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| 00:01.04 | gotousan | oh wait, typo in the file |
| 00:01.16 | gotousan | trying the commands again |
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| 00:02.26 | gotousan | okay it set up now, but whne i try to ping something it says network unreacahble |
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| 00:05.12 | gotousan | also trying to find the iso with nonfree firmware, but there is no hybrid iso available |
| 00:05.24 | sney | all of the installer isos are hybrid |
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| 00:05.51 | gotousan | okay, im going to try one of those then in case i cant get this working |
| 00:06.10 | sney | you set up /etc/network/interfaces as described in the wiki, brought the interface up with 'ifup wls5', and then when you ping a local address it says network unreachable? |
| 00:06.33 | gotousan | yes |
| 00:06.54 | gotousan | no wait i was pinging an external address |
| 00:07.03 | gotousan | not local address |
| 00:07.10 | sney | always ping your router first |
| 00:07.51 | sney | but if you still have problems I would recommend starting over with the firmware-included installer, just for simplicity |
| 00:08.06 | gotousan | i might just go that route and see how it goes |
| 00:08.21 | gotousan | the thing is this computer is just a test computer and 10 years old at this point |
| 00:08.30 | gotousan | just wanted to see if i could get debian installed on it properly |
| 00:10.01 | sney | 10 years is still basically a modern computer in terms of linux support. these firmware issues are common on old stuff all the way up to brand new gear |
| 00:10.24 | n4dir | all of my machines are round that age, and i yet have to find one i couldn't put debian on. But i am not speaking bout wireless (i don't care much for it) |
| 00:11.22 | n4dir | well: most are older. the newer ones are 10 years old |
| 00:12.10 | sney | by 2009 or so, most stuff was x86-64 with pci express and a modern bios, etc. speed has improved, and uefi/secure boot adds wrinkles sometimes, but the install process has been basically identical since then |
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| 00:15.09 | n4dir | speaking of old hardware. I got me a new hobby, fooling with audio-software. Mainly ardour, syntzesizer like amsynth or zynaddsubfx/yoshimi, seqeuencer. But really basic home stuff, fooling around. Would it make sense to go for more powerful hardware in the long run? It seems to work ok, but i got nothing to compare it with. |
| 00:21.52 | oiaohm | n4dir: it depends on what you are doing in audio. Basic audio correction I have done for a church on a computer that was 15 year old. |
| 00:23.09 | n4dir | as said, oiaohm it is really most basic. Say in ardour i make less than 8 tracks, use a synthesizer for each, and enter the notes in the grid with the mouse. Then i play it. Such stuff. With the synthesizer themself i just look what happend if i change which setting. |
| 00:23.20 | n4dir | i don't record, or if then only a bit of "noise". |
| 00:23.51 | n4dir | more like: how does this stuff work at all, then really doing something |
| 00:24.32 | oiaohm | <PROTECTED> |
| 00:25.02 | n4dir | i don't think so, i checked it a couple of times and there was nothing really high. Let me check that again. |
| 00:25.32 | oiaohm | Like you find people using GNUradio on dual core system what are like 10+ year old laptops because its good enough. |
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| 00:26.43 | n4dir | as far i can tell this is a 4 core laptop, and all cores are around 10% when using a modular synthesizer (vcvrack) |
| 00:28.10 | n4dir | might that change if i run it for longer? |
| 00:29.09 | oiaohm | https://discourse.ardour.org/t/ardour-on-raspberry-pi-4-model-b-first-impressions-and-test-results/101316/5 Thinking people run Ardour in a raspberry pi 4 with only 2G of ram. I would not be expect it pushing a 4 core x86 cpu with decent heatsink that hard. |
| 00:29.47 | n4dir | 3 Gigs of Ram here. But yes, good point. It probably has more horsepower than a raspberry |
| 00:30.22 | n4dir | thanks oiaohm :-) |
| 00:30.23 | oiaohm | I am not saying that you could not cause yourself trouble if you went stupid with jack or the like doing a huge stack of transformations. |
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| 00:31.09 | oiaohm | As long as you are sane in what you want todo a old system basic audio stuff should be fine. |
| 00:31.11 | n4dir | i am prepared for that to happen. But i got a few machines, so one going south is not the end of the world |
| 00:35.25 | oiaohm | Light audio work can be done with a entry level cpu like "AMD Athlon⢠Silver 3050GE" 2 cores 4 threads no problems. |
| 00:37.41 | oiaohm | n4dir: There audio items that can be hard. Like Plex Media Player playing back to many devices needing to transcode audio from one codec to another in realtime. This is not your composer level. There are some symths that are hevier. |
| 00:37.51 | n4dir | to me hardware is just " a black box". I get it for free, usually, so there is no need for me to think about it. But now that has changed a bit. I was wondering. But you seem to confirm that in general it may work |
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| 00:38.41 | oiaohm | I have a 8 core system but that mostly so that when I decide to build something from source it gets done fairly quickly or I am doing some light video work. |
| 00:39.02 | n4dir | Ah, i see. Ram if i may ask ? |
| 00:39.10 | oiaohm | 32G of ram. |
| 00:39.24 | n4dir | And last question: what would be the price of such a machine, more or less, not exactly yours? |
| 00:39.37 | oiaohm | I roughtly work on 2G of ram per thread. |
| 00:42.13 | oiaohm | n4dir: its roughly a 1500-2000 AUD system. |
| 00:42.44 | n4dir | Yeah, i thought so. That is not possible for me anyway. Even 500 Euros would be a little problem |
| 00:43.23 | oiaohm | Really I could build a system for the work for around 700 AUD if you was more tollerant to waiting. |
| 00:43.52 | oiaohm | Also I don't have a airconditioned house. |
| 00:44.06 | oiaohm | Yes I live where it gets fairly hot. |
| 00:44.22 | oiaohm | So 8 cores is about all I can decently cool on a hot day. |
| 00:44.38 | n4dir | I see. Let me turn that idea round my head for a couple of months. I got quite some fun with that audio stuff, and i might be in need. As said: right now it "seems" to work ok |
| 00:45.21 | oiaohm | Something people fail to consider when they buy a really powerful computer how they are going to keep it cool. |
| 00:45.38 | n4dir | :-) |
| 00:46.34 | oiaohm | Like there is no point for me having a threadripper without lot of costs for cooling for about 1 month a year. |
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| 00:46.52 | oiaohm | Opps |
| 00:47.22 | oiaohm | Without a lot fo costs in cooling I could only really use a threadripper flat out for about 1 month a year. Before it getting thermal throtrals to hell. |
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| 00:48.13 | oiaohm | basically n4dir there will be a max computer size that makes sense for your workspace. |
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| 00:49.49 | oiaohm | When I wrote there a month a year. I meaning that 11 months of a year due to heat its not going to be able to perform. |
| 00:50.11 | n4dir | Yes, i guess so. But what i hear about Ram, people calling it little, i don't have such. This machine 3 Gigs, but most have less (1 or 2 the better ones, some are really CLI only) |
| 00:50.23 | n4dir | ah, got you.l |
| 00:50.34 | n4dir | Well: Europe is pretty moderate, as long its not southern spain |
| 00:51.13 | oiaohm | I have seen people in cold areas not allow for the central heating limitations on computer sizes |
| 00:53.08 | oiaohm | n4dir I know a guy who works at a base on Antarctica. Yes stupid enough Xeon workstation system was not performing because if base Central heating. |
| 00:53.38 | n4dir | lol. |
| 00:53.38 | oiaohm | So some of your big powerful desktops don't in fact fit everywhere due to heat. |
| 00:54.14 | oiaohm | lol unless you are the one who as screwed up that way. |
| 00:54.32 | n4dir | besides web-browsing with a modern browser i was fine until now. Ok, and checking whats going on with gnome or kde i don't do anymore either |
| 00:54.59 | oiaohm | Bigger is not always better. |
| 00:55.03 | n4dir | though i just heard that kde ain't that tough on ressource usage anymore |
| 00:55.18 | oiaohm | I run kde but I have 3G of ram. |
| 00:55.20 | oiaohm | Opps |
| 00:55.24 | oiaohm | 32G of ram. |
| 00:56.05 | oiaohm | I do have another system that used for light stuff that is a 4G machine with 4 threads/cores. I don't use KDE on that. |
| 00:57.31 | n4dir | not kde, but? |
| 00:57.59 | oiaohm | The 4G machine is running xfce but that because my other famaliy member likes xfce. |
| 00:58.10 | oiaohm | and its also light. |
| 00:58.28 | oiaohm | Yes firefox and chrome both can run that system out of ram. |
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| 00:59.03 | oiaohm | really browser need ram is more likely to be a problem than most audio software. |
| 00:59.41 | n4dir | xfce does a good job for me, if i use it (which i sometimes do). Tried mate the other day, and seemed a little bit too heavy |
| 00:59.50 | n4dir | usually i go for a wm though |
| 01:00.08 | n4dir | but sure, the biggest problem are the web-browser. |
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| 01:00.45 | n4dir | mate as libraZik, an audio distribution you install on top of debian, uses it |
| 01:02.15 | n4dir | if you ever run in that question: from the distros for audio i have seen it has by far the most software pre-installed. Enough for a lifetime and your grandchildrens lifetime too |
| 01:08.17 | oiaohm | I normally just use debian testing and install what I want. |
| 01:08.37 | oiaohm | some items by flatpak and appimage. |
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| 01:10.43 | n4dir | sure. Just a shortcut to figure out what is out there. |
| 01:11.14 | oiaohm | I started using linux back in 1995 |
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| 01:11.23 | oiaohm | as my desktop. |
| 01:11.31 | n4dir | oh. |
| 01:12.10 | n4dir | i started 2007, first OS. But then it was already very easy. Put the CD in the tray and hit enter a couple of times |
| 01:12.46 | oiaohm | I cam from Unix workstations before that. |
| 01:14.01 | oiaohm | Linux on compadible hardware has less issues than windows. |
| 01:14.28 | n4dir | :-) I gotta sleep. Thanks again for the insight into hardware "problems". |
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| 01:20.45 | maxtim | this may seem a silly question, but what does it mean to add buster-backports to your apt sources list? Does it mean you're getting stuff from the "testing" branch? I've always been kinda confused about that |
| 01:21.39 | sney | it means you're getting the testing versions of (some) packages, rebuilt for stable. |
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| 01:23.12 | sney | rather, just adding buster-backports to sources.list doesn't install any software on its own. but it makes those newer packages available if you want them. |
| 01:23.47 | maxtim | will it update packages if i apt update && apt upgrade? |
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| 01:24.03 | maxtim | or do i have to specify which packages from backports? |
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| 01:24.22 | gotousan | i downloaded an ISO with firmware on it for a dell computer that is around 2 years old |
| 01:24.32 | gotousan | and it cant find the firmware on the ISO file |
| 01:24.38 | sney | backports is set at a low priority, so those packages will only install if you explicitly select them |
| 01:25.33 | sney | gotousan: what iso? what firmware? what exactly are you trying to do? |
| 01:25.52 | maxtim | it seems rather advantageous to use backports, then. I imagine the drawbacks could be some instability with certain packages... |
| 01:26.30 | sney | the main drawbacks with backports are that they don't get timely security support, and they aren't really tested to work with each other. |
| 01:26.39 | sney | so if you have a lot of backports your system can start to act weird. |
| 01:26.42 | gotousan | here is the ISO im using: https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/10.5.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-dvd/ |
| 01:26.48 | sney | they also don't always upgrade cleanly to the next debian version. |
| 01:26.54 | gotousan | the firmware it failed to detect was the network card |
| 01:27.55 | sney | gotousan: is this the same machine as before? what network card is it? |
| 01:28.16 | gotousan | different machine this time, much newer machine |
| 01:28.29 | gotousan | its still in the installation process, but gave me a warning about missing firmware |
| 01:28.39 | maxtim | that happens a lot. my guess is it's a realtek. |
| 01:28.47 | maxtim | well, a lot for me |
| 01:29.01 | sney | my guess is it *isn't* a realtek, because that would be supported by the firmware iso |
| 01:29.26 | sney | gotousan: can you be more specific? lots of hardware needs firmware so just having the warning doesn't narrow it down much |
| 01:29.42 | sney | hopes it isn't b43 |
| 01:30.43 | gotousan | apologies, need a minute since its still installing |
| 01:30.58 | gotousan | but was wondering why it was getting the error |
| 01:31.26 | sney | you can get to a different console in the installer by hitting alt-f2, or ctrl-alt-f2 in the graphical installer |
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| 02:27.18 | akp55 | anyone here using netplan? |
| 02:28.19 | sney | !anyone |
| 02:28.19 | dpkg | Please do not ask if anyone can help you, knows 'something' or uses 'some_program'. Instead, ask your real question. (If the real question _was_ "does anyone use 'some_program'?" ask me about <popcon> instead.) See <ask> <ask to ask> <polls> <search> <sicco> <smart questions>. |
| 02:28.34 | yanmaani | !popcon |
| 02:28.34 | dpkg | hmm... popcon is the Debian Popularity contest, the basis for what packages appear on the first few CDs/DVDs etc (by rank). Install the popularity-contest package to participate. See the results at http://popcon.debian.org/ -- See the FAQ at http://popcon.debian.org/FAQ . Statistics are also available via IRC, /msg judd popcon $package |
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| 02:32.05 | akp55 | sney: sometimes this the only way to start. the past few times i've attempted to ask a direct question it was crickets for days until i asked if someone has done x |
| 02:32.37 | akp55 | is anyone here successfully using netplan on a debian buster system. |
| 02:34.23 | sney | the thing is, there's like 50,000 packages in the archive, and most people haven't used all of them. but the regular helpers in here are pretty good at troubleshooting, even with the stuff that we don't use. |
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| 02:35.07 | sney | it's true that the more unusual your situation, the less likely it is that someone will be able to help. but that's true regardless of whether you think you're too special for the "anyone" guideline |
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| 02:54.31 | lenswipe | hey folks, I'm trying to add the PPA For obs studio to my debian box, but it's saying there's a missing key |
| 02:54.40 | lenswipe | https://launchpad.net/~obsproject/+archive/ubuntu/obs-studio |
| 02:54.42 | sney | !ppa |
| 02:54.43 | dpkg | [ppa] Personal Package Archive (see https://launchpad.net/ubuntu/+ppas or <launchpad>). PPAs are either: (a) an easy way to grab packages based on nightly-builds/VCS snapshots or (b) an easy way for any idiot to publish a package of extremely poor quality (remember, you will run the maintainer scripts as root during install!). Choose your repos wisely. No equivalent exists for Debian yet. Ask me about <why not use a ppa>. |
| 02:55.14 | lenswipe | Yep. I get that, but the version of OBS in the debian repos is extremely old and is missing support for things that I need to use |
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| 02:55.23 | sney | safer to grab the dsc and build the package on your debian system. ppas target ubuntu and trying to use it on debian will probably break shit |
| 02:55.26 | lenswipe | I tried building from source last time and the result ended with me re-installing my computer |
| 02:55.45 | lenswipe | and this is a work computer, so I'd rather not repeat that experience if that's okay. |
| 02:55.45 | zamnedix | lenswipe: you could pull the package from testing or sid |
| 02:55.56 | zamnedix | its possible to "pin" repositories |
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| 02:56.02 | lenswipe | ic |
| 02:56.08 | lenswipe | is that better than using the OBS PPA? |
| 02:56.25 | lenswipe | I'm aware of the whole wild west thing, but this isn't me installing a PPA for a shady flashlight app - it's the official OBS studio PPA |
| 02:56.28 | sney | mixing testing/sid with stable is *also* a good way to break debian. those packages have newer dependencies and will happily replace the buster versions of lots of stuff! |
| 02:56.40 | sney | !ssb |
| 02:56.41 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) apt update; apt install build-essential; apt build-dep packagename 4) apt -b source packagename 5) dpkg -i packagename-ver.deb To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
| 02:56.58 | lenswipe | so, i should check debian backport then |
| 02:57.07 | lenswipe | im not building OBS from source again |
| 02:57.29 | zamnedix | PPAs are usually built against ubuntu |
| 02:57.34 | sney | this will let you rebuild sid packages on buster. you can do basically the same thing with dget and the .dsc file from the ppa, and use debian tools to build the source, it's basically automated and a lot less hairy than dealing with an upstream tarball. |
| 02:57.59 | lenswipe | zamnedix, they tend to be okay. For example, right now I'm using the signal PPA, the chrome PPA and the vs code PPA |
| 02:58.07 | lenswipe | granted, that's hardly a garuntee, but it often does work |
| 02:58.18 | zamnedix | im not saying it wont work, just that its not necessarily reliable or recommended |
| 02:58.19 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: I use OBS installed from a flatpak, that's another option that won't mess up your APT |
| 02:58.21 | sney | if you're against building anything from source, upgrade to testing so you can use testing binary packages. |
| 02:58.30 | lenswipe | zamnedix, it's often the only way to install some packages |
| 02:58.32 | sney | oh right flatpaks, there's a good idea |
| 02:58.46 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, flatpak? |
| 02:58.56 | lenswipe | interesting |
| 02:59.10 | zamnedix | yeah, flatpaks are a good option if available |
| 02:59.14 | lenswipe | i tried installing it from snap before - but the result was that it ran with weird permissions and didn't integrate very well |
| 02:59.19 | zamnedix | snap is garbage |
| 02:59.21 | lenswipe | are flatpaks better than snaps? |
| 02:59.28 | zamnedix | flatpak > appimage > snap |
| 02:59.37 | sney | yes, they're the same concept but they seem to work better |
| 02:59.38 | lenswipe | wait... |
| 02:59.41 | lenswipe | appimage != snap? |
| 02:59.49 | zamnedix | they are all different |
| 02:59.54 | lenswipe | i thought appimage was the same as snap |
| 03:00.17 | lenswipe | or rather...i thought that appimage was the file extension given to a snap |
| 03:00.49 | zamnedix | appimages require the least amount of supporting software. you just download an appimage and run it |
| 03:00.57 | zamnedix | they are separate from snap |
| 03:01.03 | lenswipe | i see |
| 03:01.43 | lenswipe | so, appimages, snaps and flatpaks are the same concept implemented differentlyt? |
| 03:02.10 | zamnedix | yes. they all try to solve the same problem in slightly different ways |
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| 03:02.49 | lenswipe | i see |
| 03:02.52 | lenswipe | one moment...restarting |
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| 03:13.42 | sgo11 | hi, I have multiple sound devices in my PC. Even if I choose the default sound device in UI setting, application keeps using the non-default device. why? For most apps, I can switch the sound device in UI tools easily. But how to set terminal beep sound device? That does not appear at any sound setting UI tools. Thanks. |
| 03:19.32 | lenswipe | hey folks |
| 03:19.33 | lenswipe | quick problem |
| 03:19.45 | lenswipe | im trying to install a package that depends on something that i installed from a flatpak |
| 03:19.58 | lenswipe | <PROTECTED> |
| 03:20.25 | jmcnaught | What are you trying to install? |
| 03:20.44 | sponix | lenswipe: flatpak is self contained, therefore you can't count on it to provide a dep for anything |
| 03:21.02 | lenswipe | I'm trying to install an NDI plugin for OBS studio |
| 03:21.16 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: https://github.com/flathub/com.obsproject.Studio/wiki/NDI-Support |
| 03:21.19 | lenswipe | the NDI plugin depends on OBS (obviously) but thinks that it isn't installed |
| 03:21.26 | lenswipe | ...even though it is |
| 03:21.32 | lenswipe | im installing the NDI plugin from github |
| 03:21.50 | lenswipe | ah, that's annoying |
| 03:22.05 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, https://github.com/Palakis/obs-ndi/releases |
| 03:22.09 | lenswipe | im installing that plugin] |
| 03:22.38 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: follow the instructions I linked, they worked for me. I use OBS with NDI on Debian installed by flatpak |
| 03:22.46 | lenswipe | thanks |
| 03:22.51 | lenswipe | did you have to install libndi separately? |
| 03:23.24 | jmcnaught | no |
| 03:23.27 | sponix | jmcnaught: what is NDI ? |
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| 03:23.40 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: you don't need those .debs at all. |
| 03:23.43 | lenswipe | sponix, do you know what SDI is? |
| 03:23.49 | sponix | nope |
| 03:24.02 | sponix | goes to read the document jmcnaught posted |
| 03:24.19 | lenswipe | in professional video, there's a video standard called SDI which is a way to send HD video over a coax cable. |
| 03:24.34 | lenswipe | it's used a lot in TV studios and typically has a BNC connector. That's what the BNC connector on many expensive cameras is for |
| 03:24.43 | lenswipe | you can then feed this signal into a video switcher |
| 03:24.46 | lenswipe | NDI is the same idea but over IP |
| 03:25.11 | lenswipe | the short version is: "A way to get a high quality, low latency video feed into OBS studio over the network" |
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| 03:25.54 | sponix | Oh.. Interesting. Thanks for explaining |
| 03:25.59 | lenswipe | sure, np |
| 03:26.03 | lenswipe | NDI is pretty freakin awesome |
| 03:26.06 | sponix | I have Zero needs for that, but it is still cool |
| 03:26.42 | lenswipe | In my particular use case, if you have a motorized PTZ(Pan Tilt Zoom) camera that's NDI enabled...you can plug one ethernet cable in to provide control, power and the video signal |
| 03:27.03 | lenswipe | you can then import that NDI feed into OBS, and then have OBS spit out another NDI feed that you can then feed into TVs at your venue or whatever |
| 03:27.05 | lenswipe | NDI is awesome |
| 03:29.18 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, quick question - is the version of OBS you clone down for flatpak builder just for deps? or do you end up installing it? |
| 03:30.56 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, are you using KDE? |
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| 03:33.34 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: you're not git cloning OBS just flatpak build instructions, I already had OBS installed when I did this. I use GNOME. |
| 03:36.17 | karlpinc | Is there a way to find out which processes are using a mounted device? (Either by mount point or by device.) |
| 03:36.32 | nvz | fuser, lsof.. etc |
| 03:36.51 | karlpinc | nvz: lsof will take a device? |
| 03:37.44 | karlpinc | (Using find on a whole mounted fs to give args to lsof seems excessive.) |
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| 03:38.57 | rojiro | i am running tails in a VM, when i go to display settings sometimes there is a choice for 200% and sometimes it's missing, any ideas on why that might be? thanks in advance. |
| 03:38.59 | sney | before you go digging, make sure you don't have an open shell currently idling in one of the mounted directories. this will give you a "cannot unmount, device busy" error and doesn't show up in lsof |
| 03:39.16 | sney | !tails |
| 03:39.16 | dpkg | Tails (The Amnesic Incognito Live System) is a live DVD/USB <based on Debian>, with the aim of preserving privacy and anonymity. It is not supported in #debian. https://tails.boum.org/ #tails on irc.oftc.net. |
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| 03:39.56 | karlpinc | sney: I might. Probably do. But have no idea which shell. And I can't think of any that would.... |
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| 03:40.47 | karlpinc | (And you guessed it. I want to unmount.) |
| 03:41.08 | rojiro | sney: thanks, also have a debain 10 virtual machine running and there is no choice for 200% rendering, any ideas? how do i enable it? is it only available for certain resolutions? |
| 03:41.31 | sney | karlpinc: when I do this to myself, it's always the terminal emulator right in front of me, staring me in the face |
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| 03:41.49 | karlpinc | sney: Yeah. I don't care enough. I'll probably just leave it mounted |
| 03:41.52 | karlpinc | and wait for reboot. :) |
| 03:42.05 | sney | rojiro: what hypervisor? |
| 03:42.11 | rojiro | qemu |
| 03:42.22 | rojiro | virt-manager on ubuntu |
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| 03:47.48 | karlpinc | sney: Ah ha. A cron job, now completed. |
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| 03:48.05 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, yeah im having some issues following those instructions |
| 03:48.20 | lenswipe | error: org.kde.Sdk/x86_64/5.14 not installed\ Failed to init: Unable to find sdk org.kde.Sdk//5.14 version stable |
| 03:48.42 | lenswipe | im using gnome |
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| 03:50.21 | nvz | sounds like you're using flatpak |
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| 03:50.29 | lenswipe | nvz, i am |
| 03:50.32 | nvz | which doesnt care what you're using in my experience |
| 03:50.41 | lenswipe | that message suggests otherwise |
| 03:50.43 | nvz | you get whatever the heck someone built the package with |
| 03:50.47 | lenswipe | ah |
| 03:50.54 | lenswipe | so should i install that package? |
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| 03:51.50 | nvz | which is why I dont fool with such nonsense.. if I'm gonna install a whole damn dependency bundle that amounts to a full f'n OS, I'm gonna do it myself with debootstrap or something not use an entire pre-configured package from some random place |
| 03:52.02 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: do you have OBS installed already? |
| 03:52.27 | nvz | in my experience the only of the modern portable packages that is not a royal PITA is appimages |
| 03:53.20 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, yes |
| 03:53.23 | lenswipe | via flatpak |
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| 03:53.50 | lenswipe | nvz, fuck no. im not doing down the debootstrap debacle again |
| 03:54.03 | jmcnaught | lenswipe: if you make a paste of the command you used and the complete output I will take a look but I have a call coming up soon |
| 03:54.07 | lenswipe | nvz also, in what world is debootstrap a reasonable way to install an application? |
| 03:54.15 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, sure, one sec |
| 03:55.35 | nvz | its not, but if you're gonna slam a package in your system that pulls in 1000+ dependencies, you might as well just setup that whole system yourself |
| 03:56.55 | lenswipe | hard disagree |
| 03:57.25 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, https://pastebin.com/ntP8QVuB |
| 03:58.00 | nvz | to me snap/flatpak and such dont address the portability issue because they neither use possibly existant deps already on the system, nor do they keep all the crap self contained.. instead they implement some kinda ridiculous system requiring not only a whole new package manager system, but a daemon and runtimes to support the ridiculousness.. where an appimage.. its everything.. requires no special stuff to |
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| 03:58.06 | nvz | use, everything is inside.. |
| 03:58.31 | akp55 | folks that are using netplan, what did you have to do to get it working? on my system it doesn't ever seem to generate anything into /run/systemd/network, ever |
| 03:59.13 | lenswipe | nvm not entirely unreasonable |
| 04:01.01 | lenswipe | nvz, i mean that's kind of what a windows .exe is supposed to be, right? |
| 04:01.06 | lenswipe | minus the DLLs |
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| 04:03.12 | nvz | yeah well, thats kinda my point.. if youre gonna make portable static binaries, they should be portable static binaries.. especially when they're ridiculously huge apps with heafty dependency chains.. |
| 04:03.47 | nvz | an appimage, the file itself is both the package (like an archive or disk image) and the program.. and contains everything to run it or mount it and access its content |
| 04:04.16 | nvz | there is no fussing with it, you just obtain the file and run it |
| 04:05.04 | nvz | probably designed by some Apple nerds.. has a very Apple like feel to it :P |
| 04:05.17 | lenswipe | jmcnaught, figured it out. turns out i was just missing the KDE runtime |
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| 04:09.34 | Arrow900 | Can someone help me with Bluetooth headset does not find after reboot unless I remove it from Devices and repair ? |
| 04:10.25 | nvz | heh..took me a minute to realize wth you meant by "repair" |
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| 04:10.50 | Arrow900 | oh i mean to pair again |
| 04:11.29 | nvz | yeah.. well.. its like I say when I see someone who made excessive use of tar to try fix a roof leak.. |
| 04:11.41 | nvz | most roofing materials include tar. and if you tar it again.. |
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| 04:12.03 | nvz | its kinda retarred |
| 04:12.07 | nvz | :P |
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| 04:12.40 | nvz | really though this sounds like its in the realm of not how things work, and perhaps your headset is randomly changing its pairing code or something |
| 04:12.50 | nvz | in which case the computer can't keep track of it and stay paired |
| 04:13.13 | nvz | and in such a case you'd probably for your sanity just have to script the workaround |
| 04:13.15 | karlpinc | I've never tried to pair a bluetooth device with Debian. But now I've a use-case. Is there anything special I need to install? What's the process? |
| 04:13.46 | nvz | for most people, you just install blueman if you use a DE and want a graphical solution |
| 04:13.46 | karlpinc | (I see there's a debian wiki page....) |
| 04:14.19 | karlpinc | nvz: Thanks. I'll give it a try. |
| 04:14.48 | Arrow900 | are you saying it would be better to switch back to wired headphones then if it takes tinkering to use bluetooth every boot |
| 04:14.57 | nvz | I've began using bluetooth more in recent years cause stuff is cheaper now.. and I find that once I've paired something it just automatically reconnects |
| 04:15.25 | nvz | I am saying if you know how to work around the problem, you can probably script the workaround and not have to do that |
| 04:16.33 | nvz | the only reasons I can think of that a device wouldnt stay paired is because its changing its identifier or pairing code |
| 04:17.25 | nvz | the idea is, you pair a device to establish a sort of trust/identification system so that when the devices are on and in range, they automatically connect |
| 04:17.31 | Arrow900 | headset actually makes connection sound but it wont show in gnome sound settings or pavucontrol until removed from devices and paired again |
| 04:18.06 | nvz | ah, well then its not the BT stack per se that is your issue, its pulseaudio |
| 04:18.45 | nvz | and yeah, pulseaudio does still have quirks at times when changing devices.. I get it all the time with use of my laptops, docks, hdmi outputs, etc.. |
| 04:18.59 | nvz | THAT may actually be a much simpler issue to address |
| 04:19.17 | nvz | cause usually all thats needed in those cases is to kill pulseaudio and it'll restart and work fine |
| 04:19.36 | nvz | and THAT you can probably easily hook to happen when your device attaches |
| 04:21.52 | Arrow900 | okay I try to reboot and see if it works just to run pulseaudio -k |
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| 04:23.13 | Strykar | Is it possible to stop a systemd service when a specific interface goes down? without using external helpers like NetworkManager dispatcher scripts? |
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| 04:24.58 | Arrow900 | did not work :/ |
| 04:25.08 | nvz | Strykar: I'm not real savvy with systemd to know if it has methods for this, and I would think it does.. especially if using its networkd.. you could ask #systemd for that.. but udev could probably do the trick |
| 04:27.01 | Strykar | nvz: thanks, I'm wondering if there's a systemd method for this. I can prevent the service from starting until the interface is up by using (xecStartPre=/usr/lib/systemd/systemd-networkd-wait-online --interface=enp0s29u1u2u1) I dunno how to stop it, I read the docs, and searching around led me to https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/11830 |
| 04:27.15 | Strykar | I have asked in #systemd, no response |
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| 04:36.54 | Arrow900 | It might have been USB bluetooth dongle issue too, now it works after reboot just by switching usb port |
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| 04:43.17 | nvz | hmm.. just ran across your issue on github :P |
| 04:45.53 | Strykar | nvz: udev it is for now, I'll wait for that RFE to get updated, but it would make sense to let carrier events be used as triggers |
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| 04:49.25 | nvz | well I explored the udev route and I dont see anything hitting udev when I change my network state |
| 04:49.36 | nvz | only if I use rfkill does udev see it |
| 04:50.31 | nvz | I'm also seeing no changes in systemd units or targets |
| 04:50.49 | nvz | its really looking like you need one of many possible daemons that monitor network status |
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| 04:53.39 | Strykar | yep, so remove wont work cause no device = no ATTRS |
| 04:53.55 | Strykar | a NetworkManager dispatcher script it is |
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| 04:55.03 | Strykar | I can;te believe I'm saying this, but systemd needs to add this feature |
| 04:55.29 | Strykar | nvz: there's also https://gitlab.com/craftyguy/networkd-dispatcher |
| 04:56.33 | nvz | yeah well I fooled with n-m dispatching and its decent but looks like one of many cases different programmers worked on different parts and implemented it in totally different ways |
| 04:56.54 | nvz | the up/down pre/post events are not all configured equally in the same location and convention |
| 04:57.05 | nvz | figured that shit out the hard way |
| 04:58.01 | nvz | I'm surprised udev doesn't see the state change |
| 04:58.38 | nvz | I recently hooked udev to prevent accidentally making my backlight go off when I use the brightness applet.. |
| 04:58.40 | Strykar | udev sees the state change, its the rule that lists the device by attributes that fails, since the device doesn't exist anymore |
| 04:59.12 | nvz | idk udevadm monitor did nothing when I plugged in an ethernet cable and unplugged it |
| 04:59.38 | nvz | and I'm not sure what you mean, but I'd be matching this by the subsystem like I did with the backlight.. |
| 05:00.42 | nvz | only thing udevadm monitor saw was when I used rfkill |
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| 05:07.41 | Strykar | nvz: did you run into this by any chance? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=701242 |
| 05:08.58 | nvz | doesnt look familiar |
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| 05:27.07 | Strykar | nvz: NM dispatcher script does the job! |
| 05:27.31 | Strykar | just weird that systemd with its all encomapssing strat can't use carrier events as triggers |
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| 07:14.12 | Morg0th | Any idea why after installing nvidia-driver it still seems to be using my discrete Intel card, and if I add a xorg.conf to force nvidia I can only start X on an external monitor and not on my laptop screen (or I get a "No screens found" error)? It's starting to drive me crazy |
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| 07:27.38 | babilen5 | Morg0th: You might want to familiarise yourself with the wonderful world (and pain) of Optimus |
| 07:27.57 | babilen5 | dpkg: optimus |
| 07:27.57 | dpkg | The Bumblebee project aims to provide support for the Nvidia Optimus GPU switching technology on Linux systems. GeForce 400M (4xxM) and later mobile GPU series are Optimus-enabled; if «lspci -nn | grep '\[030[02]\]'» returns two lines, the laptop likely uses Optimus. Packaged for Debian <jessie> and <stretch> and <buster> and <bullseye>. http://wiki.debian.org/Bumblebee http://bumblebee-project.org/ #bumblebee on irc.freenode.net. |
| 07:28.34 | babilen5 | I avoided buying any hardware with it, so I am not sure what the current situation is around that, but that should give you something to look into |
| 07:28.38 | Morg0th | babilen5: I tried that a long time ago, but I recently checked it again and saw that it did not handle dual monitor well so I dropped the idea. But maybe it's not the case anymore? |
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| 07:29.39 | Morg0th | Anyway I tried it for a bit and kinda got the same problems that I have now, but I didn't stick with it for very long as it seems to complicate things more than anything else and has experimental dual-monitoring :/ |
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| 07:30.30 | alex11 | is anyone familiar with nn? how do i reset nntpserver? |
| 07:31.06 | babilen5 | Morg0th: As I said, I try to avoid any GPU switching hardware and am not sure what the current state of the art is. Hopefully matters have improved in the last couple of years |
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| 07:35.19 | alex11 | i do try to (as per the man page) do nntp-server=sci.astro.amateur but it just gives me a command not found |
| 07:36.21 | alex11 | it seems to be in /etc/news/server but i did an apt purge to get rid of that and it's still there, and there's nothing in ~/.nn |
| 07:36.59 | alex11 | maybe i can make a ~/.nn/server and set it that way but that seems like a hack |
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| 07:40.23 | jelly | alex11, "sci.astro.amateur" is probably a newsgroup name and not a host name |
| 07:41.04 | alex11 | right, makes sense |
| 07:41.14 | alex11 | i'm not sure what to a) set for the host name and b) how to change it now |
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| 07:42.44 | twanny796 | alex11: man hostname |
| 07:42.45 | jelly | you ought to know in advance which news server you want to connect to |
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| 07:43.32 | Haohmaru | who.knows.news |
| 07:44.07 | jelly | alex11, nn is just a client, it needs to connect to a working nntp server that you have access to, either an account with login and password, or a public nntp server if one of those still exists |
| 07:44.19 | alex11 | gotcha |
| 07:44.43 | jelly | https://www.quora.com/Are-there-any-free-Usenet-servers |
| 07:45.53 | alex11 | not stingy about paying, just was unsure of the current state of the art |
| 07:46.00 | alex11 | this all does make sense |
| 07:46.49 | ratrace | Allain: I don't remember what F2 does, but you add init=.... on the kernel line when (the line starting with "linux /vmlinuz-....." |
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| 08:22.32 | krion | hi guys |
| 08:22.52 | krion | is this uri supposed to work ? https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/ |
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| 08:26.48 | krion | well, working know but I hit two or three times apache error page |
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| 09:02.15 | hassoon | 'morning |
| 09:02.26 | Haohmaru | it's noon |
| 09:02.49 | Unit193 | Or 5am. |
| 09:03.11 | Haohmaru | eyeballz the clock |
| 09:03.17 | Haohmaru | no, noon |
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| 09:30.28 | nickname123 | can i tell aptitide not to automatically remove headers? i think i need them for dkms modules. also, is it possible to tell dkms to create a module for all installed kernels? |
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| 09:37.24 | fireba11 | nickname123: what you mean remove headers? they should get removed if you uninstall the kernel they are for, then you usually have no need for them anymore |
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| 09:42.54 | nickname123 | fireba11: aptitide -safe-upgrade removes them |
| 09:42.58 | nickname123 | minus - |
| 09:43.08 | nickname123 | -i+u |
| 09:43.26 | nickname123 | the kernels stay though |
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| 10:04.04 | fireba11 | nickname123: do they get removed if you explicitly install them? |
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| 10:27.58 | joro_ | Hello guys, i got a huge problem... i changed the language of my Debian system, after rebooting the os it asked me whether to keep the name of folders Dow,Docs and etc with the previous names i clicked "dont keep" |
| 10:28.09 | joro_ | then all my files from those folders dissapear |
| 10:28.45 | joro_ | does anyone know how can i recover my data...? ;[ |
| 10:30.08 | joro_ | or if they are somewhere else.. how can i find them ? |
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| 10:36.28 | RoyK | joro_: try to open a terminal first. if you can search for a specific filename, it'll make things easier |
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| 10:43.07 | babilen5 | joro_: A simple "ls ~" might help tremendously. |
| 10:43.31 | RoyK | no need for ~ either - the terminal will open there |
| 10:44.00 | jelly | the folders should have been renamed to localized translations of the same stuff |
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| 10:44.27 | Phase | Lol!!! |
| 10:44.35 | jelly | Gnome people think that is a sensible thing to do |
| 10:45.16 | babilen5 | RoyK: It probably does, but the above works without that assumption. |
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| 10:52.35 | dosmanak | Hello. Anybody understand DebianRepository? |
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| 10:53.33 | dosmanak | Is is true the binary-all Packages must be included in all other binary-$ARCH Packages? |
| 10:54.21 | dosmanak | Why apt-get update on amd64 does not request for binary-all/Packages ? |
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| 10:56.04 | azeem | dosmanak: what's your sources.list line? |
| 10:56.34 | dosmanak | deb http://10.15.253.111:9999/nangu-jessie/ nangutv main |
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| 10:56.42 | azeem | nangutv? |
| 10:56.52 | dosmanak | :-X my company :-E |
| 10:56.57 | azeem | well it might be an issue with their repository |
| 10:57.26 | dob1 | these universal packages are safe to use? |
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| 10:57.27 | dosmanak | The repository is Nexus Repository. I am not sure, it is a bug. |
| 10:57.32 | azeem | I don't think you see arch:all in apt update output, not sure; but do you evidence that those packages aren't around? |
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| 11:01.01 | dosmanak | tcpdump... https://pastebin.com/pZENCN85 |
| 11:01.52 | dosmanak | azeem: Why apt-get update does not request binary-all packages even tought is is mentioned in Release file? |
| 11:02.43 | azeem | do you have evidence for that? |
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| 11:03.04 | dosmanak | Or should it? I found on https://wiki.debian.org/DebianRepository/Format?action=show&redirect=RepositoryFormat#A.22Packages.22_Indices it should. |
| 11:03.14 | yuriii | Hi! Is it possible to define a custom makefile variable when invoking dpkg-buildpackage ? To be used in rules file. |
| 11:03.15 | dosmanak | The Packages file for architecture $ARCH should include only paragraphs concerning packages of the architecture $ARCH. It may also include packages of the architecture all depending on the value of the Architectures field in the Release file. |
| 11:04.01 | dosmanak | azeem: Have you noticed the pastebin link? Ther's the evidence: https://pastebin.com/pZENCN85 |
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| 11:04.21 | azeem | grep Arch:.all /var/lib/apt/lists/ftp.de.debian.org_debian_dists_buster_main_binary-amd64_Packages | wc -l |
| 11:04.24 | azeem | 160 |
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| 11:06.05 | dosmanak | Ok, so it is true that 'all' arch packages should be present in packages for other achitectures and that means that Nexus APT repository has a bug. But according to the documentation I pasted above it is not clear. |
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| 11:07.52 | dosmanak | Ah, the same link, for Release file: "The presents of the architecture all in this field indicates that the architecture-specific indexes do not include information about Architecture:all packages and have instead their own index file with the architecture all. Clients must download the all index files in this case, but must not download them if the Architectures field does not include all. " |
| 11:09.03 | dosmanak | azeem: Still seem like a bug in apt-get |
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| 11:12.43 | azeem | dosmanak: eh? |
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| 11:19.08 | dosmanak | azeem: Wow! jessie does not work, but stretch is OK. |
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| 11:29.03 | joro_ | there are no folders left... |
| 11:30.21 | RoyK | joro_: pastebin output of "ls -a $HOME", please |
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| 11:30.39 | dosmanak | azeem: It seems to be addes in 1.1~exp9 version of apt, but on jessie I have 1.0.9. |
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| 12:05.05 | f8e4 | hi folks, did this get removed :( $ /sbin/ifconfig -a |
| 12:05.16 | f8e4 | it says no such |
| 12:06.47 | zamnedix | f8e4: "ip a" from ip(8) is the New Way (tm) |
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| 12:07.38 | f8e4 | zamnedix ty |
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| 12:21.20 | f8e4 | is this valid to print the relative path of file: find ./install ? |
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| 13:48.35 | careta | hey guys |
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| 13:48.49 | careta | I'm running a large 4k screen off my laptop and using it exclusively |
| 13:48.54 | petn-randall | hi careta |
| 13:49.12 | careta | but if I leave the laptop unattended for a while, the laptop screen turns on (detected by xrandr) which messes up my window layout |
| 13:49.21 | careta | any idea what might be happening that causes it to turn on? |
| 13:51.09 | careta | I already turned it off in xrandr |
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| 14:05.38 | neilthereildeil | hey guys, im having trouble booting Linux. it gets stuck at the grub command line. Can someone please help? |
| 14:06.09 | neilthereildeil | im booting off a RAID5 disk in BIOS mode rather than UEFI |
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| 14:23.12 | another | fresh install? |
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| 14:37.05 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: Did you install it in BIOS mode? |
| 14:37.21 | neilthereildeil | i THINK so? how do i check? |
| 14:37.34 | neilthereildeil | also, i was able to get past the grub shell by selecting the kernel |
| 14:37.36 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: You need to remember how it was set when you installed the system. |
| 14:37.37 | neilthereildeil | it already saw /boot |
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| 14:37.51 | neilthereildeil | even without any additional modules loaded |
| 14:37.54 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: Also, what error you're getting would help narrowing the issue down. |
| 14:38.05 | neilthereildeil | so now its booting the kernel and getting stuck in initrd |
| 14:38.15 | neilthereildeil | im trynna figure out what options to pass to kernel and initrd |
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| 14:40.17 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: So, what error is there after it loads the initrd? |
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| 14:41.03 | neilthereildeil | it wasnt an error, but i get the initrd shell |
| 14:41.07 | neilthereildeil | and i dunno what to do next |
| 14:41.27 | petn-randall | You should get an error message directly before the shell prompt. |
| 14:42.08 | neilthereildeil | im booting the debian install ISO and going to take a picture of the grub.conf and try again with those args |
| 14:42.11 | neilthereildeil | plz standby |
| 14:43.59 | petn-randall | That probably won't help at all without the actual failure message. |
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| 14:44.35 | rander2 | hello |
| 14:44.37 | petn-randall | If it doesn't show you an error you might need to remove "quiet" from the grub menu entry by hand, but IIRC that's not necessary. |
| 14:44.40 | petn-randall | hi rander2 |
| 14:44.47 | neilthereildeil | yea i didnt have quiet on there |
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| 14:45.15 | rander2 | how may I write a fix server in /etc/resolv.conf? |
| 14:45.15 | petn-randall | !paste |
| 14:45.15 | dpkg | Do not paste more than 2 lines to this channel. Instead, use for text: https://paste.debian.net | pics/screenshots: https://imgbb.com/ or https://imgur.com/upload | large files up to 100MB (think tar.gz): https://filebin.net or https://wikisend.com | Remember to tell us the URL of your paste! Cannot cut and paste? Ask me about <pastebinit>, <nopaste>, <termbin>. |
| 14:45.32 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: Can you post a screenshot of the error? ^^^ |
| 14:45.45 | neilthereildeil | ok lemme reproduce it... |
| 14:46.03 | petn-randall | rander2: Usually just edit the file as root, but it depends on if you have other things installed that edit it itself. |
| 14:46.47 | petn-randall | rander2: Let me ask from a different angle: Why do you want to edit it by hand? |
| 14:47.30 | rander2 | petn-randall, to avoid that another program modify it.every time dhcp take a new IP , it modify the resolv.conf |
| 14:47.46 | petn-randall | rander2: Ok, and why don't you want that? |
| 14:48.17 | rander2 | petn-randall, 'cause dhcpwrite fake dns |
| 14:48.28 | rander2 | petn-randall, 'cause dhcp write fake dns |
| 14:48.53 | petn-randall | rander2: How is your network usually configured? Via ifupdown, or network-manager? |
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| 14:49.05 | rander2 | so I must modify it every time with hands |
| 14:49.14 | rander2 | network-manager |
| 14:50.41 | petn-randall | rander2: You can configure network-manager to manually set the DNS server. |
| 14:51.03 | petn-randall | rander2: But you probably want to also notify the owner of the DHCP server to fix their settings. |
| 14:51.13 | rander2 | how may I configure it ? |
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| 14:52.09 | petn-randall | rander2: Do you have a desktop environment installed? |
| 14:52.22 | rander2 | xfce |
| 14:53.16 | petn-randall | rander2: I don't recall the exact place, but there should be a field for DNS server when you click on configure for that network. |
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| 14:54.59 | r3m1 | hello |
| 14:55.51 | another | neilthereildeil: did you forget to install mdadm? |
| 14:56.16 | r3m1 | have a process which creates a full lot of connexions closed in FIN_WAIT2 states. been investigating about the hows and whys. I would like to know if it is possible using netstat or another command for how long a particular socket is in this state ? |
| 14:56.41 | neilthereildeil | another: unless the debian installer installed it automatically, i dont have it |
| 14:56.42 | rander2 | https://paste.debian.net/1162453/ |
| 14:57.27 | rander2 | is dhclient that modify resolv.conf ? |
| 14:59.20 | another | neilthereildeil: if you used the guided installer it's probably installed |
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| 14:59.28 | petn-randall | rander2: no. |
| 14:59.38 | neilthereildeil | but i manually partitioned the disk. not the guided partition |
| 15:00.20 | petn-randall | neilthereildeil: Could you find the error during boot yet? Without it we'll only be second-guessing what the issue is. |
| 15:00.36 | another | err.. did you also manually created the raid? |
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| 15:01.29 | neilthereildeil | im booted off the debian rescue disk |
| 15:01.37 | neilthereildeil | apparently mdadm isnt installed |
| 15:02.14 | neilthereildeil | i created this RAID array using the Dell Poweredge R630 RAID controller BIOS page |
| 15:02.32 | neilthereildeil | do i still need mdadm? This RAID array was created before the OS was installed |
| 15:02.36 | petn-randall | Ah, so it's hardware RAID. You don't need mdadm in this case. |
| 15:02.40 | neilthereildeil | ok cool |
| 15:02.47 | neilthereildeil | rebooting now and ill get u the error.. |
| 15:02.55 | petn-randall | cool |
| 15:03.30 | another | ah forgot about hw raids |
| 15:03.40 | wyoung | I like HW Raid |
| 15:03.48 | another | i don't |
| 15:03.56 | wyoung | oh |
| 15:04.07 | neilthereildeil | does hardware RAID mean the RAID logic is implemented on an ASIC? or still in software on a coprocessor on the PERC board? |
| 15:05.16 | another | it just means, there is special hardware that deals with it |
| 15:05.24 | jelly | it does not have to be an ASIC, just dedicated hardware |
| 15:05.33 | another | how that hardware is implemented? who knows |
| 15:05.44 | wyoung | neilthereildeil: The former but some motherboard say it has HW raid but it is really just a chip that stores the config and does everything via drivers |
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| 15:05.58 | jelly | we call those "fakeraid" |
| 15:06.20 | neilthereildeil | yea i wouldnt call it software RAID unless theres an ASIC |
| 15:06.28 | neilthereildeil | err hardware* RAID unless theres an ASIC |
| 15:07.05 | jelly | if Linux only sees a single volume (single "disk") it's very likely a real hw raid of some sort |
| 15:07.31 | wyoung | neilthereildeil: Yup, there are raids that perform most stuff in ASIC but others in drivers, some RAID6 cards do that, annoying |
| 15:08.16 | neilthereildeil | jelly: not neessarily, if the SATA cables go to the RAID controller rather than the motherboard. then the RAID controller can fake anything |
| 15:08.19 | neilthereildeil | even in software |
| 15:08.43 | neilthereildeil | ok, so when i booted the rescue disk, it had root=UUID=<SOME_GUID> |
| 15:08.58 | rander2 | petn-randall, solution was : chattr +i /etc/resolv.conf |
| 15:08.58 | neilthereildeil | is that a GPT GUID? |
| 15:09.52 | petn-randall | rander2: That will break a lot of other things. Changing your network-manager config is the better option. |
| 15:10.25 | rander2 | petn-randall, how change networkmanager config ? |
| 15:10.57 | petn-randall | rander2: Change it in your network-manager GUI. |
| 15:11.39 | neilthereildeil | it booted the kernel :) |
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| 15:12.07 | rander2 | petn-randall, sorry I dont found it |
| 15:13.12 | petn-randall | I guess they found something else :/ |
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| 15:30.26 | jelly | fighting with NetworkManager is really a PITA, can't be mad at a user using the nuclear option instead |
| 15:30.45 | jelly | even if that causes issues later |
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| 16:06.53 | dob1 | are these universal packages safe to use? how does they work if you install a package from it and the same from apt ? |
| 16:08.09 | dob1 | (I would like to use them to get firefox non-esr) |
| 16:08.50 | sney | what universal packages? |
| 16:09.07 | dob1 | sney, they call them in this way. flatapk/snap |
| 16:09.22 | dob1 | *flatpak |
| 16:09.27 | sney | right, ok. |
| 16:09.42 | sney | yes they are safe to use. most people seem to have better results with flatpak than snap. |
| 16:10.05 | dob1 | who mantain them? |
| 16:10.37 | sney | depends on the package, that information is available on the info pages, afaik |
| 16:10.59 | sney | it's not officially supported in #debian but it's self contained enough that it probably won't break anything. |
| 16:11.24 | oxek | dob1: they are safe to use as long as you get them from flathub |
| 16:11.44 | dob1 | oxek, so you are saying to use just flatpak? |
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| 16:11.54 | oxek | yeah |
| 16:12.24 | oxek | what flathub does is create one simple script file that contains instructions where to downloaded sources and how to build them |
| 16:13.06 | dob1 | but they don't conflict if the package is installed via apt? |
| 16:13.13 | oxek | so as long as they point to the developers official sources, and the flathub build machines and developer machines are not infected, you are safe. |
| 16:13.17 | oxek | they don't conflict |
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| 16:13.25 | oxek | they are installed in a different location |
| 16:13.58 | dob1 | they are installed just for the user or system wide? |
| 16:14.34 | oxek | your choice |
| 16:15.09 | oxek | per-user installation is with --user switch, system-wide installation is with --system switch |
| 16:15.14 | oxek | I don't remember which one is default |
| 16:16.17 | dob1 | I will try them, thanks for the infos |
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| 16:57.25 | devon | Early 2015 MacBookAir7,2 fails to see Debian live boot, any tips? |
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| 16:58.55 | oxek | devon: use unofficial builds of debian live that include non-free firmware |
| 16:59.49 | oxek | 50% of problems people talk about in here are about non-working wifi/graphics/booting, all of which is solved by including non-free firmware |
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| 17:02.36 | Zeshy | Hi! Can I make BIND on my server honor /etc/hosts? I googled high and low, and the answer /seems/ to be no. Fallback solution would be a simple script adding /etc/hosts entries to the lookup file(s), but I cannot imagine that mighty BIND would have no simple option/include to honor /etc/hosts on the machine it is running on. Any hints? |
| 17:02.39 | devon | oxek: It never even sees the boot media, so firmware is moot. |
| 17:03.30 | cluonbeam | devon: How did you write the ISO to media? |
| 17:04.50 | devon | oxek: For all I know it does see the boot media but ignores it as not having a bootable partition. I dd the ISO to the drive, then compare them to make sure. Lots of crazy instructions out there like first format it and then dd it, LOL. |
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| 17:10.45 | devon | oxek: Someone reports booting RHEL7 on the same hardware but from a USB stick not an SD Card via a USB adapter, maybe that matters. |
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| 17:13.49 | oxek | devon: that very likely matters |
| 17:14.04 | cluonbeam | I don't think so. Either way, it's USB mass storage. |
| 17:14.38 | oxek | sdcard vie usb adapter is not simple usb mass storage, depending on what the adapter reports |
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| 17:18.13 | cluonbeam | The adapter will report it as USB mass storage. That's the standard implementation for card readers. |
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| 17:32.51 | un214 | I have a spectacular apt jam |
| 17:32.57 | devon | MacOSX Mojave (no single-user mode, dd if=/dev/disk3 forbidden even with "Full Disk Access" enabled under "Nanny-OS" as I call it) System Information reports IODeviceTree:/PCI0@0/XHC1@14 whatever that means. |
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| 17:33.17 | un214 | apt-get -f install wants to upgrade apt-utils; but that hangs because of a crazy systemd timeout |
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| 17:33.41 | un214 | I'd try uninstalling and reinstalling systemd but I can't because apt says no because packages are broken |
| 17:34.26 | un214 | apt-get -f install hangs on systemd-sysv-generator referring to vboxdrv |
| 17:34.46 | un214 | systemd then complains about timeout waiting for a device that's already mounted |
| 17:35.01 | un214 | and it's impossible to make progress |
| 17:35.32 | cluonbeam | devon: Use rdisk, not disk. |
| 17:35.45 | un214 | can anybody hear me? |
| 17:35.48 | cluonbeam | Yup. |
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| 17:42.45 | Allain | Hello, does someone know why those lines do not work anymore in Stretch/Bash: "\e[A": history-search-backward |
| 17:42.45 | Allain | "\e[B": history-search-forward |
| 17:42.45 | Allain | " ? Logically |
| 17:43.21 | greycat | the obvious question is, are you actually sending those bytes when you press whatever key you're pressing |
| 17:43.26 | Allain | .inputrc when sourced tell me \e[A:: command not found |
| 17:43.26 | Allain | \e[B:: command not found |
| 17:43.38 | greycat | open your terminal, press ctrl-v, then press whatever you THINK is supposed to send those bytes |
| 17:43.42 | greycat | ... and that is NOT a bash command |
| 17:43.44 | devon | cluonbeam: I should have said dd if=/dev/*disk3 forbidden. |
| 17:43.49 | greycat | it is a line you put in ~/.inputrc |
| 17:44.08 | greycat | if you tried to run it as a command, well, that was your first problem |
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| 17:47.21 | Allain | greycatI copy ~/.inputrc in /root and it works for root, not for my username |
| 17:47.47 | greycat | open your terminal, press ctrl-v, then press whatever you THINK is supposed to send those bytes |
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| 17:48.18 | greycat | For me, in urxvt, the UP ARROW key sends the ESC [ A sequence. |
| 17:48.30 | Allain | no error message for root |
| 17:48.45 | greycat | I didn't ask about errors. Especially from whatever enviroment it WORKS in. |
| 17:48.45 | Allain | I will try |
| 17:49.31 | Allain | It sends ^[[A and ^[[B for up and down arrows |
| 17:50.04 | greycat | All right, then your terminal is fundamentally compatible with that configuration. Now you just have to put it in ~/.inputrc correctly and then restart bash (or your terminal). |
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| 17:50.20 | devon | cluonbeam: Seagate spinning drive with no partitions mounted # dd if=/dev/rdisk3 count=1 | hexdump -Cdd: /dev/rdisk3: Operation not permitted |
| 17:51.18 | devon | cluonbeam: Random SD Card # dd if=/dev/rdisk3 count=1 | hexdump -C00000000 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 |................| |
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| 17:59.20 | Allain | greycat I replaced it with ^[[A and ^[[A |
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| 17:59.56 | Allain | I do not know what to do. Why does it work for root, weird, I will search longer |
| 17:59.58 | devon | cluonbeam: Thanks for the suggestion, it let me to try the SD Card â revealing a new mystery and yet more motivation to flush MacOSX. |
| 18:00.15 | greycat | Allain: ls -ld ~/.inputrc |
| 18:00.17 | Allain | Thanks for the Ctrl-v tip greycat |
| 18:00.50 | Allain | -rw-r--r-- 1 alain alain 771 sept. 3 18:58 /home/alain/.inputrc |
| 18:01.03 | greycat | Permissions should be fine, then. |
| 18:01.20 | Allain | Yes, all hidden files have the same permissions |
| 18:01.43 | Allain | I will do that a few later greycat. I am to hungry |
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| 18:02.26 | greycat | http://paste.wooledge.org/3677 |
| 18:03.45 | Zeshy | greycat: Nice way of testing readline bindings, TIL! =) |
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| 18:14.52 | devon | Allain: up/down arrows should work with no .inputrc by default. |
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| 18:17.55 | greycat | devon: he seems to be trying to change the functionality from the default behavior to a history search thing |
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| 18:21.02 | oxek | just use FZF for history search |
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| 18:25.34 | Kasreyn | anyone know why EXT4 attributes ^64bit & ^metadata_csum make a difference when running extundelete? i can only recover a deleted file when they are unset: http://paste.debian.net/1162500/ |
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| 18:43.04 | otyugh | hey, silly question about nfs |
| 18:43.15 | otyugh | is it possible to have shared files containing accents ? |
| 18:43.18 | otyugh | (éèà ) |
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| 18:43.39 | otyugh | I couldn't do it. |
| 18:44.02 | greycat | I do not recommend using non-ASCII characters in file names. |
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| 18:46.45 | GNU\colossus | I do not recommend file names :/ |
| 18:47.09 | GNU\colossus | if everything were just to be referenced by its inode number, we'd all live happier lives. |
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| 18:48.32 | greycat | I had some filenames with the ö character in their names, back when I was using ISO 8859-1, and then when UTF-8 became the norm, those files were not quite as happy. |
| 18:51.54 | GNU\colossus | I used to work for a popular european e-commerce site that was founded before the year 2000, and tried/botched the i18n/l10n thing very early. the pain levels involved when dealing with all the de/encoding hacks in the codebase, database(s) etc. seemed just shy of insurmountable. |
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| 19:08.14 | oxek | I doubt we're ever going to see UTF8 universally adopted |
| 19:08.23 | oxek | most stuff is utf16 internally |
| 19:08.45 | oxek | or even utf32 |
| 19:09.12 | oxek | and then we have the mess of files that are utf16 without BOM |
| 19:09.36 | oxek | (and some files that have been concatenated with different endianness) |
| 19:09.55 | Regex101 | hey guys, trying to add an HE v4tunnel but it's spitting out the help for ip tunnel and at the bottom ifup: failed to bring up he. Config is here, I don't see anything specifically wrong vs the configuration examples I see online http://paste.debian.net/hidden/90e6b8e8/ |
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| 19:36.54 | atlizz | hello all |
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| 20:12.44 | jelly | I often see doubly encoded latin1->utf8 conversions with crap instead of actual characters, esp. on printed labels. Strongly suggest changing your name to only contain US-ASCII |
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| 20:19.18 | jhutchins | Kasreyn: Maybe you should consider backups instead of regularly attempting recovery. |
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| 20:21.40 | jelly | can't have one without the other |
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| 20:24.37 | wb235 | can i install java 8 in debian stable? |
| 20:25.00 | wb235 | i think the java 11 is too new and that's why i'm having an issue executing a jar file |
| 20:25.17 | wb235 | c |
| 20:26.11 | greycat | you can install anything you like; just put it in /opt or /usr/local |
| 20:26.33 | greycat | if you meant "using apt", then I have no idea |
| 20:27.11 | wb235 | yea i meant with apt |
| 20:27.26 | jhutchins | That's one of the many things to be hated about java - no cross-release compatibility. |
| 20:27.26 | wb235 | there's a package called nvidia-openjdk-8-jre |
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| 20:27.35 | wb235 | but i dont have a nvidia card. just intel graphics |
| 20:28.06 | jhutchins | wb235: What do you expect to accomplish by running it then? |
| 20:28.30 | wb235 | just trying to run a jar file jhutchins |
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| 20:29.46 | sney | yeah if you need java 8 on buster, just get the tarball from oracle and hope it works |
| 20:30.30 | wb235 | ok |
| 20:30.31 | greycat | If you talk to the people in #java or whatever the Java channel is, and they confirm that your error is consistent with "jre too new, try older one", and you really *do* want to try an older one, I would just go to java.oracle.com or whatever the right location is these days, download their older JRE, and shove it in /opt like the gods intended. |
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| 20:36.27 | FuzzyByte | shouldn't there be an openjdk-jre-xxx package? |
| 20:36.39 | FuzzyByte | or am I just dumb? |
| 20:37.11 | cluonbeam | Only if that particular version has been maintained for that release. |
| 20:37.24 | sney | the only openjdk version in debian buster is openjdk 11. |
| 20:37.37 | sney | ,v openjdk-8-jre |
| 20:37.38 | judd | Package: openjdk-8-jre on amd64 -- stretch-proposed-updates: 8u242-b08-1~deb9u1; stretch: 8u252-b09-1~deb9u1; stretch-security: 8u252-b09-1~deb9u1; sid: 8u265-b01-1 |
| 20:42.08 | wb235 | well the java channel guys said "you didnt specify your classpath correctly" and got all mad when i said i didn't write the jar myself and said to ask the person who made it. but it's a download thousands of people download and run without issues lol. oh well |
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| 20:48.52 | jelly | Regex101, is your local address facing the internet really 100.200.100.192 ? My HE tunnel looks pretty much the same except iface is called he-ipv6 and the iface ... line is NOT indented |
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| 22:04.13 | gribouille | hi |
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| 22:04.58 | gribouille | I've just installed debian on a usb stick with the normal installation procedure. the installation went well, but I can't boot the new system |
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| 22:13.22 | yanmaani | gribouille: What happens? |
| 22:15.29 | gribouille | the computer doesn't seem to boot from the stick, although I tell it to do so |
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| 22:22.38 | yanmaani | with boot menu? |
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| 22:23.14 | gribouille | yanmaani, yes |
| 22:24.42 | gribouille | I've just reinstalled GRUB. Rebooting |
| 22:28.19 | Regex101 | jelly thanks I just randomly changed the IPs to hide the official ones, but yeah, I can't seem to find what's wrong. Will try fiddling with identation |
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| 22:30.06 | Regex101 | jelly never mind it's the tunnel name. it needs to be more than 2 characters. |
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| 22:42.28 | oxek | do packages from debian-security repo eventually land in the main repo? |
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| 22:44.04 | cluonbeam | oxek: No. They're updates to what's in the main repo. |
| 22:44.14 | oxek | thanks |
| 22:44.27 | dax | i thought the main repo got updated at point releases |
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| 22:45.07 | cluonbeam | Hmm. That may be the case. |
| 22:45.54 | oxek | I did not specify it, but my question was about the packages moving in-between point-releases |
| 22:46.01 | oxek | so cluonbeam is probably right |
| 22:46.33 | dax | yeah, in between point releases the main repo definitely stays the same |
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| 23:35.20 | oxek | is installing zram-tools package on debian and then configuring /etc/default/zramswap the correct way of using zram? Or is there a more suitable way, such as something that uses zramctl from util-linux? |
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