| 00:43.38 | lkcl | heya folks. sorry, i wasn't around to answer about the dbus thing. dbus is a complete "not invented here" bastardised piece of work that completely pales into insignificance when compared to something like freedce. |
| 00:44.40 | lkcl | if you want to compare dbus to freedce, first you must take away the ability in freedce to plug in quite literally any transport, and you must also take away freedce's IDL compiler. |
| 00:45.23 | lkcl | what you have left is virtually useless - like dbus is useless. you're better off writing your own code / communications protocol. |
| 00:48.15 | lkcl | and in this case, like what has been done for gpsdrive and gpsd, a simple text-based protocol like SMTP would be more than adequate - including a "lock" and "unlock" command, to be able to multiplex AT commands onto the gsm without conflict. a simple unix domain socket or tcp socket would suffice. no. dbus is a total waste of time. |
| 00:51.43 | ben0f | well that's cleared that up then! ;) |
| 00:53.17 | ben0f | is the any reason i can't install from 0.8/base? (don'treally know what i'm doing) |
| 00:53.35 | ben0f | als ois it feasable to det opie on a BA? |
| 00:55.58 | ben0f | anyone here? |
| 00:58.53 | lkcl | he he ty ben. do let cp15 know. alternatively, cut off his internet access if he don't get the message |
| 00:59.33 | ben0f | how goes it? |
| 00:59.49 | lkcl | hiya ben - this is a fairly low-traffic, and mainly european-based, channel |
| 01:00.00 | lkcl | good, dude. it's 1am - i should be asleep. |
| 01:00.17 | lkcl | opie: is that "familiar" - gpe? |
| 01:00.37 | lkcl | cos you can definitely put gpe 2.7 on a blueangel. |
| 01:01.08 | ben0f | yeah, seems to be the other 'window manager' |
| 01:01.29 | ben0f | how do u install stuff... the default ipkg stuff didn't work..? |
| 01:01.32 | lkcl | cp15, rob and a couple of us are trying to update the openembedded.org stuff so that the latest coming from OE compiles and runs. |
| 01:01.55 | lkcl | there's a bit on handhelds.org in the wiki on the procedure you'll need to follow |
| 01:02.06 | lkcl | lemme find the link for you... |
| 01:02.33 | ben0f | well, i'm happy to sacrifce my BA for the cause! i have 12hrs a day when at work when i don't *need* it fully functional! |
| 01:02.58 | lkcl | go via these... |
| 01:03.00 | lkcl | http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=HTC_Blueangel |
| 01:03.16 | lkcl | to thiiiiis |
| 01:03.27 | lkcl | http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BlueangelResearch |
| 01:03.44 | lkcl | to thiiiiis |
| 01:03.46 | lkcl | http://wiki.xda-developers.com/index.php?pagename=BlueangelKernel |
| 01:04.05 | lkcl | to this: |
| 01:04.05 | lkcl | http://handhelds.org/moin/moin.cgi/BlueAngel |
| 01:04.20 | lkcl | and that page tells you how to get started. |
| 01:04.27 | lkcl | oh - it'll be pretty damn functional all right. |
| 01:04.37 | lkcl | well. |
| 01:05.15 | lkcl | i say fully functional: cp15's working on proper "suspend" at the moment, otherwise you have to use "idle" which gives you about 18 hours away from a charger. |
| 01:05.35 | lkcl | and all you need to do is do a hard-reset and you're back in xxxxing wince mode. |
| 01:05.59 | lkcl | yes, gomunicator works. |
| 01:06.58 | lkcl | if you want to use the phone - and hear a ring - let me cut/paste some instructions: |
| 01:06.59 | lkcl | lkcl@highfield:/usr/local/src/xanadux$ cat gomunicator.sound.format.txt |
| 01:06.59 | lkcl | It has to be 16000 Hz, stereo, format S16_LE |
| 01:06.59 | lkcl | raw format. |
| 01:07.00 | lkcl | you have to copy it as /usr/share/gomunicator/R&C_theme.raw |
| 01:07.01 | lkcl | lkcl@highfield:/usr/local/src/xanadux$ |
| 01:07.09 | lkcl | okay? |
| 01:07.44 | ben0f | yeah, would be good to be able to import/sync calendar and contacts too (i've scp'd a shit load of .vcf at the mo and i think u have to ad tehm one by one) |
| 01:08.11 | lkcl | hey, well, it's running linux, you get an ssh link, so you get to "play" :) |
| 01:08.44 | lkcl | btw - if you get difficulties with wince recognising the two partitions (30mb and "the rest") |
| 01:08.51 | lkcl | then play this trick: |
| 01:09.15 | lkcl | 1) dd if=/dev/zero of=/dev/sdc count=1 bs=1024 DO NOT get this wrong or do this on the wrong partition. |
| 01:09.25 | lkcl | 2) put the card into wince, let it reformat it. |
| 01:09.46 | ben0f | yeah, i already had to do that... was a bastard to get the partitions right!!! |
| 01:09.56 | lkcl | 3) _then_ run fdisk /dev/sdc and create a single 30mb partition - mark it as type "6" and DO NOT reformat it... |
| 01:09.58 | lkcl | yeh, damn. |
| 01:10.01 | ben0f | i dont have a /usr/local dir.. |
| 01:10.16 | lkcl | you can't type mkdir /usr/local??? |
| 01:10.35 | ben0f | oh i see... thought it was supposed to be there! :/ |
| 01:10.40 | lkcl | the 2nd partition - the ext3 one - Must be the 2nd partition |
| 01:11.03 | lkcl | only if you ever compile up software yourself is it supposed to be installed there. it's a convention, anyway. |
| 01:11.28 | lkcl | you can install software wherever the hell you like but if you don't follow the conventions you will soon wish you _had_ followed them |
| 01:12.22 | lkcl | must be the 2nd one because the initrd off the wiki will boot from the 2nd partition e.g. /dev/sdc2 |
| 01:12.43 | lkcl | oh. and _unpack_ the gpe-image.tar.bz2 into the 2nd partition - don't just copy the file over, like i did :) |
| 01:12.45 | lkcl | duh |
| 01:13.00 | lkcl | anyway. i gotta go sleep. |
| 01:13.06 | ben0f | he he! how about installing from ipkg? |
| 01:13.17 | ben0f | ok, catch ya later! |
| 01:13.22 | lkcl | that's handled by thingy. openembedded.org. |
| 01:13.41 | lkcl | oh - yes. there _is_ a package manager as part of gpe 2.7. |
| 01:13.59 | lkcl | so once you've got it installed you'll be able to add individual packages. |
| 01:14.23 | ben0f | yeah... don'tknow what i want/need really! :) |
| 01:14.36 | lkcl | if you _did_ want to build the whole lot for yourself, check out the procedure, here: |
| 01:14.37 | lkcl | http://oe.handhelds.org/cgi-bin/moin.cgi/GettingStarted |
| 01:14.42 | ben0f | is there anywhere i can get the RAW sounds u mentioned earlier? |
| 01:14.55 | lkcl | make one up. |
| 01:15.20 | ben0f | what with, total novice when it comes to audio!! |
| 01:15.23 | lkcl | but if you want gomunicator to play something, that's the format and the location required - anything else will be garbage. |
| 01:15.27 | lkcl | wavp. |
| 01:15.42 | lkcl | i used wavp and just shouted "PHONNEEE!" |
| 01:15.42 | ben0f | ok, i'll have a play! |
| 01:15.59 | lkcl | <PROTECTED> |
| 01:16.20 | ben0f | ha ha!! |
| 01:16.23 | lkcl | :) |
| 01:16.31 | ben0f | i'll see what i can find!! |
| 01:16.53 | lkcl | then scp whistle.raw 192.168.0.206:/usr/share/gomunicator/R\&C_theme.raw |
| 01:17.12 | lkcl | remember the \ because & is the "background this command" character. |
| 01:17.28 | lkcl | zzzzzs. later. luck. |
| 01:17.28 | ben0f | gotcha! |
| 01:17.47 | ben0f | cheers mate! |
| 04:14.01 | *** join/#htc-blueangel ben017f (n=ben@219-88-216-1.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 05:26.36 | *** join/#htc-blueangel ben0171 (n=ben@219-88-216-1.jetstream.xtra.co.nz) |
| 06:05.09 | *** join/#htc-blueangel rob_w (n=bob@p85.212.180.173.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 06:05.09 | *** mode/#htc-blueangel [+o rob_w] by ChanServ |
| 06:41.25 | *** join/#htc-blueangel ben017f (n=ben@203-100-219-166.jetbuster.co.nz) |
| 08:00.20 | *** join/#htc-blueangel cp15 (i=xwhlyt@p549A0AC9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 08:00.21 | *** mode/#htc-blueangel [+o cp15] by ChanServ |
| 08:00.33 | cp15 | Good morning |
| 08:16.29 | *** join/#htc-blueangel geers (n=DevzMan@c51008F31.inet.catch.no) |
| 09:51.15 | rob_w | i saw u uploaded your yesterday cp15 |
| 09:51.29 | rob_w | is that already a xda0-ba0 kernel and modules ? |
| 10:01.57 | lkcl | morning-ish all |
| 10:04.38 | lkcl | cp15 - i noticed you went "d-bus is great! let's use it in gomunicator" yesterday. please don't do that. d-bus is a piece of shit waste of time. the effort is better spent adding something gpsd/gpsdrive-like, with SMTP-like simple text commands, with a lock and unlock command, to be able to send a sequence of uninterruptable AT commands. |
| 10:14.16 | rob_w | uh lkcl that is heavy comment |
| 10:19.56 | lkcl | yep :) |
| 10:21.30 | lkcl | i _hate_ dbus, because i know what freedce can do. to compare freedce to dbus, first you must remove freedce's ability to use any encryption / authentication plugin, remove freedce's ability to use any type of transport plugin (one connection-based like tcp and one connection-less like udp), remove its IDL compiler, and then what xxxx you have left - which is pretty useless - is analogous to d-bus. |
| 10:36.18 | rob_w | wow that sounds overwhelming ... did you try to port it once ? |
| 10:36.38 | rob_w | i am is it able to crosscompile without a hassle ? |
| 10:45.43 | cp15 | lkcl: dbus makes it pretty easy to dial a contact from the address book |
| 10:46.17 | cp15 | And I see the lack of an idl compiler as an advantage. I didn't like what I have seen with orbit |
| 10:46.53 | cp15 | And third: dbus is already heavily used in gpe. It makes no sense to introduce something new |
| 10:55.10 | rob_w | brb after i build in my dvd burner :-) |
| 11:06.27 | *** join/#htc-blueangel rob_w (n=bob@p85.212.180.173.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 11:06.27 | *** mode/#htc-blueangel [+o rob_w] by ChanServ |
| 11:14.10 | lkcl | cp15: okay - if it's already been adopted, then that changes the balance. and orbit is corba, which is a object-orientated [necessary] layer on top of an underlying [non-object-orientated] function-based RPC mechanism. |
| 11:17.27 | lkcl | rob_w - freedce? yes, i tried porting it to win32. i managed to get the UDP transport working, but win32's "winsock" is so awful that TCP doesn't work properly - just like it doesn't work for microsoft. it's a long story, but freedce and MSRPC are derived from the same codebase: theopengroup's DCE 1.1 reference implementation. in microsoft's case, they actually abandoned the use of winsock and took the BSD implementation of TCP/IP and |
| 11:35.38 | lkcl | IDL compilers - decent ones - allow you to not have to think "how am i going to munge this data". _good_ IDL compilers like the DCE one allow you to create complex data structures like this, without having to think "oh my god, if i make _one_ change to the API i'm xxxxed because it's gonna take me _months_ to rewrite the hand-crafted marshalling code". in this example, note that structs named "TYPE_3" to "TYPE_17" are recursive :) http: |
| 11:36.37 | lkcl | anyway. where was i. oh yes. thumping my amd64 system cos the PSU fan warbles like anything on startup. |
| 11:44.44 | lkcl | rob_w - cross-compile freedce - for arm? no, it had occurred to me, but even though i really love freedce, i've not encountered a situation where i could recommend it - even though things like CORBA (via orbit) have already made their way into GUIs. |
| 12:26.12 | rob_w | ah nice workout lkcl ,, |
| 12:27.08 | rob_w | but still we dbus is heavily implemented in gpe already so i guess we go for that ... but feel free to develop a addon for gomunicator tobe used with freedce |
| 13:40.54 | cp15 | lkcl: How far did you get with the gpe image? |
| 13:47.09 | *** join/#htc-blueangel _bob_w (n=bob@p85.212.191.48.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 14:22.21 | cp15 | oho, are you here? |
| 14:41.35 | lkcl | heya cp15, there's a change in savannah.org's cvs policy which stops things form being downloadedd. |
| 14:41.53 | lkcl | it says check http://savannah.gnu.org/forum/forum.php?forum_id=4168 |
| 14:42.18 | lkcl | quilt can't be downloadded until the thing's corrected. use pserver isntead of anonymous access over ssh. |
| 14:42.21 | lkcl | gotta run. |
| 14:42.28 | lkcl | back in 4-5 hours or so. |
| 14:54.27 | lkcl | rob_w - hi. no, it's not worth it. if d-bus _is_ being used, then it's already too late: using something like freedce is a strategic decision that you make to make your life easier if you understand distributed computing. if you don't understand distributed computing, you do decisions like "roll-you-own" - like KDE did with DCOP - or use d-bus. *shrug* :) |
| 15:05.37 | oho | Hi cp15 - I am here now |
| 15:06.01 | oho | but haven't manage to do any more coding, I am still working on the grant proposal :-( |
| 15:31.11 | *** join/#htc-blueangel _cronos_ (n=cronos@ron34-1-82-224-149-102.fbx.proxad.net) |
| 15:45.05 | *** join/#htc-blueangel rob_w (n=bob@p85.212.191.48.tisdip.tiscali.de) |
| 15:45.06 | *** mode/#htc-blueangel [+o rob_w] by ChanServ |
| 16:08.03 | cp15 | oho: Can you send me your current state? |
| 16:30.37 | rob_w | it feels like update-modules grabs a wrong kernel name here and therefore is not finding my modules ?!? |
| 18:24.38 | *** join/#htc-blueangel immolo (n=immolo@cpc1-cosh1-4-0-cust126.cos2.cable.ntl.com) |
| 21:47.04 | *** join/#htc-blueangel JuNuKN (n=JuNuKN@Kb219.k.pppool.de) |
| 22:40.54 | cp15 | Good night, I will go to bed now |
| 22:41.47 | rob_w | sleep well cp15 |
| 22:43.07 | cp15 | You too |
| 22:45.07 | *** join/#htc-blueangel ben017f (n=ben@203-100-219-166.jetbuster.co.nz) |
| 23:02.52 | ben017f | anyone about? ikcl... i tried for ages yesterday but couldn't get sound working for love nor money!! |
| 23:09.21 | lkcl | heya ben. |
| 23:09.41 | lkcl | check the volume / sound , in settings |
| 23:20.19 | ben017f | yeah, did that... aplay with the correct settings on the host machine played it fine and then i scp'd it and mv'd to /usr/share/gomunicator/R&C_theme.raw... |
| 23:20.49 | ben017f | it sounded like the sound u hear when u call someone on a mobile and it's waiting to connect! |
| 23:24.13 | lkcl | oh right. |
| 23:35.43 | lkcl | kcl@highfield:/usr/local/src/xanadux$ cvs -t -d:pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:/cvsroot/xanadux login |
| 23:35.43 | lkcl | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:35.44 | lkcl | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:35.44 | lkcl | Logging in to :pserver:anonymous@cvs.sourceforge.net:2401/cvsroot/xanadux |
| 23:35.44 | lkcl | CVS password: |
| 23:35.45 | lkcl | <PROTECTED> |
| 23:35.47 | lkcl | cvs [login aborted]: end of file from server (consult above messages if any) |
| 23:35.49 | lkcl | oops. |
| 23:38.48 | lkcl | wtf??? |
| 23:38.58 | lkcl | ls |