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| 07:51.11 | mckoan | good morning |
| 07:58.21 | florian | hi mckoan |
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| 08:53.41 | juhe | Hi, I have a question about a *.bbappend files. I have a problem with including a file into bbappend using include "features.inc". Bitbake says that features.inc is not a bitbake file although it contains just plain assignment to FEATURE variable. Is it possible to include files from bbappend files? Any help would be greatly appreciated. |
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| 09:13.03 | bluelightning | morning all |
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| 09:15.42 | *** topic/#oe is OpenEmbedded Developer Lounge | Web: http://openembedded.org | Repositories: http://git.openembedded.org/ | Primary Repo Mirrors: https://github.com/openembedded | This is not a distro or machine support channel |
| 09:32.58 | silviof | morning all |
| 09:43.28 | mckoan | hi florian, bluelightning, silviof, all |
| 09:44.18 | bluelightning | hi mckoan, silviof |
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| 10:18.20 | ant_work | bluelightning: JaMa: so what's the plan for PR / PRINC in meta-openembedded layers? |
| 10:21.12 | JaMa | I haven't seen any plan |
| 10:26.38 | bluelightning | I think the only choice is a flag day for the changeover |
| 10:28.25 | JaMa | btw: that's right ML for meta-qt3 changes? |
| 10:28.43 | JaMa | 2 are in oe-devel ML but I don't know who maintains meta-qt3 |
| 10:29.09 | JaMa | bluelightning: ah layerindex says it's you :) |
| 10:29.25 | bluelightning | JaMa: er... yes :) |
| 10:29.34 | ant_work | heh |
| 10:29.43 | bluelightning | I think the correct ML is the yocto one |
| 10:29.52 | bluelightning | but I can pick them up from there |
| 10:30.25 | bluelightning | that layer doesn't see too many patches as you might guess |
| 10:30.32 | ant_work | maybe on the next Yocto release we bump PE and get rid of PR stuff |
| 10:30.54 | JaMa | I was just thinking if I should create new bundle for them or reply to submitter that it's wrong ML |
| 10:30.58 | bluelightning | I don't think bumping PE really helps though if you have bbappends |
| 10:31.21 | ant_work | ok, then at layer level ? |
| 10:31.21 | JaMa | right, bumping PE isn't better then bumping PR |
| 10:31.56 | ant_work | afais the issue is only for feeds |
| 10:39.18 | bluelightning | JaMa: I think I'll just merge it now and reply for future reference |
| 10:39.23 | bluelightning | JaMa: thanks for the reminder |
| 10:39.54 | bluelightning | and tut tut, the README doesn't say where to send patches |
| 10:40.05 | bluelightning | I'll fix that as well |
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| 11:16.23 | pb_ | hi all |
| 11:17.53 | bluelightning | hi pb_ |
| 11:33.47 | Crofton|work | it looks like our cat is letting a local cat in the house to eat her food |
| 11:34.21 | broonie | That's nice and friendly. |
| 11:34.48 | Crofton|work | yes |
| 11:34.56 | Crofton|work | I have a cam on the cat door |
| 11:35.11 | Crofton|work | and have video of them coming and going around the same time |
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| 12:14.37 | Crofton|work | ant_work, is it easy for foreigners to by SIM's in Italy? |
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| 12:15.05 | ant_work | well, I've asked someone, seems straightforward |
| 12:15.17 | ant_work | still your ID will be registered |
| 12:15.38 | ant_work | you can go in any shop and buy a 'rechargeable' |
| 12:15.38 | Crofton|work | as in they copy my passport? |
| 12:15.49 | Crofton|work | no special id needed |
| 12:15.52 | ant_work | seems so |
| 12:15.54 | Crofton|work | ok |
| 12:16.03 | Crofton|work | I had seen references to needing a tax number |
| 12:16.10 | Crofton|work | spain wanted a passport |
| 12:16.13 | ant_work | I've asked the shop on the corner, dealing with tourists |
| 12:16.27 | Crofton|work | Belgium mailed to the hotel from internet form :) |
| 12:16.29 | Crofton|work | thanks |
| 12:16.50 | ant_work | the gray men have to know who you're |
| 12:16.57 | Crofton|work | heh |
| 12:17.16 | ant_work | maybe you'll get some tablet for free those days... |
| 12:17.17 | Crofton|work | they can match my IMSI to other records :) |
| 12:20.00 | XorA | Crofton|work: use a GTA02 with IMSI 000000000000 :-D |
| 12:20.31 | Crofton|work | rofl |
| 12:20.36 | Crofton|work | that would be awesome to have |
| 12:20.45 | XorA | there were about 400 of them I beleive |
| 12:20.49 | XorA | I had 2 |
| 12:21.07 | XorA | of course the IMSI on GTA02 in in flash so you can just change it |
| 12:22.00 | broonie | keeps on meaning to look at getting his running. |
| 12:24.11 | stefan_schmidt_w | wonders if he can comment on that with techincal details. Don't havce my NDA around to look it up. ;) |
| 12:24.25 | ant_work | Crofton|work: http://www.vodafone.it/engl/living/italy_pack.html |
| 12:24.55 | XorA | stefan_schmidt_w: I lost the doc so I cant remember the AT commands |
| 12:26.13 | Crofton|work | hmm, they talk about a fiscal code card |
| 12:26.15 | bluelightning | still has his GTA02 but the thing was so buggy it wasn't much use as a phone |
| 12:26.17 | Crofton|work | weird |
| 12:28.08 | stefan_schmidt_w | bluelightning: Don't tell me. I used it 6 months as my main phone. I know the pain. :) |
| 12:28.27 | stefan_schmidt_w | XorA: I still should have all the docs somewhere. Don't know where so. :) |
| 12:28.43 | XorA | I gave my GTA01/GTA02 devices to the local hacklab |
| 12:28.48 | XorA | and my GTA03 |
| 12:29.14 | bluelightning | I have a GTA04 as well, haven't used it much but it does seem functional and impressive as an effort from a small team |
| 12:29.26 | stefan_schmidt_w | I kept the gta02 for dfu-util testing |
| 12:31.51 | XorA | its the only dfu device I ever saw :-D |
| 12:32.33 | broonie | Everything else seems to have adopted the fastboot protocol instead. |
| 12:34.38 | stefan_schmidt_w | Not really. Only if you think about the android world of devices. |
| 12:34.49 | stefan_schmidt_w | Still tons of smaller devices that use dfu |
| 12:35.14 | stefan_schmidt_w | The bluetooth usb chip in your Thinkpad might use it. |
| 12:35.50 | stefan_schmidt_w | PHones or tablet or other "big" devices don't use it. |
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| 12:36.21 | stefan_schmidt_w | But smaller things do. Just seen it mentioned on some Sony site about a wrist watch, etc |
| 12:36.53 | stefan_schmidt_w | And if we talk about number one have to see that Samsung is not using fastboot either. |
| 12:37.05 | stefan_schmidt_w | At leats not when I look around in the office here. |
| 12:37.42 | stefan_schmidt_w | But I think thats not OE related at all :) |
| 12:37.42 | broonie | I've never actually seen any of these other devices using DFU. |
| 12:37.58 | broonie | The Samsung stuff is their own custom protocol that predates Android. |
| 12:38.25 | stefan_schmidt_w | And they also have one that comes after android and is not fastboot |
| 12:38.43 | broonie | Oh, they changed? Nice :) |
| 12:38.56 | stefan_schmidt_w | I don't think they changed |
| 12:39.16 | stefan_schmidt_w | Can't comment on devices that are here compared to the one available in the market |
| 12:40.09 | stefan_schmidt_w | Anyway, there are DFU devices. Just not stuff you guys work with it seems. Quite some microcontroller projects are using it. |
| 12:40.28 | stefan_schmidt_w | Its better on smaller firmware images and chips with less power anyway |
| 12:41.11 | stefan_schmidt_w | Flashing the gta02 was quite a pain already with 60 MB or so. Nowadays it would be even more painful. Spec was never written for such big amounts of data. |
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| 12:52.45 | ant_work | XorA: that iphone$ still have DFU |
| 12:53.52 | XorA | ant_work: cant stand apple kit |
| 12:54.45 | stefan_schmidt_w | ant_work: not by the spec though. Would be to easy. :) |
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| 13:51.02 | RP | I only have bits of GTA01 somewhere, not sure that was ever very functional :/ |
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| 16:23.09 | jkroon_ | Hi. I'm trying to build a cross gcc for arm, that runs on Win32, using the sysroot created by OpenEmbedded. Problem is when I try to compile an application using the resulting gcc, ld.exe complains that it "cannot represent machine arm:beaglebone". Anyone who knows whats wrong ? |
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| 16:24.04 | jkridner | jkroon_: sounds ambitious. |
| 16:24.31 | jkridner | does Windows have something like strace/ |
| 16:24.32 | jkridner | ? |
| 16:24.38 | jkroon_ | jkridner, why ambitious .. ? |
| 16:24.56 | jkroon_ | jkridner, dunno.. I'm testing it using wine |
| 16:25.11 | jkridner | compiling anything for Windows is always difficult for me.... |
| 16:25.30 | jkridner | especially a compiler. |
| 16:26.14 | jkroon_ | yeah |
| 16:26.40 | jkroon_ | still, I just think I'm missing some linker-scripts or something, then it should work |
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| 17:40.28 | khem | pb_: the gihub sync for meta-openembedded repo is not happening |
| 17:41.18 | khem | pb_: well the push is happenin but it seems the repo its syncing from is not uptodate |
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| 17:52.41 | khem | pb_: never mind it seems to be ok |
| 17:54.51 | jkroon_ | for some reason, all my linker-scripts contain "OUTPUT_ARCH(arm:beaglebone)", and my gcc doesnt understand that |
| 17:56.44 | mr_science | jkroon_: maybe you're just lucky today? |
| 17:57.06 | jkroon_ | lucky ? :-p |
| 17:57.56 | mr_science | i got nothin' better than sarcasm right now... |
| 17:58.07 | mr_science | all my new stuff is at home |
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| 18:18.56 | jkroon_ | oh. I think binutils uses "$MACHINE" from the environment. And I was setting it for OpenEmbedded |
| 18:27.56 | jkroon_ | yes. that was pretty sneaky :-p |
| 18:37.36 | jkroon_ | Using bitbake, and given the image bb recipe, is there a command I can give to populate the sysroot with files from all packages that is pulled in by the image ? |
| 18:37.56 | fray | bitbake -c populate_sdk <image> |
| 18:39.29 | jkroon_ | doesnt that also create the SDK "package" ? |
| 18:39.56 | fray | yes |
| 18:40.06 | fray | end result is a full SDK.. |
| 18:40.15 | fray | based on the image vs a "meta-toolchain" recipe |
| 18:41.52 | jkroon_ | fray, yeah I guess I kind of want this, thanks |
| 18:43.10 | fray | explains to people at least once a week the difference between populate_sdka nd meta-toolchain... SDKs.. |
| 18:43.19 | fray | "generic image based" vs "highly targeted" |
| 18:47.38 | jkroon_ | fray, are there any major differences between the target system sysroot in tmp-eglibc/sysroots and the one shipped in the SDK ? |
| 18:47.47 | fray | yes |
| 18:48.14 | fray | the sysroot in the buildsystem is specific to the instances of the build system.. it will likely contain a lot of things that could build software that is incapable of running on the target.. |
| 18:48.39 | fray | many libraires and headers are produced that are never used in the software put into the image recipe.. |
| 18:48.55 | fray | so if you directly build against the build system sysroot, you can allow your SDK users to generate software that is broken.. |
| 18:49.20 | fray | the SDK on the otherhand constructs the SDK based only on the software that is available to the end user to develop against, to hopefully ensure that apps will run on the target image. |
| 18:49.40 | fray | for the image recipe, it does this by simply adding in -dev packages to each of the things insalled.. (simplified, but thats basically what it does) |
| 18:49.59 | fray | for the meta-toolchain (targeted SDK).. its up to the author of the recipe to state precisely what the app developer is allowed to use.. |
| 18:50.14 | fray | both are useful, it all depends on how much you want to hide from the application developer.. |
| 18:50.15 | jkroon_ | i would guess that would be the same dev packages as the ones in the build sysroot, no.. ? |
| 18:50.30 | fray | build sysroot has more then what was instaled onto the image.. |
| 18:50.53 | fray | i.e. if you build bash, you need ncurses.. ncurses has a number of libraries available to it.. but only one of them is needed to run bash. |
| 18:51.01 | fray | so you build 5 libraries, your image only contains 1.. |
| 18:51.13 | jkroon_ | fray, aha |
| 18:51.19 | jkroon_ | fray, makes sense |
| 18:51.22 | fray | if you build against the sysroot, you have access to link to any of the 5.. if you build against the SDK.. you will only have access to link to the 1 that is available |
| 18:51.50 | fray | and with the targeted SDK, you can say I may have ncurses, but it's forbidden for apps to use it.. only the system can.. so you just don't make it available at all |
| 18:52.12 | fray | (thats pretty normal behavior for a GUI based SDK... where people are limited to well defined GUI interfaces) |
| 18:52.26 | jkroon_ | fray, so, im creating a gcc toolchain which shall run on win32, for creating an application that runs on my image. Im better of extracting the sysroot in the SDK package, than using the one in tmp-eglibc/sysroots, right ? |
| 18:52.50 | fray | in that case, you need to generate the win32 toolchain externally.. since the build system can't.. |
| 18:53.07 | fray | you then want to generate an SDK (using either approach).. install it on a Linux machine, and then copy the sysroot from the SDK itself.. |
| 18:53.11 | jkroon_ | fray, yeah, i just got it working, but ive been using the sysroot in tmp-eglibc |
| 18:53.20 | fray | combine the Win32 and the extracted SDK stuff and you now have a windows sdk |
| 18:53.35 | jkroon_ | cool |
| 18:53.54 | jkroon_ | there really ought to be a recipe for that.. |
| 18:54.41 | fray | at this point people have avoided any Win involvement.. the future is to be able ot run a VM running oe/Yocto Project code.. |
| 18:54.54 | fray | and then simply doing your builds (controlled by the windows side) in the Linux VM.. |
| 18:55.18 | fray | initial prototyping show that is actually faster then using a windows cross compiler, due to windows and it's horrible CoW filesystem issues |
| 18:56.11 | jkroon_ | yeah.. i would guess windows not having a proper fork() not helping the performance |
| 18:56.20 | fray | yup |
| 18:57.12 | jkroon_ | the company i work for i still using windows xp |
| 18:57.22 | jkroon_ | I want to use linux in our next project |
| 18:57.26 | fray | tell them to invest in a free 'VM'.. ;) |
| 18:57.37 | jkroon_ | there arent any good ones.. |
| 18:57.52 | fray | they're still better then building with windows though... serious performance will improve |
| 18:57.54 | jkroon_ | Qemu doesnt support full virtualization on win32 AFAIK |
| 18:58.03 | fray | There are others.. |
| 18:58.18 | jkroon_ | which one are you thinking of ? |
| 18:58.20 | fray | basically they're 'player' versions thata re free.. you just need to generate an image from somewhere.. |
| 18:58.29 | fray | tries to remember I don't do much with that stuff anymore |
| 18:58.35 | jkroon_ | vmplayer is not free for commercial use |
| 18:58.44 | jkroon_ | which is a shame.. |
| 18:59.10 | jkroon_ | i tried the one oracle owns... dont remember the name... but it didnt even startup :-( |
| 18:59.15 | fray | https://www.yoctoproject.org/documentation/build-appliance-manual |
| 18:59.24 | fray | YP recommends VM Ware player.. |
| 18:59.35 | fray | the oracle one is the other ones I've seen people use |
| 19:00.34 | jkroon_ | oh well, win32 version of gcc should work for us I hope |
| 19:00.52 | fray | if you do that, then the right approach is to extract the sysroot from the SDK.. |
| 19:01.03 | jkroon_ | will do. thanks for the info |
| 19:01.13 | fray | that is how the company I work for ships the stuff to our unfortunate Win32 customers |
| 19:01.48 | jkroon_ | i find it pretty ironic that even the win32 gcc binary is compiled on a linux machine |
| 19:02.35 | jkroon_ | at least thats how I do it |
| 19:02.46 | fray | ya, same here |
| 19:03.26 | jkroon_ | everyone is struggling with working around win32 limitations :-) |
| 19:03.50 | jkroon_ | and still almost all companys out there buy windows year after yeat |
| 19:04.06 | jkroon_ | that is fucked up |
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| 20:25.24 | mr_science | windows was never a platform intended for developers or engineers... |
| 20:25.54 | mr_science | it's a marketing tool intended to make "normal" people dumb and dependent |
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