| 00:16.10 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r18684 10/trunk/bzflag/ (include/bzfsAPI.h src/bzfs/bzfsAPI.cxx): |
| 00:16.10 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: expose host ban/unban to the API |
| 00:16.10 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: change the ban functions to take a string for the ban source instead of a player ID. This can allow for more info in automated ban management. |
| 00:18.35 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r18685 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/webadmin/ (actions.cpp actions.h loops.cpp loops.h templates/Bans.page): |
| 00:18.35 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: add filter to IP ban list to filter master bans |
| 00:18.35 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: remove masterban tests from ID and Host ban lists, since masterbans are always IP. |
| 00:18.35 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: Add unban action for all ban types. |
| 00:30.36 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r18686 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/webadmin/ (actions.cpp actions.h templates/Bans.page webadmin.cpp): |
| 00:30.37 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: add ban interface. |
| 00:30.37 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: webadmin now does full ban/unban features. |
| 00:31.26 | *** join/#bzflag swigg (n=Paul@71-14-108-006.dhcp.gnvl.sc.charter.com) |
| 00:40.10 | Winny | /set _disableBots, what do you set it to to remove all bots? |
| 00:41.41 | JeffM | 1 |
| 00:42.05 | JeffM | but if they are already joined, it won't boot them IIRC |
| 00:42.18 | Winny | yeah, just wanted to set that |
| 00:42.24 | Winny | guess i should add it to my config |
| 01:21.23 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=JeffM@unaffiliated/jeffm) |
| 01:35.16 | me1 | about the _disableBots 1, if you set that while someone is in auto, they are stuck in auto unless they rejoin. Not sure if this was fixed, though. |
| 01:36.12 | me1 | nvm it was infact fixed |
| 01:54.28 | swigg | Is there a hi level BZadmin here? |
| 02:03.24 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=JeffM@76.243.140.190) |
| 02:39.04 | *** join/#bzflag short_circuit (n=short_ci@c-98-197-19-35.hsd1.tx.comcast.net) |
| 03:02.27 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=Jeff@unaffiliated/jeffm) |
| 03:05.38 | Constitution | swigg: what sort of admin? |
| 03:05.43 | TheRedBaron | ~lart SportChick |
| 03:05.43 | ibot | lowers SportChick's priority |
| 03:06.56 | TheRedBaron | will by any chance bz 3.0 The marvelous have in game VOIP support ? or is my time better spent wishing for $1,000,000 to fall into my lap? |
| 03:08.50 | blast007 | JeffM: a note before I forget.. some servers use a custom masterban. Could those then include BZID or host bans? (re: r18685) I know the official one doesn't. |
| 03:09.13 | JeffM | techincaly sure |
| 03:09.39 | JeffM | think I should add the IsMasterBan to the other lists? |
| 03:09.45 | JeffM | it's just for info |
| 03:14.13 | blast007 | ah, that's fine then |
| 03:14.29 | JeffM | yeah it'll still keep them, you jsut can't detect them or filter them |
| 03:14.43 | JeffM | you can't delete them, as the common code checks if it's not a master first |
| 03:14.44 | blast007 | k |
| 03:14.57 | JeffM | and you can't add them of course |
| 03:15.25 | AAA_awright | TheRedBaron: I have been investigating integration with Mumble |
| 03:16.12 | AAA_awright | Seeing if I can write a plugin for both bzfs and Murmur (the Mumble server) that would allow TTS to work, as well as key bindings for Mumble clients |
| 03:22.35 | TheRedBaron | AAA_awright: nice! |
| 03:25.03 | TheRedBaron | hrm wiki says it can authenticate against a phpBB database |
| 03:25.59 | TheRedBaron | plugins are changing in 3.0, in that they can change the client? |
| 03:26.05 | JeffM | no |
| 03:26.12 | JeffM | what makes you think that? |
| 03:27.53 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: the late hour |
| 03:28.11 | TheRedBaron | Mis-interpreted his line |
| 03:28.41 | JeffM | voice chat is better served by third party apps |
| 03:28.46 | JeffM | there are enough of them |
| 03:28.54 | TheRedBaron | eh - I beg to differ |
| 03:28.57 | JeffM | I can not see any advantage to including it |
| 03:29.10 | TheRedBaron | teamwork for one |
| 03:29.26 | TheRedBaron | bring the community together more. |
| 03:29.33 | JeffM | teams can use it now |
| 03:29.40 | JeffM | just get em all to install teamspeak |
| 03:29.44 | TheRedBaron | yea - but its a level of incovience |
| 03:29.51 | TheRedBaron | and you need a server |
| 03:29.54 | JeffM | or do you want to just hear random strangers call you a "fag" all day long? |
| 03:30.06 | TheRedBaron | thats where you have options |
| 03:30.15 | TheRedBaron | enable voice chat/disable voice chat |
| 03:30.27 | temp_dist | i want to be able to check my gmail in game too |
| 03:30.31 | JeffM | you have that option now, use a voice chat program or dont ') |
| 03:31.00 | TheRedBaron | nobody hear plays tf2 i guess... |
| 03:32.04 | JeffM | few will |
| 03:32.14 | JeffM | yes in the grand scheeme it would be nie |
| 03:32.27 | JeffM | TF2 has it because they already had the steam features for it |
| 03:32.40 | JeffM | on our end it would take a fair amount of work to fully integrate |
| 03:32.47 | JeffM | for honestly NOT that much benifit |
| 03:33.01 | TheRedBaron | I understand the amount of work - but disagree with you on the benefit level. |
| 03:33.08 | JeffM | peopel CAN do it now, and I don't think it's just the inconvience of having to run another app that prevents them. |
| 03:33.21 | JeffM | if it has a huge benifit level then why are people not using third party apps now? |
| 03:33.48 | TheRedBaron | Its the same laziness now, that will probably keep it from being integrated with bz ;0 |
| 03:33.59 | JeffM | that is the part I doubt |
| 03:34.11 | JeffM | the fact that the ONLY thing preventing people from using it is lazyness |
| 03:34.49 | TheRedBaron | true. |
| 03:35.42 | JeffM | using somethign like mumble can make it techincaly easier for us sure, but I feel we have larger things to worry about |
| 03:36.39 | JeffM | I woudl worry about mumble not supporting some platforms |
| 03:36.48 | JeffM | and getting in the way of our wacky sound stuff |
| 03:36.49 | blast007 | we have sommw integration with xfire already, but not sure how much |
| 03:36.54 | JeffM | it's decent |
| 03:37.01 | blast007 | and it's windows only |
| 03:37.03 | JeffM | so yeah, you can chat over that with no settup |
| 03:37.03 | TheRedBaron | I can agree with you on priority sorting. But your initial opinions of their being no advantage to including VOIP/teamchat in bz was what I disagreed with. |
| 03:37.05 | JeffM | wine too |
| 03:37.09 | blast007 | ah |
| 03:37.31 | JeffM | TheRedBaron: again, if it's a huge advantage we'd see people using third party stuff |
| 03:37.48 | JeffM | if the advantage is not enough to overcome a slight amount of lazyness, then it ain't that big of an advantage ;) |
| 03:38.22 | TheRedBaron | I think its primarily the lack of servers. |
| 03:38.39 | JeffM | teamspeak and ventrillo servers are everywhere |
| 03:38.47 | JeffM | they are used by LOADS of other games |
| 03:38.54 | JeffM | most voice chat in games is NOT handled by in game stuff |
| 03:39.09 | JeffM | it is only a recent thing that it's integrated |
| 03:39.13 | JeffM | and most integrated ones suck |
| 03:39.31 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: correct - but I believe thats going to be the norm for multi player games in the future. |
| 03:39.31 | JeffM | I've been using ventrillo for games for nearly 4 years now |
| 03:39.38 | JeffM | TheRedBaron: probabl;y |
| 03:40.13 | TheRedBaron | well - when it comes to the sound engine being rewritten - can you or whoever add some VOIP chat goodness? :) |
| 03:40.15 | JeffM | but as you have repeatedly shown, our comunity is NOT cutting edge ;) |
| 03:40.21 | JeffM | TheRedBaron: no |
| 03:40.26 | TheRedBaron | bah |
| 03:40.27 | JeffM | the sound part is not the hard part |
| 03:40.31 | TheRedBaron | ~pickle JeffM |
| 03:40.32 | ibot | ACTION crams JeffM in a barrel, adds some brine and seasoning, and lets JeffM sit for a long while in a dark room until JeffM is ripe |
| 03:40.34 | JeffM | it's the compression and social controlls |
| 03:40.48 | JeffM | yes we can leave a hook open for it sure |
| 03:41.01 | JeffM | but it's not like "an extra hour to add 'voip'" |
| 03:41.10 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: the social control is the easiest. "Mute Player" |
| 03:41.27 | TheRedBaron | Oh I understand it being no easy task |
| 03:41.36 | JeffM | it's a lot more then that |
| 03:41.46 | JeffM | and the fact that you think it's that simple shows you don't understand it |
| 03:42.05 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: wait. I'm telling you I know its not easy. |
| 03:42.14 | JeffM | I know |
| 03:42.29 | JeffM | but I still think it's a lot harder then the amount of hardness you think it is ;) |
| 03:42.43 | TheRedBaron | probably so - I'm no C Dev :) |
| 03:42.45 | JeffM | get a couple servers to throw up some vent servers |
| 03:42.52 | JeffM | and have them advertise it |
| 03:42.57 | JeffM | then see who uses it |
| 03:43.11 | JeffM | that'd be a good test to see if the players are ready for it, and if it realy is a "lack of servers" |
| 03:43.26 | JeffM | there are plenty of free voicechat servers out there |
| 03:43.45 | TheRedBaron | there used to be quite a popular Teamspeak server for Ducati |
| 03:44.09 | JeffM | what happend to it? if it was such a huge benifit why did it go away? |
| 03:44.20 | JeffM | why did someone else not rehost it? many have the servers for it |
| 03:45.04 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: the server owner/operator disappeared from the bz scene. |
| 03:45.14 | JeffM | why did another person with a host not pick it up? |
| 03:45.25 | JeffM | I can't belive that was the ONLY person with the ability to host one |
| 03:45.32 | JeffM | not with 200+ bzflag servers ;) |
| 03:45.55 | TheRedBaron | heh :) |
| 03:46.30 | *** join/#bzflag bier__ (n=bier@pD9E2E536.dip.t-dialin.net) |
| 03:48.01 | TheRedBaron | am I going to have to run TS and Ventrillo or? |
| 03:48.25 | JeffM | if it's such an advantage I can't see how you are playing with out one already ;) |
| 03:48.37 | TheRedBaron | JeffM: lack of servers ;) |
| 03:48.54 | TheRedBaron | and i'm too lazy to set one up myself - for myself - and go through the process of advertising it :) |
| 03:49.19 | JeffM | then again, that advantage isn't enough to get you over simple lazyness, so it must not be THAT big ;) |
| 03:49.35 | JeffM | I know for a fact you know more then one person who'd host it |
| 03:49.48 | TheRedBaron | are you omniscient ? |
| 03:49.58 | TheRedBaron | gets his tin foil hat |
| 03:50.00 | JeffM | no, precognicent |
| 03:50.20 | JeffM | and you've been around here long enough that you MUST know a number of server ops |
| 03:51.34 | TheRedBaron | true. |
| 03:53.12 | JeffM | personaly I'd like to see an option for integrated postiotional sound |
| 03:53.25 | JeffM | so that the person talking to you sounds like they are coming from the direction they are |
| 03:53.29 | JeffM | that could be cool |
| 03:53.57 | TheRedBaron | 3rd party app isn't going to support that. You'd need ingame voice chat. |
| 03:54.14 | JeffM | you need more then in game voice chat for that |
| 03:54.25 | JeffM | you need fully integrated and mixed 3d sound |
| 03:54.30 | JeffM | with live streams |
| 03:54.42 | JeffM | but yes it'd have to be totaly integrated |
| 03:55.21 | *** join/#bzflag Defman (n=42296b7a@bz.bzflag.bz) |
| 03:56.49 | JeffM | while it was cool for it's time, bzflag's current sound system is not the best |
| 04:03.43 | TheRedBaron | how does one set server variables in the conf? just use '-varname' instead of '_varname' |
| 04:05.43 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=Jeff@unaffiliated/jeffm) |
| 04:05.52 | chaoscon | TheRedBaron: -set _variable value |
| 04:05.54 | JeffM | there we go, back to full rams :) |
| 04:07.57 | *** join/#bzflag Flash (n=jwmelto@c-76-25-213-219.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 04:13.09 | TheRedBaron | where is the countdownresume plugin ? is it not included with 2.0.10 ? |
| 04:13.41 | JeffM | if it's not in the tree, then no |
| 04:14.00 | Constitution | that's a plugin? |
| 04:14.20 | TheRedBaron | I believe so - made for the GU league IIRC |
| 04:14.53 | JeffM | probably custom then |
| 04:14.58 | TheRedBaron | I should be more specific, the countdownresumedelay plugin |
| 04:15.05 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r18688 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/webadmin/ (loops.cpp loops.h): have the data for a player loop work outside of a player loop if the page is passed the playerID parameter. |
| 04:15.47 | TheRedBaron | i'm getting "unkown bzdb variable: _countdownresumedelay" trying to restart my server. |
| 04:16.01 | JeffM | then it wants a newer version of the server |
| 04:24.51 | TheRedBaron | I don't think its in source/svn |
| 04:27.07 | JeffM | what's your score? wins-losses-tks? |
| 04:27.24 | TheRedBaron | yes |
| 04:27.36 | JeffM | danka |
| 04:43.51 | TheRedBaron | does anybody have or know where to find the countdown resume delay plugin? I've looked through SVN and on the forums. |
| 05:23.36 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03JeffM2501 * r18691 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/webadmin/ (loops.cpp loops.h templates/showplayer.tmpl): add group and flag history listing for player info |
| 05:25.56 | *** join/#bzflag Legoguy (n=Legoguy@adsl-71-143-226-191.dsl.emhril.sbcglobal.net) |
| 05:26.31 | *** join/#bzflag noyb (n=noyb@pool-71-108-97-231.lsanca.dsl-w.verizon.net) |
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| 10:32.15 | Skeeve | Hi! Anyone around who can tell me how the "drop flag after n shots" is handled? |
| 10:32.22 | Skeeve | Is it a server plugin? |
| 10:33.55 | Skeeve | Found it |
| 11:19.23 | ts | TheRedBaron: Don't run me :p |
| 11:21.27 | AHA | TheRedBaron, IIRC, it's in the current 2.0.13 source |
| 11:28.08 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@host-091-097-001-084.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 11:43.24 | *** join/#bzflag Upsetter (n=ups@i577B75BA.versanet.de) |
| 11:53.22 | *** join/#bzflag MPS_ (n=mathias@h36-116-116-82.dsl.netz-quadrat.de) |
| 12:08.44 | Skeeve | Any C++ Experts here? |
| 12:10.22 | ts | I don't think so. |
| 12:10.52 | Skeeve | :-( |
| 12:11.15 | ts | I'm stuck by myself with a kern protection error at bzfio.cxx:81 |
| 12:24.58 | *** join/#bzflag swigg (n=Paul@71-14-108-006.dhcp.gnvl.sc.charter.com) |
| 13:08.51 | TheRedBaron | tries downloading and configuring ts :P |
| 13:22.35 | Pryon | Skeeve: you could try asking your real question. You might get lucky. |
| 13:38.47 | *** join/#bzflag nn64 (n=nn@74.94.43.196) |
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| 13:40.38 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v spldart] by ChanServ |
| 13:44.36 | Winny | anyone that's interested in security might be interested in this: http://twit.tv/sn164 |
| 13:44.38 | Winny | scary |
| 13:44.51 | Winny | good stuff starts ~45min in |
| 14:08.52 | *** join/#bzflag nn64 (n=nn@74.94.43.196) |
| 14:12.49 | brlcad | ts: stack trace? |
| 14:13.08 | brlcad | the caller is probably feeding a bad specifier or missing args |
| 14:35.28 | *** join/#bzflag MPS_ (n=mathias@h36-116-116-82.dsl.netz-quadrat.de) |
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| 14:55.04 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 14:58.37 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03bullet_catcher * r18692 10/trunk/bzflag/plugins/webadmin/templates/showplayer.tmpl: Add the Subversion eol-style=native property. |
| 15:10.08 | *** join/#bzflag Flash (n=jwmelto@c-76-25-213-219.hsd1.co.comcast.net) |
| 15:13.32 | ts | brlcad: Do you mean backtrace? |
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| 15:54.35 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@about/apple/macbook/whodaman-) |
| 15:54.47 | whodaman- | hiya |
| 15:55.20 | whodaman- | Is there any way to keep a player silenced, even if he changes his callsign on BZBB? |
| 15:57.48 | brad | use the plugin that guy created |
| 15:58.10 | brad | it stores IPs in a file IIRC |
| 15:58.19 | brad | so they are perm muted |
| 16:00.01 | ts | brlcad: http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m64539e is my backtrace and http://pastebin.bzflag.bz/m59dfb6ae is my config file. |
| 16:05.58 | ts | brlcad: After commenting out help messages it works..but that should not be the solution. |
| 16:07.25 | ts | brlcad: My help files are zipped as 'help.zip' in my home dir at bz.bzflag.bz |
| 16:10.59 | brlcad | ts: a backtrace is a stack trace |
| 16:11.36 | *** join/#bzflag JeffM (n=JeffM@unaffiliated/jeffm) |
| 16:13.58 | brlcad | ts: eh, look at the trace .. look at the logDebugMessage line .. |
| 16:14.13 | brlcad | the bug is pretty blatent :) |
| 16:15.05 | ts | brlcad: No one is user friendly :) |
| 16:15.41 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r18693 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzfs/CmdLineOptions.cxx: try not crashing on %s |
| 16:19.40 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r18694 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzfs/CmdLineOptions.cxx: help optiosn are all space separated |
| 16:20.06 | brlcad | ts: you should read that patch, reread the log, and see if you can learn how to recognize that mistake in the future |
| 16:26.12 | ts | Well, I looked into the problem before but I couldn't fix it |
| 16:26.46 | ts | brlcad: CmdLineOptions.cxx:722: error: ânameâ was not declared in this scope |
| 16:46.19 | brlcad | ts: I realize that -- that's why I said you should read the patch, reread the backtrace, .. read the sources for each line in the backtrace and learn to recognize the problem |
| 16:46.41 | brlcad | if you don't understand what the problem was in the first place, you're not going to recognize it the next time it happens |
| 16:47.05 | ts | right |
| 16:47.25 | brlcad | so learn what was wrong, more than just "oh, that fixed it -- ok" |
| 16:47.53 | brlcad | that's how you get better at fixing bugs in general ;) |
| 16:49.58 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03t-s * r18695 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzfs/CmdLineOptions.cxx: this should compile now |
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| 18:00.39 | Erroneous | JeffM: http://groups.google.com/group/google-summer-of-code-mentors-list/browse_thread/thread/36647a0d2ac10d1d |
| 18:01.20 | JeffM | so what do I have to do? |
| 18:01.28 | Erroneous | dunno. read the email ;) |
| 18:02.20 | JeffM | I think we just have to register |
| 18:02.26 | JeffM | and write each other as the roommate |
| 18:02.27 | Erroneous | I think she wants everyone to be booked and have correct rommate information |
| 18:02.45 | JeffM | how do we register? |
| 18:02.48 | Erroneous | we have not booked yet, correct? |
| 18:02.58 | Erroneous | same way as last year. wild palms website or something. |
| 18:03.05 | JeffM | we have not |
| 18:03.15 | Erroneous | http://gsoc-mentors-2008.thousandparsec.net/wiki/Travel_Information#Room_Booking_Instructions |
| 18:03.27 | JeffM | yeah now I Need to find the login info :) |
| 18:03.40 | *** part/#bzflag Marzipan (n=anonym@84-119-57-44.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at) |
| 18:04.09 | Erroneous | ah, actually looks like wild palms has no more two-bed rooms available |
| 18:04.34 | JeffM | then the domain it is |
| 18:04.53 | JeffM | or does that mean we can get solos? |
| 18:06.10 | Erroneous | I kinda don't think so. you can always ask lh. |
| 18:06.25 | longhair | ? |
| 18:06.31 | Erroneous | not you |
| 18:06.39 | longhair | goes back to sleep |
| 18:07.20 | *** join/#bzflag javawizard2539 (n=javawiza@c-67-177-4-112.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) |
| 18:16.54 | JeffM | well jbd said we could crash at his place if we had to :) |
| 18:19.47 | *** join/#bzflag me1 (n=me1@unaffiliated/me1) |
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| 18:26.00 | swigg | JeffM: PING |
| 18:26.05 | JeffM | ? |
| 18:26.18 | swigg | Hey Jeff, how can I start a forum group? |
| 18:26.25 | swigg | Talk to Donny? |
| 18:26.28 | JeffM | what do you mean? |
| 18:26.53 | swigg | A BzGroup. I want a seperate chat section only for special interest members |
| 18:27.02 | JeffM | chat section? |
| 18:27.04 | JeffM | like a subfourm? |
| 18:27.12 | swigg | Yep. Is there such a thing? |
| 18:27.14 | JeffM | no |
| 18:27.18 | JeffM | not for chat |
| 18:27.27 | swigg | No, in the BBS |
| 18:27.30 | JeffM | get a webhost and install your own fourm |
| 18:27.36 | JeffM | that's not what we are here for |
| 18:28.06 | swigg | well, it would be a player group. Maybe I don't know quite what to ask for. |
| 18:28.12 | JeffM | for special instances we do sub fourms for some leagues and servers, but they have to prove that they don't have other ways to host, or other complelling reasons for us to take up the burden |
| 18:28.24 | JeffM | what would this group be? |
| 18:28.46 | swigg | Just a group of associated players that play certain servers |
| 18:29.02 | JeffM | not what we are here for |
| 18:29.06 | JeffM | you can use a blog for that |
| 18:29.16 | JeffM | or any number of other free web fourms |
| 18:29.18 | swigg | I've had a few fols ask me, and I had no answer to give them as to what to do |
| 18:29.30 | L4m3r | mailing list :) |
| 18:29.42 | JeffM | you have LOTS of options |
| 18:30.17 | JeffM | but bzbb is not one of them |
| 18:30.20 | swigg | That would work. I'll ask a server owner if they'd host. I thought there might be a section here, I knw BadgerKing has a forum group. |
| 18:30.31 | JeffM | yes that is for server admin |
| 18:30.34 | JeffM | for that one server |
| 18:30.40 | JeffM | just just "A group of friends" |
| 18:30.52 | swigg | Exactly. That is what they have been asking for |
| 18:31.00 | JeffM | if you are looking for a place for you and your buddies to just chat, that ain't what we are for |
| 18:31.08 | JeffM | what server do you ruN? |
| 18:31.16 | JeffM | and why can it not host it's own fourms? |
| 18:31.35 | swigg | Not to chat. I don't have a server. I am not knowledgable just yet. nor do I have the time. |
| 18:31.50 | JeffM | then it is not the same thing as badgerkings server admin sub fourm |
| 18:32.07 | swigg | Ok. I will suggest a mailing list |
| 18:32.15 | JeffM | get a free froum |
| 18:32.20 | JeffM | there are tons of sites |
| 18:32.31 | L4m3r | bzbb is not really a place to socialize, especially in a private subforum. the admins are very strict about that, trust me ;) |
| 18:33.19 | swigg | Well, I had to inquire. I've been having a lot of requests lately. I've been encouraging people to register. |
| 18:33.33 | swigg | So they can use the forums |
| 18:33.34 | JeffM | and speaking of that it may be time to close the badgerking one, it's been over 6 months |
| 18:34.04 | swigg | is it a matter of cost for the bandwidth? |
| 18:34.08 | swigg | or of upkeep? |
| 18:34.13 | JeffM | yes and other things |
| 18:34.25 | L4m3r | general clutter and "Not our problem" |
| 18:34.29 | JeffM | it's just not what we provide the foursm for |
| 18:34.33 | swigg | Makes sense. Thanks. you guys are alway good help :) |
| 18:34.37 | JeffM | when there are so many other solutions |
| 18:35.40 | JeffM | deletes the dub pillbox fourm |
| 18:36.49 | Winny | turns Rick Astley off repeat |
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| 18:52.01 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@host-091-097-004-032.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 18:59.48 | brlcad | ibot: join #gsoc |
| 19:00.04 | brlcad | TimRiker: help please (ibot, #gsoc) |
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| 19:00.45 | swigg | War In The Star |
| 19:11.09 | brlcad | JeffM / Erroneous: fyi, I just booked a room at the Domain |
| 19:15.33 | TheRedBaron | brlcad: poke ! |
| 19:17.30 | brlcad | TheRedBaron: ouch ! |
| 19:18.25 | TheRedBaron | you have a few minutes ? I have some questions |
| 19:20.15 | *** join/#bzflag Think_Differentl (n=fatass__@unaffiliated/thinkdifferentl/x-838543) |
| 19:21.05 | brlcad | thanks TimRiker |
| 19:22.52 | *** join/#bzflag whodaman- (n=whodaman@about/apple/macbook/whodaman-) |
| 19:28.17 | JeffM | brlcad, what did you put for credit card? |
| 19:28.37 | JeffM | or did you do all of us? or just you? |
| 19:30.46 | brlcad | i just did me |
| 19:31.11 | brlcad | (thusfar) |
| 19:31.23 | brlcad | I can do you guys too if you like, but there's a bunch of info I'd need |
| 19:31.33 | brlcad | might be easier for you to just grab him and reserve |
| 19:31.34 | JeffM | go for it |
| 19:31.42 | JeffM | he's filling his belly with pizza |
| 19:31.52 | JeffM | and I just use my work addy, you can use that for both of us ;) |
| 19:32.06 | brlcad | also debating whether to stay two days now.. (arrive thurs) |
| 19:32.50 | JeffM | we'll get there friday and leave monday |
| 19:33.06 | brlcad | nods |
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| 19:33.32 | brlcad | you're local, for me it's another day to relax away from work, time to code, recover from flight, etc :) |
| 19:36.05 | JeffM | both of us are really busy trying to get a release out, so if you could reserve for us I think that'll help |
| 19:58.33 | Erroneous | that would be good, yeah |
| 20:05.34 | brlcad | JeffM: ok, pm me a physical address for daniel and should be good to go |
| 20:06.45 | Erroneous | work address works fine |
| 20:07.07 | brlcad | k |
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| 21:01.06 | *** join/#bzflag MindstormsKid (n=chatzill@wikipedia/MindstormsKid) |
| 21:01.51 | MindstormsKid | anyone know where i can get the current release of missile war 2.3 map and config file? |
| 21:05.06 | MindstormsKid | Winny? |
| 21:06.16 | a_meteorite | iirc missile war is closed source, you'd need permission to host it |
| 21:07.14 | MindstormsKid | O_O |
| 21:07.51 | MindstormsKid | so i can't make some fixes, change it around, add some new things, then host it?? |
| 21:08.01 | MindstormsKid | that's not fair.. |
| 21:12.02 | MindstormsKid | and it sucks |
| 21:12.14 | MindstormsKid | bzflag is supposed to be open-source :P |
| 21:12.18 | blast007 | it is |
| 21:12.23 | blast007 | the maps are different |
| 21:12.31 | MindstormsKid | that sucks :/ |
| 21:12.52 | blast007 | if I make an image in Gimp, I don't have to make it open source just because I used an open source program |
| 21:13.03 | MindstormsKid | sues ductwannabe |
| 21:13.10 | MindstormsKid | yes, but.. |
| 21:13.15 | blast007 | but nothing ;) |
| 21:13.25 | MindstormsKid | but.. |
| 21:13.33 | MindstormsKid | ARG THAT SUCKS |
| 21:13.41 | MindstormsKid | i want to get missilewars! |
| 21:13.56 | MindstormsKid | i already saved it, but i can't save the config file |
| 21:14.08 | blast007 | saving it from the server isn't the best way anyway |
| 21:14.18 | blast007 | it won't always be exactly the same |
| 21:14.26 | MindstormsKid | i know |
| 21:14.27 | MindstormsKid | :/ |
| 21:14.51 | MindstormsKid | but why is it not free? |
| 21:15.14 | blast007 | because the one who made the map licensed it that way |
| 21:15.39 | MindstormsKid | but why? XD |
| 21:16.00 | blast007 | cuz they wanted to, and because they can |
| 21:16.32 | blast007 | do you think the map would have been as big of a hit if 20 crappy servers were hosting it too? |
| 21:16.44 | MindstormsKid | no :/ |
| 21:17.40 | MindstormsKid | but i also can't find the license |
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| 21:31.16 | blast007 | JeffM: reading the rest of the scrollback re: voice chat. Seems mumble supports positional audio. http://mumble.sourceforge.net/Games |
| 21:31.28 | blast007 | MindstormsKid: I didn't say they posted a license |
| 21:31.46 | blast007 | their license is basically "No, YOU can't use it, only this guy can" |
| 21:31.56 | MindstormsKid | :/ |
| 21:32.36 | Erroneous | if you don't have a license to use the map, you can't. that's the way copyright law works. you need the license in order to have permission...the author has protection automatically. |
| 21:38.46 | JeffM | blast007, yeah muble seems cool |
| 21:39.14 | JeffM | we'd have to redo our entire sound system to take advantage of it, etcc but yeah it is defently something I'd look at for full blown integration |
| 21:40.21 | blast007 | I thought it would just be something like our xfire integration |
| 21:40.45 | JeffM | naw, mumble is cool |
| 21:41.32 | blast007 | I mean regarding just having it report stuff out to the chat/voice client |
| 21:42.00 | blast007 | why would the sound system need to be redone? |
| 21:42.14 | blast007 | from what I can tell, it's a standalone client |
| 21:42.47 | JeffM | oh I mean that we'd want to integrate it into our own sound system to do full hardware 3d postioninging |
| 21:42.51 | blast007 | that page links to here: http://mumble.sourceforge.net/Link |
| 21:42.52 | JeffM | with the game sounds |
| 21:43.04 | JeffM | yeah you could use it as an external |
| 21:43.10 | JeffM | I wanted to use it like a lib |
| 21:43.19 | blast007 | k |
| 21:43.24 | JeffM | and make bzflag be a mumble client ;) |
| 21:43.32 | blast007 | heh |
| 21:43.36 | Erroneous | our sound physics are different than reality |
| 21:43.44 | Erroneous | speed of sound in particular is much slower |
| 21:43.57 | Erroneous | so we'd have to do a bit of math if we wanted to just use their integration stuff |
| 21:43.58 | JeffM | yeah |
| 21:44.18 | JeffM | hence why I'd rather just have them do compression and streaming and merge into our mixer |
| 21:45.36 | Winny | blast007: doesn't sound like he's convinced |
| 21:45.44 | Winny | bets the map'll show up on the list anyways |
| 21:51.58 | JeffM | I've sent him a PM |
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| 21:54.55 | JeffM | brlcad, did you just do the 2 days?or sunday night as well? |
| 22:09.09 | *** join/#bzflag nn64 (n=nn@74.94.43.196) |
| 22:10.56 | Skeeve | Can anyone please tell me, how the classes LocalPlayer and Player are connected? When it comes to HUDRenderer, I have a "myTank" which is of class "Player". How can I get to info from "LocalPlayer" from there? |
| 22:12.06 | Skeeve | Sorry... Other way around. In HUDRenderer I have a "LocalPlayer" |
| 22:14.02 | Flash | look at the headers and figure out the inheritance |
| 22:14.13 | Flash | Player is a base class |
| 22:14.42 | Flash | LocalPlayer and RobotPlayer are client-side players |
| 22:15.02 | Flash | RemotePlayer is one that we only know about from the server |
| 22:17.48 | Skeeve | Thanks flash |
| 22:41.04 | Flash | What is the order of precedence of our libraries? I don't want to create a circular dependency |
| 22:44.03 | JeffM | Skeeve, player is the base class that all 3 classes are derived from |
| 22:44.26 | Skeeve | Thanks Jeff. I got it after Flash's explanatipon |
| 22:44.29 | JeffM | you can cast myTank to a localPlayer if you KNOW it's a local ( not observer) |
| 22:44.30 | JeffM | k |
| 22:45.21 | Erroneous | myTank is a LocalPlayer already most places (should be everywhere) |
| 22:45.48 | Erroneous | you can use it as a Player if you happen to need one |
| 22:45.54 | Skeeve | Right. I mixed everything up. I meant "target" in "renderShot" |
| 22:46.52 | JeffM | Flash, what are you trying to do? |
| 22:47.32 | Flash | I'm working on abstracting a common networking layer, and the code I'm stealing calls logDebugMessage (bzfio in common) |
| 22:47.41 | Flash | so I want to know if net can refer to common |
| 22:47.47 | JeffM | I woudl not |
| 22:47.59 | JeffM | what I'd do is have a set of callbacks for log handlers in net |
| 22:48.08 | JeffM | then make common install one into net |
| 22:48.09 | Flash | not even at that layer |
| 22:48.20 | JeffM | then it can be used anywhere |
| 22:48.23 | Erroneous | common depends on net, so net cannot depend on common |
| 22:48.27 | Flash | this is low low level debug, like "socket was created" |
| 22:48.38 | JeffM | just add a log handler |
| 22:48.42 | JeffM | and let common install one |
| 22:48.43 | Flash | Erroneous: I suspected as much, that's why I asked |
| 22:50.08 | JeffM | the same answer you gave Skeeve works for your question, go look at the makefile ;) |
| 22:50.33 | Flash | makefiles don't always reflect design decisions... sometimes people "just make it work" |
| 22:50.44 | JeffM | but it reflects the acutal thing |
| 22:51.07 | JeffM | but in general I think we should only make one lib dependent on another if we absolutly have to |
| 22:51.18 | JeffM | then it's easyer to reuse em |
| 22:51.37 | JeffM | if net has to go with common all the time, then may as well put net INTO common ;) |
| 22:51.54 | JeffM | but if all you need is loging, then just have some callbacks and all is good |
| 22:52.30 | JeffM | then if something else (like say auth) uses net, then it can do it's own loging and not require common, since common has stuff it may not need. |
| 22:53.31 | Flash | the argument isn't lost on me. But somewhere is generally low-level utility stuff used by everyone (or a common interface used by everyone) |
| 22:53.53 | JeffM | then it should go into it's own low level lib |
| 22:53.56 | JeffM | like a loglib |
| 22:54.05 | JeffM | or common should have less stuff in it |
| 22:54.07 | Flash | hmmmm. log4j? |
| 22:54.13 | Flash | ;-) |
| 22:54.23 | JeffM | I'm a big fan of modularity |
| 22:55.34 | JeffM | thanks the maker that this sim is taking forver so he can have some time to check on the interwebs :) |
| 22:56.00 | JeffM | speaking of logging, has anyone looked at the logs that webadmin will dump and thought of anything else to log? |
| 23:07.15 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: 03jwmelto * r18696 10/branches/v2_99_net_branch/ (6 files in 2 dirs): |
| 23:07.15 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: Add BzfNetwork::connect, and make ServerId support being used as an address |
| 23:07.15 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: Remove Address ctor/dtor/operator= that are the same as what the compiler |
| 23:07.15 | CIA-48 | BZFlag: will generate |
| 23:18.24 | Skeeve | If I changed a member function from "inline int ... const" to the same without "const", how can I tell the compiler to notice that? It's still complaining about the missing const |
| 23:18.54 | Flash | is the body separate from the declaration? |
| 23:19.01 | Skeeve | no |
| 23:19.21 | Flash | then there's nothing; just compile. What error are you getting? |
| 23:19.34 | Skeeve | error: no matching function for call to 'Player::getShotLimit() const' |
| 23:19.54 | Flash | so you have Player const& calling getShotLimit() |
| 23:19.55 | Skeeve | the function is there but no longer const |
| 23:20.02 | Flash | that's an error |
| 23:20.11 | Flash | why isn't it const anymore? |
| 23:20.21 | Skeeve | Because I changed it |
| 23:20.44 | Flash | in general an accessor shouldn't change state (that's what mutators are for) |
| 23:20.49 | JeffM | it needs to be const cus it's probalby acting on a const object |
| 23:20.57 | JeffM | why do you want to make it non const? |
| 23:21.28 | JeffM | you can't call a non const method from a const object |
| 23:21.36 | Skeeve | because I first wanted to return a value that it didn't change. But now it might change. I think I'd betterchange the name |
| 23:21.46 | JeffM | that's not what const does |
| 23:21.55 | JeffM | const means that it dosn't change the object it's in |
| 23:21.58 | JeffM | not what it returns |
| 23:22.10 | Skeeve | that's what I meant |
| 23:22.15 | JeffM | it's going to return it's data by value, so it'll be a copy |
| 23:22.19 | Skeeve | It returned just a member's value |
| 23:22.25 | Skeeve | but didn't change it |
| 23:22.26 | JeffM | ok, then a funciton called "Get" should NEVER change the object it's in |
| 23:22.33 | JeffM | make a new method |
| 23:22.38 | JeffM | and call that from your place |
| 23:22.42 | JeffM | dont' call it "get" |
| 23:22.48 | JeffM | ComputeShotWhatever() |
| 23:22.51 | JeffM | etc.. |
| 23:23.16 | Flash | if there is something that doesn't logically affect state, you can declare it mutable and change it in a const function. This should be limited to cache values or mutexs or such |
| 23:23.47 | Skeeve | Don't hit me with those words I don't uderstand, flash ;-) |
| 23:23.55 | Flash | which words? |
| 23:24.06 | JeffM | is, you.. |
| 23:24.10 | JeffM | or |
| 23:24.14 | Flash | if? |
| 23:24.28 | Skeeve | mutex mutable etc. pp. |
| 23:24.34 | Skeeve | I understand it a bit |
| 23:24.46 | Skeeve | But not in the context of C++ I guess |
| 23:24.47 | Flash | mutable is a C++ keyword that means the variable can change in a const method |
| 23:24.58 | Flash | mutable int cacheValue; |
| 23:25.23 | Flash | mutex is a "mutual exclusion" lock used to synchronize multiple threads |
| 23:25.32 | JeffM | Skeeve, make a new method |
| 23:25.37 | JeffM | that's the simplest thing |
| 23:25.50 | Skeeve | No! I got the problem :-( Now I understand! |
| 23:26.33 | Skeeve | The function gets a const Player* and calls a non-const memberfunction! That's what you tried to explain to me! |
| 23:26.52 | Flash | right. but don't just cast the const-ness away |
| 23:27.00 | Skeeve | nope |
| 23:27.03 | Skeeve | I won't |
| 23:27.15 | Skeeve | I make my function const again and live with it |
| 23:30.01 | Skeeve | Am I right that a client never knows how many shots of a flag it has, until the server sends a message? And even then the CLIENT doesn't know, just the player, if (s)he reads the message? |
| 23:31.19 | JeffM | yes |
| 23:31.22 | JeffM | for now |
| 23:34.19 | Skeeve | Okay :-( So my new little HUD Enhancement doesn't work yet. |
| 23:35.07 | Skeeve | I wanted to display the reload values (white normaly) in HUD color when I have limited shots. |
| 23:35.36 | JeffM | yeah I wanted to do that too |
| 23:35.39 | Skeeve | And switch back to white when the shots are used up |
| 23:35.39 | JeffM | but we need more messages |
| 23:36.11 | Skeeve | I had it done a bit, but the problem is, I need to check for flag drops |
| 23:36.21 | Skeeve | To reset the shotcounter |
| 23:36.56 | Skeeve | I can recognize the servermessage and store the value in a private variable in Player |
| 23:36.59 | JeffM | add shot tracking on the server, and send an update message wiht each shot ;) |
| 23:37.30 | Skeeve | I won't fiddle with the server |
| 23:38.26 | Skeeve | Even if I do. This wouldn't help me on existing servers |
| 23:38.50 | JeffM | oh you are doing this for 2.0.x? |
| 23:39.18 | Skeeve | Sure. I always do patches for 2.0 first. I'm mainly a player, not a developer ,-) |
| 23:39.29 | JeffM | cares a lot less now |
| 23:39.35 | Skeeve | :-P |
| 23:39.44 | JeffM | yeah there is not much you can do for shot limits |
| 23:40.28 | Skeeve | I guess there are to many places where flags are dropped? |
| 23:42.19 | Skeeve | nevermind... I go to bed before it´s 2am |
| 23:42.23 | Skeeve | good night |
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| 23:50.00 | whodaman- | winners for the contest gonna be declared sunday? |
| 23:50.07 | JeffM | yes |
| 23:50.21 | whodaman- | yay |
| 23:50.23 | JeffM | we've actualy decided I just have to do some work to get everything ready for it |
| 23:50.42 | JeffM | I want to have the mockups and store stuff ready for when we announce |
| 23:50.47 | whodaman- | ah - nothing has been publicly declared yet tho? |
| 23:50.50 | JeffM | no |
| 23:50.55 | whodaman- | :) |
| 23:50.55 | whodaman- | cool |
| 23:51.08 | JeffM | I'd hve done it by now but work is busy |
| 23:51.18 | JeffM | is waiting for the toolpaths to compute now :/ |
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