| 01:08.54 | *** join/#bzflag spldart (~spldart2@bzflag/contributor/spldart) |
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| 01:55.33 | Constitution | anyone for some babel? |
| 01:56.41 | mrapple | Constitution: 3.0? i compiled mine last night but you left |
| 01:57.00 | blast007 | I got my 2.99.x built too |
| 01:57.47 | Constitution | ok sure |
| 01:57.54 | mrapple | blast007: on which os? :P |
| 01:58.00 | blast007 | Windows :P |
| 01:58.11 | mrapple | heh nice, lets play |
| 01:58.12 | Constitution | and mrapple has mac, and I have linux... perfect :) |
| 01:58.14 | blast007 | didn't get OpenGL acceleration working in linux |
| 01:58.47 | mrapple | badgerking or overlord, hm |
| 02:00.19 | blast007 | think I even got sound working ;D |
| 02:02.14 | Packman | pft devs and their toys :P |
| 02:04.40 | JeffM2501 | yeah... sound cards are so rare |
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| 03:22.48 | Constitution | so can "the hub" be resurrected? |
| 03:23.17 | mrapple | if someone starts it |
| 03:25.54 | Constitution | thank you for shining the light of illumination on my ignorance |
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| 06:12.40 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r21351 10/trunk/bzflag/ (28 files in 7 dirs): * LLVM clang fixes |
| 06:14.59 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r21352 10/trunk/bzflag/src/clientbase/clientCommands.cxx: * removed the printf() FIXME |
| 06:16.02 | trepan | just making my 'clean-svn' dir clean again ;-) |
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| 08:05.11 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: 03Wendy Mayer 07http://my.bzflag.org * r7391 10/w/Classic_Ugg_Bailey_Boots_UK_Girl_Fans_Always_Love_Clearance: New page: Very luxurious leather soft and silky smooth, with sheepskin, and mold this great knitting sheepskin cheap ugg boots sale work is a series of waves, new, they return to ensure [http://www.... |
| 08:53.48 | AAA_awright | ... |
| 09:07.04 | Constitution | always the boots |
| 09:58.57 | AAA_awright | Why the boots? Why couldn't it be drugs from Canada or something? |
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| 10:33.04 | Constitution | I have a million lines of "File transfer terminated with error from libcurl 6 : Could not resolve host: stattrack.bzflag.org (Domain name not found)" in my bzfs log. Is this something that is going to come back online? |
| 10:34.20 | Constitution | or maybe it's my DNS... my home box seems to be able to resolve it |
| 10:35.30 | *** join/#bzflag enrico123 (568c08e4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.140.8.228) |
| 10:44.45 | enrico123 | Hi Guys, i have just installed VISUAL studio 2010 and how do i compile my plugin? |
| 10:50.04 | Constitution | enrico123: have you read http://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/bzflag/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/README.WIN32 |
| 10:50.45 | enrico123 | Ok i dont get that |
| 10:50.59 | Constitution | if you click the link, the browser will get it for you |
| 10:51.17 | enrico123 | I clicked it |
| 10:51.37 | enrico123 | erm the file i have is AdminMessage.cpp |
| 10:51.50 | enrico123 | but i cant open it, its not a suported format |
| 10:52.01 | Constitution | I think the easiest way to build plugins is to drop them into a bzflag build project |
| 10:52.09 | Constitution | have you tried to compile bzflag yet? |
| 10:52.29 | enrico123 | ok do i need any more files than the .cpp one and i have never done it before |
| 10:53.09 | enrico123 | How do you drop them into the build project? |
| 10:53.22 | Constitution | yes, you the .cpp needs to access files in the bzflag source code, such as bzfsAPI.h |
| 10:53.39 | Constitution | it's best to get bzflag building first, and then try compiling plugins after |
| 10:54.00 | enrico123 | arghhh |
| 10:54.28 | Constitution | if you read that file, I think it says we support building on visual c++ 2008 (I don't think 2010 is supported) |
| 10:54.35 | enrico123 | omg |
| 10:55.09 | Constitution | it may work, but we don't *support* it... unless I'm mistaken. I've never built on windows |
| 10:56.05 | Constitution | if you want to rejoin in about 6 hours, you will probably get better help |
| 10:56.18 | enrico123 | wont be here in 6 hours |
| 10:57.10 | *** join/#bzflag enrico123_ (568c08e4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.140.8.228) |
| 10:57.41 | enrico123_ | so ive opened the bzflag solution (bzflag.exe).... |
| 10:59.07 | enrico123_ | Could you compile it for me plz? |
| 10:59.35 | Constitution | I just told you |
| 10:59.40 | Constitution | I've never built on windows |
| 10:59.47 | Constitution | at least not successfully |
| 11:00.01 | enrico123_ | oh ok |
| 11:02.13 | enrico123_ | ok ty bye |
| 11:02.27 | *** part/#bzflag enrico123_ (568c08e4@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.140.8.228) |
| 11:02.49 | Constitution | wonders what AdminMessage.cpp might do |
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| 15:16.19 | enrico123 | Hi Guys, i just compiled my first Plugin :) |
| 15:19.55 | BulletCatcher | Yay. |
| 15:21.09 | enrico123 | :), It sends a custom -srvmsg to you depending on if you have the COP or ADMIN, perm, Simple but its a start! |
| 15:22.35 | Constitution | congratulations |
| 15:23.31 | enrico123 | Tanks |
| 15:23.34 | enrico123 | *Thanks |
| 15:23.46 | alezakos | lol tanks |
| 15:23.47 | enrico123 | Should i put it on BZBB? |
| 15:28.39 | enrico123 | got a question though |
| 15:29.22 | enrico123 | how do i tell the plugin to make the writing goto the next line cuse at the minute the message just squishes on to one line |
| 15:30.13 | alezakos | I send another message |
| 15:31.42 | enrico123 | ok |
| 15:31.49 | enrico123 | how? |
| 15:33.11 | trepan | bz_sendTextMessage(...) |
| 15:33.14 | trepan | then ... |
| 15:33.14 | trepan | [A |
| 15:33.16 | trepan | bz_sendTextMessage(...) |
| 15:33.21 | trepan | (withouth the [A ;) |
| 15:34.15 | enrico123 | atm it says std::string admin[adminMessages] = {"Hey %s,looks like you are a COP;Hey all, Hide! %s joined!,Great.\.\. %s joined.\.\. *Sigh*., Oh no! Not %s again!"}; std::string cop[copMessages] = {"Please welcome %s!, Oley, Oley Oley, Oley! %s, Hey everyone, please welcome %s, a featured player!, Yay! %s joined!"}; i havent changed the message yet |
| 15:34.50 | alezakos | It would be better to paste lines of code on pastebin.com |
| 15:35.09 | enrico123 | ok i will do that |
| 15:36.00 | enrico123 | http://pastebin.com/R74p2shJ |
| 15:36.11 | enrico123 | how do i make the message go over 4 lines? |
| 15:36.17 | trepan | split it up |
| 15:36.28 | enrico123 | how? |
| 15:36.35 | trepan | with a text editor |
| 15:36.43 | enrico123 | what would i do to it? |
| 15:37.00 | enrico123 | add ;? |
| 15:37.38 | enrico123 | would i just copy the code twice? |
| 15:38.52 | trepan | pastebin your complete file |
| 15:40.15 | trepan | it looks like you lack basic C skills (based on your message strings / arrays) |
| 15:42.42 | enrico123 | hmm i posted the edit |
| 15:42.48 | enrico123 | http://pastebin.com/j9vSUV9v |
| 15:43.26 | trepan | http://www.cplusplus.com/doc/tutorial/ |
| 15:44.00 | alezakos | http://pastebin.com/w0fvyJti |
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| 15:59.17 | enrico123 | This is the whole code http://pastebin.com/pGiZeg1D |
| 16:00.30 | alezakos | highlight C++ to make it easier to read --> http://pastebin.com/Hk8K5NrH |
| 16:02.21 | Flash | that may not compile. initializing an array explicitly may need std::string rather than char const* |
| 16:03.28 | enrico123 | idk it does compile |
| 16:03.42 | Flash | ok, it's just not the best C++ :-) |
| 16:05.53 | blast007 | enrico123: are you wanting all the lines of the admin/cop messages to be output, or just a single random line? |
| 16:06.40 | blast007 | there's also not an "ADMIN" or "COP" permission by default, so perhaps you'd want to have it attach to "BAN" and "SHORTBAN" instead? |
| 16:07.17 | enrico123 | 1, All output 2. yeh i will do that |
| 16:07.35 | trepan | Flash: std::string(const CharT*) array initialization shouldn't be an issue |
| 16:28.54 | blast007 | enrico123: for the first thing then, you should be doing a loop, not a rand() ;) |
| 16:30.23 | enrico123 | hmm so i shoul, ty ;) but it says identifier not found |
| 16:32.49 | enrico123 | Oh Done it |
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| 17:14.05 | *** join/#bzflag JefferyM (~JefferyM@67-131-219-2.dia.static.qwest.net) |
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| 17:23.14 | enrico123 | I have posted my source, hows it look http://pastebin.com/X2qi7s88 And sorry i was so foolish earlier |
| 17:30.26 | blast007 | heh, couldn't figure out how to use a for loop? :) |
| 17:31.10 | JefferyM | it's all about the do/while |
| 17:32.58 | enrico123 | lol ;) |
| 17:33.20 | enrico123 | should i? |
| 17:33.54 | blast007 | for the plugin to be useful for other people, you should be reading from external files, and then looping through the lines in said files |
| 17:34.48 | blast007 | and then make it possible to assign a file to any permission with a config file :) |
| 17:35.19 | enrico123 | oh so defining a config file, like -loadplugin "C:\Program Files\BZ\AdminMessage.dll,(The Conf Path)? |
| 17:35.37 | blast007 | yeah |
| 17:35.45 | blast007 | that would be the easy part |
| 17:35.45 | alezakos | you will need to edit a code TOO much |
| 17:35.54 | enrico123 | wow im lost |
| 17:36.03 | blast007 | the hard part is actually reading the config file |
| 17:36.11 | enrico123 | yeah |
| 17:36.38 | blast007 | passing it in just gives the plugin a string of text that it will know is the path to the configuration |
| 17:37.20 | enrico123 | the plugintutorial that i read had a bit in it about defining config files for plugins |
| 17:37.32 | blast007 | some plugins already do it |
| 17:37.39 | blast007 | like serverControl |
| 17:37.47 | enrico123 | yeah il look at that, Nagware? |
| 17:37.57 | blast007 | serverControl for sure |
| 17:38.04 | blast007 | not sure about Nagware |
| 17:39.02 | enrico123 | hmm, pretty sure Nagware Does http://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/bzflag/trunk/bzflag/plugins/nagware/NAGSAMPLE.cfg?revision=12351&view=markup |
| 17:39.26 | alezakos | that's a real configfile |
| 17:39.33 | blast007 | then there you go, another example |
| 17:39.59 | enrico123 | thanks :) |
| 17:43.25 | enrico123 | wow, thats well out of my league |
| 17:43.58 | blast007 | learn more then so you get into that league ;) |
| 17:44.54 | enrico123 | lol :) |
| 17:48.10 | enrico123 | i was just thinking could you do a if statement that was like if playerID bz_hasPerm "kickme" Then bz_kickUser playerID "You have kick me so what do you expect", bool yes? |
| 17:48.44 | enrico123 | im being to enthusiastic arnt i |
| 17:49.04 | enrico123 | ? |
| 17:55.40 | enrico123 | Bye Guys Thanks everybody that helped ;) |
| 18:29.43 | *** join/#bzflag TASAIRES (~TASAIRES@84.121.178.221.dyn.user.ono.com) |
| 18:41.13 | JefferyM | thinks the store is live |
| 18:41.32 | JefferyM | blast007, you arround? |
| 18:57.26 | blast007 | sorta |
| 18:58.05 | blast007 | swapping between computers at the moment, but I'll be here periodically |
| 18:59.06 | JefferyM | when you get a chance could you make store.bzflag.bz redirect to here? http://store.awesomelaser.com/products.php?label=1 |
| 18:59.15 | JefferyM | no rush or anything |
| 19:11.45 | ruskie | aww well still no other than paycrud support :( |
| 19:12.45 | JefferyM | I don't have the resources to do my own credit card transfers |
| 19:13.04 | JefferyM | gimme a couple thousand dollars and sure |
| 19:13.26 | ruskie | how about atleast adding moneybookers? |
| 19:13.55 | ruskie | that should support the microtransaction stuff as well |
| 19:15.07 | JefferyM | what services do that? |
| 19:15.49 | JefferyM | how are they different then paypal? |
| 19:16.58 | JefferyM | and if you are talking about www.moneybookers.com it looks like they only integrate with paypal |
| 19:17.04 | ruskie | erm... |
| 19:17.24 | ruskie | http://www.moneybookers.com/ads/merchant-account/ecommerce-payment-system/ |
| 19:17.27 | JefferyM | sorry with ebay |
| 19:18.01 | JefferyM | what's different about them then paypal? |
| 19:18.14 | ruskie | regulated as a financial service... something I haven't yet seen from paypal yet |
| 19:18.27 | JefferyM | paypal is a bank IIRC |
| 19:18.36 | JefferyM | but in the end what's the differeence to the end user? |
| 19:18.42 | JefferyM | you put in a credit card.. you get stuff |
| 19:18.50 | JefferyM | you don't even need a paypal account |
| 19:18.56 | ruskie | you do actually |
| 19:19.07 | ruskie | atleast last time I tried paying something on a site that used paypal as their processor |
| 19:19.11 | JefferyM | no, I set it up to allow CC payments with out an account |
| 19:19.18 | JefferyM | it's an option |
| 19:19.18 | ruskie | it wanted me to create a paypal account to pay |
| 19:19.20 | JefferyM | I turned it on |
| 19:19.21 | ruskie | hmm |
| 19:19.33 | JefferyM | it should let you ether log in, OR just enter payment info |
| 19:19.48 | JefferyM | then it treats it as a one time payment |
| 19:20.08 | JefferyM | and how long ago did you use paypal? |
| 19:20.11 | blast007 | I would imagine you still have to agree to whatever agreement/TOS paypal has when signing up for an account (in case that's the reason you don't want a paypal account) |
| 19:20.37 | JefferyM | yeah you have to agree to there terms, but you do not have to make an account and maintain it or anythying |
| 19:20.48 | ruskie | Create a PayPal Account or Log In |
| 19:20.51 | blast007 | JefferyM: also, the redirect should work |
| 19:20.52 | ruskie | that's what your payment page says |
| 19:21.04 | JefferyM | they must disallow it in your country then |
| 19:21.05 | ruskie | I can either create an account or login |
| 19:21.15 | JefferyM | cus for me I can just enter payment info |
| 19:21.44 | JefferyM | I don't really have the time to research and implement another payment API |
| 19:21.48 | ruskie | tried it in a clean no-cookies browser session? |
| 19:21.58 | JefferyM | I'm not using a premade store so I can't just 'Turned it on" |
| 19:21.59 | ruskie | just in case something is being set by paypal |
| 19:22.05 | JefferyM | dunno |
| 19:22.09 | JefferyM | don't realy care that much |
| 19:22.41 | JefferyM | dosn't look like the moneybookers do USPS shipping ether |
| 19:23.03 | ruskie | blast007, yeah their TOS/privacy policy aren't something I can agree to... |
| 19:23.12 | JefferyM | then you should not use the internet ;) |
| 19:23.28 | blast007 | then it wouldn't matter if you had to create an account or not |
| 19:23.31 | ruskie | no I simply don't use those services that I don't agree with them... |
| 19:23.32 | blast007 | you'd still have to agree to it |
| 19:23.39 | JefferyM | ok, then no shirts for you |
| 19:23.52 | ruskie | still have the one and the cap ;) |
| 19:24.09 | JefferyM | fun |
| 19:24.24 | JefferyM | it just takes a huge amount of time, and work to support all the different payment systems |
| 19:24.47 | JefferyM | with paypal it's very easy, and integrates with the shipping |
| 19:24.58 | JefferyM | so I am not out of pocket for the cost of printing shipping labels |
| 19:26.14 | blast007 | JefferyM: though actually, it's showing up here as well with either create an account or log in |
| 19:26.20 | JefferyM | hmm |
| 19:26.45 | blast007 | it asks for the payment info on the "create an account" half |
| 19:26.51 | JefferyM | $params['SOLUTIONTYPE'] = 'Mark'; |
| 19:27.00 | JefferyM | that's suposed to make the account optional |
| 19:27.13 | blast007 | it lies |
| 19:27.19 | blast007 | maybe it's cake |
| 19:27.23 | JefferyM | wonder if it's a setting in my paypal prefs |
| 19:27.30 | JefferyM | I did just change it from sandbox to live |
| 19:28.15 | blast007 | hmm, not sure the redirect is 100% right ;) |
| 19:28.26 | JefferyM | where did it send you? |
| 19:28.28 | blast007 | seems like it will work as long as they go straight to store.bzglag.bz |
| 19:28.32 | blast007 | bzflag* |
| 19:28.52 | blast007 | going to store.bzflag.bz/what ==> http://store.awesomelaser.com/products.php?label=1what |
| 19:29.10 | JefferyM | hmmm |
| 19:29.23 | blast007 | I just did a lame Redirect line in the apache config |
| 19:29.25 | JefferyM | put a & at the end of the URL |
| 19:29.28 | blast007 | probably something different I need to do |
| 19:29.28 | JefferyM | then I'll ignore it |
| 19:30.58 | JefferyM | goes to feed |
| 19:31.05 | blast007 | pfft, but that's the easy way! |
| 19:31.15 | ruskie | why not just redirect to: http://store.awesomelaser.com ? |
| 19:32.42 | blast007 | cuz label=1 is for the BZFlag stuff |
| 19:39.11 | blast007 | there, *now* it works right :) |
| 19:39.21 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: 03DonnyBaker 07http://my.bzflag.org * r0 10/w/Special:Log/block: blocked [[User:Wendy Mayer]] with an expiry time of 1 year (account creation disabled): Spamming links to external sites |
| 19:39.32 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: 03DonnyBaker 07http://my.bzflag.org * r0 10/w/Special:Log/delete: |
| 19:39.32 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: deleted "[[Classic Ugg Bailey Boots UK Girl Fans Always Love Clearance]]": |
| 19:39.32 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: content was: 'Very luxurious leather soft and silky smooth, with sheepskin, and |
| 19:39.33 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: mold this great knitting sheepskin cheap ugg boots sale work is a series of |
| 19:39.34 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: waves, n...' (and the only contributor was '[[Special:Contributions/Wendy |
| 19:39.41 | CIA-92 | BZFlag: Mayer|Wendy Mayer]]') |
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| 20:56.02 | JefferyM | blast007, thanks |
| 20:56.16 | JefferyM | ruskie, yeah, I may sell stuff for other projects if I can. |
| 20:57.48 | *** join/#bzflag rigid (~daniel@95-91-157-14-dynip.superkabel.de) |
| 20:58.00 | rigid | ahoy |
| 20:58.15 | JefferyM | the internet is a boat? |
| 20:58.39 | rigid | just wanted to try bzflag and noticed that -window doesn't seem to work (starts in fullscreen anyway) is there something i can do to launch in windowed mode anyway? |
| 20:58.51 | rigid | JefferyM: it's the ocean... maybe ;) |
| 20:58.55 | JefferyM | -window -geometry 800x600 |
| 20:59.21 | rigid | same thing |
| 20:59.34 | JefferyM | what platform are you on? |
| 20:59.48 | rigid | but just noticed that it still uses -stereo interlace (as I used that as a cmdline-option before) |
| 20:59.50 | rigid | linux |
| 21:00.06 | rigid | gentoo, bzflag release 2.0.16 |
| 21:00.07 | JefferyM | you may want to throw away your config file |
| 21:00.18 | JefferyM | in~/.bzf |
| 21:00.25 | blast007 | or delete that line from your config |
| 21:00.30 | JefferyM | yeah |
| 21:00.33 | *** join/#bzflag enrico123 (59c34693@gateway/web/freenode/ip.89.195.70.147) |
| 21:00.44 | blast007 | I forget the command line option for it, but there's also a way to reset it there |
| 21:01.10 | blast007 | -view normal |
| 21:01.15 | rigid | that worked... but now the mousepointer is trapped inside the window... can I "unsnap" it? |
| 21:01.29 | blast007 | Options > Input Settings > Confine Mouse |
| 21:01.47 | *** join/#bzflag sirquine (~quine@adsl-75-37-32-88.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net) |
| 21:01.59 | rigid | great thanks blast007 & JefferyM |
| 21:02.04 | blast007 | np :) |
| 21:02.56 | rigid | ehrm another question... can I somehow have stereo-mode with left screen -> left eye and right-screen right-eye? -view stereo might be what I want but it fails with "Could not set Video Mode: Couldn't find matching GLX visual." |
| 21:03.19 | rigid | best would be windowed (with double width) for me |
| 21:03.21 | JefferyM | it means your driver didn't support it |
| 21:04.17 | JefferyM | what video card do you have? |
| 21:04.23 | rigid | :( |
| 21:04.24 | rigid | nvidia |
| 21:04.29 | JefferyM | what driver? |
| 21:04.35 | JefferyM | the one from nvidia? |
| 21:04.41 | rigid | the closed-source one... yes |
| 21:05.05 | JefferyM | it reported that it could not create a context then |
| 21:05.58 | rigid | i'd basically just need the 2 images from bzflag drawn besides each other. my desktop is 2560x1024... but I guess that's not possible |
| 21:06.08 | rigid | JefferyM: what context exactly? 3D context? |
| 21:06.13 | JefferyM | yeah the GL context |
| 21:06.22 | JefferyM | the sterio stuff is old and very picky about what it does |
| 21:07.16 | JefferyM | what exactly are you trying to do with it? fire it out from projectors? |
| 21:07.17 | rigid | hm... i wonder if I could quickly hack it to generate the stereo images side-to-side |
| 21:07.32 | rigid | it can render them top-to-bottom already, so... |
| 21:07.42 | JefferyM | possibly |
| 21:07.53 | rigid | nope, use it with 3D goggles that have 2 VGA inputs |
| 21:08.06 | JefferyM | if your card can return a single context that wide |
| 21:08.26 | rigid | but projector + polarization filter also would be a nice idea... everyone has those glasses now :) |
| 21:08.32 | JefferyM | how old of a card is it? |
| 21:08.41 | rigid | yes, my desktop is rendered that way |
| 21:08.48 | JefferyM | some limit a context to 2048 wide |
| 21:08.53 | rigid | and the goggles are 640x480 anyway (each eye) |
| 21:09.03 | rigid | so i'd need to render 1280x480 in fact |
| 21:09.46 | blast007 | I know in windows, at least, you can configure displays so that one is on top of the other |
| 21:09.47 | rigid | but for now I have to try it on the desktop first, anyway |
| 21:09.51 | blast007 | assuming the same can be done in linux |
| 21:09.56 | blast007 | and then you could use the stacked mode |
| 21:09.57 | rigid | blast007: yea, read about that in a forum post |
| 21:10.31 | rigid | that might be a better idea with X... just thought because the "stacked" option is already in there |
| 21:10.39 | blast007 | the nvidia xconfig app might be able to do that (of course, back up your xorg config ;) |
| 21:11.05 | rigid | so adding "beside" rendering would be consistent, i'd had a quick look at the code |
| 21:11.20 | blast007 | k |
| 21:11.34 | rigid | yeah, could run the game in a new server maybe |
| 21:12.10 | rigid | another question: are there forks of bzflag that use a different 3d engine? |
| 21:12.24 | JefferyM | none that were ever completed |
| 21:12.32 | JefferyM | a version was started that used CS |
| 21:12.56 | rigid | crystalspace? |
| 21:13.25 | JefferyM | yeah |
| 21:14.21 | JefferyM | the bzflag code is not awesome so it's very hard to just "plug-in" other engines |
| 21:14.26 | rigid | i just looked at ogre3D and thought about their physics-engine might fit nice to the bzflag topic... therefore I wondered... |
| 21:14.27 | JefferyM | it was writen a long time ago |
| 21:14.30 | blast007 | probably easier to just rewrite it with that engine from the start |
| 21:14.41 | JefferyM | sure you could write a new game like bzflag using ogre pretty fast |
| 21:14.44 | rigid | yeah, i guess that would be necessary |
| 21:14.53 | JefferyM | there is nothing worth keeping from the bzflag codebase |
| 21:14.58 | JefferyM | even the models are hardcoded. |
| 21:15.00 | blast007 | our code is not cleanly separated |
| 21:15.10 | blast007 | (or separated at all, in most cases) |
| 21:15.27 | rigid | yeah, with "fork" I meant "compatible"... sure there are loads of bzflag-like games i guess :) |
| 21:15.28 | blast007 | drawing, networking, sound, etc are all mixed together |
| 21:15.33 | JefferyM | it should not take a team more then a couple months to make a new game |
| 21:15.40 | blast007 | not even worth keeping compatible |
| 21:15.40 | trepan | sepaoverated ! |
| 21:15.41 | JefferyM | there is no point in making it compatable |
| 21:15.50 | trepan | you silly people and your modular notions |
| 21:15.50 | JefferyM | the network protcoll is stupid |
| 21:15.59 | trepan | :) |
| 21:16.03 | JefferyM | all the game logic is done by the client |
| 21:16.14 | JefferyM | better to write it proper for the internet from the start |
| 21:16.19 | JefferyM | bzflag is a lan game |
| 21:16.33 | rigid | but lots of people like playing bzflag... they could migrate smoothly while beta-phase |
| 21:16.46 | JefferyM | that would make the project take a lot longer |
| 21:16.50 | JefferyM | just have them install a new game |
| 21:16.54 | JefferyM | and play on new servers |
| 21:16.58 | JefferyM | they would get over it |
| 21:17.07 | JefferyM | really there is NOTHING to keep from bzflag |
| 21:17.09 | blast007 | they already have to do that when we release new major versions |
| 21:17.20 | blast007 | (or, when we *used* to do that) ;) |
| 21:17.29 | rigid | JefferyM: is the server code secure? |
| 21:17.37 | JefferyM | oh god no |
| 21:17.42 | rigid | or "hardened" in terms of public review |
| 21:17.43 | JefferyM | the server is a dumb message relay |
| 21:17.44 | rigid | lol |
| 21:17.50 | JefferyM | bzflag IS A lan game |
| 21:17.54 | blast007 | haha, I saw thinking to myself, "here comes the 'oh god no'" and then it came ;D |
| 21:17.57 | JefferyM | it was never meant to be played on the itnernet |
| 21:17.57 | blast007 | was* |
| 21:18.00 | rigid | rofl |
| 21:18.04 | JefferyM | it was made in 1990 |
| 21:18.06 | rigid | ah k |
| 21:18.21 | JefferyM | thats why cheating is so rampant |
| 21:18.23 | rigid | and has never been improved or further developed? |
| 21:18.26 | JefferyM | slowly |
| 21:18.35 | JefferyM | but it needs a major rewrite |
| 21:18.42 | blast007 | it's been improved somewhat, but god mode is still a one character change |
| 21:18.48 | JefferyM | from the aspect of making it a proper internet game |
| 21:18.53 | JefferyM | more like how modern games do networking |
| 21:19.00 | JefferyM | authorative server state and the like |
| 21:19.06 | JefferyM | the clients should be dumb, not the server |
| 21:19.32 | JefferyM | so really it would be better if it was all redone from the ground up, using existing libs |
| 21:20.10 | JefferyM | and if you maintain any kind of compatability with old clients or servers, you can't get that new game logic that is al on the server. |
| 21:20.36 | blast007 | it would be a pain in the butt even trying to do it |
| 21:20.38 | JefferyM | heck, bzflag could just be made as a mod on top of something like quake 3 |
| 21:20.47 | JefferyM | its' not very complex gameplay |
| 21:20.49 | rigid | i agree totally... security (network code design) must be a major issue when caring for compatibility i guess |
| 21:21.14 | blast007 | rigid: we break compatability to get people to upgrade |
| 21:21.26 | JefferyM | that's why V3 isn't compatable with V2 |
| 21:21.33 | rigid | that's why I wondered... foss-games would make the perfect modding/forking-playgrund |
| 21:21.36 | blast007 | 1.10 can't play on 1.7, 2.0.x can't play on 1.10 or 1.7 |
| 21:22.07 | JefferyM | wants to make it like WOW, just force em to patch on each launch |
| 21:22.24 | blast007 | I do like the C# idea for that |
| 21:22.34 | JefferyM | you can do it with out C# |
| 21:22.36 | blast007 | minimal launcher, and have it pull down the game |
| 21:22.40 | alezakos | that's not easy, BZFlag is open-source |
| 21:22.41 | blast007 | well, I mean for ease |
| 21:22.44 | rigid | why not just lock'em out after a certain while? only current version and previous version allowed |
| 21:22.44 | JefferyM | make a C++ core then do all the guts in lua |
| 21:22.58 | JefferyM | rigid, that's what we do now |
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| 21:23.08 | JefferyM | each major version is incompatable |
| 21:23.41 | rigid | blast007: if you want to have someone who continues contributing code if lead-developers get bored, i'd not use C# ... C or C++ :-/ |
| 21:23.58 | JefferyM | C# is wicked cool |
| 21:24.04 | rigid | i guess thats fine |
| 21:24.04 | JefferyM | same bin runs on all platforms ;) |
| 21:24.12 | blast007 | rigid: using C/C++ hasn't kept people motivated here ;) |
| 21:24.15 | JefferyM | only one deployable |
| 21:24.17 | blast007 | development is dead |
| 21:24.20 | JefferyM | bzflag is dead |
| 21:24.50 | rigid | JefferyM: yeah like java... but i didn't mean the coolness but the amount of people who use it (or will use it in the future) |
| 21:25.10 | JefferyM | C# use is going up, java is going down |
| 21:25.23 | blast007 | I can build a C# app on my PC and run it on my Nokia N800, my linux system, or a mac |
| 21:25.23 | JefferyM | it's also a lot easier to deploy on the majority of platforms |
| 21:25.27 | blast007 | or any other platform mono supports |
| 21:25.42 | blast007 | the same binary |
| 21:25.43 | JefferyM | on windows, you got the runtimes installed, on mac, you can pack them into the .app |
| 21:25.48 | rigid | blast007: it doesn't motivate more or less I guess (although it IS more slowly to develop) but there's simply more people who are able to contribute if they like to |
| 21:25.51 | JefferyM | linux just needs the mono package |
| 21:25.57 | *** part/#bzflag alezakos (~alezakos@unaffiliated/alezakos) |
| 21:26.18 | JefferyM | rigid, as he said, we are C++ now and development isn't taking off ;) |
| 21:26.23 | rigid | best would be a decent ABI system so ppl could choose their own language to contribute |
| 21:26.25 | JefferyM | in fact it's stagnating bigtime |
| 21:26.39 | rigid | i guess the industries closed-source way for that would be LUA |
| 21:26.40 | JefferyM | be sure to add that to your rewrite ;) |
| 21:26.54 | blast007 | we probably have more CIA.vc messages dealing with wiki spam than we do with coding |
| 21:26.55 | rigid | hehe |
| 21:27.11 | blast007 | (recently, I mean) |
| 21:27.18 | JefferyM | well the past year |
| 21:27.22 | blast007 | yeah |
| 21:27.53 | blast007 | even ohloh agrees: http://www.ohloh.net/p/bzflag/factoids/4043146 |
| 21:28.16 | rigid | did people leave for rewrite-projects or something? |
| 21:28.19 | JefferyM | it has for a while |
| 21:28.29 | JefferyM | no, people just don't care |
| 21:28.38 | JefferyM | it's an old project with not real direction or management |
| 21:28.45 | JefferyM | it's just time for it to die |
| 21:28.45 | Chestal | hmm, seems I cannot see the solar eclipse in bz, is the draw order wrong or is the dark part of the moon not drawn at all? |
| 21:29.28 | JefferyM | I don't think it's drawn |
| 21:29.35 | rigid | JefferyM: yeah but normally projects don't die without a replacement... |
| 21:29.35 | JefferyM | it's cut out of the geometry |
| 21:29.39 | Chestal | that's disappointing |
| 21:29.44 | JefferyM | rigid, sure they do. |
| 21:29.59 | JefferyM | games are not word processors |
| 21:30.05 | rigid | yeah but only if there's no use for them (anymore) |
| 21:30.06 | JefferyM | and there are more dead open source games then anything |
| 21:30.18 | *** join/#bzflag alezakos (~kongr45gp@unaffiliated/alezakos) |
| 21:30.21 | JefferyM | people get bored of games and move to other ones |
| 21:30.28 | JefferyM | they don't have to be "replacements" |
| 21:30.33 | JefferyM | do you still play doom? |
| 21:30.57 | blast007 | I do, but only when I want to show off rockbox on my Sansa :P |
| 21:31.02 | joevano | i play Doom III on my iPhone ;-) |
| 21:31.02 | rigid | JefferyM: that would mean game-concepts aren't repeating and every game would be an innovation ;) |
| 21:31.03 | JefferyM | heh |
| 21:31.16 | JefferyM | bzflag is a simple FPS game |
| 21:31.18 | rigid | JefferyM: doom successor would be quake i guess? |
| 21:31.20 | JefferyM | there are many like it |
| 21:31.23 | JefferyM | indeed |
| 21:31.28 | JefferyM | and the hundreds of other games |
| 21:31.36 | JefferyM | by the hundreds of other projects |
| 21:31.39 | JefferyM | people move on |
| 21:31.58 | JefferyM | they don't have to move on to a "tank game where one shot kills" |
| 21:32.26 | JefferyM | cube could be considered a bassic replacement for bzflag |
| 21:32.47 | rigid | it's not just FPS, it's a tank battle game (isn't it?) |
| 21:33.04 | rigid | are there any other foss tank-games like bzflag? |
| 21:33.27 | rigid | couldnt find anything else |
| 21:33.35 | JefferyM | no it's a FPS game where your model is a tank ;) |
| 21:33.48 | JefferyM | and all shots do 100% damage |
| 21:33.59 | rigid | JefferyM: i guess a recode of bzflag could also have a brand-new "armour" feature :) |
| 21:34.03 | JefferyM | the model could be a dude and it'd play the same |
| 21:34.17 | JefferyM | it would be nice to have that as an option yes |
| 21:34.25 | rigid | yeah ok, but that's just the amount of complexity |
| 21:34.25 | JefferyM | some people would like more complex gameplay |
| 21:34.33 | JefferyM | yeah it's all just variables |
| 21:34.42 | rigid | i'm talking about the gamers view |
| 21:35.22 | rigid | i guess i have to play it to get an image ;) |
| 21:35.50 | JefferyM | the rico shots are pretty much the only thing that most FPSs don't have |
| 21:36.01 | JefferyM | the rest is pretty bassic |
| 21:36.08 | JefferyM | man I can't type today |
| 21:36.50 | rigid | am I right that I can't play without a server? there's no simple single-player mode? |
| 21:37.08 | JefferyM | bzflag is a multi player network game |
| 21:37.15 | JefferyM | it has no inhereht single player mode |
| 21:37.23 | JefferyM | you can start a local server and join it with bots |
| 21:37.26 | JefferyM | but that's about it |
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| 23:32.09 | Murielle | x |
| 23:32.14 | JefferyM | y |
| 23:33.00 | Murielle | whodare to unsilence me? I asked for a permanent silencing mode!!! |
| 23:33.40 | *** join/#bzflag Murielle (~Murielle@unaffiliated/murielle) |
| 23:37.20 | JefferyM | why even bother coming in if you want to be silenced |
| 23:52.28 | JefferyM | delusional, I just got the stickers, I'll throw them in the next 11 orders :) |
| 23:54.44 | delusional | sounds good, I was using up a couple today, forgot how hard they are to stick correctly.. there's lots of small cuts |
| 23:55.30 | JefferyM | yeah, the design could be tweaked to make it simpler |
| 23:58.34 | mrapple | delusional: did you send me mine? :D |
| 23:58.57 | delusional | i had 60 of them at one point... surprised I sent out that many |
| 23:59.20 | delusional | mrapple: yours was sent last week |
| 23:59.49 | mrapple | hm, it aint here yet :( |