| 00:00.01 | Wolf_OSGeo | jenred: good idea |
| 00:00.18 | mmadia42 | oh, man i'm tired... i thought he was asking if "now" was after 4/9 :P |
| 00:00.39 | Wolf_OSGeo | mmadia42: go to sleep! |
| 00:00.40 | annag | jenred: I just made a screen shot of the students application view - want me to email it to you? |
| 00:00.43 | *** part/#gsoc vgvgf (~vgvgf@190.30.197.211) |
| 00:00.47 | mmadia42 | it's 8pm :| |
| 00:00.55 | annag | its 2 am here ;) |
| 00:00.57 | Wolf_OSGeo | mmadia42: no its 3 AM |
| 00:01.05 | jenred | hi annag! that would be awesome |
| 00:01.10 | Wolf_OSGeo | mmadia42: well go sleep some more |
| 00:01.31 | annag | jenred: sure thing |
| 00:01.54 | Wolf_OSGeo | ok time to catch some Zs. Good luck with getting cleaner proposals jenred! |
| 00:02.20 | jenred | Wolf_OSGeo thanks and sleep well |
| 00:02.35 | Wolf_OSGeo | thanks. I will |
| 00:02.40 | Wolf_OSGeo | nighters |
| 00:02.46 | jenred | aplogizes to everyone for the melange mini-rant |
| 00:02.55 | jenred | i've been holding it in for so long now ;> |
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| 00:03.59 | carols | ok, i'm heading home. have a nice night/day everyone |
| 00:04.28 | Wolf_OSGeo | you too |
| 00:06.06 | annag | so, bedtime for me. Have a nice one! :) |
| 00:07.30 | jenred | gn annag |
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| 00:12.31 | LightNova | hi, i have a question |
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| 00:18.01 | mmadia | hi LightNova. As a rule of thumb, it's best to simply ask your question in IRC channels. |
| 00:18.25 | sreich | "do not ask to ask, just ask." |
| 00:18.35 | mmadia | ... sometimes people may not be paying attention at the exact moment you are. |
| 00:18.44 | LightNova | â¢Google begins issuing initial student payments provided tax forms are on file and students are in good standing with their communities. |
| 00:21.05 | LightNova | I'm an international student in canada, is it means i should get a work permit before April 26? |
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| 00:30.29 | Milena | away: [Inativo por mais de 30 minutos] [desde: 21:30, page: on] |
| 00:31.28 | mmadia | LightNova : http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-discuss/browse_thread/thread/2e8880015a860e35/93056b66e7963524?hl=en&lnk=gst&q=US+citizen+in+foreign+country#93056b66e7963524 may help |
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| 00:36.07 | Milena | voltou: [Inativo por mais de 30 minutos] [duração: 5mins 38secs, page: on] |
| 00:41.51 | sanjoyd | If a student qualifies for more than one organization, how is it decided which one he or she is finally alloted to? |
| 00:42.09 | Catfish_Man | sanjoyd: an irc meeting with all the mentoring organizations present |
| 00:42.16 | Catfish_Man | they will usually *attempt* to contact you if there's a conflict |
| 00:42.37 | sanjoyd | Catfish_Man, Thanks! |
| 00:42.43 | sanjoyd | BTW you've a weird nick. |
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| 00:43.16 | skbohra | O.o |
| 00:43.25 | Catfish_Man | yes |
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| 01:48.38 | DasIch | !countdown |
| 01:48.39 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 02:09.52 | emmanuelp | !countdown |
| 02:09.52 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 02:11.22 | Sgeo | I want to get involved with GSoC, but only started looking at it this week |
| 02:11.46 | Sgeo | If I send an application saying "I haven't looked at this code before, but I want to try doing this suggestion", I'm not likely to get accepted, am I? |
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| 02:13.13 | Catfish_Man | Sgeo: generally a lot more detail than that is required in proposals, yeah |
| 02:13.22 | Sgeo | :/ |
| 02:13.26 | MatthewWilkes | Sgeo: If that's all you say, no. If you say why it's interesting to you and show a real passion for learning your experience won't matter so much to most organisations. |
| 02:14.47 | Sgeo | wonders if he should just try next year |
| 02:15.07 | Sgeo | Although I think it can't hurt to try applying |
| 02:15.36 | Sgeo | What if I can't give details, because I haven't looked at it closely, but can say why I think it would be interesting? |
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| 02:16.05 | Sgeo | And I do have a passion for learning |
| 02:16.09 | skbohra | Sgeo: dont look like |
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| 02:16.26 | skbohra | Sgeo: your application is compared with others as well |
| 02:16.35 | skbohra | and they pick the best one |
| 02:16.54 | Sgeo | I think I'll just try again next year :/ |
| 02:17.22 | Sgeo | Although I _think_ I'm graduating next year, so next year will be the last opportunity I have :( |
| 02:18.13 | skbohra | you can start contributing to org right away |
| 02:18.19 | skbohra | no need to wait for gsoc |
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| 02:19.08 | Sgeo | doesn't want to contribute to code that he won't get compensated for, and isn't especially interested in |
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| 02:20.11 | coppro | then find something that interests you! |
| 02:20.37 | Sgeo | wants to get compensated for coding at some point |
| 02:21.15 | Sgeo | My life so far: Uncompensated for interesting/fun code. I want a change of pace |
| 02:21.24 | MatthewWilkes | Then get a job at a company that contributes to open source |
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| 02:25.26 | Sgeo | wants something more temporary than a job |
| 02:26.35 | tobiw | to students gsoc just seems like a great idea: no long contract, choose an interesting project yourself, quite a lot of money :) |
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| 02:27.01 | MatthewWilkes | Well, you should have started looking at SoC earlier. If you write an excellent proposal you might get accepted but if you're not willing to put the time in to look at the code and only show up a day before the deadline it doesn't look good |
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| 02:49.22 | iammisc | Im submitting my proposal for gsoc and im wondering what the abstract field is. does that contain our application? or will we submit that later |
| 02:49.59 | skbohra | its just abstract ;) |
| 02:50.04 | MatthewWilkes | iammisc: It's a short (a few lines) public description of the project so people can tell at a glance if they want to read it all |
| 02:50.13 | iammisc | so ill submit my full proposal later? |
| 02:50.25 | skbohra | in the next field |
| 02:50.31 | tobiw | iammisc: in the text area below |
| 02:50.53 | iammisc | oh i see. for psf, it contained instructions for what to do |
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| 02:51.16 | skbohra | yeah remove them and fill accordingly |
| 02:51.39 | Abhinav1 | !countdown |
| 02:51.39 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 02:51.46 | MatthewWilkes | *sigh* - I hope you guys know how lucky you are, I wish I could apply for SoC. |
| 02:52.07 | MatthewWilkes | Damn eligibility rules not allowing org admins and mentors to apply ;) |
| 02:52.20 | skbohra | MatthewWilkes: lol |
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| 02:54.06 | skbohra | MatthewWilkes: people are learning ;) |
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| 03:08.17 | iammisc | fijal: care to read my gsoc proposal? |
| 03:08.26 | ankitg | MatthewWilkes: If you *really* want to ... I could apply on your behalf ... :P -- it's foolproof ... 100% acceptance ... we can talk about splitting the profits in a PM (only just kidding - just in case someone thought I was being serious ... also MatthewWilkes, PM me if you're interested) |
| 03:08.54 | iammisc | wrong room |
| 03:09.48 | MatthewWilkes | hehe |
| 03:12.24 | skbohra | MatthewWilkes: I can give you better share then ankitg is offering ;) |
| 03:13.02 | ankitg | skbohra: you don't even know what I am offering ... you can't read my PMs ... can you!? |
| 03:13.22 | skbohra | i know what you can ;) |
| 03:14.06 | MatthewWilkes | Yes, yes, bid for my love. |
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| 03:14.16 | d4ddi0 | !countdown |
| 03:14.17 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 03:14.31 | ankitg | oh it's an auction now! |
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| 03:19.41 | tobiw | 39 hrs is actually quite a lot of time left :D |
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| 03:20.09 | skbohra | i have four exams in between :-/ |
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| 03:21.46 | pkuhad | !next |
| 03:21.47 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
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| 03:33.44 | Chetan_ | hi |
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| 03:36.40 | Chetan_ | Any mentor here? |
| 03:37.55 | d4ddi0 | Maybe the peanut gallery can answer your question? if not, eventually someone official is likely to see your post. |
| 03:38.27 | Chetan_ | I just want to knw that when does google reveals the number of slots to the org? |
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| 03:39.39 | d4ddi0 | << deathly silence >> |
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| 03:46.56 | ebo | how do I post a link to the proposal so others know where to find/review it (I poseted it public). |
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| 03:47.58 | tobiw | ebo: afaik you can submit it and still review/edit it until the deadline passed |
| 03:48.46 | ebo | I gues I was not clear. I submitted it, but wanted to post a link to my application so people in my org can review and comment. |
| 03:49.07 | ebo | I noticed above that if it is posted public then others can view and comment. |
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| 03:52.35 | kdaks | ebo: yes if you make it public even others can view it provided you share the link of the proposal |
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| 03:53.47 | ebo | understand. how do I find the link to the proposal. When I tried copy pasting that did not work because it goes to the edit pages. |
| 03:55.20 | ebo | ahh... I just figured it out -- I had to come at it from the list of proposals. |
| 03:55.26 | ebo | sorry for the confusion. |
| 03:56.43 | robbyoconnor | !timeline |
| 03:56.43 | socinfo | "timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline |
| 03:56.44 | ebo | on second thought, that only worked because I was signed in. |
| 03:57.50 | ebo | so I still need to know how to find the link to the proposals... sorry for the bother. |
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| 04:02.38 | tridactyla | ebo: i think that no matter what, people need to sign in with a google id to view your proposal, even if its public |
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| 04:05.11 | Chetan_ | Any mentorhere? |
| 04:06.21 | MatthewWilkes | Chetan_: Yes and we read your question. |
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| 04:08.14 | Chetan_ | do you knw? |
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| 04:08.46 | ebo | tridactyla: thanks. It looks like someone has already commented on the proposal I was concerned about, so I'm getting feedback. I was not sure how to invite others. I'll post the link and see if others can get to it. |
| 04:08.51 | ebo | Thanks again. |
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| 04:10.20 | skbohra | wondering when will i get my first comment on soc site : |
| 04:10.35 | skbohra | i just want to see how it looks like ;) |
| 04:15.05 | emmanuel_ | I haven't got any comments either, I didn't make my proposal public though ;) do you guys think it is important to make it public? |
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| 04:16.14 | tridactyla | emmanuel_: even if its public, random people wont be able to make comments |
| 04:17.01 | tridactyla | from what I understand, this just allows others to see your proposal |
| 04:18.12 | emmanuel_ | tridactyla: ahhh I see, so there is no real advantage of setting your proposals to public, right? |
| 04:18.33 | skbohra | i didnt get comments last year either, so i am bit too excited |
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| 04:19.12 | emmanuel_ | hehe, were you picked by an org las year? |
| 04:19.16 | emmanuel_ | last* |
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| 04:20.14 | skbohra | emmanuel yeah |
| 04:21.28 | emmanuel_ | cool, this is the first year I apply (and my las year of university, so it is also my last chance to get picked :) ) |
| 04:22.26 | skbohra | what do you plan to do after university ? |
| 04:22.35 | skbohra | just being little curious |
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| 04:24.10 | tobiw | emmanuel_: i'm also one of those last-year-at-uni guys :D |
| 04:24.24 | skbohra | so as me :) |
| 04:25.11 | emmanuel_ | hehe nice guys, it's been quite a ride huh? |
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| 04:26.25 | skbohra | emmanuel_: yeah indeed |
| 04:26.55 | emmanuel_ | I am already working, I have been for the last 3 years, I work for an outsourcing/staffing company that basically gets new customers, and forward the work to me, I think I am going to stick with them a bit more, I can't complain they pay nice, and they send a lot of work |
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| 04:28.51 | jenred | carols are you around? |
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| 04:30.38 | emmanuel_ | skbohra: since you have been picked before, do you know if there is 1 slot per idea, per organization? |
| 04:30.46 | robbyoconnor | !timeline |
| 04:30.46 | socinfo | "timeline" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline |
| 04:31.13 | skbohra | emmanuel_: i dont this every idea has a slot |
| 04:31.31 | skbohra | s/this/think |
| 04:32.16 | emmanuel_ | really? so at the end, the idea you sent a proposal for might not even be founded at all? |
| 04:32.29 | skbohra | if a idea has a mentor then definately there are chances that it will get a slot |
| 04:32.50 | robbyoconnor | !slots |
| 04:32.50 | socinfo | "slots" is Slots are allocated after student proposals are all submitted. The final count of slots are unknown until the accepted students are announced. Please see http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/program/google/gsoc2009/studentallocations for further information on how slots are allocated. |
| 04:32.55 | robbyoconnor | emmanuel: read. |
| 04:33.00 | skbohra | and in the end slots are decided by google :) |
| 04:33.04 | skbohra | robbyoconnor: thanks |
| 04:33.06 | robbyoconnor | this is all in the lovely handy dandy FAQ! |
| 04:33.20 | robbyoconnor | gets back to his proposal |
| 04:33.23 | robbyoconnor | I'm almost done. |
| 04:33.30 | emmanuel_ | robby: skbhora: thanks |
| 04:33.35 | skbohra | sends some peanuts to robbyoconnor |
| 04:33.58 | robbyoconnor | nibbles on skbohra's nuts |
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| 04:37.25 | emmanuel_ | oooook, so I just spent 2 days working on a proposal for a project without mentor, sigh |
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| 04:45.45 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Was it on their ideas list? |
| 04:46.12 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: yeah it was |
| 04:46.46 | selvakumar | what is the procedure to become a mentor in gsoc. |
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| 04:46.53 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Then they *really* need to be able to provide a mentor |
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| 04:47.39 | BWaters | !advice |
| 04:47.39 | socinfo | "advice" is http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforStudents for students, http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforMentors for mentors |
| 04:47.51 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: What happened, if you don't mind me asking? |
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| 04:48.16 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: Cool, I just got an email from them, not sure if it comes from a mentor, but at least now I know there is a technical contact behind the org interested on the proposal I made. |
| 04:48.32 | MatthewWilkes | oh, good |
| 04:49.34 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: Nothing, really, this just came up from a question I made about the number of slots allocated per idea per organization, skbohra mentioned that ideas without mentors are less likely to get an slot, I used to think that every idea would have at least one slot :) |
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| 04:51.41 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: It is the responsibility of the mentoring org to find the mentor |
| 04:51.59 | MatthewWilkes | If you suggest your own idea it's possible that there's literally nobody who's suitable but I highly doubt that |
| 04:52.12 | thebolt | emmanuel_: that is not true for most organisations.. the org I have mentored/adminned for earlier had 10+ ideas on the idea page, but 4-6 students (slots) each year |
| 04:53.26 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: Well, so far I have only applied for organization ideas, haven't applied for an idea of my own so far. |
| 04:54.15 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Your proposal will be evaluated on its own strengths, firstly on its own and then if there aren't enough spots in comparison to the other applicants |
| 04:54.36 | emmanuel_ | thebolt: how do ideas get prioritized? once google allocates a number of slots for your org, how do you decide which ideas get a slot, and which doesn't? I guess some projects are just more important for you? |
| 04:56.31 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: Even if the org thinks that my proposal is good, what happens if the idea I applied for doesn't get a slot? you think the org will ask me if there's another project I would like to work on?, or will my proposal just be dismissed? |
| 04:56.44 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Proposals get slots, not ideas. |
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| 04:57.13 | arma | (also, proposals get slots, not students) |
| 04:57.46 | MatthewWilkes | Orgs will try and work around duplicates but in general the best n proposals for unique ideas. |
| 04:57.55 | MatthewWilkes | + will get slots |
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| 04:58.08 | d4ddi0 | How does it work if multiple orgs want to approve the same student? |
| 04:58.19 | d4ddi0 | Fight to the death? |
| 04:58.33 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWiles: oh, interesting, didn't know that. So if an org thinks your proposal is worthy, It is likely that you/your proposal will get a slot |
| 04:58.40 | movicont | d4ddi0: two mentors enter a cage, one comes out |
| 04:58.45 | movicont | or so I hear ;) |
| 04:58.46 | MatthewWilkes | d4ddi0: We have a meeting to decide who gets them. Make your preference known to the org you want if you apply for many. |
| 04:58.49 | emmanuel_ | lol |
| 04:59.05 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Of course. Any other way of doing it would be crazy. |
| 04:59.34 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: cool, you just gave me back my hopes :) |
| 04:59.57 | d4ddi0 | I've only submitted one so far and the second would be to the same org, so its academic for me :) |
| 05:00.23 | MatthewWilkes | d4ddi0: In that case they would likely ask you which you prefer if they're both good enough |
| 05:00.30 | MatthewWilkes | Otherwise you'll just get accepted onto one |
| 05:01.20 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: How do we make our preference known to the org we want? through the proposal itself? |
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| 05:03.50 | movicont | emmanuel_: from reading old archives it seems like you should wait to see if there are two orgs that both come close to accepting you, then contact them |
| 05:04.42 | emmanuel_ | movicont: I see, thanks |
| 05:05.13 | MatthewWilkes | emmanuel_: Let them know somehow. The organisations are under no obligation to let you choose, they may choose for you. |
| 05:06.03 | emmanuel_ | MatthewWilkes: I understand, thanks |
| 05:07.04 | movicont | MatthewWilkes: is there supposed to be some sort of irc meeting for resolutions? do you know how that works? |
| 05:07.26 | skbohra | there is one org which have interesting project, but they dont have mailing list, irc or forum, the email i sent to them didnt get any reply, why should i apply there ? :-/ |
| 05:08.05 | robbyoconnor | crakcs his knuckles :D |
| 05:08.06 | MatthewWilkes | movicont: Yes, there'll be an IRC channel for the mentoring orgs, dunno if students are allowed or if the channel name is 'secret' |
| 05:08.12 | robbyoconnor | now I just hope i get chosen |
| 05:08.18 | robbyoconnor | I put A LOT of effort into this app |
| 05:08.24 | movicont | MatthewWilkes: ahh, I see, thanks |
| 05:08.27 | robbyoconnor | skbohraL you applying? |
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| 05:08.30 | movicont | skbohra: I found an org like that too...I ended up not applying |
| 05:08.35 | MatthewWilkes | skbohra: Wow, weird. The mailing list is a mandatory field, I think. |
| 05:08.56 | skbohra | robbyoconnor: applied to freifunk.net |
| 05:09.07 | skbohra | MatthewWilkes: seriously weird |
| 05:09.16 | MatthewWilkes | skbohra: Send them an email and cc in carols? |
| 05:09.26 | skbohra | MatthewWilkes: lemme do that |
| 05:09.27 | MatthewWilkes | If they're not communicable they're wasting a spot |
| 05:09.48 | MatthewWilkes | hmm, communicable's not the right word |
| 05:09.52 | MatthewWilkes | Damn mornings |
| 05:09.58 | skbohra | i sent them mail thrice |
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| 05:10.10 | robbyoconnor | skbohra: send it again and CC carols :) |
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| 05:10.19 | robbyoconnor | god she has to get a cool name like lh! |
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| 05:10.29 | MatthewWilkes | robbyoconnor: Advice plagiarism! |
| 05:10.40 | robbyoconnor | MatthewWilkes: come and sue me |
| 05:10.43 | skbohra | carols [at] google dot com ? |
| 05:10.44 | robbyoconnor | BRING IT ON! |
| 05:10.52 | robbyoconnor | skbohra: si si si |
| 05:11.03 | MatthewWilkes | robbyoconnor: I'm from England, my dear. We don't *sue* people. |
| 05:11.12 | skbohra | orly :D |
| 05:11.16 | robbyoconnor | damn brits |
| 05:11.24 | robbyoconnor | THE BRITISH ARE COMING, THE BRITISH ARE COMING!!! |
| 05:11.25 | coppro | MatthewWilkes: you just tell on them to the BBC? |
| 05:11.37 | MatthewWilkes | coppro: We write sternly worded letters. |
| 05:11.50 | coppro | close enough |
| 05:11.50 | robbyoconnor | wags his finger at MatthewWilkes |
| 05:12.02 | robbyoconnor | your letters mean nothing |
| 05:12.03 | robbyoconnor | :) |
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| 05:12.16 | robbyoconnor | US Americans need to clog court dockets from now until the end of time |
| 05:12.17 | coppro | suddenly recalls Good Omens |
| 05:12.33 | d4ddi0 | heh. "Stop! or I shall have to tell you to stop again!" |
| 05:12.56 | skbohra | there i go ! |
| 05:12.57 | MatthewWilkes | *sigh*, you merkins will never understand |
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| 05:13.14 | skbohra | sky will fall now :D |
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| 05:13.51 | d4ddi0 | hmm. my alter ego enters the room. My workplace must be having network issues |
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| 05:14.24 | d4ddi0 | There I go again |
| 05:15.12 | ankitg | robbyoconnor: Dear Mr O'Conner, such appaulling display is just untolerable. Clearly Mr Wilkes was first to make such a proposition. Do realize that this channel is logged (although lacking its observers). Have a ruddy good day. |
| 05:16.19 | skbohra | ankitg: are you that from childhood :D |
| 05:16.31 | ankitg | P.S: The crumpets are getting cold. |
| 05:16.34 | robbyoconnor | pushes ankitg off the bridge |
| 05:16.34 | skbohra | runs |
| 05:16.38 | robbyoconnor | shuddup :) |
| 05:16.43 | ankitg | pushes back |
| 05:17.21 | ankitg | ... after all, Newton's second law: every action has an equal and opposite reaction ... |
| 05:17.40 | coppro | I like crumpets :( |
| 05:17.41 | robbyoconnor | DAMN YOU NEWTON |
| 05:18.15 | ankitg | robbyoconnor: That is Sir Isaac Newton to you ... *Sir*! |
| 05:18.21 | MatthewWilkes | ankitg: We'd never misspell the person's name, appalling, intolerable or realise. ;) |
| 05:18.46 | robbyoconnor | ankitg: you seriously messed up there i didnt catch it |
| 05:19.01 | ankitg | MatthewWilkes: I was trying to completely simulate a letter written in the morning ;) |
| 05:19.04 | MatthewWilkes | We take letters very seriously. :) |
| 05:19.18 | movicont | even those written in the mornings, without coffee?! |
| 05:19.20 | ankitg | MatthewWilkes: even in the morning!? |
| 05:19.31 | robbyoconnor | you simply don't write stern letters w/o coffee |
| 05:19.35 | robbyoconnor | you do it drunk |
| 05:19.44 | movicont | or while drinking your afternoon tea |
| 05:19.49 | robbyoconnor | DRUNK |
| 05:20.03 | robbyoconnor | nothing funnier than a letter written by a beligerant drunk |
| 05:20.09 | ankitg | Oh my! Now all my pre-conceived notions are shattered ... |
| 05:20.36 | robbyoconnor | or better yet, the drunk in person, come on people! |
| 05:20.47 | robbyoconnor | unless they get hurt, it's still funny! |
| 05:20.56 | movicont | if you pay for the airfare :) |
| 05:21.08 | robbyoconnor | movicont: BS |
| 05:21.36 | movicont | try me, heh |
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| 05:22.38 | movicont | actually, on a more serious note, anyone know if proposals can be edited after apr 9th? |
| 05:22.38 | arma | movicont: no, but i hear you can add comments |
| 05:22.45 | movicont | arma: thanks |
| 05:22.50 | coppro | something like that |
| 05:23.16 | robbyoconnor | My proposal is in a google doc |
| 05:23.29 | robbyoconnor | so I can ammend it and link the google doc :) |
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| 05:24.00 | movicont | ah, sounds like a good idea. I've got it in a google doc...guess I should prepare to link it in case of problems |
| 05:24.22 | robbyoconnor | !learn timeline as for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 05:24.23 | socinfo | The operation succeeded. |
| 05:24.26 | robbyoconnor | !timeline |
| 05:24.26 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
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| 05:25.06 | scorche | keep in mind that some orgs might prefer the application being in the app itself for ease of viewing and rating the proposals...though external links/resources may be linked |
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| 05:25.28 | robbyoconnor | scorche: oh i know |
| 05:25.31 | robbyoconnor | im gonna link it |
| 05:25.45 | robbyoconnor | but in google docs -- my app is like 9 i think |
| 05:25.49 | robbyoconnor | it's complete |
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| 05:33.45 | robbyoconnor | I cant see how to comment lol |
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| 05:45.59 | janes | is anyone here regarding JPF |
| 05:47.06 | scorche | !anyone |
| 05:47.06 | socinfo | "anyone" is Instead of looking for mentors from specific projects here, you will likely get much better results by speaking to that mentoring organization themselves. You can find the org's contact info by clicking on their name in the list at: http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2010 |
| 05:48.42 | janes | i cant find them in their irc |
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| 05:57.02 | jdk2588 | I wsnt to point out why the formatting tool doesn't work smoothly out when u copy and paste from an editor ?? |
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| 05:59.54 | janes | what is the deadline for application in IST |
| 06:00.44 | movicont | janes: it's in UDT |
| 06:01.10 | MatthewWilkes | !countdown |
| 06:01.10 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 06:01.19 | MatthewWilkes | janes: ^^^^ |
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| 06:02.07 | robbyoconnor | it's in! |
| 06:02.12 | robbyoconnor | janes: 3pm |
| 06:02.22 | robbyoconnor | 12PM PDT is the deadline |
| 06:02.26 | robbyoconnor | EDT is 3 hrs behind |
| 06:02.27 | robbyoconnor | ;) |
| 06:02.33 | robbyoconnor | er ahead |
| 06:03.02 | robbyoconnor | jdk2588: yeh i know |
| 06:03.04 | robbyoconnor | I had to fix it |
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| 06:03.19 | tobiw | sat, 7 am NZST ;) |
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| 06:04.44 | ajuonline | o.O |
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| 06:09.28 | robbyoconnor | ajuonline:I applied! |
| 06:09.29 | robbyoconnor | :) |
| 06:09.45 | robbyoconnor | I hope i get it |
| 06:09.58 | neptunepink | robbyoconnor: What did you apply for? |
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| 06:11.01 | robbyoconnor | top secret |
| 06:11.28 | ajuonline | neptunepink: he applied for Sahana. |
| 06:11.35 | neptunepink | has not heard of that |
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| 06:13.47 | skbohra | neptunepink: orly |
| 06:14.36 | robbyoconnor | ajuonline: I hate you :) |
| 06:14.50 | robbyoconnor | neptunepink: it's a diaster relief management application |
| 06:14.54 | robbyoconnor | (webapp) |
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| 06:18.05 | ihalip | morning |
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| 06:38.18 | thebolt | re-morning (from work this time) ;) |
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| 06:41.09 | janes | robbyconnor:3pm on 9th april in idia right |
| 06:42.21 | janes | 8india |
| 06:42.26 | janes | *india |
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| 07:07.10 | dholbach | good morning |
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| 07:15.39 | Chetan | hey |
| 07:15.45 | Chetan | Any mentor or admin here? |
| 07:17.04 | thiago_home | don't ask for a person, just ask your question |
| 07:17.07 | Dark_Shikari | !timeline |
| 07:17.07 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
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| 07:22.17 | Chetan | When do the orgs get to know the slots they have got from Google? |
| 07:22.29 | Chetan | as in the initial allocation |
| 07:22.38 | Chetan | I am aware that there are a lot of iterations and adjustments |
| 07:24.12 | kai | !slots |
| 07:24.12 | socinfo | "slots" is Slots are allocated after student proposals are all submitted. The final count of slots are unknown until the accepted students are announced. Please see http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/program/google/gsoc2009/studentallocations for further information on how slots are allocated. |
| 07:24.45 | kai | but I think melange colors the number of slots we get appropriately |
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| 07:46.43 | sanket | Do the proposal need to be pucliv to be visible to the community which it is applied to ? |
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| 07:46.47 | sanket | public* |
| 07:46.59 | |Kev| | No. |
| 07:47.10 | sanket | What does public imply then ? |
| 07:47.56 | |Kev| | You can give the link to other people. |
| 07:48.03 | kai | that people who are not signed up as a mentor for the org can view it as well |
| 07:48.14 | kai | like other developers from that community |
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| 07:48.45 | sanket | Okay. |
| 07:49.01 | sanket | That should help. How much time( in Hrs ) is left for apps ? |
| 07:49.15 | ihalip | 1 day and 9 hours? i guess |
| 07:49.55 | tobiw | !deadline |
| 07:49.55 | socinfo | "deadline" is see !timeline |
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| 07:59.28 | kai | !countdown |
| 07:59.28 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 08:43.50 | luis_ | Hello everybody |
| 08:44.14 | lcastillo | Please to meet all of you |
| 08:45.41 | ritek | does any one knows if the contact info can be used as the shipping info in the students profile? |
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| 08:45.59 | kai | ritek: should be mentioned on that page |
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| 08:46.33 | ritek | kai, thx |
| 08:48.05 | ritek | kai, do you know if the "Full recipient name" can be empty in case of P.O. box office? |
| 08:48.26 | kai | no idea about po boxes |
| 08:49.21 | ritek | =/ |
| 08:49.48 | kai | but I think my t-shirt was delivered by fed-ex, and I seem to remember them not delivering to po boxes |
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| 08:50.34 | ritek | does any one knows if the "Full recipient name" can be empty in case of PO boxes (in the student's profile page) ??? |
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| 08:53.22 | lcastillo | I would like to know if even being tomorrow the last day for submitting an GSOC idea, is there any possibility for accepting my idea in case of publish it this day? |
| 08:54.10 | |Kev| | lcastillo: if you're asking "Is it ok to submit my application before the deadline" then the answer is "Yes, of course" |
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| 08:54.24 | |Kev| | lcastillo: if you're asking "Is it ok to submit my application after the deadline" then the answer is "No" |
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| 08:56.40 | gc_ | can someone help me with mentor selection |
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| 08:57.48 | lcastillo | I want to propose an OpenCV application for Maemo 5 using the N900's camera, so you can choose an option in the camera menu for detecting faces and shoot the photograpy in this case. What do you think about it? |
| 08:58.06 | gc_ | arun: can u help me with gsoc 2010 |
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| 09:01.51 | janes | where can i find how much time is left for student application deadline |
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| 09:02.08 | aganice | !timeline |
| 09:02.08 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 09:02.10 | lcastillo | Deadline is Tomorrow 9 of April |
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| 09:09.47 | Wolf_OSGeo | !timer |
| 09:09.48 | socinfo | Error: "timer" is not a valid command. |
| 09:10.02 | Wolf_OSGeo | !countdown |
| 09:10.02 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 09:13.52 | lcastillo | one question, in the student registration form, in the field Home Page, or Blog, can I put the URL of your ID that you give in the personal profile, where you have to propose the idea? |
| 09:15.57 | Wolf_OSGeo | !next |
| 09:15.57 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
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| 09:16.47 | lcastillo | How can I know what is my GSOC personal blog or page by means of my ID? |
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| 09:18.14 | mkarnicki | it's not connected with your ID. it's just your regular blog/webpage |
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| 09:18.23 | mkarnicki | not necessarily hosted by google |
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| 09:19.02 | lcastillo | Ok, thanks |
| 09:19.13 | mkarnicki | np |
| 09:20.04 | mkarnicki | lcastillo: i don't have a blog, so left it empty. i have an extremely simple page @ my institute, so i've put it in the webpage field :) |
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| 09:23.38 | lcastillo | And, in other case, how can I know what is my project proposal page by means of my ID? I saw it when I created my ID but I don't remember it and now, I want to put the idea's information. I know I can put it with the Edit menu, but I don't find the absolute link (Sorry for my poor English). |
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| 09:24.23 | pdelgallego | hi anyone knows how to submit a proposal ? |
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| 09:24.47 | pdelgallego | I trying to find the link in the gsoc page, but I cant find it |
| 09:25.00 | cheukchuen | http://socghop.appspot.com/ |
| 09:25.40 | cheukchuen | it's under Programs/GSoC2010/Submit your Student Proposal |
| 09:26.00 | tobiw | read the user guide. it's not a 5 second registration/submission thing |
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| 09:26.49 | pdelgallego | cheukchuen, I dont have any Submit under Programs/GSoC2010/ |
| 09:27.02 | pdelgallego | tobiw, I already singed up. |
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| 09:28.16 | cheukchuen | oh.. have u registered as a student yet? |
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| 09:29.29 | pdelgallego | cheukchuen, yes, but I still see Register as an Student |
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| 09:31.12 | cheukchuen | weird. by right u'll see submit your student proposal and edit my student profile after u registered |
| 09:31.34 | cheukchuen | care to click Register as a Student again? |
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| 09:32.23 | pdelgallego | cheukchuen, yes I going to click and follow the process again, maybe it wasnt a valid registration the first time |
| 09:34.48 | pdelgallego | cheukchuen, now I can see it, something went wrong the first time. Thx. |
| 09:35.13 | cheukchuen | no problem :) |
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| 09:46.06 | x` | how awesome is this: http://aturingmachine.com/ |
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| 09:50.37 | mkarnicki | x`: this is insane! :D *loves it* |
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| 09:57.06 | thebolt | x`: nice :) |
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| 10:23.53 | Waren | yo |
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| 10:36.54 | Diuturnal | Hello. |
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| 10:54.26 | umashanthi | !countdown |
| 10:54.27 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 11:13.52 | fweisbec | this countdown is a cool thing :) |
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| 11:54.22 | shreyas | !next |
| 11:54.22 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 11:54.41 | shreyas | when will you know if your proposal has been accepted or not |
| 11:55.54 | mmadia | on the 26th, according to the timeline. |
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| 12:01.49 | Beket | Hellooo everybody! Is it impossible for someone to have both roles 'mentor' and 'student' ? The web interface seems to disallow that. Can anyone please confirm ? |
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| 12:02.41 | hwked | Beket: yes, if you read the faqs, you can only be a mentor or a student |
| 12:02.42 | kai | Beket: that's because you can't be a mentor and a student at the same time |
| 12:02.53 | Beket | Excellent, thanks both |
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| 12:07.36 | sfb | kai: Good morning. |
| 12:07.49 | kai | sfb: morning |
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| 12:08.14 | bawr | yawns |
| 12:08.31 | bawr | I just got up and it's after midday. Par for the course. |
| 12:10.29 | thebolt | bah, i've been at work for six hours already.. |
| 12:10.40 | kai | thebolt: same here |
| 12:10.47 | sfb | About 45 minutes here. |
| 12:10.48 | sfb | heh |
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| 12:11.26 | aghisla | is unusually productive |
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| 12:14.59 | thebolt | aghisla: opposite here |
| 12:15.04 | thebolt | less productive than in long time |
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| 12:19.15 | kai | yay |
| 12:19.34 | kai | I just successfully remembered how to get the heck out of emacs :) |
| 12:19.35 | kai | phew |
| 12:19.55 | thebolt | hehe |
| 12:19.58 | thebolt | vim.. :P |
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| 12:29.44 | adimania | Will I be able to edit my applications after the application period finishes? |
| 12:29.52 | mmadia | !edit |
| 12:29.53 | socinfo | "edit" is You can submit your application early and edit it up until the deadline (April 9). Once the deadline passes, you cannot edit it. Instead, leave comments. |
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| 12:30.31 | adimania | thanks :) |
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| 12:32.49 | ebo | !timeline |
| 12:32.49 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 12:33.18 | loupgaroublond | haha, those explicit dollar sign are awesome |
| 12:34.39 | vegard | jpg, though? O.o |
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| 12:35.35 | ebo | hi... |
| 12:35.58 | ajuonline | !countdown |
| 12:35.58 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 12:36.29 | ebo | I was checking into the timeline. It is 10 weeks of work + 2 or is it 4 weeks to polishup? Somewhere I got 4 weeks, but seems I might be wrong. |
| 12:38.26 | koryk_ | ebo: 2 weeks left is rough pencils down, 1 week left is official pencils down, documentation, etc. but if you feel you need more time to polish up, document I am sure it can be written into your proposal |
| 12:39.44 | ihalip | loupgaroublond: i just wanted to say that :) |
| 12:40.06 | ebo | so is the max total 12 or 14 weeks? |
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| 12:41.55 | koryk_ | ebo 12 weeks after start is firm pencils down |
| 12:42.05 | ebo | also refering to the gsoc10timeline.JPG, I thought evaluations was July 7'th... |
| 12:42.19 | koryk_ | then 4 days later are evaluations http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/timeline |
| 12:42.22 | ebo | koryk_: thanks, I had it wrong. |
| 12:42.26 | koryk_ | ebo: those are interim evals |
| 12:42.44 | ebo | thanks. |
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| 12:45.24 | Mitar | why are mentoring scores being sorted as text and not as numbers? |
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| 12:46.54 | killerchicken_ | !bugs |
| 12:46.54 | socinfo | "bugs" is Melange bugs are tracked at http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/list, you can file a new bug at http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/entry |
| 12:47.01 | Mitar | thanks |
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| 13:05.13 | sfb | neL: That's an awesome nickname. (; |
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| 13:28.55 | fweisbec | !timeline |
| 13:28.56 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
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| 13:29.26 | fweisbec | !countdown |
| 13:29.27 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 13:30.54 | Crofton | for scoring, we can rank each proposal from +4 to -4 |
| 13:31.17 | Crofton | each person scoring does not have a limited number of points? |
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| 13:32.59 | ronia | Hi! I was wondering, if writing documentation for a real good, but poorly documented project could be considered/accepted as a GSOC application? |
| 13:33.08 | mmadia | nope. |
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| 13:34.09 | sfb | ronia: Google Summer of *Code* (= |
| 13:35.18 | ronia | I get it. :) I have been going through potential projects in my head, and I just wanted to be sure. Thx. |
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| 13:35.25 | killerchicken_ | which doesn't mean that good documentation shouldn't be part of any gsoc project ;) |
| 13:35.34 | kai | ronia: no, but you can do this outside of gsoc anyway :) |
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| 13:35.43 | kai | killerchicken_: yeah, right... |
| 13:36.17 | killerchicken_ | kai: (-: |
| 13:36.19 | kai | oh, somehow I heard irony in that. bad voice, no cookie |
| 13:36.26 | killerchicken_ | irony? |
| 13:36.27 | killerchicken_ | no way |
| 13:36.33 | killerchicken_ | I really do mean it. |
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| 13:37.33 | kai | true, it's not what you want to schedule for after the pens down date :) |
| 13:37.55 | killerchicken_ | indeed |
| 13:38.15 | killerchicken_ | I just talked an otherwise promising student out of doing exactly that ;) |
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| 13:45.10 | ruwan | hi an emergency here! |
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| 13:45.44 | ruwan | I've withdrawn my application by mistake |
| 13:46.00 | ruwan | how can I fix it..? |
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| 13:46.25 | ihalip | um... submit it again? |
| 13:47.18 | ruwan | any way of un-withdrawing it..? |
| 13:47.27 | ihalip | no idea, sorry |
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| 13:56.50 | joelpet | is an application binding? |
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| 13:58.52 | joelpet | that is, is it possible to submit a proposal now, and then decline around the 26th of April? |
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| 13:59.11 | joelpet | under the assumption that the proposal is accepted |
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| 14:01.06 | kartik | !countdown |
| 14:01.07 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 14:05.33 | Reinout_Stevens | can you delete a proposal from your proposal page? |
| 14:06.34 | Reinout_Stevens | k nvm, got it |
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| 14:14.39 | Ian_Corne | Is there a way to view other people's proposals? |
| 14:15.26 | Ivanovic | not in the google form |
| 14:15.32 | lcastillo | GoodBye! |
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| 14:17.21 | ihalip | Ian_Corne: not unless they give you the exact link |
| 14:18.26 | Reinout_Stevens | when an organization has a proposal, can you just supply the url to that proposal |
| 14:18.43 | fweisbec | grm, is there a mentor faq somewhere? just to get what a mentor is supposed to do |
| 14:18.59 | fweisbec | the amount of work and so |
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| 14:19.19 | rajat | wonders why the proposal editor has an underline button, when it clearly won't allow us to use it |
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| 14:22.02 | fweisbec | !mentor |
| 14:22.02 | socinfo | Error: "mentor" is not a valid command. |
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| 14:27.12 | crosvera | tomorrow is the final deadline!! |
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| 14:33.01 | igorto | hello what means: List of my ineligible/withdrawn Student Proposals. In the student proposals |
| 14:34.03 | arun | igorto, the student withdrew his/her app or the mentoring org marked the proposal as ineligible. |
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| 14:34.29 | borja | !next |
| 14:34.30 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 14:34.38 | borja | hrm |
| 14:34.40 | borja | !countdown |
| 14:34.41 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 14:34.51 | arun | fweisbec, http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforMentors |
| 14:35.03 | fweisbec | arun: thanks! |
| 14:35.22 | igorto | arun, the question is why the student would be withdrew his app? |
| 14:35.45 | kai | igorto: decided s/he didn't want to do the project after all? |
| 14:35.47 | arun | igorto, you'd have to ask the student. |
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| 14:36.11 | arun | igorto, we had one student withdraw and resubmit. i'm not sure why. |
| 14:36.39 | kai | igorto: what arun said, we had that as well |
| 14:36.52 | kai | probably the student didn't realize they could still edit the proposal |
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| 14:39.26 | ihalip | there was someone in here earlier saying he withdrew it by mistake :) |
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| 14:45.50 | kai | ihalip: I guess similar to these people who resign as a student by accident |
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| 14:50.22 | safal_soni | skbohra:i am thinking to make a project on gesture recognition can u suggest me some organisations who take cares of such projects |
| 14:51.24 | nmudgal | safal_soni: learn googling ! |
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| 14:53.56 | arun | safal_soni, you could try NUIgroup: http://wiki.nuigroup.com/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010. i think that's what they do. |
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| 14:55.54 | skbohra | ah he left |
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| 14:57.45 | sharavsambuu | hey everybody! |
| 14:58.16 | linclark | what exactly is the role of the mentor? |
| 14:58.19 | safal_soni | please answer |
| 14:58.55 | safal_soni | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:58.57 | linclark | is it to connect the student to other people in teh community, or to be a subject expert him/herself? |
| 14:59.45 | danderson | linclark: review the student's work, guide the student, make them feel at ease |
| 15:00.08 | danderson | so they should be able to tell whether or not the student is doing good work or not, if that's your definition of a subject expert |
| 15:00.24 | danderson | safal_soni: |
| 15:00.25 | danderson | !orgs |
| 15:00.26 | socinfo | "orgs" is The list of accepted mentoring organizations is here: http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2010 |
| 15:00.27 | linclark | danderson: thanks! that helps |
| 15:00.33 | Reinout_Stevens | when an organization has a proposal, can you just supply the url to that proposal for your own proposal? |
| 15:00.35 | jbartosik | !next |
| 15:00.35 | danderson | it is *your* responsibility to find orgs. |
| 15:00.36 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 15:00.53 | jbartosik | !proposal |
| 15:00.53 | socinfo | Error: "proposal" is not a valid command. |
| 15:00.57 | jbartosik | !commands |
| 15:00.57 | socinfo | Error: "commands" is not a valid command. |
| 15:01.01 | jbartosik | !help |
| 15:01.01 | socinfo | "help" is !next, !faq, !advice and !wiki. !botabuse tells you about private query syntax |
| 15:01.03 | nmudgal | safal_soni: <arun> safal_soni, you could try NUIgroup: http://wiki.nuigroup.com/Google_Summer_of_Code_2010. i think that's what they do. |
| 15:01.04 | danderson | Reinout_Stevens: if you don't add any data, especially if you haven't talked to the org, your chances of being accepted with just an URL are zero. |
| 15:01.16 | danderson | however, linking to the org's idea in your proposal would be a good idea, yes. |
| 15:01.17 | jbartosik | !faq |
| 15:01.18 | socinfo | "faq" is http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs |
| 15:01.23 | jbartosik | !advice |
| 15:01.24 | socinfo | "advice" is http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforStudents for students, http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforMentors for mentors |
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| 15:01.30 | danderson | !botabuse |
| 15:01.31 | socinfo | "botabuse" is (#1) Leave me alone! (also, you can play with me as much as you like in a private /query so as not to spam the channel), or (#2) When in a query with me, use whatis #gsoc <factoid> to get the best use., or (#3) You can also get a list of factoids with 'factoids search #gsoc *' and 'more' |
| 15:01.33 | Reinout_Stevens | I have talked to the org, smalltalk has their own website for student proposals etc |
| 15:01.33 | danderson | jbartosik: ^ |
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| 15:02.07 | danderson | Reinout_Stevens: in that case, do what makes sense for the org |
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| 15:02.57 | Reinout_Stevens | k, thx |
| 15:03.17 | skbohra | if you knew answer whats point of asking |
| 15:03.24 | jbartosik | Is proposal editable after I click submit ( but before deadline)? |
| 15:03.35 | mmadia | !edit |
| 15:03.36 | socinfo | "edit" is You can submit your application early and edit it up until the deadline (April 9). Once the deadline passes, you cannot edit it. Instead, leave comments. |
| 15:03.41 | jbartosik | Othx |
| 15:04.12 | jbartosik | !help doesnt list t |
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| 15:04.13 | socinfo | Error: "help" is not a valid command. |
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| 15:04.42 | danderson | because if it listed all the factoids the channel would be flooded every time anyone needs help |
| 15:04.57 | danderson | see !botabuse for instructions on how to obtain and consult the full factoid list in private |
| 15:07.42 | jbartosik | <PROTECTED> |
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| 15:09.44 | mmadia | this is a bit off topic, but would "Google & the Google Summer of Code program" be appropriate when expressing thanks, as in an binary's about window? |
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| 15:11.16 | ajuonline | Jai Ho! |
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| 15:13.18 | jkridner | what is the position on "open hardware"? |
| 15:13.40 | jkridner | we are encouraging students to include a significant software component to any proposal. |
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| 15:14.15 | jkridner | and encouraging them to ensure any hardware component is readily available/affordable over most of the world.... |
| 15:14.31 | jkridner | but it would be nice to know this is the right guidance. |
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| 15:21.55 | jkwood | jkridner: I'm fairly certain that Google will not pay for working on hardware, only software. |
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| 15:22.27 | jkwood | In a similar vein, we can't ask stupdents to do graphics for us, even if it's related directly to their project. |
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| 15:23.11 | jkridner | Fair enough. I'm needing to do a lot of refocusing of students away from doing hardware toward doing more software and I'll push even harder. |
| 15:25.00 | dev29aug | what is tinymce in gsoc code site ? |
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| 15:25.29 | dev29aug | googling |
| 15:25.45 | |Kev| | It's the WYSIWYG widget. |
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| 15:28.43 | Elsewise | Hello, I am very sorry to ask for this, but I found out that the deadline is to tomorrow, can someone give me a hint on the essential steps? I filled out the information form about myself, but don't know where to go next |
| 15:29.04 | |Kev| | There's a user guide, probably somewhere down the left hand side. |
| 15:30.42 | linclark | is there anyone from Drupal in here? |
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| 15:36.29 | mmadia | linclark : iirc, there's #drupal |
| 15:36.41 | linclark | yeah, I'm in drupal as well |
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| 15:49.12 | Beket | Helloo everyone. When I click 'make public' I guess others could see my proposal. But what link should they use to reach it ? I grepped for 'public' in the faq and didn't find anything relevant |
| 15:50.03 | Ivanovic | Beket: you have to tell them the link |
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| 15:50.43 | skbohra | Beket:quick trick -- change private from url to show |
| 15:51.02 | skbohra | and share that url |
| 15:51.03 | dev29aug | Hello ! How can I show my previous coding as it is asked to mention in proposal ? Do I need to upload my code to some version control system first ? |
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| 15:51.17 | skbohra | dev29aug: that would help certainly |
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| 15:52.28 | jbartosik | !advice |
| 15:52.29 | socinfo | "advice" is http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforStudents for students, http://code.google.com/p/google-summer-of-code/wiki/AdviceforMentors for mentors |
| 15:52.32 | Beket | Thank you all |
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| 15:56.35 | dev29aug | skbohra, If I upload content on kenai ? I have my source code in netbeans and netbeans have kenai. |
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| 16:14.03 | mayanks43 | Hey can anybody tell me how to directly add pics to the proposal without a url link |
| 16:14.11 | mayanks43 | ? |
| 16:14.26 | mayanks43 | coz some prob with my hosting site |
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| 16:19.05 | MrSmellySocks | mayanks43: you can upload the image to http://imageshack.us/ |
| 16:19.31 | robbyoconnor | mayanks43: or use picasa. |
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| 16:20.28 | mayanks43 | k thnk u |
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| 16:27.17 | carlasouza | !countdown |
| 16:27.17 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 16:28.16 | helgoman | hi |
| 16:28.50 | Chetan | hey |
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| 16:29.47 | helgoman | i have a question about my proposal... I edited it and now my new version is listed as withdraw and my old version is the actual proposal... how can i manage to change it? |
| 16:30.31 | xiainx | sidebar -> List my Student Proposals |
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| 16:30.39 | xiainx | choose the one oyu want to edit |
| 16:30.51 | xiainx | at the top, in the title, there's a link that says (Edit my Proposal) |
| 16:30.54 | xiainx | click on that, and there you go |
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| 16:36.51 | skbohra | robbyoconnor: yay! finally that org replied back :D |
| 16:37.14 | skbohra | but its too late :\ |
| 16:37.41 | mlankhorst | !next |
| 16:37.41 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 16:37.56 | robbyoconnor | mlankhorst |
| 16:38.22 | robbyoconnor | carols: ping |
| 16:38.42 | carols | robbyoconnor: pong |
| 16:39.04 | mlankhorst | hi carols :) |
| 16:39.07 | robbyoconnor | I submitted my application and ping'd the mentor |
| 16:39.12 | carols | whhey mlankhorst :-) |
| 16:39.13 | robbyoconnor | but it's not showing up for them... |
| 16:39.30 | carols | robbyoconnor: can you see it in your proposals list? |
| 16:39.39 | robbyoconnor | yes |
| 16:39.42 | robbyoconnor | Sahana |
| 16:40.05 | skbohra | omg, i dont know if my mentors can see it or not |
| 16:40.15 | skbohra | i hope they should |
| 16:40.21 | carols | robbyoconnor: possible its a bug, you might want to ping the melange guys |
| 16:40.23 | robbyoconnor | skbohra: the mentor said he couldn't. |
| 16:40.35 | skbohra | robbyoconnor: ah |
| 16:40.54 | robbyoconnor | protip: before making a wiseass remark, get the whole story |
| 16:41.05 | robbyoconnor | otherwise it's just ass remark w/o the wise. |
| 16:42.21 | skbohra | robbyoconnor: :) i was saying about my mentor |
| 16:42.51 | jkwood | protip: When talking in a giant irc channel, don't assume everyone is talking about you. |
| 16:42.56 | mlankhorst | bah |
| 16:43.00 | mlankhorst | misses coffee |
| 16:43.23 | *** join/#gsoc pcman (~chatzilla@port1.vghtpe.gov.tw) |
| 16:43.27 | pcman | hi all |
| 16:43.46 | pcman | I'm a mentor of our GSoc project. |
| 16:44.04 | pcman | what will happen if I click "I want to menter this student" button on the proposal page? |
| 16:44.31 | mlankhorst | You tell your intent to mentor this student? |
| 16:44.33 | mlankhorst | ;) |
| 16:44.33 | jkwood | pcman: It will let your organization know that you're willing to mentor them if they are chosen. |
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| 16:47.12 | mayanks43 | image shack \m/ |
| 16:48.05 | pcman | jkwood: then how can our organization decide who to choose? |
| 16:48.31 | danderson | with scoring |
| 16:48.51 | pcman | danderson: who can choose? |
| 16:48.58 | pcman | danderson: and how? |
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| 16:48.59 | danderson | what? |
| 16:49.08 | danderson | you choose by ranking the applications |
| 16:49.11 | danderson | you, the mentors |
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| 16:49.22 | pcman | danderson: who can choose which student can get the project? |
| 16:49.25 | danderson | then, at some point, google tells you how many student slots you have |
| 16:49.36 | danderson | and then you tweak the ranking |
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| 16:49.43 | danderson | and the first N proposals in scored order are accepted |
| 16:49.50 | danderson | pcman: you do. The mentors. |
| 16:49.55 | pcman | danderson: so what we need to do now is scoring? |
| 16:50.08 | pcman | and then who will be accepted will be determined later? |
| 16:50.13 | danderson | yes |
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| 16:50.30 | pcman | danderson: should we do that before the deadline? |
| 16:50.35 | danderson | !timeline |
| 16:50.35 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 16:50.46 | pcman | socinfo: thx |
| 16:50.47 | socinfo | Error: "thx" is not a valid command. |
| 16:50.59 | danderson | Student ranking/scoring deadline is the 21st April |
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| 16:51.39 | danderson | then, between 21st and 26th, we make the final tweaks (conflict resolution, a little bit of slot reallocations etc. |
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| 16:51.56 | pcman | danderson: will the students see their ranking or scores? |
| 16:51.57 | al1943 | !extension |
| 16:51.57 | socinfo | "extension" is The deadline WAS NOT extended and WILL NOT be. Not even for you. |
| 16:52.01 | danderson | pcman: no. |
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| 16:52.07 | pcman | danderson: ok, thanks. |
| 16:52.14 | danderson | students only see comments that you mark as "public" iirc |
| 16:52.26 | danderson | but scores and private comments are between mentors only |
| 16:52.29 | pcman | danderson: so can we do the scoring now or should we do it after 4/9? |
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| 16:52.45 | danderson | pcman: you can start now, it doesn't matter either way. |
| 16:52.57 | pcman | danderson: ok, thanks. |
| 16:53.08 | al1943 | so there's no extension for sure? |
| 16:53.12 | *** part/#gsoc umashanthi (~A@112.135.184.181) |
| 16:53.13 | danderson | !extension |
| 16:53.13 | socinfo | "extension" is The deadline WAS NOT extended and WILL NOT be. Not even for you. |
| 16:53.43 | al1943 | ok. I'd hurry up... |
| 16:53.43 | danderson | the bot is correct and accurate. |
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| 16:54.16 | al1943 | thanks |
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| 16:54.42 | shikhark | i just filled the student information form |
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| 16:55.05 | shikhark | got an error...You cannot become a Student because you are already participating in this program. |
| 16:55.18 | danderson | are you already registered as a mentor? |
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| 16:56.02 | shikhark | no, i am a student |
| 16:56.22 | jenred | carols are you around? |
| 16:56.24 | danderson | go to #melange and ask for help |
| 16:56.26 | *** join/#gsoc Mek (~marijn@93.157.1.37) |
| 16:56.28 | dhaun | a lot of people seem to click on that "accepting applications" link and then get that message |
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| 16:56.42 | carols | jenred: yes |
| 16:56.44 | shikhark | dhaun, i click accpeting applications too |
| 16:56.48 | carols | sorry, in and out for meetings but im here |
| 16:57.10 | dhaun | shikhark: can you see a link to submit a student proposal on the left? |
| 16:57.18 | dhaun | if so, use that and you're all set |
| 16:57.21 | jenred | so I have a student who needs her link id changed -- she isn't getting any response from the Melange team -- they marked her bug as "will not fix" |
| 16:57.32 | jenred | how do I help her get her link id changed? |
| 16:57.40 | shikhark | dhaun: nopes :( |
| 16:57.54 | dhaun | okay, then you need help from the experts ... |
| 16:58.15 | carols | SRabberlier: you around |
| 16:58.17 | carols | ah |
| 16:58.20 | shikhark | dhaun: got it fixed, thanx |
| 16:58.25 | carols | SRabbelier: you around? |
| 16:58.32 | dhaun | shikhark: how? |
| 16:58.41 | SRabbelier | carols: of course, always :) |
| 16:58.46 | shikhark | logged in again :) |
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| 16:59.01 | carols | SRabbelier: could you help out jenred? |
| 16:59.02 | dhaun | shikhark: k, good idea |
| 16:59.40 | SRabbelier | carols: the bug is marked "will not fix", because we can't fix it |
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| 17:00.08 | carols | SRabbelier: fair enough, so what should the student's course of action be? make a new profile? |
| 17:00.11 | SRabbelier | jenred: I'm sorry, but you'll have to tell your student that they're stuck with the link_id they chose, as they were told when they chose that link id, in big, yellow, letters |
| 17:00.31 | jenred | SRabbelier her linkid is "o" |
| 17:00.36 | SRabbelier | carols: live with the consequences of their actions :P, there were a bunch of organizations last year that had funky link_ids for that same reason |
| 17:00.40 | SRabbelier | jenred: good for her |
| 17:00.43 | SRabbelier | jenred: nice 'n short :) |
| 17:00.55 | danderson | what does it matter anyway? |
| 17:01.06 | danderson | I thought the link_id was just used as a primary key in URLs and the like |
| 17:01.09 | SRabbelier | danderson: we really just should have used incremental ids |
| 17:01.17 | SRabbelier | danderson: that's exactly right |
| 17:01.23 | danderson | yeah, so who the hell cares. |
| 17:01.33 | SRabbelier | danderson: Apparnetly jenred's student does |
| 17:01.35 | carols | jenred: this sounds reasonable to me, the student was warned when he/she signed up. |
| 17:01.50 | danderson | carols: and it also doesn't actually matter :) |
| 17:01.59 | carols | danderson: also true. :-) |
| 17:02.01 | SRabbelier | (again in very big, and yellow-boxed letters :P) |
| 17:02.04 | danderson | I'd understand if the link_id were screwgsoc or something, that might look bad |
| 17:02.08 | danderson | but there, eh |
| 17:02.14 | jenred | fine |
| 17:02.15 | danderson | it's an arbitrary blob ID used in URLs |
| 17:02.21 | mayanks43 | gsoc \m/ |
| 17:02.51 | kimelto | morning! |
| 17:02.51 | danderson | SRabbelier: honestly, for next time round, I'd remove the link_id, pull a random number out of app-engine's ass, and set link_id = sha(random number) |
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| 17:03.05 | jenred | or maybe just use UIDs |
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| 17:03.15 | jenred | that make sense |
| 17:03.33 | SRabbelier | danderson: and for everybody else the hash of the current link_id :D |
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| 17:03.46 | danderson | that's pretty much what I'm saying. The sha() step is just to avoid them being sequential |
| 17:03.49 | danderson | scraping bad. |
| 17:04.08 | SRabbelier | no seriously, I just checked |
| 17:04.12 | SRabbelier | this is what it says when you sign up |
| 17:04.17 | SRabbelier | "This Link ID is used throughout the site when creating various URL links related to you and content you create. As a result, it may only consist ofASCII alphanumeric characters, digits, and underscores. Also, it must be unique and not in use by any other user of the site." |
| 17:04.22 | danderson | I want you to have to scrape the entire sha512 search space if you want student info :P |
| 17:04.24 | SRabbelier | below that, in h1 font: "The Link ID can NOT be changed." |
| 17:04.29 | SRabbelier | danderson: hahah :P |
| 17:06.36 | kpreid | SRabbelier: that message doesn't really say that it will be used to label you |
| 17:06.43 | jenred | SRabbelier people make mistakes |
| 17:06.50 | kpreid | its emphasis is on the constraints on it, not why you care about what it is |
| 17:06.54 | jenred | and Melange is not easy to use |
| 17:07.08 | SRabbelier | jenred: it's not? |
| 17:07.10 | kpreid | s/why you/that you might/ |
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| 17:07.21 | jenred | no SRabbelier it is not |
| 17:07.26 | |Kev| | kpreid: it says it's going to be used in your URLs. |
| 17:07.30 | jenred | and this is my 2nd time around |
| 17:07.31 | SRabbelier | kpreid: it's used to label you for all urls is what that says, no? |
| 17:07.49 | SRabbelier | jenred: why haven't you told us what's bothering you? |
| 17:07.54 | kpreid | SRabbelier: yes, it does say that but not in language that makes that the point of the message. |
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| 17:08.09 | SRabbelier | kpreid: hmmm, true |
| 17:08.32 | kpreid | If it were more like "This Link ID will appear in the URLs for content you create." it would be clearer. |
| 17:08.40 | *** part/#gsoc shikhark (~7838cfc1@gateway/web/freenode/x-stvxonbbsvjprcif) |
| 17:08.46 | kpreid | As opposed to "links ... related to you" |
| 17:09.26 | SRabbelier | kpreid: *nods* |
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| 17:12.44 | ruturaj | can we edit the proposals once the deadline is over? |
| 17:12.48 | SRabbelier | kpreid: http://code.google.com/p/soc/source/browse/app/soc/templates/soc/user/edit_profile.html |
| 17:12.49 | smtms | no |
| 17:12.53 | SRabbelier | ruturaj: only the abstract |
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| 17:13.22 | SRabbelier | kpreid: if you're interested in submitting a patch, that's the file, see also http://code.google.com/p/soc/wiki/ContributionReviews |
| 17:13.53 | ruturaj | but arent we allowed to edit it everytime a comment is posted? |
| 17:14.03 | SRabbelier | jenred: saying "it's not user friendly" is not very productive, it's something that makes us (the developers that are working on Melange in our free time) feel bad, with no way of improving it |
| 17:14.15 | SRabbelier | ruturaj: you are allowed to edit it as much as you want until the deadline |
| 17:14.21 | SRabbelier | ruturaj: the comment-related stuff was from previous years |
| 17:14.42 | ruturaj | ok, thanx, misunderstanding .. sorry..thanx again |
| 17:15.23 | SRabbelier | ruturaj: no problem |
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| 17:16.47 | enthus | !next |
| 17:16.48 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 17:16.56 | annag | SRabbelier: it would be nice with a preview function in melange before submiting your proposal |
| 17:17.21 | SRabbelier | annag: hmm, you could save your proposal as a document in Melange first, it'd look the same |
| 17:17.30 | pdani | is it possible that google extends the deadline? |
| 17:17.52 | thiago_home | pdani: no |
| 17:18.08 | thiago_home | pdani: plan on submitting today |
| 17:18.16 | thiago_home | plan on making the last changes at most one hour before the deadline |
| 17:18.23 | dhaun | !extension |
| 17:18.24 | socinfo | "extension" is The deadline WAS NOT extended and WILL NOT be. Not even for you. |
| 17:18.34 | dhaun | heh, just checking if it still works :P |
| 17:18.40 | mkarnicki | haha good one |
| 17:20.32 | SRabbelier | pdani: in fact, the system will probably blow up a few hours before the deadline, deleting any submissions made after 23:23 UTC today :P |
| 17:20.34 | SRabbelier | (j/k) |
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| 17:21.33 | mkarnicki | !timeline |
| 17:21.33 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 17:21.33 | smtms | 23:23 sounds very made-up |
| 17:21.57 | mkarnicki | uuu nice visual timeline ;) |
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| 17:22.34 | SRabbelier | smtms: it was :D |
| 17:22.46 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: fancy! |
| 17:23.56 | kpreid | SRabbelier: OK, I have a patch. Shall I create an issue? |
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| 17:23.56 | mkarnicki | SRabbelier: indeed! :D |
| 17:23.57 | SRabbelier | kpreid: sure, that way it won't get lost as easily |
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| 17:23.57 | kpreid | (I don't have a lot of spare time for YA project, and I also don't have Mercurial installed) |
| 17:24.06 | alyman | I'm in Mountain View for the day -- any Googlers and/or GSoC participants in the area, and willing to let me buy them lunch? |
| 17:24.26 | joelpet | is it possible that a failure of reaching the goal in this year's project will affect the chance to be selected next year? |
| 17:25.06 | annag | SRabbelier: I guess you could save your proposal as a document but I'm not sure how many would actually think of doing so before submitting (I know I didn't) |
| 17:25.36 | smtms | joelpet, there are people that failed two years in succession |
| 17:26.02 | mkarnicki | smtms: you mean, failed to reach the goals? |
| 17:26.02 | annag | SRabbelier: also, if you edit your proposal you'd have to do that in the document as well, would be nicer to have that functionallity straight on the page where you can edit it I think... |
| 17:26.12 | smtms | joelpet, that said, the mentoring orgs are learning more and more each year |
| 17:26.15 | SRabbelier | annag: and you can always edit your proposal after submitting; either way, it should look the same as what you had when you hit save |
| 17:26.39 | jenred | SRabbelier you are right - I usually try to avoid that sort of hyperbole - my apologies |
| 17:26.41 | smtms | mkarnicki, failed - no positive final evaluation |
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| 17:26.52 | SRabbelier | jenred: thank you |
| 17:27.07 | joelpet | smtms: I see.. thanks |
| 17:27.17 | mkarnicki | smtms: and yet, such person got accepted the next year? |
| 17:27.30 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: sure, probably not with the same organization though |
| 17:27.35 | smtms | mkarnicki, yes, that's what I said |
| 17:27.59 | smtms | SRabbelier, it was the same organization for the two students I have in mind |
| 17:28.02 | mkarnicki | smtms: oh. interesting. it's nice they got another chance to show what they've got :) |
| 17:28.23 | smtms | mkarnicki, it's not nice that they blew their chance |
| 17:28.37 | mkarnicki | smtms: naturally.. that's very bad. |
| 17:28.43 | SRabbelier | smtms: curious |
| 17:28.54 | jenred | however, ppl telling new students "too bad RTFM" or ignoring their requests when they are following the process makes me a little angry. |
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| 17:28.58 | mkarnicki | smtms: I know its a geat opportunity, to fail it is.. well, sad. |
| 17:29.20 | jenred | I have some ideas to constructively address this which I'll send to the mentor list :> |
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| 17:30.21 | annag | SRabbelier: well yeah, I know, but seeing the changes before posting them is a good thing even if you can edit afterwards... I tend to notice more things to change once I started and then have to flip between editing the document and the "result" after saving it which is a bit annoying... |
| 17:30.33 | mkarnicki | if I was a 'RTFM' somewhere, I wouldn't mind. I'm a student myself, and I've seen tens of mails on the mailing list asking each day the same questions |
| 17:30.47 | SRabbelier | jenred: the problem is that we technically can't do anything about it |
| 17:30.50 | annag | SRabbelier: still, it was only a suggestion :) |
| 17:31.10 | jenred | SRabbelier I of course understand this! |
| 17:31.10 | mkarnicki | lol.. i meant, if I *saw* rtfm ;d |
| 17:31.26 | SRabbelier | annag: I'm not sure I understand? |
| 17:31.44 | jenred | I just think we can help each other be more diplomatic in communicating amongst ourselves and to new students/mentors |
| 17:31.50 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: there's a pretty clear FM on Melange if that's what your asking? |
| 17:32.23 | SRabbelier | jenred: you are right, my tone was too harsh, my apologies for that :) |
| 17:32.25 | mkarnicki | SRabbelier: no thanks, i've got everything :) I answered jenred about "Too bad RTFM" to new students. |
| 17:32.33 | annag | SRabbelier: well, I just want an additional button to preview the document as it would look like before finally saving it. Some wikis for instance have this feature... |
| 17:32.49 | SRabbelier | annag: but it'll look _the exact same way as yorr'e seeing it_? |
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| 17:32.53 | anddam | hello |
| 17:33.04 | annag | SRabbelier: uhm, no? |
| 17:33.05 | SRabbelier | annag: all the preview would be is a duplicate of what you're seeing in the editor window without the editor around it |
| 17:33.07 | jkwood | Then students would complain when they lost their whole application because they clicked preview then closed the window. |
| 17:33.20 | SRabbelier | jkwood: heh, that too of course :P |
| 17:33.48 | annag | jkwood: :) |
| 17:34.13 | jkwood | Adding a preview mode would be nothing more than an emotional safety net, given that you can edit the application a number of times before you finalize it. |
| 17:34.37 | annag | SRabbelier: imho it looks a bit different, but maybe I'm the only one... |
| 17:34.53 | alyman | I'm passing through Mountain View for the day, anyone in the area and interested in me buying them lunch, in exchange for an interesting conversation? |
| 17:34.58 | jkwood | As it stands, any organization that expects a perfect application on the first try is being unreasonable imo. |
| 17:34.59 | SRabbelier | annag: *nod*, the differences should be minimal |
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| 17:35.27 | SRabbelier | jkwood: surely a half-decent one is a fair expectation though? |
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| 17:35.39 | Ivanovic | jkwood: ehm, the normal procedure is that the students talk with their possible mentor orgs |
| 17:35.46 | SRabbelier | jkwood: I've seen applications that are basically saying "I want to work on idea X from your idea list" followed by a resume. |
| 17:35.50 | joelpet | I think in general it's always nice to check what you have typed in in a view which isn't editable before confirming |
| 17:35.55 | Ivanovic | jkwood: while talking they refine the proposal and it is being improved |
| 17:36.09 | jkwood | SRabbelier: Well, certainly. We've seen those as well, and we've made commentary using the form encouraging them to improve it. |
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| 17:36.37 | jkwood | Preview mode wouldn't help with that. |
| 17:37.08 | SRabbelier | jkwood: Heh, maybe we should add a "rtfm" button to Melange that posts a comment telling the student in kind and encouraging words to please .. well, you know.. rtfm :P |
| 17:37.19 | mkarnicki | :D |
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| 17:37.50 | annag | jkwood: well, it wouldn't be there to help against "bad" applications, merly to let the student see what he/she is posting before actually pressing "submit" |
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| 17:38.16 | jkwood | But the editor already lets them see it. |
| 17:38.17 | mkarnicki | SRabbelier: maybe.. i've read all of the faq's I think, and registering proposal was a blast (well, maybe the rich editor isn't great, but apart from that all worked just fine) |
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| 17:38.27 | anddam | how would I specify Gtalk in "Im network" field of registration form? |
| 17:38.46 | SRabbelier | anddam: just "GTalk" would do I reckon? |
| 17:38.50 | mkarnicki | anddam: when you focus the field, you've got that in the hint area |
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| 17:39.06 | anddam | there's irc: and xmpp: |
| 17:39.08 | mkarnicki | they used something like... xmpp:gmail/Home o_O |
| 17:39.09 | anddam | as example |
| 17:39.13 | kpreid | SRabbelier: http://code.google.com/p/soc/issues/detail?id=857 done |
| 17:39.15 | Zarel | SCNerd_: Have a question? ;) |
| 17:39.16 | mkarnicki | xmpp = gtalk |
| 17:39.18 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: well, that would work too :) |
| 17:39.21 | mkarnicki | in a sense.. |
| 17:39.25 | mkarnicki | :) |
| 17:39.38 | anddam | mkarnicki: what about the username? I'm using different handlers for irc and gtalk |
| 17:39.39 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: the rich editor troubles should be solved now though |
| 17:40.09 | SRabbelier | anddam: figure something out :P, you can either specify one, or use an ordered list in both fields, or... whatever works :) |
| 17:40.14 | mkarnicki | anddam: give one :D |
| 17:40.28 | mkarnicki | SRabbelier: ordered list, good one :D |
| 17:40.39 | anddam | oh, I somehow thought the handle had to be unique |
| 17:40.56 | SCNerd_ | Hey guys, quick question: I'm under the age limit (16, to be exact), but I would still like to participate somehow... |
| 17:40.59 | SRabbelier | kpreid: new text looks good |
| 17:41.00 | mkarnicki | Srabbelier: rich edior's fine, but I'd be happy if I would paste the 'wiki-code' (whatever it is called) |
| 17:41.13 | mkarnicki | SCNerd_ : get involved in open source |
| 17:41.15 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: be am entor! |
| 17:41.21 | SRabbelier | **a mentor |
| 17:41.23 | mkarnicki | oh yea! you can be a mentor |
| 17:41.27 | SCNerd_ | a mentor at 16? |
| 17:41.31 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: particpate in GHOP when it runs next |
| 17:41.37 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: our youngest mentor was 13 :P |
| 17:42.26 | hiddenpearls | wow nice , 13 years old mentor |
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| 17:42.33 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: http://google-opensource.blogspot.com/2009/03/drupalcon-dc.html |
| 17:42.44 | SCNerd_ | I thought the mentor was the person on an open source program that worked with the students... |
| 17:42.44 | Crofton | !next |
| 17:42.44 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
| 17:42.46 | SCNerd_ | am I wrong? |
| 17:43.10 | Crofton | 25 hours to the close of applications |
| 17:43.28 | Crofton | ? |
| 17:43.46 | kpreid | SCNerd_: no -- open source projects don't usually have contributor age limits! |
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| 17:43.59 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: no, that is correct |
| 17:44.20 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: the mentors are the ones who help the students |
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| 17:44.41 | SCNerd_ | ok, but there's no age limit for that? |
| 17:44.48 | mkarnicki | SRabbelier: dang, that shat is crazy.. 13 year old, i'm impressed |
| 17:45.00 | SRabbelier | mkarnicki: hehe, many of us were :) |
| 17:45.05 | anddam | mkarnicki: nvm gtalk has its own URI scheme |
| 17:45.08 | smtms | kpreid, there are legal complications with underage contributors |
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| 17:45.15 | kpreid | SCNerd_: you could also approach orgs to do work on one of their gsoc ideas while not participating *through gsoc* |
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| 17:45.32 | kpreid | smtms: hm, I'll take your word for it, good point |
| 17:45.42 | SCNerd_ | I'm actually doing that in another tab right now... |
| 17:45.43 | Zarel | Contribute to open source software without a monetary incentive? Psh, who does that? :P |
| 17:45.54 | SCNerd_ | Zarel:... |
| 17:46.02 | Zarel | (Joke...) |
| 17:46.04 | SCNerd_ | :D |
| 17:46.14 | SCNerd_ | but the GHoP idea looks interesting... |
| 17:46.46 | mayanks43 | scnerd: or w8 for growing up |
| 17:46.59 | mayanks43 | :) |
| 17:47.06 | mkarnicki | Zarel: lol ;) |
| 17:47.11 | AshishG | Google Hunt of Programmers? |
| 17:47.19 | AshishG | just joined |
| 17:47.20 | Zarel | Hrm, I should be a mentor. |
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| 17:50.09 | SCNerd_ | it seems like GHoP was just a one-time thing... |
| 17:50.47 | SCNerd_ | I can't find any details about it happening again |
| 17:50.54 | kpreid | AshishG: GHOP is 'Google Highly Open Participation Contest' -- it's sort of like gsoc but with less eligibility constraints. |
| 17:50.56 | SCNerd_ | there only appears to be GSoC |
| 17:51.08 | kpreid | indeed, GHOP hasn't happened lately |
| 17:51.13 | SCNerd_ | but the details only describe it ever happening once |
| 17:51.14 | SCNerd_ | so |
| 17:51.25 | SCNerd_ | great idea if it happens again, though |
| 17:51.30 | kpreid | but in *theory*...why do you think the url is written 'socghop'? |
| 17:51.41 | AshishG | kpreid: i see! :D |
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| 17:52.40 | Diuturnal | Anyone here representing facebook by any chance? |
| 17:52.44 | anddam | still on registration form: does the "Education" section refer to the grade I'm currently into or the best I have already achieved? |
| 17:52.46 | SCNerd_ | because it's a subset... but how does that help, if there's no info on it again |
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| 17:53.17 | SCNerd_ | * anddam: what do you mean? |
| 17:53.18 | mkarnicki | GHOP i think had little response. they had great event with little/low quality attendants, and who knows if they'll restart that. |
| 17:53.38 | mkarnicki | went to feed the dog |
| 17:54.23 | anddam | SCNerd_: that until I complete a degree I don't have it, I'm not sure what "Education" section refers to |
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| 17:54.50 | AshishG | anddam: you mean education is overrated? |
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| 17:55.28 | anddam | AshishG: that has nothing to do with what I wrote |
| 17:56.02 | AshishG | hmm |
| 17:56.09 | SCNerd_ | it's referring to where you are currently |
| 17:56.25 | anddam | yes, I just noticed the "expected graduation year" |
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| 17:56.40 | AshishG | what country are you in? |
| 17:56.42 | SCNerd_ | it asks for a graduation date, so it anticipates that you haven't yet finished college |
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| 17:57.38 | SCNerd_ | it anticipates that you're currently in college, getting your first degree |
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| 17:58.02 | robbyoconnor | :) |
| 17:58.20 | robbyoconnor | anddam: you dont need no edumacation! |
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| 17:59.10 | SCNerd_ | so, I think the answer to your question is: the grade you're currently in |
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| 17:59.54 | ihalip | evening felas |
| 17:59.57 | ihalip | fellas. |
| 18:00.37 | AshishG | ihalip: evening =) |
| 18:00.55 | SRabbelier | SCNerd_: it was planned to be held last year, but due to resource constraints Melange wasn't ready for it |
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| 18:04.22 | enthus | ajuonline: hi.. |
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| 18:06.01 | Kosma | robbyoconnor: http://www.kosma.pl/tmp/edumaction.jpg ;-) |
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| 18:07.01 | robbyoconnor | OMMMMMG |
| 18:07.01 | fabiosl | !countdown |
| 18:07.02 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 18:07.13 | robbyoconnor | Kosma: i love LOLCATSSSSSSSSS |
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| 18:08.46 | jbartosik | Hello again |
| 18:08.55 | jbartosik | after tomorows deadline |
| 18:09.03 | jbartosik | can I change proosal |
| 18:09.14 | arvind_khadri | jbartosik, no |
| 18:09.24 | arvind_khadri | that is why it is called deadline :D |
| 18:09.27 | Kosma | it's called deadline for a reason ;) |
| 18:09.28 | Kosma | haha |
| 18:09.36 | jbartosik | I can only post comments to provede additional information organisation asks me |
| 18:09.58 | jbartosik | just neeeded to make sure :) |
| 18:10.05 | jbartosik | thanks |
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| 18:12.50 | robbyoconnor | jbartosik: this is all covered on the discussion mailing list -- archives exist ;) |
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| 18:14.58 | jbartosik | O'RLY ;)? |
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| 18:15.48 | robbyoconnor | jbartosik: oh yes SEVERAL times over |
| 18:15.50 | robbyoconnor | :D |
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| 18:20.33 | BarryCarlyon | I just realised the deadline was 20 mins ago.... |
| 18:20.51 | epps | !countdown |
| 18:20.51 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 18:22.09 | gaurav_hiiii | BarryCarlyon:you've 1 more day |
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| 18:23.32 | carols | BarryCarlyon: its tomorrow at 19:00 UTC |
| 18:23.48 | dhaun | BarryCarlyon: timezone + calendar fail ;-) |
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| 18:24.55 | BarryCarlyon | o |
| 18:24.56 | BarryCarlyon | hehe |
| 18:25.02 | BarryCarlyon | I've lost a day somewhere. |
| 18:25.03 | Gangadhar | 24 hours means a lot of time! |
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| 18:25.16 | BarryCarlyon | I was sure it was on a thurday..... |
| 18:25.25 | BarryCarlyon | My apps are in anyway :-P |
| 18:25.43 | annag | BarryCarlyon: you're lucky - you just gained a day! ;) |
| 18:25.59 | BarryCarlyon | Hehe |
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| 18:27.51 | basty | hi everyone |
| 18:27.53 | jnanesh | hi |
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| 18:29.01 | basty | has anyone participated of previous gsoc editions? |
| 18:29.12 | Catfish_Man | thousands of people |
| 18:29.46 | basty | yes, I meant, if anyone of the people present in this channel |
| 18:29.50 | Abhinav1 | !countdown |
| 18:29.51 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 18:29.58 | annag | basty: I did |
| 18:30.25 | basty | can you tell me your experience? |
| 18:31.11 | BarryCarlyon | basty: this is my third. |
| 18:31.12 | annag | basty: well, what do you want to know? :) was great fun, learned incredibly much, had great support from the community... |
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| 18:31.39 | basty | sorry my bad english, it's not my natural language |
| 18:32.05 | annag | basty: you're doing fine :) |
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| 18:32.36 | basty | thanks ;). i'd like to know for instance if you contacted the organizations before submitting your app.. |
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| 18:34.29 | basty | I mean, did you establish contact with the organization after reading their ideas list? or you just saw the project you would like to participate and directly submitted your application? |
| 18:34.29 | annag | basty: I send in an application and then stayed active when they asked me stuff. If there's a mailing list to join I'd suggest you join it... Sending them an email might be a good idea, presenting yourself and possibly ask stuff. |
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| 18:35.08 | |Kev| | basty: always talk to the org before submitting an application. |
| 18:35.20 | annag | basty: I submitted my application first I think, but contacting them is probably a good idea. Other people have an opinion on this? |
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| 18:35.57 | |Kev| | annag: Yes, my opinion is that you should always speak to the org. |
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| 18:36.31 | annag | |Kev|: right. :) Sounds decent. |
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| 18:36.37 | bawr | Talk to the org, don't submit on the last day, remember you can edit your app. |
| 18:36.54 | annag | bawr: I agree |
| 18:36.57 | |Kev| | bawr: although even submitting on the last day is less of an issue if you've been talking to the org for a week. |
| 18:37.04 | |Kev| | and/or longer. |
| 18:37.06 | bawr | Ah, yes. |
| 18:37.23 | basty | ok, thanks for the tip. |
| 18:37.38 | |Kev| | Our application form has a question on it "Which members of our community did you discuss this with?" |
| 18:38.16 | bawr | But I'd prefer to do some iterative improvement - start with a proposal that just describes your idea and has WIP stamped somewhere, then improve it as you go along. |
| 18:38.22 | BarryCarlyon | basty: I was talking to a org a week or two before apps open, after orgs annocuned. |
| 18:38.24 | |Kev| | Yes, so would I. |
| 18:38.49 | bawr | Hm. Speaking of that, I should finally iron out the last kinks in my proposal. |
| 18:38.58 | annag | BarryCarlyon: so did many in our community as well |
| 18:39.26 | basty | my second question would be: the app presentation deadline is set in stone or there can be a time extension? (based on previous gsoc editions) |
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| 18:39.38 | |Kev| | !extension |
| 18:39.38 | socinfo | "extension" is The deadline WAS NOT extended and WILL NOT be. Not even for you. |
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| 18:40.33 | basty | ok, thanks a lot |
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| 18:43.16 | BarryCarlyon | annag: the pre contact comes down to knowing loosley what you want to do and being aware of GSoC from the start. |
| 18:43.27 | BarryCarlyon | my first year, I applied during the extended deadline period. |
| 18:43.53 | BarryCarlyon | Last year I was talking with my org from the date successful orgs were announced. |
| 18:44.15 | BarryCarlyon | This year I've been chatting/in the IRC channel a few weeks before the list came out. |
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| 18:44.56 | bawr | Next year you'll start just after this GSoC ends, right? :) |
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| 18:45.14 | smtms | BarryCarlyon, what about next year? you will be implementing your project before Google announces another Summer of Code? |
| 18:45.24 | BarryCarlyon | GSoC is about getting more people into open source, so those that talk to orgs before the list, shouldn't neccassarily get priority for example. |
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| 18:47.01 | bawr | This is mostly up to the orgs, I guess. |
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| 18:47.30 | annag | BarryCarlyon: well, first year I attended I didn't talk to them before and for this year I've discussed it since last years GSoC ended in August so... :) and you're right about the priority |
| 18:47.32 | BarryCarlyon | What do you mean smtms ? |
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| 18:48.05 | smtms | BarryCarlyon, please ignore |
| 18:48.53 | BarryCarlyon | :-) |
| 18:48.55 | bawr | BarryCarlyon: Did you get in every time you applied? |
| 18:48.59 | mayanks43 | smtms its never too late to start |
| 18:49.07 | Lunixed | I just submitted my proposal, when I do the "List my student proposals", its shows the proposal in 1st table.. that means it is confirm right ? or anything else from my side ? |
| 18:49.52 | BarryCarlyon | bawr: so far |
| 18:52.04 | annag | Lunixed: yes, it's confirmed |
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| 18:53.08 | smtms | confirmed? |
| 18:53.16 | basty | thanks everyone for your time and advices |
| 18:53.23 | basty | see you |
| 18:53.26 | annag | smtms: the app is submitted |
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| 18:55.34 | coolcoder | !logs |
| 18:55.34 | socinfo | "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc |
| 18:55.34 | coolcoder | !log |
| 18:55.35 | socinfo | Error: access denied (owner). |
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| 18:58.53 | thebolt | Evening |
| 18:59.10 | BarryCarlyon | Evening thebolt how do? |
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| 19:00.49 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: better than in quite some time.. had time to go by the judo exercise today, felt good :) Now I just have to eat dinner and then anohter meeting until midnight or so :P |
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| 19:00.59 | jias | hi, can i change the proposal after submitting it? |
| 19:01.10 | thebolt | !edit |
| 19:01.10 | socinfo | "edit" is You can submit your application early and edit it up until the deadline (April 9). Once the deadline passes, you cannot edit it. Instead, leave comments. |
| 19:01.45 | jias | thanks! |
| 19:01.49 | mkarnicki | i can see you've trained socinfo bot well. it knows way more than few days ago :D |
| 19:01.59 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: and you? |
| 19:02.06 | coolcoder | !logs |
| 19:02.06 | socinfo | "logs" is http://ibot.rikers.org/%23gsoc |
| 19:02.09 | kblin | hey thebolt |
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| 19:02.13 | thebolt | hi kblin |
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| 19:05.23 | *** mode/#gsoc [+o carols] by ChanServ |
| 19:05.54 | thebolt | evening/good day carols |
| 19:06.24 | carols | good evening/day thebolt |
| 19:06.28 | carols | promptly runs off for lunch |
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| 19:09.28 | BarryCarlyon | I'm not too bad, thanks for asking thebolt . |
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| 19:15.41 | kblin | carols: bon appetit |
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| 19:20.23 | Mitar | !countdown |
| 19:20.23 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 19:22.41 | apyles_home | Hi suppose that I apply for two projects : a, b, each with a different organization. Suppose project a has a higher preference than b. Is there a way to indicate that? Is there a chance that the student can be given a choice of both a and b? |
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| 19:23.18 | Jeff_S | apyles_home: if you get accepted into both, you will likely be asked which you prefer |
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| 19:23.36 | thebolt | no, most likely you won't.. so make sure you tell the organisations |
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| 19:23.52 | brightball | hey guys |
| 19:24.09 | Jeff_S | thebolt: really? this has happened to us in the past a couple of times and we always deferred to the students |
| 19:24.14 | brightball | I was wondering if I could talk to anybody who's semi-helping to coordinate SoC? |
| 19:24.27 | Jeff_S | brightball: semi-helping or really helping? ;) |
| 19:24.33 | brightball | really helping would be ideal |
| 19:24.36 | Mitar | meta-helping? |
| 19:24.38 | Jeff_S | brightball: maybe just ask your question and someone will answer |
| 19:24.39 | brightball | I'll take anybody I can get :-) |
| 19:24.39 | emmanuel_ | both organisations? I have the feeling that saying something like, hey I hope you guys pick me, but I actually preefer to work for another org |
| 19:24.43 | brightball | okay, short version |
| 19:24.54 | emmanuel_ | wont really make your proposal appealing |
| 19:25.02 | Jeff_S | emmanuel_: I agree :) |
| 19:25.04 | hiddenpearls | hey guys, is there any organization that still need students for GSOC ? |
| 19:25.13 | thebolt | Jeff_S: well, in the cases i've been involved with the conflict hasn't been known until conflict resolution meeting.. and then a decision is needed on the spot |
| 19:25.49 | Jeff_S | thebolt: hmm, ok. I'm pretty sure we tracked them down before it got that far in our cases |
| 19:26.08 | brightball | Greenville, SC is looking to take one of the project teams from a Google SoC project (main project team and SoC participants) and put them up with office space and housing for the summer to provide them with the ability to actively collaborate on the project for the entire summer rather than just working remotely |
| 19:26.13 | Mitar | hiddenpearls: freifunk? |
| 19:26.23 | brightball | and we wanted to find out if ya'll could help us locate a team that might be interested in the offer |
| 19:26.32 | Jeff_S | hiddenpearls: nothing is decided yet, apply to whatever appeals to you the most |
| 19:26.36 | brightball | I think we can handle about 20 people |
| 19:28.25 | brightball | and silence... |
| 19:29.14 | brightball | we thought it might provide a project with a unique opportunity to drive the project forward |
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| 19:29.29 | dhaun | brightball: cute idea but open source teams are usually spread all over the world - it's sort of hard to get them into one place for any amount of time |
| 19:29.48 | brightball | yea, we understand that |
| 19:29.56 | thebolt | brightball: might be that the right people are not here.. I would suggest a mail to hm, the mentor or discussion mailinglists |
| 19:30.16 | brightball | we still wanted to put the offer out there to see if anybody would be interested in the opportunity |
| 19:30.40 | brightball | what's "hm"? |
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| 19:31.03 | thebolt | brightball: me thinking.. remove it:P |
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| 19:31.40 | brightball | cool, will take a look at the mentor list first |
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| 19:34.45 | brightball | don't suppose there's a mailing list for all of the mentors? |
| 19:34.54 | sfb | There is |
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| 19:35.05 | brightball | got a link? |
| 19:35.12 | dhaun | brightball: you need to be a mentor, though |
| 19:35.24 | brightball | hmm |
| 19:35.58 | dhaun | try the public -discuss list and someone could cross-post it to the mentors list |
| 19:36.06 | dhaun | http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-discuss |
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| 19:36.20 | brightball | will do |
| 19:36.36 | dhaun | maybe even http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-mentors-meetup-list |
| 19:36.58 | dhaun | whoops, wrong list, I meant this one: http://groups.google.com/group/google-soc-meetups |
| 19:37.13 | dhaun | has too many gsoc lists :P |
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| 19:37.42 | brightball | lol |
| 19:37.44 | brightball | thank you |
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| 19:43.30 | emmanuelp | so, any one knows how to reach the Apache Software Foundation mentors? any one in da house? |
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| 20:02.23 | dmj726_n900 | anyone else planning on including video in their proposals? |
| 20:02.57 | tanatos | thanks for idea! :D |
| 20:03.43 | dmj726_n900 | I made one but It's rather low quality production wise. |
| 20:04.01 | x` | :) cool |
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| 20:04.04 | dmj726_n900 | http://talk.maemo.org/showthread.php?t=48548 |
| 20:04.08 | x` | what's it about? |
| 20:04.11 | dmj726_n900 | at the bottom |
| 20:04.46 | ea4xgr | thinks he spotted a few "2009" instead of "2010" in the GSoC user guide |
| 20:04.49 | dmj726_n900 | making the n900 an a11y device with gnome tech. |
| 20:05.15 | x` | oh man that is a tough nugget |
| 20:05.23 | dmj726_n900 | I'd be curious to get some thoughts on this. |
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| 20:12.31 | pdelgallego | hi Anybody know what had happened to the chromium-os (Im not talking about chromiun the webbrowser) organization? is not listed any more. |
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| 20:13.11 | dhaun | the two were folded into one org (for GSoC), IIRC |
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| 20:14.05 | pdelgallego | dhaun, so to apply to chromium-os I just submit to #chromium > |
| 20:14.08 | pdelgallego | > |
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| 20:14.27 | dhaun | I think so, yes - check their ideas list |
| 20:14.52 | erlehmann | am i right in the opinion that the deadline is approx 21 hrs away ? |
| 20:15.07 | Landon | !timeline |
| 20:15.07 | socinfo | "timeline" is (#1) http://socghop.appspot.com/document/show/gsoc_program/google/gsoc2010/faqs#timeline, or (#2) for the visually oriented: http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mRuBILD0TjI/S6tGHR4mM3I/AAAAAAAACbw/tftJozZHs-0/s1600/gsoc10timeline.JPG |
| 20:15.18 | m_conley | !countdown |
| 20:15.18 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 20:17.57 | nooga | hi |
| 20:18.25 | nooga | it's april 8th, can I apply tommorrow? |
| 20:18.54 | Tang_ | i have the same question |
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| 20:19.35 | smtms | nooga, you can, until 19:00 UTC |
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| 20:19.57 | ankitg | You have about 22 and a half hours to the deadline ... |
| 20:21.31 | epps | !countdown |
| 20:21.31 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 20:24.10 | pdelgallego | i |
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| 20:32.37 | KAM | the "make public" checkbox that appears in the end of the student application , make it public to whom ? should i check it to be visible to the mentor organization or what ? |
| 20:32.48 | jnanesh_ | hi |
| 20:33.20 | smtms | KAM, mentoring organization sees it without "make public" |
| 20:33.45 | x` | KAM: public for other people to see, that are not mentors of the org you are applying to |
| 20:33.53 | x` | it's a common question |
| 20:34.21 | KAM | smtms: does those others mean students or what ? |
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| 20:34.44 | Catfish_Man | KAM: anyone with a gsoc login |
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| 20:35.56 | WWS | how do you see the public proposal lists? |
| 20:36.06 | mkarnicki | WWS: there's no such |
| 20:36.09 | thebolt | you cannot, you can only see it with a direct link |
| 20:36.17 | mkarnicki | WWS: if you want to see.. exactly ^ |
| 20:37.09 | WWS | mkarnicki: the list of proposals that are submitted to a mentoring org with the "make public" checked |
| 20:39.42 | mkarnicki | WWS: mine is public. and you still have to know the link to it, to view it. |
| 20:40.12 | mkarnicki | WWS: there's no public-proposal list either. you have to know the direct link. in particular, such proposal must be 'public' to view it. |
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| 20:46.50 | LetterRip | does anyone know of how to find out how many applicants is 'typical' for a large project? |
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| 20:47.15 | LetterRip | ie are popular applicants getting 500 applicants, 50 or 5? |
| 20:47.20 | LetterRip | er applications |
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| 20:47.44 | schumaml | what's "large" and "popular"? |
| 20:48.08 | LetterRip | dunno :) probably some of the umbrella orgs like kde would be large |
| 20:48.18 | LetterRip | but single apps like blender |
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| 20:48.21 | LetterRip | or gimp |
| 20:48.27 | LetterRip | or openoffice |
| 20:48.37 | LetterRip | (not sure if oo is participating) |
| 20:48.45 | schumaml | oh, for gimp I know the exact value |
| 20:48.51 | schumaml | 5 |
| 20:48.54 | LetterRip | ah ok |
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| 20:49.41 | LetterRip | thanks |
| 20:49.44 | schumaml | note that while the project may be large, our gsoc participation isn't this time |
| 20:49.50 | LetterRip | yeah |
| 20:50.12 | schumaml | two mentors, and pretty advanced requirements to student experience |
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| 20:50.27 | LetterRip | yep we raised the bar siginficantly this year |
| 20:50.32 | LetterRip | for student applicants |
| 20:50.35 | LetterRip | which cut the number in half |
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| 21:37.23 | *** join/#gsoc ibot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 21:37.23 | *** topic/#gsoc is Google Summer of Code 2010 is On! - Student applications open through April 9th http://bit.ly/c7VsEH - File Feature Requests & Bugs at http://bit.ly/a5tD87 - Read the FAQs: http://bit.ly/9q41Ey - Consider Hosting a GSoC Info Session: http://bit.ly/amIwdd - We need flyer and presentations translations, videos too! |
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| 21:38.40 | mlankhorst | robbyoconnor: its actually not that hard to write |
| 21:39.28 | robbyoconnor | heheh |
| 21:40.59 | x` | robbyoconnor: what's your proposal byte cound |
| 21:41.02 | mlankhorst | echo 0 > /sys/class/rtc/rtc0/wakealarm |
| 21:41.03 | mlankhorst | date -u --date "now + $add" +%s > /sys/class/rtc/rtc0/wakealarm |
| 21:41.03 | mlankhorst | echo mem > /sys/power/state |
| 21:41.20 | mlankhorst | if your rtc clock is at utc and you want to suspend for "$add" time :) |
| 21:41.40 | robbyoconnor | x`: ??? |
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| 21:42.20 | robbyoconnor | x`: i dunno lol |
| 21:42.22 | robbyoconnor | it's on google docs |
| 21:42.38 | robbyoconnor | I copied it over but it's on google docs |
| 21:42.39 | x` | 9 pages don't mean much to me, what's the number of keypress events it took to make that gem :) |
| 21:43.12 | x` | uh, but that's an entirely different thing, so byte count it is |
| 21:43.14 | safal_soni | can someone suggest me mentors for gesture and speech recognition project |
| 21:43.20 | x` | i'm just curious, though, never mind me |
| 21:43.46 | robbyoconnor | x`: heh a lot lol |
| 21:44.20 | thebolt | x`: in general i think you can count a page as being about 250-300 words |
| 21:45.08 | thebolt | or hm, maybe a bit more, 350-400 even |
| 21:45.12 | thebolt | depends on language of cours |
| 21:45.13 | thebolt | e |
| 21:45.27 | x` | of course |
| 21:45.32 | thebolt | one page in chinese is way more :P |
| 21:46.14 | x` | well i tried to make it as succinct as possible, but it still came out at 2600 words, the great majority of this is the work plan |
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| 21:46.33 | robbyoconnor | I had trouble getting it to 7500 words |
| 21:46.48 | robbyoconnor | my project plan shows time-bound goals |
| 21:46.53 | robbyoconnor | with due dates |
| 21:47.07 | summatusmentis | since when is a page 300 words? |
| 21:47.15 | x` | have you perchance written a novel? :) |
| 21:47.18 | summatusmentis | in english, a page, single spaced, is closer to 700 |
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| 21:47.37 | robbyoconnor | x`: i ussed bullet points a lot :) |
| 21:47.55 | robbyoconnor | using their template leaving questions and answers as bullet points :) |
| 21:48.20 | thebolt | summatusmentis: http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview?id=608972 |
| 21:49.21 | summatusmentis | oh |
| 21:49.26 | summatusmentis | I should read back further |
| 21:49.33 | summatusmentis | I didn't realize we were talking about a novel page |
| 21:49.43 | thebolt | we haven't specced at all what kind of page :) |
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| 21:50.28 | gjordan | Hi some Brazilian? |
| 21:50.32 | summatusmentis | I'm used to writing for a newspaper, and ~700 words tends to be a standard "sheet of paper" page :) |
| 21:50.39 | gjordan | Algum brasileiro por ai? |
| 21:51.10 | felipevieira | gjordan, olá |
| 21:51.32 | robbyoconnor | english please lol |
| 21:51.36 | gjordan | Olá Felipe, você esta participando? Sou um dos colaboradores do Ghop |
| 21:52.00 | robbyoconnor | wait is google competing with Yahoo Answers? |
| 21:52.23 | gjordan | colaborei ano passado na tradução |
| 21:52.42 | gjordan | você está participando? ajude a traduzir o http://gsoc-br.org |
| 21:52.58 | felipevieira | gjordam, eu to participando pela primeira vez, tentei pra python |
| 21:53.03 | felipevieira | gjordam, posso ajudar sim. |
| 21:53.05 | robbyoconnor | could he speak english?? |
| 21:53.14 | robbyoconnor | (even if it's broken) |
| 21:54.24 | gjordan | ok, i was just talking to my Brazilian friend |
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| 21:55.25 | gjordan | hi robby , where u from? |
| 21:55.36 | emmanuelp | any one else here trying to update his/her iPhone to OS 4.0? |
| 21:56.00 | smtms | is 4.0 out already? |
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| 21:56.11 | emmanuelp | there's a tech preview |
| 21:56.19 | Catfish_Man | this is a bit offtopic guys... |
| 21:56.19 | emmanuelp | beta1 |
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| 21:56.46 | emmanuelp | yeah, sorry, just getting frustrated because mine is kinda bricked right now lol, let's get back on topic |
| 21:57.32 | sreich | sighs at the iPhone's fear fulfillment of 1984 |
| 21:58.08 | Catfish_Man | notes that that is both offtopic *and* trolling... |
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| 22:00.16 | BarryCarlyon | emmanuelp: you can only get 4 is you have paid the $99 to be a developer. To unbrick try doing a restore via iTunes. |
| 22:00.43 | sreich | Catfish_Man: apologies |
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| 22:10.55 | emmanuelp | BarryCarlyon: Yeah, I did pay the 99 bucks, (my subscription is almost over btw), I tried restoring it through iTunes, but haven't got any luck, on windows I get an Error 13, and on Mac I get an Error 2005 |
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| 22:13.36 | BarryCarlyon | emmanuelp: <insert appropriate swear word here> take it to apple store if youre near one :-) |
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| 22:14.41 | smtms | apple store? dealing with tech preview? |
| 22:15.03 | Catfish_Man | guys, this is *still* offtopic |
| 22:15.15 | smtms | Catfish_Man, you aren't supplying any on-topic content |
| 22:15.16 | emmanuelp | hehe, I'm gonna do that |
| 22:15.22 | Catfish_Man | smtms: I'm working |
| 22:15.34 | BarryCarlyon | yawns |
| 22:16.12 | jkwood | smtms: Not wise to taunt the operators, usually. |
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| 22:16.30 | Catfish_Man | jkwood: mostly I'm trying to avoid the inevitable vi vs emacs discussion from talking about this stuff |
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| 22:17.26 | jkwood | Oh, I understand completely. Social channels for off-topic, and topical channels for on-topic. That's my motto. |
| 22:17.42 | smtms | iPhone! no, Android! no, iPhone! |
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| 22:17.50 | Catfish_Man | smtms: NewtonOS! |
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| 22:18.18 | thebolt | Catfish_Man: yea, everyone knows that is uneccesary as vim is the best one ;) (and no, please, don't continue down that road anyone) |
| 22:18.49 | Diuturnal | is getting a little concerned. |
| 22:20.53 | BarryCarlyon | Catfish_Man: smtms iPad? |
| 22:21.06 | smtms | what about me? |
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| 22:21.24 | BarryCarlyon | thebolt: I'm a nano fan. Tho I have started using TextMate on my mac. |
| 22:21.43 | BarryCarlyon | smtms: you said iPhone! No Droid! No iPhone |
| 22:22.17 | smtms | I said something slightly different; what does it have to do with Catfish_Man and iPad? |
| 22:22.42 | BarryCarlyon | iPad over iPhone, Droid, and NewtonOS. |
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| 22:22.52 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: ;) |
| 22:22.53 | BarryCarlyon | Probably a bit out of context :-P |
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| 22:23.18 | SmkMnstr | how money do u get from GSOC |
| 22:23.42 | Catfish_Man | SmkMnstr: is that "how do you get money from gsoc?" or "how much money do you get from gsoc?" |
| 22:23.54 | smtms | Catfish_Man, you are supposed to be working! |
| 22:23.57 | SmkMnstr | the latter, thanks :) |
| 22:24.03 | Catfish_Man | SmkMnstr: $5k |
| 22:24.09 | smtms | I'd say $0 |
| 22:24.12 | SmkMnstr | ah |
| 22:24.13 | Catfish_Man | smtms: spintracer takes like a million years to load |
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| 22:24.50 | BarryCarlyon | SmkMnstr: of that $5k a Student gets $4.5 and the org gets $500, unless its changed. |
| 22:24.56 | BarryCarlyon | GSoC aint about the money. |
| 22:25.01 | SmkMnstr | ah im not a student |
| 22:25.15 | BarryCarlyon | Ah ;-) |
| 22:25.16 | SmkMnstr | im more of a master :) |
| 22:25.33 | BarryCarlyon | I could argue everyone is a student. |
| 22:25.40 | BarryCarlyon | As we all are until we die....... |
| 22:25.45 | Catfish_Man | SmkMnstr: unless you're either a student or a mentor for a participating organization, you can't be in GSoC |
| 22:25.46 | Kosma | $5k for student and $.5k for org, actually |
| 22:25.53 | carols | BarryCarlyon: yes, its changed. students get $5k this year and orgs get an additional $500 |
| 22:25.53 | Diuturnal | it's changed to $5,000 for student and $500 for the org. |
| 22:26.00 | SmkMnstr | yeah i was just curious, thanks for infos |
| 22:26.01 | Diuturnal | heh |
| 22:26.02 | BarryCarlyon | carols: woot? |
| 22:26.13 | carols | BarryCarlyon: yep :-) |
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| 22:26.38 | BarryCarlyon | I didn't know. |
| 22:26.38 | jkwood | We're buying ninjas with our stipends. |
| 22:26.52 | summatusmentis | do tehy sell those? |
| 22:26.55 | BarryCarlyon | I'm defo importing an iPad. |
| 22:27.02 | Diuturnal | there aren't any people representing facebook here by any chance are there? |
| 22:27.13 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: if you get a good blender then it will blend nicely :) |
| 22:27.24 | BarryCarlyon | Diuturnal: see if ScottMac is in #PHP. |
| 22:27.28 | x` | thebolt: i want proof. |
| 22:27.33 | BarryCarlyon | thebolt: indeed. |
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| 22:27.54 | thebolt | x`: willitblend.com :P |
| 22:27.58 | killerchicken_ | !countdown |
| 22:27.59 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
| 22:28.00 | BarryCarlyon | Diuturnal: ok scottmac is not about. But hes the facebook guy. |
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| 22:28.14 | Diuturnal | BarryCarlyon, tried to join but there's an overflow apparently. |
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| 22:29.08 | BarryCarlyon | Diuturnal: indeed, happens a lot on PHP. Tho I am in there. Scotts not about. I just know he was PHP and now Facebook, so not sure if he still frequents #PHP, you could always grab him via Twitter @ScottMac. |
| 22:29.15 | BarryCarlyon | The people I know :-P |
| 22:29.30 | BarryCarlyon | I met most of the PHP dev time a couple of years back. |
| 22:29.36 | Diuturnal | Bamieater, thanks for that. |
| 22:29.42 | Diuturnal | whoops. |
| 22:29.44 | BarryCarlyon | Rofl |
| 22:29.48 | Diuturnal | BarryCarlyon. |
| 22:30.07 | Diuturnal | it's just turning out to be one of those days. :) |
| 22:30.09 | BarryCarlyon | :-P |
| 22:30.42 | x` | hahahaha |
| 22:30.51 | x` | @thebolt |
| 22:30.53 | x` | it blends! |
| 22:30.56 | thebolt | yep .P |
| 22:31.42 | BarryCarlyon | I lvoe the bit where Tom wacks the iPad a few times to fold it in half. |
| 22:31.45 | x` | oh my, at first i cringed, but then i just enjoyed the process :) |
| 22:32.20 | thebolt | x`: they did that to iphone just when it was released as well ;) |
| 22:33.38 | BarryCarlyon | Hehe. |
| 22:33.46 | BarryCarlyon | Its free advertising. |
| 22:33.55 | BarryCarlyon | So I imagine Apple sent two or three to them. |
| 22:34.10 | thebolt | hehe, yea, a win-win thing (officially it is commercial for blendtech ;) |
| 22:34.30 | BarryCarlyon | Indeed. |
| 22:34.43 | BarryCarlyon | I wonder what Tom does as a day job? |
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| 22:35.13 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: i think he is the CEO |
| 22:35.27 | BarryCarlyon | O. |
| 22:35.29 | BarryCarlyon | Cool |
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| 22:36.34 | LightNova | how can I find mentor's comment for my application? |
| 22:36.46 | BarryCarlyon | It will be at the bottom of the page. |
| 22:36.46 | thebolt | BarryCarlyon: actually he is the founder of blendtec |
| 22:36.53 | BarryCarlyon | Underneath your application itself LightNova . |
| 22:37.01 | BarryCarlyon | thebolt: nice. |
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| 22:37.06 | LightNova | Thanks you guys |
| 22:37.29 | BarryCarlyon | :-) |
| 22:38.17 | admishra | <PROTECTED> |
| 22:38.37 | mlankhorst | use the web app |
| 22:38.38 | *** part/#gsoc LightNova (~chatzilla@d207-6-166-22.bchsia.telus.net) |
| 22:38.47 | Kosma | admishra: you have to hurry ;-) |
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| 22:39.09 | admishra | yaa, i know |
| 22:39.19 | admishra | means i have to submit it only at "submit your student proposal" or i have to send it via mail also..! |
| 22:39.44 | BarryCarlyon | Depends on what the org wants admishra . |
| 22:39.50 | BarryCarlyon | Minimum is thru the web app. |
| 22:39.55 | magsol | i think someone mentioned this yesterday but i don't recall the answer (sorry... :( ) - during the interim, can we edit the proposals based on feedback? |
| 22:40.14 | BarryCarlyon | For wordpress you need to document it on a blog, and others orgs like you to tackle a bug, or provide some sample code. |
| 22:40.17 | Catfish_Man | magsol: yes |
| 22:40.24 | admishra | BarryCarlyon: i also was thinking the same |
| 22:40.34 | magsol | cooool. thanks catfish_man :) |
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| 22:40.44 | admishra | BarryCarlyon: thanks :) |
| 22:40.52 | BarryCarlyon | No problem :-) |
| 22:40.56 | mlankhorst | ok it works ;P |
| 22:41.16 | mlankhorst | robbyoconnor: finished my webcam activity monitor |
| 22:41.33 | robbyoconnor | nice. |
| 22:41.44 | BarryCarlyon | robbyoconnor: you student or mentor this year? |
| 22:42.16 | Catfish_Man | magsol: wait, by "interim" what do you mean |
| 22:42.22 | Catfish_Man | magsol: I don't know about the period after submissions end |
| 22:42.29 | robbyoconnor | hss the disadvantage to not knowing the language |
| 22:42.39 | magsol | ah ok |
| 22:42.43 | robbyoconnor | but I linked my blog + last years project :) |
| 22:42.51 | robbyoconnor | in a diff language :X |
| 22:42.59 | robbyoconnor | BarryCarlyon: student |
| 22:43.10 | robbyoconnor | the $$ is good -- but I also have fun doing it |
| 22:43.20 | brik | someone I know has offered to be my mentor for a project, does it matter that I already know them personally? |
| 22:43.30 | mlankhorst | robbyoconnor: http://pastebin.cross-lfs.org/6854 for the source ;) |
| 22:43.32 | robbyoconnor | brik: no |
| 22:43.38 | Catfish_Man | brik: when I was in that situation as a mentor, I recused myself from voting on that student |
| 22:43.44 | Catfish_Man | not required, but it seems fair |
| 22:43.50 | Wolf_OSGeo | brik: it should make the mentoring more pleasant for you :) |
| 22:43.51 | smtms | brik, ask the ogranization administrator |
| 22:43.59 | BarryCarlyon | robbyoconnor: which org this year? |
| 22:44.14 | mlankhorst | if i was less lazy i would nuke the shell script, but for now it works |
| 22:44.24 | ScottMac | oh i'm about |
| 22:44.26 | ScottMac | :D |
| 22:44.36 | brik | Catfish_Man: what about evaluations later on? |
| 22:44.45 | Catfish_Man | brik: as long as they're honest, it seems ok |
| 22:44.54 | BarryCarlyon | Hey ScottMac ! Diuturnal was looking for the Facebook mentors. |
| 22:44.54 | ScottMac | BarryCarlyon: who was after me? |
| 22:44.57 | Catfish_Man | if any evidence of corruption was found, taht would be bad of course |
| 22:44.58 | Catfish_Man | *that |
| 22:45.11 | ScottMac | Diuturnal: our fb-gsoc list is for finding mentors :) |
| 22:45.42 | brik | ok, thanks all of you :) |
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| 22:46.32 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, this? http://groups.google.com/group/gsoc-fb |
| 22:46.37 | ScottMac | yeah |
| 22:46.48 | ScottMac | if you drop an email to there you shoudl get a response and if not I'll kick someone in that direction |
| 22:46.48 | drt24 | Is there any way to tell whether a subproject has a mentor registered? |
| 22:47.02 | ScottMac | are you thinking about Three20, HipHop, XHP, Hive or Scribe? |
| 22:47.04 | drt24 | or indeed who the registered mentors are? |
| 22:47.06 | BarryCarlyon | drt24: ask the subproject :-) |
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| 22:47.51 | drt24 | BarryCarlyon: yes, hopefully I will get a response soonish but I might not... and the deadline is far too close now. |
| 22:48.07 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, I'm interested in Tornado Web Server, I sent an email on their group earlier today, no reply thus far. I did ask a question last time and they were pretty quick to answer. |
| 22:48.25 | drt24 | and I had to withdraw my application to a different project because my idea was not big enough :-( |
| 22:48.51 | ScottMac | Diuturnal: ask me in 15 minutes when I'm out off this all-hands |
| 22:48.54 | ScottMac | I've forgotten who tornado is |
| 22:50.10 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, no worries. |
| 22:50.14 | ScottMac | ah its Bret Taylor |
| 22:50.19 | BarryCarlyon | spins round and round |
| 22:50.21 | ScottMac | i'll find out where he sits and tackle him in a minute |
| 22:50.27 | BarryCarlyon | I'm a tornado. |
| 22:50.34 | Kosma | BarryCarlyon: like a record? |
| 22:50.42 | BarryCarlyon | Right round baby. |
| 22:50.53 | drt24 | doesn't want to write another proposal for something that doesn't exist... |
| 22:51.03 | *** join/#gsoc ricky (~ricky@fedora/ricky) |
| 22:51.15 | ScottMac | Diuturnal: i wrote him an email kicking him |
| 22:51.50 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, thanks. here's what I posted on the tornado group: http://groups.google.com/group/python-tornado/browse_thread/thread/cb74d887364110f8 |
| 22:52.07 | BarryCarlyon | knows people in high places |
| 22:52.11 | *** join/#gsoc thiagoss (~thiagoss@189.71.75.167) |
| 22:52.26 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, I already sent you a tweet about it. But thanks for your help anyway. :) |
| 22:52.30 | BarryCarlyon | puts ScottMac back on the high shelf |
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| 22:52.40 | ScottMac | hehe |
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| 22:56.55 | jnanesh__ | Can anybody discuss on GSOC project "Extending wifi-test with nl80211 support" with me? |
| 22:57.08 | summatusmentis | you should probably talk to your org |
| 22:57.09 | jnanesh__ | its mentor is lf |
| 22:57.42 | jnanesh__ | hmmmmm .... their IRC is not active enoutgh |
| 22:57.52 | jnanesh__ | :( |
| 22:57.56 | smtms | jnanesh__, you think they are all here? |
| 22:58.14 | jnanesh__ | hmmmm..... u r correct.... |
| 22:58.37 | smtms | jnanesh__, maybe they are active, but not when you are, due to time zone difference |
| 22:58.45 | ScottMac | Diuturnal: arse kicked |
| 22:59.28 | jnanesh__ | but i was thinking.... if any other person who is also interested in this project is here... I can discuss it! :) |
| 22:59.51 | jnanesh__ | btw... thanks smtms, summatusmentis |
| 23:00.05 | summatusmentis | jnanesh__: sure thing |
| 23:00.21 | Diuturnal | ScottMac, thanks. |
| 23:02.49 | *** join/#gsoc jnanesh_ (~jnanesh@host86-180-171-244.range86-180.btcentralplus.com) |
| 23:14.06 | *** join/#gsoc ibot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 23:14.06 | *** topic/#gsoc is Google Summer of Code 2010 is On! - Student applications open through April 9th http://bit.ly/c7VsEH - File Feature Requests & Bugs at http://bit.ly/a5tD87 - Read the FAQs: http://bit.ly/9q41Ey - Consider Hosting a GSoC Info Session: http://bit.ly/amIwdd - We need flyer and presentations translations, videos too! |
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| 23:32.24 | carlasouza | !countdown |
| 23:32.24 | socinfo | "countdown" is The time left for submitting a student project proposal: http://tinyurl.com/gsoc2010-student-deadline |
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| 23:57.22 | dennda | !next |
| 23:57.22 | socinfo | "next" is Student applications are open. Apply now at http://socghop.appspot.com/gsoc/student/apply/google/gsoc2010 ! Deadline is April 9: 12 noon PDT / 19:00 UTC. |
