| 00:00.32 | sttaylor | NickFrey: if you plan to go for the grand prize then yes, you will want to contribute to one org as each org will evaluate the top 5 point earners for their org and decide on the 2 grand prize winners from their org |
| 00:01.07 | sttaylor | NickFrey: but if you plan to go for the t-shirt (3 tasks) then you can mix up orgs |
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| 00:13.48 | DrJoel | any melange folks online ? |
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| 00:38.05 | sttaylor | DrJoel: I think they stepped away for a break : ) |
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| 00:47.31 | brlcad | sttaylor: so did joel |
| 00:47.51 | Isiah | Does anyone know how to download one specific folder from Google Code in TortiseHG? |
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| 01:13.14 | cjl | hallo sttaylor busy day. |
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| 01:32.15 | sttaylor | cjl: certainly was : ) |
| 01:42.37 | lfaraone | *deep breath* |
| 01:42.49 | lfaraone | Do we have to have the same thing tomorrow? :P |
| 01:43.16 | meflin | lfaraone: depends on what you meen |
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| 01:46.19 | sttaylor | lfaraone: not to discourage you but it will likely get crazier as students get their parental consent forms submitted and can then apply for a task… sorry…. but just think you'll have a ton of task completed |
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| 01:51.37 | lfaraone | sttaylor: hehe. fair enough. |
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| 01:52.45 | meflin | try to keep in mind your battling the tsunami .. for your gain |
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| 02:02.59 | lfaraone | Yeah. The problem is we had a large task (we have lots of wiki spam) broken down into 20 subtasks, and people kept on stepping on eachothers toes, working on other people's claimed tasks, etc. |
| 02:04.36 | cjl | lfaraone: It did seem a bi tmessy, but at least the spam is all gone now, I'm creating a whitelst so we can revisit the setup of that wiki entirely. |
| 02:05.19 | cjl | but we can do that at our leisure now that we can see the meat though the spam |
| 02:08.24 | JasonDC|BNC | anyone able to assist with the error "This page is inaccessible because you do not have a profile in the program at this time. |
| 02:08.24 | JasonDC|BNC | " |
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| 02:15.49 | allman | night all! See you on the flip side. |
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| 02:23.51 | plod_ | ping #gsoc |
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| 02:36.26 | walterbender | JasonDC|BNC: obvious question: do you have a profile? |
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| 02:52.32 | mattt_ | Hmm, is anyone else having trouble accessing google-melange.com? |
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| 02:55.33 | heidi | works for me |
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| 03:09.50 | michael_j | how often do mentors check to accept claims? |
| 03:12.02 | brlcad | that's asking how often to people check their e-mail |
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| 03:15.32 | animesh | When will the Fedora tasks be accepted :/ |
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| 03:48.17 | devj | Who's excited to do this?! |
| 03:49.59 | devj | One question.. why is the Google Summer of Code IRC room being used for GCI? |
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| 03:58.38 | lfaraone | because gsoc is the organisation that runs GCI as a side project. |
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| 04:06.50 | gladoscc | there is like no javascript tasks :/ |
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| 04:11.08 | zimba12 | gladoscc: check the owncloud tasks in the kde page. |
| 04:11.25 | zimba12 | gladoscc: there are (or there will be) some js tasks |
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| 05:01.11 | SpencerNeitzke | devj: I'm excited |
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| 05:41.42 | UnderControl | Hiya |
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| 05:50.38 | votick | Hey everyone! |
| 05:50.46 | devj | Hey! |
| 05:50.51 | votick | Would anyone here be able to answer a quick question? |
| 05:50.58 | votick | A mentor perhaps. |
| 05:51.13 | devj | Depends on the question… Just ask, maybe someone will know. |
| 05:51.45 | devj | Mentors are usually on their respective codebase/org IRC, not this one. |
| 05:51.52 | votick | Alright, well I have applied to complete a task around 20 minutes after the competition began. It has now been about 12 hours and I still have not been given access to starting. |
| 05:52.07 | votick | Others have completed 2 or more tasks, yet I'm still waiting until someone just gives me access... but I have been ready all day. |
| 05:53.22 | devj | Sounds like that falls to the responsible "task assigner". I'd recommend hooking up on that org's IRC and asking them. |
| 05:53.48 | devj | I'm still working on my first task, so don't worry too much. |
| 05:55.16 | votick | Yeah. Guess I will be doing 2 all-nighters in a row until I can sleep soundly knowing a task was completed. |
| 05:55.35 | devj | I'm in the same boat. |
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| 05:56.09 | votick | Sounds like you are going for the win as well? |
| 05:57.16 | devj | Aiming for it! Probably won't get there, but I figure if I learn a few things along the way then it was worth it. |
| 05:58.24 | votick | Yeah of course. My goal is to try winning this, but it seems that I will have no hope based on how long support is taking. |
| 05:58.40 | votick | What organization did you choose to work for? I'm working with KDE :) |
| 05:59.45 | UnderControl | wonders which one he should choose. |
| 05:59.52 | devj | CCG! |
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| 06:00.38 | UnderControl | CCG? |
| 06:00.49 | devj | My mentors seem to be all based in different times zones, so it's been hard to organize this. |
| 06:01.01 | votick | Exactly... |
| 06:01.12 | devj | CCG = Copyleft Games Group |
| 06:01.15 | votick | Someone I'm competing against: BinaryKing, has already completed two tasks. |
| 06:01.27 | devj | Woah. That's impressive. |
| 06:01.30 | votick | His mentor has responded within 1 hour each time it seems. |
| 06:01.36 | votick | I skipped school today to work on this. |
| 06:01.38 | UnderControl | Devj Oh |
| 06:01.39 | votick | And yet received no direction... |
| 06:01.52 | devj | Wish I was able to skip some school! |
| 06:01.55 | UnderControl | I guess not many mentors will be in my timezone |
| 06:01.56 | devj | But alas, no. |
| 06:02.07 | votick | Aha, one day pal, one day. |
| 06:02.43 | votick | I'm just setting up my C++ workstation in case I need it. |
| 06:02.54 | votick | Have not used those for a while though considering I'm mostly doing Java/PHP. |
| 06:04.52 | devj | I'm stickin' with Java, for the most part. |
| 06:06.01 | UnderControl | Wow, there is like no tasks with federal |
| 06:06.32 | devj | I know, right! Surprised me too. |
| 06:07.44 | votick | I'm debating whether or not I should drop the current task I'm assigned too... no one is mentoring it. However if I drop it now, I bet someone will show up right after... |
| 06:08.08 | devj | I wouldn't drop it quite yet. If it's a good task, I'd wait. |
| 06:08.20 | votick | It's designing an icon, lol. |
| 06:08.21 | devj | My mentors said they can extend the deadline, if need be. |
| 06:08.25 | devj | What?! |
| 06:08.25 | SpencerNeitzke | First task as well |
| 06:08.28 | votick | I chose it based on simplicity for now. |
| 06:08.44 | devj | For real? Yours is designing an icon? |
| 06:08.54 | votick | Yeah, I could link you if you want? |
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| 06:09.03 | votick | >> http://www.google-melange.com/gci/task/view/google/gci2012/8007209 |
| 06:09.07 | devj | If you're going to drop it… let me know. |
| 06:09.39 | votick | Haha, it's not in your organization. Thanks for the support though.... |
| 06:09.54 | devj | Of course :) |
| 06:10.11 | votick | Hmm, makes me wonder. Do they really base this competition fully off of who completes the most tasks? Knowing the brain power behind these Google folks, they should notice that certain individuals have been mentored WAY faster than others. |
| 06:10.41 | votick | So that puts quite a fine line between the winners, and the unfortunate. ' |
| 06:11.07 | devj | Agreed, that seems quite unfair. And not to mention, tasks are very different in difficulty. Mine right now is extremely complicated. |
| 06:11.46 | SpencerNeitzke | Mine is alright right now, but I have seen some pretty complicated work. |
| 06:12.22 | votick | Yeah... Well I guess looking at it from an optimistic point: Google must have planned to specifically challenge us, because they had a hint that we were superior in determination! Not sure about you guys, but it will take way more effort on their part to get rid of me ;) |
| 06:12.34 | votick | What are you working on right now, Dev? |
| 06:12.44 | SpencerNeitzke | Agreed |
| 06:13.36 | devj | Working on implementing notifications in a half-baked, mess of a code, android apk. |
| 06:14.05 | votick | Aha, nice work! |
| 06:14.16 | devj | The code I was given isn't even complete, and their is only one mentor in my entire organization who has been able to get a running apk. |
| 06:14.38 | votick | I have developed during my studies in Grade 10/11 computer science, but I have never actually taken the concepts outside of class with languages like java. PHP is a whole different story, I have done some pretty cool stuff with webdev. |
| 06:14.55 | votick | Best of luck on your project though... Makes me feel lucky with what I have. |
| 06:15.00 | SpencerNeitzke | PHP is just the best. |
| 06:15.21 | votick | You're a developer also, Spencer? |
| 06:16.11 | SpencerNeitzke | Yes, I have just began my development in PHP a couple of years ago and am now starting to really love it |
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| 06:16.52 | votick | That's pretty sweet! Do you have any publicized work? I have put together a couple interesting things. |
| 06:17.05 | darkapex | I have a question related to the parental consent form. |
| 06:17.16 | votick | Heya pal, let's hear your question. |
| 06:17.20 | darkapex | Are forms signed through signnow.com valid? |
| 06:17.25 | votick | We are not mentors, but could likely help. |
| 06:17.34 | votick | Uhh, I would say that they should work yes. |
| 06:17.45 | votick | My form was not even signed, I just had a forwarded email from my mother with a picture of myself on it. |
| 06:17.59 | SpencerNeitzke | I do have one thing up right now, http://schedulous.me, an app is currently in development too! |
| 06:18.05 | darkapex | Thanks votic, then I'll upload it. |
| 06:18.11 | devj | Votick, that was exellent. |
| 06:18.11 | devj | . |
| 06:18.42 | devj | Darkapex, that's really neat! |
| 06:18.42 | darkapex | *votick |
| 06:19.03 | votick | Thanks Dev! And let me take a quick look, Spencer. |
| 06:19.21 | votick | Woah, Spencer how did you design that so nicely? |
| 06:19.23 | darkapex | okay, thank you for help devj |
| 06:19.45 | votick | And I'm astonished as your business idea, it's very similar to how I create apps. Example: www.GlobeOfGeek.com |
| 06:19.47 | devj | Spencer, that is excellent! |
| 06:19.57 | votick | Currently at roughly 13,000 students using it across the world :) |
| 06:20.26 | devj | I am amazed at all of your guy's work. |
| 06:20.35 | SpencerNeitzke | Oh I am by no means a great designer so my friend and I created it, he did most, if not all, of the frontend design. |
| 06:20.45 | SpencerNeitzke | Let me look at yours. |
| 06:21.06 | votick | That's good to know! |
| 06:21.10 | votick | No offense, but I suck with design. |
| 06:21.23 | summatusmentis | darkapex: you really should ask one of the administrators of GCI those types of questions |
| 06:21.36 | SpencerNeitzke | Same here, I am awful. Trying to get better though! |
| 06:21.45 | SpencerNeitzke | Thanks devj! |
| 06:21.45 | votick | Oh, I'm actually working on a new framework of that current site, if you'd like to see. The current globeofgeek is using free-components. However in the passed 4 months, I have made a huge framework on my own. Let me get you beta access quickly. |
| 06:21.58 | SpencerNeitzke | Awesome! |
| 06:22.03 | summatusmentis | votick: it's important not to give answers to questions that you're not in a position to answer with absolute certainty |
| 06:22.21 | devj | votick, if you need it, i would be more than willing to test anything you need. |
| 06:22.26 | votick | Sorry about that, just basing my answer logically as it worked for myself just fine. |
| 06:22.49 | darkapex | summatusmentis, should i post it on the mailing list? |
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| 06:22.53 | votick | devj: That would be great, we should keep in touch :) |
| 06:23.02 | votick | I will grant you beta access too if you'd like. |
| 06:23.13 | summatusmentis | votick: no, I understand, there's just a tendency for misinformation to spread when answers are seen as authoritative, but they're not |
| 06:23.28 | devj | Voticl: For sure! and that would be excelent! |
| 06:23.28 | summatusmentis | and it's harder to contain that information once it's been passed around |
| 06:23.57 | votick | I completely understand, wouldn't want to rile up the community. |
| 06:24.35 | summatusmentis | darkapex: that would be a good starting place |
| 06:24.48 | summatusmentis | I don't know who the admin is this year, otherwise I'd direct you to their IRC nick |
| 06:25.09 | devj | Votick: For sure! That would be excellent… I love betas ;) |
| 06:25.18 | votick | Here you guy fellas, try this: |
| 06:25.32 | UnderControl | How long did it take for you guys to get your forms approved? |
| 06:25.39 | votick | www.glassesonfirehydrants.com << that's site url for development, don't bother questioning the url, I was bored haha. |
| 06:25.46 | votick | Username to site: codein |
| 06:25.46 | SpencerNeitzke | It did not take any time for me |
| 06:25.52 | votick | pass: 15wqqwf2tw3g |
| 06:25.56 | votick | Yeah, it was quick for myself as well. |
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| 06:26.02 | SpencerNeitzke | Haha! I love the domain |
| 06:26.27 | devj | Nice domain. |
| 06:26.33 | votick | Thanks, lol |
| 06:26.43 | votick | Oh, if you guys would like a test account to login to, considering you can't do much without it: |
| 06:26.49 | votick | Username of test account: Hitler |
| 06:26.53 | votick | Pass: testaccount3 |
| 06:26.58 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 06:27.00 | votick | lol, again, I was just messing with names. |
| 06:27.07 | SpencerNeitzke | I see that |
| 06:27.29 | SpencerNeitzke | This is very nice! |
| 06:27.31 | votick | If you login though, you will see a fully setup points system, and the ability to "unlock" written content. |
| 06:27.32 | votick | Thanks :) |
| 06:27.40 | votick | I have a friend who will be designing it soon. |
| 06:27.43 | UnderControl | Is anyone doing tasks with fedora? |
| 06:27.52 | SpencerNeitzke | Sweet! |
| 06:28.02 | votick | But the point of the site, is to motivate students to do well in school. So they post their work, and when others unlock it, they earn points, and thus get paid after long-term accumulation :) |
| 06:28.16 | summatusmentis | post their work? |
| 06:28.25 | votick | Yeah, such as essays and book responses. |
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| 06:28.37 | votick | not to be confused with actually giving away work, it's purely for spreading knowledge. |
| 06:28.39 | summatusmentis | doesn't that open up a big potential for plagiarism? |
| 06:28.43 | *** join/#gsoc _o_o_oOo_o_o_ (~macambot@187.59.9.253) |
| 06:29.03 | devj | ^Same question I have |
| 06:29.06 | votick | That's a huge question, but we have backed it up over time thankfully. We have many tools set up to prevent this, and teacher can gain access just like google access any site. |
| 06:29.12 | votick | It's as easy as googling something. |
| 06:29.33 | summatusmentis | what types of tools? |
| 06:29.46 | summatusmentis | what do you mean "back it up over time"? |
| 06:30.27 | votick | I have been developing the site for almost 2 years now, and we competed in competition with it, so the judges were throwing all of these questions at us without mercy. |
| 06:30.50 | votick | We allow a chunk of the content to be public, assuming it's a decent sized article. This then let's google crawl it as it wishes. |
| 06:31.15 | votick | Along with this, a fully functional report system will be setup that allows content to be taken down/checked for inconsistency, this would include possible piracy. |
| 06:31.28 | votick | We don't allow content to be posted on our site if it's stolen, nor to we promote others stealing it. |
| 06:31.50 | votick | It would be the same as copy/pasting from any other website, you would get caught and look foolish in most cases right? |
| 06:31.55 | summatusmentis | I guess my question isn't about the content on your site being plagiarised, but people using your site for plagiarism |
| 06:32.15 | votick | What do you mean by that? |
| 06:32.33 | votick | (Note: This is great for personal reference, so thanks) |
| 06:32.46 | summatusmentis | well, if content is available in full, doesn't that mean anyone could login and plagiarise from the site? |
| 06:32.59 | *** join/#gsoc Catfish_Man (~david@adium/CatfishMan) |
| 06:32.59 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o Catfish_Man] by ChanServ |
| 06:33.11 | devj | Say I'm a student writing an essay on the Civil War, and one of the students on your site has posted their essay on the Civil War… couldn't I just copy/paste his essay? |
| 06:33.25 | summatusmentis | you're right in that it's like copying form any other site |
| 06:33.54 | votick | Yeah, I guess they technically could right? The thing is though, why would someone do that? I don't see why our site would hold any greater value of plagiarism than any other site on the web. |
| 06:34.07 | votick | However, this question comes up constantly, so I'm really looking for a way to combat it efficiently. |
| 06:34.12 | devj | And because it's written by another student, a teacher might believe that it is your work, whereas they don't when someone uses Wikipedia (due to immaculate language, etc.) |
| 06:34.15 | summatusmentis | exemplary work that others have had success with |
| 06:35.04 | summatusmentis | votick: in my mind, I could imagine students saying "oh, this site shares others' work, they've already done the work I need to" |
| 06:35.05 | devj | Have you not just thought about implementing no copy/paste? There are ridiculously easy lines of code to implement that. |
| 06:35.10 | votick | Quick refresh on the site concept: - users can post content they have made, such as essays, stories, or any other writing. This content is then listed at the price they wish on the site (in points value). When a user finds it and wishes to read as it benefits them, the points go to the author. |
| 06:35.18 | votick | Once the author has enough points, he/she can cash out for paypal/prize. |
| 06:35.35 | devj | I love that concept, though. |
| 06:35.41 | votick | @Devj, that's possible too. |
| 06:35.47 | SpencerNeitzke | Yes, it is a good idea. |
| 06:36.07 | votick | However, I have contemplated this for a while, and came to this conclusion: Rather than preventing stealing of content, I should make it easier to get caught for doing so. |
| 06:36.11 | summatusmentis | votick: please don't misunderstand me, I'm not trying to be overly negative, I'm just curious |
| 06:36.13 | Catfish_Man | devj: fwiw, that doesn't actually work |
| 06:36.22 | devj | Just write a few lines of code that don't allow selection of text. Seems simple enough. |
| 06:36.29 | votick | It's like telling someone "not" to steal for a candy store. No matter how many cameras you put, they can still steal right? |
| 06:36.45 | devj | I've seen websites implement it before…. how does it not work? |
| 06:36.46 | summatusmentis | what kinds of "cameras" do you have? |
| 06:36.47 | votick | So the real focus is not removing the ability the steal, but improving the chance of getting caught. |
| 06:36.52 | *** join/#gsoc neXyon (~neXyon@85-127-21-134.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 06:37.03 | Catfish_Man | devj: it's trivial to use something like the web inspector to grab the content anyway |
| 06:37.09 | votick | Yeah. |
| 06:37.11 | Catfish_Man | just right click > inspect element > copy |
| 06:37.17 | Catfish_Man | I suppose it does make it less obvious |
| 06:37.27 | votick | It's hard to explain... but coming from someone who has had lots of experience with this, I can honestly say there is no logical way to prevent it. |
| 06:37.35 | votick | Someone can always find a loophole, and it's not our fault. |
| 06:37.55 | votick | If I wanted to go jump off a cliff right now, I could do it. But it's all choice. The same choice people have when it comes to stealing |
| 06:37.57 | devj | For us technologically advanced? Yeah, it's pointless, but you're doing this to prevent the lazy people from doing it. That would cut down most of the people trying to cheat (One would assume) |
| 06:37.59 | summatusmentis | no, it's not, plagiarism falls squarely on the person plagiarising |
| 06:38.06 | votick | And plus, thankfully to awesome tools such as Google, it's hard to get away with stealing page content |
| 06:38.50 | devj | Votick: What kind of systems are in place to improve being caught? How could you even monitor that? |
| 06:38.57 | votick | Google :) |
| 06:39.00 | votick | Step 1: google.com |
| 06:39.03 | votick | Step 2: Paste writing |
| 06:39.06 | votick | Step 3: profit! |
| 06:39.17 | devj | Well yes, but that would be the teachers job, correct? |
| 06:39.37 | votick | Unless you're implying Google doesn't search well, I would like to believe that it catches theft well. However, this doesn't fix the problem fully. |
| 06:40.13 | devj | Certainly, it does. But it has to be done by the receiving end (i.e. the teacher who gets the paper) |
| 06:40.15 | votick | Yeah, the problem is this: If content on the site is private until unlocked, then a teacher may have not gained access to the full article and thus not noticed plagiarizm. . |
| 06:40.47 | devj | Right. |
| 06:40.48 | votick | Basically as I said, is there is really no way of stopping someone from making the wrong choice... We can only do so much to prevent people from cheating the site. |
| 06:41.02 | votick | But they will be caught eventually. |
| 06:41.04 | SpencerNeitzke | Another problem is that, I don't know any teachers at my school that even check for plagariasm. |
| 06:41.09 | votick | It's like stealing a popular youtube video. |
| 06:41.18 | votick | one day it will bite you in the back, as someone will be like: "hey, that's not your vid!" |
| 06:41.28 | votick | @Spencer, that's definitely an issue yeah. |
| 06:41.35 | devj | Do any of your teachers not use turnmein.com? |
| 06:41.45 | devj | That program uses the powers of Google to the max. |
| 06:41.46 | votick | Here's the catch: Who's stopping them from plagiarizing any other day? |
| 06:41.59 | votick | Hmm, never heard of it. |
| 06:42.00 | SpencerNeitzke | Nope, not at all. No checks what so ever. |
| 06:42.05 | devj | Sorry, turnitin.com |
| 06:42.13 | votick | Ahh. |
| 06:42.35 | devj | It's nuts! It finds the percentage of match to other articles on the internet… pretty scary stuff. |
| 06:42.43 | votick | Well, alright Spencer, here's my question then. If someone copy and pasted from Wikipedia, and successfully got 100% on their work. |
| 06:42.54 | SpencerNeitzke | I do happen to live in a rural area, so that is a contributing factor. The adoption of technology began here not to long ago. |
| 06:42.56 | votick | Who do you blame: A) The student, B) Teacher, C) wikipedia |
| 06:43.10 | devj | The student! |
| 06:43.18 | votick | Exactly! |
| 06:43.22 | SpencerNeitzke | Student |
| 06:43.26 | Catfish_Man | votick: the question of blame is relatively uninteresting, generally |
| 06:43.28 | votick | Now, change wikipedia.com into ~~ globeofgeek.com |
| 06:43.30 | votick | Same thing. |
| 06:43.32 | Catfish_Man | except if you're in charge of punishing people |
| 06:43.35 | votick | It's not our problem. |
| 06:43.47 | Catfish_Man | the interesting question is always what results, not who caused it |
| 06:43.57 | *** join/#gsoc dranov (~dranov@188.27.113.96) |
| 06:43.59 | devj | So then the only problem is people cheating the site then. |
| 06:44.04 | votick | I know that catfish, that's the point though. We aren't in charge of punishing, that's the teachers job, and it's not our fault if a student steals, that's the students fault. |
| 06:44.29 | SpencerNeitzke | What if there is no punishing though? |
| 06:44.32 | Catfish_Man | votick: you're missing my point I think :) |
| 06:44.41 | votick | Here is my question: How do I explain the site concept without people asking:"so is it for stealing work???". |
| 06:44.45 | votick | Because many people say that. |
| 06:44.46 | summatusmentis | votick: broadly, I agree, a given website is not at fault for plagiarism |
| 06:44.52 | devj | I think the whole point is that it's not wikipedia |
| 06:45.10 | votick | Catfish, would you mind shooting off your question to me again then? |
| 06:45.12 | devj | Wikipedias fault for people using it to cheat. That comes down to the cheater. |
| 06:45.27 | votick | Yeah. However, our problem is when the public assume it's our problem. |
| 06:45.33 | summatusmentis | I think the question you haven't answered yet is "Does a site target specifically for sharing schoolwork support cheating in a way that a general purpose information site does not?" |
| 06:45.35 | Catfish_Man | votick: oh I didn't have a question. I was just musing out loud |
| 06:45.35 | votick | The thought of stealing is damaging our reputation as a business opportunity. |
| 06:45.45 | devj | Good question. |
| 06:46.15 | devj | I would think in the public's eye it would, but I think that it's unfortunate that it's that way. |
| 06:46.25 | summatusmentis | votick: clearly there are websites that are pay-for services that provide answers to questions in textbooks that aren't in the back of the book |
| 06:46.32 | votick | summatusmentis: I would say based on assumption, it does. However in reality, it does not. |
| 06:46.35 | *** join/#gsoc phlip9 (4cab9571@gateway/web/freenode/ip.76.171.149.113) |
| 06:46.45 | devj | Instant information is what Google's all about, right? Its the future of our education. |
| 06:46.47 | summatusmentis | votick: I'd like to see evidence of that |
| 06:46.49 | votick | People assume a site about sharing content means it's stealing... but it really has nothing to do with that. |
| 06:47.14 | summatusmentis | there's a difference between what the goal of a site is, and what it's used for |
| 06:47.14 | devj | Has anyone heard of SparkNotes?!!? That's like cheating 101. |
| 06:47.29 | summatusmentis | right, and SparkNotes still has a business model |
| 06:47.43 | votick | Yeah... |
| 06:47.46 | summatusmentis | clearly there are websites that provide answers to textbook problems that aren't in the back of the book |
| 06:47.50 | devj | Yep. Make money off of lazy students who will pay to not read. |
| 06:47.59 | summatusmentis | I'm not trying to ascribe blame to votick, not at all |
| 06:48.05 | votick | Here is the mission statement: Read to learn, submit to earn with GlobeOfGeek. The largest academic reward system! |
| 06:48.29 | summatusmentis | I think the idea is interesting, and I think that there's potentially some merit |
| 06:48.30 | devj | What kind of reward are there? |
| 06:48.31 | votick | summatusmentis: Your criticism feeds my thirst for improvement <3 |
| 06:48.44 | votick | Rewards will begin with paypal cashout, since I'm not experienced enough to code a full shop. |
| 06:48.48 | summatusmentis | votick: not really even intended as criticism |
| 06:49.00 | votick | I understand :) |
| 06:49.07 | devj | This is a great concept. |
| 06:49.16 | SpencerNeitzke | I agree, it has potential |
| 06:49.23 | devj | Implementing it on a grand scale is the hard part. |
| 06:49.25 | votick | Thanks guys, means a lot :) |
| 06:49.29 | votick | And yeah, I completely understand. |
| 06:49.42 | summatusmentis | votick: can I ask, how old are you? |
| 06:49.54 | votick | Currently 16, I began the site upon turning 14. |
| 06:50.04 | summatusmentis | ok, cool |
| 06:50.08 | summatusmentis | pure curiosity |
| 06:50.33 | phlip9 | Hey, anyone here from NetBSD?\ |
| 06:50.44 | votick | Curiosity is always nice :) |
| 06:50.48 | votick | May I ask how old you are? |
| 06:50.59 | devj | It's quite amazing to see all of us, you know? We are really quite young, and we are the future Sergey Brins… it's fascinating. |
| 06:51.04 | votick | Wait, you're most likely someone with more authority in here right? Based on how you confronted everything. |
| 06:51.14 | votick | @Devj, I know right! |
| 06:51.15 | summatusmentis | I'm no one with authority |
| 06:51.30 | summatusmentis | I'm a 24 year-old PhD student in CS, specifically HCI |
| 06:51.31 | votick | I really wish I could find people like yourselves in person. My recent friends are mostly turning to drug usage now. |
| 06:51.49 | votick | Summa! Are you serious!? |
| 06:51.52 | summatusmentis | yes |
| 06:51.55 | votick | You're living my dream! |
| 06:51.56 | devj | Votick, I feel you. |
| 06:52.00 | SpencerNeitzke | Oh, yeah |
| 06:52.16 | votick | May I ask: What part of the world are you folks from? |
| 06:52.22 | votick | I'm in Canada, so yeah. |
| 06:52.28 | summatusmentis | I live in the US |
| 06:52.31 | devj | USA… Colorado more specifically. |
| 06:52.34 | SpencerNeitzke | Mason City, Iowa, US |
| 06:52.41 | Catfish_Man | summatusmentis has been around #gsoc long enough to have a pretty good idea how things work |
| 06:52.45 | votick | As expected, all American haha. |
| 06:52.50 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 06:53.12 | votick | @summa, I plan on going to University of Waterloo for a PhD in CS. |
| 06:53.14 | devj | I would assume that not a lot of winners are actually American… looking at last years winners. |
| 06:53.27 | devj | Stanford, all the way. |
| 06:53.33 | summatusmentis | votick: I considered applying there for undergrad, but they wanted AP Chemistry :-/ |
| 06:53.33 | votick | They were nearly all Indian (nothing wrong with that), but it was apparent. |
| 06:53.38 | summatusmentis | (for US students) |
| 06:53.43 | votick | Woah wait! |
| 06:53.43 | SpencerNeitzke | Stanford is awesome! I went there this summer for a C++ camp |
| 06:53.43 | votick | Oh, |
| 06:53.47 | votick | You scared the heck out of me haha! |
| 06:53.57 | devj | Stanford is amazing... |
| 06:54.05 | SpencerNeitzke | I loved it |
| 06:54.08 | votick | That's in the states right? |
| 06:54.09 | summatusmentis | votick: something about how US school systems aren't up to canadian standards |
| 06:54.12 | devj | Ah! The dreaded AP chem... |
| 06:54.19 | summatusmentis | Stanford is in SF, CXA |
| 06:54.22 | summatusmentis | CA* |
| 06:54.35 | summatusmentis | Catfish_Man: really, far too long :) |
| 06:54.36 | votick | Ohh, lol. |
| 06:54.37 | devj | It's right next to Google HQ, in fact. |
| 06:54.47 | votick | I always heard that US schools were way above Canadian though? |
| 06:54.52 | votick | You guys have harvard, etc. |
| 06:54.59 | SpencerNeitzke | Toured Google once, Had to sign an NDA lol |
| 06:55.02 | devj | UK has Oxford. |
| 06:55.03 | votick | But then again, that's just my 1-sided assumption kicking in. |
| 06:55.14 | votick | I really want to tour google haha :) |
| 06:55.22 | summatusmentis | votick: I'm not convinced it was about standards, it may have been "we don't want US students flooding our schools" |
| 06:55.25 | SpencerNeitzke | It's an awesome place |
| 06:55.40 | summatusmentis | regardless, I didn't go there |
| 06:55.44 | devj | When I've gone to Google IO, you have to sign NDA. Hence why there are no live-bloggers inside. |
| 06:55.45 | votick | Lol, that would explain a lot. |
| 06:56.10 | devj | And why no one really knows what goes on at Google IO unless you've gone. |
| 06:56.10 | *** join/#gsoc Help (75c22657@gateway/web/freenode/ip.117.194.38.87) |
| 06:56.14 | votick | I have yet to come down from up North to see the world. Would be nice to do once I can afford travel. |
| 06:56.28 | devj | Well, win the competion!!! |
| 06:56.29 | Help | Hello i need some help in registering !! |
| 06:56.33 | *** join/#gsoc Dhruv (~Dhruv@unaffiliated/dhruv) |
| 06:56.34 | votick | I'm going to try my best! |
| 06:56.38 | summatusmentis | _don't_ wait until you're a PhD student to travel |
| 06:56.43 | votick | Currently on almost 38 hours with no sleep haha. |
| 06:56.49 | votick | Not giving up on waiting for my task <3 |
| 06:56.52 | votick | And, why not, Summa? |
| 06:56.58 | devj | Help: don't register with that name if you need help.... |
| 06:57.11 | summatusmentis | the primary opportunities you'll get to travel is presenting at conferences |
| 06:57.14 | devj | Help: Your name implies that you are the one giving help. |
| 06:57.17 | summatusmentis | otherwise, you won't have time |
| 06:57.25 | Catfish_Man | votick: dude, go to bed |
| 06:57.25 | Guest20575 | URL ID* ?? What is this while registering !!! |
| 06:57.26 | votick | Ahh, thanks for the advice. |
| 06:57.34 | votick | Haha! Guest, that's exactly what I said. |
| 06:57.37 | summatusmentis | also, yeah, sleep is important |
| 06:57.52 | votick | My head hurts extremely right now, but I just want to complete a task. |
| 06:57.53 | devj | Dude, go to bed! You can't code on a sleepless mind. |
| 06:57.58 | Guest20575 | Smone please help me out !!! |
| 06:57.59 | summatusmentis | 38 hours of being awake won't be helpful for completing tasks |
| 06:58.02 | Guest20575 | PLEASE !!! |
| 06:58.03 | votick | Watch me! Haha. |
| 06:58.07 | SpencerNeitzke | Guest20575, it is your username |
| 06:58.14 | votick | Woah, all caps in here, serious. |
| 06:58.18 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 06:58.24 | devj | Votick: Don't worry. I dumped my task and applied for another. Haven't heard back yet. |
| 06:58.40 | votick | Ohh you did? Sweet :) Well, I guess it's sweet if you are benefiting. |
| 06:58.47 | Guest20575 | NO i just dont remember my IRC username !! I forgot it but remember my Account associated with it |
| 06:58.59 | devj | My old task was just too much for me. And no support really killed it. |
| 06:59.13 | votick | I have my laptop strapped to my back at school, and it gives me notifications when I get an email from google. |
| 06:59.18 | Catfish_Man | Guest20575: SpencerNeitzke was answering your question, I believe |
| 06:59.22 | votick | So I look like a freak somewhat... with my trenchcoat and everything lmao. |
| 06:59.29 | votick | but I will instantly be notified if my task is open. |
| 06:59.34 | SpencerNeitzke | I turned my laptop into a server... |
| 06:59.44 | devj | Laptop server? |
| 06:59.46 | SpencerNeitzke | Using it for minecraft right now |
| 06:59.52 | devj | Minecraft… ;) |
| 06:59.56 | *** join/#gsoc areke (ccd27b7e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.204.210.123.126) |
| 06:59.59 | Guest20575 | Oh oh i get it |
| 07:00.05 | devj | We should all make a giant GCI mine craft server! HA! |
| 07:00.08 | SpencerNeitzke | Indeed, slapped a new processor in there as well as an SSD for good measure |
| 07:00.16 | devj | That would be hilarious. |
| 07:00.19 | SpencerNeitzke | minecraft.neitzke.me |
| 07:00.21 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:00.22 | areke | devj: lol |
| 07:00.35 | summatusmentis | Catfish_Man: what're you up to these days? |
| 07:00.51 | Catfish_Man | summatusmentis: just got back from a week in portland seeing my folks and old friends :) |
| 07:00.59 | summatusmentis | OR? or ME? |
| 07:01.02 | Catfish_Man | OR |
| 07:01.02 | devj | I used to live in Portalnd. |
| 07:01.03 | votick | <brb> going for quick jog. |
| 07:01.06 | devj | Portland, OR. |
| 07:01.13 | summatusmentis | nice, I'd love to get out that direction |
| 07:01.16 | Catfish_Man | summatusmentis: currently trying to figure out how I managed to break the build so badly while I was away |
| 07:01.19 | Guest20575 | Thanks !! |
| 07:01.31 | Guest20575 | First time taking part in this event :) |
| 07:01.32 | devj | Beautiful there, just really rainy. |
| 07:01.36 | summatusmentis | Catfish_Man: story. of. my. life :) |
| 07:02.11 | Catfish_Man | Makin' stuff faster and smaller when it's not broken though ;) so that's something |
| 07:02.39 | devj | Spencer: MC says can't resolve hostname. |
| 07:02.45 | SpencerNeitzke | interesting |
| 07:02.49 | summatusmentis | Catfish_Man: is this still adium? |
| 07:02.51 | SpencerNeitzke | must be some dns thing |
| 07:02.56 | SpencerNeitzke | mc.neitzke.me |
| 07:02.59 | SpencerNeitzke | try that |
| 07:03.06 | SpencerNeitzke | let me check out my dns though |
| 07:03.14 | Catfish_Man | summatusmentis: nah. Haven't really had time for Adium since I got a job again |
| 07:03.22 | devj | Spencer: still no luck. |
| 07:03.23 | Catfish_Man | working on Foundation and CoreFoundation now |
| 07:03.39 | SpencerNeitzke | alright let me fix my dns in that case |
| 07:04.00 | devj | Alright ;) |
| 07:04.37 | SpencerNeitzke | eh just use this lol |
| 07:04.37 | SpencerNeitzke | 173.26.176.149 |
| 07:04.43 | Catfish_Man | summatusmentis: there's a bunch of new enthusiastic youngsters hacking on Adium now. Same mix of great work and foolish overconfidence we all had :) |
| 07:05.21 | devj | Spencer: got it! |
| 07:05.23 | votick | I have returned. |
| 07:05.29 | SpencerNeitzke | Hello! |
| 07:05.50 | summatusmentis | Catfish_Man: nice, Apple :) |
| 07:05.53 | *** join/#gsoc valex (~valex@86.126.113.211) |
| 07:05.56 | *** join/#gsoc zerobinary (6165523e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.97.101.82.62) |
| 07:06.01 | Catfish_Man | yeah, it's a good team |
| 07:06.07 | summatusmentis | that's cool |
| 07:06.18 | summatusmentis | in some ways, I think it'd be awesome to do HCI at Apple |
| 07:06.19 | Catfish_Man | 3.5 years in and I'm still the new guy. There's something to be said for stability and experience in coworkers |
| 07:06.26 | summatusmentis | but it's apparently impossible to get into that |
| 07:06.38 | summatusmentis | unless you were besties w/ Jobs or something |
| 07:06.43 | Catfish_Man | beats me |
| 07:06.49 | Catfish_Man | I got out of HCI when I found out how fun perf work is :) |
| 07:07.36 | summatusmentis | bah, I got out of systems when I found out I could do CS and social science at the same time |
| 07:08.45 | zerobinary | Hello. |
| 07:08.51 | votick | Heya. |
| 07:09.10 | votick | Hey, what time is it for you guys? |
| 07:09.15 | summatusmentis | 1:10 |
| 07:09.16 | votick | It's currently 1:09am for me. |
| 07:09.21 | zerobinary | It's 2:09AM for me. |
| 07:09.24 | summatusmentis | crap, I have class in 7 hours |
| 07:09.27 | votick | Woah, it's 1 minute later for you. That's pretty cool. |
| 07:09.35 | votick | I have to get up early in like 4 hours. |
| 07:09.36 | summatusmentis | nah, estimation |
| 07:09.37 | votick | To watch anime. |
| 07:09.44 | summatusmentis | dude |
| 07:09.51 | zerobinary | Oh lord. |
| 07:09.54 | summatusmentis | if you've been up for 38 hours, you need more than 4 hours of sleep |
| 07:09.56 | votick | Yeah? |
| 07:10.00 | votick | Haha. |
| 07:10.09 | zerobinary | Wait, He's been up for 38 hours?!. |
| 07:10.12 | zerobinary | And he wants to watch anime?. |
| 07:10.15 | zerobinary | What... I don't even.. |
| 07:10.24 | votick | I take medication to help me focus in class, since I have intense attention problems... Biggest issue is they kill my ability to sleep soundly. |
| 07:10.43 | SpencerNeitzke | I can't sleep without sleeping pills |
| 07:10.58 | votick | And that, Spencer, is why you are in the coding chat with us right now. |
| 07:11.09 | SpencerNeitzke | Exactly! |
| 07:11.15 | votick | Haha. |
| 07:11.26 | zerobinary | I am programming a game at the moment, Well i was until unity crashed. |
| 07:11.26 | votick | Oh, do you guys have any other form of contact? Or perhaps you will be in this irc often? |
| 07:11.35 | summatusmentis | I idle here |
| 07:11.36 | Catfish_Man | is omnipresent |
| 07:11.40 | zerobinary | I do. |
| 07:11.40 | SpencerNeitzke | Unity! |
| 07:11.49 | SpencerNeitzke | I have skype |
| 07:11.50 | zerobinary | :). I love unity. |
| 07:11.50 | votick | Would hate to loose contact with you fellas after such an indepth conversation about random content. |
| 07:11.54 | SpencerNeitzke | and email |
| 07:12.00 | zerobinary | Email, What's that?. |
| 07:12.01 | SpencerNeitzke | Unity is awesome |
| 07:12.02 | votick | I have skype too, if you want to add me: GlobeOfGeek |
| 07:12.05 | SpencerNeitzke | exactly |
| 07:12.06 | summatusmentis | votick: feel free to ping me, I'll be around |
| 07:12.12 | summatusmentis | with that, I should sleep |
| 07:12.16 | zerobinary | Hahaha!. |
| 07:12.23 | votick | Lmao, wait are you serious? |
| 07:12.31 | votick | Would hate to flood your cpu... |
| 07:12.52 | votick | Alright, have a good rest! |
| 07:12.53 | summatusmentis | are you talking to me? |
| 07:13.04 | zerobinary | Windows limits your network packets @Votick. |
| 07:13.06 | devj | Unity? Am i Lost? |
| 07:13.14 | zerobinary | So use linux instead. |
| 07:13.15 | summatusmentis | ok, bed |
| 07:13.15 | votick | If any of you have skype open right now, feel free to add me: GlobeOfGeek. |
| 07:13.20 | votick | Facebook: facebook.com/accountbanned |
| 07:13.20 | summatusmentis | & |
| 07:13.25 | Guest20575 | Dude is there an alternative to school ID card cause i think i have misplaced it :( |
| 07:13.26 | votick | Those are my main contact locations |
| 07:13.43 | votick | @Guest, take a video of yourself dancing on a local highway. |
| 07:14.16 | SpencerNeitzke | votick, I like looking absolutely shocked. |
| 07:14.34 | votick | Haha. |
| 07:14.37 | devj | @Guest, you can have your principle sign a form saying you go to your school, or you can provide a transcript from this current year. |
| 07:14.49 | devj | *principal |
| 07:15.10 | devj | Are any of you guys good with making a website? |
| 07:15.18 | votick | I'm alright. |
| 07:15.22 | devj | Cause I am in the market for a personal website... |
| 07:15.22 | SpencerNeitzke | Sometimes, it depends lol |
| 07:15.23 | votick | Joking I'm freaking amazing! |
| 07:15.33 | SpencerNeitzke | http://neitzke.me this is my personal |
| 07:15.37 | devj | And I don't want to pay a trillion dollars to a crappy go daddy designer. |
| 07:15.44 | votick | Amen to that! |
| 07:15.48 | Catfish_Man | devj: I think it's some sort of law of nature that anyone who's worked on a browser engine is a terrible web designer ;) so that rules out me |
| 07:16.07 | devj | Ha! |
| 07:16.21 | devj | Spencer: I like it! |
| 07:16.42 | SpencerNeitzke | Thanks! I tried many designs, that was the simplist |
| 07:16.52 | devj | Minimalism, I am a huge fan. |
| 07:16.57 | SpencerNeitzke | Agreed |
| 07:17.09 | devj | But in all serious, I would love a website like that… ugh.. |
| 07:17.21 | votick | I plan on learning a "bit" of design, which I have started, but I really don't like it. |
| 07:17.33 | devj | Yeah, not as fun as coding l) |
| 07:17.35 | devj | :) |
| 07:17.38 | SpencerNeitzke | I have been doing some CSS3 lately |
| 07:17.41 | votick | Exactly! |
| 07:17.53 | SpencerNeitzke | I have to say I like it, but not as much as coding |
| 07:18.08 | devj | Plus, in design you actually have to be artistically creative, of which I am not. |
| 07:18.09 | Catfish_Man | SpencerNeitzke: try the other side of it :) implementing CSS features can be pretty fun |
| 07:18.35 | SpencerNeitzke | It's true, I have to admit. It was like christmas |
| 07:18.38 | devj | Anyone know of a good web designer? I figured I would ask you guys. |
| 07:18.53 | devj | I need a cheep, simple, personal website. |
| 07:18.55 | Catfish_Man | SpencerNeitzke: though, admittedly, a good deal trickier than using said CSS features ;) |
| 07:19.03 | SpencerNeitzke | My friend happens to be a good web designer |
| 07:19.14 | SpencerNeitzke | lol yes |
| 07:19.16 | devj | Is his services for sal? |
| 07:19.22 | SpencerNeitzke | I have no ida |
| 07:19.22 | devj | *sale gosh |
| 07:19.27 | SpencerNeitzke | I have no idea* |
| 07:19.39 | devj | Let me know. ;) |
| 07:19.42 | SpencerNeitzke | I would have to ask him tomorrow |
| 07:19.44 | SpencerNeitzke | I will |
| 07:19.44 | votick | Time to make an important decision: I have a big history assignment due tomorrow, but I also want to watch anime... |
| 07:19.48 | votick | What do...? |
| 07:19.59 | UnderControl | Assignment! |
| 07:20.00 | devj | 30min of anime, then History. |
| 07:20.05 | SpencerNeitzke | Hmm, both at same time |
| 07:20.05 | devj | Best of both worlds. |
| 07:20.23 | votick | You guys sure set your priorities straight! |
| 07:20.28 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:20.30 | votick | Well, wait, what do you guys watch? |
| 07:20.30 | devj | I like to use the 30/30 method. ;) |
| 07:20.47 | devj | I can honestly say that I've never seen an anime... |
| 07:20.51 | SpencerNeitzke | I watch breaking bad, that's it. |
| 07:20.57 | votick | Woah. Dude, I'm here for you if you need the support... |
| 07:21.08 | votick | Should look up: Gurren Lagann, it's a great anime. |
| 07:21.20 | devj | I watch Suits, Psych, and mostly just those kind of shows. |
| 07:21.24 | votick | Ahh. |
| 07:21.49 | devj | I am kinda lost in the world of anime… it's confusing. |
| 07:21.51 | votick | I watch classic movies, anime, horror, documentary, or classic documentaries about horrific anime. |
| 07:21.52 | SpencerNeitzke | I don't watch much TV anymore, it is mostly code |
| 07:22.10 | zerobinary | I love anime. |
| 07:22.19 | zerobinary | I code, Watch anime. |
| 07:22.22 | zerobinary | Sometimes hack. |
| 07:22.23 | votick | *virtual high five* |
| 07:22.26 | devj | OH MY GOSH, WOULD SOMEONE PLEASE ACCEPT MY TASK. UGH. |
| 07:22.31 | votick | EXACTLY! |
| 07:22.31 | SpencerNeitzke | Hack! Yay! |
| 07:22.34 | zerobinary | White hat hacking of course. |
| 07:22.36 | votick | It's killing me! |
| 07:22.37 | devj | Sorry for the caps, I'm just mat. |
| 07:22.47 | SpencerNeitzke | Hehe |
| 07:22.49 | zerobinary | :). |
| 07:22.50 | votick | hi mat, I'm Kyle. |
| 07:22.53 | devj | Yay for ethical hacking! |
| 07:23.04 | devj | *mad lol |
| 07:23.11 | SpencerNeitzke | Yay! |
| 07:23.29 | devj | I wish I had someone who would teach me how to hack… that seems like the coolest thing ever. |
| 07:23.42 | devj | Like I get DDoS and stuff, but other than that… no. |
| 07:23.48 | SpencerNeitzke | it is fun, but it can be very hard. I am no expert |
| 07:23.59 | votick | That's skid hacking, lmao. |
| 07:24.04 | Catfish_Man | someone DDoSed an irc server I was on a while back |
| 07:24.04 | votick | Depends on what you define "hacking" as. |
| 07:24.11 | devj | I want to be able to crash websites. Make my enemies cry. |
| 07:24.17 | Catfish_Man | the owner of the server ended up calling his mom |
| 07:24.25 | SpencerNeitzke | hop onto anonirc |
| 07:24.26 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:24.27 | devj | LOL! ^ |
| 07:24.33 | votick | I have worked with sql injection/web pen a bit. |
| 07:24.40 | votick | Along with decryption etc. |
| 07:24.43 | SpencerNeitzke | sql injection is good |
| 07:24.45 | devj | Yeah, I would love to do that. |
| 07:24.59 | SpencerNeitzke | encryption is also fun |
| 07:25.45 | devj | Where is anonirc? |
| 07:25.57 | SpencerNeitzke | irc.anonops.net |
| 07:26.05 | SpencerNeitzke | unless they moved it... again |
| 07:26.13 | zerobinary | Votick, Is pretty popular among the hacking scene. |
| 07:26.13 | devj | This could be interesting, ha. |
| 07:26.26 | votick | Lmao, keep my name hidden zero! |
| 07:26.27 | zerobinary | If you searched him up on google you can find a'lot of info about him. |
| 07:27.04 | votick | Yeah, back when I was foolish, lol. |
| 07:27.05 | devj | Googled. Not much found...... |
| 07:27.08 | zerobinary | Did't you make the news or w.e because you crashed this online game or something?. |
| 07:27.17 | devj | That's awesome! |
| 07:27.17 | SpencerNeitzke | I use a different username for anonops |
| 07:27.22 | SpencerNeitzke | of course lol |
| 07:27.24 | votick | Yeah, that was really, REALLY foolish though. |
| 07:27.30 | votick | They threatened to sue me, but I'm too young. |
| 07:27.34 | devj | But worth it, right?! |
| 07:27.34 | zerobinary | https://www.google.com/#hl=en&tbo=d&sclient=psy-ab&q=votick+roblox&oq=votick+roblox&gs_l=hp.3..0i30.41135.42167.3.42323.7.1.0.6.6.0.60.60.1.1.0.les%3B..0.0...1c.1.vQC4sC-lXaI&psj=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&fp=cad6043851647f6&bpcl=38897761&biw=1360&bih=643 |
| 07:27.35 | devj | ;) |
| 07:27.47 | zerobinary | Yes!. The site is filled with skids. |
| 07:27.51 | SpencerNeitzke | I try to keep all of my activities hidden, seems I have done a good job |
| 07:27.57 | Catfish_Man | sighs |
| 07:28.06 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:28.09 | devj | Ha! |
| 07:28.10 | Catfish_Man | Ok, folks, the script-kiddy nonsense is really better suited to another channel |
| 07:28.14 | votick | Catfish would understand me. It's not easy being such an experience hacker. |
| 07:28.29 | zerobinary | I was/am part of EXPO. ROBLOX has the silliest security ever. They allowed you to view admin cookies by changing the URL. I of course obtained the cookie and gained admin access. |
| 07:28.40 | devj | Now, where you you learn all of this? |
| 07:28.51 | devj | Cause I want to learn how to do that lol |
| 07:28.55 | zerobinary | Hmm. That's for some-where else. |
| 07:28.56 | SpencerNeitzke | Catfish_Man, Has an excellent point |
| 07:29.01 | zerobinary | Lets stay on subject. |
| 07:29.03 | devj | Agreed... |
| 07:29.08 | zerobinary | How's everybody's tasks? |
| 07:29.08 | votick | Just study computer science, not "how to hack stuff". |
| 07:29.10 | devj | So… GCI?~ |
| 07:29.12 | zerobinary | Any completions?. |
| 07:29.25 | SpencerNeitzke | Not so far, still waiting for acception |
| 07:29.28 | devj | I would be done if they actually accepted my task. |
| 07:29.30 | votick | Gee thanks, Zero, reminding me that my task is still not accepted after a good 14 hours! |
| 07:29.34 | zerobinary | Hahaha. |
| 07:29.37 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:29.47 | votick | @Dev, I would have been done like 2-3 tasks by now if it was instant reply... |
| 07:29.59 | devj | No kidding, same here. |
| 07:30.06 | SpencerNeitzke | I guess it is just a waiting game |
| 07:30.11 | devj | This is really sort-of unfair… |
| 07:30.11 | zerobinary | I started programming at the age of 8 |
| 07:30.12 | zerobinary | :p |
| 07:30.20 | zerobinary | Learned HTML when i was 6. |
| 07:30.23 | devj | Well aren't you fancy? |
| 07:30.26 | zerobinary | :D |
| 07:30.26 | SpencerNeitzke | One year above you |
| 07:30.27 | SpencerNeitzke | 9 |
| 07:30.30 | zerobinary | ;3. |
| 07:30.31 | devj | HTML is not coding. |
| 07:30.34 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:30.42 | zerobinary | Never said it was. |
| 07:30.47 | devj | Oh, ok. ;) |
| 07:30.54 | votick | I didn't use a computer until I was 8... wow... |
| 07:31.07 | zerobinary | ^. Loner. |
| 07:31.13 | devj | I had an app on the App Store at 10! ;) |
| 07:31.15 | SpencerNeitzke | Visual Basic, that was silly |
| 07:31.18 | zerobinary | Awesome!. |
| 07:31.24 | devj | Basic. What a ride. |
| 07:31.29 | SpencerNeitzke | lol yes |
| 07:31.29 | votick | My first language was C, then I studied assembly. |
| 07:31.30 | Catfish_Man | devj: that makes me feel really old |
| 07:31.37 | votick | Almost had heart failure it scared me so much. |
| 07:31.45 | SpencerNeitzke | Hahaha! |
| 07:31.45 | devj | Catfish_Man: No worries :) |
| 07:31.47 | zerobinary | Bad choice votick!. |
| 07:31.54 | zerobinary | Start with c++ |
| 07:31.56 | zerobinary | xD |
| 07:31.59 | devj | Opinion time! |
| 07:32.02 | SpencerNeitzke | C++ is lovely |
| 07:32.09 | votick | That's 2 too many +'s for my liking. |
| 07:32.13 | zerobinary | Or learn Spaghetti code |
| 07:32.17 | SpencerNeitzke | lolcode |
| 07:32.23 | devj | What would you recommend to a kid to learn for his first programming language?! Ready, set, GO. |
| 07:32.31 | SpencerNeitzke | Hmm |
| 07:32.40 | votick | Oh no! Dev, what are you doing! You're going to start one of the most renown arguments in the technological industry! |
| 07:32.44 | SpencerNeitzke | Python |
| 07:32.46 | SpencerNeitzke | boom |
| 07:32.48 | devj | I learned Python first.... |
| 07:32.49 | votick | :inb4debate: |
| 07:32.56 | zerobinary | Id have to say C# |
| 07:33.03 | votick | It depends on this: How do you wish to approach coding? |
| 07:33.10 | zerobinary | Or Python. |
| 07:33.12 | SpencerNeitzke | I have yet to learn C# |
| 07:33.15 | votick | Do you have enough motivation to work hard at it? Or do you need something motivating you directly.? |
| 07:33.18 | zerobinary | C# is amazing. |
| 07:33.28 | votick | If you were like me, and really motivated, I would start with C. |
| 07:33.28 | SpencerNeitzke | I must try it... right now |
| 07:33.29 | devj | Same…. C#…. Haven't touched it. |
| 07:33.38 | SpencerNeitzke | getting the tools now |
| 07:33.42 | zerobinary | Anywho. Gonna go finish watching walking dead. Cya guys. |
| 07:33.46 | votick | C was scary to start with, but it made everything else really easy to pick up. |
| 07:33.51 | SpencerNeitzke | see ya! |
| 07:33.55 | devj | Python was a great first language. Had the basics of lots of languages... |
| 07:34.08 | Catfish_Man | votick: a good way to branch out from there is to try languages that aren't from the same family as C |
| 07:34.14 | Catfish_Man | haskell say, or prolog |
| 07:34.18 | SpencerNeitzke | indentation errors are the death of me |
| 07:34.21 | votick | Yeah, I somewhat did that a little later. |
| 07:34.26 | votick | moved onto Java, then php. |
| 07:34.33 | SpencerNeitzke | Same |
| 07:34.34 | votick | But PHP is based on C directly... so bad example. |
| 07:34.38 | devj | Oh god. Indentations. UGH. |
| 07:34.42 | SpencerNeitzke | hahaha |
| 07:34.47 | SpencerNeitzke | I got used to it though |
| 07:34.54 | votick | I coded an operating system in Html, true story. |
| 07:34.58 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:34.58 | devj | Java was good, too. |
| 07:35.14 | SpencerNeitzke | I use it for android apps |
| 07:35.24 | devj | Java? |
| 07:35.30 | SpencerNeitzke | Indeed |
| 07:35.35 | devj | Same here. |
| 07:35.42 | votick | I made a couple physics simulations with it. |
| 07:35.48 | SpencerNeitzke | nice |
| 07:35.52 | devj | iOS apps are mostly Obj.-C. |
| 07:36.01 | votick | Objective [BRAKET] as I call it. |
| 07:36.05 | devj | Which kinda sucks, but is easy if you are used to C. |
| 07:36.07 | votick | Such an overused amount of brackets in the language. |
| 07:36.11 | SpencerNeitzke | Yeah, I want to learn that... I don't have a Mac though |
| 07:36.13 | votick | made me and my friends laugh at computer camp while learning it. |
| 07:36.27 | devj | Good name @Votick. |
| 07:36.35 | votick | lol Thanks. |
| 07:36.42 | devj | I am doing this all on a Mac. |
| 07:36.54 | votick | Oh guys, a little heads up: If you're interested in another irc I have open, it's #globeofgeek |
| 07:36.54 | devj | It's my personal challenge to myself. |
| 07:36.55 | SpencerNeitzke | blah, I want one |
| 07:36.58 | votick | Just in case you needed to contact me or something. |
| 07:37.02 | votick | I'm going to try to be in there 24/7 |
| 07:37.06 | SpencerNeitzke | awesome |
| 07:37.09 | Catfish_Man | ObjC is reasonably nice. Cocoa is very nice though |
| 07:37.14 | Catfish_Man | 'course, I may be a little biased ;D |
| 07:37.20 | devj | Cocoa is great. |
| 07:37.29 | SpencerNeitzke | I have heard of it, I need to learn all of this |
| 07:37.52 | devj | I feel bad for all the people who are going to wake up to all of our notifications. |
| 07:37.59 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:38.03 | votick | Haha, you're right! |
| 07:38.15 | devj | Poor GCI admins…. ;) |
| 07:38.18 | votick | Spencer, should join the #globeofgeek irc with us :) |
| 07:38.22 | votick | Just to be the cool-crowd. |
| 07:38.24 | devj | Do it. Now. |
| 07:38.45 | votick | *woah woah, put away the weapon, Dev!* |
| 07:38.53 | SpencerNeitzke | lol |
| 07:39.08 | devj | I always keep one in the chamber.... |
| 07:39.17 | devj | If you know what I mean... |
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| 07:40.46 | Ashish1010 | I have uploaded my stuff till what time will my account be approved ??? |
| 07:41.09 | SpencerNeitzke | Just click home. You're done |
| 07:41.34 | devj | Now you can pick tasks. It might take a long time to get approved for the task, however. |
| 07:41.43 | devj | As demonstrated by most of us in here. |
| 07:41.44 | votick | Yeah... sheesh. |
| 07:42.15 | Ashish1010 | There are Soo many tasks which to do first ?? |
| 07:44.20 | votick | Uh yeah. |
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| 07:44.33 | votick | Which company are you working under? |
| 07:46.03 | devj | I would suggest something you want to do. Have a passion for. |
| 07:46.19 | Ashish1010 | I claimed a task and now how to and where to upload it ?? |
| 07:47.41 | Ashish1010 | Hello !!!! |
| 07:47.57 | devj | They need to approve it, first. |
| 07:48.17 | Ashish1010 | ??? |
| 07:48.22 | darkapex | Ashish1010, after approval upload it on the task page itself. |
| 07:48.33 | Ashish1010 | Oh OK !! :) |
| 07:48.38 | Ashish1010 | Whats ur task ?? |
| 07:49.07 | darkapex | Documenting an howto: dualboot netBSD |
| 07:49.30 | Ashish1010 | Same here Partitioning in netBSD !! |
| 07:49.50 | darkapex | how is it going? |
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| 07:55.02 | Ashish1010 | Well just joined it waiting for approval !! |
| 07:58.57 | Ashish1010 | How much time is usaually taken for approval ?? |
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| 10:50.07 | ambarpal | what is chris leonard(mentor)'s nickname? |
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| 11:03.20 | Ashish101 | there are soo many netBSD downloads like netBSD sun, netBSD acorn etc which one to download ?? |
| 11:03.26 | Ashish101 | !!!help guys !! |
| 11:04.40 | MatthewWilkes | Ashish101: Ask your mentors |
| 11:04.50 | mgv | Ashish101: ask in #netbsd-code |
| 11:05.01 | Ashish101 | how by commenting ?? |
| 11:05.05 | MatthewWilkes | Ashish101: In general, though, you'll want to download the one that matches the computer you're using |
| 11:05.24 | MatthewWilkes | Use netBSD sun if you're on a sun, use netBSD acorn if you're on an acorn, etc |
| 11:05.27 | mgv | Ashish101: join #netbsd-code and ask there. That's their official channel on freenode. |
| 11:05.39 | Ashish101 | kk |
| 11:06.24 | Ashish101 | i386 thanks guys :) |
| 11:06.32 | Ashish101 | any one of u finished ur task ?? |
| 11:07.25 | mgv | Ashish101: well, I did finish a few tasks, but they were very easy ones |
| 11:07.46 | mgv | Ashish101: very easy == they took about 10 to 15 minutes each |
| 11:08.19 | Ashish101 | :( i am stuck on the first to create a guide on netbsd partionioning and some other thingi |
| 11:09.56 | Ashish101 | anyone else finishd it ???? |
| 11:10.22 | mgv | Ashish101: you can always unclaim that task and claim another if you don't like it |
| 11:10.37 | mgv | Ashish101: there's no need to do something you don't want to do |
| 11:11.13 | Ashish101 | No i have started working on it and now theres no turning back !! i have read all instructions on the OS saw vedios |
| 11:11.23 | Ashish101 | now downloading it |
| 11:11.29 | Darrel | mgv - are you the one with the Wiki tasks? for Sugar? |
| 11:11.32 | mgv | oh, ok |
| 11:11.41 | mgv | Darrel: yep |
| 11:11.55 | mgv | Darrel: they were the easiest ones |
| 11:11.58 | Darrel | I was in shock yesterday when I saw how many tasks you have done already, haha |
| 11:12.14 | mgv | Darrel :) |
| 11:14.39 | mgv | Darrel: I don't know why they split the wiki cleanup like that. There should have been at most 2 wiki cleanup tasks, to match the difficulty / work required level of their other tasks |
| 11:15.09 | Darrel | Yeah.. It really looks it should have been like that |
| 11:15.13 | Darrel | Are they all done now? |
| 11:15.32 | mgv | almost |
| 11:15.38 | mgv | there are still two more |
| 11:15.43 | mgv | but they are externally claimed |
| 11:15.56 | mgv | i.e. somebody did them without claiming them first |
| 11:16.03 | Darrel | oh :D |
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| 11:23.08 | Ashish101 | How r the winners choosen if they r chosen on the basis of tasks then !!!! :mgv you are winning it !!! |
| 11:23.23 | mgv | Ashish101: not exactly |
| 11:23.29 | mgv | Ashish101: from what I've read |
| 11:23.51 | mgv | Ashish101: the mentors choose two winners from the top 5 participants by number of tasks |
| 11:24.25 | Ashish101 | saw and u have lots of tasks under you !!!! |
| 11:24.55 | mgv | Ashish101: yes, that is true. However, if the mentors don't want to give me the grand prize, they won't |
| 11:25.09 | Darrel | But they chose 2 participants per organization |
| 11:25.13 | Ashish101 | Ha ha :P |
| 11:25.16 | mgv | Ashish101: also, this is just day 2 of the contest |
| 11:25.22 | Ashish101 | Right !! |
| 11:25.24 | Darrel | so we should be worried about mgv only if we are working with Sugar :D |
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| 11:25.45 | mgv | Darrel: yes. I won't do tasks from other organizations |
| 11:26.02 | Darrel | Yeah, it's logical :) this way the chances are highest |
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| 11:27.15 | mgv | Darrel: what organization are you working for? |
| 11:27.25 | Darrel | Copyleft Games Group |
| 11:27.59 | mgv | Darrel: and what is your current task there? |
| 11:28.21 | Darrel | I just finished my first task, but I still haven't marked it as complete, because the mentors went to get some sleep :) |
| 11:28.32 | Darrel | it was making an "About" dialog for SweetSoy |
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| 11:28.54 | Darrel | the hard thing was actually building sweetsoy, there are tons of dependencies |
| 11:29.22 | mgv | Darrel: hmm... I'm wondering what are the dependencies for sugar... |
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| 11:29.50 | Darrel | it's built on a Fedora core, if I'm not mistaken.. |
| 11:29.51 | mgv | Darrel: I'll probably start working on some sugar coding tasks later today |
| 11:30.01 | Darrel | good luck :) |
| 11:30.59 | mgv | Darrel: thanks. I don't think you actually need fedora, since I have sugar as a group of packages in debian |
| 11:31.30 | Darrel | well, yes, I think they have all the dependencies packed there.. |
| 11:31.46 | Darrel | but with SweetSoy... well, let's say it's a bit of a mess :) |
| 11:32.10 | mgv | Darrel: hmm... |
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| 11:32.20 | mgv | Darrel: $ aptitude install education-desktop-sugar |
| 11:32.36 | mgv | Darrel: 0 packages upgraded, 292 newly installed, 0 to remove and 0 not upgraded. |
| 11:32.47 | mgv | Need to get 167 MB/167 MB of archives. After unpacking 538 MB will be used. |
| 11:32.55 | mgv | that's a lot of dependencies! |
| 11:33.50 | mgv | not to mention that this install breaks 6 other packages |
| 11:35.24 | Darrel | lol |
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| 12:25.36 | cjl | I thought only one task at a time could be clained. I have what appears to be the same user with two tasks claimed. |
| 12:25.52 | Ashish101 | Cool HOW ?? |
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| 12:26.02 | Ashish101 | @ cjl |
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| 12:26.07 | cjl | madrazr: Do you know how tha could happen? |
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| 12:27.22 | cjl | oops, I guess not, the second task is still open, but somehow their question about ht efirst task got posted t othe wrong place. |
| 12:28.31 | Nickolaiski | Hi I 've got question about my task |
| 12:30.51 | cjl | Nickolaiski: Standard IRC etiquette is to ask a question, DO NOT ask permission to ask a question. No one can read your mind, so spit it out. |
| 12:31.36 | cjl | Then you need to wait to see if someone has an answer. |
| 12:35.33 | Nickolaiski | Ok my task is to inster teks from txt file in xls .The text is from dictionarry and i want to know where exactly i don t have to write anything and if my pdf is correct because i have 3 pages which are empty or with a single row |
| 12:36.01 | Nickolaiski | or i have problems with reading of the PDF |
| 12:36.24 | mgv | well |
| 12:36.37 | mgv | have you looked over the exampel? |
| 12:36.39 | mgv | example* |
| 12:36.43 | mgv | Nickolaiski: ^ |
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| 12:38.02 | mgv | Nickolaiski: this is the example: http://wiki.sugarlabs.org/go/File:Batch-cni-dict-01.zip |
| 12:38.34 | gevaerts | suspects project-specific discussions would be better at home in project-specific channels |
| 12:38.52 | mgv | agrees with gevaerts |
| 12:38.57 | mgv | Nickolaiski: join #sugar |
| 12:39.16 | Nickolaiski | your channel |
| 12:39.17 | Nickolaiski | ? |
| 12:39.30 | mgv | Nickolaiski: not "my" channel |
| 12:39.36 | mgv | Nickolaiski: sugar's channel |
| 12:42.56 | cjl | Nickolaiski: The PDF is correct, the original 456 page version had three blank pages there. You posted your question about 2OCR 27 of 46 t othe ticket for t13 of 46, whci hmakes it hard to match up. |
| 12:44.03 | cjl | A reply was given on the ticket for OCR 27 of 46 to the question you asked on OCR 13 of 46. |
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| 16:25.36 | Bidik-- | Any ide what does this error mean? https://www.facebook.com/ajax/messaging/attachment.php?attach_id=2a3fc58e997e264ac6c9f86903103c86&mid=id.133199546832015&hash=AQA84NBKy3qRWOfK |
| 16:25.39 | Bidik-- | idea* |
| 16:25.55 | Bidik-- | the student could not register and have no idea what this URL id is ... |
| 16:26.30 | MatthewWilkes | Bidik--: URL id is desired username |
| 16:27.03 | Bidik-- | ok... thanks did saw that :P |
| 16:28.38 | Bidik-- | didn't expect to see this much interest with the students from Macedonia, so in this organisation mess the siplest things like this look like a big mountain :P |
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| 16:52.47 | juanje | hi there? |
| 16:53.17 | juanje | any mod on? |
| 16:54.47 | MatthewWilkes | juanje: If you have a question then just ask it, but it's likely that it's already covered in the FAQ |
| 16:54.51 | MatthewWilkes | if not, we can probably help |
| 16:55.06 | MatthewWilkes | it's only very specific problems that actually need the attention of the programme administrator |
| 16:59.23 | Varun | Any mentor Sahana here? |
| 17:00.16 | mgv | Varun: join #sahana and ask there |
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| 17:01.10 | Varun | I tried, both #sahana & #sahana-eden but no one is there |
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| 17:03.23 | ashwyn | Hi Varun ! Who are you searching for at sahana-eden? |
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| 17:04.15 | Varun | I am searching for a mentor to review my task |
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| 17:05.15 | ashwyn | Robby is there I guess |
| 17:09.11 | MatthewWilkes | Varun: If they're not in their own channel what makes you think they'd be here? |
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| 17:23.52 | juanje | Guys, I've got a question, how many papers do I need from my school as the Enrollment form? with one of the three listed there is okay, or do I need the three of them? |
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| 17:25.25 | JordiGH | detects Mexican with 80% probability. |
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| 17:27.54 | JordiGH | After some Bayesian analysis, my posterior is now Spaniards with 95% probability. |
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| 17:50.56 | brlcad | instead of this being a list with a status we can sort on, it would be effective to have them presented as FIFO queue's that we can work through |
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| 17:53.59 | brlcad | e.g., go to a "waiting for a response" queue, on top is a task needing review |
| 17:54.05 | brlcad | review it and there'd be a next button to take me to the next pending review, so on |
| 17:54.48 | brlcad | a request to claim a task comes in and it'd get pushed on to the top of the stack, new completions appended to the bottom |
| 17:56.47 | brlcad | that way we could tackle tasks in priority order instead of each mentor doing their own thing manually |
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| 17:57.46 | brlcad | another golden feature: put a button in the e-mail to accept claims! |
| 17:59.12 | Catfish_Man | brlcad: ewwww html email |
| 17:59.46 | brlcad | ehm, they're already text/html encoded |
| 17:59.59 | brlcad | put the url, I don't care |
| 18:00.51 | brlcad | it already puts a url to the task, just needs to be another/different url to accept it with one click |
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| 18:50.43 | Zargy | Make up your mind! |
| 18:51.44 | carols | Zargy: no need to yell, we can all hear you. |
| 18:51.49 | carols | serves some tea and cookies |
| 18:52.36 | |Kev| | Why thank you. |
| 18:52.38 | |Kev| | munches |
| 18:52.45 | carols | you're quite welcome, |Kev| |
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| 18:55.03 | Varun | Yippee two task completed. One more to go. |
| 18:55.35 | |Kev| | I almost regret being a ~=generation too old for GCI, it seems like quite a lot of fun. |
| 18:56.13 | meflin | I just regret being old :) |
| 18:56.28 | |Kev| | Oh, I'm not old. Just too old for GCI ;) |
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| 18:57.33 | YeyaSwizaw | Ah! I nearly missed tea and cookies! |
| 18:58.57 | carols | YeyaSwizaw: close call there :-) |
| 18:59.02 | carols | kai: you around? |
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| 19:08.36 | Darrel | System admins - just to notify you, after completing my first task, I got an email... with outdated information |
| 19:09.05 | Darrel | http://prntscr.com/kqqzi |
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| 19:32.42 | votick_ | Hey everyone, Kyle here! |
| 19:32.59 | votick_ | I'm sitting in pschology class right now, so I better focus on stuff. Couldn't help but join irc though. |
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| 20:48.48 | brlcad | bug: if we reply to a comment, write a nice detailed message and hit submit, it takes us back to the task view and our reply is lost, no error message is displayed |
| 20:49.27 | brlcad | (the error is that you HAVE to also put a title, but then I can't even back-button to re-add it nor am I told that's the problem) |
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| 20:52.34 | sttaylor | brlcad: I have sent an email to the Melange team to see if they can fix the bug |
| 20:53.17 | brlcad | sttaylor: thank you -- should I keep filling out http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/entry ? |
| 20:58.11 | brlcad | too late: http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=1660&thanks=1660&ts=1354049877 :) |
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| 21:05.32 | ccondon | Hey |
| 21:08.22 | allman | hi |
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| 21:12.16 | ccondon | Is there a leaderboard for google codein? |
| 21:12.29 | allman | no, not this time. |
| 21:12.40 | ccondon | Will there eventually be? |
| 21:13.25 | allman | no, the quality of the involvement with an org matters and can't be easily qualified onto a leader board. |
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| 21:14.41 | ccondon | Okay, thanks for the information. |
| 21:14.42 | DrJoel | would be curious to see a live count of tasks completed :) |
| 21:14.51 | DrJoel | N students have completed X tasks |
| 21:14.52 | ccondon | +1's |
| 21:15.20 | DrJoel | I don't know if that is worth the trouble to implement, encouraging, discouraging, etc. |
| 21:16.17 | sttaylor | DrJoel: wouldn't that be the same as a leaderboard? : ) |
| 21:16.37 | DrJoel | no names.. just a count.. like 1B burgers served |
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| 21:16.59 | DrJoel | I don't know who ate how many. :) |
| 21:17.35 | sttaylor | DrJoel: I see. Well we have had an amazing number of students already sign up to participate so this should be a gangbusters year |
| 21:18.02 | DrJoel | we already ave our first submission of code changes :) |
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| 21:18.48 | DrJoel | I will be back on after I reboot :) |
| 21:19.25 | brlcad | allman: the caliber of students and more impressively their level of social maturity (and technical ability) is really surprising us |
| 21:20.47 | allman | That's great! You made my after lunch food coma roll right back ;-) |
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