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| 07:48.56 | cygal | hi |
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| 08:03.08 | jroysdon | Hey, on linux, is there a way when I press F1 to bring it from full-screen to windows, to get my mouse out of the game? It's locked to the boxed window. I end up just hitting f4 which minimizes it, but I'd like to see what's going on still. |
| 08:07.46 | jroysdon | ah, found it, I had to turn off confine mouse in options |
| 08:10.06 | cygal | :) |
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| 12:26.17 | joevano | ~seen SpazzyMcGee |
| 12:26.18 | ibot | spazzymcgee <n=SpazzyMc@bzflag/contributor/SpazzyMcGee> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 3d 16h 58m 44s ago, saying: 'Anybody who wants to seed a new map, spazzy.planet-mofo.com:4884'. |
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| 14:33.08 | bizarrefish | 'ello |
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| 14:36.55 | cygal | hi bizarrefish |
| 14:37.02 | bizarrefish | hi cygal |
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| 16:37.56 | cygal | hi JeffM |
| 16:38.02 | JeffM | hello |
| 16:47.08 | cygal | I'd like to understand how "broadcast" messages work |
| 16:47.11 | cygal | they seem to be sent to each "connection" (so to real players) |
| 16:47.16 | cygal | but other messages (such as team messages) are sent to each player |
| 16:47.20 | cygal | why is there a difference? |
| 16:47.45 | JeffM | what is a team message? |
| 16:48.27 | cygal | a message sent to each member of a team |
| 16:48.41 | JeffM | well that is the difference then |
| 16:48.48 | JeffM | broadcasts go to everyone |
| 16:48.52 | JeffM | otehrs don't |
| 16:48.55 | cygal | why the way it is sent is different? |
| 16:49.09 | JeffM | broadcast sends to everyone |
| 16:49.18 | JeffM | you don't want your team messages going to everyone, jsut your team |
| 16:49.22 | JeffM | so you can't use broadcast |
| 16:49.37 | JeffM | broacast uses the connection because we know it's FAST |
| 16:49.43 | JeffM | and used for state data |
| 16:49.51 | JeffM | it used to acutualy use multicast on lans |
| 16:52.42 | cygal | let's say I am blue and I have a bot in team red. I will receive all the red messages, so the purpose is defeated |
| 16:52.45 | cygal | isn't it? |
| 16:53.16 | JeffM | ish |
| 16:53.25 | JeffM | sure there are some cases where you may get them, but big whop |
| 16:53.30 | JeffM | there are cases where you don't |
| 16:53.36 | JeffM | most games don't run bots |
| 16:53.43 | JeffM | so most games/players get a benifit |
| 16:53.48 | JeffM | bots are wierd enough as is. |
| 16:54.00 | cygal | should the player take care of redirect messages to his bots? |
| 16:54.04 | JeffM | yes |
| 16:54.11 | JeffM | the player is the router |
| 16:54.25 | cygal | great |
| 16:54.41 | cygal | looks like after all this hours spent to read code, I'm finally going to have to write some |
| 16:55.24 | cygal | thanks for your answers |
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| 16:57.49 | kierra | waves at JeffM :) |
| 16:57.55 | JeffM | hello |
| 16:58.26 | kierra | JeffM: believe it or not, I am a very nice person.....it doesn't come across very well in forum posts |
| 16:58.36 | JeffM | have I ever said you wern't? |
| 16:59.16 | kierra | well, I wasn't sure....forum discussions are limited in conveying personality, likability |
| 16:59.41 | JeffM | there is only a 50/50 chance that anyone will get the tone of a text conversation right. |
| 16:59.52 | kierra | for example, took me a while to open the pm you sent.....was afraid what you would say |
| 16:59.56 | JeffM | we all just need to figure out a better solution for the GU fourms. |
| 17:00.09 | kierra | yes, and I appreciate your patience |
| 17:00.18 | JeffM | there are 3 options |
| 17:00.26 | JeffM | well 4, but I don't want to go to 4 if I have to |
| 17:00.51 | kierra | I understand |
| 17:00.53 | JeffM | actualy 5, but 5 would take a lot of work and php :) |
| 17:01.44 | JeffM | I do wish that Mr. Firing Squad would have read the fourm rules before asking for forum rules :) |
| 17:02.09 | kierra | i will let him know :) |
| 17:02.21 | JeffM | I repplied to his post as well |
| 17:02.31 | JeffM | I knew this would happen |
| 17:03.01 | JeffM | we haven't changed our moderation style, we've been doing this for 5 years, what has channged is the fact that we started doing public fourms for leauges. |
| 17:05.19 | kierra | most players aren't familiar with the moderation style, having been used to more freedom in discussion.....doesn't excuse their not reading your rules :) |
| 17:05.32 | JeffM | unless a bunch of people want to help me start writing bzflagfacebook? |
| 17:06.52 | kierra | <---technically ignorant. Willing to help but you would regret it :) |
| 17:08.22 | cygal | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_social_networking_software ? |
| 17:09.03 | JeffM | I highly doubt there is one that could integrate with our authenticaion, stats, and leauge systems. |
| 17:09.55 | JeffM | but maybe |
| 17:10.00 | JeffM | that's what would have to be decided |
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| 17:18.59 | cygal | and how would I "redirect" those messages to the bots? create a queue containing the messages, and let the bot empty it? should the messages be stored as they are displayed on the control panel (colors, etc.)? |
| 17:19.28 | JeffM | how did they get to the bots in the old code? |
| 17:19.36 | cygal | they did not get to the bots |
| 17:19.50 | JeffM | then why do the bots need them? |
| 17:20.03 | cygal | 18:54 < cygal> should the player take care of redirect messages to his bots? |
| 17:20.04 | cygal | 18:54 <@JeffM> yes |
| 17:20.25 | JeffM | that was based on the assumption that you were talking about messages that USED to be sent to the bots that are not sent now |
| 17:20.31 | JeffM | since the bot uses to have it's own connection before |
| 17:20.40 | JeffM | I thought you were fixing a bug |
| 17:20.52 | JeffM | where something that was sent in the past, was not sent now. |
| 17:20.55 | JeffM | is that not correct? |
| 17:21.03 | cygal | the bug is that the player receives messages intended to his bots |
| 17:21.21 | JeffM | and what happenes to those message in 2.0.x? |
| 17:21.24 | JeffM | does the bot get them? |
| 17:21.30 | JeffM | or those messages just arn't sent? |
| 17:23.19 | cygal | I don't know - at least the player does not get them |
| 17:23.47 | cygal | should I check 2.0.x code? |
| 17:23.51 | JeffM | umm yeah.. |
| 17:24.03 | JeffM | there is a group of messages that the bot dosn't care about |
| 17:24.08 | JeffM | chat,etc |
| 17:24.15 | JeffM | 2.0.x should not send those out |
| 17:24.18 | JeffM | nor should 3.0 |
| 17:24.36 | JeffM | there is a group of messages that are directed TO the specific bot that the bot does care about |
| 17:24.43 | JeffM | like "here is your spwan postion" |
| 17:24.54 | cygal | sure, I am only talking about text messages here |
| 17:24.56 | JeffM | 2.0.x used to send those messages on a connection |
| 17:25.09 | JeffM | 3.0 has to get those on the player, and distribute them to the bot |
| 17:25.26 | JeffM | if you are just talking about text message, don't even send em |
| 17:25.29 | JeffM | why does a bot need to chat? |
| 17:26.09 | cygal | why not? could be a nice feature. |
| 17:26.15 | JeffM | no it woudn't |
| 17:26.17 | cygal | so I can filter them from the server? |
| 17:26.25 | JeffM | the bot logic for solo bots don't even know how to chat |
| 17:26.31 | JeffM | you are fixing bugs, not adding features. |
| 17:26.36 | cygal | "if it's for a ComputerPlayer, don't send the message" |
| 17:26.42 | JeffM | yes, that's what 2.0.x did, it fitered them |
| 17:26.53 | JeffM | there is a isHuman method |
| 17:26.55 | JeffM | use that |
| 17:27.19 | JeffM | are the spawn messages handled properly in trunk? |
| 17:27.28 | JeffM | do they get routed from the player connection to the specific bot? |
| 17:29.58 | cygal | I do not know - at least KilledMessages are routed in the handleKilledMessage function in guiplaying.cxx (a few others are too) |
| 17:30.05 | JeffM | ok good |
| 17:30.11 | cygal | concerning the spawn, if it is routed, I don't think it is in this file |
| 17:30.14 | JeffM | then the player IS doing the routing for important messages |
| 17:30.23 | JeffM | if its' doing it for killed, it's doing the same for the others |
| 17:30.27 | JeffM | for chat, just don't send it |
| 17:30.29 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19936 10/trunk/bzflag/src/obstacle/ObstacleMgr.cxx: * only print obstacle with non-empty names |
| 17:31.13 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19937 10/trunk/bzflag/src/game/NetHandler.cxx: * bumped the 'uread() len ...' messages to debug level 8 |
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| 18:01.25 | Will07c5 | today I think I'll do weapon and info objects and after that move on to the material editor a bit early since I'm pretty sure that is all the necessary object dialogs |
| 18:02.53 | JeffM | cool |
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| 18:08.38 | JeffM | blast007: you arround? |
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| 18:28.13 | JeffM | there, now every page inside a fourm has a link to the friggin board rules.... not that anyone will read them |
| 18:58.33 | eTangenT | JeffM: just to spite you, I read them. |
| 18:58.43 | JeffM | good |
| 18:58.50 | JeffM | is updating them a little |
| 19:00.00 | JeffM | I tried to get it to put the posts in the main category pages but we can't |
| 19:00.23 | JeffM | I'd have to turn them into fourms, not categories, then it woudln't list them like they are now, it'd turn it into a tree |
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| 19:24.05 | blast007 | JeffM: I am now |
| 19:24.14 | JeffM | it's ok, I figured it out |
| 19:24.19 | JeffM | or figured out that we can't do it |
| 19:24.40 | JeffM | was trying to see if we coudl move post to the main page, but the "main" fourm is a category, not a fourm |
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| 19:34.19 | blast007 | JeffM: you could have also set the rules post to "global" |
| 19:35.20 | blast007 | but what you did works too :) |
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| 19:58.36 | JeffM | you can do that? |
| 19:59.03 | JeffM | hey, look at that |
| 21:00.03 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19938 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzfs/CmdLineOptions.cxx: * allow '-d6' style debugLevel setting, as can be done with the client |
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| 22:15.09 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03Me1 07http://my.bzflag.org * r5878 10/w/Config_File: Starting to add some info on editing config files by hand. |
| 22:27.27 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03Me1 07http://my.bzflag.org * r5879 10/w/Config_File: |
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| 22:52.03 | Thumper_ | ~joevano++ |
| 23:01.51 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 0367.125.157.144 07http://my.bzflag.org * r5880 10/w/Known_Cheats: /* Blatant Cheats */ |
| 23:02.57 | CIA-63 | BZFlag: 03Me1 07http://my.bzflag.org * r5881 10/w/Known_Cheats: Undo revision 5880 by [[Special:Contributions/67.125.157.144|67.125.157.144]] ([[User talk:67.125.157.144|Talk]]) |
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| 23:20.30 | bz52 | the bzflag bb.. something's bothering me |
| 23:20.49 | bz52 | when you quote someone's post.. you get the opening quotation marks |
| 23:20.59 | bz52 | but where are the closing ones? |
| 23:21.10 | bz52 | it looks really really odd |
| 23:21.49 | JeffM | I get a [/quote] at the end when I get it |
| 23:22.13 | JeffM | ahh you mean the graphical one |
| 23:22.15 | bz52 | yeah. but how it actually appears when posted. you get opening " |
| 23:22.24 | bz52 | but not closing " |
| 23:22.30 | JeffM | that's probably part of the template |
| 23:23.01 | me1 | bz52, I'm pretty sure that the box surrounding the quote tells you when it ends just fine. |
| 23:23.13 | JeffM | I think they just put that in as a style thing |
| 23:23.33 | JeffM | it's an image, not text |
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| 23:23.39 | bz52 | me1: yeah. you don't need the quotation marks at all |
| 23:23.43 | JeffM | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/styles/proglass/theme/images/quote.gif |
| 23:23.44 | me1 | It's not uncommon to add a double-quote to signify that it's a quote. Look around the ewb |
| 23:23.57 | me1 | web |
| 23:23.57 | bz52 | isn't it normal for them to come in pairs? |
| 23:23.59 | JeffM | go get the theme, fix it, and submit a patch |
| 23:24.07 | JeffM | depends on what they are being used for ;) |
| 23:24.24 | bz52 | the other thing is: the mark appears before the name of the quoted person |
| 23:24.34 | bz52 | note before the quoted text |
| 23:24.41 | JeffM | it is NOT meant to be grammitcaly correct |
| 23:24.45 | JeffM | it's a style element |
| 23:24.52 | bz52 | i know it's just aesthetics, so doesn't matter tremendously |
| 23:25.06 | bz52 | just saying it looks really weired |
| 23:25.07 | JeffM | if you care that much, go update the template and submit a patch |
| 23:25.19 | JeffM | I woudln't use the term really, but ok, whatever |
| 23:25.24 | bz52 | like weired looks weird because it should be spelt weird |
| 23:26.10 | JeffM | is not 100% enamored with the current theme anyway |
| 23:26.17 | bz52 | half the people who post are illiterate anyway, so not to worry :) |
| 23:26.33 | JeffM | wow, way to make sweeping generalizations |
| 23:26.46 | CBG | It wasn't that sweeping... He said half... |
| 23:26.51 | JeffM | heh |
| 23:26.52 | bz52 | hehe |
| 23:27.11 | bz52 | the other half are simply insane :) |
| 23:27.27 | JeffM | looks like that style is from the base phpbb theme |
| 23:27.40 | bz52 | is it easy to alter? |
| 23:27.46 | JeffM | dunno |
| 23:27.49 | JeffM | it's in the template |
| 23:27.51 | CBG | I think it's more like 75% illiterate and 75 insane, with %50 being both. |
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| 23:27.59 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Erroneous] by ChanServ |
| 23:30.34 | bz52 | we mac users appreciate the finer things |
| 23:30.45 | brlcad | heh |
| 23:30.47 | bz52 | like the font rendering in the crash dialogs |
| 23:31.05 | SpazzyMcGee | hehe |
| 23:31.38 | SpazzyMcGee | At least when we kernel panic, we get aesthetically pleasing screen telling us in five languages. |
| 23:31.50 | SpazzyMcGee | Now that's attention to detail |
| 23:31.52 | JeffM | SpazzyMcGee: that's what you get new |
| 23:31.55 | JeffM | now |
| 23:31.59 | JeffM | remember what 10.0 did? |
| 23:32.14 | bz52 | that's a kernel panic? i thought that was the normal shutdown screen |
| 23:32.48 | JeffM | hmm the polyethylene theme isn't too bad |
| 23:33.06 | SpazzyMcGee | hehe, Jeff: you got crap printed down your screen |
| 23:33.15 | SpazzyMcGee | I still got that in 10.2 |
| 23:33.48 | bz52 | i remember our sun workstations. used to crash frequently |
| 23:33.51 | SpazzyMcGee | The motion sensor in my iBook broke, and it kernel paniced whenever I moved the laptop. |
| 23:34.06 | bz52 | we ended up forcing them to crash so we could look, we need new machines :) |
| 23:34.16 | bz52 | *we could say |
| 23:34.59 | SpazzyMcGee | How fraudulent. |
| 23:36.44 | SpazzyMcGee | Still, obviously there was a demand from mac users for a nicer kernel panic. And apple delivered. |
| 23:37.01 | bz52 | nice of them to listen :) |
| 23:37.42 | JeffM | well it happend so much |
| 23:37.56 | bz52 | i can get leopard to panic using gdb |
| 23:38.08 | bz52 | running as a standard user that is |
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| 23:38.43 | bz52 | hopefully snow leopard will be slightly more solid |
| 23:38.50 | SpazzyMcGee | I haven't had one since the intel switch |
| 23:39.48 | bz52 | i am so so glad i didn't buy a power mac g5 |
| 23:39.59 | SpazzyMcGee | Just bought one of the new 13" macbook pros |
| 23:40.06 | bz52 | i was millimetrically close months before the switch |
| 23:40.23 | SpazzyMcGee | I did buy an old macbook 4 days before they announced the new ones at WWDC |
| 23:40.35 | bz52 | ouch |
| 23:40.37 | SpazzyMcGee | I got them to swap it for a new one though |
| 23:42.12 | SpazzyMcGee | My old white plastic one just disintegrated. It was fairly shoddily built, for the price I paid |
| 23:42.47 | bz52 | the old ibook lineup. was it one machine? |
| 23:43.04 | bz52 | seems apple have rejigged things almost back to where they were |
| 23:43.43 | SpazzyMcGee | Probably, I don't remember |
| 23:53.48 | CBG | I've had less crashes on apple machines over 10 years than on my XP machine in less than 18 months. |
| 23:56.41 | bz52 | guess it depends on how you use it, cbg |
| 23:57.13 | bz52 | i do know you can lock up os x completely if you put the wrong line of opengl code in the bzflag source |
| 23:57.27 | bz52 | lock up the interface, at any rate |
| 23:57.37 | CBG | Much the same. Just run Steam and various games on the PC. Have various heavyweight apps on all the time on the Mac, browse all sorts of sites, etc... |
| 23:57.46 | bz52 | it got so i'd run a script to kill bzflag after 30 seconds just in case |
| 23:58.14 | JeffM | stream is less then stable |
| 23:58.31 | bz52 | if your video card driver crashes in os x, you're stuffed. under windows it can recover |
| 23:58.47 | JeffM | generaly vista only recovers |
| 23:58.56 | JeffM | and specific parts of some ATI drivers |
| 23:59.06 | bz52 | yeah, that and server 2008 (which i use) and i imagine win 7 |
| 23:59.24 | CBG | I've actually had no major issues related to steam in months now. |
| 23:59.36 | JeffM | good then they've been working on it |
| 23:59.52 | CBG | Yeah, as much as I hate to admit it - it's not so bad right now. |
