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| 04:58.12 | Utah_Dave | has the mail list been down? |
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| 14:55.56 | wps | 3 RSVPs for tomorrow's meeting |
| 15:00.35 | wps | :) |
| 15:01.20 | dataw0lf|w | aw, that sucks. |
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| 15:20.34 | macnewbold | morning, all |
| 15:20.46 | *** topic/#uphpu by macnewbold -> Meeting Tomorrow, 7pm | BBQ coming soon! | check out #phlyte | Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org |
| 15:21.04 | dataw0lf|w | morning mac |
| 15:21.11 | wps | good morning |
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| 15:42.17 | greygnome | ~wake * |
| 15:42.18 | jbot | *: GOOD MORNING!!! |
| 15:46.39 | wps | ~greygnome |
| 15:47.03 | wps | jbot, greygnome is the channel rooster |
| 15:47.04 | jbot | wps: okay |
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| 15:49.31 | greygnome | heh |
| 15:49.39 | greygnome | s/heh/hehe |
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| 16:13.28 | dataw0lf|w | anyone have any idea why a box would half way boot up windows, then give an inaccessible device error. when a windows cd is thrown in, it doesn't see any of the drives? it's reading the mbr, obviously (trying to boot up) |
| 16:15.43 | bigdog_ut | do you have it set to read the write area to boot up... |
| 16:15.49 | bigdog_ut | it needs the location of the windows crap |
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| 16:30.47 | dataw0lf|w | bigdog_ut: where's that at? |
| 16:31.00 | bigdog_ut | there is a boot.ini file i think |
| 16:31.10 | bigdog_ut | there is a command that you can run that helps modify the file |
| 16:31.15 | bigdog_ut | bootcfg or something |
| 16:34.00 | dataw0lf|w | yeah, can't get to the recovery console though |
| 16:35.36 | bigdog_ut | lol...can you boot with just a recovery fd |
| 16:36.48 | dataw0lf|w | screw dat, I'm going in with da knoppix |
| 16:37.40 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 16:39.27 | dataw0lf|w | ok, so I got another hard drive with linux, it wouldn't boot with that either |
| 16:39.33 | dataw0lf|w | I can mount it in knoppix |
| 16:44.33 | bigdog_ut | yes both drives...win and linux |
| 16:44.53 | bigdog_ut | as long as you can see the drives in the bios you are fine |
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| 17:33.10 | jm_ul|w | scratched win cd? |
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| 18:12.46 | *** topic/#uphpu is Meeting Tomorrow, 7pm | BBQ coming soon! | check out #phlyte | Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org |
| 18:37.25 | *** join/#uphpu toxs (~toxs@166.70.209.69) |
| 18:39.38 | toxs | anyone know much about LDAP? |
| 18:43.16 | dataw0lf|w | yes. |
| 18:43.54 | dataw0lf|w | insofar as running OpenLDAP and authentication via it, never done any PHP integration. |
| 18:45.11 | toxs | just had the thought of using it for the address book for our clients |
| 18:45.39 | toxs | don't know how much data it can handle |
| 18:46.01 | dataw0lf|w | for an address book, I'd just use SQL, but that's me. |
| 18:46.07 | mindjuju | concur |
| 18:46.31 | mindjuju | especially if your going to setup it up just for address book |
| 18:46.41 | dataw0lf|w | agreed, |
| 18:46.46 | dataw0lf|w | s/,/. |
| 18:47.08 | mindjuju | datawolf! we agree on something! absolutely amazing! |
| 18:47.13 | mindjuju | :) |
| 18:47.14 | toxs | wow |
| 18:47.25 | toxs | glad I could bring you two together |
| 18:47.47 | mindjuju | ah! i was just kidding, we agree on some points of the social contract and civil duty |
| 18:47.53 | toxs | I was just thinking that most email clients can use LDAP as well |
| 18:48.17 | toxs | that way I don't have to worry about import or export junk |
| 18:48.35 | dataw0lf|w | mindjuju: :) |
| 18:48.38 | dataw0lf|w | toxs: ah. |
| 18:49.10 | dataw0lf|w | probably be about same work / difficulty either way. |
| 18:49.12 | toxs | and squirrelmail works with LDAP |
| 18:49.48 | toxs | don't know if it would be wise to use LDAP with 250,000+ records or not? |
| 18:51.02 | dataw0lf|w | I'd like to say that LDAP can't scale that well, but I have no experience in the matter. |
| 18:51.41 | toxs | I was worried about the same thing |
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| 19:01.01 | bigdog_ut | toxs, ldap can |
| 19:01.14 | bigdog_ut | i have 1 server with 1.5 million users |
| 19:01.30 | toxs | cool |
| 19:01.41 | bigdog_ut | that means each user has 7-15 records |
| 19:01.48 | bigdog_ut | so you can see it does alot |
| 19:01.56 | bigdog_ut | i use ibm ldap servers and oracle ldap servers |
| 19:02.03 | toxs | good idea or bad idea for a multi user address ? |
| 19:02.23 | bigdog_ut | what do you mean by multi user address? |
| 19:02.24 | toxs | book? |
| 19:02.26 | mindjuju | yeah, what are your thoughts on using LDAP for address book (the initial question) |
| 19:02.38 | bigdog_ut | i support it 100% |
| 19:02.41 | bigdog_ut | best thing for it |
| 19:02.59 | toxs | cool |
| 19:03.01 | bigdog_ut | ldap can scale like no other and has been around for so long |
| 19:03.06 | bigdog_ut | i use ldap for all that stuff |
| 19:03.14 | bigdog_ut | also use ldap for web objects too |
| 19:03.15 | toxs | ever user openldap? |
| 19:03.21 | bigdog_ut | yeah |
| 19:03.22 | toxs | s/user/used |
| 19:03.32 | bigdog_ut | it is great too |
| 19:03.33 | toxs | good/ |
| 19:03.37 | toxs | ? |
| 19:03.58 | bigdog_ut | i have not used it with that many people personally but there are user out there that have tons |
| 19:04.11 | bigdog_ut | great for a hetero env |
| 19:04.22 | bigdog_ut | ldap auth is really killer |
| 19:04.56 | toxs | great |
| 19:05.04 | bigdog_ut | i have used it with php and various other apps too |
| 19:05.10 | dataw0lf|w | yeah, I use ldap auth in a hetero environment, but not at that size. |
| 19:05.35 | bigdog_ut | i do ldap replication as well between oracle ldap and ibm...which is a pain |
| 19:05.50 | bigdog_ut | some ldap objects are different or for that company |
| 19:06.08 | bigdog_ut | but with openldap you should be fine...i dont see you doing the crap we do here |
| 19:06.17 | toxs | http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/ldapsa/index.html?CMP=ILL-4GV796923290 |
| 19:06.20 | toxs | good book? |
| 19:06.26 | bigdog_ut | like serializig objects to ldap |
| 19:06.42 | toxs | no don't think I will be doing any of that |
| 19:06.49 | dataw0lf|w | excellent book. |
| 19:07.17 | toxs | cool |
| 19:07.20 | dataw0lf|w | I've only read through the first couple chapters so far, but it's pretty nice. |
| 19:07.22 | bigdog_ut | good...but better -> http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1578700701/ref=pd_sxp_f/002-0591004-0745615?v=glance&s=books |
| 19:07.55 | mindjuju | not big into buying tech books, they go out of style too quick. bigger fan of Safari Bookshelf |
| 19:08.13 | mindjuju | change books in and out and print the parts that I need if I want paper |
| 19:08.43 | bigdog_ut | if your a sys admin for ldap that one is a must have |
| 19:08.58 | toxs | bigdog_ut, uphpu need a review of that book? hint hint |
| 19:09.09 | bigdog_ut | lol...send me the info |
| 19:09.21 | bigdog_ut | if you dont then i have dataw0lf|w kick your arse |
| 19:09.36 | toxs | what info do you need? |
| 19:09.41 | toxs | blood type? |
| 19:09.56 | bigdog_ut | book info |
| 19:10.04 | bigdog_ut | title, author, publisher, isbn |
| 19:10.08 | toxs | oh k |
| 19:10.16 | bigdog_ut | sent it thru uphpu web |
| 19:10.53 | bigdog_ut | oh and add your shipping address info |
| 19:11.04 | bigdog_ut | toxs, note that sometimes they turn me down |
| 19:11.13 | toxs | that's cool |
| 19:11.13 | dataw0lf|w | and dating preferences. |
| 19:11.17 | bigdog_ut | cause uphpu users in the past have not been doing their job |
| 19:11.26 | bigdog_ut | by submittin reviews |
| 19:11.26 | toxs | ouch |
| 19:11.38 | toxs | I was just kidding any way |
| 19:11.48 | toxs | hate to wait for books |
| 19:11.49 | bigdog_ut | so they have turned me down the last 3-4 requests |
| 19:12.02 | bigdog_ut | i can do it if they say yes it is nice |
| 19:12.08 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w can attest to that |
| 19:12.25 | toxs | someone needs to crack the whip |
| 19:12.26 | bigdog_ut | nice ot get a free book in the mail...kinda like christmas |
| 19:12.30 | dataw0lf|w | sure is. |
| 19:12.39 | bigdog_ut | i just stop givin to the group |
| 19:12.47 | bigdog_ut | unless people ask now |
| 19:12.56 | bigdog_ut | though i do have some for tomorrow night |
| 19:13.03 | dataw0lf|w | whatcha got? |
| 19:13.11 | dataw0lf|w | as your co presenter, you know I have first dibs, right? |
| 19:13.12 | bigdog_ut | remember those garage ones |
| 19:13.26 | bigdog_ut | i have some of those and some new php5 ones |
| 19:13.31 | bigdog_ut | yeah you do |
| 19:13.49 | bigdog_ut | but i dont think these are your type...n00b more or less |
| 19:14.16 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w...i might give ya the new pgsql one from apress |
| 19:14.24 | bigdog_ut | if you are a good little boy |
| 19:14.57 | toxs | bigdog_ut, you know if that covers version 8? |
| 19:15.05 | bigdog_ut | of? |
| 19:15.20 | toxs | pgsql |
| 19:15.24 | bigdog_ut | it does |
| 19:15.29 | toxs | cool |
| 19:16.14 | bigdog_ut | i think it is this one -> http://www.apress.com/book/bookDisplay.html?bID=424 |
| 19:16.15 | dataw0lf|w | oooh... new pg book. |
| 19:16.26 | dataw0lf|w | I don't have a pg book |
| 19:16.32 | dataw0lf|w | me wants |
| 19:16.34 | bigdog_ut | i have 3 |
| 19:16.42 | toxs | apress books any good? |
| 19:16.49 | dataw0lf|w | omg, it's written by Matthew and Stones |
| 19:16.49 | bigdog_ut | yeah...i have liked them |
| 19:17.17 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w, you no likey them |
| 19:17.31 | dataw0lf|w | Matthew and Stones are the authors of Beginning Linux Programming, I've purchased every edition, it's my bible. |
| 19:17.38 | bigdog_ut | yeah |
| 19:17.46 | bigdog_ut | yep |
| 19:17.54 | dataw0lf|w | those guys are geniuses |
| 19:18.02 | dataw0lf|w | Professional Linux Programming is pretty hawt too. |
| 19:18.22 | dataw0lf|w | but Beginning Linux Programming got me started back in the day. |
| 19:18.24 | bigdog_ut | i might have to bring some stuff |
| 19:18.29 | dataw0lf|w | and it's still incredibly useful. |
| 19:19.07 | bigdog_ut | i got a new assembly book too |
| 19:19.19 | dataw0lf|w | http://www.wrox.com/WileyCDA/WroxTitle/productCd-0764544977.html |
| 19:19.30 | dataw0lf|w | oh? for what processor? |
| 19:19.44 | bigdog_ut | intel and linux specific |
| 19:20.40 | dataw0lf|w | damn, that'd be a nice one too, you suck. |
| 19:20.53 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 19:21.13 | bigdog_ut | why do you think i volunteered for this |
| 19:21.15 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 19:21.20 | bigdog_ut | i read most of them |
| 19:21.35 | bigdog_ut | then hand them out after i am done |
| 19:21.44 | bigdog_ut | but ive done more reviews |
| 19:21.54 | dataw0lf|w | you know I'll always do a review. |
| 19:22.04 | bigdog_ut | yeah...i got one for ya |
| 19:23.12 | bigdog_ut | ill have to show you the assembly one |
| 19:23.30 | dataw0lf|w | word. |
| 19:23.32 | bigdog_ut | that is nice too->http://www.awprofessional.com/title/0201433079 |
| 19:24.32 | bigdog_ut | i got php5 and linux in this series -> http://www.awprofessional.com/series/series.asp?ser=494820 |
| 19:24.41 | bigdog_ut | oh and tech writing too |
| 19:27.10 | bigdog_ut | http://vig.prenhall.com/catalog/academic/product/0,1144,0131494198,00.html |
| 19:27.53 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w, this one -> http://vig.prenhall.com/catalog/academic/product/0,1144,0130879401,00.html |
| 19:28.07 | bigdog_ut | very good book |
| 19:29.11 | bigdog_ut | i want to say i have one of these too -> http://vig.prenhall.com/catalog/academic/product/0,1144,0735710430,00.html |
| 19:29.19 | dataw0lf|w | bigdog_ut: oh, jea, that book is hot. |
| 19:30.15 | bigdog_ut | the assembly one? |
| 19:31.23 | macnewbold | bigdog_ut: I'm working on a review of the Mythical Man-Month, 20th anniv. edition, from addison-wesley |
| 19:31.32 | macnewbold | It's going to go on the uphpu site when I'm done |
| 19:31.38 | bigdog_ut | sweet |
| 19:31.45 | macnewbold | if you want to send it to A-W in exchange for more goods |
| 19:31.46 | macnewbold | :) |
| 19:31.51 | bigdog_ut | addison-wesley and prentice hall have some really good books |
| 19:32.06 | bigdog_ut | i tell them whenever a new review is there |
| 19:32.26 | dataw0lf|w | that 20th anniv edition is killer. |
| 19:32.27 | bigdog_ut | they also like it when you post to b&n and amazon |
| 19:32.27 | macnewbold | yeah |
| 19:32.33 | macnewbold | aha |
| 19:32.37 | dataw0lf|w | you guys read the Pragmatic Programmer? |
| 19:32.39 | macnewbold | I'll maybe do that |
| 19:33.07 | bigdog_ut | i need to do a review for slashdot sometime...cause they really like to see book reviews on slashdot |
| 19:33.22 | macnewbold | I still need to read/review my python pocket reference and my FreeBSD book (thx bigdog) |
| 19:33.39 | bigdog_ut | yeah...we are waiting for the freebsd book review |
| 19:33.39 | macnewbold | yeah, and MM-M would be great for that audience :) |
| 19:33.51 | bigdog_ut | yes he does |
| 19:33.56 | bigdog_ut | and writing some reviews |
| 19:33.58 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Send me some... |
| 19:34.03 | macnewbold | jsmith: if you can get us a few "review" copies |
| 19:34.10 | jsmith | macnewbold: I'll do my best. |
| 19:34.15 | macnewbold | we'd be happy to stuff the review boxes for you |
| 19:34.16 | macnewbold | :) |
| 19:34.25 | bigdog_ut | oh yeah |
| 19:34.25 | jsmith | macnewbold: I can get copies for 50% of retail, FWIW. |
| 19:34.31 | macnewbold | sweet |
| 19:34.42 | bigdog_ut | jsmith, really...i though you could get free ones |
| 19:34.43 | jsmith | I'm not sure how many PHP goons are interested in Asterisk, though. |
| 19:34.49 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: I probably can get a few... |
| 19:34.51 | bigdog_ut | i would be |
| 19:35.04 | macnewbold | so I presume they gave you an advance, and then royalties when it sells enough copies? |
| 19:35.04 | bigdog_ut | but you are right though not many |
| 19:35.11 | jsmith | macnewbold: Yup. |
| 19:35.20 | macnewbold | cool |
| 19:35.30 | bigdog_ut | my question: was it worth the cost? |
| 19:35.31 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: I"m trying to get O'Reilly to do some kind of promotion with the local LUGs |
| 19:35.35 | macnewbold | hopefully we can get you into royalty territory pretty soon |
| 19:35.53 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: It money, no. In fame and glory, maybe. In helping out the Asterisk community, yes! |
| 19:36.04 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 19:36.07 | bigdog_ut | my thoughts too |
| 19:36.29 | bigdog_ut | like we talked that one time...i still want to do an advanced pgsql book so bad |
| 19:37.20 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Any time you're ready... but hopefully I'll have a month or two to breathe first :-) |
| 19:37.49 | bigdog_ut | lol...probably next year right after christmas...i need to get some notes and stuff together |
| 19:38.12 | bigdog_ut | i have a couple sections down though |
| 19:38.28 | dataw0lf|w | that'd be hawt. |
| 19:38.43 | bigdog_ut | my big thing is i want it written (majority) before i even go to publisher |
| 19:39.06 | bigdog_ut | cause i really want to pick my pub...like you did jsmith |
| 19:39.15 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Yeah, that helps... we have several chapters done already, and a good solid outline. |
| 19:39.24 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Amen! Picking the right publisher is everything. |
| 19:39.25 | bigdog_ut | yeah i want that atleast |
| 19:39.41 | bigdog_ut | did you talk to apress? |
| 19:39.47 | bigdog_ut | wondering how they are |
| 19:40.36 | jsmith | Yeah, I talked with them (briefly)... they said they were interested, but never followed through. Seemed more interested in promoting their brand than actually trying to interest me as an author. |
| 19:41.01 | bigdog_ut | they seem to be still pushing their brand |
| 19:41.09 | bigdog_ut | did you pick oreilly then? |
| 19:41.16 | bigdog_ut | cant remember what you told me |
| 19:41.23 | dataw0lf|w | I believe it was O'Reilly. |
| 19:41.28 | dataw0lf|w | it up for preorder, jsmith? |
| 19:42.04 | jsmith | dataw0lf: Of course. |
| 19:42.09 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Yes. |
| 19:42.18 | jsmith | ISBN: 0696009623 |
| 19:42.18 | dataw0lf|w | what's the title? |
| 19:42.23 | dataw0lf|w | ah, cool. |
| 19:42.27 | jsmith | Asterisk: The future of telephony |
| 19:42.37 | jsmith | Oops! |
| 19:42.43 | jsmith | I typed the ISBN wrong. |
| 19:42.55 | jsmith | It's 0596009623 |
| 19:43.01 | jsmith | (I hit six instead of five) |
| 19:44.44 | dataw0lf|w | that explains it |
| 19:48.16 | dataw0lf|w | http://www.asteriskdocs.org/modules/tinycontent/content/docbook/current_v1/docs-html/book1.html |
| 19:50.02 | jsmith | Naw, that's the stuff before we started writing the book. |
| 19:50.08 | jsmith | It's all been rewritten since. |
| 19:50.11 | dataw0lf|w | jea, I was just looking through it. |
| 19:50.20 | dataw0lf|w | I found your webpage too. Hawt! |
| 19:50.28 | jsmith | (Gee -- that was hard!) |
| 19:50.35 | dataw0lf|w | I seem to think everything is hawt nowadays. |
| 19:50.39 | dataw0lf|w | Maybe I need a new girlfriend. |
| 19:50.50 | jsmith | Not hawt like Dallas was last week... |
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| 19:51.42 | *** mode/#uphpu [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 19:52.04 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w im creating a new install of eclispe for ya |
| 19:52.53 | bigdog_ut | ive removed all the stuff you will never use...added the stuff for python, ruby, ssh, ftp, webdav, subversion and a few others |
| 19:52.56 | bigdog_ut | runs nice |
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| 19:53.44 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: Natively compiled? |
| 19:53.51 | bigdog_ut | no not yet |
| 19:54.00 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: In what format are you creating this "install"? |
| 19:54.27 | bigdog_ut | it is just a zip file...but i removed alot of the core plugins that are for java and other stuff |
| 19:54.31 | bigdog_ut | that he would never use |
| 19:54.45 | bigdog_ut | so i barebones it and then i add the cool stuff |
| 19:54.52 | jsmith | Nice... |
| 19:55.04 | bigdog_ut | like colorer, subversion, python, ruby, and some others |
| 19:55.10 | bigdog_ut | it is nice |
| 19:55.20 | bigdog_ut | i might have to demo it tomorrow |
| 19:55.49 | *** join/#uphpu com4 (com4@antitech.xmission.com) |
| 19:56.07 | dataw0lf|w | bigdog_ut: cool. |
| 19:56.39 | bigdog_ut | i just need to add some more tweaks and then perhaps write up some stuff for uphpu and the you can download it from there |
| 19:57.31 | bigdog_ut | also i want to compile it native after that..like jsmith was talkin |
| 19:57.39 | dataw0lf|w | word. |
| 19:57.47 | bigdog_ut | then see how it works |
| 19:58.07 | bigdog_ut | i dropped it from like 78MB to 34MB but removing some core plugins |
| 19:59.15 | bigdog_ut | and i might put in my own splash...like a mug shot of the bigdog_ut |
| 19:59.54 | bigdog_ut | i checked out the ruby plugin for eclipse and it rocks hard core |
| 19:59.58 | bigdog_ut | it is really nice |
| 20:00.03 | bigdog_ut | one of the best i have seen |
| 20:00.26 | bigdog_ut | actually might do more ruby programming to use it |
| 20:00.37 | bigdog_ut | it even has unit testing with it |
| 20:08.42 | bigdog_ut | coming to work and downloadin at 36K/s really sucks |
| 20:08.50 | bigdog_ut | when i get like 289K/s at home |
| 20:09.00 | macnewbold | ew |
| 20:09.02 | macnewbold | yucl |
| 20:09.10 | macnewbold | s/yucl/yuck/ |
| 20:09.22 | bigdog_ut | no doubt |
| 20:10.01 | macnewbold | I've got 1.5mbps/1mbps at home, and got stuck with a half-T1 (768k/768k) at work by no choice of my own |
| 20:10.06 | macnewbold | stinks |
| 20:10.17 | macnewbold | plus, if we were on dsl here, we could have 7mpbs/1mbps if we wanted |
| 20:10.18 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 20:10.46 | bigdog_ut | yeah i have 3mpbs/1mbps at home which is nice |
| 20:11.11 | bigdog_ut | but work sucks |
| 20:11.20 | bigdog_ut | i think we have a fractional t1 |
| 20:11.55 | bigdog_ut | i think we had a burstable t1 and they said it cost to much |
| 20:12.38 | bigdog_ut | all i know is that we are going through the wrong company and not getting the fastest speed for what we have |
| 20:13.13 | bigdog_ut | ive gotten emails telling me i am using too much |
| 20:13.26 | bigdog_ut | i cant help it that i use a multi-threaded downloader :) |
| 20:19.01 | wps | anyone have any ideas on why my system would have stopped writing to /var/log/maillog ? |
| 20:19.34 | wps | I edited the file and then saved it. restarted sendmail. and now it doesn't appear to be writing to that file anymore |
| 20:19.53 | bigdog_ut | permissions |
| 20:20.09 | wps | I didn't change any permissions |
| 20:20.12 | wps | and then look the same |
| 20:20.20 | wps | -rw------- 1 root root 29 Jun 20 14:11 maillog |
| 20:20.20 | wps | -rw------- 1 root root 2822037 Jun 19 04:02 maillog.1 |
| 20:20.20 | wps | -rw------- 1 root root 3955570 Jun 12 04:02 maillog.2 |
| 20:20.20 | wps | -rw------- 1 root root 3902658 Jun 5 04:02 maillog.3 |
| 20:20.20 | wps | -rw------- 1 root root 6441346 May 29 04:02 maillog.4 |
| 20:20.35 | bigdog_ut | does syslog run as root? |
| 20:20.39 | bigdog_ut | or syslog |
| 20:20.52 | macnewbold | if it's a syslog'd file, you may need to restart syslog |
| 20:21.03 | macnewbold | since that's what would have actually opened the file |
| 20:21.06 | bigdog_ut | yeah |
| 20:21.23 | wps | I am not sure |
| 20:22.22 | wps | ah-hah! |
| 20:22.29 | wps | now it's writing! |
| 20:22.51 | Utah_Dave | was it syslog? |
| 20:22.54 | wps | thanks boys |
| 20:22.56 | wps | yeah |
| 20:23.03 | wps | once I restarted that it started writing again |
| 20:23.35 | macnewbold | sweet |
| 20:25.51 | wps | question |
| 20:26.16 | wps | an inbox (on the server) became unreadable all-of-a-sudden |
| 20:26.30 | wps | I received an error from my local mail client stating that it could not read the mail box |
| 20:26.38 | bigdog_ut | check permissions |
| 20:26.45 | wps | so, I jumped on the server and looked at the mailbox file |
| 20:26.55 | wps | all of the messages are in one file because I am using sendmail |
| 20:27.16 | wps | the file looked good but there was a number at the top and ten two hard returns before the messages started |
| 20:27.33 | macnewbold | hm |
| 20:27.38 | wps | I compared that with a few other mailboxes and decided that that number was out of place and shouldn't be there and was most likely the culprit |
| 20:27.42 | macnewbold | someone running pine maybe? or something like that? |
| 20:27.55 | macnewbold | sounds like something's editing it and has it locked perhaps? |
| 20:28.00 | wps | so I deleted it and the extra lies, saved the file, and tested it… and everything was fixed |
| 20:28.05 | macnewbold | lsof might help |
| 20:28.06 | macnewbold | hm |
| 20:28.07 | macnewbold | cool |
| 20:28.17 | wps | so, my question is… how do you think that that number might have gotten in there at the begging of the file? |
| 20:28.24 | wps | just a write error perhaps? |
| 20:28.55 | wps | well, no one should be editing it (manually or with PINE or something); it's my mailbox and I am the only one with access |
| 20:32.23 | dataw0lf|w | courier-imap? |
| 20:34.57 | dataw0lf|w | wps: what client do you use with it? |
| 20:35.07 | wps | Apple Mail |
| 20:35.07 | bigdog_ut | apple crap |
| 20:35.15 | dataw0lf|w | bunch of null values in the header? |
| 20:35.33 | bigdog_ut | bunch of intel chars |
| 20:36.14 | dataw0lf|w | what imap you running again? |
| 20:36.17 | dataw0lf|w | or are you running imap. |
| 20:36.24 | wps | yeah, running IMAP |
| 20:36.27 | wps | trying to remember which |
| 20:36.29 | wps | : |
| 20:36.30 | wps | :) |
| 20:36.30 | bigdog_ut | courier-imap |
| 20:36.38 | dataw0lf|w | yup. |
| 20:36.39 | wps | I am pretty sure it's courier-imap |
| 20:38.00 | dataw0lf|w | one sec, I can't remember what exactly I did last time, lemme check one of my mail servers and try to remember. |
| 20:38.17 | bigdog_ut | dataw0lf|w what was the imap server we were talking about in utah about a month ago |
| 20:39.12 | dataw0lf|w | dovecot? |
| 20:39.29 | bigdog_ut | sounds like it |
| 20:39.36 | bigdog_ut | are you using it now? |
| 20:39.51 | dataw0lf|w | not here. |
| 20:39.56 | bigdog_ut | at home? |
| 20:40.30 | dataw0lf|w | I hooked up a client and set it up at home, yeah, but then took it down again because I usually setup an email server for a couple days then shut it down out of paranoia on my home machines. |
| 20:40.39 | dataw0lf|w | client likes it though. |
| 20:40.54 | bigdog_ut | cool...i might need to check it out sometime |
| 20:40.55 | dataw0lf|w | can't remember this mail server's root password. |
| 20:41.06 | bigdog_ut | i use courier at home |
| 20:41.13 | bigdog_ut | but i dont like it that much |
| 20:41.45 | dataw0lf|w | yeah, I despise it. |
| 20:41.59 | dataw0lf|w | argh, what's the password |
| 20:44.32 | dataw0lf|w | oh, god. |
| 20:44.36 | dataw0lf|w | I'm an idiot |
| 20:45.24 | dataw0lf|w | oh, yeah, I remember now. |
| 20:45.40 | dataw0lf|w | the Trash file became unreadable and I tried removing the lines and it was still unreadable, so I deleted it and touched it. |
| 20:46.00 | dataw0lf|w | unreadable/writable, rather. |
| 20:47.59 | gthornock | Dovecot is pretty good. I run it at home, mainly so that I can have Squirrelmail for those few things (like attachments) where mailx doesn't quite cut it :) |
| 20:50.06 | dataw0lf|w | pretty easy to set up. |
| 20:50.15 | dataw0lf|w | I don't know how it scales, though. |
| 20:54.01 | *** join/#uphpu tierra (~tierra@dsl093-225-126.slc1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | And now, the news... |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | Tech job future, not looking so bright |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050620/ap_on_hi_te/tech_job_decline |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:56.29 | mindjuju | Why does this not seem like a good idea? |
| 20:56.31 | mindjuju | http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050618/ap_on_hi_te/wireless_wallet |
| 20:56.35 | mindjuju | You too can fight fires! |
| 20:56.37 | mindjuju | http://www.suburbanchicagonews.com/newssun/top/w17lostcrek.htm |
| 20:56.39 | mindjuju | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:56.41 | mindjuju | Software patents regurgitated |
| 20:56.43 | mindjuju | http://www.guardian.co.uk/online/comment/story/0,12449,1510566,00.html |
| 20:56.45 | mindjuju | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:56.47 | mindjuju | What the Chinese think of the American Marketplace |
| 20:56.49 | mindjuju | http://www.theonion.com/news/index.php?issue=4124&n=1 |
| 20:58.02 | mindjuju | the onion article is my fav, have several books of their articles |
| 20:58.35 | dataw0lf|w | <3 the Onion |
| 20:58.55 | dataw0lf|w | they just had bout my favorite headline evar this issue |
| 20:58.59 | dataw0lf|w | "Enchanted By Own Innocence, Michael Jackson Molests Self" |
| 20:59.23 | mindjuju | wait, i got to find that one |
| 20:59.38 | dataw0lf|w | not an article, just a headline. |
| 20:59.39 | mindjuju | oh, i see the pic |
| 21:04.23 | xilch|w | scroheart! |
| 21:06.41 | *** join/#uphpu xilch|w (~xilch@66.239.17.226.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 21:08.34 | macnewbold | get the audio from the Phlyte meeting http://uphpu.org/presentations/050609_PHP_Mono_64Kbps.ogg |
| 21:18.24 | bigdog_ut | what was the girl in the meeting...is she online here? |
| 21:18.44 | bigdog_ut | s/what/who/ |
| 21:19.07 | macnewbold | that would be Sheri Bigelow |
| 21:19.18 | bigdog_ut | is she in the channel? |
| 21:19.20 | macnewbold | when she's here, her nick is design5429 or something like that |
| 21:19.25 | bigdog_ut | oh |
| 21:19.31 | macnewbold | so no, she's not right now |
| 21:19.52 | bigdog_ut | just curios i have a friend that works at myriad that i am wondering if she knows |
| 21:19.59 | macnewbold | yeah, she's pretty cool |
| 21:32.04 | Utah_Dave | has anyone here moved a subversion repository from one server to another? |
| 21:39.14 | macnewbold | mv repo1 repo2 |
| 21:40.23 | *** join/#uphpu eco|w (~eco@dsl093-225-126.slc1.dsl.speakeasy.net) |
| 21:41.35 | Utah_Dave | so I can just copy the whole repository to the new server by hand? I'm downloading the svn book right now. I just have horribly slow internet at work. |
| 21:42.52 | *** join/#uphpu mindjuju (~mindjuju@216.20.238.225) |
| 21:44.35 | Utah_Dave | looks like I can use "svnadmin dump" and "svnadmin load" |
| 21:45.04 | *** join/#uphpu wps_ (~wade@207.108.169.214) |
| 21:54.35 | macnewbold | Utah_Dave: sorry for the misleading comment |
| 21:54.42 | macnewbold | I have no idea how to do much with subversion |
| 22:03.13 | Utah_Dave | Mac: No problem. I think I've got it. I'm just moving and upgrading some servers and I didn't want to lose the history of the project I'm working on. |
| 22:06.13 | macnewbold | yeah, that would be Bad with a capital B |
| 22:15.01 | *** join/#uphpu eco (identd@c-24-10-128-63.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 22:17.38 | *** join/#uphpu Ryan1 (~rerickson@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 22:18.38 | *** join/#uphpu wps (~wade@207.108.169.214) |
| 22:18.41 | *** mode/#uphpu [+o wps] by ChanServ |
| 22:31.41 | *** join/#uphpu beandog (~sdibb@64.50.56.200) |
| 22:34.54 | beandog | macnewbold: do you ever use innodb |
| 22:39.57 | bigdog_ut | beandog, i have used it alot |
| 22:43.55 | macnewbold | beandog: I've never used it |
| 22:44.02 | beandog | er, sec, playing a game. brb |
| 22:44.03 | beandog | :D |
| 22:44.19 | beandog | bigdog_ut: do you ever use transactions |
| 22:44.22 | macnewbold | (never had anything that was critical enough to really need transactions) |
| 22:44.27 | macnewbold | bigdog_ut does all the time |
| 22:46.58 | bigdog_ut | yes |
| 22:51.52 | *** join/#uphpu drip (~scoobmast@67.108.238.129.ptr.us.xo.net) |
| 22:59.52 | beandog | ok, finally back |
| 23:00.22 | beandog | I forgot my question |
| 23:01.36 | beandog | I was wondering about transactions cuz they were going slow, but it turns out my coworker was running a huge mass update and that was making it slow after all, so .. n/m. :) |
| 23:01.59 | *** part/#uphpu Ryan1 (~rerickson@rberick.dsl.xmission.com) |
| 23:06.07 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 23:06.52 | beandog | Does php have some kind of function to see how long a script has been running? |
| 23:06.53 | beandog | anyone know? |
| 23:07.02 | beandog | Or do I actually have to *gasp* calculate the diff myself? :) |
| 23:07.12 | bigdog_ut | calculate the diff |
| 23:07.23 | bigdog_ut | pear has some stuff to make that easier |
| 23:07.59 | beandog | really? |
| 23:08.04 | bigdog_ut | yep |
| 23:08.52 | beandog | http://pear.php.net/package/Benchmark/docs/1.2.3/Benchmark/Benchmark_Timer.html |
| 23:08.58 | bigdog_ut | y |
| 23:10.14 | beandog | good ol' pear |
| 23:11.05 | beandog | bigdog_ut: what db do you use transactions with? |
| 23:11.08 | beandog | Is there a string limit? |
| 23:11.21 | bigdog_ut | pgsql |
| 23:11.31 | beandog | good ol' postgres :) |
| 23:11.34 | bigdog_ut | limit like what? |
| 23:11.39 | beandog | well |
| 23:11.41 | beandog | as in characters |
| 23:11.48 | bigdog_ut | no |
| 23:11.54 | bigdog_ut | just a filesystem limit |
| 23:11.55 | beandog | I have no clue how long my sql statement is .. but its at least 5k queries. |
| 23:12.13 | bigdog_ut | is that a dynamic query? |
| 23:12.25 | beandog | yah |
| 23:12.30 | jsmith | 5k queries in a transaction, and you can't break it up? |
| 23:12.34 | jsmith | Wow... |
| 23:12.38 | beandog | I could. |
| 23:12.43 | beandog | RIght now Im breaking it up by thousands |
| 23:13.10 | bigdog_ut | so you have 5k queris in a transaction |
| 23:13.11 | jsmith | If you can arbitrarily break it up, that's usually a good indication that it doesn't need to be one transaction :-) |
| 23:13.15 | beandog | function commitTransaction($sql = null) { |
| 23:13.15 | beandog | global $mssql; |
| 23:13.15 | beandog | if(is_array($sql)) { |
| 23:13.15 | beandog | mssql_query('BEGIN TRANSACTION;'); |
| 23:13.15 | beandog | foreach($sql as $key => $value) { |
| 23:13.16 | beandog | mssql_query($value) or die(mssql_get_last_message()); |
| 23:13.18 | beandog | if(($key % 1000) == 0) { |
| 23:13.18 | jsmith | (I know, this is an exception, I know) |
| 23:13.20 | beandog | mssql_query('COMMIT;') or die(mssql_get_last_message()); |
| 23:13.22 | beandog | mssql_query('BEGIN TRANSACTION;'); |
| 23:13.24 | beandog | } |
| 23:13.26 | beandog | } |
| 23:13.28 | beandog | mssql_query('COMMIT;'); |
| 23:13.30 | beandog | } |
| 23:13.36 | beandog | } |
| 23:14.06 | bigdog_ut | now i am not too sure about mssql...but with mysql and pgsql your transactions are in each query...not the whole thing |
| 23:14.08 | beandog | Doing data importing ... normally theyre around ~500 queries per |
| 23:14.27 | bigdog_ut | so begin transaction would be one transaction |
| 23:14.39 | beandog | right |
| 23:14.53 | beandog | Im just gonna go back to one transaction |
| 23:14.58 | macnewbold | hm |
| 23:15.03 | macnewbold | why do you need a transaction anyway? |
| 23:15.12 | beandog | because it takes 80 times longer without |
| 23:15.22 | bigdog_ut | yes it does |
| 23:15.30 | beandog | Well |
| 23:15.31 | jsmith | beandog: Can't you just turn off keychecking, etc. until your import is done? |
| 23:15.33 | macnewbold | btw, if they're all inserts, you can inset multiple rows in one query |
| 23:15.36 | beandog | more realisticaly, tis about 1/20th the speed. |
| 23:15.59 | bigdog_ut | macnewbold, you sure mssql supports that |
| 23:16.01 | beandog | Theres updates and inserts mixed together |
| 23:16.09 | macnewbold | that would probably speed it up even more than one big txn |
| 23:16.10 | jsmith | In a data import? |
| 23:16.13 | beandog | And thats the 2nd thing, Id have to look it up to see if I could. |
| 23:16.30 | beandog | sql server is not exactly feature-rich |
| 23:16.42 | bigdog_ut | does it support arrays in stored procedures? |
| 23:16.53 | beandog | ah, dunno. Never used sp's. |
| 23:17.05 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: I seem to think it does... |
| 23:17.11 | jsmith | bigdog_ut: But it's been too long (thankfully!) |
| 23:17.21 | bigdog_ut | if it does then you pass in all the queries to the sp |
| 23:17.34 | bigdog_ut | sp is in a transaction by itself |
| 23:17.45 | beandog | bigdog_ut: well it looks like its running as one query |
| 23:17.49 | beandog | From watching the trace profile |
| 23:17.49 | bigdog_ut | so then you loop through all the queries in the sp |
| 23:18.24 | beandog | sakes alive, that way I posted is DOG slow. |
| 23:18.36 | beandog | Im going back to one query, and one butt-large string. |
| 23:18.53 | macnewbold | doh, mssql slackers. they don't support it |
| 23:18.55 | macnewbold | http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/tsqlref/ts_oa-oz_3qpf.asp |
| 23:18.59 | macnewbold | that has some alternatives though |
| 23:19.08 | macnewbold | http://troels.arvin.dk/db/rdbms/#insert-multiple |
| 23:19.08 | beandog | is postgres mentioned? |
| 23:19.09 | beandog | :) |
| 23:19.10 | macnewbold | has good info too |
| 23:19.36 | macnewbold | I think your performance problem is due to two things: |
| 23:19.40 | macnewbold | a) you're using MSSQL |
| 23:19.48 | beandog | a) thats a given |
| 23:19.48 | macnewbold | b) you're running on a windows box |
| 23:19.52 | beandog | b) ditto |
| 23:19.52 | bigdog_ut | postgresql does not do bulk queries...but utilizes files to do that with its large object support |
| 23:20.12 | macnewbold | is there a good reason why you can't use MySQL? |
| 23:20.24 | beandog | Well, yah. |
| 23:20.35 | beandog | Cant port all our webpages overnight |
| 23:20.43 | macnewbold | hm |
| 23:20.53 | beandog | But, were already migrating to pgsql |
| 23:20.57 | macnewbold | why are you inserting so many things so often? |
| 23:21.03 | beandog | data importing |
| 23:21.04 | beandog | daily |
| 23:21.12 | macnewbold | over 5k records per day? |
| 23:21.14 | beandog | Go through about I dunno 70 files |
| 23:21.18 | beandog | Between 500 and 5k each |
| 23:21.22 | beandog | x4 per file |
| 23:21.23 | macnewbold | doh |
| 23:21.31 | macnewbold | sounds like not a job for mssql |
| 23:21.43 | beandog | Well the actual box running the server keeps up great |
| 23:21.50 | macnewbold | then why is it so slow? |
| 23:21.51 | beandog | 8 xeons |
| 23:21.55 | beandog | im running it on dev. |
| 23:21.58 | macnewbold | whoa |
| 23:22.18 | beandog | I cant wait to put linux on that baby. :) |
| 23:22.22 | beandog | Once we can get rid of mssql of course. |
| 23:22.26 | macnewbold | if it isn't maxing the CPU, then what's it maxing? memory bandwidth? hd bandwidth? |
| 23:22.38 | macnewbold | there's no day like today! :) |
| 23:22.39 | beandog | ms effieciency |
| 23:22.46 | macnewbold | oh, wait... that whole overnight thing |
| 23:22.50 | beandog | yah |
| 23:22.51 | macnewbold | how about tomorrow? |
| 23:22.56 | beandog | its gonna take us months |
| 23:23.15 | macnewbold | so while we're on the evil topic of mssql |
| 23:23.17 | bigdog_ut | does mssql support temp tables/ |
| 23:23.23 | beandog | yes |
| 23:23.24 | macnewbold | I've got a column that is a string |
| 23:23.34 | macnewbold | and I need to order by whether or not that string starts with 0 |
| 23:23.36 | bigdog_ut | then insert into temp tables...no restrictions |
| 23:23.43 | beandog | Its okay -- the original transactions run super fast, fine. |
| 23:23.45 | bigdog_ut | then import from temp to active |
| 23:23.49 | beandog | The second way I wrote about is freaking slower than mold |
| 23:24.05 | jsmith | beandog: I don't see why doing it inside a transaction is faster. |
| 23:24.07 | macnewbold | but I can't get it to compare the result of a substring() with a string "0" |
| 23:24.08 | beandog | The first way, 20k inserts in about ... I dunno 3 seconds |
| 23:24.13 | beandog | 20k updates in a minute or two |
| 23:24.30 | jsmith | beandog: But I know that SQL Server support bulk inserts. |
| 23:24.32 | beandog | jsmith: Just gotta try it to see it. |
| 23:24.48 | beandog | I run the same query on sql server w/o, and it goes 20 seconds to process |
| 23:24.53 | beandog | in a transaction, takes less than one |
| 23:25.18 | beandog | Its the same with my scriptures project and postgres |
| 23:25.30 | bigdog_ut | transactions will be faster...cause you dont have the commit overhead on each one |
| 23:25.32 | beandog | on my p2 it inserts 35k records I think it is in less than 2 seconds |
| 23:25.42 | beandog | without, good gosh .. 45 minutes |
| 23:26.04 | beandog | Well, thats a bad example, cuz psql uses COPY |
| 23:26.14 | beandog | But it is true for sqlite. More like 10 seconds or so though. |
| 23:26.16 | macnewbold | any ideas for me? |
| 23:26.28 | beandog | sorry mac |
| 23:26.34 | macnewbold | I just keep getting syntax errors every time I try it |
| 23:26.41 | macnewbold | whether with = or with like or anything |
| 23:26.50 | macnewbold | whether it's in the order by clause or as a column |
| 23:27.01 | macnewbold | substring(addr_3,1,1) as a3a |
| 23:27.07 | beandog | whats your query |
| 23:27.10 | macnewbold | order by (substring(addr_3,0,1)='0') |
| 23:27.16 | macnewbold | the whole thing is pretty logn |
| 23:27.18 | macnewbold | long |
| 23:27.19 | beandog | Are you talking about on an mssql box? |
| 23:27.23 | beandog | Ok |
| 23:27.24 | macnewbold | it just bombs when it gets to the like or the = |
| 23:27.25 | macnewbold | yes |
| 23:27.28 | macnewbold | mssql |
| 23:27.42 | macnewbold | (luckily, the only one I have to work with) |
| 23:27.45 | beandog | Ive never done an order by substring |
| 23:28.43 | macnewbold | I can't even get it to work _outside_ of the order by |
| 23:28.51 | macnewbold | as a regular column in the select |
| 23:28.54 | mindjuju | what's the query? |
| 23:29.07 | beandog | Hmm |
| 23:29.11 | beandog | can you use left? |
| 23:29.15 | beandog | does mssql have left .. brb |
| 23:29.45 | bigdog_ut | it should...lol |
| 23:29.59 | beandog | yah, Id try that |
| 23:30.02 | macnewbold | left? |
| 23:30.04 | beandog | LEFT ( character_expression , integer_expression ) |
| 23:30.05 | macnewbold | sure |
| 23:30.19 | beandog | Whats the field type |
| 23:30.20 | beandog | varchar? |
| 23:30.51 | beandog | If its text you have to cast it |
| 23:31.27 | beandog | cast(column as varchar) |
| 23:31.28 | beandog | etc. |
| 23:31.30 | macnewbold | ADDR_3, SUBSTRING(ADDR_3,1,1) AS A3A , (LEFT(ADDR_3,1)='0') AS A3B FROM CUSTOMER WHERE (CONTACT_FIRST_NAME LIKE '%MAC%' AND CONTACT_LAST_NAME LIKE '%NEWBOLD%') AND NAME LIKE '%DMEDIA%' ORDER BY ID DESC Msg: Line 1: Incorrect syntax near '='. |
| 23:31.32 | macnewbold | cast? |
| 23:31.35 | macnewbold | no, it's a varchar |
| 23:31.41 | beandog | k |
| 23:32.15 | beandog | Why are you selecting left and setting it at the same time |
| 23:32.31 | beandog | or is that a where |
| 23:32.32 | beandog | doh. |
| 23:32.36 | beandog | ? |
| 23:36.20 | beandog | well I gotta run to the bank, I seeya laters |
| 23:36.34 | mindjuju | concur with beandog |
| 23:36.38 | mindjuju | why"LEFT(ADDR_3,1)='0'" |
| 23:37.37 | macnewbold | I don't what to set it, I want to do a boolean compare to see if it is equal to 0 or not |
| 23:37.44 | macnewbold | bye beandog, thanks |
| 23:37.59 | macnewbold | in the end, I need to order by that boolean result |
| 23:38.12 | macnewbold | does that make more sense, mindjuju |
| 23:38.39 | bigdog_ut | what query are you talking about? |
| 23:38.41 | mindjuju | it does, i'm mulling / research |
| 23:40.40 | macnewbold | bigdog_ut: I've got a query that needs to order the results by a boolean, whether or not field "addr_3" (a varchar) starts with the character/digit "0" or not |
| 23:40.56 | macnewbold | I pasted part of the query and the error above |
| 23:41.02 | bigdog_ut | oh |
| 23:41.11 | macnewbold | about 20 comments ago |
| 23:41.40 | macnewbold | I'm about ready to pull my hair out on it |
| 23:41.52 | macnewbold | cause the docs I've found on ms's site look like it should work fine |
| 23:41.58 | bigdog_ut | lol |
| 23:42.05 | bigdog_ut | i have no idea about ms |
| 23:50.48 | Utah_Dave | I'm replacing a server today. I had Gnome on the last one because sometimes it was nice to have some of the gui admin tools for some of my not-so-linux savvy coworkers. |
| 23:51.13 | Utah_Dave | My question is, will running the gui on a production server slow down the performance a lot? |
| 23:51.45 | Utah_Dave | How much of a speed benefit will I get by not running it with Gnome? |
| 23:58.47 | mindjuju | k, mac, what was the purpose of this line? when you use left in that case your returning part of a string starting from the left side. so it should be used left(character_expresion, interger_expression) |
| 23:59.03 | mindjuju | oh wait, you've answered |
| 23:59.07 | mindjuju | k, hang on, let me reread |