| 00:59.52 | *** join/#gsoc Jervis_ (~suckme@49.248.168.87) |
| 02:39.19 | *** join/#gsoc infobot (ibot@208.53.50.136) |
| 02:39.19 | *** topic/#gsoc is | Google Code-in: https://g.co/gci | Google Summer of Code: https://g.co/gsoc | |
| 02:41.54 | *** join/#gsoc ABC (9f6caddc@gateway/web/freenode/ip.159.108.173.220) |
| 04:30.47 | *** join/#gsoc vibhu (2bf596a9@gateway/web/freenode/ip.43.245.150.169) |
| 07:14.18 | *** join/#gsoc a2batic (Kanika@nat/redhat/x-vurrfzeudbvwmpsk) |
| 08:54.35 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 09:12.54 | *** join/#gsoc jamm (~jam@fp76f08856.tkyc113.ap.nuro.jp) |
| 09:12.54 | *** join/#gsoc jamm (~jam@unaffiliated/jamm) |
| 09:26.03 | *** join/#gsoc thc202 (~thc202@unaffiliated/thc202) |
| 09:30.21 | *** join/#gsoc Andre_H (~german_wi@dslb-088-067-231-145.088.067.pools.vodafone-ip.de) |
| 09:56.03 | *** join/#gsoc eMBee (~eMBee@foresight/developer/pike/programmer) |
| 11:20.39 | *** join/#gsoc nagyation (~nagyation@197.52.90.70) |
| 12:21.18 | *** join/#gsoc teepee (~teepee@unaffiliated/teepee) |
| 12:34.48 | *** join/#gsoc Sarv (2a6adda4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.42.106.221.164) |
| 12:49.58 | *** join/#gsoc refeed (~refeed@182.1.91.192) |
| 12:56.03 | *** join/#gsoc pd09041999 (~pd@14.139.61.129) |
| 13:22.20 | *** join/#gsoc ekyz_ (bef43b39@gateway/web/freenode/ip.190.244.59.57) |
| 13:22.37 | ekyz_ | hi i need some help implementing 2step verification |
| 13:23.04 | ekyz_ | is it possible to use google prompt to 2nd step verification in my app? is there an API? |
| 13:37.39 | *** join/#gsoc pd09041999 (~pd@14.139.61.129) |
| 13:42.54 | *** join/#gsoc Justin_o (uid14648@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-iyyboeawdtekqtgt) |
| 13:53.32 | *** join/#gsoc bkuhn (~bkuhn@fsf/director/conservancy.president.bkuhn) |
| 14:19.17 | *** join/#gsoc Lord_of_Life (~Lord@77.28.209.160) |
| 14:19.18 | *** join/#gsoc Lord_of_Life (~Lord@unaffiliated/lord-of-life/x-0885362) |
| 14:19.59 | *** join/#gsoc cfoch (uid153227@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-fxptjaqehjxltntz) |
| 15:32.37 | *** join/#gsoc infobot (ibot@208.53.50.136) |
| 15:32.37 | *** topic/#gsoc is | Google Code-in: https://g.co/gci | Google Summer of Code: https://g.co/gsoc | |
| 15:43.40 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 15:57.15 | *** part/#gsoc d3r1ck (derick@wikimedia/Alangi-Derick) |
| 16:06.25 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 16:32.55 | *** join/#gsoc him-cesjf (~cesjf@unaffiliated/himcesjf) |
| 17:09.53 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 17:35.17 | *** join/#gsoc cave (~various@h081217094244.dyn.cm.kabsi.at) |
| 17:40.53 | *** join/#gsoc boo (31233aaf@gateway/web/freenode/ip.49.35.58.175) |
| 17:43.16 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 18:48.48 | *** join/#gsoc Andre_H (~german_wi@dslb-088-067-231-145.088.067.pools.vodafone-ip.de) |
| 20:06.03 | valorie | I wonder how people intuit that this is a *google* chan, instead of GSoC/GCi/ |
| 20:17.41 | jn__ | it's the first web search result for "google irc" :( |
| 20:21.10 | terri | Clearly, we need a gsoc project to make a chatbot and another channel. ;) |
| 20:22.20 | valorie | lol |
| 20:22.41 | valorie | odd that people would even be googling for IRC |
| 20:22.54 | valorie | so many of the gci students have never heard of it |
| 20:43.36 | *** join/#gsoc perepujal (~pere@185.193.69.67) |
| 21:11.26 | r0bby | valorie: most haven't |
| 21:12.04 | valorie | I suppose commerial offerings crowd out the best: IRC! |
| 21:13.35 | scorche | we occasionally get folks asking for general Google topics - easily suggested they find help elsewhere though. :) |
| 21:14.34 | valorie | yep |
| 21:41.22 | *** join/#gsoc rohitt (~rohitt@139.59.79.46) |
| 21:47.02 | *** join/#gsoc AEtherC0r3 (~quassel@snf-734901.vm.okeanos.grnet.gr) |
| 22:00.37 | terri | yeah, I was interviewing a potential new hire at work and had to explain that IRC was "uh, kind of the tech that Slack was based on?" |
| 22:01.57 | bjorn | Ouch. |
| 22:02.20 | *** join/#gsoc pombreda (~pombreda@host-78-129-110-59.dynamic.voo.be) |
| 22:02.28 | valorie | sheesh |
| 22:03.06 | valorie | human bodies are based on the "skeleton tech" |
| 22:04.00 | terri | python's finally looking into trying to bridge IRC and slack for GSoC this year, because students really do struggle with staying connected to IRC long enough to get an answer to a question |
| 22:04.00 | valorie | as if the code is the important part |
| 22:04.28 | valorie | I don't get why they can stay connected on telegram or slack |
| 22:04.31 | valorie | but not on IRC |
| 22:04.49 | terri | they don't stay connected, because they don't really need to. it push notifies them. |
| 22:04.51 | valorie | I suppose because they don't use *computers* - mostly phones |
| 22:05.08 | terri | I think part of hte problem is that IRC clients for phones still mostly kind of suck. |
| 22:05.16 | valorie | oh gosh, they do |
| 22:05.19 | terri | so you close it and poof! |
| 22:05.29 | valorie | I'm still trying to test matrix for that |
| 22:05.39 | valorie | but so far, not really a success |
| 22:06.35 | terri | valorie: we're doing irc <-> matrix <-> slack in testing right now. Or rather, warthog9 is, so you should ask him all the questions. ;) |
| 22:07.06 | terri | matrix has been good for the mentors, but didn't solve things for students the way we hoped. |
| 22:07.27 | valorie | if anything is more complicated than IRC, matrix is |
| 22:07.47 | valorie | i've not gotten authentication to work, for instance |
| 22:08.05 | valorie | and the irc chan names are long and complicated |
| 22:08.07 | terri | I really wanted to use zulip, but the irc integration just dropped all the messages on the floor, and that didn't work for anyone. |
| 22:08.23 | valorie | feels like moving back to fidonet emails |
| 22:08.56 | valorie | terri: I talked to the zulip team about IRC integration and they were completely uninterested |
| 22:09.12 | terri | valorie: yeah, sadly |
| 22:09.26 | valorie | because KDE would love a FOSS alternative to telegram |
| 22:09.45 | valorie | telegram bridges are clunky at best as well |
| 22:09.57 | valorie | some are using rocket.chat |
| 22:10.02 | valorie | I've not tried that out |
| 22:13.34 | Cadair | I find matrix is pretty good for newcomers as long as your channel is matrix first |
| 22:13.57 | Cadair | i.e if you have to understand the matrix<>irc bridge you are never going to win |
| 22:14.44 | Cadair | imo trying to use matrix as an irc client is an advanced feature. |
| 22:15.14 | Cadair | The general UX of riot could stand to be improved, but it |
| 22:15.17 | Cadair | is a wip |
| 22:17.01 | valorie | Cadair: that is pretty much my only usecase |
| 22:17.15 | valorie | as a way to use IRC on my phone |
| 22:17.17 | Cadair | It |
| 22:17.24 | Cadair | its a great way to do that |
| 22:17.29 | valorie | for now I just use telegram via the KDE bridge we have |
| 22:17.30 | Cadair | but its not newcomer friendly |
| 22:17.59 | Cadair | I have happily used matrix as my irc client for years at this point |
| 22:18.01 | valorie | right, as I said - in spite of spending an hour to try to authenticate to freenode nickserv |
| 22:18.10 | valorie | I'm not authenticated from matrix |
| 22:18.30 | Cadair | I think matrix is pretty newcomer friendly if you are using matrix though |
| 22:18.46 | valorie | well, same with IRC |
| 22:19.01 | Cadair | i.e if you have configured a channel on matrix, and bridged it in and are not trying to reg yourself on irc |
| 22:19.29 | Cadair | the main reason my main community switched to matrix years ago was the no persistent connection thing |
| 22:19.29 | valorie | and those who are using weechat or irssi etc can use it on their phones just fine |
| 22:19.40 | valorie | I need my gui! |
| 22:20.05 | Cadair | because as was mentioned earlier the needing to hang around for an answer thing is not newcomer friendly either |
| 22:20.08 | valorie | there is no way to move the huge mass of KDE devels off IRC |
| 22:20.20 | Cadair | I still run a ZNC instance for IRC |
| 22:20.29 | Cadair | have you looked at what gnome has done with matrix? |
| 22:20.35 | valorie | I use the KDE znc, yes |
| 22:20.38 | valorie | no? |
| 22:21.06 | valorie | the next iteration of Konversation will have matrix integration builtin |
| 22:21.06 | Cadair | they have set up all their IRC channels on matrix and are advertising it for newcomers iirc |
| 22:21.15 | Cadair | also writing a native gnome client |
| 22:21.21 | Cadair | there are a few good qt matrix clients |
| 22:21.30 | valorie | but I think that needs to happen first |
| 22:21.31 | Cadair | I am speaking to you from one now |
| 22:21.32 | Cadair | it |
| 22:21.35 | Cadair | is not very KDE though |
| 22:21.35 | valorie | cool |
| 22:22.17 | terri | Yeah, Python also has the IRC channel on matrix and advertises it as such. It's helped, but we're going to give slack a go as well. |
| 22:22.25 | valorie | "set up all their IRC channels on matrix" I don't don't think anyone knows how many KDE channels on IRC there are |
| 22:22.28 | valorie | lol |
| 22:22.36 | Cadair | has major issues with open projects using slack |
| 22:22.38 | valorie | we'll never use slack |
| 22:22.44 | Cadair | just like no |
| 22:22.53 | valorie | some few teams do for sekret stuff I guess |
| 22:23.07 | valorie | like the sysadmins |
| 22:23.12 | Cadair | the whole premise of slack is closed, you have to run a webapp to get people into it, it |
| 22:23.20 | valorie | yes |
| 22:23.21 | terri | Well, not if you have an IRC bridge. ;) |
| 22:23.36 | Cadair | I mean you still do if you want to join the slack side |
| 22:23.58 | terri | But we're on year 3 of tryign to find something that students actually use, so I don't get a bunch of emails complaining that they can never find us. |
| 22:24.12 | Cadair | fwiw I have contributed to the slack bridge and maintain a slack bridge for another communtiy, so if you want any help I am happy to lend a hand |
| 22:24.44 | Cadair | but I am trying to use the matrix <> slack bridge as a way to get people *off* slack not onto it 𤦠|
| 22:25.29 | valorie | slack is ugh |
| 22:26.19 | valorie | it's true we need something student friendly, but we'll never get the older devels, the core -- using whatsapp or etc. |
| 22:26.53 | valorie | students need to step up and learn the old tech and create a bridge to something more modern |
| 22:26.55 | Cadair | I have minimal issues with slack as a thing, I just really dont think it is a good fit for open projects, given it is like the *most* closed thing possible |
| 22:26.56 | terri | really, it's a student -> mentor bridge. :) |
| 22:27.21 | valorie | right, if mentors are willing, anything can be used |
| 22:27.31 | valorie | but we want students in touch with the whole team |
| 22:27.33 | Cadair | do you have your matrix channel configured for guest access? |
| 22:27.39 | valorie | not just mentor <> student |
| 22:27.56 | Cadair | also which matrix channel? |
| 22:28.48 | terri | yeah. Really, the students need to learn to IRC eventually, but we don't want it to be a big hurdle right away. if slack lets them connect and talk while they decide if they're sticking around, I'll accept it as a tool. |
| 22:28.53 | terri | we'll see if it actually works that way, though |
| 22:28.56 | valorie | I've set up one channel but now cannot authenticate to it! |
| 22:29.12 | Cadair | terri I really would hope matrix could do that |
| 22:29.14 | valorie | from matrix |
| 22:29.21 | valorie | so I've given up for now |
| 22:29.50 | Cadair | valorie you should swing by the irc bridge matrix channel and people will help you with your issues |
| 22:29.53 | terri | Cadair: we're using matrix right now. it *has* helped, but it's clear we could do better, so we're adding slack *as well* as matrix. |
| 22:30.03 | Cadair | interesting |
| 22:30.12 | Cadair | I will be interested to hear how that goes |
| 22:30.29 | valorie | I'll search for that maybe after the hols |
| 22:30.36 | terri | matrix + authentication problem + everyone having to go +r for those freenode attacks = bad experience for summer contacts. |
| 22:30.48 | valorie | precisely |
| 22:30.57 | Cadair | yeah, the +r thing is bad |
| 22:31.10 | valorie | no, the lack of being to authenticate is bad |
| 22:31.16 | Cadair | you really need to +q the channel with a matirx hostmask exemption |
| 22:31.17 | *** join/#gsoc refeed (~refeed@140.213.2.151) |
| 22:31.25 | valorie | ugh |
| 22:31.41 | terri | that's not matrix's fault, obv, but we're tryign to have alternate stuff available in case freenode gets thrashed again |
| 22:31.42 | Cadair | having to register with nickserv from matrix is a horrendus user experience |
| 22:32.16 | valorie | I know it's possible because people have done it |
| 22:32.17 | *** join/#gsoc _refeed_ (~refeed@114.125.76.58) |
| 22:32.28 | Cadair | oh its possible |
| 22:32.34 | Cadair | its just weird |
| 22:32.59 | valorie | yep |
| 22:33.14 | Cadair | From my experience of running a couple of matrix channels with irc bridges you do have to manage the irc channel with the matrix bridge in mind to keep a nice onboarding experience for matrix users |
| 22:33.46 | Cadair | i.e. doing +q rather than +r |
| 22:34.24 | Cadair | ftr this: https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-appservice-irc/wiki/End-user-FAQ#i-am-a-chanop-and-have-a-spam-problem-how-can-i-fix-it-without-affecting-matrix-users might be useful |
| 22:34.40 | Cadair | senses we might be offtopic ð |
| 22:34.53 | *** join/#gsoc LoKoMurdoK (~LoKoMurdo@fedora/LoKoMurdoK) |
| 22:35.58 | valorie | nah, we're just into the weeds |
| 22:36.11 | valorie | we all want a better onboarding experience for our students |
| 22:36.20 | valorie | GCi as well as GSoC |
| 22:36.23 | terri | hey, it's all in service of communicating better with students and communities! |
| 22:36.44 | Cadair | :) |
| 22:37.06 | Cadair | is aware he can get a bit enthusiastic trying to persuade people to use matrix! |
| 22:38.06 | valorie | passes along Cadair's link to the kde op team |
| 22:43.54 | *** join/#gsoc rohitt (~rohitt@139.59.79.46) |
| 22:45.16 | *** join/#gsoc rohitt (~rohitt@139.59.79.46) |
| 22:48.03 | *** join/#gsoc diehlpk (~diehlpk@2620:105:b006:a100:463d:1c68:1720:2323) |
| 22:49.18 | *** join/#gsoc RT|Chatzilla (~chatzilla@reactos/tester/RT) |
| 23:06.02 | *** join/#gsoc gambatte (gambatte@bitcoinshell.mooo.com) |
| 23:27.00 | *** join/#gsoc rohitt (~rohitt@139.59.79.46) |
| 23:48.53 | *** join/#gsoc _refeed_ (~refeed@182.1.126.136) |