irclog2html for #uphpu on 20050526

01:02.29*** join/#uphpu tierra (~tierra@dsl093-225-126.slc1.dsl.speakeasy.net)
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13:33.03dataw0lf|wgood morning guys.
13:54.51*** join/#uphpu bigdog_ut (~bigdog@166.70.34.182)
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14:07.36dataw0lf|whm.  how would I script for a ssh logout event ?
14:09.02dataw0lf|wI can use .bash_logout, but I only want it to happen with ssh.
14:25.07*** join/#uphpu wps (~wade@207.108.169.214)
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14:39.28macnewboldmorning, dataw0lf
14:39.49macnewboldyour .bash_logout could check for the env. vars. that ssh sets...
14:39.53macnewboldand only do it if they're present
14:40.20macnewboldwps, bigdog_ut, dataw0lf: I submitted the article on MySQL vs. PostgreSQL
14:41.07wpsgreat
14:41.27wpswow, that's quite an article
14:44.22macnewboldalmost all of it is from what various people said in the discussion on the list
14:44.35macnewboldthere were a lot of good points that came out
14:44.41dataw0lf|wmacnewbold: mm, good idea.
14:44.48dataw0lf|wmacnewbold: cool, will check out article.
14:44.56macnewboldhopefully it still meet's dataw0lf's and bigdog_ut's standards for lack of "flamage" ;)
14:45.11macnewboldI tried to be as positive toward PG as I could bring myself to be :)
14:45.27macnewboldit doens't help that I've never actually used it, either
14:45.48macnewboldfor posterity sake, here's the link: http://uphpu.org/article.php?story=20050526083509771
14:49.36dataw0lf|wExcellent article.
14:49.59dataw0lf|wyou can tell you prefer MySQL in the article, but it's a fair comparison.
14:55.23beandogI wouldnt say postgres requires any more system administration to maintain than mysql
14:56.50beandogThe article seems pretty slanted to me
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14:58.35jsmithMorning guys...
14:58.45dataw0lf|whaven't seen you for a while, jsmith.
14:58.49dataw0lf|wg'morning.
14:58.49jsmithBeen on the road
14:58.53dataw0lf|wword.
14:58.56jsmithI'm in Dallas...
14:59.14dataw0lf|wfun times?
14:59.20jsmithEverything is bigger in Texas, except for the bandwidth.
14:59.29jsmithOh, it's alright... racking servers.
15:00.06jsmithShould I break out the asbestos underwear?
15:00.29dataw0lf|wprobably.
15:00.37dataw0lf|wthe flame level on the mailing list is at a all time high.
15:00.44dataw0lf|wwe have firefighters on standby, though.
15:01.35jsmithCool!
15:02.18jsmithIn short, you can have my transactions, triggers, and referential integrity when you pry them from my cold dead fingers.
15:02.32dataw0lf|whehe.
15:02.36jsmithAh, nothing like fire first thing in the morning!
15:02.44jsmith(Besides, I'm freezing in this data center.)
15:03.21dataw0lf|wdid you follow the top posting versus bottom posting fiasco?
15:03.29dataw0lf|wyou should still be warm from that.
15:05.54jsmithNope.
15:06.12dataw0lf|whehe.
15:06.13jsmithI bottom post, unless I'm stuck with a stupid mailer
15:06.21jsmithAnd I generously trim.
15:06.31jsmithBut I'm not a Nazi about it.
15:07.07dataw0lf|wI've convinced myself that the hate I engender from people is a talent.
15:14.29jsmithWell, I owe my "everybody hates me" attitude to my impatience with stupid people.
15:14.50dataw0lf|wso true.
15:29.53macnewboldbeandog: what maintenance steps do you have to do to a postgresql server?
15:30.09jsmithVACUUM!
15:30.46dataw0lf|wduh duh DUUUH.
15:31.39jsmithdataw0lf|w: Thanks, man... cookies make a great second breakfast.
15:31.40*** join/#uphpu mindjuju (~mindjuju@216.20.238.225)
15:31.49dataw0lf|whmm.. I didn't have a first :(
15:32.10jsmithdataw0lf|w: Shame on you... there's cold pizza and Mt. Dew in the fridge.
15:33.05dataw0lf|wmmm.
15:34.21dataw0lf|whttp://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2005-05-25&res=l hehe
15:36.45macnewboldokay, so you have to vacuum a pgsql database...
15:36.56macnewboldwhat maintenance steps do you have to do to a mysql server?
15:38.23jsmithMyisamchk!
15:38.42jsmithDon't run it on a large table though, unless you want your database out of commission for a couple of weeks :-)
15:40.30dataw0lf|wapparently I'm going to have to read up on MySQL so I have these little gems to pull out.
15:41.37macnewboldmyisamchk? huh? I've never touched it
15:41.47bigdog_utmeeting suck
15:41.53macnewboldMySQL doesn't require _any_ special maintenance
15:42.00bigdog_utlol
15:42.02macnewboldso beandog, I'd say MySQL is easier
15:42.10bigdog_utpgsql doesnt either
15:42.12macnewboldbigdog_ut: how was your meeting? :-D
15:42.19bigdog_utlong
15:42.22dataw0lf|wbtw, A River Runs Through It (soundtrack) is pure pleasure.
15:42.30macnewboldbigdog_ut: what about VACUUM?
15:42.42bigdog_utautovacuum runs by itself
15:42.46macnewbolddataw0lf: who do they have on there?
15:43.10dataw0lf|wmacnewbold: it's just some composed music.
15:43.20macnewboldah
15:43.23dataw0lf|wbigdog_ut: that's 7.4+
15:43.28dataw0lf|wif memory serves.
15:43.34bigdog_utyes...it is
15:43.47bigdog_utuse can write a cron job if needs be
15:44.04bigdog_utbut that is not a convincing argument
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15:45.02macnewboldby bobert
15:45.05macnewboldbye
15:45.35*** topic/#uphpu by macnewbold -> MySQL vs. PostgreSQL Day! | Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org
16:14.59bigdog_uthere is an article i wrote on mysql vs pgsql a couple years ago http://builder.com.com/5100-6388_14-1050671.html
16:16.35bigdog_utmacnewbold, the article was good...very informative...felt a little bias though
16:16.37bigdog_ut:)
16:17.39macnewboldthanks, and yeah, I figured
16:17.53macnewboldhopefully dataw0lf's comment will give it some weight with the PgSQL crowd
16:18.27macnewboldis there something in particular you'd refute, or just the general conclusion that most of the time, MySQL is probably more appropriate for use in PHP web apps?
16:19.05jsmith90% of MySQL users don't even use joins!
16:19.08bigdog_utthe one thing that i would bring to light is the lack of database knowledge most php developer (web) have with relation dbs
16:19.25bigdog_utjsmith, that is exactly what i think
16:19.40bigdog_utknow take wps for example...web developer
16:19.42dataw0lf|wAgreed, that's the major argument here as well: community base.
16:19.49dataw0lf|wJust like arguments against PHP that I might have.
16:19.58jsmithmacnewbold: It's really not a MySQL vs PostgreSQL question -- it's a "How much SQL do you want to use today?" question.
16:20.18bigdog_utwps probably does not know tuple relation calculus...where you macnewbold would and understands it
16:21.02bigdog_utdatabase design is an intensive process that requires extensive knowledge
16:21.13dataw0lf|wYes, it's where the majority of my 'PHP' development is spent.
16:21.26dataw0lf|wWhich is why I argued against the full fledged PHP debugger thing on the mailing list.
16:21.34dataw0lf|wPHP is pretty self explanatory in every error it gives you.
16:21.50dataw0lf|w80% of my time is spent optimizing, building, and debugging databases.
16:22.23dataw0lf|wand 15% of the other 20 is spent looking up XHTML / CSS references ;)
16:23.30bigdog_utthe issue that i really have is that many php developers lack the knowledge to chose a database based on design requirements...they tend to migrate towards mysql cause that is where mysql pushes it advertising at
16:23.58bigdog_utmost could not even tell which form their db is in
16:24.08bigdog_utlet alone the forms that are available
16:24.15dataw0lf|wwell, I'd broaden that statement and say that alot of PHP developers don't have a true understanding of application design and other fundamentals too.
16:24.32bigdog_utcorrect..theory of any kind
16:24.53bigdog_utmy overall argument is really why do you need a database?
16:25.07bigdog_utmacnewbold, going along with your comments of php moving towards sqlite
16:25.15dataw0lf|wah yes, the let's solve everything by putting it into a database crowd.
16:25.23bigdog_utmy thoughts are that many apps dont need a db at all
16:25.33dataw0lf|wAgreed.
16:25.40bigdog_utconfig files are just fine
16:25.58bigdog_utor how many have created an app with db4 or a berkley db
16:26.04bigdog_utnow that is a fast db
16:26.05dataw0lf|wheh, it's funny because some guy in the python channel when I was discussing my pybot told me I shouldn't use flat files and stick it into a mysql db
16:26.41bigdog_utfunny cause i argue more against dbs for that same issue...easier for php to include a file then to query db
16:27.29dataw0lf|wit's often the PHP crowd that interjects the 'Uber Database Solution(tm)' for everything too, when they move to another language.
16:27.43bigdog_utalso i would point out that both mysql and pgsql have great features...the other issue is that many developers dont know how to use them
16:27.56bigdog_utyes that is typical dataw0lf|w
16:28.37bigdog_uti mean we talk about transactions, replication, acid compliance...but many have no idea about it
16:28.49bigdog_utwhy would i need transactions
16:29.19bigdog_uti do agree with macnewbold that many php apps dont need the adv features of pgsql or mysql for that matter
16:30.26bigdog_utyet, one statement that i always hate is that mysql is faster than pgsql
16:31.33jsmithI think people *need* transactions for a lot of things, and just don't realize it.
16:31.56bigdog_utthey dont understand them
16:31.57jsmithBetween that and enforcing foreign keys, it would sure solve a lot of stupid database cleanup problems.
16:32.08jsmithTrue -- because if they did, they'd use them.
16:32.11bigdog_utyeah
16:32.18macnewboldbigdog_ut: your article is good
16:32.24bigdog_utit is old though
16:32.26bigdog_utthanks
16:32.26jsmithIt's the mindset that is stupid, not the tool
16:32.32macnewboldjsmith: yeah, you're right about the txns to a degree,
16:32.37macnewboldbigdog_ut: the table's a bit out of date
16:32.47bigdog_ut2002
16:32.47macnewboldit's funny how it proclaims "vacuum" as a feature of pg :)
16:33.06jsmithbigdog_ut: Maybe you or I ought to give a presentation on the subject :-)
16:33.09bigdog_utvacuum is a good feature...rebuild or trees is nice
16:33.11macnewboldbut jsmith, many times you can set up your database so a single atomic inset is fine
16:33.13jsmithmacnewbold: It is a feature.
16:33.15macnewboldand you don't really nead them
16:33.35macnewbolda feature you need because it doesn't clean up after itself automatically, like MySQL ;)
16:33.48macnewbolds/inset/insert/ above...
16:33.51dataw0lf|wI'd say you can go both ways with transactions, however, the trend is to underuse them rather than overuse them.
16:33.51bigdog_utits not clean up though
16:33.54bigdog_utit is optimization
16:34.13jsmithmacnewbold: I only use transactions when I need them.
16:34.36bigdog_uttransactions are inherit in pgsql
16:35.35jsmithTrue... I forgot about that.
16:35.55jsmithI guess I should say "I only use explicit transanctions when I need them."
16:36.00bigdog_utyeah
16:36.25bigdog_uttalking with macnewbold and dataw0lf|w i see to sides...where is your business logic
16:36.31jsmithBeing able to do an insert, test something, and then roll back is a lifesaver :-)
16:36.34bigdog_utdataw0lf|w, likes the db and macnewbold likes php
16:36.44jsmithbigdog_ut: I'm a "put the logic as close to the db as possible" type of guy
16:36.56jsmithbigdog_ut: Where it makes sense, of course.
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16:37.02dataw0lf|wjsmith: agreed.
16:37.06jsmithbigdog_ut: You can't totally go one way or the other.
16:37.09bigdog_utthough i can see macnewbold side too
16:37.18dataw0lf|wHowever, I don't use a db solution for everything.
16:37.26bigdog_utno but you can do 99% db and 1% php
16:37.59dataw0lf|wThat is more of a 'man, PHP does the job for me... but I really don't enjoy it'
16:38.01jsmithbigdog_ut: Sure... it's certainly easier to do it in PHP most of the time, but you end up with 50% of your code just munging the database.
16:38.18bigdog_uttru dat
16:38.21macnewboldbigdog_ut: I agree with you in general, but for web apps, where the only client of the db is the php code, it's _much_ easier and faster to do a lot of things in the php than in the db
16:38.38bigdog_utnot sure about faster though
16:38.47dataw0lf|wThe problem I have with PHP is it's inherent focus on web development.  It's a great language for it, however, I like my languages to have a wide range of uses.
16:38.52macnewboldfaster in terms of performance, or in development/debugging time?
16:38.55bigdog_utmysql and pgsql are highly optimized c code...php is not all that optimized
16:39.15macnewbolddataw0lf: I agree... I'm not a fan of using php for anything other than web development
16:39.31jsmithmacnewbold: You must be saying faster as in "faster development", not "faster execution"
16:39.33dataw0lf|wmacnewbold: I've actually had to work on someone's system where they had implemented PHP shell scripts.
16:39.44macnewboldyeah, kinda gross, that
16:39.57jsmithNope... PHP shell scripts rule!
16:40.04dataw0lf|wyou're ridiculous.
16:40.07macnewboldthey work, but I wouldn't say they rule
16:40.09jsmithNo, I'm serious.
16:40.12dataw0lf|wMayhap when dealing with databases.
16:40.18jsmithYes, of course.
16:40.21macnewboldyeah, okay
16:40.27macnewbolda db-driven shell script, php could be nice
16:40.36dataw0lf|wI wrote a PHP shell script that imported Access databases to Postgres for a client, it was great for that.
16:40.44jsmithIt allows us to keep a core library of code that works consistently across the web and shell.
16:40.47dataw0lf|wwell, several shell scripts.
16:40.53macnewboldanything else though, even _perl_ (gasp!) would be better than php for shell scripts
16:41.04dataw0lf|wjsmith: which is agreed, but this guy had just your everyday shell scripts in PHP.
16:41.04bigdog_uti wrote a php script for snmp router queries
16:41.12macnewboldeww
16:41.20jsmithbigdog_ut: PHP version of MRTG?
16:41.21macnewboldI've used perl for snmp a lot
16:41.30dataw0lf|wgotta love the snmp.
16:41.39dripthat was at enterasys wasn't that bigdog_ut?
16:41.45bigdog_utyeah drip
16:42.02dataw0lf|wjsmith: what's your opinion on Python, btw?
16:42.05bigdog_utfor that damn snmp vul. years ago
16:42.14dripyeah
16:42.24jsmithdataw0lf|w: Mostly like the language, hate the syntax.
16:42.31dripmy snmp interaction was all in java though
16:42.32drip=P
16:42.36jsmithdataw0lf|w: But the inconsistancies drive me nuts
16:42.49dataw0lf|wjsmith: inconsistencies?
16:43.32jsmithdataw0lf|w: When I was playing with it a lot, it just seemed like everything had it's unique way of doing things -- it's been long enough now that I don't even remember what I was trying to do with it.
16:44.25dataw0lf|wHm.
16:44.32macnewboldjsmith: you talking about snmp? If so, I totally agree
16:44.44macnewboldthere are some things that are standard MIB-2 stuff, but a lot of important things
16:44.47macnewboldare not in the standard
16:44.53macnewboldso every vendor does their own thing
16:45.22macnewboldwe had to write vlan administration routines that work on a variety of switches,
16:45.30macnewboldand it's a big mess, cause everybody did it different
16:46.05macnewboldeven sometimes different product lines from the same vendor did it different (like w/Cisco - the 6500's are different than the 5500's by quite a bit, plus CatOS vs. IOS)
16:46.21dataw0lf|whttp://www.freedom-to-tinker.com/tinyp2p.html
16:51.10macnewboldsweet... 15 lines of code (python)
16:53.08dataw0lf|wthat's pretty niftastic.
16:53.50dataw0lf|wgotta love lambda functions.
17:00.13*** join/#uphpu fungus (~fungus@2001:470:1f00:645:20a:95ff:fec5:636a)
17:11.49mindjujuhttp://news.yahoo.com/s/eo/20050526/en_movies_eo/16633
17:11.53mindjujugood times
17:12.46macnewboldokay, quick question for all y'all, especially if wps is paying attention:
17:13.02macnewboldshould we start the php group project/class on May 31st? Or maybe on June 7th?
17:13.08macnewboldmeeting would be in SLC
17:16.03mindjujuhow often and where in SLC?
17:16.23mindjujumy office building is open if it isn't too far out of the way for everybody
17:19.15dataw0lf|wmacnewbold: count me in.
17:19.22macnewboldit's out of the way for me, at least, since the SLC loc is in my office building ;)
17:19.32macnewboldanyone have a preference of which day is better?
17:19.45macnewboldnext tuesday, or 12 days from now?
17:19.47dataw0lf|wnegative.
17:19.54dataw0lf|wI'd prefer next tuesday to get the ball arollin
17:20.09macnewboldyeah, that's what I'm a-thinkin too
17:24.50macnewboldwps, you have a sec?
17:25.08macnewboldor someone else (dataw0lf?) with access to mailman on uphpu?
17:25.24wpswhat's up?
17:25.27macnewboldwe ought to set up another mail list for the class/group project
17:25.38macnewboldso we don't clutter the real list will all our little administrative stuff
17:25.51wpsk, I'll set it up
17:25.52macnewboldor should we just go ahead on the uphpu list until further notice?
17:26.10macnewboldshould I email you the list of names/emails that need to get put on it right away?
17:26.10wpsI can set it up tonight
17:26.13macnewboldsweet
17:26.28wpsyeah
17:26.29macnewboldwps: you cool with starting the meetings on May 31st?
17:26.37macnewbold(i know you can't come)
17:26.44macnewbold:-(
17:26.45wpsyeah
17:26.47wpssounds good
17:31.36dataw0lf|wsup wps
17:32.59wpshey
17:36.04macnewboldwps: email sent w/list members
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18:53.09dataw0lf|wthere goes the neighborhood..
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20:39.32*** topic/#uphpu by macnewbold -> Utah PHP Users Group | uphpu.org
20:58.56jsmithmacnewbold: What, no more database wars?
20:59.01macnewboldhehe
20:59.04macnewboldno, all done
20:59.10macnewboldthey declared MySQL the victor already...
20:59.14macnewbold;) j/k
21:00.51dataw0lf|wit's called a 'database application'
21:00.53dataw0lf|w:)
21:01.13dataw0lf|wI'm going home early.
21:01.18dataw0lf|wpizzout.
21:01.28jsmithdataw0lf|w: Good idea!
21:16.20beandogmacnewbold: did you see my challenge earlier
21:16.40macnewboldyeah, did you see our responses?
21:16.54macnewboldyou have to vacuum pgsql, and you don't have to vacuum mysql, among other things
21:16.59beandogno, I got slammed for about 3 hours after that
21:17.00macnewboldhow is mysql hard to administer than pg?
21:17.03macnewboldah
21:17.15macnewboldadministering your pg server, I guess?
21:17.17beandog/etc/init.d/pg_autovacuum start
21:17.22beandog;)
21:17.23beandogheh
21:17.28beandogActually were using sql server here.
21:17.45macnewboldauto_vacuum: one more daemon/cronjob that pgsql needs that mysql doesn't
21:17.52beandogwhy vacuum anyway?
21:17.59beandogwho cares?
21:18.01macnewboldeven with autovac, how is pg easier than mysql?
21:18.11macnewboldat best, they could be equally easy, I'd say
21:18.22beandogThat was my point
21:18.41beandogI was just saying that pg wasn't necessarily harder to maintain.  One cron job ain't gonna kill anyone.
21:18.46macnewboldsetting up my mysql servers was easy, and I've never really had to do any maintenance to keep them running smooth. It doesn't get much easier than that.
21:19.11macnewboldthat may be more true now that there's autovac. before vacuum was something I always heard complaints about.
21:19.11beandogWell, anyway, my challenge was that you actually install and use postgres
21:19.23beandogHuh, thats odd.  Ive never had issues with it.
21:19.27beandog(vacuum)
21:21.13beandogOoh, we can use pg as our class project backend db :D
21:23.00fungusthe class project will have use abstraction for db access and be db agnostic.
21:23.15beandogadodb?
21:26.10beandogbtw macnewbold, thanks for that one link
21:26.18beandogthat program would work, except its 5 years old and wouldnt even compile. :T
21:26.32macnewboldhehe
21:26.55macnewboldthere's another guy on a mailing list who said he wrote a little program to do the same thing, and he said that in april 2004
21:27.01macnewboldit would probably be more likely to work
21:28.47beandogoh really?  I didnt see that
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21:52.41macnewboldbeandog: if you can't find it, holler, and i'll look again
21:55.41bigdog_utmacnewbold, do you know what the vacuum does?
21:57.02macnewboldsucks?
21:57.41macnewboldoooh, good quote: "The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners."
21:58.00macnewbold~microsoft
21:58.01jbotmicrosoft is probably very annoying
22:00.11macnewboldjbot, microsoft is also "The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners."
22:00.13jbotokay, macnewbold
22:00.21macnewbold~microsoft
22:00.22jbotACTION shoots herself
22:00.31macnewbold~microsoft
22:00.32jbotACTION shoots herself
22:00.51macnewboldjbot, no, microsoft is "The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners."
22:00.52jbotmacnewbold: okay
22:00.55macnewbold~microsoft
22:00.56jbotextra, extra, read all about it, microsoft is "The day Microsoft makes something that doesn't suck is the day they start making vacuum cleaners."
22:25.39mindjujujbot: newsflash $1 is <action> snapped pictures of $1 prancing around like pippi longstocking picking posies!  Pictures to be posted!
22:25.40jbotmindjuju: okay
22:25.47mindjuju~newsflash bigdog_ut
22:25.48jbotACTION snapped pictures of bigdog_ut prancing around like pippi longstocking picking posies!  Pictures to be posted!
22:26.03mindjujujbot: porkchop $1 is <action> spits on a porchop and feeds it to $1   Eat up!
22:26.04jbotmindjuju: okay
22:26.12mindjuju~porkchop bigdog_ut
22:26.13jbotACTION spits on a porchop and feeds it to bigdog_ut   Eat up!
22:26.46mindjujucan't believe i misspelled porkchop
22:27.18mindjujujbot: forget cmd: porkchop (.*?)
22:27.18jboti forgot cmd: porkchop (.*?), mindjuju
22:27.32mindjujubot: porkchop $1 is <action> spits on a porkchop and feeds it to $1   Eat up!
22:27.44mindjujujbot: porkchop $1 is <action> spits on a porchop and feeds it to $1   Eat up!
22:27.45jbotmindjuju: okay
22:28.02mindjuju04 01jbot: forget cmd: porkchop (.*?)
22:28.17mindjujujbot: forget cmd: porkchop (.*?)
22:28.17jbotmindjuju: i forgot cmd: porkchop (.*?)
22:28.34mindjujujbot: porkchop $1 is <action> spits on a porkchop and feeds it to $1   Eat up!
22:28.36jbotmindjuju: okay
22:33.29mindjujujbot: tagteam $1 is <action> climbs to the top rope of the ring and launches himself at $1!  $nick slams $1 with a folding chair!  $1 is down for the count!
22:33.31jbotokay, mindjuju
22:33.41mindjuju~tagteam bigdog_ut
22:33.42jbotACTION climbs to the top rope of the ring and launches himself at bigdog_ut!  mindjuju slams bigdog_ut with a folding chair!  bigdog_ut is down for the count!
22:36.47mindjuju~punch
22:36.48jbotACTION masturbates at the thought of punch
22:36.49macnewboldmindjuju: you're getting good at this jbot stuff :)
22:37.08mindjujuwow!  who programmed punch!
22:37.09bigdog_utobviously someone has a cake job
22:37.15bigdog_uti did
22:37.20bigdog_ut~punch mindjuju
22:37.21jbotACTION hits mindjuju like the hot kiss and the end of a wet fist
22:37.38mindjujuno, the other punch
22:37.40mindjuju~punch
22:37.41jbotACTION masturbates at the thought of punch
22:37.51mindjujudid you do that one too?
22:38.01macnewboldnot I
22:38.23bigdog_utthat is you man
22:38.31mindjujunah, this is you
22:38.37mindjuju~newsflash bigdog_ut
22:38.38jbotACTION snapped pictures of bigdog_ut prancing around like pippi longstocking picking posies!  Pictures to be posted!
22:39.28mindjujuhey, place i just came back from fixing the backup server at the colocation
22:39.32mindjujui deserve a little down time
22:39.33*** join/#uphpu wps (~wade@207.108.169.214)
22:39.35*** mode/#uphpu [+o wps] by ChanServ
22:40.04macnewboldhttp://speckproducts.com/iguy-ds.html
22:44.25funguslol, the dock position looks like he is on the crapper.
22:44.32wpsyeah
22:44.35wpsfunny, huh
22:54.17wpsdataw0lf|w / bigdog_ut, can you please send me a title and description for your presentation?
22:55.17macnewbold"My Presentation, by Bigdog"
23:02.00bigdog_utmacnewbold, that was good
23:02.11bigdog_utwhat am i presenting on again?
23:02.23wpshttp://uphpu.org/calendar_event.php?eid=20050526165209351
23:02.26macnewboldhehe
23:02.37bigdog_utwhat is the name of the remote windows desktop app in linux again?
23:02.44macnewboldrdesktop?
23:02.48macnewboldor vnc?
23:02.57bigdog_utrdesktop sounds right..i have vns
23:02.59bigdog_utrdesktop sounds right..i have vnc
23:10.27wpsno takers to present on PHP 5 and SQLite?
23:10.32wpsfor July?
23:20.58dataw0lfrdesktop is correct.
23:21.20dataw0lfwps: Basic Network Security, Troubleshooting and Tips
23:21.31wpsawesome, thanks
23:21.33dataw0lferr Basic Linux Network Security, Troubleshooting and Tips
23:22.02wpscan you send me a brief description? (a paragraph)
23:22.31dataw0lfSure.
23:22.38dataw0lfadmin@uphpu.org, aye?
23:22.51wpsthat'll work
23:25.33wpsbigdog_ut, you still good being the librarian? or do you want a break?
23:25.47wpsI am not suggesting that we don't want you… just curious if you wanted a break
23:26.40wps:)
23:26.56wpsnot that anyone could every do the kind of job that you have done
23:29.21macnewboldwps: I've never used PHP5 or SQLite, but I'm looking forward to learning about them :)
23:29.40dataw0lfwps: email sent.
23:29.46wpsmeaning that you are going to learn and then present? :)
23:29.50dataw0lfbigdog_ut: hehe, want me to send you what I sent him?
23:29.51wpsthank you, dataw0lf
23:30.10dataw0lfcourse, bigdog_ut will probably ditch me like URAPUG's presentation.
23:30.12dataw0lf;)
23:31.57wpsmacnewbold, do you really want you mobile number on the website?
23:32.05macnewboldhehe
23:32.11macnewboldnot like anyone wants to call me... :)
23:32.52dataw0lf'Yes, I'm really excited about your offer!  But could you call me at home...'
23:33.42macnewboldhehe
23:33.53macnewboldmy cell phone number is already public all over the place, and it's not a problem
23:34.04macnewboldthough I may start screening calls from dataw0lf
23:34.10macnewbold;)
23:34.23dataw0lfhehe.
23:36.16macnewboldIf dataw0lf ever did call, I'd just tell him "urapug"
23:36.21macnewboldand hang up
23:36.29dataw0lfhaha.
23:36.45dataw0lf"Hey Mac, what's up!!! I got this great idea for the group project."
23:36.52dataw0lf"dataw0lf, it's 3:30 am in the morning."
23:37.15dataw0lf"Yeah, but after drinking this 26th beer, it all started to make sense!!"
23:39.21wpsman, has the group come alive this past week or what
23:39.33wpsI think we've had more traffic on the list this week then we have in the past two months
23:39.52fungusattack of the trolls.  
23:49.32macnewboldmain reason the group has come alive is cause of that whole flame war about the top posters
23:49.34macnewbold:)
23:49.40macnewboldanyway, time to go home...

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