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| 00:39.39 | a_meteorite | spldart: slurp, I could use a drink :) |
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| 01:21.40 | spldart | I could use alot of whiskey |
| 01:21.47 | spldart | .. And yet but not. |
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| 01:31.26 | spldart | anyone else getting all-recursives all evening? http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m7775ad58 |
| 01:32.22 | swigg | all recursives? |
| 01:32.55 | spldart | After warning "make[1]: *** [all-recursive] Error 1" |
| 01:33.05 | spldart | Oh the endless refrain. |
| 01:33.12 | spldart | ;0 |
| 01:33.21 | spldart | I'm just bein an arse ;) sry |
| 01:33.46 | swigg | I do that rather well myself. :P |
| 01:33.55 | spldart | :-D |
| 01:40.07 | BulletCatcher | The [all-recursive] bit just means there was a previous error, as on line 10 of your pastebin. |
| 01:42.40 | spldart | I figured... the warning about undefined string or some such was the issue.. the all-recursive is just the funny refrain over the last several years. |
| 01:42.55 | spldart | So goes config with debug |
| 01:43.26 | BulletCatcher | The warning is that the partialDecoding() function is defined but never called. |
| 01:44.20 | spldart | ... and prolly wouldn't have stopped the build if I wasn't in debug right? |
| 01:45.19 | BulletCatcher | Correct. |
| 01:46.31 | spldart | yeah |
| 01:48.37 | spldart | build make build. But nicely |
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| 02:02.43 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v menotume] by ChanServ |
| 02:09.53 | trepan | the odd part is that i don't get that warning |
| 02:11.21 | blast007 | I don't think I've ever seen that message for a function |
| 02:12.17 | trepan | i have for functions, but not when prototyped (iirc) |
| 02:16.48 | spldart | oOOoo.. I'm ground breaking broken. |
| 02:17.50 | spldart | Took out the debug switch and http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m343d4ed |
| 02:18.12 | trepan | heh |
| 02:18.14 | spldart | got alot further down the build though. |
| 02:18.17 | CIA-66 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19319 10/trunk/bzflag/src/common/CacheManager.cxx: * temporarily remove partialDecoding() |
| 02:18.55 | trepan | spldart: nice -- "internal compiler error: Segmentation fault" |
| 02:19.20 | spldart | My machine is blowing chunks? |
| 02:19.32 | spldart | Not much longer now.. new pc |
| 02:22.10 | blast007 | hehe.. |
| 02:22.12 | blast007 | CacheManager.cxx:369: warning: 'int toHexNumber(char)' defined but not used |
| 02:23.25 | trepan | blast007: heh, thanks |
| 02:23.37 | CIA-66 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19320 10/trunk/bzflag/src/common/CacheManager.cxx: * um, ya, disabled another static function |
| 02:23.37 | blast007 | want me to commit the same thing? or you got it? |
| 02:23.41 | blast007 | nvm ;) |
| 02:25.38 | CIA-66 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19321 10/trunk/bzflag/include/EventHandler.h: * a little cleanup |
| 02:25.40 | trepan | spldart: see if that one helps you to not segv |
| 02:27.21 | spldart | checkan |
| 02:27.37 | trepan | drynkan? |
| 02:28.38 | spldart | Stopped a couple hours ago. |
| 02:30.16 | spldart | runs to get a coca cola |
| 02:30.32 | spldart | Sans additives |
| 02:33.46 | biggeruniverse | silly valgrind. why won't it start gdb? |
| 02:34.34 | spldart | No debug is fine now. trying debug |
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| 02:40.24 | blast007 | temp_dist: you should see servers now |
| 02:41.16 | temp_dist | blast007: sure do - thx |
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| 03:25.14 | CIA-66 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19322 10/trunk/bzflag/ (9 files in 5 dirs): * changed stencil shadows back to "immediate drawing" to improve their appearance when using fog |
| 03:42.23 | CIA-66 | BZFlag: 03trepan * r19323 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/BackgroundRenderer.cxx: * remove a glPushAttrib()/glPopAttrib() pair |
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| 06:10.18 | SportChick | brlcad: you aroundish? |
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| 06:19.31 | biggeruniverse | too much valentine's day candy? |
| 07:17.54 | jcp | What do you have to do to get a bzflag/player cloak? |
| 07:18.54 | biggeruniverse | a what? |
| 07:19.21 | biggeruniverse | is this a quiz? I didn't study |
| 07:21.39 | jcp | biggeruniverse: ask on #freenode what a cloak is |
| 07:21.43 | jcp | Better yet, google it |
| 07:21.45 | jcp | :) |
| 07:21.50 | jcp | and it's an honest-to-goodness question |
| 07:24.28 | biggeruniverse | you kids and your new-fangled IRC |
| 07:24.44 | jcp | :) |
| 07:24.59 | jcp | You grownups and your closed-minded mentality |
| 07:25.22 | blast007 | you middle-aged people and your corvettes |
| 07:27.33 | biggeruniverse | bah |
| 07:27.53 | biggeruniverse | when I get to be middle-aged, I'm buying a stationwagon |
| 07:28.09 | biggeruniverse | I love me some wagon. |
| 07:50.39 | a_meteorite | You want everyone to KNOW you're middle-aged? |
| 07:50.52 | a_meteorite | :P |
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| 09:08.57 | Carnage00 | hey quantumdot |
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| 11:52.38 | randomparticle | bzflag is maintaining two clocks (server time clock, local time clock) |
| 11:52.58 | randomparticle | why not just have one clock and hide the server/local thing within it? |
| 11:54.30 | randomparticle | i.e., instead of having both getCurrent().getSeconds() and syncedClock.GetServerSeconds() in the code, just have one call to a TimeKeeper method |
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| 12:20.53 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-091-096-008-048.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 12:21.29 | randomparticle | the new DR code looks broken (it seems to use the wrong dts) |
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| 12:23.45 | randomparticle | my bug antennae are quivering feverishly |
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| 13:56.48 | randomparticle | who wrote the new 2.0.99 DR code please? |
| 13:57.17 | randomparticle | *2.99 |
| 14:02.15 | blast007 | SVN will tell you. read the log. |
| 14:12.26 | randomparticle | where is the log please? |
| 14:12.43 | randomparticle | ChangeLog? |
| 14:12.55 | randomparticle | there's nothing in it |
| 14:13.09 | randomparticle | well, except for this: *** To be built automatically from SVN log *** |
| 14:13.17 | blast007 | no, SVN log |
| 14:13.26 | blast007 | use your SVN client to look |
| 14:13.29 | randomparticle | yeah, read you the first time. no idea what that is |
| 14:13.30 | blast007 | or use the web SVN |
| 14:13.57 | blast007 | well, for me, I can just right click on a file and go to 'svn log' ;) |
| 14:14.23 | blast007 | 'show log', actually |
| 14:14.45 | blast007 | but I imagine 'svn log' would be a command to look up in more detail if you do it via the CLI |
| 14:14.53 | randomparticle | yes, trying it now |
| 14:16.09 | randomparticle | i'll go shoot some tanks while it downloads :) |
| 14:16.42 | blast007 | web SVN might be faster |
| 14:16.56 | blast007 | http://bzflag.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/bzflag/trunk/ |
| 14:21.37 | randomparticle | ok. large file. have searched for a few DR mentions |
| 14:21.55 | randomparticle | but i can't find who is responsible specifically for the new DR code |
| 14:21.57 | randomparticle | nvm |
| 14:22.20 | randomparticle | the dts used in the code are wrong |
| 14:22.37 | randomparticle | that might or might not be the cause of the Z problem |
| 14:22.49 | blast007 | svn blame |
| 14:23.23 | randomparticle | i've tried to set up a demonstration of the Z issue, but i couldn't see it clearly |
| 14:23.41 | randomparticle | so i'm not sure what i'm supposed to be replicating exactly |
| 14:24.05 | blast007 | when a jumping tank lands, they jitter up and down |
| 14:24.14 | randomparticle | i didn't see that |
| 14:24.26 | randomparticle | so maybe i need a different setup (diff framerate or something |
| 14:24.54 | randomparticle | i saw tanks sinking into a base. that couldn't be it, could it? |
| 14:25.12 | blast007 | hmm |
| 14:25.24 | blast007 | I haven't seen that |
| 14:25.30 | randomparticle | if someone could make a short moving screen capture, i'd have a better idea what to look for |
| 14:26.13 | randomparticle | but as i say, there was nothing very striking when i looked at it |
| 14:27.02 | randomparticle | have you been getting the issue, blast? |
| 14:27.11 | blast007 | yes |
| 14:27.16 | randomparticle | what framerate, please? |
| 14:27.29 | blast007 | hmm, can't recall |
| 14:27.45 | blast007 | probably 100 to 200 |
| 14:27.49 | randomparticle | ok |
| 14:28.24 | randomparticle | what OS are you using/ |
| 14:28.28 | randomparticle | *? |
| 14:29.19 | blast007 | linux, though I think I've seen it on Windows as well |
| 14:29.31 | randomparticle | ok |
| 14:31.02 | randomparticle | hmm.. no servers in the list atm |
| 14:32.36 | randomparticle | ok. here is the problem with the dts: |
| 14:32.58 | randomparticle | the motion of the tank is broken down into dt sized chunks. playing.cxx has the dt values |
| 14:33.28 | randomparticle | eventually doDeadReckoning() is called |
| 14:33.43 | randomparticle | but doDeadReckoning doesn't get the dt values |
| 14:33.52 | randomparticle | it constructs its own dts like so: |
| 14:33.59 | randomparticle | <PROTECTED> |
| 14:34.15 | randomparticle | and that's the wrong dt (not the same as the one used in playing.cxx) |
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| 14:40.58 | randomparticle | the original dts are in "void doUpdates(const float dt)" in playing.cxx |
| 14:42.00 | randomparticle | what you might do (off the top of my head) is give doDeadReckoning a dt parameter and pass it down from playing.cxx |
| 14:42.19 | randomparticle | that needs thinking about carefully though |
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| 15:06.06 | biggeruniverse | thinking about carefully? |
| 15:06.44 | biggeruniverse | that's no fun |
| 15:07.24 | randomparticle | yes. thinking isn't good for the brain |
| 15:12.53 | biggeruniverse | thinking is fine, but randomly changing core functionality of bzflag is where the fun is at |
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| 18:50.38 | jcp | How do you get a bzflag/player cloak? |
| 19:01.52 | me1 | Tim and jeff can set them, iirc |
| 19:14.19 | joevano | ~cloak |
| 19:14.19 | ibot | i heard cloak is a great way to protect your hostname or to show your support for freenode by making an optional contribution, or in the freenode.net faq at http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#cloaks |
| 19:14.30 | joevano | ~bzcloak |
| 19:15.13 | joevano | jcp: http://my.bzflag.org/w/IRC_Cloaks |
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| 20:48.42 | Gaming4JC | hey all |
| 20:48.56 | Gaming4JC | I was wondering how difficult it might be to port BZFlag to the DreamCast Console |
| 20:49.07 | Gaming4JC | I've seen some nice 3 |
| 20:49.16 | Gaming4JC | *3D games on the console, such as NeverBall |
| 20:49.26 | Gaming4JC | which were made from scratch. :-) |
| 20:49.36 | blast007 | probably not easy |
| 20:52.44 | blast007 | we hear a lot of "someone should make BZFlag run on <insert mobile device or console here>!" |
| 20:53.34 | Gaming4JC | lol |
| 20:53.51 | Gaming4JC | Well, I would believe it's not so difficult. C++ is a portable language |
| 20:54.03 | blast007 | that really don't mean much |
| 20:54.06 | trepan | let us know when you've got the patch done ;-) |
| 20:54.08 | joevano | looks like there is limited support for openGL on the DreamCast which usually means.. it ain't happening |
| 20:54.34 | Gaming4JC | NeverBall works ;) |
| 20:54.36 | Gaming4JC | lol |
| 20:54.44 | Gaming4JC | I might just try and get it working on the old box |
| 20:54.55 | Gaming4JC | Hmm Imagine BZFlag on the PSP ;) (another good idea) |
| 20:55.05 | joevano | like trepan said.. let us know when you get it working |
| 20:55.10 | Gaming4JC | yeah |
| 20:55.18 | joevano | please hurry because i'm holding my breath |
| 20:55.18 | trepan | r19324 |
| 20:55.19 | trepan | * re-organized the DisplayMenu |
| 20:55.19 | trepan | * replaced the wireframe/hiddenLine/depthcomplexity variables with an enumerated 'specialMode' variable, which is always NoSpecial unless roaming is enabled |
| 20:55.20 | Gaming4JC | I'll have to dive into the code myself I guess |
| 20:55.22 | trepan | * culling grid and collision grid options are only available if (debugLevel > 0) before the first time that the DisplayMenu is opened |
| 20:56.31 | trepan | also note that the DEBUG_RENDERING #define is no longer used ... |
| 20:56.42 | Gaming4JC | ... |
| 20:56.56 | trepan | oops, forgot to mention that the BZDB "stencilBits" was also added |
| 21:04.51 | *** join/#bzflag tj13820 (n=unknown@unaffiliated/tj13820) |
| 21:05.26 | tj13820 | is listserv down atm? |
| 21:05.36 | tj13820 | I can't identify on 1vs1 :( |
| 21:05.51 | Winny | identifies tj13820 |
| 21:06.00 | tj13820 | lol |
| 21:06.09 | Winny | intruder alert! intruder alert! |
| 21:06.17 | tj13820 | you have a virus! |
| 21:06.22 | tj13820 | RUN! |
| 21:06.41 | joevano | seems good for me |
| 21:06.53 | tj13820 | ni got it |
| 21:06.56 | tj13820 | i got it * |
| 21:07.03 | tj13820 | i cleared my caches |
| 21:07.47 | blast007 | ~bzflist |
| 21:10.05 | trepan | CIA takin' a leisure day? |
| 21:10.24 | Winny | trepan: you've gotta give the guy some time off ;) |
| 21:10.32 | blast007 | kills CIA-66 |
| 21:10.33 | CIA-66 | dies |
| 21:12.37 | BulletCatcher | CIA apparently observes the Presidents Day holiday. |
| 21:13.13 | Winny | hehe |
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| 22:54.36 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 23:06.12 | *** join/#bzflag randomparticle (n=randompa@about/essy/snick/randomparticle) |
| 23:11.26 | randomparticle | ok. where to start? |
| 23:13.18 | *** join/#bzflag Swigg_ (n=Default@68-119-195-191.dhcp.spbg.sc.charter.com) |
| 23:13.41 | BulletCatcher | Let's go back to the basics. |
| 23:13.44 | randomparticle | ok |
| 23:14.19 | BulletCatcher | Is there visible behavior that is a problem, or do you just see what you think is a bug in the code? |
| 23:14.43 | randomparticle | it's hard to say at this point what the consequences might be |
| 23:15.32 | BulletCatcher | Having timestamps off by the length of 1 frame is relatively minor. |
| 23:15.55 | BulletCatcher | That doesn't mean we shouldn't fix such a problem if we can. |
| 23:16.01 | randomparticle | yeah |
| 23:16.52 | BulletCatcher | It may be related to the Z DR problem, but I think you have brought this up only in the context of shots. |
| 23:16.56 | randomparticle | a shot can travel quite a distance in 1 frame. say 1/30s per frame. that's about 3.33m of travel for a shot on gu from a non-moving tank |
| 23:17.12 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=wheeeeee@65.165.173.1) |
| 23:17.22 | randomparticle | there are a few bug relating to the use of timestamps |
| 23:17.40 | randomparticle | it might be worse in 2.99 because those timestamps are used more extensively |
| 23:17.47 | BulletCatcher | Agreed. |
| 23:18.52 | randomparticle | the DR stuff also uses dodgy timestamps. again it might not be the cause of a big problem |
| 23:19.04 | randomparticle | but it's really hard to say |
| 23:19.29 | randomparticle | i can try a quick hack fix and see if the Z issue goes away |
| 23:19.50 | BulletCatcher | If that is easy to do, then go for it. |
| 23:20.18 | randomparticle | more generally speaking, i wonder if using fixed dt values might be a good idea |
| 23:20.44 | randomparticle | that way you can replicate one client's calculation on another, or at the server |
| 23:20.53 | BulletCatcher | It might be. That would certainly solve some problems. |
| 23:21.16 | BulletCatcher | The more I think about it, the more I like it. |
| 23:21.19 | randomparticle | there's been a partial decoupling of the motion stuff done already |
| 23:22.00 | randomparticle | in the past dt = duration of 1 frame |
| 23:22.11 | randomparticle | that is sometimes true now, but not always |
| 23:22.50 | *** join/#bzflag TD-Linux (n=wheeeeee@65.165.173.1) |
| 23:22.55 | randomparticle | but we could decouple it entirely |
| 23:23.47 | randomparticle | i'm thinking the server could determine the dt value |
| 23:24.07 | randomparticle | i don't know what a good value would be. obviously the smaller the value, the more computation |
| 23:24.28 | randomparticle | could start with say dt = 1/20s and go from there |
| 23:25.01 | BulletCatcher | With each client having a clock that is synchronized to the server's clock, it would certainly be relatively simple to have everyone agree on a fixed dt rate, say 50 Hz or 100 Hz. |
| 23:25.07 | *** join/#bzflag nn64 (n=nn@74.94.43.196) |
| 23:25.07 | randomparticle | yeah |
| 23:26.16 | BulletCatcher | Whatever the rate, clients that can't keep up would see more jerkiness in everyone's motion. I don't see that as a bad thing. |
| 23:26.28 | randomparticle | indeed |
| 23:27.18 | randomparticle | another thing i was thinking about: there are two kinds of time used in playing.cxx: local time and server time |
| 23:27.30 | randomparticle | but i think we can just use 1 clock, so to speak |
| 23:27.33 | BulletCatcher | Fast clients could still interpolate between the official DTs to support smooth motion at higher frame rates. |
| 23:27.53 | randomparticle | yes |
| 23:28.24 | randomparticle | but maybe calculate the motion from the start of each dt |
| 23:28.40 | randomparticle | to avoid errors accumulating |
| 23:28.49 | BulletCatcher | Yup. |
| 23:29.20 | randomparticle | when it comes to server side hit detection, for example, it will be essential to have a similar view of what's happening |
| 23:29.39 | BulletCatcher | I think we could eliminate the client's local clock after we complete the migration of event handling to the server. We'll need both clocks during the transition. |
| 23:31.10 | randomparticle | i was thinking: maybe use 1 clock (TimeKeeper). when you connect to a server synchronize it with the server clock. don't worry whether the time you get from that clock is local time or not. it's just time :) |
| 23:31.57 | randomparticle | i guess maybe you want to show the local time in the corner of the game screen? ok. maybe one does need local time too :) |
| 23:32.28 | BulletCatcher | Yeah. I depend on that to keep from playing too late. ;-) |
| 23:32.51 | randomparticle | it's the inverse of an alarm clock: tells me when i have to go sleep :) |
| 23:33.42 | BulletCatcher | I have been thinking about some kind of self timer that would tell me to quit after 1 hour, but haven't written any code yet. |
| 23:34.18 | BulletCatcher | Wouldn't need local time for that. |
| 23:34.25 | randomparticle | yeah |
| 23:35.21 | randomparticle | most things in bz are like that. one is more interested in the length of time between two events rather than the times of the events themselves |
| 23:36.19 | BulletCatcher | Celestial events are based upon local time, too. |
| 23:36.26 | randomparticle | yeah |
| 23:36.44 | randomparticle | it's a bit crazy there is that stuff in there :) |
| 23:37.02 | randomparticle | fun but crazy |
| 23:37.40 | BulletCatcher | Someone once mentioned integrating Stellarium into BZFlag for an extremely realistic sky. |
| 23:37.51 | BulletCatcher | Waaaaay overkill. |
| 23:37.57 | randomparticle | :) |
| 23:38.14 | randomparticle | hmm.. there is a map online with a great sky in it |
| 23:38.38 | randomparticle | it's one of zaphod's servers. it's very impressive |
| 23:38.55 | randomparticle | could be flight simulator x :) |
| 23:41.51 | BulletCatcher | Anyway, unless we have a solution to the dt problems I think the best thing to do is to document them as best as possible in a SourceForge bug report. |
| 23:42.24 | randomparticle | ok |
| 23:42.52 | BulletCatcher | That way the collective "we" will not forget your analysis. |
| 23:43.06 | randomparticle | that server: 100.zaphod.fr:5155 |
| 23:43.12 | randomparticle | beautiful replacement sky :) |
| 23:43.17 | BulletCatcher | checks it out |
| 23:47.34 | randomparticle | returns with his umbrella |
| 23:47.49 | BulletCatcher | Yup. Very nice clouds. |
| 23:47.57 | spldart | But but.. if your a particle... How do you get wet? |
| 23:48.16 | randomparticle | :) |
| 23:48.18 | spldart | Particle man! Particle man! Does everything a particle can /singsong |
| 23:48.51 | BulletCatcher | knows that tune |
| 23:49.10 | spldart | An old ditte |