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| 01:55.49 | wpwrak | reportingsjr: i have the battle of the catalog down to two issues: brining back the catalog text, and arcs. interestingly, they seem to be a cairo-PDF problem: with PNG/canvas output, they are there in all their splendor, but if i generate PDF, they just disappear |
| 01:56.16 | wpwrak | it seems as if arcs (also for circles) where completely ignored in PDF. very odd. |
| 02:06.26 | cirilo | it may be worthwhile then to create a specific PDF generator |
| 02:06.47 | cirilo | rather than relying on whatever is available via wx on a particular platform |
| 02:07.35 | cirilo | that would also ensure good quality output even on Windows where the output is typically extremely bad because the Microsoft Way is to generate a high-res bitmap and stuff it into PDF |
| 02:10.23 | wpwrak | oh, i use cairo directly, no wx. this is eeshow (C, gtk, cairo), not kicad |
| 02:10.47 | cirilo | ah, 'k |
| 02:11.15 | wpwrak | but i must say that the Microsoft Way does sound interesting, though ;-) |
| 02:12.04 | cirilo | well - in that case if you don't mind pulling in libpopler you might be able to put in a good layer with no compromises :) |
| 02:12.06 | wpwrak | i have another option, output to FIG, then convert to PDF. that's taking the scenic route, but ... |
| 02:12.41 | cirilo | too scenic - better convert to PS (extremely simple) and use gostscript to convert |
| 02:12.56 | cirilo | ghostscript even .. but the 'h' is invisible |
| 02:14.34 | wpwrak | yes, i'll first add PS as output format. maybe then i can see what cairo is trying to do |
| 02:15.04 | cirilo | you mean PS via Cairo? I wouldn't even bother - I'd generate the PS myself |
| 02:15.41 | cirilo | best way to find out what Cairo is doing is to look at Cairo's device context code |
| 02:18.13 | wpwrak | well, there's always the option of sifting through their code ... |
| 02:19.09 | wpwrak | but i'll give PS a try first. that should at least give me a clue what exactly to look for |
| 02:19.45 | wpwrak | also, it's a relatively easy change |
| 02:26.09 | wpwrak | like 10 minutes :) |
| 02:27.59 | wpwrak | interesting. no trace of any arcs in the PS |
| 02:33.10 | wpwrak | sigh. git clone git://anongit.freedesktop.org/git/cairo is it then ... |
| 02:38.15 | mroszko__ | hmm |
| 02:38.22 | mroszko__ | im being dumb with qt5 cmake |
| 02:38.29 | mroszko__ | it keeps wanting to create a target_autogen.cpp |
| 02:38.33 | inductiveload | i knew the end of classical moore's law is coming up, but it turns out there's another, more indidious threat to electronic engineering as we know it: http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/coffee-could-be-extinct-by-2080-due-to-climate-change-destroying-areas-suitable-for-growing-beans-a7222241.html |
| 02:38.35 | mroszko__ | which it then cant find |
| 02:38.35 | mroszko__ | ugh |
| 02:39.02 | cyborg_ar | old c4757p is going to be pissed |
| 02:39.31 | inductiveload | no coffee => no PCBs |
| 02:39.44 | wpwrak | inductiveload: excellent news. i'll be long dead by then ;-) |
| 02:40.12 | inductiveload | well, so will I, from lack of coffee, probably |
| 02:40.37 | c4757p | hm |
| 02:40.41 | c4757p | I might be able to survive with tea |
| 02:41.06 | inductiveload | i used to think that, but then I worked at a place with a bean-to-cup machine |
| 02:41.13 | inductiveload | the first cup was free |
| 02:41.28 | inductiveload | and the second, and sp on until the current sorry state |
| 02:42.42 | inductiveload | or maybe i'll just be in prison from beating whoever at xilinx saw that ISE is about 9GB of download and instead of concluding "maybe we should make some bits optional, not everyone needs all platofrms and devices all the time" instead said "just split it up to 4 archives of around 2GB each" |
| 02:43.33 | cyborg_ar | something that worries me more is that the cavendish might be in danger |
| 02:43.37 | inductiveload | i also had to decleare 4 times that i'm not going to use Xilinx ISE to resurrect Osama bin Laden or something |
| 02:43.51 | inductiveload | it's always been in danger |
| 02:43.57 | cyborg_ar | yeah |
| 02:44.10 | cyborg_ar | they are all genetically identical |
| 02:44.44 | inductiveload | and i even remember people saying "they're all identical clones, that could be bad for disease resistance" at least 15 years ago |
| 02:44.59 | mroszko__ | gah |
| 02:45.02 | inductiveload | sure enough.... |
| 02:45.03 | mroszko__ | this is irritating |
| 02:45.10 | mroszko__ | cant figure out why it wants this stupid file |
| 02:45.21 | cyborg_ar | i am goig to miss buying them for 39 cents a pound when they go |
| 02:46.26 | inductiveload | i'm going to miss all the fish |
| 02:47.59 | inductiveload | but herring is increasing, apparently, so i'll survive long enough to die of coffee withdrawal instead |
| 02:48.02 | cirilo | the cavendish? As in the tie knot? |
| 02:48.13 | inductiveload | yes, but also the banana |
| 02:48.38 | cirilo | ah, I won't miss 'em |
| 02:49.15 | cirilo | I'm no fan of contemporary market bananas .. miss the Bad Old Days. |
| 02:50.03 | wpwrak | back then, when you'd bend them yourself ... |
| 02:50.25 | cyborg_ar | ahahahaha |
| 02:50.48 | c4757p | :D |
| 02:50.54 | cyborg_ar | i am curious to see what the gros michel tasted like, i heard there are still small scale production for it |
| 02:52.04 | inductiveload | bend them? you had it easy! ours were so hard you could use them to hammer nails |
| 02:52.16 | cirilo | heh .. I'm old enough to have even worked with feral bananas |
| 02:52.33 | inductiveload | not good, the first person to tase it said "eww, that's gross, michael" |
| 02:53.30 | cirilo | you might have had the occasional banana with a properly formed seed .. the feral varieties have mostly well-developed seeds so are pretty much inedible to humans .. mostly birds that eat 'em and a few other animals like civets that don't mind the seeds |
| 02:54.24 | c4757p | groans audibly at inductiveload |
| 02:54.52 | cyborg_ar | lol |
| 03:10.48 | xzcvczx | c4757p is just annoyed he didn't come up with it first |
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| 03:33.55 | GyrosGeier | hm |
| 03:34.08 | GyrosGeier | are there TVS diodes especially for USB like there are for HDMI? |
| 03:34.34 | GyrosGeier | specifically, ones that allow me to run the trace below them without sacrificing too much of my controlled impedance |
| 03:35.02 | GyrosGeier | for HDMI there are special ones that have all the connections on one side, and the other side is mechanical only |
| 03:35.12 | xzcvczx | there are a few 3-pin ones that allow that |
| 03:35.38 | xzcvczx | but thats only for your data lines obviously |
| 03:35.42 | GyrosGeier | mmh |
| 03:35.56 | GyrosGeier | not sure if Vbus is that critical |
| 03:36.11 | GyrosGeier | since it goes into a capacitor and an inductor first |
| 03:36.26 | GyrosGeier | but I'd like to do this properly for once |
| 03:36.48 | xzcvczx | not sure your pretty little tantalum will like a couple of k transient :P |
| 03:38.52 | c4757p | capacitors and inductors resonate, big spikes upon connecting cables are common >_> |
| 03:39.05 | xzcvczx | we demand FIRE!!! |
| 03:39.07 | c4757p | throws GyrosGeier a tape of DRTR5V0U2SR |
| 03:39.49 | xzcvczx | damn that thing has an uuuugly footprint |
| 03:40.01 | c4757p | SOT-143? that's ugly to you? :P |
| 03:40.19 | c4757p | nice broad ground pin :) |
| 03:41.24 | xzcvczx | hmmm i wonder if you could turn it sideways and run io2&1 between vcc and gnd |
| 03:41.50 | xzcvczx | hmmm quite easily apparently |
| 03:41.58 | c4757p | yup, I do that |
| 03:42.12 | xzcvczx | c4757p: yeah well you also fuck up your pinouts |
| 03:42.17 | c4757p | piss off |
| 03:42.51 | xzcvczx | so you are saying you DONT fuck up your pinouts? |
| 03:43.11 | c4757p | shush |
| 03:43.48 | GyrosGeier | c4757p, these have the same footprint as the SP0503BAHT that are recommended for the USB controller I use |
| 03:44.06 | c4757p | yup, I have used that one too |
| 03:44.09 | c4757p | these cost less |
| 03:44.58 | GyrosGeier | okay, but for these I need to change the trace geometry a little bit |
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| 03:47.35 | tom_fig | Has the copydlls.sh been changed to also copy the dlls necessary for the OCE plugin? |
| 03:49.30 | tom_fig | I did it manually, but all I did was tack on the needed dlls, and didn't know if there was a more elegant way to do it |
| 03:54.10 | GyrosGeier | possibly |
| 03:54.15 | GyrosGeier | by scanning the executables |
| 03:54.23 | GyrosGeier | I have the beginnings of such a tool |
| 03:54.45 | tom_fig | I see |
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| 03:59.13 | xzcvczx | is a pity that bundleutilities doesn't work on windows |
| 04:00.49 | tom_fig | Really? I'm seeing that it was ported to windows and linux in 2.8 |
| 04:00.58 | tom_fig | Unless I'm not seeing something |
| 04:01.31 | GyrosGeier | my plan is to build MSIs directly via the MSI API |
| 04:01.41 | GyrosGeier | and merge MSMs for whatever DLLs required |
| 04:02.13 | GyrosGeier | because that way if a DLL brings an installer that does extra magic, like the VS runtime, that will be respected |
| 04:02.13 | tom_fig | Ahhh...nice. Is it hosted anywhere? |
| 04:02.41 | GyrosGeier | https://github.com/GyrosGeier/BuildMSI.git |
| 04:02.50 | GyrosGeier | but it's not in a usable stage yet |
| 04:02.59 | GyrosGeier | it can find dependencies for PE objects |
| 04:03.10 | GyrosGeier | but merging is test code so far |
| 04:03.27 | GyrosGeier | also, it has no handling for non-MSM dependencies |
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| 04:03.38 | GyrosGeier | (which should be copied from a repo directory, basically) |
| 04:20.50 | mroszko__ | lol |
| 04:20.52 | mroszko__ | tool to build msis |
| 04:20.53 | mroszko__ | god |
| 04:20.59 | mroszko__ | might as well just do UWP |
| 04:21.03 | mroszko__ | since even MS has gone fuck MSIs |
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| 04:25.34 | cirilo | I still see an awful lot of MSIs |
| 04:26.04 | cirilo | but what's the latest that MS recommends? A few years ago they were using that awful thrird-party tool .. I can |
| 04:26.15 | cirilo | I can't even remember the name now but it was baaad |
| 04:26.50 | mroszko__ | VSCode |
| 04:26.55 | mroszko__ | their fancy cross platform IDE |
| 04:26.58 | mroszko__ | uses innosetup |
| 04:27.00 | mroszko__ | lol |
| 04:27.10 | mroszko__ | even their own devs said fuck msis |
| 04:28.11 | cirilo | well, that's not so bad then. I really hate that piece of shit they were promoting in MSVS since ~2008 |
| 04:30.44 | mroszko__ | wah |
| 04:30.51 | cirilo | the only thing I don't like about inno is Delphi |
| 04:30.54 | mroszko__ | msys2 wincodec.h is heavily out of date with the latest windows header |
| 04:30.55 | mroszko__ | sigh |
| 04:30.56 | mroszko__ | fuck |
| 04:31.02 | cirilo | Borland is forever cursed |
| 04:31.32 | cirilo | not a surprise - MSYS2 is in dire need of good documentation to help devs contribute |
| 04:31.53 | cirilo | at the moment it rivals gEda for "work it out yourself or go away" |
| 04:32.33 | mroszko__ | well |
| 04:32.40 | mroszko__ | the real problem is msys2 also needs a real package manager |
| 04:32.55 | mroszko__ | because the complete lack of dependency on compiler abi |
| 04:33.00 | mroszko__ | is causing all kinds of lol |
| 04:33.16 | cirilo | shh .. "but pacman's a *real man's* package manager!" |
| 04:33.18 | mroszko__ | lol |
| 04:33.29 | mroszko__ | they keep updating gcc |
| 04:33.33 | mroszko__ | and then recompiling some packages |
| 04:33.37 | mroszko__ | which then causes a shitstorm |
| 04:33.43 | cirilo | yeah .. wtf .. they use the latest (frequently broken) gcc |
| 04:34.02 | cirilo | and I seriously doubt MSYS2 gets enough attention that gcc bugs are worked out |
| 04:34.53 | cyborg_ar | gah i'm hating this antenna manufacturer |
| 04:34.55 | cirilo | well, all that crap can be fixed by having a few dedicated build/deployment machines and a sensible deployment plan |
| 04:35.05 | cyborg_ar | no info on how to mount the piece of shit on the board |
| 04:35.30 | cirilo | which antenna is that? |
| 04:35.49 | cyborg_ar | http://www.maxtena.com/uploads/6/6/6/5/6665461/mia-1516.pdf |
| 04:36.00 | cyborg_ar | i guess i'll talk with a human |
| 04:36.44 | GyrosGeier | wx in current msys is broken on 32 bit |
| 04:37.02 | tom_fig | yeah, wxpython is broken with the same stupid abi issue |
| 04:37.04 | mroszko__ | lol |
| 04:37.11 | mroszko__ | meh ive resorted to manually building wx on msys |
| 04:37.13 | GyrosGeier | no, that is another problem |
| 04:37.18 | mroszko__ | because they break the abi compat all the time now |
| 04:37.28 | mroszko__ | luckily you can just trigger the PKGBUILD |
| 04:37.32 | GyrosGeier | for some reason, wx was built with wxIntPtr as a 64 bit type |
| 04:37.42 | tom_fig | Cripes |
| 04:37.43 | mroszko__ | 64bitmasterrace |
| 04:37.45 | mroszko__ | fuck 32-bit |
| 04:37.55 | GyrosGeier | but the headers included from our program correctly use 32 |
| 04:38.01 | GyrosGeier | so we get a missing symbol |
| 04:38.22 | cirilo | for me wx was broken on 64-bit only last week |
| 04:38.48 | cirilo | so I could compile OCE and kicad but segfault on start |
| 04:38.48 | GyrosGeier | http://ci.kicad-pcb.org/job/windows-kicad-msys2-nightlies/723/console |
| 04:39.15 | GyrosGeier | someone needs to give the MSVC port some love |
| 04:39.28 | GyrosGeier | is working three jobs now though |
| 04:40.32 | cirilo | I want MSVC to be the official compiler for kicad on Windows .. but still too much "I'm scared shitless of trivial cross-platform crap" and "MSVC90 doesn't work!" |
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| 04:42.04 | cirilo | + Microsoft's current projects suggest to me that they might even migrate from MSVC to clang in a few years and put their effort into clang for Windows rather than maintaining their own special compiler suite |
| 04:43.06 | mroszko__ | lol |
| 04:43.08 | cirilo | enormous up-front cost but could be good in the long term if everyone plays nicely instead of forking every which way |
| 04:43.14 | mroszko__ | god the hacks im doing to make this shit compile |
| 04:43.28 | cirilo | which thing are you compiling now? |
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| 04:44.23 | mroszko__ | skia under msys |
| 04:44.28 | cirilo | cyborg_ar, looks to me like a patch antenna with a U.FL connector |
| 04:44.33 | mroszko__ | basically bad idea |
| 04:44.43 | mroszko__ | but alas, cmake lets me inject paths before system paths! |
| 04:45.15 | cirilo | cyborg_ar, so typically mounted off the board |
| 04:45.16 | cyborg_ar | cirilo, the datasheet doesn't say, but client says the mounting method is to solder it with the can on a ground plane |
| 04:45.29 | cyborg_ar | but the ds does not have any guaranteed dimensions on the can |
| 04:45.43 | cyborg_ar | so it can't be soldered to |
| 04:46.05 | cyborg_ar | also their performance spec specifies a groundplane |
| 04:46.09 | cyborg_ar | which is not included |
| 04:46.14 | cyborg_ar | and no recommended way to attach it |
| 04:46.24 | cirilo | well no .. you're responsible for the ground plane |
| 04:46.36 | cyborg_ar | so i'm going to have to talk to these bastards directly to clear things up |
| 04:47.25 | cyborg_ar | taoglas recommends double sided tape, no soldering |
| 04:47.26 | cirilo | yeah - that's the safest. As for the ground plane, you're the one who has to provide that on whatever the mounting is. Typical recommendation for GPS is min. 10cm dia. plane |
| 04:47.31 | cyborg_ar | it would make a ground loop anyway |
| 04:49.05 | cyborg_ar | the other active antenna we're using uses conductive standoffs to connect the ground plane |
| 04:49.37 | cirilo | wouldn't the metal case essentially be a conductive standoff? |
| 04:50.03 | cirilo | problem I see with mounting via the case is how do you solder without everything else coming apart :) |
| 04:50.03 | cyborg_ar | i am not convinced on the other antenna either |
| 04:50.17 | cyborg_ar | also no dimensioned drawings on the case |
| 04:50.28 | cyborg_ar | i can't design in the footprint if i dont know what the case looks like |
| 04:50.37 | cyborg_ar | all i have is a photo |
| 04:50.41 | cirilo | yeah - no dimensioned drawings and tolerances = Russian roulette |
| 04:51.09 | cyborg_ar | also the surface may not be designed for soldering |
| 04:51.16 | cyborg_ar | no planarity, wrong coating |
| 04:51.34 | cyborg_ar | it just triggers every red flag for me |
| 04:52.27 | cirilo | Jesus .. Embarcadero sure know how to squeeze the balls on their Delphi victims |
| 04:52.43 | cyborg_ar | the passive antenna dataheets specify how to do the ground planes, and the recommended size |
| 04:52.56 | cyborg_ar | for the active ones all i got is a hint in the performance curves |
| 04:53.10 | cyborg_ar | where they say they used a ground plane much bigger than the one in the module |
| 04:53.35 | mroszko__ | welp |
| 04:53.40 | cirilo | yeah - the modules are small so the ground planes they have are shit |
| 04:53.44 | GyrosGeier | ooh |
| 04:53.56 | GyrosGeier | PoE transformers got cheaper since I last looked |
| 04:54.16 | cirilo | yeah, PoE stuff in general is getting cheaper. :) |
| 05:02.17 | GyrosGeier | I wonder if I should make a 10W RGBW LED board with PoE |
| 05:08.50 | reportingsjr | I made a PoE to 12V power supply and I had tons of issues with noise |
| 05:27.03 | inductiveload | how much space does ISE use? it just chewed up like 25 gigs of space before running out and killing the vm |
| 05:27.17 | c4757p | disk or RAM? |
| 05:27.29 | inductiveload | disk |
| 05:27.41 | c4757p | mine's ... uh, actually taking a bit of time to total up here ... |
| 05:28.43 | c4757p | *insert Jeopardy music* |
| 05:29.02 | inductiveload | i'm imagining more like lift muzak |
| 05:29.07 | c4757p | 19G |
| 05:29.09 | c4757p | well |
| 05:29.14 | c4757p | so yours took 25? huh. |
| 05:29.28 | inductiveload | maybe more like 20 |
| 05:29.49 | c4757p | and only 17G with --apparent-size |
| 05:29.55 | c4757p | could have different sets of options installed |
| 05:30.05 | inductiveload | i was measuring outside the VM, so there's some other crap included that I forgot about |
| 05:30.05 | c4757p | (also, I just blindly assumed you meant Linux without thinking) |
| 05:30.09 | c4757p | ahh, right |
| 05:30.25 | inductiveload | either way, I only ave like a 150GB total :-( |
| 05:32.10 | inductiveload | only one drive bay and it's got an SSD, whiich was great until it ran out of space |
| 05:32.11 | nickoe | hmm |
| 05:32.46 | inductiveload | I want ot nuke the 100GB windows partion since the VM seems to be totally fine |
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| 05:37.14 | nickoe | I wonder why my patch can't apply |
| 05:37.49 | inductiveload | there aren't very many (any?) short m.2 drives >256gb, which is a bit sad |
| 05:37.50 | c4757p | heh, a second count of the ISE size takes under a second. yay caching? |
| 05:38.17 | GyrosGeier | QuartusII takes 16G |
| 05:38.27 | GyrosGeier | made a Debian packaging script |
| 05:38.38 | GyrosGeier | installing with dpkg takes only five minutes |
| 05:38.55 | nickoe | c4757p: can you help me understand? https://github.com/nickoe/kicad-source-mirror/commits/fix_conflict latest commit |
| 05:39.13 | c4757p | what about it? |
| 05:39.29 | nickoe | I did a git pull --rebase from origin master then fixed a bad rebase in the commit, then added the file, and commit --amend. |
| 05:39.47 | nickoe | but now when I do a git format-patch master I get a patch file which does not apply to master! |
| 05:40.23 | nickoe | I try to apply with git apply patchfile |
| 05:40.41 | GyrosGeier | nickoe, format-patch master gives you changes from your master branch |
| 05:40.50 | GyrosGeier | which isn't necessarily the same as origin/master |
| 05:41.03 | c4757p | yeah, that |
| 05:41.04 | nickoe | GyrosGeier: I pulled master to be as remote |
| 05:41.22 | c4757p | I always just format-patch HEAD~1 or whatever, as I almost always want to just export a few top commits |
| 05:41.25 | GyrosGeier | that's not how it works |
| 05:41.31 | GyrosGeier | "master" is local |
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| 05:41.41 | GyrosGeier | it may point to the same commit as origin/master |
| 05:41.47 | nickoe | GyrosGeier: yes, but now it is really the same as on the remote |
| 05:41.56 | nickoe | initially it made eight patches.. |
| 05:42.04 | GyrosGeier | now it makes seven? |
| 05:42.06 | nickoe | then I pulled |
| 05:42.08 | nickoe | one |
| 05:42.13 | nickoe | as expected |
| 05:42.18 | nickoe | but it can't apply |
| 05:42.28 | c4757p | <nickoe> GyrosGeier: yes, but now it is really the same as on the remote -- so 'git rev-parse master' indeed shows c0b014c... ? |
| 05:43.43 | nickoe | mmm no |
| 05:43.49 | c4757p | so it's not :P |
| 05:44.04 | nickoe | c4757p: the remote master |
| 05:44.13 | nickoe | at your commit 9740d5e4338062fab517a79e11c2af83c5d40fcb |
| 05:44.49 | GyrosGeier | I usually rebase master on top of origin |
| 05:44.52 | c4757p | you realize I can't tell which usage of "master" you're trying to correct? |
| 05:44.53 | nickoe | c0b014c.. is my commit which has not been merged yet, so that should not be on master yet... |
| 05:45.00 | GyrosGeier | and any other branches as well |
| 05:45.10 | c4757p | nickoe: well, is it on /your/ master? |
| 05:45.18 | nickoe | c4757p: no |
| 05:45.20 | c4757p | okay. |
| 05:45.25 | nickoe | only on my fix_conflict branch |
| 05:45.26 | GyrosGeier | and master only keeps changes that are not ready to be submitted, rebased on top of submitted changes |
| 05:45.28 | c4757p | trying to form a clear picture of your repository here :P |
| 05:45.47 | nickoe | c4757p: I sent you a linke to gh |
| 05:45.48 | c4757p | I wish people would just post a screenshot of gitk when they start asking commit graph questions :P |
| 05:45.53 | GyrosGeier | is your working tree clean? |
| 05:46.00 | c4757p | yes, but that only shows the remote. I don't trust that to be equal to your local repo. |
| 05:46.21 | GyrosGeier | if so, I'd start by |
| 05:46.23 | nickoe | GyrosGeier: yes, I would say so, there are only some untracked files, not nothing that is staged or unstaged |
| 05:46.25 | GyrosGeier | git checkout master |
| 05:46.27 | GyrosGeier | git rebase origin |
| 05:46.47 | GyrosGeier | git checkout fix_conflict |
| 05:46.51 | GyrosGeier | git rebase origin |
| 05:46.59 | nickoe | Current branch master is up to date. |
| 05:47.03 | nickoe | for master |
| 05:47.18 | GyrosGeier | then master is a descendant or equal to origin/HEAD |
| 05:47.35 | GyrosGeier | (/HEAD being a symlink to master, most likely) |
| 05:48.37 | nickoe | c4757p: http://storage2.static.itmages.com/i/16/0905/h_1473054554_9671918_1559998bf1.png |
| 05:49.51 | c4757p | at this point I'd expect "git format-patch master" to do something sane |
| 05:49.58 | c4757p | wouldn't write it that way, but.. |
| 05:49.59 | GyrosGeier | too |
| 05:50.20 | nickoe | could you try it? |
| 05:50.24 | c4757p | what? |
| 05:50.35 | c4757p | try what? my repository is not yours :P |
| 05:51.15 | nickoe | This is what my patch looks like http://dpaste.com/23SF5H9.txt |
| 05:51.24 | nickoe | c4757p: you could pull my repo |
| 05:51.33 | nickoe | does that apply at your end? |
| 05:51.38 | c4757p | it applies cleanly, yes |
| 05:51.50 | c4757p | everything looks fine |
| 05:51.55 | nickoe | How do you apply |
| 05:51.56 | c4757p | so you're just fucking up applying it somehow ;) |
| 05:52.08 | c4757p | 'git am 23SF5H9.txt' |
| 05:52.14 | c4757p | well, after 'git checkout master', in your case |
| 05:52.24 | c4757p | was already on master |
| 05:52.24 | nickoe | I tried with git apply and patch --dry-run -p1 -i file.patch |
| 05:52.38 | c4757p | use git am |
| 05:52.46 | c4757p | it takes the formatted patches from format-patch |
| 05:52.58 | c4757p | doesn't just apply the changes, it imports the whole commit |
| 05:53.02 | c4757p | that's how that is meant to be used :P |
| 05:53.29 | nickoe | sure, but that fails in the same way |
| 05:53.34 | c4757p | no it doesn't :P |
| 05:53.43 | nickoe | http://dpaste.com/055KSWY |
| 05:53.43 | c4757p | it applies perfectly cleanly here. |
| 05:53.57 | c4757p | wtf |
| 05:54.09 | c4757p | git am --abort; git status |
| 05:54.10 | c4757p | ^ pls |
| 05:55.03 | GyrosGeier | 07:45 < GyrosGeier> is your working tree clean? |
| 05:55.34 | mroszko__ | hmm |
| 05:55.38 | mroszko__ | to use qstring or std::string |
| 05:55.41 | mroszko__ | that is the question |
| 05:55.48 | GyrosGeier | qstring? |
| 05:55.52 | GyrosGeier | qstring sucks |
| 05:55.57 | nickoe | mmm, fatal: Resolve operation not in progress, we are not resuming. |
| 05:55.57 | nickoe | when using abort |
| 05:55.57 | nickoe | but otherwise On branch master Your branch is up-to-date with 'origin/master'. nothing to commit, working tree clean |
| 05:56.11 | c4757p | wtf |
| 05:56.17 | c4757p | so you're on origin/master, and tree is clean |
| 05:56.22 | c4757p | and it won't apply?? |
| 05:56.30 | nickoe | yeah, that I would say |
| 05:56.44 | nickoe | I even tried to make a completely new clone of kicad-source-mirror |
| 05:56.48 | c4757p | and you're /sure/ 'git rev-parse master' returns 4b6d283, and 'git rev-parse HEAD' returns the same thing? |
| 05:57.07 | c4757p | erm |
| 05:57.09 | c4757p | wrong hash |
| 05:57.18 | c4757p | 9740d5 |
| 05:57.29 | c4757p | ^ master and HEAD are both that? |
| 05:58.01 | nickoe | mmm, now I tired to do it again with a new repo and it applied with am |
| 05:58.12 | c4757p | o_O |
| 05:58.16 | c4757p | well, I mean, yes, it should |
| 05:58.25 | c4757p | wtf is up with your repo though?? |
| 05:58.26 | nickoe | c4757p: they don't |
| 05:58.26 | c4757p | O_o |
| 05:58.56 | c4757p | <c4757p> 9740d5 <c4757p> ^ master and HEAD are both that? |
| 05:58.58 | nickoe | but if I checkout master then them matc |
| 05:59.00 | nickoe | match |
| 05:59.17 | c4757p | <nickoe> c4757p: they don't -- what? |
| 05:59.19 | c4757p | what is they? |
| 05:59.24 | c4757p | those hashes? |
| 05:59.30 | nickoe | 9740d5e |
| 05:59.46 | c4757p | so they were /not/ 9740d5e ? |
| 05:59.48 | nickoe | git rev-parse HEAD on fix_conflict branch is c0b014c |
| 05:59.54 | c4757p | urgh! |
| 05:59.57 | c4757p | you said you were on master! |
| 06:00.06 | c4757p | stop changing the repo state while I'm trying to give instructions :P |
| 06:00.12 | nickoe | c4757p: git change some times |
| 06:00.17 | c4757p | ... |
| 06:00.22 | c4757p | I give up, I'm going to bed |
| 06:00.29 | c4757p | nuke it all and clone fresh :P |
| 06:00.34 | nickoe | the rev-parse commands do return the SAME when I am on master FFS |
| 06:00.56 | nickoe | There is nothing that is wierd yet, other than the patch does not apply in that repo. |
| 06:01.05 | c4757p | but that's /very/ weird |
| 06:01.12 | c4757p | if the hash matches and git claims the tree is clean |
| 06:01.20 | c4757p | that should mean your tree is identical to what that is a hash of |
| 06:01.22 | nickoe | yeah, but I just did a completely new clone and git am there and it applied... |
| 06:01.26 | c4757p | right |
| 06:01.31 | nickoe | so I dunno what I have done in the first try |
| 06:01.31 | c4757p | that's very weird :P |
| 06:01.41 | nickoe | maybe using git apply did something strange. |
| 06:01.45 | nickoe | but I will submit it now |
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| 06:01.54 | c4757p | possibly, but still, if it says the tree is clean... |
| 06:01.55 | nickoe | I dunno if you will commit it or wayne |
| 06:02.41 | c4757p | I'd commit that, but not at 2am when I can barely keep my eyes open, that doesn't mix well with touching the build system :P |
| 06:02.48 | c4757p | so just post it to the list and whoever sees it first will get it :P |
| 06:03.20 | nickoe | Yeah, of course. |
| 06:03.39 | nickoe | Just needed to build common to be sure that it builds :P |
| 06:04.25 | nickoe | mysteries aside, now I need to go |
| 06:06.01 | mroszko__ | why do monsters put C in .cpp files :( |
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| 06:11.51 | c4757p | because cpp sucks :) |
| 06:17.00 | GyrosGeier | occasionally runs "git rebase --exec 'make -C Build -sj8' -i origin" |
| 06:17.23 | GyrosGeier | that is great for verifying that all patches in my patch stack still build |
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| 06:24.38 | mroszko__ | huh |
| 06:24.45 | mroszko__ | gerber format doesnt seem to specify it requires new lines |
| 06:24.49 | mroszko__ | ... |
| 06:24.50 | mroszko__ | hmm |
| 06:25.56 | mroszko__ | and apparently some commands can be broken up by newlines |
| 06:25.57 | mroszko__ | sigh |
| 06:26.01 | mroszko__ | who the fuck defined this thing |
| 06:29.26 | archivist | probably a paper tape user in the dark ages |
| 06:31.31 | GyrosGeier | enables KICAD_USE_SCH_IO_MANAGER for MSVC |
| 06:33.00 | archivist | does seem to date from that era Standard Gerber was a numerical control (NC) format designed by Gerber Systems Corp to drive their vector photo plotters for the PCB industry in the 1960s and 1970s. |
| 06:34.01 | mroszko__ | "The line separators CR and LF have no effect; they can be ignored when processing the file. |
| 06:34.03 | mroszko__ | ASDF!@#!$@ |
| 06:34.04 | mroszko__ | sigh |
| 06:35.05 | mroszko__ | you would think that even in the past |
| 06:35.16 | mroszko__ | new lines would have been helpful for processing/parsing applications |
| 06:35.23 | mroszko__ | fuck even AT commands used news lines |
| 06:36.02 | archivist | they only help a human read the file |
| 06:36.20 | GyrosGeier | C/C++ treat them the same as a space |
| 06:36.37 | GyrosGeier | ponders C++ with zero-width spaces |
| 06:39.52 | archivist | should I complete my online gerber display tool |
| 06:42.30 | archivist | ew 9 years old http://www.archivist.info/pcb/readgerber.php?gerberfile=5370%2F5370-Copper.pho |
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| 06:51.07 | cirilo | mroszko__, whoever did it is probly long dead - the original Gerber is a 1960s Optical Typesetter thing .. and since so many generations used random has CR,CR+LF,LF etc, I doubt it will be changed in the future |
| 06:51.23 | cirilo | in short: it's been broken so many ways in the past that it's probably beyond redemption |
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| 06:54.51 | cirilo | archivist, is it based on something like gerbv? |
| 06:55.11 | archivist | no, all live php :) |
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| 06:56.53 | cirilo | :) |
| 06:57.12 | cirilo | sounds like a nice project to learn PHP |
| 06:58.55 | archivist | 14kb of php with an additional 1.6kb yo create the jpg |
| 06:59.46 | archivist | one of those can I do it for a giggle things |
| 07:07.04 | inductiveload | anyone got a vague rule-of-tumb for the marginal cost of an IC on a PCB? Say a SO14 package on a bog-standard 4 layer PCB of around 100mm on a side |
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| 07:08.09 | archivist | cost of what, design, soldering , purchasing |
| 07:08.43 | inductiveload | well, everything on the manufacturing side |
| 07:09.10 | inductiveload | so not the time taken to do extra routing, or effort taken to actually buy the parts, or the cost of the part |
| 07:10.19 | inductiveload | but including, say, extra board area, cost of assembly, extra stencils, a couple of vias probably, etc |
| 07:10.40 | inductiveload | obviously any figure is hugely hand-wavy |
| 07:10.44 | archivist | when I was doing tape up design, 1980's and working at home I charged about an hour per 14 pins or equivalent for 2 layer |
| 07:11.30 | archivist | that is just design (and design materials) |
| 07:12.26 | archivist | cannot hand wave manufacturing cost the same way, pcb needs number of holes and layers, components at cost |
| 07:13.10 | cirilo | anyway, there's an enormous difference in cost of any particular package, depending on what the component actually is - and also the supplier and quantity |
| 07:13.48 | cirilo | and if you're including manufacturing then there are the setup costs as well, which depends on what methods the assembly people decide to use |
| 07:14.14 | cirilo | so you'lle be hand-waving at least 2 orders of magnitude |
| 07:14.34 | archivist | +- ish |
| 07:14.59 | inductiveload | yeah, i wasn't under any illusions about accuracy |
| 07:15.56 | cirilo | but some things the manufacturers take into consideration are #SMT pads, #THT pads, is it BGA? is pitch < 0,6? |
| 07:16.25 | archivist | and..quote on 100 off costs (or less) and then improve margins by clever buying when making a few thousand |
| 07:16.39 | cirilo | but devices in an SO14 can range from a few cents to a few $ with the odd tens of $ |
| 07:17.00 | inductiveload | yeah, so say a bog standard PCB, no special pitch requirements, no BGA, no odd stackups or finishes or microvias |
| 07:17.14 | archivist | ther eis no bog standard :) |
| 07:17.44 | archivist | one has to get used to costing jobs |
| 07:18.05 | cirilo | yeah; you just have to hand the design files to an assembly house and ask how much |
| 07:18.22 | archivist | one off and set up costs bite at the beginning |
| 07:19.16 | cirilo | heh .. I remember having something manufactured (not PCB) 20 years ago .. setup costs $800, all other costs per item $200 |
| 07:19.38 | inductiveload | well I was just wondering if you can, say, save 20 SO14 packages somehow, on top of hte saving in routing time and part costs roughly approximately sorta kinda ish how much cheaper does the PCB get |
| 07:20.08 | inductiveload | without, as you say, having to actually route both designs and send them out |
| 07:20.12 | cirilo | in large volumes it could be quite a bit |
| 07:20.18 | archivist | we priced http://www.collection.archivist.info/searchv13.php?searchstr=electronics+clock+pd on about a hundred iirc but made a few k so managed to improve margins quite well |
| 07:21.47 | archivist | in those days 4 layer was a waste of money |
| 07:23.41 | inductiveload | cirilo, sure, it must be cheaper, but then say you replaced them with a TQFP100: did you win? |
| 07:25.36 | inductiveload | maybe i should just just make a fake pcb with a binch of footprints and use that for quotes ;-) |
| 07:26.21 | archivist | pcb cost is a small part of overall cost |
| 07:26.40 | inductiveload | absolutely |
| 07:28.26 | inductiveload | eh, well, just curious if anyone had a 'save a SOIC, save $0.05/PCB for 100 boards |
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| 07:29.59 | inductiveload | i wonder if oshpark or someone has crunched the data (with AI!) of thousands of designs to see what drops out |
| 07:31.19 | inductiveload | probably also highly time dependent as certain things get cheaper |
| 07:31.22 | archivist | we would always try to reduce parts count because assembly cost and purchasing cost |
| 07:32.57 | archivist | although once we had no space and needed an inverter, we used part of a 7474 tied in an odd way to do it |
| 07:36.29 | inductiveload | before the days of 741g04 in teeny weeny packages then ;-) |
| 07:37.00 | inductiveload | though that _is_ like admitting failure, so |
| 07:38.14 | archivist | surface mount was not around in those days iirc was this board http://www.collection.archivist.info/archive/DJCPD/PD/2009/2009_10_15_PCB_design/IMG_0355.JPG |
| 07:38.18 | inductiveload | there should totally be a 7404 with inverters that go across the body of the chip rather than pin-to-neighbour |
| 07:39.24 | inductiveload | noice |
| 07:39.59 | archivist | I think that was my first P-CAD board |
| 07:40.16 | inductiveload | how did it go compared to tape-up? |
| 07:40.55 | archivist | time wise, similar |
| 07:41.46 | inductiveload | blood-pressure wise? |
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| 07:47.08 | archivist | not a lot of difference, just need the same patience to deal with oh fk I should have gone that way, redo it |
| 07:51.39 | alphaferret | http://www.filedropper.com/85703012 ltpsice, rload2 of 500r gives me problems |
| 08:07.17 | cirilo | inductiveload, for some online quotation systems (informal estimates) you just enter #SMT parts #THT parts, total #SMT pads total #THT, board size and whether parts on 1 or 2 sides |
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| 08:15.37 | archivist | some jobs I bet you could not send out, we had one with piggyback drams and one or two legs wired on the upper chips |
| 08:19.05 | cirilo | hehehe - I can imagine the special instructions to the assembly house: "dead-bug U11 and U12 as indicated in attached photograph" |
| 08:20.44 | archivist | we were making a tee shirt printing setup, camera frame grabber and dot matrix printer 1977 |
| 08:33.38 | cirilo | sounds like fun .. especially frame grabbers in that era :) |
| 08:34.37 | archivist | tweaked the line speed in the camera to fiddle the aspect ratio on the printer |
| 08:34.50 | cirilo | vidicon tube? |
| 08:34.54 | archivist | yes |
| 08:35.37 | cirilo | they were fun to play with, even if CCDs have outperformed them many years ago |
| 08:35.46 | archivist | we use a Logabax twin head dot matrix printer for speed |
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| 08:38.02 | cirilo | I've sometimes wondered how the older spacecraft like the Russian Luna converted the vidicon signal and transmitted on the (very slow) CCITT fax signal |
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| 08:39.30 | archivist | I thick some early sats were single sensor and scanning at the same rate |
| 08:40.31 | cirilo | ah, so don't scan the tube at the usual 30hz? |
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| 08:42.20 | archivist | I am thinking of the early noaa stuff |
| 08:42.41 | archivist | iirc they then uploaded full pics! |
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| 09:03.40 | nickoe | cirilo: do you have a working msys2 env? |
| 09:04.07 | nickoe | It is also sort of broken for me at the moment, even when I install a new and upgrade. |
| 09:04.26 | nickoe | But I have put oce packages on the futureware server. |
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| 09:55.49 | Skada | Anyone have a feeling how hard it would be to implement a the functionality to show the different copper layers in the 3D viewer in different colours? |
| 09:56.23 | Skada | The function would be getting contrast when hiding the body of the PCB |
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| 09:57.00 | Skada | I need to visually inspect wave-guides... |
| 09:57.55 | nickoe | Skada: just disable realistic rendering |
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| 09:59.34 | Skada | nickoe, haha good one! I feel like an idiot.. Tanks! |
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| 10:04.22 | cirilo | nickoe, no, MSYS2 environment is broken for me - mixed ABIs on different packages |
| 10:05.07 | cirilo | nickoe, tom_fig got a working plugin by recompiling wxWidgets and disabling all Python options |
| 10:05.29 | cirilo | so I think he's the only person on the planet with a working OCE plugin on Windows :) |
| 10:06.42 | cirilo | For me this has always been one of the biggest problems with MSYS, even in the early days |
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| 10:42.18 | decimad | Hrmm, I tried again but can't find a solution. Basically I have a problem with the git workflow because of the msvc patchset I need to apply to get kicad to compile on my machine. For my own work branches it seems to be most practical to apply the patchset to master's head and then do my work on top of that. But that way I have no branch others could use. |
| 10:42.47 | decimad | So I need a second branch, one where I cherry pick the work, and a third branch on top of that, the msvc patchset, which I don't push |
| 10:43.33 | decimad | And this is a complete mess with a dozen rebases once I want to fetch master's changes |
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| 10:43.48 | decimad | only because of this stupid msvc patchset I need |
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| 11:25.38 | antto | isn't kicad on windows built with gcc? |
| 11:25.49 | antto | ..mingw |
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| 11:40.40 | decimad | official releases yes |
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| 11:59.39 | antto | gud |
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| 12:00.20 | antto | microsoft are doing some scary things with their compiler |
| 12:00.31 | antto | ..i heard |
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| 13:52.26 | EEsam | Hey, I was starting to look at the BOM tool for a large project I'm working and came across "Kicad BOM Wizard" which can export as CSV or HTML and it allows for other fields such as manufacturer, URL etc.. |
| 13:52.28 | EEsam | My question is, I want to be able to save this data in the component libraries (can only see a place to save datasheet), not only in the schematic. If I have a specific part such as an IC, I don't want to have to update all the fields for each one/copy and paste parts. Any suggestions? |
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| 14:06.33 | c4757p | wtf @ commit message https://git.launchpad.net/kicad/commit/?id=b63f2f81b75ab7df5203edb691c403b05e71fc75 |
| 14:08.12 | archivist | it is only negative logic |
| 14:08.46 | c4757p | Reverse French Notation? |
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| 14:26.37 | nickoe | c4757p: what is the problem? |
| 14:26.54 | c4757p | the first line is "Fixes: lp:1619436" ! |
| 14:27.34 | nickoe | antto: what do you mean? |
| 14:28.01 | antto | bout M$? |
| 14:39.45 | nickoe | antto: about your comment about MS compiler |
| 14:40.59 | antto | well once they suddenly start putting "tellemetry" binary blobs into your program |
| 14:41.23 | antto | some guy noticed sudden increase in binary size for no clear reason and figured it out |
| 14:41.35 | antto | i think they removed it afterwards ;P~ |
| 14:41.46 | antto | but they do such things ;] |
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| 14:47.33 | EEsam | Hey, I was starting to look at the BOM tool for a large project I'm working and came across "Kicad BOM Wizard" which can export as CSV or HTML and it allows for other fields such as manufacturer, URL etc.. My question is, I want to be able to save this data in the component libraries (can only see a place to save datasheet), not only in the schematic. If I have a specific part such as an IC, I don't want to have to update all the |
| 14:47.33 | EEsam | fields for each one/copy and paste parts. Any suggestions? |
| 14:48.42 | nickoe | What is the kicad bom wizard? |
| 14:49.12 | EEsam | a 3rd party plugin instead of the defacto BOM exporter |
| 14:50.58 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/8n4twsloirsnfrd/properties.PNG?dl=0 |
| 14:52.00 | EEsam | I can add extra fields that I want on a component in the schematic, but would like to know if there's a way of doing it in the library, or maybe this should be an option if it isn't? |
| 14:53.54 | EEsam | http://www.hashdefineelectronics.com/kicad-bom-wizard/ |
| 14:54.27 | mroszko__ | microsoft is opensourcing bing |
| 14:54.27 | mroszko__ | wow |
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| 14:56.17 | antto | dafuq is bing? |
| 14:56.22 | mroszko__ | search engine... |
| 14:56.35 | nickoe | EEsam: you can just add it to the library |
| 14:57.09 | EEsam | I could only see a place to add datasheets |
| 14:57.25 | EEsam | keywords, footprint info |
| 14:57.30 | nickoe | EEsam: i am not sure why you need a third party plugin to generate a csv with, you can just use some of the xsl or python scripts as a bom export plugin. |
| 14:57.51 | nickoe | EEsam: you can all all the imaginary attributes you want |
| 14:58.32 | EEsam | are all fields (like MPN, user added stuff) included? at the time of that guy creating the wizard, the extra fields were ignored by bom exporter |
| 14:59.14 | EEsam | could you send me a screenshot of where in the library settings you can add these fields please? |
| 14:59.41 | nickoe | In eeschema there is a bom toom where you can call scripts |
| 15:00.06 | EEsam | yes that's what I'm using |
| 15:00.14 | EEsam | with this guys script |
| 15:01.11 | EEsam | that works fine, all additional fields go into the CSV or HTML or whatever. But where can I add those fields to the components in their libraries? |
| 15:01.29 | nickoe | See section 14.3.5 and 14.4 in eeschema doc |
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| 15:03.16 | EEsam | Fantastic, many thanks nickoe |
| 15:04.07 | EEsam | Not sure why a letter T was chosen and it wasn't just included in the component properties though |
| 15:07.55 | nickoe | EEsam: for what? Sorry for my short response, but I am on mobile. |
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| 15:09.00 | EEsam | the icon for the fields window is a capital T, don't see why it shouldn't just be included in the component properties window |
| 15:10.28 | EEsam | It looks like an icon to add plain text onto the symbol IMO |
| 15:13.37 | EEsam | Actually I've noticed a strange problem, whether in the library (symbol) or eeschema, I can't use the relative paths set up in kicad, whereas they work fine for footprints and 3d models? |
| 15:14.03 | c4757p | in the component props window would be a good place |
| 15:14.17 | c4757p | sadly I used to have all kinds of plans for improving the UI like that, but now I just don't have time to implement them :( |
| 15:15.32 | xzcvczx | dammit c4 stop whistling..... |
| 15:16.21 | Devilholk | I googled that, a car that whistles? |
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| 15:16.48 | EEsam | do you know if paths should work for eeschema (for example ${PATH_to_DATASHEET_STORAGE_DIRECTORY}/.......) in the datasheets or custom fields? |
| 15:17.00 | xzcvczx | no, an annoying little girl that thinks she can whistle |
| 15:17.27 | xzcvczx | EEsam: unlikely..... eeschema is a long way behind pcbnew |
| 15:19.51 | EEsam | <xzcvczx> oh I gave up on the idea of getting kicad sorted out (compatibility with PC version), will just wait until a new version is out. But thanks for all the help yesterday. |
| 15:20.47 | EEsam | later on I was down to a crappy wifi connection and maybe that was breaking the downloads or something like that. |
| 15:22.28 | xzcvczx | wonders how buggy c4's hypothetical patch would be |
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| 16:23.04 | alphaferret | who's doing bga with ovens |
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| 16:24.22 | alphaferret | and part deux can do them with hot air |
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| 17:05.29 | decimad | stefan strangely seems to have the same problem I had lately |
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| 17:08.02 | archivist | !later stefan_slight how about you fix your connection |
| 17:08.03 | the_wench | will tell stefan_slight when he/she joins next |
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| 17:08.44 | xzcvczx | is surprised that irc networks haven't started ratelimiting reconnections |
| 17:09.18 | c4757p | oh hey, archivist is here |
| 17:09.30 | xzcvczx | archivist is always here |
| 17:09.32 | c4757p | I was just looking up the syntax for a temporary time out |
| 17:09.34 | c4757p | :P |
| 17:09.38 | archivist | am ! |
| 17:12.07 | xzcvczx | lol.... windows still uses blaster as en example of malware |
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| 17:12.13 | the_wench | stefan_slight: archivist said how about you fix your connection |
| 17:13.46 | decimad | for me the problem somehow didn't have to do with the router, rather the usb wlan adapter seemed to reset the usb connection |
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| 17:14.50 | decimad | oh, but stefan shows up with new dynamic ips |
| 17:15.19 | Plugh | alphaferret: I'm not doing BGA's. I have seen a video showing the use of a hot air gun to help fix computer boards that have a problem with a BGA device. |
| 17:15.37 | decimad | I revived my gfx card in the oven |
| 17:15.54 | decimad | was a smelly treatment though |
| 17:16.15 | archivist | do my graphics card please |
| 17:16.57 | decimad | I'm no pervert! |
| 17:17.11 | reportingsjr | :) |
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| 17:25.24 | EEsam | Plugh: just reworking old solder joints with a hot air gun/oven's unlikely to be a permanent fix, really you need a new graphics chip or you may get away with taking the chip off and reballing - you can do that by just tinning the pads and tinning the chip lightly and using decent flux. |
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| 17:26.48 | EEsam | doesn't require any specialist treatment but it'd be a good idea to preheat the board, those types of boards sink heat like a bitch. |
| 17:26.56 | EEsam | *equipment |
| 17:28.22 | alphaferret | who wants to help with an litspice sim |
| 17:28.27 | alphaferret | ltspice |
| 17:28.50 | LeoNerd | oldspice sim |
| 17:29.10 | EEsam | what are you simulating? |
| 17:29.22 | Plugh | EEsam: The information I've seen about using a hot air gun to "fix" issues involving BGA devices do indicate it is unlikely to be a permanent solution. I have a computer with a BGA issue. I can't do anything about it as I don't the equipment to do handle that type of repair. |
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| 17:29.25 | alphaferret | well actually i got it working, but i don't understand completely why it works |
| 17:29.37 | alphaferret | boost switch into regulator |
| 17:31.41 | EEsam | don't fully understand boost switch? |
| 17:32.38 | alphaferret | the switch works fine in spice |
| 17:32.40 | cyborg_ar | c4757p, lol i just saw b63f2f81b |
| 17:33.05 | alphaferret | but if i change the load on the regulator that follows it there's a point where the switch craps |
| 17:33.38 | EEsam | I mean what's the circuit? Do you mean you're trying to test load step with a switch in series with the load? |
| 17:34.09 | alphaferret | is it easier if i just upload the spice file? |
| 17:34.15 | EEsam | yeah |
| 17:34.20 | alphaferret | ok thx |
| 17:35.15 | Plugh | alphaferret: What change do you make to the load that affects the switch? |
| 17:35.39 | alphaferret | hold on i'm uploading the melange |
| 17:37.53 | alphaferret | https://dpaste.de/uFvr |
| 17:38.06 | alphaferret | save as foo.asc load into ltspice |
| 17:38.58 | alphaferret | R4 far right is 1k, at 500R it causes the switcher to undershoot |
| 17:39.16 | alphaferret | anything over 700r makes it work |
| 17:39.42 | archivist | how many mics are you going to power |
| 17:40.04 | alphaferret | maximum 6 = 48mA |
| 17:40.08 | Plugh | ok. It makes sense. You are drawing too much current from the switcher with a 500 ohm load for it to work properly. |
| 17:40.16 | alphaferret | that's what i thought |
| 17:40.30 | alphaferret | so the solution is hang a series R right before the load on the regulator? |
| 17:40.33 | archivist | so adjust its abilities |
| 17:41.25 | Plugh | alphaferret: Do you need the device to work with loads as low as 500 ohms? If so, you need to adjust your circuit. |
| 17:41.31 | EEsam | I just set the simulation to start external voltages at 0V and it didn't do anything. |
| 17:41.39 | EEsam | fV |
| 17:41.56 | EEsam | otherwise it's just constant 11.something volts |
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| 17:42.25 | alphaferret | i want to confirm a few thoughts... if i have 6 channels of phantom = 12 x 6.8k resistors in parallel that's 480R that the regulator would see, correct? |
| 17:42.57 | archivist | why is 6 = 16 |
| 17:43.00 | archivist | -12 |
| 17:43.09 | EEsam | what are the  doing in the values? |
| 17:43.52 | alphaferret | the simulator works, click on either 48v or 50v, or both |
| 17:44.04 | EEsam | I did |
| 17:44.05 | Plugh | If you have a dozen 6.8k resistors in parallel the equivalent resistance is 6.8k/12 or 566.7R |
| 17:44.54 | Plugh | I can't look at that circuit as I don't have ltspice installed. |
| 17:45.06 | alphaferret | oh sorry plugh |
| 17:45.28 | Plugh | np. Others here do. |
| 17:45.28 | alphaferret | that was sort of the point though |
| 17:46.14 | alphaferret | EEsam I'm looking right at it, ran it 100x and works |
| 17:46.59 | EEsam | the simulation is not working for me, this is what I see: |
| 17:47.02 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/4ahdmq2043xuzny/Capture.PNG?dl=0 |
| 17:47.43 | EEsam | are the A things meant to be there in the values? |
| 17:47.43 | alphaferret | weird, could it be that i'm on spice IV? |
| 17:47.45 | Plugh | alphaferret: BTW, it would take 14 6.8k resistors in parallel to give you 485.7R |
| 17:48.03 | alphaferret | yea plugh sorry i had the wrong value at 480, yours was correct |
| 17:48.13 | alphaferret | 566 still causes it to fail though |
| 17:48.14 | EEsam | ltspice XVII shoudn't break it |
| 17:49.29 | alphaferret | again, so if 1k makes it happy all i need to do is add a series 500R before the load and that will guantee at least 1k worst case scenario |
| 17:49.37 | alphaferret | ? |
| 17:50.49 | EEsam | right, I removed the weird A-with-an-accent from the component values, now it's simulating |
| 17:50.53 | Plugh | You would be wasting power across the series resistor and lowering the effective efficiency of the device. |
| 17:50.59 | alphaferret | hmm good |
| 17:51.22 | alphaferret | right so what's a better solution, not that i care about a little inefficiency |
| 17:51.54 | EEsam | I was too busy trying to get the sim to work, remind me what load do you want? |
| 17:52.42 | alphaferret | variable load will range from 2 x 6.8k parallel to 12 x 6.8k parallel, so 3k4 to 566 |
| 17:52.50 | Bird|otherbox | EEsam: mojibake :P |
| 17:53.30 | EEsam | ? wtf u on about |
| 17:53.30 | Plugh | alphaferret: You could adjust the time constants in the circuit, or try some larger output filter caps? |
| 17:53.33 | *** join/#kicad erichvk_ (~esh@ppp118-210-130-179.lns20.adl6.internode.on.net) |
| 17:53.42 | alphaferret | tried larger caps already didn't work |
| 17:54.25 | alphaferret | i messed around with inductor values, nothing happening, the only thing that worked is guaranteeing about 700r on the regulator |
| 17:55.27 | EEsam | is it working when you put 566R load? |
| 17:55.33 | alphaferret | no |
| 17:55.51 | alphaferret | the switcher only hits about 48v at r4=566 |
| 17:56.15 | *** join/#kicad pointhi_ (~pointhi@dyn165141.wlan.jku.at) |
| 17:56.34 | EEsam | you tried simulating for 100ms |
| 17:56.36 | EEsam | ? |
| 17:56.56 | alphaferret | no comprendo |
| 17:57.06 | *** join/#kicad C47 (~d3bug@189.242.30.227) |
| 17:57.09 | EEsam | it just takes ages to get up to voltage |
| 17:57.12 | alphaferret | it stabilizes at about 3-4ms |
| 17:57.24 | alphaferret | hmm are you sure EEsam? |
| 17:57.27 | alphaferret | that would be nice |
| 17:57.46 | EEsam | will do a screen capture |
| 17:57.56 | alphaferret | i believe you |
| 17:58.35 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/hwiy0yinxla8304/Capture2.PNG?dl=0 |
| 17:58.36 | Plugh | EEsam: How long is "ages"? |
| 17:58.38 | alphaferret | is there a way to increase step size in spice so that it doesn't take so long |
| 17:59.29 | alphaferret | that's not 50 it's 49 |
| 17:59.42 | alphaferret | which actually is ok for me i just want to understand what's what |
| 18:01.49 | EEsam | think so, you can definitely turn down accuracy. The simulation isn't taking that long for me, but I'm using a 12-core xeon. |
| 18:02.06 | EEsam | Beta matrix optimisations might help |
| 18:02.08 | alphaferret | pffff |
| 18:02.31 | alphaferret | what about loading the switcher before the regulator |
| 18:03.00 | EEsam | by the looks of it it's stable by about 4ms |
| 18:03.20 | alphaferret | stable but it never hits 50 |
| 18:03.25 | alphaferret | it's 49.x |
| 18:03.29 | alphaferret | low 49's |
| 18:03.55 | alphaferret | put 10k across it and it looks a lot better |
| 18:05.02 | EEsam | is the 50v needed for anything? |
| 18:05.50 | alphaferret | no i need 48, jsut picked 50 at random to regulate down to 48 |
| 18:06.11 | EEsam | I guess you just want to ensure the regulator has enough input to guarantee 48V out |
| 18:06.37 | alphaferret | technically there's enough drop but when 50v is stable the 48v looks a lot better, ruler flat |
| 18:09.11 | *** join/#kicad ferdna (~ferdna@cpe-69-23-129-73.elp.res.rr.com) |
| 18:09.21 | EEsam | I'm just having a play around with it now |
| 18:09.29 | alphaferret | ok thanks for the help |
| 18:10.20 | alphaferret | i'm running this on a virtual 12-core xeon |
| 18:10.23 | alphaferret | :) |
| 18:12.26 | *** join/#kicad bugzc (~1@unaffiliated/bugzc) |
| 18:14.18 | *** join/#kicad _abc_ (~user@unaffiliated/ccbbaa) |
| 18:15.50 | *** join/#kicad iaglium (~i@45.63.97.181) |
| 18:18.57 | *** join/#kicad drod (~ldm@ip-95-221-235-169.bb.netbynet.ru) |
| 18:23.56 | EEsam | it could be current limiting, it's above 500mA |
| 18:24.33 | alphaferret | the switcher? |
| 18:25.01 | EEsam | yeah |
| 18:25.11 | alphaferret | hmmm ok so i'll work on reducing switch current |
| 18:25.42 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/aeqkq0zywd7zkrw/Capture3.PNG?dl=0 |
| 18:26.22 | alphaferret | where did you take the test point |
| 18:29.20 | alphaferret | yep you're right |
| 18:33.12 | *** join/#kicad kakimir (kakimir@sienimetsa.wtf) |
| 18:37.56 | EEsam | I noticed the output was a bit over 48V, you might get a bit more stability by adjusting the feedback resistors, just trying that now. |
| 18:38.43 | alphaferret | 48.3 is fine |
| 18:39.02 | alphaferret | 45-52 is fine |
| 18:39.39 | EEsam | I mean if 50V is more like 48.4-49V, you'd get a cleaner output if it was 48V not 48.3V |
| 18:44.56 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/zgf7g20ovoqmdyj/Capture4.PNG?dl=0 |
| 18:46.09 | alphaferret | the cleanest so far is raising r4 to 1k, higher r4 goes cleaner the regulator gets |
| 18:46.57 | alphaferret | so i'm tempted to just add in series 500r-1k |
| 18:48.01 | *** join/#kicad CarlPoirier (~CarlPoiri@modemcable019.249-59-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 18:48.49 | EEsam | if you can accept a bit less than 48V, as long as you're dropping 1V or something like that through the regulator you should get a clean output. |
| 18:48.51 | alphaferret | and the inductor steadies well below 500mA after 3.8ms |
| 18:49.08 | alphaferret | yea i can go to 47 or 46 |
| 18:49.20 | EEsam | that'll be fine |
| 18:51.46 | alphaferret | L between c1 and c5 for a pi filter |
| 18:52.26 | EEsam | I briefly tried that |
| 18:52.40 | GyrosGeier | hm |
| 18:52.52 | GyrosGeier | can I paint off-grid in the component editor? |
| 18:54.28 | GyrosGeier | http://psi5.com/~geier/TVS.png |
| 18:54.34 | GyrosGeier | the left diode is a zener |
| 18:54.47 | xzcvczx | lol you are really bothering to be so precise? |
| 18:54.55 | xzcvczx | and you can edit the grid to make it smaller to do that |
| 18:55.15 | xzcvczx | for that sort of thing i just use a box, otherwise the symbol just ends up being stupidly huge |
| 18:55.30 | xzcvczx | its pretty obvious what it is based on its connections and part number |
| 18:56.01 | EEsam | alphaferret: ugh ltspice decided to quit on me, so I'll call it a day there, hadn't saved recently, good luck with it, only testing it in real life will tell how it'll perform. |
| 18:56.12 | alphaferret | thanks for the help |
| 18:56.23 | alphaferret | every bit counts |
| 18:57.31 | EEsam | just keep everything really tight in the layout, at 1.5MHz you really want the inductor as close to that switch pin as possible. It'll oscillate really bad otherwise and no amount of playing with the compensation network will save you ;) |
| 18:58.44 | alphaferret | yea it's going to be tighter than (lude analogy) |
| 18:58.59 | EEsam | great stuff |
| 19:05.34 | GyrosGeier | xzcvczx, can I really edit the grid in the component editor? |
| 19:05.57 | GyrosGeier | ooooh |
| 19:06.01 | GyrosGeier | that is well hidden |
| 19:06.19 | xzcvczx | not really.... its in preferences |
| 19:06.25 | xzcvczx | or well library editor options as they call it |
| 19:08.03 | GyrosGeier | hm |
| 19:08.15 | GyrosGeier | do we have a library for Diodes Inc. |
| 19:10.07 | reportingsjr | GyrosGeier: doesn't look like it |
| 19:12.32 | GyrosGeier | hmm |
| 19:12.37 | GyrosGeier | ESD_Protection.lib |
| 19:16.53 | *** join/#kicad DocScrutinizer05 (~saturn@openmoko/engineers/joerg) |
| 19:17.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | hi! |
| 19:22.20 | alphaferret | what's up doc |
| 19:24.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | jackass |
| 19:25.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | forgot to set autojoin on this chan |
| 19:25.55 | xzcvczx | thinks DocScrutinizer05 needs "is a" between /me and jackass |
| 19:26.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | <--- jackass |
| 19:26.26 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry for any ambiguity |
| 19:27.42 | c4757p | xzcvczx <-- jackass |
| 19:27.45 | DocScrutinizer05 | usually I don't do this. another proof I'm a jackass that I forgot about it ;-) |
| 19:27.47 | decimad | take stefan's autojoin ;) |
| 19:27.47 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:27.51 | decimad | lol |
| 19:27.59 | xzcvczx | c4757p <-- american |
| 19:28.03 | c4757p | true! |
| 19:28.15 | alphaferret | jackass |
| 19:28.26 | xzcvczx | c4757p: oh i thought we were just randomly insulting each other |
| 19:28.34 | xzcvczx | didn't mean to say something true |
| 19:28.38 | alphaferret | me too, that's always a good assumption |
| 19:29.08 | *** join/#kicad kyranf (~kyranf@s209-121-157-74.bc.hsia.telus.net) |
| 19:29.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | I also just a hour ago "found out about" http://kicad-pcb.org/download/open-suse/ |
| 19:30.21 | GyrosGeier | hm |
| 19:30.31 | GyrosGeier | can I have multiple sheets that are not a hierarchy? |
| 19:30.47 | xzcvczx | no |
| 19:31.04 | GyrosGeier | basically, the toplevel would be empty, and there are five subsheets with the four I/O banks of the central controller IC |
| 19:32.01 | xzcvczx | well the top level will just have the 3 subsheets on it |
| 19:32.02 | xzcvczx | s/3/4 |
| 19:32.06 | GyrosGeier | hmm |
| 19:32.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | GyrosGeier: that's why we had to do stuff like http://wstaw.org/m/2016/09/05/plasma-desktopCK2309.png |
| 19:32.28 | GyrosGeier | lol "Click here" |
| 19:32.35 | c4757p | I don't mind that, honestly. gives a nice listing of the sheets |
| 19:33.18 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:34.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | would be even nicer if you could also adjust relative position of sheetname in relation to sheet symbol |
| 19:34.35 | xzcvczx | i despise heirachial most the time |
| 19:34.37 | c4757p | that's on the new format feature wishlist |
| 19:34.42 | xzcvczx | esspecially how its not just infinite zoom |
| 19:34.45 | c4757p | xzcvczx: I despise you most of the time, but I put up with you |
| 19:34.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | xzcvczx: me too |
| 19:35.21 | xzcvczx | c4757p: says the prick that booted me after saying 2 words in an irc channel o_O |
| 19:35.29 | c4757p | /I/ didn't boot you :) |
| 19:35.34 | xzcvczx | you did so |
| 19:35.37 | reportingsjr | what were the words, fuck you? |
| 19:35.38 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:35.41 | c4757p | reportingsjr: p much |
| 19:35.44 | xzcvczx | no nothering of the sort |
| 19:35.46 | reportingsjr | haha |
| 19:35.47 | c4757p | he got booted by ktemkin :D |
| 19:35.52 | xzcvczx | i was very polite and the bastard kicked me |
| 19:36.12 | xzcvczx | c4757p: thats why the bot sayed "kicked at request of c4757p"? |
| 19:36.15 | xzcvczx | i believe you |
| 19:36.19 | c4757p | pretty sure it didn't :P |
| 19:36.31 | xzcvczx | you can be pretty sure all you like |
| 19:36.34 | c4757p | hey, I've had ops in here for a while now and I've yet to kick you :D |
| 19:36.48 | xzcvczx | because for some reason you think you need to behave in ehre |
| 19:37.00 | c4757p | okay, hands up |
| 19:37.00 | xzcvczx | i think i have only seen you kick 1 person and that was ee with the flood yesterday |
| 19:37.02 | reportingsjr | hahaha |
| 19:37.03 | c4757p | who thinks I behave? |
| 19:37.10 | DocScrutinizer05 | hey, iirc you were not even aware you have +o, until maybe 2 weeks ago |
| 19:37.17 | reportingsjr | keeps his hands down |
| 19:37.20 | c4757p | 2 weeks is a lot of time to kick xz |
| 19:38.13 | xzcvczx | only because you are really slow |
| 19:38.29 | DocScrutinizer05 | c4757p: yeah, but before that point in time, you hardly could have kicked anybody ;-) |
| 19:39.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | whatever, I'm more interested in how to install nightly and stable in same user account (linux) concurrently |
| 19:39.59 | c4757p | shrugs |
| 19:40.24 | c4757p | I kick Problems - spammers, legit trolls, pastefloods, bouncers (*shoots stefan a glare*), etc :P |
| 19:40.31 | c4757p | xz is just a jackass, not a problem :D |
| 19:40.52 | DocScrutinizer05 | no, i'm the jackass! |
| 19:41.00 | c4757p | we're all jackasses :) |
| 19:41.08 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@159.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:41.45 | c4757p | ... |
| 19:42.00 | c4757p | glares at ChanServ too, isn't authorized to give him a temporary time-out |
| 19:42.07 | *** join/#kicad CarlPoirier (~CarlPoiri@modemcable019.249-59-74.mc.videotron.ca) |
| 19:43.36 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@159.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:43.36 | DocScrutinizer05 | what's wrong with chanserv? |
| 19:43.46 | xzcvczx | yeah you talking out yo ass c4 |
| 19:43.57 | c4757p | nothing's wrong with it, I'm just glaring at it |
| 19:44.01 | c4757p | as it holds the permission bits ;) |
| 19:44.17 | xzcvczx | wonders if repair is anything other than download everything and reinstall everything on windows |
| 19:45.20 | *** join/#kicad berkutta (~quassel@80-219-171-127.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:45.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah, repair is fdisk c: |
| 19:45.45 | xzcvczx | nah app repair |
| 19:45.50 | xzcvczx | msvc was broke for some reason |
| 19:46.36 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:49.02 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~eeshow |
| 19:49.02 | infobot | extra, extra, read all about it, eeshow is https://neo900.org/git?p=eeshow;a=summary, or https://neo900.org/stuff/werner/tmp/eeshow/ |
| 19:49.29 | *** join/#kicad C47 (~d3bug@189.242.30.227) |
| 19:49.49 | DocScrutinizer05 | infobot: no, eeshow is https://neo900.org/stuff/eeshow/ and https://neo900.org/git?p=eeshow;a=summary |
| 19:49.49 | infobot | okay, DocScrutinizer05 |
| 19:50.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~eeshow |
| 19:50.04 | infobot | [eeshow] https://neo900.org/stuff/eeshow/ and https://neo900.org/git?p=eeshow;a=summary |
| 19:50.50 | xzcvczx | errr wtf is infobot |
| 19:51.22 | *** join/#kicad 64MAAUYTW (~quassel@80-219-171-127.dclient.hispeed.ch) |
| 19:51.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~+help |
| 19:52.11 | xzcvczx | oh god... get it the fuck out |
| 19:52.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, why? |
| 19:52.44 | Kinnison | Ban it |
| 19:52.48 | Kinnison | in-channel bots are EVIL |
| 19:52.52 | xzcvczx | ^^ |
| 19:53.08 | DocScrutinizer05 | Kinnison: coordinated with chanop |
| 19:53.24 | Kinnison | remains convinced that they're EVIL |
| 19:53.28 | DocScrutinizer05 | and no need to ban anything, will leave chan on request of chanops |
| 19:53.32 | Kinnison | if you want a bot, it should respond by /msg |
| 19:53.36 | Kinnison | ONLY |
| 19:53.39 | gordonjcp | Kinnison: doc smith reference? |
| 19:53.53 | Kinnison | gordonjcp: non-sequitur, but yes :-) |
| 19:53.58 | c4757p | I'll change my mind if it's going to be annoying |
| 19:54.12 | gordonjcp | Kinnison: :-) |
| 19:55.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | the bot only replies when addressed. The main purpose however is for providing "bookmarks" to other chan users, so answering in query or msg is not exactly useful |
| 19:55.38 | c4757p | yes, but you can test it in query |
| 19:55.42 | c4757p | that long list is just annoying |
| 19:55.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes, sorry |
| 19:55.47 | xzcvczx | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:55.58 | DocScrutinizer05 | it is, unless you use ~+ |
| 19:56.10 | xzcvczx | no it should still only be in msg |
| 19:56.16 | xzcvczx | its way too long to be in channel |
| 19:56.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | which I did as answer to >><xzcvczx> errr wtf is infobot<< |
| 19:56.37 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@159.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 19:56.50 | xzcvczx | and it should only ever respond to first character |
| 19:56.57 | xzcvczx | not if there is a space before hand |
| 19:56.59 | *** mode/#kicad [+o c4757p] by ChanServ |
| 19:57.09 | *** mode/#kicad [+b *!*@159.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] by c4757p |
| 19:57.18 | xzcvczx | ++ |
| 19:57.25 | decimad | i wonder if xxx.com is really the best example! |
| 19:57.27 | *** mode/#kicad [-o c4757p] by c4757p |
| 19:57.35 | c4757p | remind me to remove that later, since I can't do a timed one |
| 19:57.48 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 19:58.14 | Kinnison | solves the problem with a nice simple 20:58 Ignoring ALL from infobot |
| 19:58.15 | alphaferret | fuck i spent all day on ocd 8570 calculations, then loaded up 8330 and with no calculations and it works better than the 8570 oh well |
| 19:58.27 | xzcvczx | DocScrutinizer05: and a general etiquette lesson for you.... on irc bots should only be from channel owners or you should request persmission before they say anything at all, prefereably before they are even introduced to the channel |
| 19:58.40 | c4757p | xzcvczx: he did ask permission, relax dude |
| 19:58.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | xzcvczx: please read what I wrote |
| 19:59.00 | EEsam | <alphaferret>: are you f**king kidding me ;) |
| 19:59.10 | c4757p | I'm not going to put up with Bot Politics though, if arguments continue I will revoke permission no matter how unfair |
| 19:59.15 | alphaferret | well not ALL day but yea it looks like 8330 is good |
| 19:59.30 | alphaferret | maybe due to the 1A switch |
| 19:59.39 | xzcvczx | oh ok, i didn't see when permission was asked, my bad |
| 19:59.49 | xzcvczx | but yeah /me also /ignores |
| 20:00.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | c4757p: I'm not interested in doing bot politics discussions |
| 20:00.28 | alphaferret | and it takes longer to stabilize >4ms |
| 20:00.52 | EEsam | the 8330? |
| 20:00.57 | alphaferret | yes |
| 20:01.08 | xzcvczx | DocScrutinizer05: but yeah to a certain degree pointing bots to people can also be a good idea.... aka ~eeshow c4757p would pm c4 that information |
| 20:01.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | ~tell xzcvczx about eeshow |
| 20:01.50 | xzcvczx | well i have it /ignored so that does nothing :) |
| 20:01.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | which will have failed since you got it on iggnore |
| 20:01.56 | Kinnison | ponders ignoring all talk with a ~ on the front too |
| 20:02.03 | Kinnison | because more irritating than the bot is people talking to it |
| 20:02.05 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight_ (~Thunderbi@166.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:02.10 | decimad | lol |
| 20:02.38 | alphaferret | ~ponders the same thing |
| 20:02.41 | Wetmelon | Hello #kicad! |
| 20:02.50 | Kinnison | hands Wetmelon a towel |
| 20:02.52 | decimad | Is Thunderbi a new sexuality? |
| 20:03.13 | decimad | Sorry Wetmelon ;) |
| 20:03.15 | Wetmelon | There was some discussion a while back about being able to set up "zones" on the PCB which would adhere to different DRC. Is that still in progress? |
| 20:03.18 | Wetmelon | heh |
| 20:03.39 | alphaferret | yep 8330 rock solid |
| 20:04.44 | EEsam | oh well sometimes it just goes like that, peddling away on one thing for ages to find a different component/circuit just works out of the box.. |
| 20:05.29 | xzcvczx | Wetmelon: what do you mean adhere to different drc? |
| 20:05.41 | Kinnison | drc zones would be awesomely useful |
| 20:05.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | different rules apply in that zone? |
| 20:05.51 | alphaferret | originally i picked the 8330 because of something i don't even remember, oh yea it can go into discontinuous mode |
| 20:05.52 | Wetmelon | For example "min trace spacing" |
| 20:06.02 | Wetmelon | yes, Altium has a term for them that I'm forgetting |
| 20:06.12 | alphaferret | so i though oh i need to torment myself and be pro use something with lots of calculations |
| 20:06.21 | *** join/#kicad ricardocrudo (~ricardocr@ip5f5bf536.dynamic.kabel-deutschland.de) |
| 20:06.39 | Wetmelon | So for example you could set a zone under a BGA with tighter allowed spacing and smaller min trace width |
| 20:07.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | makes a lot of sense to me |
| 20:07.12 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight_ (~Thunderbi@166.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:07.15 | alphaferret | but who the fuck knows maybe it's just they used a different diode on the example switch |
| 20:08.11 | xzcvczx | Wetmelon: can't you set the settings for each individual zone? |
| 20:08.19 | EEsam | what's the current limit on the 8330? |
| 20:08.55 | alphaferret | power switch is 1A 60v |
| 20:09.01 | alphaferret | not sure if you meant output current |
| 20:09.31 | Wetmelon | xzcvczx: That's what I'm asking lol. When you say zone, do you mean polygon/pour/etc? Because I'm talking about traces |
| 20:09.36 | Wetmelon | You can set them for each individual trace |
| 20:09.40 | Wetmelon | s/trace/net |
| 20:09.53 | xzcvczx | oh well you have net classes |
| 20:09.57 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight_ (~Thunderbi@166.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:10.00 | xzcvczx | my bad i was a bit confused |
| 20:10.10 | xzcvczx | so you mean an area of the board that has different drc |
| 20:10.20 | Wetmelon | Yes |
| 20:10.42 | xzcvczx | the problem i see with that is it would conflict with net classes woudl it not? |
| 20:10.54 | EEsam | yeah, well it'll have some current limit at the maximum current (or on some devices it's resistor programmable). Yeah well as the 8570 was possibly current limiting around 500mA possibly, a 1A device is a nice bit of overhead, so long as it's still efficient at usual operating currents. |
| 20:11.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | to avoid getting any bot involved into the topic: please see latest (now prolly final) release of eeshow at https://neo900.org/stuff/eeshow/ |
| 20:11.39 | *** join/#kicad oldtopman (~oldtopman@unaffiliated/oldtopman) |
| 20:12.02 | *** join/#kicad mithro (sid24875@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zlxtznsfuegvltmn) |
| 20:12.02 | *** join/#kicad seve (~seve@2604:180:2:1c3::27bd) |
| 20:12.02 | *** join/#kicad c4757p (c4757p@2604:a880:0:1010::631:8001) |
| 20:12.11 | alphaferret | it's a bit over my head. it uses smaller inductor and steady freq at 2Mhz |
| 20:12.32 | EEsam | you typically need bigger inductors to be stable at lower output currents |
| 20:12.32 | xzcvczx | Wetmelon: aka what takes precedence? net class or area of the board |
| 20:12.50 | c4757p | does the netsplit dance |
| 20:12.58 | EEsam | higher frequency also reduces inductor size.... |
| 20:13.05 | xzcvczx | c4757p: haha how many died? |
| 20:13.14 | alphaferret | right i knew about the higher frequency |
| 20:13.24 | alphaferret | but it's not that much higher 2Mhz vs 1.5Mhz |
| 20:13.39 | EEsam | but it's also twice the output current... |
| 20:13.42 | c4757p | xzcvczx: a few screenfuls from my perspective |
| 20:13.56 | alphaferret | it's not happy at 300r, 566 it was good |
| 20:14.17 | xzcvczx | c4757p: ah ok, i have quits/joins ignored so yeah i don't see the beauty of splits :( |
| 20:15.23 | alphaferret | hmmm interesting at 300r the 8330 puts out 47.7v and i had the 3012 set for 48 but i guess it just went for nominal drop and regulated down to 47.4v |
| 20:15.35 | *** mode/#kicad [+o c4757p] by ChanServ |
| 20:15.45 | *** mode/#kicad [-b *!*@159.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] by c4757p |
| 20:16.13 | *** mode/#kicad [+b *!~Thunderb*@*.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] by c4757p |
| 20:16.32 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 20:16.38 | xzcvczx | c4757p: why not just ban the username? |
| 20:16.38 | c4757p | oh, gj c4757p |
| 20:16.48 | c4757p | because the client usually tries an alternate :P |
| 20:16.52 | xzcvczx | aka /mode +b *!~Thunderb*@* |
| 20:17.02 | c4757p | ah, right, username, not nick, herp derp |
| 20:17.05 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 20:17.08 | *** mode/#kicad [-b *!~Thunderb*@*.red-88-5-117.dynamicip.rima-tde.net] by c4757p |
| 20:17.20 | EEsam | yeah the 3012 will I guess drop a minimum of 0.3V |
| 20:17.22 | xzcvczx | username/ident whatever its called these days |
| 20:17.26 | *** mode/#kicad [+b *!~Thunderbi@*] by c4757p |
| 20:17.37 | *** mode/#kicad [-o c4757p] by c4757p |
| 20:17.40 | c4757p | grumbles |
| 20:18.25 | xzcvczx | wonders why irc servers even bother looking for ident these days |
| 20:18.28 | decimad | our hero! |
| 20:18.31 | c4757p | lol |
| 20:18.31 | xzcvczx | seems to just be a waste of time |
| 20:19.19 | EEsam | has stefan_slight actually posted anything? |
| 20:19.28 | c4757p | well, the plan was for me to be less derpy and get the mask right the first time ;) |
| 20:19.40 | *** join/#kicad oxapentane (~greg@92.38.168.1) |
| 20:20.23 | c4757p | EEsam: no idea |
| 20:20.47 | xzcvczx | EEsam: the same can be said for 60% of people in this channel |
| 20:21.11 | c4757p | yo archivist - can I have +b perms on ChanServ? so I can place timed bans instead of having to lift manually? |
| 20:21.13 | xzcvczx | i don't understand how people can leave a connection open forever, i mean sure i sometimes do until i restart my computer but then i can't be bothered rejoining everywhere |
| 20:21.33 | EEsam | maybe people just love watching the stream of comments |
| 20:21.57 | c4757p | I don't have to rejoin everywhere, if I like a channel I put it in my join-on-start list :P |
| 20:22.24 | xzcvczx | meh kicad is my only 24/7 channel |
| 20:22.45 | c4757p | EEsam: I stick around in a few channels where I don't say much. once in a while they say something interesting and I'll jump in for the first time that month :D |
| 20:22.57 | xzcvczx | and irssi is a pain in the ass when you have over 9 windows open anyways |
| 20:23.09 | c4757p | (though those channels are the first to go if I want to add another-- already have enough to make it a bit annoying to manage them) |
| 20:23.25 | c4757p | xzcvczx: I've mapped two entire rows of ten keys to switch windows |
| 20:23.30 | c4757p | so I can do 20 easily :) |
| 20:24.11 | EEsam | show off ;) |
| 20:24.16 | c4757p | :) |
| 20:24.28 | EEsam | it's not quantity of tabs... |
| 20:24.29 | c4757p | esc + 1..0 goes to window 1..10 |
| 20:24.37 | c4757p | then esc + the key under each of those goes to 1..20 |
| 20:24.53 | xzcvczx | esc? |
| 20:24.58 | c4757p | or alt |
| 20:25.02 | xzcvczx | so you need 2 hands for 890? |
| 20:25.15 | c4757p | I usually do type two-handed ;) |
| 20:25.51 | EEsam | what? you can type with two hands.. never thought of that, I recon that could be more efficient :p |
| 20:26.14 | *** join/#kicad berjan_ (~chatzilla@vpn097101.vpn.utwente.nl) |
| 20:26.20 | c4757p | haha |
| 20:26.56 | alphaferret | ok simulating burst mode now, 3k4 load |
| 20:27.28 | *** join/#kicad tcurdt (~tcurdt@5.189.136.58) |
| 20:27.33 | xzcvczx | finally, found whats caused the performance of my macmini to be as slow as c4 |
| 20:28.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | single handed typing? |
| 20:28.40 | EEsam | :D you have a dirty mind doc. |
| 20:28.51 | DocScrutinizer05 | I know :-) |
| 20:29.11 | c4757p | 's'okay, only reason I didn't mention it is I couldn't think of a sufficiently funny interjection in time |
| 20:29.13 | GyrosGeier | there is a picture viewer called pornview |
| 20:29.24 | GyrosGeier | all the keyboard shortcuts are on the left half of the keyboard |
| 20:29.59 | c4757p | approves of this |
| 20:30.08 | *** part/#kicad oxapentane (~greg@92.38.168.1) |
| 20:30.13 | EEsam | is that beneficial to right-handed or left-handed people? |
| 20:30.29 | c4757p | right-handed, ofc ;) |
| 20:30.38 | xzcvczx | no one cares about right handers |
| 20:30.42 | xzcvczx | they should be shot |
| 20:30.49 | EEsam | as a left-handed person I was confused |
| 20:31.06 | EEsam | or offended |
| 20:31.24 | *** join/#kicad odo2063 (~eni@p4FE9A380.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:32.10 | alphaferret | hmm rock solid in supposed burst mode, which i was warned not to use |
| 20:32.24 | *** join/#kicad irw (~irw@bl14-162-154.dsl.telepac.pt) |
| 20:32.26 | EEsam | warned not to use? |
| 20:32.31 | EEsam | by whom or what? |
| 20:33.28 | nickoe | c4757p: do you use kicad at work? |
| 20:33.54 | alphaferret | various nefarious kicadders |
| 20:34.00 | nickoe | maybe negotiate to get time for kicad dev in every other sprint :P |
| 20:34.06 | c4757p | nickoe: when I do hardware. I haven't in a while |
| 20:34.16 | alphaferret | but they could be right, haven't done noise analysis |
| 20:34.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | alphaferret: what critter you mess with? |
| 20:34.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | MCU? |
| 20:34.54 | c4757p | if you're going for absolute lowest noise, yes, avoid burst mode, it tends to produce lower-frequency noise that is harder to filter. but you're not a good engineer if you're going for absolute lowest |
| 20:34.56 | c4757p | have a number, meet it |
| 20:35.13 | c4757p | if you can meet your requirement and still allow it to run in burst mode, then do so. |
| 20:35.15 | alphaferret | i got some switchers ltspiced up lt8570 and lt8330 into lt3012 regulator |
| 20:35.45 | xzcvczx | oh the irony of c4757p telling someone they aren't a real engineer |
| 20:35.57 | alphaferret | you should have ended that sentence with 'im not a good engineer' |
| 20:36.02 | alphaferret | which is certainly accurate |
| 20:36.17 | c4757p | I'm not saying he's not a real engineer, I'm saying how he should think if he wants to be one ;) |
| 20:37.29 | EEsam | with lower frequency converters (still above audible frequency) when you get into pulse skipping and frequency modulation you can end up hearing the bastard |
| 20:37.50 | alphaferret | right it's still way above audio spectrum even when it's bursting |
| 20:38.18 | c4757p | if that's the case it's probably fine. |
| 20:38.35 | EEsam | but the ripple current through some components may be much slower if it's modulating at a low frequency.. |
| 20:38.57 | alphaferret | hopefully the regulator will take care of that |
| 20:39.06 | EEsam | the 8330 is at 2MHz so you're probably safe! |
| 20:39.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | alphaferret: >> Low Ripple Burst Mode®<< |
| 20:39.33 | alphaferret | right i saw that |
| 20:39.44 | alphaferret | i thought it was just fluff though :) |
| 20:39.47 | xzcvczx | c4757p: hmmm you are an engineer... tell me.... is a piezo sensor with wires attached enough to hear music if you are buy a high power transmitter? |
| 20:40.00 | xzcvczx | piezo sensor/transducer |
| 20:40.26 | c4757p | a piezo? yeah, if you end up getting some parasitic resonances and nonlinearities in the right place |
| 20:40.35 | EEsam | how loud's your music :p |
| 20:40.57 | xzcvczx | EEsam: quiet enough that i wasn't sure if i was just going c4757p |
| 20:41.07 | xzcvczx | woops stupid autocorrect..... "if i was just going nuts" |
| 20:41.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | xzcvczx: no, since you lack the nonlinear component to demodulate the RF AM |
| 20:42.17 | xzcvczx | DocScrutinizer05: in which case i will make sure i record it next time :) |
| 20:42.22 | c4757p | well, if you're trying to /make/ one, sure. but lots of things are unintentionally nonlinear |
| 20:42.32 | c4757p | just look at some of how the first radios were constructed |
| 20:42.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | xzcvczx: well, I don't know for sure if there's a nonlinear component in your piezo |
| 20:43.39 | xzcvczx | it would most likely be going straight to a micro pin, maybe from an amp |
| 20:43.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | c4757p: indeed. And there are confirmed reports of even a steel pot on the oven creating a receiver for American Forces Network |
| 20:43.58 | xzcvczx | (haven't opened the case) |
| 20:43.58 | c4757p | indeed |
| 20:44.12 | c4757p | going to a micro pin? well, there's your diode |
| 20:44.16 | c4757p | case closed :P |
| 20:44.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | thought it was about design |
| 20:44.33 | nickoe | DocScrutinizer05: ohh, eeshow starts to look awesome :) |
| 20:44.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-D |
| 20:44.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 20:44.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | kudos to wpwrak |
| 20:45.16 | alphaferret | DocScrutinizer05, I am reserving 10 minutes of your time this week for another strategy session, my brain is too fried to think straight tonight |
| 20:45.30 | DocScrutinizer05 | k |
| 20:45.32 | alphaferret | thx |
| 20:45.53 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: re piezo, easily |
| 20:46.12 | nickoe | DocScrutinizer05: wpwrak has always been awesome to create stuff |
| 20:46.19 | *** join/#kicad mgottschlag (~quassel@reactos/tester/phoenix64) |
| 20:46.21 | DocScrutinizer05 | yes |
| 20:46.26 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: a friend of my father's once said he'd been able to hear radio transmissions on his *hifi speakers* with the amp disconnected as he was packing to move |
| 20:46.47 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: ... from his flat within direct line of sight to the Eiffel Tower, when it was used as an MF broadcast mast |
| 20:47.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | oh! |
| 20:47.53 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, considering even air itself is nonlinear to sonic waves... |
| 20:49.56 | DocScrutinizer05 | kicking out air molecules of a given volume is more efficient than waiting for them to re-enter same volume |
| 20:50.02 | xzcvczx | gordonjcp: when did the eiffel tower stop being a mf mast? |
| 20:50.40 | alphaferret | bookmarking discussion of huchison effect for later date |
| 20:51.01 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: not sure |
| 20:51.05 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: maybe it still is |
| 20:51.19 | xzcvczx | not sure if people would be welcome up it if it still were |
| 20:51.51 | xzcvczx | or is mf not that high power *shrug* |
| 20:52.00 | *** join/#kicad Plugh (~kcozens@CPE68b6fc4e50b3-CM68b6fc4e50b0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 20:52.46 | DocScrutinizer05 | I _seem_ to recall that use been retired several years ago |
| 20:54.11 | xzcvczx | hmm still fm and digital tv apparently |
| 20:54.32 | xzcvczx | fm @ max 10kW |
| 20:54.33 | Bird|otherbox | gordonjcp: not surprising, considering how easy it is to accidentally create a rectifying junction :p |
| 20:54.42 | gordonjcp | Bird|otherbox: yup |
| 20:54.48 | xzcvczx | tv @ 100kW |
| 20:54.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eiffel_Tower#Communications |
| 20:55.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | xzcvczx: those will be well out of reach of any humans |
| 20:56.15 | DocScrutinizer05 | RF killed quite a few field service technicians |
| 20:56.41 | xzcvczx | lol that doesn't make it inaccessiable |
| 20:56.51 | xzcvczx | that just makes it slightly more complicated to get around security |
| 20:57.39 | DocScrutinizer05 | yeah sure, you can climb up any arbitrary power pylon as well |
| 20:58.46 | xzcvczx | haha |
| 20:58.47 | DocScrutinizer05 | I however would rather jump down than climb up to the antennas if I was to hurt myself |
| 20:59.13 | xzcvczx | do you know how hard it is to climb up round wood power pylons? |
| 20:59.24 | DocScrutinizer05 | that's probably also not easy but possible on Tour Eiffel |
| 21:00.01 | DocScrutinizer05 | wood? where you're living? |
| 21:00.11 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 21:00.17 | xzcvczx | we have a shitton of wood power poles still |
| 21:00.24 | c4757p | wait |
| 21:00.30 | c4757p | what /else/ do you make a power pole from? o_O |
| 21:00.36 | xzcvczx | metal |
| 21:00.37 | DocScrutinizer05 | https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Hochspannungsmast_ww_IMGP4430.jpg |
| 21:00.40 | gordonjcp | c4757p: concrete |
| 21:00.49 | gordonjcp | xzcvczx: you get strap-on pole spikes |
| 21:00.52 | xzcvczx | who the hell makes them out of concrete |
| 21:00.53 | c4757p | oh, well, yeah, metal like that for the /huge/ ones |
| 21:00.57 | c4757p | concrete is silly |
| 21:01.01 | EEsam | metal conducts electricity, that's a stupid idea ? |
| 21:01.15 | c4757p | so does wet wood |
| 21:01.17 | xzcvczx | EEsam: thats what the insulators are for that the wire sits on |
| 21:01.25 | c4757p | that's why god invented insulators ;) |
| 21:01.40 | xzcvczx | or hangs from in some cases |
| 21:02.21 | xzcvczx | goddamn windows.... "Configuring System...Please wait" takes 10x longer than the damn install |
| 21:03.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | fix it! format & fdisk do a great job on that ;-) |
| 21:04.39 | xzcvczx | lol, i don't think thats a good idea, as this is based on a free win 10 |
| 21:04.49 | xzcvczx | when i never had a legit win7 |
| 21:05.14 | decimad | \o/ xzcvczx on windoze! |
| 21:05.21 | *** join/#kicad Fleck (~fleck@unaffiliated/fleck) |
| 21:05.33 | c4757p | eww, xz on windows? |
| 21:05.33 | xzcvczx | no, that ain't gonna happen.... its a vm that i can use with msvc |
| 21:05.36 | c4757p | so much for that respect I had |
| 21:05.37 | xzcvczx | the only reason i bother |
| 21:05.58 | xzcvczx | c4757p: yet you still have more respect for me than i do for you |
| 21:06.01 | decimad | why? |
| 21:06.02 | xzcvczx | so i am happy with that |
| 21:06.12 | xzcvczx | decimad: because msvc doesn't work for shit in wine |
| 21:06.15 | c4757p | lol |
| 21:06.35 | decimad | what do you need msvc for? |
| 21:07.56 | xzcvczx | to test the very occasional thing.... waht else would one use msvc for? |
| 21:08.12 | decimad | true development, instead of playing around! |
| 21:08.18 | c4757p | eew |
| 21:09.20 | xzcvczx | one can not true dev on anything ms has released |
| 21:09.26 | decimad | xzcvczx think about how productive you'd be tracking down c4757p's bugs! :P |
| 21:09.48 | xzcvczx | decimad: i find a flamethrower is much more successful at getting rid of c4's bugs |
| 21:09.57 | *** join/#kicad maartenBE (~maarten@ptr-2hj4tbw72shbhqkz7unph5byh.ip6.access.telenet.be) |
| 21:10.14 | xzcvczx | either fire it at c4 and no more bugs.... or burn up whatever the shit hes written is running on and hey no more bugs |
| 21:10.36 | decimad | it will also destroy any functionality |
| 21:10.43 | xzcvczx | if you need to do the former reduce the paperwork by saying he had the plague |
| 21:10.46 | decimad | deperate means! |
| 21:10.50 | decimad | +s |
| 21:11.03 | xzcvczx | desperate means call for desperate measures :) |
| 21:11.20 | xzcvczx | or deperate means calls for a median |
| 21:11.28 | decimad | with msvc you hadn |
| 21:11.35 | decimad | 't gotten into this situation ;) |
| 21:13.47 | decimad | I expect you're only searching for weaknesses and then you'll flame about it! |
| 21:14.42 | EEsam | I know I mentioned this earlier, but does anyone know for certain whether paths work or not, in eeschema/library editor for fields like datasheet, MPN etc. I use kicad on multiple computers and need to reference locations on my dropbox as I do for footprints and 3d models. |
| 21:15.48 | EEsam | ... as it's not working for me |
| 21:18.56 | nickoe | EEsam: what paths? |
| 21:19.08 | nickoe | I am sure c4757p can tell you they don't work as you expect... |
| 21:19.26 | Thor-Arne | EEsam: you need to have the paths set in preferences->configure paths, then you can add the pdfs from the symbol editor |
| 21:19.26 | EEsam | paths ${} |
| 21:19.49 | Thor-Arne | that dont work inside the editor |
| 21:21.28 | *** join/#kicad tannewt (~textual@c-71-231-55-126.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 21:21.46 | Thor-Arne | this will probably change in the next version of eeschema |
| 21:22.15 | EEsam | my paths work within pcbnew and footprint editor, they are declared in the opening kicad page preferences-> configure paths |
| 21:23.00 | Thor-Arne | yeah, but eeschema isnt there yet |
| 21:23.07 | DocScrutinizer05 | :-/ |
| 21:23.48 | Thor-Arne | kicad will run just fine with libraries/docs on dropbox, I've done that for years |
| 21:23.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | well, probbaly nothing a sed call couldn't fix on a per site basis |
| 21:24.05 | c4757p | wait, what? |
| 21:24.10 | c4757p | what are we going to sed? |
| 21:24.58 | *** join/#kicad matyvico (~matyvico@152.169.53.3) |
| 21:25.08 | EEsam | if I try to reference a path in eeschema or symbol library editor, it tries unsuccessfully to open a webpage (it's not a webpage) |
| 21:25.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | s!${foo}/xy.z!/foo/bar/xy.z! |
| 21:25.32 | c4757p | wat |
| 21:25.38 | DocScrutinizer05 | nevermind |
| 21:25.39 | c4757p | a webpage..? |
| 21:25.52 | nickoe | EEsam: screeenshot? |
| 21:25.56 | EEsam | ok |
| 21:26.00 | nickoe | what are you looking at? |
| 21:26.03 | Thor-Arne | that sounds strange |
| 21:26.16 | nickoe | y |
| 21:28.22 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/zm45ptn01nsjd87/Capture5.PNG?dl=0 |
| 21:29.26 | c4757p | erm, probably he wanted a screenshot of where the path was set up in kicad :P |
| 21:29.30 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/mcl0d1blffmbtlh/Capture6.PNG?dl=0 |
| 21:29.45 | c4757p | oh, datasheet link |
| 21:29.53 | c4757p | well, yeah |
| 21:29.58 | EEsam | yes |
| 21:30.02 | c4757p | that's what that's meant for :P |
| 21:30.52 | Thor-Arne | you have to enter the datasheet link in the symbol editor, and there it must be a real path or url |
| 21:31.00 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmmm, could that be caused by kicad opening $FILEBROWSER <pathname>/filename and on your system that's WEBBROWSER instead? or meybe I should STFU |
| 21:31.26 | nickoe | EEsam: so what is the problem? Try to specify a file too |
| 21:31.27 | Thor-Arne | shellopen i think |
| 21:31.50 | nickoe | Thor-Arne: remember he is on windows there |
| 21:32.10 | Thor-Arne | yeah, me too |
| 21:32.29 | Thor-Arne | it works 100% fine here, he just doing it the wrong place |
| 21:32.54 | EEsam | if I do that / or \ the path to the actual pdf it'll do the same thing, it's the ${} path whichever one I choose, which doesn't work. |
| 21:33.08 | c4757p | pretty sure it doesn't expand variables |
| 21:33.11 | c4757p | so...yeah. |
| 21:33.23 | EEsam | what do you mean? |
| 21:33.34 | nickoe | c4757p: it should, but dunno if it does that for that field |
| 21:33.46 | c4757p | ${DROPBOX} is an environment variable, right..? |
| 21:33.59 | EEsam | if I said my datasheet was in KISYSMOD then it'll still barf at ${KISYSMOD} |
| 21:34.13 | EEsam | yes |
| 21:34.20 | c4757p | so... right |
| 21:34.23 | c4757p | it's a path |
| 21:34.30 | EEsam | yes |
| 21:34.36 | c4757p | environment variables are not valid in raw paths |
| 21:34.46 | c4757p | scratches head a bit |
| 21:35.12 | EEsam | ${DROPBOX} works in pcbnew and footprint editor |
| 21:35.23 | Thor-Arne | does even eeschema accept any expandable paths? |
| 21:35.27 | EEsam | the paths that come with kicad don't work |
| 21:37.14 | Thor-Arne | EEsam: you can set your datasheet in the symbol editor properties, it works just fine there. but that is only relevant for the symbols that is unike |
| 21:39.45 | EEsam | it still won't accept paths in the symbol editor |
| 21:42.12 | DocScrutinizer05 | did you add a filename? |
| 21:42.18 | EEsam | yeah |
| 21:42.27 | EEsam | I get the following error: |
| 21:43.35 | EEsam | Doc File '${blah}/foo/file.pdf' not found |
| 21:43.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | arrrgh, that IRC tab: #systemd |
| 21:43.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | closes |
| 21:44.13 | EEsam | when I click on the pdf icon |
| 21:45.13 | Thor-Arne | you have to have fully qualufied paths or urls there |
| 21:45.22 | DocScrutinizer05 | hmm, either the error message is fubar, or the var is not defined, or the part of kicad doesn't do var expansion at all |
| 21:46.02 | Thor-Arne | I dont think eeschema supports expandable paths at all |
| 21:46.15 | EEsam | when I said blah foo file etc. I was writing shorthand for my path to file |
| 21:46.42 | DocScrutinizer05 | how's that related to path? unless by path you just refer to the filename |
| 21:46.54 | *** join/#kicad cirilo (~cirilo@CPE-120-144-53-157.lnse5.win.bigpond.net.au) |
| 21:46.58 | EEsam | I'll screenshot |
| 21:47.14 | Thor-Arne | you must have "D:/Dropbox/KiCad/doc/Kingbright_ACSX03-41xxx.pdf" |
| 21:47.44 | EEsam | https://www.dropbox.com/s/vj2z48zy3h9wjc9/Capture8.PNG?dl=0 |
| 21:48.17 | Thor-Arne | no ${} in there at all |
| 21:48.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: I got that |
| 21:48.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | Thor-Arne: so it doesn't expand vars |
| 21:48.47 | EEsam | I just sent a link to a screenshot |
| 21:48.53 | Thor-Arne | nope |
| 21:49.01 | Thor-Arne | never had |
| 21:49.27 | DocScrutinizer05 | would be pretty cool though :-) |
| 21:49.30 | EEsam | it shoud open it's a dropbox link to a png |
| 21:49.45 | EEsam | maybe hadn't finished uploading |
| 21:50.13 | Thor-Arne | pcbnews expandable came in the refactoring when pns was added, refactoring on eescema hasent been done yet |
| 21:50.18 | xzcvczx | c4757p with too much coffee and a long weekend ---> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-gSYKgAMPBc |
| 21:51.16 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: use full URL without ${} vars, that's what I understood from Thor-Arne |
| 21:51.58 | EEsam | it's not a url. I have a dropbox folder (could be any folder) that there's a working kicad path to |
| 21:52.18 | DocScrutinizer05 | c4757p: and that ^^^ is what I expected to fix for different platforms via sed, though that applies only when it's a local FQN and not a URL |
| 21:52.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: same applies |
| 21:52.54 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: don't use ${} |
| 21:53.41 | EEsam | so for now the only option for fields is to use URL or local path? |
| 21:53.56 | Thor-Arne | yes+ |
| 21:54.26 | EEsam | ok |
| 21:54.48 | EEsam | well that was an anticlimax! |
| 21:55.02 | Thor-Arne | so just use that and have til dropbox folder in the same location on all computers, works just fine |
| 21:55.15 | EEsam | not cross platform |
| 21:55.42 | Thor-Arne | true |
| 21:56.39 | EEsam | I can have a look at whether putting it in the home directory works mac and pc |
| 21:58.04 | cirilo | sounds like I missed all the fun :O |
| 21:58.13 | DocScrutinizer05 | haha |
| 21:58.30 | EEsam | something like that |
| 21:58.38 | nickoe | cirilo: hi |
| 21:58.41 | Thor-Arne | nah, just the dropbox-blues :p |
| 21:59.14 | DocScrutinizer05 | that dropbox part was pretty puzzling to me |
| 21:59.39 | cirilo | nickoe, hi :) |
| 21:59.44 | DocScrutinizer05 | must me an MSism |
| 21:59.48 | DocScrutinizer05 | be* |
| 21:59.53 | Thor-Arne | shouldnt be, eeschema hasnot been refactored yet |
| 22:00.10 | EEsam | and it's actually nothing to do with dropbox (except for the need for using paths). It's just eeschema not working with paths |
| 22:00.55 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: huh? |
| 22:01.00 | nickoe | cirilo: I will enable the OCE in the windows build soon. |
| 22:01.25 | DocScrutinizer05 | EEsam: kicad IS "working with pathes" |
| 22:01.30 | Thor-Arne | not working with expandable paths, normal paths and urls vorks perfect |
| 22:01.38 | cirilo | nickoe, Thanks. :) With MSYS2/MinGW is it a matter of waiting for the maintainers to update all the other packages we use so that they are all built with the same compiler? |
| 22:01.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | it is however NOT working with variables |
| 22:02.24 | EEsam | what's a variable? |
| 22:02.32 | DocScrutinizer05 | ${} |
| 22:02.44 | EEsam | and that's the same thing as an expandable path? |
| 22:03.03 | DocScrutinizer05 | seems Thor-Arne has this naming conventions, yes |
| 22:03.09 | cirilo | nickoe, I think once you have it building the nightlies we can push the kicad2step tool into the main branch. I think all OSX issues are resolved and it's just a matter of xzcvczx and Adam getting the OSX build set up |
| 22:03.45 | nickoe | cirilo: hmm, ok |
| 22:04.01 | nickoe | I have not tried the kicad2step, is that the one you called kicad2mcad earlier? |
| 22:04.07 | nickoe | does it convert to iges too?? |
| 22:04.57 | cirilo | It's the one that used to be kicad2mcad. I made the IGES output optional and at the moment do not build it by default. The IGES files that were produced were corrupt and I haven't worked out why. |
| 22:05.07 | EEsam | is importing of regular CAD formats coming any time soon to nightly builds? |
| 22:05.16 | EEsam | (3D) |
| 22:05.48 | cirilo | I suspect I can get a working IGES file by using libIGES :) |
| 22:06.06 | nickoe | cirilo: ok |
| 22:06.28 | nickoe | EEsam: there is no such thing as importing 3d models |
| 22:06.43 | nickoe | you only "link" them |
| 22:06.46 | cirilo | EEsam, yes - nickoe's been working on getting it to build for Windows and there should be no problem if we activate it on Linux (just need to set up the libraries) |
| 22:06.56 | EEsam | that's what I mean |
| 22:07.06 | *** join/#kicad berjan_ (~chatzilla@ip54538619.speed.planet.nl) |
| 22:07.23 | nickoe | EEsam: but I am doing som updates to some of the build scripts, but I accidently deleted the build dir and it takes quite some time to rebuild. |
| 22:07.41 | nickoe | so I can only continue tomorrow |
| 22:08.04 | EEsam | atm, I'm having to recolour my 3D models in wings as wings ignores them on import. ok |
| 22:08.15 | nickoe | becaue I will go to bed now |
| 22:08.31 | nickoe | EEsam: I expect the nightlies to support STEP and IGES before next week |
| 22:08.46 | Thor-Arne | is off to bed to . . . |
| 22:08.50 | nickoe | ... windows nightlies |
| 22:09.11 | nickoe | EEsam: it will probably take some time for osx |
| 22:09.16 | EEsam | will there also then be any OSX nightlies? (W or W/O that) |
| 22:10.09 | EEsam | atm I'm in versions limbo - on the 7009 on OSX and can't open PCB stuff on the laptop. |
| 22:10.15 | nickoe | EEsam: I haven't heard from Adam, the guy who maintains the osx builds for a while. |
| 22:10.34 | nickoe | EEsam: did you use round rect pads or not? |
| 22:10.39 | EEsam | nope |
| 22:10.46 | nickoe | it makes no sense |
| 22:11.08 | nickoe | did you figure out what the issue was or? |
| 22:11.15 | *** join/#kicad mozmck (~moses@67.210.159.94) |
| 22:11.17 | EEsam | I was version 7090 on PC and 7009 on OSX and it said I needed a version later than 15th Aug |
| 22:12.03 | nickoe | hmm, what feature was added on the 15 of august, c4757p do you remember? |
| 22:12.19 | c4757p | ...no? |
| 22:12.47 | c4757p | not necessarily the date the feature was added, but rather the date of the version that saved the file |
| 22:12.57 | c4757p | my guess is rounded-rectangle pads |
| 22:13.00 | EEsam | yeah that's more likely |
| 22:13.15 | EEsam | 7090 was probably 15th Aug |
| 22:13.24 | nickoe | ohh, was it the trace and via locking? |
| 22:13.24 | cirilo | I thought rounded rect pads was older |
| 22:13.28 | cirilo | lemme see log |
| 22:13.41 | nickoe | cirilo: round rect was fromapril |
| 22:13.59 | c4757p | hm |
| 22:14.01 | nickoe | c4757p: https://github.com/KiCad/kicad-source-mirror/commit/293849256e97e5941348157312075e62edad1073 |
| 22:14.05 | nickoe | around that commit. |
| 22:14.15 | c4757p | ah, right, cern dudes added some stuff. |
| 22:14.19 | c4757p | forgot about that |
| 22:14.56 | EEsam | error: PARSE_ERROR: Expecting 'clearance, trace_width, via_dia, vos_drill, uvia_dia, uvia_drill, or add_net' in input/source |
| 22:15.11 | EEsam | *via_drill |
| 22:15.26 | *** join/#kicad nitrousnrg (~quassel@190-103-222-12.cepanet.com.ar) |
| 22:15.27 | cirilo | auf 15 was a big merge from Orson |
| 22:15.28 | c4757p | cern guys made it record some more properties, diff pair stuff I think |
| 22:15.30 | *** join/#kicad nitrousnrg_ (~quassel@190-103-222-12.cepanet.com.ar) |
| 22:15.35 | c4757p | so it's choking on those |
| 22:15.45 | c4757p | you can probably delete the lines it's complaining about by hand |
| 22:15.54 | c4757p | (...read them first and make sure that makes sense) |
| 22:16.12 | nickoe | good night from here |
| 22:16.24 | EEsam | it says line 152 and line 369. Goodnight nickoe |
| 22:16.32 | *** mode/#kicad [+o c4757p] by ChanServ |
| 22:16.40 | *** mode/#kicad [-b *!~Thunderbi@*] by c4757p |
| 22:16.40 | EEsam | what file would I delete them from? |
| 22:16.44 | *** mode/#kicad [-o c4757p] by c4757p |
| 22:16.47 | c4757p | the .kicad_pcb file |
| 22:16.49 | *** join/#kicad stefan_slight (~Thunderbi@237.red-83-44-171.dynamicip.rima-tde.net) |
| 22:16.55 | c4757p | urgh, he's still bouncing |
| 22:17.00 | c4757p | fucking hell, stef |
| 22:17.03 | c4757p | stefan_slight: |
| 22:17.11 | EEsam | hahaha |
| 22:19.13 | c4757p | ...yeah he hasn't spoken since May |
| 22:19.18 | *** mode/#kicad [+o c4757p] by ChanServ |
| 22:19.24 | *** mode/#kicad [+b *!~Thunderbi@*] by c4757p |
| 22:19.30 | *** mode/#kicad [-o c4757p] by c4757p |
| 22:19.43 | c4757p | hasn't spoken since May and has been bouncing /since before then/ |
| 22:19.45 | c4757p | it's a bit silly, really. |
| 22:20.00 | EEsam | just a bit |
| 22:20.07 | c4757p | woo, PCB is submitted for review :) |
| 22:20.24 | c4757p | xzcvczx: hm, did you ever bet me I'd never finish my board? that sounds like something you'd do |
| 22:20.27 | c4757p | if so, you lost |
| 22:22.46 | cirilo | he's probably just betting there's some horrible wiring mistake |
| 22:24.47 | *** join/#kicad fellbuendel (~furry@unaffiliated/fellbuendel) |
| 22:24.57 | EEsam | I'm just deleting any lines with errors atm, see if that works |
| 22:26.19 | *** join/#kicad Steffann (uid181611@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-rmdewkbsejuqhyky) |
| 22:27.42 | matyvico | Hi, I'm using KiCad for a while now and I would like to help with it |
| 22:28.08 | matyvico | Is there some area where I could do so? |
| 22:28.52 | kakimir | have you looked into kicad launcpad? |
| 22:29.02 | matyvico | I was thinking maybe in the library development, but I'm not sure... I can program in C, and Python |
| 22:29.19 | matyvico | Also I'm learning FreeCAD |
| 22:29.34 | kakimir | https://bugs.launchpad.net/kicad |
| 22:29.39 | matyvico | Yeah, I took a look of it |
| 22:29.59 | matyvico | But I'm not very familiar with lauchpad :S |
| 22:30.44 | mroszko__ | so |
| 22:30.49 | mroszko__ | gerber parsing is ...interesting |
| 22:30.51 | mroszko__ | \stupid |
| 22:31.01 | kakimir | I think most of "main developers" to say are on this channel |
| 22:31.12 | mroszko__ | besides wayne, jp, dick |
| 22:31.33 | matyvico | That has to do with the 3d visualization or with the process of building the gerber? |
| 22:31.40 | mroszko__ | no |
| 22:31.47 | matyvico | sorry if I make a mistake, english is not my mothertongue |
| 22:31.48 | *** join/#kicad kuldeep (~kuldeep@unaffiliated/kuldeepdhaka) |
| 22:31.50 | mroszko__ | im totally on my own tangent |
| 22:31.51 | *** join/#kicad sandeepkr (~sandeepkr@111.235.65.5) |
| 22:32.23 | c4757p | you /are/ your own tangent |
| 22:32.29 | mroszko__ | :P |
| 22:32.49 | decimad | better than the secant |
| 22:33.16 | matyvico | So I think there are guidelines you agree on, and then develop it in your freetime but separately? |
| 22:36.08 | decimad | matyvico: What are your interests? What do you like to do? I'm nearly in your position. My motivation was eeschema, I ended up trying to work on the pns router currently ;) |
| 22:36.58 | decimad | position/situation |
| 22:39.15 | decimad | A strategy would be to hang around here and study the topics most people are being sarcastic about ;) |
| 22:39.28 | matyvico | Hahaha |
| 22:39.44 | matyvico | I'm studying electronics engineering |
| 22:39.58 | matyvico | I like to program |
| 22:40.05 | matyvico | And I would like to retribute |
| 22:40.35 | matyvico | Currently I think I'm more oriented towards the graphical stuff |
| 22:41.22 | matyvico | That's why I thought about library development, footprint, etc |
| 22:41.28 | matyvico | 3d models |
| 22:43.28 | decimad | I'm no expert, but if you want to work on the 3d stuff (viewer, export, rendering), then cirilo is the person to talk to imho |
| 22:44.30 | decimad | For the pcbnew stuff, it'd be orsonmmz... there was discussion on using signed distance field fonts there recently for opengl |
| 22:44.41 | decimad | that might be something |
| 22:45.31 | decimad | eeschema is currently rather a mine field, because there is work going on |
| 22:46.09 | decimad | and now the experts should take over ;) |
| 22:47.18 | *** join/#kicad ayjay (~ajp_@24-151-28-56.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 22:50.39 | c4757p | there are no eeschema experts. only insane people and masochists. |
| 22:51.42 | *** join/#kicad cirilo (~cirilo@CPE-120-144-53-157.lnse5.win.bigpond.net.au) |
| 22:54.25 | xzcvczx | c4757p: it isn't finished until it works and doesn't require 50 patch wires |
| 22:54.35 | c4757p | nah |
| 22:54.40 | c4757p | patch wires are required on a rev1 |
| 22:55.11 | xzcvczx | real engineers don't need them :) |
| 22:55.21 | *** join/#kicad C47 (~Xwx47@189.242.30.227) |
| 22:55.22 | decimad | now I know what all this talk about wireless means |
| 22:56.10 | decimad | wayne's explaining orson c++? there's something wrong |
| 22:56.18 | c4757p | wonders if xzcvczx has ever met a real engineer |
| 22:56.39 | xzcvczx | apparently not... as i have met you |
| 22:56.47 | decimad | not a social engineer, that's for sure! |
| 22:57.53 | matyvico | Great, and should I contact them here or by launchpad? |
| 22:58.05 | *** join/#kicad EEsam (~EEsam@host86-166-90-3.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) |
| 22:58.15 | decimad | You should register on launchpad to get onto the mailing list I think |
| 22:58.23 | matyvico | I think I'm going to get the sources and start seeing what is actually there |
| 22:58.25 | decimad | Then shoot there |
| 22:58.30 | matyvico | I think I have an account |
| 22:58.37 | matyvico | Great, thanks! |
| 22:58.42 | c4757p | yup, https://launchpad.net/~kicad-developers |
| 22:58.44 | c4757p | join the mailing list |
| 22:59.59 | *** join/#kicad EEsam (~EEsam@host86-166-90-3.range86-166.btcentralplus.com) |
| 23:00.08 | matyvico | I'm on it |
| 23:00.20 | matyvico | Any one from here from Argentina? I doubt it haha |
| 23:00.26 | matyvico | Or germany :D |
| 23:00.41 | decimad | germany a few |
| 23:01.12 | kakimir | is there possible to define shortcuts for componets? |
| 23:01.40 | c4757p | matyvico: cyborg_ar, originally |
| 23:01.45 | c4757p | (Argentina) |
| 23:01.50 | kakimir | like - placing gnd, c, r would be faster |
| 23:02.05 | gordonjcp | kakimir: you could just use "C" to clone an existing one |
| 23:02.24 | kakimir | I do |
| 23:02.36 | matyvico | Great, but I assume that English is the main language |
| 23:02.59 | decimad | indeed |
| 23:03.09 | decimad | i like that word ;) |
| 23:03.53 | xzcvczx | gah is there no way to do blame in launchpad-git? |
| 23:04.15 | EEsam | but it's only a case of typing two letters to get caps, resistors etc. A C Enter A C P enter for pol cap, A C S small cap etc. |
| 23:04.23 | c4757p | just go into your handy local repository and type 'git blame' ;) |
| 23:06.50 | DocScrutinizer05 | sorry for late ((<c4757p> you can probably delete the lines it's complaining about by hand)) yes proven solution |
| 23:07.12 | matyvico | Done, already joined the email list! |
| 23:07.23 | c4757p | \o/ |
| 23:10.21 | xzcvczx | hmmm "One word of warning: the class is not at all optimized for big files and thus it will load the file entirely into memory when opened. Of course, you should not work in this way with large files (as an estimation, anything over 1 Megabyte is surely too big for this class). On the other hand, it is not a serious limitation for small files like configuration files or program sources which are well |
| 23:10.27 | xzcvczx | handled by wxTextFile." i wonder if thats why dick wrote his own io code |
| 23:10.40 | DocScrutinizer05 | ((delete lines)) let me suggest to make that a non-fatal error, more of a warning, for the future. Yes I know the file format will change eventually anyway |
| 23:10.50 | xzcvczx | still it can happily read 8MB in well under 1sec so who gives a shite |
| 23:10.58 | c4757p | ^ |
| 23:11.01 | *** join/#kicad tannewt (~textual@c-71-231-55-126.hsd1.wa.comcast.net) |
| 23:14.21 | cyborg_ar | :) |
| 23:14.58 | cyborg_ar | matyvico, che boludo |
| 23:15.57 | matyvico | @cyborg_ar que haces culiado? jaja |
| 23:17.11 | cyborg_ar | tudo bene |
| 23:18.31 | cyborg_ar | estoy por hacer un asadito |
| 23:20.20 | matyvico | No me jodas! que buena onda! |
| 23:20.27 | matyvico | Yo estoy a masitas de agua jaja |
| 23:20.57 | matyvico | Como le escribo directamente a alguien, estoy usando Polari y probe con el @ pero no se si le escribo bien |
| 23:21.10 | matyvico | En que parte colaboras? |
| 23:37.15 | cyborg_ar | para escribirle en privado a alguien usas /msg <nick> <mensaje> |
| 23:37.41 | cyborg_ar | para abrir una ventana de conversacion es /query <nick> |
| 23:45.09 | cyborg_ar | c4757p, re: sheet pins, also g works in sheets but not pins, so you still got a little bit of alternative |
| 23:45.42 | c4757p | indeed |
| 23:52.53 | cirilo | decimad, Wayne is just saying be careful because of DICKLIST and similar constructs |
| 23:53.39 | cirilo | there are some constructs in kicad that would be bad manners even in pure C. |
| 23:54.42 | *** join/#kicad ayjay (~ajp_@24-151-28-56.dhcp.nwtn.ct.charter.com) |
| 23:55.13 | cirilo | xzcvczx, yeah - still in a 1968 mindset |
| 23:55.31 | cirilo | OMFG - 1M is like lots and it will bring a supercomputer to its knees! |
| 23:56.06 | xzcvczx | lol |
| 23:56.10 | xzcvczx | cirilo: thats a wx quote |
| 23:56.40 | cirilo | xzcvczx, ah, still - Dick seemed to work with that sort of thing in mind |
| 23:56.47 | c4757p | would have no qualms about reading in a tens of MB file prior to parsing it, let alone 1MB >_> |
| 23:57.15 | cirilo | when *did* the wx project start. If it began in the mid-80's and Athena was one of the popular free widgets then I can understand |
| 23:57.40 | *** join/#kicad Plugh (~kcozens@CPE68b6fc4e50b3-CM68b6fc4e50b0.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 23:57.58 | cirilo | well, even 10y ago I've have embedded x86 computers consuming >200M doing their stuff |
| 23:58.54 | cirilo | and that's just the working memory that I allocated .. other libs pulled in + the program's own executable code would range from ~2 to 20MB |
