 20:11.27 | mgeary | right |
| 20:11.35 | brasto | cool, trying it now... |
| 20:14.53 | brasto | doh, i just thought of a problem... if i tweak this file, then the next cms upgrade will overwrite my tweek... |
| 20:15.36 | mgeary | brasto: that egrep command will search the contents of ALL files, including binary ones, so depending on your directory, it might take a while |
| 20:15.39 | brasto | i'm customizing a php-generated theme, and one function returns two lines of html... |
| 20:15.57 | mgeary | you can pass --exclude and --include parameters to narrow the kinds of files that get searched |
| 20:15.58 | brasto | they are all plain text include files for php |
| 20:16.00 | *** join/#uphpu timinator (n=timinato@c-67-171-118-199.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 20:16.00 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v timinator] by ChanServ |
| 20:16.10 | timinator | sigh |
| 20:16.13 | timinator | I'm back |
| 20:16.21 | mgeary | ok, i just ask because unless there's a ton of files, that search should be done by now |
| 20:17.00 | brasto | oh, i did grep instead of egrep |
| 20:17.18 | brasto | starting it over.... |
| 20:17.20 | mgeary | not sure of the difference, frankly |
| 20:17.43 | brasto | i knew yesterday... but the diff escapes me right now... |
| 20:18.37 | brasto | here's what's bugging me... view source on http://pre.retvtours.com/ |
| 20:18.57 | mgeary | k |
| 20:19.31 | mgeary | and? |
| 20:23.19 | mindjuju | it must be some big thing that's bugging him |
| 20:23.23 | mgeary | i guess |
| 20:24.13 | mindjuju | i've got the page up, the source code on a seperate monitor, looking at each line of code for the slightest anomoly that may be bugging brasto, but alas, i'm not seeing anything |
| 20:24.13 | mgeary | maybe it's that the page requires a 1100-pixel-wide window ;) |
| 20:28.11 | mindjuju | curious |
| 20:33.13 | mgeary | hey folks, can you have an "ErrorDocument 404" do a proxy, rather than a re-direct? I'm being asked by someone who is having POSTs to domain.com/someview get lost |
| 20:33.26 | *** join/#uphpu brasto (n=brasto@71-219-154-236.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 20:33.26 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v brasto] by ChanServ |
| 20:34.49 | brasto | qwest went down for a bit, so i got disconnected |
| 20:35.29 | brasto | i think what i want to do might be better in the theme file |
| 20:35.51 | beandog | mgeary: why not just pass on the header requests? |
| 20:36.21 | brasto | anyone know of a string function that ads a space after each newline and/or carriage return? |
| 20:36.32 | mgeary | never done that, beyond header("Location:..."). got any sample(s)? |
| 20:37.07 | beandog | no |
| 20:37.13 | beandog | or you could put $_REQUEST in a session |
| 20:37.20 | mgeary | brasto: sure: preg_replace("/([\r\n]+)/","\1 ",$input_data); |
| 20:38.15 | brasto | thanks mgeary, i'll prob'ly give that a try |
| 20:41.28 | macnewbold | mgeary: did you get your thing solved? if you don't want to redirect from the 404, you can instead do header("HTTP/1.0 200 OK"); followed by include("someotherfile.php"); |
| 20:41.56 | mgeary | macnewbold: i'm relaying the question, so i don't know, but i'll suggest that as well |
| 20:43.54 | mgeary | so, here's the thing, as i understand it-- there's a POST going to domain.com/someview, but that's being ErrorDocument-404-redirected to index.php?view=someview |
| 20:44.03 | mgeary | and in the redirect process, index.php doesn't get the POST data |
| 20:44.25 | macnewbold | ah |
| 20:44.27 | mgeary | so i don't see how the POST headers would be available to pass along |
| 20:44.29 | macnewbold | yes, it won't get the POST data |
| 20:44.57 | macnewbold | one option is to take the contents of $_POST, turn them into a query string, and add them to the GET, |
| 20:45.51 | macnewbold | or you can grab the POST contents, and repost them to index.php, but that would likely need curl or something weird like that, as you can't do a redirect that carries over the post that I know of |
| 20:46.17 | mgeary | right, so you couldn't *get* the POST contents, because they would have been lost in the redirect |
| 20:46.27 | macnewbold | or you can have the errordoc set $view=someview or $_GET[view]=someview; then do what I suggested with status 200 and include |
| 20:46.53 | macnewbold | mgeary: yes, they were posted in the request that resulted in the 404, and in the redirect, it will only do a get request on index.php |
| 20:47.00 | macnewbold | there won't be any post data sent to index.php |
| 20:47.50 | mgeary | so, there's no Apache config that could manage this? |
| 20:48.39 | macnewbold | mod_rewrite probably could do it |
| 20:48.56 | mgeary | yeah |
| 20:48.58 | macnewbold | but not if the choice of which view to use is based on the contents of the post |
| 20:49.06 | macnewbold | it would have to depend on the get |
| 20:49.13 | macnewbold | and couldn't depend on a session/cookie either |
| 20:49.28 | macnewbold | nor could mod_rewrite pull anything from a database to decide, etc. |
| 20:49.38 | macnewbold | you've basically got a regexp you can use, and that's it |
| 20:49.45 | mgeary | yeah |
| 20:49.49 | macnewbold | my #1 suggestion for him would be: |
| 20:49.54 | macnewbold | post it to the right URL in the first place |
| 20:49.56 | macnewbold | :-D |
| 20:52.06 | mgeary | well, yeah. i think he's trying to do a MVC kind of thing |
| 20:52.39 | wps | jsmith, you around? |
| 20:52.46 | macnewbold | mgeary: yeah, those are a waste of time |
| 20:52.47 | jsmith | Yup |
| 20:52.55 | macnewbold | <flamesuit> |
| 20:52.56 | wps | what is the difference between CentOS and FC? |
| 20:53.07 | wps | CentOS is the same as RHEL, just without branding right? |
| 20:53.17 | mgeary | that's my (weak) understanding |
| 20:53.40 | wps | and Fedora is the community version of RH that Red Hat sponsors to get free beta testing? |
| 20:53.56 | wps | (they roll what becomes stable in FC into RHEL?) |
| 20:54.30 | jsmith | wps: CentOS is a re-spin of RHEL... so it's 18-month release cycles, 7 years of update.... slow, long, ultra-stable OS |
| 20:54.36 | macnewbold | I thought FC was a more consumer-grade thing and CentOS/RHEL was supposed to be some kind of premium enterprise-level thing |
| 20:54.49 | brasto | some of drupal's code is annoying... |
| 20:54.56 | macnewbold | s/some/all/ |
| 20:55.03 | macnewbold | hm |
| 20:55.12 | macnewbold | I guess it won't let me fix brasto's comments, only my own... |
| 20:55.26 | jsmith | wps: FC is the "community" release... a lot of the work is still done by RH engineers, but it's up to the community to decide what goes in |
| 20:55.39 | brasto | macnewbold - fix my comments? |
| 20:55.40 | jsmith | wps: FC has ~6 month release cycles, and only 13 months of updates |
| 20:56.09 | jsmith | wps: FC is more aimed at the desktop, CentOS/RHEL are more aimed at the server |
| 20:56.18 | wps | k |
| 20:56.22 | macnewbold | yeah, you said some of drupal's code is annoying, I tried to replace it with "all of drupal's code is annoying" |
| 20:56.48 | wps | is my impression that FC is kind of a test-bed or development area for what makes it into the enterprise level version wrong? |
| 20:56.48 | jsmith | wps: That often get's simplified down to "FC is the beta for RHEL", but it's nowhere near that simple. |
| 20:56.58 | macnewbold | wps: in short, what he's saying leads to one conclusion: you're better off with FreeBSD... |
| 20:57.02 | brasto | lol! look at line 21 of drupal-generated code on http://pre.retvtours.com |
| 20:57.07 | wps | k, that makes sense |
| 20:57.09 | brasto | the entire list on one line... |
| 20:57.11 | wps | thanks jsmith |
| 20:57.20 | jsmith | wps: There are certainly technologies that are tried out in FC before being used in RHEL... |
| 20:57.26 | thebigdog | ~whip macnewbold |
| 20:57.28 | jbot | ACTION takes macnewbold outside to be thoroughly whipped by thebigdog |
| 20:57.36 | macnewbold | ~wiseguy thebigdog |
| 20:57.37 | jbot | ACTION runs up to thebigdog and pokes thebigdog in the eyes! |
| 20:57.37 | wps | I should upgrade my server to CentOS 4 |
| 20:57.40 | macnewbold | ~insult thebigdog |
| 20:57.44 | macnewbold | ~bdhit thebigdog |
| 20:57.46 | jbot | ACTION slaps the diviner's tin avalanche on thebigdog |
| 20:58.00 | macnewbold | ~freebsd++ |
| 20:58.08 | brasto | what's a fen? |
| 20:58.11 | brasto | ~fen |
| 20:58.32 | brasto | jbot, what is fen? |
| 20:58.34 | jbot | brasto: what are you talking about? |
| 20:58.39 | thebigdog | ~freebsd--100000000 |
| 20:58.43 | jsmith | wps: In short, I like FC on desktop machines that can be re-imaged every 6 to 12 months, and CentOS on servers that are gonna be around a while |
| 20:59.07 | brasto | jbot said thebigdog is "fen-sucked..." what's a fen? |
| 20:59.09 | jbot | okay, brasto |
| 20:59.16 | brasto | lol |
| 20:59.22 | brasto | ~thebigdog |
| 20:59.24 | jbot | i guess thebigdog is a guroob, or the sql guru |
| 20:59.41 | brasto | ~said thebigdog |
| 20:59.42 | jbot | methinks said thebigdog is "fen-sucked..." what's a fen? |
| 20:59.49 | brasto | lol |
| 21:00.52 | thebigdog | fen is a technical term |
| 21:01.03 | mgeary | ~define fen |
| 21:01.05 | jbot | Use ~dict for definitions. |
| 21:01.08 | mgeary | ~dict fen |
| 21:01.23 | mgeary | ~dict bog |
| 21:01.30 | mgeary | ~dict moor |
| 21:01.43 | mgeary | no no |
| 21:02.08 | brasto | ~dict vim |
| 21:02.10 | mgeary | a tract of open uncultivated upland; a heath |
| 21:02.34 | brasto | ~vim |
| 21:02.35 | jbot | hmm... vim is better than emacs |
| 21:02.53 | mgeary | moor ~= fen ~= heath |
| 21:04.16 | brasto | jbot, vim is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. Perhaps that's why vim is such a popular text editor... |
| 21:04.18 | jbot | ACTION drops is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. Perhaps that's why vim is such a popular text editor... into a vim buffer and edits is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. ... |
| 21:04.38 | brasto | huh? |
| 21:04.42 | brasto | ~vim |
| 21:04.44 | jbot | well, vim is better than emacs |
| 21:05.35 | brasto | jbot vim is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. Perhaps that's why vim is such a popular text editor... into a vim buffer and edits is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. |
| 21:05.36 | jbot | ACTION drops is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. Perhaps that's why vim is such a popular text editor... into a vim buffer and edits is also power; force; energy; spirit; activity; vigor, Vendor Independent Messaging, and a healthy capacity for vigorous activity. into ... |
| 21:05.51 | brasto | ~insult jbot |
| 21:06.36 | wps | so no takers for presenting at tomorrow's meeting? |
| 21:06.47 | mgeary | where is the meeting? |
| 21:06.50 | wps | I guess I'll have to present on customizing Word Press or something |
| 21:06.57 | wps | 123rd and I-15 |
| 21:07.09 | thebigdog | i can do it on jasperreports |
| 21:07.10 | wps | or we can all get together and work on installing spam assassin on my server |
| 21:07.11 | mgeary | is that by South-Towne |
| 21:07.13 | mgeary | ? |
| 21:07.25 | macnewbold | mgeary: an exit further south |
| 21:07.30 | mgeary | Draper? |
| 21:07.39 | macnewbold | southtowne is 106, 123 is draper, yes |
| 21:09.00 | wps | you think you can present thebigdog ? |
| 21:09.14 | thebigdog | lol no one wants jasperreports |
| 21:09.31 | wps | oh (I don't have a clue what those are :) ) |
| 21:09.34 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@75-162-170-152.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 21:09.34 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 21:09.36 | mgeary | i'd vote for jasperreports |
| 21:09.42 | mgeary | but i can't guarantee i can come |
| 21:09.44 | thebigdog | report generation tool |
| 21:09.58 | mgeary | i'd vote for that over WP. :) |
| 21:10.10 | Lone_Wanderer | Sweet! Bluemars is back up. |
| 21:10.34 | Lone_Wanderer | What are you voting for over Wade, mgeary? |
| 21:10.41 | mgeary | JasperReports |
| 21:10.52 | thebigdog | or i can talk about o/r mapping with hibernat |
| 21:10.53 | thebigdog | :) |
| 21:11.01 | thebigdog | for mgeary |
| 21:11.26 | mgeary | uh, that's a Java thingy, no? ewwww |
| 21:11.32 | thebigdog | lol |
| 21:11.36 | thebigdog | you can use it with php |
| 21:11.56 | mgeary | well hey then |
| 21:12.13 | thebigdog | a lot of guys are using lucene and php |
| 21:12.28 | thebigdog | maybe i should do jasper and php for the zend framework |
| 21:12.41 | Lone_Wanderer | ohhh, I thought you meant Wade when you said WP. |
| 21:12.49 | mgeary | oh, hah |
| 21:13.18 | mgeary | no, i got no beef with WPS :) |
| 21:16.09 | thebigdog | wps is the next american idol |
| 21:16.23 | mgeary | oh, well then maybe i do have a beef |
| 21:16.41 | jsmith | thebigdog: He can sing too! Dang... what can't wps do? |
| 21:17.10 | thebigdog | he can act, sing, design, paint, dance, cook and play piano |
| 21:18.16 | wps | mostly true… I don't do much painting |
| 21:18.27 | thebigdog | i shoudl have done art there |
| 21:19.12 | Lone_Wanderer | thebigdog: He can also slap together a mean web site. |
| 21:19.23 | thebigdog | oh yeah |
| 21:19.29 | Lone_Wanderer | And I mean literally mean. The last site he put together made me cry. |
| 21:19.40 | thebigdog | and his wife is really nice too so he has a great fam |
| 21:20.16 | thebigdog | as my six year old informed me the other day 'wade's wife put my bed together' |
| 21:20.39 | Lone_Wanderer | ? |
| 21:21.03 | thebigdog | wade and his wife help me and my fam move into my house |
| 21:21.20 | thebigdog | wade and his wife put together my girls bunk bed |
| 21:21.39 | *** join/#uphpu brast1 (n=brasto@71-219-154-236.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 21:21.58 | thebigdog | i got on my girls case about there bed and how much it cost...and my six year old told me that i did not put it together though |
| 21:22.09 | thebigdog | so i started laughing about it |
| 21:24.06 | *** part/#uphpu brast1 (n=brasto@71-219-154-236.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 21:26.28 | thebigdog | ~wake wps |
| 21:26.31 | jbot | ACTION throws a barrel-full of ice water on wps and shouts "GOOD MORNING!!!!" |
| 21:26.42 | wps | be nice to me… I'm sick again |
| 21:26.46 | wps | :) |
| 21:28.12 | thebigdog | did you not read my stuff |
| 21:28.22 | thebigdog | i thought you would get a kick out of it |
| 21:28.35 | thebigdog | ~wake timinator |
| 21:28.38 | jbot | ACTION throws a barrel-full of ice water on timinator and shouts "GOOD MORNING!!!!" |
| 21:29.07 | wps | oh… I didn't |
| 21:29.13 | wps | sorry, just scrolled back up |
| 21:29.17 | wps | that's funny she said that |
| 21:29.35 | thebigdog | i tought she forgot that was like 2 years ago |
| 21:29.40 | wps | yeah |
| 21:29.49 | wps | thanks Lone_Wanderer for the compliment as well |
| 21:30.01 | thebigdog | timinator...smile .|.. |
| 21:30.09 | timinator | LMAO |
| 21:30.18 | timinator | back at ya baby |
| 21:30.21 | timinator | :) |
| 21:30.22 | wps | well, I guess I'm presenting tomorrow |
| 21:30.57 | thebigdog | timinator (.)(.) |
| 21:32.19 | timinator | LOL |
| 21:32.19 | thebigdog | timinator ).( |
| 21:32.19 | thebigdog | timinator (.)(.) |
| 21:32.20 | timinator | I don't *even* want to know what that one is |
| 21:32.20 | thebigdog | timinator (.)(.) |
| 21:32.20 | thebigdog | timinator ).( |
| 21:32.20 | thebigdog | lol |
| 21:32.23 | thebigdog | ~kick thebigdog |
| 21:32.26 | jbot | ACTION kicks thebigdog |
| 21:32.51 | timinator | AAAAAAAAAAAHHH .......thebigdog is flashing me |
| 21:32.56 | timinator | :) |
| 21:33.08 | thebigdog | lol |
| 21:33.15 | thebigdog | man boobies |
| 21:33.20 | timinator | eek |
| 21:33.54 | mgeary | "mannary glands", you mean |
| 21:34.02 | thebigdog | man time for programming now |
| 21:34.40 | timinator | <quote> "he's got a rubber boobie!" </quote> |
| 21:34.58 | thebigdog | ~kick timinator |
| 21:35.00 | jbot | ACTION kicks timinator |
| 21:35.11 | timinator | hehehe |
| 21:36.12 | thebigdog | man that flex2 looks kinda sweet |
| 21:36.25 | timinator | fo sho |
| 21:36.41 | thebigdog | we are thinking of hooking into our j2ee app that we have |
| 21:37.10 | mgeary | flex2 rocks |
| 21:37.37 | mgeary | y'all ought to come to one of our UDFUG presentations on Flex2 |
| 21:37.43 | mgeary | ~udfug |
| 21:38.14 | Lone_Wanderer | I love writing emails that cite specific statues of federal law. |
| 21:38.16 | mgeary | ~udfug |
| 21:38.17 | jbot | udfug is probably the Utah Director and Flash Users Group, found at http:www.udfug.org/ |
| 21:38.34 | Lone_Wanderer | "Actually, section 7704 (a) (5) (A) (iii) states that..." |
| 21:38.54 | thebigdog | ~fart timinator |
| 21:38.55 | jbot | ACTION farts in timinator's general direction |
| 21:39.03 | thebigdog | literally |
| 21:39.20 | timinator | come on jbot.... I had my mouth open and everything |
| 21:39.22 | thebigdog | im waiting to come on board working with timinator full time |
| 21:39.26 | timinator | geez |
| 21:39.30 | timinator | for shure |
| 21:39.30 | thebigdog | taht is a nice boulder |
| 21:39.34 | timinator | I'd hire ya |
| 21:39.43 | thebigdog | timinator = hr breaking crap |
| 21:39.58 | timinator | I'll even give you free Rockstars |
| 21:40.01 | timinator | :) |
| 21:40.18 | Lone_Wanderer | Rockstar energy drinks? The purple ones? |
| 21:40.21 | Lone_Wanderer | Those are yummylicious. |
| 21:40.26 | timinator | Black Label |
| 21:40.33 | timinator | :) |
| 21:40.35 | Lone_Wanderer | I haven't had a black label one. |
| 21:40.38 | thebigdog | black label society that is killer |
| 21:40.46 | timinator | LOL |
| 21:40.50 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh come on Bluemars, you can do better than this! |
| 21:41.51 | thebigdog | ~watchout |
| 21:43.31 | timinator | ~lart thebigdog |
| 21:43.38 | mgeary | hahahahahahahaha |
| 21:43.48 | thebigdog | anyone interested in nuchi? |
| 21:44.29 | mgeary | hey, we're looking to hire a smart, entry-level designer/html person. no coding required. Anyone know of someone? |
| 21:44.44 | thebigdog | timinator, |
| 21:44.52 | thebigdog | roflol |
| 21:45.09 | timinator | hey now |
| 21:45.23 | timinator | thebigdog: .|.. |
| 21:46.08 | thebigdog | lol |
| 21:46.41 | Lone_Wanderer | mgeary: my niece, but she's in... well, out east. Or my sister, but she's in Orem. |
| 21:46.56 | thebigdog | anyone interest in nuchi's meeting let me know |
| 21:46.56 | Lone_Wanderer | And 16. |
| 21:46.56 | mgeary | we're in Orem |
| 21:46.56 | mgeary | 16 might be a bit young |
| 21:46.59 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah, I thought so ;) |
| 21:47.18 | thebigdog | yeah timinator likes "older women" |
| 21:48.06 | timinator | LOL |
| 21:48.15 | timinator | I'm on thebigdog's hit list today |
| 21:50.22 | thebigdog | its all fun and games until the timinator takes you out |
| 21:50.34 | timinator | :) |
| 21:50.38 | timinator | for shure |
| 21:53.12 | Lone_Wanderer | Woah. This guy's voice is serious. |
| 21:53.39 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah, watch out for timinator, he'll drop a tree on you and forget to yell "timber". |
| 21:54.17 | timinator | LOL.... in the lumber industry, I go by "timber" |
| 21:54.17 | Lone_Wanderer | timinator: You should pick up A River Runs Through It (and other stories). One of the other stories is Logging and Pimping and Your Pal, Jim |
| 21:54.31 | timinator | LOL |
| 21:54.37 | Lone_Wanderer | about a guy who works two years in a lumber camp |
| 21:54.56 | Lone_Wanderer | this was back when they used the long draw saws (or whatever you call them), pulled by two men |
| 21:55.18 | Lone_Wanderer | and a guy named Jim, who everyone agrees is the toughest guy in camp, asks him to be his partner for the second year |
| 21:55.22 | macnewbold | those are good saws |
| 21:55.33 | macnewbold | much quieter and more fuel efficient than chainsaws |
| 21:55.57 | mgeary | oh oh oh |
| 21:55.58 | timinator | not our chainsaws.... they cut like a hot knife through butter |
| 21:56.07 | mgeary | i've got a great lumberjack joke. completely clean |
| 21:56.09 | Lone_Wanderer | and how he spends the entire summer hating Jim and thinking of ways to kill him |
| 21:56.21 | Lone_Wanderer | timinator: do you really work in the lumber industry? |
| 21:56.26 | timinator | yes |
| 21:56.34 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 21:56.46 | Lone_Wanderer | Have you heard of greenspirit.org? |
| 21:56.47 | timinator | we have 2 sawmills |
| 21:56.55 | timinator | no... checking |
| 21:57.35 | mgeary | so, this lumberjack goes into a hardware store. "I guess i need to get me one of those 'chain saws'", he says. "I hear they cut down trees faster. I can cut down 12 trees a day with my axe, you think a chain saw can help me do more?" |
| 21:57.51 | Lone_Wanderer | Founder of Greenpeace runs it. He's in favor of logging. Thought you might be interested in reading what he has to say, in case you are ever in the unfortunate position of having to speak to an environmentalist. |
| 21:57.57 | mgeary | the sales rep says, "oh, yes, you'll be able to do much more with a chain saw" |
| 21:58.52 | mgeary | so the lumberjack buys the chainsaw, and goes out. He comes back the next day, "i want my money back," he says, "i could only cut down 5 trees today!" |
| 21:59.25 | mgeary | the sales rep looks the chain saw over, says, "well, let's see if there's anything wrong". He rips the cord and the chain saw roars to life |
| 21:59.38 | mgeary | Startled, the lumberjack jumps back and says, "What's that noise??!!" |
| 21:59.40 | mgeary | haahahahahahahahahahah |
| 21:59.58 | thebigdog | that has happened to timber |
| 22:00.05 | timinator | LOL |
| 22:00.30 | Lone_Wanderer | timinator: A River Runs Through It is a really good book. Tell me that you're going to read it so that I can stop bugging you about it. |
| 22:00.42 | timinator | I use a $3.5 million HewSaw |
| 22:00.59 | timinator | it kicks butt |
| 22:00.59 | Lone_Wanderer | You're kidding me. Your chain saw cost $3.5 million? |
| 22:01.09 | timinator | something like that |
| 22:01.35 | Lone_Wanderer | A chainsaw consists of a motor, a handle, a chain that goes round and round, and a guide for the chain to go in. |
| 22:01.40 | Lone_Wanderer | My car is more complicated than that. |
| 22:02.07 | timinator | this is a HewSaw.... log goes in one side, lumber out the other |
| 22:02.37 | timinator | and there's a ton of software |
| 22:02.39 | Lone_Wanderer | So it's not a thing that you carry into the woods to chop down trees with? |
| 22:02.39 | mindjuju | Oh, I'm a lumberjack and I'm OK,I sleep all night and I work all day. |
| 22:02.51 | timinator | LW: no |
| 22:02.52 | Lone_Wanderer | That sounds more like a lumber mill than a chain saw to me. |
| 22:02.59 | mindjuju | I cut down trees, I eat my lunch, I go to the lavatory. |
| 22:03.00 | mindjuju | On Wednesdays I go shopping,And have buttered scones for tea. |
| 22:03.04 | timinator | yes... we have 2 lumber mills |
| 22:03.23 | Lone_Wanderer | okay cool |
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| 22:04.13 | mindjuju | I cut down trees, I skip and jump, I like to press wild flowers. |
| 22:04.13 | mindjuju | I put on women's clothing,And hang around in bars. |
| 22:04.27 | Lone_Wanderer | when I went to Nauvoo on a trip with my stake as a kid, we got a little tour of that place you stay in and the guide said that it was built in... I don't recall, some year or other. |
| 22:04.29 | timinator | stay away from me |
| 22:04.32 | mindjuju | i'm guessing nobody knows that Monty python song |
| 22:04.37 | Lone_Wanderer | mindjuju: I do :p |
| 22:04.38 | mgeary | mindjuju: of course we do |
| 22:04.40 | timinator | LOL no |
| 22:04.48 | timinator | but I love Monty Python |
| 22:04.49 | mindjuju | you don't timinator? |
| 22:04.59 | timinator | not that one... what's it off of? |
| 22:05.01 | mindjuju | let me see if i have a copy here at work |
| 22:05.14 | Lone_Wanderer | My Dad said, later, "You said this place was built in (early year), but these timbers were cut by a circular saw, which wasn't invented until (some later year)." |
| 22:05.34 | Lone_Wanderer | Which I thought was a cool thing to know. |
| 22:05.40 | Lone_Wanderer | >.> |
| 22:08.15 | timinator | that's cool |
| 22:08.27 | timinator | we use a HewSaw in one mill and a band saw in another |
| 22:08.42 | timinator | the HewSaw has software and is way cooler |
| 22:08.43 | Lone_Wanderer | heh, Neil Stevenson wrote about band saws. |
| 22:08.55 | Lone_Wanderer | Stephenson? I don't recall. In Cryptonomicon. |
| 22:09.14 | mgeary | i don't remember that |
| 22:09.34 | Lone_Wanderer | Billy Shaftoe, in Italy, talking about the machine gun that they were using |
| 22:09.35 | timinator | the mill is in OR and we can log in from UT and change the settings |
| 22:09.39 | Lone_Wanderer | he related it to a bandsaw |
| 22:09.57 | mindjuju | that Monty Python album really has some classics |
| 22:10.32 | Utah_Dave | ~lart mindjuju |
| 22:10.40 | mindjuju | don't be jealous |
| 22:10.45 | mgeary | but hey, you were all supposed to be thinking of entry-level designers you can refer to me |
| 22:11.04 | Utah_Dave | sorry, mindjuju. I've been at a conference all week with horrible wifi |
| 22:11.12 | mindjuju | that would suck! |
| 22:11.24 | mindjuju | want to hear the lumberjack song? |
| 22:11.31 | Utah_Dave | I haven't hardly been able to get on the intarweb |
| 22:11.39 | Utah_Dave | sure! |
| 22:11.57 | Utah_Dave | I'll probably lose the signal any second now. |
| 22:23.18 | timinator | here's a pic of my boss/client by a saw at our mill: http://mylumbertrader.com/images/johnny_1.jpg |
| 22:29.49 | mindjuju | wow, i forgot how unNSFW the Monty Python Sings Album is |
| 22:33.22 | mgeary | you mean how NSFW it is |
| 22:40.04 | Lone_Wanderer | Who's the heavy metal fan here? |
| 22:41.51 | mgeary | heavy metal-- |
| 22:51.02 | mgeary | is it unkind to say that i hate giving my sister-in-law technical support over IM? |
| 22:51.05 | mgeary | 'cause dang |
| 22:54.23 | beandog | just tell her everything wrong |
| 22:54.27 | beandog | soon she wont come to you any more |
| 22:55.17 | mgeary | heh. |
| 22:55.31 | mgeary | "now, drag the firefox icon into the Applications folder" |
| 22:55.42 | mgeary | getting that process right has taken more than 10 minutes |
| 23:05.44 | macnewbold | oh, she uses a mac... |
| 23:05.54 | macnewbold | I was going to suggest what works for most of my tech support requests: |
| 23:07.06 | macnewbold | start using almost exclusively Mac OSX or Linux or FreeBSD or something else more obscure, and the 95% of your requests (the ones for Win98 or WinXP help) will be easy - you just have to tell them you don't use windows very much and take a wild guess and shrug your shoulders |
| 23:07.24 | mgeary | yeah, that's usually what i do |
| 23:08.30 | thebigdog | Lone_Wanderer, im the heavy metal fan in this house! |
| 23:08.43 | Lone_Wanderer | thebigdog: Have you heard of Disaster Area? |
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| 23:09.23 | thebigdog | can say that i have |
| 23:09.27 | thebigdog | cant say |
| 23:10.34 | Lone_Wanderer | It's a fictional band from the Hitchhiker's Guide. They're not just the loudest band in the universe, they're the loudest noise ever. |
| 23:10.57 | beandog | man |
| 23:11.01 | beandog | I hate phantom phone rings |
| 23:11.02 | thebigdog | man it has been a long time since i read that book |
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| 23:11.23 | Lone_Wanderer | Their performances regularly destroy entire civilizations and, on occasion, planets. Their fans listen from concrete bunkers approximately 37 miles from the stage. |
| 23:11.34 | thebigdog | lol |
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| 23:22.54 | mindjuju | ~chuckfact |
| 23:22.56 | jbot | i guess chuckfact is Chuck Norris uses Tabasco Sauce for eye drops |
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| 23:23.35 | mindjuju | ~rlart |
| 23:24.40 | *** join/#uphpu PoeticIntensity (n=jason@70.96.176.13) |
| 23:24.47 | PoeticIntensity | Hey all.... |
| 23:24.55 | PoeticIntensity | Anyone wanna attack a PHP arrays question I've got? |
| 23:25.19 | PoeticIntensity | I want to "insert" a new key=>value pair smack-dab in the middle of an already-existing array. |
| 23:25.37 | beandog | bueno |
| 23:25.39 | beandog | do it. |
| 23:25.46 | beandog | array_merge() |
| 23:25.50 | mgeary | no, don't, it's too dangerous |
| 23:25.55 | mgeary | think of the children |
| 23:26.00 | beandog | I want a kitten. |
| 23:26.07 | Lone_Wanderer | Think of the KITTIES! |
| 23:26.11 | Lone_Wanderer | (cuteoverload.com) |
| 23:26.34 | Lone_Wanderer | PoeticIntensity: Why does it matter to you where in the array (technically, a hash) the key/value pair lies? |
| 23:26.35 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: so this is a name/value array, not a linear array, yes? |
| 23:27.02 | PoeticIntensity | I know the name of the keys both in front of, and after the position of the point of insertion. |
| 23:27.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Because in a hash, they don't *have* any particular order. They may get printed out in a particular order, but that doesn't mean that the order you see is intrinsic to the structure of the hash. |
| 23:27.20 | PoeticIntensity | I need it to print in an order. |
| 23:27.34 | PoeticIntensity | it seems that the order in which the array is created, is the way the array is looped through. |
| 23:27.35 | mgeary | LW is correct |
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| 23:27.43 | Lone_Wanderer | Alphabetical order, or just the order in which you created it? |
| 23:27.54 | PoeticIntensity | it also seems that the only sort option of PHP is alphabetically. |
| 23:27.57 | Lone_Wanderer | Best to make it a numerically indexed array and have each value be an array |
| 23:28.00 | beandog | so you dont want to touch the fragile order, basically |
| 23:28.03 | PoeticIntensity | I don't want it alphabetized. |
| 23:28.04 | mgeary | PoeticIntensity: you may have success if you get an array of the keys, and an array of the values, then you're dealing with 2 linear lists who have a significant order |
| 23:28.10 | mgeary | array_keys() array_values() |
| 23:28.25 | PoeticIntensity | I have the order I need it to be in, and the array is already created when one more value needs to be inserted into the middle of it. |
| 23:28.27 | Lone_Wanderer | Right, but you need it in a specific order, which you can't do with a hash. So you need to use a numerically indexed array. |
| 23:28.43 | PoeticIntensity | mgeary: That's definitely something I hadn't thought about. |
| 23:28.44 | beandog | Hmm, tahts true |
| 23:28.51 | mgeary | yeah, i've done that before |
| 23:29.03 | mgeary | LW's approach is also good |
| 23:29.14 | Lone_Wanderer | And you need to rewrite the numbers of the higher members of the array when you do the insert. It's kind of a pain. PHP may have a way to do it for you, I don't know. |
| 23:29.20 | Lone_Wanderer | PHP needs a list. |
| 23:29.23 | mgeary | it has one |
| 23:29.33 | mgeary | list($a,$b,$c) = array(1,2,3) |
| 23:29.36 | Lone_Wanderer | has a list, or a way to insert things into the middle of an array? |
| 23:29.37 | PoeticIntensity | yeah.... I'm reading through it right now. |
| 23:29.37 | mgeary | $a = 1, $b = 2 |
| 23:29.53 | PoeticIntensity | (no insertion into the middle as far as I'm aware, Lone_Wanderer) |
| 23:30.01 | Lone_Wanderer | I think that's a function though, not a data structure. |
| 23:30.11 | PoeticIntensity | and creating a numerically indexed array would be difficult.... as the keys are also important. |
| 23:30.15 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah, it is a function. |
| 23:30.32 | PoeticIntensity | unless I created two numerical arrays. |
| 23:30.55 | PoeticIntensity | gah.... |
| 23:31.01 | Lone_Wanderer | PoeticIntensity: Have the array's members each be an array, with the first value the "key" and the second value the "value". |
| 23:31.21 | Lone_Wanderer | Yes, it's a pain, but it will guarantee your order, and it will... something else that I just forgot. But it was a good thing. |
| 23:31.22 | PoeticIntensity | yup..... |
| 23:31.31 | beandog | feed your kittens |
| 23:31.31 | PoeticIntensity | *that* might be a great idea. |
| 23:31.45 | PoeticIntensity | see.... here's the problem...... |
| 23:31.47 | PoeticIntensity | hold on.. |
| 23:31.49 | Lone_Wanderer | Actuallly, no. You don't need to mess around with the numbering. |
| 23:31.50 | PoeticIntensity | here's another question: |
| 23:31.53 | Lone_Wanderer | -l |
| 23:32.07 | Lone_Wanderer | Just chop it in half where you want it, stick your new thing on, and then slap the end onto your new array. |
| 23:32.13 | PoeticIntensity | I've got two queries (MySQL) |
| 23:32.26 | PoeticIntensity | 1. huge crazy query pulling all sorts of joins 'n' crud. |
| 23:32.45 | PoeticIntensity | 2. query pulling data specific to each row pulled from the first query. |
| 23:33.06 | PoeticIntensity | it'd be optimal if query 2 were implemented into query 1. |
| 23:33.07 | PoeticIntensity | Problem: |
| 23:33.27 | Lone_Wanderer | use array_slice to get your array into two pieces, then $arr_front[] = $foo, where $foo is the value to be inserted, and then foreach($array_end as $endpiece) { $arr_front[] = $endpiece) |
| 23:33.37 | PoeticIntensity | query 2 pulls multiple rows that need to be concatenated into a comma-separated value, which is then inserted into the array of the results of the first query. |
| 23:33.43 | PoeticIntensity | anyone know how to do that in SQL? |
| 23:33.45 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 23:33.56 | Lone_Wanderer | Not I. And I didn't even read the question, I just know that I don't know how to do it. |
| 23:34.04 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 23:34.07 | beandog | return results in CSV? thats easy. |
| 23:34.18 | PoeticIntensity | LW - also a *very* good idea.... |
| 23:34.23 | PoeticIntensity | which I hadn't considered. |
| 23:34.41 | PoeticIntensity | however.... If I can get SQL to do the work for me, I won't have to sort my array at all. |
| 23:35.05 | Lone_Wanderer | Just replace the for loop with array_merge and you're good to go. |
| 23:35.13 | PoeticIntensity | basically.... I need a subquery to pull multiple rows and concatenate them all into a single field |
| 23:35.30 | PoeticIntensity | all inside of another query. |
| 23:35.44 | beandog | ~asplode my head |
| 23:35.46 | jbot | my head head asplode, k thx |
| 23:35.47 | PoeticIntensity | gah..... CONCAT won't work, either.... |
| 23:35.48 | Lone_Wanderer | Man, this stream is cool today. |
| 23:35.54 | beandog | what stream |
| 23:36.01 | Lone_Wanderer | Voice from Within, on bluemars.com |
| 23:36.19 | Lone_Wanderer | Lots of weird eastern and middle eastern music. |
| 23:36.28 | PoeticIntensity | *note to self*.... |
| 23:36.30 | Lone_Wanderer | Makes me wish I spoke Arabic. |
| 23:36.50 | PoeticIntensity | When all people once concerned about problem start talking about random Arabic, it means I've lost em'... :) |
| 23:36.52 | beandog | ooh I love that stuff. |
| 23:37.00 | Lone_Wanderer | PoeticIntensity: I don't know if you can do that in SQL, but you could do it with Postgres no problem, using PL/SQL. |
| 23:37.03 | PoeticIntensity | thanks for the ideas, guys. |
| 23:37.14 | PoeticIntensity | hrmmmm............. |
| 23:37.20 | beandog | PoeticIntensity: I compeltely lost what you are trying to do |
| 23:37.25 | PoeticIntensity | I know. |
| 23:37.26 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: are you sure thats the site? |
| 23:37.26 | PoeticIntensity | :) |
| 23:37.48 | Lone_Wanderer | beandog: He's got two queries he wants to combine into one, but the second one does some complicated stuff that (in my limited experience) can't be done in MySQL. |
| 23:37.49 | Lone_Wanderer | brt |
| 23:38.00 | beandog | combine two queries into one ...? |
| 23:39.01 | Lone_Wanderer | Ashan sho chan'do bhakavan shak daa vish num jish num hasha! |
| 23:39.11 | beandog | oh man. |
| 23:40.37 | PoeticIntensity | okay.... I've got the question simplified. |
| 23:40.42 | PoeticIntensity | here goes..... |
| 23:40.48 | PoeticIntensity | *clap* ROUND TWO: |
| 23:40.50 | PoeticIntensity | *ding ding ding* |
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| 23:41.28 | PoeticIntensity | Is there any way to, instead of returning multiple rows, return all data in a comma-separated list within the same field on the same row? |
| 23:42.07 | beandog | no. |
| 23:42.35 | beandog | unless you can do subselects. |
| 23:43.23 | beandog | and even then, I dont know why you would want to go through the hassle of doing it in SQL when its easy to do with implode |
| 23:43.46 | beandog | $csv = "'".implode("',"', $arr)."'\n"; |
| 23:43.53 | beandog | er, I got a quote backwards tehre. |
| 23:44.45 | beandog | ~implode eyeball |
| 23:45.03 | Lone_Wanderer | Oh come on, you don't like vaguely musical chanting performed on an 8-note octave? |
| 23:45.21 | Lone_Wanderer | (The Western octave is actually 12 notes I think. More than 8 at any rate.) |
| 23:45.24 | beandog | not that kind |
| 23:46.10 | Lone_Wanderer | Who, or what, is that? |
| 23:46.41 | Lone_Wanderer | This song is a bit different from what they were playing before. This sounds more like traditional Arabic music, but the things before this were more Western. |
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| 23:47.45 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: indian / balkan / new age music |
| 23:47.47 | beandog | magnatune.com |
| 23:48.05 | beandog | amazing voice. |
| 23:48.09 | beandog | Im gonna put some on right now! |
| 23:48.16 | PoeticIntensity | believe me, beandog, I've got my reasons for doing it this way... |
| 23:48.23 | PoeticIntensity | otherwise, I wouldn't even think about doing this crud. |
| 23:48.26 | Lone_Wanderer | Yep, I got it right, there's 12 notes in the Western octave, but apparently the Arabic octave can have up to 24 notes in it. |
| 23:48.31 | Lone_Wanderer | Which is why it sounds so weird. |
| 23:48.34 | PoeticIntensity | its either do it with SQL, or inject something into the middle of an array. |
| 23:48.47 | beandog | I think injecting inside an array would be much simpler. |
| 23:48.59 | beandog | if you know the exact place to split it, do array_chunk() |
| 23:49.02 | beandog | then rejoin em. |
| 23:49.10 | PoeticIntensity | indeed, I Do. |
| 23:49.15 | beandog | well, array_chunk is overkill, but oh well. |
| 23:49.15 | PoeticIntensity | I'll look at doing that... |
| 23:49.48 | beandog | either way, if you know where to put it in |
| 23:49.51 | beandog | you can rebuilt it using a counter. |
| 23:49.55 | Lone_Wanderer | But Arabic music is more focused on rhythm than tones anyway. |
| 23:49.59 | Lone_Wanderer | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:50.19 | Lone_Wanderer | :D |
| 23:50.42 | beandog | http://magnatune.com/artists/albums/quist-silver/ |
| 23:50.46 | Lone_Wanderer | I lived in an Arab country for two years when I was a kid, so I was exposed to it early on. |
| 23:51.04 | Lone_Wanderer | So it doesn't sound as weird to me (*as* weird) as it does to most Westerners. |
| 23:51.15 | beandog | well I didnt think it was weird. |
| 23:51.16 | beandog | Just boring. |
| 23:51.22 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, ok |
| 23:51.32 | beandog | needed some substance |
| 23:51.41 | beandog | mindjuju: the movie or the floor cleaner? |
| 23:51.43 | Lone_Wanderer | yeah, it's kind of... flat |
| 23:51.53 | mindjuju | the movie |
| 23:52.22 | beandog | mmm I love that movie. |
| 23:52.42 | PoeticIntensity | me too. |
| 23:52.49 | PoeticIntensity | I love watching movies in bean's head. |
| 23:52.52 | beandog | nobody asked for your opinion, jerk |
| 23:52.53 | beandog | lols |
| 23:53.07 | PoeticIntensity | flamer. |
| 23:53.08 | mindjuju | yeah, it's a good movie. great mix of CG, plot, it's written by Azimov, action |
| 23:53.10 | beandog | fag |
| 23:53.18 | PoeticIntensity | m0r0n |
| 23:53.22 | beandog | :C |
| 23:53.24 | beandog | he's got me there. |
| 23:53.27 | PoeticIntensity | LOL |
| 23:53.57 | mindjuju | don't have myth, but do have it on my SAN at home |
| 23:54.05 | beandog | whats a SAN/ |
| 23:54.05 | beandog | ? |
| 23:54.09 | Lone_Wanderer | hmm, I like the first two seconds of Monster. |
| 23:54.11 | mindjuju | storage area network |
| 23:54.18 | beandog | two seconds? |
| 23:54.30 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, I just barely started it. |
| 23:54.35 | beandog | boy and I thought I was impatient |
| 23:54.36 | beandog | ah |
| 23:54.36 | beandog | :) |
| 23:54.56 | Lone_Wanderer | Okay, it's six, I'm leaving. |
| 23:54.57 | mindjuju | have nearly a terabyte of my DVD library backed up |
| 23:55.01 | Lone_Wanderer | no wait! |
| 23:55.06 | mindjuju | using XBMC to view |
| 23:55.11 | beandog | mindjuju: I was thinking about doing that |
| 23:55.17 | beandog | but then I realized, I dont mind switching discs. |
| 23:55.19 | mindjuju | have 3 xboxes throughout the house to view and play on |
| 23:55.27 | mindjuju | discs? |
| 23:55.31 | mindjuju | too prone to scratch |
| 23:55.32 | Lone_Wanderer | I think that this is one of the songs I like... |
| 23:55.32 | beandog | so now I have 1.5 terabytes of unused harddrives |
| 23:55.42 | Lone_Wanderer | beandog: you want to sell them? |
| 23:55.45 | mindjuju | especially the kids stuff |
| 23:55.56 | beandog | Lone_Wanderer: nah. im gonna put it back together some day. |
| 23:56.00 | Lone_Wanderer | k |
| 23:56.15 | timinator | I'm out.... later guys |
| 23:56.16 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm looking for some high quality storage in the next month or so. |
| 23:56.20 | mindjuju | later timinator |
| 23:56.20 | Lone_Wanderer | later timinator |
| 23:56.26 | beandog | mindjuju: XBMC? |
| 23:56.31 | beandog | Is that as good as everyone raves? |
| 23:56.33 | mindjuju | xbox media center |
| 23:56.36 | mindjuju | it's better |
| 23:56.40 | beandog | hmm. |
| 23:56.42 | beandog | Ill buy yours. :) |
| 23:56.44 | mindjuju | cause look at this |
| 23:56.55 | mindjuju | i buy a used xbox on eBay for $110 including shipping |
| 23:57.01 | beandog | or if you wanna set one up for me, Ill pay you for that too |
| 23:57.05 | mindjuju | it plays all vids, mp3, pictures, etc perfectly |
| 23:57.06 | mindjuju | plus |
| 23:57.10 | mindjuju | i can still game on it |
| 23:57.14 | beandog | buh. |
| 23:57.24 | mindjuju | you can't get anything near the functionality for the price |
| 23:57.37 | mindjuju | even mediamvp costs 100 and is jump in video playback |
| 23:57.44 | mindjuju | never had a prob with xbmc |
| 23:57.50 | beandog | yah I had mediamvp for a bit |
| 23:57.53 | beandog | *awesome* idea |
| 23:57.58 | beandog | too bad it didnt work. |
| 23:57.59 | beandog | :C |
| 23:58.02 | beandog | well, work well enough. |
| 23:58.19 | Lone_Wanderer | is xbmc made by Microsoft? |
| 23:58.27 | beandog | no, I think its an OSS project |
| 23:59.52 | Lone_Wanderer | cool. how big is the HD on an xbox? |
