IRC log for #bzflag on 20121121

01:37.56*** join/#bzflag ibot (~ibot@rikers.org)
01:37.56*** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://wiki.BZFlag.org/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || 2.4.2 is released, deal with it, purple monkey dishwasher
01:37.56*** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ
02:04.42*** join/#bzflag JeffM (~Toybox@cpe-76-166-194-19.socal.res.rr.com)
02:04.42*** join/#bzflag JeffM (~Toybox@unaffiliated/jeffm2501)
02:04.42*** mode/#bzflag [+v JeffM] by ChanServ
08:11.30*** join/#bzflag ibot (~ibot@rikers.org)
08:11.30*** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://wiki.BZFlag.org/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || 2.4.2 is released, deal with it, purple monkey dishwasher
08:11.30*** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ
10:59.18*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (~frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)
11:57.15*** join/#bzflag bier_ (~bier@p5085DFBA.dip.t-dialin.net)
11:57.25*** join/#bzflag bier (~bier@p5085DFBA.dip.t-dialin.net)
12:31.29*** join/#bzflag TD--Linux (~thomas@x-160-94-86-22.uofm-secure.wireless.umn.edu)
12:36.17*** join/#bzflag ashvala (~ashvala@unaffiliated/ashvala)
12:44.09*** join/#bzflag TD---Linux (~thomas@2607:ea00:104:1000:2677:3ff:fe83:7814)
13:29.36*** join/#bzflag cods_ (~cods@tuxee.net)
13:29.52*** join/#bzflag FastLiza1d4|zZzZ (fastlizard@fastlizard4.org)
13:44.06*** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (~thomas@2607:ea00:104:1000:2677:3ff:fe83:7814)
13:44.07*** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (~thomas@about/essy/indecisive/TD-Linux)
15:19.16I_Died_Oncehttp://pastebin.com/h22brEDb
16:47.35*** join/#bzflag swigg (~swigg@nsc69.38.101-238.newsouth.net)
16:47.36*** join/#bzflag swigg (~swigg@bzflag/player/Swigg)
16:52.37*** join/#bzflag JeffM (~JeffM@69.36.85.131)
16:52.38*** join/#bzflag JeffM (~JeffM@unaffiliated/jeffm2501)
16:52.38*** mode/#bzflag [+v JeffM] by ChanServ
17:14.04*** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (~thomas@x-134-84-102-177.reshalls.umn.edu)
17:14.05*** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (~thomas@about/essy/indecisive/TD-Linux)
17:27.03*** join/#bzflag swigg (~swigg@bzflag/player/Swigg)
17:32.54*** join/#bzflag swigg_ (~swigg@nsc69.38.101-238.newsouth.net)
18:10.40*** join/#bzflag FastLizard4|zZzZ (fastlizard@wikipedia/pdpc.active.FastLizard4)
18:26.22*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (~frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)
18:42.13*** join/#bzflag Tuxist (~quassel@dyndsl-031-150-007-250.ewe-ip-backbone.de)
18:43.08*** join/#bzflag catay (~smertens@kaiya.catay.be)
19:14.40*** join/#bzflag SpazzyMcGee (~SpazzyMcG@host-78-144-188-41.as13285.net)
19:36.11*** join/#bzflag Tuxist (~quassel@dyndsl-085-016-213-123.ewe-ip-backbone.de)
21:11.15*** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (~frank@gondolin.pimpi.org)
21:27.45*** join/#bzflag Delusional (~delusiona@pool-108-17-117-49.pitbpa.fios.verizon.net)
21:27.46*** join/#bzflag Delusional (~delusiona@unaffiliated/delusional)
23:01.42*** join/#bzflag YoDawg (6c14357b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.108.20.53.123)
23:02.43YoDawgWondering if anyone has had success running bzflag on an Intel 4000HD equipped Mac.
23:03.24YoDawgI get an absolutely terrible frame-rate. The issue was mentioned here http://forums.bzflag.org/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=18265
23:04.27blast007Apple's driver likely doesn't like some of the old OpenGL calls in the game
23:05.40blast007not much that can be done about that besides substantial work on the graphics code, or getting Apple to release a non-sucky driver.  Or the alternative.. running some other operating system like Windows on your mac.
23:06.51JeffMit runs ok on the 3000 on a macbook but yeah I've heard the same about the 4000
23:07.12JeffMand even on the 3000 video performance is better under windows
23:08.53blast007JeffM: does this backtrace provide a clue as to why the client is crashing on mofo?  http://pastebin.com/raw.php?i=h22brEDb
23:09.38YoDawgInteresting. bzflag seems like a very graphic-unintensive game (lots of simple shapes), so I'm surprised that anything short of a bug would cause the performance hit I'm seeing.
23:09.40JeffMsweet monkey jesus is that long
23:09.49JeffMwhere is the callstack in that thing?
23:10.01blast007that's a 'backtrace full', so it outputs all the local variables as well
23:10.30JeffMI see that it's in the remote add shot stuff
23:10.38JeffMare they dicking with shot IDs?
23:11.03blast007probably
23:11.04JeffMshotNum = 665099056
23:11.18JeffMthey are progbably setting a shot ID over the MS value
23:11.25JeffMso it's writing to other memory
23:11.27blast007yeah, that looked a bit odd.. but I wasn't sure what a sane number was there
23:11.36JeffM1, 2, 3
23:11.37JeffM5
23:11.40YoDawgIs it possible to disable 3D acceleration?
23:11.44blast007heh..
23:11.55JeffMYoDawg, not in our game, that's up to your GL implementation
23:12.02JeffMblast007, bassicly 0 to MS-1
23:12.06blast007k
23:12.18JeffMthe postion looks ok, it's very close to 0
23:12.25YoDawgCool, thanks guys!
23:13.38*** join/#bzflag dedis4 (~dedis4@akw403.cs.yale.edu)
23:14.56JeffMblast007,  yeah I'd check to see what they are doing with IDs
23:15.09JeffMmy guess is they have an overflow issue and sent in -1
23:16.21JeffMI don't like id = 30976 in the firing info ether
23:16.46JeffMwe can protect against the crash in the client pretty easy, but that won't fix old ones
23:16.51blast007yeah
23:17.16blast007it's probably one of the custom flag plugins
23:17.23blast007maybe the snakeshot
23:17.38JeffMI wonder if they are using the API with the shots or sending messages directly
23:17.47JeffMthe API can protect against bad IDs too
23:18.25JeffMsnakeshot work like a GM?
23:18.47blast007it's a super bullet that zig zags ;)
23:19.27blast007I think the shot is overwritten repeatedly
23:21.27JeffMoh
23:21.28JeffMoh god
23:21.31JeffMyeah don't do that
23:25.19JeffMthey may arive out of order
23:25.29JeffMsince IIRC they are UDP
23:36.58blast007snakeshots uses shot IDs 600 through 1599 when passed to bz_fireWorldWep
23:38.09blast007and it looks like it doesn't overwrite shots.. just creates shots with a short lifetime
23:38.26JeffMso they are world weapon shots are player shots?
23:38.29JeffMdoes it set an owner?
23:38.43JeffMthe world can have N shots, we grow the shot array as needed
23:38.50JeffMbut the player shot list does not grow
23:39.05JeffMIIRC
23:39.11blast007sent as the server
23:39.26JeffMthat stack trace had a player ID of 3
23:39.31JeffMso that's not the server
23:39.50blast007in the die event, though, it changes the killerID in the event data to the player that shot the original bullet
23:40.17JeffMnot sure what that does
23:40.36JeffMdo we use the resutls of that event to build the death notification?
23:40.53JeffMif so that's not really how it was intended to work
23:41.06JeffMmultiple plugins can modify that value in any order
23:41.37blast007yeah, we update the data that bzfs will send out if the plugin changes it
23:41.54JeffMthat sucks, cus the local player that died had a different state
23:42.13blast007hmm
23:42.24JeffMwell, live on the bleeding edge, expect to get cut
23:42.31I_Died_Oncewe dont have snakeShots on the Apocalypse
23:42.35blast007is there a point to that even working that way, then?
23:42.39blast007I_Died_Once: oh?
23:42.43I_Died_OnceThank you, Jeff for giving that a look over
23:42.54JeffMthe call is a call to add shot
23:43.00JeffMso it's not a death
23:43.00I_Died_Onceno, but we do have the Ass Cannon, Triple Barrel, and Death Blossom
23:43.14JeffMdo the crashes go away if you remove those?
23:43.39I_Died_Oncewell the crashes are periodic, theres no way to duplicate them on demand
23:43.59JeffMdid you get the Badadd crater of badassery blast007 ?
23:44.12I_Died_Oncewe're hoping to hear from the author of those soon
23:44.32blast007JeffM: in BL2?
23:44.36JeffMyeah
23:44.40JeffMit has more Tiny Tina
23:44.44blast007don't think so
23:44.53blast007haven't played much lately
23:45.05JeffMwe only started playing cus the new DLC came out
23:45.08JeffMit's funny
23:45.11blast007heh
23:45.38JeffMI_Died_Once, you have source for all of them?
23:45.39blast007the game jumped my progress ahead for some reason (I swear I was telling it not to each time), so I had started over with a new character
23:46.07JeffMthe mechromancer is fun
23:46.13JeffMDeathtrap is a murder machine
23:46.19I_Died_Oncenope, those are closed ones :(
23:46.32JeffMI_Died_Once, you run code you don't even have sources for?
23:46.32I_Died_Onceclosed source plugins
23:46.50JeffMI can understand not releasing them but I'd think you'd have a copy of the sources
23:46.59JeffMhow do you know they don't have evil in them?
23:47.11blast007because the readme files say so!
23:47.26I_Died_Oncewe're just bleeding edge crazy like that
23:47.33blast007s/bleeding edge //
23:47.42JeffMyou already got burned once by trusting a third party with admin
23:47.47I_Died_Oncewas written by a trusted senior member of our crew
23:48.10JeffMthen if you trust them, they should show trust in you by letting you have a copy of the sources for maint issues
23:48.11blast007trust goes two ways.. why don't they trust you with the sources?  ;)
23:48.22JeffMusualy it's just ego reasons
23:48.39JeffMtho techincaly I can force them to release sources ;)
23:48.48JeffMif they started with the samples I wrote
23:48.52JeffMLGPL!
23:49.04JeffMbut that's not cool
23:49.11I_Died_Onceno need for all that, would be a dick move
23:49.18JeffMit would be
23:49.20I_Died_Oncelanguage!
23:49.38JeffMbut I would think that they should at least trust you, and be ok with you getting help debuging it
23:49.48JeffMI understand the desire for exlcusivity
23:50.04JeffMbut letting me or blast look at the code to help should also be understandable
23:50.35blast007JeffM: ever used gDEBugger?  It's a (now free) cross-platform OpenGL and OpenCL debugger/profiler/analyze.
23:50.44JeffMnope
23:50.46blast007analyzer*
23:50.51JeffMdoes it work on the .nets?
23:50.54blast007http://www.gremedy.com/products.php
23:51.08blast007it probably doesn't care what language
23:51.44blast007I think on Windows it temporarily copies in some new OpenGL DLLs that let it tap in to the calls
23:51.51I_Died_Oncehopefully we can get this resolved this evening
23:51.55JeffMyeah that's commonly how it's implemented
23:52.00JeffMwith a wraper
23:52.13I_Died_Onceseriously, thanks for the help
23:52.16blast007has some neat features, like a texture viewer and whatnot
23:52.21JeffMhaven't helped yet I_Died_Once
23:52.34I_Died_Onceyeah you have
23:52.42I_Died_Oncepointing out the extra shots
23:52.42JeffMdoes it debug shaders?
23:53.06blast007'Edit and continue GLSL shaders "on the fly"'
23:53.11JeffMnice
23:53.38blast007and can track down memory leaks and the number of calls to specific functions
23:54.45JeffMheh with modern cards it'd take days of play time for a memory leak to fill the vram at the rate bzflag draws things :)
23:56.17blast007profiling mode might be interesting on a mac with the intel hd 4000

Generated by irclog2html.pl Modified by Tim Riker to work with infobot.