| 00:00.22 | javispedro | oh, now I get what GoF means. |
| 00:01.20 | GeneralAntilles | Alright, updated. |
| 00:01.27 | GeneralAntilles | Now I've got an empty space where the weather should be. |
| 00:01.33 | GeneralAntilles | You mentioned something about the config file? |
| 00:02.05 | javispedro | GeneralAntilles: yep, https://gitorious.org/sowatch/pages/Home, |
| 00:02.09 | javispedro | err. https://gitorious.org/sowatch/pages/Home |
| 00:03.18 | GeneralAntilles | Ah, I see. |
| 00:03.21 | GeneralAntilles | Sorry, head cold. :P |
| 00:04.04 | javispedro | sadly, I have to go |
| 00:05.44 | GeneralAntilles | Ta! |
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| 04:21.48 | iekku | morning |
| 04:22.43 | dm8tbr | moaning |
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| 15:53.50 | *** topic/#harmattan is A place for harmattan device and development discussions |NEW flasher to "unbrick": http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/release/N950-39-5/ | Developers check this: http://library.developer.nokia.com/ | http://wiki.meego.com/N950_landing_page | logs: http://mg.pov.lt/harmattan-irclog/ | UPGRADES: http://bit.ly/rffn73 |
| 15:53.50 | *** mode/#harmattan [+v infobot] by ChanServ |
| 15:57.03 | DocScrutinizer | ~botsnack |
| 15:57.03 | infobot | :), DocScrutinizer |
| 15:57.10 | DocScrutinizer | ~+uptime |
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| 16:16.06 | kkito | hello |
| 16:16.22 | kkito | do you know how to add a google account that is not @gmail.com ? |
| 16:18.05 | kkito | I get an unknown error when trying to add a google account :( |
| 16:22.28 | iekku | can the google account be something else than @gmail.com? |
| 16:22.33 | iekku | didn't even know |
| 16:25.26 | ab | RST38h, so what can you use that 480x64x3 stripe for? It is global area and if it is accessbile, it would be accessible to all applications. What good can you do with that? |
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| 16:44.42 | matrixx | has anyone does custom themes for harmattan? |
| 16:44.47 | matrixx | *done |
| 16:45.26 | kkito | iekku: yes, a google account can be something else than @gmail.com, but it seems that the current fw (n950) has problems setting up a google account that is not @gmail.com :( |
| 16:45.43 | kkito | perhaps there is a workaround to bypass this :/ |
| 16:46.22 | iekku | oh |
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| 17:02.36 | faenil | heeeey |
| 17:06.48 | faenil | so sad... |
| 17:06.49 | faenil | back from qtdd11 :( |
| 17:06.55 | javispedro | hi faenil . |
| 17:07.00 | faenil | moo javis :D |
| 17:08.19 | RST38h | BREAKTHROUGH: Avira anti-virus labels itself as spyware |
| 17:08.26 | faenil | LOL |
| 17:08.28 | faenil | is that true? |
| 17:08.37 | faenil | Avira has the one ProActive protection out.. |
| 17:08.42 | RST38h | TheRegister reports it |
| 17:08.45 | javispedro | hey RST38h |
| 17:08.50 | RST38h | mooo, javispedro |
| 17:09.07 | javispedro | AV vendors are more stupid every day |
| 17:09.14 | RST38h | javispedro: Lumia,yeah? =) |
| 17:09.19 | berndhs | no just more honest |
| 17:09.22 | javispedro | ah, well. |
| 17:09.38 | RST38h | They are selling snake oil and everyone except for the management knows it |
| 17:10.04 | faenil | javispedro: you got lumia? |
| 17:10.16 | RST38h | As well as the fact that there is no fully automatic 100% proof antivirus solution |
| 17:10.17 | DocScrutinizer | well, I heard one of the antivir is actually spyware, and police being the real boss of the company |
| 17:10.45 | javispedro | RST38h: never heard that word with the supposed meaning. I've heard it a few times in a rural context meaning bright, or lively, in a pseudo-positive sense. But I doubt any urbanite would know it is a spanish word. |
| 17:11.13 | *** join/#harmattan faenil_ (b21a2812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.26.40.18) |
| 17:11.17 | faenil_ | damn connection |
| 17:11.20 | javispedro | therefore: nonstory. |
| 17:11.30 | javispedro | albeit it would have been amusing. |
| 17:11.35 | RST38h | javispedro: "lumia" for "bright" is understandable etymologically |
| 17:12.07 | javispedro | maybe... not really an expert. |
| 17:12.19 | faenil_ | why you talking about lumia? |
| 17:12.29 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, why? |
| 17:12.52 | DocScrutinizer | maybe aegis is not evil enough by now? :-D |
| 17:12.56 | javispedro | turns out the "official" spanish dictionary says lumia is "prostitute" |
| 17:13.04 | DocScrutinizer | LOL |
| 17:13.07 | RST38h | OMG |
| 17:13.10 | javispedro | but see above :) |
| 17:13.23 | RST38h | javispedro: also adds "colloquial |
| 17:13.28 | macmaN | lumia is definitely just a whored off n9 |
| 17:13.30 | faenil_ | LOL |
| 17:13.38 | Frye | Nice1 macmaN |
| 17:13.47 | faenil_ | I like it anyway, very nice phone, N9 with WP7 |
| 17:13.50 | DocScrutinizer | macmaN: citation needed |
| 17:14.17 | faenil_ | oh and by the way, just coz I'm very happy about it, I have won the drawing at QtDev Days :D |
| 17:14.21 | faenil_ | I've won a Kindle :D |
| 17:14.30 | faenil_ | I was so happy when I heard my name xD |
| 17:15.20 | faenil | and it was the day of my birthday! :D 24th |
| 17:15.27 | faenil | so that sounded like magic :D |
| 17:15.42 | javispedro | pssh :) |
| 17:15.49 | javispedro | happy birthday either way :) |
| 17:15.51 | faenil | ^_^ |
| 17:15.53 | faenil | thanks :D |
| 17:15.53 | berndhs | it was rigged :) |
| 17:16.00 | faenil | ehehehe |
| 17:16.01 | faenil | actually |
| 17:16.06 | faenil | the winner was another guy |
| 17:16.09 | faenil | but he didn't show up |
| 17:16.19 | faenil | and the extracted another card out of the box |
| 17:16.21 | faenil | :D |
| 17:16.24 | faenil | and it was me xD |
| 17:16.31 | faenil | they* |
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| 17:19.49 | faenil | AAAAAAAAAND |
| 17:19.55 | faenil | I got a free N9 too :D |
| 17:20.23 | faenil | the day after :D |
| 17:20.28 | faenil | so I was pretty lucky actually :D |
| 17:20.31 | iekku | faenil, christmas is early this year? or just a birthday presents and christmas is coming? |
| 17:20.48 | faenil | iekku: that's what I thought :P |
| 17:20.56 | iekku | or they together? |
| 17:20.58 | faenil | is Santa Claus here at QtDD or what? XD |
| 17:21.04 | iekku | :D |
| 17:21.05 | faenil | yeah...I'd go for that one :D |
| 17:21.18 | faenil | we were at the keynote |
| 17:21.21 | iekku | but i think you have earned them :) |
| 17:21.33 | faenil | and they said "we're going to choose a colour now" |
| 17:21.43 | faenil | they started a random thing, which selected the blue color |
| 17:22.10 | faenil | and all people with the blue card (the color of your card depended on the sessions path you registered to) |
| 17:22.16 | faenil | got a Free N9 :D |
| 17:22.17 | faenil | xD |
| 17:22.22 | iekku | :D |
| 17:22.30 | DocScrutinizer | now THATs kinda insane |
| 17:22.34 | faenil | :D |
| 17:22.56 | javispedro | I am really impressed about -- http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/26/nokia-lumia-800-vs-nokia-n9-the-tale-of-the-tape/ |
| 17:23.15 | javispedro | thought they were just dumping the wp device but it seems that it is really cheaper and more lowend |
| 17:23.22 | faenil | well, otherwise, quim gil had told me I should have gone and talk to him, to see if he could do anything about that :) |
| 17:23.36 | faenil | it is cheaper, but... |
| 17:23.48 | faenil | less ram...no NFC... |
| 17:24.06 | javispedro | that's exactly what I mean. |
| 17:24.11 | Ans5i | new symbian |
| 17:24.34 | faenil | xD |
| 17:24.54 | Ans5i | i liked some of the stuff like xbox etc. and the online storage |
| 17:24.57 | faenil | does anyone have any suggestion about what to do with my new Kindle? :D |
| 17:25.29 | faenil | It's not the latest one, it's the one with the physical keyboard, but it's got 3G + WiFi, + WorldWide FREE 3G Connection!! :D |
| 17:25.42 | javispedro | even the OMAP is potentially comparable to that Qualcomm. |
| 17:26.02 | faenil | javispedro: you, but the gpu is probably better in the qualcomm |
| 17:26.07 | faenil | yup* |
| 17:26.58 | DocScrutinizer | clone the SIM and send a copy to me |
| 17:27.15 | DocScrutinizer | worldwide free 3G data, WTF?! |
| 17:27.50 | faenil | yup... |
| 17:27.59 | faenil | with some exceptions...which are not specified there... |
| 17:28.05 | faenil | like, Germany..-.- |
| 17:28.20 | DocScrutinizer | I'd be surprised to find a SIM that allowed worldwide roaming for calls |
| 17:29.20 | DocScrutinizer | some sat carriers may have a pretty good coverage on GSM roaming |
| 17:29.33 | faenil | ok here's it |
| 17:29.46 | faenil | Travel the globe and still get books in under 60 seconds. Kindle Keyboard 3G uses GSM technology â the most popular mobile wireless standard â with wireless coverage in over 100 countries and territories, such as Australia, Hong Kong, Germany, Japan, Norway, Spain, South Africa, the United States and many others |
| 17:29.54 | DocScrutinizer | still they rely on fill in via SAT in those areas where they didn't find a roaming partner |
| 17:30.12 | faenil | bit, it doesn't work here in Munich...-.- |
| 17:30.28 | DocScrutinizer | LOL |
| 17:30.41 | DocScrutinizer | so much for "worldwide GSM" - ok, next |
| 17:30.51 | faenil | ahahahha |
| 17:31.14 | faenil | yeah... |
| 17:31.19 | faenil | the package only says 3G |
| 17:31.46 | DocScrutinizer | worldwide roaming on 3G, meh. Even more unlikely |
| 17:32.00 | faenil | man, that's what it says.. :D |
| 17:32.26 | faenil | No Monthly Wireless Bills No monthly wireless bills or commitments. Amazon pays for Kindle Keyboard 3G's wireless connectivity so you won't see a monthly wireless bill |
| 17:33.45 | DocScrutinizer | sure, and here in Europe you pay roaming fees of like $$$/MB by only accidentally booking in to italy's carrier when living in Germany next to the border |
| 17:34.14 | DocScrutinizer | so I *bet* Amazon happily will pay all that, worldwide |
| 17:35.02 | faenil | I know man, it sounds so strange... |
| 17:35.09 | faenil | but that's what they advertise it for.. |
| 17:35.14 | faenil | what's your opinion instead |
| 17:35.19 | DocScrutinizer | I guess Amazon has some config page where you can move your account home network to one of arbitrary 100 countries |
| 17:35.53 | faenil | mmm |
| 17:36.49 | DocScrutinizer | also you're aware this "3G" is for sure limited to access to Amazon site *only* |
| 17:37.19 | faenil | nope |
| 17:37.27 | faenil | there's the "Browser" |
| 17:37.53 | faenil | I can connect to the shop everywhere |
| 17:37.58 | DocScrutinizer | I can't see this fly |
| 17:37.58 | faenil | wirelessly |
| 17:39.21 | faenil | yey :D |
| 17:39.27 | faenil | it doesn't work in germany, but it should work in Italy :D |
| 17:40.20 | faenil | oh wait |
| 17:41.54 | DocScrutinizer | whatever, tell me when you're able to google wirelessly, for $=nuttin, worldwide. Would for sure be worth the purchase of the kindle then, as any similar SIM card / contract is more per month than any such device of Amazon |
| 17:43.00 | SpeedEvil | They're making web browsing only wifi IIRC |
| 17:43.18 | DocScrutinizer | well, that doesn't count here, really |
| 17:43.47 | DocScrutinizer | each idiot can make $random_app for free over wifi |
| 17:44.25 | DocScrutinizer | as it's you paying for the wifi<->internet connectivity |
| 17:44.57 | javispedro | I do know some people that do this |
| 17:45.09 | javispedro | was never interested in the details but discussions are plenty on the www |
| 17:45.21 | DocScrutinizer | doing what exactly? |
| 17:45.36 | DocScrutinizer | wifi sharing communities |
| 17:45.38 | DocScrutinizer | ? |
| 17:45.41 | javispedro | they thether using the amazon 3g |
| 17:45.49 | DocScrutinizer | ooh |
| 17:46.06 | faenil | Doc |
| 17:46.14 | faenil | it's real 3g web browsing, check this out |
| 17:46.19 | DocScrutinizer | so it *might* be more interesting than I thought |
| 17:46.30 | faenil | some countries get webbrowsing for all websites |
| 17:46.38 | faenil | the rest only Wikipedia and Amazon store |
| 17:46.39 | faenil | http://kindleworld.blogspot.com/p/countries-with-free-kindle-3g-access.html |
| 17:46.49 | DocScrutinizer | :nod: |
| 17:46.53 | DocScrutinizer | thought as much |
| 17:46.54 | javispedro | DocScrutinizer: aiui it's not real internet though, but rather you have to go through their proxy |
| 17:47.02 | DocScrutinizer | yes |
| 17:47.14 | DocScrutinizer | they even have a browser optimizer |
| 17:47.25 | DocScrutinizer | with a *huge* cache |
| 17:47.49 | faenil | yeah probably :) |
| 17:48.01 | faenil | well, I guess they're already paying A LOT to give this service |
| 17:48.07 | faenil | and I guess how long this will last.. |
| 17:48.10 | DocScrutinizer | sth like "render in 'the cloud', mobile only gets the preprocessed data" |
| 17:48.15 | faenil | but it's one year now I think, or smthg like that |
| 17:49.10 | DocScrutinizer | kinda like vnc to amazon server with real browser |
| 17:49.31 | faenil | ehehe |
| 17:50.13 | SpeedEvil | ponders linking to his proposal ages ago for something like the browser optimies |
| 17:51.15 | DocScrutinizer | so no matter what you are thinking you are browsing at in that kindle, your 3G connection is always to amazon.com, and carriers won't probably allow anything else |
| 17:51.56 | javispedro | SpeedEvil: at this rate someone's going to bring your idea to the patent office first ;P |
| 17:52.03 | DocScrutinizer | iirc apple has a similar deal for their OTA "SIM activation" |
| 17:52.29 | javispedro | and BB used to have |
| 17:52.30 | faenil | what do you mean Doc? |
| 17:52.46 | faenil | still, you can visit all websites |
| 17:52.59 | faenil | who cares if you do that through amazon.com or throught the direct website |
| 17:53.20 | DocScrutinizer | try freenode IRC web portal ;-P |
| 17:53.49 | faenil | I'm on IRC webchat :D |
| 17:53.49 | *** join/#harmattan rafael2k (~rafael2k@187.106.20.152) |
| 17:53.49 | javispedro | or e.g. they'd ban you if you try to do anything interesting over port 80 |
| 17:53.57 | DocScrutinizer | faenil: for sure not via 3G |
| 17:54.02 | DocScrutinizer | for free |
| 17:54.07 | faenil | ;) |
| 17:54.10 | faenil | what's the problem with it? |
| 17:54.26 | DocScrutinizer | it TOO FRIGGIN EXPENSIVE for Amazon |
| 17:54.41 | DocScrutinizer | and won't earn them a dime in return |
| 17:54.42 | faenil | I meant why IRC web portal...I know that 3g is expensive :P |
| 17:54.51 | rafael2k | people, is hamattan-dev.nokia.com the right place to the SDK? it's still at beta2! |
| 17:55.02 | javispedro | rafael2k: go complain to Nokia... |
| 17:55.09 | rafael2k | javispedro: :/ |
| 17:55.42 | rafael2k | <- still not able to compile things locally in the N950 because of this.. |
| 17:56.01 | RST38h | wonders why anyone would go into anal slavery to Amazon |
| 17:56.28 | RST38h | Just get yourself a generic Android tablet *or* a generic Chinese-made ebook reader. |
| 17:57.12 | DocScrutinizer | faenil: Amazon hosts the true "browser", has full control over what it will allow/forward and what not, and I can't see Amazon paying GB/month of OTA data via 3G that's not caused by paid content giving them return of investment |
| 17:57.58 | RST38h | Doc: They are selling you .pdf files for $11 a pop. I think they can afford shelling out a bit of this money for 3G. |
| 17:58.15 | DocScrutinizer | data volumes at carriers aren't for free, neither for you nor for Amazon nor for anybody else, as carriers want to make profit |
| 17:58.30 | faenil | DocScrutinizer: so what do you think they'll do? |
| 17:58.38 | RST38h | Doc: Especially by signing a wholesale deal with a big corporate cellservices provider |
| 17:58.42 | faenil | Doc: anyway, it's still something wonderful...you've got complete (kinda) worldlike (kinda) FREE internet access |
| 17:58.46 | faenil | exactly |
| 17:59.01 | DocScrutinizer | they'll make sure your data volume is well below where they start to pay more to carriers than you pay to them |
| 17:59.42 | javispedro | RST38h: not a .pdf but a PalmOS database file (.azw) ;P |
| 17:59.52 | DocScrutinizer | and they are free to choose whatever restrictions they consider opportune to achive this goal |
| 17:59.57 | npm | Is this correct?? -- "Store the application icon in /usr/share/themes/base/meegotouch/icons/ . " http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Platform_Guide/Publishing_with_Harmattan_Platform_SDK/Packaging_your_application_with_Harmattan_Platform_SDK |
| 18:00.25 | rafael2k | other doubt with the new firmware, how to disable aegis? |
| 18:00.34 | RST38h | javispedro: OMG |
| 18:00.42 | rafael2k | ow at least put it in the relaxed mode |
| 18:00.55 | RST38h | javispedro: this qualifies as cruel and unusual punishment. How do they deal with the 64000-byte size limit? =) |
| 18:01.05 | rafael2k | I cannot even chmod the sources.list.d files... |
| 18:01.19 | DocScrutinizer | so while my deal for 3G data is like "10â¬/month for 500MB" right now, your deal with this Amazon worlwide "free" 3G data is completely on the mercy of Amazon |
| 18:01.21 | RST38h | rafael2k: That is for your own good! |
| 18:01.30 | rafael2k | RST38h: eheheheh |
| 18:01.32 | javispedro | RST38h: that applies to records only, there's also a 64000 limit of records, so the real max size is larger |
| 18:02.01 | RST38h | javispedro: 4palgigabytes? |
| 18:02.02 | javispedro | the format is basically an evolution of the palmdoc, which palm later based their "streaming" pdbs specification upon |
| 18:02.16 | javispedro | :) |
| 18:02.17 | javispedro | exactly :) |
| 18:02.24 | RST38h | wonders what made Amazon choose this particular format |
| 18:02.31 | javispedro | RST38h: mobipocket |
| 18:02.36 | rafael2k | RST38h: I know, same thing that some say to me about don't drinking wiskie. But I do prefer drinking it! |
| 18:02.36 | RST38h | ah |
| 18:02.45 | RST38h | is it in any way related to .mobi format? |
| 18:03.01 | javispedro | very much |
| 18:03.04 | rafael2k | really people, no workaround for disabling aegis yet? |
| 18:03.09 | RST38h | not yet |
| 18:03.27 | javispedro | rafael2k: go complain to Nokia too |
| 18:03.37 | RST38h | kernel sources out, best esotheric scientists in the universe are working on building a usable kernel from them. |
| 18:03.47 | javispedro | I am in too much of a good point to post another rant to the Aegis thread, but I guess I will do once mood drops |
| 18:03.53 | javispedro | s/good point/good mood |
| 18:04.12 | rafael2k | well, I'll wait a little then |
| 18:04.36 | javispedro | for the bad news you mean =) |
| 18:04.50 | rafael2k | the usb of my N900 broke and now the N950 is my primary phone. So I have no way out |
| 18:04.51 | javispedro | RST38h: basically, .azw = .mobi |
| 18:04.59 | RST38h | aha |
| 18:06.05 | *** join/#harmattan faenil_ (b21a2812@gateway/web/freenode/ip.178.26.40.18) |
| 18:07.13 | faenil_ | stupid hostel wifi |
| 18:07.16 | faenil_ | logs out every 10 mins |
| 18:07.29 | SpeedEvil | Hostile indeed. |
| 18:07.38 | DocScrutinizer | rafael2k: there'll never be a real "workaround" to "disable aegis" in HARM. You're free to basically switch OS, if only by booting your own "non-HARM" kernel and watch the HARM userlend blow chunks |
| 18:09.22 | DocScrutinizer | userland* |
| 18:10.05 | faenil_ | the Nemo image for n950 is coming soon... |
| 18:10.13 | faenil_ | we could spend massive amount of time on that |
| 18:10.15 | faenil_ | and make it usable |
| 18:10.37 | faenil_ | and the N9 Moslo is coming soon too, I have seen the community edition on the N9 at QtDev Days |
| 18:10.48 | faenil_ | problem is the guy who takes care of that is on holiday |
| 18:10.53 | faenil_ | that's why it's taking longer |
| 18:11.17 | SpeedEvil | scuba-diving with the fishes? |
| 18:12.12 | DocScrutinizer | what's the use of MOSLO anyway? |
| 18:12.24 | rafael2k | people, just to make sure, the before present "aegis relaxed mode" available in beta1 and beta2 is not available anymore, is that right? |
| 18:12.50 | RST38h | yes |
| 18:12.57 | DocScrutinizer | NOLO boots MOSLO in "open mode", so no way back to HARM proper without reflashing |
| 18:13.45 | DocScrutinizer | actually in my book MOSLO is for booting *other* OS, not for HARM |
| 18:14.40 | faenil | SpeedEvil: no clue, that's what I was told by the guy who had the CE on N9 :D |
| 18:15.02 | faenil | Doc: exactly, we're booting Mer in fact... |
| 18:15.03 | DocScrutinizer | rafael2k: well, it gets harder each release, and by now is probably not available at all, until this may change again *maybe*, *eventually* |
| 18:15.06 | faenil | with a UX on top of that |
| 18:15.10 | faenil | well, they are |
| 18:15.50 | rafael2k | RST38h: DocScrutinizer: thanks for the anwsers people, now I understand the situation better... |
| 18:16.05 | DocScrutinizer | yw |
| 18:16.41 | faenil | Mer is only the core... |
| 18:16.50 | *** join/#harmattan japplo (~japplo@89.204.153.219) |
| 18:17.19 | javispedro | rafael2k: I suggest that if you have complains about the situation, make them known. |
| 18:17.24 | javispedro | as this does not seem to be getting better. rather, worse. |
| 18:17.33 | DocScrutinizer | indeed |
| 18:17.58 | rafael2k | javispedro: I'll do this. Where do you suggest me to publish such report? |
| 18:17.59 | japplo | hi |
| 18:18.24 | DocScrutinizer | I think Nokia selling this N9 as a FOSS linux device is a bait-and-switch, a red herring |
| 18:18.34 | javispedro | rafael2k: If I'd knew, you'd find a message from me on such a place... ;P |
| 18:19.10 | DocScrutinizer | nokia care might be the right addressee |
| 18:20.07 | rafael2k | I'll try to message nokia |
| 18:21.54 | DocScrutinizer | though HARM technically is linux and FOSS, in practice it's like you won a $million at some lottery and they tell you the money is on this and that bank account, the account even is on your name, but they don't give you any credit card or credentials or whatever to actually *access* this account |
| 18:24.31 | japplo | I like to build a source code with mad. The problem is, that the libXtst-devel is missing.??? |
| 18:24.45 | DocScrutinizer | you could however ask the lottery management to send you a check to pay something, and they may or may not do that |
| 18:28.09 | *** join/#harmattan harbaum (~quassel@dslb-088-066-128-098.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:29.43 | rafael2k | Just email quim gil |
| 18:30.57 | rafael2k | let's see nokia's answer |
| 18:32.23 | javispedro | quim != nokia these days, aiui, he's more of a Troll right now ;) |
| 18:32.41 | javispedro | (in the Trolltech tense, if there are any ignorants around) |
| 18:34.13 | faenil | DocScrutinizer: you can install Debian on the Kindle xD |
| 18:34.33 | javispedro | DocScrutinizer: it's interesting to note than one N9 that used my kernel build didn't show the warranty void warning |
| 18:35.00 | DocScrutinizer | I still doubt that's all correct |
| 18:35.10 | DocScrutinizer | needs some confirmation |
| 18:35.21 | javispedro | well, I am waiting for your N9... |
| 18:35.29 | DocScrutinizer | too |
| 18:35.42 | javispedro | but in the meantime, why'd he lie |
| 18:35.51 | javispedro | maybe on PR1.0 they'd forgot to put the warning =) |
| 18:35.58 | DocScrutinizer | actually I wait for *some* mail confirming any of my mails made it to either Ronan or Quim |
| 18:36.09 | faenil | I could try that, if my N9 wasn't still sealed in my bag |
| 18:36.30 | javispedro | well, you don't have warranty either |
| 18:36.44 | DocScrutinizer | javispedro: nobody lies. It's just he maybe looked some nudy at TV while the warning popped up, or whatever |
| 18:37.06 | javispedro | it's not like it doesn't stay on the screen for a whopping 10 seconds =) |
| 18:37.32 | javispedro | damn cable TV pr0n networks |
| 18:37.36 | DocScrutinizer | unless e.g GSM TZ adjusts the system time, whatever |
| 18:37.58 | faenil | javispedro: I think the N9 we were given are retail ones... |
| 18:38.09 | faenil | with warranty and stuff |
| 18:38.28 | javispedro | you have a receipt? =) |
| 18:38.29 | gri | faenil: girlfriend unsealed mine and changed background to some flowers ... have to get it back before it's too late! |
| 18:38.46 | faenil | javispedro: no but I have imei xD |
| 18:39.19 | faenil | gri: lol gri, naughty girl! |
| 18:39.24 | faenil | you should have paid attention to it! |
| 18:39.49 | iekku | gri, hah, you haven't teach her |
| 18:39.52 | faenil | For you who don't know it, gri had a red card, so he could not get an N9, but he went to Quim Gil, and Quim gave him one :D |
| 18:39.57 | gri | my attention was at the food :/ |
| 18:40.51 | iekku | i don't touch my "wife's" (i call my husband as a wife) phone or computer |
| 18:41.27 | DocScrutinizer | javispedro: do you think the rootfs&kernel&whatnot/NOLO could get updated while keeping cmt FW/rev-tag untouched? |
| 18:41.32 | iekku | not even for practical jokes |
| 18:42.37 | faenil | iekku: did not know you were a she :D |
| 18:42.45 | faenil | iekku : need to remember that, lol :P |
| 18:42.45 | iekku | as i don't want him to do any kind of stuff with my phones and computers |
| 18:42.48 | javispedro | faenil: they didn't hand out N9s for all assistants? O.o |
| 18:43.05 | faenil | javispedro: what do you mean by assistant? |
| 18:43.10 | iekku | faenil, i think i am physically she |
| 18:43.12 | javispedro | err. |
| 18:43.22 | iekku | mentally, not |
| 18:43.29 | faenil | iekku: good :) |
| 18:43.37 | javispedro | short circuits for a moment |
| 18:43.38 | faenil | iekku: right ;) |
| 18:43.44 | DocScrutinizer | faenil: even that was an assumption of you |
| 18:43.45 | faenil | javispedro: lol |
| 18:43.47 | javispedro | faenil: they didn't hand out N9s for all attendees? |
| 18:43.55 | faenil | DocScrutinizer: which one? |
| 18:44.00 | faenil | javispedro: nope |
| 18:44.07 | gri | halt of the attendees |
| 18:44.09 | gri | half* |
| 18:44.15 | faenil | javispedro: only those with blue cards + those who got it from quim |
| 18:44.17 | javispedro | hm :\ |
| 18:44.18 | gri | + a lot more to other people |
| 18:44.19 | DocScrutinizer | <faenil> iekku: did not know you were a she :D |
| 18:44.43 | faenil | DocScrutinizer: yeah ofc how could I imagine she was a she :D |
| 18:45.06 | iekku | faenil, easy google trick ? :D |
| 18:45.17 | faenil | ehehe :P |
| 18:45.22 | DocScrutinizer | well, at least here we got some couples where each has a husband |
| 18:45.36 | iekku | :) |
| 18:46.09 | faenil | yup :) well, I'm not married, but got a gf :D |
| 18:46.16 | iekku | and if someone is calling husband as a wife i think it's easy to assume that both are males |
| 18:46.24 | DocScrutinizer | which would actually make >>i call my husband as a wife<< sound more plausible ;-D |
| 18:46.54 | iekku | gri, so there's "divide et impera" situation :P |
| 18:47.07 | iekku | :) |
| 18:48.00 | iekku | i do the nerd stuff and bring money, he does the rest :P that's why he is wife |
| 18:48.13 | gri | does both ... damn |
| 18:48.15 | faenil | iekku: haahaha |
| 18:48.22 | DocScrutinizer | boooh, macho!!! ;-P |
| 18:48.28 | iekku | gri, you can't always win :D |
| 18:48.46 | faenil | ahahahah |
| 18:49.16 | faenil | but is scared of everything :P |
| 18:49.16 | faenil | but gri* |
| 18:49.32 | iekku | spiders? |
| 18:49.42 | gri | faenil: no, only cameras (and spiders, yes) |
| 18:49.46 | faenil | ahahaha |
| 18:50.01 | iekku | :D |
| 18:50.12 | iekku | oh, time to get some sleep |
| 18:50.23 | faenil | he was asked to take part in an interview, and he sent me XD |
| 18:50.39 | gri | if there's a spider in the room, my girlfriend and I seem to be doomed |
| 18:50.50 | faenil | bastard xD lol :P and I also lied during the interview ( well, that's anothing thing, lol) |
| 18:51.01 | faenil | gri: ahaah my ex-gf was like that |
| 18:53.46 | faenil | gri: are you already in augsburg? |
| 18:54.24 | gri | faenil: In a city next to it since I'm not directly from augsburg |
| 18:54.49 | faenil | ok |
| 18:54.54 | gri | traffic home was hell but it was rush hour |
| 18:55.03 | faenil | oh...well good anyway |
| 18:55.26 | gri | was here at 18:40 so I'm here quite a while :) |
| 18:55.59 | faenil | you got there almost before me, lol |
| 18:56.56 | faenil | iekku: so, don't you know anything about CE on n9? |
| 19:00.23 | faenil | she must be already sleeping :D |
| 19:01.46 | *** join/#harmattan Natunen (nalle@213-186-240-19.bb.dnainternet.fi) |
| 19:04.16 | japplo | I try to build keepassx for meego manhattan and I get this error: http://fpaste.org/MKED/ |
| 19:04.40 | javispedro | Manhattan!! |
| 19:04.48 | javispedro | I'd love to checkout such a Meego. |
| 19:04.54 | faenil | xD |
| 19:04.59 | faenil | don't be evil javis! XD |
| 19:05.08 | japplo | what is the reason for this? |
| 19:05.22 | javispedro | japplo: you want to add libxi-dev to your build dependencies |
| 19:05.24 | faenil | it's Harmattan, not Manhattan |
| 19:05.33 | faenil | oh you meant the problem, lol |
| 19:05.35 | javispedro | javispedro: you are a genius! |
| 19:05.42 | javispedro | japplo: where are you building this? |
| 19:05.48 | faenil | javispedro: ahahah |
| 19:06.10 | japplo | i tried it with mad |
| 19:06.27 | japplo | :-) |
| 19:06.32 | javispedro | japplo: under the QtSDK? try the other rootstrap |
| 19:06.53 | japplo | yes, /opt/qtsdk/Madde/bin/mad make |
| 19:06.57 | javispedro | harmattan mad in the qtsdk comes with two sysroots/rootstraps, one is called "nokia-meego" iirc, try that one. |
| 19:07.32 | mgedmin | japplo, looks like missing build dependencies |
| 19:07.45 | japplo | /opt/qtsdk/Madde/bin/mad list says harmattan-nokia-meego-api is default |
| 19:07.58 | javispedro | japplo: err then try the other one, what's it named? |
| 19:08.21 | japplo | harmattan-platform-api |
| 19:08.25 | javispedro | that one :) |
| 19:08.55 | mgedmin | XInput.h ought to be in the libxi-dev package |
| 19:09.45 | javispedro | hmrpf |
| 19:09.49 | japplo | yes, I've installed it. I think... |
| 19:09.57 | japplo | wget http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta2/free/libx/libxtst/libxtst-dev_1.1.0-3-meego421+0m6_armel.deb |
| 19:10.04 | japplo | /opt/qtsdk/Madde/bin/mad-admin xdpkg -i libxtst-dev_1.1.0-3-meego421+0m6_armel.deb |
| 19:10.23 | javispedro | ah, so you already know mad-admin, perfect |
| 19:10.54 | mgedmin | I'm completely unfamiliar with madde |
| 19:11.20 | javispedro | japplo: do the same with http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/pool/harmattan-beta2/free/libx/libxi/libxi-dev_1.3-4-meego392+0m6_armel.deb |
| 19:11.20 | mgedmin | does it build debs from a debian source package in a chroot of some kind? do you have a debian/control file with Build-Depends: ..., libxi-dev ? |
| 19:11.59 | javispedro | mgedmin: madde does not care about them |
| 19:12.12 | javispedro | (at least when using QtCreator...) |
| 19:13.05 | javispedro | javispedro: you need a better IRC client that does not include the user's current alias in the TAB completion roster |
| 19:13.52 | japplo | javispedro: is installed and now I get a Segmentation fault :-) |
| 19:14.03 | faenil | zz_gri: rescue your n9 |
| 19:14.06 | javispedro | runs away |
| 19:14.17 | faenil | hides |
| 19:15.42 | merlin1991 | needs a flash image for n9 ffs |
| 19:16.08 | *** join/#harmattan BluesLee (~held@ip-178-202-182-84.unitymediagroup.de) |
| 19:16.17 | faenil | merlin1991: the new ocf is out |
| 19:16.21 | faenil | oh sorry |
| 19:16.24 | faenil | that's for n950 |
| 19:16.27 | merlin1991 | n9 not n950 :/ |
| 19:16.43 | faenil | sure, sorry :) got both, so I did not think about it |
| 19:17.06 | japplo | http://fpaste.org/jNGf/ |
| 19:17.09 | faenil | last news from Nokia Conversations is, it's coming in the Fourth Quarted |
| 19:17.14 | faenil | quarter |
| 19:18.01 | faenil | merlin1991: while at qt dev days someone was saying that the fw should have been released the day before Dev Days...but they found some last minute bug, and the |
| 19:18.07 | faenil | and they postponed it |
| 19:18.54 | faenil | merlin1991: I tried to get more info about the new update from a N9 team guy at dev days this morning, but he would just say |
| 19:19.07 | faenil | "I know when it's coming out, but I can't say anything" |
| 19:20.48 | faenil | and there's one more thing to witness that theory |
| 19:21.03 | faenil | we were given free NFC stickers to use with the N9 (those who got a free one= |
| 19:21.07 | faenil | ) |
| 19:21.13 | SpeedEvil | ~aegis |
| 19:21.13 | infobot | http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/Harmattan:Developer_Library/Developing_for_Harmattan/Harmattan_security/Security_guide , or "The purpose of this framework is: ... to make sure that the platform meets the requirements set by third party software that requires a safe execution environment.", or http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trusted_Computing#Criticism, or http://en.qi-hardware.com/w/images/1/10/ME_382_LockedUpTechnology2.gif |
| 19:21.16 | faenil | BUT, actual fw can't read NFC tags... |
| 19:21.34 | faenil | actually it can read NFC tags, but it doesn't perform the correspondent operation |
| 19:21.35 | SpeedEvil | hmm - what's the link to the limits... |
| 19:21.46 | faenil | like it reads the website but doesn't open the webbrowser |
| 19:21.56 | merlin1991 | thanks for the info faenil |
| 19:22.05 | faenil | np ;) |
| 19:22.21 | faenil | so I think they had NFC stickers coz they wanted to release the update before dev days :) |
| 19:22.49 | merlin1991 | afaik nfc reading works if you try it directly, at least the test app gives me results |
| 19:22.59 | faenil | yes that's what I meant... |
| 19:23.08 | faenil | it reads, but it doesn't perform the corresponding operation |
| 19:23.16 | faenil | it reads the website string |
| 19:23.30 | faenil | but it doesn't open the website in the webbrowser afterwards |
| 19:24.21 | merlin1991 | I would really like a way to write some sort of plugin that can handle any nfc uri |
| 19:24.30 | merlin1991 | not only specifig ndef msgs |
| 19:25.02 | faenil | I know almost nothing about nfc, so I can't help you :) |
| 19:25.43 | merlin1991 | the problem is that according to docs you can only register your application to get called for custom ndef messages |
| 19:25.52 | merlin1991 | so in order todo what I want I need to write a bg deamon :/ |
| 19:26.35 | faenil | I can tell you thought (just as an info) that the stickers we were given are 96bytes, 192bytes, and 1Kb |
| 19:26.55 | faenil | and the 1kb one should have some kind of security feature |
| 19:28.30 | faenil | Just noticed that the Lumia 800 ha NO front camera...-.- |
| 19:28.35 | deram | nfc reading seams to work at least in bundled angry birds... |
| 19:28.46 | merlin1991 | my interest is not exactly todo anything with the data, but I want to use it as sort of action trigger, i.e put a sticker on my car bt system where the id triggers enabling of bt on the phone |
| 19:28.59 | *** join/#harmattan lardman|home (~simon@host-78-146-248-231.as13285.net) |
| 19:29.15 | lardman|home | evening all |
| 19:29.20 | deram | got levels open with city public transportation card.. |
| 19:29.22 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: That will mean continual polling of the NFC at ~1hz or more. |
| 19:29.24 | faenil | merlin1991: and that was the kind of application I was thinking about too |
| 19:29.28 | faenil | kinda switch |
| 19:29.42 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: Which will have some impact on battery life. |
| 19:29.53 | SpeedEvil | As it's got to activate quite a high power transmit coil. |
| 19:30.15 | faenil | SpeedEvil: I did not get you |
| 19:30.22 | merlin1991 | SpeedEvil: the phone detects nearby tags by itself if nfc is enabled in the settings |
| 19:30.33 | lardman|home | anyone have any ideas how I access the QGLWidget that I've set as my view widget from my QDeclarativeItem? |
| 19:30.34 | merlin1991 | (I do get the nfc banner) |
| 19:30.37 | *** join/#harmattan Arkenoi (~ark@178.177.73.237) |
| 19:30.48 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: Sure - the hardware has to poll for the tag. This will be moderately expensive in terms of power. |
| 19:30.53 | faenil | lardman|home: I have been playing with that same thing... |
| 19:30.58 | SpeedEvil | I'd expect it to knock a few days off standby. |
| 19:31.24 | lardman|home | faenil: I guess one could just pass a pointer to the QDeclarativeView? |
| 19:31.50 | merlin1991 | SpeedEvil: I have nfc "enabled" all the time, and standby is more than a day so more than enough |
| 19:31.54 | lardman|home | but I don't see a method of QDeclarativeView to get the view widget anyway |
| 19:31.55 | gri | damn, laptop turned off while phoning :/ |
| 19:32.07 | faenil | I have a QDeclarativeItem and put the gl functions in its paintevent |
| 19:32.35 | faenil | so that's kinda QGLWidget but with qml access |
| 19:32.35 | lardman|home | same here, but i need to bind a texture |
| 19:32.41 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: do you have 'energy profiler' installed? And can you try it with and without? |
| 19:32.47 | merlin1991 | no but I can |
| 19:32.57 | faenil | ok so you just do that inside the paint function of the item |
| 19:32.58 | lardman|home | QDeclarativeItem isn't descended from QGLWidget unfortunately |
| 19:33.24 | merlin1991 | I just need to find some way to plug into that os level nfc detection |
| 19:33.29 | gri | faenil: did you also need all three nfc stickers to unlock all angry birds levels? |
| 19:33.50 | faenil | gri: my N9 is still sealed...do they unlock ab levels? O_O |
| 19:33.59 | Arkenoi | so seems that it is reliably bricked, won't even charge :-( |
| 19:33.59 | merlin1991 | SpeedEvil: is energy profiler one of the dev tools? |
| 19:34.15 | faenil | lardman, I don't get your problem, you need no glwidget |
| 19:34.27 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: yes. |
| 19:34.30 | gri | faenil: oh, forgot that :) yes every nfc thingy unlocks the angry birds levels |
| 19:34.39 | faenil | you just set an empty glwidget as the viewport of the qdeclarativeview |
| 19:34.43 | mgedmin | gri, all you all you need to unlock angry birds is vi :) |
| 19:34.47 | lardman|home | faenil: I was hoping to use the bindTexture() method of QGLWidget |
| 19:34.48 | faenil | gri: wow! :D |
| 19:34.49 | SpeedEvil | merlin1991: Alternatively - bmedatalogger may be installed as a commandline app |
| 19:34.59 | faenil | lardman|home: of course, and you can use it |
| 19:35.13 | merlin1991 | SpeedEvil: docs on the energy profiler? |
| 19:35.23 | gri | mgedmin: well, I did not activate the developer mode nor put a sim card in yet :) |
| 19:35.33 | SpeedEvil | nvm - sorry - going to sleep. |
| 19:35.56 | faenil | lardman|home: I don't get your problems :D You just transfer all your calls from the glwidget's paintGL to item's paint() |
| 19:36.18 | gri | lardman: you don't need a gl view, a context is enaugh - and this even has static functions for getting the current one |
| 19:36.23 | lardman|home | faenil: so you have placed a QGLWidget in the QDeclarativeWidget? |
| 19:36.44 | Summeli | sounds like a very bad idea... |
| 19:36.44 | gri | err glwidget, you need a glwidget as viewport - damn :P |
| 19:36.59 | faenil | declview.setViewport(glwidget); |
| 19:37.18 | gri | faenil: or -graphicssystem opengl ;) |
| 19:37.20 | faenil | glwidget being an "empty" one |
| 19:37.24 | Summeli | mixing qgraphicsview based stuff with qwidgets... not so good idea :) |
| 19:37.40 | lardman|home | faenil: yeah, done that |
| 19:37.42 | faenil | Summeli: qgraphicsview and qwidgets? |
| 19:38.03 | faenil | lardman|home: ok, so now you just take your paintGL code and copy it to QDeclItem's paint() |
| 19:38.05 | Summeli | faenil: yeah, huge penalty in fps |
| 19:38.09 | faenil | and find a way to call initializeGL too |
| 19:38.37 | faenil | Performance I have are the ones I expected... |
| 19:38.50 | faenil | i.e. 20fps with 40k tri/sec |
| 19:38.54 | faenil | or smthg like that |
| 19:39.01 | faenil | don't remember .. |
| 19:39.20 | lardman|home | faenil: hang on 5, on phone |
| 19:39.27 | gri | would use Qt3D but that's out of the yuestion here |
| 19:39.32 | Summeli | gri: me too |
| 19:39.47 | faenil | sure |
| 19:39.53 | faenil | exactly, out of question :P |
| 19:39.55 | Summeli | using shaders is so fast with that code |
| 19:40.18 | faenil | Summeli: well using shaders is always write code and compile, what's difficult in that? |
| 19:40.31 | faenil | setting uniforms and stuff? |
| 19:40.58 | faenil | Summeli: anything if you think I'm doing something wrong, please insist and I'll change it ;) |
| 19:41.01 | faenil | anyway* |
| 19:41.02 | Summeli | faenil: yeah, you don't have to do that with qt3d |
| 19:41.14 | faenil | Summeli: okay, but that's easy stuff :) |
| 19:41.16 | Summeli | and it even has the default shaders for you |
| 19:41.25 | faenil | Summeli: that's already better :P |
| 19:41.38 | ieatlint | i'm voting for someone for mayor running on a platform of "shut up", a tax on "ironic mustaches", and "all cops in chaps".. among other key ideas. |
| 19:41.42 | ieatlint | loves his city |
| 19:41.42 | faenil | I'm not using anything because I want to learn how it works, don't know about lardman ;) |
| 19:43.09 | gri | faenil: already left the bar? |
| 19:43.28 | faenil | gri: I'm still in the hostel... |
| 19:43.37 | faenil | gri: which bar are you talking about? :) |
| 19:43.46 | gri | the hostel's bar |
| 19:43.56 | faenil | oh ok, yeah I'm still close to there |
| 19:44.15 | faenil | people sleeping in my 12 people room, lol |
| 19:44.46 | lardman|home | re |
| 19:44.50 | faenil | Summeli: I'm actually having problems with raypicking atm |
| 19:45.06 | faenil | would you please help me out? I can send you the code...even tomorrow ;) |
| 19:45.26 | Summeli | faenil: I'm afraid that I don't have time for it :/ |
| 19:45.37 | Summeli | I'm quite busy at work.. |
| 19:45.46 | lardman|home | the issue is when I set up my OpenGL code, I need to bind a texture, which was previously being done by a call to QGLWidget, but now I don't have a pointer to one of those |
| 19:45.55 | faenil | Summeli: ok, no problem ;) my problem is I think I have some problems with don't know what... |
| 19:46.06 | faenil | ray picking only works when I don't move camera/scene |
| 19:46.23 | faenil | and it works on the left but not on the right, or smthg like that |
| 19:46.24 | lardman|home | in initialiseGL() in fact... |
| 19:46.50 | faenil | just replace that call with a pure GL one then |
| 19:47.00 | faenil | glGenTexture or don't know whatelse :) |
| 19:47.04 | faenil | glBindTexture |
| 19:47.08 | gri | noo |
| 19:47.14 | lardman|home | sure, 'twas my next step, just wondering if I was doing it wrong though |
| 19:47.24 | lardman|home | the docs are somewhat sparse on things like this |
| 19:48.00 | faenil | yup, I asked for help for days to get it working xD |
| 19:48.07 | faenil | read forums and stuff |
| 19:48.07 | lardman|home | :) |
| 19:48.24 | lardman|home | yeah I've got this far using tips from Questions and forums |
| 19:48.28 | faenil | and still, I have a little problem, which could be unrelated to this though |
| 19:48.49 | lardman|home | I'll have another look at the OpenGLES code and convert away from the Qt wrappers |
| 19:48.57 | faenil | ;) |
| 19:49.16 | faenil | Summeli: what's your idea instead? what should I do? |
| 19:49.20 | lardman|home | I'd prefer to not being using OpenGL, I just want to render video data to a QML element |
| 19:49.42 | lardman|home | s/prefer not to/am not bothered whether I use |
| 19:49.59 | Summeli | faenil: hard to say anything without looking at the code or seeing the what it does.. |
| 19:50.14 | faenil | I meant you said something about qwidgets and graphicsview |
| 19:50.40 | faenil | lardman|home: there was a session about qtquick3d being used to render video on a cube today at qt dev days |
| 19:50.41 | Summeli | yeah, last time i tested it, it turned out with very bad fps |
| 19:50.50 | Summeli | but that could be better now.. |
| 19:50.59 | faenil | Summeli: could you please elaborate? what's the alternative |
| 19:51.00 | gri | damn, nvidia driver installer just resarted my laptop without asking |
| 19:51.07 | faenil | gri: lol |
| 19:51.08 | Summeli | faenil: not mixing them :D |
| 19:51.10 | lardman|home | faenil: hmm, I'll see if I can find a webcast |
| 19:51.26 | faenil | Summeli: who's using qwidget and who's using qgraphicsview? |
| 19:51.41 | faenil | and what's the alternative? (how do I avoid mixing them?) |
| 19:51.57 | Summeli | faenil: in this case I would guess that you're going go get the same 20fps in you qgrpahicsview based object too |
| 19:52.06 | Summeli | maybe that's not a problem |
| 19:52.07 | faenil | this is the only way it seemed to work, and that's what people on chat told me to do, and what qtdevnet forum said |
| 19:52.52 | faenil | but really, who's using qwidget and who qgraphicsview? |
| 19:52.56 | faenil | :) |
| 19:53.00 | faenil | I mean which class.. |
| 19:53.38 | Summeli | faenil: I think that it depends... |
| 19:53.53 | Summeli | which Qt version are you using |
| 19:53.56 | faenil | 4.7.3 |
| 19:54.05 | faenil | how do you know that I'm mixing them then XD |
| 19:54.06 | lardman|home | mixing as in how? Having a ui which has both QWidgets and QGraphicsView objects? |
| 19:54.42 | faenil | lardman|home: that's what I'm trying to understand :) I'm not a Qt expert, and Summeli is quite good at graphics :P |
| 19:54.50 | gri | lardman|home: No idea what you're looking for but you can also start your program with "-graphicsystem opengl" and use QGLContext::currentContext() for your texture calls |
| 19:54.53 | Summeli | faenil: newermind |
| 19:55.19 | Summeli | I have only tested these on my desktop with the git-version |
| 19:55.37 | faenil | Summeli: really, I wanted an explanation :O as you wish, anyway ;) |
| 19:55.52 | faenil | Could you please elaborate more on the details? :D |
| 19:56.01 | faenil | I'm not getting what's going on here xD |
| 19:56.08 | Summeli | faenil: what I tested it seemed that the glwidget slowed my drawing with the declarative view |
| 19:56.10 | lardman|home | gri: I have a QML app, with a QDeclarativeView setup in C++ and I wish to export a C++ object in the form of a QDeclarativeItem to the QMl code so that I can render video |
| 19:56.14 | Summeli | I didn't get the 60fps with that one |
| 19:56.43 | faenil | ok...what could you do instead? |
| 19:56.44 | lardman|home | gri: QGLContext static calls look interesting though |
| 19:56.46 | Summeli | I haven't debugged that one enough to say more about mixing them.. |
| 19:57.08 | Summeli | faenil: there's no solution, if you want to have them both |
| 19:57.09 | faenil | lardman|home: hadn't you already solved the problem : ) |
| 19:57.33 | faenil | Summeli: the things is, at the moment I see NO other option to do the same thing, that's why I'm asking you :D |
| 19:57.49 | Summeli | faenil: yes, there's no options for this |
| 19:57.51 | lardman|home | faenil: potentially ;) |
| 19:58.01 | faenil | Summeli: okay, good :) |
| 19:58.05 | gri | Summeli: don't all meegotouch applications use opengl by default? I thought it was like that |
| 19:58.20 | Summeli | gri: but those are not qwidget based |
| 19:58.34 | Summeli | or are they? :) |
| 19:58.46 | faenil | xD |
| 19:58.46 | mgedmin | qt apps use opengl when they're in the foreground, and regular 2d graphics when their thumbnails are rendered for the task switcher |
| 19:58.49 | gri | Summeli: yeah but faenil wanted to use a qglwidget as viewport that's not a qwidget based application |
| 19:59.14 | faenil | gri: I can use whatever you think it's best... |
| 19:59.25 | faenil | gri: I only want to reach my target, which is opengl 3d game |
| 19:59.30 | faenil | with qml ui |
| 19:59.55 | gri | well, qdeclarativeview with gl viewport != widget based application as far as I know |
| 20:00.07 | Summeli | gri: yeah! |
| 20:00.20 | faenil | so? |
| 20:01.30 | gri | faenil: so that should be fast - it get slow when you start adding qwidget*'s to your graphicsscene |
| 20:02.10 | faenil | ok got what you meant, you were referring to Summeli |
| 20:02.11 | Summeli | that's what I saw too |
| 20:02.41 | gri | yeah, I was just telling you both that you were not talking about the same topic :P |
| 20:02.47 | faenil | gri: :P |
| 20:03.20 | faenil | gri: I forgot to check the code with you.. |
| 20:04.09 | gri | faenil: well, you still have gitorious, remote desktop, skype ... so there should be ways |
| 20:04.17 | faenil | sure ;) |
| 20:04.48 | faenil | gri: remember it's not starting from the icon? I think it's because of the target update in the sdk |
| 20:04.51 | merlin1991 | does anybody know about the underlying nfc software stack? |
| 20:04.55 | faenil | because the icon is not there either |
| 20:05.02 | faenil | while there should have been Qt icon |
| 20:05.10 | faenil | so probably both icon and bin paths have changed |
| 20:05.13 | faenil | in the latest update |
| 20:05.16 | faenil | or smthg like that |
| 20:05.18 | merlin1991 | I could only find the high level qt api docs, wich do't offer what I need |
| 20:05.52 | gri | faenil: I also have the latest sdk (couple of days old) and my application still works |
| 20:06.05 | faenil | who knows :P |
| 20:06.15 | faenil | application icons doesn't break like that :P |
| 20:06.30 | faenil | it's not like my code is bugged, that's autogenerated xD |
| 20:07.02 | gri | so does it start by commandline? |
| 20:07.26 | gri | do you use invoker? can you start it with invoker by the commandline? |
| 20:07.45 | faenil | is it in opt/bin? |
| 20:08.05 | gri | depends where you have installed it |
| 20:08.07 | Summeli | yeah, I had to change invoker after lates update |
| 20:08.17 | faenil | Summeli: good news |
| 20:08.35 | faenil | gri, I did not choose any installation path |
| 20:08.38 | Summeli | --type=d into --type=e and it starts up |
| 20:08.49 | faenil | where |
| 20:08.58 | gri | .desktop file |
| 20:08.58 | Summeli | you can test that with console application quite easily |
| 20:09.05 | Summeli | try to start your app with invoker |
| 20:09.39 | Arkenoi | sucks. last time i tried it was identified by USB subsystem as "nokia rom". now it does not show up on usb at all :-/ |
| 20:10.01 | faenil | ok ;) |
| 20:10.17 | gri | still has --type=d there and it works .. hmm |
| 20:10.26 | faenil | xD |
| 20:10.43 | Arkenoi | i guess i should try to open the cover and charge the battery by external charger :-/ if i only had one.. |
| 20:10.50 | Summeli | gri: well, I all kinds of starnge memory tricks with my app |
| 20:11.04 | Summeli | I'm just happy that it starts |
| 20:11.06 | *** part/#harmattan japplo (~japplo@89.204.153.219) |
| 20:11.13 | faenil | xD |
| 20:11.46 | Summeli | I can't really remember what those types were, but changing the app type did help |
| 20:11.52 | gri | Summeli: yeah but I also have other problems with invoker. If the application is started by invoker, aegis forbis me to open the contact card which is just a simple dbus call that's not even limited to something |
| 20:12.07 | *** join/#harmattan berndhs (~berndhs@2604:8800:11b:1:21e:90ff:fe8f:8bee) |
| 20:12.29 | Summeli | gri: maybe you should check the types aswell :) |
| 20:18.22 | *** join/#harmattan DanielW (~danielw@2a01:198:74b:0:1e6f:65ff:fe21:5f30) |
| 20:18.24 | DanielW | hi |
| 20:19.29 | DanielW | i got my n9 yesterday and just start playing arround with the qtsdk |
| 20:20.03 | DanielW | and well i now have a problem with qtmobility |
| 20:20.22 | faenil | DanielW: got it where? |
| 20:20.47 | DanielW | i am always getting 0 entries from QOrganizerManager.items( |
| 20:21.07 | faenil | maybe gri knows something about that |
| 20:21.13 | DanielW | i bought it on ebay.de from a guy who got it from getmobile.de |
| 20:23.26 | mgedmin | googles QOrganizerManager |
| 20:23.44 | *** join/#harmattan niqt (~quassel@host215-8-dynamic.21-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 20:24.08 | mgedmin | what is this "organizer"? calendar? |
| 20:24.25 | mgedmin | could be you need some aegis tokens to access that info... |
| 20:25.27 | DanielW | i thought it is the calender. and about aegis tokens, i put something (not sure if it is correct) in the manifest.aegis file |
| 20:26.05 | *** join/#harmattan NIN101 (~NIN101@p5DD28114.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) |
| 20:26.51 | DanielW | shouldn't i get this "QOrganizerManager::PermissionsError" from QOrganizerManager::error() if it is an aegis problem? |
| 20:27.32 | *** join/#harmattan M4rtinK (~M4rtinK@ip-94-112-98-210.net.upcbroadband.cz) |
| 20:27.36 | mgedmin | no idea, sorry |
| 20:28.08 | mgedmin | haven't encountered aegis-protected stuff in my meager development efforts yet... |
| 20:31.05 | faenil | so how can I get root on 39-5? |
| 20:31.09 | gri | I think I heard that you can't access the calendar of the n9 at all but that may be wrong |
| 20:31.25 | gri | faenil: login as developer or user and run devel-su with "rootme" as password |
| 20:31.45 | faenil | is that exactly the same? |
| 20:31.54 | gri | yes |
| 20:32.20 | faenil | ok thx |
| 20:32.35 | faenil | why did they delete the other way? |
| 20:33.02 | mgedmin | because letting anyone in the local network root your n950 is a bad idea? |
| 20:33.46 | gri | damn, I could have put a trojan horse on all beta2 n950's on devdays :P |
| 20:34.26 | faenil | ahahahah |
| 20:34.28 | faenil | right |
| 20:34.29 | faenil | lol |
| 20:39.39 | npm | anybody have a sample debian 'control' file that passed ovi store requirements for a qt multimedia/mobility/location app? |
| 20:40.25 | npm | is 'Depends: ${shlibs:Depends}' good enough or do i need to explicitly list dependencies? |
| 20:44.15 | *** join/#harmattan briglia (~briglia@85.13.70.251) |
| 20:49.58 | npm | or ... if my package builds and installs fine on my n950, can i assume its deb 'control' file is setup apropriately? |
| 20:50.52 | npm | attempting to understand/comply with http://www.developer.nokia.com/Community/Wiki/index.php?title=Special:PdfPrint&page=Harmattan:Platform_Guide/Publishing_with_Harmattan_Platform_SDK/Packaging_your_application_with_Harmattan_Platform_SDK |
| 20:51.37 | faenil | gri: |
| 20:51.40 | faenil | O_O http://www.engadget.com/2011/10/26/nokias-kinetic-future-flexible-screens-and-a-twisted-interface/ |
| 20:51.50 | npm | which says "control file: added short and long package descriptions and any dependencies and build dependencies to the file" |
| 20:53.06 | lardman|home | heads for bed |
| 20:53.10 | lardman|home | night all |
| 20:53.16 | gri | faenil: wow, I saw this displays some months ago and though "who would control a phone by twisting" :P |
| 20:53.27 | faenil | gri: ahahaha |
| 20:53.43 | faenil | elop will, lol |
| 20:54.28 | gri | did I mention that I even hate controlling games with accelerometer? ;) |
| 20:54.40 | faenil | well I hate that too... :| |
| 20:55.43 | gri | the video convinced me that even the woman showing the controls is confused by them |
| 20:56.13 | faenil | NEWS: N9 preorder in Italy...769,99â¬............................................................................................................................ |
| 20:56.29 | faenil | gri: that's coz it's a new UI |
| 20:57.07 | gri | "you broke your display by bending too hard" |
| 20:58.10 | faenil | who said that? :D |
| 20:58.24 | gri | me |
| 20:58.39 | faenil | oh ok :D |
| 20:58.56 | MohammadAG | lol |
| 20:59.05 | faenil | because this one doesn't seems to break down |
| 20:59.05 | faenil | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJEHp15Hoo0 |
| 20:59.08 | faenil | look at the end |
| 20:59.27 | MohammadAG | oh nice, a wiggle interface |
| 20:59.49 | MohammadAG | I have the best marketing campaign for it |
| 20:59.52 | faenil | :D |
| 20:59.58 | gri | faenil: how do you bend the rest of your phone hardware? |
| 21:00.24 | MohammadAG | Swipe, show yourself | Kinetic, Wiggle yourself |
| 21:00.27 | faenil | gri: that's true, but you don't break the display, you break the phone :P |
| 21:01.08 | faenil | MohammadAG: lol |
| 21:01.16 | DanielW | about my calendar access with qtmobility: i am getting this to the output: "sqlitestorage.cpp: 268 - database "/home/developer/.calendar/db" opened" . so it does somehow open it? |
| 21:03.16 | gri | DanielW: output QOrganizerManager::availableManagers () to your console |
| 21:03.34 | gri | because you should initialize QOrganizerManager with "tracker" instead of "" |
| 21:03.56 | DanielW | ok, i see the problem |
| 21:04.22 | DanielW | when i start it as developer (from qtcreator) or in the ssh console it starts as user "developer" |
| 21:04.38 | gri | that might also be a problem |
| 21:04.39 | DanielW | and that doesn't have any entires |
| 21:04.41 | MohammadAG | oh no no no |
| 21:04.47 | MohammadAG | bend yourself |
| 21:05.01 | MohammadAG | now that's marketing |
| 21:05.11 | gri | DanielW: You have to use the user account otherwise other things like using accounts also does not work |
| 21:05.45 | faenil | MohammadAG: bend yourself! ahahaha |
| 21:05.50 | DanielW | is there a way to do this from qtcreator or the ssh konsole? |
| 21:07.27 | gri | DanielW: most simple way would be: ssh onto the device as developer, become root with devel-su and "rootme" as password, call "passwd user" and set a password, allow user login in /etc/passwd, deploy ssh key to user account using qtcreator - but that's not simple if you have no clue of those parts |
| 21:07.39 | gri | or I am completely wrong and there is a simple way :) |
| 21:08.15 | mgedmin | hm, so are you saying that if I run an app using Qt Creator's Run (which uses the 'developer' account), my app won't get access to certain stuff? |
| 21:08.33 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@catv-80-99-26-170.catv.broadband.hu) |
| 21:08.33 | *** join/#harmattan Venemo (~Timur@fedora/Venemo) |
| 21:08.38 | gri | mgedmin: It gets access but it creates its own files |
| 21:08.46 | mgedmin | hm... maybe it makes some kind of sense -- I won't accidentally wipe my real calendar, say... |
| 21:08.48 | DanielW | doesn't sound too complicated. i am using linux for something like 10+ years |
| 21:08.56 | gri | mgedmin: So you can't see users's accounts as developer |
| 21:09.10 | gri | you may have login dialogs popping up |
| 21:10.47 | faenil | gri: does that mean he has to change "user" psw if he wants to deply to app to ovi store? |
| 21:11.03 | gri | faenil: no |
| 21:11.09 | faenil | I mean, first time the user will start the software it will change password or what? |
| 21:11.14 | faenil | ok, so it asks for login |
| 21:11.18 | faenil | and that's it |
| 21:11.31 | gri | faenil: if you deploy your application using qtcreator and start it, it will run from developer user |
| 21:11.33 | faenil | which would sound weird to people :D |
| 21:11.40 | faenil | gri: yes I got that |
| 21:11.43 | gri | if you start it from your .desktop file in the menu, it will run as "user" |
| 21:11.59 | gri | if you save th $HOME/some.db this may be two files then |
| 21:12.32 | gri | user and developer share the same MyDocs dir but the rest is not the same as far as I remember |
| 21:12.56 | faenil | yeah I got what you mean |
| 21:13.09 | faenil | but who knows its "user" password? people who bought N9 I mean |
| 21:13.30 | gri | you don't have to know it |
| 21:13.33 | DanielW | you don't have to know it |
| 21:13.48 | gri | root user can change the password for everyone |
| 21:13.56 | gri | "passwd username" sets the password for a given user |
| 21:13.58 | DanielW | and thanks now my calendar access is working |
| 21:13.59 | faenil | I know -.- |
| 21:14.11 | faenil | what I am saying is |
| 21:14.14 | faenil | let's suppose he put this app on the store |
| 21:14.14 | DanielW | but not sure if it has anything to do with aegis |
| 21:14.21 | faenil | and some n9 user downloads it |
| 21:14.33 | faenil | what will it do about this login thing? |
| 21:14.40 | mgedmin | faenil, NOTHING AT ALL |
| 21:14.47 | gri | faenil: the login thing I mentioned was something different |
| 21:14.51 | faenil | how does it get access then? |
| 21:15.07 | mgedmin | apps, launched from the app launcher, run under the 'user' account |
| 21:15.16 | faenil | ok |
| 21:15.19 | faenil | ok so they do that by default |
| 21:15.21 | mgedmin | apps launched from the Qt Creator using the SDK Connectivity Tool run under the 'developer' account |
| 21:15.26 | faenil | the problem was only that Daniel was running it from creator |
| 21:15.30 | faenil | yeah okay |
| 21:15.32 | mgedmin | these two accounts have separate calendars etc. -- stuff in /home/user versus /home/developer |
| 21:15.32 | faenil | of course |
| 21:16.23 | faenil | sure sure |
| 21:16.27 | faenil | that was all known |
| 21:16.42 | faenil | I just was not thinking about the fact that once you start it you're already logged |
| 21:17.17 | *** join/#harmattan javispedro (~javier@Maemo/community/contributor/javispedro) |
| 21:20.08 | DanielW | weird there are two calendars in my nokia n9 with chinese names. they seem to contain chinese holidays ... |
| 21:20.18 | faenil | javispedro: do you know anything about Nemo on N950? |
| 21:20.38 | javispedro | like? |
| 21:20.58 | faenil | like what's the current status of the fw image? is there anything I can test? |
| 21:21.03 | faenil | and play with? |
| 21:21.03 | Arkenoi | asked local nokia guys, they told me they have no hw flasher for n950, just the same usb procedure |
| 21:21.05 | Arkenoi | damn |
| 21:21.07 | faenil | not officially |
| 21:21.29 | javispedro | there is CE 1.3 |
| 21:22.34 | Arkenoi | wonder if charging the battery separately will help |
| 21:22.49 | Arkenoi | doubt it |
| 21:22.59 | faenil | javispedro: CE 1.3 is not NEMO |
| 21:23.06 | faenil | and it's not usable :) |
| 21:23.11 | javispedro | how not? |
| 21:23.26 | faenil | have you tried it on the n950? |
| 21:23.39 | javispedro | it's not like it will be utterly different considering the few time that has past |
| 21:23.57 | faenil | I know, I don't care about that ;) it's just that the core has changed anyway, so... |
| 21:24.03 | faenil | have you tried it ? |
| 21:24.04 | faenil | on n950 |
| 21:24.06 | Arkenoi | does anyone here have any "unbricking" success story when generic ocf did not work and any other tricks do? |
| 21:24.08 | javispedro | nope |
| 21:24.33 | faenil | okay, then I'll tell you some known things :) |
| 21:24.41 | faenil | 1) battery level not working |
| 21:24.44 | faenil | 2) camera not working |
| 21:24.51 | faenil | 3) can't receive SMS (I could not) |
| 21:24.54 | mgedmin | when ocf failed I shipped my n950 back to nokia, and nokia gave me another one |
| 21:24.58 | faenil | 4) Can't sent sms by contact |
| 21:25.03 | javispedro | faenil: I don't know why you are telling this to me |
| 21:25.14 | mgedmin | (the other way around actually: they shipped me a new one, and a prepaid dhl envelope to return the broken one0 |
| 21:25.27 | faenil | javispedro: just chatting :) thought you were into that given you are a hacky guy |
| 21:25.46 | faenil | and just asked if you had news about Nemo on n950 :) |
| 21:26.00 | faenil | and because I think that's where we should spend our time on :D |
| 21:26.08 | Arkenoi | mgedmin: this takes some time. probably a lot of it, if they have a spare one at all |
| 21:26.37 | mgedmin | a few days, yes |
| 21:26.39 | DocScrutinizer | hands javispedro a sol y sombra |
| 21:26.50 | Arkenoi | mgedmin: and exactly how it failed? |
| 21:27.02 | mgedmin | emmc chip failed, or something |
| 21:27.07 | faenil | Doc : lol |
| 21:27.14 | mgedmin | disk read errors, remount ro, etc.; then flashing failed in the middle of rootfs |
| 21:27.23 | faenil | don't you think Nemo is the way to go? :D |
| 21:27.31 | mgedmin | after which it wouldn't boot at all |
| 21:28.51 | DocScrutinizer | faenil: I think javispedro will pick what he thinks is his way to go |
| 21:28.55 | faenil | gri: I haven't eaten yet...we've eaten so much during these three days that I'm never hungry, lol |
| 21:29.05 | faenil | Doc: I was actually talking to you :D |
| 21:29.32 | faenil | Doc: and ofc, everyone will make his choice..we're just chatting here :) don't take it personal :D |
| 21:29.37 | gri | faenil: I ate a lot when I came home :D |
| 21:30.20 | SpeedEvil | may have overprepared for GoF2 end. 150 nukes, maxed-out everything. custom shield and cloak. |
| 21:30.28 | SpeedEvil | Way too easy. (on hard mode) |
| 21:30.53 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 21:30.54 | faenil | xD |
| 21:31.16 | Arkenoi | SpeedEvil: flying mantis? which weapons? |
| 21:32.08 | SpeedEvil | three maxheat o20. They do lots of damage when locked, but I hate that they're almost useless when not. |
| 21:32.11 | DocScrutinizer | SpeedEvil: probably time to have some fun on the dark side then |
| 21:32.31 | SpeedEvil | On balance, I prefer the slightly weaker ship with a turret. |
| 21:33.10 | Arkenoi | SpeedEvil: i hate that target lock is likely to stick to wrong ship |
| 21:33.12 | DocScrutinizer | pirate the pirates, kill the cops... ;-P |
| 21:33.24 | SpeedEvil | That's why those suck. |
| 21:33.26 | gri | faenil: good night, have to stand up early for university :( |
| 21:33.33 | javispedro | bah, I only have 30minutes so far in GoF |
| 21:33.35 | SpeedEvil | The rest of the projectiles go where you aim them. |
| 21:33.35 | faenil | SpeedEvil: there was the head of GoF company here at DevDays, and he showed a bit of game |
| 21:33.38 | javispedro | so there's a difficulty setting? |
| 21:33.43 | faenil | and he launched something which exploded to the whole screen xD |
| 21:33.47 | SpeedEvil | javispedro: I'm not sure what it _does_ |
| 21:33.56 | javispedro | missed it |
| 21:33.59 | faenil | gri: cya :D |
| 21:34.32 | SpeedEvil | faenil: 'start new game' -> easy/... |
| 21:34.43 | DocScrutinizer | in the old days it was mainly dampening which isn't exactly what you usually see in outer space |
| 21:34.48 | Arkenoi | had one maxheat, a custom laser, a weapon with fasted fire rate and something i do not remember.. well, anyways, everything is lost as i had no backup for things "not important enough" as usual :-/ |
| 21:34.49 | faenil | oh ok so that was the beginning |
| 21:34.59 | faenil | I thought it was some spoiler or something lol |
| 21:34.59 | faenil | I have never played it :) |
| 21:35.06 | faenil | he didn't start the official app |
| 21:35.12 | faenil | so I thought that was something new |
| 21:35.18 | DocScrutinizer | but of course a good steering computer would dampen any movement automatically |
| 21:35.23 | faenil | the app had no icon :) |
| 21:35.33 | SpeedEvil | Something fast firing, with good range is best IMO, even if not best damage rate |
| 21:36.28 | SpeedEvil | Ah - extreme mode looks more interesting. |
| 21:37.10 | Arkenoi | will there be valkyrie addon? |
| 21:37.28 | Arkenoi | played for two months or so |
| 21:38.05 | faenil | so is this game really worth playing :) |
| 21:38.39 | Arkenoi | yes |
| 21:38.48 | Arkenoi | it is much like Elite |
| 21:38.51 | SpeedEvil | It's limited. |
| 21:38.53 | javispedro | SpeedEvil: pfft you are right, can't believe I missed it the first time, probably I was bored of the introduction and in "hit next, next, next, next" mode |
| 21:39.14 | Arkenoi | Elite's universe is much bigger though and there are more things to do |
| 21:39.16 | SpeedEvil | It needs various things, and the interface screw is high. |
| 21:40.08 | SpeedEvil | It needs a random universe, probably prices which vary as you sell stuff, and some way of seeing what _all_ the prices you have seen for an item are, not just the high/low. |
| 21:40.18 | DocScrutinizer | I want back my ELITE |
| 21:40.29 | DocScrutinizer | ;'( |
| 21:40.29 | SpeedEvil | Also - the drill noise is broken and doesn't always stop. |
| 21:40.37 | faenil | what's elite? another game? |
| 21:40.46 | SpeedEvil | Elite is what this is a clone of. |
| 21:40.55 | DocScrutinizer | bell and braben, elite |
| 21:40.57 | SpeedEvil | Elite was less shiny, but probably with better gameplay. |
| 21:41.18 | SpeedEvil | For example - the 'radar' in this version gives you _no_ feedback, so you can't slow for targets outside range. |
| 21:41.26 | faenil | oh ok |
| 21:41.29 | DocScrutinizer | actually I hate the "shiny" remote-control view of the ship |
| 21:41.37 | SpeedEvil | That too. |
| 21:42.10 | DocScrutinizer | and the radar is useless |
| 21:42.18 | DocScrutinizer | at least compared to ELITE's |
| 21:42.29 | SpeedEvil | If you skip the cutscenes, you'll get confused. |
| 21:43.34 | DocScrutinizer | the fights seem more like WW-I aircraft dogfights to me |
| 21:44.55 | *** join/#harmattan T_UNIX (~leif@HSI-KBW-091-089-006-243.hsi2.kabelbw.de) |
| 21:44.55 | Arkenoi | Oolite is great |
| 21:44.55 | Arkenoi | but i am afraid porting is too much effort |
| 21:45.03 | SpeedEvil | Ah - extreme mode is _easier_ - the guns work as you'd expect. |
| 21:45.12 | DocScrutinizer | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elite_(video_game) |
| 21:45.55 | faenil | thx doc |
| 21:46.04 | mgedmin | hm? do guns work in surprising ways in easy mode? I hadn't noticed |
| 21:46.29 | javispedro | http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2011/10/prideaux-prosthetic-arm-duo.jpg |
| 21:46.39 | Arkenoi | http://www.oolite.org/ |
| 21:47.27 | SpeedEvil | mgedmin: they sometimes auto-target, making 'leading' not work as expected. |
| 21:48.22 | mgedmin | hm, I haven't noticed |
| 21:48.37 | faenil | time to leave guys |
| 21:48.43 | faenil | it's midnight and I have not eaten yet |
| 21:48.44 | faenil | :) |
| 21:48.52 | faenil | bye bye |
| 21:48.52 | mgedmin | no food = no fun! |
| 21:49.04 | faenil | yup, thing is, at Qt Dev Days there was food every hour |
| 21:49.13 | faenil | so I've eaten a lot there... xD |
| 21:49.24 | faenil | bye bye :) |
| 21:50.36 | DocScrutinizer | >>The sequels employed a realistic flight model based on Newtonian mechanics rather than the original arcade-style engine. While this was more realistic, many players also found it frustratingly difficult, particularly in combat<< :-D |
| 21:51.42 | ieatlint | "more realistic" ... yes. i demand my inter-galactic space fighting games be as close to real life as possible |
| 21:52.23 | DocScrutinizer | ponders to nuke his GSM carrier O2, for not allowing to book another month of data plan since 36h |
| 21:53.06 | javispedro | ieatlint: May I suggest Orbiter here. |
| 21:53.12 | javispedro | despite it being propietary win32only software |
| 21:53.26 | javispedro | rather nice and very interesting time waster imho. |
| 21:54.01 | javispedro | man, I SO want my VGA card back., |
| 21:55.49 | ieatlint | :P |
| 21:56.51 | DocScrutinizer | orbiter, a friend of mine is wasting weeks on it :-D |
| 21:57.43 | javispedro | btw |
| 21:58.17 | javispedro | ready to start crushing the dreams and hopes of all those people that will buy an n9 thinking they can install wp7 on it? |
| 21:58.36 | javispedro | "but but but they are the same specs!" |
| 21:59.00 | DocScrutinizer | ieatlint: though I agree there's no way to implement realistic intergalactic hyperjumps in a game, I still don't want my spececraft to behave like a worldwar-1 biplane with a getling gun |
| 21:59.28 | DocScrutinizer | javispedro: SoC? haha |
| 21:59.41 | javispedro | (reading the engadget comments and already finding some saying "the lumia is nice but I'll buy a N9 because it has 64GiB and the community will install WP7 to it" |
| 21:59.42 | javispedro | ) |
| 22:00.00 | DocScrutinizer | WTF?! LOL |
| 22:00.45 | DocScrutinizer | sure, the wp7 FOSS community will do that in no time X-P |
| 22:01.13 | *** join/#harmattan MohammadAG (~MohammadA@ool-44c62415.dyn.optonline.net) |
| 22:02.15 | ieatlint | hey, i've already got wp7 installed on my n9 |
| 22:02.33 | ieatlint | well, close enough, i set a blue screen |
| 22:02.53 | javispedro | you need to set it on fire |
| 22:03.37 | DocScrutinizer | well MALF is a legit analog to BSOD |
| 22:04.38 | *** join/#harmattan djszapi (~lpapp@kde/developer/lpapp) |
| 22:04.46 | *** part/#harmattan djszapi (~lpapp@kde/developer/lpapp) |
| 22:07.19 | GeneralAntilles | I want more simulation-style space fighter games. |
| 22:07.23 | GeneralAntilles | Like Freespace. |
| 22:07.36 | javispedro | I want X-Plane :( |
| 22:09.15 | *** join/#harmattan deimos (~deimos@host160-71-dynamic.50-79-r.retail.telecomitalia.it) |
| 22:09.28 | GeneralAntilles | I need to setup my HOTAS rig again. |
| 22:09.31 | GeneralAntilles | X-Plane is fuuuun |
| 22:09.34 | GeneralAntilles | Helicopters are the best. |
| 22:20.57 | *** join/#harmattan tsdgeos_ (~tsdgeos@77.231.53.202) |
| 22:21.16 | tsdgeos_ | is it possible to use meego components 1.1 in the n9[50] ? |
| 22:21.17 | DanielW | is anyone trying to port pidgin or libpurple to the n9? |
| 22:21.42 | DocScrutinizer | tsdgeos_: please elaborate |
| 22:22.35 | tsdgeos_ | DocScrutinizer: well, as far as i can see the phone only ships meego components 1.0 |
| 22:22.50 | tsdgeos_ | i want to use 1.1 since TextField in 1.0 is missing the onAccepted signal |
| 22:23.02 | tsdgeos_ | is that elaborated enough? |
| 22:23.07 | M4rtinK | GeneralAntilles: Frontier might work in dosbox :) |
| 22:23.22 | DocScrutinizer | well, probably I'm not the right one to answer as I've no clue what's meego components |
| 22:23.36 | tsdgeos_ | import com.nokia.meego in QML |
| 22:24.31 | *** join/#harmattan lizardo (~lizardo@201008207211.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 22:24.56 | tsdgeos_ | seems one has to wait for the next image |
| 22:25.00 | tsdgeos_ | sad |
| 22:25.06 | DocScrutinizer | M4rtinK: tried it, never got it to really work, and that'S been on a win98 P-II-300 and it's not been to *slow* |
| 22:25.45 | DocScrutinizer | too *slow* |
| 22:26.21 | M4rtinK | I think I remember playing it just fine on Win 98 or XP |
| 22:26.50 | M4rtinK | on my Pentium 150 MHz :) |
| 22:28.22 | DocScrutinizer | yep, P-II-300 is too fast |
| 22:28.59 | M4rtinK | oh, so another game using the CPU as its clock ? |
| 22:29.14 | M4rtinK | well, that could get problematic |
| 22:31.55 | *** join/#harmattan piggz (~piggz@host-89-241-10-50.as13285.net) |
| 22:32.04 | javispedro | I'm pondering if I should make a pseudoformal GPL request for the PR1.1's kernel |
| 22:32.08 | javispedro | source |
| 22:32.08 | javispedro | . |
| 22:34.14 | DocScrutinizer | err, istn't the kernel source puslished meanwhile? |
| 22:34.29 | javispedro | if you know where, please tell... |
| 22:34.53 | DocScrutinizer | dang, I referred to *something* several days ago |
| 22:35.05 | DocScrutinizer | dunno if that'S exactly what you were looking for |
| 22:35.14 | javispedro | on this channel? |
| 22:35.21 | DocScrutinizer | mhd |
| 22:36.27 | tsdgeos_ | javispedro: pr1.1 has not yet been released, as it? |
| 22:36.37 | javispedro | it has, for n950. |
| 22:36.46 | tsdgeos_ | hmmm |
| 22:37.06 | tsdgeos_ | i have a n950, what is pr1.1, http://harmattan-dev.nokia.com/release/N950-39-5/ <- this? |
| 22:37.08 | javispedro | it's fun that we finally have the "beta channel" for firmware updates that we have been requesting for years |
| 22:37.15 | javispedro | tsdgeos_: yes. |
| 22:37.40 | tsdgeos_ | ok |
| 22:38.35 | tsdgeos_ | sad |
| 22:38.36 | tsdgeos_ | then |
| 22:38.54 | tsdgeos_ | because it means it does not contain qml meego components 1.1 |
| 22:38.55 | DocScrutinizer | javispedro: nm, was probably the 1.0 kernel source |
| 22:39.04 | tsdgeos_ | i was hoping pr1.1 would include it |
| 22:39.22 | javispedro | who's "meego components" |
| 22:39.57 | javispedro | s/who's/whose |
| 22:40.38 | DocScrutinizer | I asked same |
| 22:40.49 | DocScrutinizer | seems sth related to QML |
| 22:40.56 | javispedro | I can guess that =) |
| 22:40.56 | tsdgeos_ | https://qt.gitorious.org/qt-components/qt-components/blobs/master/src/meego/ |
| 22:41.03 | tsdgeos_ | these ones |
| 22:41.03 | javispedro | so, nokia's. |
| 22:41.08 | tsdgeos_ | yes |
| 22:41.09 | javispedro | those are included for sure, 1.1 |
| 22:41.16 | tsdgeos_ | hmmm |
| 22:41.33 | tsdgeos_ | starts the terminal |
| 22:42.00 | Frye | Any of you have pointers to documentation about showing application specific information in the notification screen? |
| 22:42.07 | Frye | on N9 |
| 22:42.21 | Frye | I have tried to look, but I'm all new to this so most likely from wrong places |
| 22:42.43 | Frye | I mean the N9 UX checklist even does not have anything about the notification stuff |
| 22:42.51 | javispedro | Frye: it's called "Events view", might help you to search |
| 22:42.56 | Frye | ok |
| 22:43.11 | Frye | bingo |
| 22:43.11 | tsdgeos_ | javispedro: you're right |
| 22:43.17 | tsdgeos_ | they are there |
| 22:43.39 | tsdgeos_ | now the big question is can i check for them? |
| 22:44.18 | tsdgeos_ | because they being there doesn't really help much :D |
| 22:45.26 | javispedro | "check for them"? |
| 22:45.32 | tsdgeos_ | well |
| 22:45.49 | tsdgeos_ | let's say someone tries to run my app on a n9 that does not have pr1.1 |
| 22:46.01 | tsdgeos_ | so no qml meego components 1.1 is there |
| 22:46.06 | DocScrutinizer | lol |
| 22:46.21 | DocScrutinizer | the app won't install, missing dependencies |
| 22:46.31 | DocScrutinizer | AIUI |
| 22:47.23 | javispedro | tsdgeos_: depend on qt-components (>= 1.1) |
| 22:47.30 | tsdgeos_ | let's assume i want to put my app on the ovi store... |
| 22:47.43 | javispedro | then you should ask the ovi store |
| 22:48.03 | javispedro | I wonder how they will handle different PR releases this time. |
| 22:48.14 | DocScrutinizer | HAH |
| 22:48.51 | DocScrutinizer | they'll assume there's no such thing like different PRs, as you basicaly can't reject a SSU |
| 22:49.23 | tsdgeos_ | SSU? |
| 22:49.31 | DocScrutinizer | OTA update |
| 22:49.39 | tsdgeos_ | well |
| 22:49.41 | DocScrutinizer | upgrade to PR1.1 |
| 22:49.51 | tsdgeos_ | but are they going to OTA everyone in the world at the same time? |
| 22:50.04 | DocScrutinizer | err, basically yes |
| 22:50.24 | tsdgeos_ | ok |
| 22:50.25 | javispedro | in N900 times, iirc, there were different builds for each app in the store for each PR. |
| 22:50.43 | DocScrutinizer | fremantle-1.3 |
| 22:50.54 | DocScrutinizer | intoduced really late |
| 22:50.54 | javispedro | I do not think they are going to do the same (as I can get apps from the Store on 1.1 N950 just fine) |
| 22:51.15 | javispedro | they'll have a plan I guess. |
| 22:51.37 | DocScrutinizer | optimist ;-P |
| 22:52.27 | DocScrutinizer | I'm more than amazed OVI works at all |
| 22:53.12 | DocScrutinizer | ooh and scratch my cmment about fremantle-1.3, this applied to maemo repo, not to OVI |
| 22:54.46 | merlin1991 | at least on extras fremantle-1.3 was a symlink to fremantle-1.2 |
| 22:55.22 | tsdgeos_ | i've updated stuff for the n900 for the ovi store |
| 22:55.24 | merlin1991 | ah wait it was 1.2 -> fremantle |
| 22:55.30 | tsdgeos_ | they basically say you can assume 1.3 is there |
| 22:55.31 | DocScrutinizer | maybe because PR1.3 was "compatible" ? |
| 22:56.23 | DocScrutinizer | merlin1991: yup, that's mor elike it |
| 22:58.19 | DocScrutinizer | tsdgeos_: toldya. They'll also assume the most recent PR on N9 is installed, and not bother to keep any compatibility for older PR versions |
| 22:58.58 | Frye | Perfect now I have something to read \o/ |
| 22:59.01 | Frye | Thanks javispedro |
| 22:59.07 | javispedro | yw |
| 22:59.20 | DocScrutinizer | though they could. OVI should be able to transparently detect the PR version of your device, from a browser ID or whatever, and dynamically offer the matching packages only |
| 22:59.36 | Frye | This is sad, I would need to do an app for iPhone at work, but all I'm interested is my N9 and programming for it on my freetiem ;-) |
| 22:59.50 | Frye | And I would get paid for doing the iphone stuff |
| 23:00.16 | DocScrutinizer | :-/ |
| 23:00.48 | Frye | Anyway time to set teh N9 next to my bed. Enjoy. |
| 23:00.50 | DocScrutinizer | (I feel with you) |
| 23:02.25 | javispedro | now has to code some crap in Java |
| 23:02.41 | DocScrutinizer | eew |
| 23:03.27 | T_UNIX | has to continue to lern Scala, while he hates Java |
| 23:03.33 | DocScrutinizer | well, at least you know it might survive for a few months - way longer than anything on meego did until now |
| 23:03.50 | javispedro | this reminds me that wp7 is also doomed |
| 23:04.07 | javispedro | as ms wants to eventually replace it with full Win32onARM |
| 23:04.07 | DocScrutinizer | err, sure. ;-D why? |
| 23:04.15 | javispedro | yet noone mentions that.. |
| 23:04.33 | DocScrutinizer | o.O |
| 23:05.05 | DocScrutinizer | are you ging haloween spooky now? |
| 23:05.10 | DocScrutinizer | going* |
| 23:05.19 | javispedro | no |
| 23:05.23 | ieatlint | wp7 may be replced with win8, but i think you can count on silverlight and xna staying around |
| 23:05.29 | javispedro | it is not happening before the next version, though. |
| 23:05.42 | javispedro | ieatlint: you could say the same about qt and look how happy devs are. |
| 23:05.59 | ieatlint | yeah, but nokia has never shown loyalty to its developers |
| 23:06.10 | DocScrutinizer | aaaah, M$ has |
| 23:06.16 | javispedro | surely ( http://www.osnews.com/story/24846/Windows_8_HTML5_JS_Comment_Causes_Panic_Among_Developers ) |
| 23:06.21 | ieatlint | whereas microsoft has maintained backwards compatibility so much that i can still run some dos stuff on win7 |
| 23:06.30 | javispedro | not on any 64 bit version of win7. |
| 23:06.50 | ieatlint | fine, then as of vista |
| 23:06.57 | javispedro | not on any 64 bit version of vista either ;P |
| 23:07.00 | ieatlint | that's still 20 years of backwards compability |
| 23:07.15 | ieatlint | you sure? thought there was still the emu in place |
| 23:07.29 | special | 64bit windows can't run 16-bit applications |
| 23:07.35 | ieatlint | but the sentiment is still pretty clear, i'll bump up my example to win95 programs if you insist |
| 23:07.46 | javispedro | they have removed it on 64 bit versions because they decided it was "about time" |
| 23:07.54 | DocScrutinizer | umm yeah, until "recently" (aka some 18..24 months back) Nokia also was great in maintaining a certain backwards compatibility |
| 23:08.02 | ieatlint | the point is that they have a history of maintaining backwards compatibility, and largely they are known for keeping their developers happy |
| 23:08.22 | javispedro | a reputation I think it's ill-deserved |
| 23:09.11 | ieatlint | regardless, i'll bet on history and practicality before i believe the unsubstantiated rumour of abandoning silverlight |
| 23:09.54 | javispedro | s/it's/is :P |
| 23:10.10 | DocScrutinizer | I bet on my stomach feeling instant nausea on mentioning of "silverlight" now and in 5 years, so perfect backward compatibility |
| 23:11.12 | ieatlint | soon the days of running native code on mobile devices will pass |
| 23:11.38 | ieatlint | all that's left, with exceptions, is apple and qt |
| 23:11.48 | javispedro | qt not much longer |
| 23:11.53 | DocScrutinizer | yeah, soon all embedded devices will just run java apps, errr.... |
| 23:12.08 | ieatlint | eh, symbian will be around a bit |
| 23:12.12 | ieatlint | meltemi maybe |
| 23:12.28 | special | Qt and Cocoa are both proof that you can have compelling modern frameworks with native code, though. |
| 23:12.59 | javispedro | in fact, with the very exception of Qt and QML, I think the trend was going back to native again |
| 23:13.18 | ieatlint | blame android? |
| 23:13.23 | javispedro | heh |
| 23:13.46 | javispedro | Google for some reason calls rewriting überslow Java class into native implementations "enabling the use of hardware acceleration" |
| 23:13.50 | javispedro | *classes |
| 23:14.00 | javispedro | but they are also busy doing it. |
| 23:14.42 | DocScrutinizer | I don't buy this platform independent nonsense. It never really worked and I don't see it work in the future. Rather you might ask what'S wrong in on time building of a native app for each device rather than making portable "binaries" that in RL nobody is ever actually porting |
| 23:15.13 | javispedro | DocScrutinizer: now you sound like achipa suggesting a rewrite for each platform ;) |
| 23:15.27 | ieatlint | depends on the app |
| 23:15.29 | DocScrutinizer | well, he for sure got a point there |
| 23:15.44 | ieatlint | i've written a couple apps that have been 95% identical across multiple platforms |
| 23:15.49 | special | there is much in common between the same software on different platforms, but it's a mistake to think that they can be identical, unless they're angry birds. |
| 23:15.49 | DocScrutinizer | though I not exactly suggested reWRITING but just reCOMPILING |
| 23:17.43 | ieatlint | well opengl-es does a decent enough job there |
| 23:18.41 | javispedro | plus, I think the fact that Apple, the one company that has changed instruction architectures in consumer devices quite a few times, does not use a VM is quite enlightening |
| 23:19.15 | DocScrutinizer | sure |
| 23:19.36 | javispedro | companies that on the other side have never used more than two IAs on the other side go crazy on the thought of VMs. |
| 23:20.16 | javispedro | oops, forgive the RAS syndrome ;P |
| 23:20.59 | DocScrutinizer | all this VM and JIT and P-code whatnot cruft is just an idea of escapist CS profs |
| 23:21.21 | wmarone_ | P-code... haven't heard that used outside of reference to Visual Basic |
| 23:21.24 | wmarone_ | shudders |
| 23:21.44 | ieatlint | some of it has its place |
| 23:21.48 | DocScrutinizer | th eidea of P-code is way older than VBA |
| 23:21.50 | DocScrutinizer | VB |
| 23:21.52 | wmarone_ | no doubt |
| 23:22.33 | ieatlint | there's just something a bit weird at the thought of taking a relatively slow embedded device and adding in a VM that takes additional ram and cpu |
| 23:22.50 | DocScrutinizer | yep |
| 23:22.51 | javispedro | looks at a SunSpot on a nearby table |
| 23:22.56 | ieatlint | ineffecient, but i think android has proven not impractical |
| 23:23.21 | *** join/#harmattan jylan (~Adium@yoland.lnk.telstra.net) |
| 23:23.32 | javispedro | android IMHO proved it impractical, because... they relented. |
| 23:23.35 | ieatlint | it's caused nokia to hurt a bit... the fast cpu competition has been spurred by android, trying make devices that can cope with it |
| 23:23.43 | javispedro | WP7 on the other side it's the one that seems not to have relented yet. |
| 23:23.57 | ieatlint | nokia devices may be "slower", but their performance is the better place to judge that |
| 23:24.04 | javispedro | I've checked a few binaries, even from EA games, and no hint of native code, they really do 3D games in C#. |
| 23:24.04 | DocScrutinizer | well, toasting my sandwiches with a plasma cutter is also feasible in some way |
| 23:24.14 | ieatlint | javispedro: not necessarily |
| 23:24.14 | wmarone_ | javispedro: they're trying the Apple tack of controlling the hardware (just mostly, instead of completely) |
| 23:24.22 | ieatlint | the ie9 browser on it is written in c++ |
| 23:24.34 | ieatlint | and partners have access to write things in native code |
| 23:24.46 | javispedro | that's what I thought, but see above. |
| 23:25.00 | javispedro | at least for the sample set I had access to, it was really C#. |
| 23:25.16 | ieatlint | yeah, i'm surprised then that the well known games are c# |
| 23:25.27 | javispedro | WP7 doesn't have OpenGLES, so I guess that if they have to rewrite the engine either way |
| 23:25.39 | javispedro | they might as well do it in C# with whatever money MS must be paying them =) |
| 23:25.52 | ieatlint | pretty much... the xna crap |
| 23:26.44 | ieatlint | however it does it, there must be real hardware accelertion in there |
| 23:27.13 | javispedro | that is probably the reason they support only Adreno |
| 23:27.31 | javispedro | assuming it really is older-ATI-hardware based, they probably had some D3D stuff they could blow the dust off |
| 23:28.34 | ieatlint | dunno, but i bet there will be a lot of lumia phone handouts |
| 23:28.36 | javispedro | (though, come to think of it, the MBX also had PocketD3D drivers) |
| 23:29.01 | javispedro | ieatlint: one for each member of the #n950club to begin with... as we're launchpaders... |
| 23:29.27 | ieatlint | that's unconfirmed... the offer for them was made before most of us became launchpad members |
| 23:29.36 | ieatlint | and hasn't necessarily been extended to us |
| 23:29.57 | javispedro | they basically completed stopped processing the launchpad incomers queue when the offer was made |
| 23:30.01 | javispedro | *completel |
| 23:30.04 | javispedro | *completely :( |
| 23:30.13 | ieatlint | yep |
| 23:30.21 | ieatlint | i signed up in february |
| 23:30.30 | ieatlint | got approved in march after pulling a favour |
| 23:30.48 | javispedro | me in january :(, not got approved until n950 |
| 23:30.58 | ieatlint | and after all that application process, you suddenly find there's nothing inside |
| 23:31.07 | DocScrutinizer | a bottom line before I call it a day: it still seems to me like SW devels/industry is investing 10 $currency to allow savings on investments for porting things in the magnitude of 1 $currency, and the result is that you still don't have true portability, all the devels have to invest 50 $currency every year into learning a new uebercool new toolkit, and the apps get slow, buggy, and requiring each user to invest twice as much into the |
| 23:31.08 | DocScrutinizer | faster fatter hardware than he needed for same apps to run better if only they were native |
| 23:33.00 | javispedro | but you get to charge $5 for the newest iteration of $SAME_STUFF_AS_YESTERDAY |
| 23:33.16 | javispedro | or $800.. |
| 23:33.43 | ieatlint | sounds like the movie industry... i've given up on buying star wars again |
| 23:36.29 | *** join/#harmattan npm_ (~npm@cpe-76-90-30-220.socal.res.rr.com) |
| 23:50.42 | DocScrutinizer | the portability approach makes sense (maybe) for android / winphone with closed source apps, as no company is going to develop a new slightly adapted version for the 538th new device that's coming with android OS. For FOSS however the whole idea is completely pointless |
