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| 00:17.05 | soh_cah_toa | hey guys, this is my first gsoc and i need a little advice |
| 00:17.13 | soh_cah_toa | once the list of organizations is posted should i apply for one project or is it kinda like college where it's a good idea to apply for several? |
| 00:17.29 | pygi | apply for one, if you're 100% you'll get in :) |
| 00:17.57 | carols | soh_cah_toa: it's up to you. but one quality application and a good relationship with the community is worth a lot more than 20 mediocre applications you just submit blindly |
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| 00:18.37 | pygi | you cna bribe people with cookies |
| 00:18.40 | pygi | that's what I do every year |
| 00:18.43 | soh_cah_toa | i suppose you're right. i guess that's why i'm here. to get to know you guys |
| 00:18.44 | pygi | and I always get accepted :p |
| 00:19.12 | soh_cah_toa | cookies? what if they have cookies blocked? |
| 00:19.28 | ojwb | don't submit 20, maybe consider a 2nd one though |
| 00:19.29 | carols | soh_cah_toa: it's wonderful having you here, but what you really want to do is start talking to the specific community of people you're interested in working with in *their* IRC channel and on *their* mailing lists |
| 00:19.43 | ojwb | the most compelling applications I've seen were the student's only application though |
| 00:20.04 | pygi | soh_cah_toa: I send out real cookies :p |
| 00:20.21 | soh_cah_toa | haha, i know. that was a geek joke |
| 00:20.57 | soh_cah_toa | man, i'm nervous. i feel like i got a big job interview coming up |
| 00:21.05 | pygi | its not that hard =) |
| 00:21.12 | pygi | if they accepted me, anyone can get in xD |
| 00:21.45 | soh_cah_toa | haha |
| 00:22.04 | pygi | I'm serious xD |
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| 00:22.50 | soh_cah_toa | well did you have any prior work experience before gsoc? b/c i don't, just writing code for my own pleasure. that's why i'm nervous |
| 00:23.05 | pygi | yea sure I did, but still :P |
| 00:23.23 | pygi | soh_cah_toa: one of my students did only uni-level programming before joining gsoc |
| 00:23.29 | pygi | today he's one of the best developers I know |
| 00:23.33 | pygi | (that was few years ago) |
| 00:23.40 | carols | soh_cah_toa: the not so secret way to get accepted to gsoc is to get to know the people and help them out before you apply. they want to see you're motivated and interested in them, not the money |
| 00:23.40 | soh_cah_toa | really? that's encouraging |
| 00:24.33 | soh_cah_toa | well since the 2011 list isn't up until saturday should i look at last year's list? |
| 00:24.49 | ojwb | most orgs are likely to be looking at the whole package - mad coding skills are useless if the student doesn't communicate or the mentor isn't engaged |
| 00:25.39 | soh_cah_toa | ojwb: yeah, looks like that's what most people are saying. looks like i got some mingling to do :) |
| 00:26.11 | ojwb | yeah, do that |
| 00:27.03 | ojwb | if the first and only contact is an application submitted two minutes before the deadline, you'll probably get beaten by someone who's been talking to use for weeks |
| 00:27.55 | gangil | do people submit 2 min before deadline? |
| 00:28.23 | ojwb | yes, there's always a last minute rush |
| 00:28.25 | gangil | I mean what quality would it have, it would be equal to null |
| 00:28.32 | ojwb | sometimes they aren't bad |
| 00:28.42 | gangil | hm... |
| 00:28.46 | ojwb | but if you submit early most orgs will give you feedback and you can improve it |
| 00:29.24 | ojwb | and that process allows us to get a feel for how it'll be to work with you |
| 00:29.26 | anth | yes, that's best. we try hard to provide useful feedback on early submissions, and i think that's the norm. |
| 00:29.29 | gangil | I am going with two orgs, hope they get selected :) anyways their projects really interests me |
| 00:29.43 | pygi | which ones? |
| 00:30.02 | ojwb | I've heard a few orgs just get too many applications to give feedback, but certainly the ones I've been involved with do |
| 00:30.16 | soh_cah_toa | that's good |
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| 00:33.27 | soh_cah_toa | thanks for the advice guys. i'm feeling a little more confident about gsoc. |
| 00:33.40 | soh_cah_toa | i'm gonna head off and take care of some homework. bye |
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| 00:35.19 | tty1 | well if i am to beleive this fortune cookie i just got, we will be accepted into GSoC this year "A good letter is on its way to you" :) |
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| 00:37.31 | tty1 | does google use fortune cookies as official com,munications? :) |
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| 00:50.30 | anth | yes, but be warned: the service is still in beta. |
| 00:51.48 | tty1 | anlol |
| 00:52.30 | tty1 | anth lol |
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| 01:29.12 | mlankhorst | oo yay |
| 01:29.26 | lassi | Hi |
| 01:31.31 | mlankhorst | that gsoc 2010 tshirt will save me for st patricks day |
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| 01:36.01 | thebolt | morning |
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| 10:18.59 | greeniekin_ | I was wondering who reviews and accepts students applications. Is it the organisation or is it people at google? |
| 10:19.15 | pygi | mentors in organizations |
| 10:19.58 | greeniekin_ | thanks for the quick reply |
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| 11:43.19 | manik | is eagerly counting down to the mentor org announcement |
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| 11:56.35 | |Kev| | manik: I'm trying to largely not think about it. |
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| 11:58.13 | greeniekin_ | not that long untill untill student application deadline. i havn't even ironed out how everything will be implemented for one application and i was planning to submit 2 |
| 11:59.46 | ojwb | greeniekin_: it's a little early to stress - I bet most students won't even have started to think about what to apply for yet |
| 12:00.16 | ojwb | but definitely good to be ahead of the crowd in this case |
| 12:00.37 | |Kev| | Good to plan, but save stressing for later :) |
| 12:00.42 | |Kev| | (Or never, life's too short) |
| 12:00.52 | greeniekin_ | yes thats true |
| 12:00.52 | ojwb | argh! life's too short! |
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| 12:01.25 | greeniekin_ | you blink and you've aged 10 years |
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| 12:09.47 | manik | Damn, life's short? No one told me⦠|
| 12:09.55 | manik | crap, I'm not 19 anymore!! |
| 12:10.51 | greeniekin_ | lol |
| 12:10.54 | mlankhorst | so.. manik are you wearing green? |
| 12:12.49 | manik | mlankhorst: heaven forbid |
| 12:13.03 | rizzo | lol |
| 12:13.08 | mlankhorst | *pinches in arm for st patricks day* |
| 12:13.10 | mlankhorst | there ya go |
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| 12:14.39 | gevaerts | lives in a place that doesn't care much about St. Patrick's day |
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| 12:15.27 | mlankhorst | neither here, but the part of wearing green sorta carried over in my geek circles :P |
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| 12:17.11 | sfb | I got my totally awesome GCI shirt yesterday. |
| 12:17.18 | sfb | Should I post on the mailing list? |
| 12:17.28 | ojwb | slaps sfb |
| 12:17.32 | sfb | ahhah |
| 12:17.34 | ojwb | wearing mine now! |
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| 12:18.57 | greeniekin_ | o i was so excited to find out i would find out gsoc orgs tommrow. turns out it will be 6am on sat >< |
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| 12:19.50 | aghisla | last year i woke up in middle of the night to check list of accepted students :) |
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| 12:20.55 | mlankhorst | aye, wearing my gsoc 2010 tshirt for st patricks day, only other green shirt i had was xkcd ;p |
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| 12:21.52 | gevaerts | greeniekin_: that's your own fault for living in the wrong place! |
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| 12:25.05 | sfb | haha |
| 12:25.08 | sfb | !next |
| 12:25.09 | socinfo | sfb: "next" is Friday, March 18 - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 12:25.16 | sfb | Oh, it doesn't have the time. |
| 12:25.57 | ojwb | i think the time was added to the timeline since |
| 12:26.03 | ojwb | 1900 UTC isn't it? |
| 12:26.06 | sfb | Yeah, its on the timeline page. |
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| 12:26.27 | sfb | ojwb: Yup. |
| 12:26.33 | ojwb | socinfo: learn next as Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 12:26.33 | socinfo | ojwb: The operation succeeded. |
| 12:26.37 | ojwb | socinfo: forget next 1 |
| 12:26.37 | socinfo | ojwb: The operation succeeded. |
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| 12:29.26 | greeniekin_ | gevaerts, lol yes that is true. i should move to england or something |
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| 12:30.16 | greeniekin_ | !next |
| 12:30.16 | socinfo | greeniekin_: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
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| 12:30.37 | ojwb | believe it or not, it hasn't changed since I set it 4 minutes ago |
| 12:30.38 | greeniekin_ | thats really cool. i wasn't aware this had a bot for that |
| 12:31.04 | greeniekin_ | ojwb, yah i know. i just wanted to try it for myself |
| 12:31.58 | greeniekin_ | anyway goodnight. i have to get up in6.5 hours and go to work>< |
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| 12:42.23 | LeoBH | Does anyone know how flexible the dates are for when coding starts and ends? My summer term ends on 20th June, a good month in based on the official timeline... |
| 12:42.40 | |Kev| | Ends is non-negotiable forwards. |
| 12:42.52 | |Kev| | You must have must have stopped coding by the published end date. |
| 12:43.08 | |Kev| | Earlier dates you can probably negotiate with an org. |
| 12:43.14 | MatthewWilkes | LeoBH: Make that clear in your application and state how you will interact with the community before hand and how you will make sure you have enough time. Also include a strict timetable so the org knows you take keeping up to date seriously |
| 12:43.32 | |Kev| | You can probably write in your application that this happens, but offer to start a bit earlier to make up, or something. |
| 12:43.37 | |Kev| | Oh, right, what MatthewWilkes said :) |
| 12:43.40 | LeoBH | Ah, I was rather afraid of that |
| 12:44.21 | MatthewWilkes | LeoBH: If you agree with the mentoring org that you'll work for a month later and you're an good student that keeps to his deadlines I doubt it'd be a problem |
| 12:45.10 | MatthewWilkes | you need something useful by the final date, it doesn't have to be finished |
| 12:45.57 | thebolt | hi MatthewWilkes , how's things going today? |
| 12:46.00 | ojwb | well, you can certainly keep coding after the end date |
| 12:46.01 | LeoBH | MatthewWilkes, that sounds like a reasonable compromise. The difficulty I have is with exams in the week beginning 13th June, but I would hope to have time to make contributions before then |
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| 12:46.18 | ojwb | but you work for the purposes of GSoC will be judged on what's done by the end date |
| 12:47.03 | MatthewWilkes | LeoBH: Sure, we understand that (for the most part), but for us to remain happy we'd still expect you to be talking on mailing lists a bit |
| 12:47.06 | |Kev| | Students rarely (IME) completely finish their projects by pens-down. I think they should expect to stick around to see the code integrated etc. |
| 12:47.38 | |Kev| | Just that Pens-down is when they must Be Judged. |
| 12:47.53 | LeoBH | MatthewWilkes, of course. I fully intend to carry on contributing after the official deadline as well - indeed, the next term doesn't begin until the middle of October, and I would hope to become a regular contributor anyway |
| 12:48.00 | |Kev| | If you've put in a bit of work previously (during community bonding or whatever), orgs are sympathetic creatures. |
| 12:48.40 | MatthewWilkes | LeoBH: Ok, make sure you say that and that you show them you're enthusiastic |
| 12:48.50 | MatthewWilkes | LeoBH: May I ask who you're hoping to work with? |
| 12:49.01 | |Kev| | Long-term contributer is the best possible outcome for an org :) |
| 12:50.00 | LeoBH | MatthewWilkes, I'm interested in working on Perl 6, having used Perl 5 extensively in a work placement a couple of years ago |
| 12:50.39 | LeoBH | |Kev|, undoubtedly! |
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| 13:13.57 | MatthewWilkes | How on earth am I getting away with playing an album called "20 years of electronic avant-garde" at work? |
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| 13:14.47 | |Kev| | Haha. |
| 13:15.08 | |Kev| | I can get away with playing most things at work. |
| 13:15.12 | |Kev| | Hoorah for home working. |
| 13:15.17 | MatthewWilkes | ah, maybe I'm not |
| 13:15.20 | MatthewWilkes | "What ARE we listening to? |
| 13:15.31 | mlankhorst | can get away with a tons of games at work :P |
| 13:15.36 | MatthewWilkes | The guy shouting "and MURDER, and MURDER, and MURDER" etc must have done it |
| 13:15.38 | mlankhorst | hooray for crossover games \o/ |
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| 13:45.36 | surex | !next |
| 13:45.37 | socinfo | surex: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 13:45.44 | dotnick | \o/ |
| 13:46.10 | surex | :) |
| 13:48.37 | spectre | :D |
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| 13:59.02 | nic_ | hai friends |
| 13:59.19 | surix16 | hi |
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| 13:59.43 | nic_ | well .. tomorrow big day.... |
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| 14:00.11 | |Kev| | 24 hours, same as the rest :) |
| 14:00.25 | surix16 | an someone tell utc 1900 in Indian Standard Time? |
| 14:00.29 | surix16 | Can* |
| 14:00.46 | |Kev| | Google can. |
| 14:00.46 | ravenlock | +530 I thought |
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| 14:01.26 | ravenlock | yup. +530 :) |
| 14:01.41 | nic_ | yup utc+5:30 |
| 14:01.43 | m0nhawk | utc is a gmt on greenwich |
| 14:02.04 | |Kev| | UTC is almost the same as GMT, yes. |
| 14:02.07 | nic_ | yup utc+5:30 gives ist |
| 14:02.13 | surix16 | k |
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| 14:06.47 | dberkholz | surix16: http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedform.html |
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| 14:19.26 | surix16 | dberkholz: thanks :) |
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| 14:30.47 | sfb | MatthewWilkes: Try playing some Angerfist at work. |
| 14:31.01 | sfb | MatthewWilkes: That'll end your music-playing work days really quickly. |
| 14:31.48 | MatthewWilkes | I'm gonna try some combichrist |
| 14:32.57 | MatthewWilkes | how long will it last, I wonder |
| 14:33.23 | thebolt | MatthewWilkes: you who work for a norwegian company surely know that the norwegian death metal scene used to be pretty hm.. active ;) |
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| 14:33.53 | MatthewWilkes | thebolt: But I work in Berlin with germans |
| 14:34.10 | MatthewWilkes | no offense to Germans, but they're not very tolerant at times ;) |
| 14:34.17 | thebolt | MatthewWilkes: i am sure they will also appriciate Gorgoroth and others :P |
| 14:34.35 | thebolt | (i don't :P) |
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| 14:35.16 | MatthewWilkes | thebolt: Do you know combichrist? |
| 14:35.53 | thebolt | MatthewWilkes: not really, no |
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| 14:52.52 | MatthewWilkes | took 17 minutes |
| 14:53.01 | |Kev| | Good show. |
| 14:53.07 | atekinalp | hey |
| 14:54.39 | MatthewWilkes | hi atekinalp |
| 14:56.12 | atekinalp | ı'm from turkey and ı develop free software application |
| 14:56.21 | atekinalp | can u speak anything gsoc? |
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| 14:56.54 | MatthewWilkes | atekinalp: I'm sorry, I don't understand? If you mean can we answer your questions, we don't know until we hear them. |
| 14:57.36 | atekinalp | ok |
| 14:59.03 | atekinalp | ı learch some info for google of summer code can you suggest any free software application |
| 14:59.47 | MatthewWilkes | atekinalp: The list of participating organisations won't be released until tomorrow evening, it's probably best to wait until then and look at the list |
| 15:00.11 | atekinalp | ok thanks ... |
| 15:00.46 | MatthewWilkes | you can try searching for organisations that were accepted last year, but that's no guarantee |
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| 15:07.05 | tty1 | gets excited for friday |
| 15:07.16 | tty1 | man its not even friday yet and im uber excite d:) |
| 15:07.20 | tty1 | friday will be rough! |
| 15:07.30 | koda | !next |
| 15:07.31 | socinfo | koda: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 15:07.48 | koda | 19 utc, what time is CET? |
| 15:08.12 | tty1 | koda, dont you knwo your GMT +/- ? |
| 15:08.22 | MatthewWilkes | 20:00 CET |
| 15:08.26 | nonreviad | CET is UTC+1, Google tells me |
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| 15:08.35 | koda | cet = gmt + 1 |
| 15:08.39 | koda | iirc |
| 15:08.45 | MatthewWilkes | Although, remember Europe goes into daylight savings on sunday |
| 15:08.57 | tty1 | koda, then add 1 :) |
| 15:09.25 | tty1 | MatthewWilkes, thats after friday :) |
| 15:09.34 | tty1 | unless europe reordered the week days too :) |
| 15:09.34 | MatthewWilkes | tty1: But before the next deadline |
| 15:09.52 | MatthewWilkes | so don't just remember "UTC + 1" the whole time |
| 15:09.57 | tty1 | MatthewWilkes, no its not, Friday, saturday, sunday... sunday is after friday |
| 15:10.15 | MatthewWilkes | tty1: The deadline after friday, genius⦠|
| 15:10.38 | tty1 | MatthewWilkes, oh, well he asked about friday :) |
| 15:10.59 | MatthewWilkes | and I said it was before the next one |
| 15:11.12 | tty1 | MatthewWilkes, no biggie dude |
| 15:11.13 | aghisla | daylight saving! argh, i forget about it every 6 months |
| 15:11.41 | thebolt | koda: gmt is retired as timebase long time ago |
| 15:11.57 | |Kev| | GMT lives! |
| 15:12.32 | tty1 | thebolt, not really considering most people know their gmt +/- and use it to calculate their timezone adjustment... seems to live on rather strong |
| 15:12.42 | MatthewWilkes | |Kev|: If we try the moving to CET again it might properly died |
| 15:12.48 | koda | but utc = greenwich time? |
| 15:12.55 | |Kev| | tty1: Those offsets are from UTC, not GMT. |
| 15:12.59 | |Kev| | koda: Almost exactly. |
| 15:12.59 | MatthewWilkes | currently they're defined as the same, yes |
| 15:13.15 | koda | ah cool |
| 15:13.24 | koda | then gmt+0 = utc |
| 15:13.28 | koda | easy enough |
| 15:13.29 | tty1 | |Kev|, not really the offset applies to both gmt and UTC, but its a moot point regardless |
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| 15:15.28 | MatthewWilkes | No, it's not, as GMT isn't fixed |
| 15:15.33 | MatthewWilkes | it has changed before and it may change again |
| 15:16.00 | MatthewWilkes | For part of the 70's it was the same as BST |
| 15:16.01 | thebolt | no, GMT+0 and UTC are not equivalent |
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| 15:16.11 | gevaerts | The time changes continuously! |
| 15:16.42 | tty1 | well that just means that when they redefine it then it will no longer be the same, but for now (And possibly forever) they are |
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| 15:17.03 | |Kev| | tty1: They won't redifine it. |
| 15:17.08 | |Kev| | Ergh, typing. |
| 15:17.18 | MatthewWilkes | ⦠|
| 15:17.28 | |Kev| | GMT'll still be GMT, just with a different offset :) |
| 15:17.41 | thebolt | when you want to be exact the whole time reference thing et kind of complicated |
| 15:17.44 | MatthewWilkes | After two talks on this advanced subject at the mentor summit they're still getting me. |
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| 15:18.07 | thebolt | you have UT0, UT1, UT1R, UT2, UT2R and UTC, which all are time bases ;) |
| 15:19.03 | gevaerts | sees that it's not dark outside, so it must be daytime |
| 15:19.12 | gevaerts | Nobody needs more precision than that! |
| 15:19.36 | thebolt | gevaerts: i have no way of seeing if it is dark or light outside.. |
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| 15:20.03 | gevaerts | thebolt: In that case, your time base is Schrödinger Standard Time! |
| 15:20.27 | thebolt | gevaerts: i trust my ntp-synched computer & phone to give me a somewhat correct time ;) |
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| 15:22.23 | |Kev| | I feel this needs someone to exclaim "You trusting fool!" and start cackling. |
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| 15:25.10 | sfb | I tried to make an NTP joke at work. |
| 15:25.24 | sfb | "Matt, why were you late to the 9 am meeting?" |
| 15:25.34 | sfb | "I used nist.gvo.com instead." |
| 15:25.59 | |Kev| | Man, they must have been killing themselves with laughter :) |
| 15:26.04 | sfb | Nope. |
| 15:26.27 | sfb | But I suppose your rheterical sarcasm didn't require an unnecessary "nope." |
| 15:26.27 | sfb | haha |
| 15:26.48 | sfb | rhetorical too. |
| 15:27.06 | MatthewWilkes | I loved the stories of the people testing their Y2K compliance but forgetting they're an NTP server |
| 15:27.07 | |Kev| | I like rheterical. A cross between rhetorical and hysterical. |
| 15:28.08 | sfb | hahah |
| 15:28.36 | gevaerts | MatthewWilkes: surely that's just large scale testing then? |
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| 15:28.55 | sfb | gevaerts: No, we made the same mistake where I worked. |
| 15:29.01 | sfb | gevaerts: We set the system clock ahead |
| 15:29.09 | sfb | gevaerts: Fired up the server software. |
| 15:29.17 | sfb | gevaerts: And then basked in the glorious lack of crashes. |
| 15:29.27 | sfb | gevaerts: Someone goes, "that's strange, the software fixed the time in the OS." |
| 15:29.33 | gevaerts | sfb: it may be *unintended* large scale testing, but it's still large scale testing :) |
| 15:29.41 | sfb | gevaerts: One of the engineers says "no you idiot, the OS used NTP to fix the time." |
| 15:30.28 | gevaerts | sfb: what OSes blindly trust large jumps from an ntp server? |
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| 15:38.28 | sfb | gevaerts: NT using the WinTime crap |
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| 15:44.02 | MatthewWilkes | carols! |
| 15:44.08 | carols | MatthewWilkes! |
| 15:44.15 | mlankhorst | carols! |
| 15:44.18 | mlankhorst | Are you wearing green? |
| 15:44.19 | carols | mlankhorst! |
| 15:44.29 | carols | looks at her clothing |
| 15:44.34 | carols | uhhh...looks like not |
| 15:44.36 | mlankhorst | *pinches your arm* |
| 15:44.38 | mlankhorst | there ya go :D |
| 15:44.48 | carols | yeah, I guess I saw that one coming |
| 15:44.56 | mlankhorst | :P |
| 15:45.15 | carols | I am, however, making brown bread and guinness and beef stew - does that count for anything? |
| 15:45.30 | mlankhorst | well i wont pinch you twice :x |
| 15:45.36 | MatthewWilkes | I'm wearing teal, does that count? |
| 15:45.41 | carols | i appreciate that, mlankhorst :-) |
| 15:45.42 | MatthewWilkes | mhm |
| 15:45.45 | MatthewWilkes | no, more like olive |
| 15:45.49 | MatthewWilkes | that definitely counts |
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| 15:46.40 | MatthewWilkes | There are so many irish people wandering around town at the moment, I think about half are escaping and half are having a foreign piss-up |
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| 15:48.20 | thebolt | hi carols |
| 15:48.24 | carols | hi thebolt |
| 15:48.40 | carols | you're up late/early |
| 15:48.48 | thebolt | late, yes.. soon midnight ;) |
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| 15:56.37 | carols | trundles off for breakfast |
| 15:56.46 | carols | serves tea and coffee in the meanwhile |
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| 16:00.01 | dberkholz | surix16: np, that website is really useful for converting to/from utc times |
| 16:00.11 | dberkholz | surix16: there's another page where it just shows the current time in utc and other timezones |
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| 16:06.25 | surix16 | dberkholz: yeah :) |
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| 16:18.23 | surix16 | dberkholz: Hi.. just now read your blog about "7 problems gsoc admins encounter". Its a nice post :) |
| 16:19.40 | surix16 | dberkholz: but comments are closed :( |
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| 16:24.33 | hc | comments are overrated ;) |
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| 16:25.47 | sfb | I was at said summit session. |
| 16:25.50 | sfb | Good post. |
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| 16:27.06 | aakriti | !next |
| 16:27.06 | socinfo | aakriti: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 16:27.22 | surix16 | In 6th point...For the first, target non-accepted students from previous years (Reject gently!). Means once not got selected..then less chance for next year !!! |
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| 16:27.37 | surix16 | sfb: dberkholz ^^ |
| 16:28.10 | gevaerts | surix16: huh? |
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| 16:28.35 | surix16 | gevaerts: Reject gently, ??? |
| 16:28.42 | gevaerts | Yes |
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| 16:29.54 | gevaerts | If you reject gently ("Your proposal was nice, but unfortunately we had so many proposals that it didn't make the cut"), people will me more likely to apply again next year than if you reject harshly ("That's rubbish! Go away!") |
| 16:30.04 | Xeli | I'm still a bit confused, is the point of GSoC to have students come up with idea's, or have organizations come up with them? or both? ;o |
| 16:30.11 | gevaerts | Xeli: both |
| 16:30.58 | Xeli | gevaerts: but if a students comes up with an idea, chances are organizations will only pick those students who's idea's can be of 'use' to them? |
| 16:31.05 | *** join/#gsoc surix16 (~surex@49.203.62.101) |
| 16:31.07 | gevaerts | Organisations have an ideas list (but students who use those will have to interpret those and expand on them), and students can propose something |
| 16:31.30 | eoc | if you can convince somebody of the organization to mentor your own idea, that's very well okay |
| 16:31.46 | Xeli | I see, thats clarifies it for me :) thanks |
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| 16:32.07 | surix16 | gevaerts: but most of the students improve for the second time |
| 16:32.15 | gevaerts | surix16: yes, exactly |
| 16:32.31 | eoc | surix16: I think you misread that line. |
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| 16:33.05 | surix16 | eoc: misunderstood, I think |
| 16:33.17 | eoc | the "reject" part is meant for the year before, not the current application of a student that got rejected earlier |
| 16:33.29 | eoc | but if you reject in a harsh way, students won't come back |
| 16:34.50 | anth | or stick around. we've rejected students we liked (limited number of slots and all that) and had at least one stick around and do his project anyway. |
| 16:35.18 | sfb | Xeli: OpenNMS when they participated ~3 years ago had about a half-and-half ratio between ideas students composed themselves and ideas based on those provided by the project. |
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| 16:36.19 | |Kev| | sfb: That sounds pretty high. Much higher than we get, anyway. |
| 16:36.50 | sfb | |Kev|: My first year mentoring with WF I think all of our students used the projects ideas. |
| 16:37.25 | sfb | |Kev|: But OpenNMS had this "new web" theme so we had a guy who wanted to make Flex app and another guy who wanted to do like Google Maps integration or something like that. |
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| 16:38.26 | sfb | |Kev|: Should I be accepted under Ryzom Core I'll be (and have been, we've had a few potential students come on IRC) encouraging students to think of fresh ideas of their own. |
| 16:39.04 | *** join/#gsoc SITZ (~chatzilla@115.111.52.227) |
| 16:39.13 | |Kev| | I don't think we actively encourage students to think of their own ideas much. |
| 16:39.28 | SITZ | hi |
| 16:39.29 | |Kev| | We're not opposed to it if they come up with a good idea, but we don't push them to do so. |
| 16:40.26 | sfb | |Kev|: Well with RC we focused on a lot of the things we need for the platform (tools and such) and not so much on the core stuff like gameplay. So I suggested that if they have gameplay ideas they think fit then to feel free to propose that. |
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| 16:41.21 | SITZ | today the lists of organizations are going to be out, right ? |
| 16:41.36 | carols | SITZ: tomorrow |
| 16:41.40 | sfb | Tomorrow, 1900 UTC |
| 16:41.42 | carols | don't scare me like that :-P |
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| 16:41.54 | sfb | carols: Surprise, all of us decided to change the time on you. (; |
| 16:41.57 | SITZ | aah.. right :) |
| 16:42.26 | carols | sfb: yeah, good luck with making that actually happen :-) |
| 16:42.29 | sfb | haha |
| 16:42.44 | sfb | carols: You mean repeating something out loud doesn't eventually make it true? |
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| 16:43.21 | carols | sfb: unfortunately, no. not in this case at least. since, well, I'll publish the list of orgs when I'm done with it and not a minute before :-) |
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| 16:44.29 | DrLou | sfb: No, printing it 3 times, does, though! |
| 16:44.45 | DrLou | Hey Carols, am interested in this whole GSoC thing... |
| 16:45.00 | DrLou | Universities and Open Source projects only, more or less? |
| 16:45.39 | DrLou | Must a mentoring person/organization be at a discrete physical site? |
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| 16:46.09 | Triskelios | DrLou: maybe you should read the FAQs... |
| 16:46.17 | carols | DrLou: um, I'm unclear on if you're asking because you're a student or representing an org. if you're representing an org the application deadline has already passed. |
| 16:46.21 | Triskelios | the application deadline was a week ago, anyway |
| 16:46.51 | DrLou | Thanks, all... Am reading through websites and FAQs as we speak... |
| 16:46.58 | DrLou | Bye! |
| 16:48.00 | |Kev| | sfb: Yes, in the case of games I can see much merit in getting ideas in from outside. |
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| 16:49.33 | eoc | we structured some of ideas to provide a starting point and then, when students got to know our codebase and gameplay, they are open to head in any direction they think is helpful |
| 16:49.43 | eoc | some of our* even |
| 16:51.01 | sfb | |Kev|: Well, if I'm accepted we'll find out if it's a foolish idea. (; |
| 16:51.21 | sfb | |Kev|: But the two potential students are players and wanted to "scratch an itch" |
| 16:51.33 | sfb | |Kev|: That seems like a good motivator. |
| 16:52.03 | sfb | eoc: Which game are you with? |
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| 16:56.41 | |Kev| | sfb: Yeah. Don't get me tempted to join in :p |
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| 16:59.01 | sfb | |Kev|: Why wouldn't I tempt you to join? Are you trying to warn me? |
| 16:59.02 | sfb | hahah |
| 16:59.24 | sfb | "Don't solicit to me, I'm a terrible student." |
| 17:02.33 | |Kev| | No, "Don't solicit me to play even more games, I have little enough time to code as it is" |
| 17:03.19 | |Kev| | I tried Ryzom many many years ago, back in beta. |
| 17:03.57 | |Kev| | http://www.kismith.co.uk/wordpress/index.php/2004/09/10/the-saga-of-ryzom/ |
| 17:06.03 | eoc | sfb: Unknown Horizons |
| 17:06.08 | eoc | sorry for the delay |
| 17:06.47 | |Kev| | eoc: What mainstream commercial game is that most like? |
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| 17:07.15 | |Kev| | Looks vaguely Civvish from the sshots. |
| 17:07.26 | eoc | possibly anno / a.d. series if you played that |
| 17:07.32 | |Kev| | Ah, right. |
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| 17:07.51 | |Kev| | You mean it promised multiplayer on the box, you buy it because of that, and then you find out they didn't include it? :) |
| 17:07.58 | |Kev| | s/sed/ses/ |
| 17:08.16 | eoc | heh, that was still the best game of it though :) |
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| 17:10.01 | |Kev| | Is UH multiplayer? |
| 17:10.34 | eoc | yep, we promise and feature it |
| 17:10.47 | |Kev| | Good. If it's missing, I'll want my money back. |
| 17:11.09 | eoc | although there's a slight backdraw, you currently can't do much there. one of our larger ideas is implementing a combat system ;-) |
| 17:11.20 | |Kev| | Heh. |
| 17:11.24 | eoc | no money back, we'll patch it :P |
| 17:11.24 | |Kev| | That applies to SP too? |
| 17:11.42 | |Kev| | Ok, I have no prior reason to not believe that statement. |
| 17:11.55 | |Kev| | Wait a minute... |
| 17:11.55 | |Kev| | :) |
| 17:11.59 | eoc | :> |
| 17:12.21 | eoc | given that another task is to create a settlement AI, you can probably imagine my answer |
| 17:12.39 | |Kev| | Maybe I won't give it a go *quite* yet :) |
| 17:12.46 | *** join/#gsoc Vermeille (~SirSiata@LLagny-156-34-48-187.w193-252.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 17:12.54 | Vermeille | Hail everybody :) |
| 17:12.58 | eoc | we focused on the economy side as a start, and that part is quite advanced |
| 17:13.08 | eoc | start being several years. :| |
| 17:13.21 | |Kev| | I'm familiar with that problem :) |
| 17:14.07 | Vermeille | Hey, does somebody know if a french student could participate at the gsoc ? |
| 17:14.20 | eoc | but I'd say the gameplay so far is quite solid, you can maintain large settlements over three increments |
| 17:14.46 | *** join/#gsoc iamaregee2 (~iamaregee@118.102.186.1) |
| 17:14.55 | eoc | which is why we head out for students that want to help implementing exciting new features </ad> :-) |
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| 17:15.32 | |Kev| | If I were I student, I'd be tempted. |
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| 17:19.00 | |Kev| | eoc: There, downloading. I am not amused at this attempt at distraction :p |
| 17:19.21 | eoc | thanks, I'd possibly also be. now hoping that we can offer it in the first place (-. |
| 17:19.45 | |Kev| | I'm not a student, so offering it for GSoC is largely irrelevant to me. |
| 17:19.52 | eoc | heh that was why I hesitated to put our name in here, I'm so sorry :( |
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| 17:20.25 | |Kev| | You don't have downloads for Mac, I notice. |
| 17:21.05 | Vermillion | guys, I am interesting about the gsoc but there is apparently a huge problem, and I don't know if google acknowledges it : the gsoc starts in the school test period |
| 17:21.51 | eoc | |Kev|: we lack a developer on mac, yeah. we have a manual to compile it if there are *really* interested people, but we can't provide releases currently. maybe this will change with the next one though |
| 17:22.04 | carols | Vermillion: we know. we can't accommodate everyone, I'm sorry. |
| 17:22.17 | |Kev| | eoc: How difficult is that? |
| 17:22.33 | |Kev| | eoc: If it's not too hard, I could run off a one-off build for you so you've at least got *something*. |
| 17:22.54 | |Kev| | Less inclined if it involves weeks of effort and half the known world in dependencies :) |
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| 17:24.05 | eoc | Vermillion: if you are open about this in your application (make sure to ask the organization beforehand) and offer to do some extra work, it can still turn out well |
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| 17:24.35 | eoc | |Kev|: for the dependencies, nobody knows, we haven't had mac users for some months now. looking for our manual currently |
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| 17:25.27 | eoc | might I query you for that? going a bit off-topic in here |
| 17:25.38 | |Kev| | Yeah, guess it is (sorry everyone) |
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| 17:26.26 | iamaregee | hey I 've been learning python lately with the help of official docs .... any 1 can suggest me some good books for python... |
| 17:26.51 | Vermillion | carols, eoc : thx :) Is there any geographic limitation for the application ? I live in France and someone told me that the gsoc isn't "avalaible" here, but this person wasn't sure |
| 17:27.09 | carols | Vermillion: um, available? it's online. :-) do you have internet access? |
| 17:27.38 | |Kev| | Vermillion: You have to be elligible to work in the country in which you'll be residing. That's about it. |
| 17:27.52 | Vermillion | obviously :) |
| 17:29.35 | m0nhawk | Vermillion: i knew people who participate in GSoC from Russia |
| 17:31.19 | Vermillion | Obviously I have an internet connection, very very slow (150 ko/s max), but I have :) |
| 17:31.24 | eoc | there's a (small) list of countries where google isn't allowed to have business contracts such as iran or north korea iiuc |
| 17:32.34 | entith | Vermillion: According to the FAQ, the only countries who's residents can't participate are Iran, Syria, Cuba, Sudan, North Korea, and Myanmar (Burma) |
| 17:33.26 | Vermillion | okay, I attend a conference yesterday, and someone was saying that french can't participate, and it sounded very odd |
| 17:34.16 | Vermillion | (sorry for my english, far from perfection) |
| 17:37.13 | |Kev| | Vermillion: They were simply wrong. |
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| 17:39.13 | Vermillion | Good :) And what's the minimal level to have ? |
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| 17:39.57 | eoc | Vermillion: http://www.booki.cc/gsocstudentguide/_v/1.0/am-i-good-enough/ |
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| 17:44.27 | Vermillion | nice ! I have some game programming experience, and general programming, i might get by :) |
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| 17:45.12 | eoc | the whole book is surely worth a read by the way ;-) |
| 17:45.51 | Vermillion | I do :p |
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| 17:54.06 | entith | what would be the minimum number of hours you'd need available per week to be able to practically work on a GSoC project? |
| 17:54.21 | carols | entith: you should treat it as a full-time job. so 40 hours/week. |
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| 18:03.12 | anitamp | ha |
| 18:03.36 | anitamp | oops wrong window :) |
| 18:03.58 | Vermillion | Thx =) I'll see the list of participating organizations tomorrow, good bye and thanks again :) |
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| 18:19.30 | Nightrose | |Kev|: dberkholz: we still have that antipattern doc... sorry i had zero time for it :( |
| 18:19.40 | Nightrose | we should probably get it done sometime soon before gsoc really starts |
| 18:19.48 | |Kev| | Nightrose: Right - I did put a few points onto it. |
| 18:20.08 | Nightrose | yeah i saw |
| 18:20.10 | Nightrose | thx |
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| 18:20.38 | |Kev| | Certainly could do with a touch more work though :) |
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| 19:00.27 | orion21 | is the list of participating organizations available? |
| 19:00.51 | |Kev| | !next |
| 19:00.51 | socinfo | |Kev|: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 19:00.55 | gevaerts | orion21: it will be 24 hours from now |
| 19:01.18 | gevaerts | Almost exactly :) |
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| 19:02.29 | orion21 | acc to US time? |
| 19:02.45 | |Kev| | 24 hours from now is pretty universal, regardless of time zone. |
| 19:03.11 | gevaerts | Well, global anyway. I don't know what "24 hours" means on Mars |
| 19:03.43 | orion21 | In India it is 18 already |
| 19:03.53 | orion21 | was sort of waiting |
| 19:04.01 | gevaerts | Yes, but the deadline is the 18th at 19:00 UTC |
| 19:04.14 | gevaerts | *Not* the 18th, somewhere |
| 19:04.17 | dhaun | learning about timezones is also important for GSoC :) |
| 19:05.01 | schumaml | gevaerts: Robert L. Forward's "Martian Rainbow" deals with that |
| 19:05.08 | hackyyy | I put UTC clock on my desktop for easy timing :D |
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| 19:06.34 | schumaml | getting rid of locale time zone names could be a worthwhile effort |
| 19:06.39 | schumaml | -e |
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| 19:07.47 | jairo | hi |
| 19:07.51 | schumaml | utc-5 and utc+2 can easily be shortened to "I'm in -5, you?" "+2" |
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| 19:34.13 | nishant | what are my chances of being selected as a student if i have mostly engineering background? |
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| 19:35.20 | nishant | is anyone there? |
| 19:35.40 | dotnick | nishant: may I suggest http://www.booki.cc/gsocstudentguide/_v/1.0/am-i-good-enough/ |
| 19:36.00 | Di_Ex | yep |
| 19:36.23 | iamaregee | nishant r u from delhi / ncr ??? |
| 19:36.27 | nishant | if i have a better knowledge of algorithms but little pror exp, will tht work out? |
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| 19:37.04 | Di_Ex | Anybody from Siberia? :) |
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| 19:42.21 | nishant | <imaregee> No, I'm from India IIT |
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| 19:43.24 | nishant | dotnick: thanks for the site. I'm just worried what will the selections be based on as I have not worked on ope source projects in the past |
| 19:43.59 | kblin | meh, I hate booking flights |
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| 19:44.41 | kblin | websites alway assume you have a boring one-way or return trip |
| 19:46.01 | nishant | thanks alot guys |
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| 19:52.29 | iamaregee | Pragma: I am interested in gui devlopment ... |
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| 19:52.48 | iamaregee | but i am learning pygtk... |
| 19:52.53 | iamaregee | and python ... |
| 19:53.12 | iamaregee | no idea about QT.. :( |
| 19:53.33 | Pragma | you mean you'd like to work on kvirc ? |
| 19:56.48 | Triskelios | Pragma: did you guys apply independently, or under an umbrella? |
| 19:57.26 | Pragma | Triskelios: kvirc did not apply at all |
| 19:57.42 | Triskelios | oh |
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| 20:25.27 | carols | peeks in and serves some cookies |
| 20:26.37 | gevaerts | adds tea and coffee to those excellent cookies |
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| 20:28.29 | shady__ | is there a project based on c |
| 20:28.52 | pygi | tons |
| 20:29.28 | shady__ | please guide me though them .. where do i find them ? |
| 20:29.32 | dhaun | shady__: there will be, lots of them - tomorrow, when the list is published :) |
| 20:29.45 | dhaun | !next |
| 20:29.45 | socinfo | dhaun: "next" is Friday, March 18 19:00 UTC - Mentoring organizations are announced |
| 20:29.51 | shady__ | ok .. i hope so |
| 20:30.08 | gevaerts | Us C based orgs also hope so :) |
| 20:30.22 | pygi | :P |
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| 20:30.54 | dhaun | did anyone ever compile statistics about the most-used languages in open source? |
| 20:31.03 | pygi | yes |
| 20:31.18 | pygi | its c, c++, assembly, python, ruby, perl, lua, c#, vb.net, etc :D |
| 20:31.22 | pygi | in no particular order :p |
| 20:31.28 | pygi | hides |
| 20:31.29 | shady__ | gevaerts what is the name of your org / |
| 20:31.34 | gevaerts | rockbox |
| 20:31.50 | pygi | its an evil org :p |
| 20:31.58 | milki | pygi: lol |
| 20:32.04 | gevaerts | pygi: we do want CD burning support! :) |
| 20:32.06 | shady__ | can u give me the link of your ieas page ? |
| 20:32.10 | Di_Ex | I am interesting in projects on PHP. |
| 20:32.12 | dhaun | "C represents more than 40 percent of all code written for open source software" |
| 20:32.12 | pygi | lies gevaerts! |
| 20:32.13 | pygi | :D |
| 20:32.14 | Di_Ex | and C |
| 20:32.43 | dhaun | that quote was from http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/osrc/article.php/3834596/Most-Popular-Open-Source-Languages.htm |
| 20:32.46 | merlish | http://www.blackducksoftware.com/oss/projects#language |
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| 20:32.50 | merlish | ah same source i think |
| 20:32.51 | gevaerts | shady__: http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/SummerOfCode2011 |
| 20:33.07 | dhaun | merlish: yep, looks like it |
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| 20:33.20 | pygi | gevaerts: proof or it didnt happen |
| 20:33.44 | gevaerts | pygi: the CD stuff is on the wiki. Burning support is just a trivial extension :) |
| 20:33.57 | pygi | pardon, trivial_ ÄD |
| 20:33.59 | pygi | ? :D |
| 20:34.12 | gevaerts | Well, it's a trivial extension of the idea :) |
| 20:34.15 | pygi | I shy away from anything trivial :D |
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| 20:35.26 | dhaun | ah, Black Duck are the guys that own ohloh.net, so they should know which languages are popular in open source |
| 20:36.33 | shady__ | @gevaerts what is your requirement so that i can become an intern .. |
| 20:36.55 | pygi | shady__: gsoc is not internship |
| 20:37.00 | pygi | not in a strict sense of word at leastr |
| 20:37.08 | shady__ | ok .. |
| 20:37.10 | summatusmentis | yeh, define "internship" |
| 20:37.12 | pygi | shady__: read faq, etc then we can help |
| 20:37.15 | pygi | !faq |
| 20:37.15 | socinfo | pygi: "faq" is http://goo.gl/Up2Qf |
| 20:37.18 | shady__ | ok |
| 20:37.34 | gevaerts | Well, the first requirement is of course that we're on the list tomorrow |
| 20:37.43 | pygi | as for rockbox and gevaerts, I think the requirement is you have to be crazy ÄD |
| 20:37.44 | pygi | :D |
| 20:37.50 | pygi | tha is the first requirement :P |
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| 20:40.21 | shady__ | @rockbox all the best :) |
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| 20:41.41 | arbu | shady__: GNOME will probably also have several C-based projects |
| 20:42.14 | pygi | but evil C |
| 20:42.22 | pygi | gobject *yuck* |
| 20:42.33 | shady__ | ok.. i will look forward to them .. |
| 20:42.58 | gevaerts | pygi: is there something around that's *not* evil? :) |
| 20:43.18 | pygi | certainly, pure C in rockbox is less evil that gobject stuff |
| 20:43.36 | shady__ | is there a project which requires AI and applications to be developed in c ? |
| 20:43.40 | pygi | I have to maintan an app written in that *******, and I dont think I'd ever do it again :p |
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| 20:44.18 | pygi | gevaerts: :) |
| 20:44.24 | merlijn | shady__: we have an AI related gsoc project up on the ideas page for Xonotic |
| 20:44.32 | gevaerts | pygi: thanks! :) |
| 20:44.45 | arbu | is maintaining a lib written in it... I don't regret it but I'm not sure I'd do it again either :) |
| 20:45.11 | pygi | arbu: just feels counter-productive and against the forces of nature |
| 20:45.25 | pygi | I think that's one of the reasons I've never ported that app to gnome3 |
| 20:45.34 | pygi | probably gonna deprecate the app all together |
| 20:45.58 | arbu | pygi: It also has some nice properties, such as being friendly to language bindings |
| 20:46.31 | arbu | Though I agree you often spend lots of activity for boilerplate stuff |
| 20:46.37 | pygi | arbu: possibly, but with so many bad properties, who would think about the good things? :p |
| 20:47.41 | arbu | Apart from being a bit cumbersome to work with I don't think it has too many bad properties :) |
| 20:50.14 | pygi | dunno man :P |
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| 20:56.07 | wolfb | agrees with pygi; gobjects are yuck |
| 20:56.44 | arbu | pygi: Have you tried vala yet? It compiles a C#-like language to gobject C |
| 20:57.12 | wolfb | Qt FTW! |
| 20:57.12 | schumaml | we're pondering to use Vala in GIMP |
| 20:57.20 | pygi | arbu: I didn't tbh arbu |
| 20:57.29 | pygi | wolfb: dunno what'll happen with QT, but its nice |
| 20:58.31 | arbu | Actually I didn't do anything serious with it either yet but from what I hear it's pretty cool |
| 20:58.58 | pygi | arbu: that's what I hear too, but python, ruby and C are enough for me |
| 20:59.07 | pygi | given that my regular job isnt programming at all |
| 20:59.15 | gevaerts | It's burning? |
| 20:59.21 | wolfb | Vala has come a long way, and I hear it's pretty nice |
| 20:59.25 | pygi | nah, management |
| 20:59.33 | gevaerts | Same thing! |
| 21:00.32 | arbu | pygi: same here if you replace ruby by erlang :) |
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| 21:00.53 | pygi | arbu: might poke your brain once then! |
| 21:01.06 | pygi | I think I needed some modifications done to riak |
| 21:01.09 | pygi | if I remember right :D |
| 21:02.04 | pygi | good thing you mentioned it arbu :p |
| 21:02.12 | arbu | pygi: hehe |
| 21:02.14 | arbu | pygi: feel free :) |
| 21:02.26 | pygi | erlang always seemed weird for me |
| 21:04.10 | |Kev| | I think erlang could be fun, but I have no need to code in it right now. |
| 21:04.48 | arbu | For being a functional language it has quite much "pragmatism" IMHO |
| 21:04.58 | arbu | Though I'm saying this without knowing another functional language :) |
| 21:05.07 | arbu | just feels that way to me |
| 21:05.13 | |Kev| | I quite like using things like Lua, and trying to write them mostly functionally. |
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