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| 12:29.02 | drip | good mornin' on everyone |
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| 14:40.13 | bigdog_ut | mornin |
| 14:40.44 | Utah_Dave | morning |
| 14:41.18 | macnewbold | g'day |
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| 14:47.46 | mindjuju | morning |
| 14:48.20 | timinator | good morning |
| 14:51.04 | timinator | anybody know the average bitrate for a DVD? |
| 14:51.25 | mindjuju | bigdog_ut might know |
| 14:51.38 | timinator | ~wake bigdog_ut |
| 14:51.39 | jbot | ACTION throws a barrel-full of ice water on bigdog_ut and shouts "GOOD MORNING!!!!" |
| 14:51.54 | timinator | ~coffee bigdog_ut |
| 14:51.55 | jbot | ACTION steals some of cyco|w's special coffee and gives it to bigdog_ut on a silver platter. |
| 14:52.53 | bigdog_ut | not sure....depends on what format you have the dvd in |
| 14:53.12 | timinator | I have the DVD.... |
| 14:53.22 | timinator | am converting to MP4 |
| 14:53.30 | timinator | to throw on a CD |
| 14:53.40 | timinator | (it's 8 minutes long) |
| 14:54.17 | timinator | but I usually use 1000 for normal DVDs because it creates a file around 1 Gig |
| 14:54.32 | timinator | approximately |
| 14:54.39 | timinator | but that's dumbed down |
| 14:55.48 | mindjuju | bummer, i thought Gspot might say, but it doesn't |
| 14:55.55 | bigdog_ut | here is a calc i use for bitrate http://www.videohelp.com/calc.htm |
| 14:58.43 | timinator | thanks bigdog_ut |
| 14:58.54 | bigdog_ut | np |
| 14:59.03 | bigdog_ut | what are you trying to calculate? |
| 15:00.02 | timinator | what the normal bitrate is for the DVD |
| 15:00.21 | timinator | so that I don't bump or pull down the quality of the video |
| 15:04.38 | bigdog_ut | http://www.videohelp.com/dvd check out video file comparison section |
| 15:07.36 | timinator | I see |
| 15:07.53 | timinator | so the bitrate is probably different for each DVD |
| 15:08.06 | timinator | they just scale the vid down to fit, huh? |
| 15:09.49 | timinator | oh |
| 15:10.07 | timinator | 720x480 at ~5000 kbps |
| 15:10.09 | timinator | cool |
| 15:10.10 | timinator | thanks |
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| 15:19.39 | bigdog_ut | np |
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| 16:44.23 | bigdog_ut | synic, where do you live at? |
| 16:44.39 | synic | murray |
| 16:44.43 | bigdog_ut | oh |
| 16:45.03 | bigdog_ut | where do you work again? |
| 16:45.28 | synic | sendoutcards on 3300s |
| 16:45.31 | bigdog_ut | with like tierra and some other guys like com4? |
| 16:45.43 | synic | com4, xilch |
| 16:45.44 | tierra | not me |
| 16:46.03 | bigdog_ut | oh |
| 16:46.54 | bigdog_ut | synic, are u the one that wrote jbother? |
| 16:47.13 | synic | yeah |
| 16:48.35 | bigdog_ut | ok |
| 16:48.40 | bigdog_ut | just trying to remember |
| 16:51.22 | timinator | anyone within 10-15 minutes of Ogden? |
| 16:52.35 | timinator | I'm out here in the middle of nowhere... and the closest guy is bigdog_ut, and he get's cranky sometimes |
| 16:52.39 | timinator | jk bigdog |
| 16:53.18 | bigdog_ut | im the only one here for you |
| 16:53.33 | timinator | heavy sigh |
| 16:53.36 | timinator | :) |
| 17:02.20 | xilch|w | timinator: com4 lives up in the o-town |
| 17:02.53 | timinator | :) |
| 17:06.03 | timinator | live in Ogden, work in Murray?!?! That's one pain of a commute, huh? |
| 17:13.49 | xilch|w | he loves it |
| 17:13.49 | xilch|w | don't you com4? |
| 17:18.04 | tierra | yeah, he has mental problems... |
| 17:18.14 | tierra | hehe |
| 17:19.34 | macnewbold | at least he doesn't have a girly name |
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| 17:30.26 | wps | #2 all time pet peeve: people who use vacation notices for email |
| 17:30.36 | synic | what's #1? |
| 17:30.42 | wps | #1 all time pet peeve: people who use vacation notices for email accounts that they are subscribed to mailing lists with |
| 17:30.57 | synic | hah, yeah, that's the worst. |
| 17:33.04 | tierra | can anyone point out anything wrong with this RewriteRule? |
| 17:33.12 | tierra | RewriteRule ^community/.*$ /support/technicalSupport.php [R=301,NC,L] |
| 17:33.59 | tierra | I have others right above it that work fine and look like this: |
| 17:34.06 | tierra | RewriteRule ^support/faqs\.(htm|php)$ /support/technicalSupport.php [R=301,NC,L] |
| 17:37.16 | macnewbold | wps: if the vacation notice only goes to the sender, that's not so bad. When it goes to the whole list, that's terrible. The other thing that's annoying are the ones that send it for _every_ message, rather than once per sender during their entire trip. |
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| 17:59.18 | timinator_ | what is it earth devil? |
| 17:59.42 | tierra | it doesn't like my RewriteRules |
| 18:02.39 | macnewbold | what do you expect for $2.99/month :) |
| 18:03.13 | tierra | I still just find this weird that I can get all my other new rules working fine, but not this one |
| 18:03.27 | timinator_ | mac: LOL |
| 18:03.28 | macnewbold | apache error logs have any clues? |
| 18:03.39 | tierra | heh, if I had error logs... |
| 18:04.04 | macnewbold | ah, yes, they'd help for sure |
| 18:04.25 | tierra | even if I did actually, I doubt they'd tell me anything as it just doesn't redirect (so the rule probably just doesn't match) |
| 18:14.17 | macnewbold | so what is it supposed to match, and what does the rule currently say? |
| 18:21.33 | tierra | I posted it before fungus joined |
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| 18:23.20 | tierra | I've been using derivatives of "^community/(.*)$", "^community/.*$", and "(.*)"/".*" in the directory itself |
| 18:23.29 | tierra | none of them are working |
| 18:23.43 | fungus | apache error logs are almost useless in tshooting rewrite problems. |
| 18:23.52 | fungus | you might want to turn on the rewrite logging |
| 18:24.20 | tierra | well, as I mentioned, it's on GoDaddy hosting, so I don't have access to error logs |
| 18:24.32 | tierra | nor could I turn on rewrite logging |
| 18:24.57 | bigdog_ut | how are you turning on rewrite it the first place? |
| 18:24.58 | fungus | oh yeah, crap. |
| 18:25.11 | tierra | "RewriteEngine on" ;) |
| 18:25.13 | _psychic_ | hehe |
| 18:25.19 | fungus | RewriteLog must be set in the server or virtual host config |
| 18:25.23 | tierra | like I mentioned, other rules I've written work |
| 18:25.28 | tierra | just that one doesn't |
| 18:25.32 | bigdog_ut | yeah then you can add debuggin then |
| 18:26.02 | tierra | I can't tell if it's just because I'm trying to use ".*" or not (it's the only rule that uses it) |
| 18:26.03 | bigdog_ut | RewriteLogLevel 3 |
| 18:26.15 | bigdog_ut | RewriteLog "/path" |
| 18:26.58 | bigdog_ut | that should show you how it is matching the regex |
| 18:27.31 | fungus | bigdog_ut: he is on godaddy, and those directives are only allowed in the server or virtual host configs which he has no access too |
| 18:28.32 | tierra | yeah, that's not working |
| 18:29.25 | tierra | I need a new stage server for dev work |
| 18:30.51 | bigdog_ut | that sucks they dont let you have access to that |
| 18:32.21 | fungus | If each virtual host had their own error and rewrite logs it would use up a whole lotta filehandles really quick, and cause many problems as they grow. |
| 18:32.36 | fungus | This is why shared hosting kinda sucks |
| 18:33.15 | tierra | yeah, I've seen vhost CustomLogs get out of hand :( |
| 18:33.17 | tierra | heh |
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| 18:38.35 | mindjuju | wow, Ogden is really far up there |
| 18:39.02 | timinator_ | :) |
| 18:39.15 | mindjuju | i wonder if there is a middle ground somewhere with good Eats? |
| 18:39.30 | mindjuju | next friday is geek lunch |
| 18:39.36 | timinator_ | where would the middle be for you mindjuju? |
| 18:39.46 | mindjuju | i'm in draper |
| 18:40.01 | timinator_ | For the next 4 weeks I'm over swamped... |
| 18:40.06 | timinator_ | we're releasing a new company |
| 18:40.17 | timinator_ | and I'm in the thick of it |
| 18:40.27 | mindjuju | sounds like fun |
| 18:40.30 | timinator_ | but after that, I'd love to set something up |
| 18:40.34 | timinator_ | yes |
| 18:41.22 | timinator_ | draper is really far down there |
| 18:41.42 | mindjuju | nah, i think it's more that Ogden is so far up there |
| 18:41.48 | mindjuju | :) |
| 18:41.51 | timinator_ | :) |
| 18:42.52 | timinator_ | in a month (or 2 w/ Christmas), we should do a geek lunch in Bountiful or the very north edge of Salt Lake |
| 18:43.19 | mindjuju | bigdog_ut, fungus, macnewbold, utah_dave, wps, _psychic_, burnin, diskotec|w , drip, eco, herlo, jnbek, synic, tierra, watermouse, xilch|w, com4, cyco|w -- Geek Lunch is next friday, any suggestions on a place with good eats? |
| 18:43.27 | timinator_ | that appears to be halfway |
| 18:43.43 | mindjuju | that's what i was thinking, timinator_ , bountiful |
| 18:43.50 | _psychic_ | mindjuju: Utah County :) |
| 18:43.54 | *** mode/#UPHPU [+v timinator] by ChanServ |
| 18:44.28 | mindjuju | which place in Utah county? |
| 18:52.52 | mindjuju | i wonder if week could have our lunch at Octavio's in American Fork, the eats there are REALLY very good. It's a bit south, but an idea. Any other ideas of your favorite eateries, let me know. as always, i'm looking for a place right in the middle so everybody can come. |
| 18:56.41 | mindjuju | macnewbold |
| 19:01.40 | drip | i know bigdog_ut is all up for the mcd's |
| 19:02.26 | timinator | sounds like a cheap date |
| 19:02.52 | drip | lol |
| 19:02.56 | timinator | lol |
| 19:05.47 | drip | in fact.. he's probably there now. |
| 19:05.52 | timinator | LOL |
| 19:06.02 | drip | and left at 11:15 |
| 19:06.11 | drip | =P |
| 19:23.52 | macnewbold | mindjuju: I'm here, sup |
| 19:26.06 | mindjuju | hey, was going to see how nov 3rd for geek lunch was going to do for you? |
| 19:26.14 | mindjuju | i think that is a month from the last one we had |
| 19:27.01 | macnewbold | sounds possible so far |
| 19:27.31 | macnewbold | might be iffy to get all the way down south though - it ends up meaning my lunch hour is 2-2.5 hrs, but I can probably get away with it once a month |
| 19:27.57 | mindjuju | cool, sent an email to the list to see what restaurants get nominated |
| 19:28.55 | mindjuju | as far as going way south or way north, i was thinking we should try to have most in the center, though the occassional to bountiful or am fork so that everybody has at least the opportunity |
| 19:28.57 | mindjuju | just an idea |
| 19:32.23 | synic | I nominate Koko's Kitchen |
| 19:33.29 | Utah_Dave | how about eating at Thanksgiving Point? there's some good food there. |
| 19:34.08 | mindjuju | there are some good eats in there. took the wife in for the Saturday Brunch -- fantabulous |
| 19:34.26 | synic | I wouldn't mind driving out there |
| 19:36.06 | mindjuju | wow! koko's kitchen has 5 stars by everybody that reviewed it |
| 19:36.47 | synic | they have some really good food there |
| 19:36.55 | synic | if you're into the Japanese food... |
| 19:37.05 | mindjuju | Japanese food would be fun. let's see, 702 s, 300 east so central slc |
| 19:37.31 | mindjuju | well, we've eaten Chinese, and Indian thus far. I've had Japanese cuisine in China and it was good |
| 19:38.00 | synic | I must've missed out on the Chinese... where did you go? |
| 19:38.24 | mindjuju | it was first evar geek lunch |
| 19:38.26 | mindjuju | http://uphpu.org/2006/09/26/geek-lunch-friday-29-september/ |
| 19:38.36 | mindjuju | well, uphpu geek lunch that is |
| 19:38.45 | synic | oh crap, it was just up the street from us |
| 19:38.46 | synic | :( |
| 19:39.29 | mindjuju | sorry bout that, i'll work with wade to get these on the calendar so everybody knows a week or two in advance |
| 19:40.48 | mindjuju | wait a minute, that can't be the right date |
| 19:41.14 | mindjuju | cause when we went to the restaurant, dataw0lf was there |
| 19:42.37 | mindjuju | that sept date was the last one at the Indian restaurant |
| 19:44.41 | macnewbold | I've done koko's before - not bad at all |
| 19:52.06 | herlo | Geek Lunch again!! Damn It!!! I can't go again, stupid travel jobs...!!! |
| 19:52.33 | mindjuju | where you going to be this time? |
| 19:52.45 | herlo | San Francisco |
| 19:53.08 | herlo | I mean, that's nice and all, but I'd like to be home at least once in a while...;) |
| 19:53.10 | mindjuju | oh man! San Fran! i've always wanted to go to Fisherman's wharf |
| 19:53.24 | herlo | well, it'll be my first time... |
| 19:53.42 | mindjuju | dude, that's freakin' cool |
| 19:55.56 | tierra | whoa, when did UPHPU.org migrate to a new CMS? |
| 19:56.11 | tierra | P.S. Wordpress sucks |
| 19:56.38 | tierra | heh, though it is about on the same level as Geeklog imo |
| 19:57.03 | tierra | at least there isn't as much bloat |
| 19:57.05 | _psychic_ | wordpress isn't that great, but its probably better than most |
| 19:58.27 | Utah_Dave | Fisherman's Wharf is cool. There are a lot of cool things to do in San Francisco |
| 19:58.33 | mindjuju | tierra, you got any nominations for where to eat? |
| 19:58.51 | mindjuju | what bout you, _psychic_ ? |
| 19:59.03 | tierra | not really, I'm not too familiar with places in SLC |
| 19:59.21 | mindjuju | where you at? |
| 19:59.22 | _psychic_ | Not sure I can come yet |
| 19:59.30 | synic | navaho hogan is good. |
| 19:59.34 | _psychic_ | I'd second the Thai Chili suggestion on the list, though |
| 19:59.36 | _psychic_ | good eats |
| 19:59.47 | tierra | I live in Sandy, but only typically go out to eat at work in Bountiful |
| 20:01.01 | mindjuju | that's cool! be thinking of a place in Bountiful, tierra, cause we do want to have one there for the ogden boys to come down to |
| 20:01.11 | tierra | if it were up to me, I might just suggest some good La Frontera mexican |
| 20:01.29 | fungus | There is a great Vegan/Vegetarian place downtown called Sage's Cafe. |
| 20:02.20 | mindjuju | i'm native texan, fungus. I'll be disowned by the Great State of Texas if I eat a meal without meat |
| 20:02.27 | tierra | there's this italian place we just found here in Bountiful actually that's really good, called Robertinos I think |
| 20:02.28 | _psychic_ | here here |
| 20:02.45 | _psychic_ | tucanos lunch |
| 20:02.50 | _psychic_ | is pretty good |
| 20:03.04 | fungus | tierra: it is called Robintino's, and yes it is good. |
| 20:03.29 | tierra | thanks, yeah |
| 20:03.31 | fungus | It is just a few blocks east of the Dragon Diner |
| 20:04.22 | macnewbold | yeah, robintinos is good to |
| 20:04.23 | tierra | I heard the Tepanyaki here in Bountiful closed, burned down or something |
| 20:04.38 | tierra | haven't been up that way in a long time though |
| 20:04.38 | macnewbold | I've tried sage's too |
| 20:04.57 | macnewbold | they have a portobello/soy-"cheez" philly cheesesteak if you want, mindjuju |
| 20:05.02 | mindjuju | there is a tepanyaki in am fork |
| 20:05.14 | bigdog_ut | and in layton |
| 20:05.19 | macnewbold | and in lehi |
| 20:05.37 | mindjuju | oh wait, that's the one i was thinking of macnewbold, the one in lehi |
| 20:05.50 | mindjuju | i drive so fast going south that everything blurs |
| 20:07.26 | mindjuju | k, here are the nominations thus far |
| 20:07.27 | mindjuju | _psychic_thai chili |
| 20:07.28 | mindjuju | _psychic_tucanos |
| 20:07.28 | mindjuju | fungussage's café |
| 20:07.28 | mindjuju | synickoko's kitchen |
| 20:07.28 | mindjuju | synicnavaho hogan |
| 20:07.29 | mindjuju | tierrala frontera |
| 20:07.31 | mindjuju | tierrarobintion |
| 20:07.33 | mindjuju | tierratepanyaki |
| 20:07.35 | mindjuju | utah_davethanksgiving point |
| 20:08.23 | tierra | we should just get a full list together, then pick like 3 at random, and put up a poll or something |
| 20:11.11 | mindjuju | we could do that. let me collect the responses from email and i'll put together the whole list |
| 20:11.57 | Utah_Dave | herlo: ci 1.5 should be coming out this week. I'm going to start coding against that version |
| 20:19.58 | tierra | hmm... so I setup a stage server, have it runnning almost all the same versions of everything, and the RewriteRules all work perfectly... :/ |
| 20:20.31 | tierra | definately feels like a GoDaddy issue |
| 20:26.49 | drip | only problem w/ tepanyaki is they are not open for lunch |
| 20:27.04 | drip | at least not the one in layton. |
| 20:35.19 | tierra | I assume it's talking about his proposed changes for GPLv3? |
| 20:36.10 | fungus | They eventually get to that, but pad the article with so many inaccuracies and biases to try to promote their opinion. |
| 20:36.35 | tierra | yeah, looks extremely bias |
| 20:37.01 | fungus | Bias I can deal with, but flat out LIES! |
| 20:39.18 | mindjuju | i'm still reading the article, but am unfamiliar with stallman, which statements weren't accurate? |
| 20:40.37 | fungus | Too many to count. Here is an example. |
| 20:40.41 | fungus | "Richard M. Stallman is a 53-year-old anticorporate crusader who has argued for 20 years that most software should be free of charge." |
| 20:41.09 | fungus | The FSF is *not* about free of charge. It is about Freedom to use the software. |
| 20:47.59 | _psychic_ | the GPL is rather limiting somtimes though. I think its ironic that they overuse the term "free" when the GPL forces things. |
| 20:49.03 | fungus | I agree the GPL isn't the best license for everything |
| 20:49.34 | fungus | The GPLv3 is completely optional, any developer can continue to use the GPLv2 if they so wish. |
| 20:50.05 | _psychic_ | sure sure, but the first F in FSF should be asterisked |
| 20:50.12 | fungus | Also, that article fails to mention, that RMS and his followers wrote most of the operating system. Linux is just a kernel. |
| 20:50.27 | mindjuju | actually, they do mention that |
| 20:50.52 | mindjuju | Stallman and his allies hacked away for nearly a decade but couldn't get GNU to work. In 1991 Torvalds, then an unknown college kid in Finland, produced in six months what Stallman's team had failed to build in years--a working "kernel" for an operating system. Torvalds posted this tiny 230-kilobyte file containing 10,000 lines of code to a public server, dubbing it "Linux" and inviting anyone to use it. |
| 20:51.32 | fungus | Right, but that doesn't say, that Linux is only the last small part of the OS, that they couldn't hack together. |
| 20:51.50 | fungus | In any Linux OS, there is more GNU than there is Linux. |
| 20:55.44 | mindjuju | well, that's true, they don't come out and say that, but towards the end, it is implied enough that I did get that sentament |
| 20:55.45 | mindjuju | "Red Hat gets a lot of code from people who don't work for Red Hat. They would have to replace all that and do the work in-house," says Larry W. McVoy, chief executive of software developer Bitmover and a longtime Torvalds collaborator. Even then, however, Stallman and his loyalists may carry on developing their own v3 versions. This "forking" of multiple incompatible versions could lead to "Balkanization" and derail Linux, the T |
| 20:55.56 | timinator | Utah_Dave: I love Fisherman's Warf |
| 20:57.40 | timinator | my wife got a pearl from an oyster and had it set in a ring right there from one of the vendors on the dock |
| 20:57.55 | timinator | and we ate seafood from a street vendor |
| 20:58.06 | timinator | it was great |
| 20:59.32 | fungus | I agree that the incompatibilities between v2 and v3 could create problems and forking, just as Linus warns. I do not agree with the article that the new GPLv3 is meant to be incompatible, and meant to fork the the open source community. |
| 21:00.18 | mindjuju | so are you saying that despite the articles comments, that industry is not fearful of the GPLv3? |
| 21:02.41 | *** join/#uphpu _psychic__ (n=_psychic@65.103.232.203) |
| 21:03.04 | timinator | how is Linux raking in $15 billion in annual sales???? |
| 21:03.07 | timinator | it's free |
| 21:03.14 | mindjuju | support contracts |
| 21:03.26 | mindjuju | you don't get the modules for redhat unless you pay |
| 21:03.28 | fungus | CD sales, books, etc |
| 21:04.53 | timinator | so it's redhat specifically? not all of the linux orgs/companies? |
| 21:05.02 | fungus | mindjuju: I am saying that the article is total FUD. It's tagline "Software radical Richard Stallman helped build the Linux revolution. Now he threatens to tear it apart." is total crap. RMS *never* threatened or does he intend to tear it apart. |
| 21:05.08 | mindjuju | others charge money too |
| 21:05.36 | fungus | RedHat is just one example because it is most prevalent. |
| 21:05.38 | synic | timinator: it says hardware sales |
| 21:06.11 | mindjuju | k, i can see that the article has a slant and is not partial -- as to the point that they foster, however, are you saying that despite the articles comments, that industry is not fearful of the GPLv3? |
| 21:06.46 | fungus | And judging by the spirit of the article, filled with bias, generalization, and lies, it is probably including sales of anything with the word Linux on it, any embedded hardware that runs linux, etc. |
| 21:07.24 | mindjuju | wow, your really mad about this article! |
| 21:07.39 | fungus | Oh yes, I haven't been this mad in a long time. |
| 21:08.13 | mindjuju | well, in that case, wikipedia may need to be corrected because with comments like this, it does lead one to believe that he is for free as in money software |
| 21:08.14 | mindjuju | When Brian Reid in 1979 placed "time bombs" in Scribe to restrict unlicensed access to the software, Stallman proclaimed that "the prospect of charging money for software was a crime against humanity."[5] |
| 21:09.18 | fungus | They took this argument between the Torvalds and RMS camps, added in a few truths, a whole lot of lies, mixed it with total FUD, and call it journalism. |
| 21:09.42 | mindjuju | yeah, but now your just commenting on the article and leaving my questions unanswered |
| 21:10.12 | mindjuju | question 1 being - are you saying that despite the articles comments, that industry is not fearful of the GPLv3? |
| 21:10.19 | fungus | Ok, your question refers to the "industry", the "industry" is not unified so I cannot answer. |
| 21:11.09 | mindjuju | question 2 - it appears he is for free as in money software |
| 21:11.10 | mindjuju | k, how bout "industry" as the article defines it |
| 21:11.10 | fungus | Q2: http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/selling.html |
| 21:11.28 | fungus | the article doesn't define the "industry" |
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| 21:11.52 | mindjuju | uno momento por favor |
| 21:12.39 | fungus | If they mean the Linus Torvalds camp is the industry, then Yes. the "industry" is fearful of the GPLv3. |
| 21:12.53 | mindjuju | k, the link was broken for IE, not sure about FF |
| 21:12.53 | mindjuju | but here is a link to the resource |
| 21:12.53 | mindjuju | http://www.forbes.com/2006/10/12/biz-biztech_cz_dl_1030forbes_104_slide.html?boxes=custom&thisSpeed=20000 |
| 21:12.57 | mindjuju | listing people who are likely to be hurt |
| 21:13.07 | fungus | However this definition of "industry" is totally inaccurate. |
| 21:14.08 | mindjuju | are you saying that despite the articles comments, the industries as identified by the following URL http://www.forbes.com/2006/10/12/biz-biztech_cz_dl_1030forbes_104_slide.html?boxes=custom&thisSpeed=20000 are not fearful of the GPLv3? |
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| 21:15.04 | fungus | They included IBM in that URL, but IBM did *not* comment! |
| 21:15.40 | mindjuju | not that was quoted in this article, i believe your right, didn't see one |
| 21:16.38 | mindjuju | i can confirm heavy editorial slant in the article about stallman, but FUD about GPLv3 -- the article has some points i think i'll have to investigate |
| 21:16.46 | fungus | All of their taglines on the companies mentioned didn't have any facts that these companies are actually fearful. |
| 21:17.27 | mindjuju | in my opinion, your stretching to completely discredit |
| 21:17.57 | mindjuju | i guess we'll have to see if forbes runs a retraction in fear of libel suits by those they alleged were fearful of GPLv3 |
| 21:18.17 | fungus | The entire point of the article is to allege that RMS is intending to tear apart the Linux ommunity. That is total BS |
| 21:18.20 | mindjuju | though the article did bring up valid questions that would lead one to believe that they were fearful |
| 21:21.34 | mindjuju | so fungus, just a question. who would benefit most by a forbes FUD on stallman and GPLv3? |
| 21:22.00 | fungus | Microsoft |
| 21:22.22 | fungus | It scares companies away from using Linux, because they think it might fail. |
| 21:22.53 | fungus | The other options for them are BSD, proprietary UNIX, or Windows. |
| 21:22.58 | mindjuju | so this is proMicrosoft / antiLinux FUD, k, let me reread this with that in mind |
| 21:23.47 | fungus | I don't think it is specifically pro Microsoft, but generally anti-Free Software, hence anti-Linux. |
| 21:24.16 | mindjuju | and now to prove that i'm not closed minded to your arguements, here is this article that seems to confirm what your saying though stallman here is antiRIAA and antiMPAA |
| 21:24.17 | mindjuju | http://www.forbes.com/2006/03/21/linux-stallman-gnu_cx_dl_0321stallman1.html?partner=rss |
| 21:24.32 | mindjuju | again, a forbes article |
| 21:29.03 | fungus | They lied on this questions. "A lot of movie production companies use GPLv3-licensed software programs in "render farms."". |
| 21:29.17 | fungus | There is no GPLv3-licensed software as of yet. |
| 21:29.48 | fungus | Too bad RMS didn't berate them for that, unless they reworded the question for print. |
| 21:31.02 | mindjuju | now this quote from Stallman is really curious and speaks back to the fearful industries point |
| 21:31.05 | mindjuju | I can't speak for other people in the community. I have met people who are tremendously attached to the popularity of the GNU/Linux system, and I think that is a mistake--freedom and community are more important than the success of the system I launched. |
| 21:31.29 | mindjuju | which connects to the point on page 1 of the interview where he says it is the moral obligation to create a collision course |
| 21:32.24 | fungus | I think his Anti-DRM idea is pretty good in theory, but could create more problems than it is worth. |
| 21:32.43 | mindjuju | from what i have read thus far, industries betting on some version of Linux didn't bargin for a collision course |
| 21:33.05 | fungus | Note his answer to the last question on page 1. It completely refutes the original article I mentioned. |
| 21:33.14 | synic | heh, this server has 29912 fonts on it :o |
| 21:34.42 | mindjuju | yeah, that was the portion that caused me to send you to this new article |
| 21:34.48 | mindjuju | aka - keeping an open mind |
| 21:35.42 | fungus | I like this interview article. This is good journalism. |
| 21:35.52 | fungus | They seem to keep his words intact, and complete. |
| 21:37.43 | mindjuju | well, i'm going to bookmark these resources and get to them tonight during dinner, better get back to work |
| 21:38.39 | tierra | this is so stupid, why would GoDaddy not support using ".*" in mod_rewrite rules? |
| 21:38.59 | fungus | They don't? that is really strange. |
| 21:38.59 | tierra | I don't even know how you would turn that off in Apache |
| 21:39.47 | tierra | I've used all sorts of other syntax that works fine except using that... ie: using "\.(htm|php)$" works fine... |
| 21:40.16 | tierra | it's something to do with using .* |
| 21:40.45 | tierra | I can redirect if I just specify a specific filename |
| 22:03.30 | tierra | ok, so I can't even use character classes either... |
| 22:03.54 | tierra | [A-Za-z0-9_/]* doesn't work |
| 22:04.03 | tierra | (but does on my stage server) |
| 22:18.41 | macnewbold | tierra: an alternative to mod rewrite is to use a PHP script as your ErrorDocument and do the necessary setup there before calling the real script |
| 22:18.53 | macnewbold | not quite the same, but just as powerful |
| 22:19.14 | tierra | not a bad idea, thanks macnewbold |
| 22:19.40 | macnewbold | we use it quite often |
| 22:19.49 | macnewbold | apache can be a beautiful thing |
| 22:23.10 | mindjuju | bummer, i missed john digweed's set today! |
| 22:24.46 | _psychic_ | anyone know of a rich text editor that works on safari? |
| 22:25.33 | wps | what do you mean by works on Safari? |
| 22:26.24 | _psychic_ | um |
| 22:26.26 | _psychic_ | it doesn't break |
| 22:26.31 | _psychic_ | ? |
| 22:26.45 | mindjuju | i've used this one |
| 22:26.46 | mindjuju | http://www.kevinroth.com/rte/ |
| 22:26.53 | wps | a plug in or something? |
| 22:27.07 | _psychic_ | I'm talking stuff like tinyMCE or FCKEditor |
| 22:27.11 | macnewbold | ah |
| 22:27.14 | macnewbold | don't those work? |
| 22:27.19 | _psychic_ | neither |
| 22:27.30 | macnewbold | seriously? we've never had problems on safari with them |
| 22:27.35 | macnewbold | haven't used tinyMCE I think, |
| 22:27.40 | macnewbold | but FCKE we've used |
| 22:28.14 | macnewbold | hang on, it may not work on safari after all |
| 22:28.20 | mindjuju | _psychic_ , kevin roths' supports all of these |
| 22:28.21 | mindjuju | IE5.5+/Mozilla 1.3+/Firefox 0.6.1+/Netscape 7.1+/Mac Safari 1.3+/Opera 9+, or any other browser that fully supports designMode() for rich-text features. All other browsers will display a standard textarea box instead. |
| 22:28.24 | macnewbold | we used it without me knowing that it didn't do safari :) |
| 22:28.31 | _psychic_ | mindjuju: yeah - that one is looking pretty good |
| 22:28.38 | _psychic_ | macnewbold: whoops :) |
| 22:29.20 | _psychic_ | mindjuju: did you have to pay the $50? |
| 22:29.42 | mindjuju | i actually got last year before he started charging |
| 22:29.47 | mindjuju | just noticed the "donation" |
| 22:30.06 | _psychic_ | i don't mind paying |
| 22:30.10 | _psychic_ | I just need something that works |
| 22:30.18 | wps | I still don't understand what it is/you're looking for |
| 22:30.33 | _psychic_ | google up tinyMCE |
| 22:30.34 | _psychic_ | or FCKeditor |
| 22:30.49 | mindjuju | rich text editor - it's a web page that has a module that allows you to write text and apply markup |
| 22:31.07 | mindjuju | RTE's look like a word processing program like MS Word or whatever |
| 22:31.23 | _psychic_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:31.26 | wps | ah, so it's module you can load into a web page to allow the user to edit text |
| 22:31.38 | _psychic_ | wps: http://www.kevinroth.com/rte/demo.htm |
| 22:31.39 | _psychic_ | try it |
| 22:31.44 | mindjuju | yes, and apply HTML markup easily |
| 22:32.02 | wps | not to be nit-picky, but wouldn't MS Word also be an RTE? |
| 22:32.10 | macnewbold | it can edit Rich Text Format, |
| 22:32.15 | macnewbold | but it isn't embeddable |
| 22:32.17 | _psychic_ | maybe if I asked this in #msword |
| 22:32.20 | macnewbold | and doesn't work very well |
| 22:32.21 | wps | doesn't it need a designation, such as an in-browser-RTE? |
| 22:32.40 | wps | (just justifying my confusion) |
| 22:32.42 | _psychic_ | do desktop application questions get asked in here? ;) |
| 22:32.45 | macnewbold | given the channel, many of us would assume that, but you're right |
| 22:32.52 | wps | good point, _psychic_ :) |
| 22:32.56 | macnewbold | one mention of safari was enough for me |
| 22:32.59 | wps | sorry |
| 22:33.02 | macnewbold | hehe |
| 22:33.05 | macnewbold | no worries |
| 22:33.10 | _psychic_ | :) |
| 22:33.15 | wps | well, I thought that he was looking for something write text in… not provide a tool for others to write text in |
| 22:33.17 | macnewbold | s/no worries/no worries, Mr. Sexy Pants/ |
| 22:33.38 | _psychic_ | mindjuju: looks like it has some sort of auto fallback |
| 22:35.17 | mindjuju | auto fallback? |
| 22:35.28 | _psychic_ | in firefox, I have like 15 buttons |
| 22:35.32 | _psychic_ | in safari, I have 9 |
| 22:35.35 | _psychic_ | or whatever |
| 22:35.50 | mindjuju | oh gotcha, it degrades gracefully |
| 22:36.05 | mindjuju | yeah, never tested it on safari, just remembered that it was safari friendly |
| 22:40.39 | mindjuju | yipes! i missed by misspelling the name |
| 22:42.10 | _psychic_ | I yield, sir. |
| 22:42.30 | mindjuju | i've still got to rebuild those attacks that i made for you |
| 22:42.42 | mindjuju | i've sadly lost the comments though i'm sure i have them in history |
| 22:42.52 | mindjuju | something like the 1000 burrito breath |
| 22:42.55 | _psychic_ | the burrito and ... yeah |
| 22:43.02 | _psychic_ | that was synic, I think |
| 22:43.03 | mindjuju | oh wait, yours was the black hole though, right? |
| 22:43.08 | _psychic_ | mine was the black h..... yeah |
| 22:43.09 | _psychic_ | :) |
| 22:44.40 | mindjuju | i should make one of the randomized attacks bring in Stephen Hawkins for some major astrophysics butt kicking |
| 22:44.56 | _psychic_ | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:45.31 | mindjuju | honesty, i still get a little confused with string theory though i've researched it several times |
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| 22:57.21 | herlo | mindjuju: saw that on /. today. It's a bunch of bunk |
| 22:57.35 | herlo | mindjuju: the RMS article |
| 22:57.38 | herlo | was scrolling up |
| 22:57.46 | mindjuju | oh, was a little confused |
| 22:58.07 | mindjuju | yeah, didn't really know stallman so it's all news to me |
| 22:59.21 | mindjuju | though, truth told, i'm always very cautious about what i read and did notice the editorializations so wouldn't have given it much credence, but like i mentioned, left with a couple of questions about who is affected and what may have been the motivation for the article |
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| 23:03.57 | herlo | mindjuju: I mean the GPLv3 probably won't even become anything until people like Linus and a few others put their blessing on it, and right now they aren't |
| 23:04.11 | mindjuju | ah |
| 23:04.35 | mindjuju | so your saying people will still continue to code in GPLv2 ? |
| 23:04.40 | macnewbold | yes |
| 23:04.47 | herlo | that's my opinion |
| 23:04.51 | mindjuju | that's cool |
| 23:05.00 | macnewbold | the way GPLv3 is, there's a lot of people who aren't likely to ever approve of it |
| 23:05.04 | mindjuju | hadn't been able to research if a person had a choice |
| 23:05.26 | macnewbold | there are two places people have a choice: |
| 23:05.28 | herlo | mindjuju: sure they do, it's just a version... like using ff2.0 v ff1.5 |
| 23:05.35 | macnewbold | you can license your code under either version, |
| 23:05.43 | herlo | macnewbold: or both |
| 23:05.47 | herlo | ;) |
| 23:05.51 | herlo | but they aren't compatible |
| 23:06.01 | macnewbold | and a user can use GPLv2 licensed code under the v2 or the v3 rules |
| 23:06.29 | herlo | right |
| 23:06.30 | macnewbold | cause the v2 rules say (paraphrased) "this license or any future version of this license" |
| 23:06.42 | macnewbold | herlo: remind me how they're not compatible |
| 23:07.14 | herlo | macnewbold: can't remember off-hand, read somewhere in an editorial by one of the techzines the reasons why |
| 23:07.20 | herlo | macnewbold: I'll try to find it... |
| 23:07.46 | mindjuju | well, if you aren't constrained to use the latest version, then fungus is right, lots of FUD |
| 23:08.34 | herlo | macnewbold: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License#GPLv3 |
| 23:08.45 | herlo | GPLv2 is right above it... |
| 23:08.46 | macnewbold | you are constrained to use the latest version if it is licensed under GPLv3 |
| 23:09.00 | herlo | macnewbold: right, and it makes is not backward compatible. |
| 23:09.01 | tierra | macnewbold: excellent suggestion, it worked out well |
| 23:09.06 | macnewbold | you can't use a v3 project under the v2 rules |
| 23:09.10 | tierra | (on the PHP redirections) |
| 23:09.12 | macnewbold | tierra: awesome! glad to hear it |
| 23:09.45 | tierra | wrote up my own little mod_rewrite function that just uses the Location header, it's slightly limited, but works |
| 23:10.22 | herlo | here's the diff betwen v2 and v3 http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?story=20060118155841115 |
| 23:17.27 | herlo | section 14 of the license clearly states that it is forward compatible |
| 23:17.31 | herlo | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:17.53 | herlo | I wonder if that's because it's the diff between v2 and the 1st draft of v3 |