| 00:34.19 | *** join/#qi-hardware wej (~j@2001:1af8:4010:a08c:1::6e) |
| 01:47.44 | *** join/#qi-hardware atommann (~atommann@58.251.2.94) |
| 02:58.25 | *** join/#qi-hardware rjeffries (~rjeffries@pool-108-40-199-126.snloca.fios.verizon.net) |
| 03:24.09 | *** join/#qi-hardware xiangfu (~xiangfu@111.198.29.53) |
| 03:58.20 | *** join/#qi-hardware wpwrak (~werner@154-164-231-201.fibertel.com.ar) |
| 04:06.44 | rjeffries | wpwrak would sense to add anelok in the description for this channel. More a focus that Ben NanoNote these days |
| 04:30.40 | wpwrak | psst .. not so loud. you wouldn't want to scare my internet connection. |
| 04:30.54 | wpwrak | for it's a shy and fragile thing ... |
| 04:31.57 | rjeffries | Ok |
| 04:33.52 | wpwrak | regarding adding anelok to the channel topic, well, if anyone does it, it won't complain. not sure if anyone actually pays attention to these things, though :) |
| 04:38.19 | *** mode/#qi-hardware [+o kyak] by ChanServ |
| 04:38.29 | *** topic/#qi-hardware by kyak -> Copyleft hardware - http://qi-hardware.com | hardware hackers join here to discuss Ben NanoNote, atben/atusb 802.15.4 wireless, anelok and other community driven hw projects | public logging at http://en.qi-hardware.com/irclogs and http://irclog.whitequark.org/qi-hardware |
| 04:38.40 | *** mode/#qi-hardware [-o kyak] by kyak |
| 04:39.53 | kyak | sudo topic :) |
| 04:40.49 | wpwrak | whee ! thanks ! :) |
| 04:41.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | ?? |
| 04:41.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh anelok |
| 04:42.22 | rjeffries | what is this Ben Anelok of which you speak? |
| 04:42.39 | wpwrak | it has a nice "low battery" indication: the display flickers heavily, yet the device's power situation is still very far from upsetting the CPU |
| 04:43.20 | DocScrutinizer05 | fair enough |
| 04:44.29 | wpwrak | (looking at the one unit that's been on battery power since march 28. still operational, despite a "standby" current of some 0.9 mA. it does seem to drain the 2032 about twice as fast as i would have expected. but then, 0.9 mA is pretty abnormal anyway.) |
| 04:45.23 | rjeffries | Double A is looking better and better |
| 04:46.22 | wpwrak | AA is very big. AAA may be necessary, though. but let's see. i'd like to keep the small form factor. AAA would add a bulge and also make it less symmetric. |
| 04:46.50 | rjeffries | nods |
| 04:47.59 | rjeffries | One could conceive of industrial design of case that is round on bottom. might feel nice in the hand. |
| 04:48.09 | wpwrak | overall volume would go up by some 20%. not horrible, but every cubic mm counts |
| 04:48.50 | wpwrak | hmm, i think it would be more like a wedge |
| 04:49.34 | wpwrak | save some mm by not having the PCB under/above the battery |
| 04:49.56 | rjeffries | nods |
| 04:52.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | that might actually look nice and ergonomic |
| 04:52.31 | wpwrak | and hell to make with my mill :) |
| 04:52.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | that too |
| 04:53.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | you obviously need a whole new case concept for that |
| 04:53.24 | rjeffries | I'm thinking it might be rather cool. There's a high-end music player out recently that if memory serves, is packaged in a triangular shape case, nt sure why they did it |
| 04:54.00 | wpwrak | but yes, it may look fairly nice. not so sure about ergonomic. the current design is pretty good for two-hand operation. one hand would be an option ... ah, lemme try it ... |
| 04:54.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, we need a sketch |
| 04:54.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | you lost me |
| 04:55.41 | wpwrak | wow, feels very weird. the behaviour of the slider chances quite a bit if you touch it with the side of the thumb |
| 04:55.59 | DocScrutinizer05 | since I'm poor at sketching, is it faintly like http://www.voelkner.de/products/38974/Pult-Gehaeuse-Hit-Pult.html what we're talking about? |
| 04:57.14 | wpwrak | yes, that sort of shape |
| 04:58.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | looks ideal for placing on a table |
| 04:58.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | I know the size and weight is so small it gets tricky with attached cables |
| 04:59.23 | wpwrak | anelok is more the hand-held type. and yes, if you connect a cable, the cable rules, not the inertia of the device :) |
| 05:00.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway that shape of case seems pretty feasible even with your mill |
| 05:01.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | just the concept of 2 quasi-symmetric halfes would have to change |
| 05:02.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | rather build it similar to what's shown in http://www.voelkner.de/products/38974/Pult-Gehaeuse-Hit-Pult.html |
| 05:02.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | regarding shape of parts |
| 05:03.33 | wpwrak | (inertia) 18.2 g :) but with some extra cables that wouldn't be in a "normal" device |
| 05:03.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | up to you if you make the flat part the bottom or the display |
| 05:04.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | 18.2g suffice for a USB plugged to center of "backside" |
| 05:04.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | T |
| 05:05.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | might even work for 90° angle USB plug and L |
| 05:05.18 | wpwrak | well, the connector is on the "front" side. actually has better mechanical properties (though it's there simply because that's how i could make everything fit) |
| 05:05.39 | wpwrak | see also http://anelok.com/test/ |
| 05:06.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | ooh, then no problem |
| 05:21.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | prolly even better would be jack on left or right small side, with a mandatory 90° plug cable |
| 05:27.01 | wpwrak | with this form factor, that's not possible. i have the battery on one side and the antenna on the other. with a wedge, the AAA battery would be on a long side and i'd put USB on a short side. |
| 05:27.25 | wpwrak | but i wouldn't require 90 deg cables ;-) |
| 05:28.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | wpwrak: a straight cable will tirn you device along long axis |
| 05:28.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | turn* |
| 05:29.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe you could put the USB to backside, next to left or right corner. Then you need straight cable |
| 05:32.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | AAA max length 44.50mm |
| 05:33.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | plus holder |
| 05:33.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | usb would add a ?? 5mm on top, 8mm? |
| 05:34.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | maybe you can find a way to mount it upright (tricky) then it's only a 3mm max |
| 05:34.51 | wpwrak | usb would be at Y- of the AAA. since the AAA is very fat, there wuold be plenty of Z room for USB (USB is also fat, but now nearly as bad as AAA) |
| 05:36.02 | wpwrak | cable forces are not such a big issue. if they're inconvenient, then you just grab the connector |
| 05:36.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | please rephrase |
| 05:36.40 | wpwrak | AAA axis would be parallel to X axis. let's say Y = Z = 0 |
| 05:37.37 | wpwrak | then USB insertion movement would also be parallel to X, maybe Y = -10 mm, Z = whatever works |
| 05:38.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | a micro USB receptacle is deeper than wide |
| 05:38.29 | wpwrak | i.e., AAA would be "rear", then USB, similar to where it's on the Ben, then the thin side of the wedge |
| 05:38.54 | wpwrak | mmh, i don't think so. lemme check ... |
| 05:39.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | how wide is anelok now? |
| 05:39.04 | wpwrak | (in any case, depth is no issue) |
| 05:39.17 | wpwrak | see anelok.com/test :) |
| 05:39.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | I don't see any measures there |
| 05:39.45 | wpwrak | did you hover ? |
| 05:39.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | occasionally |
| 05:40.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | well it's easter, nevertheless |
| 05:40.09 | wpwrak | hover over the case and you get the measures |
| 05:40.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | aha |
| 05:40.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | you really should add tags |
| 05:40.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | visible tags to hover |
| 05:40.56 | wpwrak | micro-usb: depth 5-5.6 mm, width 7.5-8.8 mm, height 2.5-3 mm |
| 05:41.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | toldya |
| 05:41.19 | wpwrak | there's a reason why it's called "test" :) |
| 05:41.37 | wpwrak | you said deeper than wide :) |
| 05:41.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | oops |
| 05:41.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | right |
| 05:41.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry, no coffee |
| 05:43.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | anyway, a upright "riser" board for one of the battery contacts and the USB would result in convenient 3mm X width for the USB, heading to back of case which is higher than 8.8mm |
| 05:44.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | such "riser" board easily fixes into two slots in case |
| 05:44.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | just an idea |
| 05:45.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | I see anelok X = 67 mm now, AAA = 45.50mm max |
| 05:46.08 | *** join/#qi-hardware fengling (~fengling@2002:6fc6:1d36:0:8041:4c1:b79b:e977) |
| 05:46.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | AAA dia max: 10.50mm |
| 05:50.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | HEY, you prolly even could use the very USB jack sleeve for minus/GND contact of AAA |
| 05:50.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-D |
| 05:51.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, maybe the shape isn't ideal for this purpose |
| 05:51.38 | wpwrak | no, it isn't :) |
| 05:52.10 | wpwrak | and i wouldn't put the connector at X+ of the battery, but at Y- |
| 05:52.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | why? |
| 05:52.58 | wpwrak | think part of the wedge = battery. medium part = connectors. thin part = just PCB and thin stuff |
| 05:53.04 | wpwrak | s/think/thick/ |
| 05:53.05 | qi-bot | wpwrak meant: "thick part of the wedge = battery. medium part = connectors. thin part = just PCB and thin stuff" |
| 05:53.17 | wpwrak | argl |
| 05:53.53 | wpwrak | the battery is already very long. adding somthing to make the assembly even longer would be bad |
| 05:54.04 | DocScrutinizer05 | I see anelok X = 67 mm now, AAA = 45.50mm max |
| 05:54.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | you're actually wasting space |
| 05:54.51 | wpwrak | i would then put the slider on top of the battery |
| 05:55.16 | wpwrak | so it would be on the long side |
| 05:55.31 | DocScrutinizer05 | that makes think end even bulkier, no? |
| 05:56.17 | wpwrak | not really. the slider is thin. else, i would have a lot of completely unused case surface |
| 05:57.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | ok |
| 05:57.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | sidenote on lanyard hole: not very suited for keyrings |
| 05:57.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | but then... |
| 05:59.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | I mean, for a ring the thing should be as wide as it's deep |
| 05:59.24 | wpwrak | no keyring :) |
| 05:59.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ideally with rounded edges of the hole anyway |
| 05:59.36 | wpwrak | but a standard lanyard fits very nicely |
| 06:00.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | you want at least a 1mm radius there |
| 06:00.26 | wpwrak | naw, where would be the fun in that ? they have to be razor-sharp, with a diamond inlay so that they cut through the lanyard within seconds ;-)) |
| 06:00.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | exactly |
| 06:00.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | ;-) |
| 06:02.53 | wpwrak | the standard cell phone / camera type lanyards seem to fit nicely. i tried the one from my ancient garmin, which is the usual size (goes around the neck, not the smaller ones from cameras that go around the wrist) |
| 06:03.47 | wpwrak | i was too lazy to round the edges, though. but the nylon or whatever it is made of appear to be tough enough :) |
| 06:51.41 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@nat-minsk-pool-46-53-200-107.telecom.by) |
| 08:01.30 | *** join/#qi-hardware pcercuei (~paul@137.71.226.54) |
| 08:01.35 | *** join/#qi-hardware atommann (~atommann@58.251.2.94) |
| 08:10.12 | *** join/#qi-hardware rjeffries (~rjeffries@pool-108-40-199-126.snloca.fios.verizon.net) |
| 08:28.28 | *** join/#qi-hardware wolfspraul (~wolfsprau@xd9bad184.dyn.telefonica.de) |
| 08:53.41 | *** join/#qi-hardware rejon (~rejon@223.17.152.15) |
| 08:59.45 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@nat-minsk-pool-46-53-200-107.telecom.by) |
| 09:53.19 | *** join/#qi-hardware infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 09:53.19 | *** topic/#qi-hardware is Copyleft hardware - http://qi-hardware.com | hardware hackers join here to discuss Ben NanoNote, atben/atusb 802.15.4 wireless, anelok and other community driven hw projects | public logging at http://en.qi-hardware.com/irclogs and http://irclog.whitequark.org/qi-hardware |
| 09:53.19 | *** mode/#qi-hardware [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
| 10:20.15 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@port-253-adslby-pool36.infonet.by) |
| 11:06.02 | *** join/#qi-hardware Haswell (~broaderba@unaffiliated/haswell) |
| 11:13.09 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@port-253-adslby-pool36.infonet.by) |
| 11:37.23 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@port-201-adslby-pool41.infonet.by) |
| 12:26.49 | *** join/#qi-hardware atommann (~atommann@222.248.72.156) |
| 12:47.12 | rjeffries | wpwrak your "what if" discussion re revised case w/AAA rather than CR2032 is encouraging |
| 12:49.09 | rjeffries | looking at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AAA_battery |
| 12:54.41 | rjeffries | one benefit is in AAA size is variety of batter chemistries available. |
| 12:57.48 | rjeffries | Lithium Iron Disulfide Li FeS2 has advantage of exceptionally low self-discharge if I understand correctly |
| 12:57.59 | rjeffries | http://gadgetsandgear.net/Data%20Sheets/Cn%20data%20sheets/FR03%20Data%20Sheet.pdf |
| 13:30.23 | *** join/#qi-hardware kilae (~chatzilla@catv-162-034.tbwil.ch) |
| 13:33.33 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor (~jek@port-201-adslby-pool41.infonet.by) |
| 13:36.31 | *** join/#qi-hardware zrafa (~rafa@200.85.178.139) |
| 14:30.01 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor_ (~jek@port-201-adslby-pool41.infonet.by) |
| 14:32.49 | *** join/#qi-hardware wolfspra1l (~wolfsprau@xd9bad184.dyn.telefonica.de) |
| 14:32.58 | *** join/#qi-hardware pcercuei_ (~paul@p4FDE75E3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:06.01 | *** join/#qi-hardware atommann (~atommann@222.248.72.156) |
| 16:18.13 | *** join/#qi-hardware FDCX (~fdcx@2a02:2f0a:a02f:ffff::bc19:fa10) |
| 17:59.47 | *** join/#qi-hardware FDCX_ (~fdcx@188.25.250.16) |
| 18:07.40 | *** join/#qi-hardware pcercuei (~pcercuei@2a02:810d:1b40:1118:1af4:6aff:fec5:1c8f) |
| 18:48.51 | *** join/#qi-hardware wolfspraul (~wolfsprau@xd9bad184.dyn.telefonica.de) |
| 19:57.13 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor_ (~jek@nat-minsk-pool-46-53-200-107.telecom.by) |
| 20:33.49 | *** join/#qi-hardware freespace (~steve@167.160.169.163) |
| 20:33.58 | *** join/#qi-hardware jekhor_ (~jek@nat-minsk-pool-46-53-200-107.telecom.by) |
| 20:39.16 | *** join/#qi-hardware freespace (foobar@167.160.169.163) |
| 21:40.33 | *** join/#qi-hardware unclouded (~neil@2001:4428:200:80fc:7e05:7ff:fe0d:d421) |
| 22:03.43 | *** join/#qi-hardware wpwrak (~werner@154-164-231-201.fibertel.com.ar) |
| 23:14.42 | wpwrak | hmm, seems that the nighttime internet curfew is beginning again ... |