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| 11:09.42 | tobylane | im starting to think super bullet is pathetic as well |
| 11:10.03 | tobylane | do most ctf games have the cap spot, flag spawn and player spawn all on the same place? i havnt played many |
| 11:10.35 | tobylane | also, the player is pretty big for the world size, you can do far too well in this game without looking |
| 11:11.00 | ruskie | tobylane, actually no you can't |
| 11:11.11 | ruskie | SB is good if not set to insanely |
| 11:11.51 | tobylane | its the same with laser, you cant protect newly spawning people, which is desperately needed, without stopping the last second chance to kill a capper |
| 11:12.13 | ruskie | base, flag spawn, flag safe, player zones are all settable |
| 11:12.23 | ruskie | erm |
| 11:12.26 | tobylane | which just means i think there should be some sort of box to cap, and you can only jump in no jump maps when you're nearly there to get on top |
| 11:12.34 | tobylane | is the first spawn settable |
| 11:12.43 | ruskie | I think so |
| 11:12.47 | ruskie | not sure though |
| 11:13.16 | tobylane | must be, i think one of jefferys is like that |
| 11:13.51 | ruskie | I tend to play on viper's two castle |
| 11:13.53 | tobylane | still, people are maxing out the patheticness of the game, taking advantage of a game where you can spawnkill and geno and so on, its just not worth it |
| 11:15.32 | ruskie | world weapons make that a had thing |
| 11:15.35 | ruskie | erm hard |
| 11:16.47 | ruskie | and in a well organised team spawnkillers tend to get quickly eliminated |
| 11:17.41 | ruskie | and wrt to your far to well without looking comment... try it sometime... dependengi on the map and players you can be extremly lucky or you actually need some skill to play |
| 11:21.02 | tobylane | wrt? |
| 11:21.28 | ruskie | with regard to |
| 11:21.33 | tobylane | well yeah, but it takes one person to spawnkill, and three+ to make sure there arent any |
| 11:21.39 | ruskie | not really |
| 11:21.45 | ruskie | again depends on the map |
| 11:22.19 | ruskie | but iirc most maps have large spawn zones after being killed |
| 11:22.22 | tobylane | somewhere popular like mw2, would do well with some sort of undercarry to the normal spawnbox, and have the top as just the cap area and team flag spawn |
| 11:22.48 | ruskie | only on cap(and a world weapon solves that well) or new joiners get hit by that |
| 11:22.50 | tobylane | i might try t make that |
| 11:23.36 | ruskie | try playing on viper sometime |
| 11:23.46 | tobylane | ok |
| 12:41.31 | tobylane | whats end shot detection |
| 12:48.16 | joevano | tobylane: all of your complaints are map related... not the games fault |
| 12:48.30 | joevano | complain @ the map maker, not us |
| 12:50.36 | tobylane | why does the game have geno, rico, rouges and something else where so few other games do |
| 12:51.10 | tobylane | in most games people max out the patheticness of the game, but here that actually goes far from normal play |
| 12:51.17 | joevano | because we aren't them... don't like it we don't force you to play |
| 12:51.25 | tobylane | or improve |
| 12:51.44 | tobylane | theres a good reason why those things often make games boring, and why its so rare |
| 12:52.16 | joevano | again... these are MAP maker issues... not the game |
| 12:52.22 | tobylane | how? you put geno in |
| 12:52.44 | joevano | it's all in how the tools are used |
| 12:53.04 | tobylane | you really love your 2nd amendmant, democrat? |
| 12:53.19 | tobylane | whats end shot detection |
| 12:54.02 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o joevano] by ChanServ |
| 12:54.20 | tobylane | i still dont see the point in any of them |
| 12:54.31 | tobylane | rouges for example, its mixing ffa and ctf/team games |
| 12:54.41 | joevano | it is when a shot ends when the game doesn't think it should i believe |
| 12:55.05 | joevano | right... but again... it is the map |
| 12:55.17 | tobylane | why have the tools there for no good use |
| 12:55.41 | joevano | i dont like rouge on CTF maps either, so guess what, I don't play those maps |
| 12:56.14 | tobylane | is 3 doing anything different, like koth and others i dont know of |
| 12:56.21 | joevano | we are not there to say exactly how a tool is to be used, it stifles innovation |
| 12:56.40 | tobylane | ... the tool does nothing but stifle fun |
| 12:56.59 | joevano | no your bad attitude does |
| 12:57.13 | tobylane | a gun maker can sell a gun, but if one type of gun is loved by murders only they might not sell it |
| 12:57.31 | tobylane | the stuff making it boring is there boring me making me speak |
| 12:57.50 | joevano | tobylane: wrong, if it sells they will make it |
| 12:58.18 | TutTankAhmon | false example : in a real world no weapon is never used by only one kind of people |
| 12:58.21 | joevano | your best bet is to play or don't makes no difference to me |
| 12:58.21 | tobylane | you have odd ethics.. |
| 12:58.40 | tobylane | how about a non effective referendum |
| 12:59.26 | TutTankAhmon | tobylane: it's just like if you were complaining to a movie theater owner that the movie you just seen was bad |
| 12:59.29 | joevano | tobylane: there are plenty of other games in the world... this one obviosly isn't for you |
| 12:59.42 | joevano | i'm done discussing it |
| 12:59.44 | tobylane | why do i have to leave sucky games as they are, with things no other game has |
| 13:00.04 | tobylane | TutTankAhmon, this is a work in progress |
| 13:00.15 | TutTankAhmon | borrow a server , make your own map , admin it |
| 13:00.25 | joevano | it is your opinion... but it is not shared by the majority of the players |
| 13:00.38 | tobylane | i am, but when i fix the most popular map all i can do is send it back to the hoster and maker |
| 13:00.52 | tobylane | joe whens the last time you asked? |
| 13:01.03 | tobylane | people just accept it, because sometimes they do well with it |
| 13:01.32 | joevano | tobylane: this is open source... fork the project and make it the way you want |
| 13:01.48 | tobylane | and its a free game, so they dont expect the same high calibre of people of paid games, and mght not expect the project to change much, but it can do far more so than retail games |
| 13:01.56 | tobylane | why? you have something pathetic, why? |
| 13:02.39 | tobylane | even if you ignore all those reasons why people might not be sure which way to vote, you should prove me wrong and have a mass poll |
| 13:03.08 | tobylane | the forums are levered towards the skilled, capable of evening out geno and so on so they hit a lot more than the average |
| 13:03.28 | TutTankAhmon | some ppl play bzflag as a coffee break game ; other play it more seriously ; everybody can find his own intereste int |
| 13:04.03 | tobylane | who would not benefit from removing the things no other game has? the people depending on geno to have a high score? |
| 13:05.20 | TutTankAhmon | geno is great; when you have it |
| 13:05.33 | tobylane | exactly, thats 1 v 10 people or so |
| 13:05.51 | TutTankAhmon | theres' no justice in bzflag super flags |
| 13:05.52 | tobylane | its not worth it for the fun of one person |
| 13:05.54 | TutTankAhmon | it's random |
| 13:06.06 | tobylane | and geno is an exception |
| 13:06.10 | TutTankAhmon | if you want justice, (except lag issues), play ducati gu or pillbox |
| 13:06.28 | tobylane | i do, but still, pathetic things exist |
| 13:06.30 | joevano | tobylane: if geno is so ban why is MW the most poppular map most of the time |
| 13:06.41 | tobylane | no idea |
| 13:06.49 | TutTankAhmon | i never play on MW personaly |
| 13:06.52 | tobylane | i like it, its the closest thing to amazing on this game |
| 13:07.14 | tobylane | that map has geno specific flaws, but the game as a whole |
| 13:07.28 | tobylane | geno kills are generally little more skilled than a normal kill |
| 13:07.50 | TutTankAhmon | why are the most seen TV shows generally the more stupid ? |
| 13:07.54 | tobylane | im not calling it scientific, but when i obs i see about a third of geno killings worth more than one point |
| 13:08.01 | tobylane | its funny |
| 13:08.19 | tobylane | you're not in it, someone is at a loss but its probably a fictional character |
| 13:09.49 | TutTankAhmon | let the poor noob whose *ss has been hardly kicked on GU a place to say : ok me too i can kill ppl (with G) |
| 13:10.18 | tobylane | the trouble (more so in mw2) is getting to a place to shoot with g than actually killing with g |
| 13:10.35 | tobylane | geno users are more skilled, but the killings generally arent |
| 13:10.49 | tobylane | and it just affects too many people |
| 13:11.43 | TutTankAhmon | if i see MW popularity, you're the only one that has problems with this server |
| 13:12.01 | TutTankAhmon | if it's allways crowded , it means that noobs can stay their |
| 13:12.09 | TutTankAhmon | *there |
| 13:12.24 | TutTankAhmon | frsutration must not be that big |
| 13:12.39 | tobylane | when i say what the problem is, others agree |
| 13:13.07 | tobylane | and the fact alone that when one team is doing better, it can go from 10 10 to 10 7 in a few minutes of a lot of geno |
| 13:13.07 | TutTankAhmon | ok : then , create Missile war bis, without G ! |
| 13:13.14 | joevano | again a MAP related issue |
| 13:13.22 | TutTankAhmon | joevano+1 |
| 13:13.50 | TutTankAhmon | if what you say is true, in a couple of weeks, nobody will stay on MW and all ppl will switch on MW bis |
| 13:13.53 | tobylane | that map just puts geno on a pedastal, literally, predictably, that shows geno |
| 13:13.54 | joevano | take this to #bzflag-chat and quit cluttering up the dev channel please |
| 13:14.05 | joevano | this discussion is done here |
| 13:14.15 | tobylane | yeah bbl |
| 13:14.55 | joevano | not here tobylane if all you are going to do is continue this discussion |
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| 14:15.57 | Chestal | geno, must have been years since I last carried that flag, I almost forgot it existed |
| 14:16.30 | Chestal | it's a fun flag though, but only if the teams work well |
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| 15:19.06 | ak|ra | HA |
| 15:19.08 | ak|ra | greetings |
| 15:19.46 | blast007 | hello |
| 15:22.01 | ak|ra | just lurks around to see when (if) Chestal awakes ... |
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| 21:51.29 | remote | is there an easy way to make a small version of a map? |
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| 21:51.49 | remote | i'm wanting to reduce a world from 400 to 300 |
| 21:51.53 | mrapplecomputer1 | small as in KB or size and playability area |
| 21:52.04 | mrapplecomputer1 | oh, no not really |
| 21:52.06 | remote | thought there might be a script that does that |
| 21:52.15 | mrapplecomputer1 | i have a program that does |
| 21:52.21 | remote | i'm interested |
| 21:52.24 | mrapplecomputer1 | but doesnt do decimals |
| 21:52.26 | mrapplecomputer1 | ;) |
| 21:52.40 | remote | i'm not an experienced map maker what do decimals do? |
| 21:52.49 | mrapplecomputer1 | decimals as in the number |
| 21:52.54 | mrapplecomputer1 | 1.3 |
| 21:53.02 | remote | let me check my map |
| 21:53.27 | remote | all decimals are zero'd |
| 21:53.35 | remote | it should be a trivial fix |
| 21:53.48 | mrapplecomputer1 | it doesnt matter, the script doesnt take decimals |
| 21:53.58 | remote | i can remove them all |
| 21:54.10 | mrapplecomputer1 | so if you wanted to make it 300 WU you would need to give the script a vaule of 1.3 |
| 21:54.20 | mrapplecomputer1 | im not talking about the decimals in the map file |
| 21:54.21 | remote | oh |
| 21:54.25 | mrapplecomputer1 | ;) |
| 21:54.39 | remote | in what language is your script? |
| 21:54.47 | mrapplecomputer1 | C# |
| 21:54.55 | mrapplecomputer1 | its a .exe i got from a friend :) |
| 21:54.55 | remote | hides |
| 21:55.03 | remote | runs |
| 21:55.05 | remote | :) |
| 21:55.09 | mrapplecomputer1 | so i dont have the source, sorry |
| 21:55.20 | mrapplecomputer1 | but i can make the map 200 in size ;) |
| 21:55.34 | mrapplecomputer1 | you could also group all of the objects, then just set size to like 0.7 0.7 0.7 |
| 21:55.36 | remote | you know my problematic |
| 21:55.44 | remote | it's HIX 400 size is too large for 2 vs 2 |
| 21:55.51 | mrapplecomputer1 | haha |
| 21:55.54 | mrapplecomputer1 | i already have a mini hix |
| 21:55.59 | remote | 300 ? |
| 21:55.59 | mrapplecomputer1 | so do alot of other people |
| 21:56.01 | mrapplecomputer1 | no |
| 21:56.06 | mrapplecomputer1 | 200 |
| 21:56.09 | mrapplecomputer1 | its fine though |
| 21:56.17 | remote | how big is standard ducati? |
| 21:56.23 | mrapplecomputer1 | idk |
| 21:56.27 | mrapplecomputer1 | 400 i guesse |
| 21:56.31 | remote | i think it's 300 |
| 21:56.36 | mrapplecomputer1 | really? |
| 21:56.39 | remote | yes |
| 21:56.42 | remote | let me check |
| 21:56.51 | mrapplecomputer1 | let me check |
| 21:56.56 | mrapplecomputer1 | lol oops :P |
| 21:58.08 | mrapplecomputer1 | its 400 |
| 21:58.36 | remote | official match server? |
| 21:59.40 | remote | ls |
| 22:01.25 | remote | i can't see the world size in the worlds i save |
| 22:04.44 | mrapplecomputer1 | its 400 then |
| 22:07.35 | *** join/#bzflag kierra (n=jolie@unaffiliated/kierra) |
| 22:07.39 | remote | so i don't need to make a smaller map |
| 22:07.40 | remote | hey kierra |
| 22:07.54 | mrapplecomputer1 | umm i guess :P |
| 22:07.54 | kierra | hey remote! |
| 22:08.23 | remote | kierra: are you aware of how official match servers work on ol? |
| 22:08.42 | kierra | why do you ask? |
| 22:08.54 | remote | because I've discussed with monster about HIXBOX |
| 22:09.05 | remote | and we want an HIXBOX map on openleague |
| 22:09.23 | kierra | monster knows to send the configs of the map to zaphod and ash3 |
| 22:09.27 | kierra | ahs3 |
| 22:09.46 | remote | ahs3 is hosting one hixbox 2 teams CTF that could be used for official |
| 22:10.11 | remote | but i don't think it works for official match |
| 22:10.13 | remote | can you verify |
| 22:10.19 | remote | bzbattleground.com 5682 |
| 22:10.21 | kierra | just make him aware that its an official OL map....15, 20, 30 in timers |
| 22:10.25 | remote | 5672* |
| 22:10.27 | kierra | hmm |
| 22:10.35 | kierra | let me pm him on OL |
| 22:10.45 | remote | ok |
| 22:10.48 | remote | what about zaphod's version |
| 22:10.57 | remote | i mean who decides what maps are accepted on OL |
| 22:11.05 | kierra | should be same configs for both |
| 22:11.07 | remote | because right now there's zaphod version and my version |
| 22:11.13 | kierra | hmmm |
| 22:11.21 | remote | no zaphod added bases along with other structures |
| 22:11.33 | remote | as per his message on my forum thread on ol |
| 22:12.05 | kierra | i take it you prefer yours over his |
| 22:12.30 | remote | well his might be interesting, it's a personal preference Monster and I are sharing |
| 22:12.46 | kierra | well, Monster is head map judge |
| 22:12.57 | remote | zaphod is right it's GPL so he can do whatever he wants with it i'm just concerned about some confusion there might be between HIXATI (his version) and HIXBOX |
| 22:13.02 | kierra | the buck stops with me if there is conflict |
| 22:13.26 | remote | and what version was approved for OL, his or mine? |
| 22:13.35 | remote | it's just questions we need to clear out i think |
| 22:13.53 | kierra | at the time, I didnt realize the difference |
| 22:14.01 | kierra | let me talk to mons and zaph |
| 22:14.08 | *** join/#bzflag R0b0t1 (n=Enigma@unaffiliated/r0b0t1) |
| 22:14.25 | remote | wait i'm not saying the entire story; we agreed on was to run his version on bzflag.fr and my version on bzbattleground.com and see which one people play on |
| 22:14.31 | remote | i forgot about that |
| 22:14.49 | kierra | :) |
| 22:14.56 | remote | so my real question is where's my version of the map that i can play offi match on? :) |
| 22:15.03 | kierra | you're too young to be that forgetful....thats my department |
| 22:15.19 | remote | maybe bzbattleground.com is off but it doesn't support /countdown (does that say we can't offi on it) ? |
| 22:15.43 | kierra | no countdown, no official.....prob an oversite on ahs3's part |
| 22:15.55 | remote | i'll send him a message |
| 22:15.57 | kierra | give him a heads up on it |
| 22:16.07 | remote | i'd like to keep a public version of the map somewhere too since alot of people seem to like it |
| 22:16.23 | kierra | Constitution could help you with that |
| 22:16.27 | kierra | CA server |
| 22:17.03 | remote | i can host it i have a server with decent bandwidth |
| 22:17.20 | mrapplecomputer1 | would also be willing to :D |
| 22:18.21 | remote | feel free to do so the map is in the bzflag forums |
| 22:18.50 | remote | make something original maybe 4 teams CTF to see if that works or i know zaphod removed a rogue only map that had success and many players played it |
| 22:18.53 | mrapplecomputer1 | sure |
| 22:29.20 | remote | i also sent you an OL invite to my team or invite you to make your own team to play the map |
| 22:29.30 | remote | i have a few players who are online but we need opponents :) |
| 22:29.36 | mrapplecomputer1 | ok |
| 22:34.57 | kierra | hugs brlcad |
| 22:35.01 | kierra | adios |
| 22:35.10 | *** part/#bzflag kierra (n=jolie@unaffiliated/kierra) |
| 22:36.13 | brlcad | drive by hugging! |
| 22:38.26 | *** join/#bzflag ramirez (n=ramirez@189.124.144.197) |
| 22:38.44 | remote | i've discoverted bzflag in debugging mode had some options unavailable in normal mode |
| 22:38.59 | remote | and i played around with the hidden lines option |
| 22:39.05 | blast007 | yes, some of which shouldn't be used for playing |
| 22:39.28 | remote | my question is i really like to play with hidden lines on but i always have to enable to option when i restart the game |
| 22:39.36 | remote | can i somehow make it default? |
| 22:39.41 | blast007 | change the code |
| 22:39.55 | remote | i don't do cpp |
| 22:40.03 | blast007 | then no, you can't |
| 22:40.10 | remote | bah |
| 22:40.15 | remote | have you played with hidden lines? |
| 22:40.22 | remote | i think it's great |
| 22:40.30 | blast007 | it's interesting |
| 22:40.56 | blast007 | can you even tell what teams the tanks are on with that? |
| 22:41.30 | remote | yeah you see tanks with green lines for example and tanks with red lines |
| 22:41.35 | remote | you see bullet colors and all |
| 22:41.36 | blast007 | ah |
| 22:41.41 | remote | on a black background |
| 22:42.04 | remote | earlier on zaphod's random dupi map it was all purple becuase of a setting he made but usually it's black |
| 22:42.18 | remote | i just like it darker it's easier for the eyes i guess |
| 22:42.23 | brlcad | remote: there's probably some foo you could put in your cofig file |
| 22:42.46 | remote | some foo? |
| 22:42.49 | blast007 | brlcad: if it's not a persistent setting, it probably just gets discarded when the config is written |
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| 22:44.36 | brlcad | right, so if it's manually set, it should load it back up until he does something that changes the config |
| 22:45.40 | remote | i could just chattr +i bzflag config |
| 22:45.56 | remote | so it never gets overwritten by the bzflag process |
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