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| 03:14.42 | awakecoding | Hi |
| 03:16.07 | ravenlock | evening |
| 03:17.40 | awakecoding | how are you? |
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| 03:22.10 | ravenlock | I'm fine. You? |
| 03:22.42 | awakecoding | I'm fine, I'm filling my application form right now :P |
| 03:25.24 | ravenlock | nice |
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| 04:31.48 | awakecoding | is it possible to get my application reviewed before March 11th, just to get advice on how to improve it? |
| 04:31.57 | awakecoding | I really want to get accepted |
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| 04:33.05 | Catfish_Man | awakecoding: the best advice I can give you is to get in touch with your organization early, and ask them to take a look |
| 04:33.15 | Catfish_Man | at the same time, grab the code for the project and start poking around in it |
| 04:33.18 | Catfish_Man | maybe fix a few bugs |
| 04:33.29 | awakecoding | I'm applying as a mentoring organization |
| 04:33.34 | awakecoding | not as a student :P |
| 04:33.41 | Catfish_Man | oh, hah. I'm way too used to giving student advice |
| 04:33.59 | Catfish_Man | um, email carols I guess? She's pretty busy though generally |
| 04:34.01 | svaksha | grins |
| 04:34.10 | awakecoding | there was a place in the form that asked for larger GSoC organizations that can vouch for us, or Googlers |
| 04:34.19 | awakecoding | luckily enough I know one googler |
| 04:34.55 | awakecoding | http://2011.cusec.net/democamp/ <- I mentioned my presentation there (FreeRDP) |
| 04:35.19 | awakecoding | http://2011.cusec.net/speakers-list/ <- and the Googler who's using my software (Marc-Antoine Ruel) |
| 04:35.24 | awakecoding | I hope that's enough |
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| 04:38.38 | awakecoding | do you know how many student slots get allocated per project usually? |
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| 05:12.45 | Upthorn | awakecoding: google assigns them to projects based on interest and merit, so it varies a great deal |
| 05:13.26 | Upthorn | my project last summer had, um, six? And the one before got four. |
| 05:14.08 | awakecoding | cool |
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| 07:18.07 | sudo | hi |
| 07:19.54 | sudo | help |
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| 07:59.51 | Guest54407 | how to go abt gsoc? |
| 08:00.49 | Guest54407 | ??? |
| 08:00.56 | Guest54407 | ne1 there |
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| 08:02.10 | |Kev| | !faq |
| 08:02.10 | socinfo | |Kev|: "faq" is http://goo.gl/Up2Qf |
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| 09:37.43 | dreimark | !timeline |
| 09:37.43 | socinfo | dreimark: "timeline" is http://goo.gl/0lYPz |
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| 09:47.49 | socketguru | !help |
| 09:47.49 | socinfo | socketguru: (help [<plugin>] [<command>]) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin. |
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| 14:42.59 | ahel | !next |
| 14:42.59 | socinfo | ahel: "next" is (#1) 23:00 UTC on Friday, March 12th - Mentoring organization application deadline, or (#2) 23:00 UTC on Friday, March 11 - Mentoring organization application deadline |
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| 16:30.31 | sid | hey all |
| 16:30.36 | sid | :) |
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| 18:54.20 | LetterRip | Hi all, a request for the gsoc form - adding a field for additional licenes that students can use. Ie Blender is GPL2, but if a students project is primarily a library in nature, then any GPL2 compatible library is acceptible |
| 18:54.39 | LetterRip | so BSD, MIT, Zlib, etc. |
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| 19:16.37 | djmitche | hm, the mentor org application says I can edit it, but I can't find out where to do so.. help? |
| 19:21.11 | LetterRip | djmitche just go to your organization docs section |
| 19:21.18 | LetterRip | it contains stuff you filled out already |
| 19:21.25 | LetterRip | not the 'new' section |
| 19:21.42 | djmitche | "User (self)" -> "List Documents"? |
| 19:24.06 | Umair | Hi gsoc team |
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| 19:25.06 | Umair | can anyone tel me about the projects for the gsoc 2011 |
| 19:25.26 | djmitche | Umair: mentoring orgs are just applying now, so that list doesn't exist yet |
| 19:26.14 | djmitche | LetterRip: ah, "List My Organization Applications" |
| 19:26.23 | LetterRip | right |
| 19:26.32 | LetterRip | couldn't recall the name of it :) |
| 19:27.13 | Umair | ok djmitche... thanks .. i m master student of wireless system ak Royal Institute of Technology,Sweden |
| 19:30.46 | Umair | hi djmitche.. do u hv idea about the possible mentor's organization for this year? |
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| 19:31.44 | djmitche | you could look at last year's organizations and projects.. |
| 19:35.19 | Umair | ham.. |
| 19:35.38 | djmitche | ham? |
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| 19:38.13 | Umair | i mean ok |
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| 19:55.01 | Upthorn | I think Umair meant "hmm" |
| 19:55.39 | djmitche | I thought I had missed a new irc-ism :) |
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| 21:32.54 | koda | hi all! |
| 21:33.15 | koda | i'm having a hard time in finding voucher organisations for our small project |
| 21:33.22 | koda | what can be done with it |
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| 21:43.00 | |Kev| | koda: It's not compulsory, is it? If you don't have any contact with other orgs that can vouch for you, submit withou.t |
| 21:47.24 | djmitche | koda: it basically needs to be someone who knows your project is for real |
| 21:47.30 | djmitche | do you know anyone who works at google? |
| 21:47.39 | djmitche | or any organizations that use your project? |
| 21:48.34 | koda | well no, because it's a game and the contacts i have with other orgs are mostly personal |
| 21:48.46 | djmitche | that should be OK |
| 21:48.57 | koda | they say 'yes we know you but we don't know anything about the organization' |
| 21:49.04 | koda | and they turn me down :\ |
| 21:49.06 | djmitche | ah |
| 21:49.20 | djmitche | well, then don't worry about it - I think Kev is right that it's optional |
| 21:49.34 | djmitche | and you can add some explanation in the "Anything else" field |
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| 21:53.53 | koda | thanks :) |
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| 22:15.18 | koda | umh i have another question |
| 22:15.29 | koda | how detailed should be the list of ideas? |
| 22:15.51 | koda | i'm seeing that wesnoth has a page for each ideas |
| 22:15.56 | |Kev| | Detailed enough that students can make an informed decision. |
| 22:16.08 | gevaerts | Better more than less |
| 22:16.15 | |Kev| | How hard it is, what skills they need, who they should contact to talk about it, what the project's about. |
| 22:16.30 | gevaerts | http://www.rockbox.org/wiki/SummerOfCode2011 is ours (not complete yet, we want more ideas) |
| 22:16.49 | gevaerts | And that's definitely not too detailed I'd say |
| 22:16.57 | |Kev| | So you have much more detail there than we typically have. |
| 22:17.15 | |Kev| | Just enough to say what the student would need to do, and then let them discuss with mentors to form a plan. |
| 22:17.34 | gevaerts | Collecting details is also useful in evaluating if it matches the timeframe |
| 22:17.49 | koda | ah i see |
| 22:18.03 | koda | right now i have title / language / description |
| 22:18.21 | |Kev| | I like the student to need to have thought about, and discussed, the project so their application shows they've done more than read the ideas. |
| 22:18.23 | koda | i'd better add details, people to bug and so |
| 22:18.25 | gevaerts | Depending on "description", that might be fine |
| 22:18.29 | |Kev| | I can see merit in writing significantly more, though. |
| 22:18.44 | |Kev| | http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summer_of_Code_2011_Project_Ideas#Swift |
| 22:18.51 | |Kev| | I'd say that if you have less than that, you need more. |
| 22:19.06 | koda | right now it is something like this http://www.hedgewars.org/gsoc_ideas2011.html |
| 22:19.09 | dhaun | really seems to vary a lot between orgs - the KDE ones are pretty short while ours also tend to be more detailed |
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| 22:20.28 | |Kev| | koda: That doesn't give any idea of who to discuss ideas with, or how difficult each idea is. |
| 22:20.37 | |Kev| | Nor which skills are needed for each. |
| 22:20.51 | koda | yes yes i'll add them |
| 22:20.56 | |Kev| | *I* think those are necessary bits of information, others' opinions may vary :) |
| 22:21.32 | gevaerts | I don't think you can put too much there basically |
| 22:22.32 | gevaerts | And I'd rather have the student application concentrate on telling us *how* they'll solve the thing than convincing us they figured out what the idea is about :) |
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| 22:23.33 | |Kev| | I think it greatly depends on the project to what extent you need to figure out what it's about. |
| 22:23.43 | gevaerts | nods |
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| 22:23.54 | |Kev| | If you say "Add history saving support to the Swift XMPP Client", you already know pretty much everything you need to :) |
| 22:24.07 | gevaerts | Yes |
| 22:24.16 | gevaerts | And "Support protocol X" is also pretty simple |
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| 22:25.15 | gevaerts | Well, understanding what it's about is simple anyway |
| 22:28.00 | Michitux | imho the main difficulty when you are new to a software is to estimate how difficult a certain part is and thus how many additional features you can plan |
| 22:28.21 | |Kev| | Yes, but if the student discusses with the mentors beforehand... |
| 22:29.33 | gevaerts | Oh, you'll find that students tend to like your first idea a lot. It doesn't matter a lot what that idea is :) |
| 22:30.25 | |Kev| | Heh, I hadn't noticed that, although I could have been unobservant. |
| 22:31.44 | gevaerts | Maybe not in the final proposals, but I know last year we had lots (well, more than three...) people ask about the first one on irc and (once they got a bit of detail) disappear forever. That didn't happen with any of the other ideas |
| 22:32.25 | pygi | if the first idea is about adding burning capabilities to firefox, I'm all for it! |
| 22:32.28 | djmitche | istm that GSoC is as much an object lesson in human nature for admins/mentors as anything else |
| 22:32.29 | pygi | I always wanted to do that! |
| 22:32.34 | pygi | where always == last three years :D |
| 22:32.39 | gevaerts | The idea was "Turn this into an android application", and people apparently thought that was easy :) |
| 22:32.56 | pygi | gevaerts: what org are you? |
| 22:33.01 | gevaerts | pygi: rockbox |
| 22:33.01 | |Kev| | Well, sounds it :) |
| 22:33.20 | pygi | ah |
| 22:33.22 | djmitche | pygi: Mozilla was an org last year and IIRC will be again this year |
| 22:33.25 | gevaerts | |Kev|: well, it involves things like "implement a cooperative threading system in android" :) |
| 22:33.33 | pygi | djmitche: I know, but they dont want to accept my proposal :D |
| 22:33.44 | pygi | they say internets cannot be burned on optical mediums! |
| 22:33.46 | djmitche | yeah, that's what I was going to say next |
| 22:33.49 | djmitche | :) |
| 22:33.54 | pygi | that is so untrue |
| 22:34.09 | pygi | given an assumption that there is an infinite amount of optical mediums on stock, it could be done! |
| 22:34.16 | |Kev| | Internets? How many do you have? :D |
| 22:34.17 | gevaerts | The internet comes pre-burned! It still has the scorch marks! |
| 22:34.30 | pygi | |Kev|: at least 2 |
| 22:34.32 | |Kev| | New, stone-washed Internet. |
| 22:34.53 | pygi | tho I'd really like to get a student that makes k3b useful :P *me hides* |
| 22:34.53 | pygi | :D |
| 22:35.15 | djmitche | that's a tough point in the process of OSS contributions, in general - people tend to have ideas that either burn a lot of developer time for no benefit, or are out of scope for the project |
| 22:35.24 | djmitche | and obviously those points are heavily debatable :) |
| 22:35.33 | |Kev| | Talking about useful OSS, I finally got around to trying Redmine the last couple of days, and was really impressed. It's nearly as good as Fogbugz. |
| 22:35.44 | pygi | |Kev|: not user friendly tho :( |
| 22:36.00 | |Kev| | pygi: As an end-user, or as a dev? |
| 22:36.05 | pygi | been trying to put in bake in some ticketing functionality into gitorious lately :P |
| 22:36.09 | pygi | |Kev|: as an end-user |
| 22:36.17 | |Kev| | Ah, I don't care for those to use it :) |
| 22:36.21 | pygi | :D |
| 22:36.32 | |Kev| | I have slightly contentious ideas about project management and users reporting issues. |
| 22:37.10 | pygi | |Kev|: are you part of some org as well? |
| 22:37.11 | |Kev| | I'm happy for them to *see* the bug list, I just don't want them mangling it. |
| 22:37.22 | |Kev| | pygi: Yes. |
| 22:37.27 | pygi | which one? |
| 22:37.36 | |Kev| | XMPP Standards Foundation. |
| 22:37.44 | pygi | fun. |
| 22:37.59 | |Kev| | (Umbrella org for all things XMPP. The project I primarily work on these days is swift.im) |
| 22:38.14 | pygi | yes, I know what XMPP Standards foundation is :p |
| 22:38.17 | pygi | but no idea about swift |
| 22:39.01 | pygi | should I install it or will it eat my cookies? |
| 22:39.05 | |Kev| | Swift is the client for 'everyone else', or so we'd have it. |
| 22:39.31 | |Kev| | Remko and I stopped working on Psi after we'd written The Book, and started Swift. |
| 22:39.49 | pygi | I remember Psi too :D |
| 22:40.04 | pygi | fun |
| 22:40.05 | |Kev| | I ran that project for far too many years :) |
| 22:40.13 | pygi | I once wrote an IM app ... CLI app based on telepathy |
| 22:40.15 | pygi | was fun :P |
| 22:40.39 | |Kev| | And sure, give Swift a whirl if you want, it's unlikely to eat your puppies. |
| 22:41.05 | pygi | been using adium since I switched to mac primarily, only has one minor bug which I'd like fixed |
| 22:41.16 | |Kev| | It's not a power-user's client, though, so you may not find it does much for you. |
| 22:41.16 | pygi | but given that I'm lazy to report it to bug tracker.... :P |
| 22:42.11 | pygi | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Fama_IM_0.0.1.jpg |
| 22:42.11 | pygi | :P |
| 22:43.07 | |Kev| | Jolly good. |
| 22:43.22 | Michitux | I'm wondering what happened if all universities offered open source programming with the practical part "work on an opensource project of your choice" as subject for cs students... |
| 22:45.14 | pygi | unlikely, at least in this part of the world :P |
| 22:46.04 | LetterRip | just curious if any students are here planning to apply for gsoc |
| 22:46.13 | pygi | I assume tons, as usual : |
| 22:46.14 | pygi | :p |
| 22:46.25 | LetterRip | heh |
| 22:46.37 | pygi | |Kev|: well, if you need cd burning functionality, let me know :D |
| 22:46.39 | pygi | perhaps for logs :p |
| 22:46.57 | LetterRip | well last year arguably two of the best were individuals i 'recruited' :) one from here, and one from a 3d forum |
| 22:47.00 | |Kev| | Heh, thanks! |
| 22:47.24 | Michitux | pygi: the Czech Technical University offers this subject (last year one student, this year two students who've contacted us (dokuwiki)) ;) |
| 22:47.25 | pygi | LetterRip: what org are you? |
| 22:47.36 | LetterRip | Blender Foundation |
| 22:47.40 | pygi | Michitux: nice, wish they did it here as well (Croatia) |
| 22:47.51 | pygi | LetterRip: fun! |
| 22:47.55 | pygi | python :D |
| 22:47.57 | LetterRip | yeppers |
| 22:48.05 | LetterRip | i gathered that from your nick :) |
| 22:48.23 | pygi | no, I mean I'm not python org :P I was referring to your usage of python :P |
| 22:48.33 | pygi | but yea, my nick is partly composed from python programming language :p |
| 22:49.04 | pygi | I used to be ubuntu org (mentor) when they didnt let me be a student (too young) then 4 years student, and now its either enough or mentor again :p |
| 22:49.14 | LetterRip | ah - yeah we have python bindings, and now a lot of our gui is python based |
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| 22:49.31 | pygi | LetterRip: I did some work for python org tho as a student :p |
| 22:49.40 | LetterRip | ah ic |
| 22:50.04 | pygi | do you have burning functionality? :D |
| 22:50.08 | pygi | hides |
| 22:50.24 | pygi | if not, you should! :P |
| 22:50.54 | djmitche | I hear grub was thinking of supporting DVD burning |
| 22:51.02 | djmitche | also, MP3 playback and social networking |
| 22:51.02 | pygi | djmitche: :P |
| 22:51.05 | djmitche | :) |
| 22:51.10 | pygi | I think grub already uses some of our libraries |
| 22:51.12 | pygi | grub2 that is |
| 22:51.31 | gevaerts | pygi: I wouldn't mind having CD burning support in rockbox |
| 22:51.34 | pygi | I forgot for what exactly :p |
| 22:51.55 | pygi | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:52.26 | gevaerts | Well of course not. It's not implemented yet! |
| 22:52.34 | gevaerts | But some of them have USB host |
| 22:52.49 | pygi | :P |
| 22:53.20 | gevaerts | wants pygi to write a USB host subsystem |
| 22:53.56 | pygi | gevaerts: if you'll implement UDF and reading support for me in libburnia, I'll consider it :p |
| 22:54.21 | gevaerts | pygi: is it enough if I promise to implement it? |
| 22:54.25 | pygi | no |
| 22:54.46 | pygi | first. I'll ask you questions to see if you've read all the many useless specs that exist around :p |
| 22:54.50 | pygi | then we can take it to round 2 :p |
| 22:55.07 | pygi | that being said, I have no idea how involved would it be to write a USB host subsystem anyway? |
| 22:55.25 | gevaerts | Good. That means you won't run away before starting :) |
| 22:56.01 | pygi | but I dont wanna be a student this year! :D |
| 22:56.30 | gevaerts | But if you add USB host, you can add CD burning! |
| 22:56.33 | gevaerts | Oh, wait... |
| 22:56.42 | gevaerts | I had another idea a while ago that you might like |
| 22:56.52 | koda | add a thunderbolt host! |
| 22:56.54 | pygi | :D |
| 22:56.54 | koda | ftw |
| 22:57.02 | gevaerts | Add CD burning support to rockbox, in the sense of adding CD emulation :) |
| 22:57.34 | pygi | I assume adding remote cd burning capabilities to devices with wifi would be more sane task :p |
| 22:57.51 | gevaerts | Oh, definitely |
| 22:57.56 | pygi | and it doesnt involve writing usb subsystem! |
| 22:57.57 | pygi | :D |
| 22:58.05 | gevaerts | doesn't mention that rockbox doesn't have any wifi support at all yet |
| 22:58.10 | pygi | .... |
| 22:58.13 | pygi | :D |
| 22:58.14 | gevaerts | :) |
| 22:58.29 | pygi | so wifi stack eh? :D |
| 22:58.50 | gevaerts | Well, first you'll have to get rockbox to run on a player that has wifi in the first place! |
| 22:58.58 | pygi | gevaerts: ipod touch wouldnt work? |
| 22:58.59 | |Kev| | What rockbox really needs is XMPP support, of course. |
| 22:59.27 | |Kev| | Albeit, without wifi you might be limited to reading stanzas off the screen and typing them into a workstation :) |
| 22:59.53 | gevaerts | pygi: if you port rockbox to the ipod touch, many people would thank you for it :) |
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| 23:00.09 | pygi | o my |
| 23:00.46 | pygi | |Kev|: I need some protections |
| 23:00.57 | pygi | I think gevaerts is trying to recruit me outside usual gsoc rules :p |
| 23:01.07 | pygi | mentors cant recruit mentors :p |
| 23:01.11 | |Kev| | I think no such thing :) |
| 23:02.04 | gevaerts | pygi: of course they can! |
| 23:02.19 | |Kev| | What I *do* think is that I should get some sleep before I get stuck into some coding again. |
| 23:02.22 | |Kev| | gn |
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| 23:02.44 | pygi | |Kev|: gn |
| 23:02.54 | pygi | gevaerts: not withnin the GSoC framework! |
| 23:02.59 | pygi | you'd need to override the rules! |
| 23:03.47 | gevaerts | pygi: Point me to those rules that say I can't poach mentors here |
| 23:03.58 | gevaerts | is sure those don't exist! :) |
| 23:03.58 | pygi | they're in my head! |
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| 23:04.53 | pygi | are you telling me my head is non-existant? :p |
| 23:05.22 | snc | head not found, list is empty |
| 23:05.51 | pygi | :D |
| 23:05.55 | gevaerts | pygi: not entirely. It's certainly there, but I don't know about its contents :) |
| 23:06.29 | pygi | I'm not sure if this is an insult or what... |
| 23:06.30 | pygi | :P |
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| 23:09.16 | gevaerts | Let's put it this way: the contents of my head do not include much information about the contents of your head :) |
| 23:09.59 | pygi | :D |
| 23:10.06 | pygi | what about the rest of the list? :D |
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| 23:39.27 | Gary_B | hi |
| 23:39.44 | snc | o hai |
| 23:40.39 | Gary_B | would you say most gsoc participants have had experience commiting to open source? |
| 23:41.02 | Gary_B | esp the projects they apply to work on? |
| 23:41.53 | snc | while some would, i doubt it's a majority for the same project |
| 23:41.55 | ThomasWaldmann | maybe some have general experience, but many not for the project they apply to |
| 23:43.04 | gevaerts | Many organisations expect some work during the selection process (like fixing some bugs), so technically yes. In a wider sense, many students have never done any open source work before |
| 23:43.47 | Dark_Shikari | most don't |
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