| 00:00.06 | Lone_Wanderer | Stringing things together one after another, piling hack upon hack, until the entire system collapses under it's own weight. |
| 00:00.11 | fungus | but he is young and ambitious. |
| 00:00.28 | macnewbold | he's going to try and do it in PHP right? At least give him that much of a hint... |
| 00:00.57 | fungus | Yeah, i'll probably be tutoring him a whole lot. |
| 00:01.25 | fungus | My boss thinks he'll save me time and have him do it, but he doesn't understand that I'll be the one holding his hand anyway. |
| 00:02.48 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@c-67-177-32-125.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 00:02.48 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 00:02.54 | macnewbold | yeah, and you could do it faster yourself :) |
| 00:03.13 | macnewbold | training new people always takes way longer than anyone in mgmt. ever wants to believe it will |
| 00:03.23 | fungus | yup |
| 00:03.40 | timinator | fo sho |
| 00:03.56 | macnewbold | generally our new guys here at CG are in "training" mode for their entire first project, usually about 160-180 work hours (2 months part time, 1 month full time) |
| 00:04.13 | macnewbold | that's their hours, not including the hours we spend working with them |
| 00:04.25 | macnewbold | and they are smart guys, too |
| 00:07.01 | Lone_Wanderer | Which CSS property, or whatever, makes something be right in the middle of the page horizontally? |
| 00:11.27 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: horizontal centering is done with things like <center>, align="center", text-align: center, and so forth |
| 00:11.47 | macnewbold | vertical centering is done with valign="middle" and vertical-align: middle |
| 00:13.13 | timinator | I'm out guys |
| 00:13.15 | timinator | later |
| 00:13.33 | macnewbold | bye tim |
| 00:13.35 | macnewbold | do |
| 00:13.36 | macnewbold | h |
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| 01:59.22 | Utah_Dave | ~seen herlo |
| 01:59.47 | jbot | herlo <n=herlo@class1-nat.gurulabs.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #ubuntu-utah, 1h 47m 56s ago, saying: 'http://ubuntustudio.com/'. |
| 01:59.53 | mindjuju | yeah, when was the last time he was around |
| 02:03.03 | macnewbold | ~rlart |
| 02:05.38 | macnewbold | doh |
| 02:05.40 | macnewbold | he's broken |
| 02:05.43 | macnewbold | ~rlart |
| 02:13.50 | mindjuju | sup mac |
| 02:14.05 | macnewbold | evenin |
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| 02:59.12 | *** join/#uphpu mwingle (n=mwingle@cpe-66-87-4-209.ut.sprintbbd.net) |
| 03:24.24 | Utah_Dave | mindjuju: do you ever go home early? |
| 03:40.53 | mindjuju | rolling out a new site, have employee training tomorrow |
| 03:41.36 | mindjuju | i'm taking off like prolly 1 1 / 2 around christmas |
| 03:42.17 | mindjuju | what about you, what are you up to? |
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| 03:43.11 | mindjuju | herlo |
| 03:43.12 | mindjuju | sup |
| 03:43.21 | mindjuju | utah_dave was looking for you |
| 03:49.22 | Utah_Dave | herlo: hey, did you get my email? I'm home now. Things ended earlier than I thought |
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| 04:49.51 | mindjuju | anybody around? |
| 05:08.37 | macnewbold | just me, mindjuju |
| 05:08.49 | macnewbold | had the power supply in our devel server blow up tonight |
| 05:09.03 | mindjuju | that sux |
| 05:09.05 | macnewbold | had to diagnose the burning smell, cross fingers/pray, pick up a new one, |
| 05:09.07 | mindjuju | did it take anything with it? |
| 05:09.10 | macnewbold | and put it back in and pray even harder |
| 05:09.13 | macnewbold | everything came back up |
| 05:09.21 | macnewbold | I was _extremely_ relieved |
| 05:09.32 | macnewbold | it was down for about 90 minutes in total |
| 05:10.01 | mindjuju | cool, a buddy one mine lost a hard drive when his power supply went out, something about how it was doing something erratic with the power |
| 05:10.05 | mindjuju | suxed to be him |
| 05:10.50 | *** join/#uphpu herl1 (n=herlo@71-219-19-242.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 05:11.02 | mindjuju | macnewbold, are all your pages based on 1 or 2 templates |
| 05:11.07 | mindjuju | like for a web site |
| 05:11.20 | mindjuju | or do you have several pages |
| 05:11.21 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v herlo] by ChanServ |
| 05:11.31 | mindjuju | hey herlo, did you see utah_dave message? |
| 05:11.40 | herlo | mindjuju: yeah |
| 05:11.49 | mindjuju | cool, just checking |
| 05:11.55 | herlo | mindjuju: thanx |
| 05:12.18 | macnewbold | yeah, my dad had his power supply go out once, and a capacitor inside it literally exploded, and instead of cutting the power off, it surged everything else in the box. Fried the mobo, cpu, and hard drive. the hard drive cost about $700 to recover, luckily half of which was paid by his employer, cause they had him doing company stuff at home a lot of the time |
| 05:12.23 | macnewbold | templates |
| 05:12.41 | macnewbold | I usually have one file (header.php) that everything includes, |
| 05:12.54 | mindjuju | i mean like design wise |
| 05:12.55 | macnewbold | and it knows the different ways it needs to handle things, say for home page and normal pages |
| 05:12.59 | macnewbold | design wise... |
| 05:13.00 | macnewbold | hm |
| 05:13.08 | mindjuju | you prolly don't mess with the header, but the general content area |
| 05:13.09 | macnewbold | generally home page might look somewhat different |
| 05:13.22 | mindjuju | right, but the internal page, maybe 1 or 2 variants |
| 05:13.27 | macnewbold | but yeah, we try to keep a consistent look/feel/navigation tec. on all the others |
| 05:13.34 | mindjuju | k |
| 05:20.45 | macnewbold | depending on the site, |
| 05:21.06 | macnewbold | it might have some pages (hopefully groups of pages, and only a few groups) that have different layouts in some degree |
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| 06:53.18 | herlo | mindjuju: Juno Reactor rocks |
| 06:54.12 | mindjuju | yup, right now listening to their remix of traci lords - fallen angel |
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| 15:37.20 | timinator | good morning guys |
| 15:49.15 | *** join/#uphpu bigdog_ut (n=bigdog@208.177.146.102.ptr.us.xo.net) |
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| 16:02.56 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf, you htere? |
| 16:03.18 | dataw0lf | yea |
| 16:03.55 | bigdog_ut | i was looking at ext3 faq and it says that it has a 4TB limit on 32bit cpu itself you know anything on that |
| 16:04.07 | bigdog_ut | http://batleth.sapienti-sat.org/projects/FAQs/ext3-faq.html |
| 16:04.24 | bigdog_ut | check question largest possible size |
| 16:04.30 | bigdog_ut | last sentence |
| 16:05.59 | bigdog_ut | im wondering if that is partition size or total partitions |
| 16:06.27 | dataw0lf | No, it has a limit of 16TBs |
| 16:06.31 | dataw0lf | it's based on the block size |
| 16:06.43 | *** join/#uphpu wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
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| 16:06.56 | bigdog_ut | why would they say ext3 supports only up to 4TB though |
| 16:07.15 | bigdog_ut | but blocksize is only 4k right...8k for alpha |
| 16:08.21 | dataw0lf | blocksize can be up to 4k on anything other than alpha architecture and some SPARC stuff |
| 16:08.31 | bigdog_ut | k |
| 16:08.33 | bigdog_ut | ty |
| 16:09.19 | dataw0lf | what they're saying is that ext3 imposes that limit |
| 16:09.30 | dataw0lf | but if you raise the block size, you should be fine. |
| 16:10.30 | dataw0lf | but 32 bit arch isn't the way to go with large files / filesystems, imho |
| 16:11.31 | dataw0lf | the reason why the blocksize isn't set by default to 4K is for obvious reasons; since a 'block' is the basic unit, if you have files smaller than 4k, they're going to take up 4k minimum |
| 16:13.06 | bigdog_ut | k |
| 16:14.44 | dataw0lf | dude, I'm shedding. |
| 16:23.46 | dataw0lf | you can always use XFS, too, y'know |
| 16:23.58 | beandog | if your UPS is good, that is. |
| 16:24.00 | dataw0lf | the only non ext3 file system on Linux that I'll advise |
| 16:24.27 | dataw0lf | well, you want your UPS to be good in any situation ;) |
| 16:24.50 | dataw0lf | not all filesystems can be thrown into the bottom of the ocean, dragged across hot lava, hit by a nuclear attack, and survive like ext3 |
| 16:25.35 | *** part/#uphpu wps (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
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| 16:26.58 | bigdog_ut | xfs is not supported in centos without me rebuilding the kernel |
| 16:28.05 | dataw0lf | oh |
| 16:28.09 | dataw0lf | CentOS |
| 16:28.31 | dataw0lf | you ever seen the Simpsons? |
| 16:28.33 | beandog | bigdog_ut: its not already compiled as a module? Thats weird. |
| 16:28.38 | bigdog_ut | nope |
| 16:28.42 | dataw0lf | there's this kid |
| 16:28.44 | dataw0lf | named Nelson |
| 16:28.46 | dataw0lf | and he goes |
| 16:28.49 | dataw0lf | ha ha! |
| 16:29.02 | dataw0lf | ;-0 |
| 16:29.12 | dataw0lf | dang shift key sticking |
| 16:33.55 | dataw0lf | I think a couple PAM modules are broken on this system |
| 16:37.39 | *** join/#uphpu cyco|w (n=cyco@66.114.120.2) |
| 16:38.06 | dataw0lf | sup cyco|w |
| 16:54.45 | *** join/#uphpu Black_Ch1os (n=admin@70-57-91-148.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 17:06.37 | *** join/#uphpu timinator_ (n=timinato@c-67-171-118-199.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
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| 17:10.27 | dataw0lf | the moto q is terrible |
| 17:11.02 | dataw0lf | I'd throw it out in the street but I'd get fined for littering... cuz it's TRASH! |
| 17:11.03 | dataw0lf | har har |
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| 17:13.16 | dataw0lf | morning mac |
| 17:21.00 | dataw0lf | http://www.impactguns.com/store/650350117073.html |
| 17:21.05 | dataw0lf | that's what I want for Christmas |
| 17:21.11 | dataw0lf | thnx bigdog_ut |
| 17:24.06 | timinator_ | I've been looking at the 17C: http://www.impactguns.com/store/glock17.html |
| 17:25.19 | dataw0lf | I like the 29 |
| 17:25.30 | dataw0lf | but I'm a sucker for .40 / 10mm sidearms |
| 17:27.46 | *** join/#uphpu Lone_Wanderer (n=chatzill@208-186-98-2.customer.csolutions.net) |
| 17:28.41 | Lone_Wanderer | morning all |
| 17:28.48 | dataw0lf | g'mornin |
| 17:35.28 | timinator_ | the 29 bounces around in my big hands |
| 17:35.49 | dataw0lf | I got tiny hands, it works perfectly for me. |
| 17:35.57 | timinator_ | but I do like the bang of the larger ammo |
| 17:36.04 | *** join/#uphpu swb (n=designsi@70.98.111.41) |
| 17:36.12 | timinator_ | morning swb |
| 17:36.15 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v swb] by ChanServ |
| 17:36.16 | dataw0lf | has best punch to accuracy ratio from all the handguns I've qualified on |
| 17:36.32 | timinator_ | nice |
| 17:36.40 | Lone_Wanderer | the 29 is, dataw0lf? |
| 17:36.52 | dataw0lf | glock 29, yea |
| 17:36.57 | Lone_Wanderer | cool |
| 17:37.01 | Lone_Wanderer | that means nothing to me :D |
| 17:37.33 | dataw0lf | as a pathfinder you get to choose the sidearm you want |
| 17:37.55 | dataw0lf | although primary weapons are limited to a slightly larger pool than rangers, unfortunately. |
| 17:38.11 | dataw0lf | no ak47s for us like SF and SEALs :\ |
| 17:38.38 | dataw0lf | Lone_Wanderer: the 29 is a 10mm subcompact handgun |
| 17:38.48 | dataw0lf | about 2 lbs or so fully loaded |
| 17:38.53 | macnewbold | g'day all |
| 17:39.16 | timinator_ | mornin mac |
| 17:39.24 | Lone_Wanderer | what does subcompact mean? |
| 17:39.32 | dataw0lf | and the 10mm doesn't have the same case failure problem as the .40 |
| 17:39.34 | dataw0lf | or at least not as bad |
| 17:39.36 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: "really small" |
| 17:40.04 | dataw0lf | http://www.impactguns.com/store/glock29.html |
| 17:40.29 | timinator_ | instead of my fav: http://www.impactguns.com/store/glock17.html |
| 17:42.18 | Lone_Wanderer | So is 2 pounds fully loaded considered light? |
| 17:45.07 | dataw0lf | lighter than the standard M-9 pistol |
| 17:45.18 | Lone_Wanderer | k |
| 17:46.38 | Lone_Wanderer | I can't decide if I love it (because it's amusing) or hate it (because it's stupid) when you say "I don't think the government should pass unconstitutional laws" and someone comes back with "Well what would you do if you were the president?" |
| 17:47.17 | timinator_ | LOL |
| 17:47.23 | dataw0lf | Wow. |
| 17:47.33 | timinator_ | hey guys. I've got a JS question... any objections?? |
| 17:47.50 | dataw0lf | Lone_Wanderer: you visit a psych ward... or a republican convention? |
| 17:47.50 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't mind any questions so long as they're not "What would you do if you were the president?" |
| 17:48.00 | dataw0lf | timinator_: of course not, shoot |
| 17:48.01 | Lone_Wanderer | Nah I'm talking to my brother via email. |
| 17:48.02 | timinator_ | LOL |
| 17:48.21 | timinator_ | okay, I've got a <select> menu for changing the URL w/ a page refresh |
| 17:48.38 | timinator_ | but now I've added an <option> for a pop-up window |
| 17:49.10 | timinator_ | but on the original window, it keeps that option selected after the pop-up has opened |
| 17:49.19 | Lone_Wanderer | So everything else changes the url except for that one option, which opens a popup? |
| 17:49.26 | timinator_ | yep |
| 17:49.49 | timinator_ | so, I'd like to have something that returns the <select> menu to it's original state |
| 17:49.52 | timinator_ | any ideas? |
| 17:50.06 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v timinator] by ChanServ |
| 17:50.11 | dataw0lf | and there's a page refresh? |
| 17:50.18 | timinator | no page refresh |
| 17:50.22 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm pretty sure you can set the select's state |
| 17:50.25 | macnewbold | timinator: your onchange will either cause a refresh to a different page, or trigger a popup? |
| 17:50.30 | macnewbold | that should work fine |
| 17:50.32 | timinator | yes |
| 17:50.38 | macnewbold | if it triggers a popup, it will stay where it is anyway |
| 17:50.58 | macnewbold | but you're saying you want to reset the menu when it pops up? |
| 17:51.04 | timinator | yes |
| 17:51.18 | wps | can someone remind me how to search recursively through directories for a string within a file? |
| 17:51.24 | wps | fgrep -r ? |
| 17:51.27 | Lone_Wanderer | grep -r ;) |
| 17:51.30 | dataw0lf | grep -r |
| 17:51.47 | Lone_Wanderer | grep -lR <string> * |
| 17:51.53 | Lone_Wanderer | the l will make it print only file names |
| 17:51.55 | dataw0lf | timinator: you could have an onload in the popup to change the select value back |
| 17:52.13 | wps | fgrep == grep ? |
| 17:52.23 | Lone_Wanderer | I've never heard of fgrep. |
| 17:52.23 | macnewbold | fgrep -r string filesandfiles |
| 17:52.30 | macnewbold | fgrep is a common alias for grep -F |
| 17:52.32 | timinator | but the popup doesn't have the <select> menu |
| 17:52.35 | macnewbold | egrep is grep -E |
| 17:52.39 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, ok |
| 17:52.40 | macnewbold | rgrep is sometimes grep -r |
| 17:52.51 | dataw0lf | timinator: refer back to the parent window |
| 17:52.51 | timinator | for example: the main window has something like this: |
| 17:53.21 | macnewbold | it would be easier to just put it in the select - right after triggering the popup, reset the menu |
| 17:53.39 | *** join/#uphpu jsmith (n=jsmith@199.227.185.35) |
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| 17:53.45 | wps | Lone_Wanderer: is your "lR" and "el"? |
| 17:53.55 | timinator | I'd rather have it part of the popup trigger.... |
| 17:54.00 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't understand the question |
| 17:54.04 | dataw0lf | wps: yes |
| 17:54.07 | timinator | because this page could be accessed in other ways |
| 17:54.09 | wps | the character that preceeds the R |
| 17:54.26 | wps | is it an "el," a "one," or a "pipe" |
| 17:54.28 | wps | :) |
| 17:54.30 | macnewbold | timinator: yes, you can make it part of the popup trigger: |
| 17:54.39 | macnewbold | window.open(...); resetMenu(); |
| 17:54.55 | timinator | nice, thanks mac |
| 17:55.33 | dataw0lf | wps: it's an "el" |
| 17:55.38 | wps | thanks |
| 17:56.10 | dataw0lf | -l just prints the filenames instead of all line occurences of the string |
| 17:56.34 | Lone_Wanderer | 0 2 01 * * - that's 2 am on the first of every month, right? |
| 17:56.36 | Lone_Wanderer | (cron) |
| 17:57.21 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: yeah, but usually 01 isn't used that I've seen |
| 17:57.32 | macnewbold | min hrs mday month wday user cmd |
| 17:58.54 | Lone_Wanderer | k |
| 17:59.27 | Lone_Wanderer | there we go :) |
| 18:00.59 | dataw0lf | one of the funniest hacks I've ever seen was on a Purdue network where they did a cron to run every minute an hour before new years, walling everyone on the server. |
| 18:01.18 | Lone_Wanderer | nice |
| 18:01.19 | dataw0lf | "30 Minutes til New Years... You Need To Get Out of Your Cave And Partaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay" |
| 18:01.22 | dataw0lf | or something along those lines |
| 18:01.26 | Lone_Wanderer | :) |
| 18:01.38 | dataw0lf | numerous geeks were angered |
| 18:01.44 | dataw0lf | but perhaps learned something about life |
| 18:02.19 | Lone_Wanderer | That reminds me of my idea for a dating site. |
| 18:02.34 | Lone_Wanderer | It only has one page, which is static. It says "Turn off your computer and go outside." |
| 18:02.42 | beandog | heh |
| 18:04.43 | timinator | lol |
| 18:10.13 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf, fyi ext3 does have a block device limit of 4tb |
| 18:13.16 | dataw0lf | it has a file size limit of 4tbs. |
| 18:13.27 | bigdog_ut | no block device limit of 4tb |
| 18:13.52 | bigdog_ut | on 32bit arch with 2.6.x kernel it will not work on a partition over 4tb |
| 18:15.25 | dataw0lf | are you reading docs from 2002 or something? |
| 18:15.39 | bigdog_ut | nope |
| 18:15.54 | dataw0lf | any current 2.6 kernel has been patched to remove the 4 tb limit |
| 18:16.15 | bigdog_ut | that is the kernel...but ext3 itself has the limit |
| 18:17.41 | bigdog_ut | on 64bit arch i dont think you have that limit but the 16tb |
| 18:17.51 | bigdog_ut | it seems to be only on the 32bit |
| 18:19.14 | bigdog_ut | also might be for back compatibility with ext2 |
| 18:19.55 | dataw0lf | http://lwn.net/Articles/186754/ |
| 18:21.33 | beandog | Just wait for ext4 :) |
| 18:22.55 | dataw0lf | go buy me that shotgun, bigdog |
| 18:23.02 | dataw0lf | it's much more important than your filesystem woes |
| 18:28.02 | timinator | :) |
| 18:29.10 | dataw0lf | holy crikey: 78 GBs of logs on this server. |
| 18:29.21 | dataw0lf | *cough* log rotation *cough* |
| 18:30.52 | dataw0lf | I didn't know the Euro I had dropped in value so much |
| 18:31.03 | dataw0lf | that's awesome |
| 18:32.41 | bigdog_ut | +1 dataw0lf |
| 18:32.45 | bigdog_ut | ^5 |
| 18:33.06 | dataw0lf | ^5 |
| 18:33.08 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 18:33.11 | dataw0lf | for what? my sarcasm? |
| 18:33.13 | bigdog_ut | had to convert to gpt frist |
| 18:33.35 | dataw0lf | ah |
| 18:33.42 | Lone_Wanderer | The Euro I? Is that like the Euro, only with a capital i after it? |
| 18:33.55 | bigdog_ut | and fdisk no worky on it...parted was the key |
| 18:34.14 | dataw0lf | Lone_Wanderer: sorry, in my haste to be a smart arse, I added that I. |
| 18:34.19 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh ok |
| 18:34.38 | dataw0lf | I was totally planning on going back to Europe next year too. Drats. |
| 18:34.40 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm missing the smartassery there but whatever. |
| 18:34.51 | dataw0lf | the euro is worth alot more than the dollar |
| 18:34.59 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, okay |
| 18:35.09 | dataw0lf | I think it actually hit an all time high a couple days ago. |
| 18:35.10 | Lone_Wanderer | how much more these days? |
| 18:35.12 | Lone_Wanderer | ohhh |
| 18:35.17 | Lone_Wanderer | oh well |
| 18:35.18 | dataw0lf | like, 1 dollar to .75 euro |
| 18:35.35 | Lone_Wanderer | still better than sterling innit? |
| 18:36.05 | dataw0lf | yea, I think. |
| 18:36.18 | dataw0lf | unless the brits have gone through an economy collapse in the past year |
| 18:36.43 | Lone_Wanderer | Not that I've heard of from my friends over there. |
| 18:37.00 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, the easy part's done. Now for the javascript. |
| 18:37.01 | dataw0lf | yea, it's rather doubtful. |
| 18:39.11 | dataw0lf | look how ex military I look in this pic: http://www.acid.org/images/pilgrimage04/20040917/images/pgm04a-dataw0lf_and_callahan-x768.png that was like two months after I left Iraq. |
| 18:40.24 | Lone_Wanderer | *movie guy voice* His eyes stare wildly into the distance - eyes that have seen more than you will ever know... |
| 18:41.48 | dataw0lf | you can see my mouth twitching to go into it's patented smirk if you look closely |
| 18:42.02 | Lone_Wanderer | You do have quite the distinctive smirk. |
| 18:42.23 | Lone_Wanderer | You don't stay cleanshaven while you're out in the field, or whatever you call it, do you? |
| 18:42.33 | dataw0lf | pfft, no. |
| 18:42.46 | Lone_Wanderer | Somehow I can't imagine soldiers taking time in the morning to lather up. |
| 18:43.10 | dataw0lf | I think I may be making fun of Gentoo in that picture... |
| 18:43.16 | dataw0lf | Lone_Wanderer: you'd be surprised |
| 18:44.26 | beandog | macnewbold: ping |
| 19:01.49 | macnewbold | pong |
| 19:01.51 | macnewbold | hehe |
| 19:01.59 | macnewbold | already got the /msg |
| 19:08.33 | *** join/#uphpu fungus (n=fungus@firebat.aros.net) |
| 19:08.33 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o fungus] by ChanServ |
| 19:11.04 | dataw0lf | http://a332.g.akamai.net/f/332/936/12h/www.edmunds.com//pictures/VEHICLE/2007/Volkswagen/20100573-E.jpg |
| 19:11.56 | Lone_Wanderer | http://gracewanderer.livejournal.com/99849.html |
| 19:12.09 | Lone_Wanderer | That's an entry asking for help with the politics thing I mentioned earlier. |
| 19:13.34 | dataw0lf | this is a standard argument from Bush supporters. They avoid the issue and insinuate that you're 1) anti troops, 2) anti american, 3) anti democracy, or 4) all of the above |
| 19:14.06 | Lone_Wanderer | Yeah. |
| 19:14.12 | Lone_Wanderer | Ad hominem + non sequitur. |
| 19:14.25 | dataw0lf | which, I tell you what, when they use that against me, I usually reach for a baseball bat with an american flag wrapped around it. |
| 19:14.52 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't think beating my brother senseless would help. |
| 19:15.04 | dataw0lf | it makes you feel better, though! |
| 19:15.08 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm sure it would :) |
| 19:15.19 | Lone_Wanderer | I think *you* should beat him senseless. |
| 19:15.31 | dataw0lf | my nominal fee is 20 dollars. |
| 19:15.42 | Lone_Wanderer | "Hi, I'm a veteran who served in Iraq and Afghanistan both." BAM! |
| 19:15.52 | Lone_Wanderer | Well he's in Minnesota. So I'd have to fly you out there and put you up. |
| 19:16.12 | Lone_Wanderer | http://reddit.com/info/t9iw/comments/ct9j8?context=5 if you're a redditer |
| 19:16.59 | dataw0lf | nah. |
| 19:18.23 | dataw0lf | just tell him to go to Iraq if he wants to help Americans. Or support raising taxes. Or at least have his elected official vote for armoring vehicles and soldiers. |
| 19:18.52 | dataw0lf | supporting torture of prisoners is a waste of time, and usually has the exact opposite effect that he suspects it does. |
| 19:18.57 | fungus | That is just lame, begging for comments on reddit. |
| 19:19.18 | Lone_Wanderer | Actually I asked them to comment on Reddit rather than on my LJ. |
| 19:20.10 | fungus | oh that's you? uh... sorry. |
| 19:20.32 | dataw0lf | fungus you're such an arse. |
| 19:20.36 | Lone_Wanderer | lol it's cool |
| 19:20.55 | Lone_Wanderer | I just figured the redditors would be happy to help someone out in an argument like this. |
| 19:22.56 | fungus | He is answering your statement with a completely unrelated, emotionally charged question. |
| 19:23.22 | Lone_Wanderer | I know. |
| 19:23.45 | dataw0lf | http://www.alertnet.org/thenews/newsdesk/N30222160.htm |
| 19:23.47 | dataw0lf | pfft |
| 19:24.08 | dataw0lf | American hackers have been staving off terrorist attacks for years |
| 19:24.14 | Lone_Wanderer | We cannot allow a financial cyber attack gap!!! |
| 19:24.50 | fungus | You don't go around breaking the Geneva convention, destroying years of civilized thought, go against the WWJD thought (which he claims to believe in) just because you are pissed that americans died. |
| 19:25.05 | Lone_Wanderer | "Who Would Jesus Torture?" |
| 19:25.25 | dataw0lf | fungus: yea, most physical torture is inspired by emotions of retribution, rather than any sort of intelligence gathering. |
| 19:25.39 | fungus | Exactly |
| 19:25.53 | dataw0lf | it's pretty ridiculous, because if you're being water boarded, you're going to give faulty intelligence that we're going to waste resources on. |
| 19:26.05 | dataw0lf | I mean, and that's just the pragmatic view. |
| 19:26.12 | fungus | That and I don't think it is worth sinking our morals into the shithole to get some shoddy intelligence anyway. |
| 19:26.23 | dataw0lf | so, from pretty much every view, people who SUPPORT terrorist torture are anti american. |
| 19:26.23 | Lone_Wanderer | I already linked him to the letter from the CIA that talks about that. |
| 19:26.26 | Lone_Wanderer | I don't think he read it. |
| 19:26.43 | fungus | s/shithole/garbage/ |
| 19:27.06 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm tempted to ask if his views are so fragile that he can't handle considering alternate points of view |
| 19:27.12 | Lone_Wanderer | but I'm trying not to insult him |
| 19:27.51 | fungus | He's your brother. who else can you insult if it isn't your bro? |
| 19:28.00 | Lone_Wanderer | Well, I don't mind insulting him |
| 19:28.05 | Lone_Wanderer | but doing so in a debate is not good form |
| 19:28.36 | fungus | Ahh, true, but he already ended the "debate" when he brought up unrelated emotionally charged crap. |
| 19:28.55 | *** join/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@c-67-177-32-125.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 19:28.55 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o Utah_Dave] by ChanServ |
| 19:29.08 | dataw0lf | yea, best way to win against ad hominem attacks are to respond in such a way. |
| 19:29.10 | dataw0lf | there, I said it |
| 19:29.15 | dataw0lf | everyone knows I'm the best at it. |
| 19:29.21 | Lone_Wanderer | lol |
| 19:29.36 | dataw0lf | just invoke Godwin's Law and get it over with |
| 19:29.57 | Lone_Wanderer | I'm tempted to. |
| 19:30.49 | dataw0lf | you can even go with the Reductio ad Hitlerum offense. |
| 19:30.57 | dataw0lf | "Y'know, Hitler supported torture." |
| 19:31.21 | Lone_Wanderer | rofl, I've never heard it called that |
| 19:31.43 | dataw0lf | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductio_ad_Hitlerum |
| 19:32.56 | dataw0lf | who doesn't love fallacies more than Bush supporters? |
| 19:34.37 | Lone_Wanderer | Is asking the question he posed any specific fallacy? |
| 19:35.59 | dataw0lf | sure. it's deceiving, erroneous, and illogical. |
| 19:38.11 | Lone_Wanderer | But that will do as well. |
| 19:38.44 | dataw0lf | the whole point of free speech is for intelligent political discourse. Since 9/11, they've really been trying to destroy that. Because if anyone subjectively looks at their policies, the fail to stand up to any sort of reason. |
| 19:38.56 | dataw0lf | s/the/they |
| 19:41.48 | dataw0lf | err, jeez, s/subjective/objective |
| 19:42.01 | Lone_Wanderer | was waiting for that one ;) |
| 19:42.23 | *** join/#uphpu wps_ (n=wps@67.108.236.230.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 19:43.06 | dataw0lf | they're just forcing people into a 'Good German' position, which, obviously, is inherently wrong. |
| 19:43.19 | dataw0lf | there's your intelligent, yet Godwin Law meeting, response. |
| 19:45.25 | wps_ | pet peeve of the day: |
| 19:45.35 | wps_ | people who sent you an instant message to let you know that they sent you an email |
| 19:45.48 | dataw0lf | rol |
| 19:46.40 | dataw0lf | at least they didn't call, too |
| 19:50.06 | macnewbold | haha |
| 19:50.10 | macnewbold | or page your cell phone |
| 19:50.25 | jsmith | wps_: This is a quick note in IRC to tell you I left you a voice message about the email I just sent you |
| 19:50.37 | wps_ | thanks, man |
| 19:50.41 | jsmith | Anytime |
| 19:59.27 | *** part/#uphpu dataw0lf (n=user@64.173.193.1) |
| 20:11.32 | *** part/#uphpu Utah_Dave (n=boucha@c-67-177-32-125.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 20:17.56 | wps_ | pet peeve of the hour: |
| 20:18.13 | wps_ | when people use the phrase "…if you will…" to conclude every other sentence |
| 20:19.32 | wps_ | he is not a good presentor |
| 20:19.34 | wps_ | he is scary |
| 20:19.48 | fungus | pet peeve of the hour: |
| 20:19.53 | fungus | EQSE News |
| 20:19.55 | fungus | Do any real stock investors take hints from mass spam? |
| 20:20.31 | wps_ | he sounds like a sports news caster… not a leader of a computer company |
| 20:20.54 | fungus | It's the subject of spam touting the latest penny stock of the day. |
| 20:21.30 | fungus | Oh, monkey boy. |
| 20:21.42 | fungus | yeah, I don't care enough about windows to watch. |
| 20:21.44 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic_ (n=_psychic@71.32.228.156) |
| 20:21.44 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v _psychic_] by ChanServ |
| 20:21.51 | fungus | but monkey boy can be funny sometimes. |
| 20:21.53 | wps_ | actually, I take that back… |
| 20:21.58 | wps_ | not a sports caster |
| 20:23.17 | wps_ | a charismatic preacher or the leader of an MLM |
| 20:23.29 | fungus | lol |
| 20:24.17 | fungus | or an evangelical preacher talking about his MLM |
| 20:24.19 | wps_ | I wouldn't buy an OS from him, but he about has me sold on a 1983 Ford Taurus |
| 20:26.03 | wps_ | does anyone know what Ballmer did before he was at Microsoft? |
| 20:27.15 | fungus | :wq |
| 20:27.19 | fungus | nope. |
| 20:28.09 | beandog | I thought he helped start it |
| 20:28.21 | _psychic_ | he was at Ford |
| 20:28.28 | wps_ | ha ha ha |
| 20:28.31 | wps_ | you're kidding!!!! |
| 20:28.38 | _psychic_ | oops no |
| 20:28.44 | wps_ | oh |
| 20:28.49 | _psychic_ | P&G |
| 20:28.51 | wps_ | dang, I about spit with the irony |
| 20:28.52 | beandog | Its been a good while |
| 20:28.58 | _psychic_ | Proctor and Gamble |
| 20:29.22 | fungus | wikipedia says he was a manager at Ford too |
| 20:29.32 | _psychic_ | that was his dad |
| 20:29.35 | fungus | ~wikipedia Ballmer |
| 20:29.39 | _psychic_ | "his father worked as a manager at Ford Motor Company." |
| 20:29.44 | fungus | oh yeah, duh. |
| 20:39.08 | Lone_Wanderer | Can I access a tr's td's individually through the DOM/JS/whatever? |
| 20:53.45 | herlo | ~wikipedia "Linus Torvalds" |
| 20:54.01 | herlo | ~wikipedia Torvalds |
| 20:59.51 | Lone_Wanderer | ~ajax |
| 21:00.01 | jbot | [ajax] Asynchronous JavaScript + XML |
| 21:00.09 | Lone_Wanderer | Meh. That does not help me find a tutorial. |
| 21:00.23 | Lone_Wanderer | We need jbot to have a ~tutorial function, where people can post links to tutorials for various things. |
| 21:00.37 | Lone_Wanderer | So I could say ~tutorial ajax and he'd spit out links to tutorials that others have found helpful |
| 21:07.54 | Lone_Wanderer | How stupid is it to generate js with php? |
| 21:08.56 | timinator | why is that stupid? |
| 21:09.09 | timinator | I've got PHP functions that are called that need JS |
| 21:09.57 | timinator | like a PHP function that builds an HTML form.... and it builds the JS to do innerHTML to make the form easier to use |
| 21:10.15 | timinator | s/innerHTML/innerHTML replace/ |
| 21:37.06 | Lone_Wanderer | ok 'cause I want to make an ajax class that will request things off of whatever server is being hit at the time |
| 21:37.20 | Lone_Wanderer | which I can get with $_SERVER['whatever'] |
| 21:38.37 | timinator | OH, my mistake.... I perceived your question to be rhetorical. |
| 21:38.55 | Lone_Wanderer | nope |
| 21:39.01 | Lone_Wanderer | you changing your answer now? ;) |
| 21:39.15 | timinator | no.... but no longer on the defensive |
| 21:39.25 | Lone_Wanderer | k |
| 21:40.26 | timinator | I think it makes total since to have some JS that is used globally, and JS that given as needed |
| 21:41.40 | timinator | just make sure none of the functions are using the same name.... |
| 21:41.50 | timinator | many of mine that I need for a 1 time deal, I will use a naming covention that matches the app/module/script that needs it |
| 21:42.44 | timinator | my $0.02 |
| 21:42.47 | timinator | :) |
| 21:53.29 | timinator | can anyone get to everydns.net??? |
| 21:53.43 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 21:54.59 | Lone_Wanderer | Don't make me revoke your ? privilege! |
| 21:55.04 | Lone_Wanderer | !!!!!11!@one |
| 21:55.21 | Lone_Wanderer | And it doesn't appear that I can, no. |
| 21:55.25 | beandog | timinator: doesnt look like it. |
| 21:55.26 | beandog | :T |
| 21:55.33 | beandog | I wonder if they are getting DDOS'd |
| 21:55.39 | beandog | My DNS servers were yesterday. |
| 21:55.41 | beandog | It was kinda poopy. |
| 21:56.21 | Lone_Wanderer | My sister's kid had a "poop explosion" today. |
| 21:56.48 | timinator | I hate those "poop explosion" diapers |
| 21:57.10 | Lone_Wanderer | "No don't m... DON'T MOVE! You need to hold still. Just lay down." |
| 21:57.32 | Lone_Wanderer | Every poop explosion reminds me of how desperately I need to find an apartment in SLC. |
| 21:58.30 | timinator | in SLC? why's that? |
| 21:58.54 | Lone_Wanderer | 'cause I work up here now |
| 21:59.16 | timinator | ah |
| 21:59.33 | Lone_Wanderer | and I live(d) in Orem (an hour's drive away) previously/currently |
| 22:00.58 | timinator | hey guys |
| 22:00.58 | timinator | is there another service similar to everyDNS? |
| 22:00.58 | timinator | that I could setup my URLs to point to everyDNS first, then another service second, and another third |
| 22:01.13 | timinator | then if one got hit, it'd simply roll over |
| 22:02.41 | beandog | timinator: hmm, dunno, if you find one ping me |
| 22:03.03 | beandog | well I can hit them now |
| 22:03.07 | timinator | will do |
| 22:04.19 | timinator | I still can't |
| 22:04.24 | timinator | (hit them) |
| 22:05.56 | timinator | anyone tried: http://www.zoneedit.com/ |
| 22:06.59 | *** join/#uphpu Black_Chaos (n=admin@70-57-91-148.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 22:10.49 | timinator | this looks a bit better. Anyone tried these guys: http://freedns.afraid.org |
| 22:13.30 | Lone_Wanderer | For which I deserve a cookie. |
| 22:15.16 | Lone_Wanderer | Ugh, this book recommends using js to validate form input. |
| 22:15.31 | timinator | that's silly |
| 22:15.53 | Lone_Wanderer | I guess there's nothing wrong with it specifically, as long as you're validating it on the server side. |
| 22:16.21 | timinator | true, as long as your validating on the server side |
| 22:16.42 | timinator | (but why do things twice??) |
| 22:18.13 | Lone_Wanderer | ahh, I think I found it |
| 22:18.54 | Lone_Wanderer | onChange="somefunction(this.value)" on a select box will pass the value of the selected element to somefunction, correct? |
| 22:20.45 | timinator | I think so |
| 22:43.23 | bigdog_ut | somethings are nice to validate on the frontend though before you send it to the backend for validation |
| 22:46.07 | Lone_Wanderer | Crimony, man. There's got to be a better way to perform ajax requests than this. |
| 22:55.44 | wps | can someone ping the site for me? |
| 22:55.47 | wps | http://uphpu.org |
| 22:56.49 | herlo | wps: uphpu.org. 3600 IN A 216.194.124.132 |
| 22:56.57 | herlo | result of a dig uphpu.org command |
| 22:57.10 | herlo | but the website is taking it's sweet time coming up |
| 22:57.25 | herlo | website fails |
| 22:58.20 | swb | ping returns "Ping request could not find host uphpu.org. Please check the name and try again." |
| 22:59.30 | fungus | Page loads fine from a Sprint based network. Fails from a MCI/Verizon based network. |
| 23:01.03 | wps | weird |
| 23:01.05 | fungus | Hrm, DNS issues. |
| 23:01.15 | fungus | I have seen DNS issues quite a bit today. |
| 23:02.54 | macnewbold | Lone_Wanderer: in your onchange, no, it wont. For a select box, you want something like this.options[this.selectedIndex].value |
| 23:03.14 | macnewbold | the select box itself has a selected index, while the values belong to the options, one of which is selected usually |
| 23:05.00 | Lone_Wanderer | So I need to look up <select> in my book and see what all the names of the.... things... for it are |
| 23:05.01 | fungus | wps: there is a post on NANOG confirming that EveryDNS.net is down from a DoS attack. |
| 23:05.04 | macnewbold | oh, and wps: the server looks slow to me too, on XM's network, or rather, DNS is going really slow for it |
| 23:05.18 | wps | dang… that sucks |
| 23:05.24 | macnewbold | fungus: the attack appears to be working... |
| 23:05.34 | wps | what king of hose-head kills a non-for-profit? |
| 23:05.58 | *** join/#uphpu Black_Ch1os (n=admin@70-57-91-148.slkc.qwest.net) |
| 23:05.59 | macnewbold | is uphpu registered through a registrar that provides free DNS? |
| 23:06.01 | fungus | They are probably aiming for someone else. |
| 23:06.07 | fungus | It's called collateral damage. |
| 23:06.17 | wps | it is |
| 23:06.18 | macnewbold | herlo: serious about what? |
| 23:06.29 | herlo | macnewbold: fungus: the attack appears to be working... |
| 23:06.32 | macnewbold | I'm always serious... |
| 23:06.40 | herlo | macnewbold: except when you're not |
| 23:06.45 | Lone_Wanderer | DEADLY serious |
| 23:06.47 | macnewbold | well, yeah |
| 23:06.57 | macnewbold | no, dataw0lf is the deadly one |
| 23:07.01 | macnewbold | ~seen dataw0lf |
| 23:07.12 | jbot | dataw0lf <n=user@64.173.193.1> was last seen on IRC in channel #uphpu, 3h 20m 32s ago, saying: 'at least they didn't call, too'. |
| 23:07.54 | *** join/#uphpu ssdd (n=ssdd@166.70.209.108) |
| 23:08.37 | ssdd | anyone having problems with everydns.net? |
| 23:08.45 | fungus | lol |
| 23:08.46 | fungus | yup |
| 23:08.47 | beandog | yah we were just talking about that |
| 23:08.54 | ssdd | ah |
| 23:08.59 | ssdd | good not just me |
| 23:09.01 | fungus | Not just them either. |
| 23:09.08 | ssdd | really |
| 23:09.09 | fungus | Got problems with public-dns.net too |
| 23:09.18 | ssdd | strange |
| 23:09.28 | ssdd | major backbone down? |
| 23:09.33 | ssdd | a name server? |
| 23:09.57 | beandog | ddos, Im guessing. |
| 23:10.19 | Lone_Wanderer | this.selectedIndex.value? |
| 23:10.40 | ssdd | this.value |
| 23:10.54 | Lone_Wanderer | macnewbold says that won't work |
| 23:11.16 | ssdd | this.options[this.selectedIndex].value? |
| 23:11.46 | ssdd | lol |
| 23:11.46 | fungus | When I said it worked from Sprint networks, that was only because the DNS record was cached. |
| 23:11.56 | ssdd | ah |
| 23:12.08 | Lone_Wanderer | actually I'll just write a test page that does it several ways |
| 23:13.51 | olds | nice.... http://muffinresearch.co.uk/archives/2006/11/28/domtool/ |
| 23:14.01 | ssdd | document.formname.selectname.options[document.formname.selectname.selectedIndex].value |
| 23:14.07 | wps | I wonder how long before everydns can get things back up |
| 23:14.47 | olds | yea did the uphpu.org website go down? |
| 23:14.53 | wps | for some |
| 23:15.04 | wps | depends on which backbone you're behind |
| 23:15.07 | Lone_Wanderer | this.value works in both FF and IE 6 |
| 23:15.41 | olds | ssdd: watcha trying to do? |
| 23:15.50 | ssdd | not me |
| 23:15.55 | ssdd | Lone_Wander |
| 23:16.03 | olds | oh |
| 23:16.22 | olds | Lone_Wanderer: watcha trying to do? |
| 23:16.28 | fungus | depends on the caching strategies of your dns server. |
| 23:16.45 | fungus | OpenDNS still returns results for uphpu.org |
| 23:16.50 | ssdd | Lone_Wanderer: it will probably work in Safari too |
| 23:16.52 | olds | irssi + Terminal on OS X == funky |
| 23:24.15 | bigdog_ut | im going to have some pics of my new toys |
| 23:45.02 | bigdog_ut | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:45.34 | jbot | mindjuju is currently on #uphpu (1d 2h 50s). Has said a total of 24 messages. Is idling for 16h 51m 22s, last said: 'yup, right now listening to their remix of traci lords - fallen angel'. |
| 23:59.08 | bigdog_ut | check out all http://venticon.com/gallery |
| 23:59.34 | bigdog_ut | my new toys |
