| 00:03.14 | mwester | yes, if you are permitted to tell me |
| 00:03.45 | mwester | I'm wondering about the connection from the s3c2410 UART to the GSM modem -- what is the mux chip, does it have specs? |
| 00:03.55 | roh | there is no chip |
| 00:04.07 | roh | its firmware only inside the gsm arm |
| 00:04.29 | mwester | So where does the console connect? to the GSM? |
| 00:06.11 | mwester | Specifically I'm observing that when the GSM wakes up the system from suspend, data is transmitted immediately after the 50606 driver is resumed -- I'm wondering if that is coincidence. That then brings up the question of how is the PMU connected to the GSM and the device that muxes the serial port? |
| 00:07.02 | roh | mwester: there is a latch in between |
| 00:07.07 | mwester | This is important because I think this may impact how to resume without risking overruns; it would be pointless to manipulate the I/O lines if the device on the other end were unpowered (for example). |
| 00:07.35 | mwester | Ah, and is the latch powered by a bus switched by the PMU? and what clocks it to latch the contents? |
| 00:07.48 | roh | its controlled by GSM_EN which has a pullup and a line to EINT2/GPF2 |
| 00:08.16 | roh | controlled by the regular soc, not pmu |
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| 00:11.37 | roh | the latch is powered by io_3v3.. thats sane |
| 00:12.02 | roh | hm.. one could remove 2 resistors and add 2 nc and have the modem tx and rx on the usb conn *shiver* |
| 00:12.10 | roh | but no cts/rts |
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| 00:14.48 | roh | the latch is a SN74LV125ARGYR, means negative logic control line, noninverting or so |
| 00:15.07 | mwester | Ah, that's a rather simple device, IIRC. |
| 00:17.10 | roh | jap. it only switches all 4 lines from/to the modem through to it. |
| 00:17.39 | roh | the rx and tx on the debug conn are connected directly to the samsung. |
| 00:17.52 | mwester | How is the console disabled when the modem is activated? does it have its own buffer/line driver that is disabled when the modem is enabled? |
| 00:17.55 | roh | so you should 'see' the modem talking there |
| 00:18.21 | mwester | Ah, but I don't see the modem talking there... |
| 00:18.30 | roh | uhm.. well.. see the cpu talking to the modem and you can talk to the cpu, |
| 00:18.46 | roh | eeheheh.. would need some hacky 2nd serial to see both directions |
| 00:18.55 | mwester | Ah, of course. |
| 00:19.34 | roh | one could mod a debugboard for that. or a moko |
| 00:20.00 | mwester | :) Now there's the problem :D I don't have enough of either. |
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| 00:20.15 | SpeedEvil | mwester: or I think you can get to the GPS CTS/RTS pads easily |
| 00:20.32 | SpeedEvil | I seem to recall tehy are brought out to solderpads just above the LCD |
| 00:20.36 | roh | *remark* really need a 2-way usb serial sniffer with all blinkylights on, flow control, wiggling of single lines, hw as well as sw uart and baudrate measurement |
| 00:20.44 | SpeedEvil | these can be configured as /dev/ttySAC3 |
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| 00:20.57 | mwester | roh: plus the scope on the interrupt line from the GSM. |
| 00:21.01 | SpeedEvil | these can be configured as /dev/ttySAC2 |
| 00:21.15 | SpeedEvil | If the aim is simply to have an uninterrupted console |
| 00:22.02 | mwester | I would really *LOVE* somebody to confirm that there are no glitches on any of those signals during suspend and resume; I have no such confidence as it seems to me that the serial driver was never written to save the UART state; rather it seemed to be written to re-init each time. |
| 00:22.40 | SpeedEvil | only has an analog scope, which isnt' great for that. |
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| 00:22.45 | roh | i fear something like that. |
| 00:22.48 | mwester | SpeedEvil: one of the big "regrets" of the GTA01, I suspect, is the split use of ttySAC0 for console and GSM -- it's hard to get worse. |
| 00:23.06 | roh | mwester: agreed. |
| 00:23.11 | SpeedEvil | mwester: yeah - you don't have to use SAC0 for console though - you can make it SAC2 I think. |
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| 00:23.24 | SpeedEvil | If you don't care about the GPS not working |
| 00:23.43 | mwester | For example, as you dig through the suspend/resume code, you find that the console changes fundamental behavior (the port is initi'd twice, with different termios structures, for example). |
| 00:23.44 | roh | the only thing is, you cannot disconnect the gps, only power it down and hope |
| 00:23.57 | SpeedEvil | roh: oh yeah. Hmm. |
| 00:24.02 | mwester | SpeedEvil: u-boot would need to initialize SAC2 for that to work; I tried it. |
| 00:24.10 | SpeedEvil | mwester: yes, it would. |
| 00:24.57 | mwester | I think it's easier to disable the console in inappropriate spots, and avoid the problems that way. |
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| 00:25.31 | SpeedEvil | roh: I suppose it depends if the GPS loads the lines when powered down enough to ignore it serial input. |
| 00:25.50 | SpeedEvil | ponders. |
| 00:26.02 | SpeedEvil | Sigh. I need a digital scope of some description. |
| 00:26.02 | mwester | But, but, but - I want my GPS too! :D |
| 00:26.19 | SpeedEvil | mwester: yeah - this would only be a debug tool for looking at glitches |
| 00:26.45 | SpeedEvil | roh: happen to know anything about the GSM-firmware-flashing-in-the-field quesiton? |
| 00:26.51 | roh | SpeedEvil me too. friends of mine at the cccb have a agilent 2+16channel mixed signal dso.. thats cool |
| 00:27.09 | SpeedEvil | roh: that's a bit more than what I'm looking at. |
| 00:27.15 | roh | means 2 channel dso (still ctr, no lcd) and 16 channel logic input |
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| 00:27.31 | SpeedEvil | roh: unfortunately. Ebay, china. |
| 00:27.33 | roh | superb for this problem, but sadly i cannot just get it from there. |
| 00:27.34 | mwester | Well, I'm changing strategies now, and I'm just going to disable and delay things longer, and hope that all glitching is done and over. Hence the quesitons about the PMU; I think I shall wait until after the PMU is init'd to enale the GSM. |
| 00:28.14 | mwester | BTW, I suspect that the MMC resume is adding ~ 200 - 230 ms to the resume time. We'll need to do something about that. |
| 00:28.19 | roh | mwester: there is this spike on all gpio on suspend.. could that change state somewhere? |
| 00:28.57 | mwester | roh: I wouldn't have thought it long enough to do so, but it is certainly possible. |
| 00:29.02 | roh | its while powering off rails. there seems to be some discrepancy between what the arm wants as order and whats possible with that pmu (but there isnt a more fitting one afaik) |
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| 00:29.58 | roh | well.. my assumption atm is to get a moko, wire all 4 modem lines at the arm to it and measure it |
| 00:30.11 | roh | s/moko + 4channel dso/ |
| 00:30.59 | mwester | I suspect there will be a number of very low cost GTA01's on eBay as soon as the 02 ships, perhaps that would be a good way to aquire some stock for testing purposes. (I lack equipment to do it correctly, I'm afraid). |
| 00:31.07 | roh | we could try asking seanc if they have a board wired up like that already in taiwan |
| 00:31.23 | SpeedEvil | wants brokenmoko bits. |
| 00:31.28 | SpeedEvil | Cases, ... |
| 00:31.40 | roh | mokos shouldnt be the problem. time and soldering caps are it ;) |
| 00:31.50 | SpeedEvil | I think I've got a way to fit a wifi card into my GTA01. |
| 00:31.58 | mwester | That might not be a bad idea. The GSM module is the same on the GTA02, and if this is a kernel/GSM problem, we'll have it on the 02 as well (although that has twice the FIFO on the UARTs IIRC) |
| 00:32.02 | SpeedEvil | But I don't want to butcher my only case. |
| 00:32.14 | roh | SpeedEvil rip out the speakers, wire it to spi? |
| 00:32.30 | SpeedEvil | roh: I have a USB board only, so it'd be that. |
| 00:33.00 | SpeedEvil | roh: rip out the GPS antenna, place board where it is, place small ceramic antenna on top of where GPS antenna was. |
| 00:33.12 | SpeedEvil | roh: rip out the GPS antenna, place board where it is, place small ceramic GPS antenna on top of where GPS antenna was. |
| 00:33.13 | roh | mwester: as more as i think about it i am quite sure the issue has to do with that latch and the spikes (which should be gone on gta02 , i think) |
| 00:34.28 | mwester | If we assume that a spike occurs as the PMU powers things up, and that this affects the latch, that could account for the consistent pattern of the overrun. |
| 00:36.27 | summatusmentis | CRAP! Just deleted the VM I had openmoko in |
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| 00:39.52 | dcordes1 | downer |
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| 01:40.47 | bmk789 | Will i be able to connect my BT headphones to my Freerunner and make calls with the headphones? or is that one of those things that seems easy but is almost impossible in the FOSS world? |
| 01:40.51 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 01:41.02 | SpeedEvil | in the 'the hardware is there' sense |
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| 01:41.42 | bmk789 | but i dont imagine it will be able to do it out of the box right? |
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| 01:48.48 | SpeedEvil | Do the headphones have microphone on them? |
| 01:49.42 | bmk789 | yes |
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| 01:51.03 | SpeedEvil | I recall mentions on the wiki of bluetooth calling working - but not to initiate calls. |
| 01:53.24 | bmk789 | hmm, ill have to search the wiki |
| 01:53.49 | SpeedEvil | just search onb bluetooth |
| 01:53.51 | SpeedEvil | there isn't much |
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| 02:15.43 | jadams_ | my ipod touch just came in |
| 02:16.26 | SpeedEvil | turns off his innuendo filter. |
| 02:17.07 | mjr | what, you have an innuendo filter? |
| 02:17.56 | jadams_ | is there any effort being made to super-simplify gprsification on the moko? |
| 02:17.56 | rtm | The ipod touch is not fun. It comes with functional software. |
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| 02:18.10 | jadams_ | rtm: I don't agree with it philosophically. But jailbroken, it's pretty fun |
| 02:18.58 | rtm | jadams: I guess a fugitive ipod is ok. |
| 02:19.34 | mjr | the problem with fugitive iThings is you still pay the jailer.. |
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| 04:33.12 | justin_ | is there any date set in stone for the consumer release yet |
| 04:40.06 | rtm | gosh, there's no date for the *developer's* release yet. |
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| 05:26.41 | ScaredyCat | hrmm... anyone else found their neo in a funny state in the morning ? |
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| 05:39.33 | mwester | wonders at the question, as if the neo is ever in a "normal" state |
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| 06:02.58 | ScaredyCat | well, perhaps not, but twice now about a week apart I've come back to the neo to find it in an apparent off state but the only way to get it to respond in any way is to remove and replace the battery |
| 06:06.04 | cibomahto | ScardeyCat: That happens to me when I had the 'dim first, then lock' suspend mode selected |
| 06:06.20 | cibomahto | surely you have a more interesting problem :-) |
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| 06:46.32 | Mek | okay... my openmoko-devel-image/openmoko-qtopia-image builds succeeded, now only my openmoko-feed build is failing... |
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| 06:51.08 | cibomahto | Mek: Good job. I haven't gotten an openmoko-devel-image to work in some days |
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| 07:04.53 | Hopscotch | good morning |
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| 08:41.38 | josch_ | !seen michaelshiloh |
| 08:41.40 | cdbot2 | MichaelShiloh (n=chatzill@166.129.245.150) was last seen quitting from #openmoko 15 hours, 6 minutes ago stating (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)). |
| 08:41.46 | josch_ | darn |
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| 08:52.04 | fish_ | can someone clarify that for me: i've read about that 'power management issue' here and there. is that a software-only problem or is there still an issue with the hardware? |
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| 09:21.10 | cnwdup | hello |
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| 09:23.20 | cnwdup | I am seriously considering ordering a freerunner, but I have a few questions first I couldn't find answers for in the wiki. First: Is phoning possible? Seems as if sending SMS is possibly by now. What's the deal with receiving SMS? How is standby working? |
| 09:24.15 | edistar | cnwdup: phoning is possible |
| 09:25.02 | emilis_info | whatabout battery life? |
| 09:25.26 | edistar | emilis_info: afaik it runs 6h when used actively |
| 09:26.02 | emilis_info | hmm |
| 09:26.05 | emilis_info | and standby? |
| 09:26.12 | cnwdup | edistar: That's good. If it was possible receiving sms as well, I'd buy it right away. But with this not being the case, I am not quite sure. Thus I am interested in what exactly isn't working with receiving sms. |
| 09:26.30 | edistar | emilis_info: I suppose you mean suspend, I think about 60h is manageable |
| 09:26.39 | edistar | cnwdup: it can |
| 09:26.46 | emilis_info | can you receive calls and sms in suspend? |
| 09:26.56 | emilis_info | 60h is decent enough for me, for a linux phone ;-) |
| 09:26.57 | edistar | emilis_info: yes, it wakes up |
| 09:27.01 | emilis_info | cool |
| 09:27.03 | emilis_info | ;) |
| 09:27.12 | edistar | at least usually;) |
| 09:27.20 | cnwdup | edistar: I can receive SMS but it's not able to read them or what? Or is the wiki outdated and it can send *and* receive sms? |
| 09:27.58 | edistar | cnwdup: last time someone asked here some people said that reading and writing sms is possibe |
| 09:28.04 | edistar | *possible |
| 09:28.24 | cnwdup | edistar: Oh, that's pretty cool. |
| 09:28.34 | cnwdup | Thanks for your information. (= I think I'll order today. |
| 09:29.07 | cnwdup | *going to |
| 09:29.32 | emilis_info | where can you order it today? |
| 09:29.45 | emilis_info | shop says it is sold out |
| 09:29.52 | edistar | emilis_info: trisoft.de/openmoko |
| 09:29.56 | cnwdup | emilis_info: On trisoft.de you can pre-order it for the german (european?) market. |
| 09:29.57 | edistar | emilis_info: for europe |
| 09:30.11 | emilis_info | 404 |
| 09:30.18 | cnwdup | And it says it'll be shipped at the end of this month. |
| 09:30.27 | emilis_info | ah, redirected to somewhere where it works |
| 09:30.27 | *** join/#openmoko johncylee (n=john@firewall.tw.openmoko.org) |
| 09:30.29 | emilis_info | :) |
| 09:30.55 | cnwdup | Are there any reasons against ordering a freerunner now? |
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| 09:32.06 | edistar | cnwdup: the usual.. might still be hw bugs that have't been found yet.. but that's na permanent reason |
| 09:32.22 | edistar | cnwdup: so in half a year you might think the same |
| 09:32.34 | emilis_info | hmm |
| 09:32.49 | cnwdup | Yeah, the fact that it's open source and still has its bugs is actually no big deal for me. |
| 09:33.47 | cnwdup | Eh, the bugs are not a big deal. The "open source" thing is actually a huge pro. :D |
| 09:34.47 | edistar | cnwdup: :) |
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| 09:41.21 | pyknite | is there a backup manager on the freerunner (for sms/mail/calendar/...)? |
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| 09:48.09 | ScaredyCat | scp |
| 09:48.58 | thos | rsync? |
| 09:50.17 | pyknite | hum ok |
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| 09:50.55 | pyknite | when i get my freerunner and got time (to work at school) i will see if i can code one (like some software on windoews mobile) |
| 09:52.13 | roh | pyknite well. you could write some ui for rsync or boxbackup |
| 09:52.50 | zedstar | or unison |
| 09:52.51 | pyknite | yeah exactly... |
| 09:53.11 | pyknite | the graphiq tools are gtk? or something else? |
| 09:53.31 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4391 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libopkg/opkg.c: opkg: add some safety macros |
| 09:53.36 | zedstar | i think there are some gtk front ends to rsync and unison u can adapt |
| 09:53.45 | roh | pyknite basically everything that can render to x11 |
| 09:53.57 | roh | gtk or efl or similar stuff is propably preferred |
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| 09:54.09 | roh | your choice |
| 09:54.13 | pyknite | ok... and main language is python? c++? |
| 09:54.36 | thos | pyknite, gtk+ is available on the default images |
| 09:54.47 | pyknite | ok |
| 09:54.51 | thos | pyknite, and python is not available on default images |
| 09:54.54 | thos | yet anyway |
| 09:55.10 | thos | pyknite, I would suggest C and GTK+ if you have the apprioriate experience |
| 09:57.18 | ScaredyCat | syncml !! |
| 09:57.43 | pyknite | ok.. i will read some tut on gtk ;) (and c too, make too many c++ and ada at school :( ) |
| 10:00.17 | pyknite | ....ada is to boring |
| 10:00.52 | Sup3rkiddo | pyknite, remember, real men directly program using logic gates |
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| 10:02.03 | pyknite | Sup3rkiddo: hum... I'm not a men... I'm a student :D |
| 10:02.14 | Sup3rkiddo | too :/ |
| 10:02.21 | Sup3rkiddo | i am a student man |
| 10:02.58 | pyknite | in dev? |
| 10:10.17 | SpeedEvil | mwester:pin |
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| 11:11.53 | ScaredyCat | goes a little ott with the btkb script |
| 11:12.11 | SpeedEvil | btkb? |
| 11:12.21 | SpeedEvil | bluetooth keyboard? |
| 11:15.10 | ScaredyCat | yeah |
| 11:15.32 | ScaredyCat | works well now... and I have zenity so it's all wizzy |
| 11:15.40 | SpeedEvil | zenity? |
| 11:15.58 | ScaredyCat | x dialogs for scripts |
| 11:16.06 | SpeedEvil | ah |
| 11:16.16 | ScaredyCat | so now at least you get to pick the keyboard it connects to... |
| 11:16.28 | ScaredyCat | rather than it just attaching to the first one it finds |
| 11:16.53 | SpeedEvil | 'It comes from the same family as dialog, Xdialog, and cdialog, but it surpasses those projects by having a cooler name.' |
| 11:17.05 | ScaredyCat | heheh |
| 11:17.13 | ScaredyCat | well, it works too. |
| 11:17.28 | ScaredyCat | and I couldn;t get xdialog to compile properly |
| 11:17.48 | ScaredyCat | zenity was a pain - but now it compiles ok |
| 11:18.11 | SpeedEvil | Nice. |
| 11:20.10 | ScaredyCat | http://scap.linuxtogo.org/ |
| 11:21.15 | SpeedEvil | Now all you need is a flexible configuration script for GPRS :) |
| 11:21.26 | ScaredyCat | :) |
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| 11:40.48 | *** join/#openmoko profoX` (n=wesley@ubuntu/member/profox) |
| 11:40.54 | profoX` | hello everyone |
| 11:41.07 | profoX` | does the Openmoko support OpenGL ES? |
| 11:42.02 | SpeedEvil | No |
| 11:42.18 | SpeedEvil | At least - if you're asking 'is it 3D acceleerated' |
| 11:42.39 | profoX` | oh :( |
| 11:42.40 | SpeedEvil | 3D acceleration will not happen in the freerunner |
| 11:43.03 | thos | well, OpenGL ES is supposed to be in there, but no one is planning on writing a driver for it |
| 11:43.10 | thos | and it will probably suck balls anyway |
| 11:43.29 | SpeedEvil | Yeah - it'll 'work' in the sense that it's all software emulated. |
| 11:43.46 | thos | SpeedEvil? |
| 11:43.56 | raster | the only way it will be written is if the specs get out from nda |
| 11:44.02 | thos | SpeedEvil, the glamo chip is supposed to have (some) GLES support |
| 11:44.10 | thos | but like raster says... |
| 11:44.11 | raster | those with nda's dont have the time/money to work on it |
| 11:44.12 | raster | :( |
| 11:44.33 | SpeedEvil | As I understood it , ES supports an emulated mode on dumb framebuffer too |
| 11:44.36 | raster | even if u spent the time - i am very dubious of the qialty of 3d u will experience and if it was worth the effort :( |
| 11:44.38 | SpeedEvil | which is what I meant. |
| 11:44.57 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-171-203.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 11:45.05 | raster | SpeedEvil: all GL can be eumlated |
| 11:45.06 | raster | in software |
| 11:45.09 | raster | ... in theory |
| 11:45.10 | SpeedEvil | In that it's just a software 3D library in effect, not significnatly hardware accelerated. |
| 11:45.16 | raster | its just a question of how slow it will be |
| 11:45.17 | raster | :) |
| 11:45.21 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 11:45.43 | raster | chances are it will be so slow - continental drift will begin to look interesting and fast |
| 11:45.53 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 11:45.57 | raster | u only get a fast software 3d enigne if u cut features and take shortcuts |
| 11:46.11 | raster | and "introcue errors" in rendering that are "acceptable" tradeoffs for speed |
| 11:46.13 | raster | :) |
| 11:46.15 | SpeedEvil | And you have a fast video bus. |
| 11:46.19 | raster | yeah |
| 11:46.20 | raster | that too |
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| 11:50.47 | SpeedEvil | goes back to routing his graphics board, such as it is. |
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| 12:13.27 | Onef | good day to all!!! |
| 12:13.49 | Bubbi | well hello Onef |
| 12:14.09 | Onef | there are any information about the mass release? |
| 12:14.34 | Onef | in interne I've found many info... but no one are in agree with the others... |
| 12:16.30 | Bubbi | Onef: shh.. it's a secret.. |
| 12:17.03 | Bubbi | as the topic suggests.. "The Freerunner phone (with wifi) will be released at some time" |
| 12:17.11 | *** join/#openmoko tr2x (n=alvar@80-218-176-45.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 12:17.22 | Bubbi | so no-one really knows yet.. but hopefully soon |
| 12:17.32 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4392 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libbb/ (unarchive.c unzip.c): opkg: fix some initialisation and double free issues in libbb |
| 12:18.46 | Onef | Bubbi: I've read on top :D but I've thought maybe here on IRC someone know somthing more :) |
| 12:19.50 | Bubbi | Onef: we're all here for the same thing then ;) Everybody wants to know when and what.. but no-one can reply :) |
| 12:20.46 | Onef | eheh understood ;) nevermind we'll wait lil'bit... |
| 12:21.22 | rtm | I think that CIA-42 guy knows the release date. |
| 12:24.19 | ScaredyCat | ~lart the CIA |
| 12:24.19 | apt | takes the CIA to the vet for a "special" visit |
| 12:24.53 | *** join/#openmoko tombhadAC (n=tombhad@pD95DC589.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 12:25.56 | Bubbi | don't think you can trust the CIA... |
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| 12:28.17 | rtm | The DVT tests involve waterboarding. |
| 12:28.54 | pitbullpc | hi all, anyone seen sameo around? |
| 12:29.17 | ScaredyCat | ~seen sameo |
| 12:29.20 | apt | sameo <n=samuel@AAnnecy-257-1-141-89.w90-41.abo.wanadoo.fr> was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 126d 2h 3m 59s ago, saying: 'CM: let's hope so, yes.'. |
| 12:29.33 | ScaredyCat | that would be a no hten pitbullpc |
| 12:29.52 | pitbullpc | damn, he fell of the face of the earth |
| 12:30.21 | pitbullpc | i was wondering what ever came of the AR6001 driver he was working on |
| 12:31.02 | josch | could someone ping me when michaelshiloh comes online? i would be very grateful - a camisole is at stake!! |
| 12:31.26 | ScaredyCat | whatever information we have is at least 26d 2h 3m 59 old |
| 12:32.20 | ScaredyCat | s/26/126/ |
| 12:32.38 | pitbullpc | where might that information be found |
| 12:33.55 | ScaredyCat | google ... or sameo's website (where ever that may be) |
| 12:34.32 | ScaredyCat | lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/commitlog/2008-January/003453.html |
| 12:34.42 | ScaredyCat | last commit |
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| 12:38.04 | pitbullpc | <PROTECTED> |
| 12:38.30 | pitbullpc | at any rate, thanks for the info |
| 12:39.22 | XorA | his driver work is effectively finished AFAIK |
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| 12:39.54 | pitbullpc | last I talked to him he was having significant throughput issues |
| 12:40.18 | XorA | I beleive that was fixed with a firmware update from atheros if I recall the correct problem |
| 12:40.46 | pitbullpc | good deal |
| 12:41.15 | pitbullpc | i also sent him an Eye-fi card to hack at. anyone ever hear anything about that? |
| 12:42.03 | XorA | no |
| 12:42.40 | pitbullpc | do you know what the eye-fi card is? |
| 12:43.47 | XorA | nope |
| 12:44.17 | pitbullpc | it is really pretty impressive. a 2 GB SD card with an embedded AR6001 |
| 12:44.45 | XorA | sweet |
| 12:44.57 | XorA | like the old Sandisk Connect+ cards |
| 12:44.58 | pitbullpc | designed to be cofigured via a pc and stuck in a digital camera to wirelessly upload your pics to flickr or whereever |
| 12:45.47 | pitbullpc | http://www.eye.fi/ |
| 12:46.01 | mjr | yeah I've heard of it, it's a nifty kludge since digital cameras are so limited in wireless connectivity... |
| 12:46.16 | mjr | I mean come on, gimme at least bluetooth for cheap cams... |
| 12:46.47 | mjr | haha, first vanity fi domain I've seen :) |
| 12:46.55 | mjr | Well, there's sci.fi, but that doesn't count ;) |
| 12:47.27 | pitbullpc | it has special firmware that would need to be changed, but i envision that this card could be hacked to be an easy wireless upgrade to any linux based cell/pda platform that doesn't have wireless and has an SD slot |
| 12:47.42 | pitbullpc | lol |
| 12:48.30 | pitbullpc | not sure with they just didn't use www.eye-fi.com |
| 12:49.15 | mjr | I dunno, the card is rather limited as sold, would probably be a nontrivial firmware hack... |
| 12:49.35 | mjr | don't we have sdio wifi anyways? |
| 12:49.58 | pitbullpc | not in that form factor |
| 12:50.11 | mjr | okay |
| 12:50.32 | anrp | yeah, usually its got extra length and thickness beyond the standard sd size |
| 12:50.52 | anrp | that would be quite handy for a zaurus, for instance |
| 12:51.08 | pitbullpc | since it is the size of a generic SD card it can be completely house within the SD slot |
| 12:51.23 | anrp | of course... many sd card slots are made & surrounded by metal |
| 12:51.23 | pitbullpc | nothing poking out to get broke off |
| 12:51.30 | anrp | so who knows how well it would work |
| 12:52.22 | pitbullpc | that is true, but this thing is supposed to work in older SD digital cameras, and you know they didn't use plastic slot with this in mind |
| 12:53.23 | ScaredyCat | http://dist.trolltech.com/video/wince/qtembedded44video.html |
| 12:53.51 | anrp | wince |
| 12:53.52 | anrp | ~_~ |
| 12:53.53 | apt | :/ |
| 12:54.14 | anrp | ... |
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| 12:56.59 | pitbullpc | if the firmware could be replaced with the normal Atheros firmware for the chip, then this could be extremely easy (provided one has access to an Atheros Radio Test station and the stock firmware) |
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| 12:59.00 | Onef | sorry to bother you again... there is some emulation of the current point of the release (usable under Windows...) |
| 12:59.33 | *** join/#openmoko pyknite (n=pyknite@pub1.heig-vd.ch) |
| 12:59.41 | anrp | mentally swaps is and there |
| 13:00.10 | mjr | pitbullpc, I don't think it's likely to be hooked up in a way that the normal firmware would be able to function as directed from the host computer, but *shrug |
| 13:01.06 | pitbullpc | well, you would need to have an SD interface to the PC |
| 13:02.12 | pitbullpc | in particular this thing called an Ellen Card (SD to PCI) and the PC would need to run the ART software to reflash the firmware |
| 13:02.23 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89_ (n=ewanm89@unaffiliated/ewanm89) |
| 13:02.55 | YetAnotherNoob | hello everyone. i'm building a devel image for neo1973 - or at least i'm trying - on an debian system. make setup works and after make openmoko-devel-image the system was busy for 2h or so. the process terminated with ERROR: '/home/darkschneider/moko/openembedded/packages/linux/linux-openmoko_2.6.24+git.bb' failed question: how do i find out what is wrong ? looks like the kernelbuild faild ... |
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| 13:03.44 | pitbullpc | the harder part would be doing the calibration |
| 13:05.32 | pitbullpc | anyway, i'll give this some more thought and ping some ideas of off some engineers i know at one of the Atheros authorized design centers |
| 13:05.54 | pitbullpc | got to run, take care |
| 13:05.59 | *** part/#openmoko pitbullpc (n=mbergand@194.32.100.97.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 13:06.17 | anrp | YetAnotherNoob: maybe post the last 50 lines of the build process to pastebin |
| 13:06.21 | anrp | that isn't really enough to say |
| 13:07.19 | YetAnotherNoob | what is pastebin ? |
| 13:07.31 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=Kevin@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 13:08.45 | anrp | http://pastebin.com/ |
| 13:09.00 | anrp | just a tool to help to not clutter irc |
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| 13:12.14 | YetAnotherNoob | very well. posted to pastebin. |
| 13:12.54 | anrp | ... now, you have to post the link here so we can see it :\ |
| 13:13.40 | YetAnotherNoob | good point. sorry. http://pastebin.com/m6332ff90 |
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| 13:14.10 | *** join/#openmoko sameo (n=samuel@AAnnecy-256-1-14-133.w90-10.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 13:15.48 | anrp | mmm, it actually failed on coreutils |
| 13:16.02 | anrp | error: short SHA1 4194 is ambiguous. |
| 13:16.13 | anrp | dunno where that 4194 came from |
| 13:16.25 | anrp | maybe post /home/darkschneider/moko/openembedded/packages/coreutils/coreutils-native_5.3.0.bb ? |
| 13:18.11 | ScaredyCat | wonders if 1 freerunner could power another from it's usb port creating an endless supply of electricity |
| 13:18.38 | mjr | Good idea. If not, should be a goal for the next-gen device! |
| 13:18.39 | ScaredyCat | it's because someone didn't change the srcrev |
| 13:18.42 | XorA | ScaredyCat: we should ship you two and see if you can end the universe from there |
| 13:18.49 | ScaredyCat | ok.. |
| 13:18.51 | YetAnotherNoob | posted: http://pastebin.com/d102279ed |
| 13:18.52 | ScaredyCat | no problem |
| 13:18.58 | ScaredyCat | ship them now! :S |
| 13:19.00 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 13:19.02 | ScaredyCat | even |
| 13:19.44 | XorA | ScaredyCat: heh, Im first in the Queue for freerunner |
| 13:20.23 | ScaredyCat | don't you just have to reach over to one of hte other desks in the office to get one though?# |
| 13:21.15 | anrp | pokes ScaredyCat to elaborate on the srcrev |
| 13:21.37 | ScaredyCat | XorA: just be sure to say 'Yoink!' when you take them |
| 13:21.38 | *** join/#openmoko AzalynHD (n=junon@mcbain.semsolutions.com) |
| 13:21.52 | ScaredyCat | anrp: there was a move from svn to git |
| 13:22.11 | XorA | ScaredyCat: well as Im a few thousand miles away from office, that would have to be a loud YOINK! |
| 13:22.34 | ScaredyCat | XorA: yoip |
| 13:22.56 | *** join/#openmoko massoud (n=massoud@59-124-111-20.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 13:22.57 | XorA | Yoink Over Internet Protocol :-) |
| 13:26.01 | *** join/#openmoko pvborza (n=pvborza@79.119.153.220) |
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| 13:29.12 | Sup3rkiddo | woo...dbus server support for vala :D |
| 13:29.19 | Sup3rkiddo | oops..wrong window |
| 13:33.49 | pvborza | does anyone know Daniel Willmann's nick? |
| 13:34.36 | *** join/#openmoko spydon (n=spydon@90-227-33-55-no42.tbcn.telia.com) |
| 13:39.23 | fgau | pvborza: i think, alphaone |
| 13:39.25 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@209.195.169.219) |
| 13:41.23 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03sean_chiang * r4393 10/trunk/src/target/audio/om-gta02/gsmhandset.state: loud the voulume of mic |
| 13:43.07 | pvborza | thanks |
| 13:43.17 | *** part/#openmoko pvborza (n=pvborza@79.119.153.220) |
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| 14:01.46 | SpeedEvil | http://xkcd.com/413/ |
| 14:02.42 | *** join/#openmoko emonkey (n=emonkey@ubuntu/member/emonkey) |
| 14:03.44 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:03.59 | mwester | SpeedEvil: pong! |
| 14:04.32 | Bubbi | great fun there :P |
| 14:04.48 | SpeedEvil | tries to remember what he was thinking of. |
| 14:05.07 | SpeedEvil | Oh yeah. |
| 14:05.10 | mwester | suggests ginsing; it's supposed to be good for memory |
| 14:05.30 | SpeedEvil | Can you give me an exact test that you'd like to do with a scope on the GTA01 |
| 14:05.37 | SpeedEvil | to find glitches |
| 14:07.52 | *** join/#openmoko retracile_ (n=eli@76-204-213-211.lightspeed.allntx.sbcglobal.net) |
| 14:07.58 | mwester | :) I'll have to put together some test cases that would be reproducable. Do you have a working SIM, or do we need to find a way to tickle the GSM w/o SIM? |
| 14:08.07 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 14:10.12 | mwester | Ok. The new day has brought me new suspicions on this; I'll see if this new line of investigation reveals anything before I trouble you. Thanks! |
| 14:10.19 | Bubbi | SpeedEvil: I believe you need to specify which of the two things, you are saying yes to.. :) |
| 14:10.25 | *** join/#openmoko tombhadAC (n=tombhad@pD95DC589.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:11.23 | SpeedEvil | the first |
| 14:11.27 | SpeedEvil | It works. |
| 14:11.32 | SpeedEvil | (the SIM) |
| 14:12.01 | *** part/#openmoko Onef (n=Onef@host23-197-static.106-82-b.business.telecomitalia.it) |
| 14:12.11 | mwester | has a prepaid one, and has refilled it several times now in troubleshooting this problem. This is becoming pricey... |
| 14:13.00 | *** join/#openmoko paul0 (n=paulo@201-25-203-85.fnsce701.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 14:14.06 | SpeedEvil | why do you need cash? |
| 14:14.35 | mwester | to send it SMS messages to make it wake up. |
| 14:14.44 | SpeedEvil | Huh? |
| 14:14.48 | SpeedEvil | Oh |
| 14:15.11 | SpeedEvil | I assumed that incoming SMSs are free. |
| 14:15.44 | ScaredyCat | not for americans |
| 14:15.50 | mwester | It will *occaisionally* fail when getting incoming signal quality messages, but the only sure way to cause the overrun is to send a few SMS's, and in the US the recipient is charged per message. |
| 14:15.59 | ScaredyCat | they pay for both ends of a call too |
| 14:16.00 | mwester | It's a huge ripoff. |
| 14:16.24 | SpeedEvil | Yes, I know that - I just forgot. |
| 14:18.28 | *** join/#openmoko diego_at_work (i=5960ae7b@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-9108c97bcda0b8d0) |
| 14:18.51 | ScaredyCat | w000t! |
| 14:19.02 | ScaredyCat | just fixed audio on resume! |
| 14:19.07 | SpeedEvil | :) |
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| 14:25.42 | *** join/#openmoko niclone (n=nicolas@d90-144-86-162.cust.tele2.fr) |
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| 14:39.35 | Bubbi | ScaredyCat: so if you wanted somebody to go broke, then you just spam him with a lot of SMS's?! |
| 14:40.03 | Bubbi | poor americans.. they never learn.. |
| 14:40.17 | ScaredyCat | I guess so, americans get ripped off over calls... |
| 14:40.34 | summatusmentis | it's not all plans... some providers give you free incoming, mine does |
| 14:40.42 | summatusmentis | but I don't think gsm providers do |
| 14:42.46 | Bubbi | incredible.. in Denmark you don't pay for stuff that you don't have a saying in.. so incomming calls/sms/mms are free of charge.. and IF you need to pay for a service, then you need to interact with the device, accepting to connect.. |
| 14:43.15 | I-MOD | in america all the providers want is an arm and a leg! i say let's give it to them! |
| 14:43.15 | Bubbi | but that's only if you are downloading stuff of your own choice |
| 14:43.47 | *** join/#openmoko tomjoad (n=tomjoad@adsl-70-130-139-0.dsl.stlsmo.swbell.net) |
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| 14:44.46 | summatusmentis | Bubbi: yeah, well, the US is seemingly incredibly backward in the way they do mobile stuff |
| 14:45.10 | I-MOD | verizon is soooo great, that they strip all sms/mms down to 160 characters of text with none of the other media if it goes outside their network |
| 14:45.14 | summatusmentis | and by incredibly backward, I mean they want to suck the life and soul out of their consumers |
| 14:45.26 | I-MOD | summatusmentis, agreed |
| 14:45.47 | summatusmentis | I-MOD: they do? my parents won't be getting VZW |
| 14:46.04 | I-MOD | yeah...i have a razr right now, i can't tether with EVDO either |
| 14:46.13 | I-MOD | as verizon expressly forbids it |
| 14:46.23 | summatusmentis | you're not even supposed to be tethering |
| 14:46.51 | I-MOD | it lets me tether with 1xRTT |
| 14:47.01 | summatusmentis | yeah, still forbidden in ToS |
| 14:47.14 | I-MOD | another issue I have with verizon... |
| 14:47.35 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@dsbg-4db7c01e.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 14:47.43 | summatusmentis | people out here really life VZW, but they're not paying attention |
| 14:48.29 | I-MOD | the one thing that is awesome is their coverage, when others don't have a signal, i still get signal 90% of the time |
| 14:48.35 | anrp | likes a (almost-)world-usable phone a bit more, but dislikes the mostly-lacking-3g in the us |
| 14:48.47 | anrp | so we use verizon for data cards :\ |
| 14:49.17 | I-MOD | my company uses gprs/edge data cards through t-mobile for tech support that |
| 14:49.23 | I-MOD | 's on-call |
| 14:49.26 | summatusmentis | that's why I'm still not sure I'll be able to justify a FreeRunner, because I'll want to use it as my phone, and GSM doesn't work at my parents house |
| 14:49.52 | summatusmentis | I think it works where I go to school though |
| 14:50.20 | I-MOD | gsm coverage where I am is pretty decent |
| 14:50.40 | I-MOD | including the surrounding rural areas (which is surprising and nice) |
| 14:51.23 | summatusmentis | where are you located? |
| 14:51.28 | summatusmentis | if you don't mind my asking |
| 14:51.54 | I-MOD | northern alabama (huntsville if you know the area) |
| 14:52.00 | *** join/#openmoko key (n=key@nat/ibm/x-7ee518b5fb27b0b1) |
| 14:52.03 | summatusmentis | ah, I'm in MN |
| 14:52.13 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@zip.kortex.jyu.fi) |
| 14:52.20 | I-MOD | mmmm....cold weather |
| 14:52.27 | I-MOD | need more of that down here |
| 14:58.17 | *** join/#openmoko haakeyar (n=haakeyar@c9C364BC1.dhcp.bluecom.no) |
| 14:59.00 | ScaredyCat | mwester: ping |
| 15:04.21 | spydon | soon this month has ended too without a released freerunner :'( |
| 15:05.12 | *** join/#openmoko martijn_ (n=martijn@188.Red-213-97-48.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
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| 15:09.50 | *** part/#openmoko JanMalte (n=janmalte@dslb-088-067-247-066.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:15.11 | CIA-42 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickeyl * r243 10/trunk/specifications/otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.Call.xml.in: otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.Call.xml.in: docs++ |
| 15:16.02 | *** join/#openmoko kdean06 (n=kdean06@fsf/member/kdean06) |
| 15:16.24 | summatusmentis | spydon: the month isn't over yet |
| 15:16.44 | *** join/#openmoko mjbroek (n=martijn@188.Red-213-97-48.staticIP.rima-tde.net) |
| 15:17.00 | summatusmentis | does anyone know why testing for MP is taking so long? |
| 15:18.06 | spydon | summatusmentis, yeah you can always hope they release it before the month is over ^^ |
| 15:18.19 | summatusmentis | that's my hope, until May 1 |
| 15:20.18 | summatusmentis | Sup3rkiddo: you around? |
| 15:21.18 | spydon | one week :P |
| 15:21.39 | spydon | you better buy a whip :P |
| 15:21.56 | *** join/#openmoko SirBob1701 (n=mcginley@139.84.102.34) |
| 15:22.06 | *** join/#openmoko jmichel (n=jmichel@modemcable135.172-56-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 15:22.07 | summatusmentis | I don't have $400 anyway, so... |
| 15:23.23 | SpeedEvil | Multiprocessor is a big step. |
| 15:23.33 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03zecke * r0ff5de564e25 10/src/libraries/qtopiaprediction/ (qtopiaprediction.pro wordprediction.cpp wordprediction.h): [prediction] Start extracting the prediction into a library used by other processes |
| 15:23.33 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03zecke * r42ff2ca73828 10/src/libraries/qtopiaprediction/ (qtopiaprediction.pro wordprediction.cpp wordprediction.h): [prediction] Start with the header file |
| 15:23.33 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03zecke * r3019cc28cb1c 10/src/libraries/qtopiaprediction/ (wordprediction.cpp wordprediction.h): [prediction] First implementation of the C Interface, untested |
| 15:23.35 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03zecke * rf39ac37db3b1 10/src/plugins/inputmethods/predictivekeyboard/pred.cpp: [prediction] Fix a wtf. Converting is a char to string is not guaranteed to be null terminated |
| 15:23.50 | summatusmentis | SpeedEvil: multiprocessor? |
| 15:23.57 | SpeedEvil | MP |
| 15:24.00 | SpeedEvil | ignore me. |
| 15:24.08 | summatusmentis | lol, oh |
| 15:25.22 | *** join/#openmoko sameo_ (n=samuel@AAnnecy-256-1-29-58.w90-10.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
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| 15:28.37 | CIA-42 | freesmartphone.org: 03mickeyl * r244 10/trunk/specifications/otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX.xml.in: otapi/org.freesmartphone.GSM.MUX.xml.in: docs++ |
| 15:31.15 | *** join/#openmoko MarkTheDaemon_II (i=MarkTheD@phpbb/modifications/MarkTheDaemon) |
| 15:32.50 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 15:36.31 | *** join/#openmoko ahven (n=kala@194.126.113.157) |
| 15:37.57 | jmichel | Any ideas why I would get an error like "linux-openmoko_2.6.24+git.bb' failed" when building my image ? |
| 15:39.01 | jmichel | More details here: "error: short SHA1 4194 is ambiguous." |
| 15:39.21 | jmichel | and: "fatal: Not a valid object name 4194" |
| 15:40.31 | CIA-42 | openmoko: 03thomas * r4394 10/trunk/src/target/opkg/libopkg/ (opkg.c opkg_cmd.c opkg_download.c opkg_download.h): opkg: improve download callback handling and integrate into opkg_update_package_lists |
| 15:41.47 | thos | wooooo! |
| 15:42.00 | thos | opkg_update_package_lists() is pretty much complete! |
| 15:42.46 | ScaredyCat | !logs |
| 15:42.48 | cdbot2 | Channel logs for #openmoko are archived at: |
| 15:42.49 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/%23openmoko |
| 15:42.50 | cdbot2 | Live-logs are available at |
| 15:42.51 | cdbot2 | http://hentges.net/tmp/logs/irc/livelogs/%23openmoko.livelog |
| 15:42.53 | cdbot2 | See ?? help-logs for usage instructions |
| 15:44.35 | ScaredyCat | jmichel: change the rev in openembedded/conf/distro/include/sane-srcrevs.inc to ${AUTOREV} |
| 15:45.23 | *** join/#openmoko lunartear (n=cayres@ip68-103-160-30.ks.ok.cox.net) |
| 15:46.36 | ScaredyCat | and you anrp |
| 15:48.44 | jmichel | ScaredyCat: what is anrp? |
| 15:49.03 | ScaredyCat | someone else in here wiht the same issue |
| 15:49.31 | ScaredyCat | t's someone's nick |
| 15:49.48 | ScaredyCat | /'s' |
| 15:49.56 | *** join/#openmoko p3t3r__ (n=p3t3r__@gate1.net-you.de) |
| 15:53.01 | jmichel | ScaredyCat: I think it worked... it succeeded the fetch part... thanks |
| 15:53.26 | *** join/#openmoko zAMz1 (n=chatzill@dslb-084-058-072-232.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 15:54.20 | ScaredyCat | np |
| 15:55.32 | SpeedEvil | ScaredyCat: and me |
| 15:56.31 | ScaredyCat | nd you |
| 15:56.34 | ScaredyCat | a |
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| 16:34.31 | ScaredyCat | SpeedEvil: |
| 16:34.32 | ScaredyCat | ping |
| 16:34.34 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru_ (n=geaaru@host194-218-dynamic.16-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 16:35.22 | SpeedEvil | ... |
| 16:36.40 | ScaredyCat | you said about the 01 have 60m/s to the gpu, but can it actually do that? |
| 16:37.15 | SpeedEvil | In some ways, yes. |
| 16:37.29 | ScaredyCat | i mean, can the cpu throw that much data fast enough |
| 16:37.32 | SpeedEvil | The fundamental write speed is around that order of magnitude. |
| 16:37.52 | SpeedEvil | Of course, you're not really going to get much processing at that rate |
| 16:38.07 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@209.167.232.101) |
| 16:38.32 | ScaredyCat | is there any data on the speeds currently being used on the 01... |
| 16:38.43 | ScaredyCat | it seems kinda scarey - the difference |
| 16:38.57 | playya | wow. the qt stuff looks cool |
| 16:39.01 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z5899.z.pppool.de) |
| 16:39.19 | SpeedEvil | speeds? |
| 16:39.22 | SpeedEvil | It's 200MHz |
| 16:39.57 | SpeedEvil | The display reads data out of main memory at 640*480*2*60 bytes/second |
| 16:40.00 | SpeedEvil | Or 36M |
| 16:40.06 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-209-039.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 16:40.16 | ScaredyCat | k |
| 16:41.23 | *** join/#openmoko mboldisc (n=mike@c-66-41-225-167.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 16:41.27 | ScaredyCat | right but the bandwidth is 5 times (ish) less on the 02 |
| 16:41.31 | *** join/#openmoko MarcOChapeau (n=MarcOCha@bgn92-4-82-238-213-101.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 16:41.38 | SpeedEvil | Um - no. |
| 16:41.42 | SpeedEvil | Ok. |
| 16:41.46 | SpeedEvil | From the top. |
| 16:41.50 | ScaredyCat | k |
| 16:42.00 | SpeedEvil | 02 - CPU - 7M/s pipeline - GPU |
| 16:42.13 | SpeedEvil | GPU refreshes the screen locally using local memory. |
| 16:42.16 | SpeedEvil | 01 - CPU - |
| 16:42.19 | SpeedEvil | 01 - CPU - LCD |
| 16:42.32 | *** join/#openmoko Fauphi (n=kill@p5491AA5C.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:42.52 | SpeedEvil | It's directly connected, and refreshes the framebuffer from main system RAM timeshared with normal RAM accesses. |
| 16:43.21 | ScaredyCat | ok.. so th cpu is only concerned with getting the data to the gpu, once it's there the gpu will handle it easing the cpu load |
| 16:43.27 | SpeedEvil | yes. |
| 16:44.28 | SpeedEvil | With a GPU that can do 2D/3D acceleration capably, and video decoding too, it's much less of an issue. |
| 16:44.50 | ScaredyCat | mmm.... if it shares the ram, can you poke it ? |
| 16:44.53 | SpeedEvil | But the 3D acceleration for 02 will likely not be written, and there are performance problems, and it looks like video may not happen either. |
| 16:45.08 | ScaredyCat | :( |
| 16:45.20 | SpeedEvil | It's just - from a sofftware point of view - with GTA01 - another area of RAM |
| 16:45.51 | SpeedEvil | It's just that it's got special hardware that reads that area of RAM constantly out to the LCD at the appropriate rate. |
| 16:46.48 | ScaredyCat | right, so why not write directly to that then? |
| 16:46.59 | ScaredyCat | or is that what's actually happening |
| 16:47.02 | SpeedEvil | Yes |
| 16:47.10 | SpeedEvil | On 01 |
| 16:47.33 | SpeedEvil | On 02, it's connected via an external bus to the GPU |
| 16:47.46 | ScaredyCat | right. ok now I get it |
| 16:53.40 | Weiss_ | SpeedEvil: what performance problems? the 7M/s pipeline is simply too much of a bottleneck to get decent (say, OpenGL) throughput? |
| 16:54.17 | *** join/#openmoko ecraven (n=nex@plc31-103.linzag.net) |
| 16:56.17 | SpeedEvil | If you're saying 'blit rectangle from x to y' - then it's completely adequate and very fast. |
| 16:57.08 | SpeedEvil | If you run up against something that the hardware can't quite do - or has no software for - you're reduced to rendering it on the CPU, and painting it on the framebuffer at 7M/second |
| 16:58.04 | SpeedEvil | Which - when the whole screen is a over half a meg - can slow things down and make them jerky. |
| 16:59.27 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@AOrleans-152-1-100-239.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 16:59.49 | ScaredyCat | so only an issue if you need a really high framerate |
| 16:59.51 | *** join/#openmoko CVirus (n=GoD@82.201.174.127) |
| 17:00.04 | ScaredyCat | ie can it play doom == no |
| 17:00.11 | ScaredyCat | ? |
| 17:00.34 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@umm-yrless170.morris.umn.edu) |
| 17:00.50 | SpeedEvil | Worst case, drop to QVGA and it'll be fine. |
| 17:01.29 | SpeedEvil | At 30FPS+ |
| 17:01.59 | ScaredyCat | well, we only want 24.5 :) |
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| 17:18.56 | peeps[work] | what's the color depth of the GTA02 screen? |
| 17:19.12 | peeps[work] | didn't see it on the wiki |
| 17:19.18 | SpeedEvil | 17 bits, same as GTA01 |
| 17:19.20 | SpeedEvil | 16 |
| 17:20.29 | jmichel | ScaredyCat: Thanks now my image was able to build |
| 17:20.40 | ScaredyCat | :D |
| 17:20.51 | peeps[work] | hmm, i just read that the bus to the graphics chip has only 7MB/s bus on GTA02. this means at 640x480x2 you get about 13 fps max? |
| 17:21.26 | peeps[work] | i mean 11 |
| 17:21.33 | jmichel | ScaredyCat: But I need the source for the kernel and it seems that there is no more INHERIT += "rm_work" in the config that I can comment to keep the downloaded source |
| 17:21.37 | josch | peeps[work], hush! glamo bus performance is a forbidden word here! |
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| 17:22.28 | ScaredyCat | if it's not there jmichel it shouldn;t clean it out.. |
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| 17:22.37 | ScaredyCat | you should still have it |
| 17:22.54 | wibbit | Hello all |
| 17:22.56 | peeps[work] | but 11fps makes baby mokoninja cry |
| 17:23.00 | SpeedEvil | peeps[work]: about that. |
| 17:23.21 | SpeedEvil | peeps[work]: QVGA is better - and if you can do some of the work locally, that's also better |
| 17:23.26 | SpeedEvil | (on the gamo) |
| 17:23.52 | peeps[work] | what do you mean "do some of the work locally"? |
| 17:24.07 | ScaredyCat | you have to draw it on paper |
| 17:24.12 | wibbit | Any know of any one who's tested the freerunner (or gta02) in Russia? |
| 17:24.18 | jmichel | ScaredyCat: Shouldn't it be in build/tmp/work/om-gta01-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/linux-openmoko-1_2.6.24+git20080423-r0/ because it is not there |
| 17:24.36 | SpeedEvil | peeps[work]: if it's simple 2D manipulation that can be done on the glamo. |
| 17:27.18 | ScaredyCat | .. |
| 17:27.24 | ScaredyCat | mm I have it jmichel |
| 17:27.27 | *** join/#openmoko doc|work (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 17:27.28 | ScaredyCat | build/tmp/work/om-gta01-angstrom-linux-gnueabi/linux-openmoko-1_2.6.24+git20080423-r0 |
| 17:27.45 | ScaredyCat | the source is in the git dir |
| 17:28.48 | jmichel | no git dir for me :( |
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| 17:29.39 | ScaredyCat | :o |
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| 17:30.47 | jmichel | could the rm_work variable be somewhere else than local/conf/site.conf ? |
| 17:31.24 | ScaredyCat | build/conf/ |
| 17:31.45 | jmichel | ok I see |
| 17:31.53 | ScaredyCat | local.conf |
| 17:31.53 | jmichel | sorry that was my mistake |
| 17:31.55 | ScaredyCat | in there |
| 17:31.57 | ScaredyCat | try that |
| 17:31.58 | jmichel | thanks |
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| 17:46.43 | cb22_ | ba doink a doink doink |
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| 17:51.24 | cb22_ | is that 7mb/s read / write shared or write only? |
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| 19:58.12 | bricode | Any hints as to how to get the u-boot menu? I've tried all combinations of the aux key and power key, but the menu never displays. |
| 19:58.31 | ahven | hold down aux and press power? |
| 19:58.32 | bricode | GTA02v3 (as reported by software) GTA02v4 as printed on the PCB. |
| 19:59.14 | bricode | ahven: Tried that. Holding for 4 seconds. Then 10. Doesn't work. |
| 19:59.17 | ahven | hold down aux and press and hold power until menu appears* |
| 19:59.24 | ahven | it doesn't turn on at all? |
| 19:59.53 | bricode | Not while the aux button is held down. |
| 20:00.05 | ahven | time doesn't matter, only the fact that it must be pressed down whilst holding down power |
| 20:00.07 | bricode | Just pressing the power button it will boot. |
| 20:00.42 | ahven | is the aux functioning as should with the software? |
| 20:00.57 | bricode | Yes. |
| 20:01.19 | ahven | strange |
| 20:01.27 | bricode | Yeah. |
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| 20:16.22 | bricode | Is there any way to force a new bootloader (without a debug board)? |
| 20:16.40 | bricode | I keep getting "File is not targeted for use by this device" errors with dfu-util. |
| 20:20.01 | *** join/#openmoko wasanderes (n=chatzill@p4FD3EF20.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 20:24.11 | mwester | bricode: whatever it is you are doing, without a debug board you are almost certainly in grave danger of bricking the device. |
| 20:25.23 | bricode | mwester: Yep. I realize that. I'm already well on my way. Still boots up, but can't mount mtdblock4. |
| 20:31.04 | josch | MichaelShiloh, hi! did you receive my email concerning the camisole? :-) |
| 20:42.26 | quicksand | Sorry josch, He's Just Not That Into You. |
| 20:42.36 | quicksand | ;-) |
| 20:42.40 | josch | nooooo!! |
| 20:42.44 | josch | :'( |
| 20:42.53 | josch | MichaelShiloh, dont do this to me! |
| 20:43.47 | MichaelShiloh | hi josch, sorry, i wasn't watching irc. i don't think i saw any camisole email. can you resend? should i ask? |
| 20:43.56 | josch | darn |
| 20:44.12 | josch | i sent you an email concerning my tshirt for community member of the week ^^ |
| 20:46.27 | josch | MichaelShiloh, did you receive it? it had the subject "Community member of the week price" |
| 20:46.50 | *** join/#openmoko broedje (n=hellvis@92.116.217.66) |
| 20:47.11 | Spydon | that sounds like a spam subject ^^ |
| 20:47.27 | josch | -___- |
| 20:47.28 | I-MOD | lol, you're right. it does |
| 20:47.30 | MichaelShiloh | oh, yes, i did receive that. sorry - i thought i had replied. i have not yet ordered it, but will do so shortly. i aplogize for the delay. |
| 20:47.31 | tc | MichaelShiloh: Hi Micheal, I asked on the community list a few days ago if some GTA02v5's will ship and if so will the power consumption be the same as v6? I really think it needs some clarification, can you help? |
| 20:47.40 | josch | MichaelShiloh, ah great |
| 20:47.54 | doc|work | tc that's been answered on the list |
| 20:47.59 | josch | MichaelShiloh, would be nice if it would arrive by the end of next week - is this possible? |
| 20:48.28 | tc | doc|work: Are you referring to the email by Tony? |
| 20:48.31 | MichaelShiloh | josch: yes, i can order it today or tomorrow, should get there end of next week. i'll rush the shipping. |
| 20:48.57 | doc|work | tc I'm not sure exactly, I just thought I read that all phones would have the problem fixed |
| 20:48.59 | josch | MichaelShiloh, thank you very much!!! |
| 20:50.10 | tc | doc|work: I've been following it on the list and I cannot find a conclusive answer at all |
| 20:50.46 | doc|work | tc is it a big deal really? it's only when the led is actually lit anyway |
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| 20:52.15 | tc | doc|work: No, I don't think it's that much of a big deal but if it does affect power consumption it would be nice to have an answer |
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| 20:54.05 | ScaredyCat | hehehe.. walked into that one MichaelShiloh .. :) |
| 20:54.24 | tc | sorry :) |
| 20:54.40 | josch | MichaelShiloh, sent you another mail with a new shipping address for next week |
| 20:55.11 | ScaredyCat | stabs sipgate |
| 20:59.02 | tomjoad | tc: What is wrong with the explanation from Tony? |
| 21:00.33 | tc | tomjoad: "A5 or A6 *should* all apply the LED transistor change" |
| 21:01.46 | tc | tomjoad: The word should is a concern of mine |
| 21:06.25 | tomjoad | tc: yeah, I see what you're saying. I can't decipher the wiki page he linked to either as to the change being applied to A5 |
| 21:10.16 | tc | tomjoad: Yeah, that's why I would like an official response from Steve or Micheal |
| 21:11.16 | tomjoad | tc: I agree i would like to see that too. or atleast more of a definitive, "yes the A5 has the transistor fix" |
| 21:11.50 | tomjoad | tc: though I have to admit I'll be buying in the first batch eitherway |
| 21:12.30 | mjr | I think it's nitpicking to be concerned about it, though one agress it should be further made absolutely clear before sales |
| 21:13.21 | mjr | As to the question of v5's power consumption vs. v6, it's pretty clear it's not the same. The wiki mentions at least a 1 mA change not applied in v5 :] |
| 21:14.45 | tc | mjr: I think it's nit picking too, but the longer the question goes unanswered the more concerned I am getting |
| 21:15.26 | mjr | basically I think it has been answered |
| 21:15.29 | *** join/#openmoko paul0 (n=paulo@200-102-50-204.fnsce701.dsl.brasiltelecom.net.br) |
| 21:15.46 | mjr | and it's nitpicking to get concerned for not having it hammered into your skull |
| 21:17.57 | tc | I just don't think leaving it with a "should" is the greatest idea. |
| 21:18.18 | anrp | i think what he's trying to say is that he'd be happier if he didn't even know it was a problem |
| 21:18.22 | anrp | :\ |
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| 21:18.49 | mjr | yea |
| 21:18.50 | tc | anrp: I think you're right :/ |
| 21:19.28 | tomjoad | I'm still concerned about the GSM firmware working with all AT&T sim cards |
| 21:20.10 | tomjoad | i sent an email to the ml and got one response but it was not somebody with an OM email so I assume they were just guessing |
| 21:20.51 | josch | MichaelShiloh, could you drop me a message via irc when you manage to order it? did you receive my email with the changed shipping address? |
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| 21:21.25 | tc | tomjoad: are you worried you will get a contract and the sim not working? |
| 21:22.12 | tomjoad | tc: I am actually already with AT&T and have an old sim but received a new sim that is on the list of non-working sims |
| 21:22.41 | tomjoad | tc: i would like to start using the new sim but am afraid to incase the new one doesn't work with the FR |
| 21:23.15 | tc | ah I see :/ |
| 21:23.31 | tomjoad | tc: I guess I'll just stick with the old one |
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| 21:27.19 | MichaelShiloh | josch: got it. will ship to new address. and i will send you email w/ tracking number when i order it. |
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| 21:31.07 | bricode | MichaelShiloh: Do you guys have debug boards in stock these days for gta02? |
| 21:32.47 | broedje | any repositories that i could put in the ipkg app? i have the late march firmware |
| 21:33.59 | broedje | does alternate mean.... flash anything you like, as long it is compatible? or is there a file existing with -alternate suffix? |
| 21:34.25 | MichaelShiloh | bricode: good question. i think not yet. i will ask. ping me on the kernel list in a few days if you don't hear back. |
| 21:36.03 | bricode | MichaelShiloh: Cool. Thanks. |
| 21:36.43 | emdete | alphaone: query..? |
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| 21:53.04 | prpplague | anyone know if the neo1973 support in qemu is being pushed upstream to qemu main tree? |
| 21:53.42 | thos | prpplague, ask balrog-kun |
| 21:54.14 | prpplague | thos: ok thanks |
| 21:54.33 | thos | prpplague, he wrote it :-) |
| 21:55.10 | prpplague | i thought andrew with o-hand.com did most of the core s3c24xx support |
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| 21:56.56 | sandsmark | if I install qtopia on the freerunner, is any gtk-stuff needed? |
| 21:57.16 | balrog-kun | prpplague: yes, it's planned |
| 21:57.19 | thos | prpplague, that's the same person |
| 21:57.40 | prpplague | ahh |
| 21:57.55 | balrog-kun | prpplague: there's so much higher priority stuff to do before that though :( |
| 21:58.16 | prpplague | balrog-kun: is there seperate patches for adding s3c24xx support and adding neo1973? |
| 21:58.59 | balrog-kun | prpplague: nope, currently it's not split into patches, just a svn tree |
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| 21:59.25 | prpplague | balrog-kun: ahh ok |
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| 22:01.01 | balrog-kun | prpplague: are you specifically interested in s3c24xx emulation? |
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| 22:01.22 | prpplague | balrog-kun: yea, thats mainly what i'm interested |
| 22:02.10 | balrog-kun | if there was a machine other than neo1973 using the s3c24xx code then i could even go over this weekend and merge the core stuff |
| 22:02.25 | balrog-kun | this part is rather clean and upstreamable |
| 22:02.51 | prpplague | http://www.elinux.org/Hammer_Board |
| 22:02.57 | prpplague | thats where i'm starting |
| 22:03.12 | prpplague | i'll be adding a 2440 device as well |
| 22:03.39 | prpplague | http://www.elinux.org/Nail_Board |
| 22:04.29 | balrog-kun | prpplague: that's very neat hardware |
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| 22:04.43 | prpplague | balrog-kun: thanks |
| 22:05.21 | balrog-kun | prpplague: imho it should be safe for a person to develop against the qemu-neo1973 tree their own emulator, i think there's somene already doing that (though their tree isn't public) |
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| 22:05.52 | prpplague | balrog-kun: yea i did a diff, looks pretty straight forward |
| 22:06.32 | prpplague | balrog-kun: i'll be tinkering with it over the next couple of weeks, any problems pestering you on this channel if i have any questions? |
| 22:07.15 | balrog-kun | prpplague: nope, pester me any time, i just may be a bit slow ansering some days |
| 22:07.17 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 22:07.30 | prpplague | balrog-kun: np, i'm sure mallum is a slave driver |
| 22:08.28 | balrog-kun | i can also merge patches from people into qemu-neo1973 tree and if we reach something usable i can merge it upstream directly together with the rest of s3c24xx code |
| 22:08.43 | balrog-kun | it's just that if i upstreamed that now there would be no machine code using it |
| 22:08.53 | balrog-kun | prpplague: no, quite the opposite :) |
| 22:09.06 | prpplague | balrog-kun: hehe |
| 22:09.06 | balrog-kun | it's my university that's my slave driver :( |
| 22:09.26 | prpplague | balrog-kun: ok, i'll do some testing and get back with you about some patches |
| 22:09.34 | SpeedEvil | rmmod slave |
| 22:10.18 | prpplague | balrog-kun: thanks and later |
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| 22:12.59 | ljp | sandsmark: no gtk needed with qtopia |
| 22:14.39 | sandsmark | ok, the anti-qtopia-rant on the wiki was a bit misleading |
| 22:15.07 | raboof | qtopia doesn't even need X, iirc, does it? or has that changed? |
| 22:15.27 | ljp | no x needed |
| 22:15.44 | ljp | anti qtopia rant? |
| 22:15.50 | sandsmark | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Why_Not_QT |
| 22:15.54 | raboof | does that also mean you can't run X apps when you chose qtopia? or can they live together? |
| 22:16.13 | ljp | that does mean no x apps too |
| 22:16.54 | sandsmark | bah, who needs X, when you have qtopia |
| 22:17.17 | sandsmark | wants to port kdelibs and amarok ^_^ |
| 22:17.20 | mjr | OM is apparently porting (with some pains ;] ) qtopia on X11 to be able to run those apps alongside the rest |
| 22:17.27 | ljp | actually gtk apps use more memory than qtopia apps |
| 22:17.37 | sandsmark | ljp: indeed |
| 22:17.51 | sandsmark | ljp: but that wiki page was misleading, because it compared qt + gtk to just gtk |
| 22:18.33 | mjr | yes, and that's because OM is (well, at least was, dunno nowadays with the E) gtk-based |
| 22:19.05 | mjr | it's not misleading, you're just trying to read it in a context it was not written for |
| 22:19.25 | ljp | its not misleading, its just plain wrong |
| 22:19.34 | ljp | especially about memory constraints |
| 22:20.04 | ljp | qtopia takes less space in flash and has more functionality than the gtk stuff |
| 22:20.28 | ljp | if you include x and all gtk dependencies, daemons, etc |
| 22:20.57 | mjr | ljp, congratulations, thanks for demonstrating yet again that you lack reading comprehension skills and are simply droning on about the wonders of qtopia whenever you get the chance |
| 22:21.06 | ljp | pff |
| 22:21.15 | ljp | prove me wring |
| 22:21.15 | ljp | wrong |
| 22:21.16 | raboof | afaics the page tells you why not to use QT if you stick to the existing openmoko framework (which includes X and GTK) |
| 22:21.42 | mjr | indeed what raboof said |
| 22:21.42 | raboof | it doesn't seem to be referring to ripping out all the X and GTK stuff and replacing the entire platform with qtopia |
| 22:21.54 | mjr | indeed it isn't referring to that |
| 22:22.27 | ljp | " |
| 22:22.29 | mjr | and it, methinks, makes it _very_ clear |
| 22:22.32 | raboof | (key words in first paragraph: "application developers", not platform developers) |
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| 22:22.42 | ljp | "OpenMoko is a distribution designed around GTK+2 and not Qt." |
| 22:22.52 | ljp | pretty much seems to sum up all the bias |
| 22:23.12 | raboof | bias? looks like an undeniable fact to me. |
| 22:23.13 | mjr | it's not bias, it's a fucking statement of fact |
| 22:23.41 | mjr | (forgetting recent movement toward perhaps something raster-based...) |
| 22:24.02 | ljp | this seems to rant that because it was first conceived for gtk, nothing should ever change |
| 22:24.52 | mjr | No, you moronic corporate drone. It says that if you have a gtk-based platform, you incure less overhead and are more consistent if you use GTK for your apps. It says no more, and no less. |
| 22:24.56 | ljp | look and feel is wrong, as qt can have the same look, as we can tie into the glib event loop. look at distributions that do this |
| 22:25.13 | ljp | at least I dont call anyone names to try and prove a point |
| 22:25.25 | mjr | that also was a statement of fact |
| 22:25.32 | ljp | ppfft |
| 22:25.56 | SpeedEvil | hands out pugel sticks. |
| 22:26.33 | mjr | I understand how some facts may be unpleasant to hear. |
| 22:26.33 | ljp | calling someone names ike that just proves you are being childish and cannot come up with good enough reasons to back up your side of the argument |
| 22:26.33 | raboof | ljp: indeed the page looks like it's intended for application developers targeting the *current* openmoko platform, not a theoretical QT-based platform |
| 22:26.40 | mjr | of course, you forget all about me providing the actual reasons why you're being a moronic corporate drone right after saying you are. |
| 22:27.28 | ljp | fuk off |
| 22:28.11 | mjr | you're purposefully twisting the wiki page to suit your blind "qtopia everywhere" agenda, completely ignoring any sanity in interpreting what the page is actually trying to say |
| 22:28.33 | raboof | ljp: as for the look and feel: the page doesn't say it's impossible for QT to have the same look and feel, but that making that happen will be quite a bit of work. |
| 22:28.38 | raboof | ljp: sounds reasonable to me, too |
| 22:29.14 | ljp | well, seeing as they changed directions a few times already, it doesnt reallt matter |
| 22:29.44 | raboof | ljp: good. then why all the discussion? :) |
| 22:29.51 | ljp | openmoko is about freedom, anyway |
| 22:30.27 | raboof | agreed entirely, the work being done to bring qtopia to the openmoko hardware is really interesting |
| 22:30.30 | mjr | Hell, calling the wiki page an (implicitly anti-qtopia) rant even when it explicitly says that _on a qtopia platform_ you should likewise use qtopia and stay away from gtk, now that is pure fanatical blindness to the extreme |
| 22:30.39 | ljp | raboof: because that wiki page only presents one persons view and one side |
| 22:31.03 | ljp | raboof: nokia will be doing almost the same with maemo and bringing qt to that platform as well |
| 22:31.49 | raboof | ljp: I think I responded to your statements about that wikipage above, so you won't be surprised I think the wikipage seems mostly correct to me |
| 22:32.04 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=dave123_@ppp-70-244-166-139.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) |
| 22:32.27 | mjr | Now, I await the "good enough reasons" to back up ljp's "fuk off" side of the argument. |
| 22:32.40 | raboof | and does *not* say bringing qtopia to the openmoko hardware is a bad idea. it just says writing qt-based *applications* for the gtk-based openmoko framework is a bad idea. |
| 22:32.48 | rtm | mjr & ljp: You're discussing the "Why Not GT" page, right? |
| 22:32.55 | mjr | rtm, QT, yes |
| 22:33.03 | rtm | oops QT, not GT |
| 22:33.16 | doc|work | why not fluxbox?! why?! WHY? |
| 22:33.25 | doc|work | stabs randomly due to pointless discussions |
| 22:33.27 | mjr | rtm, he seems to think it's a biased rant because it doesn't say "YES, you should code in Qtopia no matter what the underlying platform uses" |
| 22:33.59 | mjr | I on the other hand think he's a moron because of this |
| 22:34.42 | raboof | just tries to point out where ljp seems to misread the page, and gets ignored completely :) |
| 22:34.43 | mjr | that, I think, summarizes the different points here pretty well |
| 22:35.00 | mjr | raboof, oh, I'm with you there |
| 22:35.01 | ljp | i am not ignoring you |
| 22:35.06 | rtm | Gosh - that page seems pretty reasonable to me. |
| 22:35.24 | alphaone | points to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agree_to_disagree |
| 22:35.29 | raboof | ljp: ok, i was being a bit dramatic :) |
| 22:35.37 | mjr | raboof, and yes, he's too blind to see it. I think that may be due to "Stock option blindness" |
| 22:35.42 | ljp | problem is, neo is not exactly memory constrained nor an embedded device |
| 22:36.04 | alphaone | ljp: I wouldn't actually call it a problem :-) |
| 22:36.19 | SpeedEvil | I'd disagree about embedded. |
| 22:36.20 | *** join/#openmoko polz_ (n=polz@cpe-213-157-235-31.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 22:36.27 | ljp | alphaone: no, but some people seem to mistake this anyway |
| 22:36.44 | mjr | ljp, I see, you lost that discussion so you're trying to frame it into a new one. |
| 22:36.51 | ljp | so my computer 10 years ago is embedded? |
| 22:36.59 | mjr | Clever trolling (!) tactic |
| 22:37.08 | doc|work | mine is, in the bottom of a landfill somewhere |
| 22:37.16 | ljp | i still have 20 MB hard disks around |
| 22:37.29 | SpeedEvil | ljp: no - but because your washing machine - for example - now has more power than your first computer, that does not make it not embedded. |
| 22:37.47 | rtm | Even though the neo has memory comparable to a 10 year old PC, it has a lot more constraints, particularly with power usage. |
| 22:37.53 | doc|work | can we install qt on a washing machine? |
| 22:38.03 | ljp | a washing machine is embedded because it has one purpose only |
| 22:38.13 | ljp | doc|work: why not! |
| 22:38.22 | raboof | who cares about the definitions of 'memory constrained' and 'embedded'? the definitions used usually seem to be either irrelevant or clear from context... |
| 22:38.26 | doc|work | ljp: because it's pointless! |
| 22:38.29 | doc|work | ;) |
| 22:38.30 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 22:38.39 | mjr | doc|work, indeed you should do so and only code in qtopia for it, otherwise you're "biased" and any reasons you might give for your decisions are "rants" |
| 22:38.45 | ljp | no its not, it would provde and very easy to develop and functional ui |
| 22:38.46 | doc|work | ;) |
| 22:39.06 | doc|work | ljp: except.... it's a fucking washing machine. :) |
| 22:39.08 | ljp | qt runs on some volvo buses |
| 22:39.29 | doc|work | qt there are also airbags on buses, should we put airbags onto washing machines too :) |
| 22:39.35 | doc|work | er, ljp :) |
| 22:39.37 | rtm | OM runs on some buses when I commute to work. |
| 22:39.39 | ljp | probably. |
| 22:39.57 | SpeedEvil | doc|work: remove the explosive capsule first, and use extra fabric software, and wash on a low-temp cycle. |
| 22:40.14 | doc|work | awww, no boom? :( |
| 22:40.30 | ljp | airbags deply when it senses a 2 year old toddler nearby |
| 22:40.30 | *** join/#openmoko moko-bunny (n=reik@CPE-76-178-148-218.natnow.res.rr.com) |
| 22:40.34 | ljp | deploy |
| 22:41.23 | doc|work | haha, best homemade video ever. you see a child waddling across the kitchen floor, next thing *bang* kid is flying through the air heading for the wall towards the back of the room |
| 22:41.34 | doc|work | *smack* |
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| 22:44.09 | ljp | getting back to that wiki page. I think its admirable that openmoko wants to use multiple toolkits |
| 22:44.45 | tharvey | anyone know what the state of the ar6k driver is in openmoko? |
| 22:44.48 | ljp | no where have I seen a statement about the visio for openmoko limiting itself to gtk. it wants to create an _open_ phone |
| 22:45.03 | ljp | open means just that - open to new things |
| 22:45.39 | ljp | some people cannot handle that qtopia runs better on the phone |
| 22:45.46 | bricode | wonders where the closes debug board is to him. |
| 22:45.51 | SpeedEvil | ljp: in some ways - from my perspective - openmmoko is two seperate aims. A) Open hardware. B) An open software stack. |
| 22:46.12 | mjr | ljp, who are these people? |
| 22:46.31 | SpeedEvil | ljp: the primary aim of FIC in supporting the project is not to develop a cool OS. It's to develop software that's free to tehm, that they can use on phones to sell them direct to end-users. |
| 22:46.42 | SpeedEvil | bricode |
| 22:46.47 | SpeedEvil | bricode: lat/lon? |
| 22:47.28 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Costa Rica? |
| 22:47.36 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 22:47.39 | SpeedEvil | Prolly not me then. |
| 22:48.03 | bricode | Toronto in a couple of weeks... |
| 22:48.13 | mjr | personally couldn't care less how well qtopia runs, so I handle it just fine. The main reason for not caring is, of course, the suboptimal "openness to new things" of the qtopia stack :] |
| 22:49.19 | SpeedEvil | is about 10000Km from bricode. |
| 22:49.34 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Well, thanks for looking that up. |
| 22:49.53 | SpeedEvil | bricode: you've bricked yours? |
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| 22:52.36 | ljp | SpeedEvil: yes, but the software must also work. qtopia provides all that. they just need to abide by the GPL |
| 22:54.03 | Mononoke | silently points at http://zecke.blogspot.com/2008/04/slowly-getting-frustrated-with-qtopia.html |
| 22:54.45 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Yep. It was a slow process where it was just a corrupt filesystem, but now I've borked everything such that even dfu-util doesn't work. |
| 22:55.08 | *** join/#openmoko morricone (n=foobar@dslb-084-057-171-203.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 22:55.39 | SpeedEvil | bricode: does it not boot at all now? |
| 22:56.02 | SpeedEvil | bricode: And are you sure it's not battery flat issues? |
| 22:56.41 | ljp | Mononoke: that is one persons subjective opinion. I know of 40 developers who disagree |
| 22:56.58 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Nope. Just turns the backlight on (battery still works). |
| 22:57.44 | SpeedEvil | bricode: and you get nothing showing up on lsusb? |
| 22:57.48 | SpeedEvil | :/ |
| 22:57.57 | SpeedEvil | bricode: sounds bricked then. |
| 22:58.43 | bricode | SpeedEvil: dfu-util -s section -R -D file doesn't work anymore, but lsusb does show it being there. |
| 22:59.14 | *** part/#openmoko caratorn (n=aratorn@tui75-3-88-168-237-15.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 22:59.35 | SpeedEvil | Can you get into the u-boot bootloader with ttyACM? |
| 22:59.42 | ewon | best debian bug EVAR: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=477454 |
| 22:59.54 | SpeedEvil | USB serial IOW |
| 23:00.26 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Nope. Couldn't do that from the start. That's why I tried this whole u-boot upgrade process. The phone I have is a bit of a mutt. |
| 23:00.58 | SpeedEvil | bricode: was this a purchased phone - or an early version? |
| 23:01.29 | bricode | SpeedEvil: How's this: gta01 software with gta02v3 bootloader on a gta02v4 pcb. It's an early version. |
| 23:02.21 | SpeedEvil | Ah |
| 23:02.32 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Yeah. Debugboard time. |
| 23:02.59 | SpeedEvil | I know there on the GTA02 a boot flash that can recover things. I don't know if it's been implemented. |
| 23:04.50 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Considering that phone was obtained in January, it's got some crusty code on it. |
| 23:04.56 | SpeedEvil | Yeah. |
| 23:05.48 | ewon | who did you sleep with to get a GTA02? |
| 23:06.07 | bricode | SpeedEvil: I can still dump stuff into RAM. Is there a way to pause the processor (like in JTAG) through the USB? |
| 23:06.12 | bricode | ewon: The right people. |
| 23:06.26 | mjr | I didn't know you could get a GTA02 by sleeping with someone? Who? |
| 23:06.39 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@AOrleans-152-1-13-161.w90-21.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 23:06.40 | bricode | ewon: Sadly the right people didn't also include a debug board with the phone. |
| 23:07.16 | SpeedEvil | bricode: yes - as I understand it - if you can get to u-boot - you can get into the bootloader serial console over USB. |
| 23:07.39 | SpeedEvil | bricode: howevfer, this might not be the case I suppose in your hardware. |
| 23:07.59 | SpeedEvil | bricode: anyway - find yourself in scotland, and you can use my debug board. |
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| 23:08.48 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Thanks for the offer. |
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| 23:10.43 | SpeedEvil | bricode: to check - you know how to get to u-boot via tty-ACM - and it just doesn't work? |
| 23:11.42 | *** join/#openmoko polz__ (n=polz@cpe-212-18-59-51.dynamic.amis.net) |
| 23:11.51 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Tried both cu -l /dev/ttyACM0 (properly chown'd) and neocon. No dice. |
| 23:12.10 | bricode | SpeedEvil: Even cat doesn't give me any love. |
| 23:13.08 | SpeedEvil | do you get the ACM device? |
| 23:13.14 | SpeedEvil | It ust doesn't respond? |
| 23:13.38 | quicksand | What are the vid/pid you see for the device in lsusb? |
| 23:13.58 | bricode | Yep. ACM device, doesn't respond. |
| 23:14.23 | bricode | quicksand: oldskool 1457:5119 |
| 23:16.41 | quicksand | Hmm, that's what dfu-util would be looking for, so I'm out of ideas. (On my GTA01 at least -- dunno if GTA02 is different) |
| 23:24.51 | bricode | Well, thanks for ideas guys. |
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| 23:47.14 | duffyd | hi ScaredyCat, how do your images match up with Kevin Dean's? Are they dated the same? |
| 23:47.20 | duffyd | probably stupid question ;) |
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