| 00:00.55 | jarray52 | rudi_s: Fair enough. I was a little loose with my words since this is a chat channel. |
| 00:01.25 | jarray52 | rudi_s: Rigorously speaking, the evidence definitely isn't as strong as the evidence we have for paper. |
| 00:01.39 | Ponch0 | how do I get youtube to work? |
| 00:02.08 | Ponch0 | get flash and all that good stuff |
| 00:02.32 | rudi_s | jarray52: Don't worry ;-) - Let's wait a few hundred years and we'll have that evidence. |
| 00:02.50 | rudi_s | Ponch0: Shouldn't youtube work with HTML 5 for most of the videos? |
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| 00:04.03 | Ponch0 | hmm yeah you're right rudi_s, thanks. |
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| 00:07.15 | jarray52 | Nanuq: how long will the cheaper blurays last? |
| 00:07.50 | Nanuq | jarray52: Probably about the same as current CD and DVD media. I've had 15 year old CD-Rs that were still readable. Barely. |
| 00:08.25 | jarray52 | Nanuq: DVDs apparently last significantly longer than CDs. |
| 00:08.29 | Nanuq | jarray52: I had to resort to my miracle drive. |
| 00:09.13 | Ponch0 | it's not really working it just loads |
| 00:09.20 | Ponch0 | I can see the preview image |
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| 00:11.55 | Ponch0 | I got it to work with magic |
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| 00:12.23 | Nanuq | jarray52: I haven't really looked into it though. The convenience of portable HDs alone had me sold. Since I plan to continually upgrade every few year, long term data retention wasn't a huge priority. |
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| 00:13.59 | cocotton | Hey guys, got a little question for you. I just installed Debian on my laptop hdd, and it can be found into a logical partition (under an extended one). Now, I'd like to use lvm on that partition to split it into smaller ones. The problem is, if I want to use pvcreate, I would to unmount it (i.e. unmount /). Anyone know how I could achieve to create a physical volume on the debian partion while running it?? |
| 00:14.37 | Nanuq | jarray52: Don't forget you have the option of resilvering the drives periodically. |
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| 00:16.48 | rudi_s | cocotton: AFAIK you can't. |
| 00:18.04 | cocotton | damn :( |
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| 00:18.45 | rudi_s | cocotton: Reboot from CD/USB/etc. and partition in the installer. |
| 00:19.30 | themill | cocotton: use a live cd image or the installer in rescue mode to do this |
| 00:19.43 | cocotton | rudi_s: Yep, that's what I'll do right away. Thank you for the help! |
| 00:19.47 | rudi_s | np |
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| 00:38.27 | sybariten | ok so i dont have 'swedish keyboard' in my live debian, what do i want to look into? Locales? Keyboard? |
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| 00:50.13 | hanasaki | anyone know how to get a decode on mcelog errors? |
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| 01:02.28 | dont-panic | not sure if this is a debian question or a awesome wm question... I'm looking for a battery monitor for x |
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| 01:04.45 | ectospasm | dont-panic: wouldn't that be part of whatever panel you're using? |
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| 01:22.10 | dont-panic | ectospasm: im using awesome wm. maybe a widget? ill ask there and see |
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| 01:36.14 | rhizome | is it well-known that nvidia (-glx) and kernel 3.2 might not like each other very well? |
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| 01:36.54 | rhizome | regardless, having a ton of trouble with it |
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| 01:56.22 | marcelo_ | . |
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| 02:01.13 | reisio | hello Debianites |
| 02:01.27 | reisio | are there dpkg/apt alternatives made for Debian? |
| 02:03.11 | PryMar56 | reisio, have you seen alien? |
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| 02:03.34 | Freeaqingme | reisio, why are you looking for alternatives? |
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| 02:03.49 | gnarface | reisio: aptitude and synaptic are the popular apt alternatives. |
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| 02:04.10 | gnarface | reisio: ignore PryMar56's thing about alien. that's for importing foreign packages and irrelevant to you. |
| 02:04.12 | marcelo_ | I just installed a fresh debian 7 and the evolution email is not syncing my google calendar. Any ideas? |
| 02:04.31 | reisio | Freeaqingme: just curious |
| 02:05.04 | reisio | I know of less mature package managers than dpkg that have alternatives already because people found the original antiquated |
| 02:05.23 | gnarface | dpkg, tell reisio about aptitude |
| 02:05.28 | reisio | yeah not alien, I mean proper package managers |
| 02:05.32 | reisio | doesn't aptitude still use dpkg, though? |
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| 02:05.59 | reisio | and even apt? |
| 02:06.04 | gnarface | reisio: yes, they're all just just frontends for dpkg |
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| 02:07.23 | reisio | I suppose in a way that is a testament to the worth of dpkg/apt, if nobody has ad a remotely successful alternative |
| 02:07.24 | dkeoui | Hi, if I have my X kbd map set to an alternative scheme via setxbkmap, would the magical elephant sysrq sequence be interpreted as my layout or still as if the keyboard were qwerty? |
| 02:07.32 | reisio | has made a* |
| 02:08.03 | gnarface | reisio: use synaptic if your complaint about apt-get is that you can't control it with a mouse, use aptitude if your complaint is that apt-get makes you think too hard and you don't mind the text-only interface you just want it to be a little more like microsoft clippy |
| 02:08.39 | reisio | I really don't have a complaint, purely curious |
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| 02:09.14 | reisio | but they totally should integrate that clippy into aptitude :p |
| 02:09.24 | gnarface | you almost never have to actually touch dpkg or apt correctly if you're following the rules, so that's probably why nobody has replaced them |
| 02:09.34 | reisio | obligatronic: http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3031/2784420693_913239d70a_o.gif |
| 02:09.38 | gnarface | s/correctly/directly/ |
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| 02:26.31 | ectospasm | heh, I guess that's right... I always use aptitude (or synaptic on others' computers), which are frontends to apt... |
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| 02:30.06 | reisio | I guess if apt already does "everything", it's naturally people focus on things running on top of it |
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| 02:31.15 | Ponch0 | is wheezy different than sid? |
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| 02:31.30 | dvs | Ponch0: yes, or else they would have the same name |
| 02:31.56 | gnarface | reisio: yea, the thing about arcane or confusing interfaces is that its only a problem at first, while you're learning the interface. after that all that matters is the flexibility of the interface, ease-of-understanding becomes irrelevant |
| 02:33.08 | Ponch0 | dvs: is that how that works? |
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| 02:33.12 | Ponch0 | thanks! |
| 02:33.15 | rryoumaa | dunno, i still struggle with the murky corners of git and rsync and stuff |
| 02:33.19 | reisio | gnarface: yeah, well |
| 02:33.31 | reisio | I don't have a problem with how apt works, but |
| 02:33.36 | rryoumaa | you learn them, then a year later you need the same feature, and you have to read the man pages again |
| 02:33.39 | dvs | Ponch0: Yes, each release has their own codename |
| 02:33.47 | reisio | I do think a lot of its parameters use English words that are synonymous... in English :p |
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| 02:34.04 | reisio | update, upgrade; remove, purge |
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| 02:34.19 | rryoumaa | hehe, just have to get used to those |
| 02:34.20 | themill | they're not synonyms in English either |
| 02:34.24 | reisio | sure they are |
| 02:34.39 | themill | not at all |
| 02:34.56 | gnarface | well, they may be synonyms, but they have very different connotations of volume/scale to a native speaker |
| 02:35.02 | reisio | well, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, you, me (and thesauruses everywhere) |
| 02:35.17 | reisio | gnarface: I don't think so |
| 02:35.26 | gnarface | reisio: i'm agreeing with you |
| 02:35.31 | reisio | ah :p |
| 02:35.33 | themill | dictionaries define words not thesauruses btw |
| 02:35.34 | gnarface | reisio: i can see how it could be confusing |
| 02:35.49 | reisio | themill: yeah, thesauruses just save you the trouble of reading the definitions and comparing them |
| 02:36.03 | themill | that's a lossy process, hence your confusion |
| 02:36.19 | reisio | nah, because I actually retain the ability to read, as you might have noticed :p |
| 02:36.27 | mrdeb | how do u upgrade to vlc 2.10 on debian 7 |
| 02:36.33 | gnarface | reisio: while technically meaning the same general action, the cultural connotation of the word "purge" compared to the word "remove" has a clearly forceful connotation |
| 02:36.54 | Ponch0 | how do I tie ctrl+alt+T shortcut to terminal? |
| 02:36.56 | reisio | mrdeb: upgrade or update? |
| 02:37.06 | reisio | Ponch0: in what DE? |
| 02:37.09 | gnarface | reisio: update [cache] |
| 02:37.19 | mrdeb | reisio: whichever bec 2.03 is too old |
| 02:37.22 | gnarface | reisio: upgrade [system] |
| 02:37.25 | Ponch0 | reisio sorry gnome 3.4 |
| 02:37.29 | gnarface | reisio: its only initially confusing |
| 02:37.37 | reisio | gnarface: yes they have their uses, they're just a little closer than I would choose had it been my software |
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| 02:38.26 | gnarface | reisio: those ones are easier to remember because if you use them in a sentence, saying you're updating the system and upgrading the cache sounds clumsy and wrong to a native speaker, so its obviously the other way around |
| 02:38.33 | reisio | Ponch0: https://help.gnome.org/users/gnome-help/3.4/keyboard-shortcuts-set.html.en |
| 02:38.45 | Ponch0 | awesome ty |
| 02:38.57 | reisio | gnarface: yes easily overcome |
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| 02:39.12 | gnarface | reisio: but that's also something aptitude answers with a paradigm shift; it just doesn't require you to manually request a cache update it does it every time |
| 02:40.04 | gnarface | reisio: you'll find this basic dichotomy in many competing tools; one will favor automatic behavior while the other will favor efficiency at the cost of more manual control requirements |
| 02:40.53 | reisio | some strangers here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Dpkg |
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| 02:41.20 | themill | reisio: e.g. remove: "to move or take (something) away"; purge: "to eliminate or expel". They're not synonyms. As gnarface said, there's a significant difference in their meanings. purge always has implications of purification and cleansing that remove does not. No thesaurus I trust lists remove as a synonym for purge. |
| 02:42.11 | reisio | themill: sure they are |
| 02:42.11 | gnarface | reisio: personally, if i had designed it all, i'd have resolved any confusion with verbosity, but you wouldn't like my solution any better because it would require twice as much typing to get the same job done |
| 02:42.22 | reisio | gnarface: heh |
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| 02:43.23 | rryoumaa | aiksaurus lists remove under two categories for purge. i think that's fine, because the purpose is not exact synonyms. |
| 02:43.30 | gnarface | themill: well, the low quality of the data at thesaurus.com and dictionary.com may well shock you |
| 02:43.33 | rryoumaa | however, oddly the reverse is not true |
| 02:43.50 | reisio | mrdeb: I don't think 2.10 is in any official repos, but .0.8 is |
| 02:44.04 | rryoumaa | removal* |
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| 02:44.31 | themill | gnarface: crap on the internet is yet to redefine the language. mostly. |
| 02:44.40 | mrdeb | reisio: how do u upgrade to .08 then bec i am still showing .03 |
| 02:44.48 | reisio | gnarface: I don't really need a thesaurus to know they're synonymous, my grasp of English being that amazing, but I could produce a thesaurus to show it if I needed, and I could compare dictionary definitions, too, if I were quite that starved for something to do, heh |
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| 02:45.02 | reisio | mrdeb: 2.0.8 is in testing & sid |
| 02:45.21 | mrdeb | why is it in testing when its stable per vlc developers |
| 02:45.26 | mrdeb | it should already be in stable 7 |
| 02:45.33 | themill | dpkg: tell mrdeb about stable |
| 02:45.40 | themill | (but then we've had this discussion before...) |
| 02:45.43 | reisio | mrdeb: because VLC developers maintain a single package, and Debian developers maintain thousands |
| 02:45.58 | reisio | which need to be stable with regard to one another |
| 02:45.58 | mrdeb | they make the program and tested ita lrady |
| 02:46.00 | karlpinc | I thought that debian came with users configured with their own group, and their group = their username, and a umask of 0002. But I installed wheezy some time ago and my umask seems to be 0022. Did I break something or pbkac or what? |
| 02:46.00 | reisio | among other things |
| 02:46.09 | reisio | mrdeb: different standards, different purposes |
| 02:46.18 | themill | reisio: you can continue to believe they are if you want. I don't care. I'll quite happily continue to maintain, with evidence from trusted sources like the OED, that they are not. |
| 02:46.19 | reisio | mrdeb: but if you feel that way, maybe you should use testing :) |
| 02:46.20 | mrdeb | how do i get it on my debian 7 then |
| 02:46.30 | reisio | themill: I can tell you don't care |
| 02:47.17 | gnarface | mrdeb: did you check the backports repo for the version of vlc you want? i thought i saw it had been backported... |
| 02:47.36 | reisio | mrdeb: what's wrong with 2.0.3, again? |
| 02:47.41 | mrdeb | gnarface: so apt-get install --backports vlc? |
| 02:47.48 | mrdeb | its too old |
| 02:47.50 | gnarface | mrdeb: no |
| 02:47.50 | themill | mrdeb: stop making up commands... |
| 02:48.01 | reisio | mrdeb: what makes it too old? |
| 02:48.05 | gnarface | dpkg: tell mrdeb about backports |
| 02:48.06 | themill | gnarface: there was talk about backporting it; I don't think anything has been uploaded |
| 02:48.13 | reisio | I haven't seen a significant change in VLC in years and years |
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| 02:48.48 | reisio | it does sound like moving to testing would make you happier, though; either that or it'd give you a new appreciation for stable |
| 02:48.51 | themill | gnarface: and given that other packages now use vlc internally (like phonon), backporting starts to have some danger to it |
| 02:48.53 | gnarface | has seen a significant change in vlc with every release |
| 02:48.56 | mrdeb | so i have to install testing is that it |
| 02:49.01 | gnarface | reisio: i think you don't push it to its limits |
| 02:49.07 | reisio | gnarface: I know I don't :) |
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| 02:49.12 | themill | mrdeb: perhaps you should have a reason to want to do that first? |
| 02:49.13 | reisio | gnarface: what's a significant change you saw? |
| 02:49.32 | gnarface | mrdeb: no, you don't have to install testing, you just have to backport vlc |
| 02:49.41 | mrdeb | how |
| 02:49.41 | gnarface | dpkg: tell mrdeb about ssb |
| 02:49.58 | reisio | I don't think 2.0.8 is in anything but testing and higher |
| 02:50.03 | gnarface | mrdeb: read some of the shit dpkg and judd pm'd you |
| 02:50.11 | reisio | but he won't say what he's missing in 2.0.3, so it's kind of a mystery |
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| 02:50.31 | gnarface | dpkg: tell mrdeb about sns |
| 02:50.33 | mrdeb | speed and new features |
| 02:50.34 | themill | reisio: the version number is about all... |
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| 02:50.47 | themill | mrdeb: specifically? with a URL to show what you're talking about, perhaps? |
| 02:50.48 | reisio | themill: that's what I was thinking :) |
| 02:50.55 | mrdeb | i dont need a reason |
| 02:50.59 | themill | reisio: that's normal |
| 02:51.04 | reisio | mrdeb: you don't, it'd just be nice |
| 02:51.12 | themill | mrdeb: well, you're expecting other people to do work for you... |
| 02:51.16 | reisio | hahah, sns, nice |
| 02:51.23 | karlpinc | mrdeb: No, you don't. But if you had a reason people could help you meet your needs. |
| 02:51.45 | reisio | maybe even very simply |
| 02:51.52 | reisio | as in less time wasted |
| 02:51.58 | gnarface | mrdeb: you don't need a reason but these people are here to help you. we see a lot of people putting themselves through completely unnecessary amounts of anguish in complete futility... |
| 02:52.06 | reisio | catch you guys later, thanks for the chat |
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| 02:52.30 | mrdeb | how hard is it to upload 2.08 to repo |
| 02:52.33 | mrdeb | or 2.10 |
| 02:52.37 | mrdeb | it is already on vlc page |
| 02:52.46 | themill | mrdeb: I think we've already been through that |
| 02:53.00 | gnarface | mrdeb: volunteers welcome :) |
| 02:53.08 | mrdeb | so its hard, is that it |
| 02:53.18 | gnarface | mrdeb: yes, its hard |
| 02:53.18 | mrdeb | i dont rem what u said before |
| 02:53.23 | mrdeb | ok |
| 02:53.28 | mrdeb | so i have to use testing |
| 02:53.39 | ectospasm | or sid |
| 02:53.55 | gnarface | mrdeb: i wouldn't advise testing for you. i'd advise you backport vlc 2.0.8 |
| 02:54.29 | mrdeb | how do i install vlc backport |
| 02:54.29 | gnarface | mrdeb: but do what you want, i will not stop you from learning in your own way... |
| 02:54.44 | gnarface | mrdeb: are you not seeing the private messages sent to you by dpkg? |
| 02:55.04 | gnarface | please, nobody else engage him until he answers that one question |
| 02:55.20 | mrdeb | ok let me click that |
| 02:55.22 | gnarface | i just want a straight answer about whether he can SEE the instructions dpkg has sent or not |
| 02:55.54 | mrdeb | so i have to add sid repo to my sources? |
| 02:55.57 | mrdeb | is that safe |
| 02:55.59 | gnarface | mrdeb: the information you are requesting is literally at your fingertips and nobody is trying to hide it from you |
| 02:56.07 | gnarface | mrdeb: no, its not safe |
| 02:56.10 | karlpinc | I seem to have a fundimental mis-understanding of cp. If I have a directory that's g=rwx and a file in the directory that's g=rwx and the file is owned by user A and user B does a "cp somefile directory/file" then directory/file remains owned by user A. I understand the security problems involved in allowing ownership to change (or maybe I don't?) but why isn't user B's file, and umask just used to remove the old file and make a new |
| 02:56.11 | karlpinc | one owned by user B? Or is this just the way it works and there's no real sense to it? |
| 02:56.23 | gnarface | mrdeb: the only safe option is to stick with the version currently in wheezy |
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| 02:57.34 | karlpinc | I mean, why not rip the old inode out and start over? |
| 02:58.04 | dont-panic | I have a wifi issue... when I installed it said I was missing iwlwifi-2030-6.ucode and iwlwifi-2030-5.ucode. I was able to find iwlwifi-2030-6.ucode but not the other one |
| 02:58.39 | gnarface | karlpinc: you didn't give enough details to answer your question but i assume the answer is "because you forgot user B owns directory/" |
| 02:58.54 | karlpinc | (Oh yeah, and in my example both user A and B are members of the directory's and file's group.) |
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| 02:59.30 | dont-panic | 02:00.0 Network controller: Intel Corporation Centrino Wireless-N 2230 (rev c4) is my wifi card |
| 02:59.49 | karlpinc | gnarface: Neither user owns the directory. |
| 03:00.03 | karlpinc | gnarface: I just tried in in /var/tmp/ |
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| 03:01.15 | karlpinc | gnarface: But I've done it before in a directory that's not got the tmp bit set (whatever one that is that /tmp has set) and have the same issue. |
| 03:01.57 | gnarface | karlpinc: show 1) full group membership of each user 2) full ownership/permissions (ls -l *) line for the directory/ as well as the directory/file before and afterwards, *then* maybe i could help you understand |
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| 03:02.45 | dont-panic | nvm got it |
| 03:03.07 | gnarface | dont-panic: sorry, it was a firmware-something package you were missing, you found it? |
| 03:03.16 | gnarface | dont-panic: likely from non-free |
| 03:03.34 | dont-panic | gnarface: yeah, just tryign to get wicd workign with it now |
| 03:03.56 | gnarface | dont-panic: its not apparently well known that you also need wpasupplicant |
| 03:04.00 | themill | btw the list of packages that need testing for any new version of vlc (or any backport of vlc) is significant... http://paste.debian.net/60684/ |
| 03:04.38 | gnarface | dont-panic: i believe there was a *recent* change to the default config packaged with wpasupplicant so that in normal situations you should no longer have to edit it |
| 03:04.51 | gnarface | dont-panic: i could be wrong |
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| 03:06.08 | dont-panic | wpasupplicant is installed with debian base I believe? |
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| 03:06.12 | dont-panic | idk, its been here both times |
| 03:06.21 | gnarface | dont-panic: then you installed more than "base" |
| 03:06.28 | dont-panic | I installed ssh |
| 03:06.33 | dont-panic | laptop and system utilites |
| 03:06.42 | gnarface | probably came with laptop |
| 03:07.16 | dont-panic | either way, almost record timing this time... from usb to fully working desktop in roughly 30 mins |
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| 03:07.46 | gnarface | dont-panic: set up a local apt proxy and you could chop that down even further |
| 03:08.03 | dont-panic | gnarface: local apt proxy? |
| 03:08.11 | karlpinc | gnarface: Is this good? |
| 03:08.22 | gnarface | dont-panic: check out apt-cacher-ng |
| 03:08.43 | dont-panic | I'm using a reallllly local mirror |
| 03:08.48 | karlpinc | http://paste.debian.net/60686/ The question being, why, at line 18 is /var/tmp/foo/bar still owned by kop? |
| 03:08.52 | dont-panic | rit is like 5 miles from my house so that helps |
| 03:09.00 | gnarface | dont-panic: oh, i guess that works too |
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| 03:09.55 | karlpinc | gnarface: (FWIW, the file content gets replaced, although the example does not show this.) The ownership is what leads to the sorta strange error message about times at the bottom, fwiw. |
| 03:11.16 | karlpinc | gnarface: Note also that the cp _without_ the -a does update the timestamp of /var/tmp/foo/bar, which makes that last error message all the odder. |
| 03:12.41 | karlpinc | dont-panic: Ok then, speed it up by using an ssd. ;-) |
| 03:14.25 | karlpinc | suspects posix, always the culprit in cases like this |
| 03:14.38 | gnarface | karlpinc: its user error |
| 03:14.49 | karlpinc | What'd I do wrong? |
| 03:15.13 | maxxist | can anyone suggest a good how to on installing enlightenment in wheezy? |
| 03:15.31 | dont-panic | karlpinc: I do have an ssd |
| 03:15.40 | gnarface | karlpinc: well, actually you still didn't show enough information, but i can fairly certainly still guess that the problem is you're still not getting that the contents of a directory listing are owned by the owner/group of the directory (and in some cases that can override the file owner/group) |
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| 03:16.06 | dont-panic | karlpinc: 2.8ghz dualcore i7, 256g agility 3, 8gigs ram |
| 03:16.13 | gnarface | karlpinc: but its probably disasterous for you to be testing this in /tmp without understanding basic filesystem permissions yet, since /tmp has the sticky bit set on it, which does weird stuff to default permissions |
| 03:16.47 | gnarface | karlpinc: also each user's default umask can come into play here to confuse you on permissions defaults, but there is no way to force the users to accept any given default umask (its a per user config) |
| 03:17.28 | karlpinc | gnarface: I wondered about the umask above. I thought I should get 0002 on debian but am getting 0022. |
| 03:18.01 | gnarface | karlpinc: 0022 is the default because it means users in the same groups can't steal files from each other by default |
| 03:18.09 | karlpinc | gnarface: I should understand basic permissions. Been doing Unix for nigh 20 years. But something's broken in my brain tonight, that's for sure. |
| 03:18.26 | themill | except the default is not 0022 it is 0002 with user-private-groups |
| 03:18.35 | karlpinc | gnarface: Unless the default group is the user's private group. |
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| 03:19.38 | gnarface | karlpinc: you can override the *users effective* default group for a given directory with the sguid bit (g+s) |
| 03:19.56 | karlpinc | gnarface: What else am I not showing you? You've got . on /var/tmp/foo/. |
| 03:20.11 | karlpinc | gnarface: Yes, overriding the user's effective group is the point of a 0002 umask. |
| 03:20.23 | gnarface | karlpinc: wrong |
| 03:20.35 | karlpinc | gnarface: (in conjunction with g=s) |
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| 03:20.53 | gnarface | g+s is what overrides the default group |
| 03:21.14 | karlpinc | gnarface: It allows collaboration just by setting the g=s bit and the group on a directory and putting all the collaborators in the designated group. |
| 03:21.26 | karlpinc | id=0002 |
| 03:21.27 | dont-panic | gnarface: for some reason I cant right click with my touchpad, do you know what would cause that? |
| 03:21.31 | karlpinc | it=0002 |
| 03:21.32 | Ponch0 | My wifi connection works but alot of times it hangs before it starts to actually connect, where can I look up 'fixes' things to try for debian? |
| 03:21.44 | themill | gnarface, karlpinc: I think you're finding an odd way of agreeing with each other here :) |
| 03:22.03 | karlpinc | themill: IRC. Can't be helped. ;) |
| 03:22.08 | themill | heh |
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| 03:23.07 | gnarface | dont-panic: you might benefit from the synaptics touchpad driver, or your touchpad may just not be supported. unfortunately i don't know how to tell the difference |
| 03:23.08 | karlpinc | Anyhow. Just to keep my head from worrying. What's the default debian umask? I thought it was switched to 0002 around lenny-ish. |
| 03:23.36 | themill | karlpinc: correct, 0002 |
| 03:23.47 | karlpinc | Ok. (I must have broken something.) |
| 03:24.18 | karlpinc | Can't think of what I did to break it though. |
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| 03:25.18 | dont-panic | gnarface: I just installed synaptic, not sure how to get it working correctly. looks like I'm gonna have to do some googling |
| 03:25.26 | gnarface | themill: are you sure? i've still never seen it at anything other than 0022 and it seems ridiculously insecure for any less strict of a default to exist. furthermore, i'm kindof shocked that you'd suggest such a thing. |
| 03:25.42 | themill | gnarface: in what way is it insecure? |
| 03:26.00 | gnarface | themill: its not obvious? |
| 03:26.05 | themill | gnarface: not at all |
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| 03:26.43 | themill | karlpinc: I'm finding 022 in /etc/login.defs, however... |
| 03:26.48 | karlpinc | gnarface: If you're tired of this fine, but if if you like I can repeat the cp example in, say, /var/lib/cache or someplace sticky-bit-free. |
| 03:26.57 | gnarface | themill: users could get tricked into giving members of groups they're in into giving away files by accidentally writing them to directories with sguid set |
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| 03:27.14 | themill | gnarface: users can always get tricked into doing silly things. They could copy the file into /tmp too |
| 03:27.18 | gnarface | karlpinc: repeat it in your own home directory and i think you won't need me to help you anymore |
| 03:27.21 | karlpinc | themill: Perhaps I'd not broken anything and 0022 snuck back in. |
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| 03:28.11 | gnarface | karlpinc: i'm pretty sure 0022 is the sane and normal global default forever and always and themill is just more drunk than even me tonight (rare form) |
| 03:28.34 | karlpinc | gnarface: I don't suppose you could give me a hint as to why the grandparent directory of the file matters. (x bit aside) |
| 03:28.46 | karlpinc | gnarface: Actually RH comes with 0002 also. |
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| 03:29.35 | gnarface | themill: what was that about user-private-groups? is that some package or installation setting? |
| 03:29.39 | karlpinc | gnarface: If you google for "user private groups" you'll hit RH docs pretty quick. |
| 03:29.47 | gnarface | redhat? |
| 03:29.56 | gnarface | rh = redhat? |
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| 03:30.16 | karlpinc | gnarface: user private groups is the name for the setgid bit + group + 0002 umask collaboration technique. |
| 03:30.23 | karlpinc | gnarface: Yes rh=redhat. |
| 03:30.28 | themill | gnarface: it's an administration paradigm that debian (and most other linux and unixes) have been using for many years |
| 03:30.30 | gnarface | unacceptable |
| 03:30.33 | themill | https://wiki.debian.org/UserPrivateGroups |
| 03:30.43 | themill | not at all. Learn about it to understand it first. |
| 03:31.11 | karlpinc | themill: Not a good link. I wrote that wiki entry. (Then somebody bunged it up, but what can you do? :-) |
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| 03:31.22 | themill | karlpinc: https://wiki.debian.org/Debate/umask btw |
| 03:31.26 | gnarface | themill: the "permissions hassle" part is synonymous with security to me |
| 03:31.35 | themill | gnarface: it really isn't |
| 03:31.48 | gnarface | themill: i don't see failure to understand and work with it as an acceptable excuse to castrate it |
| 03:32.12 | themill | gnarface: I can say the same back to you about UPG. There's nothing more or less insecure about it. |
| 03:32.19 | gnarface | themill: clearly, you work on a team with people you can trust entirely implictly down to the man, 100% |
| 03:32.19 | karlpinc | gnarface: It's not castrating it, it's enabling groups. |
| 03:32.33 | gnarface | themill: i'm jealous |
| 03:32.36 | karlpinc | gnarface: If you don't trust them, don't give them permission. |
| 03:32.37 | themill | gnarface: trust isn't necessary here |
| 03:32.46 | gnarface | karlpinc: bwahaha |
| 03:33.01 | gnarface | karlpinc: unfortuately its not about whether *i* trust them or not, its about whether the client trusts them |
| 03:33.06 | gnarface | karlpinc: and damage mitigation thereof... |
| 03:33.13 | karlpinc | gnarface: You don't have to trust them with anything, unless you do trust them and put them in a group. |
| 03:33.25 | gnarface | yea |
| 03:33.31 | gnarface | group = sudoers |
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| 03:33.35 | gnarface | trust = the client's |
| 03:33.36 | themill | what? |
| 03:33.49 | karlpinc | gnarface: sudoers for security. Ugh. |
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| 03:34.16 | karlpinc | gnarface: That requires real trust. |
| 03:35.26 | themill | gnarface: UPG allows you to mark a directory as "shared" (g+s) which then means that it does The Right Thing for members of that group (the group you've created for that project) from then on. No-one gets any default permissions over anyone else's files. Anything that should not be shared isn't. Anything that should be private to a user or private to a different group remains so. |
| 03:36.27 | karlpinc | themill: And it's so sad debian is back to 0022. |
| 03:36.45 | gnarface | themill: i'm not clear on how that is different from setting g+s without UPG installed |
| 03:36.46 | themill | gnarface: The only threat model her is "Jim, please copy $foo into /srv/blah" and jim does without thinking. That's no worse than "Jim, please email me $foo" and jim does without thinking. Basically, there's no threat that this creates. There's no change in security. |
| 03:37.17 | gnarface | themill: jim won't email you shit unless there is a christmas bonus in it |
| 03:37.28 | themill | gnarface: and he won't copy the file around likewise |
| 03:37.36 | gnarface | themill: jim is copying shit everywhere left and right all day, sometimes over, just for fun, cause it makes him feel powerful |
| 03:38.03 | karlpinc | gnarface: Without 0002 when new files are created in the project directory the group cannot modify them without permission fobbing, which kind of destorys the point. |
| 03:38.12 | themill | if that's your threat model, you perhaps you need to disconnect your network cable and also your keyboard and mouse |
| 03:38.15 | gnarface | themill: jim is also logging in as root twice a week to read log files he should have read by adding himself to the adm group instead too |
| 03:38.16 | themill | gnarface: without thhat umask, you've got to manually mark the files as group writeable each time. Someone will always forget. Why do things manually when a computer can do the right thing for you. |
| 03:38.40 | themill | gnarface: well if that's the case you've already lost and UPG or not doesn't matter. once again, UPG is not changing the security |
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| 03:39.11 | gnarface | karlpinc: no, it doesn't destroy the point, what it does is it makes every single user required to change their umask and understand it before they can successfully share files with the group. i don't see anything wrong with that whatsoever. |
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| 03:39.32 | themill | To object to UPG on security grounds, you need a threat that it creates. All you're showing us is that you're giving root to people and they can do things... which is a different problem unrelated to UGP |
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| 03:40.03 | Ponch0 | holy cow meat - iceweasel version 17 on debian wheezy is that correct? |
| 03:40.06 | gnarface | themill: its not a show stopping critical event that someone copies a file before remembering to update their umask. it IS a show-stopping critical event if i user who can't grok umask copies a file into shared group ownership though... |
| 03:40.13 | karlpinc | gnarface: Then each user individually decides whether they'll be able to collaborate? Like they're not going to want to collaborate? Why not just let the system default allow them to collaborate in the first place? |
| 03:40.15 | themill | gnarface: UPG requires the user to change the group of the files and then know that they are sharing the file. No difference |
| 03:40.46 | themill | gnarface: no... they're copying the file to a shared location to.. umm... share it. |
| 03:40.48 | gnarface | themill: maybe you're missing my point. i'm not saying that its a mistake to use umask 0002 to share files in shared groups, what i'm saying is its a mistake to make that the default configuration. |
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| 03:41.24 | gdos | anyone here use dhelp and or dwww? (online, browser-based help systems for viewing man pages) - according to dwww man page - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man8/dwww.8.html - there is supposed to be a 'apache2.conf' file in '/etc/dwww' and symbolically linked from /etc/apache*/conf.d/dwww but there is neither a file or a symbolically linked file in /etc/dwww NOR /etc/apache2/conf.d and /var/lib/dwww appears empty. suggestions? |
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| 03:41.29 | karlpinc | gnarface: But if the default is that the user creates files with his own private group, then what harm is a 0002? |
| 03:41.35 | gnarface | themill: i'm still not clear on how "UPG" is different fundamentally from every user manually setting their umask to 0002 on first login, but i'm sure in any ways it COULD be different fundamentally, its bad |
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| 03:42.10 | themill | gnarface: UPG is also creating a separate primary group for every user rather than just sticking everyone in "users". |
| 03:42.28 | karlpinc | gnarface: The difference is that user creation also creates each user his own group and makes him the sole member of the group and makes his private group his default group. |
| 03:43.08 | karlpinc | gnarface: So that files are created with a group of each user's private group. So the user has to change the group of a file to share it. |
| 03:43.26 | gnarface | themill: that's the debian default |
| 03:43.34 | gnarface | themill: every user has its own default group by default |
| 03:43.36 | themill | I know. And UPG is why it is the default... |
| 03:43.40 | gnarface | themill: so they don't share any group by default |
| 03:43.46 | gnarface | themill: so why are you coming at me saying that i'm wrong? |
| 03:43.48 | themill | *headdesk* |
| 03:43.56 | gnarface | themill: do it again |
| 03:44.00 | themill | *headdesk* |
| 03:44.41 | gnarface | themill: basically you interupted me and confused me by telling me that i'm wrong and your counter argument was my own argument, with a fancy ancronym |
| 03:44.48 | themill | eh? |
| 03:45.20 | gnarface | themill: that still doesn't change my stance that i feel every single user even in a shared group environment should be at least capable of changing their own umask |
| 03:45.25 | karlpinc | gnarface: So why not let jim's default be 0002 if you're going to allow him to set his default to 0002 anyhow? |
| 03:45.50 | karlpinc | gnarface: What do you get with a 0022 default? |
| 03:46.14 | themill | gnarface: you're the one claiming that this is insecure -- but without a threat model. Also, I didn't interrupt you at all... I answered your questions. |
| 03:46.14 | gnarface | karlpinc: my only argument is that jim should have to set it himself. it shouldn't be the global debian default ... the current default of 0022 is correct for security, because jim should have to be aware of what he's doing before he gives write access to his files to members in his group |
| 03:46.19 | gnarface | *groups* |
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| 03:46.50 | gnarface | karlpinc: i feel this is sane and very inline with other debian default paradigms that are security-minded |
| 03:46.51 | themill | both approaches are doing exactly the same thing with permissions which is why there is no difference in the security. One way requires two steps the other requires one. I'm struggling to see the problem |
| 03:47.05 | gnarface | karlpinc: i'm only shocked that themill is the one saying i'm wrong. i expected he was smarter than me. |
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| 03:47.46 | themill | you can leave the ad hominem nonsense out of this, thanks |
| 03:48.05 | karlpinc | gnarface: You're worried that jim will inadvertantly give access? But he has to chgrp foo a file in order to grant access to members of the foo group. How would he inadvertantly do this? |
| 03:48.32 | themill | suspects it's time to just agree to disagree and move on |
| 03:48.36 | gnarface | karlpinc: no, someone else who shares a group with him just has to g+s a directory he's gonna copy a file into |
| 03:48.41 | Ponch0 | ok does anyone know how to get youtube working without flash? It worked on html5 when I first tried it but it magically stopped working |
| 03:48.57 | themill | Ponch0: not all videos are available in html5 |
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| 03:49.36 | gnarface | themill: like i said, you must work with a group of extremely smart and ethical people you can trust almost implictly. i'm not judging you i'm merely jealous of the bubble you live in. |
| 03:49.57 | themill | gnarface: there's no difference here. No difference in trust is required. It's still just unix permissions. |
| 03:50.11 | gnarface | karlpinc: (jim won't in a million years think of or notice a g+s, it will always be a mystery to him) |
| 03:50.16 | themill | You either already trust them or you don't. |
| 03:50.31 | Ponch0 | themill: understood thanks |
| 03:50.37 | themill | gnarface: why is jim copying a file into a shared space if it's not supposed to be shared? |
| 03:51.09 | gnarface | themill: well, the truth is i already don't, but on multi-user systems where i'm the one with the authority over who the *system* trusts and who it doesn't, i'm the only one with access. |
| 03:51.18 | gnarface | themill: so in that case its irrelevant |
| 03:51.33 | karlpinc | gnarface: I see the point. But I don't see that convincing jim to do that is any eaiser than convincing him to otherwise do something stupid. |
| 03:51.51 | gnarface | themill: the answer to your question obviously is "jim didn't realize copying files to a shared space would give away his sole ownership of them, because jim is unqualified by your standards to even do his job" |
| 03:52.14 | themill | he didn't understand "shared"? |
| 03:52.43 | gnarface | themill: jim is a php coder with root access to production systems that are owned by investors millions of dollars in the hole |
| 03:52.50 | gnarface | themill: the world is a horrifying place |
| 03:52.53 | karlpinc | gnarface: Jim is going to get bit anyhow under your threat model, since he must always frob his umask to 0002 anyway to collaborate it'll just be set that way all the time. |
| 03:53.20 | gnarface | karlpinc: don't worry, jim will find another job... |
| 03:53.36 | gnarface | karlpinc: he never once cared about production time outages either |
| 03:53.42 | karlpinc | gnarface: If you don't trust jim don't put him in any groups. |
| 03:53.55 | gnarface | karlpinc: bwahahaaha! i know right? |
| 03:53.57 | karlpinc | Problem solved. |
| 03:54.18 | gnarface | karlpinc: that's like saying "if you don't like your mother judging your girlfriend, don't introduce them" |
| 03:55.05 | gnarface | in the real world not everyone you work with will be competent |
| 03:55.13 | karlpinc | themill: You're right. Time to end this thread. |
| 03:55.18 | gnarface | sometimes thin veils of security through obscurity are all that is left |
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| 03:55.57 | gnarface | sometimes that thin veil is the *only* thing left that will teach anyone competence |
| 03:56.08 | gnarface | if you don't make them think about it, they'll lose the ability to judge for themselves what is safe |
| 03:56.34 | karlpinc | gnarface: If the veil is there, jim's not collaborating anyhow. He may as well not be in any groups since he's not frobbing his umask. |
| 03:57.24 | gnarface | karlpinc: but he's most of the development community, so i feel its a huge mistake to make the defaults less secure by default for those who don't understand them completely |
| 03:57.57 | karlpinc | gnarface: The default is to not put them in any groups but their own private group, so the default is safe. |
| 03:58.10 | gnarface | we shouldn't be allowing the incompetent to get things done easier at the risk of the whole community's basic security integrity |
| 03:58.33 | themill | gnarface: no-one is. Your argument is the one that relies on incompetence. |
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| 03:59.15 | karlpinc | gnarface: It'd have to be the person putting people in groups that's incompotent. (Trusting people who shouldn't be trusted.) |
| 03:59.48 | |oop | all you need is love |
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| 04:02.13 | gnarface | themill: wrong. my argument is one that takes incompetence into account rather than blindly assuming incompetence is something that only happens to other people. |
| 04:03.23 | gnarface | themill: i assume also that every system in which you have root on and that you are responsible for in any way whatsoever that you're also the primary authority on what gets done with that system |
| 04:03.57 | mrdeb | how come the radio stations are no loading in vlc 2.03 |
| 04:04.04 | gnarface | themill: many of the rest of us manage systems for clients on teams of... less qualified people. |
| 04:04.08 | gnarface | themill: not by choice either |
| 04:04.49 | themill | gnarface: root has nothing to do with the security or otherwise of UPG and every time you bring up malicious root users you just demonstrate that you have no threat model that you're using to argue about this. I think we really should move on. |
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| 04:05.04 | gnarface | themill: the notion that only one man holds the root password at any given time, or that multiple holders of a root password would consult with each other before breaking things is also naive and quaint |
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| 04:05.23 | themill | and also utterly irrelevant to the discussion. Let's move on. |
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| 04:05.58 | gnarface | i don't think its irrelevant if you take into account that not every command everyone writes may not be a mistake |
| 04:07.06 | gnarface | its sort of like the whole thing where people alias rm="rm -i" by default |
| 04:07.08 | themill | if you have a malicious/incompetent root then no unix permissions are going to help you anyway. It doesn't matter what groups or umask you have because root can walk through all those permission settings. That makes it utterly irrelevant to a discussion of permissions settings. |
| 04:07.22 | gnarface | its stupid to alias rm="rm -i" if you assume that nobody will ever rm in error |
| 04:07.37 | gnarface | but its fundamentally also very naive to assume nobody will ever rm in error |
| 04:08.47 | gnarface | themill: again, not irrelevant, because incompetence won't try harder to break the system every time. sometimes you can actually materially mitigate large losses of man hours this way |
| 04:08.49 | karlpinc | I prefer backups to rm='rm -i'. But ... So what? |
| 04:09.13 | gnarface | karlpinc: backups have COST |
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| 04:09.36 | gnarface | i'm bitter and jaded |
| 04:09.44 | gnarface | and i'm jealous of the fantasy world themill lives in |
| 04:09.50 | ctmjr | if you kids don't stop am going to take away your keyboards |
| 04:09.51 | karlpinc | gnarface: Me too. The y key starts pressing itself. |
| 04:09.59 | gnarface | and i feel sorry for karlpinc or anyone jumping into the deep end on only themill's advice alone |
| 04:10.01 | gnarface | but i'm done |
| 04:10.04 | gnarface | quits |
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| 04:10.18 | themill | gnarface: seriously.. there is no fantasy... if your method is safe, so is UPG and vice versa. |
| 04:10.46 | gnarface | themill: your schroedinger's cat argument is noted but it only works in theory |
| 04:11.13 | themill | you're yet to come up with a threat model. Without a threat model, any discussion about security is ranting. |
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| 04:11.42 | gnarface | i maintain i clearly stated a threat model and you simply discarded it as irrelevant |
| 04:11.54 | gnarface | i honestly hope you're lucky enough to maintain that opinion forever too |
| 04:12.03 | themill | "malicious root user" is your threat model for when you're discussing user permissions? |
| 04:12.21 | karlpinc | themill: The threat model is that user A shares a group with user B and user B wants a file user A has access to and convinces user A to copy that file into a place where user B has access. |
| 04:12.37 | gnarface | themill: basically yea, but when you state it like that you make it sound like its not common place, or that its always escapable |
| 04:13.20 | dont-panic | kinda got the touchpad working... its a touchpad like what a mac has, no real buttons but the pad itself clicks |
| 04:13.27 | karlpinc | themill: And UPG gives user B more places where she has access because she shares a group with user A. That's the threat model I heard. |
| 04:13.32 | themill | karlpinc: that can happen already so there's no change |
| 04:13.38 | dont-panic | I was able to set a 2 finger tap to right click, which works for now |
| 04:14.03 | karlpinc | themill: I agree. I don't see the "more places" argument as compelling. |
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| 04:15.10 | themill | gnarface: what arrangement of permissions will stop a malicious root user doing as they please? |
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| 04:15.51 | gnarface | themill: none, but you'd be shocked at how irrelevant that argument is |
| 04:16.20 | mrdeb | themill: dual layer id system |
| 04:16.32 | themill | gnarface: so if no arrangement of permissions will stop a malicious root doing something, how is it relevant to a discussion of permissions? |
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| 04:16.49 | karlpinc | themill: Or rather, I don't see the "more places" argument as something that's larger the insecurity that will happen by adopting other collaboration models. (like sudo) |
| 04:17.09 | gnarface | themill: because sudo is logged, everyone knows that. not everyone knows that you can have a file you own stolen from you if you copy it into a directory somoene else owns. |
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| 04:18.03 | karlpinc | themill: That's the real question. What are the alternatives to UPG and how do they stack up in terms of threat -- given the threat model proposed. (I don't understand why anybody's talking about root.) |
| 04:18.05 | gnarface | themill: under the basic plausible deniability most real-world workplaces operate in with unix in that "if they had access by default, it must have been not their fault if they broke something" your suggestion basically just makes everyone might as well log in as root. mine does not |
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| 04:19.14 | themill | sorry... I don't have time to pursue this crazy talk any more... really. You're now talking about everyone logging in as root as being an equivalent to user groups? |
| 04:19.32 | gnarface | themill: if your whole user base is implictly competent, implicitly trusted, implicitly ethical, and in the cases where they're incompetent, magically stilll completely competent JUST ON KNOWLEDGE OF HOW TO ROOT THE BOX then what is the point of there even being multiple users? why not just make it a single user system with everyone logged in as uid 0 and a shared password? |
| 04:19.41 | themill | my time is not infinite but your capacity to come up with more random and unrelated things is |
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| 04:20.17 | gnarface | i could have said the same thing about your arguments |
| 04:20.24 | gnarface | i really hope you never change your mind |
| 04:20.31 | gnarface | i wouldn't wish on you the experiences i've had |
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| 04:21.30 | gnarface | themill: the malicious users don't have infinite resources either |
| 04:21.48 | gnarface | the incompetent ones have very few |
| 04:21.57 | harlan | ... and never makes mistakes/typos |
| 04:22.00 | gnarface | and they will waste almost none of them trying stuff twice |
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| 04:23.38 | dondelelcaro | what's the argument? If you're doing UPG, 0002 is sane. If you're not, you do 0022. If you know better, do whatever you want. If you really know better, do selinux or similar. |
| 04:24.20 | dondelelcaro | (and there's really no reason not to do UPG anymore anyway) |
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| 04:25.11 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: The argument is.... ongoing. That seems to be the point. On a more practical level https://wiki.debian.org/Debate/umask The default debian umask seems to have gone back to 0022. IMO it'd be nice if it was 0002 but frankly, it's late.... |
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| 04:26.21 | mrdeb | is systemd going to be default soon |
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| 04:27.03 | dondelelcaro | mrdeb: it won't be the default everywhere, but if you want it to be your default, just install it |
| 04:27.17 | mrdeb | i tried to read about it but its hard to confiugre |
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| 04:27.26 | mrdeb | i just know that system that uses it boots 3 times faster |
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| 04:28.01 | dondelelcaro | mrdeb: so install it? In general, it should just work. |
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| 04:28.16 | fruitFly | what is the command to check my wifi firmware? |
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| 04:28.25 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: Since you're here, and nobody seems to be following the cp thread, I don't suppose you could tell me why, at line 18 of http://paste.debian.net/60686/ bar is owned by kop and not tuser. I'd expect cp to unlink the file and start over with a new inode but this does not seem to happen. |
| 04:28.33 | mrdeb | no i reada bout changing to it and it seemed hard |
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| 04:29.15 | karlpinc | mrdeb: Systemd is not the only way to a fast boot. The insserv method in wheezy works fine too. |
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| 04:31.58 | dondelelcaro | karlpinc: nah; it should use the same inode, I believe |
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| 04:32.29 | fruitFly | what is the command to check what my wifi nic is? |
| 04:32.31 | dondelelcaro | karlpinc: at least, that's what it has to be doing in order to get that output |
| 04:33.01 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: Yeah, but why. I don't get it. Why not just start over with tuser's bar? Why does the cp command work the way it does? |
| 04:33.20 | dondelelcaro | karlpinc: I suspect that if you gave --backup it would do something differently |
| 04:33.44 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: (I just came across the 'unable to set time' error message and got to wondering.) |
| 04:33.55 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: Yeah... But I don't want a backup. |
| 04:34.38 | karlpinc | My mental model of cp is clearly broken. |
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| 04:37.45 | karlpinc | I guess I could motivate and go read the posix docs. I was hoping for a quick answer and that's long since not happened.... |
| 04:38.51 | karlpinc | (There's already --strip-trailing-slashes to strip posix wierdness....) |
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| 04:40.36 | xsamurai | running debian wheezy 7.1 and using some packages from testing, wanted to run smartctl but I get the following error " Inconsistency detected by ld.so: dl-version.c: 224: _dl_check_map_versions: Assertion `needed != ((void *)0)' failed! " |
| 04:40.45 | xsamurai | anybody else see something similar ? |
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| 04:41.37 | karlpinc | xsamurai: Running some packages from testing is ungood. You want to backport yourself or use something already backported from backports. |
| 04:41.38 | vitalius | which package has smbfs? |
| 04:41.44 | vitalius | for mounting shared drives |
| 04:41.50 | peterrooney_ | !frankendebian |
| 04:41.51 | dpkg | When you get random packages from random repositories, mix multiple releases of Debian, or mix Debian and derived distributions, you have a mess. There's no way anyone can support this "distribution of Frankenstein" and #debian certainly doesn't want to even try. See if you can convince ##linux to help. |
| 04:41.58 | karlpinc | vitalius: the apt-file command will tell you. |
| 04:41.58 | dondelelcaro | karlpinc: yeah, you can basically read copy.c for the full bit about it (in coreutils) |
| 04:42.36 | xsamurai | karlpinc: I always thought testing wouldnt be as bad as unstable |
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| 04:42.40 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: Thanks! I can rest easy now. :) |
| 04:42.56 | karlpinc | xsamurai: That'd be if you ran testing in it's entirity. |
| 04:43.29 | xsamurai | hmmm, Im strongly considering it thanks i'll upgrade to testing then |
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| 04:44.01 | karlpinc | xsamurai: Backports (and self-backporting if necessary) can often be preferrable. |
| 04:44.17 | karlpinc | !tell xsamurai about backports |
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| 04:48.05 | xsamurai | is there a way to tell which packages are from stable and which are from testing ? |
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| 04:49.49 | karlpinc | xsamurai: Yes. But I've forgotten. I'd probably go looking in the aptitude manual to figure it out. That might or might not be best. |
| 04:49.55 | elkingrey | When I update through the software update manager it tells me whether or not my system needs a restart. But when I update via apt-get will it also tell me? I just finished doing an update of a lot of packages. How do I know if I should restart my machine? |
| 04:50.36 | xsamurai | karlpinc: thanks for all the help |
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| 04:50.39 | karlpinc | elkingrey: It won't tell you. You should restart if either the kernel or glibc has been upgraded. (That's my rule of thumb.) |
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| 05:01.37 | Ponch0 | Ah, I got a message "Low Disk Space on "Filesystem root"" |
| 05:01.41 | Ponch0 | what does that mean? |
| 05:01.59 | doomikus | I notice that after installing the nvidia drivers, sometimes the splash screen/logo comes up and other times does not. how can I tell from the cli if the nvidia driver is running/working? |
| 05:03.01 | karlpinc | dondelelcaro: Humm. cp --remove-destination |
| 05:03.26 | doomikus | Ponch0: what does, df -h show? |
| 05:03.59 | Ponch0 | rootfs 9.1G 9.1G 0 100% / |
| 05:04.10 | karlpinc | !tell Ponch0 about fhs |
| 05:04.39 | doomikus | karlpinc: ? |
| 05:05.11 | Ponch0 | Is there a way to increase the size ? |
| 05:05.58 | doomikus | Ponch0: I would probably first think about removing files before expanding first. Did you install using lvm? |
| 05:06.03 | karlpinc | !tell doomikus about dpkgbot |
| 05:06.19 | Ponch0 | doomikus, I did not, there was an issue with lvm during install. |
| 05:07.01 | Ponch0 | so I chose entire disk option but no lvm |
| 05:07.04 | karlpinc | Ponch0: "aptitude clean" could help by cleaning out your apt cache. |
| 05:07.14 | doomikus | Ponch0: not that I know much about lvm, but basically it would allow you to dynamically add other partitions/drives |
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| 05:08.04 | Ponch0 | doomikus: thanks. |
| 05:08.13 | Ponch0 | karlpinc: thanks that freed up 16% |
| 05:08.24 | doomikus | Ponch0: take a look around the fs, especially since you don't seem to know what caused it |
| 05:09.15 | karlpinc | Ponch0: Now think bout restructuring your partitions. Do you really need more than /, /boot, and some swap? (It will be annoying, but you will learn things.) |
| 05:09.53 | Ponch0 | thanks doomikus. |
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| 05:10.20 | Ponch0 | karlpinc: I have 970 gigs of free space, this is just silly. |
| 05:10.21 | karlpinc | Ponch0: du -sh can be your friend. But if you're partitions are just too small it won't help. |
| 05:10.56 | doomikus | Ponch0: yw |
| 05:10.58 | karlpinc | Ponch0: You should not have created separate partitions, without a good reason. |
| 05:11.26 | Ponch0 | karlpinc: you're right. let me google-fu this |
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| 05:20.49 | DANtheBEASTman | how hard would it be to hook up a monitor, mouse and keyboard up to this laptop next to me and have them running separate X servers/sessions |
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| 05:25.05 | Ponch0 | I found this and under post #5 http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?f=30&t=106935 :is that reasonable sounding option? |
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| 05:28.42 | Ponch0 | Also, if I were to do a reinstall, picking entire disk in the option erases what was there previously? I'd like to get everything erased start fresh |
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| 06:02.14 | klimtx | hello everybody from italy |
| 06:03.29 | doomikus | hi klimtx |
| 06:03.44 | klimtx | there's somebody with good knowledge about linux and some programing language like phyton interessed to help me with my project? |
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| 06:04.06 | doomikus | would love to, but I'm not knowledable enough |
| 06:04.18 | doomikus | *knowledgable |
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| 06:04.47 | spergy | anyone else having troubles with apt-get update? |
| 06:04.57 | spergy | seems to be stuck on a server |
| 06:05.11 | doomikus | spergy: lemme try |
| 06:05.25 | klimtx | I have a very good idea to make easy and legal money offering web service |
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| 06:05.45 | spergy | keep getting this: Failed to fetch http://ftp.au.debian.org/debian/dists/wheezy/Release.gpg Connection failed |
| 06:06.11 | doomikus | spergy: no issues for me |
| 06:06.32 | rryoumaa | wodim works really well, but it writes to dos-style pathnames. is there a recommended set of options? i don't know what all the modes mean. |
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| 06:06.55 | spergy | hmmm any ideas doomikus? |
| 06:07.02 | spergy | everything else is fine, net works fine |
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| 06:07.10 | spergy | must be a server issue with the au server |
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| 06:08.31 | doomikus | spergy: au ftp returns a ping, so it's up |
| 06:08.38 | jargon | test |
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| 06:08.44 | jargon | \o/ |
| 06:09.41 | spergy | hmm well that sucks |
| 06:09.45 | spergy | no idea whats up |
| 06:09.51 | spergy | its a fresh install |
| 06:10.03 | doomikus | anyone here using cli music players? which ones? not sure what I think of mp3blaster |
| 06:10.22 | doomikus | spergy: do you generally have connectivity otherwise? |
| 06:11.29 | spergy | doomikus: yeah everything is fine, browsing the web, apt-get installing has been fine, just wanted to get flashplugin-nonfree and tried adding the nonfree server and then apt-get update and now it's stuck on that same spot everytime with that server |
| 06:11.46 | klimtx | there's a channel where people talk and help other people in this fucking channel? |
| 06:12.15 | klimtx | there's a channel where people talk and help other people in this fucking node? |
| 06:13.40 | doomikus | spergy: it might have something to do with the gpg key itself, try googling on that |
| 06:13.45 | bazhang | klimtx, please be patient, and civil |
| 06:14.08 | doomikus | klimtx: probably the wrong channel. I certainly don't know how to help you with get rich quick schemes ;) |
| 06:14.36 | spergy | doomikus: alright will do |
| 06:14.41 | klimtx | yes I'm patient and civil too but not stupid... |
| 06:15.01 | klimtx | anyway I'm sorry... |
| 06:15.19 | bazhang | klimtx, try #python |
| 06:15.55 | klimtx | I don't need just phyton, is reductive |
| 06:16.45 | rryoumaa | klimtx: #linux is holistic |
| 06:16.55 | rryoumaa | klimtx: #unix is holistic |
| 06:16.59 | bazhang | klimtx, asking for people that want to help you with a project; this is debian support. perhaps try ##programming or #python |
| 06:17.33 | klimtx | thanks |
| 06:17.37 | bazhang | np |
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| 06:20.47 | spergy | now it's fine again |
| 06:20.50 | spergy | well that was weird haha |
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| 06:24.29 | klys | what's the best way to get flash for iceweasel squeeze ? |
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| 06:26.24 | gnarface | klys: from the package for it in non-free, just like for any other debian version, but you're not supposed to be using squeeze anymore |
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| 06:27.11 | klys | I also have chroots of etch and lenny |
| 06:27.17 | themill | contrib not non-free; squeeze is still a supported release |
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| 06:28.00 | themill | (although iceweasel in squeeze is no longer supported) |
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| 06:30.16 | gnarface | themill: don't you dare. |
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| 06:30.27 | themill | dare what? |
| 06:30.53 | gnarface | klys: just fyi, despite themill's trolling (yes, squeeze IS still supported) squeeze is no longer current "stable" you *should* use wheezy |
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| 06:31.25 | themill | gnarface: I'm not trolling. You said one sentence that was factually wrong on two points. This isn't personal... you were just wrong. |
| 06:31.26 | gnarface | klys: the package should be there regardless... |
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| 06:31.47 | klys | just pretend I know what I want to use it for and leave it at that. |
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| 06:32.13 | themill | klys: flashplugin-nonfree |
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| 06:35.09 | rryoumaa | is there an uneject? |
| 06:35.25 | rryoumaa | or do cd drives not support that in hardware? |
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| 06:35.50 | themill | rryoumaa: it depends on the hardware. see eject(1) |
| 06:36.18 | rryoumaa | ah, -T |
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| 06:36.33 | themill | (a desktop machine probably can do it; a laptop probably can't) |
| 06:36.42 | rryoumaa | nice |
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| 06:59.11 | rryoumaa | what does -sao do in wodim? i seemed to burn ok without it, but everybody says you need to use it. the man page doesn't say what it does. |
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| 07:02.03 | themill | rryoumaa: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_disc_recording_modes#CD_Disc-At-Once |
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| 07:02.38 | themill | (that's as good an explanation as I know for what "disk at once" means |
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| 07:04.18 | SmartGuy | How I can run an .sql file from linux console? to run those sql command... it's 5Gb and it will take a lot of time for me to upload it with PhpmyAdmin ... |
| 07:05.08 | rjsalts | SmartGuy: mysql|psql|... < foo.sql |
| 07:05.59 | rjsalts | SmartGuy: with whatever options you need to connect to the correct database |
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| 07:09.01 | rryoumaa | thanks themill. it looks like for data (normal filesystem as opposed to burning an audio disc) it doesn't matter whether you use the option or not, but that's just a guess based on my halfway understanding of that page. |
| 07:09.20 | rryoumaa | (the -sao option) |
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| 07:10.38 | themill | iirc there's also some difference in whether you can add more files to the disc in another session later or not. |
| 07:11.22 | themill | that said, I can't remember when I last even burnt an optical disc so whatever I once knew about this I suspect I have forgotten |
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| 07:17.02 | boudiccas | trying to open a leafpad as 'sudo leafpad [sudo] password for boudiccas: No protocol specified leafpad: Cannot open display: boudiccas@london:~$ ' how can i do it please? |
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| 07:23.31 | themill | boudiccas: using gksu or gksudo instead of sudo. |
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| 07:26.52 | boudiccas | themill, that gives me 'boudiccas@London:~$ gksudo leafpad leafpad: Cannot open display: (gksudo:7246): GLib-CRITICAL **: g_str_has_pr' |
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| 07:28.48 | themill | can you start any other programs at this stage? what happens if you just try "leafpad" |
| 07:29.13 | themill | also -- where are you running this? (on a local machine? in an xterm?) |
| 07:29.37 | boudiccas | oh, leafpad runs okay, just not as root |
| 07:29.58 | boudiccas | in xfce-terminal on a freshh wheezy install |
| 07:30.00 | themill | you've double checked that just now? |
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| 07:30.06 | boudiccas | yes |
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| 07:53.41 | afsal | babilen, here the source list http://paste.debian.net/60481/ |
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| 08:08.42 | babilen | afsal: That's quite a delay in answering questions :) |
| 08:09.26 | bezaban | he might be on CPIP |
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| 08:09.50 | babilen | afsal: It would be nice if you wouldn't use ftp.debian.org but either http.debian.org, a country specific mirror network (e.g. ftp.uk.debian.org, ftp.tw.debian.org, ...) or a mirror. |
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| 08:10.23 | babilen | bezaban: I doubt that would delay an answer by more than eight hours :D |
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| 08:11.24 | babilen | But, granted, it is a valid hypothesis |
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| 08:12.27 | szunyi | hello, i have a question about 'lm-sensors' |
| 08:12.46 | babilen | szunyi: okay |
| 08:12.57 | szunyi | the critical number is read from sensor? |
| 08:13.28 | szunyi | example: Core 0: +94.0°C (high = +78.0°C, crit = +100.0°C) |
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| 08:19.01 | madmac2501 | hi, i am looking for a debian mirror that is not updated |
| 08:19.08 | madmac2501 | ideally from the last week |
| 08:19.17 | madmac2501 | anyone can knows one? |
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| 08:19.37 | linux-fox | not updated? |
| 08:19.42 | linux-fox | what mean? |
| 08:20.00 | madmac2501 | linux-fox, one that doesn't have the latest versions of the debian packages |
| 08:20.11 | jelly-home | madmac2501: why? |
| 08:20.15 | bezaban | wouldn't be a very good mirror then :/ |
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| 08:20.39 | jelly-home | !tell madmac2501 about snapshot |
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| 08:21.00 | madmac2501 | jelly-home: because i have a custom debian distribution but i have a dependency problem with the latest version |
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| 08:22.02 | madmac2501 | jelly-home,thanks, that could do the trick |
| 08:22.08 | madmac2501 | thank you |
| 08:22.41 | bezaban | after you've installed something from snapshot you can freeze the package at that version to prevent automatic upgrades |
| 08:22.57 | bezaban | (may have consequences) |
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| 08:24.34 | madmac2501 | bezaban, yes, i do that, but my build process is not right because use the latest versions, i need to make a mirror and use that mirror always to not have problems like the one i have |
| 08:24.58 | bezaban | madmac2501: then you'd probably have to set one up for yourself |
| 08:25.07 | bezaban | as you say :) |
| 08:26.42 | madmac2501 | thanks all, you make my day |
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| 08:30.12 | lotherk | hi there. |
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| 08:31.21 | lotherk | I want to setup my own apt repo with reprepo. I'm searching for an option to set the prioritoy of the repo below 500 without createing an preferences file to pin either certain packages or the whole repo. Is there a way to tell the default priority of a repo in the repo side? A simple term to google for would be great. |
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| 08:47.35 | lotherk | NotAutomatic=yes and ButAutomaticUpgrades=yes is I was looking for. |
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| 08:53.27 | __marco | Hello! I need to build a meta-package that instals and configure some components like dnsmasq. What is the guideline of adding custom configuration to a package? |
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| 08:54.51 | g105b | I was wondering if there was something like chroot where depending on my webserver process's cwd, the process could be locked out of the rest of the filesystem? |
| 08:55.10 | g105b | ... each process may have a different cwd. |
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| 08:55.24 | threexk | hello. When you are looking at a man page, is there an easy way to jump to the documentation for a specific option (e.g., -W)? |
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| 08:55.51 | threexk | I typically use a regular expression like /^\s*-W, but that is a pain. |
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| 08:56.42 | __marco | threexk: usually you don't need a complex regex like that but just /-W and then move between the results |
| 08:56.47 | __marco | n and N |
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| 09:01.28 | moldy | hi |
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| 09:05.29 | threexk | __marco: I use that too but sometimes it gives false positives. Guess I was hoping there were some underlying structure to the document and you could jump specifically to an option. |
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| 09:05.49 | threexk | don't know how man pages are created but doesn't seem like they have such semantics |
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| 09:07.53 | __marco | threexk: they have not. They are just text, created using groff syntax and, for what I understand, converted on the fly |
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| 09:08.25 | __marco | threexk: apropos troff, man 7 roff |
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| 09:13.46 | threexk | __marco: thanks, I had wondered how they are created. |
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| 09:34.53 | g105b | How do I fix this error message when performing apt-get update? |
| 09:34.54 | g105b | W: GPG error: http://ftp.us.debian.org squeeze-updates Release: The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not available: NO_PUBKEY 8B48AD6246925553 |
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| 09:37.48 | caraconan | Hi there. I am wrong or the SID branch as an older package than stable one? http://packages.debian.org/search?keywords=pdfedit |
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| 09:38.42 | p0g0 | wrong |
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| 09:39.10 | ksk | ,versions pdfedit |
| 09:39.11 | judd | Package: pdfedit on i386 -- squeeze: 0.4.5-1 |
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| 09:39.21 | p0g0 | err. did you mean "is" where you said "as" ? or "has" ? |
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| 09:40.00 | jelly | judd: bug rm pdfedit |
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| 09:40.03 | judd | Bug http://bugs.debian.org/678046 in ftp.debian.org (closed): «RM: pdfedit -- ROM; depends on Qt3 libraries»; severity: normal; opened: 2012-06-18; last modified: 2012-07-18. |
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| 09:40.46 | jelly | caraconan: the package has been removed from debian due to using obsolete libraries |
| 09:40.51 | caraconan | So if I'm on jessie, what's the best approach to install this particular package? |
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| 09:41.06 | ksk | probably not. |
| 09:41.25 | ksk | there are many pdf-tools around, maybe there are alternatives for you to use? |
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| 09:42.13 | jelly | caraconan: since qt3 is not present in the distro, that might be a bit of a problem. If you really need it right now, make and use a squeeze chroot |
| 09:42.51 | caraconan | ok, thanks everybody, as usual I learn a lot in this channel |
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| 09:43.13 | caraconan | I will look for another alternative to Acrobat, and if I can't find it, I will go for chroot environment |
| 09:43.33 | jelly | caraconan: if you choose to do the latter, see /msg dpkg debootstrap, /msg dpkg schroot |
| 09:43.54 | caraconan | I had a recipe documented by my own long time ago. Anyway thanks a lot |
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| 09:54.14 | jackfinn | When using Skype, my webcam shows alright and is available in the settings, but when I try to call somebody, the button to turn on video is blocked, but when they call me, it isn't blocked so I can turn my video on, how to fix this? |
| 09:56.24 | jackfinn | so the thing is, when I call them, I can't turn the video on. |
| 09:57.19 | rmacd | jackfinn: Skype isn't supported by Debian. Have you checked through bug reports? |
| 09:57.34 | jackfinn | rmacd: can you help me, man. |
| 09:57.37 | jackfinn | I am stuck in here. |
| 09:57.44 | jackfinn | there might be a problem with v4l2 or something? |
| 09:57.47 | jackfinn | cause, when I call em' |
| 09:57.52 | jackfinn | I can't turn da video on, dude.... |
| 09:57.57 | jackfinn | is there a problem with gufw? |
| 09:57.57 | *** part/#debian spergy (~spergy@123-3-40-59.static.dsl.dodo.com.au) |
| 09:58.06 | jackfinn | that isnt allowing incoming connections? |
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| 09:58.19 | tirengarfio | Im trying to install php-pear using sbut I get this: http://pastebin.com/bHRM4Zfz |
| 09:58.38 | tirengarfio | im using apt-get install php-pear |
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| 09:59.15 | rmacd | jackfinn: Squeeze? 32 or 64 bit? |
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| 10:00.23 | jackfinn | yeah, and 32. |
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| 10:01.02 | tirengarfio | rmacd, yes, squeeze |
| 10:01.24 | tirengarfio | how can I know if it is 32 or 64? |
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| 10:02.34 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: do lsmod you fucking idiot. |
| 10:02.49 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: this is a channel, reserved for professional and mature people. |
| 10:02.54 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: please leave. |
| 10:03.09 | jackfinn | FUCKING LEAVE. |
| 10:03.14 | jackfinn | alright sorry guys... |
| 10:03.15 | STMelon | jackfinn: STOP |
| 10:03.18 | rmacd | jackfinn: Easy there. |
| 10:03.28 | jackfinn | rmacd: man, can you help me with my skype problem |
| 10:03.30 | jackfinn | i am fucking angry |
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| 10:03.55 | tirengarfio | jackfinn, you are fucking idiot |
| 10:03.56 | pode | that's no reason to make everybody else angry |
| 10:04.27 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: your mother's bumhole. |
| 10:04.30 | jackfinn | alright enough guys. |
| 10:04.36 | jackfinn | enough cussing. |
| 10:04.36 | tirengarfio | ok thank you |
| 10:04.44 | tirengarfio | you are great |
| 10:04.44 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: be more mature. |
| 10:04.51 | jackfinn | yes, I am the greatest. |
| 10:04.55 | jackfinn | I know that. |
| 10:04.59 | tirengarfio | ok, i will try but dont say those words |
| 10:05.03 | jackfinn | ok |
| 10:05.04 | tirengarfio | it is not necessary |
| 10:05.31 | jackfinn | does anybody here uses skype on debian? |
| 10:05.46 | STMelon | no one will help you with the attiude you are presenting |
| 10:05.49 | STMelon | ignored |
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| 10:05.56 | pode | anybody have problems gdm not starting a greeter on sid |
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| 10:06.07 | pode | ? |
| 10:06.23 | tirengarfio | so it is 64 |
| 10:06.36 | tirengarfio | rmacd, |
| 10:07.15 | jackfinn | tirengarfio: he is busy. |
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| 10:08.16 | pode | been a while since last X restart, but after upgrades, didn't start |
| 10:08.32 | pode | manually reloaded nvidia module, and I can start x with startx.. |
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| 10:14.40 | verblendet | hi, i have debian jessie installed, and tried to install ia32libs, which is broken for some reason, so i skipped it and just installed the libs manually, however, works fine, but now e.g. if i install google earth, i get missing dependencies for ia32libs, which is not true, packages installed, but not metapackage... however. i used force-depends to install and all is fine. but now synaptic mentions broken packages google earth, which sho |
| 10:14.40 | verblendet | uld be removed before i can install anything. how can i fix this and mark google earth as NON BROKEN? |
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| 10:15.45 | themill | you can't force dependencies like that. You could try to fix the google earth package or try to fix the dependency that is a problem (opus, I assume) |
| 10:16.40 | themill | tirengarfio: where is this ndn-php5-cgi package from? it's not from Debian |
| 10:16.49 | testi | verblendet: do you still need ia32libs these days? Isn't multiarch-support intended to replace this? |
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| 10:17.21 | verblendet | testi, however, some debs want a ia32libs package |
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| 10:17.54 | verblendet | its fine to see there is a new solution to this, but as long some packages need just the metapackage this is no solution |
| 10:18.23 | themill | testi: ia32-libs is just a metapackage (wrapper) to help you install the relevant packages via multiarch |
| 10:18.40 | verblendet | and i wonder why i get all i386 libs installed on my 64 bit linux, but not the meta package |
| 10:18.57 | verblendet | i installed the multiarch stuff, added arch i386 to my repo etc |
| 10:19.07 | verblendet | but the /&%&$& metapackage wont install |
| 10:19.18 | themill | I assume that you're not getting all of its dependencies |
| 10:19.20 | verblendet | however, this marks other packages who requires ia32libs to be broken |
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| 10:19.46 | verblendet | so, i need to find out how to mark a package as non broken , i am the oss, not dpkg :) |
| 10:19.54 | verblendet | eh, boss :) |
| 10:20.16 | themill | you'd need to fix the package |
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| 10:21.23 | verblendet | themill, oh yeah, i need to fix it, and how do i do that? just need to mark a package as NOT broken |
| 10:21.23 | troulouliou_dev | hi is there an equivalent of fdisk f to fix pqrtition order but for gpt disk ? |
| 10:21.38 | verblendet | gdisk iirc |
| 10:21.49 | verblendet | or gfdisk or so |
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| 10:22.02 | themill | verblendet: there is no such thing as making a package not broken like that. You would need to get the .deb and edit its Depends line |
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| 10:22.10 | verblendet | wtf? |
| 10:24.13 | troulouliou_dev | verblendet, ok thanks |
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| 10:24.48 | troulouliou_dev | btw what is the recomended amount of swap recomended with 32 gb if i plan to hibernate |
| 10:25.01 | verblendet | at least x 1.5 |
| 10:25.11 | verblendet | of ram |
| 10:25.38 | troulouliou_dev | verblendet, ok i won't hibernate :) |
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| 10:26.03 | themill | if you've got that much memory, I'd be surprised if you didn't have a disk big enough to spare that though |
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| 10:26.38 | verblendet | ok, to resolve dependendies errors and because of a missing feature in dpkg to unmark a broken package as broken, hehe, i need a hint on how to extract a deb and recreate it. |
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| 10:27.20 | troulouliou_dev | themill, i m putting my swap on the ssd disk under cryptsetup/lvm so it a lot compared to the disk size |
| 10:27.33 | themill | verblendet: it's not a feature of dpkg, it's a feature of apt. And it's apt's job to maintain sensible dependencies ... if you don't want it to do that then don't use apt. |
| 10:27.59 | verblendet | themill, ok, thx for cleatrifyfing, but not very helpful |
| 10:28.04 | tirengarfio | themill sorry, I dont know where that is.. how can know it? any clue? |
| 10:28.12 | themill | dpkg: tell verblendet about package recompile |
| 10:28.38 | themill | verblendet: you could rebuild a local version of the package in toto, or you could extract it with dpkg-deb and then repackage it |
| 10:29.14 | verblendet | ok, seems i can live without gearth, i can also extract the deb and dont care about apt... |
| 10:29.42 | verblendet | i think i will use a manual install |
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| 10:35.56 | anonnumberanon | Is there a debian stable channel? |
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| 10:36.41 | bhuddah | anonnumberanon: you found it. |
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| 10:37.51 | anonnumberanon | Yeah because see, I like this stable distro, but I feel like the Iceweasel provided is pretty old. |
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| 10:38.44 | anonnumberanon | That and the fact that the PC will not wake up from sleep are the only two things that are a little problematic with this computer. |
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| 10:40.42 | OpenTokix | Where is the actual exim4 configuration file in debian? So I can very my cfengine promise ran the update-exim4.conf script? |
| 10:41.56 | anonnumberanon | halp |
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| 10:45.53 | JasonWoof | why is there no samba-clients package? (in instable) |
| 10:47.08 | JasonWoof | oh, it's samba-client |
| 10:47.18 | JasonWoof | weird that there's samba4-clients and samba-client |
| 10:47.22 | jelly | JasonWoof: apt-cache search samba clients? |
| 10:48.04 | JasonWoof | jelly: I found it. I just assumed that since the samba4 one had an s at the end that the samba one would too |
| 10:48.08 | jelly | dpkg, tell anonnumberanon about mdn |
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| 10:49.08 | Kroach | is Debian Unstable/Sid a rolling release? |
| 10:49.23 | anonnumberanon | thanks jelly |
| 10:49.45 | *** part/#debian TrIXx (~Thunderbi@87.128.226.58) |
| 10:49.45 | jelly | Kroach: it's not much of a "release" at all |
| 10:50.02 | petern_ | It's a rolling development version... |
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| 10:51.08 | Kroach | so I will only have to install it once and won't need to upgrade manually, right? |
| 10:51.18 | Kroach | upgrade as in release upgrade |
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| 10:51.43 | petern_ | Well you might also need to fix it when it breaks. |
| 10:51.53 | babilen | Kroach: As it is not a release you can't upgrade from one release to another. You can and do have to upgrade packages though. |
| 10:52.17 | Kroach | petern_: that's fine with me, I was using Arch for a long time and I'm used to that |
| 10:52.34 | babilen | Kroach: New packages are uploaded to unstable and transition to testing (outwith the freeze) the entire time. |
| 10:53.20 | babilen | Kroach: You might want to read https://wiki.debian.org/DebianUnstable and http://debian-handbook.info/browse/stable/sect.release-lifecycle.html |
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| 10:53.36 | Kroach | thanks, I'll check this out |
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| 10:56.05 | jelly | dpkg, cve lookup CVE-2013-4332 |
| 10:56.05 | dpkg | Information about the security advisory CVE-2013-4332 may be found at http://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2013-4332 |
| 10:56.21 | jelly | dpkg: botsnack |
| 10:56.21 | dpkg | jelly: :) |
| 10:56.23 | cusco | hi |
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| 10:56.46 | cusco | in netstat -tapn I see connections that should not be there, however in lsof -i, they're not there... |
| 10:56.56 | cusco | how could I find the process that has that connection? |
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| 10:57.45 | jelly | cusco: -p ought to show the process in most cases. Are you running it as root? |
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| 10:58.06 | cusco | I am, the process comes as - |
| 10:58.24 | cusco | and it is not established, instead is TIME_WAIT |
| 10:58.53 | jelly | cusco: TIME_WAIT is an almost-finished connection |
| 10:59.06 | cusco | well.. it seems as it is stucked there |
| 10:59.37 | jelly | the local process has closed its end, it's just the kernel still cares due to the way tcp stack works |
| 10:59.47 | blue_sky | Reading http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/debian-reference/ch05.en.html where it has '(legacy)' does that mean "This is the old way, there is a new way" ? |
| 10:59.48 | cusco | hmm |
| 11:00.00 | cusco | ok jelly thanks |
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| 11:00.58 | jelly | either googles or stevens will tell you what that's about |
| 11:01.24 | jelly | can't be bothered to look it up himself |
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| 11:09.23 | anonnumberanon | is it ok to use a Sid browser in a Wheezy distro. Is the Sid browser not in Wheezy because it is risky to use or because it just has not been implemented in the stable distro yet? |
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| 11:10.24 | jelly | anonnumberanon: it's almost never ok to use binary packages from sid in a stable release |
| 11:10.39 | anonnumberanon | OW! |
| 11:11.33 | jelly | !backports |
| 11:11.33 | dpkg | A backport is a package from a newer Debian branch, compiled from source for an older branch to avoid dependency and <ABI> complications. http://www.debian.org/doc/manuals/reference/ch02.en.html (2.7.4 and 2.7.10), http://backports.debian.org/ . Ask me about <debian-backports> and <backport caveat>. See also <simple sid backport>. |
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| 11:11.55 | anonnumberanon | Some websites discriminate against me while using this browser. |
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| 11:13.35 | bezaban | ,version kismet |
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| 11:13.37 | judd | Package: kismet on i386 -- squeeze: 2008-05-R1-4.1+b1; jessie: 2013.03.R1b-1; sid: 2013.03.R1b-2 |
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| 11:17.07 | anonnumberanon | dpkg tall me about <simple sid backport> |
| 11:17.07 | dpkg | anonnumberanon: I'm not sure, is it larger than a breadbox? |
| 11:17.13 | anonnumberanon | dpkg tall me about simple sid backport |
| 11:17.14 | dpkg | anonnumberanon: i don't know |
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| 11:17.38 | anonnumberanon | dpkg tall me about debian-backports |
| 11:17.38 | dpkg | anonnumberanon: KCI error, or a problem with the Keyboard-Chair Interface. |
| 11:17.45 | musca | anonnumberanon: did you apply the security updates? there is iceweasel 17 |
| 11:17.57 | anonnumberanon | musca yes I have |
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| 11:18.45 | anonnumberanon | !simple sid backports |
| 11:18.45 | dpkg | First, check for a backport on <debian-backports>. If unavailable: 1) Add a deb-src line for sid (not a deb line!); ask me about <deb-src sid> 2) enable debian-backports (see <bdo>) 3) aptitude update; aptitude install build-essential; aptitude build-dep packagename; apt-get -b source packagename; 4) install the resultant debs. To change compilation options, see <package recompile>; for versions newer than sid see <uupdate>. |
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| 11:20.23 | anonnumberanon | ok I'm gonna to wait and learn more about gnu before playing around with these things |
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| 11:21.45 | jelly | anonnumberanon: you can ask the bot in private using eg. /msg dpkg ssb |
| 11:22.13 | anonnumberanon | thanks |
| 11:22.24 | anonnumberanon | ssb stands for? |
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| 11:23.12 | anonnumberanon | <PROTECTED> |
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| 11:23.21 | anonnumberanon | eg. /msg dpkg ssb |
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| 11:23.40 | jelly | just write /msg dpkg ssb |
| 11:23.58 | jelly | it's just an example, happens to point to the same thing as Simple Sid Backport |
| 11:24.07 | deepy | Whenever I want to install something apt tries to uninstall libperl 5.10, can I make it NOT do that? |
| 11:24.11 | anonnumberanon | eg. /msg dpkg !backports |
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| 11:24.45 | jelly | "eg. " means "for example" |
| 11:24.55 | bhuddah | and the command starts with a slash. |
| 11:25.11 | jelly | deepy: don't mix repos from different releases |
| 11:25.21 | jelly | !tell deepy about bat |
| 11:26.56 | anonnumberanon | ah ok thanks jelly |
| 11:27.16 | anonnumberanon | max kharma in your general network direction |
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| 11:38.34 | ExeciN | can I de-suckify gnome 3 or should I go with an alternative? |
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| 11:39.19 | jelly | dpkg, tell ExeciN about install xfce |
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| 11:40.14 | jelly | "de-suckify" is a bit nonspecific |
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| 11:41.01 | peterrooney_ | ,versions suckless-tools |
| 11:41.02 | judd | Package: suckless-tools on i386 -- squeeze: 35-1; jessie: 38-2; sid: 38-2; wheezy: 38-2; experimental: 39-1 |
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| 11:56.15 | blue_sky | need to set up Debian box as a network gateway/firewall. Google find lots of old documents, what should I be reading to find how to set up recent debian for firewall? |
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| 11:58.20 | gnarface | blue_sky: iptables documentation is probably a good place to start |
| 11:59.26 | blue_sky | gnarface: OK, thank you, will start there |
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| 12:04.25 | cheri__ | hi I am not able to mount a nfs share created on a wheezy unit onto a lenny unit. Says mount.nfs: Protocol not supported |
| 12:04.31 | cheri__ | can anyone help on this please |
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| 12:07.01 | babilen | blue_sky: Join #netfilter and read the documents/pages linked in their /topic ; Debian isn't really special and simply packages iptables which means that using it boils down to you learning how to use iptables. You might want to take a look at https://wiki.debian.org/iptables though which discusses a method to tie in activation of iptables to the activation of interfaces. |
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| 12:07.18 | blue_sky | cheri__: have you got nfs-common and portmap installed? |
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| 12:07.27 | blue_sky | babilen: thank you will take a look |
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| 12:07.46 | cheri__ | yes I have |
| 12:08.15 | cheri__ | I don't have prblm mounting nfs shares from a lenny machine. this is seen only from the wheezy unit |
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| 12:08.50 | cheri__ | I have another ubuntu server there it mounts without any problem |
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| 12:09.45 | imdea | Hi, I'm having problems trying to setup ssh key authentication within 2 debian hosts, I have created my key pair using 'ssh-keygen -f puppet-git' and got two files (public and private key), added puppet-git.pub to authorized_keys2 in the server and copied the private key to the client under .ssh directory, but when trying to do: ssh git@myserver it asks me for password. Any ideas? |
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| 12:10.42 | blue_sky | cheri__: searching google for "mount.nfs protocol not supported" give a lot of results, I wouldn't know which are relevant. |
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| 12:11.31 | cheri__ | blue_sky: I spent three hours yesterday but not able to find the issue |
| 12:11.57 | Rwhar | Where should applications be installed (best/common practices wise)? (in this case, a java web application installed manually from an archive) |
| 12:12.14 | Rwhar | is /usr/[application-name] the most common? |
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| 12:12.22 | blue_sky | imdea: ~/.ssh/authorized_keys must have perms 0600, you got that? |
| 12:12.22 | anonnumberanon | >keyboars shortcuts can launch programs that are in the PATH |
| 12:12.34 | abrotman | Rwhar: /usr/local/ or /opt/ perhaps |
| 12:12.36 | imdea | blue_sky, yes I do |
| 12:12.40 | anonnumberanon | But how to make a shortcut for something that is not in the path?? |
| 12:12.53 | imdea | blue_sky, actually file is ~./ssh/authorized_keys2 |
| 12:13.04 | cheri__ | imeda: I think by disabling the passwd authentication in the ssh config should solve the problem |
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| 12:13.08 | themill | dpkg: tell Rwhar about fhs |
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| 12:13.11 | jackfinn | ask.fm is not detecting my webcam? it says "Please turn your camera on or make sure that it is not in use by another application" |
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| 12:13.49 | imdea | blue_sky, and I'm able to connect with other keys to other servers which authorized_keys2 files don't have 0600, and it works. |
| 12:13.52 | themill | Rwhar: /usr/share/java is the normal location for jars. (or /usr/local/share/java) for locally compiled things |
| 12:13.54 | blue_sky | cheri__: do the logs on the NFS server give any clue? |
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| 12:14.41 | blue_sky | imdea: On the client you've got the .pub file as 0644 too? |
| 12:14.52 | jackfinn | blue_sky: do you know what a /dev/video0 is? |
| 12:14.55 | jackfinn | blue_sky: DO YOU?! |
| 12:15.29 | Yoshi1 | how ddo you upddaate ssomething that aapt-get iss holldding back? |
| 12:15.38 | Rwhar | hmm, this perticular app includes tomcat if that makes any difference. Thanks for the links @themill |
| 12:15.39 | imdea | blue_sky, you don't need the .pub on the client. |
| 12:15.43 | blue_sky | jackfinn: I'd have a guess but I know nothing about it |
| 12:16.03 | jackfinn | then you must try to know, blue_sky. |
| 12:16.13 | jackfinn | blue_sky: please go google and learn about it. |
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| 12:16.43 | blue_sky | imdea: then I'd go with cheri_'s suggestion, and restart sshd |
| 12:16.51 | blue_sky | jackfinn: why? |
| 12:17.24 | imdea | cheri__: No, it's working on other hosts that don't have password authentication disabled. |
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| 12:18.28 | themill | jackfinn: please try to be more constructive, less abrasive and less annoying. |
| 12:18.46 | blue_sky | imdea: I would compare md5 of the .pub and that part of the authorized_keys file. |
| 12:18.49 | jackfinn | themill: why are you being mean? |
| 12:18.50 | cheri__ | blue_sky: http://paste.debian.net/plain/60812 |
| 12:18.56 | jackfinn | being mean is not allowed on here, themill |
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| 12:19.23 | themill | jackfinn: please take a dose of your own medicine |
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| 12:20.24 | imdea | blue_sky: it's the same. |
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| 12:20.40 | cheri__ | imdea: may be some problem with permissions it seems. Just to ensure this you can disable passwd auth and only key based auth and increase verbosity when you ssh using the keys then it should give you more info of the problm |
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| 12:21.13 | blue_sky | imdea: you've not got two stanzas in authorized_keys for the same host? |
| 12:22.10 | imdea | blue_sky: two stanzas? what do you mean? |
| 12:22.23 | blue_sky | cheri__: it's been about three months since I set up NFS and I know I had major issues with it. Don't recall how I solved it. |
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| 12:23.19 | blue_sky | imdea: authorized_keys lists all keys for machines user is authorized to login from, do you have two lines from the client machine? |
| 12:23.39 | cheri__ | blue_sky: actually the nfs server auto negotiates when there is a version related issue but I don't understand why its not working |
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| 12:23.52 | cheri__ | I tried to force the nfs 3 version but still not working |
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| 12:24.37 | blue_sky | imdea: last part of each line is $USER@$HOST, check for doubles |
| 12:24.57 | blue_sky | imdea: (meaning you've done it twice) |
| 12:25.27 | imdea | blue_sky: as I told you before, I don't have authorized_keys file but authorized_keys2 since I'm using ssh v2. Within my authorized_keys2 file I have http://paste.debian.net/60814/ |
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| 12:25.49 | gionny | hi there guys |
| 12:26.05 | Walex | imdea: the names of the "authorized keys" files are arbitrary... |
| 12:26.34 | imdea | ?? |
| 12:26.52 | blue_sky | keys/keys2 you say potato, I say? still, I see only one line, you can't have done it twice. Server logs give any clues? |
| 12:27.20 | imdea | strange thing is that if I use option: -i <private_key_file> then it works. why? |
| 12:27.28 | blue_sky | I have to go and pay some attention to customers now. sorry wasn't able to help resolve before going. |
| 12:28.14 | gionny | I have a problem with setcap, when used on a process, on a machine A it disables the ld-library path, on another machine B it doesn't. The only difference is that in the machine B, when I selected what packages to install I selected all the packages.. I get an error of this type: error while loading shared libraries: mylib.so.1: cannot open shared object file: no such file or directory |
| 12:28.55 | cheri__ | imdea: have you placed in the file the .ssh directory of the user from where you are trying to connect? |
| 12:29.10 | imdea | cheri__: of course. |
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| 12:35.53 | cheri__ | imdea: are you using the standard naming id_rsa or id_dsa for your key or a different name |
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| 12:36.22 | anonnumberanon | if I install a package with dpkg will dpkg install it where I am at the moment I type the command, or will it install it where it is supposed to go? |
| 12:36.48 | vlt | anonnumberanon: the latter |
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| 12:37.18 | eb0t | cheri__ just picked up on back end of this conversation.....maybe its working your ssh and it may actually be asking you for your passphrase rather than your password |
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| 12:37.27 | anonnumberanon | vlt ok ill try that |
| 12:38.07 | cheri__ | eb0t: its not the passphrase issue |
| 12:38.24 | eb0t | and cheri have you edited your ssh config file to deactivate using passwords for authentication use pam no |
| 12:39.19 | cheri__ | eb0t: actually the issue is for the user imdea. my issue is about nfs mounting |
| 12:39.35 | eb0t | ha ha ....so sorry |
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| 12:40.53 | storagenewbie | hello how the package for the ldap utils is called I cannot find it :( |
| 12:41.42 | anonnumberanon | if I installed a package that is not in the repo with dpkg -i, can it get messed with the next time I update my distro? |
| 12:41.57 | themill | storagenewbie: ldap-utils? |
| 12:42.16 | themill | anonnumberanon: why are you installing packages with dpkg and not with apt, btw? |
| 12:42.17 | babilen | storagenewbie: Anything specific you have in mind? If not take a look at "apt-cache search ldap-utils" which lists, among others, ldap-utils |
| 12:42.21 | eb0t | storagenewbie try sudo apt-cache search ldap |
| 12:42.30 | themill | eb0t: (without the sudo) |
| 12:42.30 | babilen | no need to run that as root |
| 12:42.44 | gionny | nobody? |
| 12:42.46 | storagenewbie | oh ok thanks worked hurray |
| 12:42.50 | gionny | I've found this: create a file such as > this, with the path to libjli.so % cat /etc/ld.so.conf.d/java.conf /home/someuser/jdk1.7.0_04/jre/lib/i386/jli This will add the the pathname to the trusted user path, that ld.so will use, to build its runtime cache, verify if ld.so is seeing it by doing this, need to run it as root, and a reboot may be necessary. % ldconfig | grep libjli libjli.so -> libjli.so |
| 12:42.55 | gionny | but I haven't got it |
| 12:43.06 | anonnumberanon | themill, xchat is a package for apt that has security vulnerabilities so I got hexchat instead, which is not present for apt-get |
| 12:43.18 | eb0t | ah right ...when i deal with aptitute im in habbit of sudo it |
| 12:43.20 | eb0t | thanks guys |
| 12:43.37 | babilen | bad habit, only use it if you really have to! |
| 12:43.43 | babilen | (and want to!) |
| 12:43.59 | jelly | perhaps he really wants to |
| 12:44.06 | themill | anonnumberanon: I know of no important security problems in the xchat package. Do you have a CVE for that? |
| 12:45.29 | anonnumberanon | themill, do you not consider this important: http://www.cvedetails.com/vulnerability-list/vendor_id-552/Xchat.html |
| 12:45.54 | themill | anonnumberanon: precisely which of those are you worried about? |
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| 12:46.21 | themill | which do you believe the debian package is vulnerable to? |
| 12:46.42 | anonnumberanon | themill, the DoS one and the Code Executing one. |
| 12:46.53 | themill | anonnumberanon: that's windows only. |
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| 12:47.21 | tormen | hi. I have a question: I have a package AAA installed from stable, now I would like to "apt-get source" the unstable/experimental source version of AAA. How do I do? apt-get source AAA pulls me the stable source of AAA. |
| 12:47.22 | anonnumberanon | themill, how can you tell? |
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| 12:47.52 | babilen | Is it a bug or a feature that "apt-get autoremove" accepts the name of a package and will then continue to remove that package and unneeded pacakges? (cf. http://paste.debian.net/60820/) -- Couldn't find that in the manpage (might be blind though) |
| 12:47.53 | themill | anonnumberanon: https://security-tracker.debian.org/tracker/CVE-2012-0828 |
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| 12:48.25 | themill | anonnumberanon: also http://bugs.debian.org/686454 |
| 12:49.01 | babilen | tormen: You need a deb-src entry for unstable |
| 12:49.13 | themill | anonnumberanon: but in answer to your original question, if the package you have installed is a well-behaved package (doesn't try to overwrite files from other packages) then upgrading will be safe |
| 12:49.56 | babilen | dpkg: tell tormen -about ssb |
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| 12:53.50 | tormen | babilen: I knew, but had forgotten. Thanks! Really neat the "dpkg: tell tormen -about ssb" :)) |
| 12:54.49 | tormen | ssb = software stable build ? |
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| 12:55.37 | themill | simple sid backport |
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| 12:56.29 | Paterito | anybody... does the ext3 file system supports ñ |
| 12:57.03 | ectospasm | it should |
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| 13:01.30 | anonnumberanon | themill thanks |
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| 13:01.52 | value-picks | <PROTECTED> |
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| 13:05.34 | cheri__ | imdea: create a config file under .ssh and specify this IdentityFile ~/.ssh/<private key file>. save and close |
| 13:05.44 | cheri__ | imdea: that should resolve the issue |
| 13:06.04 | imdea | cheri__: yes that's was what I did :) |
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| 13:06.18 | cheri__ | imdea: cool |
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| 13:06.39 | imdea | cheri__: thanks |
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| 13:07.41 | tormen | babilen: /many/ thanks again!! :)) |
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| 13:15.47 | babilen | Is it a bug or a feature that "apt-get autoremove" accepts the name of a package and will then continue to remove that package and unneeded pacakges? (cf. http://paste.debian.net/60820/) -- Couldn't find that in the manpage (might be blind though) |
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| 13:18.03 | themill | babilen: yes |
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| 13:19.07 | babilen | themill: \o/ (exactly) |
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| 13:20.21 | babilen | themill: I was surprised to see that behaviour yesterday when a user used it by mistake, but have taken a liking to it since. Couldn't find it in the documentation though |
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| 13:21.24 | jelly | now do an autopurge |
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| 13:22.00 | babilen | invalid jelly in the fridge! |
| 13:23.37 | tormen | hi. I have another question: "apt-get dist-upgrade -V" wants to remove a bunch of packages. How can I learn why they need / should be removed ? |
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| 13:24.22 | babilen | tormen: Show us on http://paste.debian.net please |
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| 13:25.29 | tormen | http://paste.debian.net/60828/ |
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| 13:26.34 | tormen | Let's maybe focus on these 2: Why audacity, why mpd? |
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| 13:27.40 | ubsafder | i am changing the architecture of my system can reinstall without loosing my system |
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| 13:28.25 | themill | ubsafder: changing architecture is highly experimental... enough said? |
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| 13:29.38 | ubsafder | themill: i have i386 to raberypi ( arm) |
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| 13:29.57 | themill | ummm... |
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| 13:31.27 | JordiGH | /usr/include/dcmtk/ofstd/ofstream.h:67:22: fatal error: iostream.h: No such file or directory |
| 13:31.32 | JordiGH | You're kidding, right? |
| 13:31.52 | JordiGH | Does libdcmtk2-dev really ship with C++ headers that can't compile with g++? |
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| 13:32.37 | JordiGH | Ah... it's behind a macro. |
| 13:32.41 | JordiGH | Let's define it. |
| 13:33.08 | ubsafder | themill: i have debian weehzy on both machine what do i need to copy how to preserve permissions /etc /home ?? |
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| 13:33.27 | babilen | buys a rubber duck for JordiGH |
| 13:33.31 | arad | Guy noob here, i was happy with my wheezy then suddenly i decided to move to jessie and now X doesn't start when i boot with kernel 3.10. how can i fix this ? i have hybrid intel/amd graphic and i haven't installed catalyst . just firmware-non-free |
| 13:33.40 | eflynn | where do i set environment variables? .bashrc or .profile ? |
| 13:33.52 | eflynn | or rather, what do you recommend |
| 13:33.54 | jelly | /etc/environment? :-) |
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| 13:34.26 | JordiGH | babilen: It's kinda ridiculous that you have to define USE_STD_CXX_INCLUDES if you want to use DCMTK from C++. |
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| 13:35.55 | JordiGH | Wait, wtf... there *is* a macro defined. |
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| 13:36.14 | JordiGH | Under /usr/include/dcmtk/config/cfunix.h |
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| 13:36.43 | tormen | What is the easiest way how to see/understand the reason for a package removal proposed on apt-get dist-upgrade ? |
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| 13:37.14 | JordiGH | tormen: aptitude why-not the-package |
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| 13:39.24 | deni | during upgrade apt showed me a message. where are those messages stored so i can re-read it? |
| 13:39.49 | deni | it was a message for a particular package, from it's maintainer |
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| 13:40.39 | tormen | JordiGH: "Unable to find a reason to remove mpd." yet apt-get dist-upgrade wants to remove mpd ?! |
| 13:41.05 | JordiGH | tormen: Trying doing the upgrade with aptitude. |
| 13:41.09 | deni | nevermind...i kind of find what i was looking for on the package changelog |
| 13:41.27 | JordiGH | tormen: You can drop into a conflict resolution UI in aptitude and figure out why the package should be removed. |
| 13:41.28 | babilen | tormen: Could you show us the output of "apt-cache policy" and "apt-cache policy mpd" along with that of "aptitude -s full-upgrade" too? |
| 13:41.29 | Kagee | What is the difference between "docs", "package.doc-base" and a separate -doc-package when i make a deb? |
| 13:41.52 | babilen | Kagee: You want #debian-mentors on irc.oftc.net (aka irc.debian.org) |
| 13:41.58 | Kagee | thanks. |
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| 13:43.21 | tormen | babilen: apt-cache policy --> http://paste.debian.net/60835/ |
| 13:43.46 | babilen | tormen: preferably all in one paste |
| 13:43.57 | tormen | babilen: ok :) |
| 13:44.02 | JordiGH | tormen: Jesus, that's a very promiscuous sources.list |
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| 13:44.22 | tormen | it is just so convenient to pipe into pastebinit ;) |
| 13:44.27 | babilen | tormen: But I am sure that it is due to your (obviously) insane pinning. Mind pasting /etc/apt/preferences also? |
| 13:44.52 | JordiGH | tormen: You've made quite the mess here, buddy. |
| 13:44.55 | petn-randall | Hi, I've debugged a problem we have with trac to the http auth in front of it to allow whitespaces. So if 'jsmith' typoes and does http authentication as 'jsmith ', apache will let the authentication pass, which will later confuse trac. Any ideas how to tell apache to do more strict checking? |
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| 13:45.01 | jelly | tormen: (echo blah; blah; echo foo; foo; echo bar; bar) | pastebinit |
| 13:45.07 | babilen | tormen: And i don't like seeing experimental in there ... Please also paste your sources.list |
| 13:45.17 | tormen | babilen: yes I like pinning here and there |
| 13:45.23 | babilen | "here and there" |
| 13:45.34 | Elemeno-work | OOH, pastebinit? |
| 13:45.48 | babilen | Show us what you've done and we'll try to make sense of it, but I don't like the look of what I've seen so far. |
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| 13:46.58 | babilen | Elemeno-work: pastebinit is handy, but it is one of the more horrible Python scripts I had the pleasure to read. I'd recommend nopaste (from the horribly named "libapp-nopaste-perl" package) instead. |
| 13:47.23 | tormen | jelly: thanks! |
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| 13:47.40 | tormen | still pasting... |
| 13:48.13 | oo_miguel | when I connect to a server for the first time it asks me to accept a certificate / fingerprint, how can I check if its fine? |
| 13:48.20 | oo_miguel | via ssh |
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| 13:48.57 | babilen | oo_miguel: The admin of the server has given you the fingerprint earlier and you compare what you are being offered to what you expect. |
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| 13:49.55 | babilen | oo_miguel: Well, any method of making the fingerprint available to you is okay :) |
| 13:50.01 | tormen | ok without a --simulate I can wait long for aptitude -s full-upgrade to finish ;) |
| 13:50.10 | gdos | anyone here use dhelp and or dwww? (online, browser-based help systems for viewing man pages) - according to dwww man page - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man8/dwww.8.html - there is supposed to be a 'apache2.conf' file in '/etc/dwww' and symbolically linked from /etc/apache*/conf.d/dwww but there is neither a file or a symbolically linked file in /etc/dwww NOR /etc/apache2/conf.d and /var/lib/dwww appears empty. HELP? |
| 13:50.11 | rgr | whats the way to force reinstall of, for example, apache config files? Do I need to purge then reinstall the whole thing= |
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| 13:50.49 | tormen | dough -s |
| 13:50.50 | babilen | dpkg: tell rgr -about confnew |
| 13:50.52 | oo_miguel | babilen: What if its my own remote server and I just installed a fresh image of debian via some web-gui on it? |
| 13:51.02 | jelly | rgr: You do have to figure out the right package to purge. |
| 13:51.57 | babilen | oo_miguel: Then you list the fingerprint on the server and check it when connecting with the client. (ssh-keygen -lf /path/to/key) |
| 13:52.24 | tormen | ok, why does aptitude -s still ask me if I want to continue Y/N ? this doesn't make sense if I told him to simulate, or? |
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| 13:52.46 | mumpitze1 | tormen: it does. it simulates the real thing |
| 13:52.51 | babilen | tormen: Compare the behaviour |
| 13:53.21 | tormen | Yeah great after entering "Y" it tells me "Would download/install/remove packages." |
| 13:53.21 | ectospasm | tormen: it will still ask, but then exit when you say either yes or no |
| 13:53.28 | ectospasm | ^ |
| 13:53.42 | babilen | tormen: We know its great! :) |
| 13:53.48 | tormen | :) |
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| 13:53.56 | tormen | can I make it not prompt ? |
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| 13:54.29 | ectospasm | that's usually not a good idea, you may agree to something you don't want. |
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| 13:54.32 | oo_miguel | babilen: but I have no physical access to the server, so I need to connect to it BEFORE I can check the fingerprint, right? |
| 13:54.41 | jumperswitch | So I use multistrap. One can specify a setupscript. I want to use the device-table.pl script shipped with multistrap. However, it suspects a -f argument for the file to parse. So how can I specify the script in setupscript + the argument to the file? Because I can only specify script file paths in a multistrap config |
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| 13:55.00 | jumperswitch | This is really a problem. But they shipped it with multistrap and they recommend to use it. So there should be a way, but I haven't found it :( |
| 13:55.00 | tormen | ah, atitude -sy does the trick |
| 13:55.00 | ectospasm | ...aptitude will (aggressively?) remove packages to satisfy dependencies... |
| 13:55.08 | babilen | oo_miguel: Sure |
| 13:55.33 | oo_miguel | babilen: How can I connect securely to the server without knowing the fingerprint ? :P |
| 13:55.35 | ectospasm | oo_miguel: are there any admins on site that can send you the fingerprint? |
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| 13:55.39 | babilen | oo_miguel: You can't |
| 13:55.44 | oo_miguel | haha ok |
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| 13:55.51 | tormen | sorry, one clearly notices that I still ususually work with apt-get... |
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| 13:56.02 | oo_miguel | ectospasm: babilen: So I will ask if someone can send me the fingerprint |
| 13:56.24 | oo_miguel | thanks for the suggestion. I just wondered if there might be some other way, without annoying them |
| 13:56.25 | babilen | oo_miguel: The information about the fingerprint *has* to be communicated in a trusted way and, most importantly, out of band |
| 13:56.26 | tormen | (apt-cache policy; apt-cache policy mpd; aptitude -sy full-upgrade;cat /etc/apt/sources.list; cat /etc/apt/preferences.d/*_*) |pastebinit --> http://paste.debian.net/60841/ |
| 13:56.51 | ectospasm | tormen: have them run this command: ssh-keygen -lf /etc/ssh/ssh_host_rsa_key.pub |
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| 13:56.57 | oo_miguel | babilen: allrigth, Ill ask them |
| 13:57.19 | themill | tormen: what a mess... are you really surprised things are behaving strangely? |
| 13:57.21 | babilen | tormen: oh dear god |
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| 13:57.49 | babilen | tormen: First and foremost: Don't use ftp.debian.org but a mirror such as http.debian.org, ftp.fr.debian.org or ... |
| 13:58.01 | ectospasm | well, at least it was a simulation run |
| 13:58.15 | babilen | tormen: I will not support that setup. This is insane. |
| 13:58.16 | tormen | babilen: ok, done. |
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| 13:59.11 | tormen | babilen: let me clean that up for you |
| 13:59.39 | babilen | until tomorrow! ;) |
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| 14:00.20 | jumperswitch | anyone? |
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| 14:01.59 | oo_miguel | is the original ssh certificate generated by debian during installation randomly? |
| 14:02.41 | mumpitze1 | very pointless if it weren't |
| 14:02.41 | themill | yes |
| 14:02.58 | oo_miguel | :) |
| 14:03.08 | themill | well, there are some derivatives that get this wrong, so ... |
| 14:03.09 | oo_miguel | I agree |
| 14:03.10 | petn-randall | Well, at one point in time they used to be predictable ... |
| 14:03.14 | petn-randall | ducks. |
| 14:03.45 | petern_ | return 4; // chosen by fair dice roll. guaranteed to be random. |
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| 14:04.14 | arad | guys i switched from wheezy to jessie and now X doesn't start, what should i do ? |
| 14:04.38 | petn-randall | arad: Go to #debian-next on irc.oftc.net :) |
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| 14:05.38 | arad | petn-randall: thankyou |
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| 14:06.03 | rgr | arad: what video card and driver did you have? Did oyu install from the nvidia installer by any chance? |
| 14:06.29 | *** part/#debian Kagee (hildenae@wikimedia/Kagee) |
| 14:06.55 | arad | i have intel/amd hybrid and i just installed firmware-nonfree on wheezy |
| 14:07.01 | petn-randall | rgr: He already asked again on #debian-next, which is the more appropriate channel for jessie. |
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| 14:09.25 | tormen | babilen: better? http://paste.debian.net/60843 |
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| 14:10.51 | tormen | babilen: The problem actually went away when I was removing old pinning entries... you are absolutely right that this was a huge mess. Not anymore. Now I have 2 pins beside the defaults :) ... it's just keeping your room tidy is not always easy... thanks again for making me clean up my mess :)) |
| 14:11.15 | babilen | tormen: No, your pinning is insane. You should *not* use priorities >= 1001 by default, you shouldn't have to pin in most cases anyway. On top of that you are using several third-party repositories that I also don't support, so please find someone else who supports your setup. |
| 14:11.43 | jelly | pinning is insane by default! |
| 14:11.55 | petn-randall | wouldn't touch that setup with a 10-foot pole, either. |
| 14:12.00 | jumperswitch | Question: http://www.emdebian.org/trac/browser/current/host/trunk/emdebian-rootfs/trunk/device-table.pl?rev=7042 |
| 14:12.17 | jumperswitch | Question: So when no -f argument is set, a hardcoded, absolute path is used. |
| 14:12.44 | jumperswitch | So either the file which path is hardcoded in is present or -f argument is used. But there is no third option? |
| 14:12.55 | jumperswitch | e.g. looking for a file in the same directory as the script itself |
| 14:13.04 | babilen | jumperswitch: what? are you looking for #emdebian on irc.oftc.net ? |
| 14:13.13 | jumperswitch | babilen: I use this script for native debian, too |
| 14:13.35 | tormen | babilen: hmm, which 3rd party repo am I actually /using/ that you don't like ? |
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| 14:14.05 | jumperswitch | babilen: The point is that the script aparantly expect either an -f argument or a file at some absolute path. What I need is that the script looks for file next to it (in the same directory) |
| 14:14.13 | jumperswitch | babilen: So the only way would be to modify the script, right? |
| 14:14.30 | ixela | jumperswitch: or create a symlink at the path that points to the file you want |
| 14:14.36 | ixela | or ensure the file exists |
| 14:14.44 | ixela | or use the flag |
| 14:14.46 | tormen | babilen: cat /etc/apt/sources.list|grep -v "^#"|grep -v debian lists opera and "liveusb.info/multisystem/depot" both of which are not essential to me and could be removed. |
| 14:14.54 | babilen | jumperswitch: I have no idea as I've never used that script before ... #perl might be able to help with the scripting |
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| 14:15.40 | rneese | is there a way to run nore then 1 repo server on a system |
| 14:15.40 | ixela | jumperswitch: I'm not sure what you're asking for specifically. |
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| 14:16.20 | babilen | tormen: yes, please do that. Then make sure that you *do not* use any pin >=1001 (and no pinning would be best). Keep in mind that experimental sets ButAutomaticUpgrades: yes and "NotAutomatic: yes" too (cf. apt_preferences(5)) |
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| 14:16.47 | babilen | tormen: You also don't need the initial cat. "grep -v "^#" /etc/apt/sources.list" works just fine. |
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| 14:18.50 | tormen | babilen: thanks for the pin >= 1001, I'll change that immediately this was bad! |
| 14:19.34 | babilen | tormen: You shouldn't use pinning at all. Well, you shouldn't mix stable with *anything* but backports in the first place. |
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| 14:20.35 | babilen | tormen: So, remove all the pinning as they are pointless and lets take it from there. |
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| 14:21.03 | babilen | tormen: I assume, among other things, that you don't have anything installed from either testing or unstable. |
| 14:21.09 | cheri_ | hi I am getting mount.nfs: Protocol not supported error when I try to mount a nfs share created a wheezy unit from a lenny machine |
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| 14:21.14 | cheri_ | can anyone help reg this |
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| 14:21.44 | tormen | babilen: how can I quickly check what I actually have installed from lets say testing? |
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| 14:22.02 | jimmy__ | Hello I am trying to run a cronjob In the logs I actually see it pass but it does not get executed. The command I run is: 56 15 * * * root "python /scripts/move.py" |
| 14:22.04 | petn-randall | cheri_: lenny has reached its EOL quite a while ago, you should upgrade to squeeze, and maybe even to wheezy after that. |
| 14:22.27 | babilen | dpkg: You have no sources defined for either of them |
| 14:22.27 | dpkg | I resemble that remark! |
| 14:22.34 | babilen | rightfully so |
| 14:22.44 | babilen | tormen: You have no sources defined for either of them |
| 14:22.59 | babilen | dpkg: tell tormen -about which repo |
| 14:23.15 | babilen | tormen: Those one-liners assume that you *do* have the repo in question enabled though. |
| 14:23.17 | petn-randall | jimmy__: Which log says it executes and how do you know it doesn't? |
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| 14:23.34 | cheri_ | petn-randall: yeah but there are few custom packages that need to be ported to other distros. but I just don't understand why this is a problem |
| 14:24.08 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, /var/log/syslog sais this: Oct 23 15:56:01 BW12 /USR/SBIN/CRON[16792]: (root) CMD (root "python /scripts/move.py") |
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| 14:24.39 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, and I think it doens't get executed deu to the files in the script not being moved |
| 14:25.02 | petn-randall | jimmy__: The quotes are probably the problem. |
| 14:25.23 | petn-randall | jimmy__: Remove them and see if it runs properly. |
| 14:25.35 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, ok I ll try that now |
| 14:25.54 | Paterito | I want to mount a fs making a specified user as the owner so I do sudo mount -t ext3 -o nosuid,uid=999,gid=999 /dev/sda5 /media/data/ 999 is my uid and gid but it gives me an error why |
| 14:26.03 | petn-randall | cheri_: You probably don't have nfs-common installed on the lenny machine. |
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| 14:27.43 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, it ran fine but the python code didn't get executed |
| 14:27.55 | cheri_ | pten-randall: that is there. I don't have problem mounting nfs shares from another lenny machine. I am facing this problem when I mount nfs shares from a wheezy system |
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| 14:28.47 | petn-randall | cheri_: Ok, which is the client and which is the server? This isn't clear to me. |
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| 14:29.10 | cheri_ | lenny is the client and wheezy is the nfs server |
| 14:29.13 | petn-randall | cheri_: Also petn<tab>, typoed nicks don't highlight. |
| 14:29.37 | petn-randall | jimmy__: And running 'python /scripts/move.py |
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| 14:29.39 | *** mode/#debian [-qo *!*@119.154.224.113 eir] by eir |
| 14:29.41 | petn-randall | ' works fin? |
| 14:29.46 | jimmy__ | that works fine |
| 14:29.52 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, That works fine |
| 14:29.57 | cheri_ | petn-randall: got it |
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| 14:30.13 | petn-randall | jimmy__: Can you paste the contents to http://paste.debian.net? |
| 14:31.13 | petn-randall | cheri_: Then I guess that the nfs shipped with lenny is just too old. I can't remember which protocol version the NFS in lenny supported. |
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| 14:32.45 | gdos | anyone here use dhelp and or dwww? (online, browser-based help systems for viewing man pages) - according to dwww man page - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man8/dwww.8.html - there is supposed to be a 'apache2.conf' file in '/etc/dwww' and symbolically linked from /etc/apache*/conf.d/dwww but there is neither a file or a symbolically linked file in /etc/dwww NOR /etc/apache2/conf.d and /var/lib/dwww appears empty. HELP? |
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| 14:33.10 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, http://paste.debian.net/60851/ |
| 14:33.24 | cheri_ | http://paste.debian.net/plain/60852 |
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| 14:33.41 | cheri_ | petn-randall: here it is http://paste.debian.net/plain/60852 |
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| 14:34.33 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, is it possible it is just not knowing what to do with python? |
| 14:34.56 | petn-randall | jimmy__: Oh wait. You have to use the full path to python, as PATH isn't set in cron. |
| 14:35.20 | petn-randall | jimmy__: So either add a shebang to the script and call it directly, or use '/usr/bin/python'. |
| 14:35.59 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, shebang? That sound like somthing out some bad porn... |
| 14:36.04 | jimmy__ | I ll just use the full path |
| 14:36.14 | petn-randall | cheri_: lenny can't do NFSv4. |
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| 14:36.32 | petn-randall | jimmy__: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shebang_%28Unix%29 |
| 14:36.41 | cheri_ | petn-randall: I read that it should auto negotiate |
| 14:36.42 | petn-randall | jimmy__: Only remotely porn ;) |
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| 14:37.15 | petn-randall | cheri_: It does, and you have no NFSv3 mounts. Either way, lenny is from the stone-age, and hasn't been supported in years. |
| 14:37.45 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, hehe thanks ) |
| 14:38.06 | giuscri | I've just found out I'm using Java6 instead of Java7, or at least I've realised it looking at the output of `aptitude search "*jdk*"`. |
| 14:38.32 | cheri_ | petn-randall: so no solution for this except to upgrade. is it worth trying to install nfs-common from squeeze? will that solve this problem? |
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| 14:39.16 | giuscri | How can I upgrade to Java7 ...? Using `aptitude purge openjdk-6-*` seems quite dangerous |
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| 14:40.14 | maxyz | cheri_: If you want to just try, check archive.debian.org/backports.org lenny-backports |
| 14:40.39 | maxyz | cheri_: I think I've used nfsv4 in lenny |
| 14:40.40 | cheri_ | maxyz: ok will give it a try |
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| 14:41.31 | maxyz | Either way, you should really consider to upgrade your lenny s |
| 14:41.33 | jimmy__ | petn-randall, thanks mate. That did the trick |
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| 14:42.43 | cheri_ | maxyz: I just installed nfs server on one of my lenny machine and rpcinfo show 2, 3 , and 4 versions for nfs |
| 14:43.02 | Cityjohn | I'm having a problem with Debian, after updates i can no longer start the 686-pae version as opposed to the 486 one... anyone know if this is normal or fixable? someone told me it might have to do with a package or kernel, can I reinstall these? reverting does not seem to be an option. Everything is up to date. |
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| 14:43.53 | babilen | Cityjohn: Which processor do you run it on? And just to clarify: You can boot the 486 but not the 686-pae kernel? |
| 14:44.11 | Cityjohn | yes, I have a core duo |
| 14:44.49 | Cityjohn | This happened after updating and upgrading, and after a reboot |
| 14:45.23 | babilen | Upgrading from what to what? That processor should support pae just fine. What happens if you boot the 686-pae kernel? |
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| 14:45.34 | Cityjohn | it sits at blinking cursor |
| 14:45.51 | Cityjohn | upgrading from the Debian live cd to the latest distro updates |
| 14:46.33 | babilen | Cityjohn: You installed Debian from the Live CD and then ran "apt-get update ; apt-get dist-upgrade" ? Which kernel do you try to boot into? |
| 14:46.41 | maxyz | cheri_: Ah, no, nfsv4 uses mount -t nfs4 |
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| 14:47.56 | Cityjohn | Yes, I'm trying to boot into the 686-pae but it doesn't work, the 486 does. the kernel is 3.2.0-4-686-pae |
| 14:48.16 | jhutchins | Cityjohn: You might try running update-grub to rebuild the boot menu. |
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| 14:48.52 | wakejagr | I can't seem to find this info when I search on the website: can someone tell me what kernel version installs with squeeze? |
| 14:49.04 | jhutchins | ,kernels |
| 14:49.05 | judd | Available kernel versions are: experimental: 3.11-trunk-686-pae (3.11-1~exp1); sid: 3.11-1-686-pae (3.11.5-1); jessie: 3.10-3-686-pae (3.10.11-1); wheezy-backports: 3.10-0.bpo.3-686-pae (3.10.11-1~bpo70+1); wheezy: 3.2.0-4-686-pae (3.2.51-1); squeeze-backports: 3.2.0-0.bpo.4-686-pae (3.2.46-1+deb7u1~bpo60+1); squeeze: 2.6.32-5-686 (2.6.32-48squeeze4) |
| 14:49.26 | cheri_ | maxyz: when I use -t nfs4 I get the error no such device. Anyhow I got it mounted using the nfsvers 2. For some reason it doesn't like nfsvers 3 |
| 14:49.27 | Cityjohn | I have yes, doesn't seem to have worked, if I had more experience i'd just take a look in the grub config |
| 14:49.35 | cheri_ | maxyz: thanks |
| 14:49.48 | cheri_ | petn-randall: thanks |
| 14:49.50 | Cityjohn | hmmm my kernel is experimental... |
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| 14:50.42 | maxyz | cheri_: in your setup you should use: mount -t nfs4 192.168.24.63:/ /mnt/nas |
| 14:50.46 | jhutchins | Cityjohn: Why do you think it is experimental? |
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| 14:51.10 | Kagee | Is there a tool(kit) that can take input <documentation of library in format x> and output e.g. html and manpages for a library? x can be whatever the tool(kit) requires. |
| 14:51.15 | Cityjohn | because judd just posted it didn't he? 3.2.0-4-686-pae (3.2.51-1) |
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| 14:51.59 | gdos | anyone here use dhelp and or dwww? (online, browser-based help systems for viewing man pages) - according to dwww man page - http://manpages.ubuntu.com/manpages/hardy/man8/dwww.8.html - there is supposed to be a 'apache2.conf' file in '/etc/dwww' and symbolically linked from /etc/apache*/conf.d/dwww but there is neither a file or a symbolically linked file in /etc/dwww NOR /etc/apache2/conf.d and /var/lib/ |
| 14:52.04 | gdos | dwww appears empty. HELP? |
| 14:52.08 | cheri_ | maxyz: I tried the same it says no device |
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| 14:53.18 | maxyz | Kagee: docbook? |
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| 14:53.58 | jhutchins | Cityjohn: Read that more carefully. |
| 14:54.19 | jhutchins | Cityjohn: Experimental is 3.11-trunk-686-pae |
| 14:54.42 | Cityjohn | My bad |
| 14:54.45 | Cityjohn | excuse me |
| 14:54.55 | jhutchins | ,versions dwww |
| 14:54.56 | judd | Package: dwww on i386 -- squeeze: 1.11.3; wheezy: 1.11.8; jessie: 1.12.0; sid: 1.12.0 |
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| 14:55.23 | jhutchins | gdos: Where did you get the software and how was it packaged? |
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| 14:56.26 | gdos | jhutchins: through ubuntu repositories (*.deb) but nobody in the ubuntu channels seems to know how to fix. |
| 14:56.56 | gdos | i figured since Ubuntu is based on Debian this'd be the right place to ask. |
| 14:57.47 | jhutchins | !ubuntu |
| 14:57.47 | dpkg | Ubuntu is based on Debian, but it is not Debian. Only Debian is supported on #debian. Use #ubuntu on chat.freenode.net instead. Even if the channel happens to be less helpful, support for distributions other than Debian is offtopic on #debian. See also <based on debian> and <ubuntuirc>. |
| 14:58.37 | jhutchins | gdos: If we don't even have a similar package in Debian it's unlikely anybody herer can help you. This is another example of how the two distributions are different. |
| 14:59.01 | jelly | gdos: you may try the more generic ##linux channel |
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| 14:59.18 | gdos | jhutchins: i understand that. but i figured dhelp and or dwww are from debian anyways. |
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| 14:59.36 | abrotman | gdos: This is not hte correct place to ask. |
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| 15:00.09 | jelly | gdos: given the unknown amount of changes in derivative distros, it's hard to help unless you reproduce the issue on an actual Debian installation |
| 15:00.24 | gdos | Ok. |
| 15:00.31 | abrotman | Good luck! |
| 15:01.34 | gdos | thanks! |
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| 15:04.49 | tormen | babilen: "that you don't have anything installed from either testing or unstable." --> yes and yes, without any pins nothing changes. Cool I learned again stuff about pinning. Thanks! |
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| 15:06.30 | babilen | tormen: yay! Please read "man 5 apt_preferences" and keep in mind that "pinning = bad", "mixing releases = horrible", "priorities >= 1001 = not a good idea unless you know what you are doing", ... |
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| 15:09.56 | karlpinc | Why isn't --remove-destination the default for cp? |
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| 15:10.40 | tormen | babilen: yes thanks :)) |
| 15:11.31 | tormen | babilen: "apt-get policy" is really great! Thanks for everything!! |
| 15:11.34 | Kagee | karlpinc: because then you should probably use mv ? |
| 15:12.52 | karlpinc | Kagee: But then you can't keep the original in place. |
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| 15:20.23 | karlpinc | Without --remove-destination you get odd-ish behavior, like if the files are owned by someone else an you have permission to overwrite them and set their permission bits then when you cp your files over the old files the result is still owned by the old user. Which in turn leads to odd error messages about n ot being able to preserve times when using cp -p. I'm thinking there's some historical reason since my googling seems to |
| 15:20.24 | karlpinc | indicate that linux differs in this respect from other Unixs, although I could be wrong about this. |
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| 15:22.54 | Kagee | good point. I read your question as "--remove-source" and became confused :) |
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| 15:24.48 | karlpinc | Kagee: Glancing a the code though (coreutils), mv does always implicitly --remove-destination and so does not suffer from this problem. |
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| 15:26.02 | karlpinc | (could be wrong) |
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| 15:27.07 | jumperswitch | Hi! |
| 15:27.11 | jumperswitch | So it is about this: https://wiki.debian.org/DeviceTableScripting |
| 15:27.16 | jumperswitch | They write that that script can be used. |
| 15:27.26 | jumperswitch | So that script requires an argument -f |
| 15:27.31 | petn-randall | cheri_: You're welcome. squeeze/wheezy mixed NFS mounts work, it works here. So plan to upgrade that machine to squeeze, even more so if it somehow touches the internet or untrusted machines/people. |
| 15:27.46 | jumperswitch | I cannot pass it to it when using multistrap because the multistrap config allows to specify a configuration file, not a skript+argument |
| 15:27.53 | jumperswitch | So what did they think about this? |
| 15:27.57 | jumperswitch | It is absolutely useless... |
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| 15:31.09 | karlpinc | Humm, but even --remove-destination does not solve the "problem" for directories. I guess I could cp to a temp name and then mv the temp name over the original.... (Or maybe use rsync and avoid the issue....) |
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| 15:31.48 | jhutchins | karlpinc: rsync has more options for how it handles target file, you might find it appropriate. |
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| 15:32.16 | karlpinc | jhutchins: Yah. rsync has so many options I can never keep them straight. :-) |
| 15:33.49 | jumperswitch | device-table.pl sucks |
| 15:34.09 | jumperswitch | Why have they added an absolute hardcoded path? I can't use it with multistrap :( |
| 15:34.13 | karlpinc | jhutchins: (and I can't ever keep straght rsync's trailing slash rule either. There's probably a way to remember it, but I don't know what it is.) |
| 15:34.49 | jumperswitch | A nice script ruined by that damn hardcoded path. |
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| 15:35.52 | rgr | crikey. apache2 config has changed hugely in the latest testing update. |
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| 15:38.42 | babilen | jumperswitch: Can't you change it to your liking? |
| 15:39.25 | babilen | jumperswitch: And I still think that you want #emdebian rather than #debian |
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| 15:40.46 | stoffLer | hi |
| 15:41.16 | jumperswitch | babilen: I don't want to change it. But I guess I will have to |
| 15:41.28 | jumperswitch | babilen: Because there could be newer versions later, I will have to rechange them, too |
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| 15:41.49 | babilen | .oO( file a bug and include the patch ? ) |
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| 15:45.14 | karlpinc | jhutchins: FWIW I can't get rsync to "work" either, at least not with respect to copied directories. |
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| 15:59.56 | fruitFly | does making a seperate home partition make it easier to upgrade in the future by just installing to the root partition? |
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| 16:00.14 | jhutchins | fruitFly: Not really. |
| 16:00.25 | fruitFly | jhutchins: why? |
| 16:00.31 | mumpitze1 | debian is not like windows |
| 16:00.36 | karlpinc | fruitFly: Upgrades work. |
| 16:00.56 | jhutchins | fruitFly: upgrades to a new release look very much like ordinary software updates. |
| 16:00.59 | mumpitze1 | and you can easily use the debian installer to delete everything but your home/ or even move it aside and reinstall, if you want to |
| 16:01.07 | vizzy | ...but it tries to be ;) |
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| 16:01.58 | jhutchins | fruitFly: A seperate /home can make it easier to do a new install or switch distros, but that can cause problems because of config files in your $HOME. |
| 16:03.10 | jhutchins | fruitFly: backups are much more useful, and until you know where your data is gioing to end up partitioning is usually a bad idea. |
| 16:03.13 | karlpinc | fruitFly: Separate partitions provide one way to manage your disk usage, but then you need to manage your disk usage. You usually need a reason to make a separate partition. So, good question. |
| 16:03.16 | jhutchins | fruitFly: just swap and / |
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| 16:03.43 | karlpinc | jhutchins: I'm always paranoid and do /boot too. |
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| 16:04.25 | fruitFly | can any app I get on ubuntu be gotten on debian? |
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| 16:04.36 | jhutchins | karlpinc: There were some reasons I thought that was a good idea, but I've seen too many people and programs mess up because /boot wasn't mounted. These days most people leave it mounted all the time, so it's kinda pointless. |
| 16:05.02 | jhutchins | fruitFly: Not necesssarily, they are DIFFERENT distributions that are based on the same setup. |
| 16:05.03 | karlpinc | fruitFly: Hard to say. Debian does appear to have more programs than any other distro I can think of. |
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| 16:05.40 | jhutchins | In fact we had one just 45 minutes ago, dwww is in Ubuntu but not Debian. |
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| 16:05.49 | karlpinc | jhutchins: It's not the mounting that's the issue. It's that I'm never sure what sort of box, with what sort of bios, the disk might get moved into someday. |
| 16:06.38 | jhutchins | Ubuntu also tends to have a lot of third-party packagers doing their own repositories, whereas with Debian most packages are integrated into the official repos or aren't packaged for Debian. |
| 16:07.24 | jumperswitch | During Debian installation (normal setup) the dev nodes are created, what program / tool is responsible for that, notably for the creation of the virtual devs (random / urandom / proc and friends)? |
| 16:07.41 | jumperswitch | Because someone has to create them, a package for this doesn't exist obviously. |
| 16:07.52 | mumpitze1 | the installer does |
| 16:08.16 | mumpitze1 | jumperswitch: but you probably ask about "man MAKEDEV" |
| 16:08.36 | jhutchins | jumperswitch: A lot of the /dev entries are created dynamically by udev these days, but I think mkdev is still valid. |
| 16:08.39 | karlpinc | mumpitze1: I thought the kernel did that stuff these days, and then udev splatters symlinks around. |
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| 16:09.35 | mumpitze1 | the kernel creating files on the filesystem? |
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| 16:10.05 | karlpinc | mumpitze1: Maybe in /sys. I forget. One of those virual places. |
| 16:10.24 | mumpitze1 | <PROTECTED> |
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| 16:14.00 | stoffLer | hi guys. I have some trouble with installing debian on a intel based raid |
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| 16:15.43 | popolon | hi |
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| 16:15.55 | popolon | is there an atlernative usbid database ? |
| 16:16.08 | popolon | the db interface doesn't work now |
| 16:16.13 | popolon | and the contact mail is invalid |
| 16:16.24 | popolon | or is someone know where to find it's mail ??? |
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| 16:16.44 | popolon | adding devices in the db, left the name of the device blank |
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| 16:20.08 | popolon | oh, didn't see another email adress on the site |
| 16:20.13 | popolon | nice will try it |
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| 16:29.40 | jubo2 | Shukran, shukran FLOSS devels |
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| 16:30.03 | jubo2 | I bought an SSD migration kit and now I'm wondering if to open it |
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| 16:30.53 | jubo2 | It carries an advisory that the so called "disk cloning" software supports Win XP and Win7 and Vista |
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| 16:31.31 | jubo2 | but this shouldn't be a problem.. I mean there should be ample tools to make and move disk images around.. |
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| 16:32.07 | jubo2 | with gparted and uhh.. tools.. |
| 16:32.19 | ScottE | jubo2: there are tools to do that, but frankly it's faster and less painful to backup, install the new drive, reinstall debian from scratch, and restore /home and a few configurations |
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| 16:32.50 | ScottE | That also prepares you for the inevitable for when you have a disk failure |
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| 16:34.51 | jubo2 | How much do I need for Linux |
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| 16:35.06 | jubo2 | I'm thinking 15GB + 5 GB swap |
| 16:35.20 | mumpitze1 | what do you need 5GB swap for? |
| 16:35.41 | mumpitze1 | and for a debian system with not a whole lot of data, 15GB looks ok. easily doable |
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| 16:36.29 | tosted | Hello everybody, Here trying something about upgrade from linux debian. IS there some tool to do that??? |
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| 16:36.59 | mumpitze1 | tosted: what debian version are you running? and what do you want to upgrade to? |
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| 16:39.12 | tosted | mumpitze1, Hi sir... Debian squeeze-krnl 3.200 bpo 4 amd64 |
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| 16:39.36 | mumpitze1 | no need to "sir" anyone on irc. and what do you want to upgrade to? |
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| 16:40.35 | tosted | sorry about that, mumpitze1 ...Now LG l5 E615F and L9 P768. |
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| 16:41.02 | Paterito | I have a folder I created in /media called data/ I assigned full rights to all users by doing chmod 757 -R to it howerver now I want it to be for root only and I can't the bit w for users won't stick out help me |
| 16:41.21 | mumpitze1 | tosted: I assume you are telling us about your hardware. why would you do this? please start again and clearly explain what your problem is |
| 16:41.51 | mumpitze1 | Paterito: set it to 700 then? |
| 16:42.03 | mumpitze1 | tho you shouldn't set all the files to be executable |
| 16:42.17 | tosted | android tool adb are not available on squeeze? mumpitze1 |
| 16:42.36 | mumpitze1 | no. it's closed source and only available from google |
| 16:43.02 | mumpitze1 | it's part of the android SDK |
| 16:43.11 | Paterito | mumpitze1: how do u come up with those numbers? by the way that removes read access to other users I want read for them |
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| 16:43.14 | tosted | mumpitze1, i dont wanna use w i n d o w s to flash my pdas! :P |
| 16:43.16 | Paterito | mumpitze1: do u know another number |
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| 16:43.38 | mumpitze1 | Paterito: then set it to 755. gives read access to everyone, write access to owner only |
| 16:43.43 | mumpitze1 | !tell Paterito about permissions |
| 16:43.50 | jubo2 | ScottE: so where to look for these tools that can move Ext 4 partitions from disk-to-disk ? |
| 16:43.59 | *** join/#debian Joschii (~joschii@89.204.135.115) |
| 16:44.15 | mumpitze1 | tosted: then don't. but so far I haven't seen you stating any debian related problem |
| 16:44.33 | mumpitze1 | jubo2: gparted should be ablt to do it. heck, cp will too |
| 16:44.34 | tosted | debian could not recognize my pda. |
| 16:44.40 | mumpitze1 | jubo2: a partition is just another file |
| 16:45.03 | *** join/#debian __jm1 (~Thunderbi@env-auth-ev2-129-97-22-83.dynamic.uwaterloo.ca) |
| 16:45.10 | mumpitze1 | !tell tosted about mtp |
| 16:45.24 | *** join/#debian \\Mr_C\\ (mrc@75-137-252-8.dhcp.mntv.al.charter.com) |
| 16:45.30 | ScottE | jubo2: Since I just do backup, reinstall, restore I don't know the actual tools, just that they do exist. |
| 16:46.14 | jhutchins | I just built an xfce wheezy system and it uses 3.4 GB with one user's data.. |
| 16:46.18 | jubo2 | mumpitze1: thanks for the info. now I'd need to find where in Win7 one can shrink disks, I've seen it, it exists!! |
| 16:46.18 | ScottE | I have used gparted (there's a live cd) |
| 16:46.38 | mumpitze1 | jubo2: diskmgmt.msc run it |
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| 16:46.53 | mumpitze1 | jhutchins: less recommends? |
| 16:46.54 | jhutchins | jubo2: For a unified suite of tools to move drive images around see clonezilla |
| 16:46.55 | ScottE | jubo2: and I think I used clonezilla once |
| 16:47.11 | tosted | mumpitze1, with mtp can i flash them? |
| 16:47.14 | jhutchins | rsync would also work. |
| 16:47.27 | jordilopezamat | dear #debian community |
| 16:47.36 | jubo2 | jhutchins: clonezilla.. does that come in Linux and/or Windows version..? |
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| 16:48.06 | jhutchins | jubo2: It is a linux-based system, usually on a live CD that can clone/backup disks and partitions regardless of the OS. |
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| 16:48.34 | jubo2 | jhutchins: would it be in the newest Ubuntu.. I have that on a multiboot stick ? |
| 16:48.39 | jordilopezamat | newbie here... my (regular) user session is being reseted systematically in my Wheezy (thus, back to login screen) ... any hints ? which log should i look into ? thanks for your attention |
| 16:48.44 | tosted | is there any channel to help me with upgrade android from linux.?? |
| 16:48.54 | jhutchins | jubo2: It is not "in" any distribution, it is essentially a stand-alone distribution/live CD. |
| 16:49.23 | jhutchins | jubo2: It is a collection of tools that are available in most distributions, but they are assembled in a simple menu-driven system designed to copy disks. |
| 16:49.42 | jordilopezamat | (symptons are ... CPU usage goes around 50% , not more... but memory rockets to 92 % ) |
| 16:49.48 | ScottE | jordilopezamat: take a look at .xsession-errors for the user you are logging in as, for starters |
| 16:49.57 | *** join/#debian init33 (~diskman@host-211-240-9-69.midco.net) |
| 16:49.59 | jhutchins | jubo2: Once you have some experience with it, you can transfer that knowledge to using the tools directly. |
| 16:50.09 | init33 | Hello! |
| 16:50.19 | jhutchins | jubo2: You need to boot to some other system to copy an OS disk anyway, so just using the clonezilla CD is easy. |
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| 16:50.55 | jordilopezamat | thanks ScottE , i'm suspicious about flashplugin-nonfree ... although , i want to make sure before any change to be applied... |
| 16:51.21 | jhutchins | jordilopezamat: It would make a lot of difference what programs you were running at the time. |
| 16:51.40 | jhutchins | tosted: There is #anderiod on freenode. |
| 16:51.44 | ScottE | jordilopezamat: flash plugin should not prevent you from starting your desktop environment |
| 16:52.16 | mumpitze1 | tosted: no. mtp is something totally different. to flash you need to follow whatever tutorial you use. not a thing debian can help you with. as I wrote before: for adb, you will need to get the android sdk from google |
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| 16:53.35 | jordilopezamat | jhutchins ... regular desktop user , Iceweasel, VLC ... (and some light LAMP web dev ) |
| 16:53.55 | jordilopezamat | nothing really "heavy" , or particular ... |
| 16:54.20 | tosted | thanks mumpitze1 and jhutchins ... i ll google that. |
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| 16:55.51 | jordilopezamat | ScotteE , the thing is that , what i perceive is huge amount of RAM memory consumption (mainly by Iceweasel ... Flashplugin driven ? ) |
| 16:56.10 | bbtech_ | Anyone know what the redirection does with a command like this: command 2>&1 > file.txt |
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| 16:56.30 | bbtech_ | It appears that the 2>&1 needs to be after the redirection to the file |
| 16:56.40 | jordilopezamat | and when i notice, and able to 'Kill' the Flashplugin related running process... the sytems goes more stable |
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| 17:00.14 | ExeciN | Can I install Debian on a USB flash drive? |
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| 17:01.44 | bbtech_ | It appears the 2>&1 does nothing in the following command (because it is in the incorrect order): { echo 'hi'; echo 'world' 1>&2; } 2>&1 > test.txt |
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| 17:04.07 | jubo2 | booting to pendrive ubuntu to see if there is Clonezilla there |
| 17:05.39 | Zzeiss | Problem with freeCAD - it's available for Sid, and available for Squeeze. But not for Wheezy. Is there a workaround? What should I do? |
| 17:05.41 | jubo2 | no clonezilla on ubuntu |
| 17:05.54 | *** join/#debian cbt (~cbt@46.254.100.38) |
| 17:06.06 | jubo2 | I'm doing the wrong step! |
| 17:06.22 | jubo2 | I need to use gparted to resize my existing partition so that it'll fit |
| 17:07.01 | jordilopezamat | jhutchins ... i followed your suggestion, and got https://pad.riseup.net/p/YnkCYXVQMX74 xsessions.errors log |
| 17:07.20 | *** join/#debian babilen (~babilen@unaffiliated/babilen) |
| 17:07.58 | jordilopezamat | just before crashing ... my user session, log says "Could not check applicable rules for about:blankuri.host is explosive!(about:newtab)" :-/ |
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| 17:09.03 | jordilopezamat | any hints on way could my Wheezy be resetting my user session ( on "simple activity" conditions... ) ? thanks beforehand ! |
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| 17:09.34 | jubo2 | how do I resize an Ext4 partition.. gparted..? |
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| 17:12.28 | bullgard4 | jubo2: Yes, GParted on a Live CD is a good solution. |
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| 17:12.56 | mtn | jordilopezamat: take a look at this: http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=2171372 |
| 17:12.57 | jubo2 | I do that. |
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| 17:16.24 | jordilopezamat | thanks mtn , i'll do ! |
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| 17:19.16 | chrisoprase | How do I get the audio bell working on debian? It used to work but it stopped a week ago, no idea why |
| 17:19.21 | jordilopezamat | mtn ... what you mention seems to be related to Firefox & UFW ... could it be that it also leads to X session crash ? |
| 17:19.43 | chrisoprase | It's important because I'm always missing when people hilight me in ir |
| 17:19.47 | chrisoprase | *irc |
| 17:20.00 | mtn | jordilopezamat: I don't know, but if find the crash always follows such a message, I would think there could be a connection. |
| 17:20.05 | mtn | if you find |
| 17:20.20 | jordilopezamat | ok |
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| 17:22.09 | mumpitze1 | !bell |
| 17:22.09 | dpkg | To disable the bell: "xset b off" in X, "setterm -blength 0" in console. For some reason, bash beeps excessively when in emacs (default) mode; "set -o vi" puts it in vi editing mode, which doesn't beep on partial completions. In konsole, Settings->Bell->Visible Bell. See also <pcspkr>, <shell beep>, <metacity bell bug>. |
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| 17:27.09 | chrisoprase | !shell beep |
| 17:27.09 | dpkg | shell beep is, like, man inputrc ; man readline (i.e. edit ~/.inputrc and set bell-style none) - also man setterm. |
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| 17:29.51 | chrisoprase | mumpitze1: The problem still persists both in X and in the term |
| 17:29.58 | mumpitze1 | !tell chrisoprase about selftell |
| 17:30.01 | *** mode/#debian [+l 1455] by debhelper |
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| 17:30.08 | chrisoprase | been /34 |
| 17:30.13 | mumpitze1 | also make sure the module pcspkr is loaded |
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| 17:33.35 | AlexRussia | hello! |
| 17:33.37 | AlexRussia | Help me! |
| 17:33.49 | AlexRussia | I install debian 7.2, kde-version |
| 17:33.52 | AlexRussia | (cd) |
| 17:33.57 | *** join/#debian [A3G1S] (~A3G1S]@182.68.203.140) |
| 17:34.12 | *** join/#debian wcfields (~wcfields@64-31-96-210.static-ip.telepacific.net) |
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| 17:35.07 | *** join/#debian jeep (~jeep@ip-64-134-171-98.public.wayport.net) |
| 17:35.16 | AlexRussia | And I have not configured an Internet connection. |
| 17:35.27 | *** join/#debian ogny (~orkun@78.186.152.96) |
| 17:35.32 | AlexRussia | And at me not configured an Internet connection. |
| 17:35.45 | chrisoprase | mumpitze1: /14 |
| 17:35.50 | chrisoprase | sorry |
| 17:36.17 | mumpitze1 | AlexRussia: how do you connect to the internet? wlan or ethernet? |
| 17:36.18 | *** join/#debian marlinc (~marlinc@ip565fa73c.direct-adsl.nl) |
| 17:36.21 | AlexRussia | it screenshots my setting in Fedora 20 Alpha, here internet worked |
| 17:36.23 | AlexRussia | http://yadi.sk/d/qk1BbwQMBUEFo |
| 17:36.41 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: ethernet for local network |
| 17:36.52 | AlexRussia | and PPPoE(dsl) for internet |
| 17:36.58 | AlexRussia | PPPoE use ethernet |
| 17:37.04 | AlexRussia | for connection |
| 17:37.27 | *** join/#debian Randominator (~TheVoid@aftr-37-24-155-255.unity-media.net) |
| 17:37.28 | *** part/#debian Javid (~bacon@168-103-51-3.eugn.qwest.net) |
| 17:37.31 | mumpitze1 | then check if you can reach your DSL modem |
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| 17:37.48 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: im on dsl modem now, worked in fedora. |
| 17:37.49 | mumpitze1 | AlexRussia: and tell us the output of "lspci -nn |grep -i net" |
| 17:37.56 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: hmm |
| 17:38.04 | *** join/#debian MaddinXx (~racksteri@zux221-207-053.adsl.green.ch) |
| 17:38.06 | *** part/#debian g_r_eek (~g_r_eek@176.92.244.113) |
| 17:38.08 | AlexRussia | tme reboot or how to use chroot for it |
| 17:38.11 | AlexRussia | ? |
| 17:38.15 | AlexRussia | me* |
| 17:38.24 | *** join/#debian {her|bert} (~herbert@xdsl-87-78-142-59.netcologne.de) |
| 17:38.32 | AlexRussia | <mumpitze1> AlexRussia: and tell us the output of "lspci -nn |grep -i net" |
| 17:38.33 | mumpitze1 | are you in fedora right now? this command works in fedora too |
| 17:38.40 | mumpitze1 | stop pressing enter so much |
| 17:38.41 | mumpitze1 | !enter |
| 17:38.42 | dpkg | The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel. |
| 17:39.00 | AlexRussia | sry, flood here |
| 17:39.08 | AlexRussia | 01:00.0 Network controller [0280]: Intel Corporation Centrino Wireless-N 130 [8086:0896] (rev 34) |
| 17:39.10 | AlexRussia | 02:00.0 Ethernet controller [0200]: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168/8411 PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet Controller [10ec:8168] (rev 06) |
| 17:39.18 | AlexRussia | tooops |
| 17:39.25 | AlexRussia | im now read you, mumpitze1 |
| 17:39.27 | AlexRussia | =) |
| 17:40.21 | AlexRussia | !enter |
| 17:40.21 | dpkg | The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel. |
| 17:40.22 | AlexRussia | <mumpitze1> are you in fedora right now? this command works in fedora too |
| 17:40.24 | AlexRussia | [21:38] <mumpitze1> stop pressing enter so much |
| 17:40.25 | AlexRussia | [21:38] <mumpitze1> !enter |
| 17:40.27 | AlexRussia | [21:38] <dpkg> The enter key is not a substitute for punctuation. Hitting enter unnecessarily makes it difficult to follow what you are saying. Consider using ',', '. ', ';', '...', '---', or ':' instead. If you hit enter too often, you will be autokicked by debhelper for flooding the channel. |
| 17:40.28 | AlexRussia | hmmm |
| 17:40.31 | AlexRussia | how to use !enter? |
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| 17:40.56 | mumpitze1 | you misuse the enter key on your keyboard. either you stop doing that or I stop helping you |
| 17:41.04 | chrisoprase | mumpitze1: thanks, beeps working locally, but still can't hear them with ssh |
| 17:41.10 | mumpitze1 | and download this package and install it with dpkg -i: http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/firmware-realtek |
| 17:41.19 | AlexRussia | ok |
| 17:41.32 | mumpitze1 | chrisoprase: you need to configure your ssh client then |
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| 17:42.40 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: downloaded, me returned later, okay? |
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| 17:42.57 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: p.s. ethernet connection worket, not worked dsl |
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| 17:43.05 | AlexRussia | worked* |
| 17:43.31 | AlexRussia | im exit |
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| 17:43.51 | jubo2 | hmm... there is isolinux on the installation CD that came with the "migrate-to-SSD"-kit .. this raises my hopes that it will also transfer the Ext4 partitions |
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| 17:49.47 | jubo2 | it didn't refuse to move the Ext4's |
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| 17:50.26 | jubo2 | pops to the shoppe |
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| 17:54.21 | bbtech_ | oh, gotomeeting, your killing me! |
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| 17:54.34 | AlexRussia | im here =( |
| 17:54.38 | AlexRussia | not worked it |
| 17:54.40 | AlexRussia | =( |
| 17:54.49 | AlexRussia | yes, im reboot system |
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| 17:55.50 | AlexRussia | HEEEY! |
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| 17:57.39 | AlexRussia | ehh |
| 17:58.05 | AlexRussia | mumpitze1: hey |
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| 18:00.27 | ten1 | I upgraded my laptop to wheezy lately, and it seems that new php extensions (php5-redis, php5-xdebug) are not being loaded. I've checked the symlinks referenced in php --ini, they're all pointed to the same place, and all have the same permissions. The contents of the files are correct (being only two lines, this is easy to verify). Previously installed extensions continue to function, but reinstalled, newly installed, or any ini file I define are not load |
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| 18:11.51 | jhutchins | ten1: Are these PHP modules or Apache modules? |
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| 18:12.40 | ten1 | jhutchins: php, I don't use apache much |
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| 18:13.37 | somiaj | I don't see any debian package php5-redis. Are you or were you using unoffical debian repos (such as dotdeb)? |
| 18:15.02 | ten1 | somiaj: hmm, that appears to be the case |
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| 18:17.13 | ten1 | it probably even seemed like a good idea at the time |
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| 18:20.51 | somiaj | sounds like there is your issue. (: |
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| 18:39.48 | haole | why is mencoder not available on debian? |
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| 18:40.49 | mtn | haole: maybe you need to enable non-free and contrib in your sources |
| 18:42.14 | haole | mtn: forgot about this detail :) |
| 18:42.15 | haole | thanks |
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| 18:42.42 | mtn | haole: welcome |
| 18:42.46 | somiaj | haole: what version of debian? mencoder is in main I thoguht |
| 18:43.05 | K|NgGh0sT | So I recently upgraded from Wheezy to Jessie and I was unaware due to my poor assumptions that fglrx would work. It's clearly removed in testing due to xorg being updated so I am wonder what driver and I use instead? |
| 18:43.09 | haole | somiaj: Debian testing and mencoder won't show with apt-file |
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| 18:43.16 | somiaj | mtn: mencoder is in main |
| 18:43.20 | somiaj | ,v mencoder |
| 18:43.21 | judd | Package: mencoder on i386 -- squeeze: 2:1.0~rc3++final.dfsg1-1; squeeze-multimedia: 2:1.0~rc3++svn20100804-0.2squeeze1; squeeze-backports: 2:1.0~rc4.dfsg1+svn34540-1~bpo60+1; sid: 2:1.0~rc4.dfsg1+svn34540-1+b2; wheezy: 2:1.0~rc4.dfsg1+svn34540-1+b2; wheezy-multimedia: 3:1.1.1-dmo4.wheezy1; jessie-multimedia: 3:1.1.1-dmo6; sid-multimedia: 3:1.1.1-dmo6 |
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| 18:43.54 | haole | doesn't appear on my system |
| 18:43.55 | mtn | somiaj: thanks, missed that |
| 18:43.59 | somiaj | hmm, I am unsure what jessie-multimedia and sid-multimedia are |
| 18:44.14 | somiaj | wonder if they are spliting things apart for the next release |
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| 18:45.07 | somiaj | haole: http://packages.qa.debian.org/m/mplayer.html |
| 18:45.12 | somiaj | haole: the package was removed from testing |
| 18:45.56 | somiaj | wish I knew how to read those lnks better so I could see why it was removed, but it is no longer in testing |
| 18:46.03 | somiaj | if you are running jessie you will have to get the packages from sid. |
| 18:46.13 | haole | somiaj: thanks... guess I'll compile from source |
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| 18:46.24 | haole | I hope it's not painful |
| 18:46.26 | haole | :) |
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| 18:46.55 | K|NgGh0sT | I also am trying to purge fglrx and I get this issue... dpkg: error processing fglrx-driver (--remove): |
| 18:46.55 | K|NgGh0sT | <PROTECTED> |
| 18:46.55 | K|NgGh0sT | Errors were encountered while processing: |
| 18:46.55 | K|NgGh0sT | <PROTECTED> |
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| 18:47.01 | K|NgGh0sT | ah damnit didnt mean to spam that |
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| 18:48.07 | somiaj | haole: right now installing it fomr sid will be no issues |
| 18:48.25 | somiaj | haole: if you just want the binary package. As jessie freezes and gets close to stable it may be an issue, but that won't be for a while |
| 18:48.36 | haole | good call |
| 18:48.37 | haole | thx |
| 18:49.00 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: can you identify what the error is? What command are you using to remove the package, also what version of debian are you running? |
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| 18:51.31 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, just updated to jessie... http://pastebin.com/J61ANv3s |
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| 18:52.33 | jubo2 | classic.. |
| 18:52.35 | somiaj | you are still running wheezy's kernel. Why are you trying to remove this package? |
| 18:53.00 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: it could be a bug in the package, you are running testing. I can tell you how to get the package to remove. It may not be a clean remove but it will remove it |
| 18:53.42 | jubo2 | the "disk cloning" tool copied all partititions and complained no probs.. switched in the new disk to be sd0 and now I get up to the point that it says "Grub loading." and then the machine reboots |
| 18:54.04 | somiaj | !tell jubo2 about fixmbr |
| 18:54.04 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, as long as dpkg lets me keep using aptitude I don't really care :) |
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| 18:54.45 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: goto /var/lib/dpkg/info/packagename.postrm |
| 18:54.53 | jhutchins | k| |
| 18:55.02 | jhutchins | K|NgGh0sT: aptitude -f install ? |
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| 18:55.49 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: that is the post rm script. edit that file and put 'exit 0' as the top line. That will exit the script and let the package be removed. Of course this will mean the script will not do what it is supose to do and there could be artificats but the package is removed. Also listen to jhutchins. Do you plan on using fglrx, you may want to try to figure out why the sciprt errors out over just removing hte package |
| 18:55.58 | somiaj | you can also look at the postrm script and see if you can spot the bug |
| 18:56.07 | stoffLer | hi. I'm still learning linux. done a lot at the moment - xen-hypervisor icinga/nagios lots of web based things Time Machine bkp server etc. are there more interesting things to do? just tipps and so on? |
| 18:56.31 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, well apparently fglrx doesnt work in testing from what I've seen |
| 18:57.09 | haole | stoffLer: I'd go for thin clients - install linux automatically on your LAN for computers that will just be plugged in |
| 18:57.10 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: why are you running testing? It seems you would be better suited to running a stable version where these things should not happen? |
| 18:57.14 | haole | take a look at the FAI project |
| 18:57.19 | haole | and maybe tinyCore as well |
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| 18:57.36 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, because I was having issues with a lot of applications not being able to be updated |
| 18:57.53 | stoffLer | sounds cool - like wds for windows? |
| 18:58.08 | haole | stoffLer: don't know, but it's way cool :) |
| 18:58.14 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, I have run testing in the past I just didnt expect flgrx to not be there |
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| 18:58.18 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: yes debian wheezy is frozen. But what issues did you have, the fact that you didn't have the newest version or was there an actual feature you needed. |
| 18:58.48 | stoffLer | haole: is it using pie boot? |
| 18:58.50 | somiaj | backports are actually prefered and I am willing to bet most of the features you need are in wheezy. (: |
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| 18:58.58 | haole | stoffLer: pxe? yes |
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| 18:59.45 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, there were features I needed in the newest versions |
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| 19:01.11 | jubo2 | what is the default su password for Debian 7.2 Live CD ? |
| 19:01.27 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: of what? Again I am just trying to point out that in the cases you need you a few backports should be fine |
| 19:01.29 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/pkgreport.cgi?pkg=fglrx-driver;dist=unstable |
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| 19:01.47 | somiaj | seems there is an xorg abi issue (this is common in testing/unstable) with both nvidia and ati non-free drivers |
| 19:01.58 | somiaj | jubo2: the default user it boots you into has full sudo privlages |
| 19:02.01 | jubo2 | ah.. got it with 'sudo su' |
| 19:02.05 | somiaj | jubo2: so run 'sudo su - ' |
| 19:02.16 | somiaj | jubo2: or 'sudo passwd root' and set the password you want |
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| 19:02.53 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, biggest issue was vlc, I tried using their backport directions and couldnt get the newest version |
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| 19:04.12 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: well seems there are some issues with fglrx right now, check those bug reports, there might be solutions there |
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| 19:06.09 | jubo2 | somiaj: I get error with the 1st mount command ( trying to follow the instructions given by dpkg ) |
| 19:06.21 | jubo2 | dmesg says.. |
| 19:06.24 | Hundred | hmm |
| 19:06.51 | jubo2 | "error: can't find an ext2 filesystem on dev sda" |
| 19:06.52 | somiaj | jubo2: are you using an ext4 file system and you used the -t ext2 option? adjust it |
| 19:07.09 | somiaj | jubo2: also you want to mount the actual partition so it should be like /dev/sda1 for example |
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| 19:07.18 | somiaj | that is more likely the issue |
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| 19:07.28 | jubo2 | ahaa.. |
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| 19:09.25 | jubo2 | somiaj: ok.. 'mount -t ext4 /dev/sda5' run without errors |
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| 19:09.51 | jubo2 | then I need to adjust and run all those other mount commands ass well somiaj ? |
| 19:09.52 | somiaj | jubo2: umm that comand shouldn't have worked, you did specify a mount point? |
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| 19:10.01 | jubo2 | yeah '/' |
| 19:10.15 | somiaj | jubo2: do not do that |
| 19:10.22 | jubo2 | oh..? |
| 19:10.31 | somiaj | jubo2: you are on a live cd, / is already mounted as something else, you just mounted your file system over root, this could be bad |
| 19:10.48 | somiaj | jubo2: the instructions said to mount it somewhere such as /mnt or /target |
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| 19:11.05 | somiaj | jubo2: i.e. 'mount -t ext4 /dev/sda5 /mnt' |
| 19:11.37 | jubo2 | somiaj: mount point /target does not exist |
| 19:11.48 | somiaj | jubo2: mkdir /target, or use /mnt |
| 19:12.00 | jubo2 | ok.. that run |
| 19:12.02 | jubo2 | then what ? |
| 19:12.05 | somiaj | jubo2: but if you already mounted it as /, you may want to reboot the live system and start over |
| 19:12.13 | jubo2 | ok. I do that |
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| 19:19.05 | jubo2 | somiaj: ok.. now modified and run the other commands successfully but I'm unsure about the last line |
| 19:19.07 | jubo2 | "update-grub && grub-install /dev/whatever" |
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| 19:19.36 | jubo2 | I'm not sure what I should put in /dev/whatever ( the same as in start /dev/mnt ?? ) |
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| 19:19.52 | somiaj | jubo2: you need to put the mbr of the disk you want to boot off of |
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| 19:20.05 | somiaj | jubo2: so if it was /dev/sda5 (The partition) you want to boot off of /dev/sda -- so use that |
| 19:20.12 | somiaj | i.e. you need to reinstall grub into the mbr |
| 19:21.00 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, so I am guessing to go back to wheezy I have to reinstall? |
| 19:21.02 | jubo2 | the MBR was probably that 1GB sized partition in the start of the disk |
| 19:21.23 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, because I see no solution to ATI support in Jessie |
| 19:21.28 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: yes, again if you want to run jessie go for it. |
| 19:21.34 | jubo2 | somiaj: How do I find out where the MBR is located ? |
| 19:21.37 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: do you not like the free radeon drivers? |
| 19:21.53 | somiaj | jubo2: the mbr is on the main disk, /dev/sda while /dev/sda5 is the 5th partition |
| 19:22.03 | somiaj | jubo2: most likely it is /dev/sda in your case |
| 19:22.05 | jubo2 | ok. |
| 19:22.26 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, the radeon drivers overheat my card |
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| 19:22.48 | mumpitze1 | K|NgGh0sT: use 3.11? |
| 19:23.10 | somiaj | mumpitze1: the bug seems to be an xorg abi bug not a kernel bug |
| 19:23.34 | somiaj | http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=725817 |
| 19:23.36 | K|NgGh0sT | ati doesnt like that xorg has updated :) |
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| 19:23.58 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: snapshot.debian.org has older packages for jessie. If you really want to use jessie you can download older xorg versions while you wait for the ati fix |
| 19:24.29 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, I'll give it a go. Thank you |
| 19:24.47 | somiaj | note xorg is split into lots of packages, it will be a pain to manually download them all and install |
| 19:25.32 | somiaj | K|NgGh0sT: this is why we suggest stable so much, things like this are actually more common than not in testing and just take time to fix. I personally prefer sid over jessie because it gets fixes faster. |
| 19:25.44 | somiaj | (though it also has a higher chance of major breaks) |
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| 19:26.14 | K|NgGh0sT | yeah, I moved from testing to sid before and I wanted just to be stable but since wheezy has been frozen for a while it's getting harder and harder to stay there |
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| 19:26.40 | K|NgGh0sT | I can normally find solutions to everything but this is a major one |
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| 19:26.58 | mumpitze1 | K|NgGh0sT: "ati" doesn't exist, and the radeon driver is actually part of xorg |
| 19:27.25 | somiaj | yea I don't use vlc myself, so unsure on the process to backport it. Seems like an odd thing to need a newer feature to me. But I guess I am simple when it comes ot multimedia. Does it play. good |
| 19:27.44 | jubo2 | somiaj: yeah.. now grub works and both Linux and Windows are bootable |
| 19:27.53 | jubo2 | somiaj: big thanks for your help! |
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| 19:28.44 | K|NgGh0sT | somiaj, it's more to do with agent emulation when it comes to VLC |
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| 19:29.13 | chickz | I have 10y old compaq with radeon 9600, does debian support it |
| 19:29.38 | jeep | chickz, sure |
| 19:29.44 | chickz | yay |
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| 19:32.12 | jhutchins | K|NgGh0sT: Wheezy is neither testing nor, technicall, frozen. |
| 19:32.23 | jhutchins | s/technicall/technically. |
| 19:32.28 | chickz | there are a alot of download options, the live cd is debian-7.2.0-i386-kde-CD-1.iso right |
| 19:33.29 | mumpitze1 | it's the live cd with kde |
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| 19:33.50 | mumpitze1 | chickz: for a 10 year old PC, I suggest you use lxde |
| 19:34.37 | chickz | cool thanks |
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| 19:34.41 | dondelelcaro | or no DE at all, and just a WM. |
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| 19:38.14 | chickz | is debian owned by somebody? like ubuntu |
| 19:38.27 | enyc | chickz: no, i think |
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| 19:38.43 | enyc | chickz: there are like elected officers and lots ofp eople that contribute resources etc. |
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| 19:39.14 | chickz | from the people for the people |
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| 19:43.51 | urterror | help |
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| 19:44.48 | chickz | can I install debian 7 lxde live cd on a hard drive with windows(go2meetings doesn't like linux) |
| 19:44.48 | chickz | will the setup manage to shrink the windows partition |
| 19:44.48 | chickz | how much HDD space does debian7lxde need |
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| 19:49.00 | jhutchins | chickz: 1) Linux installers have been doing that for 20+ years. 2) I have a recent xfce install that uses 3.8GB including user data. |
| 19:49.43 | chickz | ok thank you great |
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| 19:50.13 | jhutchins | Well, 20+, make that ~20. |
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| 19:53.54 | chickz | --How to Install---------------------- |
| 19:53.54 | chickz | * You need login as root * |
| 19:53.54 | chickz | 1. Run "tar jxvf linux_install.tar.bz2" |
| 19:53.54 | chickz | 2. Run "./install" in TERMINAL to install MobilePartner |
| 19:53.54 | chickz | <PROTECTED> |
| 19:53.55 | chickz | 3. If you had installed this software in your system before, you will get a prompt: "The software is exist, do you want overwrites? ([Y]/[N])", enter "y" to overwrites or "n" to exit. |
| 19:53.55 | chickz | 4. If you do not had installed this software in your system before, you will get a prompt: "Please input the install path[/usr/local/Mobile_Partner]:". Then you can input install path(fullpath), or you may using the default path(/usr/local/Mobile_Partner) by press ENTER direct |
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| 19:56.12 | sjamaan | Hi. I get an error stating that acpi is not installable |
| 19:56.19 | sjamaan | I'm on wheezy (stable), on powerpc |
| 19:56.30 | sjamaan | Is this a known problem? |
| 19:57.16 | sjamaan | (I get that error when I install anything which depends on acpi via apt-get) |
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| 19:58.19 | jumperswitch | hi |
| 19:58.26 | jhutchins | sjamaan: Since acpi is an intell-based spec, I would expect that. |
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| 19:58.44 | sjamaan | Ah, that makes sense |
| 19:58.53 | jumperswitch | So does multistrap accept multiple scripts in configscript in a multistrap config? |
| 19:58.57 | AlexRussia | how to create ppp0? |
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| 19:59.14 | jhutchins | AlexRussia: Start a ppp connection. |
| 19:59.15 | sjamaan | I'm trying to figure out how to get /sys/class/power_supply/* |
| 19:59.23 | AlexRussia | jhutchins: ? |
| 19:59.35 | AlexRussia | tme use PPPoE |
| 19:59.38 | AlexRussia | tme* |
| 19:59.40 | sjamaan | ... on my ibook, so I can get i3status to show my battery status |
| 19:59.41 | AlexRussia | me* |
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| 20:00.29 | AlexRussia | and PPPoE not worked if no interface ppp0 |
| 20:00.30 | jhutchins | !tell AlexRussia about pppoe |
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| 20:00.52 | jhutchins | !tell AlexRussia about ru |
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| 20:01.29 | rneese | afternoon |
| 20:01.44 | rneese | how does one get a list of installed software on a deb box |
| 20:01.53 | rneese | deb pkgs installed |
| 20:02.21 | jhutchins | rneese: dpkg -l |
| 20:02.33 | rneese | ok |
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| 20:04.34 | *** join/#debian msn (~msn@50.21.175.33) |
| 20:04.51 | msn | if i manage to wipe my /var is there a way to restore or recreate teh dpkg db? |
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| 20:05.18 | petern_ | Yes, from your backups ;) |
| 20:05.38 | msn | no backups |
| 20:05.40 | msn | :D |
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| 20:06.21 | msn | my /var was a seperate lvm partition and that whole partition was on a different disk and well the disk went bad stop responding |
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| 20:11.30 | jhutchins | msn: You're probably best off re-installing. |
| 20:12.03 | msn | well the host works i am using it right now |
| 20:12.09 | msn | just cant update/upgrade or apt-get anything |
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| 20:12.39 | msn | and since i am leaving this job in a month i am not gonna bother with reinstalling but thatnks for the help |
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| 20:17.49 | jhutchins | msn: I do not know of any way to rebuild the DB. Other things will be missing too, and that may cause problems going forward. |
| 20:18.23 | jhutchins | msn: I don't know that rpm's rebuilddb command would work in your circumstances; I suspect it wouldn't, and I don't know of an equivalent for apt. |
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| 20:18.59 | msn | dont think there is an quilent |
| 20:19.04 | msn | but thank jham |
| 20:19.10 | msn | jhutchins: |
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| 20:27.04 | staar2 | hello, fellow debianers |
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| 20:28.06 | staar2 | could anyone point me correct directions, I installed urxvt terminal its great and fast but all the keybindings are like wrong |
| 20:28.22 | staar2 | no ctrl-backspace to delete word and so on |
| 20:28.42 | staar2 | home does not jump front of the command |
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| 20:30.20 | jhutchins | staar2: What shell are you using? |
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| 20:30.40 | staar2 | jhutchins, using zh |
| 20:30.42 | DANtheBEASTman | I'm trying to set-up multiseating, does anybody know of any resources? |
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| 20:31.15 | DANtheBEASTman | staar2: you're using zsh? have you configured it yet? |
| 20:31.44 | DANtheBEASTman | the default zsh configuration probably doesn't have any keybinds or features enabled |
| 20:32.36 | staar2 | i use oh-my-zsh base conf |
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| 20:47.23 | somiaj | DANtheBEASTman: what is multiseating? |
| 20:47.43 | jhutchins | somiaj: More than one keyboard/mouse/display per machine. |
| 20:48.30 | somiaj | ahh, do many actually use that, I figured vm's with vnc would be the way to go, but I guess you need the extra machines as dumb clients |
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| 20:49.49 | DANtheBEASTman | i'm setting up a family computer running kde, and everybody's fighting over who gets to use it, I figured if I could set up multiseating one more person could use it, but it's kind of an old laptop i'm wondering if it'll work |
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| 20:50.29 | hikenboot | hello, Here is an odd questions. In windows if I have more than one IP address on an interface...it causes huge problems. I have an apache2 webserver that I am trying to bind web stuff on one ip and autodiscovery and autoconfig on the other I would like to put both internal addresses on one nic card and map them separately using NAT and Virtual IP on the firewall. is this likely to cause issues? |
| 20:50.31 | rampageRipper | hello world,has anyone saved this page: books4electricians.blogspot.com? |
| 20:51.22 | jhutchins | hikenboot: Only if you get some part of it wrong. |
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| 20:51.38 | jhutchins | hikenboot: I have several servers that have six-eight IPs. |
| 20:51.44 | rhizome | hi all. is there a gui for .xz files? xfce-look seems to like them. |
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| 20:55.24 | hikenboot | the main issue I had had to do with broadcasts in windows getting confused..how do i prevent this? |
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| 20:55.38 | hikenboot | with debian |
| 20:56.30 | jhutchins | hikenboot: I dunno. Don't worry about it? |
| 20:56.44 | hikenboot | oh i thought I would need to setup a firewall rule... |
| 20:56.48 | jhutchins | hikenboot: I don't have an problems with it. |
| 20:56.50 | hikenboot | thanks I will try it and see what happens |
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| 20:58.41 | jrpalmer | Ahem. |
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| 20:58.57 | jrpalmer | I am going to install Debian. Right now I have Windows 7 installed with Truecrypt, Truecrypt's MBR/Loader/Thing. I want to dual boot. Can I use the installer and resize the windows partition(s) and have GRUB boot both? Or do I have to wrestle between GRUB and Truecrypt's loader? |
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| 20:59.03 | jrpalmer | I have backup disks for the keys and loader for truecrypt. Also, there is a vendor backup partition near the end of the disk IIRC. Maybe a suspend/sleep one too. |
| 20:59.44 | rhizome | jeez, screw this xz crap. it's for the birds. |
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| 21:02.12 | evilytwisted | hi all, im having problems getting my samsung galaxy s3 to synch properly with my linux mint 15 os system....what program do i need? |
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| 21:03.29 | ctmjr | evilytwisted: ask in the mint channel i think it is #linux-mint |
| 21:03.45 | evilytwisted | Yes i know, But linuxmint is based from debian right? |
| 21:03.55 | nosklo | evilytwisted: yeah, but this channel doesn't support it. |
| 21:04.07 | nosklo | evilytwisted: only pure debian here |
| 21:04.12 | evilytwisted | why is that? |
| 21:04.37 | ctmjr | !based on debian |
| 21:04.37 | dpkg | Your distribution may be based on and have software in common with Debian, but it is not Debian. We don't and cannot know what changes were made by your distribution (compare http://futurist.se/gldt/). #debian only supports Debian; please respect our choice to volunteer here to help Debian users. Support for other distributions is off-topic on #debian, even if your own distro's channel is clueless or non-existent. |
| 21:04.38 | nosklo | evilytwisted: large volume of support, lots of unrelated questions |
| 21:04.53 | evilytwisted | :( |
| 21:04.55 | nosklo | evilytwisted: we're volunteer support. |
| 21:05.04 | evilytwisted | yes i would expect that |
| 21:05.05 | nosklo | evilytwisted: suggestion: install airdroid in the SGS3 |
| 21:05.20 | evilytwisted | airdroid ? |
| 21:05.28 | nosklo | evilytwisted: then you don't need cables to sync anymore, and no extra software in the computer |
| 21:05.38 | evilytwisted | ok ty |
| 21:06.04 | evilytwisted | and how wouldi connect airdroid to pc? |
| 21:06.08 | *** join/#debian sharky_ (~sharky@f049008214.adsl.alicedsl.de) |
| 21:06.14 | nosklo | evilytwisted: it uses your existing wifi connection |
| 21:06.24 | evilytwisted | ahhh ty! |
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| 21:07.57 | evilytwisted | If i may be honest about why i came in here.... linuxmint chat thinks debian are notrious for there . superiority about them being the first ubuntu.. so to speak..... they wanted to see how you guys react to a linux mint question |
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| 21:09.40 | jhutchins | evilytwisted: The reason we're "hostile" mint and other derivations is because we can't know what changes they've made to debian. Some of us have spent hours trying to help people, only to find that our solution won't work because their system is different. |
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| 21:09.57 | evilytwisted | ahhh |
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| 21:10.02 | evilytwisted | that explains alot |
| 21:10.26 | rhizome | "the first ubuntu" lol |
| 21:10.31 | evilytwisted | basically you guys are |
| 21:10.33 | petern_ | What does that even mean? |
| 21:10.36 | rhizome | *that* explains a lot |
| 21:10.42 | evilytwisted | ubuntu is from debian no? |
| 21:10.47 | evilytwisted | linux mint is from ubuntu |
| 21:10.52 | evilytwisted | debian is the first ubuntu |
| 21:10.56 | rhizome | so ubuntu was the first mint |
| 21:11.00 | evilytwisted | exactly |
| 21:11.10 | rhizome | whatever! |
| 21:11.36 | evilytwisted | hey ill admit that im glad debian made what it made |
| 21:11.38 | rhizome | is the concept of distributions foreign? |
| 21:11.43 | evilytwisted | otehrwise i would have used fedora.. |
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| 21:12.32 | sjamaan | jhutchins: Thanks for the hint, I managed to get the PMU battery stuff into /sys/class/power_supply. For some reason, it provides only POWER_SUPPLY_{VOLTAGE,CURRENT}_AVG but not POWER_SUPPLY_{VOLTAGE,CURRENT}_NOW, so i3status does not output anything, causing i3bar to disappear |
| 21:12.37 | rhizome | which is the first centos...or something |
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| 21:12.47 | sjamaan | This is probably a i3 issue, not a Linux kernel issue |
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| 21:13.08 | evilytwisted | really rhiz? |
| 21:13.47 | jrpalmer | Does anyone know of some pitfalls I can avoid when installing Debian for dualbooting with a truecrypt encrypted windows install? |
| 21:14.05 | jrpalmer | GRUB, MBR, partition resizing, backup partitions, etc, areall lookingto be an issue. |
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| 21:14.55 | nosklo | jrpalmer: are you installing debian inside the truecrypt volume or outside? |
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| 21:19.09 | stoffLer | possible to install domU with x11? |
| 21:20.11 | denom | How can I tell what process is using my webcam? |
| 21:20.28 | evilytwisted | denom system monitor? |
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| 21:22.36 | jrpalmer | nosklo: Outside. |
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| 21:22.59 | nosklo | jrpalmer: you'll need truecrypt-aware software to resize the truecrypt volume |
| 21:23.18 | jrpalmer | Does such a thing exist nosklo ? |
| 21:23.20 | mumpitze1 | denom: lsof for /dev/video0 or whatever its device is |
| 21:23.29 | nosklo | jrpalmer: I believe the installer is not. I'm unsure |
| 21:23.44 | jrpalmer | nosklo: what is debian's installer called |
| 21:23.47 | hikenboot | when using sub interfaces do i use 0:0 0:1 or 0.0 0.1 ? |
| 21:24.21 | jrpalmer | nosklo: even if I resize it, wont I have to deal with the MBR conflicting between truecrypt's loader and debian's GRUB? |
| 21:24.46 | nosklo | jrpalmer: that's an easier problem. You can chainload one or the other |
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| 21:26.10 | jrpalmer | I'm not sure what I would prefer. But I am getting ahead of myself. I haven't done this in a while, what is Debian's installer called? Unity? |
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| 21:27.24 | phy1729 | Unity is Ubuntu's desktop environment |
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| 21:28.08 | jrpalmer | it's not anaconda |
| 21:28.12 | jrpalmer | it's just debian-installer |
| 21:28.13 | nosklo | jrpalmer: dunno, I call it "the debian installer" |
| 21:28.15 | jrpalmer | d-i |
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| 21:28.21 | jrpalmer | ok |
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| 21:29.32 | jrpalmer | nosklo: maybe if I have a filesystem driver for truecrypt partitions I can open it in a livecd environment and resize with parted? |
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| 21:30.26 | jhutchins | jrpalmer: Usually there isn't a problem with a dual-boot Windows7 machine, but I don't think many of us have worked with truecrypt and we can't really say what could go wrong. |
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| 21:31.12 | jrpalmer | something will go wrong tho |
| 21:31.15 | jrpalmer | it always does |
| 21:31.31 | jrpalmer | I'm going to boot the installer and see what it sees |
| 21:31.38 | jhutchins | jrpalmer: Truecrypt might have a partition tool that can resize, but sometimes the only way is to backup, repartition, and restore. |
| 21:31.43 | jrpalmer | then maybe i'll decrypt the truecrypt container for windows |
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| 21:31.46 | jrpalmer | and do things like normal |
| 21:31.48 | jrpalmer | ohhhh |
| 21:31.58 | jhutchins | jrpalmer: Backups are always a good idea. |
| 21:32.07 | jrpalmer | I have some backups of things I need |
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| 21:32.19 | jrpalmer | but I guess I better go out and buy a hard drive the same size as the one I'm running |
| 21:32.25 | jrpalmer | don't know why I am not doing this |
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| 21:35.13 | jhutchins | jrpalmer: Disk space is pretty cheap these days. I recommend http://pricewatch.com |
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| 21:48.01 | demfc | does Debian support Tegra3 PC? |
| 21:48.10 | demfc | like the lenovo yoga 13 |
| 21:48.11 | demfc | 11 |
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| 21:50.22 | saintgermain | Hello, Anyone knowing a little about ACPI to help me debug a suspend problem ? |
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| 21:52.00 | epsilon | jrpalmer: basically from empty disk: 1. install windows, 2. crypt it with TC with bootloader (partition with windows, not whole disk), 3. install on another partition linux and bootloader on same partition (NOT MBR), 4. let TC search for alternative bootpartition if not detected automatically |
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| 21:55.46 | flufmnstr | what exactly is the trigger to apt-get install prompting me for yes/no input? a lot of things seem to do it, but a few dont. |
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| 21:57.11 | epsilon | default apt-get should trigger it. It won't if 'assume yes' is used |
| 21:57.12 | ectospasm | many times if apt-get or aptitude is only going to pull the packages you specified, it won't prompt yes/no |
| 21:57.29 | ectospasm | if it needs to pull in dependencies, it will ask |
| 21:57.36 | ectospasm | I shun assume yes |
| 21:57.44 | flufmnstr | ah, isee |
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| 21:57.52 | saintgermain | Nobody to help me with ACPI ? It is driving me crazy... |
| 21:58.26 | epsilon | dont ask to ask |
| 21:58.35 | ectospasm | !ask |
| 21:58.36 | dpkg | If you have a question, just ask! For example: "I have a problem with ___; I'm running Debian version ___. When I try to do ___ I get the following output ___. I expected it to do ___." Don't ask if you can ask, if anyone uses it, or pick one person to ask. We're all volunteers; make it easy for us to help you. If you don't get an answer try a few hours later or on debian-user@lists.debian.org. See <smart questions><errors>. |
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| 21:59.32 | saintgermain | Ok I shoot: when I close my laptop lid, it goes in suspend mode. After resuming, it won't work anymore (lid close but don't suspend) |
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| 22:00.25 | saintgermain | Disconnecting and Reconnecting again restore the ability (Debian Testing with Gnome, up to date) |
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| 22:01.11 | epsilon | disconnecting and reconnecting what? |
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| 22:01.32 | saintgermain | disconnecting and reconnecting from Gnome (gdm) |
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| 22:36.38 | K|NgGh0sT | I am starting to think SID is better then Testing :/ |
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| 22:37.58 | druizz | K|NgGh0sT, maybe haha |
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| 22:39.52 | Gen_Otmin | http://youtu.be/SEwClHBYiEg |
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| 22:41.25 | SmashingX | hey somebody knows why I get this error when I try to rewrite directories? |
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| 22:41.39 | SmashingX | I do this |
| 22:41.41 | SmashingX | sudo mv -v * ../ |
| 22:41.56 | SmashingX | I get this mv: cannot move `includes' to a subdirectory of itself, `../includes' |
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| 22:42.13 | SmashingX | but I want to rewrite whatever is in thart directory |
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| 22:58.01 | cordell | what is the difference between regular updates and security updates? Is it that regular updates can provide new features to a package while security updates only fix critical flaws? |
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| 23:03.39 | jeep | cordell: yes |
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| 23:09.35 | BitPuffin | would you think that debian sid is more stable than arch? |
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| 23:13.34 | gchristensen | forgive this question ... but does the kickseed package use the same thnig that RH uses? |
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| 23:13.51 | gchristensen | I'm noticing similar (identical) options |
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| 23:18.04 | buu | Silly question but how do I format a disk as 'vfat'? |
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| 23:18.55 | buu | oh |
| 23:18.56 | buu | That's how |
| 23:19.24 | LtL | buu: use mkfs.vfat |
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| 23:22.25 | buu | LtL: Yes, I forgot that partitions weren't the same as filesystems |
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| 23:22.43 | holycow | hi guys |
| 23:23.08 | holycow | i have a debian 6 install that has encrypted hard drives (lvm based encryption scheme used by the original debian 6 installer) |
| 23:23.23 | holycow | i upgraded to debian 7 but grub now cannot find the lvm partitions |
| 23:23.29 | holycow | it just drops to a busybox shell |
| 23:23.47 | holycow | does anyone have any idea how to fix that? or where to begin in order to fix it? |
| 23:24.02 | holycow | bascially nothing is found in /dev/mapper for some reason |
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| 23:25.09 | CissWit | i encrypted my disk the same way and still have not upgraded my debian. :D Hope you find an answer before i do ;) |
| 23:25.22 | CissWit | before i upgrade mine* i mean |
| 23:25.37 | holycow | i have a feeling the installer nuked anything from /dev/mapper and now it just cannot find the partitions. |
| 23:25.43 | holycow | do you mind posting what you have in your /dev/mapper? |
| 23:26.39 | holycow | oh udev recreates /dev every reboot |
| 23:26.45 | holycow | so it does not know what to scan for maybe |
| 23:28.09 | fruitFly | what is the debian equivalent of "make" and "make install"? |
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| 23:28.21 | holycow | make / makeisntall |
| 23:28.31 | holycow | why would it be different? |
| 23:28.38 | CissWit | only the control file, and symlinks to /dev/dm-N, my vgs |
| 23:28.47 | fruitFly | holycow: I tried to execute "make" and it said invalid command |
| 23:28.52 | dont-panic | you gotta have gcc installed for make and makeinstall to work |
| 23:28.52 | holycow | CissWit: danke |
| 23:28.57 | holycow | fruitFly: install make |
| 23:29.07 | holycow | apt-get install *whatever install package here) |
| 23:29.07 | holycow | * |
| 23:29.46 | dont-panic | might have to use configure too |
| 23:29.47 | LtL | fruitFly: install build-essential that should do the trick |
| 23:30.01 | holycow | what LtL said is best actually, right |
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| 23:31.25 | K|NgGh0sT | so I am assuming that the radeon drivers don't give hardware opengl support? |
| 23:31.46 | holycow | CissWit: it is a bit disconcerting that grub is not aware of encrypted lvm volumes, and does this automatically. it has now done this on two separate installs. still looking for a resolution |
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| 23:31.56 | holycow | K|NgGh0sT: why would you assume that? |
| 23:32.10 | holycow | oh you mean the open source ones? |
| 23:32.24 | K|NgGh0sT | because I loaded it and now XBMC is angry :( |
| 23:32.29 | K|NgGh0sT | and it also looks like crap |
| 23:32.29 | fruitFly | holycow: dont-panic I am trying to update my wlan firmware so don't have an internet connection on my deb partition. I installed deb 7.2 xfce and am trying to install this firmware: http://www.realtek.com/downloads/downloadsView.aspx?Langid=1&PNid=21&PFid=48&Level=5&Conn=4&DownTypeID=3&GetDown=false&Downloads=true i.e. the latest linux one. It's readme said it works for debian and to install it extract it run "make" and then "make |
| 23:32.33 | fruitFly | "make" |
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| 23:32.53 | holycow | kingsley: you must have installed the open source radeon drivers, they have 3d support but it isn't complete |
| 23:33.02 | holycow | so yes, you are correct, that is what will happen |
| 23:33.05 | fruitFly | how do I accomplish this in debian 7.2? if you could download the file and read the readme for me that would be awesome. holycow dont-panic |
| 23:33.30 | holycow | install the proprietary ones, they should be and installer in the repos for them (i have only used nvidia so don't know the exact package name any more) |
| 23:33.49 | K|NgGh0sT | holycow, problem is fglrx doesnt work with Jessie |
| 23:34.13 | dont-panic | fruitFly: what's your wifi card? |
| 23:34.18 | holycow | really? ohhhhhh ..... yeah. open source won't be able to help you then. |
| 23:34.33 | holycow | *drivers* even |
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| 23:34.38 | fruitFly | holycow: that link is the wlan manufacturer, the firmware install didn't work. |
| 23:34.54 | fruitFly | dont-panic: realtek 8188CE I linked it |
| 23:34.58 | holycow | well .... did it compile successfully first? |
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| 23:35.29 | dont-panic | fruitFly, is this a laptop or is that one of those small wifi usb chips? |
| 23:35.37 | fruitFly | dont-panic: laptop |
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| 23:37.07 | fruitFly | dont-panic: holycow I also download the the .deb firmware, but when I tried it my network disconnects after a few seconds, it also did that on mint. but when I installed the driver I'm trying to install now on mint it worked! |
| 23:37.13 | dont-panic | fruitFly: have you tried installing firmware-realtek? |
| 23:37.56 | fruitFly | dont-panic: I did and just explained what problems I faced above. |
| 23:38.12 | dont-panic | oh, sorry, I'm at work lol |
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| 23:42.51 | dont-panic | fruitFly: did you do ./configure first? |
| 23:43.05 | fruitFly | dont-panic: no |
| 23:43.11 | holycow | also, if you need to recompile you can do make-clean at the end |
| 23:43.22 | holycow | that will clean everything up and you can then do what dont-panic said and go from there |
| 23:44.06 | dont-panic | fruitFly: try using make clean to clean things up then start with ./configure |
| 23:44.45 | dont-panic | you may have to do some research on the card... I had one where I had to edit some of the c files to get it to work |
| 23:45.17 | holycow | yeah. i only buy laptops / hardware with known components with only open source drivers |
| 23:45.19 | dont-panic | That's the only reason my one desktop hasn't been reformatted, I'm afraid of having to do that again lol |
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| 23:45.25 | holycow | i have not had to compile anything in ages |
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| 23:45.38 | fruitFly | dont-panic: this is the readme, please peep the install instructions for me, i have a FRESH deb7.2 instsll |
| 23:45.40 | holycow | but that is not going to help here unfortunately |
| 23:45.43 | fruitFly | dont-panic: holycow https://github.com/tianon/linux-rtlwifi-8188ce |
| 23:45.53 | fruitFly | holycow: I've DEFINITELY learned my lesson |
| 23:46.56 | dont-panic | holycow: this was a $1.50 wifi usb dongle from ebay that had drivers, but they forgot to comment some stuff out or something, it was weird.. had to delete three lines and change all the eth1's to wlan0 before compiling.. nearly shit myself when the card worked lol |
| 23:47.11 | holycow | you have done everything correctly i guess. i am not sure what to suggest beyond this point. i am at work too so cannot drill into this deeper unfortunately |
| 23:47.19 | holycow | dont-panic: sweet! |
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| 23:49.37 | dont-panic | fruitFly: I'm not gonna be here in 10 mins... read the github instructions carefully and I would sugguest installing a Xorg/a window manager and wicd so you don't have to mess with the /etc/network/interfaces to get it working |
| 23:50.22 | fruitFly | dont-panic: i read the readme, but the "make"command it's suggesting is not working on this xfce 7.2 install holycow |
| 23:50.24 | dont-panic | fruitFly: did you do a full debian install or netinstall? |
| 23:50.30 | BitPuffin | has anyone tried running wayland and xwayland on debian? |
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| 23:50.46 | fruitFly | dont-panic: cd xfce install 700MB |
| 23:51.15 | dont-panic | fruitFly: I've never used that, I have no clue what it comes with. I've only ever done debian from nearly scratch installs |
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| 23:51.48 | dont-panic | I use awesome wm and a million terminals lol... I'd research why make isn't working |
| 23:51.57 | dont-panic | google the error it throws |
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| 23:53.48 | dont-panic | fruitFly: if make isn't working then your spinning your wheels until you can get that working |
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| 23:55.17 | dont-panic | If fruitFly comes back, someone have him run gcc -v at the command line to see if he even has gcc |
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| 23:55.56 | dont-panic | I have a feeling he may have gave up on the debian dream though |
| 23:56.29 | holycow | yeah |
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| 23:56.59 | dont-panic | holycow: I kinda like compiling, its a bitch, but its a rush when it works |
| 23:57.20 | holycow | its a huge mountain to undestand for someone who has never done it before |
| 23:57.22 | holycow | however |
| 23:57.41 | dont-panic | that readme looked pretty straight forward lol |
| 23:57.41 | holycow | if i think more users would probably enjoy the process than we give them credit |
| 23:58.02 | holycow | his make is probably erroring out and he isn't reading the messages |
| 23:58.49 | dont-panic | yeah, that's why if he comes back, he's gotta check if he even has gcc. I remember beating my head against the wall in puppy linux and then found out a few hours later I didn't even have gcc |
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| 23:59.55 | dont-panic | oh well... I got a minute left and I'm clocking out and going home lol |
