IRC log for #bzflag on 20090903

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03:04.31*** topic/#bzflag is Server side lua was re-added || global login down due to sql optimising || http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || Latest Release: 2.0.12 (linux), 2.0.10 (everyone else)
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13:21.28temp_distBZBB mods - spammer - http://my.bzflag.org/bb/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=44124
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14:06.36joevanothanks temp_dist
14:07.10CBGHas spamming like that EVER worked...?
14:07.40CBGI know (or at least I hope) it's automated, but still must take time to set up... And for what?
14:07.58joevanoyeah I really dont get it either
14:08.16temp_distit must work somewhere sometimes or they wouldn't do it
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16:56.14Supra7hey... for some reason i cant log in to Ducatiwannabe Missile Wars
16:56.26Supra7can anyone help me with that?
17:03.09ts~bzflist
17:06.38joevanoSupra7: probably not... you ISP has been banned from that server
17:06.47Supra7what??
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17:06.51Supra7why?
17:06.53Supra7that's crazy
17:06.53joevanomore than once I might add...
17:07.01Supra7the whole isp?????
17:07.14joevanonot really.. and there are plenty of other servers
17:07.21Supra7yeah true
17:07.27Supra7but still i do love playing there
17:07.29joevanoyes.. the whole ISP
17:07.48Supra7so everyone from bellsouth in the US is banned?
17:08.22joevanowell actually not the whole ISP.. just asm.bellsouth.net
17:08.43Supra7oh ... well i cant change my carrier
17:08.44joevanoso wahtever asm stands for is banned
17:08.54Supra7probably a dsl designation
17:09.04Supra7gz... guess we need to start our own server then
17:09.18joevanoright, so I guess you'll play on another server
17:09.23Supra7maybe a missile wars for only bellsouth
17:09.29Supra7hmm we could do that
17:09.55joevanono you could not, as misslewars has not been publicly released
17:10.00Supra7any way to get the map?
17:10.06Supra7that's kind of messed up
17:10.14Supra7nothing says we cant host it
17:10.15joevanoyou would need permission to host the map
17:10.26Supra7permission from whom?
17:10.32Supra7i thought bzflag was open source?
17:10.44joevanoyou won't host it using our public list server
17:10.56Supra7hmm maybe host something like it
17:11.13Supra7you *can* patent derivatives
17:11.17joevanothe game is, but the creator of the map has the rights to their map
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17:11.56Supra7are you the server owner?
17:12.01joevanothe map is not open source.. it is copyrighted..so no derivatives of it are not ok
17:12.14Supra7yeah you can patent derivatives
17:12.27Supra7that's a well known fact
17:12.33Supra7just cant be the same thing
17:12.38joevanothis is not a patent issue.. it is copyright
17:12.51Supra7umm what the hell do you think a patent is?
17:13.00joevanonot the same...
17:13.19Supra7you can do a derivative... just cant be reasonably the same
17:13.24CBGSupra7: what the hell makes you think you can steal someone elses work and change it slightly without their permission?
17:13.29joevanoand watch your language please
17:13.37Supra7tell CBG joevano
17:13.50CBGPiss off, troll.
17:13.50Supra7that's what i thought
17:14.11joevanohe is just responding in kind and he knows already...
17:14.33Supra7ok fair enough
17:14.38CBGjoevano can ban me for all he likes, as long as you know this: copyright infrigement is against the law and the owner of missilewar will not hesitate to file a lawsuit.
17:14.52Supra7lol
17:14.54joevanolmsg chanserv op #bzflag
17:15.01*** mode/#bzflag [+o joevano] by ChanServ
17:15.21CBGSecond time's the charm.
17:15.28Supra7man you guys have created a lot of bad karma for yourselves
17:15.29joevanoSupra7: he speaks the truth
17:15.35Supra7as do i
17:15.36spldartwow
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17:15.44Supra7lots and lots
17:15.51Supra7but that's your problems
17:15.54Supra7see ya guys
17:15.56spldartSupra7
17:15.56*** part/#bzflag Supra7 (n=chatzill@adsl-88-79-96.asm.bellsouth.net)
17:16.00spldarthave anything ...
17:16.07spldart..constructive... hehehehe
17:16.22CBGArsewipe.
17:16.33joevanohe was a ttroll and I think I know exactly wh o it was
17:16.33spldartRight?
17:19.54CIA-72BZFlag: 03208.53.138.21 07http://my.bzflag.org * r6663 10/w/Getting_Started: /* Downloading and installing the game */
17:22.15CIA-72BZFlag: 03DonnyBaker 07http://my.bzflag.org * r6664 10/w/Getting_Started: Reverted edits by [[Special:Contributions/208.53.138.21|208.53.138.21]] ([[User talk:208.53.138.21|Talk]]); changed back to last version by [[User:75.72.60.35|75.72.60.35]]
17:23.48joevanoif I had my guess Supra7 was polydektes or SpongeBob Sp//pants
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17:35.38Supra7joevano & CBG if you guys weren't such condescending jerks, you wouldnt have all the bad karma you guys have been getting im sure
17:35.52Supra7not so much directed to you two as to the whole community
17:36.07Supra7sorry to single you two out only
17:36.19Supra7as a whole you guys have been jerks
17:36.32joevanobad karma... karma where and who really cares
17:36.32Supra7even to kids who just waned to play
17:36.32Supra7exactly joevano
17:36.39Supra7you prove it by your words
17:36.45joevanoyou can play.. just not on that server
17:36.59Supra7it's not even just about that server
17:37.15Supra7you guys are punishing a whole block of players
17:37.17joevanowe as a project dont own the servers or have any control over them
17:37.18Supra7for one jerk
17:37.39Supra7yeah but dont play like you as a project have *not* been jerks
17:38.03joevanowhy do you say that
17:38.08Supra7i figure ill pick up playing on another server eventually
17:38.24Supra7it just sucks not being able to play there anymore because you guys cant come up with a way to keep the a-holes out
17:38.42Supra7sorry man... but it does suck
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17:39.33Supra7always being down on everyone who has legitimae questions nd requests but doesn't ask exactly the way you guys might want us to
17:39.47Supra7so we get kicked and banned
17:39.52Supra7or just pushed to the side
17:40.25Supra7well... sorry to vent so publicly .. ill just play elsewhere
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17:53.32RAThomasso, anyone who has an inkling of how the world and life work is a jerk
17:55.00BulletCatcherjoevano: Is there a ##bzexcess channel or similar that future discussions like that can be taken to?
17:55.41joevanoBulletCatcher: do you think he would have really gone.. we know who he is
17:58.31BulletCatcherIf you're that sure, then kick or ban (here in IRC) and be done with it.
17:58.33BulletCatcherBut if he really is collateral damage then a more gentle response on your part could have ended with a whitelist and a happier player.
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18:02.01joevanoBulletCatcher: I read back. I did not escalate the issue.. just stated the facts and told him to play elsewhere
18:02.50joevanodon't think I would have done it any other way if I had the chance other than just banning him outright
18:03.34brlcadhe didn't do anything in the channel that warranted getting kicked/banned here
18:03.45joevanoexactly
18:03.59brlcadpeople's misbehavior / reputataion on a server doesn't automatically follow them into here, each to their local actions
18:04.01joevanoother than knowiwg who it was
18:04.35joevanowhich is why i didnt
18:04.53brlcadif anything, CBG crossed the line
18:04.53BulletCatcherThis incident helps me understand why JeffM always insists that bans not be discussed here.
18:04.55BulletCatcherIf that is his own rule and not anyone else's, then so be it.
18:04.59brlcadand should have known better
18:05.00CBGDamn right I did.
18:05.07CBGDamn right I should.
18:05.13joevanoi unbanned him last week... and the ban on that server is back in place and i was just stating the facts
18:05.36brlcadCBG: not at all helpful
18:05.49joevanothat it wasnt going to happen and play somewhere else
18:06.04CBGIf nobody but helpful people are welcome here, ban me.
18:07.00brlcadI don't really care if you're helpful or not, but I do care if you call others names in here or otherwise engage in personal attacks
18:07.33brlcadcall him whatever you like in private, this isn't your personal retaliation soapbox
18:08.00CBGThe guy deserved it. I'm not going to change who I am or what I say because you "care" brlcad, but if you dont want me bashing the trolls, why not just ban me.
18:08.17CBGSure, like I want to contact the troll privately.
18:08.47CBGOn the other hand, reading back the bit I missed, the dude made a great point.
18:09.04CBG[6:39pm] <Supra7> always being down on everyone who has legitimae questions nd requests but doesn't ask exactly the way you guys might want us to - I don't think he knows how right he is.
18:09.39brlcadwhatever your feelings are, doesn't matter -- there's no personal attacks in here, period -- if you can't deal with that simple fact, then you can leave
18:09.46brlcadjust like there's a language rule
18:10.15CBGI aint leaving, but I'm similarly not promising I wont attack the trolls.
18:11.49BulletCatcherIt just reinforces their unwanted behavior when you "attack the trolls."
18:11.51brlcadwell, the next time will be a ban, ignore or deal with that awareness however you like
18:12.22CBGRead up. The tit left when I pushed him.
18:12.26brlcadnobody is above basic channel ettiquette
18:12.28CBGThe trick is to push them the right way.
18:13.05brlcadit's not your responsibility to push anyone around, rather makes you a bully if anything
18:13.17CBGOh, the irony. ;)
18:13.22brlcadquite
18:14.26CBGYou think I do this sort of thing to feel better about myself.
18:14.46brlcadwell, the fact that you wouldn't take the comments and name-calling private  reinforces that you're using the public channel for your own personal motivations
18:14.58brlcadotherwise there's no difference
18:15.13CBGwonders how many others spoke to the troll in private.
18:16.25CBGdoes what he likes and should be banned if "what he likes" is so out of order to warrant such a long and pointless debate.
18:16.58brlcadit's after the fact now
18:17.31brlcadthere wasn't an op active when it was said, so now it's just topic fodder
18:17.40CBGSo, you have a "no after the fact banning" policy here too?
18:17.54CBGScroll up, it's still there. I can repeat it too, if you like.
18:17.57brlcadno, just more benefit of the doubt
18:18.27bryjenspeaking of topic, is the sql now optimal ?
18:18.42brlcadbryjen: nice topic shift :)
18:18.53brlcadit's definitely improved
18:18.56CBGwonders if he just happens to be extremely charming. Why else would he get t be a jerk without being banned?
18:19.50brlcadthe daemon still needs some more work -- there are still a few phpbb3 queries that are absurdly expensive
18:20.04bryjenneeds a real irc client to update the topic :(
18:20.16CBG/topic Whatever. ?
18:20.29bryjenmeh
18:20.31brlcadthere's also still at  least one table that couldn't be updated because the temporary join for the index was several GB in size
18:21.04brlcadit was technically never "down" too .. just massively overloaded
18:21.48*** topic/#bzflag by brlcad -> http://cia.vc/stats/project/BZFlag || http://my.BZFlag.org/w/Getting_Help || Channel Logs: http://ibot.rikers.org/%23bzflag/ || http://ohloh.net/projects/189 || Release testing for 3.0 is just about ready to begin
18:23.12cygalwe still have the preloading problem though :(
18:28.55CIA-72BZFlag: 03Bullet Catcher 07http://my.bzflag.org * r6665 10/w/V3RCChecklist: /* RC Critical fixes. */ 32-bit teleporter problem is not critical, and no fix is in sight
18:30.55cygalso basically what's left is the end of MsgPause, network oddities and DR
18:35.34BulletCatcherThose are the big ones, and I think we'll find new network/protocol problems the more we dig into it.
18:37.05BulletCatcherScrumpy: I haven't forgotten about your HPUX portability problems.  I should be ready to commit somthing this weekend.
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20:27.59ScrumpyBulletCatcher: ah, ok :) didn't know it was already in the queue
20:28.07Scrumpythanks :)
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