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00:18.10ejlsHey! Can we update our proposal after submiting it?
00:18.44mmadiayes, up until the deadline.  after that, you can still communicate via comments.
00:20.18ejlsOk, thanks. :)
00:20.51mmadia!edit | ejls
00:20.52gsocbotejls: "edit" is Students can edit proposals up until the application deadline. Mentors can allow students to edit proposals on a case-by-case basis after the deadline. Note that comments on proposals can _not_ be edited after submitting.
00:21.07mmadiaseems there's a factoid. :)
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00:22.11ejlsgsocbot: you're a good bot.
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00:34.10meflinhuh you can't edit coments?
00:34.58Fatbagbut can't you just add another comment to make corrections?
00:35.25meflinwell I've never comented on the system so I"m not sure how those are used
00:36.53meflinI would hate to comment on a initial proposal where I misunderstood then that coment makes it look bad later when I was wrong/or fixed my issue
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00:38.11meflininteractively working with I've always put a lot of stock in
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00:44.39meflinI dont want a student to look bad if i blast them and the learn stuff and prove me wrong
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00:47.39harlanhey AmberJ
00:48.05AmberJHello harlan and everyone
00:51.57harlan<PROTECTED>
00:52.47harlanIt should not be difficult to express yourself in a way that is simply disagreement.
00:54.35meflinblat might be a bit strong :)
00:54.58meflinin previous years my job was to the the "not nice once" .. this year .. well as admin can't do that
00:55.27meflinprevious years all my "blasting" was on irc in /msg
00:58.26meflinmy projects dynamics may also be quite unique
00:59.03meflinthe not nice part is used for project lead and mentors
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03:31.15harshit14can someone please direct me to the twitter irc channel for gsoc, if it exists? Thanks
03:31.53Catfish_Manwhat is a twitter irc channel?
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03:35.38MatthewWilkesCatfish_Man: I guess a channel for discussing twitter applications?
03:35.56MatthewWilkesharshit14: No, we can't, but I'm sure there is contact info on the pages for the org you want to apply for
03:37.03harshit14MatthewWilkes: No, all that they have mentioned is the twitter page of the mentor
03:37.36MatthewWilkesharshit14: That sounds like contact info to me
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04:26.01seed_Hi All, although I am not a student currently, I shall be one starting Fall 2012, and have already received an admission letter. Could you please let me know if I am eligible to apply as a student to Google Summer of Code 2012?
04:26.22FatbagYes, you are
04:26.39Fatbagas long as you are admitted to the school by April 21st
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04:27.23seed_I am already admitted, but the classes only start in August (Fall semester)
04:27.54FatbagJust admitted is fine. you just need to be able to supply Google with proof that you've been accepted
04:28.15Fatbaghttps://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2012/faqs#student_eligibility
04:29.13seed_great!
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04:29.39seed_I guess I am already late, will get started, missed the discussion period with participating organizations..
04:30.45ChrisOelmuellerif you do focus on getting things done until friday, that's still fine. but delaying that communication any further is not advisable ;-)
04:34.53seed_thanks
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04:36.50seed_I want to use skype for im
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04:37.08seed_any idea what is the "Im network" for skype?
04:41.20klocatelliI think you can just put skype
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04:49.31seed_#postgresql
04:49.44seed_okay
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05:39.18felipevieira!next
05:39.20gsocbotfelipevieira: "next" is Apr 6 19:00 UTC - Student application deadline.
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06:17.58jzteinhi
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06:19.05jzteinhow detailed do projects expect "Implementation Details" to be?
06:21.35ChrisOelmuellerhave you tried asking your organization?
06:21.43tomprince!itdepends | jztein
06:21.43gsocbotjztein: "itdepends" is That depends on the organisation. Ask them.
06:21.48ChrisOelmuellerthere usually are guidelines to follow which are different for each org
06:22.07tomprinceIt may also very depending on the particular project.
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06:28.31jzteinokay thanks.
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06:29.36kblinin general "Magic happens, and then the code will work." is not a sufficient level of detail
06:29.42kblin;)
06:30.01jzteinhaha
06:30.26Catfish_Mankblin: well, unless that actually is your implementation strategy, and you can provide a small demo ;)
06:31.00kblinCatfish_Man: touchée :)
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08:11.28quantumfrostHi, should I enter my home address or my uni address in the address field? I'll be staying at home during the summer.
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08:13.47SukhEquantumfrost: Enter that address where you want the package to be delivered.
08:14.00SukhEs/package/packages
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08:14.43quantumfrostThere are separate fields for shipping address
08:15.24quantumfrostIs the provided address used for anything other than that?
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08:15.52SukhEIf your home address is different from your shipping address, fill the latter. Else leave it blank.
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08:16.53quantumfrostThanks, I'll just fill my home address then.
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08:35.00harshit14if i post my gsoc proposal on the melanege site today, can i make changes/updates/additions to it until the last date i.e. 6th April?
08:35.44aksharany buddy please tell me why the actual utl is appending at the end of google melange when i am inserting a link in my proposal
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08:35.56aksharharshit14: absolutely
08:36.23harshit14akshar, thanks
08:36.57aksharharshit14: never mind, which organization you are applying for
08:37.52aksharany buddy please tell me why the actual utl is appending at the end of google melange when i am inserting a link in my proposal
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08:39.51jaspreet838hi
08:40.30jaspreet838can avybody tell me is there any project related to latex in any organisation?
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08:41.40jaspreet838hello
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08:43.14jaspreet838please tell me is there any project related to laTeX in any organisation?
08:45.47weltalli don't think we can really help you. documentation projects aren't allowed so sorta you would have only things like latex generators/importers/exporters. you might want to look at orgs doing something related like graphics editors, textual editors, ...
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08:47.21jaspreet838ye i want like that
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08:48.41jaspreet838do you know abot these type of projects
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09:27.22Filaraghisla: o/
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09:27.32Filarboom1992: o/
09:27.50harshit14akshar, open suse and meadiwiki
09:28.05aksharwhy
09:28.23harshit14akshar, why means?
09:29.26aksharharshit14: why do u want me to opent that
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09:30.07harshit14akshar, sorry? u asked why am i applying to open suse nd mediawiki :P
09:31.07aksharharshit14: i never asked you this, I ask you which organization u are applying for
09:31.26|Kev|!polls | akshar
09:31.27gsocbotakshar: "polls" is Please don't use #gsoc to do polls.
09:31.28harshit14ya, applying to openSUSE nd mediawiki
09:32.12harshit14akshar, sorry i thought ur "why" after my comment was directed to me
09:32.34aksharharshit14: k good submitted the proposal
09:33.06harshit14no not yet, have to make a few changes, will submit later today...how about u?
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11:22.39arch2012HI
11:23.04arch2012Hi erveryone. I want to konw if the projects proposal are the  final projects?
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12:16.23nickonarch2012, of course they are :)
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12:41.15suyogp_while submitting i am getting melange server error..what to do?
12:41.21suyogp_500  Internal Server Error Click here to return to the homepage >
12:41.30suyogp_this type of message is coming
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12:56.06suyogp_i posted right proposal in description box but it came different after submitting
12:56.08suyogp_help
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13:09.20tomprincesuyogp_: Try asking in #melange
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14:26.23solardizis my understanding correct that students are now able to edit their already-submitted applications, until the april 6 deadline? and that they will be able to do so after the deadline and until the student selection deadline if explicitly permitted by org?
14:26.30solardiz(i vaguely recall that it was that way last year)
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14:27.39tomprinceYes. But don't count on the later.
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14:29.13solardiztomprince: thanks. i don't currently see an "allow edits" checkbox or whatever in Melange; i _guess_ one will appear after april 6. but we won't count on it as you suggest.
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14:31.11Phitherek_I see, that there are some people, that have taken part in previous editions of GSoC. I am here for the first time and I want to check, if I understand everything correctly before I even start to do something for it. Can you help me?
14:32.37solardizPhitherek_: you'll need to ask more specific questions
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14:35.37Phitherek_How much knowledge do I have to have before I start watching for a project, where they write, for example, C and GTK+ skills? And can I learn during the GSoC?
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14:37.14Phitherek_I mean, if I had some experience with writing simple programs in C and GTK+, will it be enough to apply?
14:37.19solardizPhitherek_: different orgs have different expectations even when they write that they require similar skills (like in your example). you'll need to ask them.
14:37.53Phitherek_Thank you, solardiz.
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14:38.31solardizPhitherek_: one org might primarily want to gain a long-term contributor and be willing to help you learn, another might primarily look to get the given task done, etc.  and this might vary by task you're applying for as well.
14:39.33dhaunPhitherek_: I'd say GSoC is not the place to learn a programming language, and some projects require more skills than others, but other than that, learning during GSoC is pretty much normal
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14:40.11solardizPhitherek_: i don't mean that the other org wouldn't be willing to help you learn, but the balance between getting useful code written vs. helping the student learn may differ between orgs and tasks.
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14:42.43solardizPhitherek_: one thing you may do is try to demonstrate (to a specific org and for a specific project) your ability to learn new things quickly during the remaining time before student selection deadline. just start work on the task.
14:43.11Phitherek_I do not expect the mentors to help me learn the skills - I will try to learn it on my own, by reading docs, references etc. I mean - will they expect me to provide the advanced code from the start or can I start from more basic things and learn the advanced skills at that time?
14:43.44solardizPhitherek_: like i said, it varies. there's no universal answer for all orgs and tasks.
14:44.23Phitherek_So is it better to ask the communities of the organizations?
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14:44.30solardizPhitherek_: definitely
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14:46.05Phitherek_And I' ve read that contact with the community and some contribution BEFORE applying is a good thing to do...
14:47.12solardizPhitherek_: sure, and after applying as well
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14:48.21Phitherek_And is it better to talk directly to the mentor of the project, that seems interesting to me, or to the whole community?
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14:49.19tomprincePhitherek_: Typically things in open source are done publicly, and often on a volunteer basis, so best send to the community as a whole.
14:50.17tomprinceSo, for example, question you have can then be answered by anyone who can answer, rather than limiting who can answer.
14:50.37kolyaflashPhitherek_, I support tomprince  opinion.
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14:50.53solardizPhitherek_: i second tomprince' advice. we usually ask potential contributors who contact us privately to post to the right project's development mailing list instead.
14:51.41tomprinceOn the other, follow the lead you get there. So if you get a private response, follow up to at least that in private.
14:53.07Phitherek_Thank you all for help. One more question: As I am on my first year of studies and I have quite a lot of work there. And in May, when the coding actually starts, I will have an exam session (a hard one). Will I have enough time to do both GSoC and studies? I mean, how much time it takes at the very start (of course, on holiday I can sit and code)?
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14:54.19kolyaflashPhitherek_, 4 hours by day is minimal imho
14:54.47tomprinceWell, the biggest thing is to be up-front about other commitments you have.
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14:55.37tomprinceGSoC is expected to be a full-time job.
14:56.15Phitherek_Yeah, I' ve read it somewhere.
14:56.23tomprinceBut it is up to the org, and they are likely to be somewhat flexibile.
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14:57.59Phitherek_Thank you for all your help, solardiz, tomprince and kolyaflash.
14:58.43kolyaflashPhitherek_, good luck
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14:58.53akshaya4rCan somebody with no experience in open source coding do the project successfully ?
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14:59.34codeoclockakshaya4r: Presumably yes, as long as you have experience in working on features for large projects.
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15:01.45akshaya4rhmmm. Not much with that either. Just our university level coding. But i believe i'm good with it. And i have a love for programming
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15:02.41dhaun!amigoodenough | akshaya4r
15:02.41gsocbotakshaya4r: "amigoodenough" is http://en.flossmanuals.net/GSoCStudentGuide/ch003_am-i-good-enough/
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15:06.35akshaya4rThanx.
15:07.07akshaya4rJust wanted to know if any beginner ended up successful
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15:11.46Jasrajanyone from ASCEND?????
15:13.47tomprince!anyone | Jasraj
15:13.47gsocbotJasraj: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here>
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15:35.22rmpHello!
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15:45.05kolyaflashrmp, hi
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15:53.33hunterhectorHI, first time to IRC
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16:35.17ximionhi! If you apply for more projects, how can you choose which one you will do this summer?
16:35.51ximionDoes Google allow only one project and chooses a project for you from your applications, or do you get accepted for more projects and choose then by yourself?
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16:39.23tomprinceximion: The organisation weill decide among themselves. They will taken into account any preference you have indicated, but aren't required to follow it. (It depends on what other candidates there are for various projects in both orgs). The underlying assumption is that you'd be willing to do any of the projects you have applied for.
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16:41.20ximiontomprince: ...meaning that the organisations say "well, there are 3 applicants for project X, one of them applied for project Y which only has one applicant, so projects X tells project Y to accept the student"?
16:41.50tomprinceximion: Something like that yes.
16:41.52ximionmeaning that I would get accepted for one of the projects I applied for?
16:42.03ximionokay, good :)
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16:42.53tomprinceWell, that is assuming your application is selected by both organizations.
16:43.28thebolthi
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16:51.16Gentlecatso orgs can see how many applications I submitted, right?
16:52.03tomprinceThey can see any application you send to them. I'm not sure if they can see totals.
16:52.22tomprinceIf you get accepted by multiple orgs, they will learn of that.
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16:55.23ximiontomprince: this all only applied *if* I get accepted, of course :P
16:55.41ximionbut it's better to know what happens then, helps avoiding problems
16:56.00ximion(I was a bit confused how the process of sending multiple applications works)
16:56.05braverockthen the orgs that accepted you work it out w/ google
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16:56.52tomprincegoogle doesn't really get involved, unless the orgs can't work it out among themselves.
16:57.30tomprince(as I understand it)
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16:58.18braverockwell, there's a conference to work it out.  google is there
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16:59.17braverocktypically, one question that gets asked is 'do you have another qualified candidate for this project too?  if one org says yes and the other says no, then the second org will get the student who's been multiple-accepted, and the first will take their other applicant
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17:00.00dhaunbraverock: the IRC meeting is only the last resort - orgs get alerted of duplicates before and can work it out, erm, peacefully :)
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17:00.58braverockright, I know.  if peaceful working out is possible, it often runs along the lines I described above
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18:09.24bantuHi everyone. When will we know how many slots we get?
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18:09.43bantuI haven't found that info in the timeline.
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18:11.24mmadiaiirc, after the student application period ends.
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18:11.57ChrisOelmuellerthe preliminary numbers will be assigned at about that time, yep. you know for sure after the deduplication meeting, which should be listed in the timeline
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18:13.31mmadiahere's a thread from last year, which may be useful :  http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-mentors-list/browse_thread/thread/3734e35163a16668/95b2064fb1245c8d
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18:16.43bantuthanks
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19:05.49dreimarksomeone from london area here?
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19:13.18AlexPwhy?
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19:27.03macobowhew.
19:27.14macoboFirst draft of proposal done. :)
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19:28.09robertcurtisI'm still "shopping"
19:28.52robertcurtisEvery time I find a project that sounds perfect for me, I find something that convinces me that I am in way over my head.
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19:29.50macoborobertcurtis: I think it would be a great idea to mark those projects down and at least try to apply somewhere. If you weren't over your head somehow, you wouldn't be learning. :)
19:30.09macobonevertheless, good luck finding a great project.
19:30.20|Kev|robertcurtis: *Some* amount of "Uhm, I don't know exactly how I'll do that" is expected. If you really feel completely in over your head, maybe you are, but I wouldn't expect everything to be clear 3 months in advance.
19:30.31robertcurtisThanks
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19:40.48ecretHi gents.  I am mentoring a project, someone asked if people who are graduating in a month can still apply
19:41.25dhaunecret: that's addressed in the FAQ
19:41.45ecretshaun : ok i will take another look
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19:43.06ecretahh april 25, thanks
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19:44.01akshathi, I am applying as a student. I want to know if i add some comment on my proposal will that be informed to mentors automatically
19:44.34ecrethey dhuan, i think faq should be changed to april 25, 2012
19:44.37ecretit is set to 2011
19:44.50ecretahh i suck, disregard
19:44.52gevaertsakshat: that depends. Getting notifications is optional
19:45.14akshatok
19:45.16ecreti googled gsoc rules, it shows 2011 faq, disregard
19:46.29dhaunecret: http://www.google-melange.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2012/faqs#middle
19:46.34dhaunApril 23, 2012
19:46.36ecretyes, i found
19:46.53ecretjust initially google results gave 2011 link, i noticed url eventually
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19:47.01ecretconfusing they show old faq's still
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19:47.58budiliis here someone from the ASF ??
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19:48.41meflin!anyone | budili
19:48.41gsocbotbudili: "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. Try searching for the org's contact info or even just try a /join #<mentoring org here>
19:50.23budiliok, sorry
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20:22.21vernonhello! I have question about applying to this program.
20:22.53tomprincevernon: Just ask your question. (Don't ask to ask).
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20:24.59vernonOnly students can apply for Summer of Code, and in my country I had to apply to get accepted into a university till February 15th, and I will know if I got accepted by July 15th. Can I still apply for summer of code, if it's only 100% sure by that date that I can enroll in September?
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20:26.51scorchevernon: you need to be accepted into or enrolled in a college or university program as of April 23, 2012
20:27.05scorcheif you are not, then you are sadly, ineligible
20:29.29vernontoo bad
20:29.30vernon:D
20:29.39vernoni will apply next year then
20:29.41vernonthanks
20:30.59scorchesure - until next year!  ;)
20:31.03budilihello, where becomes the students proposals? Google or the organizations?
20:31.13ChrisOelmuellervernon: you can always contribute to open source projects outside of gsoc!
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20:31.41ChrisOelmuellerand this will also help you with next year's application, should google run a gsoc 2013
20:31.56vernonI hope they will!
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20:33.18ChrisOelmuellerjust reach out to any open source team and offer your help [if it's a mentoring org this year, you may want to wait a few days since they're swamped with reviewing applications right now]
20:33.58|Kev|+1
20:34.01tomprincebudili: The propsals need to be submitted to google-melange.com. The orgs will decide which ones they want to accept, within the limits of the number of slots assigned to them by google.
20:34.04|Kev|<-- Absolutely shattered.
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20:34.40budilitomprince: okay, thanks
20:35.14vernonchris: I got interested in developing the Battle for Wesnoth game. It's hard to imagine how a group works with 100+ devs who only communicate online. And I'm also interested to see how the actual language and the embedded scripting language should work together in a game. They had a project with that
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20:37.18ChrisOelmuellervernon: yeah i've seen that earlier tonight :) just idle in their channel a  bit more, get to know others, report a bug, start with a small task and you'll see things develop from there
20:37.30MatthewWilkesvernon: Conferences are very useful for that, meeting someone in person helps to understand them online
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20:37.53MatthewWilkeswith a few Plone developers I can hear their tone of voice in lots of their IRC messages ;)
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20:41.26sonney2kdoes anyone know when the number of slots for organizations is announced?
20:42.26ChrisOelmuellersonney2k: announced? when the accepted students are
20:43.04vernonokay thanks for the tips everyone, see ya
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20:43.09ChrisOelmuellerthings can change between the application review deadline and that point basically
20:44.08tomprinceInitial allocation will probably happen shortly after applications close.
20:44.11sonney2kChrisOelmueller, well if one would want to accept 10 students but gets only 5 slots one has to do another ranking - so I remember from last year that the number of slots was fixed before one could accept students
20:44.54MatthewWilkessonney2k: The ranking doesn't decide what students get accepted
20:45.12MatthewWilkessonney2k: You have to select that it should be accepted
20:45.22ChrisOelmuellerthere's a preliminary number which is assigned after you got to review your proposals a bit, yes, but that's not exactly "fixed". you have to flip "accept" to yes for these applications anyways
20:45.25ChrisOelmuellerwhat MatthewWilkes said
20:45.26MatthewWilkessonney2k: That UI becomes available when you have a provisional number of students
20:45.44MatthewWilkessonney2k: Then, if/when it changes you update it to add or remove some people
20:46.26sonney2kI know that I have to manually accept students at some stage - my concern is only when.
20:46.30MatthewWilkessonney2k: But, the number of slots you have can change right up until a few minutes before the deadline, thanks to waitlists
20:46.51sonney2kMatthewWilkes, so somewhen after Apr 6 I guess :)
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20:47.41MatthewWilkessonney2k: Before the deduplication meeting, then maybe again before the real deadline
20:47.57MatthewWilkessonney2k: There will be a lot of emails about it
20:48.39sonney2kMatthewWilkes, OK thanks ...
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20:49.09sonney2kI am only asking because I am worried that #slots doesn't match #extraordinary student proposals
20:49.23sonney2kbut yeah that's the game I guess
20:51.03ChrisOelmuellerit usually doesn't (in both directions) but you should also consider mentoring capability and so on, not only the amount of students you'd love to work with
20:51.23dhaun!slots
20:51.23gsocbotdhaun: "slots" is (#1) Slot allocation is done manually by Chris DiBona and Carol Smith, be a good org, play nice on the mentor list and #gsoc, ask for a non-crazy-high number of slots, and you'll probably get what you ask. Note that non-crazy-high for new orgs is around 1 or 2., or (#2) http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/NotesonStudentAllocations
20:52.05sonney2kahh great - that is the info I was looking for :)
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20:52.15gevaertsWell, it isn't really
20:52.40gevaertsThat's almost certainly not *wrong*, but...
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20:54.37ryaoIs the GSoC open to graduate students in China?
20:55.00MatthewWilkes!eligibility | ryao
20:55.00gsocbotryao: "eligibility" is Follow this handy flowchart to see if you are eligible http://goo.gl/kvCSv (text version at http://goo.gl/ImfNT)
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20:55.37ryaoMatthewWilkes: Thanks, but it isn't for me. I have a student in China that wants to do my idea.
20:55.53MatthewWilkesryao: Okay, that makes it a little more complicated
20:55.55gevaertsryao: I don't see China on the list of excluded countries, so unless the age limit or enrollment condition kick in, yes
20:56.00MatthewWilkesryao: You see in the flowchart where it says 'you'?
20:56.07MatthewWilkesReplace that with 'your student'
20:56.22ryaoThanks.
20:56.40gevaertsryao: also replace the date of birth in there
20:56.48MatthewWilkesryao: The other condition is that it's okay with the org
20:56.48gevaertsWell, all dates
20:56.52budiliryao: also students from china can participate from GSoC
20:57.15MatthewWilkesryao: As you can add additional constraints, so it's worth checking with the org admin, as your organisation could have its own legal restrictions
20:57.18gevaertsThat flowchart hasn't been updated for this year
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20:57.46ryaoMatthewWilkes: I will. Thanks. :)
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22:48.56kalabalikHi everybody!
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22:50.58MatthewWilkesHi Dr. Nick!^W^W kalabalik
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22:56.07kalabalikI have a question regarding how to approach an organization. I would like to apply with my own project idea. There are about four organizations in the list which operate in the vicinity, so to speak, of my project idea. Should I go ahead and ask them if they could imagine mentoring the project I will be proposing? Should I do this informally, that is without a full project outline and a cv? Thanks for your advice!
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23:04.42isaacbwkalabalik, try and pop in to IRC or join the mailing list and ask if it is an idea worth pursuing
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23:10.20jordan`8~par
23:10.26jordan`oops
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23:17.08ojwbdoubts the approach of "have an idea, then try to find an org" works at all well
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23:40.05arg3tlamQuestion: while submitting an application, 'project title' and 'short description are self-explanatory'
23:40.19arg3tlamthe 'content' is by default filled with the organisation template
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23:40.36arg3tlamwhere do we write in the details regarding the project ?
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23:41.35arg3tlamCan anyone help me out? Thanks. :)
23:43.55neenaarg3tlam: In the 'Content' text area
23:43.57MatthewWilkesarg3tlam: In content, you're expected to fill in the template
23:45.09arg3tlamOk, but the questions in the template are supplementary questions like "what previous work have you done", etc. Not pertaining directly to the details of the present project.
23:45.15arg3tlamSo where do I fill in the latter ?
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23:50.27neenaarg3tlam: Maybe your organization's template expects you to implicitly understand that you must fill in the project details there. That is where you are supposed to fill the project details.
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