| 00:00.34 | ryoohki | sorry, wrong channel |
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| 00:19.38 | *** topic/#openmoko is wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | First orders have shipped yesterday - (24/7) for US, was supposed to be 25/7 for rest of world for processed orders - failed . http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html (black/silver only, in order of RT) |
| 00:20.26 | freelock | Is there an ipkg repository set up anywhere? |
| 00:20.36 | freelock | Looking to install something like cron |
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| 00:20.48 | freelock | Also looking for a proc or sys interface for battery level |
| 00:21.44 | joeyh | I *think* that I successfully ordered a Neo the first day they were on sale, but I have not received any mail from FIC about it. Anyone know who I should talk to? |
| 00:21.44 | aloril | joeyh: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
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| 00:25.11 | joeyh | from what I'm seeing in the shipping faq, others may have never gotten confirmation mails due to greylisting.. which I use |
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| 00:28.01 | SpeedEvil | idarwin: because the wiki is a horrible steaming mess. |
| 00:28.09 | Bryce_Leo | SpeedEvil: that's for sure |
| 00:28.20 | Bryce_Leo | SpeedEvil: it'd be nice to have a "wiki freeze" to go though and organize it |
| 00:28.28 | Bryce_Leo | and fix alot of it |
| 00:28.48 | SpeedEvil | I'm at the moment going through all the pages, culling obvious errors, and adding categories. |
| 00:28.51 | SpeedEvil | About 1/3 done. |
| 00:28.56 | *** join/#openmoko vosen (n=v0@86-63-84-163.asta-net.com.pl) |
| 00:29.14 | SpeedEvil | Though I'm not checking translated pages of course. |
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| 00:29.25 | Bryce_Leo | SpeedEvil: I'd hope not! |
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| 00:29.57 | calamous_ | Hmm, I wonder if my sim reader is bad. I have tried to different sim cards and when I do AT commands I get back CME ERROR 10 which is sim not inserted |
| 00:30.19 | SpeedEvil | The SIM connector is reportedly not brilliant. |
| 00:30.27 | SpeedEvil | What I would try. |
| 00:30.33 | SpeedEvil | Open the back of the phone. |
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| 00:30.52 | SpeedEvil | Press with 100g or so on the SIM, then power the phone up. |
| 00:30.58 | SpeedEvil | While still pressing on it. |
| 00:31.14 | linux_galore | anyone got a phone yet? |
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| 00:31.48 | SpeedEvil | Lots of people. |
| 00:31.53 | SpeedEvil | Well - 6ish in here. |
| 00:32.01 | linux_galore | 6 lol |
| 00:32.07 | SpeedEvil | in here. |
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| 00:33.34 | duffyd | s/seems/seams |
| 00:33.34 | ben_goodger | oh my |
| 00:33.36 | calamous_ | Do they not turn on without a battery? |
| 00:33.37 | daMaestro | way to go simmons |
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| 00:33.49 | ben_goodger | calamous_: it seems to me that it'd be difficult |
| 00:33.49 | *** join/#openmoko bhima (n=gopi@64.213.69.62) |
| 00:33.49 | ben_goodger | unless it was plugged in |
| 00:33.49 | linux_galore | lol @ no battery |
| 00:33.49 | linux_galore | yeah, sorry we forgot to add a solar panel |
| 00:33.49 | Writchie | SpeedEvil: Did you catch Harald's posting on community re: wiki / restructuring? |
| 00:33.49 | calamous_ | of course I have it plugged in but It wont turn on without a batt |
| 00:33.50 | daMaestro | lol |
| 00:33.52 | SpeedEvil | Writchie: yeah. |
| 00:34.01 | SpeedEvil | Writchie: that's the least of the wikis problems :) |
| 00:34.08 | Writchie | the thread was hijacked |
| 00:34.18 | Writchie | true on least of the problems |
| 00:34.21 | ben_goodger | daMaestro: you don't know how early crystal radios were powered, then? |
| 00:34.40 | dando | hi |
| 00:34.41 | SpeedEvil | It's very, very hard to do two-way that way though. |
| 00:34.47 | linux_galore | the openmoko is so powerful it will increase the IQ of your cat |
| 00:34.53 | Writchie | SpeedEvil: BTW BT wakeup doesn't look like it will work with present hardware |
| 00:34.58 | SpeedEvil | You run into the 1/r^4 signal dropof. |
| 00:35.07 | SpeedEvil | Writchie: where did you get that? |
| 00:35.27 | SpeedEvil | Writchie: the pins on the BT module are connected to wakeup capable pins. |
| 00:35.31 | SpeedEvil | AIUI. |
| 00:35.36 | linux_galore | looks like the bug squashing will start this week |
| 00:35.38 | Writchie | SpeedEvil: not EINT pins |
| 00:35.41 | Writchie | just pio |
| 00:35.47 | linux_galore | as phones arrive |
| 00:35.55 | Writchie | wakeup must be on EINT1 - 16 |
| 00:36.08 | Writchie | 2410 host usb doesn't support wakeup either |
| 00:36.39 | Writchie | old way is to poll the gpio pin from slow mode |
| 00:36.46 | Writchie | old=only |
| 00:36.54 | SpeedEvil | Bugger. |
| 00:37.13 | Writchie | if slow is really less than 50mw may not be too bad in interrim |
| 00:37.25 | SpeedEvil | The CPU number is 33mW |
| 00:37.26 | Writchie | hopefully could be fixed for gta02 |
| 00:37.28 | SpeedEvil | However. |
| 00:37.38 | SpeedEvil | 50mW is probably more realistic. |
| 00:38.06 | Writchie | i'll take 50mw - batter is 1200mahr * 3.6 V if a read it right |
| 00:38.14 | SpeedEvil | It's not _bad_. |
| 00:38.30 | SpeedEvil | It does have a nice side-effect - sortof. |
| 00:38.33 | Writchie | ultimately i'd like to see 5mw in BT wakeable standby flight mode |
| 00:38.47 | SpeedEvil | It means that when bluetooth is on, you've got essentially free GPS. |
| 00:39.00 | Writchie | how much power for gsp in standby |
| 00:39.07 | SpeedEvil | That's the nice thing. |
| 00:39.13 | SpeedEvil | It can be off most of the time. |
| 00:39.28 | Writchie | wake up every 10 seconds for a peek? |
| 00:39.31 | SpeedEvil | You only need to wake up the GPS and take a position every 3 min or so, for 1s to keep lock. |
| 00:39.54 | Bryce_Leo | wow, that's awesome |
| 00:39.54 | SpeedEvil | Unless you're in a fast plane. |
| 00:40.01 | SpeedEvil | This is in principle. |
| 00:40.06 | Writchie | my plane is only 160kts |
| 00:40.09 | SpeedEvil | The current GPS driver cannot do this. |
| 00:40.17 | Writchie | nor BT |
| 00:40.20 | Bryce_Leo | isn't that half the fun? |
| 00:40.33 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-162-178.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 00:40.35 | Writchie | bring out the blue wires |
| 00:40.35 | SpeedEvil | you need to move about a third of a millisecond or so in 3 mins in order to throw it off. |
| 00:40.59 | moko-bunny | :( my plane is only 100kts |
| 00:41.02 | Writchie | third of a ms? |
| 00:41.03 | calamous_ | SpeedEvil: I keep getting CME error 10 |
| 00:41.14 | calamous_ | I would hate to think that my sim reader is messed up |
| 00:41.15 | Writchie | has this SIM ever worked in any phone |
| 00:41.25 | calamous_ | Chances are I'm making some mistake, hardware is usually not defective |
| 00:41.30 | calamous_ | Writchie: Yes |
| 00:41.45 | Writchie | last resort: pencil eraser |
| 00:41.48 | calamous_ | Ive tried 2 sim cards and they both work in other phones but not my neo |
| 00:41.53 | Writchie | sometimes corrosion |
| 00:41.55 | calamous_ | Pencil eraser? |
| 00:41.56 | Bryce_Leo | calamous_: lol you're lucky, i've had more defective hardware than anyone else i know, however that's only when buying new |
| 00:42.02 | SpeedEvil | They are not 3.3V SIMS? |
| 00:42.14 | SpeedEvil | Dunno about that. |
| 00:42.25 | calamous_ | SpeedEvil: Are there 3.3V and 5V sims? |
| 00:42.42 | SpeedEvil | calamous_: yes - I don't know much about it. |
| 00:42.48 | Writchie | when's the last time you saw a 5V SIM? |
| 00:42.53 | SpeedEvil | calamous_: I'd post to the community mailing list. |
| 00:43.24 | calamous_ | goodidea |
| 00:43.47 | SpeedEvil | Otherwise, do the warranty return thing :/ |
| 00:44.14 | daMaestro | SpeedEvil, what carrier are you rocking? |
| 00:44.22 | Bryce_Leo | yugh warrranty returns are always a hassle |
| 00:44.30 | daMaestro | SpeedEvil, this is assuming you actually have your phone |
| 00:44.32 | SpeedEvil | carrier? |
| 00:44.34 | Writchie | what warrantee |
| 00:44.46 | daMaestro | i just don't want to find out that carrier XYZ's sims don't work with the neo |
| 00:44.49 | daMaestro | that would just suck |
| 00:45.22 | daMaestro | ah sorry |
| 00:45.32 | daMaestro | where is jason1 when you need him (or her) |
| 00:45.37 | freelock | t-mobile sims work, at least... |
| 00:45.47 | daMaestro | ok, well calamous_ is att |
| 00:46.08 | daMaestro | wow that would suck; i've been looking more at att over t-mobile |
| 00:47.10 | Writchie | looks like 5v sim in 3.3V phone won't work. |
| 00:47.26 | SpeedEvil | I have _no_ idea if that is the issue though. |
| 00:47.42 | Writchie | I don't think it is. |
| 00:47.51 | calamous_ | The neo uses 3.3V? |
| 00:47.53 | Bryce_Leo | Writchie: where is the sim from? |
| 00:47.56 | Writchie | Never had problems with t-mobile sims |
| 00:48.06 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 00:48.07 | Writchie | AT&T |
| 00:48.15 | Bryce_Leo | what phone? |
| 00:48.20 | Bryce_Leo | prepay or not pre-pay? |
| 00:48.38 | calamous_ | Prepaid ATT card |
| 00:48.38 | Writchie | i think he using an AT&T prepay SIM |
| 00:49.06 | Bryce_Leo | that should work, is the phone a nokia? |
| 00:49.22 | daMaestro | he is using the neo1973 |
| 00:49.43 | Bryce_Leo | right but did he just buy a sim or pull it out of a pre-pay phone |
| 00:50.28 | daMaestro | calamous_, you got just the sim correct? |
| 00:50.41 | calamous_ | daMaestro: correct, and it works in other phones |
| 00:50.59 | Bryce_Leo | calamous_: what country are you in? |
| 00:51.02 | calamous_ | US |
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| 00:51.42 | Bryce_Leo | and you could just buy a sim? I've never heard of that |
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| 00:52.26 | Bryce_Leo | but back to the task at hand, is there any text on the front and back of the sim? |
| 00:52.26 | linux_galore | yeah, most countries allow you to buy a sim card (prepay) but you have to ring up the service provider first though to turn it on |
| 00:52.42 | SpeedEvil | In the UK. |
| 00:52.52 | SpeedEvil | If you buy a SIM, you can get them for $1 or so equiv. |
| 00:52.59 | SpeedEvil | Even prepaid. |
| 00:53.06 | Writchie | or $100 in US |
| 00:53.07 | SpeedEvil | But you have to top up by $15 to use it. |
| 00:53.10 | Writchie | for a $1 sim |
| 00:53.12 | bhima | AT&T gave me a SIM for free with $20 credit |
| 00:53.16 | linux_galore | yeah you can buy a sim card for $2 here in AU |
| 00:53.23 | calamous_ | I hate the US |
| 00:53.28 | Writchie | move |
| 00:53.31 | calamous_ | I will :) |
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| 00:53.51 | daMaestro | bhima, does it work with the neo? |
| 00:53.54 | Writchie | china has best rates |
| 00:54.08 | bhima | daMaestro: I would presume it would, but I don't have a neo. |
| 00:54.11 | daMaestro | ok |
| 00:54.12 | linux_galore | US is in the stone age when it comes to mobile phones, I find it amusing that people see the iPhone as being curring edge when there are phones in Asia that have miles more features |
| 00:54.13 | calamous_ | I just email Jason to ask him what he uses since he is chicago |
| 00:54.25 | linux_galore | cutting* |
| 00:54.33 | calamous_ | linux_galore: I could not agree with you more, american's are easly brainwashed |
| 00:54.41 | daMaestro | yeah, well apple's stock is agreeing with that statement linux_galore |
| 00:54.41 | bhima | linux_galore: I find people who rate "features" as the most important metric amusing. |
| 00:54.48 | daMaestro | calamous_, thanks. |
| 00:54.56 | SpeedEvil | Err. |
| 00:55.05 | SpeedEvil | How aren't features important? |
| 00:55.08 | daMaestro | calamous_, that is too much of a generalized statement for a FOSS project (a lot of us are in the US) |
| 00:55.35 | SpeedEvil | For me, the major feature is 'can write own stuff'. As a phone, I'd never buy it if that wasn't the main feature. |
| 00:55.37 | calamous_ | daMaestro: I make that judgement based upon the average consumer and what they tolerate in the US |
| 00:55.39 | linux_galore | Kanji scanner isnt important heh heh |
| 00:55.46 | SpeedEvil | If that wasn't a desire for me. |
| 00:56.04 | Writchie | second feature - you need a network that works |
| 00:56.12 | calamous_ | daMaestro: and its a bunch not to do with technology, its goes with other things |
| 00:56.17 | daMaestro | calamous_, s/tolerate/are force fed/ |
| 00:56.22 | bhima | SpeedEvil: The feature spec sheet of the handset is not the most important thing. |
| 00:56.36 | SpeedEvil | The feature set of the network + handset. |
| 00:56.44 | Agrajag- | calamous_: probably goes with the fact that 20% of americans are functionally illiterate ;) |
| 00:56.49 | calamous_ | daMaestro: agreed, thats better diction. |
| 00:57.05 | calamous_ | Agrajag: Really? |
| 00:57.06 | bhima | SpeedEvil: Do you include usability as part of feature set? |
| 00:57.07 | Writchie | only 20% - you're dreaming ;) |
| 00:57.10 | linux_galore | the major Telco here has a weird setup 850mhz channel for data with the rf using CDMA not gsm |
| 00:57.24 | Agrajag- | calamous_: apparently so - http://education-portal.com/articles/Illiteracy%3A_The_Downfall_of_American_Society.html |
| 00:57.24 | calamous_ | Anyway, I would like to get my sim slot working |
| 00:57.30 | Writchie | where is that? |
| 00:57.44 | SpeedEvil | bhima: of course. An unusable feature is not a feature. |
| 00:57.58 | bhima | When I say features, I mean, "Send and recieve faxes", or "play youtube videos" |
| 00:58.10 | bhima | SpeedEvil: Many, many people have trouble with that idea. :) |
| 00:58.15 | *** join/#openmoko dennis_lan (n=Hoolxi@203.110.163.133) |
| 00:58.36 | linux_galore | So we have this wonderful nightmare were none of the Nokia phones work on this network because even though they support 850mhz for data they use GSM |
| 00:58.40 | bhima | SpeedEvil: I see so many people saying, "But that one, it does <foo>, it's *better*!" |
| 00:58.53 | SpeedEvil | But it is. |
| 00:58.57 | SpeedEvil | If the others don't. |
| 00:59.03 | SpeedEvil | And the user wants the feature enough. |
| 00:59.06 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.113) |
| 00:59.20 | linux_galore | Yeah, 3 months is a long time in japan for a mobile heh |
| 00:59.23 | SpeedEvil | OM may allow users to add features. |
| 00:59.28 | Bryce_Leo | SpeedEvil: thank you for being the voice of reason |
| 00:59.41 | SpeedEvil | But that's not the point for a user at a given point in time. |
| 00:59.42 | bhima | SpeedEvil: The last part, "wants the feature enough," is the operative part of that. |
| 01:00.03 | bhima | SpeedEvil: I'm talking about people who say that "it does more" as if that makes it objectively better for that reason alone. |
| 01:00.06 | SpeedEvil | they (ideally) compare features on phones, and buy the one that most suits them. |
| 01:00.12 | linux_galore | Im wondering if the OM may become too feature rich |
| 01:00.16 | *** join/#openmoko PMT (n=rich@c-68-39-249-165.hsd1.nj.comcast.net) |
| 01:00.20 | bhima | SpeedEvil: Spec sheets are poor for evaluating usability. |
| 01:00.21 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: how do you figure? |
| 01:00.26 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: not really. |
| 01:00.26 | calamous_ | Does anyone know about the Linux LED driver class. I looked though the vibrator source and its treated as the LED. Can I manually vibrate my phone by echoing 1 into some file in proc or sys? |
| 01:00.53 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: people adding crack to set software sets |
| 01:01.13 | *** join/#openmoko ahbritto (n=guest@adsl-64-161-117-110.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net) |
| 01:01.14 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: huh? |
| 01:01.17 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: end up like Gnome 1.4 with its 101 window setup options |
| 01:01.28 | SpeedEvil | linux_galore: see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Profiles#User_Profiles |
| 01:01.41 | daMaestro | SOUTH SAN FRANCISCO, CA, US 7/26/2007 3:05 A.M. |
| 01:01.41 | daMaestro | AN INCORRECT ROUTING AT A UPS FACILITY CAUSED THIS DELAY / THE PACKAGE WAS MISSORTED AT THE HUB. IT HAS BEEN REROUTED TO THE CORRECT DESTINATION SITE |
| 01:01.46 | daMaestro | awesome.. way to go UPS |
| 01:02.04 | SpeedEvil | You set it up so the user can pick the interface. |
| 01:02.13 | rwhitby | morning |
| 01:02.21 | calamous_ | daMaestro: Sorry to hear that |
| 01:02.24 | linux_galore | Im just saying I hope we dont end up like Gnome 1.4 with all the useless crack (Gnome 2.0 removed it all) |
| 01:02.24 | daMaestro | meh |
| 01:02.25 | Bryce_Leo | daMaestro: 2 days ago i had fedex steal parts of my package, scans in at 7.6 lbs gets to my house at 2.2lbs |
| 01:02.32 | daMaestro | wow |
| 01:02.36 | SpeedEvil | 'teen/myspace' 'buisness/financial times' 'pervert/4chan' |
| 01:02.37 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: ahh ok i see what you mean |
| 01:02.40 | daMaestro | now that i would be PISSED about |
| 01:03.02 | SpeedEvil | 'it fell open'. |
| 01:03.05 | freelock | calamous_: I turned the vibrator on and off with an echo |
| 01:03.18 | freelock | let me find it... |
| 01:03.19 | calamous_ | What was the path you used |
| 01:03.21 | calamous_ | ty |
| 01:03.26 | Bryce_Leo | daMaestro: i was furious, but fedex took the complaint, i called geeks.com and told them, they said, ok we'll handle it and 2nd day aired me a replacement |
| 01:03.35 | Bryce_Leo | daMaestro: and they've got it all handled |
| 01:03.41 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@ottawa-hs-209-217-93-173.d-ip.magma.ca) |
| 01:03.52 | daMaestro | Bryce_Leo, yeah.. i would have also be very livid |
| 01:03.58 | linux_galore | I got my zaurus from geeks.com |
| 01:04.05 | linux_galore | they had it on special |
| 01:04.23 | linux_galore | they are pretty fast |
| 01:04.32 | Bryce_Leo | geeks.com is amazing, they've done nothing but treat me well, i've bout well over 1.5k worth of stuff from them |
| 01:05.20 | linux_galore | I paid US$120 for a Zaurus 5500 (got a 5600 now) |
| 01:05.36 | Bryce_Leo | wow, i wish the zaurus was still available they were pretty cool |
| 01:06.03 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-162-178.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 01:06.07 | SpeedEvil | XorA|gone |
| 01:06.08 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 01:06.24 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: you can still buy them, i see Linux geeks with them all the time, especially the new clamshell models with a hardisk |
| 01:07.09 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: but where can you buy them from? |
| 01:07.19 | Bryce_Leo | i've got a treo right now and i'd like to just go back to a reg phone and pda |
| 01:07.42 | freelock | calamous_: echo 1 > /sys/class/leds/gta01\:vibrator/brightness |
| 01:07.44 | Bryce_Leo | my treo is shite, it's been dropped, kicked, soaked, blasted with heat burried in sand.... |
| 01:07.49 | freelock | calamous_: echo 0 > /sys/class/leds/gta01\:vibrator/brightness |
| 01:07.51 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@foad2.obtuse.com) |
| 01:07.54 | freelock | ... turns it back off |
| 01:08.09 | calamous_ | freelock: thats, my girlfriend will like that feature |
| 01:08.10 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: there are a few companies on line that sell them converted (Japanese -> English) for delivery all over the world |
| 01:08.15 | calamous_ | thanks |
| 01:08.16 | daMaestro | lol |
| 01:08.16 | freelock | lol |
| 01:08.51 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: although the Linux geeks throw that firmware in the bin and use the Debian version |
| 01:08.55 | SpeedEvil | calamous_: the neo is _not_ 'water'proof. |
| 01:09.08 | calamous_ | lol |
| 01:09.12 | daMaestro | yes, "water" |
| 01:09.13 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: haha well that doesn't suprise me |
| 01:09.16 | daMaestro | bwhwhahhahaha |
| 01:09.45 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i've always been a fan of debians younger sluttier daughter |
| 01:09.49 | linux_galore | I can imagine as soon as the debian guys see the openmoko they will create their own fork |
| 01:09.56 | idarwin | Bryce_Leo: I have a treo just like that! |
| 01:10.08 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: lol pretty darn sturdy phone ain't it |
| 01:10.25 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: my problem is i use Verizon and that means 500 to buy a new replacment no contract |
| 01:10.36 | idarwin | yeah, it just kept going and going until the end. |
| 01:10.57 | linux_galore | create a waterproof mod case |
| 01:10.57 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: the debian folks probably would, but they might just leave it as it is |
| 01:11.10 | idarwin | urgh, I hate carrier lock-in but then you get the subsidy. :-( |
| 01:11.14 | Bryce_Leo | otter case |
| 01:11.17 | Bryce_Leo | those things are nuts |
| 01:11.29 | idarwin | so your Neo will replace your Treo, right? |
| 01:11.34 | joeyh | linux_galore: hi, fwiw, I'm a debian guy, and that's exactly why I (hopefully) have a neo on order |
| 01:11.40 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: you know how the debian guys are, it has to bee 100% open source and gpl so they may fork it, |
| 01:11.46 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: yes but why can you buy a treo 680 for gsm for 350 and yet it's 500 for a new 700 with identical specs to the 650 pretty much and the 650 is pretty similar to the 680 |
| 01:11.47 | joeyh | although I think of it more as packaging OpenMoko for Debian than a fork |
| 01:11.58 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: but they they'll be left without gprs |
| 01:12.20 | calamous_ | I posted about my sim card reader on the list. Does anyone know any good way to clean the contacts? |
| 01:12.22 | joeyh | nah, just snarf the gprs stuff from the installed system during bootstrapping |
| 01:12.23 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: that's the goal |
| 01:12.52 | linux_galore | calamous_: use PCB cleaner, you can buy it at any electronics shop |
| 01:12.54 | bhima | How easy is it to use the neo's touch screen with fingers? |
| 01:12.56 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: i'd like to see my treo go away and switch to att contract with an open moko |
| 01:12.59 | SpeedEvil | calamous_: I would wait till you get a comment from the list. |
| 01:13.15 | idarwin | ask me? no, ask palmsource. I dunno why they price it like that. Cuz GSM is better? Cuz it doesn't have wince inside? Really don't know |
| 01:13.33 | linux_galore | <- electronics engineer |
| 01:13.43 | linux_galore | retired though |
| 01:13.50 | Bryce_Leo | idarwin: it's probably because the cdma isn't open so they have to license the spec to build the hardware |
| 01:14.05 | idarwin | the merger of "community events" into "current events" is done in en, but will take a while for all the translations to synch. |
| 01:14.25 | calamous_ | Ok. I'll sit tight |
| 01:14.32 | bhima | I don't think that licensing fees are high enough to account for a $150 difference. |
| 01:14.50 | idarwin | Bryce_Leo, that could be, I just don't know |
| 01:14.58 | linux_galore | calamous_: dont use any oil based products it will just attract dirt and some alcohol based cleaners leave residue |
| 01:15.06 | Bryce_Leo | bhima: they might be, i really don't know, i just think that it's stupid |
| 01:15.27 | Bryce_Leo | calamous_: if you have any eclipse cleaner for camera lenses that should work well |
| 01:15.54 | bhima | All I know is, Palm gives you PalmOS and Wince as your OS choices. Not very impressive IMHO. |
| 01:16.10 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: Just use PCB cleaner, it perfect, a sim card in reality is just a small pcb |
| 01:16.12 | calamous_ | I'm taking a closer look at the sim contacts and it looks like one of them is too far depressed, I'm going to try and raise it a bit and try again. |
| 01:16.31 | Bryce_Leo | bhima: they'll have a linux option out by middle of next year supposedly |
| 01:16.35 | calamous_ | Not to comment to much on the physical design, the construction of the sim card and memory card slots look "flimsey" |
| 01:16.54 | linux_galore | WinCE is friggin slow |
| 01:16.57 | bhima | Bryce_Leo: You mean, PalmOS UI with Linux underneath? |
| 01:16.57 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i don't have any pcb cleaner so i generally use the eclipse to clean any contacts taht need it |
| 01:17.12 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: wince sucks terribly |
| 01:17.14 | linux_galore | PalmOS was good 5 years ago |
| 01:17.58 | Bryce_Leo | bhima: sort of, linux underneath and for alot of things with a plam 68k compat envornment licences from Access to run the palm apps supposedly has 95% compatiblity |
| 01:18.04 | *** part/#openmoko rschuste2 (n=rob@vpn.tarent.de) |
| 01:18.11 | linux_galore | I notice Palm's new ultra portable laptop runs LInux now and they are porting the palm software stack over |
| 01:18.14 | Bryce_Leo | licences = licenced |
| 01:18.28 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: yeah the foleo is all linux underpinings |
| 01:18.39 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: it's supposed to be pretty cool |
| 01:19.06 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: price is pretty good too, be fun to see how the EEE and the Foleo compare |
| 01:20.00 | calamous_ | Anyone know the pinouts of a sim card? |
| 01:20.05 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: the price is ok, i'm still waiting for the asus epc |
| 01:20.06 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: although I have my sites set on a Toshiba R500 with a 64GB flash drive weighting 1.7lb |
| 01:20.09 | calamous_ | Its multimeter time |
| 01:20.23 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: hahah that's a hell of a machine |
| 01:20.48 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i got a brand new dell 1420 it's small enough and light enough to be just what i wanted |
| 01:20.56 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: I cant believe they got that much grunt into such a small machine |
| 01:21.10 | linux_galore | (R500) |
| 01:21.19 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: haha i know what you meant, that is remarkable |
| 01:21.30 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i'm curious to see the speed and reliablity of the ssd |
| 01:21.40 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: Ive already seen the R500 with a hardisk in the flesh, I have never seen a screen so thin |
| 01:22.08 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: its so thin you can actually bend it |
| 01:22.17 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: that sounds almost dangerous |
| 01:22.17 | *** join/#openmoko sublime_ (n=richard@144.90.11.17) |
| 01:22.41 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: the sales guy said it was designed to be bent |
| 01:23.06 | Bryce_Leo | haha linux_galore check out this case http://www.geeks.com/details.asp?invtid=HM-103R&cat=NBB |
| 01:23.34 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i hope they used hq polycarbonate rather than glass for the lcd |
| 01:23.55 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: thats cheap, freight will cost more |
| 01:24.39 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: go computer the shipping you'll be floored |
| 01:24.45 | Bryce_Leo | they also have a smaller lighter one for up to 15" |
| 01:24.58 | Bryce_Leo | and every case i've got has been fantastic build quality |
| 01:25.01 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: I think they go to china and just buy bulk stock of stuff thats not selling well |
| 01:26.16 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: I have a aluminum attache case for my laptop, it was cheaper than buying a leather carry case, how dumb is that |
| 01:26.24 | Bryce_Leo | they probably just ship from china, if you buy in bulk and ship cheap frieght you can get incredible deals |
| 01:26.28 | Bryce_Leo | like tomtop.com is a great example |
| 01:26.46 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: i know exactly what you mean, it's crazy isn't it |
| 01:27.05 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: but if you go to get a aluminum case from most places they're rediculously badly priced |
| 01:27.19 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: its padded inside too |
| 01:27.32 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: very nice, where'd you buy yours from? |
| 01:27.37 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: yeah, I dont buy much from shops |
| 01:27.55 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: me neither i pretty much web/mail oreder everything |
| 01:28.04 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: ohh you mean you ebay alot?> |
| 01:28.16 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: local chinese junk shop, they just buy lots of crap from China and sell it cheap |
| 01:28.42 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: that's pretty cool, what state are you in that has one of them? |
| 01:28.52 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: Im in AU |
| 01:29.12 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 01:29.43 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: I have a relative in CA who mails stuff for me |
| 01:29.54 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: lol ohhh ok, but you have china right there!! |
| 01:30.00 | Bryce_Leo | wait |
| 01:30.02 | Bryce_Leo | au or aus? |
| 01:30.06 | linux_galore | yep |
| 01:30.20 | linux_galore | US is actually closer than cn |
| 01:30.30 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: really? |
| 01:30.33 | linux_galore | yeah |
| 01:30.41 | Bryce_Leo | wow that's pretty cool |
| 01:31.10 | linux_galore | no real difference between shipping from the US and CN |
| 01:31.27 | linux_galore | also with CN you can never be sure what your getting |
| 01:31.40 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: well i guess that's true |
| 01:31.47 | bhima | Shipping stuff out of Kuwait is great. It's really, really cheap. |
| 01:32.12 | Bryce_Leo | bhima: wow really? what country are you in? |
| 01:32.23 | bhima | Right now I"m in the US. But I lived in Kuwait for awhile. |
| 01:32.24 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: go on youtube and type in fake ipod or fake nano , these are idiots who purchased an ipod from Chine only to get a crappy fake |
| 01:32.35 | bhima | The only thing they ship out of Kuwait is oil. |
| 01:32.43 | bhima | So they have many empty containers and airplanes leaving. |
| 01:33.16 | *** join/#openmoko crunchywelch (n=welch@c-69-255-216-151.hsd1.dc.comcast.net) |
| 01:33.26 | linux_galore | bhima: yeah, Im amazed people dont transfer stuff in Kuwait to save money |
| 01:33.37 | happycube | heh... go fig |
| 01:33.40 | bhima | Shipping _in_ to Kuwait isn't that cheap. |
| 01:33.50 | happycube | it's like booking a u-haul here |
| 01:34.00 | happycube | one way is often *much* cheaper than the other depending on how people are migrating |
| 01:34.08 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: well that figures |
| 01:34.13 | Bryce_Leo | bhima: ahh ok |
| 01:34.29 | *** part/#openmoko idarwin (n=ian@207.81.133.5) |
| 01:34.43 | linux_galore | I had a friend who just got back from the emirates on contract and the guy has so much luxury crap from Europe its not funny |
| 01:34.51 | linux_galore | its all tax free |
| 01:35.09 | Bryce_Leo | wow, tax free? |
| 01:35.30 | linux_galore | imagine fillinh your gas guzzling car for $12 |
| 01:35.41 | linux_galore | filling* |
| 01:35.48 | Bryce_Leo | hahahahahahaha, now that's hard to imagine |
| 01:36.01 | linux_galore | nope they have a special local rate for fuel |
| 01:36.09 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: wow, that sounds awesome |
| 01:36.24 | bhima | People in Kuwait still pay attention to gas mileage. |
| 01:36.29 | linux_galore | they dont have medical insurance, its all free |
| 01:36.56 | bhima | Big American cars are known to be cheap for spare parts, but use more gas. |
| 01:37.05 | bhima | Japanese cars are efficient but cost more to maintain. |
| 01:37.53 | linux_galore | yeah, he was given a Toyota Land Cruiser (Diesel) |
| 01:38.01 | linux_galore | as a company car |
| 01:38.02 | *** join/#openmoko chreekat (n=b@84.235.125.209.transedge.com) |
| 01:38.29 | linux_galore | land Cruisers are pretty common in the middle east |
| 01:38.34 | Bryce_Leo | that's a heck of a company car |
| 01:38.51 | linux_galore | actually they are very common here in AU too |
| 01:39.11 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: how much is gas per litre by you/ |
| 01:39.12 | Bryce_Leo | ?* |
| 01:39.18 | Bryce_Leo | i'm assuming you don't buy per gallon |
| 01:40.40 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: well my car (V6 3.8L motor) doesnt run on petrol (gas) but LPG, I pay AU$48c per litre (US$42c) |
| 01:41.36 | *** join/#openmoko dietricha (i=dietrich@conference/oscon/x-1b1706680f4941d6) |
| 01:41.36 | Bryce_Leo | your'e kidding me? that's like a 1.60 american per gallon |
| 01:41.38 | linux_galore | petrol is about AU$118 |
| 01:41.59 | linux_galore | petrol is about AU$1.18 per litre |
| 01:42.18 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: good or bad |
| 01:42.27 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: very very very good |
| 01:42.35 | *** part/#openmoko Bryce_Leo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 01:42.40 | *** join/#openmoko Bryce_Leo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 01:42.55 | happycube | i've always wanted a wlan cruiser |
| 01:42.58 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: well Australia has tons of LPG, in the past we just burnt it as wast now we use it as a fuel |
| 01:42.59 | *** join/#openmoko ozark2 (n=Compaq_O@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 01:43.00 | happycube | with a big-arse antenna on top ;) |
| 01:43.03 | ckuethe | linux_galore: about the same as here in edmonton, actually |
| 01:43.14 | happycube | i can't imagine the shortsightedness of burning LPG/NG |
| 01:43.39 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: jeez, i couldn't imagine just burning it |
| 01:43.42 | linux_galore | happycube: well it was a side product of the oil |
| 01:43.52 | happycube | yeah... still |
| 01:44.13 | linux_galore | Bryce_Leo: well for about 20-30 years they just burnt a few billion barrels of the stuff |
| 01:44.54 | linux_galore | now every taxi or car with a big V8 in Australia runs on the stuff |
| 01:45.18 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: man, that's alot |
| 01:45.33 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: well it makes sense for them to all run on it now |
| 01:45.48 | SpeedEvil | I was in the supermarket today. |
| 01:45.50 | linux_galore | if you visit Sydney about 60% of the buses run on LNG |
| 01:46.00 | SpeedEvil | Cooking oil was 59p/l. |
| 01:46.02 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: jeez that's good |
| 01:46.10 | SpeedEvil | Diesel was some 90p/l. |
| 01:46.47 | Bryce_Leo | SpeedEvil: haha we had truckers around me getting in trouble for using that |
| 01:46.50 | borg_ | mh |
| 01:46.51 | Bryce_Leo | instead of diesel |
| 01:46.54 | linux_galore | we also have shit loads of LNG, so much we export the stuff to Japan and China (China recently signed a US$20 Billion dollar contract) |
| 01:47.13 | borg_ | we pay something like 1.35€ per litre benzin now in germany |
| 01:47.20 | borg_ | thats something like 2$ |
| 01:47.22 | borg_ | :\ |
| 01:47.43 | Bryce_Leo | borg_: aww man that sucks |
| 01:47.44 | SpeedEvil | US phones - http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=07/07/26/1420211 |
| 01:48.03 | SpeedEvil | and why they suck |
| 01:48.09 | borg_ | i think ~70% of it is tax |
| 01:48.42 | *** join/#openmoko superbnerb (n=superbne@CPE0080c8df7759-CM00194757e7b4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 01:48.48 | linux_galore | its funny CA kicked up a fuss about a transfer station for importing LNG from Australia, all thats hapened is China bought it all so now even if CA now reverses the decision they cant buy anything |
| 01:48.50 | *** part/#openmoko alep1 (n=aleph@190.49.105.74) |
| 01:49.15 | *** join/#openmoko zaery (n=zaery@c-71-202-249-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 01:49.33 | superbnerb | does anyone know how the openmoko phone is being distributed in canada? Do they have a canadian distributor yet? |
| 01:49.39 | SpeedEvil | no. |
| 01:49.46 | SpeedEvil | look at topic |
| 01:49.52 | linux_galore | Blame Canada |
| 01:49.53 | ckuethe | not yet... buy direct |
| 01:49.57 | ckuethe | blame rogers. |
| 01:50.21 | linux_galore | be back laterz |
| 01:50.27 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: lol |
| 01:50.33 | Bryce_Leo | linux_galore: sucks for CA |
| 01:50.40 | zaery | Hello everyone, i just got my phone today and i accidentally calibrated the touchscreen wrong, how do i recalibrate the touchscreen? Thanks in advance. |
| 01:50.41 | aloril | zaery: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 01:51.01 | Bryce_Leo | zaery: you could always re-flash |
| 01:51.07 | Bryce_Leo | zaery: but i'm sure there's a better way |
| 01:51.37 | Writchie | SpeedEvil: Article is basically correct. |
| 01:52.15 | Bryce_Leo | alrighty guys i gotta run |
| 01:52.17 | Bryce_Leo | c ya |
| 01:52.19 | *** part/#openmoko Bryce_Leo (n=bryce@nj-71-48-102-108.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 01:52.21 | zaery | Bryce_leo: cya |
| 01:52.23 | Writchie | North American Cellular was originally marketing an image |
| 01:52.27 | zaery | Bryce_leo: and thx |
| 01:52.34 | Writchie | big time dude with a cellphone rather a tool |
| 01:53.08 | Writchie | Separation of handset and network is essential for either to be competitive. |
| 01:53.13 | Writchie | i.e. like gsm. |
| 01:53.30 | Writchie | this is the issue Goggle is trying to force open. |
| 01:54.30 | Writchie | Verizon is still bell-shaped heads - the same ones who argued the pstn would be destroyed if the conection to the network was allowed. |
| 01:55.07 | Writchie | US is now about 35 - 40 % GSM |
| 01:56.23 | Writchie | 95% of americans don't realize they can buy their own handsets. |
| 01:56.56 | Writchie | as a result carriers build handset into the network service price. |
| 01:57.30 | Writchie | as Steve Jobs said, you have to push the phone through one of 4 orfices |
| 01:59.43 | Writchie | imho t-mobile and At&t together will now gain market share as their networks compete with one another in an environment of open attachment. |
| 02:00.02 | Writchie | we are not there yet but it is in sight. |
| 02:01.11 | Writchie | once americans learn about separation of handset and network and start buying each on their own merit, the gsm carriers togher will make gains against the other two. |
| 02:02.09 | ozark2 | Witchie: It might be nice to see a separation of phone and device |
| 02:02.25 | ozark2 | Americans certainly love to pull the wool over their own eyes, |
| 02:02.28 | Writchie | 1.5 to 2 billion people already have this |
| 02:03.22 | ozark2 | but the real problem is just that phones are very inexpensive (when subsidized by a two year contract) |
| 02:03.38 | *** join/#openmoko aesci99 (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 02:04.16 | ozark2 | So I don't think it's a matter of Americans learning about separation of device and service. |
| 02:04.51 | Writchie | it is not possible to educate americans |
| 02:05.08 | ozark2 | uh oh. The gloves are off now. :-) |
| 02:05.25 | Writchie | the culture doesn't allow it. |
| 02:05.38 | Writchie | I know, i am one |
| 02:06.05 | Writchie | But I lived overseas many years so I can now see the forest |
| 02:06.28 | ozark2 | Apple may be able to change the landscape a little |
| 02:06.34 | Writchie | it will take a killer app of some kind |
| 02:06.47 | ozark2 | but I don't think they're going to change the cellular culture entirely. |
| 02:06.49 | Writchie | Apple is it - they are playing ball. |
| 02:06.57 | Writchie | i mean apple isn't it |
| 02:07.05 | Writchie | apple is tied to the carrier. |
| 02:07.21 | Writchie | Openmoko devices may help |
| 02:07.24 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 02:07.28 | ozark2 | For now. |
| 02:07.45 | Writchie | you need enough traction for the carrier to restructure subsidy. |
| 02:07.49 | ozark2 | I think OpenMoko is neat, and I can't wait to get the phone I ordered |
| 02:08.01 | *** join/#openmoko ChooseOpen (n=ws1@c-24-15-3-175.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 02:08.08 | ozark2 | but I don't think it will ever be anything but a sideshow. |
| 02:08.31 | Writchie | it could enable the killer app |
| 02:08.34 | daMaestro | well you mean the neo1973 will be nothing but a sideshow |
| 02:08.42 | daMaestro | the openmoko platform is what is going to be the gem |
| 02:08.48 | daMaestro | the neo1973 is just the *start* |
| 02:09.10 | roh | ozark2 apple is not going to change american culture.. its just a company which adapted to feed that market products which are usable uneducated about things |
| 02:09.30 | daMaestro | hello roh, how are things? |
| 02:09.32 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D83BB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 02:09.48 | roh | daMaestro you do not want to know ;) |
| 02:13.05 | *** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@122-124-78-111.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 02:13.49 | *** part/#openmoko ozark2 (n=Compaq_O@cpe-76-184-78-54.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 02:16.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User:Romulus]] [[Neo1973_Battery]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Vancouver]] [[Talk:Community_Events]] [[Community_Events]] [[Main_Page]] [[Current_events]] [[Neo1973_Power_Management]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Bern]] and other changes |
| 02:19.46 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@foad2.obtuse.com) |
| 02:22.19 | *** join/#openmoko kiney_ (n=kiney@p5488110A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 02:22.20 | *** join/#openmoko charkin1 (n=casey@64.122.195.244) |
| 02:22.39 | BlackBsd | can i compile openmoko on a pc using gcc4.x? |
| 02:26.15 | cesarb | BlackBsd: only qemu needs gcc-3.x |
| 02:26.44 | cesarb | BlackBsd: and it autodetects, so you can install both the normal gcc-4.x packages and the gcc-3.x packages for your distribution and it'll figure it out |
| 02:28.48 | *** join/#openmoko orospakr (n=orospakr@bas4-ottawa23-1177561774.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 02:29.31 | seemant | roh: I wanna know |
| 02:30.34 | *** join/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 02:33.08 | roh | seemant lots of stress. too many peeople asking questions they should ask end of the year earliest. |
| 02:33.43 | seemant | roh: I'm sorry to hear that -- I hope things let up |
| 02:33.52 | *** join/#openmoko sagacis (n=mark@cpe-76-185-118-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 02:34.27 | roh | seemant e.g. tons of plain users which have no clue about the difference of gsm and cdma and what a sim is asking where to buy und what service they need.. such stuff takes a lot of power which we could use more productive |
| 02:34.37 | roh | SpeedEvil yeah ;) |
| 02:34.47 | seemant | roh: indeed :/ |
| 02:35.03 | calamous_ | Anyone have any ideas about "my broken sim reader"? |
| 02:35.11 | seemant | roh: in a way it's good, because you know that people are thirsting for it |
| 02:35.17 | calamous_ | I posted on the list but was reffered back to IRC |
| 02:35.58 | calamous_ | I have tried many sim cards and get back CME ERROR 10 (sim card not inserted) from the GSM modem |
| 02:36.09 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: That was you? :) |
| 02:36.28 | aloril | (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte <laforge at openmoko.org> Re: Bluetooth to 2410 Wiring |
| 02:36.45 | calamous_ | ChooseOpen: Jason? |
| 02:36.53 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Hey! |
| 02:36.56 | ChooseOpen | LOL |
| 02:37.02 | calamous_ | hey! lol yeah |
| 02:37.17 | LaF0rge | WARNING: I'm taking svn.openmoko.org offline temporarily |
| 02:37.27 | ChooseOpen | "There are alot of smater people here" |
| 02:38.04 | calamous_ | I just hope I'm doing something wrong and the hardware is not deffective |
| 02:40.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 664 has been created by autobuild-reports(AT)openmoko.org |
| 02:40.01 | cdbot2 | * * linux-gta01-2.6.21.6-moko10-r1_0_0_2388_0-do_fetch |
| 02:40.02 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=664 |
| 02:40.06 | roh | calamous_ no. administrative work. |
| 02:40.36 | roh | calamous_ ah.. you mean your sim slot... did you lock it properly? |
| 02:40.43 | calamous_ | roh: yeh |
| 02:40.54 | calamous_ | roh: Ive made sure the pins are touching |
| 02:41.04 | roh | ok |
| 02:41.09 | *** join/#openmoko mwester-road (n=chatzill@12.27.45.5) |
| 02:41.24 | roh | are all your sim from the same carrier? |
| 02:41.49 | calamous_ | roh: unfortuantly, one 2 year old cingular one and 2 new AT&T ones |
| 02:41.51 | BlackBsd | anyone tried integrating the projected with eclipse? |
| 02:42.02 | calamous_ | someone mentioned 3.3 and 5v sim cards |
| 02:42.03 | sublime_ | are you the guy that posted to the mailing list too? |
| 02:42.10 | calamous_ | yeah I'm Harry |
| 02:42.34 | sublime_ | ok, did you try manually powering on the gsm modem? |
| 02:42.44 | sublime_ | im the one that suggested that |
| 02:42.53 | calamous_ | Yeah. ive tried it all |
| 02:43.11 | calamous_ | I should be able to dial 911 (or 112) from the modem but I really don't want to test that |
| 02:43.22 | sublime_ | good idea |
| 02:43.24 | sublime_ | haha |
| 02:43.34 | calamous_ | cause when i do AT+CREG I get error 32 which means no network but emergency calls allowed |
| 02:44.09 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03root * r2528 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/: create OM-2008 directory |
| 02:44.09 | calamous_ | "911 what is your emergency?" -- "nothing officer, just testing my neo" |
| 02:44.20 | ChooseOpen | heh |
| 02:44.42 | *** join/#openmoko aesci99 (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 02:44.47 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03root * r2529 10/trunk/ (applications/ src/target/OM-2008/applications/): move applications to the right location |
| 02:44.56 | ckuethe | that's where you do it from a car ... with an anonymous prepaid SIM.... then leave. in a big hurry |
| 02:45.07 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03root * r2530 10/trunk/ (artwork/ src/target/OM-2008/artwork/): move artwork to the right location |
| 02:45.33 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03root * r2531 10/trunk/ (libraries/ src/target/OM-2008/libraries/): move libraries to the right location |
| 02:45.58 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03root * r2532 10/trunk/ (mockups/ src/target/mockups/): move mockups to the right location |
| 02:46.15 | *** join/#openmoko longshot (n=gl@CPE-58-161-49-56.nsw.bigpond.net.au) |
| 02:46.26 | *** join/#openmoko dkirker (n=dkirker@c-24-6-210-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 02:49.13 | *** join/#openmoko spliffy (n=frost@p54B1FC54.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 02:51.39 | compbrain | I might take my neo down to the local 911 dispatch and do some testing |
| 02:52.05 | ChooseOpen | compbrain: Thats nice of you to make it easy on the cops :) |
| 02:52.16 | compbrain | I've gpt a friend who works there, so he's actually auth'd to perform such tests |
| 02:52.36 | compbrain | and its dispatchers, not the cops, that handle calls |
| 02:52.46 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 02:56.01 | calamous_ | Woot! I just got the bluetooth PAN set up (its slow as hell though). but now I have "wireless internet" on my moko (as long as I'm withen 15 ft of my comp) |
| 02:56.11 | cjb | :) |
| 02:57.54 | orospakr | compbrain: they let you do that? |
| 02:58.29 | SpeedEvil | I've got an adaptor that lets you use bluetooth up to 150 feet easily with the neo. |
| 02:58.43 | SpeedEvil | The downside is that it's an 80cm satellite dish. |
| 02:58.52 | SpeedEvil | (bought for GPS experiments). |
| 02:59.06 | cjb | :) it sounded like a great home wifi replacement for a while there.. |
| 03:00.29 | compbrain | orospakr: Well, if your testing things, I immagine going down and working with someone there is preffered to spurious calls to 911 |
| 03:00.50 | ChooseOpen | Just found the "Stroke REcognizer". pretty cool |
| 03:00.52 | *** join/#openmoko SP-8472 (i=8472@dslb-084-056-251-179.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 03:17.21 | *** join/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 03:17.54 | *** join/#openmoko Cyphi^ (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 03:20.34 | sagacis | Finally got my ship notification. |
| 03:22.06 | happycube | woot! |
| 03:22.08 | ChooseOpen | sagacis: Yay! |
| 03:22.25 | ChooseOpen | sagacis: Whats you est deliv date? |
| 03:22.38 | ChooseOpen | /s/you/your |
| 03:24.16 | juri_ | oh well. so i'm in shipment two. big deal. that means i get to watch everyone else break theirs. :) |
| 03:25.37 | calamous_ | ChooseOpen: Jason, you want to try to meet up next weekend? |
| 03:26.31 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Sure. I am free then, i think |
| 03:26.49 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: What side of town are you on? |
| 03:28.30 | zaery | Anyone found/made any apps to download yet? |
| 03:28.35 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 03:30.09 | zaery | so, nobody has any downloadable apps? |
| 03:37.08 | aloril | (script) openmoko-neo1973: Harald Welte <laforge at openmoko.org> Re: Bluetooth to 2410 Wiring |
| 03:39.28 | *** join/#openmoko bendo (i=bendo@irc.cnet.sk) |
| 03:39.49 | calamous_ | OMG! I got my sim working but with an older sim card (3 years old) |
| 03:40.01 | calamous_ | The new at&t ones don't work but the old ones do |
| 03:40.06 | SpeedEvil | :) |
| 03:40.11 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: cool |
| 03:40.16 | zaery | sweet, i have no idea if my sim works |
| 03:40.21 | calamous_ | I would love to know why |
| 03:40.26 | zaery | it won't work to call people |
| 03:40.51 | calamous_ | The gold plating on the older sim compaired to the new one looks defferent, I'm not sure if they're sim revisions or not |
| 03:41.08 | zaery | oooh |
| 03:41.09 | calamous_ | But I would love others on AT&T to try their sim card |
| 03:41.50 | calamous_ | Their new sim card (with a picture of a blazing fireball saying "3G" (how ironic)) are the ones that don't work |
| 03:42.10 | zaery | i use cingular, i wouldn't know |
| 03:42.19 | calamous_ | cingular=at&t |
| 03:42.46 | zaery | i had no idea that one bought the other |
| 03:42.48 | bmidgley | calamous_ does the nonworking sim have that big "3G" logo |
| 03:42.56 | calamous_ | yes |
| 03:43.06 | calamous_ | bmidgley: that is correct |
| 03:43.12 | zaery | ill check what my sim looks like |
| 03:43.16 | bmidgley | I also tried one of those and it didn't work |
| 03:43.26 | bmidgley | that was about a month or two ago on an early p1 |
| 03:43.31 | calamous_ | Yes |
| 03:43.46 | calamous_ | at&t (cingular) changed their sim design about 4m ago |
| 03:43.53 | calamous_ | The old cingular sims work fine |
| 03:44.15 | bmidgley | the one I tried has the 3G thing printed on it but it's a year or so old |
| 03:44.29 | bmidgley | cingular/att/cingular/att |
| 03:44.51 | *** join/#openmoko amarsh04 (n=amarsh04@CPE-124-182-100-214.sa.bigpond.net.au) |
| 03:44.52 | bmidgley | they shouldn't even bother changing the signs... they'll be cingular again before long |
| 03:44.56 | calamous_ | bmidgley: hmm. What do the contacts on the sim look like |
| 03:44.57 | ChooseOpen | wow this seems kinda critical... |
| 03:45.07 | bmidgley | calamous_ I don't have it handy |
| 03:45.30 | calamous_ | bmidgley: either at&t is doing something non standard or the neo engineers need to make it work with their sim |
| 03:45.47 | Writchie | calamous: 3G means it could be a 1.8V SIM |
| 03:46.02 | calamous_ | Jason did you try a t-mobile sim earlier? |
| 03:46.08 | zaery | mine says "64k smart chip" across the middle and then the cingular sign in the bottom left |
| 03:46.14 | ChooseOpen | cal, yeah I have tmobile SIM |
| 03:46.34 | happycube | ouch... i wonder why the new att sim dosen't work |
| 03:46.38 | calamous_ | Does anyone know of documentation on the sim chips? |
| 03:46.40 | happycube | *how it could be made to work |
| 03:47.06 | calamous_ | Well. If we know how the TI clyipso operated we could find out |
| 03:48.01 | calamous_ | I have "4 bars" on this old cingular card. lol |
| 03:48.28 | calamous_ | "2 bars" now. thats how I know its an at&t network |
| 03:48.32 | bmidgley | I have 4 bars with no card at all :) |
| 03:48.38 | zaery | wow |
| 03:48.47 | bmidgley | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sim_card has a pic of the cingular "3g" sim |
| 03:48.55 | happycube | at&t: all your bar are belong to nsa |
| 03:48.55 | zaery | you guys are funny |
| 03:50.38 | calamous_ | at&t, your world delivered to the NSA |
| 03:51.08 | happycube | verizon: it's not our crap phones. |
| 03:51.08 | calamous_ | I'm taking number theory and I want to go to the local AT&T office and apply to work for the NSA. |
| 03:51.30 | calamous_ | I figure if I just leave my resume at the at&t store it will wind up in the hands of the nsa |
| 03:51.37 | happycube | lol |
| 03:52.16 | calamous_ | I just bought this at&t sim today. I'm going to call them and say that my old cingular one works but not my new one |
| 03:52.23 | cjb_ie | assuming you can find an employee who'll know to forward it... |
| 03:52.47 | bmidgley | is the neo hardware only able to do 3v sims? |
| 03:52.48 | calamous_ | true |
| 03:53.22 | calamous_ | they transfered me twice and I was talking about AT commands and GSM proto and the guy after 2 transfers still didnt know what I was talking about |
| 03:53.27 | cjb_ie | best thing might be to embed a few buzzwords and send it back and forth a few million times with random enc keys |
| 03:53.30 | calamous_ | I called earlier |
| 03:55.23 | calamous_ | are we sure the neo supports 3g? |
| 03:55.41 | SpeedEvil | no, it doesn't. |
| 03:55.45 | SpeedEvil | very sure. |
| 03:56.17 | calamous_ | Is that why the new AT&T sim cards dont work but the old ones w/o the 3g logo do? |
| 03:56.28 | calamous_ | I tried a very old cingular one in my phone and it works |
| 03:57.00 | guaqua | there might be some extra bits due to the 3g logo |
| 03:57.09 | *** join/#openmoko alUrdun_ (n=jordan@64.180.94.253) |
| 03:57.41 | guaqua | you should probably come open and ask how it differs from the old from the technology perspective and if they can't answer, try to find out who produced the new sims and ask them |
| 03:57.50 | *** join/#openmoko MrWGW (n=opera@cpe-76-173-136-18.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 03:58.08 | MrWGW | good evening |
| 03:58.30 | calamous_ | Ok. the cingular "64K smartchip" works, but the "at&t 3G" dosent |
| 03:58.43 | cjb_ie | guaqua: i'd imagine whoever produced them is buried under NDAs |
| 03:59.20 | zaery | hmmm, how can i tell that my 64k smartchip works, i tried doing a few calls and even tried to recieve one, but it dosen't work |
| 03:59.34 | aloril | cool, my Neo1973 has shipped! |
| 03:59.35 | calamous_ | Zaery go to a shell |
| 03:59.40 | zaery | kk |
| 03:59.51 | guaqua | cjb_ie: unfortunately :( |
| 03:59.52 | calamous_ | type libgsmd-tool -m atcmd |
| 03:59.58 | zaery | k |
| 04:00.12 | calamous_ | do a ps and tell me if gsmd is running |
| 04:00.13 | ChooseOpen | aloril: Congrats! When will it arrive? |
| 04:00.26 | aloril | some time next week I guess |
| 04:00.57 | aloril | hmm.. charge on Visa card not yet visible ;-) |
| 04:01.05 | ChooseOpen | aloril: I take it UPS is not showing you an est. delivery date yet? |
| 04:01.21 | calamous_ | If its not running do: gsmd -p /dev/ttySAC0 -s 115200 -F, but then you will need to open up a new terminal |
| 04:01.54 | MrWGW | is it known yet if the initial batch of OpenMokos will be able to connect to any existing cellphone networks |
| 04:01.54 | MrWGW | ? |
| 04:01.55 | aloril | MrWGW: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 04:01.57 | calamous_ | If it is running (or in that new terminal) type: libgsmd-tool -m atcmd |
| 04:02.05 | calamous_ | and issue: AT+CNUM |
| 04:02.09 | aloril | ChooseOpen: don't see any, status is pickup |
| 04:02.20 | calamous_ | and see if it gives you your sell phone number, or if it will give you error 10 |
| 04:02.26 | ChooseOpen | aloril: I think it takes while before they show it... |
| 04:02.47 | MrWGW | thanks aloril |
| 04:02.52 | aloril | anyway, its already Friday here, so doubt it will arrive today ;-) |
| 04:03.38 | calamous_ | SpeedEvil: You are the answer guy, Is it a problem that it wont work with the 3g sim cards? |
| 04:05.00 | zaery | grrr, theres no way to redo the last command |
| 04:05.51 | cjb | in the terminal? switch to the gpe terminal |
| 04:05.56 | cjb | instead of the flashy openmoko one |
| 04:06.01 | calamous_ | zaery: is gsmd up? |
| 04:06.43 | zaery | no, i tried to do the second command you told me, but i typed it wrong, im tr\yping it again |
| 04:07.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 665 has been created by steven.demetrius(AT)fiwwi.com |
| 04:07.02 | cdbot2 | * * Real time Dual SIM |
| 04:07.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=665 |
| 04:07.14 | calamous_ | Is the upgrade from GSM 2.5G to 3 actual hardware or software? |
| 04:09.17 | zaery | calamous_: i did the second command, im now typing the third |
| 04:09.41 | calamous_ | Zaery: Are you typing it on the neo?!?!?! |
| 04:09.53 | zaery | yeah |
| 04:09.54 | aloril | anybody else outside USA got "Order shipped: OpenMoko direct order" and "Resolved: OpenMoko direct order" mails? |
| 04:09.54 | calamous_ | Zaery: you should SSH into it from a "real" computer |
| 04:10.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 666 has been created by steven.demetrius(AT)fiwwi.com |
| 04:10.02 | cdbot2 | * * 3G SIM capability |
| 04:10.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666 |
| 04:10.08 | zaery | kk |
| 04:10.45 | aloril | hehe, funny number ^ |
| 04:11.37 | misc-- | bug 666 :/ |
| 04:12.08 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=Christop@p508CC565.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 04:13.44 | calamous_ | Steven, you beat me to the post |
| 04:14.22 | ljp | aloril: yes. just an hour ago |
| 04:14.23 | zaery | i cant find the /dev for my moko, its connected through USB |
| 04:14.49 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Have you played with any of the other AT commands? |
| 04:15.11 | calamous_ | Yeah a bunch. I cant do _much_ without a working network connection |
| 04:15.32 | calamous_ | I got the datasheet with all the commands and protocol its really helpful |
| 04:15.49 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Yeah Im playing with it now |
| 04:16.21 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Trying to get data out of hte phonebook... |
| 04:16.21 | calamous_ | Its pretty cool, I learned alot about GSM. its no longer magic, its AT commands |
| 04:16.26 | ChooseOpen | :) |
| 04:16.32 | Arachnid | 'course, what those AT commands do is magic ;) |
| 04:16.33 | calamous_ | the syntax is intersting too |
| 04:16.50 | calamous_ | Yes only TI and FIC know (i hate NDAs) |
| 04:17.06 | ljp | gsm is an open standard |
| 04:17.08 | Arachnid | Is the GSM spec really NDAed? |
| 04:17.17 | calamous_ | no GSM standard is open |
| 04:17.23 | zaery | How do i ssh to the device, i know the command is ssh something, but i cant figure out the something |
| 04:17.26 | calamous_ | but how the chip "dose it" is closed |
| 04:17.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Building_Gadget_USB_Module]] [[P1_Owners]] [[User:WetSpot]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_North_Texas]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Atlanta]] [[SH1]] |
| 04:17.38 | calamous_ | zaery: did you set up usb net? |
| 04:18.09 | zaery | well, i did connect it through the usb cable |
| 04:18.20 | calamous_ | zaery: do: ifconfig usb0 192.168.0.200 |
| 04:18.31 | zaery | but im a newb with ssh'ing |
| 04:18.33 | zaery | kk |
| 04:18.34 | calamous_ | and then: ssh root@192.168.0.200 |
| 04:18.58 | calamous_ | if you're a n00b make sure to do the ifconfig as root but you can ssh as your normal self |
| 04:19.06 | zaery | kk |
| 04:19.51 | calamous_ | ChooseOpen: Next time I talk with people when I'm done with the conversation I should say ATH |
| 04:19.59 | calamous_ | If they are haise compatable they will understand |
| 04:20.04 | calamous_ | hayse* |
| 04:20.19 | *** topic/#openmoko by aloril -> wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | First orders have shipped yesterday - (24/7) for US, at least some shipped 26/7 for rest of world. http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html (black/silver only, in order of RT) |
| 04:20.22 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: The it is today, you will at least getto type it after every conversation :) |
| 04:20.33 | ChooseOpen | the way it is |
| 04:20.42 | calamous_ | lol |
| 04:20.58 | calamous_ | "ATH mo fu, shut your mouth" |
| 04:21.03 | ChooseOpen | hehe |
| 04:21.22 | calamous_ | or you could do the TCP version of hello: syn, syn ack, ack |
| 04:21.41 | calamous_ | bye bye = fin if you are nice or rst if you are mean |
| 04:22.42 | calamous_ | Zaery: hows it going? |
| 04:23.00 | calamous_ | I wish the neo could support 3g sim cards, I hope it can be soft patched |
| 04:23.07 | *** join/#openmoko summatusmentis (n=summatus@216.17.28.226.ip.usinternet.com) |
| 04:23.21 | calamous_ | speedevil said it was just 2.5g though :( |
| 04:23.29 | zaery | i tried ssh, but it refused the connection, then i pinged it, it can send and recieve packets, and when i tried to telnet to it, it refused |
| 04:23.30 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: You know you are going to buy the GTA02 in a few months... |
| 04:23.45 | calamous_ | oh yeah of course |
| 04:24.14 | ChooseOpen | zaery: What subnet is your home network on? |
| 04:24.19 | calamous_ | Jason do you fell the device is sorta slow when you interact with it |
| 04:24.26 | calamous_ | feel* |
| 04:25.02 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Launching apps is pretty slow. ssh commands are pretty quick. Things like 'top' are decent considering the device... |
| 04:25.19 | calamous_ | I'm hoping the faster proc in the GTA02 will pay off |
| 04:25.25 | zaery | ChooseOpen: my wifi is at 192.128.1.8 |
| 04:25.32 | ChooseOpen | calamous_: Yeah that and the graphic accell |
| 04:25.43 | calamous_ | msg me the output of just: ifconfig |
| 04:26.11 | *** join/#openmoko LaF0rge (n=laforge@59-124-92-123.HINET-IP.hinet.net) |
| 04:26.13 | ChooseOpen | zaery: You should be alright with that then. You just dont want to be on 192.168.0.0 |
| 04:26.14 | calamous_ | ChooseOpen: I want opendoom or open quake on it. test out that graphics accelerator |
| 04:26.31 | ChooseOpen | hehe |
| 04:26.55 | zaery | ChooseOpen: then why is it refusing connections? |
| 04:27.04 | calamous_ | I heard, don't know if its true, that someone ran world of warcraft on the iPhone |
| 04:27.11 | calamous_ | zaery can you ping 0.202 |
| 04:27.20 | calamous_ | 192.168.0.202 (0.202) |
| 04:27.23 | zaery | hmmm, ill try |
| 04:27.32 | calamous_ | paste me your ifconfig |
| 04:27.50 | zaery | yup, the ping works great |
| 04:28.08 | zaery | the whole ifconfig? |
| 04:28.18 | calamous_ | ssh into it (since its slow it can take like 10 or 15 secs to establish the encryption) |
| 04:28.31 | calamous_ | nah if you can ping it your on atleast layer 3 connection with it |
| 04:28.42 | *** join/#openmoko omokoman (n=menasse@c-71-202-150-101.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 04:28.51 | omokoman | hello all |
| 04:28.56 | zaery | hi |
| 04:29.02 | ChooseOpen | hey omokoman |
| 04:29.13 | omokoman | I got my openmoko today! |
| 04:29.20 | zaery | YAY! me too |
| 04:29.35 | omokoman | congrats! |
| 04:29.36 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: COngrats. got it running yet? |
| 04:29.37 | calamous_ | omokoman: try a 3g sim card in there and let us know if it works |
| 04:29.39 | *** join/#openmoko holymoly (n=hello@S01060016b6b53675.vf.shawcable.net) |
| 04:29.55 | omokoman | yea it's running, simple to flash, etc... |
| 04:30.23 | omokoman | only problem is with the "phone" part, i put in a brand new at&t sim card, it's a no go |
| 04:30.31 | calamous_ | ME TOO |
| 04:30.43 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: Yup, talk to calamous_ |
| 04:30.43 | calamous_ | I bought a $25 dollar at&t prepaid |
| 04:30.43 | holymoly | hello my moko monkeys |
| 04:30.57 | zaery | wow, im tired, calamous, any way i can reach you tommorow? |
| 04:31.03 | zaery | ;p'\ |
| 04:31.08 | calamous_ | Your sim card has the fireball "3g" logo on it right |
| 04:31.15 | zaery | ;p'\lol, my cat jumped on my keyboard |
| 04:31.30 | calamous_ | zaery: I'm going to be flying to martha's vinyard to visit my gf tomorrow, but I'll be back in about a week |
| 04:31.40 | calamous_ | I'll be online but tomorrow is a hell travle day |
| 04:32.01 | *** join/#openmoko wowow (n=hello@mail.wjsgroup.com) |
| 04:32.02 | holycow | zaery, that was a pretty good emoticon |
| 04:32.03 | holycow | :) |
| 04:32.22 | omokoman | calamous_: yes it does |
| 04:32.26 | zaery | holycow, its my cats fault ;p'\ |
| 04:32.44 | zaery | well, cya tommorow everyone |
| 04:32.46 | calamous_ | omokoman: your SOL for now, sorry man. Hopefully the big guns can find a way around this |
| 04:32.51 | holycow | kitty has style |
| 04:32.58 | omokoman | SOL? |
| 04:32.58 | aloril | omokoman: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 04:33.06 | calamous_ | Talk to at&t and see if they will give you a 2.5G one |
| 04:33.13 | calamous_ | Well I'm depressed about the 3g sim card. I'm going to the bar. see you guys |
| 04:33.30 | ChooseOpen | hehe |
| 04:33.44 | ChooseOpen | OM is driving a man to drinking |
| 04:34.54 | doc|home | what sort of power connector is on the phone? Will it charge from USB? |
| 04:35.06 | ChooseOpen | doc|home: Yep. |
| 04:35.12 | doc|home | excellent |
| 04:35.37 | omokoman | so it won't do 3g, it has to be 2.5g? |
| 04:35.58 | ChooseOpen | doc|home: There is a whole science to it: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Battery_Charger |
| 04:36.56 | doc|home | wow, that's messy |
| 04:37.08 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: You are #3 to report this problem. Apparently that is the case. Nobody is sure if it is something that can be fixed in software or not... |
| 04:37.49 | omokoman | ah thanks, choooseopen are you from chooseopen.com? |
| 04:38.01 | ChooseOpen | doc|home: From what I understand, if you plug it in, it will do some sort of charing, but depending on the type of device host/hub/charger, will depend on the charging mode... |
| 04:38.08 | doc|home | hmmm |
| 04:38.10 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: Thats me |
| 04:38.49 | omokoman | ChooseOpen: cool! I'm running the kernel that's on you're site |
| 04:38.56 | doc|home | I have a motorola slvr 2 right now, piece of crap really :) but it charges on USB at home but not in work, while my iriver will charge on both. That might be because of the hub/host? |
| 04:39.05 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: cool. glad I could help. |
| 04:40.03 | ChooseOpen | doc|home: I think there is a discussion about this in the mailing list too. Something about smart hosts and dumb hosts and wiring configurations....blah, blah blah :) |
| 04:40.10 | omokoman | ChooseOpen: do you just build from the workspace or do you put extra stuff in the builds? |
| 04:40.19 | doc|home | ChooseOpen: hehe, ok, thanks |
| 04:40.38 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: No, just virgin MokoMakeFile builds. I havent gotten that good yet :) |
| 04:41.10 | blindcoder | moin |
| 04:41.51 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: The builds in buildhost are outdated (ie. bugy), so I put mine up on the server until OM can catch up... |
| 04:43.07 | omokoman | ChooseOpen: I started with buildhost, saw some really ugly things, tried yours, and it's all much better now... though start up seems a little slow for the apps |
| 04:44.09 | ChooseOpen | omokoman: Yeah. GUI app startup is sluggish. IMO, to be expected. Im surewith a little optimization, things will get snappier. And of course the upgrade GTA02 hardware will help :) |
| 04:46.26 | omokoman | ChooseOpen: so does it build "out-of-the-workspace"? or are there any hacks required? |
| 04:46.54 | ChooseOpen | no hacks required |
| 04:47.45 | ChooseOpen | mokomakefile sets everything up, makes the process painless |
| 04:49.12 | omokoman | ChooseOpen: I'll try it, i'm on x86_64. |
| 04:51.46 | *** join/#openmoko doc|work (n=doc@gentoo/contributor/doc-007) |
| 05:02.37 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
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| 05:07.35 | *** part/#openmoko baird (n=cbaird@brushtail.apana.org.au) |
| 05:08.15 | *** part/#openmoko ChooseOpen (n=ws1@c-24-15-3-175.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
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| 05:17.26 | linux_galore | I saw a picture of a OM battery being charged in a generic Nokia charging station |
| 05:17.38 | linux_galore | wonder if that still stands |
| 05:23.26 | linux_galore | doc|home: yeah different USB connections have different power ratings (there is actually a category code for each), often hubs with a power pack have a very high rating so are more idead for charging |
| 05:23.59 | linux_galore | ideal* |
| 05:23.59 | doc|home | linux_galore: and is there a reason one device would take a charge while another wouldn't, both from the same machine? |
| 05:24.17 | doc|home | different draws? |
| 05:24.35 | linux_galore | I suspect the draw currrent is too high |
| 05:24.46 | ckuethe | and whether or not the device negotiated more current |
| 05:24.58 | *** part/#openmoko MrWGW (n=opera@cpe-76-173-136-18.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 05:24.59 | hads | It has to ask for it |
| 05:25.07 | linux_galore | yeah there is also a hand of to tell the chipset how much juice is needed |
| 05:25.11 | doc|home | and might that vary between machines? for example, the phone charges on my home machine, but not my work machine. |
| 05:25.32 | ckuethe | openbsd's "uberry" driver exists for the sole purpose of matching the blueberry device id and turning up the juice |
| 05:25.37 | ckuethe | might depend on the chipset? |
| 05:25.47 | linux_galore | some chipsets though have a higher rating than others and that makes life very confusing |
| 05:25.52 | ckuethe | one machine happily pumps out max current all the time? |
| 05:26.00 | ckuethe | maybe lossy cables? |
| 05:26.09 | *** join/#openmoko tg (i=tg@2001:618:1a23:0:0:0:0:1) |
| 05:26.19 | ckuethe | i have one usb cable that will run my usb laptop drive, and another cable that won't |
| 05:26.24 | doc|home | ckuethe: no idea, but it charges from my desktop at home, but not from work. My work machine is a much cheaper machine though. Same cable on both |
| 05:26.52 | linux_galore | ckuethe: I suspect the +-5V is missing |
| 05:27.02 | linux_galore | on the cable |
| 05:27.26 | linux_galore | 4 wires, 2 data, 2 power |
| 05:27.29 | ckuethe | no, the cable is ok if i plug it in to a pwered hub |
| 05:27.42 | ckuethe | it's just slightly thinner -> higher resistance |
| 05:28.05 | ckuethe | as it is, running a notebook drive powered solely by usb seems a little dodgy |
| 05:28.14 | ckuethe | my laptop can drive it, my work machine can't. |
| 05:28.17 | linux_galore | ckuethe: sounds like it a dodgy cable to me, the cable if made to spec shouldnt matter |
| 05:28.30 | *** join/#openmoko tg (i=tg@x-net.hu) |
| 05:28.46 | linux_galore | ckuethe: hubs have way more power, so much that some devices have been known to blow up |
| 05:28.59 | ckuethe | hence the whole power negotiation |
| 05:29.27 | linux_galore | ckuethe: thats if it works, on some of the cheap units Ive seen they dont have it |
| 05:29.49 | hads | Its in the spec |
| 05:30.01 | linux_galore | heh, tell the chinese that |
| 05:30.22 | linux_galore | they just saved 5c on a hub and it works |
| 05:31.08 | doc|home | for varying values of works :) |
| 05:31.14 | ckuethe | meh. i'm merely relating a couple of anecdotes regarding usb and power deliver |
| 05:33.00 | linux_galore | yeah, good sample in line 24 pin plastic connectors on my desk right now made in China, they look just as good as our normal supplier, size spec everything, one small problem the female doesnt click on so if the product is dropped the connector comes loose |
| 05:33.40 | linux_galore | s/good sample/a good example is the/ |
| 05:34.05 | linux_galore | comes loose |
| 05:36.03 | linux_galore | got them from our mainland chinese engineers as a money saving idea. |
| 05:36.31 | linux_galore | <sigh> |
| 05:37.58 | ckuethe | hope you save enough to cover the warrany replacement ... :P |
| 05:38.13 | *** join/#openmoko icman (n=icman@123-240-172-33.cctv.dynamic.lsc.net.tw) |
| 05:38.17 | linux_galore | ckuethe: well thats what my report is basically saying |
| 05:38.24 | *** join/#openmoko cyphi (n=aasss@213.141.100.28) |
| 05:39.50 | ckuethe | you know it won't, i know it won't ... |
| 05:40.00 | ckuethe | been there done that |
| 05:40.44 | linux_galore | ckuethe: you have to be careful not to insult them but explain why the product although nice fails in one respect and they may want to ask the manufacturer to add some revisions (see design revision) to the product then send me another sample run |
| 05:42.41 | linux_galore | its funny if a local engineer stuffed up I would say as much but you cant do that with the Chinese |
| 05:43.14 | doc|home | why's that? |
| 05:43.15 | ckuethe | not sure why.... (but i've never really been good with people) |
| 05:44.20 | linux_galore | doc|home: they do take things personally and as an attack against their social position, were the local guys just shrug and go OK thanks I will try again |
| 05:44.49 | doc|home | hmmm |
| 05:45.11 | ynezz | wow, neo has been shipped! |
| 05:45.13 | ColdFyre | does anyone have a neo1973 yet? |
| 05:45.25 | linux_galore | ynezz: a few people do already |
| 05:45.34 | ynezz | nice |
| 05:45.52 | ColdFyre | even though it's a dev, i am tempted to get it |
| 05:46.08 | linux_galore | Im not, without wifi its a brick |
| 05:46.24 | ColdFyre | yeah, i hear rev2 is alot better |
| 05:46.34 | hads | You're right, you aren't good with people. |
| 05:46.48 | ynezz | wow it's already in germany |
| 05:47.09 | linux_galore | cant wait for the reviews, wtf it doesnt work |
| 05:47.15 | linux_galore | heh |
| 05:47.18 | ynezz | :) |
| 05:47.34 | ynezz | yea people seems to be suprised that it even don't boot :p |
| 05:47.55 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (n=behdad@CPE000fb55e466d-CM0012c9c84bc4.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 05:48.01 | ColdFyre | i made sure to read the part "DONT USE IT AS A PHONE" |
| 05:48.03 | linux_galore | another reason to wait for the GTA02 |
| 05:48.15 | ynezz | but I myself like it, you learn a lot when you're hunting bugs |
| 05:48.20 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@ip-217-204-146-41.easynet.co.uk) |
| 05:48.23 | hads | That all depends what you want to do with it. |
| 05:48.37 | hads | Some people might actually want to develop with it. |
| 05:49.08 | hads | Some people might not think it's "a brick" just because it doesn't have wifi |
| 05:49.14 | ckuethe | GTA01 is a toy for me |
| 05:49.33 | linux_galore | hads: yeah I can imagine it now, look at my cool new phone, even has a Linux boot, what you want me to make a phone call, eeer hold on let me debug my gsm module and I will get back to you nect week |
| 05:49.36 | ckuethe | it'll teach me about low level ARM stuff, about gsm, etc.... |
| 05:49.53 | ckuethe | i don't really expect it to be a phone |
| 05:49.55 | hads | Bah I give up. Goodbye. |
| 05:50.08 | ckuethe | more like a computer engineering lab kit. |
| 05:50.16 | happycube | yeah |
| 05:50.25 | hads | ckuethe: Exactly |
| 05:50.26 | ColdFyre | my moto a780 was fun to play with in that aspect too |
| 05:50.26 | happycube | which'll hopefully be a phone not too long from now |
| 05:50.33 | ckuethe | $450 computer engineering textbook |
| 05:50.38 | hads | Some people just don't get it. |
| 05:50.39 | linux_galore | Ive got enough arm based junk on my desk as it is |
| 05:50.59 | *** join/#openmoko uwe_ (n=uwe@dslb-084-056-031-058.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 05:51.14 | ColdFyre | i wonder how long until people ask "how do i put windows on it" |
| 05:51.19 | codyl | linux_galore, amen to that :-P |
| 05:51.50 | linux_galore | ARM stuff was a joke 8 years ago, now everything runs arm |
| 05:51.53 | *** join/#openmoko Balthamaisteri (i=baltha@g0atse.com) |
| 05:52.12 | ynezz | i don't have arm board with such a nice display and with gps/gsm builtin :) |
| 05:52.22 | ynezz | and it's worth the money |
| 05:52.47 | Balthamaisteri | Hi |
| 05:52.47 | ynezz | with debug board/jtag etc |
| 05:53.00 | linux_galore | ynezz: if you want an arm based machine with a screen and runs Linux a GP2X is a better option |
| 05:53.13 | linux_galore | its only US$200 |
| 05:53.13 | ynezz | with gsm? |
| 05:53.20 | linux_galore | with 2 x ARM cpu's |
| 05:53.34 | linux_galore | ynezz: now but for research its great |
| 05:53.37 | linux_galore | no* |
| 05:53.40 | ynezz | it is |
| 05:53.41 | Balthamaisteri | i just wanted to know, will there be a camera on Neo 1973? |
| 05:53.41 | aloril | There is no camera included. With (battery) powered USB hub, you should be able to attach to (almost) any external camera. See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo1973_Hardware for details on what is included. Also see http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (also some model next year probably will gave camera module: http://www.channelweb.co.uk/vnunet/news/2192036/first-open-source-mobile-phone ) |
| 05:53.46 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno (n=Pupeno@ip-217-204-146-41.easynet.co.uk) |
| 05:53.55 | ynezz | linux_galore: but I've have PSP... |
| 05:53.57 | codyl | the serious deal for an ARM device is the slug |
| 05:54.06 | codyl | $60 refurbished from Amazon |
| 05:54.16 | happycube | oh i didn't know there were refurbs |
| 05:54.34 | calamous_ | Has anyone gotten ipkg to sync? |
| 05:54.35 | codyl | works just as well |
| 05:54.45 | linux_galore | Balthamaisteri: ok, go buy a Nikon D80 SLR, plug it into your openmoko phone and bang you now have the worlds first mobile phone with a 10MP camera |
| 05:54.49 | codyl | calamous_, ipkg update; ipkg upgrade |
| 05:55.14 | calamous_ | I dont know the syntax of the ipkg's repo file |
| 05:55.23 | happycube | lol |
| 05:55.25 | calamous_ | and the default repo dosent exist |
| 05:55.25 | linux_galore | codyl: PSP isnt 100% open by default |
| 05:55.54 | happycube | we lucked out because sony screwed up and didn't put an mmu inj |
| 05:55.55 | happycube | *in |
| 05:56.35 | Balthamaisteri | linux_galore: hmm, thats not so handy, but probably i don't really need that camera |
| 05:56.47 | linux_galore | also I would say the GP2X has more grunt (dual cpu) than a PSP |
| 05:56.57 | happycube | psp cpu is 222-333mhz |
| 05:57.08 | happycube | can the gp2x keep up with that? |
| 05:57.09 | ynezz | psp has also 2 cpu's |
| 05:57.14 | ynezz | cpu and gpu |
| 05:57.25 | happycube | yeah - like the ps2's right? |
| 05:57.40 | linux_galore | Balthamaisteri: you can always buy a USB 2MP kit camera (without a case) and just mod the case (drill a hole) and add one |
| 05:57.42 | ynezz | don't know ps2 |
| 05:57.44 | happycube | (even bigger sony screwup... relying on ps2 ports but only putting one analog stick in!) |
| 05:58.14 | calamous_ | codyl: Can you tell me what is in your /etc/ipkg.d directory |
| 05:58.37 | ynezz | i think psp is success, at least i enjoy it a lot |
| 05:58.47 | ckuethe | lumines! |
| 05:59.21 | Balthamaisteri | linux_galore: can neo work like GPS ... what is that thing in your car? |
| 05:59.41 | ynezz | pls, read wiki |
| 05:59.50 | linux_galore | ynezz: try playing a xvid avi file that is ripped in high resoltion on the PSP, you can but I can on my GP2X |
| 05:59.51 | ynezz | you've everything there |
| 06:00.14 | linux_galore | s/can/cant/ |
| 06:00.18 | Balthamaisteri | i know there are this GSP thing, but that doesn't tell me anything :D |
| 06:00.24 | ynezz | linux_galore: you can also with custom firmware |
| 06:00.34 | linux_galore | Balthamaisteri: yes |
| 06:00.36 | Balthamaisteri | PSP 4 the win :) |
| 06:00.47 | ynezz | it was a firmware problem not cpu/gpu |
| 06:01.00 | *** join/#openmoko Ycros (n=Ycros@gnaw.yi.org) |
| 06:01.11 | linux_galore | PSP is really nice but sony crippled it so badly its pretty limited |
| 06:01.34 | ynezz | what's limited? |
| 06:02.26 | ynezz | once you ring0 it, you can do almost everything |
| 06:02.46 | *** part/#openmoko uwe_ (n=uwe@dslb-084-056-031-058.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 06:03.01 | linux_galore | ynezz: it can play 1/4 of the media types that i can play on my GP2X for starters and it wont play video files that are at the wrong resolution for its screen, the GP2X has on the fly resolution re encoding |
| 06:03.14 | ynezz | ok |
| 06:03.18 | linux_galore | s/can/cant |
| 06:04.02 | linux_galore | ynezz: try play a mkv file or an xvid file, sorry your shit out of luck |
| 06:04.07 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby (n=nnrwhitb@nslu2-linux/rwhitby) |
| 06:04.09 | Balthamaisteri | psp updates all the time |
| 06:04.18 | ynezz | i just want to play GTA |
| 06:04.25 | roh | :) |
| 06:04.27 | ynezz | i've never used psp for movies/music |
| 06:04.33 | ynezz | :) |
| 06:04.36 | *** join/#openmoko BrianHV (n=bhv1@copland.brianhv.org) |
| 06:04.46 | Balthamaisteri | i will buy psp so i can play games when i go to army :D |
| 06:04.52 | linux_galore | ynezz: because you cant its crippled and hardly any files on the web are mp4 |
| 06:04.53 | Balthamaisteri | ps1 games |
| 06:05.01 | ynezz | Balthamaisteri: yea, brothers in arms! |
| 06:05.12 | Balthamaisteri | :D |
| 06:05.15 | ynezz | i don't need your wars, i've mine! |
| 06:05.25 | roh | ynezz thats exactly it.. i sit here on a 1680x1050 and wonder why people want video on stamps so badly when i just wish i had enough pixels for hd |
| 06:06.00 | ynezz | roh: well, how do you get 1680x1050 in your pocket? :) |
| 06:06.01 | Balthamaisteri | linux_galore: some sites provides video files to your ipod or/and psp |
| 06:06.05 | linux_galore | roh: depends on the resolution on the small screen |
| 06:06.13 | roh | ynezz its 15" and mounted on a notebook |
| 06:06.30 | roh | linux_galore even then its only usable for something like 5 minutes of news or so |
| 06:06.40 | roh | not for real movies or series. |
| 06:06.52 | ynezz | 15" with such resolution? |
| 06:06.54 | linux_galore | I have tried watching video on my 5G ipod but the resolution is rubbish |
| 06:07.03 | ynezz | what type of notebook it is? |
| 06:07.07 | roh | ynezz lenovo T60p |
| 06:07.11 | *** join/#openmoko gamin (n=m@car06-3-82-240-156-91.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 06:07.35 | ynezz | nice |
| 06:07.53 | *** join/#openmoko jsmanrique (n=jsmanriq@cme-staticIP-212-89-8-169.telecable.es) |
| 06:08.08 | roh | ynezz about the same chipset like a macbook pro but with real screen, case and keyboard and some extendability |
| 06:08.20 | ynezz | true |
| 06:09.07 | linux_galore | I never use the screen on my laptop at home, I just plug in a 22" wide LCD so Im usually looking for something compact |
| 06:09.28 | doc|home | why is it that desktop screens are so much lower res than laptops, he has the same res in 15" as I do in 22. |
| 06:09.51 | linux_galore | doc|home: I have 1650x1280 |
| 06:10.02 | linux_galore | my laptop is lower |
| 06:10.06 | doc|home | linux_galore: I have 1680x1050 |
| 06:10.14 | doc|home | so it's only slightly lower |
| 06:10.17 | linux_galore | sorry 1050 |
| 06:10.27 | linux_galore | my laptop is 1024 x 768 |
| 06:10.38 | doc|home | ok, but, why are desktop lcds always so far behind laptop ones? |
| 06:10.50 | *** join/#openmoko cody__ (n=codyl@adsl-71-142-91-149.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 06:11.04 | linux_galore | doc|home: depends, you can actually get very high res LCD's for autocad |
| 06:11.17 | doc|home | but you'll pay silly money for them :/ |
| 06:11.17 | happycube | ... and pay through the nose |
| 06:11.40 | linux_galore | for me 1650 x 1050 is fine |
| 06:11.58 | doc|home | linux_galore: sure, but seems like a raw deal compared to laptop screens :/ |
| 06:12.09 | linux_galore | you guys are spoilt, my first cad station monitor was 320 x 480 |
| 06:12.18 | happycube | when was that? |
| 06:12.20 | doc|home | what annoys me is the whole widescreen thing :/ I have a 1600x1200 square screen lcd :/ |
| 06:12.22 | *** join/#openmoko fgau (n=fgau@pD953AFF3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 06:12.25 | linux_galore | 1980's |
| 06:12.27 | happycube | 320x480... that sounds like a mode x trick |
| 06:12.32 | doc|home | which they don't sell any more |
| 06:12.43 | happycube | dell still has a 20" 16x12 |
| 06:12.44 | linux_galore | cost 3k too |
| 06:12.49 | happycube | but it costs a lot more than the 20" wide |
| 06:12.58 | roh | its a good compromise of money, used energy and space. 15" in 19:10 is actually the biggest notebook i want to carry arround ever |
| 06:12.58 | doc|home | happycube: hmmm, so samsung probably does too. Interesting |
| 06:13.03 | doc|home | happycube: yeah |
| 06:13.09 | doc|home | roh: yeah |
| 06:13.10 | linux_galore | yeah, dell has the 27" units on special |
| 06:13.31 | happycube | same res as the 24" tho :P |
| 06:13.50 | linux_galore | there is actually a laptop with 21" LCD running around |
| 06:14.01 | happycube | the 2560x... lcd's have huge controller drawbacks though |
| 06:14.04 | linux_galore | dell has a 20" unit |
| 06:14.15 | roh | ive not seen any lcd above real-hd besides these 2560x thingies and these are pretty expensive |
| 06:14.23 | doc|home | linux_galore: they're usually rebadged samsungs, probably http://www.samsung.com/ca/products/monitor/lcd_regular/ls20brdbbvxaa.asp ? |
| 06:14.38 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X0d0c.x.pppool.de) |
| 06:14.47 | roh | happycube you need a graphics card which can to multi-lane dvi since the pixelclock is limited |
| 06:14.51 | happycube | the 2560x ones *only* take dual dvi, and the 1920x1200's take vga, single-link dvi or maybe hdmi, and hdtv component |
| 06:15.08 | linux_galore | doc|home: they are Dell 20" laptops |
| 06:15.23 | doc|home | linux_galore: ah, screw that. Who wants to carry one of those around? :/ |
| 06:15.45 | happycube | maybe when screens roll up/out 20"'ll make sense for a notebook |
| 06:15.52 | linux_galore | doc|home: people who want a full machine but they live in a rental |
| 06:16.00 | doc|home | linux_galore: true |
| 06:16.16 | doc|home | wow, these are pretty cheap: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16824001226 |
| 06:16.18 | linux_galore | doc|home: dell actually sell allot of the things too |
| 06:16.22 | orospakr | does Avi Kivity hang out on IRC? |
| 06:16.51 | happycube | doc - it's a TN panel tho |
| 06:17.01 | doc|home | happycube: big difference? |
| 06:17.09 | happycube | depends on your eyes and pickyness |
| 06:17.16 | linux_galore | HP are now also selling media centre laptops with 19/20" wide screen LCDs |
| 06:17.30 | happycube | most TN's have a flicker because they're dithering between colors |
| 06:17.35 | doc|home | urgh |
| 06:17.40 | happycube | (samsung has *some* 8-bit tn's) |
| 06:17.48 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[MokoMakefile]] [[SH1]] [[Debug_Board]] [[Wish_List]] [[Gsmd]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_OWL]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Paderborn]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Building_Gadget_USB_Module]] |
| 06:17.50 | happycube | and their viewing angles are limited compared to pva and ips |
| 06:18.41 | linux_galore | Im happy with my crappy viewsonic 22" |
| 06:18.52 | doc|home | linux_galore: I have the 20" |
| 06:19.03 | doc|home | vp201b, which I miss :/ |
| 06:19.13 | linux_galore | doc|home: for the price fonts look pretty good on the things |
| 06:19.16 | doc|home | too big to bring over |
| 06:19.27 | doc|home | linux_galore: I love it, and it cost me a lot of money when I got it |
| 06:20.05 | linux_galore | doc|home: well I paid USD$420 6 months ago for mine and they are now USD$340 |
| 06:20.08 | Pupeno | I want to run OpenMoko in my notebook to take a look at it, develop a couple of toy applications, etc. Should I run emulated or not? |
| 06:20.15 | doc|home | linux_galore: that's not bad |
| 06:20.35 | linux_galore | doc|home: pretty cheap for 22" LCD |
| 06:20.51 | linux_galore | even has speakers that I never use lol |
| 06:20.57 | doc|home | hehehe |
| 06:21.39 | xkr47 | you could use it as gsm traffic detector :) |
| 06:22.02 | happycube | (buzz buzz click buzz) |
| 06:22.13 | linux_galore | Im thinking of getting a Dell 27" lcd and plugging in HD Tuner box to make a cheap tv for the missus |
| 06:22.28 | happycube | yeah - it's a good way to get full hd |
| 06:22.33 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 06:22.49 | happycube | also the latest 24" and 27" dells have high-color backlights |
| 06:23.06 | linux_galore | most of the LCD TV's Im seeing are lower res and more expensive |
| 06:23.17 | happycube | ;) |
| 06:23.26 | happycube | well, harold did mention vga and maybe even dvi |
| 06:23.33 | xkr47 | yeah |
| 06:23.47 | linux_galore | lol, openmoko media centre |
| 06:23.58 | linux_galore | just add big assed lcd |
| 06:24.04 | happycube | two (full-size!) sd card slots... by then that's 16gb |
| 06:24.04 | Stephmw | doc|home: you're stalking me! |
| 06:24.11 | doc|home | gerroff!! |
| 06:24.16 | happycube | hdmi's pretty small |
| 06:24.21 | xkr47 | true |
| 06:24.21 | doc|home | Stephmw: and yeah, I think it was you that told me about this :) |
| 06:24.22 | happycube | you could probably actually fit one |
| 06:24.34 | Stephmw | doc|home: probably :) |
| 06:24.36 | linux_galore | yeah there is a micro hdmi connector thing running around |
| 06:24.37 | happycube | of course it would *not* have hdcp |
| 06:24.45 | aloril | to Finland: "Your package is on time with a scheduled delivery date of 08/03/2007." |
| 06:24.54 | happycube | mine's coming tommorow |
| 06:25.44 | happycube | glad the int. shipping rates dropped a bit... still, ow |
| 06:25.54 | happycube | i wonder why there wasn't a european reseller since it has CE |
| 06:25.58 | aloril | about half price of original now |
| 06:26.18 | aloril | they don't have resources to organize that |
| 06:26.37 | happycube | too bad :( |
| 06:26.43 | happycube | i hope gta02 actually gets resellers |
| 06:27.00 | hads | P1 was never meant to have resellers |
| 06:27.06 | aloril | should, at least that is their plan |
| 06:27.17 | happycube | hads - yeah |
| 06:27.47 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 06:28.09 | happycube | the design work's done... if there's an embedded use i could see several thousand 01bv4's being made |
| 06:28.20 | happycube | *use/customer |
| 06:28.37 | happycube | hopefully there will be so openmoko's costs will get recouped |
| 06:29.27 | happycube | i could see a ruggedized case for the gta01/02 |
| 06:29.59 | linux_galore | <music= dramatic> <voice=deep anouncer> it first started as a opensource mobile phone <scene= John in living room> ooh cool my openmoko has arrived. <voice=anouncer> then John started to modify the phone <voice=John> Im adding a webcam and a satalite dish and robot arms to my phone <voice=anouncer> at 12.13 July 9th 2014 Johns telephone decided human kind were an inferior being and must be destroyed |
| 06:30.22 | happycube | heh |
| 06:31.27 | linux_galore | rm -rf humanity |
| 06:32.17 | doc|home | rm: cannot remove `humanity': No such thing |
| 06:33.24 | happycube | make love |
| 06:33.25 | happycube | make: *** No rule to make target `love'. Stop. |
| 06:33.31 | happycube | make war |
| 06:33.31 | happycube | make: *** No rule to make target `war'. Stop. |
| 06:33.58 | calamous_ | make my phone work |
| 06:34.06 | doc|home | happycube: man bush |
| 06:34.13 | doc|home | *shuts |
| 06:34.16 | calamous_ | make: *** No rule to make target `my phone work. Stop |
| 06:34.19 | happycube | heh |
| 06:34.31 | ynezz | calamous_: why have you bought then? :p |
| 06:34.50 | calamous_ | People on the list say that 3g sim cards work but I still cant get it to work |
| 06:35.36 | ynezz | you can't buy working one for $3 or what? :p |
| 06:35.38 | linux_galore | calamous_: just thank your lucky stars they didnt base it on gentoo |
| 06:35.56 | calamous_ | ynezz: you tell me why the GSM modem works with an older sim card but when I use a new one the gsm modem returns CME error 10 (sim card not inserted) |
| 06:36.01 | linux_galore | calamous_: take 4 weeks to compile everythign to find out it doesnt work |
| 06:36.13 | calamous_ | emerge --update --newuse --deep world |
| 06:36.17 | *** join/#openmoko fix_ (n=fix@cable-87-244-191-178.upc.chello.be) |
| 06:36.47 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=data@h-193-67.A148.cust.bahnhof.se) |
| 06:37.12 | calamous_ | Anyone have ideas why my 3G sim card inst working but an older one is? |
| 06:37.19 | roh | happycube you wouldn't believe what people would want as cases... the spectrum is from metal to woof and from 'make it watertight and floating' to 'tune the vibra-motor and add a round rubbercover' *cough* |
| 06:37.28 | linux_galore | calamous_: the Openmoko isnt 3G |
| 06:37.31 | ynezz | calamous_: because its 3G ? ;p |
| 06:37.37 | calamous_ | Yes but the 3g cards should work |
| 06:37.43 | ynezz | "but it works for others" |
| 06:38.00 | calamous_ | companies like at&t ensure that their new 3g cards work with older phones |
| 06:38.06 | linux_galore | calamous_: did you sacrifice a virgin to the gcc gods |
| 06:38.12 | calamous_ | It wont have the 3g features but it should work |
| 06:38.36 | calamous_ | I sacrificed Richard Stallman |
| 06:38.56 | ynezz | gsm part isn't open, i don't know what do you expect here :) |
| 06:39.21 | ynezz | ask someone from openmoko or make bugreport |
| 06:39.22 | calamous_ | The GSM proto IS open. I'm looking at the long-ass PDF with all the commands and return codes |
| 06:39.25 | linux_galore | calamous_: patience |
| 06:39.33 | *** join/#openmoko dietricha (n=dietrich@c-67-166-84-16.hsd1.or.comcast.net) |
| 06:39.33 | calamous_ | the cylapso drivers arnt |
| 06:39.34 | aloril | roh: hehe |
| 06:39.56 | ynezz | but it don't work with your card, it's not problem with AT commands |
| 06:40.11 | happycube | roh - dang... yeah i could see that |
| 06:40.12 | roh | aloril: i can understand the wish for metal, round rubber and floating.. but wood? |
| 06:40.18 | calamous_ | The sim has both USIM and SIM application on it so it *should* |
| 06:40.20 | happycube | i'm happy with just the silver/black case ;) |
| 06:40.30 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 06:40.32 | calamous_ | The new sim card can work with old (non 3G) phones |
| 06:40.38 | happycube | a stylus holder would be nice tho, but it's hard to go back in time and change th emold |
| 06:40.40 | linux_galore | I think black with a "round" case is wrong |
| 06:40.46 | aloril | roh: well, same people as steampunk? |
| 06:40.52 | roh | calamous_ basically it should. a bug has been filed? |
| 06:40.53 | linux_galore | black is a "square" colour |
| 06:40.59 | doc|home | are there any signs of an open gsm chip or driver? |
| 06:41.06 | roh | aloril: hrhr |
| 06:41.11 | calamous_ | Yes someone already beat me to the bug today because they had the same problem |
| 06:41.13 | happycube | hummm... ThinkMoko |
| 06:41.18 | calamous_ | and other P1 devel said the same think |
| 06:41.21 | calamous_ | thing* |
| 06:41.23 | roh | these can build their own cases better i think |
| 06:41.26 | ynezz | nice |
| 06:41.35 | calamous_ | "It worked with the 64K smart card but no with the new one with the 3g fireball" |
| 06:41.48 | roh | calamous_ *sigh* |
| 06:41.56 | ynezz | maybe calypso don't work with fireball :) |
| 06:42.04 | happycube | someone needs to get a 3g att card over to taiwan |
| 06:42.09 | calamous_ | Ynezz: yes but we will never know |
| 06:42.19 | roh | calamous_ we need to follow this one. |
| 06:42.20 | ynezz | or it might be fixed by new firmware |
| 06:42.28 | calamous_ | roh: yes I agree its import |
| 06:42.37 | roh | happycube the question is: do these cards have roaming enabled? |
| 06:42.41 | ynezz | so you have to send your moko back to flash it :p |
| 06:42.44 | calamous_ | were going to have lots of ppl who want to take their sims out and if it dosent work there is a huge problem |
| 06:43.07 | ynezz | what kind of problem? |
| 06:43.08 | calamous_ | At first I though my reader was dead until I dug out that old sim. because the error was sim not inserted (not bad sim) |
| 06:43.10 | happycube | that and there are only 2 major us gsm providers... |
| 06:43.27 | calamous_ | T |
| 06:43.32 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 06:43.40 | calamous_ | T-mobile and the lovley att |
| 06:44.02 | calamous_ | I just bought a $25 dollar ATT prepaid plan to use with my neo but I cant cause of the damn 3g sim card problem |
| 06:44.04 | happycube | tracfone's gsm in some places |
| 06:44.11 | *** join/#openmoko freskog_work (n=fredriks@hst3.eget.fi) |
| 06:44.20 | calamous_ | roh: have you seen my post on the community list? |
| 06:44.40 | roh | yep |
| 06:44.58 | ynezz | calamous_: have noted that '[x] I have been warned!' when placing your order? :) |
| 06:45.29 | calamous_ | Ynezz: dont be dumb. |
| 06:46.08 | ynezz | wait, i have to look up dumb in my translator |
| 06:46.35 | linux_galore | calamous_: you will find the OM will be very rough around the edges for a while |
| 06:46.53 | calamous_ | Hey thats fine, thats why I got into it |
| 06:47.22 | calamous_ | I can recomplie software, I can't recompile hardware |
| 06:47.26 | linux_galore | calamous_: the company i work for has just spent 2 years developing the firmware for an VoIP phone and we still find bugs |
| 06:47.56 | calamous_ | linux_galore: naturally |
| 06:48.24 | linux_galore | calamous_: the OM isnt even "alpha" in my books so the fatc you can boot it up is amazing lol |
| 06:49.33 | calamous_ | I'm not trying to replace my phone with the neo yet, I'm trying to work on the neo. and while I can do some things, I really want to play around with the GSM part (since it is a phone) but I cant if the Cylapso cant handle 3g cards |
| 06:49.56 | ynezz | you don't have other types of card? |
| 06:50.30 | ynezz | i mean in US |
| 06:50.40 | calamous_ | I have a deactivated old cingular card. but of course AT+CREG fails |
| 06:50.47 | doc|home | calamous_: I'll give you $20 for it ;) |
| 06:50.49 | calamous_ | With error CME 32 |
| 06:51.05 | ynezz | I don't know what's that anyway |
| 06:51.08 | calamous_ | so If i wanted I could test out the "phone" parts by dialing 911 but I dont think the police would be very happ |
| 06:51.09 | calamous_ | y |
| 06:51.19 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 06:51.20 | linux_galore | calamous_: openmoko guys are based in the USA so they will be getting similar problem |
| 06:51.22 | calamous_ | ynezz: well. there is one way to find out read the GSM specifications |
| 06:51.47 | ynezz | you can buy some used prepaid card, older one which probably won't be 3G |
| 06:51.49 | ynezz | or no? |
| 06:51.58 | calamous_ | Good. Earlier lots of guys were complaining out the 3g sim card problem |
| 06:52.29 | ynezz | and they will more if they'll send neo back for gsm firmware reflash :p |
| 06:52.37 | calamous_ | ynezz: I would love to find an older pre paid plan. That way I can work on phone apps and not worry about when the 3g sim card problem is fixed |
| 06:52.44 | *** join/#openmoko mmp (n=mmp@adsl-d102.84-47-32.t-com.sk) |
| 06:52.52 | ynezz | why do you need plan? i simply don't get it :) |
| 06:53.04 | ynezz | i have like 10 prepaid cards here |
| 06:53.04 | calamous_ | Well, I dont know if the cylapso hardware needs to be upgraded or I can just flash this problem away |
| 06:53.12 | ynezz | you can't |
| 06:53.17 | ynezz | that's the point |
| 06:53.26 | ynezz | soe it will take some time anyway |
| 06:53.30 | happycube | ... i wonder if tracfone sims work |
| 06:53.35 | ynezz | go and find some card which work |
| 06:53.41 | calamous_ | GTA02 wont be any different if we dont fix GTA01v4 |
| 06:53.44 | ynezz | fast fix |
| 06:53.58 | ynezz | they'll fix it for sure |
| 06:54.09 | ynezz | it's show stopper... |
| 06:54.14 | linux_galore | calamous_: yeah but they wont go into full production till many of the serious bugs in the GTA01 are fixed |
| 06:54.34 | calamous_ | Yes. *we* are here to assist with fixing those bugs. |
| 06:54.36 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno2 (n=Pupeno@ip-217-204-146-41.easynet.co.uk) |
| 06:55.03 | calamous_ | If we are not it may as well have been a closed source project in which they release the final source when they are done |
| 06:55.33 | *** join/#openmoko agoode (n=agoode@2001:4830:1633:0:212:3fff:fe70:6222) |
| 06:56.37 | calamous_ | ynezz: people on the list say that the 3G cards should "just" work. but others have reported problems with these cards |
| 06:56.38 | linux_galore | calamous_: could be something very vague in the way the kernel identifies some data from the sim |
| 06:56.45 | aloril | counter_msg (last update 2007-07-27 06:54) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Delivered prob. 75% in |
| 06:56.45 | aloril | aloril changed counter prefix message to (last update 2007-07-27 06:54) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Delivered prob. 75% in |
| 06:57.26 | calamous_ | linux_galore: good though. perhaps its just throwing up instead of trying a different routein because the people on the list say the card should work with older phones |
| 06:57.47 | linux_galore | calamous_: what suprised me is they didnt offer an external sim break out kit to look at the data |
| 06:58.22 | calamous_ | linux_galore: yeah. I dont know much about the sim card but it has an actual CPU in it right? its not just like a storage chip |
| 06:58.26 | ynezz | you can with smart reader |
| 06:58.43 | ynezz | and with sim spy tool |
| 06:58.50 | linux_galore | calamous_: yeah its a special asic chip |
| 06:59.15 | calamous_ | it must handle basic key exchange for network authentication right? |
| 06:59.16 | linux_galore | its not storage |
| 06:59.42 | calamous_ | It has some storage on it though |
| 07:00.04 | ynezz | i meant smart card reader |
| 07:00.13 | linux_galore | calamous_: yes it has "some" storage, the funny thing is the sims can vary allot though |
| 07:01.08 | calamous_ | linux_galore: do you know how tamper proof they are? some security chips "self destruct" (lol) if you tamper with them |
| 07:01.21 | linux_galore | calamous_: you may find the sims they use in TW are a very different animal to the ones in the USA |
| 07:01.50 | calamous_ | the ones in the USA automatically report stuff to the NSA while the ones in TW cook you dinner? |
| 07:01.58 | linux_galore | lol |
| 07:03.12 | linux_galore | calamous_: FIC actually sell phones in the USA so Im surprised they didnt pick it up |
| 07:03.14 | doc|home | that's one thing that bothers me, there have been cases in the past of mics been switched on remotely for "legal" reasons and because it's closed source, that's still possible :/ |
| 07:03.35 | linux_galore | doc|home: yep |
| 07:03.53 | doc|home | would it be possible to kill the mic in software unless a call is underway? |
| 07:03.58 | calamous_ | doc|home: welcome to the USA |
| 07:04.01 | linux_galore | doc|home: the 3G phones running Wince can be hacked into |
| 07:04.09 | doc|home | calamous_: I'm in canada :) |
| 07:04.14 | calamous_ | anything running win* can be hacked |
| 07:04.18 | doc|home | linux_galore: it's wince, of course it can :) |
| 07:04.31 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@163.pool85-48-166.static.orange.es) |
| 07:04.34 | hads | calamous_: This isnt the USA |
| 07:04.46 | linux_galore | there was recently a network trojon that setup office in wince phones |
| 07:04.56 | doc|home | I mean, there's an entire criminal underworld market out there, just waiting for a properly open source solution ;) |
| 07:05.33 | linux_galore | doc|home: i said that last week, the OM will become the best spy phone around |
| 07:05.39 | calamous_ | hads: I'm not advicating the USA |
| 07:05.55 | calamous_ | I'm moving out of here when I can |
| 07:06.03 | linux_galore | GPS+Opensource Mobile = way cool spy phone |
| 07:06.10 | calamous_ | I would love to live in TW over the US any day |
| 07:06.25 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@cable-vrk-fe5cdd00-177.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 07:06.26 | calamous_ | or Australia |
| 07:06.49 | linux_galore | calamous_: TW has its won problem, you know its easier to buy TW made hardware in the USA than it is in TW lol |
| 07:06.53 | linux_galore | own* |
| 07:07.07 | calamous_ | lol no I didnt |
| 07:07.10 | linux_galore | <-- Australia |
| 07:07.13 | calamous_ | But do you have good health care? |
| 07:07.35 | linux_galore | calamous_: the hospitals here are very good |
| 07:07.52 | calamous_ | Hospitals here are very good if you have *lots* of money |
| 07:07.57 | doc|home | linux_galore: depends, GPS can be tracked too, right? :) |
| 07:08.04 | linux_galore | calamous_: you pay 3% (more if your on a high income) for universal health cover |
| 07:08.06 | rwhitby | linux_galore: it's just the doctors under suspicion of terrorism we need to watch out for ;-) |
| 07:08.24 | rwhitby | <-- Australia too |
| 07:08.24 | calamous_ | linux_galore: I love that system. I wish we had that here |
| 07:08.48 | calamous_ | I would prefer more socialized services and heigher taxes |
| 07:08.56 | linux_galore | calamous_: its funny but we pay less per person for health cover than the USA |
| 07:09.02 | calamous_ | Yes |
| 07:09.13 | calamous_ | Because you belive in preventative care |
| 07:09.25 | linux_galore | calamous_: the problem with the US system is most of the money goes into companies profits |
| 07:09.31 | Clint | we believe in pharmaceuticals |
| 07:09.37 | calamous_ | In the US HMOs dont want to spend anything, but somtimes they have to and its a lot fore than if the did before |
| 07:09.38 | *** join/#openmoko ajmitch (n=ajmitch@ubuntu/member/ajmitch) |
| 07:09.46 | calamous_ | Drug patents kill people |
| 07:10.05 | rwhitby | So anyway, back to openmoko .... |
| 07:10.41 | *** join/#openmoko Tv (n=tv@207.181.6.54) |
| 07:10.48 | calamous_ | Yes back to openmoko on the neo |
| 07:11.15 | ajmitch | evening |
| 07:11.19 | linux_galore | calamous_: well its a wholeistic approach to health care, for starters drugs are cheaper because the government wont allow a new drug to be listed unless its allot better than the cheaper older version, in the USA people are paying for the latest gee-wiz drugs but the reality is they are no better or in some cases worse than the previously used drugs |
| 07:11.21 | calamous_ | any other thoughs about 3G (at&T) sim cards in the neo |
| 07:11.51 | *** part/#openmoko holtmann (n=holtmann@nikita.holtmann.net) |
| 07:12.01 | doc|home | calamous_: tried borrowing cards from friends to see what might work? |
| 07:12.32 | doc|home | besides, at & t are evil |
| 07:12.38 | rwhitby | isn't it the case that all sim handling between the AT command and the card is done by the firmware on the GSM module, so if it doesn't work, it doesn't work and the only fix is a firmware upgrade on the GSM module (which can't be done in the field except by a duly authorised and NDA'd openmoko employee) ? |
| 07:12.39 | calamous_ | linux_galore: Yes, do you know much organic chem, do you know what steriochemistry is or an enantiomer is? |
| 07:12.43 | linux_galore | calamous_: on average the USA spends more per person than most countries but actually offers less |
| 07:12.59 | calamous_ | linux_galore: yes that is true we spend more and get less |
| 07:13.35 | calamous_ | doc|home: I have tried may sim cards. I'm going to meet up with another gentlemen from chicago who also has the neo next week |
| 07:13.37 | roh | rwhitby sadly true. we will research the problem and then find a way |
| 07:13.52 | linux_galore | calamous_: the US drug industry has higher returns than banks and oil companies, think on that for a moment |
| 07:13.55 | rwhitby | linux_galore, calamous_, don't forget that people log this channel when they are not here, and expect to see reasonably on-topic discussion ... ;-) |
| 07:14.19 | linux_galore | calamous_: were is the money coming from, then you realise why you get less for more |
| 07:14.21 | calamous_ | linux_galore: its basically like the mirror image of a molicule. Some mirror images are both active like ibuprofin |
| 07:14.24 | roh | rwhitby irc and on-topic? youre kiddin |
| 07:14.28 | roh | ;) |
| 07:14.33 | rwhitby | roh: one can try ;-) |
| 07:14.42 | ajmitch | rwhitby: a futile hope |
| 07:14.50 | calamous_ | linux_galore: I could not agree with you more. its redicuous that the american population tolerates it |
| 07:14.56 | doc|home | lies, #gentoo is kept on-topic :) |
| 07:15.08 | calamous_ | anyway companies patent the mirror image of drugs after their 17yr patent runs out |
| 07:15.23 | linux_galore | rwhitby: 1. when is my phone being delivered, 2 why doesnt my phone work 3. my mokobuild file doesnt work |
| 07:15.28 | calamous_ | if it isnt harmful (some enantiomers are) |
| 07:15.39 | calamous_ | Patent law here is horrible |
| 07:16.04 | linux_galore | calamous_: well the mirror drug scam didnt work here in Australia |
| 07:16.10 | *** join/#openmoko misc-- (n=misc@122.2.118.233) |
| 07:16.10 | rwhitby | linux_galore: you can add 4. why doesn't my at&t 3g sim card work now too |
| 07:16.21 | calamous_ | good |
| 07:16.28 | calamous_ | rwhitby: you have the same problem? |
| 07:16.29 | roh | <PROTECTED> |
| 07:16.40 | calamous_ | I wonder if at&t is doing some non standard thing |
| 07:16.41 | rwhitby | calamous_: no, I have a good old aussie 2G sim |
| 07:16.42 | *** join/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 07:17.46 | sandos | why are they dead? have you killed them :) |
| 07:18.18 | calamous_ | linux_galore: do you accept private messages? |
| 07:18.19 | linux_galore | rwhitby: there was an image on the wiki of the om battery being charged on a cheap Nokia charging station |
| 07:18.23 | sandos | i thought batteries only really died if you overdischarge them |
| 07:18.50 | hrw|gone | linux_galore: cheap 3rdparty charger for nokia bl-5c batteries |
| 07:18.50 | linux_galore | calamous_: Im about to take off in 2 min |
| 07:19.09 | hrw|gone | linux_galore: I use such one and it is very usefull |
| 07:19.14 | calamous_ | linux_galore: well have a good day sir. I'm about to go to bed |
| 07:19.49 | linux_galore | anyway b'duh b'duh thats all folks!! |
| 07:20.10 | *** part/#openmoko linux_galore (n=Richard@dsl-220-253-69-10.NSW.netspace.net.au) |
| 07:22.39 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lrg2.demon.co.uk) |
| 07:22.46 | koen | good morning lrg |
| 07:22.48 | rwhitby | hrw|gone: yeah, I need to get one of those chargers it seems |
| 07:23.06 | lrg | hey koen |
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| 07:31.08 | happycube | how much are bl-5c's? |
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| 07:43.27 | roh | calamous_ can you provide me with some hi-res photos of both sides of the simcard? or put it on some scanner |
| 07:43.57 | *** join/#openmoko nibbler_de (n=nibbler@as250.net) |
| 07:43.58 | roh | calamous_ i want to find out the vendor. g&d, gemplus or whatever |
| 07:44.08 | nibbler_de | cheerio ;) |
| 07:44.39 | nibbler_de | calamous_: can you take a picture of your SIM? |
| 07:50.38 | bmidgley | no word on t-mobile sims? |
| 07:50.41 | nibbler_de | gizmodo had some coverage on it |
| 07:51.19 | roh | hm... time to do a clean build once more |
| 07:51.44 | nibbler_de | bmidgley: there are quite a number of different t-mobiles out there ;) and even more different SIMs i guess. |
| 07:52.30 | *** join/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 07:53.53 | bmidgley | nibbler_de: right... i'm thinking US t-mobile and whatever kind of sim they currently hand out... :) |
| 07:53.59 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03werner * r2533 10/trunk/src/host/devirginator/ (config.example setup.sh): |
| 07:53.59 | CIA-24 | openmoko: - made bv4 the default, instead of bv3 |
| 07:53.59 | CIA-24 | openmoko: - removed confusing ancient v3 and v4 from config.example |
| 07:54.19 | FuzzyCat | holy crap |
| 07:54.38 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@ip-217-18-177-19.static.reverse.dsi.net) |
| 07:54.41 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 07:54.53 | FuzzyCat | it's basically the size of a 2.5" hdd |
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| 07:58.03 | nibbler_de | bmidgley: without more details it will be hard to tell |
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| 07:59.08 | *** join/#openmoko sunkist (n=sunkist@adsl-69-111-167-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 07:59.57 | sunkist | calamous_: i bought a 3g sim card from at&t today, same number as you |
| 08:00.28 | roh | sunkist have a digicam or a scanner at hand? |
| 08:00.50 | quinton | i have a neo! |
| 08:00.57 | quinton | =D |
| 08:01.15 | nibbler_de | or a card reader and the appropriate software to figure out what the vendor of the card is |
| 08:01.22 | sunkist | yes |
| 08:01.45 | sunkist | digicam & scanner I have |
| 08:02.44 | jeddy3 | and, talking like yoda you are ;) |
| 08:03.22 | nibbler_de | then a picture of his card he shall make! ;) |
| 08:03.28 | aloril | nibbler_de: does gizmodo have one in their 'hand'? (search in their site doesn't give any other than old stuff) |
| 08:03.30 | roh | sunkist then please do us a nice closeup of your som front and back |
| 08:03.50 | sunkist | som? |
| 08:03.51 | aloril | sunkist: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 08:04.01 | roh | sunkist sorry.. sim |
| 08:04.16 | nibbler_de | aloril: aparently not. as i just found some strange coverage about a multitouch display which doesn't exist |
| 08:04.46 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r (n=Rac0r@p5081FE82.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:04.52 | sunkist | ok but without the serial :) |
| 08:06.09 | nibbler_de | the serial is not of value for anybody as it is just some number that identifies the piece of plastic (your SIM) but no data on it |
| 08:07.31 | aloril | interesting to see coverage of Neo1973, more from viewpoint of "how cluefull/clueless journalists" are than any new information about Neo1973 ;-) |
| 08:07.38 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@81-187-78-211.multithread.co.uk) |
| 08:08.08 | sunkist | true except if u work at at&t :) |
| 08:09.32 | sunkist | i'm scanning |
| 08:14.46 | sunkist | http://i14.tinypic.com/6cze61w.jpg |
| 08:15.27 | sunkist | http://i14.tinypic.com/5z41o5z.jpg |
| 08:15.36 | hads | That doesn't seem particually helpful. |
| 08:15.36 | aloril | "Sean Moss-Pultz: We plan on going 3G next year. .. Adding 3G would increase the cost by more than 80 percent." http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,134987-c,cellphones/article.html |
| 08:15.37 | sunkist | good enough/ |
| 08:15.52 | sunkist | ok i'll do full scan |
| 08:16.07 | *** join/#openmoko denis__ (n=denis@p5492B205.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:16.12 | *** join/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p57A540BC.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:16.17 | nibbler_de | it is helpfull |
| 08:16.38 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[SH1]] |
| 08:16.40 | nibbler_de | when i'm back home i can tell you the vendor |
| 08:17.01 | hads | Impressive. |
| 08:17.12 | *** join/#openmoko bug_ (n=bug@86.59.65.236) |
| 08:17.16 | nibbler_de | as i recall the design and can match it to one of my cards for sure. |
| 08:18.31 | nibbler_de | i suspect it's a card from Oberthur |
| 08:18.57 | nibbler_de | yup |
| 08:18.58 | nibbler_de | it is |
| 08:19.01 | nibbler_de | http://www.oberthurcs.com/getpage.aspx?id=65 |
| 08:19.17 | nibbler_de | it's a SIMphonIC 3G |
| 08:20.20 | sunkist | http://i10.tinypic.com/4v4xbg8.jpg |
| 08:20.40 | sunkist | want the other side too? |
| 08:20.40 | nibbler_de | yup |
| 08:20.43 | nibbler_de | no |
| 08:20.49 | sunkist | ok |
| 08:20.54 | nibbler_de | definitely a Oberthur CS SIMphonIC 3G |
| 08:21.59 | nibbler_de | it is a really nice card though |
| 08:22.31 | sunkist | is it capable 2.5g? |
| 08:22.41 | nibbler_de | that's not a matter of the card |
| 08:22.42 | aloril | script line already said it, but pasting it again: new info by HaraldWelte at http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SH1 |
| 08:22.47 | nibbler_de | but yes - it is |
| 08:23.24 | *** join/#openmoko TRIsoft (n=mac@p57A2E951.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:23.35 | sunkist | what's the verdict on these card, can i get it to work on or not? |
| 08:24.16 | aloril | anybody who got device should read it IMHO |
| 08:24.32 | *** join/#openmoko bug_ (n=chatzill@86.59.65.236) |
| 08:24.49 | XorA | so no secret software on the new phones then :-) |
| 08:24.50 | nibbler_de | i don't know the Neo's hardware so i guess fic/the openmoko guys could investigate this further |
| 08:25.18 | roh | nibbler_de do you own such a card and can bring it to the camp? |
| 08:25.57 | nibbler_de | roh: i can have a look at my collection, yes. i assume the .nl "lebara" prepaid card is one of them |
| 08:26.18 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@ip-217-18-181-130.static.reverse.dsi.net) |
| 08:27.09 | aloril | btw.. is there gllin in rootfs? |
| 08:28.04 | *** part/#openmoko Risto (n=Christop@p508CC565.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 08:28.45 | *** part/#openmoko sunkist (n=sunkist@adsl-69-111-167-70.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 08:30.07 | Shoragan | XorA, do you have some time to look at the 2.6.22.1 port? There is some alsa problem left... (http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/openmoko-kernel/2007-July/000227.html) |
| 08:31.06 | XorA | Shoragan: I need to clear a task at work before I can get back to Neo support |
| 08:31.16 | Shoragan | ok |
| 08:31.18 | XorA | Shoragan: what alsa problems BTW |
| 08:31.41 | Shoragan | take a look at the mail |
| 08:32.22 | XorA | Shoragan: you missed a patch |
| 08:32.38 | Shoragan | which one? |
| 08:32.48 | koen | isn't pulseaudio blocking the device? |
| 08:33.05 | alphaone | Shoragan: Look at the openmoko-kernel list |
| 08:33.24 | alphaone | Rtp replied to your post |
| 08:33.27 | *** join/#openmoko alech (n=alech@IP-213188106106.dialin.heagmedianet.de) |
| 08:34.08 | Shoragan | the patch mentioned in rtp's mail is applied |
| 08:34.26 | Stephmw | howdy |
| 08:34.37 | Shoragan | http://svn.openmoko.org/branches/src/target/kernel/2.6.22.x/patches/series |
| 08:35.52 | *** join/#openmoko Dongxu (n=mukunda@60-234-155-226.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
| 08:36.05 | XorA | Shoragan: odd as it worked for rtp in 2.6.23 |
| 08:36.22 | Dongxu | Was there any news on what the discount would be for the second release, for stage 01 purchasers? |
| 08:36.22 | aloril | Dongxu: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 08:36.42 | hads | Dongxu: None |
| 08:36.53 | aloril | Dongxu: its part of GTA01 price already ($350 -> $300) |
| 08:36.54 | Dongxu | hads: oh, thanks. |
| 08:36.58 | hads | Dongxu: P1 was discounted instead |
| 08:37.03 | Dongxu | Okay, cool as. |
| 08:37.15 | Shoragan | XorA, the told me, so i tried to use the commit from 2.6.23-rc1 |
| 08:37.24 | Shoragan | s/the/he/ |
| 08:37.44 | XorA | Shoragan: <4>mapped channel 10 to 2 |
| 08:37.44 | XorA | <3>asoc: can't set platform s3c24xx-audio hw params |
| 08:37.44 | XorA | <4>mapped channel 10 to 2 |
| 08:37.54 | *** join/#openmoko geaaru (n=geaaru@81-208-74-190.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 08:37.57 | XorA | Shoragan: that looks like it asked for DMA twice, exactly what that patch prevents |
| 08:38.23 | Shoragan | hmm, then i may have broken something ;) |
| 08:39.46 | Shoragan | i'll verify that i've applied that patch in my test build later |
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| 08:44.52 | squalyl | hi :) |
| 08:50.01 | Dongxu | Well thanks guys. |
| 08:50.02 | *** part/#openmoko Dongxu (n=mukunda@60-234-155-226.bitstream.orcon.net.nz) |
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| 08:54.34 | rtp | morning |
| 08:54.38 | ewon | FuzzyCat: that would explain a lot |
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| 09:14.44 | Dmitry_Platonov | any reviews of P1/SH1 hardware/software? |
| 09:15.09 | XorA | software review is pointless |
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| 09:19.50 | Dmitry_Platonov | XorA, why? |
| 09:20.15 | *** join/#openmoko jebba (n=jebba@220-179-89-200.fibertel.com.ar) |
| 09:20.51 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:21.05 | hrw | Dmitry_Platonov: because there is nearly no software for review |
| 09:21.14 | XorA | Dmitry_Platonov: it depends on what day you install the software |
| 09:22.14 | *** join/#openmoko lrg (n=liam@lumison.wolfsonmicro.com) |
| 09:23.48 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.19) |
| 09:24.04 | Kheldar | what would be nice would be a very small version of that : www.io2technology.com |
| 09:24.52 | Dmitry_Platonov | XorA, I mean latest build 8) |
| 09:25.24 | XorA | Dmitry_Platonov: latest build changes every couple of hours, I dont think you quite understand the development model |
| 09:25.30 | *** join/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 09:25.31 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2534 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard-2/gtk-2.0/openmoko-contacts: * Add colours for openmoko-contacts history view |
| 09:25.35 | XorA | see :-D |
| 09:26.26 | hrw | Dmitry_Platonov: official latest? developer latest? |
| 09:27.00 | hrw | my latest != openmoko latest for example as I have some apps which will show in future probably |
| 09:27.20 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-159-20-1.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 09:28.17 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03thomas * r2535 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard-2/gtk-2.0/openmoko-contacts: * Remove font specification from openmoko-contacts history style |
| 09:28.57 | ewanm89_laptop | Can anyone tell me when mokobot died? |
| 09:29.06 | hrw | ~seen mokobot |
| 09:29.08 | apt | mokobot <n=ewanm89@host81-159-22-129.range81-159.btcentralplus.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #openmoko, 17h 48m 23s ago, saying: 'roh is currently on #openmoko (1d 21h 24m 29s). Has said a total of 18 messages. Is idling for 21h 46m 4s, last said: 'hopefully there will be a lot of hands on hacking and not too much would be could be ... |
| 09:29.18 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 09:29.23 | *** part/#openmoko bendo (i=bendo@irc.cnet.sk) |
| 09:29.27 | hrw | I hope that it will not reapper |
| 09:29.40 | ewanm89_laptop | That was me ages ago. |
| 09:30.35 | ewanm89_laptop | hrw: Why not? |
| 09:30.37 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host81-159-20-1.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 09:31.31 | hrw | it conflict with apt |
| 09:31.42 | hrw | ~lart mokobot |
| 09:31.42 | apt | eats mokobot and falls over dead |
| 09:31.43 | daxxar | FuzzyCat: Cool, is it a VIA board? |
| 09:31.43 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: change the activiation character for mokobot please |
| 09:31.44 | ewanm89_laptop | hrw: I'm working on that. |
| 09:31.54 | Dmitry_Platonov | hrw, anything will do. Something is better then nothing. |
| 09:32.08 | XorA | Dmitry_Platonov: fire up the software, take a look |
| 09:32.22 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: I wishn they made it easy for me to find the activation character. |
| 09:32.32 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: heh heh |
| 09:32.58 | hrw | and now we have apt (freenode standard), cdbot (bugtracker), aloril (planet, wiki) and mokobot.. |
| 09:33.12 | ewanm89_laptop | Some idiot hardcoded it in, so I'm trawling through all the perl code for it. |
| 09:33.15 | hrw | ewanm89_laptop: then put mokobot on #ewanm89 and test it there |
| 09:33.21 | XorA | hrw: any idea how to get apt to join a channel BTW? |
| 09:33.26 | hrw | XorA: nope |
| 09:33.33 | XorA | ~lart apt/ibot |
| 09:33.33 | apt | takes out apt/ibot with the trash |
| 09:33.55 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: I do, but you have to be a user registered to allow it. |
| 09:33.58 | hrw | XorA: there are commands for it but it refuse them for me |
| 09:34.13 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: how do you get registered |
| 09:34.25 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: or are you such a person? |
| 09:34.46 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 09:34.52 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: Speak to someone who is allowed to register, I'm the one for mokobot, Tim Riker is apt. |
| 09:35.10 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-46-16.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 09:35.20 | XorA | obviously gone are the days you used to just ask the bots to join :-( |
| 09:36.11 | hrw | years ago I spent few years maintaining botnet on one of ircnet channels |
| 09:36.16 | hrw | no more |
| 09:39.29 | *** join/#openmoko Odin- (n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is) |
| 09:39.44 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: The problem is bots are far too powerfull to sensibly allow it. |
| 09:40.21 | ewanm89_laptop | That is why I started mokobot, to have it in #openmoko-dev too. |
| 09:40.46 | XorA | there is a #openmoko-dev |
| 09:41.26 | roh | i still see no reason for any bot at all. thats why freenode is bearable at all. less bots. no ops |
| 09:42.10 | FuzzyCat | ~p1 |
| 09:42.11 | mokobot | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/P1_Owners |
| 09:42.33 | hrw | #openmoko #openmoko-dev #openmoko-devel - who will start #openmoko-development? |
| 09:42.42 | FuzzyCat | Sublime, your order going all wrong? :/ |
| 09:42.45 | XorA | roh: apt/ibot is useful for channel logging |
| 09:42.57 | XorA | roh: but I hate this botstorm that is happening |
| 09:43.17 | FuzzyCat | daxxar, yes, VIA |
| 09:43.29 | roh | XorA for logging every client surfices |
| 09:43.42 | daxxar | FuzzyCat: Specs? |
| 09:43.50 | XorA | roh: but apt/ibot logs when you are not logged in, make it easy to find info using google |
| 09:44.35 | FuzzyCat | daxxar, http://linitx.com/viewproduct.php?prodid=11693 |
| 09:44.52 | roh | XorA i know what youre saying.. i just wanted to point out that the logging aspect is not different between a client on a server and some bot. thus no need to write any scriptfoo or so. |
| 09:45.14 | XorA | roh: oh yes, there is 99% of crap ibot/apt doesnt need to do |
| 09:45.48 | daxxar | Cool, I've got a, uhm, mini-itx running as my media center. :-9 |
| 09:45.49 | daxxar | :-) |
| 09:45.58 | roh | XorA in the end it boils down to: is a bot answering or not. when yes it mostly is useless, but i have to say this 'question asked by new user within $timeframe -> faqurl' is practical. |
| 09:46.08 | ewanm89_laptop | What char do you want mokobot to use? |
| 09:46.33 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: the æ character would be good :-D |
| 09:46.48 | ewanm89_laptop | & |
| 09:47.01 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 09:47.23 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 09:47.23 | mokobot | Hello Lord |
| 09:47.24 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: Is that supposed to be an ampersand? |
| 09:47.25 | FuzzyCat | daxxar, it's just tiney :) |
| 09:47.30 | roh | ewanm89_laptop when you ask me it should be as quiet as possible and only answering to the people who talk to it, not always directly to the channel. too much senseless scrolling |
| 09:47.36 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: its (ae) |
| 09:47.47 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: No then. |
| 09:47.59 | XorA | ł |
| 09:48.18 | ewanm89_laptop | roh: Most of the time it does |
| 09:48.31 | hrw | ẘ maybe? |
| 09:48.44 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: Nothing I need a char table or obscure keystrokes for. |
| 09:49.00 | hrw | ŧ is handy |
| 09:49.04 | roh | µ |
| 09:49.09 | FuzzyCat | iirc mokobot only responds to questions, and dtx's abuse |
| 09:49.30 | ewanm89_laptop | And a little onjoin. |
| 09:49.33 | XorA | ←↓→ |
| 09:49.35 | FuzzyCat | aloril posts useful info.. and apt... well it;s just apt |
| 09:49.41 | hrw | ŧ←↓→↓þðđŋħĸµ |
| 09:49.50 | XorA | hrw: toprow goodness :-) |
| 09:49.58 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host81-159-20-1.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 09:50.17 | ewanm89_laptop | &dtx |
| 09:50.26 | ewanm89_laptop | &dtx |
| 09:50.30 | FuzzyCat | disney.... |
| 09:50.31 | hrw | ~dtx |
| 09:50.32 | mokobot | A seriously annoying gimp. |
| 09:50.44 | hrw | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:50.51 | hrw | safest way |
| 09:50.57 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 09:51.40 | *** join/#openmoko mokobot (n=ewanm89@host81-159-20-1.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 09:51.41 | ewanm89_laptop | &dtx |
| 09:51.43 | alphaone | <PROTECTED> |
| 09:51.45 | mokobot | A seriously annoying gimp. |
| 09:51.55 | ewanm89_laptop | It works now |
| 09:51.57 | ewanm89_laptop | ~dtx |
| 09:52.04 | ewanm89_laptop | Sorted |
| 09:52.15 | hrw | argh.. |
| 09:52.30 | hrw | ~curse microsoft for product keys |
| 09:52.30 | apt | May the fleas of a thousand camels infest your most sensitive regions, microsoft for product keys ! |
| 09:52.44 | ewanm89_laptop | lol |
| 09:52.49 | XorA | hrw: I miss the old days when all MS keys were 111-1111 |
| 09:52.49 | hrw | my dell has license for xp pro but refuse to instal with that key |
| 09:52.54 | cesarb | No rootfs? That means no gllin, right? |
| 09:53.01 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: Me to. |
| 09:53.09 | ewanm89_laptop | s/o./oo. |
| 09:53.13 | hrw | gliin is not released at all |
| 09:53.18 | cesarb | Or does it come with gllin on one of the SD cards? |
| 09:53.36 | cesarb | hrw: shouldn't gllin come with the phones (and only the phones)? |
| 09:54.00 | hrw | cesarb: no idea |
| 09:55.06 | cesarb | If it doesn't have gllin, the only option would be sphyrna... |
| 09:55.38 | koen | the inclusion of gllin was an error according to inside sources |
| 09:55.57 | XorA | a lucky error for us :-) |
| 09:56.00 | *** join/#openmoko buluca (n=luca@81-208-36-82.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 09:56.36 | SpeedEvil | cesarb: for small values of option. |
| 09:57.36 | daxxar | What's gllin? |
| 09:57.43 | SpeedEvil | GPS driver |
| 09:57.52 | hrw | rather gps tester then driver |
| 09:57.57 | daxxar | I thought it was meant to be shipped with it? |
| 09:57.59 | SpeedEvil | It's a driver. |
| 09:58.05 | SpeedEvil | It spits out NMEA. |
| 09:58.15 | SpeedEvil | It can be used as any serial GPS. |
| 09:58.32 | SpeedEvil | Ok - it's got problems, but it's still a perfectly useful driver. |
| 09:58.55 | daxxar | Why is it an error to include it? |
| 09:59.16 | SpeedEvil | In theory it's an error. It'd be nice to have it open-source. |
| 09:59.28 | SpeedEvil | In practice - there is no open-source driver (yet?) |
| 09:59.38 | SpeedEvil | Some really clever people are working on it. |
| 09:59.49 | daxxar | I know there's no opensource driver yet, so that's why they were *supposed* to ship a closedsource one, right? |
| 10:00.34 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg_ (n=thomasg@p57AFDF48.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:00.44 | FuzzyCat | :/ I appear to have buggered up my laptop install |
| 10:04.28 | rwhitby | hrw: nslu2-log is a bot too, but it's just a silent logger-bot :-) |
| 10:04.44 | *** join/#openmoko kuyky (n=kuyky@85.138.202.19) |
| 10:07.16 | bug_ | is gllin on the neo or not ( no rootfs --> where is gllin?) |
| 10:10.16 | ewon | is the gps like a winmodem? e.g. the binary driver offloads some of the logic onto the host CPU? |
| 10:10.20 | SpeedEvil | yes |
| 10:10.25 | ewon | I see |
| 10:10.27 | SpeedEvil | Which in some ways is a good thing. |
| 10:10.36 | SpeedEvil | See Hammerhead/Protocol on the wiki |
| 10:10.49 | ewon | noted |
| 10:10.51 | koen | and http://projects.linuxtogo.org/plugins/scmsvn/viewcvs.php/?root=sphyrna |
| 10:11.24 | SpeedEvil | Which is more a collection of notes, than a driver ATM. |
| 10:11.40 | bug_ | i mean to backup gllin prior to flash new rootfs |
| 10:11.52 | XorA | bug_: in dm2 directory |
| 10:12.10 | bug_ | XorA: thanks |
| 10:14.50 | *** join/#openmoko yerga (n=yerga@87.223.219.48) |
| 10:15.08 | *** part/#openmoko squalyl (n=squalyl@139.100.140.131) |
| 10:15.46 | *** join/#openmoko sixfeet (i=sixfeet@p5484F13F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 10:17.38 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User_talk:CathodioN]] [[User:Das_nl]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Eindhoven]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Den_Haag]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Amsterdam]] [[P1_Owners]] [[Clocks]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Netherlands]] |
| 10:18.49 | *** join/#openmoko equanimity (n=equanimi@206-248-130-48.dsl.teksavvy.com) |
| 10:22.24 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=cs@proxy12.sbs.de) |
| 10:24.14 | *** join/#openmoko jpcass (n=chatzill@johnkerry.plus.com) |
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| 10:32.04 | *** join/#openmoko quinton (n=quinton@84-45-151-51.no-dns-yet.enta.net) |
| 10:32.18 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Harald Welte <laforge at openmoko.org> Re: Product naming / wiki page naming / restructuring |
| 10:32.42 | buz | is the ar6000 chip available on a mini pci express card? |
| 10:38.08 | roh | buz nope. its avail. as sdio-card |
| 10:38.23 | buz | not much use to put it into a macbook ;) |
| 10:38.50 | mjr | btw, I saw at lwn announced an sdio stack going into the linux kernel base; anything to do with moko's sdio work for gta02? |
| 10:39.58 | buz | i think that comes from atheros yes |
| 10:40.33 | buz | but they were working on it before moko came around |
| 10:40.42 | mjr | apparently by Pierre Ossman <drzeus-list@drzeus.cx> and Nicolas Pitre <nico@cam.org> |
| 10:40.45 | roh | buz what should a b/g sdio chipset be good for when there is an internal abg networking card? |
| 10:40.58 | buz | the internal card is broadcom shite |
| 10:41.01 | ossman | mjr, morning ;) |
| 10:41.36 | kiney_ | counter |
| 10:41.36 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-27 06:54) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Delivered prob. 75% in 4 days 13:18:23 (4.554±2.5 days) (1780;251) |
| 10:42.15 | mjr | ossman, do I know you or do you think I'm MJ Ray? ;) |
| 10:42.30 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 10:42.30 | roh | buz its minipci express.. so swap it with a intel 3945 or better 3965 (802.11n) and youre done |
| 10:42.38 | ossman | mjr, You mentioned my name ;) |
| 10:42.44 | mjr | ossman, oh, right, *duh* :) |
| 10:42.51 | buz | well intel still hasnt got entirely free drivers, but yeah, i might do that |
| 10:42.54 | mjr | I'll get me coat. |
| 10:43.49 | roh | buz they have. the only binary component in the meantime is firmware which runs on the card itself.. it does not get better anywhere |
| 10:43.49 | ossman | buz, the sdio stack is not based on the atheros one, it's entirely new. and we actually started writing it after moko arrived. I've just been planning to do it for ages :) |
| 10:44.11 | florian | hi all |
| 10:44.42 | mjr | so, the moko sdio bit is separate from the one that's going into the kernel? One would wish for integration at some point but obviously no great rush... |
| 10:45.28 | mjr | buz, and was it so that also the bluetooth was behind sdio instead of USB in GTA-02 |
| 10:45.58 | buz | oh thats good |
| 10:46.08 | mjr | no that was a question :) |
| 10:46.13 | mjr | forgot the ?, apparently |
| 10:46.24 | buz | oh ;) |
| 10:46.38 | *** join/#openmoko dcorking (n=dcorking@82.152.172.75) |
| 10:46.50 | ossman | mjr, I haven't seen anything about sdio in moko |
| 10:46.58 | ossman | got links? |
| 10:46.59 | mjr | but there was some mail on the list that almost implied so |
| 10:47.17 | mjr | ossman, wait a moment; there was a list mention of the ar6k going behind sdio |
| 10:47.21 | ossman | oko |
| 10:47.31 | mjr | in response to me |
| 10:47.44 | koen | sdio or spi? |
| 10:47.49 | koen | or ssp? |
| 10:48.29 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 10:48.42 | mjr | http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/007242.html |
| 10:48.50 | mjr | "thats why the ar6k module will be connected via 4bit wide sdio" |
| 10:49.03 | mjr | so that's probably with the atheros' stack |
| 10:49.26 | mjr | and didn't imply so much about the bt as I recalled |
| 10:49.43 | mjr | so, still curious if the bt will remain behind usb |
| 10:50.11 | ossman | most bt chips are usb based, so that's rather likely |
| 10:50.57 | SpeedEvil | The BT will be on USB. |
| 10:51.00 | mjr | ok |
| 10:51.06 | SpeedEvil | Look on the neo1973-hardare list |
| 10:51.29 | mjr | so sdio for wifi, usb for bt |
| 10:51.39 | mjr | fair enough |
| 10:51.43 | ossman | as for the ar6k, we could certainly write a driver for it since atheros code is completely open. but I have no hardware for development |
| 10:51.56 | ewon | I sincerly hope the ar6k will do packet injection. |
| 10:52.07 | ewon | a phone that can crack WEP... oh baby |
| 10:52.09 | SpeedEvil | it will AIUI |
| 10:52.12 | ewon | \o/ |
| 10:52.16 | mjr | ossman, you mean driver on top of your stack instead of the atheros one, presumably? |
| 10:52.22 | ossman | yes |
| 10:52.27 | mjr | *nod* |
| 10:52.29 | dando | how long did it take to compile the openmoko-devel-image? |
| 10:52.52 | Obri | long |
| 10:53.01 | dando | okay :) |
| 10:53.47 | ewanm89_laptop | Leave overnight and hope no errors typ of long. |
| 10:54.15 | ewanm89_laptop | s/typ/type/ |
| 10:54.18 | mjr | ossman, well, later this year hopefully the hardware will be plentiful :] |
| 10:54.35 | ewon | I wonder when they will start accepting orders for GTA02 |
| 10:55.26 | dando | what do you think about bitbake ? |
| 10:55.55 | dando | I need GTA02 |
| 10:59.17 | *** join/#openmoko hypa7ia_ (i=hypatia@judecca.aculei.net) |
| 10:59.30 | *** join/#openmoko thomasg__ (n=thomasg@p57AFF203.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 11:00.15 | mjr | hmm, interesting; as the wifi goes to 2442, the microsd slots changes to be wired to the glamo3362 |
| 11:00.21 | dando | BitBake is able to generate dependency graphs using the dot syntax <--- i like this feature |
| 11:01.23 | ossman | mjr, sure? that would probably mean a new driver, which can be a pain |
| 11:01.42 | mjr | wonder if the need for more sd was one of the reasons they got the glamo ;) |
| 11:01.55 | mjr | ossman, Harald says so here: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/neo1973-hardware/2007-July/000186.html |
| 11:02.40 | ossman | ok |
| 11:03.38 | ossman | nothing about a SD/MMC controller is mentioned on the product page |
| 11:03.58 | *** join/#openmoko meandtheshell (n=markus@85.127.116.66) |
| 11:04.05 | mjr | but then, the product page was really sparse |
| 11:04.11 | mjr | no good datasheet for that |
| 11:05.11 | dando | writing a driver for SD Card sure is a pain in the ass. |
| 11:05.30 | koen | " It seems that it is intertwisted with complex things |
| 11:05.31 | koen | like dbus, that I definitely do not want to have on my machines due to |
| 11:05.32 | koen | its resource usage." |
| 11:05.51 | koen | if dbus runs on my 100 MHz avr32 it will run on haralds 4way powermac |
| 11:05.58 | koen | (talking about FUD) |
| 11:12.18 | dando | its all greek to me |
| 11:16.40 | jgm | D-Bus isn't too hard once you get the hang of the bindings. |
| 11:17.08 | jgm | And the higher-level language bindings seem to be relatively simple |
| 11:17.11 | koen | the point was harald's FUD about resource usage |
| 11:17.26 | jgm | Yep |
| 11:17.47 | jgm | Was more thinking of the 'complex' bit but yeah I don't see it being a resource hog (compared to gnome, for example) |
| 11:17.49 | koen | someone should reply with "I don't use netfilter on my machine due to the resource usage" |
| 11:18.01 | cdbot2 | * * OM Bug 667 has been created by roh(AT)openmoko.org |
| 11:18.02 | cdbot2 | * * missing dependency on libusb in bluez-utils |
| 11:18.03 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=667 |
| 11:19.09 | Kheldar | I don't use Vista on my machine... due to it's ressources usage |
| 11:19.19 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03njp * r2536 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/libraries/libmokojournal/ (ChangeLog mokojournal/moko-journal.c): |
| 11:19.19 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-07-27 Neil J. Patel <njp@o-hand.com> |
| 11:19.19 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * mokojournal/moko-journal.c: (moko_journal_class_init): |
| 11:19.19 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Fixed signal marshalling problem. |
| 11:23.04 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
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| 11:32.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03njp * r2537 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/applications/openmoko-dialer/ (ChangeLog src/moko-history.c): |
| 11:32.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 2007-07-27 Neil J. Patel <njp@o-hand.com> |
| 11:32.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: * src/moko-history.c: (on_delete_clicked), (history_add_entry), |
| 11:32.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: (on_entry_added_cb), (moko_history_load_entries): |
| 11:32.12 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Update to use the new mokojournal api. |
| 11:32.35 | *** part/#openmoko jsmanrique (n=jsmanriq@cme-staticIP-212-89-8-169.telecable.es) |
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| 11:51.31 | SpeedEvil | What's the GPS serial port again? |
| 11:52.01 | koen | ttySAC1 iirc |
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| 11:58.34 | koen | *** glibc detected *** hhconsole: double free or corruption (out): 0x00013038 *** |
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| 12:00.05 | Linux_Galore | give you an idea how far behind the phones are in the USA, heres a Samsung phone with a 10mp camera and a proper zoom http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iqHvjh26Lc&mode=related&search= |
| 12:00.25 | buz | i think that one has been around a while |
| 12:00.34 | buz | picture quality is said to be abysmal for a 10mp cam |
| 12:00.51 | buz | (or maybe i'm remembering it's 7mp brother) |
| 12:01.13 | cjb_ie | buz: well, of course, it's a sodding camera phone. they have to suck by definition :-) |
| 12:01.26 | Linux_Galore | in general camera phones wont produce the image depth of a good quality DSLR |
| 12:01.27 | buz | one would think that zoom optics might be better |
| 12:01.34 | koen | anything over 6MP with a compact sensor will give abysmal results due to noise |
| 12:01.44 | buz | well obviously not, but they might come close to point and shoot ones |
| 12:01.53 | koen | especially with firmware that uses pixelbinning |
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| 12:02.45 | Linux_Galore | N95i is been brandished around by Nokia execs with 8GB storage capacity |
| 12:03.29 | Linux_Galore | the whole phone is black, even the keys |
| 12:03.57 | ewon | STEAL IT |
| 12:04.16 | Linux_Galore | two laptops back for me and I had a laptop with a 6GB hardisk lol |
| 12:05.57 | Linux_Galore | Samsung G600 looks pretty nice, basically a N95 clone http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7RY9BmfM8I4&mode=related&search= |
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| 12:11.47 | Linux_Galore | eat your heart out Apple, Latest Linux compiz effects http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QUUAuTG26bY |
| 12:13.18 | ewon | jeebus |
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| 12:14.25 | Psi_ | doesnt look that new |
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| 12:15.01 | Psi_ | the pc im using now already does most of that and more |
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| 12:17.17 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[FAQ]] [[Event_Field]] [[Email_Address_Field]] [[Devirginator]] [[Wishlist:Determine_Position]] [[Data_Entry_Dialog]] [[Calculator]] [[Building_a_hello_world_application]] [[Bluetooth_Connection_Status]] [[Applications]] [[Application_Manager]] and other changes |
| 12:18.23 | dando | i get an error building with make openmoko-devel-image. |
| 12:21.07 | Linux_Galore | yeah there are a few effects missing from the latest compiz-fussion build in that video likebeing able to put objects in the middle of the cube |
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| 12:46.38 | XorA | wow just found an 80Wh battery, that'll keep a neo going for a while |
| 12:46.43 | ewon | nice |
| 12:46.45 | woglinde | lol |
| 12:46.46 | ewon | form factor? |
| 12:46.57 | woglinde | ethanol driven? |
| 12:47.15 | XorA | http://www.maplin.co.uk/module.aspx?ITAG=SPEC&ModuleNo=48490&doy=27m7#spec |
| 12:47.28 | XorA | not al all useful form factor, or technology, just amusing |
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| 12:48.24 | keesj | 1Kg approx?? |
| 12:49.29 | Stephmw | XorA: you're taking my V12 suggestion too seriously :D |
| 12:50.05 | XorA | Stephmw: V12 as im pistoned engine? |
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| 12:50.11 | koen | ~v12 |
| 12:50.12 | apt | extra, extra, read all about it, v12 is the next must-have in the Neo1973, http://www.ultimatestupidity.com/pics/1/diesel/ |
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| 12:51.46 | keesj | :p |
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| 12:53.58 | mokobot | Hello master |
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| 12:56.51 | Linux_Galore | mokobot ? |
| 13:00.04 | alep1 | hi. anyone? |
| 13:00.11 | XorA | ho |
| 13:00.33 | alep1 | it's so quiet here... |
| 13:00.37 | MetaBookfoziS | ho |
| 13:00.40 | XorA | server just split |
| 13:00.52 | woglinde | everyones playes with his moko |
| 13:01.05 | MetaBookfoziS | not anyone has:( |
| 13:01.18 | alep1 | ...everyone who HAS a neo... |
| 13:01.21 | MetaBookfoziS | ;) |
| 13:01.29 | alep1 | not my case :( |
| 13:01.41 | woglinde | it will come |
| 13:01.46 | MetaBookfoziS | I waits for 2.0:( |
| 13:02.14 | MetaBookfoziS | painly thing:) |
| 13:02.57 | XorA | MetaBookfoziS: it will be worth the wait |
| 13:03.16 | alep1 | how do you all feel about the forum idea that has been proposed in the mailing lists? |
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| 13:03.27 | XorA | alep1: link? |
| 13:03.59 | alep1 | there is nothing official. yet. |
| 13:04.22 | dando | how much will the gta02 be ? |
| 13:04.27 | dando | 400 $? |
| 13:04.28 | jgm | Forums will be better when we have users, at current the email list is probably easier (although there are so many email lists it is hard to keep track even of them) |
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| 13:04.56 | nbd | web forums are a plague |
| 13:04.58 | nbd | they all suck |
| 13:05.04 | alep1 | at this time there are 355 folks in this "room" |
| 13:05.13 | Fatal | nbd: agreed |
| 13:05.23 | alep1 | I think it's a considerable number |
| 13:05.26 | dando | 355 |
| 13:05.48 | alep1 | unless they are all bots... |
| 13:05.50 | ewanm89_laptop | I prefer mailing lists and irc over forums. |
| 13:06.17 | dando | forum is good for the avaerage user! the masses |
| 13:06.38 | dando | how to install a package .... |
| 13:06.51 | woglinde | ipkg install? *g* |
| 13:06.52 | jgm | The average user shouldn't know what a 'package' is... |
| 13:06.54 | *** join/#openmoko hypa7ia (i=hypatia@judecca.aculei.net) |
| 13:07.00 | dando | :) |
| 13:07.03 | cjb_ie | aiee, openstreetmap had precisely this discussion a few months back, nearly came to blows over it (irc / ml / forums that is ) |
| 13:07.15 | woglinde | the average user will not buy a neo |
| 13:07.29 | MetaBookfoziS | :) |
| 13:07.30 | jgm | woglinde: only if the UI is unfriendly (in that unix way) |
| 13:07.30 | nbd | if only someone came up with a decent forum software that integrates well with news/mailinglist as backend |
| 13:07.36 | alep1 | as jgm said, there are so many lists, and I have 76 mails waiting me to be readed |
| 13:07.41 | nbd | and it must not be written by php kiddies |
| 13:07.47 | XorA | the problem the new generation of users have ISP that dont provide email, therefore they never learn to use it |
| 13:08.01 | jgm | There's every reason why you should be able to sell this 'phone (or at least a 'phone with this software on it) to the masses |
| 13:08.09 | ewanm89_laptop | cjb_ie: There is an applications program that allows graphical packagemanagement in openmoko. |
| 13:08.10 | jgm | And if you can't then it suggests that the software has failed |
| 13:08.40 | cjb_ie | ewanm89_laptop: erm, i was talking about the irc / ml / forums debate |
| 13:08.50 | raynet | IMHO the goal for this project shouldn't be phone for the masses but phone for us |
| 13:09.11 | raynet | the mass part can be a side effect |
| 13:09.11 | woglinde | we will see |
| 13:09.15 | XorA | raynet: no, a phone for the masses, so the masses subsadise a phone for us |
| 13:09.19 | jgm | raynet: a 'phone for us (assuming is is the 350-odd people in this room) will fail |
| 13:09.24 | ewanm89_laptop | Um j<tab> didn't work. |
| 13:09.25 | jgm | s/is/us/ |
| 13:09.37 | ewanm89_laptop | jgm: There is an applications program that allows graphical packagemanagement in openmoko. |
| 13:09.43 | raynet | it cannot fail |
| 13:09.44 | ewanm89_laptop | cjb_ie: Sorry |
| 13:09.56 | raynet | once i get my neo, it is there and wont go anywhere |
| 13:10.02 | raynet | thus it cannot fail |
| 13:10.05 | jgm | Plus I'm not even interested in writing software for a 'phone with so little interest. 'phones, especially their user interfaces, suck, and that's what I want to see fixed |
| 13:10.28 | jgm | ewanm89_laptop: yeah I haven't looked at it yet but I'm hoping that it's *really* friendly |
| 13:10.31 | jgm | But suspect not |
| 13:10.45 | ewanm89_laptop | jgm: Fix it then, that is the beuty of openmoko. |
| 13:11.02 | jgm | Well I'm currently building out the extensions framework (has anyone looked at that by the way?) |
| 13:11.12 | jgm | I'm more of an infrastructure than an app guy |
| 13:11.13 | sandos | to me, the problem with phones today is that they pretend to be computers but are sooo far from actually being that |
| 13:11.22 | alep1 | I'm not even thinking if this will be the phone for masses. I'm thinking about another tool to let us share knowledge, and a forum isn't that bad |
| 13:11.37 | sandos | I DONT have to fiddle with certificates when developing for my desktop, but I do have to for my phone |
| 13:11.48 | sandos | unless I like security dialogs |
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| 13:12.21 | jgm | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Wishlist:Extension_Framework |
| 13:12.35 | sandos | the phone manuf. should just concede defeat and say "we dont know shit about software, someone please save us" |
| 13:12.37 | jgm | And there is code if anyone wants it: ftp://ftp.devzero.net/openmoko/dist/omext.tar.gz |
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| 13:13.31 | guaqua | jgm: looks complicated |
| 13:13.38 | jgm | And a message on the mailing list talking about it: http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008293.html |
| 13:13.43 | guaqua | please start with use cases first |
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| 13:13.58 | jgm | guaqua: It isn't too bad actually |
| 13:14.13 | guaqua | and imo the location awareness should be built into geoclue |
| 13:14.22 | jgm | There is some complexity there but that's because it is designed to be easier for the extension developer to write |
| 13:14.26 | guaqua | or how to determine the location |
| 13:15.03 | jgm | It's not designed to have a load of functionality in itself, just to provide the ability for people to extend the 'core' functionality without having to hack the low-level stuff themselves |
| 13:16.26 | sannes | hm, seems like the reservation on my account is gone and I have not been charged, weird |
| 13:16.50 | sannes | Anyone experienced the same? |
| 13:16.57 | guaqua | is calling only one part of it? |
| 13:17.21 | jgm | ? |
| 13:17.34 | guaqua | the way you pictured it, looks right, but i'm just asking are there other possible ways to use it? |
| 13:17.51 | guaqua | this is a computer with a phone attached after all, not just your regular cell phone |
| 13:18.39 | jgm | Well the gsmd is just an example call, I used it partly because its an obvious 'phone feature and partly because the applications themselves are still pretty nebulous so it is hard to say what is going to exist to extend |
| 13:18.49 | jgm | But it's a general extensions framework that could be used for pretty much anything |
| 13:19.28 | jgm | As soon as I get a 'phone in my hands I'll pick a few apps and write some simple extensions so that people can see more of the applicability of the system |
| 13:19.38 | jgm | But frankly even if it just extended gsmd it would be worth it |
| 13:19.44 | guaqua | definitely |
| 13:20.29 | guaqua | i've had this idea of a geoclue interface that would have some sort of fuzzy logic built into it |
| 13:20.48 | guaqua | so for example it could determine you are "at home" or "at work" |
| 13:21.01 | guaqua | it would see how it's connected to the internet |
| 13:21.13 | guaqua | use gps and any information it would get |
| 13:21.21 | guaqua | and the user could set the rules |
| 13:21.39 | guaqua | it might be useless, however, if the gps is as good as they've told |
| 13:22.39 | jgm | So in that case the geolocation would be a separate app, but you could geo-enable existing application by building an extension that changed their behaviour depending on your location |
| 13:23.28 | guaqua | yeah |
| 13:24.39 | *** join/#openmoko ag (n=ag@fedaykin.roxor.cx) |
| 13:26.15 | Kensan | guaqua: you could define your "home" location also through different parameters, like certain bluetooth devices that are present etc. |
| 13:27.02 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 13:27.23 | guaqua | Kensan: most definitely :) |
| 13:27.35 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@static-b5-252-25.telepac.pt) |
| 13:27.50 | guaqua | it would need a gui, some sort of a wizard to define the rules and the backend part |
| 13:28.57 | *** join/#openmoko prpplague (n=billybob@mail.americanmicrosystems.com) |
| 13:29.44 | Kero | example rules like that should go onto the wiki somewhere. |
| 13:30.05 | guaqua | it would need specifications |
| 13:30.15 | Kero | infrastructure (based on dbus, I reckon) should be built to handle those rules conveniently |
| 13:30.27 | Kero | sepcs follow from usecases |
| 13:30.33 | Kero | s/sepcs/specs/ |
| 13:30.36 | Shoragan | XorA, sound is working now, i had old module in my rootfs. :/ |
| 13:30.47 | XorA | Shoragan: phew!!!! |
| 13:31.01 | guaqua | Kero: it would be based on the existing geoclue architecture |
| 13:31.17 | guaqua | and would use geoclue's other backends extensively |
| 13:32.42 | Kensan | guaqua: A wizard with a "scan now" function would be nice, then you could label it as a certain location like "home" or "work" etc. |
| 13:32.50 | guaqua | yeah |
| 13:33.26 | guaqua | maybe by answering questions like "is this your home wlan?" |
| 13:33.35 | Kensan | guaqua: how does geoclue relate to Dbus? |
| 13:33.39 | Kero | does it involve probing bluetooth, wireless, wireless USB and GPS? |
| 13:33.45 | guaqua | geoclue is used via dbus |
| 13:34.19 | guaqua | Kero: i don't see a problem with probing those |
| 13:34.43 | guaqua | we'd just have to get the right combination working |
| 13:34.44 | Kensan | guaqua: so geoclue could propagate events via dbus? |
| 13:34.53 | guaqua | geoclue by itself doesn't do that |
| 13:35.03 | *** join/#openmoko ag (n=ag@fedaykin.roxor.cx) |
| 13:35.25 | guaqua | so there would have to be another daemon asking geoclue about the current location |
| 13:35.52 | *** join/#openmoko l4rs (n=laprican@hsiproxy.astra-net.com) |
| 13:35.59 | Kero | aha, "GeoClue is a D-Bus API and library that provides all kinds of geographic information to applications." |
| 13:36.10 | *** join/#openmoko aesci99 (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 13:36.28 | guaqua | and my idea is basically creating an intelligent backend for geoclue that could be customized |
| 13:36.44 | guaqua | so that there wouldn't have to be more than one place to do it in |
| 13:36.47 | Kero | 'backend' ? |
| 13:37.00 | guaqua | backend/api |
| 13:37.11 | guaqua | gps is one backend in geoclue |
| 13:37.19 | *** join/#openmoko poffy (n=poffy@c-76-30-222-129.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 13:37.50 | guaqua | it also has some sort of wlan ip-based intelligent backend for determining the current location |
| 13:38.08 | Kero | so gathering info from geoclue and saying "home" is not a backend, but a layer on top of. |
| 13:38.38 | guaqua | i'd implement a new backend to geoclue to do that |
| 13:38.50 | guaqua | so that pure geoclue could be used by the applications |
| 13:40.33 | *** join/#openmoko empty_mind (i=kvirc@122.167.177.167) |
| 13:42.27 | guaqua | you should read the geoclue wiki |
| 13:42.37 | Kero | seems geoclue is actually flexible enough to say "home". |
| 13:42.37 | guaqua | which can be found here: http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/GeoClue |
| 13:42.42 | guaqua | yeah |
| 13:44.02 | Kero | slightly wondering how an application would make clear it wants coordinates or something like "home" or "city". |
| 13:44.11 | Kero | but I guess that's on the wiki then. |
| 13:44.48 | Kero | mm, page I was reading alreayd was the wiki :) |
| 13:45.07 | guaqua | Kero: by asking geoclue's different backends |
| 13:45.28 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 13:45.30 | guaqua | so by asking geoclue for the city you are in, it would do the math, not the application you are working on |
| 13:45.46 | *** join/#openmoko Cyphi^ (n=cyphi@a91-153-116-247.elisa-laajakaista.fi) |
| 13:45.46 | calamous_ | Has anyone else tried an at&t sim card in their phone? |
| 13:45.53 | guaqua | there could be a city backend for that purpose |
| 13:45.56 | Kero | guaqua: dev docs still need to be written :( |
| 13:46.08 | guaqua | calamous_: afaik the one with 3g-logo doesn't work |
| 13:46.14 | guaqua | calamous_: older one works |
| 13:46.28 | calamous_ | Yep. same thing here |
| 13:46.51 | calamous_ | It "should" work. People looked up the sim card online and said that it should work with 2g phones |
| 13:47.15 | calamous_ | and someone on the list said that the sim card works in other old 2g phones, but not the neo |
| 13:47.15 | thomasg__ | sounds like a bug in openmoko |
| 13:47.25 | thomasg__ | or in the bootloader, whatever detects this |
| 13:47.35 | calamous_ | Yeah, a pretty serious bug |
| 13:47.55 | thomasg__ | can't imagine, that a US provider has USIMs without normal GSM-SIM support |
| 13:48.42 | thomasg__ | coult it be, that this sims from AT&T are for UMTS and CDMA only? (no GSM?) |
| 13:48.44 | calamous_ | Yeah me neither |
| 13:48.46 | guaqua | doesn't sound that special |
| 13:48.47 | XorA | UK has gone the other way, all 3G phones are using SIM not USIM |
| 13:48.53 | guaqua | thomasg__: sim is gsm specific |
| 13:48.59 | guaqua | dunno about umts |
| 13:49.11 | thomasg__ | the same for me and cdma :) |
| 13:49.25 | calamous_ | Do you think I should email Harald Welte? |
| 13:49.32 | thomasg__ | in umts special sim-cards are used, called USIM |
| 13:49.36 | XorA | calamous_: no, look in the bug tracker |
| 13:49.37 | guaqua | file a bug, calamous_ |
| 13:49.41 | *** join/#openmoko dtx (n=dtx@cdf-imaging.com) |
| 13:49.41 | mokobot | Please don't let this man torture me. |
| 13:49.42 | guaqua | or look first, really |
| 13:49.43 | XorA | bug is already there |
| 13:49.45 | thomasg__ | but they should be compatible to old GSM SIM |
| 13:49.49 | *** join/#openmoko chris^ (n=kraetzi@p548ADC45.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 13:50.02 | XorA | thomasg__: thats not 100% true |
| 13:50.18 | thomasg__ | XorA, ok, the CAN be compatible, but the do not have tot be |
| 13:50.20 | thomasg__ | *to |
| 13:50.28 | XorA | thomasg__: yup :-) |
| 13:50.36 | calamous_ | is this what you mean: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666 |
| 13:51.00 | thomasg__ | well, so or so, sounds weird |
| 13:51.30 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 13:51.44 | thomasg__ | I have 5 sim cards here, all USIM, hope it will work |
| 13:51.47 | XorA | calamous_: thats the bug I was thinking of |
| 13:52.04 | Kero | ha. bug reporter is clueless |
| 13:52.15 | Kero | wants 3G in a gprs device |
| 13:52.25 | Kero | second comment is about your bug, though |
| 13:52.35 | thomasg__ | I also want 3G in this 2G device :) |
| 13:54.30 | koen | what's a neo1873 ? |
| 13:54.35 | calamous_ | I don't know |
| 13:54.41 | calamous_ | Thats why I posted the second comment |
| 13:54.44 | prpplague | koen: never heard of one |
| 13:54.45 | calamous_ | and 3rd just now |
| 13:55.20 | Kensan | guaqua: I imagine one would implementa daemon that sends out notifications (possibly via DBUS) when you enter a location that has been "tagged" (home, etc). |
| 13:55.26 | prpplague | koen: back from your trip? |
| 13:55.28 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D8430.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 13:55.28 | dando | NOTE: package openmoko-rssreader-0.0.1+svn20070723-r1: task do_configure: started |
| 13:55.34 | dando | ERROR: function do_configure failed |
| 13:55.37 | koen | prpplague: yes |
| 13:55.38 | dando | hmm |
| 13:55.42 | prpplague | koen: lovely |
| 13:55.56 | prpplague | koen: you know anyone on the core team working on the sdio wifi stuff? |
| 13:56.04 | koen | nope |
| 13:56.18 | koen | prpplague: but ossman is in this channel :) |
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| 14:01.07 | Kensan | dando: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=648 |
| 14:03.31 | *** join/#openmoko drath_ (i=vmaster@p5B07E9B3.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 14:04.32 | CoreDump|home | hi |
| 14:04.43 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: what were you asking yesterday if I'd be around for? I am, as you probably guessed. |
| 14:05.14 | *** join/#openmoko aesci99 (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 14:05.17 | *** join/#openmoko hypa7ia_ (i=hypatia@judecca.aculei.net) |
| 14:06.09 | *** join/#openmoko vosen (n=v0@86-63-84-163.asta-net.com.pl) |
| 14:06.33 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: mainly because you seem to be up on all the goings on for the openmoko/fic teams |
| 14:07.07 | prpplague | koen: yea, i've been tinkering with ossmans new sdio stack, but as far as sdio wifi goes, it still has a ways to go |
| 14:07.51 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: i'm just trying to find out what direction the openmoko team is going with their sdio interface |
| 14:08.12 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: if they are using a third party sdio stack or if they will try to use an open source stack |
| 14:08.22 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: as well as some hardware issues |
| 14:08.48 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: i.e. it does appear that card to host sdio interrupts don't appear to be working on the s3c2410 |
| 14:08.50 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: only as I've been lurking on the ML, and IRC, and wiki, and have understanding of the electronics. |
| 14:08.56 | Shoragan | i think nbd was working on the sdio stuff |
| 14:09.18 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: what I was thinking about on different pinout I've remembered. |
| 14:09.31 | nbd | i'm working on porting the ar6000 driver to pierre ossman's stack |
| 14:09.31 | prpplague | SpeedEvil: do tell |
| 14:09.36 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: it was in the context of me contemplating driving several cards wired together. |
| 14:09.44 | prpplague | nbd: oh good |
| 14:09.49 | sannes | When is it they actually charge the card? When they send it or before they sent the "Payment Received" e-mail ? |
| 14:09.54 | prpplague | nbd: you starting with the s3c2410 or 2440? |
| 14:09.59 | nbd | 2410 |
| 14:10.06 | nbd | i have a qt2410 board |
| 14:10.13 | prpplague | nbd: ahh |
| 14:10.13 | ossman | nbd, you really should shout out about that as I believe others are doing the same thing |
| 14:10.27 | ossman | I think Nicolas Pitre has a board, for example |
| 14:10.30 | nbd | i'm currently stuck with a problem, maybe you guys can help |
| 14:10.38 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: there is no disambiguation mechanism for SDIO cards when working as SDIO - you need an extra pin per card. In normal conditions, when all pins are wired back to the SD controller this isn't an issue. |
| 14:10.44 | prpplague | nbd: yea, might be nice to start a channel specific to sdio stack issues |
| 14:10.49 | nbd | the card probe works, but as soon as it does any mmc_io_rw_extended calls, the controller locks up |
| 14:10.55 | nbd | it says transaction still in progress |
| 14:11.00 | nbd | but the reset calls don't bring it back to life |
| 14:11.03 | nbd | and the load average goes up to 1.0 |
| 14:11.16 | *** join/#openmoko devestate (n=devestat@r02amsdm2.desktop.umr.edu) |
| 14:11.17 | nbd | it manages to do 1-5 read commands until it locks up |
| 14:11.20 | SpeedEvil | prpplague: I was considering a large stack of SD/SDIO cards on a microprocessor, but this can't be done without an enable line to each SDIO card. |
| 14:11.38 | SpeedEvil | IMO, only if it's spammy. |
| 14:11.53 | SpeedEvil | s/microprocessor/microcontroller/ |
| 14:12.01 | prpplague | nbd: yea, i'm seeing similiar problems |
| 14:12.02 | ossman | nbd, it crashes on the first extended io? |
| 14:12.25 | nbd | ossman: sometimes on the first, sometimes on the fifth, but the driver is repeating the same command |
| 14:12.47 | ossman | odd |
| 14:13.08 | nbd | some stuff in the datasheet looks like i have to set some extra flags for the extended commands, but experimenting with that led to no different results |
| 14:13.14 | nbd | datasheet of the controller, i mean |
| 14:13.19 | *** part/#openmoko VladoK (n=vlado@adsl-dyn38.91-127-103.t-com.sk) |
| 14:13.29 | prpplague | nbd: so far many of the irq triggers i'm seeing don't match what i've got unmasked |
| 14:15.05 | *** join/#openmoko denis^da (n=denis@p5492884E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 14:16.19 | nbd | do you guys think i need to check the sdio irq support at this early point? it seems to me as if the extended commands should be able to work without it |
| 14:17.00 | *** part/#openmoko mdt (n=mdt@littlelun.emdete.de) |
| 14:17.34 | prpplague | nbd: right the extended commands should work without the sdio interrupt but like i said, even the other interrupts seemed to not handled like the documentation stated |
| 14:17.57 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[QT2410]] [[Main_Page]] [[Freshman_todo]] [[Translation]] [[Neo1973_compatible_cellphone_providers]] [[Profiles_%28Application%29]] [[Picture_Preview]] [[Neo1973_OpenOCD]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU_on_MacOSX]] [[OpenMoko_under_QEMU]] and other changes |
| 14:18.22 | nbd | prpplague: hm. i think i'm currently running the controller in polled mode |
| 14:19.15 | prpplague | nbd: ahh right ossmans stack is running polled only right now |
| 14:19.27 | prpplague | nbd: i have two other stacks i'm tinkering with as well |
| 14:19.52 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@125.33.225.203) |
| 14:19.57 | nbd | initially i played with the thought of porting the host controlller driver to that montavista stack |
| 14:20.02 | nbd | but i just couldn't bear that garbage |
| 14:20.12 | prpplague | nbd: agreed |
| 14:20.32 | LetoTo | nbd: put montevitsa down immediately. you don't know where it has been! |
| 14:20.48 | nbd | LetoTo: already did |
| 14:20.51 | nbd | ;) |
| 14:20.55 | prpplague | nbd: oh, another note, i've been unable to get the sdi controller to xmit properly in 4-bit mode as well |
| 14:20.56 | LetoTo | i wonder why Harald hasn't managed to sue them |
| 14:21.13 | nbd | prpplague: hmm.. that could be related to this issue |
| 14:21.13 | LetoTo | guess it's hard to buy montevista without signing NDA's and spending a million |
| 14:21.34 | prpplague | nbd: ahh you are trying to run in 4-bit mode |
| 14:21.48 | prpplague | nbd: ? |
| 14:22.25 | nbd | prpplague: i didn't actually change anything in that area. i just merged the stack, made the host controller work with it and then attempted to attach ar6k to it |
| 14:22.53 | prpplague | nbd: ahh, iirc ossmans stack doesn't try to use 4-bit mode at this stage yet |
| 14:23.16 | nbd | i wish i had brought the hardware with me |
| 14:23.23 | nbd | now i have to wait for a few days until i can test again |
| 14:23.42 | prpplague | nbd: hehe, np |
| 14:23.55 | prpplague | nbd: i'll be around next week |
| 14:24.25 | prpplague | nbd: i've already gotten most of it working with a hardcoded i/o (not really a stack) |
| 14:24.40 | prpplague | nbd: gonna start trying to intergrate it into ossmans stack next week |
| 14:25.03 | prpplague | nbd: just wanted to get with the openmoko/fic guess to make sure we don't duplicate work |
| 14:25.09 | nbd | prpplague: most of what specifically? |
| 14:25.17 | prpplague | nbd: btw, which ar6k module are you using |
| 14:25.28 | nbd | i pulled it from the sdio-linux project |
| 14:25.32 | nbd | is there a different one? |
| 14:25.51 | prpplague | nbd: mainly the cmd53/cmd52 stuff as well as irq handling |
| 14:26.03 | nbd | ah, ok |
| 14:26.10 | prpplague | nbd: http://git.kernel.org/?p=linux/kernel/git/drzeus/mmc.git;a=tree |
| 14:27.18 | prpplague | nbd: there is an sdio head |
| 14:27.26 | nbd | prpplague: yeah, that's the one i used |
| 14:28.09 | prpplague | nbd: ahh ok |
| 14:28.18 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gabe@c-67-167-84-69.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 14:28.25 | nbd | although i patched it a bit to expose the mmc_io_rw_extended functions directly. but this is just a hack because i wanted to use something that's closer to what the ar6k host interface part expects |
| 14:28.32 | *** join/#openmoko florian (n=fuchs@217.146.132.69) |
| 14:28.43 | nbd | are you guys going to be at ccc camp? |
| 14:28.54 | prpplague | nbd: hey, i have to run to an engineering meeting |
| 14:28.57 | prpplague | nbd: sorry no |
| 14:29.00 | prpplague | nbd: bbiab |
| 14:30.59 | koen | nbd: there was some talk on LAK about the sdio stack and missing features |
| 14:31.20 | nbd | are there any other sdio stacks that i could use as reference? |
| 14:31.29 | nbd | to add what's missing |
| 14:31.40 | nbd | i mean aside from the mvista garbage |
| 14:31.43 | SpeedEvil | Do you have a copy of the standard? |
| 14:31.53 | nbd | yeah, i have a few pdfs on that |
| 14:32.01 | *** join/#openmoko jeddy3 (n=mattiast@v-417-adsl-torsang-3.bitnet.nu) |
| 14:32.04 | nbd | but reading code is easier for me, even if it's structured differently ;) |
| 14:32.43 | koen | nbd: atheros is said to have its own stack, or is that the mv crap? |
| 14:32.56 | nbd | the mv crap |
| 14:33.11 | nbd | it comes with the ar6k driver |
| 14:33.38 | nbd | those two seemed to have worked on it together and i can't decide which one writes crappier code |
| 14:33.41 | nbd | ;) |
| 14:33.59 | ossman | all public stacks so far have been rather uneasy on the eyes |
| 14:34.08 | ossman | which is why we started from scratch |
| 14:34.13 | nbd | makes sense |
| 14:34.26 | nbd | i found yours very convenient to read |
| 14:34.27 | ossman | so you're better of reading the public spec than another stack |
| 14:34.36 | nbd | will do |
| 14:34.55 | ossman | SpeedEvil, you can find the spec on sdcard.org |
| 14:35.04 | ossman | it just comes with a "no warranty" disclaimer |
| 14:35.50 | nbd | actually cleaning up ar6k will be a tough job |
| 14:35.52 | nbd | but that's for later |
| 14:35.55 | nbd | i want to get it working first |
| 14:36.33 | ossman | cleaning up isn't always the way to go |
| 14:36.41 | ossman | rewrite is often a better option |
| 14:36.57 | ossman | I suspect there is some softmac in there aswell? |
| 14:37.11 | nbd | nope, it seems to be hardmac |
| 14:37.20 | nbd | couldn't find many references to 802.11 stuff in there |
| 14:38.06 | mjr | yeah the ar6k iirc has quite a firmware (on flash), probably does a lot of the work internally |
| 14:38.23 | Elrond | ossman - It hardly depends, wether cleanup or rewrite is a better option. "bit rot" theory/management is a though area. In many cases a cleanup is the better option. |
| 14:38.24 | ossman | firmmac then ;) |
| 14:38.50 | nbd | my guess is that the firmware is probably based on eCos or something like that |
| 14:39.00 | nbd | it'll probably be similar to atheros usb devices |
| 14:39.10 | nbd | which have a mips 4Kc internally |
| 14:39.15 | nbd | or maybe 4KEc |
| 14:39.18 | nbd | i don't remember |
| 14:39.38 | nbd | with the usb devices it runs a similar hal as the one used in madwifi, just on the device instead of on the host |
| 14:39.56 | ossman | Elrond, depends on how far away the code is |
| 14:40.11 | mjr | nbd, *nod* |
| 14:40.13 | ossman | if I remember correctly, the atheros code was a windows driver with some glue |
| 14:40.38 | Elrond | yuck. |
| 14:40.50 | mjr | eww indeed |
| 14:41.02 | mjr | might be rewrite-time if that's the case :] |
| 14:41.04 | Elrond | But it's FOSS? |
| 14:41.08 | ossman | GPL |
| 14:41.18 | Elrond | Well, at least. |
| 14:41.25 | mjr | Elrond, that's the reason we're getting ar6k :) |
| 14:41.35 | nbd | actually the ar6k driver does not look like windows code to me |
| 14:41.42 | Elrond | mjr - That was my understanding anyway. |
| 14:42.01 | ossman | nbd, I might be mixing things up. hang on |
| 14:42.06 | Elrond | And I was surprised to see windows code as FOSS. |
| 14:42.34 | nbd | ossman: the stack code smells a bit like windows stuff, though |
| 14:42.57 | nbd | but the ar6k driver isn't really tainted by that |
| 14:43.16 | nbd | it has a small host interface part, which attaches to the stack and adds another abstraction layer |
| 14:43.17 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@66.83.208.219.nw.nuvox.net) |
| 14:43.23 | nbd | so the ar6k driver is mostly stack independent |
| 14:43.30 | ossman | nbd, ah, right |
| 14:43.31 | ossman | my bad |
| 14:43.37 | ossman | I got the entire thing in one chunk |
| 14:43.42 | ossman | so I assumed all the code was like that |
| 14:44.11 | Elrond | So it could be easily ported to the new linux stack in 2.6.22? |
| 14:44.18 | nbd | Elrond: i'm already working on that |
| 14:44.28 | Elrond | nbd - Huh, great :-) |
| 14:44.38 | Elrond | nbd - Do you have hardware to test on? |
| 14:44.42 | nbd | yeah |
| 14:44.57 | Elrond | Great :-) |
| 14:45.06 | *** join/#openmoko rob_w (n=bob@X1c67.x.pppool.de) |
| 14:45.07 | Elrond | Is atheros cooperating? |
| 14:45.14 | nbd | we'll see |
| 14:45.42 | Elrond | Have you tried to contact them and told them, on what you're working? |
| 14:45.43 | *** join/#openmoko Boaz_- (n=Boaz@bull1.hereno.info) |
| 14:45.48 | nbd | Elrond: it's being worked on |
| 14:45.58 | aloril | warning at direct.openmoko.com works, properly scared: http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=41147 |
| 14:46.02 | Elrond | Ahh, good. |
| 14:50.01 | Stephmw | aloril: haha |
| 14:50.30 | Elrond | aloril - Which is good. |
| 14:51.02 | Elrond | The article seems very sane. |
| 14:51.19 | SpeedEvil | Though slightly inaccurate on the GPS |
| 14:51.25 | aloril | they 'still' sold all out, I see practically only downsides for easily scared people buying it |
| 14:51.52 | aloril | s:'still':as excepted: #was intentional 'typo' ;-) |
| 14:53.05 | cjb_ie | aloril: well, the upside is they may ebay them off and developers may get them cheaper :-) |
| 14:53.49 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - GPS: Yeah; I was expecting more exaggerations, that's why I call it "sane". |
| 14:54.07 | Elrond | cjb_ie - hehe, yeah. |
| 14:54.27 | cjb_ie | the downside of course is the attendant bad PR |
| 14:54.28 | aloril | cjb_ie: hehe |
| 14:54.46 | Elrond | cjb_ie - If they bricked them, $developer needs to know someone with a devel board though. ;) |
| 14:55.11 | aloril | Elrond: well.. I was kind of excepting binary driver being available, maybe it is? (haven't heard yet any report to either direction) |
| 14:55.14 | cjb_ie | how hard is it to brick them without a devel board? |
| 14:55.20 | *** join/#openmoko andrunko (n=andrunko@200.184.118.132) |
| 14:55.23 | aloril | Elrond: or it being downloadable |
| 14:55.38 | *** join/#openmoko dantalizing (n=dantaliz@n128-227-82-248.xlate.ufl.edu) |
| 14:55.42 | Elrond | aloril - I don't know any source for gllin. :-| |
| 14:56.09 | Elrond | cjb_ie - One single line as root can brick it. :-| |
| 14:56.17 | aloril | cjb_ie: new u-boot has some kind of check against flashing wrong version, but you do modify u-boot and flash: high chance in bricking eventually |
| 14:56.18 | XorA | cjb_ie: depends what you do, its easy to brick |
| 14:56.26 | Elrond | cjb_ie - (no, it's no "you'll type it by accident", but it exists.) |
| 14:56.32 | dtx | man that inquirer article doesn't seem to understand what developer preview means |
| 14:56.38 | aloril | cjb_ie: flashing kernel, rootfs partitions: won't brick |
| 14:58.19 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 14:58.20 | mokobot | Hello Lord |
| 14:58.26 | Elrond | cjb_ie - Bad picture: "If you update your bios on your desktop with a bad one, you're screwed". It's the same with the neo. Except, that the "update bios" functgionality is ready available from within the running OS. |
| 14:59.53 | koen | I wouldn't flash uboot from linux |
| 15:01.03 | Elrond | koen - I wouldn't do it either. It's bound to be errorsome. You can't easily fix up the env-location in the first dector. |
| 15:01.40 | koen | I wouldn't say 'the "update bios" functgionality is ready available from within the running OS.' |
| 15:02.10 | Elrond | It is. But it surely always will be b0rked afterwards. Unless you fixup a few bytes by hand. |
| 15:02.18 | XorA | koen: dd if=/dev/random of=/dev/mtdblock2 count=64k :-) |
| 15:02.50 | quinton | i was trying to flash the u-boot from linux, then i saw what you're all talking about |
| 15:03.09 | *** join/#openmoko Jason1 (n=Jason@74.93.81.197) |
| 15:03.51 | Elrond | mokobot - Can you decrease your "random rant"-rate by 50%? |
| 15:03.52 | quinton | are you saying that i don't need to do that step? |
| 15:04.16 | ewanm89_laptop | Elrond: It isn't random. |
| 15:04.20 | XorA | quinton: if it aint broke, dont fix it when it comes to u-boot |
| 15:04.20 | Elrond | quinton - IF you ever intend to update u-boot, do it via DFU. |
| 15:04.23 | quinton | i'm still just following the wiki page |
| 15:04.28 | Jason1 | Got a problem guys. My neo drained it's battery last night. Dont seem to want to charge now... |
| 15:04.31 | aloril | idea for webkit based browser and using accelerometers: phone is window to page: when you move phone up/down/left/right/any mix it shows different thing in window just like it was transparent window to actual paper page |
| 15:05.06 | XorA | Jason1: plug in, wait an hour or so then turn on, it will come back to life, but on completely drained battery it only charges at 100mA |
| 15:05.16 | quinton | okay, thanks guys |
| 15:05.22 | Elrond | Jason1 - Remove batter, insert battery, connect to PC via USB, leave there for 3 hours. Don't touch it for those hours, just let it sit there. Then switch on and let it charge fully. |
| 15:05.27 | *** join/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@b131.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 15:05.31 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 15:05.46 | Jason1 | XorA. Good news. I had not waited that long. I plugged it in for like 10 minutes before I left for work and it still wasnt doing anything. Hopefully when I get home, all will be well :) |
| 15:06.03 | SpeedEvil | aloril: see [[Category:Accelerometer]] it's in there |
| 15:06.18 | aloril | Jason1: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/SH1#My_device_doesn.27t_power_up_at_all |
| 15:06.54 | hrw | looks like I need to look at those SH1 |
| 15:07.13 | SpeedEvil | aloril: though you can't actually quite do that, as you have no roll information. |
| 15:08.13 | aloril | SpeedEvil: umm? why not, they are 3D accelerometers and I'm talking only about relatively fast changes in movement? |
| 15:08.27 | SpeedEvil | The physics. |
| 15:08.44 | SpeedEvil | The best in breed hardware has around 60 degree/second noise in roll. |
| 15:08.55 | SpeedEvil | With a 10cm axis between the accelerometers. |
| 15:09.13 | *** join/#openmoko ruoso (n=ruoso@static-b5-252-25.telepac.pt) |
| 15:09.15 | koen | You want 3d accell + 3d gyro |
| 15:09.16 | SpeedEvil | The hardware that's been mentioned in the ML has around a 720 degree/second noise. |
| 15:09.26 | koen | which you can do with most intertial sensors |
| 15:09.34 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 15:09.41 | SpeedEvil | In roll. |
| 15:09.55 | aloril | SpeedEvil: ah yeah, there are 2 accelerometers only, I was thinking about z-axis ;-) |
| 15:10.00 | SpeedEvil | 3d gyro are _always_ seperate. |
| 15:10.10 | SpeedEvil | No - there are two three axis. |
| 15:10.36 | SpeedEvil | See [[Accelerometer Fundamentals]] on the wiki for all the gory details on how the physics works. (though it's quite readable.) |
| 15:11.14 | aloril | SpeedEvil: no, I meant portrait <-> landscape stuff (z-axis) |
| 15:11.32 | aloril | SpeedEvil: ie.. keep it always like it was on table |
| 15:11.37 | aloril | (script) openmoko-community: Sean Moss-Pultz <sean at openmoko.com> Re: whee! |
| 15:12.29 | *** join/#openmoko chreeka7 (n=b@81.235.125.209.transedge.com) |
| 15:12.46 | SpeedEvil | You can easily tell which way is down with a fair accuracy. |
| 15:12.56 | SpeedEvil | You can do anything with regards to that. |
| 15:12.58 | *** join/#openmoko chris^^ (n=kraetzi@p548ADC45.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:13.37 | SpeedEvil | But derived measurements - especially with the 7bits per G accelerometers that have been mentioned in the ML are basically very, very limited. |
| 15:14.52 | aloril | well, it should be enough for fast changes, not talking about constant velocity stuff, talking about flick it around on table stuff |
| 15:15.17 | SpeedEvil | Sorry - on table? |
| 15:16.39 | *** part/#openmoko Jason1 (n=Jason@74.93.81.197) |
| 15:17.34 | aloril | yes, basically like that: just move it around, rotate it to see table size paper content |
| 15:18.43 | aloril | SpeedEvil: looked at [[Wishlist:3D_Viewport]]: seems like this idea was obvious (and one that might have been easily patentable ;-) |
| 15:19.05 | LetoTo | what kernel is openmoko at? |
| 15:19.41 | *** join/#openmoko some1_ (n=some1@p54A0F9B6.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 15:20.21 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 15:20.38 | Kensan | LetoTo: afaik 2.6.22.1 but might be wrong. |
| 15:20.50 | LetoTo | thanks. |
| 15:21.01 | *** join/#openmoko openfanss (n=df@218.79.146.16) |
| 15:21.44 | ewanm89_laptop | Kensan: Um, I though usb network emulation was supposed to work if it was the same version? |
| 15:22.52 | *** join/#openmoko zaery (n=zaery@c-71-202-249-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 15:23.11 | Kensan | ewanm89_laptop: I read in here that people (afaik Shorogan) were porting patches to 2.6.22.1 but it might not be done. |
| 15:23.26 | XorA | its done |
| 15:23.38 | XorA | and rtp did it to 2.6.23-rc1(ish) |
| 15:25.03 | ewanm89_laptop | XorA: So if I update what kerenl should I get? |
| 15:25.13 | ewanm89_laptop | s/en/ne/ |
| 15:25.31 | XorA | ewanm89_laptop: the official one whatver that is |
| 15:25.42 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03werner * r2538 10/developers/werner/snap/ (. README config.template mksnap): |
| 15:25.42 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Simple snapshot generator, with usage instructions for the |
| 15:25.42 | CIA-24 | openmoko: snapshots. |
| 15:27.13 | Kensan | ewanm89_laptop: latest bb-recipe for kernel suggests 2.6.22.1 |
| 15:27.50 | ewanm89_laptop | Kensan: Thanks, won't update host to 23-rc1 just yet then. |
| 15:28.22 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@81-187-78-211.multithread.co.uk) |
| 15:28.29 | *** join/#openmoko zaery_ (n=zaery@c-71-202-249-103.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 15:29.16 | *** join/#openmoko wolog (n=wolog@brusc.guerrier.com) |
| 15:29.44 | zaery_ | Can someone help me SSH into my neo1973? |
| 15:30.15 | zaery_ | Im a noob with SSH'ing |
| 15:30.35 | guaqua | read the wiki |
| 15:30.48 | guaqua | the instructions are there |
| 15:30.48 | Shoragan | ewanm89_laptop, your host and neo kernel can be different versions without problems |
| 15:30.58 | zaery_ | hehe, i didn't think of that |
| 15:31.24 | quinton | if the u-boot is working properly, should i be getting this http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Image:Neo1973_uboot_menu.jpg ? i get a kernel panic |
| 15:31.56 | quinton | it's just that some of the instructions seem to imply that's what i should be seeing |
| 15:31.57 | *** join/#openmoko aesci7E (n=aesci99@125.33.225.94) |
| 15:32.02 | XorA | quinton: you need to flash a new kernel and rootfs AFAIK |
| 15:32.16 | XorA | quinton: someone said something about phone shipped with a kernel when they shouldnt have been |
| 15:32.25 | Kensan | quinton: afaik you only get to see the u-boot menu if you press the AUX-Button on boot-up. |
| 15:34.12 | zaery_ | hmmm, i cant find the wiki page |
| 15:34.26 | quinton | XorA, do you mean flashing them to the microsd card? |
| 15:34.40 | XorA | quinton: no, I think you need to go read the wiki |
| 15:35.08 | Kensan | zaery: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973#Getting_shell_access_on_the_phone |
| 15:35.33 | zaery_ | aloril: mine did :) |
| 15:35.49 | SpeedEvil | aloril: Look at P1_owners. The numbers seem to work out right - of people charged - for 500 phones. |
| 15:35.50 | zaery_ | kensan: thanks |
| 15:35.53 | quinton | XorA, i'm trying to follow the 'building openmoko from scratch' page, but i'm a bit stuck because i need to get a serial console |
| 15:36.02 | *** topic/#openmoko by aloril -> wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | First orders have shipped yesterday - (24/7) for US, at least some shipped 26/7 for rest of world. http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html (black/silver only, in order of RT) |
| 15:36.48 | XorA | quinton: I think you have gone down the wrote tree in the wiki |
| 15:36.59 | XorA | quinton: Im not very familiar with the wiki |
| 15:37.00 | *** topic/#openmoko by aloril -> wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | SH1 has shipped, you should have received tracking number |
| 15:37.04 | raynet | oO, so this mean the neo that was shipped to me is black |
| 15:37.26 | aloril | raynet: yes, unless you have changed it somehow to orange |
| 15:38.06 | quinton | XorA, okay, i'll follow one of the other guides this time around |
| 15:38.11 | Kensan | quinton: have you tried this: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Flashing_openmoko ? |
| 15:38.16 | SpeedEvil | It looks like it's reasonable to guess that 1/3 to 1/2 have shipped. - of that first 100. |
| 15:38.18 | *** topic/#openmoko by aloril -> wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | SH1 has shipped, you should have received tracking number http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html |
| 15:38.25 | SpeedEvil | s/100/500/ |
| 15:38.46 | aloril | SpeedEvil: well, there is probably delay in updating P1_Owners page ;-) |
| 15:38.48 | SpeedEvil | Look at the ratio of CC charges to tracking number received. |
| 15:38.52 | aloril | but... yeah |
| 15:38.58 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (i=casey@conference/oscon/x-baca374a092003e7) |
| 15:39.12 | raynet | aloril: ok. i can live with black. atleast i might get it by monday |
| 15:39.17 | SpeedEvil | It's possible people simply haven't commented on it. |
| 15:39.33 | raynet | ah, must remember to update the wiki |
| 15:40.06 | aloril | raynet: if you wanted orange, you should have mailed ORANGE with your YES_I_DO mail ;-) |
| 15:40.30 | quinton | Kensan, i haven't flashed the u-boot yet. i'm not sure whether i need to or not yet |
| 15:40.45 | aloril | quinton: don't think there is need to flash u-boot |
| 15:40.52 | raynet | aloril: but i wanted it in ASAP color :) |
| 15:41.01 | aloril | raynet: hehe |
| 15:41.18 | raynet | which i did get so w00t! |
| 15:41.39 | Kensan | quinton: if you get to the u-boot menu you don't need to. And if you don't have the Debug-Board you probably should not flash u-boot if you don't really need to. |
| 15:42.08 | raynet | i can always give the case for my friend and she can paint dragons on it |
| 15:42.28 | empty_mind | countr |
| 15:42.31 | quinton | ah, breakthrough, i was trying to push the aux button when the flash screen was up, but i guess you need to hold it down when you are powering it up |
| 15:42.36 | empty_mind | counter |
| 15:42.36 | aloril | (last update 2007-07-27 06:54) http://londerings.novalis.org/wlog/index.php?title=Neo1973_counter : Order https://direct.openmoko.com/ ; Delivered prob. 75% in 4 days 08:17:23 (4.345±2.5 days) (1781;252) |
| 15:42.47 | *** join/#openmoko Sup3rkiddo (n=sudharsh@unaffiliated/sudharsh) |
| 15:42.49 | mokobot | Hello Lord |
| 15:43.02 | Kensan | quinton: just follow the instructions on the wiki, they are quite extensive and self-explanatory |
| 15:43.17 | quinton | Kensan, thanks, i'm not going to flash it right now, but maybe some time later, i have the debug board just in case =) |
| 15:43.21 | empty_mind | oops that was for Sup3rkiddo not Sufflope |
| 15:43.33 | jgm | It's pretty frustrating that they didn't bother telling us that the orange 'phones would ship later *before* we had were asked the colour choices. I mean, it's not like they didn't know what they were shipping to the USA... |
| 15:44.14 | quinton | okay, i'm back on track now, thanks for the advice guys, sorry for being such a noob |
| 15:44.51 | raynet | jgm: no-one would have taken orange then :) |
| 15:45.05 | empty_mind | rwhihowdy |
| 15:45.07 | zaery_ | how do i check if my SIM card is working |
| 15:45.18 | jgm | raynet: and this would have been bad how? There are 2000 guys backed up behind me that could have taken them |
| 15:45.36 | dando | @ all :I get some strange ascii chars pressing the <- del Button on virtual keyboard typing in an terminal. Do you have the same problem? |
| 15:45.46 | jgm | I actually ordered two, one of each, so suspect that when the orange shipment turns up they still won't be able to ship to me as they'll have sent off all the black/silver ones |
| 15:45.48 | jgm | <sigh> |
| 15:46.08 | raynet | jgm: but i might not get mine so i am glad they did ask for color |
| 15:47.36 | Kensan | zaery_: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_your_Neo1973#Inserting_the_SIM_card_.28optional.29 |
| 15:48.04 | zaery_ | thx kensan |
| 15:48.10 | dando | I get some strange ascii chars pressing the <- del Button on virtual keyboard typing in an terminal. Do you have the same problem? |
| 15:49.02 | *** join/#openmoko Ryushin (i=proxy@windwalker.openinnovations.com) |
| 15:51.50 | *** join/#openmoko buluca (n=luca@81-208-36-82.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 15:54.33 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@ip-217-18-177-19.static.reverse.dsi.net) |
| 15:56.32 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack (n=j_ack@p508D886A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 16:01.19 | bluefir | dando: Yep. The delete key seems to be implemented as <LEFT><SPACE><LEFT>, but the cursor movement characters are shown as boxes. The command is edited correctly, it just doesn't render properly. |
| 16:02.01 | *** topic/#openmoko by aloril -> wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | SH1 has at least partially shipped, you might have received tracking number ( http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html ) |
| 16:02.23 | aloril | maybe most of international part of SH1 has not yet shipped |
| 16:03.25 | dando | im missing a lot on the keyboard |
| 16:03.46 | dando | e.G: Ctrl C |
| 16:03.59 | dando | Ctrl Z D L ... |
| 16:04.06 | bluefir | There are two different keyboards... |
| 16:04.35 | dando | ok |
| 16:04.54 | bluefir | to switch to the full version, select the second option in the menu |
| 16:05.01 | ewanm89_laptop | click to the right of the keyboard rectangle to get the menu. |
| 16:05.53 | dando | cool |
| 16:06.04 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gabe@c-67-167-84-69.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 16:06.28 | zaery_ | grrr, the UI dialer won't work, how do i dial manually? |
| 16:06.31 | aloril | latest number with shipped status in [[P1_Owners]] page is #2409 -> 590 or 85% |
| 16:06.44 | dando | i like this keyboard |
| 16:06.45 | aloril | that doesn't include orange ones to be shipped later either |
| 16:07.20 | aloril | and I think they shipped only orders where YES_I_DO mail was received |
| 16:07.37 | ewanm89_laptop | dando: Yeah, it's more like your traditional qwerty keyboard. |
| 16:07.51 | dando | yep |
| 16:09.15 | aloril | latest number is 4504 so maybe 2300-2800 units sold |
| 16:09.38 | dando | the first keyboard is ok too. For managing contacts .... |
| 16:09.41 | aloril | taking longer than I thought for 3000 units, but getting closer ;-) |
| 16:10.21 | SpeedEvil | I really hope they kicked off a batch of 5000 on July 10-12 or so. |
| 16:10.56 | ferric | SpeedEvil: it's more likely that they're doing 1000 unit batches. |
| 16:11.04 | SpeedEvil | Indeed. |
| 16:11.22 | aloril | on the other hand they probably lost/are losing many orders because it requires 2 letter code |
| 16:11.24 | SpeedEvil | It's just that even if anohter 1000 has been ordered, it looks close to that limit. |
| 16:12.18 | *** join/#openmoko buz (n=buz@84-73-66-71.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 16:12.20 | aloril | probably should be mentioned at order page (or change script to translate into 2 letter codes) |
| 16:13.14 | *** join/#openmoko marsan (n=marsan@ti500720a080-2350.bb.online.no) |
| 16:13.44 | dando | but maybe we should report a bug, because of the bksp. |
| 16:13.50 | dando | del |
| 16:15.05 | bluefir | I've heard the issue mentioned before, but I'm not sure what the deal is. I haven't found it in bugzilla. |
| 16:15.40 | dando | me neither |
| 16:16.32 | dando | im still looking maybe it was reported and closed allready. |
| 16:17.38 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Wishlist:Distance_tracker]] [[Wifi_power_reduction]] [[WM8976]] [[Variometer]] [[Userspace_root_image]] [[SH1]] [[Unit_Converter]] [[Bootloader]] [[Messages]] [[Test_Openmoko_Emulation_with_chroot_image]] [[Camera]] and other changes |
| 16:17.48 | ferric | SpeedEvil: did you order a p1 phone as well? |
| 16:18.22 | anrp | it arrives! |
| 16:18.30 | ferric | anrp: congrats! |
| 16:18.54 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 16:20.46 | SpeedEvil | ferric: indirectly. |
| 16:20.52 | SpeedEvil | group order |
| 16:21.30 | anrp | hmm, the dpi is about the same as the sony ux series |
| 16:21.45 | anrp | higher than the n800 though D: |
| 16:22.58 | anrp | guess i'm going to have to dl the build system now... |
| 16:23.50 | anrp | ships with a broken root image? that's kind of sad.. |
| 16:25.19 | *** join/#openmoko TimRiker (n=timr@216.49.181.128) |
| 16:26.21 | zaery_ | How do i dial people through the terminal? |
| 16:27.36 | anrp | the wrong way is "printf ATDT<number>;\r" > /dev/ttySAC0 |
| 16:27.43 | zaery_ | lol |
| 16:27.46 | anrp | er, be sure to quote the arg |
| 16:28.29 | anrp | man, i got 3 mobile devices in 2 days ~_~ too much |
| 16:28.37 | dando | ttySAC0 isnt that GPS? |
| 16:28.39 | zaery_ | woah |
| 16:28.55 | anrp | mm maybe, i'm not sure |
| 16:28.57 | anrp | could be sac1 |
| 16:28.58 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 16:29.39 | dando | ;) |
| 16:30.52 | daMaestro | ok, lame |
| 16:31.21 | daMaestro | my second day air shipment is not going to get here until next week |
| 16:31.38 | daMaestro | it's going to take a full 6 days |
| 16:32.08 | don-o | i wish i knew about the next production run(s) |
| 16:32.36 | don-o | id feel better about ordering if i knew there was a phone to buy |
| 16:33.48 | Kero | *Aug 11 |
| 16:34.04 | daMaestro | http://wwwapps.ups.com/WebTracking/processInputRequest?Requester=UPSHome&loc=en_US&HTMLVersion=5.0&tracknum=1Z5VX0380251715251 this is bogus |
| 16:35.00 | *** join/#openmoko heikkit (n=chatzill@c-67-188-122-139.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 16:35.07 | Kero | mm, tracking number daMaestro ... |
| 16:35.21 | anrp | kero maybe you should get it shipped to somewhere in the us to save shipping? |
| 16:35.33 | Kero | anrp: already paid :) |
| 16:35.47 | anrp | o |
| 16:36.09 | zaery_ | anyone know the *right* way to dial a number |
| 16:36.12 | Kero | but not shipped, yet. if it takes UPS a week, FIC better hurry :) |
| 16:36.45 | Kero | zaery_: I had to use `chat` on my iPAQ (to talk over Irda with my GSM to dial in...) |
| 16:37.19 | zaery_ | im using a Neo1973 |
| 16:37.22 | Kero | specifically, there's some termios settings that the /dev/ttyxxx needed |
| 16:37.33 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03chris * r2539 10/trunk/src/target/OM-2008/libraries/libmokoui/ (ChangeLog libmokoui/moko-finger-scroll.c): |
| 16:37.33 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Synthesise more events so that buttons and other like widgets work. |
| 16:37.33 | CIA-24 | openmoko: Also fix a possible infinite loop. |
| 16:38.00 | Kero | yup, but if it's an AT command set, why wouldn;t the tty behave the same? |
| 16:38.25 | zaery_ | sry, im a noob, i have no clue |
| 16:38.43 | zaery_ | i dont even know how to use the AT commands |
| 16:39.03 | *** join/#openmoko Kensan (n=ken@gw.ptr-80-238-206-248.customer.ch.netstream.com) |
| 16:39.27 | prpplague | nbd: the main item missing in all the open source sdio stuff is the implementation of the cmd53 |
| 16:39.35 | prpplague | nbd: or atleast from what i can tell |
| 16:39.49 | prpplague | nbd: and there really aren't any good examples on the implementation |
| 16:40.13 | SpeedEvil | dOES THE short-form standard not cover it? |
| 16:40.39 | Kero | zaery_: but you have a Neo, no? :) |
| 16:40.45 | zaery_ | yes, i do |
| 16:41.10 | Kero | well, you give me your Neo and I'll explain how it works :P |
| 16:41.11 | nbd | prpplague: doesn't mmc_io_rw_extended do that? or what parts are missing there? |
| 16:41.32 | Kero | just teasing. I'm leaving shortly, or I could have tried to help you |
| 16:41.33 | hhf423 | ~p1 |
| 16:41.38 | zaery_ | lol |
| 16:41.49 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 16:41.50 | hhf423 | ~P1 |
| 16:41.57 | hhf423 | sigh |
| 16:42.02 | morricone | openmoko-rssreader says it doesn't find WebKit/Gtk, where can i download it? i'm using mokomakefile |
| 16:42.31 | dando | morricone : same problem |
| 16:42.38 | zaery_ | well, i have to go too, ill see everyone later |
| 16:42.40 | dando | @ all |
| 16:42.49 | *** join/#openmoko sagacis (n=mark@cpe-76-185-118-188.tx.res.rr.com) |
| 16:43.24 | prpplague | nbd: i've got too look at that section of code |
| 16:43.27 | Kero | Who wants (spam) "You've received a greeting card from a Worshipper!" when you really want to see "[rt 18xx Shipped]" *snif* |
| 16:43.34 | nbd | prpplague: it's what i used in my ar6k port |
| 16:44.40 | *** join/#openmoko Writchie (n=writchie@195.230.118.70.cfl.res.rr.com) |
| 16:49.16 | dando | BitBake files: (4361/4361) [100 %] |
| 16:49.42 | dando | Parsing finishes. 4179 caches 0 parsed 182 skipped 0 masked |
| 16:51.20 | dando | i dont know bitbake. |
| 16:52.43 | Kensan | dando, what error do you get? can you post the log to pastebin.ca? |
| 16:54.51 | dando | ok |
| 16:55.56 | *** join/#openmoko abraxa_ (n=abraxa@pD95FF7D5.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 16:57.37 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@desdemona.cns.ualberta.ca) |
| 16:58.07 | dando | http://www.pastebin.ca/636110 |
| 16:58.28 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 17:01.30 | dando | WebKitGdk is missing |
| 17:01.43 | dando | gtk |
| 17:01.51 | Kensan | dando: it's in bugzilla: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=648 |
| 17:02.22 | dando | Kensan: thanks for helping |
| 17:02.26 | *** join/#openmoko bluefir (n=dave@milligan.bluefir.org) |
| 17:03.00 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:03.48 | Kensan | dando: you need to use svn revision 2389. |
| 17:07.03 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 17:07.03 | *** topic/#openmoko is wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | SH1 has at least partially shipped, you might have received tracking number ( http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html ) |
| 17:07.07 | Kensan | zecke: is the bug fixed in head then? |
| 17:07.24 | *** join/#openmoko goxboxlive (n=goxboxli@141.80-202-161.nextgentel.com) |
| 17:08.16 | zecke | Kensan: afaik stefan_schmidt changed the to be used svn rev |
| 17:11.06 | Kensan | zecke: i see. Just read the bugzilla entry again ;) |
| 17:11.24 | *** join/#openmoko wvdschel (n=wvdschel@d51A467A6.access.telenet.be) |
| 17:11.35 | wvdschel | hi |
| 17:11.44 | happycube | HUH??? my openmoko charge is gone |
| 17:11.58 | wvdschel | I read online that the openmoko phone with wifi will cost $450? |
| 17:12.09 | ckuethe | that's what the wiki says. |
| 17:12.25 | wvdschel | as opposed to the $350 they talked about earlier on? |
| 17:12.58 | ckuethe | that's for phase1 |
| 17:12.59 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 17:13.11 | ckuethe | the rationale for this was already discussed on the mailing list |
| 17:13.30 | wvdschel | link? |
| 17:13.38 | *** join/#openmoko drear (n=drear@nblzone-208-36.nblnetworks.fi) |
| 17:13.44 | wvdschel | or never mind, was just checking |
| 17:13.49 | ckuethe | short version: make the dev kit cheap so lots of people can get in on the act early, then there are no issues wrt. upgrade discounts |
| 17:13.50 | wvdschel | $450 is still more then reasonable |
| 17:13.54 | *** join/#openmoko bigup (n=kvirc@4va54-4-82-244-102-183.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 17:14.00 | *** join/#openmoko d0tslash (i=dotslash@217-68-170-219.dynamic.primacom.net) |
| 17:14.08 | *** part/#openmoko wansti (n=wansti@b131.apm.etc.tu-bs.de) |
| 17:15.45 | *** part/#openmoko d0tslash (i=dotslash@217-68-170-219.dynamic.primacom.net) |
| 17:15.48 | *** join/#openmoko drear (n=drear@nblzone-208-36.nblnetworks.fi) |
| 17:18.32 | *** join/#openmoko apt (i=ibot@pdpc/supporter/active/TimRiker/bot/apt) |
| 17:18.32 | *** topic/#openmoko is wiki.openmoko.org | Store: www.openmoko.com | Received Neo1973? See [[SH1]] | SH1 has at least partially shipped, you might have received tracking number ( http://lists.openmoko.org/pipermail/community/2007-July/008010.html ) |
| 17:21.14 | *** join/#openmoko chouse (n=chadh@142.163.211.34) |
| 17:22.01 | *** join/#openmoko rd_ (n=rd@vnsecurity.net) |
| 17:27.40 | *** join/#openmoko inksmithy (n=alan@user-544735cb.wfd85a.dsl.pol.co.uk) |
| 17:27.48 | inksmithy | lo all |
| 17:27.58 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 17:28.22 | inksmithy | hmm, anyone awake? |
| 17:28.22 | aloril | inksmithy: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 17:28.46 | aloril | hehe |
| 17:29.04 | inksmithy | heh yeah it got me |
| 17:29.13 | happycube | ok i see what happened - the phone rep said that they put the money on hold for 3-4 days and it gets "credited" back if the money isn't claimed but that can be done later |
| 17:30.09 | aloril | inksmithy: unlikely to have answer to that question, but maybe there is answer to question you had in mind ;-) |
| 17:30.27 | inksmithy | There is actually, which you may be able to help with |
| 17:31.08 | inksmithy | I've done a fair bit of fiddling with the gp2x and I'm wondering whether there is anything stopping gp2x apps working on the openmoko? |
| 17:32.26 | inksmithy | reason I ask is because one of the guys who writes for the gp2x has managed to get stuff like abiword and so on working on it. I can't see any reason why a recompile of his source would get that working on the Neo |
| 17:33.18 | SpeedEvil | <PROTECTED> |
| 17:33.23 | SpeedEvil | X+GTK |
| 17:33.30 | SpeedEvil | +fluxbox as a WM. |
| 17:33.34 | koen | or X + fw |
| 17:33.39 | koen | SpeedEvil: fluxbox? |
| 17:33.42 | SpeedEvil | err |
| 17:33.52 | koen | s/fw/efl/ |
| 17:33.57 | dtx | How can you even use Abiwordon GP2X? |
| 17:34.00 | *** join/#openmoko zipola (n=zipola@cable-vrk-fe5cdd00-177.dhcp.inet.fi) |
| 17:34.05 | inksmithy | thats what I though, cos this guy actually has x running on the gp2x as well, with mouse support and so on |
| 17:34.11 | koen | SpeedEvil: opened-hand is doing the software, so I don't think it's fluxbox |
| 17:34.30 | inksmithy | on screen keyboard, or use a powered USB hum |
| 17:34.37 | inksmithy | *hub |
| 17:34.47 | dtx | I have a powered USB hub and GP2X |
| 17:34.50 | dtx | I should try it sometime |
| 17:34.51 | dtx | :-P |
| 17:34.55 | inksmithy | I've found a supplier of those things and I reckon they would be a natural for the Neo |
| 17:35.37 | inksmithy | battery powered USB hub I mean |
| 17:35.40 | dtx | But the powered hub doesn't know when its connected to the host I think unless you wire it up specially |
| 17:36.12 | *** join/#openmoko alep1 (n=aleph@190.49.124.58) |
| 17:36.29 | inksmithy | I'll have to pull mine out and figure out how they did it |
| 17:37.00 | inksmithy | but surely if the host is on and there is power flowing both ways the info would flow as well |
| 17:37.02 | inksmithy | ? |
| 17:37.36 | *** join/#openmoko mbuf (n=mbuf@gprs-ggsn5-nat.mobil.telenor.no) |
| 17:39.01 | mbuf | to create a new application, build it openmoko and to test it with qemu, should i follow these instructions: http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#Developing_with_MokoMakefile ? |
| 17:40.08 | *** join/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 17:41.42 | Kensan | SpeedEvil: It's Matchbox. |
| 17:42.06 | *** part/#openmoko ozarka (n=elineber@12.106.220.2) |
| 17:48.38 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@128.8.37.122) |
| 17:49.04 | *** join/#openmoko Aria (n=aredride@betelgeuse.theinternetco.net) |
| 17:50.11 | *** join/#openmoko onispawn (n=onispawn@207.224.214.190) |
| 17:50.29 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (i=casey@conference/oscon/x-d32f6c9a44f5da55) |
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| 17:52.06 | *** join/#openmoko Frostshoc (n=Sionic@c-1fb4e255.017-347-6c756c10.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se) |
| 17:53.46 | rushforth | hola :) i seem to experience neo shutting down in uboot if i dont keep pressing alt (like it says on the wiki, etc).. curious if alt still needs to pressed occasionally during the flashing process.. |
| 17:54.28 | rushforth | err ^alt^aux |
| 17:54.33 | mbuf | what is the fastest way to develop, build applications and test it with qemu? |
| 17:54.34 | Frostshoc | any kernel progress? |
| 17:54.37 | *** join/#openmoko Obri (i=daniel@sonne.alt-f4.ch) |
| 17:55.16 | mbuf | do these instructions still hold good? http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/MokoMakefile#Developing_with_MokoMakefile ? |
| 18:01.52 | *** join/#openmoko greentux (n=lemke@Z58a5.z.pppool.de) |
| 18:02.13 | abraxa_ | mbuf: I think so but why would you want to test them in qemu? |
| 18:03.06 | mbuf | abraxa_, because i don't have the phone in hand, yet |
| 18:03.42 | mbuf | abraxa_, i can simply write a standalone GTK+, compile it openmoko environment, but, its display and buttons don't match similar to the qemu environment |
| 18:03.57 | koen | use Xoo |
| 18:04.33 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Did you make use of the theme's gtkrc? |
| 18:04.38 | mbuf | koen, i see |
| 18:05.39 | mbuf | abraxa_, i just did ./autogen.sh, make and then ran the executable as it is; just been doing that; but, just wanted to know what the developers were doing for rapid application development for openmoko |
| 18:06.32 | *** join/#openmoko cw666 (n=anticw@c-24-5-75-45.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) |
| 18:06.55 | *** join/#openmoko ds3 (n=dpfleger@nat0.xsigo.com) |
| 18:07.15 | ds3 | folks -- anyone know how to enable the sound on the moko? |
| 18:07.30 | abraxa_ | mbuf: I personally do the same (running on local X), just I also made a special user who I run the apps under - it has the OpenMoko theme's gtkrc referenced and thus gives me the same look'n'feel as on the device itself |
| 18:07.53 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 18:07.55 | ds3 | got a P1 phone yesterday, all flashed up |
| 18:07.58 | ds3 | no sound working |
| 18:08.16 | abraxa_ | ds3: I think you need to load an ALSA profile first |
| 18:08.29 | mbuf | abraxa_, yes, it runs faster that way; how do you reference the OpenMoko theme gtkrc? |
| 18:09.02 | happycube | http://lists.ximian.com/pipermail/mono-devel-list/2007-July/024072.html |
| 18:10.02 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Create a file named .gtkrc-2.0 in the user's home directory and put this line in there: include "/home/someuser/somepath/openmoko/target/OM-2007/artwork/themes/openmoko-standard/gtk-2.0/gtkrc" |
| 18:10.09 | *** join/#openmoko webar7 (n=webart@198.62.158.205) |
| 18:10.42 | mbuf | abraxa_, just looked at that in the Xoo documentation, thanks |
| 18:10.51 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Good :) |
| 18:10.59 | abraxa_ | At least it's on the wiki then as well |
| 18:12.24 | *** join/#openmoko nop (n=nop@p54A08F1F.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:12.33 | prpplague | nbd: sorry for the delay, too many meetings today |
| 18:12.50 | prpplague | nbd: let me have a quick look at the mmc_io_rw_extended code |
| 18:12.53 | mbuf | prpplague, long time :) |
| 18:13.00 | prpplague | mbuf: hey |
| 18:13.22 | prpplague | mbuf: where you at these days? |
| 18:13.26 | ds3 | abraxa: thx I'll give it a shot |
| 18:13.34 | mbuf | prpplague, traveling a bit in EU |
| 18:14.06 | prpplague | mbuf: lovely |
| 18:14.12 | prpplague | mbuf: still doing dev work then? |
| 18:14.16 | mbuf | prpplague, moved here, probably be here for long; i knew you would be involved in this project somehow |
| 18:14.35 | mbuf | prpplague, yes, of course |
| 18:14.44 | prpplague | mbuf: actually no, i'm working on another project, but similiar hardware |
| 18:15.15 | mbuf | prpplague, they are all the same hardware; good to see you around |
| 18:17.09 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[User_talk:Speedevil]] [[P1_Owners]] [[UI_Improvements]] [[User:Fthiery]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Paris]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups]] |
| 18:17.53 | mbuf | abraxa_, works! thanks! this way i can use the processing speed on x86 to quickly develop applications, rather than having to run it on any simulator |
| 18:18.36 | noidd | STR=`AT+CNUM' |
| 18:18.36 | noidd | RSTR=`+CME ERROR: 10' |
| 18:18.39 | noidd | not good I guess |
| 18:19.04 | abraxa_ | mbuf: Glad to help :) |
| 18:20.18 | mbuf | noidd, which operator? where? |
| 18:21.17 | noidd | Cingular |
| 18:21.23 | noidd | SIM is 3 years old |
| 18:22.06 | *** part/#openmoko ds3 (n=dpfleger@nat0.xsigo.com) |
| 18:22.36 | noidd | but looks like it is 3G |
| 18:22.41 | noidd | from a Treo 650 |
| 18:23.33 | mbuf | ok |
| 18:24.20 | mbuf | noidd, can you create a page in the wiki with a table of AT commands, operator and location, so we can get an idea |
| 18:24.36 | *** join/#openmoko zell1983 (n=zell1983@host90-122-dynamic.14-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 18:24.39 | mbuf | noidd, information will be flowing in fast in the next few days, so it is important to track them |
| 18:26.01 | noidd | Just verify I didn't do anything stupid |
| 18:26.07 | noidd | I did the following: |
| 18:26.17 | noidd | gsmd -p /dev/ttySAC0 -s 115200 -F # Wasn't running already |
| 18:26.24 | noidd | libgsmd-tool -m atcmd |
| 18:26.28 | noidd | then |
| 18:26.29 | noidd | AT+CNUM |
| 18:27.44 | *** join/#openmoko j_ack_ (n=j_ack@p508DBE3B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 18:29.59 | *** join/#openmoko harzi_ (n=dani@84-73-140-176.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 18:34.40 | webar7 | are there any videos of Sean speaking? |
| 18:36.18 | happycube | i think so |
| 18:36.24 | happycube | there was one at fossdem on google video |
| 18:36.27 | webar7 | youtube seems only to have ads ... good ones but :-) |
| 18:36.36 | webar7 | ok cool |
| 18:41.00 | webar7 | found it |
| 18:42.08 | *** join/#openmoko behdad (i=behdad@nat/redhat-ca/x-745aab3c56fe7fd6) |
| 18:43.28 | webar7 | behdad from toronto :-) |
| 18:45.09 | webar7 | behdad, heard of http://panl10n.net/ :-) |
| 18:46.11 | prpplague | nbd: yea the io_rw_extended command(cmd53) is what you'd need to do the multiple block transfers |
| 18:46.31 | behdad | webar7: heard before. never checked it though |
| 18:46.46 | prpplague | nbd: normally after sending the cmd53 with data, you should get an irq back from sdio card |
| 18:47.00 | behdad | looks nice, but I can't get what it really is :) |
| 18:47.00 | nbd | prpplague: what hardware did you experiment with? |
| 18:47.12 | webar7 | supported by cdn gov't |
| 18:47.18 | webar7 | that's why :) |
| 18:47.23 | prpplague | nbd: but from what i can tell, the sdi controller on the s3c2410 isn't detecting the irq |
| 18:47.36 | webar7 | it's a research network on localization and font tech |
| 18:47.55 | prpplague | nbd: basically the same device as this http://www.elinux.org/M5900 |
| 18:48.16 | webar7 | the leader of the project Sarmad Hussein |
| 18:48.20 | webar7 | is wicked smart |
| 18:48.29 | prpplague | nbd: along with a marvell 88w8385 sdio module |
| 18:48.31 | webar7 | Hussain |
| 18:48.44 | webar7 | anyway given your expertise :) |
| 18:48.46 | prpplague | nbd: i have a atheros module from cardaccess but i've not started testing with it yet |
| 18:48.46 | nbd | prpplague: interesting |
| 18:49.03 | nbd | how far did you get? what works and what doesn't? |
| 18:49.26 | webar7 | ... maybe they could localize the neo interface |
| 18:49.36 | prpplague | nbd: for my sdio wifi card everything is working except the detection of the sdio interrupt from the card to the host |
| 18:49.52 | prpplague | nbd: right now i'm just using a timmer to kick of a polling of the line |
| 18:50.45 | nbd | ah, interesting |
| 18:51.16 | nbd | i'll throw my current (rather hackish) patches and the ar6k tree into the openmoko svn |
| 18:51.30 | nbd | maybe you can give it a try and see if the controller locks up just like on my board |
| 18:51.34 | prpplague | nbd: ok great |
| 18:51.46 | prpplague | nbd: let me know when its available |
| 18:51.48 | aloril | (script) openmoko-devel: "Michael 'Mickey' Lauer" <mickey at openmoko.org> Re: OM-2008 |
| 18:52.03 | nbd | prpplague: will do |
| 18:55.24 | CIA-24 | openmoko: 03nbd * r2540 10/developers/nbd/ (111 files in 11 dirs): add my WiP ar6k tree and kernel patches |
| 18:55.27 | prpplague | nbd: do you have the schematics for the qt2410 ? |
| 18:55.38 | nbd | prpplague: haven't checked yet |
| 18:55.50 | *** join/#openmoko quinton (n=quinton@84-45-151-51.no-dns-yet.enta.net) |
| 18:56.24 | prpplague | nbd: i'm curious if the qt2410 has 10k pullups on the sdio lines per the sdio spec |
| 18:56.44 | prpplague | nbd: i've seen several different designs for the s3c2410, some with , some without |
| 18:57.02 | nbd | prpplague: i'll look for the schematics |
| 19:04.38 | *** join/#openmoko evanpro (n=evan@pdpc/supporter/silver/evanpro) |
| 19:04.39 | prpplague | nbd: got another meeting, bbiaf |
| 19:05.37 | *** join/#openmoko sunkist (n=Administ@adsl-69-109-105-136.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 19:06.09 | sunkist | any news on the 3g at&t card problem? |
| 19:08.45 | ynezz | yes |
| 19:09.32 | nbd | prpplague: according to the schematics, there are pullups on all the lines |
| 19:16.31 | Writchie | Just got my two neo's - eat your hearts out :) |
| 19:16.39 | Fatal | :/ |
| 19:18.04 | ColdFyre | hey, heres one..does the open moko kernel/neo support gsm multiplexing? |
| 19:18.19 | ferric | what is gsm multiplexing? |
| 19:18.45 | ColdFyre | being in a phone call and able to Tx/Rx data over like...edge |
| 19:18.51 | ferric | ah |
| 19:20.00 | ColdFyre | i hate irc dropping because i am in a call for 2 min with my current phone :) |
| 19:21.08 | dando | my cross compiler will be ready in no time ! |
| 19:21.11 | *** join/#openmoko zecke (n=ich@dsl-62-220-14-162.berlikomm.net) |
| 19:21.15 | dando | lets say 5 -6 hours |
| 19:21.16 | *** join/#openmoko dneary (n=dneary@mne69-9-88-163-116-163.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 19:21.18 | dando | ;) |
| 19:21.18 | zecke | roh: ping |
| 19:21.36 | ColdFyre | just found it .. OpenMoko will also include a kernel patch that adds GSM multiplexing capabilities to the 2.6 kernel. |
| 19:21.39 | dando | pong |
| 19:22.32 | *** join/#openmoko charkins (i=casey@conference/oscon/x-a437de794491b02d) |
| 19:24.31 | ferric | ColdFyre: sweet. |
| 19:25.30 | *** join/#openmoko rob__w (n=bob@Mab3a.m.pppool.de) |
| 19:25.42 | *** join/#openmoko Rac0r_ (n=Rac0r@p5081FECB.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 19:26.18 | *** join/#openmoko Mandarino (n=Mandarin@86.pool85-50-112.dynamic.orange.es) |
| 19:26.36 | *** join/#openmoko gdiebel (i=gdiebel@conference/oscon/x-4ece91030c06441c) |
| 19:33.24 | SpeedEvil | ColdFyre: is it just that most modems support it, but the software to do so is rather complex? |
| 19:33.43 | *** join/#openmoko Eludias (n=eludias@wingding.demon.nl) |
| 19:33.52 | SpeedEvil | So isn't implemented in many phones. |
| 19:35.09 | buz | why would you buy two neos??? |
| 19:35.29 | SuN | Because you can't afford a dozen? |
| 19:35.30 | buz | endurance testing? ;) |
| 19:35.53 | buz | to me phones are much like laptops, more than one is useless |
| 19:35.59 | ynezz | nope |
| 19:36.11 | *** join/#openmoko ScaredyCat (n=andy@AC8E25BB.ipt.aol.com) |
| 19:36.34 | sunkist | anyone know where i can buy a 2g sim card in the US? |
| 19:36.58 | dando | A stupid question! What exactly is a toolchain and what komponents belong to it? |
| 19:37.02 | daMaestro | tmobile and att prepay plans, sunkist |
| 19:37.11 | webar7 | so before I couldn't buy a phone for work if it had wifi |
| 19:37.22 | webar7 | now I want to buy a Neo and people complain |
| 19:37.26 | webar7 | it doesn't have wifi |
| 19:37.28 | webar7 | jeez |
| 19:38.02 | ynezz | buz: imagine that you've just one piece and you find some strange problem, you can check on seconds one if it behave the same or so |
| 19:38.33 | ynezz | of course, you can ask other owners, but I prefer to check it myself |
| 19:39.05 | SuN | For development purposes, it makes sense. But for daily use... I don't think so. |
| 19:39.06 | ynezz | and you can have for dev purposes and one for daily use |
| 19:39.23 | SuN | 2 solely for daily use, I mean. |
| 19:39.41 | ynezz | sure, i'm talking about dev purposes also |
| 19:39.59 | buz | oh yeah, i guess 1 running dev stuff and 1 for general use makes sense |
| 19:40.13 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - Current theory: integration (correlation) happens in digital space. ;o) |
| 19:40.16 | dando | i guess there is no better phone for dev purposes |
| 19:40.41 | SuN | Depends on the kind of development you do, I guess :D |
| 19:41.49 | dando | development for a mobile device |
| 19:43.01 | SuN | Well, it doesn't make much sense for J2ME developing, for instance. |
| 19:43.20 | dando | thats right |
| 19:44.04 | dando | or is it ? I dont know if J2ME is running |
| 19:44.14 | SuN | Not yet, I think. |
| 19:44.47 | dando | i guess it will be |
| 19:44.52 | SuN | And even if it did, the Neo isn't a very representative device if you want to push your J2ME apps into mainstream. |
| 19:44.57 | dando | depends on sun |
| 19:45.35 | buz | touchscreen, vga screen really isnt very representative |
| 19:45.46 | buz | something like a nokia n70 or so would be better suited |
| 19:45.48 | buz | or even lower end |
| 19:46.00 | dando | :) |
| 19:46.03 | *** join/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.124) |
| 19:47.58 | *** part/#openmoko yveslu (n=yves@194.235.200.124) |
| 19:49.50 | prpplague | nbd: ok thanks |
| 19:50.02 | prpplague | nbd: thats consistant with the smdk design |
| 19:50.22 | prpplague | nbd: but from what i gather, those are mainly needed when using removable sd/sdio cards |
| 19:50.48 | prpplague | nbd: with a hardwired device, i.e. wifi module, the internal pullups on the SoC are enough |
| 19:50.55 | dando | But isn't J2ME compiled for arm architecture? |
| 19:51.07 | dando | it should run |
| 19:51.13 | prpplague | nbd: looking over your patches now |
| 19:51.55 | ferric | one day, all mobile devices will be as open as the neo :-) |
| 19:52.20 | dando | i hope so |
| 19:53.46 | *** join/#openmoko bug_ (n=bug@86.59.65.236) |
| 19:55.47 | dando | they could do the same thing with gpu's, so we dont need nvidia or ati any more. |
| 19:56.38 | *** join/#openmoko rm (n=rm@osbk-4db581e3.pool.einsundeins.de) |
| 19:57.22 | dando | a plain opengl gpu |
| 19:57.39 | rm | Hello, in qemu-emulator, when calibration starts, I cannot click on the crosshairs, and therefore do not get further. Why? |
| 19:58.22 | dando | I dont like blob drivers |
| 19:58.42 | rm | This are the command line parameters: arm-softmmu/qemu-system-arm -M neo -m 130 -mtdblock openmoko/openmoko-flash.image -kernel openmoko/openmoko-kernel.bin -usb -show-cursor |
| 19:58.55 | prpplague | nbd: ping |
| 19:58.56 | dando | did you start with -show-cursor? |
| 19:58.59 | nbd | prpplague: pong |
| 19:59.04 | rm | dando: yes |
| 19:59.08 | *** join/#openmoko Odin- (n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is) |
| 19:59.23 | rm | Do I need to recompile? |
| 19:59.29 | prpplague | nbd: i'm looking at the patches now |
| 19:59.32 | nbd | ok |
| 19:59.38 | prpplague | nbd: http://svn.openmoko.org/developers/nbd/patches-2.6.22/800-sdio_merge.patch |
| 19:59.49 | prpplague | nbd: the section for the mmc_io_rw_write |
| 19:59.49 | dando | maybe it is just a little slow! |
| 19:59.58 | nbd | iirc this is pierre's stack without further modification |
| 20:00.01 | dando | try -m 512 instead 130 |
| 20:00.12 | rm | dando: ok |
| 20:00.13 | prpplague | nbd: ahh ok |
| 20:00.21 | prpplague | nbd: there is something that looks odd to me |
| 20:00.25 | nbd | prpplague: i change a few things in a later patch |
| 20:00.42 | dando | but run ./openmoko/flash.sh first |
| 20:00.48 | *** join/#openmoko dcorking (n=dcorking@82.152.172.75) |
| 20:01.20 | prpplague | nbd: ok, i'll continue to look then |
| 20:01.27 | nbd | LarstiQ: wat |
| 20:01.29 | nbd | oops |
| 20:01.35 | nbd | prpplague: what looks odd? |
| 20:02.55 | rm | dando: Yes, thanks. But I think I download the latest version and recompile. I copied it from an older installation of my OS. Perhaps there are newer libraries or something dependand missing. But it goes till the crosshairs. |
| 20:02.55 | prpplague | nbd: +data.blksz = size; |
| 20:02.55 | prpplague | +data.blocks = 1; |
| 20:03.29 | prpplague | nbd: thats only valid in stream mode, not in block mode |
| 20:03.32 | dando | ok |
| 20:03.38 | nbd | prpplague: hm |
| 20:03.57 | nbd | prpplague: but in my case it probably wasn't the reason. since the read ops that the driver did were 1 byte |
| 20:04.27 | prpplague | nbd: agreed, i was just point out that its something that is incorrect |
| 20:04.33 | nbd | ok |
| 20:05.00 | prpplague | nbd: the read you are doing is only 1 byte? |
| 20:05.04 | nbd | ye |
| 20:05.05 | nbd | yes |
| 20:06.02 | prpplague | nbd: its hanging on the mmc_io_rw_extended command? |
| 20:06.25 | *** join/#openmoko infernix (i=nix@unaffiliated/infernix) |
| 20:06.53 | prpplague | nbd: so your block size is 1 and the block count is 1? |
| 20:07.13 | *** join/#openmoko _rob (n=rob@77.47.0.11.static.cablesurf.de) |
| 20:07.28 | prpplague | nbd: sorry, just trying to get a clear picture of the layout of the issue |
| 20:07.43 | *** join/#openmoko ufo76 (n=macmac@host81-153-249-245.range81-153.btcentralplus.com) |
| 20:08.06 | nbd | prpplague: yeah |
| 20:08.36 | dando | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R70V1Yz-dZ4 |
| 20:08.56 | *** join/#openmoko Q_Continuum (n=Q@rrcs-67-52-219-78.west.biz.rr.com) |
| 20:09.21 | *** join/#openmoko fabiand (n=fabiand@p54890FC3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:09.36 | prpplague | nbd: ok, so i have to ask, why are you using io_rw_extended for 1 block, when io_rw_direct would be better suited? |
| 20:12.55 | *** join/#openmoko hozer (n=hozer@excalibur.hozed.org) |
| 20:15.14 | *** part/#openmoko Sublime (n=Sublime@ip70-162-246-65.ph.ph.cox.net) |
| 20:16.40 | *** join/#openmoko jpozlovsky (n=jindra@rb5cc115.net.upc.cz) |
| 20:17.29 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[Main_Page/jp]] [[Clock]] [[Main_Page]] [[Calendar]] [[Bug_Report]] [[Booting_from_SD]] [[Bluetooth_Support]] [[Anti-Theft_Mode]] [[Buying_Interest_List]] [[Template:Languages]] [[OpenMoko_Local_groups:_Boston]] [[Wishlist:Tracking_lost_phone]] and other changes |
| 20:19.28 | hozer | the last known credit card changed ticket number was 2464, and his is 2971 |
| 20:20.01 | daMaestro | hozer, it's ok... i've been billed, the phone shipped... but someone fucked up |
| 20:20.06 | daMaestro | http://wwwapps.ups.com/WebTracking/processInputRequest?Requester=UPSHome&loc=en_US&HTMLVersion=5.0&tracknum=1Z5VX0380251715251 |
| 20:21.15 | sannes | hm |
| 20:21.41 | sannes | I have ticket number 1848, got a payment received mail, but then nothing |
| 20:21.53 | *** join/#openmoko Pupeno2 (n=Pupeno@cl-241.dub-01.ie.sixxs.net) |
| 20:22.08 | daMaestro | yeah, i'm 1964 |
| 20:25.14 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gburt@c-67-167-84-69.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:26.10 | hozer | that sucks a LOT |
| 20:27.04 | daMaestro | it makes no sense. I selected air, 2nd day (ups even says that.) .... how hard is it to get to Colorado from CA |
| 20:27.32 | ynezz | my neo is already in germany |
| 20:27.46 | ynezz | and we have choosen 'saver' |
| 20:27.57 | ynezz | (group order) |
| 20:28.01 | Vegar | anyone got their neos yet? |
| 20:28.11 | ynezz | yes |
| 20:28.17 | Vegar | cool |
| 20:29.08 | marsan | i wonder if we get to see any stress tests on youtube with the neo |
| 20:29.31 | ynezz | what do you mean by stress tests? |
| 20:30.47 | marsan | like they did with the iphone..droping it on the floor, scrach the display up to look if it holdes togheter |
| 20:32.57 | happycube | mine's waiting at home |
| 20:33.10 | ynezz | ah, don't know if anybody want to drop a neo for which he/she had to wait a month or so... |
| 20:34.27 | SpeedEvil | There need to be tests on some P0 hardware on that. |
| 20:34.33 | SpeedEvil | drop-tests. |
| 20:34.41 | SpeedEvil | Systematic ones. |
| 20:34.47 | don-o | all we need to know is.... will it blend? |
| 20:35.08 | phrozen77 | probably |
| 20:35.08 | phrozen77 | :P |
| 20:35.20 | ynezz | these are usualy done by producer, not by end-users :p |
| 20:35.21 | marsan | Isnt blender mobile edition pretty old now? |
| 20:35.23 | mmp | don-o: You heretic! :) |
| 20:35.26 | happycube | lol |
| 20:35.39 | happycube | someone could send them a gta01[b]v<=3 |
| 20:36.16 | mmp | but still, the question is... |
| 20:36.17 | SpeedEvil | Iphone trade-in program. |
| 20:36.24 | SpeedEvil | Send in a blended iphone, get a neo. |
| 20:36.24 | mmp | "What is mahna-mahna"... |
| 20:36.33 | mmp | err, "will it blend?" |
| 20:36.34 | mmp | :) |
| 20:37.19 | happycube | mmp - the first sketch of the first season of the muppet show? |
| 20:37.26 | SpeedEvil | miguelanxo: do you have a UPS? |
| 20:37.28 | SpeedEvil | oops |
| 20:37.50 | *** join/#openmoko webjames (n=james@82-46-37-48.cable.ubr01.nail.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 20:37.53 | mmp | happycube: yes:) (but I guess it was in last few seconds) |
| 20:37.53 | *** join/#openmoko switch3r (n=switch3r@dsktop.student.umd.edu) |
| 20:40.05 | happycube | :) |
| 20:42.42 | prpplague | nbd: are you sure you were getting the blocksize set to 1 ? |
| 20:43.47 | *** join/#openmoko galexande (n=greg@shed.goonies.be) |
| 20:43.48 | mokobot | Come in #1841 your time is up |
| 20:43.54 | galexande | *sigh* |
| 20:45.32 | *** join/#openmoko gabaug (n=gburt@c-67-167-84-69.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 20:47.07 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrae1 (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 20:47.12 | *** join/#openmoko Tyrae1 (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 20:48.41 | *** join/#openmoko pipomolo42 (n=alex@ALille-152-1-101-212.w90-34.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 20:49.55 | nbd | prpplague: yes |
| 20:50.08 | nbd | prpplague: i added a printk to the function in question to verify that |
| 20:52.51 | prpplague | nbd: that seems very odd |
| 20:53.21 | prpplague | nbd: normally i'd expect a 1 block 1 byte read/write to be execute by a cmd52(io_rw_direct) |
| 20:55.29 | nbd | prpplague: the driver does all of its transfers using io_rw_extended |
| 20:57.18 | *** join/#openmoko njpatel (n=njp@5ac6146b.bb.sky.com) |
| 20:57.37 | prpplague | nbd: that definetly sounds odd to me |
| 20:58.15 | *** join/#openmoko njpatel (n=njp@5ac6146b.bb.sky.com) |
| 20:59.14 | *** join/#openmoko bmk789 (n=bmk789@74-132-81-162.dhcp.insightbb.com) |
| 21:00.40 | bmk789 | would openmoko be capable of running on an ipaq? |
| 21:01.22 | zecke | bmk789: what do you think? |
| 21:01.27 | galexande | bmk, sure why not, but you'll have to deal with drivers on your own |
| 21:02.50 | bmk789 | isnt it being made to run on many different devices eventually? |
| 21:03.06 | Aria | The software is really quite portable. |
| 21:04.08 | bmk789 | i figured since its ARM architecture i could flash the image on the ipaq then deal with hardware support and such |
| 21:04.28 | cjb | there's more than one ARM architecture. |
| 21:04.50 | zecke | bmk789: *yawn* http://dominion.kabel.utwente.nl/koen/cms/openmoko-running-on-an-ipaq |
| 21:05.04 | Aria | arm3, arm4, arm4t, ... arm9; add big and little endian versions of each |
| 21:05.59 | bmk789 | thanks |
| 21:07.41 | prpplague | nbd: i'll have to patch up my build and give it a test, but something doesn't look correct there |
| 21:07.54 | nbd | prpplague: ok |
| 21:08.33 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - I think, I have the "integration time". I have no idea on its unit yet. I start to think, I'll do some measuremtn on that. ;-) |
| 21:09.29 | *** part/#openmoko gamin (n=m@car06-3-82-240-156-91.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 21:12.13 | quinton | is the microSD card simply for more memory, or is there a deeper meaning? |
| 21:12.53 | *** join/#openmoko webjames_ (n=james@82-46-37-48.cable.ubr01.nail.blueyonder.co.uk) |
| 21:13.11 | quinton | i can see that it's possible to boot from it, but other than that, is there anything special about it? |
| 21:13.29 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: :) |
| 21:13.36 | ferric | deeper meaning! haha |
| 21:13.49 | SpeedEvil | quinton: more storage. |
| 21:14.40 | quinton | SpeedEvil, thanks, for some reason i was surprised that i could boot fine without it |
| 21:14.58 | SpeedEvil | quinton: Ideally the final software will not require the SD. |
| 21:15.05 | SpeedEvil | Otherwise the user changing it gets hard. |
| 21:15.08 | *** join/#openmoko rwhitby (n=nnnrwhit@nslu2-linux/rwhitby) |
| 21:16.30 | noidd | any UNIX admin people in the bay area want a job? :-) |
| 21:17.25 | anrp | lol |
| 21:17.44 | *** join/#openmoko bug_ (n=bug@86.59.65.236) |
| 21:19.12 | abraxa_ | Elrond: You'll come tomorrow, right? ;D |
| 21:22.39 | *** join/#openmoko calamous1_ (n=shannon@c-76-24-204-125.hsd1.ma.comcast.net) |
| 21:23.01 | calamous1_ | Anyone heard any news on the AT&T 3G sim cards |
| 21:25.01 | ynezz | yes, more people ask the same question |
| 21:26.07 | *** join/#openmoko sixfeet (i=sixfeet@p5484F13F.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:26.35 | Elrond | abraxa_ - Yes, I'm highly planning to. I hope mickey and you come too? |
| 21:27.08 | abraxa_ | Elrond: Mickey is and I am, too, yes |
| 21:27.21 | *** part/#openmoko dantalizing (n=dantaliz@n128-227-82-248.xlate.ufl.edu) |
| 21:27.44 | abraxa_ | Elrond: If you don't come I'll be forced to nag at you for several days on IRC to make you repent your sin |
| 21:29.18 | Elrond | abraxa_ - Heh, where's the problem, if I wouldn't come? |
| 21:29.39 | *** join/#openmoko jeefers (n=jeefers1@oh-76-5-108-5.dhcp.embarqhsd.net) |
| 21:29.43 | abraxa_ | Elrond: I want to meet you cause I'm curious ;) |
| 21:30.50 | Elrond | abraxa_ - hehe. I'm trying to be pretty normal. ;o) |
| 21:31.00 | rushforth | calamous1_: http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=666 looks like there is a bug report now.. |
| 21:31.52 | *** join/#openmoko baze (n=baze@xdsl-213-196-192-237.netcologne.de) |
| 21:31.54 | calamous1_ | rushforth: yeah, someone beat me to the post but the 2 comments there are mine |
| 21:32.12 | calamous1_ | I think this bug is very important and it should be looked at |
| 21:33.14 | rushforth | indeed, although I figure I will pick up a cheap t-mo prepaid card for 15 bucks.. seems like it would be handy to have dual phones atm anyways.. |
| 21:34.54 | noidd | calamous1_: I show the same symptoms here with a Cingular 3G sim card which is a 64k data card but 3G |
| 21:35.14 | *** join/#openmoko daMaestro (n=jon@fedora/damaestro) |
| 21:35.30 | calamous1_ | noidd: so you are working with the old "smart chip" but not the "3g fireball" |
| 21:35.34 | calamous1_ | ? |
| 21:35.34 | aloril | calamous1_: See http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/FAQ (and also SH1_FAQ, Neo1973, Developer_preview and Neo1973_Hardware#GTA01Bv4 pages) (Hopefully this link answers your question. This autotrigger for new nick and question during first 15 minutes done only once.) |
| 21:36.00 | noidd | calamous1_: the SIM is about 3 years old and oackaged with Treo 650 |
| 21:36.09 | calamous1_ | but the old one works right? |
| 21:36.12 | noidd | there is no fireball on it |
| 21:36.15 | calamous1_ | and the new one dosent work? |
| 21:36.28 | noidd | I can't get this one to work either. error 10 |
| 21:36.37 | noidd | STR=`AT+CNUM' |
| 21:36.44 | noidd | RSTR=`+CME ERROR: 10' |
| 21:36.52 | calamous1_ | noidd: if you are getting error 10 each time maybe your sim reader is messed up |
| 21:36.52 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-48-128.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 21:37.00 | rushforth | ive gotten both CME ERROR 13, and 10 |
| 21:37.03 | calamous1_ | Are you sure your card is firmly inserted? |
| 21:37.09 | noidd | its locked down |
| 21:37.18 | noidd | I can try again (once the phone is re-charged) |
| 21:37.26 | calamous1_ | rushforth: did you get the error 13 and 10 on the same card or different ones? |
| 21:37.59 | *** part/#openmoko herbyle (n=pascal@p57A540BC.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:38.18 | rushforth | calamous1_: same card. it seem that every other time I boot the neo, gsmd comes up ok, and that I have signal. However, anytime i do AT+CFUN, or AT+CIMI, or AT+CREG, I get error 13 |
| 21:38.32 | rushforth | calamous1_: then every other time I boot it up, gsmd fails, and i get error 10 |
| 21:38.40 | noidd | booting |
| 21:38.52 | rushforth | seems totally random. |
| 21:39.04 | calamous1_ | Hmm. I wonder if there is some AT cmd to make the modem use the right card |
| 21:39.09 | calamous1_ | the card the right way* |
| 21:39.13 | rushforth | and, fwiw, CME ERROR 13 means 'sim failure' I suppose |
| 21:39.17 | calamous1_ | Prehaps it needs to be initalized correctly |
| 21:39.39 | daMaestro | calamous1_, are you still using the same SIM and the same neo? |
| 21:39.42 | noidd | calamous1_: did you perfrom any other commands before the AT+CNUM? |
| 21:40.03 | calamous1_ | Noidd: I turn on echo first |
| 21:40.16 | calamous1_ | So I can see whatI'm trying |
| 21:41.32 | calamous1_ | If this board cant use the AT&T card I would say that there is a serious flaw that FIC overlooked |
| 21:41.54 | noidd | so I don't need to activate the antennea or anythinglike that |
| 21:42.39 | rushforth | noidd and calamous1_, do you either have the reception bars in the upper right? |
| 21:42.54 | noidd | I did a few days ago |
| 21:42.59 | noidd | not today |
| 21:43.08 | noidd | maybe loose connection |
| 21:43.09 | noidd | reseating |
| 21:43.14 | rushforth | when I get the reception bars is when I get error 13, when I dont get reception bars (gsmd fails), i get error 10 |
| 21:43.54 | calamous1_ | rushforth: sometimes. It seems to be intermentant |
| 21:44.10 | *** join/#openmoko koen (n=koen@dominion.kabel.utwente.nl) |
| 21:44.16 | calamous1_ | I wish herald or sean were here lol |
| 21:44.41 | noidd | +CME ERROR: 10 |
| 21:45.21 | noidd | I have faith that i'm doing something stupid ;-) |
| 21:45.35 | don-o | calamous1_: is there something special about the AT&T SIM card? |
| 21:45.36 | calamous1_ | noidd: me too :) I just want to know what |
| 21:46.05 | noidd | I wonder if there are docs on the wiki for these AT commands and how to activate the antenna, register network etc |
| 21:46.10 | calamous1_ | don-o: I don't think so (although I would not put any "underhanded" moves past at&t) but they want their procuct to be campat in lots of phones |
| 21:46.18 | calamous1_ | Yes there are |
| 21:46.26 | calamous1_ | +CREG is register |
| 21:46.31 | noidd | this is a singular sim |
| 21:46.37 | calamous1_ | you will get CME err 32 back prob |
| 21:46.42 | noidd | nope |
| 21:46.46 | noidd | I get an OK |
| 21:46.53 | don-o | calamous1_: also i would think the SIM slot would be part of the GSM module and up to that manufacturer to do compatibility testing |
| 21:47.06 | calamous1_ | noidd: really? do ATD7732812244 and call me |
| 21:47.23 | noidd | NO CARRIER |
| 21:47.28 | calamous1_ | don-o: you are right the cylapso comunicates with it |
| 21:47.40 | calamous1_ | noidd are you using the cu utililty? |
| 21:47.49 | calamous1_ | Turn on extended error reporting if you are |
| 21:47.54 | noidd | libgsmd-tool -m atcmd |
| 21:47.56 | Elrond | abraxa_ - It is 15:00 tomorrow, right? |
| 21:48.29 | calamous1_ | noidd: AT+CMEE=2 is verbose error |
| 21:48.53 | noidd | +CME ERROR: SIM not inserted |
| 21:49.30 | Stephmw | dando: afaik it does run. but without integration into the UI layer, it's gonna look butt ugly |
| 21:49.41 | noidd | yet CREG works |
| 21:49.42 | *** join/#openmoko BeRo (i=bero@p5089FEB8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:49.46 | Stephmw | dando: there's also the problem with various JSRs for J2ME |
| 21:50.06 | Stephmw | dando: only the core stuff is open source (as Sun owns it), the rest typically are owned by other companies |
| 21:50.14 | calamous1_ | ohh you need to do the right creg |
| 21:50.28 | calamous1_ | AT+CREG=1 |
| 21:50.38 | XorA | SIM + handset compatability isnt as high as people seem to think |
| 21:50.41 | Stephmw | dando: there are already efforts underway to supply all the necessary JSRs though, look into MIDPath for instance |
| 21:50.52 | *** join/#openmoko Risto (n=Christop@p508CF5A0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 21:51.03 | *** join/#openmoko rick1 (n=ricky@ppp-70-244-80-189.dsl.rcsntx.swbell.net) |
| 21:51.50 | noidd | STR=`AT+CREG=1' |
| 21:51.50 | noidd | RSTR=`OK' |
| 21:52.11 | dando | Stephmw: ok |
| 21:52.13 | calamous1_ | do AT+COPS=0 |
| 21:52.18 | noidd | err |
| 21:52.21 | dando | Stephmw good to know |
| 21:52.22 | noidd | I think its dialing you |
| 21:53.13 | Stephmw | dando: I really should update the wiki on this |
| 21:53.16 | calamous1_ | noidd: really? |
| 21:53.24 | dando | ;) |
| 21:53.33 | dando | do it ! |
| 21:53.41 | noidd | I don't get a RSTR |
| 21:53.54 | calamous1_ | But atleast it didnt say no carrier |
| 21:53.55 | noidd | and no AT commands are working anymore |
| 21:53.56 | rushforth | noidd: you may need to peek at /tmp/gsm.log |
| 21:54.05 | rushforth | it might say no carrier there :) (unfortunately) |
| 21:54.09 | Stephmw | dando: I'm a little knackered after 3hrs of bouldering ;) |
| 21:54.11 | SpeedEvil | Elrond: about half a page, firming up my thoughts on integrators by writing a 'faq'. http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Hammerhead/Integrators |
| 21:54.17 | Stephmw | dando: fingers are seriously aching |
| 21:54.21 | dando | lol |
| 21:54.41 | alphaone | noidd: Please do realize that gsmd is noch |
| 21:54.59 | alphaone | gsmd still has issues communicating with the modem |
| 21:55.30 | zecke | I'm getting insane :} |
| 21:55.33 | noidd | wierd |
| 21:55.40 | alphaone | !OMbug 574 |
| 21:55.41 | cdbot2 | * * Bug 574, Status: NEW, Created: Unknown |
| 21:55.42 | cdbot2 | * * mickey(AT)vanille-media.de: timing issues / buffer parsing issues in gsmd |
| 21:55.43 | cdbot2 | * * http://bugzilla.openmoko.org/cgi-bin/bugzilla/show_bug.cgi?id=574 |
| 21:56.09 | alphaone | zecke: What's wrong? |
| 21:56.13 | noidd | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:56.32 | *** join/#openmoko nnpiggy (n=nnpiggy@qiqinebs.chi.il.us) |
| 21:56.33 | zecke | alphaone: Gdk :) |
| 21:56.47 | alphaone | zecke: Ah, say no more :-) |
| 21:56.47 | noidd | alphaone: that's good to know - thanks. |
| 21:57.09 | zecke | I have to implement a working scroll view that can be hooked into GtkScrolledWindow... |
| 21:58.06 | Elrond | SpeedEvil - great. I'll read it soon. :-)) |
| 22:00.28 | *** join/#openmoko ckuethe (n=ckuethe@S0106000024c38a18.ed.shawcable.net) |
| 22:01.11 | *** join/#openmoko pudelfish (n=thomas@DSL01.83.171.149.154.ip-pool.NEFkom.net) |
| 22:01.12 | calamous1_ | noidd: I hope they get this sim working |
| 22:01.22 | calamous1_ | because I have no clue where to go from her |
| 22:01.24 | calamous1_ | e |
| 22:02.33 | noidd | you can buy pay as you go sims at Walmart |
| 22:02.40 | *** part/#openmoko pudelfish (n=thomas@DSL01.83.171.149.154.ip-pool.NEFkom.net) |
| 22:02.41 | noidd | I'll go by the store and test that this eve |
| 22:03.53 | XorA | UK t-mobile sims work :-) |
| 22:05.18 | *** join/#openmoko duplex (n=duplex@p57A87774.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:06.41 | don-o | i thought a SIM was a SIM was a SIM |
| 22:07.26 | nbd | this is not 'the sims' ;) |
| 22:07.30 | XorA | don-o: unfortunately GSM suffers from design by commitee |
| 22:08.07 | noidd | I just got 2 unsolicted messages from the GSM line |
| 22:08.10 | noidd | +CREG: 2 |
| 22:08.10 | noidd | +CREG: 3 |
| 22:08.18 | *** join/#openmoko Vndmtrx (n=Ox0ff@unaffiliated/vndmtrx) |
| 22:08.24 | calamous1_ | Will lets post our updates on the 3G sim cards to either the mailing list as "3G sim cards" or to bugzilla #666 |
| 22:09.05 | calamous1_ | creg 2 responce menans you are roaming I think |
| 22:09.15 | *** join/#openmoko ewanm89 (n=ewanm89@host81-159-20-1.range81-159.btcentralplus.com) |
| 22:09.15 | mokobot | Hello Master |
| 22:09.25 | *** part/#openmoko BeRo (i=bero@p5089FEB8.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 22:10.52 | rushforth | noidd: what does AT+CREG? spit out? |
| 22:11.37 | noidd | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:11.51 | rushforth | intersting, mine is 0,3 |
| 22:13.09 | rushforth | I wonder if the fireball sim cars need AT+CPIN..? I don't believe my sim has a pin on it, but maybe its an att thing. |
| 22:13.16 | rushforth | ^cars^cards |
| 22:14.31 | noidd | you think the phone firmware might do the unlock? |
| 22:14.52 | mokobot | sorry, I will not be available for a few hours due to maintanence |
| 22:15.26 | mokobot | Bye |
| 22:15.35 | *** join/#openmoko Hadaka (i=naked@naked.iki.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
| 22:15.43 | ewanm89_laptop | gtg, bye |
| 22:19.28 | aloril | (script) wiki RecentChanges: [[P1_Owners]] [[Hammerhead/Integrators]] [[SH1]] [[Hammerhead/Protocol]] [[OpenMoko_Local_Groups:_Netherlands]] [[User:Arndot]] [[SH1_FAQ]] [[OpenMoko2008]] |
| 22:23.25 | noidd | the wierd thing about this is that I am certain that at some point I actually got connectivity |
| 22:25.48 | Elrond | hmpf... Bv03 again drained its battery... sometimes it survives days... sometimes not a single day. :-( |
| 22:29.43 | happycube | got my phone! |
| 22:29.56 | noidd | http://item.express.ebay.com/Cell-Phones-Wireless-Products_SIM-Cards__New-32K-2G-GSM-Cell-Phone-SIM-Card-For-Cingular-ATT_W0QQitemZ110153547612QQihZ001QQddnZCellQ20PhonesQ20Q26Q20WirelessQ20ProductsQQadnZSIMQ20CardsQQptdiZ125QQddiZ964QQcmdZExpressItem |
| 22:30.02 | noidd | 2G sim on ebay |
| 22:30.51 | noidd | hehe "Some cingular users find 32k sim has better reception than 64K sim card" |
| 22:30.55 | noidd | ignore the link :-P |
| 22:31.43 | *** join/#openmoko wvdschel (n=wvdschel@d51A467A6.access.telenet.be) |
| 22:33.08 | *** join/#openmoko lysanderslair (n=jeff@CPE0014bf4ad3e5-CM000a7363f3b6.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 22:33.17 | *** join/#openmoko quinton (n=quinton@84-45-151-51.no-dns-yet.enta.net) |
| 22:34.58 | Stephmw | noidd: that's a weird assertion... do they have anything to back it up? |
| 22:35.03 | Stephmw | noidd: sim generation maybe? |
| 22:35.44 | noidd | I dunno |
| 22:35.44 | *** join/#openmoko nox-Hand (i=johnhand@unaffiliated/nox-hand) |
| 22:36.01 | noidd | there are a ton of sim cards on ebay, they're all 3G that I can tell so far (oh, and satphones) |
| 22:36.04 | *** join/#openmoko ossman (n=drzeus@85.8.24.16.se.wasadata.net) |
| 22:37.41 | SpeedEvil | noidd: You're US? |
| 22:37.53 | SpeedEvil | noidd: there are insane numbers cheap on ebay UK. |
| 22:38.11 | SpeedEvil | Last week I saw a pack of 100 sims for 5 pounds. |
| 22:39.33 | noidd | I'm a Brit in the US |
| 22:39.46 | noidd | and yes, there are insane numbersof sims but they |
| 22:39.59 | noidd | re all the same type as my current one which appears to be giving me problems |
| 22:40.08 | SpeedEvil | Hmm. |
| 22:40.20 | Stephmw | are the sims dodgy, or just unconnected to a network? |
| 22:40.33 | SpeedEvil | Stephmw : unconnected |
| 22:40.39 | noidd | STR=`AT+CNUM' |
| 22:40.39 | noidd | RSTR=`+CME ERROR: SIM not inserted' |
| 22:40.50 | SpeedEvil | you need to top up before talk. |
| 22:41.41 | hads | Over here SIMs get disconnected after 12 months of no use. |
| 22:42.13 | *** part/#openmoko Tyrae1 (n=tyrael@213-140-6-114.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 22:45.13 | *** part/#openmoko jgm (n=jgm@host-87-74-179-156.bulldogdsl.com) |
| 22:49.22 | *** join/#openmoko danilos (n=danilo@163.pool85-48-166.static.orange.es) |
| 22:49.36 | noidd | ok, i need to head out |
| 22:49.39 | noidd | see y'all later |
| 22:54.33 | *** join/#openmoko Leftmost (n=leftmost@host-69-144-3-42.msl-mt.client.bresnan.net) |
| 22:59.00 | Leftmost | I'm attempting to build the qemu-neo1973 stuff but it's erroring out once it starts trying to build the arm target. I'm using gcc3 and I've cleared CFLAGS, but it keeps giving the same error. Anyone possibly know why? |
| 22:59.59 | daMaestro | Leftmost, what distro? |
| 23:00.02 | Leftmost | Gentoo. |
| 23:00.08 | daMaestro | Leftmost, sorry; can't help |
| 23:00.16 | *** join/#openmoko Jason1 (n=ws1@c-24-15-3-175.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 23:00.52 | daMaestro | i had some similar issues build i386 on x86_64 |
| 23:03.51 | *** join/#openmoko alep1 (n=aleph@190.49.105.74) |
| 23:03.56 | *** part/#openmoko chreekat (n=b@81.235.125.209.transedge.com) |
| 23:04.02 | Leftmost | I'm on an x86 system and everything is configured to use gcc 3.4.6, but it dies anyhow. |
| 23:04.16 | *** join/#openmoko greentux_ (n=lemke@Z58a5.z.pppool.de) |
| 23:07.08 | *** join/#openmoko sunkist (n=Administ@adsl-69-109-105-136.dsl.pltn13.pacbell.net) |
| 23:07.33 | sunkist | my openmoko's been sitting idle since yesterday :( |
| 23:07.49 | *** part/#openmoko Risto (n=Christop@p508CF5A0.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:08.26 | *** join/#openmoko nop_ (n=nop@p54A0BA08.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:08.37 | Elrond | sunkist - What do you mean? |
| 23:09.25 | sunkist | i can't make calls, I can only find 3g sim cards |
| 23:10.02 | sunkist | i need to pull the workspace, start building/porting apps... |
| 23:10.10 | ChooseOpen | sunkist: DOnt worry you are not missing a whole lot. Even withhte SIM, the devicebarely makes calls :) |
| 23:11.40 | don-o | ChooseOpen: ha :) |
| 23:11.47 | ChooseOpen | hehe |
| 23:11.52 | sunkist | ChooseOpen: :) |
| 23:13.53 | *** join/#openmoko dando- (n=dando_@L2db6.l.pppool.de) |
| 23:14.42 | sunkist | ChooseOpen: has anyone looked into porting the OpenEmbedded apps? |
| 23:14.59 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 23:15.18 | ChooseOpen | sunkist: No idea... |
| 23:15.45 | sunkist | something like this would be nice: http://www.killefiz.de/zaurus/ |
| 23:16.08 | *** join/#openmoko phrozen77 (n=phrozen7@unaffiliated/phrozen77) |
| 23:16.57 | ChooseOpen | Yup. Hopefully with a little time, we will have that sort of variety as well. :) |
| 23:18.58 | *** join/#openmoko arw_ (i=familia@201.244.107.247) |
| 23:23.33 | sunkist | /status |
| 23:23.59 | sunkist | what is the state of the current build |
| 23:24.12 | sunkist | is it actively being worked on? |
| 23:25.29 | *** join/#openmoko NeoStrider (n=daniel@cm-tvcidade-nri-C8B1D66A.dynamic.brdterra.com.br) |
| 23:26.36 | *** join/#openmoko BlackBsd (n=brian@72.168.193.117) |
| 23:28.11 | *** join/#openmoko khaije1 (n=khaije1@unaffiliated/khaije1) |
| 23:29.26 | *** join/#openmoko bluelightning (n=blueligh@219-89-45-224.dialup.xtra.co.nz) |
| 23:30.48 | dando- | yes, why not? |
| 23:32.47 | *** join/#openmoko fabiand (n=fabiand@p54890FC3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 23:33.55 | khaije1 | i've been wondering about voice recognition, is this expected in gta02 or any subsequent phone? |
| 23:34.11 | khaije1 | afaik, there isn't much foss that handles this... am i wrong? |
| 23:34.43 | *** join/#openmoko daniel_bergamini (n=danieber@70-41-162-178.cust.wildblue.net) |
| 23:34.48 | dando- | http://lists.openmoko.org/mailman/listinfo/ |
| 23:35.03 | dando- | you get a lot of information aout of mailing lists |
| 23:35.28 | Dunedan | khaije1: Do you want special hardware for voice recognition? Or why do you ask for gta02? |
| 23:35.30 | dando- | i guess there will be no voice recognition on gta02 |
| 23:36.13 | SpeedEvil | Why not? |
| 23:36.30 | hads | If someone writes it there will be. |
| 23:36.37 | dando- | :) |
| 23:36.42 | dando- | thats how it works |
| 23:37.01 | dando- | at least i dont think there will be one at september |
| 23:37.38 | sunkist | anyone know how i can test the sound? |
| 23:37.58 | khaije1 | Dunedan: gta02 is the immediately forthcoming consumer version. but there are also other phones in the design process. it's a great feature but i'm not sure if it's even possible for this class of phone w/o speech recognition software in the free domain |
| 23:38.34 | *** join/#openmoko BasiC (n=ish@p4FC4D72B.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 23:38.46 | BasiC | damn .. they made the neo more expensive? why? |
| 23:38.56 | khaije1 | i've never heard of foss speech recognition, so i'm not even sure what the hw req's would be, or how difficult it would be to 'bolt on' |
| 23:38.58 | dando- | they did? |
| 23:39.01 | daxxar | What? |
| 23:39.06 | Dunedan | khaije1: right. It's software. So there is no need fot gta02. Voice recognition will be also possible with gta01. |
| 23:39.09 | BasiC | 450 dollars |
| 23:39.29 | BasiC | for base -_- |
| 23:39.39 | khaije1 | Dunedan: but does the software exist? and is there a plan for it...? |
| 23:39.43 | daxxar | What's your source, BasiC? |
| 23:40.05 | hads | Um, no they didn't. |
| 23:40.06 | Dunedan | khaije1: I don't know. But this software has nothing to do with gta02 (because that's hardware ;-)) |
| 23:40.11 | arcanericky | Is there a channel for openmoko app development or is this it? |
| 23:40.22 | SpeedEvil | This is pretty much it. |
| 23:40.25 | BasiC | the iphone wiki page |
| 23:40.30 | SpeedEvil | There may be a future channel. |
| 23:40.47 | dando- | :) |
| 23:41.09 | daxxar | The .. iPhone wiki page? o.0 |
| 23:41.14 | dando- | -.- |
| 23:41.15 | hads | Probably would be a good idea. This channel is too busy with off topic chat to be that useful for actual development. |
| 23:41.20 | daxxar | That's your source for FIC Neo1973 information? |
| 23:41.22 | BasiC | .._- noah i mean the iphone compare page |
| 23:41.25 | BasiC | http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/IPhone |
| 23:41.52 | daxxar | Ah, GTA02 |
| 23:41.55 | daxxar | Yes, I think that'll be $450 |
| 23:42.00 | arcanericky | Thanks - I'm asking because the docs on the the wiki don't go into detail on starting your own application. Just a simple hello world, then falls short on using bitbake |
| 23:42.00 | hads | Yeah. |
| 23:42.11 | daxxar | It has better hardware, and appeals to non-developers too. |
| 23:42.15 | dando- | i guess this will be the price for gta02 |
| 23:42.25 | daxxar | (So they're not getting as much free labour as they do with the gta01 ;) |
| 23:42.38 | BasiC | damn it |
| 23:42.41 | BasiC | i think i will even pay it xD |
| 23:42.45 | arcanericky | I know there's a channel for internal developers - will need one for the rest of the world at some point. |
| 23:42.49 | BasiC | buy* |
| 23:42.58 | dando- | gta02 has 400 MHz CPU and Wifi |
| 23:43.10 | daxxar | I don't think I'll buy GTA02 at launch |
| 23:43.20 | daxxar | But I might once accelerometer & wifi-software begins to flourish. |
| 23:43.22 | BasiC | daxxar: u think its going to be cheaper? or why? |
| 23:43.36 | *** join/#openmoko buluca (n=luca@81-208-36-82.ip.fastwebnet.it) |
| 23:43.51 | dando- | I will get it as soon they selll it |
| 23:43.53 | daxxar | Depending on what comes. I don't use WiFi on my current phone very much, so heh. |
| 23:43.55 | BasiC | its just the cooleste mobilephone ever |
| 23:44.09 | BasiC | i never had wifi on my phone |
| 23:44.47 | BasiC | .. and playin videos will be offered with 400 mhz and smedia bullshit , uh? am i right? |
| 23:45.00 | SpeedEvil | Sort-of. |
| 23:45.05 | BasiC | yeah freakin cool |
| 23:45.18 | SpeedEvil | Playing specially encoded videos on this version will work just fine. |
| 23:45.26 | BasiC | wohoo |
| 23:45.28 | dando- | with GPS there could be cool applikation to config wifi for the corresponding hotspot |
| 23:45.37 | BasiC | yeah xD |
| 23:45.41 | dando- | home or work or mc-donalds ... |
| 23:45.55 | arcanericky | Cool! Latest openmoko revision finally finished compiling. Time to load it up and check it out. The version I loaded was back from 7/4. |
| 23:46.22 | BasiC | damn this mobilephone is just great :D |
| 23:46.57 | SpeedEvil | Night everyone! |
| 23:47.09 | dando- | night |
| 23:47.32 | BasiC | good nite |
| 23:47.36 | dando- | its 2 am |
| 23:47.36 | BasiC | good nite again |
| 23:47.42 | dando- | lol |
| 23:47.50 | dando- | good morning |
| 23:48.08 | BasiC | its 2 am in europe.. u dont know where are they from right? |
| 23:48.19 | dando- | yes |
| 23:48.21 | Elrond | Thanks BasiC |
| 23:48.23 | BasiC | u c :D |
| 23:48.48 | dando- | but he doesnt too |
| 23:48.49 | *** join/#openmoko mindCrime (n=chatzill@cpe-065-190-188-124.nc.res.rr.com) |
| 23:49.09 | BasiC | yeah scotland is cool :P |
| 23:49.12 | dando- | germany / mainz |
| 23:49.27 | dando- | scotland rulz |
| 23:49.58 | SpeedEvil | You may take our liberty, but you will never take our deep-fried-pizza! |
| 23:50.14 | BasiC | is this a real thing.. gta02 WILL DEFINITALY come out in october 07? |
| 23:50.20 | dando- | :) |
| 23:50.29 | BasiC | or will it be just like in phase 1 xD |
| 23:50.42 | daxxar | I guess that's hard to say. |
| 23:50.45 | daxxar | Things can happen. |
| 23:51.12 | BasiC | are u just a user or dev? daxxar ? |
| 23:51.18 | dando- | i hope they will release it for december 07 |
| 23:51.24 | arcanericky | Anyone here tried today's openmoko build yet? |
| 23:51.42 | BasiC | yeah me too, i think i will make somebody give me one @ christmas |
| 23:52.02 | BasiC | arcanericky: .. the guys who felt asleep did :D |
| 23:52.43 | BasiC | yeah openmoko wifi will be great.. i got wlan @ sql |
| 23:52.55 | arcanericky | Sigh. Either I worked too long a day, or the U.S. is behind the curve. Just now getting around to updating. |
| 23:54.31 | BasiC | holy shit |
| 23:54.34 | BasiC | 8 gb sd cards |
| 23:54.34 | dando- | there is this rumor, that linux isn't that popular as it is in europe. |
| 23:54.49 | dando- | 8 GB |
| 23:54.49 | BasiC | i cant believe that .. 8 million mbytes on this little thing .. man :D |
| 23:55.02 | dando- | 8 GiB or 8 GB |
| 23:55.06 | BasiC | gb |
| 23:55.10 | *** join/#openmoko Odin- (n=sbkhh@s121-302.gardur.hi.is) |
| 23:55.14 | BasiC | http://www.comtech.de/product_info.php?ref=19&pID=194655&seo=SD-Card-8GB-HC |
| 23:55.54 | BasiC | hope gta02 will support this :D |
| 23:56.19 | dando- | :) |
| 23:57.23 | BasiC | that will be great |
| 23:57.39 | BasiC | D |
| 23:57.49 | dando- | this is the perfect phone for developer |
| 23:57.50 | XXLT | yeah, my first hdd had a size of 20 mb :/ |
| 23:58.04 | dando- | 20 MB cool |
| 23:58.19 | arcanericky | You're young. My first HDD was 5 meg. My first floppy was 88K |
| 23:58.27 | BasiC | my first was 1 gb |
| 23:58.31 | dando- | my 30 MB with 80x386 CPU |
| 23:58.41 | BasiC | holy :/ |
| 23:58.44 | BasiC | u oldschools |
| 23:58.54 | arcanericky | Yep. And that 88K floppy drive was $549. |
| 23:58.54 | Leftmost | I'm really looking forward to the regular release. It will be great to actually be able to write applications for my phone.:P |
| 23:59.01 | dando- | lol |
| 23:59.09 | XXLT | arcanericky: no, i already could afford a 20 mb hdd :) |
| 23:59.11 | BasiC | yeah u r right leftmost |
| 23:59.19 | BasiC | i think i will have to take a look on gtk |
| 23:59.29 | arcanericky | You can already write applications for it. If I can just figure out how to get mine to link with those darn ARM x11 libraries! So close! |
| 23:59.31 | XXLT | do that |
| 23:59.41 | dando- | First floppy 720KB HD |
| 23:59.44 | Leftmost | arcanericky, but the applications won't do me any good.:P |
| 23:59.48 | dando- | DD |
| 23:59.57 | XXLT | is it possible to run a screen session on a neo phone? |
