| 00:00.03 | JeffM_ | yeah that thing |
| 00:00.15 | blast007 | bryjen: the client *is* smart enough for that already |
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| 00:00.33 | JeffM_ | crapp... I got most active commiter for bzflag... |
| 00:00.55 | blast007 | JeffM_: bwahahaha... all according to the PLAN! |
| 00:01.09 | JeffM_ | ok, then we go managed in 2.6 ;) |
| 00:01.33 | bryjen | Ok, but the server needs to be able to discriminate which the client capped, so the client has to say something more than "I capped" |
| 00:02.12 | blast007 | bryjen: in 2.0.x, the client handled grabs, so there wasn't a problem the way it was set up |
| 00:02.37 | blast007 | I question if the server has an accurate enough state to even /determine/ if the player is on a specific base |
| 00:02.41 | Thumper_ | checks in |
| 00:03.15 | bryjen | but things have changed. either move it all (caps, grabs) server side, or the client and server have to talk more to keep consistent |
| 00:04.43 | bryjen | the existing messages work when it was all client side because the server didn't need to know |
| 00:05.37 | blast007 | it worked because the client had a better idea of its state, so it could better handle the capture |
| 00:05.56 | bryjen | yes |
| 00:06.04 | blast007 | it handled the grab, so it didn't grab a new flag before the capture was successful |
| 00:06.34 | blast007 | though I wonder what would happen if someone had a lot of lag (say, 500ms or more) in 2.0.x |
| 00:09.17 | bryjen | so doing these things server side means the client has to tell the server more about what it's doing (ie which flag it thinks its capped) |
| 00:10.04 | blast007 | the server already does some checking |
| 00:10.39 | blast007 | just sending the capture once should take care of the issue, barring any oddities |
| 00:10.51 | bryjen | via tcp? |
| 00:11.02 | blast007 | we already send it via TCP |
| 00:11.05 | bryjen | ah, ok |
| 00:11.07 | blast007 | however, we're sending it multiple times |
| 00:11.28 | blast007 | that's causing problems since it doesn't say which flag |
| 00:11.39 | blast007 | so we may say "i capped" three times |
| 00:12.07 | bryjen | that may do it, since this all goes away if server is keeping more state and deciding when a capture has happened. |
| 00:12.21 | bryjen | eventually |
| 00:12.23 | blast007 | after the first one gets to the server, the server takes the flag away from you, then sees that you're over your own team flag, and says "here, have this flag" - and then it gets the next "I capped" message |
| 00:12.39 | bryjen | yeah, that's what i figured |
| 00:12.53 | blast007 | 2.99.x probably has the problem too |
| 00:13.03 | bryjen | and one solution to that is to make the "I capped" message less generic |
| 00:13.22 | bryjen | but another is to not scream "I capped" over and over |
| 00:13.46 | bryjen | I tried with recent 2.99 and it didn't seem to |
| 00:15.01 | blast007 | hmm, you're right - just tried with 2.99.x and it works just fine |
| 00:18.57 | bryjen | that the server accepts the cap message for your own flag on your own base is a bug anyway though. a mod'ed client could send it as an annoyance. |
| 00:19.06 | bryjen | meh |
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| 00:25.21 | blast007 | bryjen: a modded client could still do it |
| 00:25.38 | blast007 | they'd just not do it on your own base |
| 00:26.04 | bryjen | yeah, so not much help :( |
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| 00:32.57 | Pimpi | still the server has enough info not to capture a flag in this special case |
| 00:33.47 | Pimpi | but thats probably done early enough in 2.4.x |
| 00:33.48 | blast007 | what benefit does server-side flag grabs give us in 2.4.x? |
| 00:34.36 | Pimpi | it's cheat protection |
| 00:34.49 | blast007 | nope, it's not. |
| 00:35.07 | blast007 | not in the current form, nor will it likely be in any form for the entire 2.4.x branch |
| 00:35.27 | blast007 | for it to be an anti-cheat, the server would need a complete and accurate state |
| 00:35.39 | blast007 | the server will likely not have that in any 2.4.x version |
| 00:35.55 | blast007 | even 2.99.x doesn't have a complete enough state for it to be an anti-cheat |
| 00:36.01 | Pimpi | it's not perfect now, but yes, it can be improved in 2.4.x |
| 00:36.07 | blast007 | but it won't be |
| 00:36.51 | JeffM | can the server even get a complete state with this proto? |
| 00:36.59 | blast007 | doubt it |
| 00:37.02 | Pimpi | no |
| 00:37.10 | JeffM | then yeah it's pointless |
| 00:37.23 | blast007 | I just see it as a risk with no benefit right now |
| 00:38.51 | Pimpi | would we want it in 2.6 then? |
| 00:39.00 | blast007 | maybe |
| 00:39.04 | JeffM | that would be soonest if it needs more proto changes |
| 00:39.28 | Pimpi | why if we don't get any benefit from it? |
| 00:39.48 | blast007 | well, I'm not saying do the exact same thing in 2.4 in 2.6 |
| 00:39.51 | JeffM | we would want it in 2.6 if we had a full state |
| 00:39.53 | blast007 | I'm saying do it right |
| 00:39.59 | JeffM | yeah if it was improved to the point where it was a benfit |
| 00:40.13 | blast007 | less duct tape and chewing gum holding the feature on ;) |
| 00:40.34 | Pimpi | i see benefit even now |
| 00:40.41 | blast007 | which is? |
| 00:41.20 | JeffM | does it limit the distance where a client can grab a flag? as in can I not grab a flag from the other end of the map now? |
| 00:41.30 | Pimpi | it stops cheat code i have already seen |
| 00:41.42 | JeffM | you need to give us some more specifics please |
| 00:42.06 | Pimpi | grabbing distant flags |
| 00:42.26 | JeffM | so it does limit the grab distance then right? |
| 00:42.57 | blast007 | Pimpi: it doesn't fix that ;) |
| 00:43.11 | blast007 | I can just fake my position and the server will say "oh, you're by this flag now - here!" |
| 00:43.11 | Pimpi | to some point. you'd need to mess with your data more that you have now |
| 00:43.20 | Pimpi | it does fix the implementation |
| 00:43.37 | Pimpi | doesn't make it impossible of course |
| 00:43.38 | JeffM | well at least it would show people over by the flag |
| 00:43.46 | blast007 | but that's the same as we already have |
| 00:43.50 | JeffM | but yes it dosn't seem like a big thing to get out of the feature |
| 00:43.53 | blast007 | there is already checks for grabbing distant flags |
| 00:43.55 | JeffM | yeah pull it |
| 00:44.02 | JeffM | at least we understand why now |
| 00:44.05 | JeffM | so that's good |
| 00:44.17 | Pimpi | you'd have to mess with your location and other players would see that as jumping |
| 00:44.19 | JeffM | and we can make a better feature later |
| 00:44.29 | blast007 | Pimpi: for a fraction of a second |
| 00:44.32 | JeffM | Pimpi, but nothing pevents that on the server |
| 00:44.53 | blast007 | they send two updates in a row, one with the fake position, one with the real one |
| 00:44.54 | JeffM | I understand what you are saying but I don't think it's a big enough feature for the risk |
| 00:45.08 | bryjen | can the ability to send bogus location updates be added without breaking protocol? |
| 00:45.15 | bryjen | errr |
| 00:45.19 | blast007 | bryjen: that'd be a lot of work |
| 00:45.24 | bryjen | ability to check for .... |
| 00:45.25 | blast007 | if we remove teleporters, not as hard ;) |
| 00:45.41 | JeffM | bryjen: yeah we need more state data and sim on the server to know what valid moves are |
| 00:45.44 | blast007 | but we have to factor that in, as well as physics drivers, and so on |
| 00:46.08 | JeffM | that's what makes that project hard |
| 00:46.14 | blast007 | we can't even figure out if a tank is going too fast if there are physics drivers right now, much less if their position/movement is sane |
| 00:46.48 | blast007 | we could just make it a Portal mod with fixed portals ;) |
| 00:46.56 | JeffM | we'll have this code in hisotry so we can reference it |
| 00:47.05 | blast007 | or a PG flag to make portals |
| 00:47.11 | JeffM | and we'll get a better server state with regards to at least point based updated |
| 00:47.21 | JeffM | that's the start of a good state |
| 00:47.31 | bryjen | is that just because it was easier to note that phydrvs are present and switch the checks off, not that it can't be done? |
| 00:47.49 | blast007 | bryjen: it can be done |
| 00:47.49 | JeffM | we can't do good interpolation on the server |
| 00:47.52 | blast007 | it just wasn't |
| 00:47.58 | blast007 | it's complicated |
| 00:48.00 | JeffM | the code for all that is on the client |
| 00:48.03 | JeffM | not the server |
| 00:48.10 | JeffM | we CAN do it, we just don't as blast says |
| 00:48.15 | JeffM | and moving it over is a big project |
| 00:48.27 | blast007 | the server doesn't accurately know where the tank is, so it's hard for it to know if it's on a base or on a physics driver or whatever |
| 00:48.29 | JeffM | not a point release |
| 00:48.43 | JeffM | the server knows where the last update was that's it |
| 00:49.37 | bryjen | OK. i understand its a big change. i just thought maybe this was a little step toward it. |
| 00:49.54 | JeffM | it would be, but it causes more problems then it solves |
| 00:50.01 | JeffM | and it's not going to be hard to do it when we have the rest |
| 00:50.09 | blast007 | little steps should be done when the goal for the release would be to end up with a complete server-side state |
| 00:50.11 | JeffM | so we don't really loose anything by not having it here |
| 00:50.16 | JeffM | yeah |
| 00:51.12 | bryjen | agreed then. getting 2.4 out is the goal. |
| 00:52.02 | JeffM | I'm glad the time was spent to understand it better |
| 00:52.52 | JeffM | server side ID can stay in right? |
| 00:55.43 | blast007 | yeah, I'll keep that |
| 00:56.01 | JeffM | then we get some benifit from that |
| 01:00.10 | blast007 | hmm, and we do seem to send the "I capped" message once per frame until the server acknowledges us |
| 01:00.51 | JeffM | we should thread it :) |
| 01:01.04 | blast007 | or just send it once, since it's TCP ;) |
| 01:01.19 | JeffM | oh yeah toataly |
| 01:01.25 | JeffM | we should not send anything once per frame |
| 01:01.30 | blast007 | though we'll worry about that later |
| 01:01.49 | blast007 | that might break stuff if the server has some check that says the cap isn't valid ;) |
| 01:01.55 | blast007 | and then they might be unable to cap at all |
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| 01:52.48 | blast007 | okay, successfully reverted that part |
| 01:53.00 | blast007 | just need to clean out the unnecessary stuff from searchFlag() now |
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| 02:09.06 | JeffM | we'll move the beta drop till tomorow |
| 02:50.43 | trepan | little steps won't get you over the fissure, you'll just fall in :) |
| 02:52.42 | blast007 | trepan: also, the more I think about it, the more I think that trying to move to a DVCS is going to be less than optimal |
| 02:53.18 | blast007 | we've kinda abused SVN - all of our subprojects are within trunk/, and we've moved files between those |
| 02:55.35 | trepan | you a conversion to a proper setup would be less than optimal? |
| 02:55.40 | trepan | s/you/you mean/ |
| 02:58.08 | trepan | either way, can always use git/hg/bzr svn wrapper :) |
| 02:58.46 | blast007 | we just have a lot of stuff in our repo.. |
| 02:58.52 | blast007 | multiple projects |
| 02:59.13 | trepan | only one of any significant size |
| 02:59.21 | trepan | and even that's no titan |
| 02:59.27 | blast007 | shrugs |
| 02:59.32 | trepan | mehs |
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| 03:29.26 | blast007 | JeffM: oh, and are we not intending to link with GLEW on Windows? |
| 03:30.00 | JeffM | what uses it? |
| 03:30.02 | JeffM | aniso? |
| 03:30.18 | blast007 | yeah |
| 03:30.33 | blast007 | in 2.4, I think that's all we use it for |
| 03:30.55 | blast007 | (2.99.x may also use it for toggling vsync, but I'm not sure) |
| 03:31.35 | trepan | 2.99.x uses it for a number of things |
| 03:31.39 | blast007 | k |
| 03:32.05 | trepan | depth clamp, 2 sided stencils, bindable GLSL uniforms, etc... |
| 03:32.25 | JeffM | yeah we'll have to make a project for it |
| 03:32.37 | blast007 | there's a vc6 one in there right now |
| 03:33.04 | JeffM | yeah |
| 03:33.09 | JeffM | I thought I upgraded it once |
| 03:33.16 | JeffM | wonder if I didn't check it in |
| 03:33.41 | trepan | damned DVCS's :) |
| 03:34.17 | JeffM | oh I'd have missed it in a DVCS as well |
| 03:37.32 | JeffM | what #defs do we need |
| 03:37.38 | JeffM | have_glew or something? |
| 03:39.06 | blast007 | yep, HAVE_GLEW |
| 03:39.33 | JeffM | there are vc9 projects in the vc6 dir |
| 03:39.39 | JeffM | trying static now |
| 04:08.44 | yosef | two things: gm smoke trails are awesome, and how can the on-screen pointer to the team flag be turned off? |
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| 04:38.10 | JeffM | I belive enhanced markers are tied to experimental mode |
| 04:45.53 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03blast007 * r21957 10/trunk/bzflag/ (6 files in 5 dirs): |
| 04:45.53 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: Revert the server-side flag grab part of r21838. The server-side identify flag is still in place, and the searchFlag function has been stripped down to only what is necessary for that functionality. |
| 04:45.53 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: Revert r21956 as it was a workaround for the server-side flag grab issue. |
| 04:45.53 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: Reformat the 2.3.0 ChangeLog items to conform to DEVINFO (limit to 80 chars). |
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| 05:22.59 | TD-Linux | why did you revert that instead of making MsgCaptureFlag one-shot? |
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| 06:21.33 | yosef | I'm having problems with shockwave on high or experimental settings with the latest trunk build |
| 06:22.01 | yosef | it's jerky, slow, and fires up my jitter. Is it a graphics issue? |
| 06:22.28 | yosef | the issue does not occur in 2.0.16 |
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| 08:28.39 | Pimpinella | TD-Linux: because the benefits we get from it do not justify possible risks server side flag grab may have |
| 08:35.18 | Pimpinella | benefits = nearly no for 2.4. If the server knew more about client state it would be nice to have, but it doesn't |
| 08:35.34 | Pimpinella | risks = who knows |
| 08:39.51 | Pimpinella | however, i'd liked to have seen it in beta. it is one step ahead to where we want even though it wouldn't be in an environment where it became really useful |
| 08:40.32 | Pimpinella | so learning about the risks would have been worth a try IMHO |
| 08:40.51 | Pimpinella | but it is like it is now |
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| 15:15.59 | trepan | assumes it's far too late for 2.4 to get BZDB dynamic colors :) |
| 15:17.00 | blast007 | yeah ;) |
| 15:18.11 | trepan | too bad in got squashed up front, useful feature |
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| 15:44.17 | mdskpr_ | anyway you can bypass a UDP block on a firewall to connect to bzflag servers? |
| 15:45.22 | BulletCatcher | BZFlag has no features that would help with that. |
| 15:45.44 | blast007 | mdskpr_: bribe the network admin? ;) |
| 15:45.57 | blast007 | I hear they like money and food |
| 15:46.04 | BulletCatcher | and booze |
| 15:46.47 | joevano | especially sweets like cookies and cake or donuts if in the AM |
| 15:47.23 | mdskpr_ | i'd probably have to bribe all the other bureaucrats to even find him |
| 15:47.36 | BulletCatcher | It would be worth it. |
| 15:48.08 | BulletCatcher | Just tell them that BZFlag is a network testing tool. |
| 15:50.31 | joevano | BulletCatcher: it is... Thumper is always the first to notice that our T1 is down |
| 15:51.18 | joevano | before the end users at the site it is located at |
| 15:56.19 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03bullet_catcher * r21958 10/trunk/bzflag/ (DEVINFO debian/rules): Distributed maps have been moved from misc/ to misc/maps/ directory. |
| 15:57.32 | Thumper_ | heh |
| 16:24.26 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03bullet_catcher * r21959 10/trunk/bzflag/man/Makefile.am: Do not install bzfquery.6 since we don't install bzfquery itself. |
| 16:26.00 | blast007 | why do we even have a man page for that? :) |
| 16:26.15 | BulletCatcher | Documentation is very important! |
| 16:26.35 | blast007 | it's documented in the header of the file, no? |
| 16:27.08 | BulletCatcher | Yes, and the man page is generated directly from that header. |
| 16:27.13 | blast007 | heh |
| 16:27.20 | blast007 | what about the python one? ;) |
| 16:27.34 | BulletCatcher | patches welcome ;-) |
| 16:27.40 | blast007 | pfft |
| 16:28.13 | blast007 | my patch would be something like "don't generate man pages for example scripts" ;) |
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| 17:18.24 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03Mdskpr 07http://my.bzflag.org * r7764 10/w/Meshpyr: Makes it look sharper and more consistent with similar pages. |
| 17:23.01 | BulletCatcher | TimRiker: We are very close to a beta release, so this would be an excellent time for you to make any needed changes to the debian directory. |
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| 18:04.54 | TD-Linux | trepan, bzdb dynamic colors aren't protocol breaking are they? |
| 18:14.16 | Pimpi | what does it require to add another plugin? |
| 18:15.14 | Pimpi | i'd like to add onevsone if catay agrees |
| 18:15.50 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r21960 10/trunk/bzflag/MSVC/build/ (8 files): use glew in windows build |
| 18:16.14 | JeffM | you add it to the folder, add it to the makefile and config |
| 18:16.19 | JeffM | and ask me to add it to full build |
| 18:16.30 | JeffM | but really it's a bit late for that |
| 18:16.33 | JeffM | no new features |
| 18:16.45 | JeffM | so wait till 2.4.2 |
| 18:16.54 | Pimpi | ok |
| 18:17.30 | JeffM | was the plugin ever even updated to 2.4? |
| 18:18.36 | Pimpi | not sure, but if not $SOMEBODY will have to update it now |
| 18:18.50 | JeffM | then yeah no way it's going in this release |
| 18:24.21 | BulletCatcher | If catay wrote the plugin, he should commit it when the time comes so there is no question of permission to do so. |
| 18:24.23 | BulletCatcher | He already has commit access. |
| 18:24.50 | JeffM | indeed |
| 18:25.51 | Pimpi | seems catay is very busy atm though |
| 18:26.13 | Pimpi | so i guess $SOMEBODY will me me |
| 18:26.54 | trepan | TD-Linux: yes, they are |
| 18:27.42 | BulletCatcher | I have asked L4m3r a couple of times about contributing the fairCTF plugin, but he never responds to my requests. :-( |
| 18:27.46 | trepan | (could do another stuff-the-data-in-the-name hacks, but there are already too many of those) |
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| 18:28.46 | trepan | ... that never got cleaned up in 2.4 :) |
| 18:29.50 | BulletCatcher | Is the procedure for doing a beta release documented anywhere? |
| 18:30.36 | BulletCatcher | It seems like it would have some noteworthy differences from a real release. |
| 18:30.45 | JeffM | no it isn't |
| 18:30.56 | JeffM | beta is mostly just informat testing |
| 18:31.01 | JeffM | informal |
| 18:31.08 | JeffM | we don't bump version |
| 18:31.15 | JeffM | we just put some packages up |
| 18:31.20 | JeffM | it isn't really a "release" |
| 18:31.34 | JeffM | that's why I called it the "beta testing program" :) |
| 18:31.43 | trepan | is it an RC#? |
| 18:31.51 | JeffM | not yet |
| 18:31.52 | trepan | (for BZ_BUILD_TYPE) |
| 18:32.01 | trepan | so still DEVEL |
| 18:32.04 | JeffM | yeah |
| 18:32.14 | JeffM | we just provide some packages so that players can help us test |
| 18:32.32 | JeffM | cus it is still dev code, we expect bugs |
| 18:32.48 | JeffM | BulletCatcher, can you make me a windows and linux source package? |
| 18:32.54 | BulletCatcher | So we would just release, say, 2.3.15 from trunk and simply *describe* it as a beta? |
| 18:33.00 | JeffM | yep |
| 18:33.08 | BulletCatcher | That's easy enough. |
| 18:33.14 | JeffM | yeah it's not complex |
| 18:33.32 | JeffM | make the the packages and I'll upload them and winbins and we'll be in beta :) |
| 18:33.58 | trepan | do the sources/autotools get adjusted to build "bzflagb241" execs? |
| 18:34.18 | JeffM | nope |
| 18:34.36 | BulletCatcher | That would be done with --program-suffix=24b1 at configure time. |
| 18:35.34 | BulletCatcher | I am fighting with the Fedora RPM .spec file, trying to make it install everything with different names. |
| 18:35.37 | JeffM | just make the packages using the existing version as if it was the release |
| 18:35.53 | Pimpi | did somebody prepare the debian packaging yet? |
| 18:36.12 | JeffM | pffft no, tim hasn't even answered my questions about it |
| 18:36.14 | JeffM | it's sad |
| 18:36.42 | BulletCatcher | I poked Tim about it earlier this morning, but no response. |
| 18:36.50 | Pimpi | i'll have a look on it, it's been quite a while i did that though |
| 18:37.09 | Pimpi | can't promise i can do it |
| 18:37.13 | JeffM | pimpi won't matter in the end, tim has to do it he is the only one that can submit them |
| 18:38.19 | Pimpi | but we won't have a .deb for beta, no? |
| 18:38.26 | JeffM | we can if you want to |
| 18:38.29 | JeffM | it'd be nice |
| 18:38.53 | Pimpi | it failed when i tried last, not sure now |
| 18:38.57 | trepan | Pimpi: for which arch? |
| 18:39.05 | Pimpi | i386 |
| 18:39.43 | JeffM | BulletCatcher, I can get you an account to upload to beta.bzflag.org if you need it |
| 18:39.50 | BulletCatcher | blast007: Do you still have the Debian/Ubuntu system with the old autotools that you used to make the 2.0.16 release? If so, that would be best for generating beta source distributions. |
| 18:39.53 | Pimpi | it's been a few weeks though and i didn't look for possible reasons |
| 18:40.44 | catay | Pimpi: the plugin is at github : https://github.com/catay/OneVsOne |
| 18:41.13 | catay | i have no problem with adding at some point into bzflag |
| 18:41.13 | JeffM | catay, if you want it incuded in bzflag then you should have commited it here, but don't do it untill after release |
| 18:41.30 | catay | I just wonder if it makes sense as it's quite league specific |
| 18:41.37 | JeffM | what does it do? |
| 18:42.05 | catay | 1vs1 gameplay , the one that dies X times loses |
| 18:42.17 | catay | but there is also a ton of code in it that reports to the league site |
| 18:42.27 | JeffM | ahh then yes we don't want that |
| 18:42.31 | catay | retrieve playerinfo , stuff like that |
| 18:42.35 | JeffM | it's available in a repo leave it at that |
| 18:42.56 | catay | to make it fully functional you need the league code and that's not mine |
| 18:43.06 | catay | Strayer did that |
| 18:43.12 | JeffM | then yeah it's yours, keep it :) |
| 18:43.18 | catay | lol |
| 18:43.53 | catay | now , it can work in the basic mode without all the fancy stuff |
| 18:44.01 | catay | but i also feel it's too specific to add |
| 18:44.09 | JeffM | if someone wants to port it to only have the baisc code and commit that later that's fine |
| 18:44.38 | catay | but ... it's out there , so people can change it |
| 18:45.01 | JeffM | http://beta.bzflag.org/bzflag-2.3.15.2011216_32Bit.exe and http://beta.bzflag.org/bzflag-2.3.15.201121_64Bit.exe if anyone wants em |
| 18:45.39 | trepan | 201121.6 ? |
| 18:46.11 | JeffM | is that the right format for the date? |
| 18:46.24 | JeffM | or should we just do .1,2,3 for the 4th? |
| 18:46.54 | BulletCatcher | I would use 20110621 for today. |
| 18:47.00 | JeffM | ok |
| 18:47.01 | trepan | it's just that they're different, 20110621 also works |
| 18:47.22 | JeffM | fixed |
| 18:47.44 | JeffM | any webmonkeys out there want to make me a php page for beta releases? |
| 18:48.06 | mdskpr_ | mrapple ^^ ? |
| 18:48.32 | JeffM | the word "drupal" should not be uttered |
| 18:48.59 | trepan | BulletCatcher: at least i'm seeing YYMMDD more thsee days, dislike MMDDYY |
| 18:49.18 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (~spldart2@c-98-198-227-61.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
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| 18:49.18 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 18:49.32 | BulletCatcher | Yeah. People realize it sorts much better. |
| 18:50.07 | trepan | heh, from <man strftime>: %D Equivalent to %m/%d/%y. (Yecch â for Americans only... |
| 18:51.22 | JeffM | goes back to caching voxels |
| 19:02.40 | Gabe_G23 | the 64-bit beta works! yay good job :P |
| 19:07.04 | KTL | grmbl yesterday i went to the door of a ict-company, seems they wanted some drupal-dev, i'm not very attracted there |
| 19:17.53 | Pimpinella | we don't have a userdb anymore, correct? |
| 19:17.57 | blast007 | BulletCatcher: how old of autotools do I need? |
| 19:18.28 | blast007 | I'm no longer on debian etch, but I could easily set up a VM for an older debian |
| 19:19.32 | blast007 | I'm on Ubuntu 10.04, which has autoconf 2.65 and automake 1.11.1 |
| 19:21.59 | BulletCatcher | IIRC, the problem was the new libtool version. |
| 19:22.06 | BulletCatcher | I have 2.2.10 on Fedora 14. |
| 19:23.03 | BulletCatcher | Pimpinella: It looks like userdb still works in 2.3.15. |
| 19:23.09 | blast007 | 2.2.6b here |
| 19:23.44 | BulletCatcher | I think the older libtool version we wanted was 1.something . |
| 19:24.10 | BulletCatcher | For the (first) beta I'll just go with libtool 2.2.10 and we'll see if anyone complains. |
| 19:25.38 | blast007 | ok |
| 19:26.12 | blast007 | debian stable has 2.2.6b as well |
| 19:26.52 | blast007 | lenny has 1.5.26. |
| 19:26.55 | blast007 | (oldstable) |
| 19:27.08 | BulletCatcher | That must be the one I was thinking of. |
| 19:31.23 | JeffM | my server is debian stable and trepan set it up to build bz if it's needed |
| 19:33.40 | BulletCatcher | If the tarballs I am generating right now on Fedora 14 don't work for everyone, then we'll need to do it on Debian Lenny. |
| 19:37.25 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03Pimpinella 07http://my.bzflag.org * r7765 10/w/BZFS_2.4_Upgrade: /* Server Groups */ |
| 19:38.50 | Pimpinella | BulletCatcher: yeah, it was passdb that was removed |
| 19:42.00 | CIA-5 | BZFlag: 03Pimpinella 07http://my.bzflag.org * r7766 10/w/BZFS_2.4_Upgrade: /* Server Groups */ |
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| 21:02.45 | mrapple | JeffM: i would, but leaving for jamaica on wed and wont be back till june 2nd :) |
| 21:06.23 | JeffM | k |
| 21:07.10 | BulletCatcher | Have fun there, mon! |
| 21:09.37 | BulletCatcher | http://beta.bzflag.org/bzflag-2.3.15-20110621.tar.bz2 |
| 21:09.43 | BulletCatcher | http://beta.bzflag.org/bzflag-2.3.15-20110621.zip |
| 21:10.02 | JeffM | time to make the post |
| 21:10.02 | BulletCatcher | Those are today's beta source distributions. |
| 21:10.15 | BulletCatcher | Yup. |
| 21:10.24 | trepan | svn tag? |
| 21:10.31 | JeffM | naw |
| 21:10.36 | JeffM | it's not a real release |
| 21:10.52 | JeffM | we will NEVER need to back to it |
| 21:11.00 | BulletCatcher | For the record, it is r21960. |
| 21:11.14 | trepan | and that's why you tag, makes it easier to track |
| 21:11.23 | JeffM | and if someone builds with changes later they are just further up the curve then those of us that did it early |
| 21:11.29 | JeffM | you tag when you need to track it |
| 21:11.35 | JeffM | we have no reason to track it |
| 21:11.55 | JeffM | optimaly we'd update the beta with every commit |
| 21:12.18 | BulletCatcher | We're limited to one per day with the current naming scheme. |
| 21:12.21 | trepan | optimally, the SVN rev would be embedded in the execs :) |
| 21:12.35 | JeffM | yeah I wasn't sure if we wanted to do that |
| 21:12.42 | JeffM | but really once a day is fine for us |
| 21:12.53 | JeffM | we don't change THAT offten |
| 21:13.06 | BulletCatcher | We don't *want* to change that often. :-) |
| 21:13.08 | JeffM | it'll take a day or 2 for people to report buts, a day or 2 for us to fix em |
| 21:13.12 | JeffM | yeah |
| 21:13.22 | JeffM | so we'll have another build in a few days |
| 21:13.36 | JeffM | I think we should tag the RC |
| 21:13.40 | JeffM | but not these |
| 21:13.54 | JeffM | this is just extended integration testing |
| 21:19.39 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM] by ChanServ |
| 21:19.51 | *** topic/#bzflag by JeffM -> http://my.BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || Alpha testing of 2.3 is going on now || 2.4 beta now, test like the wind || The PLAN http://my.bzflag.org/w/Development_RoadMap |
| 21:23.52 | *** join/#bzflag mdskpr_ (~mdskpr@108.25.145.104) |
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| 21:26.41 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v tupone] by ChanServ |
| 21:48.01 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o blast007] by ChanServ |
| 21:48.48 | *** topic/#bzflag by blast007 -> http://my.BZFlag.org || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || 2.4 beta now, test like the wind || The PLAN http://my.bzflag.org/w/Development_RoadMap |
| 21:51.25 | Thumper_ | mrapple: you're going for a year? ;) |
| 21:51.56 | mrapple | er july 2 |
| 21:52.53 | mrapple | holy crap im being ddos'd |
| 21:52.59 | mrapple | or something of the sort |
| 21:53.03 | mrapple | anyone have a quick guide for firewalling |
| 21:53.27 | mrapple | netstat reveals a ton of connections from a single ip |
| 21:53.30 | JeffM | don't you host game servers? |
| 21:54.29 | mrapple | yes |
| 21:54.37 | mrapple | but this shouldnt be happening |
| 21:54.47 | JeffM | should you not then know all about firewalling and blocking IPs? |
| 21:55.33 | mrapple | should, but dont |
| 21:55.51 | JeffM | so your servers are wide open to the world? |
| 21:56.20 | blast007 | he wouldn't know what a DDoS was if it bit him in the face |
| 21:56.24 | JeffM | heh |
| 21:56.31 | JeffM | just block the IP at the interface level |
| 21:56.47 | blast007 | doubt it's even an DoS attack of any form |
| 22:01.12 | catay | mrapple: iptables -P INPUT DROP |
| 22:01.25 | catay | but dont blame me for things that dont work anymore :P |
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| 22:03.52 | blast007 | catay: best to not make stupid suggestions like that |
| 22:05.03 | trepan | note the shiny @ :) |
| 22:15.01 | brad | catay got told off |
| 22:15.03 | brad | har har |
| 22:15.06 | brad | ~lart catay |
| 22:15.06 | ibot | gives catay a "free" copy of Windows and then charges double for "Upgrades" |
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| 22:18.53 | blast007 | TimRiker: is there anything that needs to be updated in the debian/ directory? also, is there any special build tricks for making a debian package? |
| 22:19.21 | catay | your 'bit him in the face' remark wasn't indeed much nicer |
| 22:19.24 | catay | *was |
| 22:19.35 | JeffM | catay, yes but it won't brick his machine ;) |
| 22:19.56 | brad | fight fight fight! |
| 22:19.59 | brad | hehe |
| 22:20.00 | catay | fair enough :) |
| 22:20.09 | blast007 | catay: he's got a remote system, so if he did that, he'd be locked out of his system until support could fix it |
| 22:20.39 | JeffM | we all know he's silly to not know enough to be a proper system admin, but telling him something to do that would break his machine is overly mean. |
| 22:20.49 | JeffM | yeah it could cost him real money |
| 22:20.52 | JeffM | and that's not cool |
| 22:21.35 | catay | true, wasn't intended that way |
| 22:21.53 | JeffM | I know, but he dosn't know that you wern't serious |
| 22:22.18 | JeffM | and dosn't know enough about unix commands to know what it was doing |
| 22:22.28 | brad | I just tried that and now i cant connect to anything |
| 22:22.33 | brad | catay you owe me $100 to fix :P |
| 22:22.43 | BulletCatcher | It's for your own good, brad. |
| 22:22.55 | blast007 | brad: now go outside and play |
| 22:23.00 | brad | but but.. |
| 22:23.09 | brad | outside is no fun |
| 22:23.13 | brad | especially at night |
| 22:23.27 | JeffM | take a torch |
| 22:23.34 | brad | alright! |
| 22:23.46 | BulletCatcher | At night you are in no danger from that nuclear powered ball in the sky. |
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| 22:23.58 | *** join/#bzflag Anxuiz (~Anxuiz@unaffiliated/anxuiz) |
| 22:24.22 | brad | :p |
| 22:28.09 | trepan | BulletCatcher: true dat, just earned me a nasty sunburn building stuffs outside |
| 22:31.56 | BulletCatcher | The summer (northern hemisphere) solstice was about 5 hours ago, so sunburns will come easy today. |
| 22:36.16 | TimRiker | blast007, make debian-svn for a snapshot, and make debian-release for a release. |
| 22:36.37 | JeffM | TimRiker, will that build with plugins and package them? |
| 22:36.47 | TimRiker | there the gl libs got renamed (again... ugh) so the depends should get updated. |
| 22:37.27 | TimRiker | JeffM, dunno. it calls debian/buildsnap so if there are extra build steps they should get added there. |
| 22:37.54 | TimRiker | building in trunk again, right? I'll try one here. |
| 22:38.01 | JeffM | yeah |
| 22:48.13 | TimRiker | should I be using system curl and ares? |
| 22:48.43 | JeffM | depends if you set it as a dep or not |
| 22:48.50 | JeffM | I'd think we'd want to use systems' |
| 22:49.00 | TimRiker | libares-dev 1.1.1-5.1build1 installed here (ubuntu natty) and it wants to build the included one. |
| 22:49.30 | blast007 | pokes BulletCatcher |
| 22:51.26 | TimRiker | hmm. there is a /usr/lib/libares.so.0.0.0 but log shows: configure:16581: checking for ares_init in -lcares configure:16615: result: no |
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| 23:47.35 | BulletCatcher | TimRiker: It's cares (with a c), so libcares-dev will probably provide the dependency. |
| 23:52.04 | BulletCatcher | IIRC, c-ares forked from ares long ago. |
| 23:54.05 | trepan | BulletCatcher: solstice, did not realize that; thanks :) |