| 04:40.13 | *** join/#maemo-ssu DocScrutinizer05 (~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
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| 12:04.14 | enyc | meeps |
| 12:05.17 | enyc | never fully understood maemo updates -- "apt-get upgrade" seems to be safe, "apt-get dist-upgrade" is not, generally, seems to want to do zillions of removals and so on, wondered whats going on there?? |
| 12:11.58 | bencoh | I'd say man apt-get for details on the difference between upgrade and dist-upgrade :) |
| 12:15.33 | enyc | well yes, upgrade only upgrades existing packgas wihtout allowing installations/removals |
| 12:16.14 | enyc | but I'm asking about maemo+ssu situation -- is it normal that 'dist-upgrade' wants to change lots and break stuff? |
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| 12:38.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, since maemo is one huge metapackage |
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| 15:44.16 | enyc | DocScrutinizer05: I don't 010% get that though... current state is that apt-get dist-upgrade would want to "0 upgraded, 0 newly installed, 287 to remove and 0 not upgraded." |
| 15:52.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | I can't help with analysis _why_ and _what_ goes awry when you do apt-get (dist)upgrade. I just know that with maemo it doesn't work the way you'd hope for |
| 15:54.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | there are no proper dependencies maintained in maemo, it's one huge metapackage |
| 16:00.22 | enyc | I get ''no proper dependencies'' |
| 16:00.43 | enyc | 'one huge metapackage'' suggests i should find a package like 'maemo' that depends on loads of things |
| 16:14.48 | kerio | hm, lots of stuff in -devel |
| 16:14.59 | kerio | or maybe it's stuff in -testing |
| 16:20.37 | enyc | hrrom, somethinc like pinning deselcting all that stuff or somesuch? |
| 16:22.03 | kerio | honestly maemo needs pretty much a rebuild from the current debian or something |
| 16:22.19 | kerio | it's too hard to figure out how things *were* supposed to be like |
| 16:22.22 | kerio | now that so much time has passed |
| 16:24.59 | enyc | kk |
| 16:25.05 | enyc | its based on a particular debian past version? |
| 16:29.32 | drathir | kerio: migration to alarm will be great... but closed things sadly... |
| 16:30.45 | drathir | kerio: but really amazing job is all time done keep it up2date as much as possible... |
| 16:32.32 | enyc | =) |
| 18:28.57 | Pali | reason is that dist-upgrade try to install some defaul debian packages (like baseutils, etc) |
| 18:29.18 | Pali | but maemo uses busybox, not gnu utils |
| 18:29.37 | Pali | and there are dependences which will replaces/remove busybox packages |
| 18:30.19 | Pali | but maemo metapackage depends on busybox and so as reverse dependency is not OK, dist-upgrade will try to remove maemo metapackage |
| 18:30.47 | Pali | and so after that there will be couple of auto packages which are not needed anymore, so they are going to be removed too |
| 18:31.19 | Pali | I would say, this is bug in dist-upgrade algorithm |
| 18:31.37 | Pali | anyway, you can use aptitude upgrade which should work fine |
| 19:17.21 | enyc | Pali: hrrm mine doesn't have aptitude! |
| 19:17.41 | Pali | it is in extras-devel |
| 19:33.10 | enyc | how problematic is extras-devel? see lots of 'not ready for users' warnings and not sure if there are mohulitple apt lines for it etc etc |
| 19:40.19 | Sicelo | has extras-devel always enabled. no issues. but i do take some reasonable care myself .. ymmv |
| 19:42.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | extras-devel is de3finitely a nogo with apt-get upgrade |
| 19:43.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | several packages have a working version in extras and a newer broken version in extras-devel |
| 19:43.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | there might even be packages in extras-devel that would replace core libs from Nokia repos |
| 19:44.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | which usually doesn't pan out |
| 19:44.06 | Sicelo | agreed. :) |
| 19:45.07 | Sicelo | except i look what apt-get upgrade is trying to do, before choosing "yes" .. the windowsy habit of clicling Yes/Next/OK is absolutely bad |
| 19:46.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | you not only need to check, you also need to know |
| 19:47.44 | Sicelo | well said |
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