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| 06:50.15 | kerio | what's the best way to run ssh-agent in maemo? |
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| 08:34.20 | zeq | freemangordon: I've been looking through romaxa's mercurial code repo on hg.mozilla.org. I thought I'd have a go at building the IPCLite based browser. Have you tried? Not sure which project to checkout: http://hg.mozilla.org/users/romaxa_gmail.com/ |
| 08:38.29 | zeq | I'm guessing I need his xulrunner+qtmozembed..? |
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| 12:47.11 | sambo7 | Hi,nandtester here-I finally managed to get the battery charged...unfotunately I'm having some problems trying to cold flash |
| 12:47.24 | sambo7 | I have followed these instructions: http://wiki.maemo.org/Updating_the_firmware/Cold_Flashing |
| 12:48.25 | kerio | oh, hi |
| 12:48.31 | kerio | i kinda forgot about you! |
| 12:48.32 | kerio | :D |
| 12:48.41 | sambo7 | but after the temporary bootloader has been loaded & I enter the flasher-3.5 -F image.bin --flash-only=nolo -f it gets stuck |
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| 12:48.58 | sambo7 | at this point Suitable USB device not found, waiting. |
| 12:49.08 | sambo7 | at this point: Suitable USB device not found, waiting. |
| 12:49.20 | kerio | well, did you connect your n900 at that point? |
| 12:49.42 | kerio | also, is 2101 your hw revision? |
| 12:49.55 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: ping, i think you're interested too |
| 12:50.00 | sambo7 | I first enter the boot-loader command & then connect the phone |
| 12:50.10 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: and besides, you can help him better than me |
| 12:50.19 | kerio | sambo7: does the n900 do something at that point? |
| 12:50.19 | sambo7 | after a while the Nokia logo appears |
| 12:50.34 | kerio | hm, maybe you should hold "u" then? |
| 12:50.55 | sambo7 | don't know which hw rev I actually have |
| 12:51.24 | sambo7 | thought that I might find out with lsusb when phone is recognised but I didn't |
| 12:52.30 | sambo7 | after the bootloader has been loaded this pops up in the syslog: hub 4-1:1.0: connect-debounce failed, port 3 disabled |
| 12:52.59 | kerio | jacekowski: are you around? |
| 12:53.19 | sambo7 | this comes up a few times & in the end I get this in the syslog: usb 4-1.3: USB disconnect, device number 7 |
| 12:53.45 | sambo7 | so I guess that the connection is lost after the bootloader & is not established anymore |
| 12:54.24 | sambo7 | the amber led is still on for a while but nothing happens anymore |
| 12:54.40 | kerio | :( |
| 12:55.15 | sambo7 | how many hw rev are there....maybe I try one after the other |
| 12:56.11 | kerio | i have 2104 |
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| 12:58.15 | sambo7 | when I look at what pops up after the second flash command, there seems to be more that 30/40/50 hw revisions |
| 12:58.23 | sambo7 | I will try with holding the u button |
| 12:58.44 | kerio | sambo7: http://talk.maemo.org/showpost.php?p=776474&postcount=35 |
| 12:59.42 | sambo7 | it could take a while to test all of them...if that is relevant at all |
| 13:00.21 | sambo7 | anybody ever tried to flash with wrong hw rev. given?result? |
| 13:03.37 | sambo7 | get the same result with the u button |
| 13:04.31 | sambo7 | after the boot loader is loaded the usb connection is lost & the flash command stops at Suitable USB device not found, waiting. |
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| 13:07.13 | sambo7 | anybody ever succeeded to cold flash a device & is that just pure theory?:-( |
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| 13:09.57 | kerio | jacekowski DocScrutinizer05 DocScrutinizer DocScrutinizer51 |
| 13:11.42 | jacekowski | kerio: ? |
| 13:12.17 | jacekowski | sambo7: don't distonnect the phone |
| 13:12.21 | jacekowski | sambo7: it has to stay connected |
| 13:12.37 | sambo7 | had it connected for about 20min |
| 13:12.58 | sambo7 | after the boot loader nothing happened...wait some longer? |
| 13:13.02 | jacekowski | sambo7: you need switched off phone, run coldflashing command connect phone, insetrt the battery |
| 13:13.10 | jacekowski | then run normal flashing command |
| 13:13.19 | jacekowski | linux or windows? |
| 13:13.24 | sambo7 | linux |
| 13:13.48 | jacekowski | hmmm |
| 13:13.55 | jacekowski | try different machine |
| 13:13.57 | jacekowski | or different cable |
| 13:14.03 | sambo7 | cannot switch on phone at all...nandtested it:-( |
| 13:14.09 | kerio | jacekowski: this is the phone with the borked CAL |
| 13:14.14 | kerio | could it be related? |
| 13:14.15 | jacekowski | ahm |
| 13:14.19 | jacekowski | broken cal |
| 13:14.36 | sambo7 | after the boot loader I see usb diconnection in the syslog |
| 13:14.43 | jacekowski | no way to recover that without phoenix |
| 13:14.54 | sambo7 | what is that? |
| 13:15.26 | kerio | jacekowski: hm, are you sure about that? shame :( |
| 13:15.36 | jacekowski | nolo reads stuff from cal |
| 13:15.48 | jacekowski | and probably if cal is gone then partition table is gone |
| 13:15.49 | kerio | jacekowski: is there a way to rebuild a cal? |
| 13:15.52 | jacekowski | and that's not recoverable as well |
| 13:15.56 | jacekowski | kerio: theoretically |
| 13:15.58 | sambo7 | after I enter the boot loader flash command & connect the phone the Nokia logo appears & boot loader is loaded...then disconnection |
| 13:16.15 | jacekowski | sambo7: because bl is failing to read cal data |
| 13:16.24 | jacekowski | it's looking for partition table |
| 13:16.27 | jacekowski | and that's not there |
| 13:16.46 | sambo7 | I nandtested mtd0-mtd5 accidentally |
| 13:16.54 | kerio | "accidentally" |
| 13:17.03 | jacekowski | sambo7: how, why? |
| 13:17.16 | jacekowski | sambo7: you've done nolo nandtest? |
| 13:18.01 | jacekowski | theoretically it is recoverable, but because we can't sign BL and therefore load any code onto n900 |
| 13:18.14 | sambo7 | I was a little hasty...nandtested it before having read about that it doesn't test actually |
| 13:18.17 | jacekowski | because nokia signed BL is crashing without valid cal |
| 13:18.26 | jacekowski | it does test |
| 13:18.27 | kerio | hey, it does test! |
| 13:18.32 | jacekowski | it's destructive test though |
| 13:18.44 | kerio | jacekowski: to be fair it should really print out more warnings |
| 13:18.54 | sambo7 | yes,but without the -k not only test |
| 13:18.56 | jacekowski | well, is that nolo nandtest we are talking about? |
| 13:19.11 | jacekowski | or some other test? |
| 13:19.15 | kerio | jacekowski: no, nandtest from mtdtools |
| 13:19.15 | kerio | mtd-tools? |
| 13:19.19 | sambo7 | I did enter nandtest mtd0 |
| 13:19.22 | kerio | (destructive) |
| 13:19.25 | sambo7 | the mtd1 |
| 13:19.29 | sambo7 | till mtd5 |
| 13:19.48 | jacekowski | well, problem is that all calibration data and imei was stored in cal |
| 13:20.31 | sambo7 | so,no possibility to debrick it?what about the serial pins? |
| 13:20.32 | *** join/#maemo javispedro (~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro) |
| 13:20.40 | jacekowski | nope |
| 13:21.05 | jacekowski | nokia probably has copy of calibration data |
| 13:21.19 | kerio | or at least could calibrate it again |
| 13:21.20 | jacekowski | so it could be recovered without it going back to them if they were willing to help |
| 13:21.21 | sambo7 | nandtest should be called nandfuck |
| 13:21.41 | jacekowski | sambo7: nobody said it's not destructive |
| 13:21.50 | sambo7 | but nevertheless it was my fault |
| 13:22.05 | kerio | sambo7: send a letter to elop! |
| 13:22.13 | jacekowski | nokia would have to supply signed bl that would write cal data |
| 13:22.26 | sambo7 | so I might try to contact NOKIA & tell them what happened to my phone.... |
| 13:22.37 | kerio | jacekowski: what's stored in CAL? |
| 13:22.39 | jacekowski | or you have to send it back and they will redo it |
| 13:22.42 | jacekowski | kerio: everything |
| 13:22.51 | jacekowski | kerio: imei, radio calibration data, wifi mac |
| 13:23.10 | kerio | kinda wants to backup his CAL |
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| 13:23.21 | kerio | jacekowski: ooh, so you can change your imei by writing to CAL? |
| 13:23.27 | jacekowski | kerio: if you can sign it |
| 13:23.40 | kerio | oh, it's in the signed part? :c |
| 13:23.47 | kerio | spoilsports |
| 13:24.01 | jacekowski | basically all calibration data and imei is stored in one block that is sent to rapuyama on boot |
| 13:24.06 | jacekowski | and rapuyama verifies it's signature |
| 13:24.09 | *** join/#maemo valeriusM (~user@31.23.69.72) |
| 13:24.15 | jacekowski | but hmmm |
| 13:24.17 | kerio | fucking rapuyama :( |
| 13:24.24 | jacekowski | you could clone another n900 probably |
| 13:24.41 | jacekowski | unless rapuyama has it's own cal as well |
| 13:24.45 | jacekowski | which it probably has |
| 13:25.00 | sambo7 | I got one on ebay uk a few days ago & am waiting for this one to arrive |
| 13:25.25 | jacekowski | sambo7: well question is exactly what have you done |
| 13:25.30 | jacekowski | to be honest |
| 13:25.44 | jacekowski | when i was looking at it |
| 13:25.48 | sambo7 | I entered these commands |
| 13:25.55 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd0 |
| 13:26.03 | jacekowski | coldflash bl should be fine with messed up cal |
| 13:26.04 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd1 |
| 13:26.06 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd2 |
| 13:26.07 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd3 |
| 13:26.08 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd4 |
| 13:26.09 | sambo7 | nandtest mtd5 |
| 13:26.25 | sambo7 | after the last one the phone turned off |
| 13:26.25 | jacekowski | it will not work without partition table |
| 13:26.31 | kerio | hahahaha |
| 13:26.39 | jonwil | I bet that phone is busted |
| 13:26.46 | kerio | sorry, but it is hilarious |
| 13:27.03 | kerio | especially because i did the same thing on a sheevaplug |
| 13:27.07 | kerio | with debian installed on the NAND |
| 13:27.07 | jacekowski | there was great big warning when installing mtd-tools |
| 13:27.10 | sambo7 | not so funny to me;-) |
| 13:27.26 | kerio | and after i nandtested mtd2 shit started to blow up |
| 13:27.28 | kerio | (rootfs) |
| 13:27.39 | sambo7 | for me after mtd5 |
| 13:27.40 | kerio | that's when i did "man nandtest" on my computer |
| 13:27.53 | kerio | sambo7: yeah, the n900's rootfs is in mtd5 |
| 13:27.57 | sambo7 | before all was fine |
| 13:28.23 | kerio | sambo7: luckily for me, the sheevaplug has a low-level interface (jtag) to flash stuff to the NAND regardless of what you do with it |
| 13:28.29 | jacekowski | what is the RM-number of N900? |
| 13:28.46 | kerio | which is accessible via a mini-usb port |
| 13:28.53 | kerio | flashing a n900 is... more complicated |
| 13:28.59 | kerio | if it doesn't cooperate, i mean |
| 13:29.04 | SpeedEvil | jacekowski: I knew that at one point. I forgot though. |
| 13:29.12 | sambo7 | RM-number? |
| 13:29.23 | jacekowski | yeah |
| 13:29.23 | sambo7 | sorry |
| 13:29.24 | jacekowski | from sticker |
| 13:29.31 | jacekowski | there is rm-number |
| 13:29.36 | jacekowski | i need that number |
| 13:29.41 | SpeedEvil | sticker? |
| 13:29.55 | jacekowski | rx-51 |
| 13:29.55 | sambo7 | under tha battery? |
| 13:30.02 | SpeedEvil | powers off. |
| 13:30.04 | sambo7 | mine too |
| 13:30.25 | SpeedEvil | rx51 |
| 13:30.36 | jonwil | Does anyone know how the web browser is able to dial phone numbers when you click on certain URLs? |
| 13:30.43 | sambo7 | does the N900 have a jtag too? |
| 13:30.50 | javispedro | jonwil: "tel:xxx" URL scheme |
| 13:30.52 | SpeedEvil | jonwil: I don't think it's that. |
| 13:30.55 | SpeedEvil | oh |
| 13:31.00 | SpeedEvil | yeah - that. |
| 13:31.15 | SpeedEvil | I thought you meant the auto-dial thingy on any string of numbers in contacts |
| 13:31.17 | jonwil | what I mean is does anyone know what handles those URLs? |
| 13:31.30 | jonwil | I cant find the handler for it in microb-engine |
| 13:31.40 | SpeedEvil | Not me, sorry. |
| 13:31.49 | jonwil | I want to do the same thing from my app :) |
| 13:31.50 | javispedro | on harm it's defined in a .desktop file |
| 13:32.05 | javispedro | jonwil: you can probably try to pass that url to hildon mime or similar lib |
| 13:32.30 | jacekowski | sambo7: you can try flashing it with phoenix under windows |
| 13:33.07 | sambo7 | where do I get that phoenix sw?not the nokia suite? |
| 13:34.03 | jacekowski | ussualy some russian sites |
| 13:34.08 | jacekowski | you have to find cracked version |
| 13:34.57 | *** join/#maemo GNUton-BNC (~gnuton@85-156-155-89.elisa-mobile.fi) |
| 13:35.41 | javispedro | jacekowski: do you think that will restore CAL? |
| 13:35.59 | jacekowski | well, phoenix is what nokia uses |
| 13:36.11 | jacekowski | so i would expect that phoenix can recover completly dead phone |
| 13:36.51 | javispedro | looking forward to that then :P |
| 13:37.14 | javispedro | this is one of the reasons I'm personally quite happy with n9's openmode write-locking CAL |
| 13:37.44 | jacekowski | well, you can lock nand blocks on n900 as ell |
| 13:37.45 | jacekowski | well* |
| 13:37.47 | sambo7 | found a cracked one...hopefully it runs on win7_64 or winxp |
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| 13:38.07 | javispedro | jacekowski: have any hints on how that is done btw? I'm curious. It's a feature of the onenand chip? |
| 13:38.13 | jacekowski | yes |
| 13:38.24 | jacekowski | but nandtest unlocks everything beforehand |
| 13:38.34 | javispedro | hm. |
| 13:38.47 | jacekowski | that's why he managed to fuck it up |
| 13:38.52 | jacekowski | because normally it's locked |
| 13:41.20 | sambo7 | @jacekowski dzienkuje...sobacze co z tego wyjdzie....:-) |
| 13:41.50 | jonwil | ok, it definatly looks like its done through libhildonmime |
| 13:42.58 | jonwil | now to find the code in microb that calls libhldonmime |
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| 13:50.54 | jonwil | hmm, need to read the hildonmime documentation |
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| 13:59.09 | jonwil | ok, better yet, I found a dbus interface I can trigger :) |
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| 14:06.49 | jonwil | com.nokia.CallUI.ShowDialpad seems to work :) |
| 14:12.13 | jonwil | now I know how to trigger a call if I decide to write this app I am thinking about :) |
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| 14:17.42 | sambo7 | have to leave right now...will be back in the evening hopefully to give you an update if recovering with phoenix works |
| 14:17.45 | jonwil | its an app to make it easier if I want to call around to a bunch of different outlets of <retailer X> to figure out if any of them have <item Y> in stock |
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| 15:22.51 | kerio | is it a good idea to use an ssh agent on the n900 |
| 15:22.53 | kerio | ? |
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| 15:26.30 | andre__ | per se it's neither good nor bad. |
| 15:26.47 | Gyjf | yeah i ssh to my n900 all the time |
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| 15:52.08 | kerio | andre__: well, it means you have to keep your public keys unencrypted, at least for a bit, on a portable device that can be stolen kinda easily |
| 15:56.56 | NIN101 | you mean private keys I guess, and "unencrypted" isn't true either |
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| 15:58.36 | kerio | er, yes |
| 15:58.52 | kerio | don't you need the full plaintext of those to connect? |
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| 15:59.24 | NIN101 | sure, but they don't have to be stored unencrypted on the EMMC. |
| 16:02.24 | NIN101 | I mean dm-crypt/cryptsetup, truecrypt. |
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| 17:23.36 | kerio | oh, he left |
| 17:23.44 | kerio | NIN101 et al: i meant unencrypted in ram |
| 17:23.54 | kerio | root can happily access /dev/ram and /dev/kram |
| 17:24.20 | kerio | ssh-agent will have to keep the private key unencrypted to use it |
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| 17:35.27 | kerio | i mean, i use ssh-agent on my laptop but it requires a password to access |
| 17:35.45 | kerio | so you can't get to the plaintext without freezing the ram |
| 17:35.50 | kerio | and it's a laptop, so it's quite hard |
| 17:36.40 | kerio | the n900, on the other hand, is absolute crap wrt security |
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| 17:58.11 | SpeedEvil | I vaguely recall someone saying they;'d gotten ffull dick encryptipn working. |
| 17:58.17 | SpeedEvil | Full disc encryption |
| 17:59.17 | Gh0sty | LOL |
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| 18:02.32 | kerio | SpeedEvil: full rootfs compression is slow enough already |
| 18:02.44 | kerio | and it's not a matter of encryption |
| 18:02.55 | kerio | it's a matter of ssh-agent requiring the *decrypted plaintext* in ram |
| 18:03.35 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: should i file a bug against rootsh and sudser for allowing passwordless root execution? it's a pretty big security flaw, after all |
| 18:03.46 | kerio | i mean, HAM itself is fucking awful |
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| 18:05.44 | NIN101 | I got /home/ and MyDocs encryption at least. No point in encrypted /, and it would be a big pain. |
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| 18:13.43 | Estel_ | Hello #maemo! |
| 18:14.26 | Estel_ | is back to "civilization", after almost 3 weeks vacations - now only another day of travelling, and "sweet home" |
| 18:15.43 | Estel_ | just little question - have anyone experienced (or is experiencing) strange behavior of N900, that - after turning off - have problems with turning on again, due to starting in act-dead mode *without* charger connected? |
| 18:16.06 | Estel_ | otherwise, it works 100% ok - including USB data connection (incl. hostmode) and charging |
| 18:16.06 | Gh0sty | i always wait for 60 sec to restart |
| 18:16.16 | Gh0sty | mine never starts immediatly after i shut it down |
| 18:16.36 | Estel_ | Gh0sty, my N900, after power off and usual little waiting time, starts immediately on pressing power buton, but, in act-dead |
| 18:16.47 | Gh0sty | hm no |
| 18:16.49 | Estel_ | (framebuffer messages indicates that it's act-dead) |
| 18:16.54 | Gh0sty | if I shut it down |
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| 18:16.57 | Gh0sty | press power again |
| 18:16.59 | Gh0sty | does nothing |
| 18:17.04 | Gh0sty | wait 10 - 20 sec |
| 18:17.05 | Estel_ | and after a while it turns itself off, due to no charger connected |
| 18:17.07 | Gh0sty | press power |
| 18:17.09 | Gh0sty | it starts ... |
| 18:17.33 | Estel_ | well, mine is in such loop no way to turn it on, until I take battery off for few minutes |
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| 18:18.07 | Estel_ | then, upon inserting battery, I can turn it on normally. Situation repeats on next power off |
| 18:19.23 | Estel_ | but, if I insert battery too early - for example, 30 seconds after removal, instead of waiting 2 minutes - it turns itself on instantly, when I put battery in |
| 18:19.30 | Estel_ | in act-dead, again |
| 18:19.59 | Estel_ | when it happens (vibration on battery inserted, and act-dead) I know that I can't turn it on for a life of me - need to take battery away and wait few minutes |
| 18:20.20 | Estel_ | it looks like it need to wait until goldcap discharge, no idea why |
| 18:21.15 | Estel_ | I would say something about shorted data+ abd - pins, so it think that it's connected to charger and enters act-dead, *but* they're not shorted, and when working, it detects data + and - correctly |
| 18:21.22 | Estel_ | no problem with USB data and charging |
| 18:21.49 | Estel_ | as said, 0 problems, until I need to restart or turn it off and on |
| 18:22.10 | Estel_ | quite irritating, though - every reboot = taking battery out for few mins (or no turning on) |
| 18:22.27 | Estel_ | any ideas, anyone? DocScrutinizer? |
| 18:23.01 | Estel_ | it would look hardware'ish, if not for fact that hardware seems to be 100% OK via other tests (like usb connection) and it "smells" software'ish :P |
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| 18:33.00 | Sicelo | Estel_: was there no such thing in some early power kernel .. which was related to boost current/voltage after using hostomode :/ |
| 18:36.45 | Sicelo | 5~/win 22 |
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| 18:42.44 | Estel_ | Sicelo, no idea, but it happens also when I haven't used hostmode (since last "reboot") |
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| 18:46.10 | kerio | Estel_: i had that once, phone thinking the charger was plugged in, and entered act_dead mode on shutdown |
| 18:46.23 | kerio | but i could turn it on afterwards, and it fixed itself |
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| 18:51.25 | Estel_ | kerio, hm, mine doesn't want to fix itself for a week now |
| 18:52.11 | kerio | Estel_: reflash and restore |
| 18:52.18 | Estel_ | good joke :P |
| 18:52.39 | Estel_ | I haven't done full reflash on this device since one after buying it |
| 18:52.40 | kerio | no srsly |
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| 18:53.20 | Estel_ | I haven't did it even when faced Most Irritating Issue (tm) with broken .ogg/theora playback, so I'm not going to do it now :P |
| 18:53.23 | kerio | btw, ask ShadowJK how to properly reset the battery/charging chips |
| 18:53.59 | Estel_ | kerio, I've already chatted with him about it. Reseting bq2x00 doesn't help here |
| 18:54.14 | kerio | sucks to be you, i guess |
| 18:54.20 | kerio | check the connector |
| 18:54.29 | Estel_ | it looks like for some twisted reason it doesn't shut down properly, and think that it's in constant act-dead |
| 18:54.52 | Estel_ | conenctor is ok, and as said, usb data and charging works fine in all humanly possible combinations |
| 18:54.55 | Estel_ | 0 issues |
| 18:55.06 | Estel_ | detecting wall-charger too |
| 18:55.16 | *** join/#maemo vi__ (~user@86.186.125.91.dyn.plus.net) |
| 18:55.17 | Estel_ | (i.e. D+/D- short detection) |
| 18:55.24 | kerio | dick around with r&d mode maybe |
| 18:55.37 | kerio | it screws up act_dead mode, doesn't it |
| 18:55.39 | Estel_ | maybe, but R& doesn't touch act-dead afaik :P |
| 18:55.49 | kerio | hm |
| 18:55.51 | Estel_ | I may end up like reinob kicking this sucker out of device |
| 18:56.02 | Estel_ | act-dead, not reinob (kicking) |
| 18:56.13 | kerio | try turning it off from bootmenu |
| 18:56.41 | Estel_ | fun fact - when this bug happens, bootmenu/backupmenu doesn't show up, as it doesn't in act-dead :P |
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| 18:57.19 | kerio | lol! |
| 18:57.44 | kerio | DocScrutinizer: your best friend's phone is stuck in act_dead mode, wat do? |
| 18:58.20 | kerio | Estel_: did you use bq24x00_charger? |
| 18:58.49 | Estel_ | kerio, sure, but it happens even if I don't use it since power cycle |
| 18:58.51 | Estel_ | or not? |
| 18:58.54 | Estel_ | need to check it |
| 18:59.17 | Estel_ | but it definitely happens, when I have BME enabled and bq2415 rmod'ed |
| 18:59.31 | kerio | i had it happen when i used pali's module |
| 18:59.39 | kerio | and i think bme was still running |
| 18:59.48 | Estel_ | but I haven5 checked if it happen, if I don't load it at all during runtime |
| 19:00.10 | Estel_ | kerio, I never use Pali's module with bme |
| 19:00.17 | Estel_ | but, it's good guess anyway |
| 19:00.24 | kerio | Estel_: does it think the charger is plugged in when the system is up? |
| 19:00.30 | Estel_ | I though about that, but was curious why no one else reports it |
| 19:00.34 | Estel_ | no |
| 19:00.44 | Estel_ | only when disabled |
| 19:00.51 | Estel_ | You know what? I'll test it now :P |
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| 19:04.08 | vi__ | estel set r&d flag power-button |
| 19:04.41 | vi__ | if n900 STILL act dead then it is time for a reflash. |
| 19:04.59 | kerio | vi__: too late |
| 19:06.09 | vi__ | WTS 1*N950, 1000 euro. |
| 19:07.07 | kerio | WTB 1*N950, 3 euro. |
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| 19:19.00 | SpeedEvil | wtb Nokia, 8 euro. |
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| 19:20.35 | vi__ | fuck nokia |
| 19:21.00 | Venemo_N9 | what happened? |
| 19:29.05 | joga | 8 euro? |
| 19:29.18 | kerio | Venemo_N9: the elopcalypse or however it's spelled |
| 19:30.06 | kerio | but it's kind of old |
| 19:30.27 | kerio | i'd totally buy Nokia for 19.95 € |
| 19:30.52 | kerio | especially if billy mays made an infomercial about it |
| 19:32.22 | Venemo_N9 | kerio, so nothing new |
| 19:32.25 | kerio | nope |
| 19:32.33 | kerio | but vi__ is selling his n950 for 1000 EUR |
| 19:32.40 | kerio | i offered 3 |
| 19:33.40 | Venemo_N9 | 3 what? |
| 19:33.46 | kerio | 3€ |
| 19:33.51 | kerio | he didn't accept :( |
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| 19:39.02 | Venemo_N9 | lol |
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| 19:50.18 | Estel_ | kerio, confirming, this bug seems to have something to do with latest bq2415 things in KP |
| 19:50.40 | Estel_ | Sicelo's note about similaritiy to ancient bug with 5V is also in line with it |
| 19:51.25 | Estel_ | strange obserfvation - if I kinsert battery without bug manifesting itself (no vibration = no instant-turning-on in act-dead), I have something like 5 seconds to turn device on normally |
| 19:51.41 | Estel_ | if I do it later, it boots up in act-dead again |
| 19:52.20 | kerio | Estel_: well, at least it can be kicked into shape by bme |
| 19:52.29 | kerio | by the way, act_dead mode is stupid |
| 19:52.30 | Estel_ | this, + fact, that leaving device without battery for few minutes temporary fixes it (*if*I turn device on fast enough after iknserting battery) would suggest some capacitors getting charged on 5V |
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| 19:52.40 | Estel_ | and device thinking it's in act-dead |
| 19:52.45 | Estel_ | kerio, yea, it is |
| 19:53.05 | Estel_ | but bme doesn't kick it in shape 100%. It just allow normal turn off/on cycle |
| 19:53.27 | Estel_ | but pulling battery out and inserting again + turning device on more than 5 seconds after it = bug kicks again |
| 19:54.09 | Estel_ | no matter if bq2415 was used, or not. I suspect, that it have something to do with changes in KP itself, that allow Pali's charging module to work |
| 19:54.14 | Estel_ | need to report it to him |
| 19:54.31 | Estel_ | thanks for good advices, both of You, it was shot for ten points |
| 19:55.17 | kerio | Estel_: oh btw vi__ said something too, not sure if you read the logs |
| 19:57.02 | vi__ | kerio: my suggestion was a bodge. |
| 19:57.07 | kerio | k |
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| 20:03.41 | Estel_ | vi__, thanks anyway, will check logs |
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| 20:34.37 | eijk | I can't find it on Google: Does anybody know what it means when the N900 makes that deep "ping" sound on shutdown? I think it's some error indicator and I had it when the internal backup battery was broken. Is there any place where I can get more information? |
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| 20:41.10 | Sicelo | i just had a discussion with an android fanboy. he pointed out the benefits of LBE Privacy Guard app, in, for example, showing which app is accessing IMEI info, etc. |
| 20:41.45 | Sicelo | btw, is there a way for us to monitor such stuff on maemo? |
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| 20:47.53 | kerio | Sicelo: the source code |
| 20:47.57 | kerio | >:D |
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| 20:48.54 | Sicelo | :P |
| 20:49.17 | Sicelo | what about dbus thingies maybe :-/ |
| 20:51.24 | kerio | strace |
| 20:51.42 | kerio | besides, wtf is an "app"? |
| 20:53.06 | Sicelo | lulz, it's what makes android tick.. they always say we have thousand of apps :P |
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| 20:53.34 | kerio | yeah but |
| 20:53.36 | kerio | like |
| 20:53.41 | kerio | how many apps is aircrack-ng? |
| 20:53.46 | kerio | it's at least 5 or 6 binaries |
| 20:58.33 | Sicelo | lulz..just now i burst out laughing.. so this app of his says Jorte is accessing IMEI info. Jorte is a calendar. heh |
| 20:58.46 | Sicelo | wft is it doing with IMEI then. |
| 20:59.07 | Sicelo | gives his N900 some love :D |
| 21:00.10 | ShadowJK | maybe it just lists the permissions used |
| 21:03.28 | kerio | do you want to know what the "app" is sending/receiving? just use wireshark or tshark |
| 21:04.41 | kerio | or, again, just look at the fucking source code |
| 21:05.01 | kerio | every package in extras* has the source code |
| 21:09.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: ( <Estel_> but, if I insert battery too early - for example, 30 seconds after removal, instead of waiting 2 minutes - it turns itself on instantly, when I put battery in) bq24150 and/or 1707 PHY misconfigured. Probably a kernel problem |
| 21:10.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | actually it needs a few minutes battery removal to reset those chips to proper state. see: |
| 21:10.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~flatbatrecover |
| 21:10.13 | infobot | Remove battery for 1 minute. Insert battery. Plug powered Nokia wallcharger to device. Watch steady amber. Let sit and charge. Do NOT try to boot. After 30 min, you got either a) a booted up N900, b) flashing amber which means you can boot, c) steady amber going off - in this case start over again with ~flatbatrecover |
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| 21:16.31 | kerio | DocScrutinizer05: a few minutes... what if one still has a good bupbat? |
| 21:18.35 | DocScrutinizer05 | bupbat doesn't power bq24150 nor 1707 |
| 21:18.43 | DocScrutinizer05 | just small capacitors |
| 21:22.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | c1113 150uF, c1146 10uF... |
| 21:23.33 | DocScrutinizer05 | you may short battery connector pins (in N900) with some conducting object to reduce time for discharging those |
| 21:26.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | but actually the faulty config *might* as well happen in TWL4030 GAIA, which afaik detects vbus, and that chip indeed is powered by bupbat |
| 21:27.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | and it's known you might configure it in a way it will forbid powerup of device |
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| 22:09.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | btw all this (and more, worse) may happen if you accept "patches" to kernel like the I2C-locking disable patch introduced to make bq27200.ko work |
| 22:10.41 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, this "i2c-locking disable" patch is a history since looong time ago, i.e. it doesn't exist in KP for ages |
| 22:11.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's my rationale to oppose any unreviewed untested patches to the lately discussed "cssu kernel" |
| 22:11.26 | Estel_ | personally, I don't use bq27200 at all - reading all things from i2c - but afaik bq27200 may be used properly if loaded before or without bme |
| 22:11.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: yes, I know. I spotted the problem and I made it vanish |
| 22:11.39 | Estel_ | and bless You :) |
| 22:12.00 | Estel_ | btw, it's sane to keep heavy experimental things like bq2415 charging outside cssu-kernel |
| 22:12.11 | Estel_ | and afaik it was the plan from beginning? |
| 22:12.48 | Estel_ | anyway, thanks for Your pointers where problem may lie in kernel, I'll forward it to Pali, too |
| 22:13.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | the severity/danger of undetected lateral effects of any patches can't be deduced from the primary nature of the patch |
| 22:13.17 | Estel_ | as I'm 99,99% sure that it started with latest KP and my experiments with bq2415 module charging |
| 22:14.33 | Estel_ | sure, sure, that's what KP is for (such experimental things like modules for bme-less charging) until they're rock solid. No one opposed way of thinking about kernel-power as extras-experimental :) |
| 22:15.03 | Estel_ | and "kernel" for cssu as place for patches and things stable for ages |
| 22:15.29 | Estel_ | what makes me wonder about this particular trouble, is that no one else reported it. I'm the only one using bq2415 for charging?... |
| 22:15.50 | Estel_ | + reinob, but he purged half of blobs, including act-dead itself :P |
| 22:16.09 | DocScrutinizer05 | I2C-fuckup been considered "stable for ages" since nobody associated the problems it definitely introduced to the nature of the patch |
| 22:16.17 | Estel_ | personally, I use bq2415.ko for charging exclusively |
| 22:16.43 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, afaik it was never stable - just added in times of Titan, when he applied every path without review... |
| 22:17.01 | Estel_ | and before people like You, freemangordon, Pali etc. reviewed whole KP |
| 22:18.12 | Estel_ | next thing like that - some good in nature, but unfinished, unmaintained, and kinda random addon - highpass filter in kernel, submitted by luke-jr after new KP duo got estabilished, was detected in minutes |
| 22:18.17 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, before Titan "reviewed" whole KP. A single developer looking cursory across the source is not any sane review, no matter if done by me, Pali, FMG, or Titan |
| 22:18.32 | Estel_ | Titan never reviewed it :P |
| 22:18.52 | Estel_ | then, left without single note, which made it even harder to properly review |
| 22:18.59 | vi__ | ~seen a pair of boobs in my life |
| 22:19.02 | infobot | vi__: i haven't seen 'a pair of boobs in my life' |
| 22:19.03 | Estel_ | it took some time for Pali, fmg and others to clear mess |
| 22:19.52 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, btw, afaik this highpass thing go detected by kp users not from everyday usage, but from reviewing code (!) and then quickly confirmed by fmg |
| 22:20.04 | Estel_ | wasn't it vi_ who detected it? |
| 22:20.23 | DocScrutinizer05 | nfc what yiu're talking about |
| 22:20.41 | Estel_ | kinda a feat, as path was described wrong way, and brief look at it wasn't resulting in suspicious observations |
| 22:20.54 | Estel_ | there was some good idea path by... Nox? I don't remember |
| 22:21.04 | Estel_ | kernel controlled filters, ages ago |
| 22:21.14 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: afaik you can implement an FIR filter on the sound chip...or something. |
| 22:21.21 | Estel_ | main goal was to inroduce hardware equalizer, but idea got abandoned |
| 22:21.40 | vi__ | Estel_: the hardware already supports it. |
| 22:21.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | vi__: I know, as it's again been me who spotted that (well together with HNZ or what's been his name) |
| 22:21.54 | Estel_ | then, luke-jr got old code from this abandoned project, messed it a little, and submitted to KP as ultimate speaker protection |
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| 22:22.25 | Estel_ | the problem is, that it was filtering low frequencies no matter if You use headphones or speakers or fmtx or... |
| 22:22.56 | Estel_ | +, code was not maintained, no one wazs interested in maintaining it, and it wasn't submitted by original author :P |
| 22:23.11 | Estel_ | i.e. standard for KP in Titan's times, with all due respect |
| 22:23.36 | vi__ | ~seen titan |
| 22:23.37 | infobot | titan <~zero@pdpc/supporter/student/titan> was last seen on IRC in channel #debian, 862d 12h 36m 55s ago, saying: 'extra ips on the default interface'. |
| 22:23.58 | Estel_ | that's why things like i2c-fuckup were included, then. But, hardware highpass got worse luck, as it was submitted in times of real maintainership over KP |
| 22:24.28 | vi__ | they re-made total recall. |
| 22:24.33 | vi__ | without arnie. |
| 22:24.34 | Estel_ | well, our whole discussion about act-dead fuckup proves, that many people, even far frommbeing kernel hackers, are interested in hammering bugs :P |
| 22:24.44 | vi__ | blasphemy |
| 22:24.58 | Estel_ | vi__, You're using thumb and KP |
| 22:25.07 | Estel_ | havemYou tried bq2415 module? |
| 22:25.08 | vi__ | yes. |
| 22:25.10 | Estel_ | for charging? |
| 22:25.14 | vi__ | nope |
| 22:25.50 | Estel_ | well, I use it exclusively and it works great, especially for charging 3Ah behemot battery with 1250 mAh instead of 950 ;) |
| 22:25.56 | Estel_ | but, introduced strange bug |
| 22:26.16 | Estel_ | turn device off, and on every ON attempt, it thinks it's in act-dead |
| 22:26.28 | vi__ | act dead mode can suck my balls. |
| 22:26.35 | Estel_ | or "it thinks it *should* go into act-dead" |
| 22:26.41 | Estel_ | got rid of it? :) |
| 22:26.42 | vi__ | just set power_button r&d flag. |
| 22:26.49 | vi__ | problem solved. |
| 22:27.06 | vi__ | no more act dead |
| 22:27.08 | vi__ | ever. |
| 22:27.20 | Estel_ | it solves charging in act-dead when connecting to charger? I've forget about it, totally |
| 22:28.38 | Estel_ | well, honestly, act_dead is a biatch, no bootmenu, no backupmenu, no u-boot... I wonder if I should be happy that butbat is flat |
| 22:28.50 | Estel_ | it depends, if it's gaia problem or this 1st one |
| 22:28.59 | vi__ | just set power_button r&d flag. |
| 22:29.02 | vi__ | no more act dead |
| 22:29.05 | vi__ | problem solved. |
| 22:29.19 | Estel_ | yea, just after I'll help in tracoing down issue, as it should be fixed in KP nevertheless |
| 22:29.26 | vi__ | it is a kludge. |
| 22:29.30 | vi__ | idgaf. |
| 22:29.56 | Estel_ | If my 5V capacitors are charged when device is off, it is a problem, no matter of act_dead |
| 22:30.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | I'd say the only thing this "discussion" shows is that patches going to KP do not see even the minimum of review and QA needed for kernel patches |
| 22:30.19 | Estel_ | DocScrutinizer, every thing we discuss about is in -devel |
| 22:30.28 | vi__ | DocScrutinizer05: feel free. |
| 22:31.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: and you think it will get review before moving from -devel to KP ? |
| 22:31.14 | Estel_ | Well, replacing bme is such a thing, that I don't mind hammering a bug or two in the process :) |
| 22:31.26 | Estel_ | sure, it's what I'm participating now, in a small part :) |
| 22:32.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | you obviously have no concept of a proper review process |
| 22:32.02 | Estel_ | name a single bug in KP in extras (not fixed later in further releases)) |
| 22:32.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | ^^^ another evidence that you don't |
| 22:32.39 | vi__ | Estel_: poweroff on reboot bug. |
| 22:32.48 | Estel_ | fortunately, I'm not talking about new android toy for masses, so I don't need to give a shit about corporate review standards, and can follow regular FOSS way of people contributing via using -devel... |
| 22:33.02 | Estel_ | vi__, there are reports of it happening without KP |
| 22:33.12 | Estel_ | i.e. on stock |
| 22:33.28 | Estel_ | this one is a real biatch, probably result of many different modifications |
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| 22:34.14 | vi__ | idgaf anymore |
| 22:34.32 | Estel_ | If poweroff on reboot ever get fixed, I'm going to open '36 bootle of wine |
| 22:34.34 | Estel_ | vine |
| 22:34.38 | Estel_ | even |
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| 22:35.15 | Estel_ | (and hope that it's not acid yet) |
| 22:35.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | Estel_: that's bullshit. The regular FOSS way to contribute kernel patches is exactly what I refer to, demand, and see is not folllowed a singe bit for KP |
| 22:35.43 | Estel_ | erm, like? |
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| 22:36.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | rewgular (FOSS) way for review of kernel patches: publish patch on LKML, so several hundered *really* experienced experts for that particular topic can review and comment |
| 22:36.46 | Estel_ | ough, several hundred kernel hackers? out of our all 2 of them? |
| 22:36.51 | Estel_ | well, maybe 3 or 4 |
| 22:37.18 | Estel_ | I think You've missed scale, better compare us to things like openwrt, than to upstream kernel patches |
| 22:37.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | you can't substitute that by "review" done by Pali, estel, DocS, FMG and declaring patch "rock solid" after a few months in some marginal test kernel used by a few hundered users |
| 22:37.35 | Estel_ | not to mention that some things from KP already got upstreamed, IIRC |
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| 22:38.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | theres no difference between KP and any other kernel |
| 22:38.05 | Estel_ | few hundred users would be a heaven, as we have few hundred power users as whole Maemo base |
| 22:38.41 | DocScrutinizer05 | this day's lesson finished, afk |
| 22:38.57 | Estel_ | well, there is difference - KP is targeted for single device users. It's even less than openwrt, which work on few dozens of devices and really got few thousand of active power users |
| 22:39.32 | Estel_ | even they don't follow Your way, as it's not scalable, unfortunately, for less than few ten thousands active users |
| 22:39.51 | Estel_ | what we have in KP looks *very* sane for resources that we have in hand, IMO |
| 22:40.28 | Estel_ | today's polemic finished, going back to hammering out bq2415 bugs by extensive testing in all possible scenarios, before reporting :P |
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| 22:58.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | sure, KP looks *very* sane for what KP is. KP is not the default kernel though, and no way to move KP to CSSU-kernel, even when we kick out some 10% of most suspicious patches, since the remaining 90% are as well without any sane review that's mandatory for a solid kernel meant for regular users. Your own words: "few hundred users would be a heaven, as we have few hundred power users as whole Maemo base". suggests this KP thing by no |
| 22:58.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | means is tested for CSSU-grade standards applicable to kernel |
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