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| 01:05.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14265 10/trunk/bzflag/ (9 files in 5 dirs): |
| 01:05.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: CacheManager doesn't belong in libGame as it's a general cache'd file manager. |
| 01:05.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: The lowest level usage is libMediaFile, which is where it probably belongs |
| 01:05.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: regardless. This consequently also cleans up a libGame dependency on |
| 01:05.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: libMediaFile. |
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| 01:21.11 | a_meteorite | ~seen AAA_awright |
| 01:21.46 | ibot | aaa_awright <n=chatzill@wsip-68-14-251-102.ph.ph.cox.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 3d 22h 48m 43s ago, saying: '--without-bzfs?'. |
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| 01:40.23 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14266 10/trunk/bzflag/configure.ac: enable compilation of bzrobots by default so it doesn't fall out of sync |
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| 02:05.06 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14267 10/trunk/bzflag/include/bzfio.h: undefining NULL should not be necessary any more .. if it is, there should be a configure check for it. |
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| 04:29.05 | jude- | hello all |
| 04:29.25 | L4m3r | evening |
| 04:29.34 | L4m3r | and just who I wanted to talk to :) |
| 04:29.48 | jude- | what's up? |
| 04:30.11 | L4m3r | were you planning on doing some sort of model/group import for BZWorkbench? |
| 04:30.21 | jude- | yeah |
| 04:30.28 | L4m3r | cool :) |
| 04:30.46 | L4m3r | I have a slight offshoot idea for that |
| 04:30.47 | jude- | you will be able to save selected objects in the world to an internal .bzw file (i.e. "templates.bzw"), and you can import them into future maps |
| 04:30.51 | jude- | what is that? |
| 04:30.56 | L4m3r | pardon me if I've mentioned it before |
| 04:31.13 | L4m3r | some sort of simplistic scripting API for making customizeable objects |
| 04:31.27 | jude- | hmmm....can you give a real-world use? |
| 04:31.38 | jude- | or example? |
| 04:31.46 | L4m3r | it'd be like an extension of primitives, sorta |
| 04:32.00 | L4m3r | say, for instance, someone writes a module to make a torus |
| 04:32.11 | jude- | torus objects are already supported, tho |
| 04:32.28 | L4m3r | as a BZW primitive, or in your app? |
| 04:32.33 | jude- | as a BZW primitive |
| 04:32.53 | jude- | not sure its in the wiki |
| 04:32.54 | Epyon | Hmm, ties well with the level gen idea xP |
| 04:33.11 | L4m3r | but it's only an example |
| 04:33.12 | jude- | I think its in the man page |
| 04:33.17 | jude- | bring it on :) |
| 04:33.23 | L4m3r | yeah, manpage should be in the wiki |
| 04:33.41 | jude- | not all objects in the man page are in the wiki, though |
| 04:33.44 | jude- | like corners |
| 04:34.36 | Epyon | Use the source, luke :P |
| 04:34.43 | jude- | indeed |
| 04:35.28 | L4m3r | wait, you don't mean... |
| 04:35.30 | rob1n | ~seen trepan |
| 04:36.04 | ibot | trepan <n=trepan@unaffiliated/trepan> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 12d 6h 10m 38s ago, saying: 'you should submit a request to O.E.D. for 'dekerberosization''. |
| 04:36.05 | L4m3r | the object has been there and was never doc'd?! |
| 04:36.05 | jude- | yup |
| 04:36.05 | L4m3r | zomg. |
| 04:36.05 | rob1n | ~seen TimRiker |
| 04:36.09 | ibot | timriker <n=timr@pdpc/supporter/bronze/TimRiker> was last seen on IRC in channel #utah, 1d 7h 34s ago, saying: 'take that brac.'. |
| 04:36.09 | jude- | well, they're doc-ed...in a few obscure forum threds |
| 04:37.10 | L4m3r | well, anyhow, it's a moot point |
| 04:37.27 | L4m3r | think of it as an extension to imported models. |
| 04:37.58 | jude- | ...er...how? |
| 04:38.25 | L4m3r | okay, this is simplistic but it will work |
| 04:38.41 | L4m3r | say, someone makes a module for star-shaped boxes. |
| 04:39.17 | L4m3r | the user can load the module into BZWorkbench, and then pick the number of points, height, radius of point tips, and radius of "armpits" |
| 04:39.24 | L4m3r | and it'll generate a nice mesh model |
| 04:39.33 | rob1n | what happened to trepan? |
| 04:39.38 | L4m3r | he left |
| 04:39.46 | rob1n | left bzflag? |
| 04:39.48 | jude- | that should already be supported |
| 04:39.50 | L4m3r | he's working on (TA) Spring now |
| 04:39.59 | jude- | BZWorkbench will implement a binary plug-in system |
| 04:40.01 | L4m3r | jude-: er... |
| 04:40.04 | rob1n | http://spring.clan-sy.com/ ? |
| 04:40.06 | L4m3r | ah |
| 04:40.23 | L4m3r | rob1n: that's the one. |
| 04:40.31 | L4m3r | last I heard he was working on UI |
| 04:40.31 | jude- | and the coder can write the dialog code and implement my abstract DataEntry class (which is the base class for all objects in BZWorkbench) |
| 04:40.43 | L4m3r | neat :) |
| 04:41.03 | jude- | there will be an SDK for all of this |
| 04:41.17 | L4m3r | very cool |
| 04:41.45 | rob1n | uh, what *is* BZWorkbench? |
| 04:42.04 | jude- | the title of the BZW2-compliant graphical editor I'm writing for Google Summer of Code |
| 04:42.11 | jude- | see bzworkbench.wordpress.com |
| 04:42.45 | rob1n | cooooool |
| 04:42.49 | jude- | indeed :) |
| 04:43.04 | rob1n | any screenshots yet? ;) |
| 04:43.12 | jude- | there's not much to see yet, I'm afraid |
| 04:43.20 | jude- | just a blank window you can right-click to bring up a menu |
| 04:43.41 | rob1n | is it going to be something like Hammer? |
| 04:43.49 | jude- | dunno. what's Hammer? |
| 04:44.08 | rob1n | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Valve_Hammer_Editor |
| 04:44.12 | rob1n | it's for the Half Life engines |
| 04:44.41 | jude- | not *that* advanced |
| 04:44.49 | jude- | the idea is for it to be simple enough for the complete n00b to use |
| 04:45.04 | rob1n | good |
| 04:45.10 | rob1n | hammer's very very very very complicated |
| 04:45.10 | jude- | but powerful enough for any power user to be right at home |
| 04:45.16 | rob1n | unless you want to do a square of dirt |
| 04:45.39 | jude- | see http://www.u.arizona.edu/~jnelson/bzworkbench.html for the candidate user interfaces |
| 04:45.58 | rob1n | they're not going to look exactly like that, are they? |
| 04:46.01 | jude- | no |
| 04:46.03 | jude- | those are mock-ups |
| 04:46.07 | jude- | I'm using FLTK |
| 04:46.25 | rob1n | ohh FLTK looks cool |
| 04:46.42 | jude- | that's not really the reason why I chose it, though :) |
| 04:46.50 | rob1n | i don't do C++ devel, so i'm kinda out of touch with things round here |
| 04:47.15 | jude- | FLTK just happens to be statically-linkable, making it ultra-portable :) |
| 04:47.17 | rob1n | now, if you've got a PHP or wordpress question, that i can help with ;) |
| 04:47.24 | rob1n | yeah it's a nice idea |
| 04:48.11 | jude- | my goal is to have Linux (first and foremost), Windows, Mac OS X, and (hopefully) IRIX, BSD, and Solaris support |
| 04:48.40 | jude- | the only reason Linux comes first is because I'm developing it on a Linux box :) |
| 04:48.53 | rob1n | and you can finish this in a summer? ^.^ |
| 04:48.54 | L4m3r | what IDE, jude-? eclipse? |
| 04:49.07 | jude- | Eclipse 3.2.1 with Subclipse (SVN management) and C++ plugins |
| 04:49.17 | L4m3r | hm |
| 04:49.19 | jude- | rob1n: that's the idea :) the blog has a timeline |
| 04:49.29 | L4m3r | Eclipse looks so complicated... do you like it? |
| 04:49.39 | jude- | actually, it's not that bad |
| 04:49.42 | L4m3r | I'd like to find a decent linux IDE |
| 04:49.57 | jude- | KDevelop is pretty good--it's simple and elegant |
| 04:50.12 | jude- | Emacs is great if you like the CLI |
| 04:50.20 | L4m3r | yeah, it looked ok, but it seems to use its own project format |
| 04:50.26 | jude- | so does Eclipse |
| 04:50.32 | L4m3r | :x |
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| 04:50.47 | jude- | well, it's project configuration files are Eclipse-specific |
| 04:50.48 | L4m3r | you have the luxury of not working on the bzf mainline |
| 04:50.56 | jude- | yup :) |
| 04:50.57 | L4m3r | :P |
| 04:51.12 | jude- | what's the IDE of choice for bzf? |
| 04:51.19 | jude- | vi? |
| 04:51.29 | rob1n | to each his own i think |
| 04:51.56 | jude- | L4m3r--you *should* be able to develop BZFlag from Eclipse...just don't upload your project configs :) |
| 04:52.08 | L4m3r | yeah |
| 04:52.17 | jude- | with the proper plug-ins, you can create a new project by downloading it from SVN |
| 04:52.29 | jude- | and then work inside the project space like any IDE |
| 04:52.38 | DTRemenak | vi, emacs, and msvc are all directly supported to some extent. ultimately it's "any text editor" though |
| 04:52.42 | L4m3r | have you used MSVS? |
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| 04:52.49 | jude- | lightly |
| 04:52.58 | jude- | I don't use Windows |
| 04:53.03 | jude- | but I've tried it out |
| 04:53.05 | L4m3r | heh |
| 04:53.07 | jude- | it's pretty neat |
| 04:53.10 | purple_cow | MSVC seems like it's got some cool stuff |
| 04:53.16 | L4m3r | it does |
| 04:53.18 | jude- | Eclipse is fine for me, though |
| 04:53.24 | jude- | especially because it's cross-platform |
| 04:53.25 | L4m3r | it's just the whole "windows" thing that gets me |
| 04:54.01 | jude- | heh--I prefer to stick to open standards for development :) |
| 04:54.22 | jude- | (to whom it may concern: I'm no longer using GCC-specific C++ methods, like Map::at()) |
| 04:54.44 | jude- | (so no, I'm not being a hypocrite :) |
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| 04:55.57 | jude- | L4m3r: what "windows" thing? |
| 04:56.19 | L4m3r | jude-: having to use it :) |
| 04:56.43 | jude- | lol |
| 04:56.46 | jude- | I know what you mean :) |
| 04:56.50 | L4m3r | it's like Office |
| 04:57.00 | L4m3r | great app, but a PITA to have to boot windows to use it |
| 04:57.10 | jude- | use WINE or CrossOver |
| 04:57.19 | jude- | or OOo |
| 04:58.11 | jude- | yeah, it's a great office suite |
| 04:58.28 | blast007 | OOo doesn't compare to Microsoft Office |
| 04:58.33 | jude- | I know |
| 04:58.38 | jude- | but it does the job most of the time |
| 04:58.52 | blast007 | when it's not being slow :) |
| 04:58.54 | jude- | even then, M$ Office doesn't even compare to Emacs :P |
| 04:59.07 | jude- | blast007--it's not slow for me :) |
| 04:59.15 | jude- | it's faster than Office on comparable hardware |
| 04:59.22 | rob1n | i'd just download office, but that's just me?... |
| 04:59.35 | purple_cow | office 2007 is totally sweet |
| 04:59.40 | rob1n | purple_cow, agreed |
| 04:59.48 | rob1n | except for the whole new formats thing |
| 05:00.18 | rob1n | well, i loathe OOo more, so i'll put up with docx ;) |
| 05:00.30 | rob1n | once you set it to save by default .doc you're fine though |
| 05:00.30 | jude- | docx can't be read by anything but Office |
| 05:00.41 | purple_cow | yet |
| 05:01.05 | jude- | there was no reason to move to docx other than to break Linux/OOo/Abiword compatibility |
| 05:01.30 | jude- | just another example of M$'s anti-competitive nature |
| 05:02.17 | jude- | s/MSOOMXL/MSOOXML |
| 05:04.07 | jude- | besides, ODF 1.2 will add all the functionality (i.e. scripting languages, macros, etc.) it lacks when compared to M$'s formats |
| 05:04.25 | jude- | so there's no reason to go to a proprietary format |
| 05:04.35 | jude- | and ODF is an ISO standard to boot |
| 05:04.49 | jude- | </rant> |
| 05:13.34 | eTangenT | yo kids |
| 05:14.25 | jude- | hello eTangenT |
| 05:14.52 | eTangenT | hey jude- |
| 05:14.55 | eTangenT | wasabi? |
| 05:15.37 | jude- | wasabi? as in, the spicy green stuff that tourists think is guacamole and learn the hard way that it is not? |
| 05:15.59 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14268 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzrobots/: ignore the bzrobots binary |
| 05:16.10 | eTangenT | yeah |
| 05:16.12 | eTangenT | that |
| 05:16.17 | eTangenT | I had some last night with my sushi |
| 05:16.32 | jude- | it's good...in small milligram amounts :) |
| 05:16.40 | eTangenT | with lots of soy saucee |
| 05:16.47 | jude- | mmmm...soy sauce |
| 05:17.21 | eTangenT | mmm. |
| 05:17.29 | jude- | that reminds me |
| 05:18.22 | jude- | mmmm....caffeine-free diet coke :) |
| 05:18.44 | eTangenT | ew |
| 05:18.47 | eTangenT | diet? |
| 05:18.52 | eTangenT | I donn't mind the caffeine free |
| 05:18.56 | eTangenT | but diet causes cancer |
| 05:19.01 | eTangenT | and aspartame tastes like poo |
| 05:19.02 | jude- | no it doesn't |
| 05:19.31 | jude- | the report that everyone refernces? the lab rats were given the equivalent dosage of 5,000 cans of soda per day |
| 05:19.44 | jude- | ANYTHING of that magnitude causes cancer |
| 05:19.53 | eTangenT | hm |
| 05:19.55 | eTangenT | yeah |
| 05:20.03 | eTangenT | I BLAME MY SCIENCE TEACHERS WHO TOLD ME THIS |
| 05:20.09 | jude- | it was a FUD article |
| 05:20.11 | eTangenT | I AM SUING LPS |
| 05:20.24 | jude- | personally, I'm more worried about Splenda |
| 05:20.34 | jude- | it's glucose with three chlorine molecules bound to it |
| 05:20.43 | jude- | s/molecules/atoms |
| 05:21.02 | jude- | not healthy |
| 05:21.41 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14269 10/trunk/bzflag/src/ (7 files in 2 dirs): |
| 05:21.41 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: remove the libGLKit dependency on libPlatform that was introduced by the |
| 05:21.41 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: creation/usage of OpenGLGState:initContext()... the 'problem' however, is that |
| 05:21.42 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: we still need to reinit the context when a resize or full-to-window conversion |
| 05:21.42 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: occurs. fortunately, these seem to be entirely wrapped in the client's |
| 05:21.44 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: MainWindow resize(). regardless... this is going to need cross-platform testing |
| 05:21.46 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: big time. (tested os x) |
| 05:22.09 | jude- | another essay-long commit :) |
| 05:22.52 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14270 10/trunk/bzflag/ (21 files in 21 dirs): no longer need the .cvsignore files -- should be using 'svn propset svn:ignore pattern dir' now |
| 05:23.15 | *** join/#bzflag ElectricElf (n=dbharris@bas14-toronto12-1167997887.dsl.bell.ca) |
| 05:23.41 | jude- | hmmmmm....there's a bzflag package for OpenZaurus |
| 05:25.31 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14271 10/trunk/bzflag/src/other/ (ares/ curl/): more generated files to ignore |
| 05:27.19 | jude- | also, that new research that links sodum benzoate and gene damage is scary |
| 05:27.40 | jude- | s/sodum/sodium |
| 05:30.03 | eTangenT | yeah, Splenda is gross |
| 05:30.07 | eTangenT | really gross |
| 05:30.29 | jude- | indeed |
| 05:30.39 | DavidHKMrPowers | any 2D version of this tank game? |
| 05:31.33 | eTangenT | DavidHKMrPowers: The radar. |
| 05:31.47 | DavidHKMrPowers | heh :) |
| 05:32.12 | DavidHKMrPowers | i think that an online 2D tank game would be popular |
| 05:32.14 | eTangenT | but seriously, why would you want a 2D game? |
| 05:32.27 | DavidHKMrPowers | eTangenT i like 2D more than 3D |
| 05:32.39 | eTangenT | :o |
| 05:32.42 | eTangenT | heathen! |
| 05:32.51 | eTangenT | :D |
| 05:32.57 | eTangenT | it's cool man |
| 05:33.03 | eTangenT | I dunno of a good 2D tank game though |
| 05:33.15 | jude- | TankWars for the TI-89 graphing calculator? |
| 05:33.15 | DavidHKMrPowers | there can be more graphics and combinations in 2D games |
| 05:34.09 | eTangenT | hey jude-, you were right. |
| 05:34.14 | eTangenT | Eclipse is awesome. |
| 05:34.28 | eTangenT | I'm coding a One-Time Pad app in C++ with Eclipse |
| 05:34.28 | jude- | :D |
| 05:34.33 | eTangenT | it just looks nice |
| 05:34.39 | eTangenT | and functions |
| 05:34.42 | jude- | doesn't it? :) |
| 05:34.50 | eTangenT | I haven't explored much, but the interface is nice |
| 05:34.58 | jude- | there's TONS of configurations possible |
| 05:35.04 | jude- | and it's multi-lingual |
| 05:35.08 | DavidHKMrPowers | is the multi-player engine complicated? |
| 05:35.09 | jude- | (Java by default, however) |
| 05:35.47 | jude- | DavidHKMrPowers: yes |
| 05:35.49 | DavidHKMrPowers | is this game based on an existing network engine or what? |
| 05:35.50 | brlcad | http://my.bzflag.org/bb/files/hosted/jeffm2501/gpx01.avi |
| 05:35.52 | DavidHKMrPowers | jude- oh |
| 05:36.10 | jude- | pretty sure its custom |
| 05:36.19 | DavidHKMrPowers | oh |
| 05:36.35 | DavidHKMrPowers | yesterday i found a funny thing : arianne |
| 05:36.47 | DavidHKMrPowers | this is an online game engine |
| 05:36.53 | DavidHKMrPowers | but haven't tried yet |
| 05:37.17 | jude- | brlcad: su-weet! |
| 05:37.29 | jude- | is that in the works? |
| 05:37.52 | DavidHKMrPowers | i always want to make an online game, but graphics always beats me |
| 05:38.36 | jude- | brlcad: that's so cool. when can we expect to see that in a release? |
| 05:39.22 | DavidHKMrPowers | what's that in the avi? |
| 05:39.29 | DavidHKMrPowers | downloading |
| 05:41.53 | brlcad | jude-: alas, probably not |
| 05:42.31 | jude- | aww |
| 05:42.42 | DavidHKMrPowers | jude- oh! this is a 2D version! |
| 05:42.56 | DavidHKMrPowers | brlcad ^ |
| 05:43.04 | jude- | well, it's still 3D, but different perspective |
| 05:43.05 | brlcad | that was just one of several cool test projects that jeff's hacked up over the years |
| 05:43.11 | brlcad | that one more recent |
| 05:43.41 | DavidHKMrPowers | what's 'alas' ? |
| 05:44.29 | brlcad | ~dict alas |
| 05:44.59 | DavidHKMrPowers | brlcad thanks :D |
| 05:45.20 | DavidHKMrPowers | so..why will it not released? |
| 05:47.48 | DavidHKMrPowers | i don't know, but will it be difficult to just change the view angle and release a new version? |
| 05:48.02 | blast007 | make a fork |
| 05:48.25 | blast007 | or is there already different camera views in 2.1? |
| 05:49.42 | brlcad | it could be done in bz easily enough -- just nobody has really even tried plus it's a huge gameplay change even to allow it so it would have to be discussed |
| 05:50.03 | brlcad | as a game in itself, though, or a client of its own -- it'd be great |
| 05:50.18 | jude- | maybe it could be an option? |
| 05:50.39 | brlcad | that video had no shared code with bz, though -- jeff just wrote all that up from scratch |
| 05:50.48 | jude- | damn |
| 05:51.06 | jude- | not bad at all :) |
| 05:51.17 | brlcad | it's in cvs if someone wanted to pick it up and work on it |
| 05:52.13 | brlcad | jeff's moved on to greener pastures at the moment, though |
| 06:04.26 | *** join/#bzflag stylus (i=stylus@freenode/helper/stylus) |
| 06:07.13 | *** join/#bzflag h3ath (n=heath@c-71-207-247-195.hsd1.al.comcast.net) |
| 06:16.39 | eTangenT | hm |
| 06:16.54 | eTangenT | brlcad: Jeff's not working with BZ as much anymore? |
| 06:17.23 | *** join/#bzflag The_Vaxorcist (n=phillip@dial-209-148-113-241.sonic.net) |
| 06:19.30 | brlcad | eTangenT: that is what he has said |
| 06:20.29 | eTangenT | That's what it looked like. |
| 06:20.35 | eTangenT | I hope he stays around, I like Jeff. |
| 06:20.56 | eTangenT | Despite his anti-n00bishness (like taht towards me when I first got into bz) |
| 06:21.06 | eTangenT | but now I see where he's coming from :) |
| 06:23.50 | *** join/#bzflag CRWheelchair (n=john@ip68-105-98-187.sd.sd.cox.net) |
| 06:23.52 | brlcad | it's not being a n00b so much as it is the attitude of many and energy it takes to keep things running smoothly (with very little visible appreciation) |
| 06:24.00 | brlcad | given the effort at least |
| 06:27.23 | eTangenT | ... |
| 06:27.26 | eTangenT | CRWheelchair: |
| 06:27.31 | eTangenT | you the stupid cheater? |
| 06:29.09 | *** join/#bzflag noyb (i=noyb@nat/sun/x-8547950b7ac67eef) |
| 06:30.54 | eTangenT | I apologize, how very rude of me. |
| 06:31.00 | eTangenT | How are you this fine evening? |
| 06:39.06 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteorite (n=a_meteor@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 06:41.14 | DavidHKMrPowers | what's anti-noob? |
| 06:41.53 | DavidHKMrPowers | it seems that it's lack of helpers here. i may help in translation to chinese when you need help |
| 06:43.50 | jude- | anti-noob I guess means "against n00bs" |
| 06:48.40 | Deepa | There should be a intelligence level on IRC/USENet |
| 06:48.47 | Deepa | You have to be THIS smart to post/talk |
| 06:49.00 | Deepa | Sorry, Your IQ is below 75 (disconnecting) |
| 06:49.20 | a_meteorite | Deepa: I'd much rather have a way to punch people over the internet |
| 06:49.31 | Deepa | That's just wishful thinking |
| 06:49.35 | Deepa | I'd hate such a feature |
| 06:49.56 | Deepa | I'm halfop at a channel with 340 users |
| 06:50.03 | Deepa | I annoy atleast 200 of them daily |
| 06:50.12 | a_meteorite | and you're saying this because...? |
| 06:50.28 | Deepa | PUNCH THE MONKEY! |
| 06:52.20 | a_meteorite | iirc, a senator wanted to introduce a bill to destroy a user's HD if they download illegal music |
| 06:52.27 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14272 10/trunk/bzflag/src/platform/ (8 files in 2 dirs): separate out SDLVisual and SDLWindow from the SDLDisplay files so it's consistent with the other platform files |
| 06:52.41 | The_Vaxorcist | or a nework card "tester" |
| 06:52.47 | Deepa | Did he also work at RIAA a_meteorite? |
| 06:53.09 | a_meteorite | Deepa: I don't remember, this was a few years ago |
| 06:54.07 | jude- | he was payed by the RIAA |
| 06:54.32 | jude- | besides, how's that going to stop it from happenning? |
| 06:54.37 | jude- | just create a remote back-up |
| 06:54.39 | jude- | or encrypt it |
| 06:54.46 | Deepa | 2 HDD's to destroy! |
| 06:54.55 | jude- | they only know about one hard drive, though :) |
| 06:54.59 | jude- | or use a RAID |
| 06:55.01 | Deepa | Well you upload it |
| 06:55.06 | Deepa | So someone gotta download it |
| 06:55.09 | Deepa | Twice the crime |
| 06:55.21 | Deepa | How do they know you downloaded a illegal mp3 at all then? |
| 06:55.33 | jude- | another good question |
| 06:55.39 | jude- | that's still unanswerable |
| 06:55.45 | jude- | what if you received it from a friend? |
| 06:55.53 | Deepa | cat logs/* | grep mp3 |
| 06:55.56 | a_meteorite | they post exe's masqueraded as mp3's on torrent sites? |
| 06:56.03 | Deepa | PIRATES! |
| 06:56.07 | jude- | pfft. use Linux (no .exe crap |
| 06:56.30 | Deepa | They just grep the logs for "mp3" |
| 06:56.33 | a_meteorite | shell scripts. |
| 06:56.47 | Deepa | Every occurancy is a HDD to slaughter |
| 06:56.54 | jude- | how's it going to execute without my permission? |
| 06:56.59 | a_meteorite | magic |
| 06:57.13 | Deepa | Include a copy of john the ripper |
| 06:57.16 | jude- | which shell? |
| 06:57.17 | Deepa | brute-force the root pw |
| 06:57.25 | a_meteorite | bash, cause I can't stand anything else |
| 06:57.27 | Deepa | msh, the magic one |
| 06:57.32 | Deepa | mbash* |
| 06:57.33 | Deepa | magic bash |
| 06:57.34 | a_meteorite | Deepa: yeah... like the user won't notice... |
| 06:57.48 | Deepa | make it wget a mp3 and play it |
| 06:57.57 | Deepa | cat file.mp3 < /dev/speakers |
| 06:58.00 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-085-016-150-245.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 06:58.01 | Deepa | err opposite way |
| 06:58.04 | Deepa | Would that work :P? |
| 06:58.08 | purple_cow | files named .mp3 don't execute on windows either =P |
| 06:58.37 | a_meteorite | purple_cow: unless... hmm... they exploit a vulnerability. oh noez! |
| 06:58.43 | jude- | unplug your internet interface and then play it :) |
| 06:58.57 | jude- | or... |
| 06:59.01 | a_meteorite | the app could wait till you reconnect to open a backdoor |
| 06:59.03 | jude- | use something REALLY obscure |
| 06:59.14 | jude- | like BeOS, SkyOS, QNX, etc |
| 06:59.22 | a_meteorite | which is easy on windows |
| 06:59.27 | jude- | plan 9... |
| 06:59.33 | a_meteorite | ... |
| 07:00.06 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14273 10/trunk/bzflag/MSVC/VC71/platform.vcproj: add the new SDLVisual and SDLWindow files to the windows build |
| 07:00.41 | a_meteorite | except the GUI for plan 9... is... uh. not so great. |
| 07:00.50 | jude- | masquerade your IP address |
| 07:00.50 | a_meteorite | at least from what I've seen |
| 07:00.55 | a_meteorite | I haven't tried it |
| 07:00.58 | jude- | or use a SW MAC |
| 07:01.23 | jude- | or block the port :) |
| 07:01.30 | jude- | many ways to block a backdoor |
| 07:01.35 | a_meteorite | yeah. don't allow any outgoing connections. |
| 07:01.38 | a_meteorite | that would REALLY work. |
| 07:01.40 | a_meteorite | ;) |
| 07:03.36 | jude- | a_meteorite: screw the GUI; I want the obscurity :) |
| 07:03.55 | a_meteorite | heh |
| 07:04.14 | The_Vaxorcist | what about writing your own OS then ? :) |
| 07:04.48 | jude- | will do when I take the class in OS design theory |
| 07:04.48 | jude- | (at least one semester away from that) |
| 07:04.48 | a_meteorite | team up with AWOS |
| 07:05.05 | The_Vaxorcist | which reminds me, I never did get my computer in protected mode |
| 07:05.17 | a_meteorite | protected mode? |
| 07:05.21 | jude- | ring 0 |
| 07:05.29 | jude- | ..er.. |
| 07:05.30 | jude- | ring 1 |
| 07:05.34 | jude- | (ring 0 is real mode) |
| 07:05.35 | a_meteorite | ring 1? ... eh? |
| 07:05.54 | a_meteorite | i'm a nerd, but "protected mode" and "ring" does not ring a bell (no pun intended) |
| 07:05.58 | The_Vaxorcist | protected mode is 32 bits |
| 07:06.10 | a_meteorite | oh. |
| 07:06.16 | The_Vaxorcist | aka 4GB (or so) of memory |
| 07:06.18 | a_meteorite | so you don't like 64-bit mode..? |
| 07:06.35 | DTRemenak | protected mode is an 80286 extension, no 32-bit |
| 07:06.39 | The_Vaxorcist | well, I don't have a 64 bit chip |
| 07:06.42 | jude- | chips that support multi-tasking OS's natively have at least two rings of execution: ring 0 and ring 1 |
| 07:06.44 | a_meteorite | mmk |
| 07:06.51 | jude- | ring 0 is real mode, where the kernel runs |
| 07:06.57 | jude- | it has direct access to all hardware |
| 07:06.59 | jude- | ring 1 is protected mode |
| 07:07.04 | a_meteorite | I don't have any 64-bit chips so I wouldn't know (would love em, but no cash kinda prohibits new stuff) |
| 07:07.04 | jude- | this is where user-space is |
| 07:07.23 | jude- | ring 1 doesn't have direct access to all memory or hardware |
| 07:07.25 | DTRemenak | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_%28computer_security%29 |
| 07:07.37 | jude- | ring 1 thinks it runs in a contiguous chunk of memory (like 4 GB) |
| 07:07.45 | a_meteorite | that is also why I need to take a computer science course |
| 07:08.01 | jude- | rings of execution combined with a PMMU allow multi-tasking at the hardware level |
| 07:08.04 | a_meteorite | *courses |
| 07:09.11 | jude- | in fact, when ring 1 tries to access memory it doesn't control, the chip throws a hardware-level error that can be caught in ring 0 and handled |
| 07:09.22 | jude- | the PMMU handles this, I believe |
| 07:09.44 | jude- | (the PMMU allows processes to run in their own address space) |
| 07:10.07 | jude- | (and catches page fault errors, memory management errors, etc) |
| 07:10.33 | jude- | this is why a userspace program can't crash your system by writing to memory it doesn't own |
| 07:11.06 | jude- | but on, say, DOS, or a Palm Pilot, or a TI-83, it CAN because there is no PMMU or it isn't used (i.e. the OS and the programs run in the same address space) |
| 07:11.18 | jude- | this was a problem in Macs until OS 9 |
| 07:11.21 | a_meteorite | sounds dangerous |
| 07:11.29 | jude- | because OS 9 and previous didn't use the PMMU on the PowerPC or the Motorola 68K |
| 07:11.38 | jude- | it is |
| 07:11.52 | DTRemenak | it's fun. reading other processes' memory lets you pull all kinds of stuff :) |
| 07:11.58 | a_meteorite | so one could write a PDA virus for Palms and cause mass devestation |
| 07:11.59 | jude- | it's a miracle that there wan't a Mac super-virus |
| 07:12.09 | jude- | a_meteorite: several already exist |
| 07:12.19 | jude- | it's pretty easy to crash your PalmOS pda |
| 07:12.54 | a_meteorite | sweet |
| 07:13.01 | jude- | I've done it hundreds of times |
| 07:13.05 | jude- | when I used to develop for it |
| 07:13.15 | a_meteorite | DTRemenak: like stealing personal data? heh |
| 07:13.26 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * r14274 10/trunk/bzflag/src/platform/WinWindow.cxx: reactivateAll is static, callExposeCallbacks is not. call it on the scanned instance. |
| 07:13.38 | a_meteorite | now I just feel so safe when I put stuff on my cell phone... ;) |
| 07:13.49 | jude- | well, it depends on the cell phone's OS |
| 07:13.55 | a_meteorite | luckily we don't have a data plan, that would open quite a bit up |
| 07:13.57 | jude- | and whether or not the OS can multi-task |
| 07:14.03 | a_meteorite | true |
| 07:14.18 | The_Vaxorcist | and I guess thats why OS X is such an improvement |
| 07:14.26 | jude- | most cell phones have two processors: one for the OS, and one for transmitting/receiving data, IIRC |
| 07:14.27 | DTRemenak | one of many reasons |
| 07:14.51 | jude- | so, you have multi-tasking, but it's all implemented at the hardware level |
| 07:14.58 | a_meteorite | I didn't grow up on OS 9, and I'm glad I didn't.. I hear a ton of horror stories about it and extensions (I think that's what they were called) |
| 07:15.08 | jude- | and the two processes don't run in the same address space, fortunately (IIRC) |
| 07:15.23 | jude- | a_meteorite: OSX is a *HUGE* improvement |
| 07:15.29 | a_meteorite | so I've heard |
| 07:15.49 | jude- | and yes, it's pretty horrific |
| 07:15.56 | jude- | extensions are kind of like kernel modules |
| 07:16.11 | jude- | only they run in user-space |
| 07:16.16 | jude- | OS 9 uses a nanokernel, IIRC |
| 07:16.43 | jude- | which emulates a 68K on the PowerPC for native legacy compatibility (plus providing PPC-native support) |
| 07:16.49 | a_meteorite | ick |
| 07:16.57 | jude- | and manages IRQs, memory, interrupts, etc |
| 07:17.14 | jude- | everything else is in user-space (filesystems, networking, extensions, etc) |
| 07:17.41 | jude- | 68K emulation at the kernel level is present in all Mac OS's that ran on PPC prior to OSX |
| 07:17.53 | jude- | the Finder is like a user-space process switcher |
| 07:18.04 | jude- | (very bad idea) |
| 07:18.13 | a_meteorite | :o |
| 07:18.27 | jude- | only all processes run in the same address space |
| 07:18.42 | jude- | in fact, the Finder *is* a user-space process manager |
| 07:18.57 | jude- | (not in OSX, though) |
| 07:19.27 | jude- | heh--win9x is the same way |
| 07:19.33 | jude- | only at least win9x used the PMMU |
| 07:19.42 | jude- | (or tried to) |
| 07:20.00 | jude- | (in user-space) |
| 07:20.03 | jude- | (another very bad idea) |
| 07:20.34 | jude- | (and the reason why simple errors like page faults caused BSOD's--there was no way to catch them outside of DOS, which had access to ring 0) |
| 07:21.19 | jude- | UNIX, however, has been free of all these stupid design decisions for decades |
| 07:21.20 | The_Vaxorcist | that makes me really curious about how win9x was hacked together |
| 07:21.43 | jude- | The_Vaxorcist: by sweaty M$ programmers in a velvet sweatshop :) |
| 07:21.57 | a_meteorite | did they get paid per feature? |
| 07:22.10 | jude- | lots of x86 assembler, lots of kludges, lots of legacy code |
| 07:22.34 | a_meteorite | oooh. assembler. sounds like lots of work. |
| 07:22.34 | jude- | there's a reason why Windows can only run on an x86--there are so many x86 assembler kludges that porting it wouldn't be worth it |
| 07:22.55 | jude- | WinNT4 ran briefly on a DEC Alpha processor, but not very well IIRC |
| 07:23.02 | jude- | and support has long since been dropped |
| 07:23.08 | a_meteorite | did they port the assembly? |
| 07:23.12 | jude- | they had to |
| 07:23.16 | jude- | well, |
| 07:23.25 | jude- | WinNT was from a different codebase than DOS |
| 07:23.31 | jude- | so it might have been much easier |
| 07:23.48 | jude- | WinNT shares lots of similarities internally with DEC VAX, IIRC |
| 07:23.56 | a_meteorite | or they could use something that can be compiled on all architectures... like C |
| 07:24.13 | jude- | well, you need assembler to access specific features of the chip |
| 07:24.16 | jude- | like the hardware timer |
| 07:24.21 | jude- | and the ring switcher |
| 07:24.23 | jude- | and the PMMU |
| 07:24.29 | jude- | there all specific to their chip |
| 07:24.32 | jude- | and can't be written in C |
| 07:24.38 | a_meteorite | oh |
| 07:24.40 | jude- | they must use opcodes |
| 07:24.41 | DTRemenak | erm, windows is relatively portable and runs on plenty of other architectures. at various times it has run on alpha, sparc, powerpc, i860, i960, mips, and ia64 |
| 07:24.50 | a_meteorite | see how much I know about OS theory. |
| 07:25.03 | jude- | DTRemenak, there's a sparc port? |
| 07:25.29 | DTRemenak | it was originally developed on i860, specifically to prevent nonportable code from slipping in |
| 07:25.30 | jude- | hmmm...now that you mention it, I remember that IBM was trying to get it to work on the PPC to promote their chip architecture... |
| 07:25.43 | jude- | didn't know that one |
| 07:25.55 | DTRemenak | 3.51 ran on sparc internally, but was not sold retail |
| 07:26.14 | jude- | where'd the mips port come from? |
| 07:26.16 | DTRemenak | retail shipped on x86, alpha, and mips, plus powerpc in 3.51 |
| 07:26.19 | DTRemenak | sgi |
| 07:26.32 | jude- | no--SGI made x86 machines to run NT, right? |
| 07:26.36 | DTRemenak | yes |
| 07:26.42 | DTRemenak | both :) |
| 07:26.52 | jude- | hmm....never heard of a MIPS machine running NT' |
| 07:26.52 | DTRemenak | 'tis part of the reason it was such a mess |
| 07:27.04 | DTRemenak | well nobody would CHOOSE to run NT over IRIX, jude- :) |
| 07:27.09 | Chestal | I remember the Alphas with NT which they tried to sell to the average joe |
| 07:27.11 | jude- | this is true |
| 07:27.25 | DTRemenak | especially a version of NT that would not run any available windows applications |
| 07:27.25 | Chestal | was going to conquer the world - and failed miserably |
| 07:27.34 | jude- | DTRemenak, definitely |
| 07:27.47 | jude- | Chestal--Intel can market better, and Alpha chips are expensive |
| 07:28.03 | DTRemenak | IA-64 is still supported across the whole line |
| 07:28.05 | jude- | CISC chips are easier to produce--less hardware |
| 07:28.30 | jude- | and Alpha is RISC (and still a decent chip, even today) |
| 07:28.31 | DTRemenak | heh, then why is everything internally RISC these days? :P |
| 07:28.46 | jude- | prior to the Pentium, Intel chips were CISC only |
| 07:29.14 | jude- | that's partly why a Pentium is much faster than a 486 at the same clockspeed |
| 07:29.16 | purple_cow | modern CPUs are pretty CISCey |
| 07:29.43 | Chestal | btw., has anything changed with respect to the handling of gameover and countdowns 2.0 -> 2.2? |
| 07:29.51 | jude- | purple_cow: AMD and Intel chips are RISC internally and use CISC instructions (which are broken down into RISC instructions and executed), right? |
| 07:29.51 | DTRemenak | probably yes |
| 07:31.04 | *** join/#bzflag noyb (i=noyb@nat/sun/x-2e5775d1961737cf) |
| 07:31.40 | Chestal | at first glance it seems to be the same mess as in 2.0. going to submit a small change to 2.0, I guess it is useful for 2.2, too, but I am simply not that familiar with all the changes made |
| 07:32.00 | DTRemenak | go ahead and commit to both |
| 07:32.05 | DTRemenak | there may have been some stuff added |
| 07:32.06 | jude- | DTRemenak--while Intel-compatible chips are internally RISC, they're much simpler than a full RISC chip |
| 07:32.27 | jude- | I think they're a hybrid |
| 07:32.39 | jude- | and I think there's still some CISC-only instructions |
| 07:33.02 | jude- | a_meteorite: still with us? :) |
| 07:33.11 | a_meteorite | yeah jude- |
| 07:33.18 | a_meteorite | just.. uh.. following along and trying to keep up |
| 07:33.26 | jude- | that's what I meant |
| 07:33.54 | jude- | DTRemenak, is there an ARM port of Windows (not WinCE, but an actual desktop windows)? |
| 07:34.01 | DTRemenak | not that I know of |
| 07:40.35 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03Chestal * r14275 10/branches/v2_0branch/bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfs.cxx: only report server as empty to list server when in case of gameover when it is a traditional timed game |
| 07:40.37 | jude- | I guess, then, Linux still has the upper-hand in number of supported architectures :)\ |
| 07:41.23 | *** join/#bzflag noyb (i=noyb@nat/sun/x-d9f02ac6f705f3b8) |
| 07:41.38 | DTRemenak | more than netbsd now? |
| 07:41.58 | DavidHKMrPowers | are there any existing opensource multiplayer game engine? |
| 07:42.23 | jude- | DTRemenak, pretty sure |
| 07:42.30 | jude- | I think they're at 24 |
| 07:42.47 | jude- | how many does netbsd support? |
| 07:42.51 | DavidHKMrPowers | can suggest me some please? |
| 07:43.07 | DTRemenak | 60-some |
| 07:43.20 | jude- | never mind, then :) |
| 07:43.25 | jude- | which architectures are those? |
| 07:43.28 | DTRemenak | by platform architecture, not cpu architecture |
| 07:43.35 | jude- | I meant CPU architecture |
| 07:43.42 | DTRemenak | i.e. mac68k and next68k are different to netbsd |
| 07:43.56 | The_Vaxorcist | DavidHKMrPowers, tried google? |
| 07:44.13 | jude- | Linux supports 24-ish types of CPUs, I think |
| 07:44.50 | DTRemenak | 16 cpu architectures |
| 07:45.12 | jude- | yeah, linux has the upper hand |
| 07:45.18 | DavidHKMrPowers | The_Vaxorcist not yet, just want someone to suggest me some by their experience |
| 07:45.19 | DTRemenak | got a list? |
| 07:47.30 | The_Vaxorcist | good luck then |
| 07:47.52 | jude- | x86, x64, powerpc, crux, pa-risc, s390, CELL/BE, alpha, mips (both endians), arm, sparc, superH, m68k, blackfin, avr32, cris, fr-v, h8, m32r, v850e, |
| 07:47.58 | jude- | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linux_kernel_portability_and_supported_architectures |
| 07:48.34 | jude- | there are more, but I'll have to check the source code |
| 07:48.52 | jude- | cell/be, for example, isn't listed in that article, but it is supported |
| 07:49.07 | jude- | (how else do you run Linux on the PS3?) |
| 07:50.05 | jude- | ....power, openrisc, ibm zseries, arc, ... |
| 07:50.52 | jude- | if the chip has a port of GCC and has a PMMU, there theoretically is Linux support |
| 07:51.25 | jude- | even then, uclinux doesn't need the pmmu |
| 07:51.31 | DTRemenak | likewise for netbsd...the 16 are those which have offical support under "make buildworld" (i.e. the entire bsd userland is supported) |
| 07:51.45 | DavidHKMrPowers | any other suggestions of opensource multi-player games? |
| 07:52.13 | jude- | ahh |
| 07:52.31 | DTRemenak | bsd treats itself as an operating system, not just a kernel |
| 07:52.46 | jude- | hmmm |
| 07:53.00 | jude- | well, Linux *is* just a kernel |
| 07:53.06 | jude- | GNU/Linux is the OS |
| 07:53.07 | DTRemenak | exactly :) |
| 07:53.31 | DavidHKMrPowers | so complicated |
| 07:53.37 | jude- | I wonder how many OS's GNU supports? |
| 07:53.41 | jude- | (i.e. the userland) |
| 07:55.05 | DTRemenak | depends which part |
| 07:55.58 | jude- | the essential parts (i.e. the compiler, the basic POSIX libs, libc, glibc, bash, init, emacs, cron, etc.) |
| 07:56.19 | DTRemenak | HAH... [the essential parts (i.e. ... emacs ... ) :P |
| 07:56.28 | jude- | honestly, I hate both emacs and vi |
| 07:56.36 | jude- | I hate emacs less than vi, thouhg |
| 07:56.51 | jude- | emacs is just *officially* part of GNU cause rms wrote it |
| 07:57.12 | jude- | you need at least one text editor |
| 07:58.03 | jude- | tis true |
| 07:58.07 | jude- | it take WAY less memory |
| 08:03.33 | jude- | DTRemenak, how strict should I be on syntax errors in BZWorkbench? right now, if there are duplicate world objects, BZWorkbench only looks at the last one, for example |
| 08:03.45 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03Chestal * r14276 10/trunk/bzflag/src/platform/SDLPlatformFactory.cxx: include necessary headers |
| 08:03.58 | DTRemenak | jude-: my initial instinct is to say "exactly as strict as bzflag", but that's probably wrong :) |
| 08:03.59 | jude- | and only looks at the last non-repeatable key-value pair (i.e. the world name) if duplicates exist |
| 08:04.16 | jude- | should it at least dump a warning? |
| 08:04.38 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03Chestal * r14277 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzfs/bzfs.cxx: only report server as empty to list server in case of gameover if it is a traditional timed game |
| 08:04.40 | DTRemenak | you should probably be as strict as possible, and throw resolvable errors as much as possible (i.e. "two world blocks specified, please select the one you wish to keep" |
| 08:05.06 | DTRemenak | and yeah, at least some sort of warning |
| 08:05.46 | jude- | kk |
| 08:09.06 | purple_cow | sigh |
| 08:11.09 | jude- | why? |
| 08:14.25 | purple_cow | registration renewal |
| 08:16.09 | jude- | sorry |
| 08:20.36 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * r14278 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/ (MainWindow.cxx MainWindow.h): windows REALLY needs that state reset on minimize/restore. throw it in as an ifdef'd callback. it's uglier than before; platform-dependent code doesn't really belong in src/bzflag. |
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| 09:22.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03judecn * r14279 10/trunk/bzworkbench/ (13 files in 8 dirs): (log message trimmed) |
| 09:22.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: Okay, a LOT has changed. The internal representation of all map objects has |
| 09:22.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: been completely revamped and decided (see include/DataEntry.h for the format). |
| 09:22.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: Every map object is represented as a BZW2-formatted string now, and a collection |
| 09:22.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: of BZW parsing methods have been created. Each object can parse itself and |
| 09:22.58 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: update its internal variables, as well as send itself in string form to a |
| 09:23.00 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: caller. Loading/Saving is going to be trivial now--just tell each object to |
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| 09:30.07 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v Tupone] by ChanServ |
| 10:12.15 | ruskie | erm is bzw2 still a simple plaintext format? |
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| 13:08.24 | wanda | Hi, i think bzadmin Makefile needs an update: http://pastebin.ca/533365 |
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| 14:09.07 | KTL | first time I hear of a lib cares |
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| 14:53.58 | Winny | woohooo... watch out for "boy007" on the forums... I think he is going to be a problem. |
| 14:56.27 | eTangenT | Winny: I couldn''t agree more. |
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| 15:13.18 | brlcad | ruskie: that's all it's ever been |
| 15:13.25 | brlcad | and afaik, there's no plans on changing that |
| 15:14.14 | ruskie | ??? |
| 15:15.06 | brlcad | DTRemenak: hm, I actually had that callback in there at one point for all plats |
| 15:15.22 | blast007 | bzw2 is just referring to the 2.0.x version of BZW |
| 15:15.29 | ruskie | ahh |
| 15:17.09 | brlcad | DTRemenak: that's why I'd (tested) adding the calling the exposure callbacks in the WinWindow (or whereever it was) - I've been trying to find other ways to get there, if you have any ideas |
| 15:19.17 | brlcad | the issue has come up because I'm writing an app that uses libPlatform (only) -- and there have been just a handful of (unresolved) symbols that don't make sense from that usage perspective (because they're in other libraries like libGame, etc) .. there's only a two left now .. |
| 15:19.37 | brlcad | ruskie: yeah, jude- likes to call it bzw2 for some reason |
| 15:19.47 | ruskie | lol |
| 15:23.42 | wanda | brlcad: with the last bunch of commits, the bzadmin linkage is broken .. could u pse check http://pastebin.ca/533365 ? |
| 15:24.50 | brlcad | thanks |
| 15:25.02 | wanda | np :-) |
| 15:25.43 | brlcad | which platform was that? |
| 15:27.54 | wanda | suse linux 10.2+ some private updates ... i configured ' --enable-ares-build --enable-ares' |
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| 15:49.24 | *** join/#bzflag smallfoot- (i=smallfoo@clamwin/translator/smallfoot) |
| 15:49.28 | smallfoot- | where is theh nightly build? |
| 15:49.30 | smallfoot- | i forgotte |
| 15:49.39 | smallfoot- | i get so tired of old release, i cry |
| 15:49.52 | smallfoot- | it must come release in 2007! HELLO |
| 15:50.00 | smallfoot- | hafl 2007 has gone away, and no reelase |
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| 15:51.30 | blast007 | smallfoot-: there isn't a nightly build |
| 15:51.48 | blast007 | go build it yourself :) |
| 15:54.19 | ts | brlcad: BTW: On OS X it's still broken |
| 15:55.46 | smallfoot- | blast007, i found website with nightly build before |
| 15:55.51 | ts | as soon as the binary and the script is moved into a different location the bzflag client does no longer load the libares lib |
| 15:55.51 | smallfoot- | someone in this cahnnel told me the website |
| 15:56.49 | brad | you mean http://beta.bzflag.bz? those builds aren't nightly at all |
| 15:58.42 | ts | They're built when some stuff works |
| 15:58.54 | ts | meaning broken but not extremly broken |
| 15:59.02 | smallfoot- | brlcad, yes that site |
| 15:59.34 | smallfoot- | brad, yes that site* |
| 15:59.36 | ts | smallfoot-: I expect the next big release will last long |
| 15:59.42 | smallfoot- | :( |
| 15:59.45 | smallfoot- | but last release was 2006 |
| 15:59.52 | smallfoot- | now is 2007, half already goone, i waont relrease |
| 16:00.08 | ts | Do you want a game full of bugs? |
| 16:00.31 | ts | There is not enough development capacity..we need to do some stuff to warrant a release |
| 16:00.54 | smallfoot- | ok |
| 16:01.11 | ts | It's sad bug bz's future does not look very good at the moment |
| 16:01.23 | smallfoot- | :( |
| 16:01.33 | smallfoot- | you should put on bzflag website "developers wanted" |
| 16:02.43 | ts | Well, the code is partly very difficult, BZFlag's problems are complicated |
| 16:03.07 | ts | The target audience for the game are kids mostly |
| 16:03.26 | ts | So it is hard to get new people |
| 16:03.43 | brlcad | smallfoot-: please stop whining about a release unless you intend to contribute code |
| 16:03.52 | brlcad | it really doesn't help, no matter how much you want it |
| 16:04.29 | brlcad | neither does ts's negative poisoning either |
| 16:05.04 | brlcad | ts, that's merely a build/distribution issue -- far from critical |
| 16:05.11 | smallfoot- | ok |
| 16:05.11 | smallfoot- | good |
| 16:05.22 | smallfoot- | but hey, put on website, developers requested, so it can speed up develpoerment |
| 16:05.45 | brlcad | ts: i probably wouldn't deal with it until it comes time to release, you're welcome to fix it yourself as always too |
| 16:05.51 | ts | brlcad: heh, but it bugs me when I try to test it ;) |
| 16:05.55 | brlcad | smallfoot-: go for it |
| 16:06.08 | ts | it's not mission critical, I agree |
| 16:06.09 | brlcad | ts: so fix it instead of whining |
| 16:06.18 | brlcad | that seriously does not help and just gets very annoying |
| 16:06.19 | ts | I tried..with no luck |
| 16:06.28 | brlcad | then make a note in a bugs file and deal with it |
| 16:06.35 | brlcad | or keep trying |
| 16:07.02 | brlcad | otherwise you elevate what is a petty issue above other actual real development that matters a whole lot more |
| 16:07.14 | ts | Oh |
| 16:08.30 | brlcad | we're still in dev mode, so the binaries don't even need to move on os x strictly speaking -- we're not making public distributions of builds, and to do so would also just slow down any real progress |
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| 17:33.14 | catay | ts: a lot of 'old' people play bzflag too :P |
| 17:35.27 | catay | to be honest, when I started playing I was surprised to find out how many +30y people are playing this game |
| 17:45.37 | ts | Yeah, thought the "kiddies" make the most noise |
| 17:46.46 | catay | That's why they are kiddies :) |
| 17:47.14 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03t-s * r14280 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/Makefile.am: Try to let the bzflag client to be moved around again |
| 17:47.48 | ts | heh, perhaps ;) |
| 17:50.34 | brlcad | ts: INSIDE_BZ is a windows-only flag for dll exports |
| 17:52.00 | brlcad | you can't move the binary because the libraries aren't being included in the frameworks -- if you're building via xcode or manually, you have to either install the library into the frameworks dir (and make sure run-time searches there) or link the library static (the easy way out) |
| 17:57.32 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14281 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/MainWindow.cxx: if the window is exposed, it should probably reinit the opengl context regardless (per spec?) |
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| 18:50.37 | ts | brlcad: Well, it changes the linking. If you want to revert feel free to. |
| 18:53.08 | brlcad | changes the linking howso? |
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| 19:01.49 | Winny | brb |
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| 19:05.21 | a_meteorite | ~seen AAA_awright |
| 19:05.58 | ibot | aaa_awright <n=chatzill@wsip-68-14-251-102.ph.ph.cox.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 4d 16h 32m 55s ago, saying: '--without-bzfs?'. |
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| 19:10.07 | a_meteorite | ~seen daniel_jackson |
| 19:11.06 | ibot | daniel_jackson <n=bsanford@cpe-24-25-198-254.san.res.rr.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 6d 14h 12m 40s ago, saying: 'true, but its not comcast!'. |
| 19:25.22 | onami | Hi, why is that bzfs contains a select loop when threads are used all around ? |
| 19:26.13 | Chestal | "used all around"? |
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| 19:27.16 | onami | :) In GameKeeper for instance |
| 19:31.59 | Chestal | I am not familiar with the extent to which bzfs (optionally) uses threads now |
| 19:32.10 | onami | I think is just in GameKeeper |
| 19:32.17 | Chestal | but anyway, even when you use threads why not use select, too? |
| 19:32.29 | Chestal | fo rinstance there is one and only one socket to receive UDP packets |
| 19:32.54 | Chestal | so you have to demultiplex that somewhere |
| 19:34.39 | onami | using UDP, you don't quite use threads, until after the demultiplexing |
| 19:53.05 | DTRemenak | brlcad: glx explicitly preserves contexts until the window is destroyed, so there's not really any point to reinitializing it for them, just adds another half second to the time it takes to switch to the window. dunno what happens on mac. |
| 19:55.10 | *** join/#bzflag Macrosoft (n=Macrosof@c-75-65-79-249.hsd1.la.comcast.net) |
| 19:55.55 | DTRemenak | even our own x platform code only creates a context if it doesn't already have one, and never frees it until destruction. wgl, on the other hand, will potentially take the opportunity to release the context without your permission any time it's not current. |
| 19:57.04 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03dtremenak * r14282 10/trunk/bzflag/src/platform/XWindow.cxx: same static-called-from-nonstatic issue as WinWindow |
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| 20:10.14 | onami | what is the purpose of bz_TickEventData_V1 please ? |
| 20:10.48 | a_meteorite | onami: have you looked at bzfsApi.h? |
| 20:11.21 | onami | I am, I'm trying to get a whole image |
| 20:11.47 | a_meteorite | well, it provides double eventTime |
| 20:11.53 | a_meteorite | which is how long since the server started |
| 20:12.14 | a_meteorite | so you're doing async stuff? |
| 20:12.23 | catay | it gets called everyhting bzfs has done with his main loop or something like that |
| 20:12.26 | a_meteorite | like grab a little then continue, grab a little on another tick, continue? |
| 20:12.29 | catay | *everytime |
| 20:13.12 | a_meteorite | a tick event is called a lot... everytime it goes through a loop, and it gets called a minimum amount |
| 20:13.19 | a_meteorite | someone correct me if I'm wrong about that though |
| 20:14.15 | catay | yeah, sorta, don't know the specifics :P |
| 20:14.15 | catay | <PROTECTED> |
| 20:14.15 | onami | thanks |
| 20:14.15 | catay | it's not really up to date but it should do the job |
| 20:14.20 | a_meteorite | oh, whoops, catay != onami :) |
| 20:15.26 | *** join/#bzflag a_meteorite (n=a_meteor@unaffiliated/ameteorite/x-000000001) |
| 20:18.08 | catay | onami: are you working on a plugin ? |
| 20:18.37 | onami | catay: kind off, I'm trying to get in a web admin |
| 20:18.48 | a_meteorite | a web admin? |
| 20:19.06 | onami | catay: right now, I'm just trying to understand how bzfs works |
| 20:19.08 | a_meteorite | a lot of people are working on that already, including myself/BZFX |
| 20:19.27 | onami | a_meteorite: so how can I help ? |
| 20:19.32 | catay | work together :) |
| 20:19.51 | *** join/#bzflag a_temp_dist (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 20:19.55 | catay | onami: the plugin documentation is a good start , its not up to date , but it gives a clear picture |
| 20:20.01 | a_meteorite | one minute... I need to do something |
| 20:20.54 | a_temp_dist | any admins at borasi.de:5154 here - "a meteorite" imposter with unkillable cheat on now |
| 20:20.54 | catay | but teh best thing is to look in the bzfsAPI.h for all the methods and suchs |
| 20:23.12 | a_meteorite | onami: well, BZFX's stuff is planned to be closed-source... so... people are welcome to help me out, but some people only like open-source |
| 20:23.33 | a_meteorite | AAA (on IRC as AAA_awright, who has been gone for a few days), is working on something open-source but not as integrated as BZFX |
| 20:23.44 | a_meteorite | he's also teamed with me for BZFX |
| 20:25.26 | onami | why closed source ? |
| 20:25.26 | *** join/#bzflag trovao (n=trovao@201008097050.user.veloxzone.com.br) |
| 20:26.19 | Macrosoft | whats he working on |
| 20:27.04 | blast007 | onami: because he can |
| 20:27.36 | blast007 | he doesn't want someone else making use of it before his stuff is running (or maybe at all, even in the future) |
| 20:27.55 | Macrosoft | but what stuff is it |
| 20:28.12 | blast007 | code |
| 20:28.21 | blast007 | why do you care? :) |
| 20:28.38 | Macrosoft | fine then, be that way |
| 20:28.43 | blast007 | you'll see what it is, eventally |
| 20:28.51 | blast007 | only he knows, and a few others |
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| 20:30.45 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v SportChick] by ChanServ |
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| 20:31.09 | a_meteorite | onami: others have had an express interest in using my work for commercial servers |
| 20:31.27 | a_meteorite | the GPL (one of the strictest open-source licenses compared to others) would allow this, and I don't want that |
| 20:31.45 | onami | you can use dual licensing |
| 20:32.09 | a_meteorite | I have considered modifying it to make it more strict, but I am not well versed in licenses enough to do that... |
| 20:32.39 | a_meteorite | could I add a condition to the GPL license that would prevent all commercial applications? |
| 20:32.59 | a_meteorite | *uses |
| 20:33.57 | onami | this I don't know |
| 20:34.31 | onami | but I don't think so |
| 20:34.32 | a_meteorite | yeah, if I could get a modded up license to restrict commercial uses I would probably go open-source |
| 20:34.34 | CRWheelchair | I'm sure you can adapt your own license modeled after the GPL with the necessary changes that you'd like to make. |
| 20:34.55 | a_meteorite | CRWheelchair: of course, but I am not well versed enough in legal licensing, so there would probably be tons of loopholes |
| 20:35.30 | blast007 | "Sweet, this license allows me to use the code all I want, if I use it on my toaster! Time to install linux!" |
| 20:35.31 | CRWheelchair | touché |
| 20:35.45 | a_meteorite | haha |
| 20:36.01 | Macrosoft | you can always just add in a threat |
| 20:36.28 | blast007 | "I know where you live." |
| 20:37.04 | Macrosoft | like: "if this code is used by party B to gain profit, party B will die" |
| 20:37.33 | CRWheelchair | "free for private use only" |
| 20:37.34 | Macrosoft | party B being the individual(s) agreeing to the license |
| 20:37.34 | ruskie | and thus making your software non-Free |
| 20:38.29 | Macrosoft | what kind of software did they have in mind to use |
| 20:38.42 | ruskie | seems you have the same issue the povray devs do... |
| 20:38.57 | *** part/#bzflag a_temp_dist (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 20:38.58 | ruskie | you could try one of the many non-commercial only licenses |
| 20:39.01 | a_meteorite | ruskie: yeah, it would be like a mix between open and closed source |
| 20:39.14 | a_meteorite | ruskie: any in mind? none of those are OSI approved... |
| 20:39.19 | ruskie | and none will be |
| 20:39.23 | a_meteorite | I know that |
| 20:39.31 | a_meteorite | but googling hasn't turned up any licenses |
| 20:39.32 | blast007 | use the Microsoft EULA |
| 20:39.33 | ruskie | read up what povray uses for their own |
| 20:39.36 | a_meteorite | and OSI has a good index :) |
| 20:39.38 | a_meteorite | ok |
| 20:39.40 | CRWheelchair | hehehe |
| 20:39.45 | ruskie | OSI is weird |
| 20:39.48 | ruskie | I trust FSF more |
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| 20:40.03 | blast007 | I trust the FSM |
| 20:40.11 | Macrosoft | expand acronyms: what are OSI and FSF |
| 20:40.19 | a_meteorite | haha blast007 |
| 20:40.21 | ruskie | Free Software Fundation |
| 20:40.26 | Macrosoft | ok |
| 20:40.27 | ruskie | Open Source Initiative |
| 20:40.28 | a_meteorite | Macrosoft: Open-Source Initiative |
| 20:40.34 | Macrosoft | ok, thanks |
| 20:40.40 | ruskie | one promotes the freedom to use software and get the code etc... |
| 20:40.45 | ruskie | the other promets the development model |
| 20:40.47 | blast007 | Flying Spaghetti Monster |
| 20:41.00 | blast007 | now you've learned 3 acronyms :) |
| 20:41.12 | ruskie | there's also a third project: SPI - Software in the Public Interest or some such |
| 20:41.20 | ruskie | whiche forked from OSI |
| 20:41.20 | Macrosoft | meteor, are you still playing on pentagon? |
| 20:41.31 | a_meteorite | back and forth Macrosoft |
| 20:41.52 | a_meteorite | ruskie: found the povray license, will check it out, thanks |
| 20:42.10 | Macrosoft | im trying to watch for cheating, but that observer bug makes that kinda hard |
| 20:42.39 | blast007 | which bug? |
| 20:42.40 | brad | observer bug? |
| 20:43.08 | *** join/#bzflag Admirarch (i=mwr25@pip.srcf.societies.cam.ac.uk) |
| 20:43.08 | Macrosoft | it makes everyone appear to be nr, but i can still talk to them and stuff |
| 20:43.15 | brad | that's your router... |
| 20:43.17 | blast007 | that's probably a router bug |
| 20:43.24 | Chestal | router with amnesia |
| 20:43.35 | blast007 | UDP issues most likely |
| 20:43.39 | blast007 | what router do you have? |
| 20:43.57 | Chestal | although I think there was a bug once wheer client did not send UDP (lagpings) when it was observer. Should be fixed - I guess |
| 20:44.00 | Macrosoft | i cant bypass my router, it would cut off internet connection to the rest of the house |
| 20:44.20 | Macrosoft | using a netgear router |
| 20:44.37 | blast007 | hmm, can't remember if it was netgear or d-link routers that sucked for that |
| 20:44.51 | blast007 | what client version? |
| 20:44.58 | Macrosoft | its been nothing but a pain, i cant host public servers because of NAT |
| 20:45.08 | blast007 | sure you can |
| 20:45.10 | Macrosoft | client is 2.0.8 |
| 20:45.12 | blast007 | port forwarding |
| 20:45.35 | Macrosoft | i have port forwarding set up, but it doesnt work |
| 20:45.38 | blast007 | if your router can't handle that, then it's time to get a real router |
| 20:46.18 | Macrosoft | any you would recommend |
| 20:46.27 | blast007 | Linksys WRT54GL |
| 20:46.41 | blast007 | the GL is the one still running linux |
| 20:46.52 | ruskie | or get an old box and instal pfsense on it |
| 20:46.59 | blast007 | yeah, or that |
| 20:47.31 | Macrosoft | old box? you mean computer or router |
| 20:47.39 | ruskie | computer |
| 20:48.24 | Macrosoft | ive tried updating firmware on router, it gave me more options for NAT security, but didnt help |
| 20:49.12 | Macrosoft | what i want to do is make this computer a gateway and have the router connect through it |
| 20:49.38 | Macrosoft | that way i dont cut off the internet to everyone else |
| 20:49.58 | Macrosoft | but i dont have an extra NIC to use |
| 20:50.17 | blast007 | but then you can't connect from your machine to any of the others (if you attach your computer to the Internet port on the router) |
| 20:50.36 | blast007 | I would say just pick up a new router |
| 20:50.37 | Macrosoft | i know, but i dont need to |
| 20:50.49 | CBG | sounds like you want to |
| 20:50.55 | Macrosoft | interact with them, that is |
| 20:50.55 | ts | brlcad: Without it, bzflag is a sh script, executung bzflag game binary in .libs, that tries to load the libares build during compilation with a "hardcoded" relative loaction inside the source tree. Using it lets the shell script and .libs in that dir go away and the binary loads libares from different locations on the same computer, too. |
| 20:51.13 | Macrosoft | huh? |
| 20:51.34 | CBG | Macrosoft: he is talking to brlcad |
| 20:52.04 | Macrosoft | anyway, i dont need to be able to communicate with others on my network, they dont play bzflag |
| 20:52.05 | blast007 | buy a new router, test it heavily (run a bzfs server, sit on observer, etc), and if it doesn't live up to your expectations, return it |
| 20:54.03 | *** join/#bzflag Epyon (n=Epyon@host99.180.219.81.magma-net.pl) |
| 20:56.04 | Macrosoft | would linux's firewall block it? |
| 20:56.14 | Macrosoft | the server incoming? |
| 20:56.20 | Macrosoft | port? |
| 21:02.55 | blast007 | depends if you even run the firewall |
| 21:02.59 | blast007 | if you do, then yes |
| 21:03.17 | *** join/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-085-016-204-127.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 21:03.26 | Macrosoft | gotta go for now, ill be back later |
| 21:05.14 | *** join/#bzflag tupone (n=atupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 21:05.14 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v tupone] by ChanServ |
| 21:06.36 | *** join/#bzflag tupone (n=atupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 21:06.36 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v tupone] by ChanServ |
| 21:17.24 | Winny | and we have a new record! a 4 letter post! |
| 21:20.08 | TD-Linux | no |
| 21:20.13 | TD-Linux | I've seen an 'ok' post before, I think |
| 21:20.55 | blast007 | I've seen one with just a smilie |
| 21:21.01 | blast007 | s/one/several/ |
| 21:21.28 | Winny | bah |
| 21:21.29 | blast007 | TD-Linux: and there's probably been one with just "k" then too ;) |
| 21:21.30 | Winny | :( |
| 21:23.35 | brlcad | ts: the -static flag should be doing that .. maybe you just hadn't run ./autogen.sh since -static was added (which was pretty recent) |
| 21:23.54 | brlcad | otherwise it shouldn't be making libtool wrapper scripts any longer regardless |
| 21:24.03 | brlcad | i suspect you just had an "unclean" build |
| 21:24.13 | ts | brlcad: Hmm, I tried it and it didn't work |
| 21:24.27 | ts | brlcad: I'll try again to verify |
| 21:25.38 | ts | let's see what it does after a distclean |
| 21:29.41 | brlcad | yeah, try removing it, distclean, ./autogen.sh, configure, make |
| 21:29.58 | brlcad | should not be a wrapper script if -static is an LDFLAG |
| 21:37.59 | ts | brlcad: Hmm, it works without the flag it seems |
| 21:38.23 | brlcad | :) |
| 21:38.50 | ts | brlcad: Ah, I got the directory path to data wrong on the other box I tested on. That must be why it didn't work there |
| 21:38.59 | brlcad | you probably are on one of the few platforms that requires a re-autogen.sh whenever a Makefile.am changes |
| 21:39.28 | ts | brlcad: Ok, I am going to rever the DINSIDE_BZ ok? |
| 21:39.59 | brlcad | ok |
| 21:40.27 | brlcad | won't hurt or help, it's just like adding -Dblahblablahasdf |
| 21:41.34 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03t-s * r14283 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzflag/Makefile.am: -DINSIDE_BZ not needed, a rebuild alone works |
| 21:50.58 | *** join/#bzflag FarkSimmons (n=chatzill@24-178-110-164.dhcp.stbr.ga.charter.com) |
| 21:51.23 | FarkSimmons | hi guys ... anything going on today? |
| 22:05.02 | wanda | FarkSimmons: check svn and you will see ... |
| 22:05.12 | FarkSimmons | wow |
| 22:05.14 | FarkSimmons | new code?? |
| 22:05.25 | FarkSimmons | anything earth-shattering? |
| 22:05.27 | FarkSimmons | :-) |
| 22:05.43 | a_meteorite | no |
| 22:05.52 | wanda | yes, several commits ... are rocking your compiler |
| 22:06.21 | wanda | sry: just wanna have some fun :-) |
| 22:07.25 | Macrosoft | hurray, i got my firewall to let the web server through |
| 22:07.37 | Macrosoft | try this link |
| 22:07.49 | brlcad | wanda: a fish called? |
| 22:07.54 | Macrosoft | http://75.65.79.249:8001:/ |
| 22:08.01 | wanda | i fell fishy today ... |
| 22:08.19 | a_meteorite | fell fishy? interesting |
| 22:08.36 | Deepa | I suddenly got a idea |
| 22:08.48 | Macrosoft | hey meteor, try that link and tell me if it works |
| 22:08.55 | a_meteorite | it works Macrosoft |
| 22:09.05 | Macrosoft | you can see the pictures |
| 22:09.07 | Macrosoft | ? |
| 22:09.40 | wanda | yas ican see them too .. new years eve? |
| 22:10.02 | Macrosoft | no, just stuff for the forums |
| 22:10.26 | Macrosoft | now im one step closer to hosting a public server |
| 22:10.28 | Deepa | http://rafb.net/p/vgmlow31.html |
| 22:10.29 | Deepa | Would that work? |
| 22:10.40 | Deepa | I think of runnig it in a crontab every 6th hour |
| 22:12.45 | Deepa | Would it bork somehow? |
| 22:13.58 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03judecn * r14284 10/trunk/bzworkbench/ (7 files in 3 dirs): okay, now that I figured out that these files weren't automatically added to SVN, here they are. Sorry to everyone who tried to build this and found that it was missing headers! |
| 22:13.59 | blast007 | Deepa: why do that? |
| 22:14.10 | Deepa | To keep my one single BZFS always running |
| 22:14.14 | *** join/#bzflag jude- (n=jude@c-68-84-206-92.hsd1.ar.comcast.net) |
| 22:14.14 | Deepa | even incase of a crash |
| 22:14.16 | jude- | hello all |
| 22:14.23 | Deepa | Hey jude- |
| 22:14.25 | Macrosoft | greetings |
| 22:14.26 | a_meteorite | why a crontab...? |
| 22:14.39 | Deepa | crontab check's if its running every 6th hour |
| 22:14.46 | blast007 | just run it in a screen, and have a loop script run in screen |
| 22:14.48 | Deepa | if it isnt, it starts it |
| 22:14.50 | a_meteorite | use a shell script that loops every 10 seconds and checks if it's still running |
| 22:15.56 | Deepa | too resource intensive |
| 22:15.57 | a_meteorite | a crontab might not catch it for 6 hours though |
| 22:15.57 | blast007 | a_meteorite: you don't even need that |
| 22:15.57 | a_meteorite | that's not resource intensive Deepa |
| 22:15.57 | blast007 | just have a script that loops |
| 22:15.57 | Deepa | well then, 3 hours instead of 6 then |
| 22:15.57 | jude- | and delays |
| 22:15.57 | blast007 | when bzfs ends, sleep for 10 or 20 seconds, and relaunch |
| 22:15.57 | Deepa | Say my computer does a accidental reboot |
| 22:15.58 | a_meteorite | or like blast007 said |
| 22:15.58 | Deepa | Does bzfs still launch? |
| 22:15.58 | blast007 | Deepa: then it's not a very good server |
| 22:16.07 | Deepa | It's summer, the only thing that isnt ups'ed is the switch :P |
| 22:16.07 | blast007 | mine has been up for 175 days |
| 22:16.16 | Deepa | there is occasionaly lightning |
| 22:16.24 | FarkSimmons | a shell script wont be too resource intensive |
| 22:16.32 | FarkSimmons | in fact a shell script would be best |
| 22:16.33 | Deepa | and sometimes my parents decide to remove power for the switch, and then after 2 hours my ups is out of battery |
| 22:16.38 | FarkSimmons | i wouldnt run it every 10 secnds though |
| 22:16.47 | jude- | maybe once a minute |
| 22:17.01 | FarkSimmons | yeah that would be plenty |
| 22:17.25 | blast007 | Deepa: glue the power adapter to the outlet ;) or put a note "Do NOT remove, under penalty of law" in all red |
| 22:17.42 | jude- | or install a solar grid in your back yard |
| 22:17.46 | blast007 | heh |
| 22:17.55 | Deepa | and then kazaam, lightning strikes |
| 22:18.10 | Deepa | and I'm left without my 600$ switch |
| 22:18.10 | FarkSimmons | maybe you need a dedicated server deepa |
| 22:18.25 | Deepa | I'm going to be gone for 2 months, I want everything to be running while I am gone! |
| 22:18.33 | FarkSimmons | oh |
| 22:18.35 | FarkSimmons | lol |
| 22:18.38 | FarkSimmons | good luck with that one |
| 22:18.40 | FarkSimmons | :-) |
| 22:18.41 | blast007 | Deepa: wow, $600? I go two 24-port managaged switches for $100 with fiber uplinks |
| 22:18.50 | Deepa | blast007: manager or unmanaged? |
| 22:18.52 | *** join/#bzflag a_temp_dist (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 22:18.54 | Deepa | managed* |
| 22:19.08 | blast007 | managed |
| 22:19.17 | FarkSimmons | deepa: you do plan on loggin into your server while you're gone right? |
| 22:19.30 | Deepa | yea, I can login during about 3 days |
| 22:19.40 | a_temp_dist | blast007, are you a BZBB forum moderator? |
| 22:19.47 | Deepa | stupid vacation |
| 22:19.48 | blast007 | a_temp_dist: sure |
| 22:19.57 | a_temp_dist | I think http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=10857 need to be locked |
| 22:20.09 | Deepa | ow crap |
| 22:20.13 | Deepa | the dollar is worth taht little? |
| 22:20.32 | blast007 | brlcad: because my C++ skills involve mostly copy and paste and "I wonder what this does" ;) |
| 22:20.51 | brlcad | blast007: who said anything about C++? :) |
| 22:20.58 | blast007 | bheh |
| 22:20.59 | blast007 | heh* |
| 22:21.36 | blast007 | I write plenty of other code :) |
| 22:21.36 | blast007 | just mostly for trial projects |
| 22:21.39 | Deepa | blast007: gimme 4 minutes and I'll get you the correct price :P |
| 22:21.43 | Deepa | the dollar is worthl ess then I thought |
| 22:21.54 | blast007 | Deepa: mine were used though ;) |
| 22:21.55 | Deepa | or was it the otherway? |
| 22:21.57 | Deepa | ah |
| 22:22.06 | Deepa | Mine was 2 days old :) |
| 22:23.49 | Deepa | The company that bought it was closed down the day after it was bought XD |
| 22:25.41 | Macrosoft | sorry about the insanity on the thread |
| 22:26.01 | Deepa | AHA! |
| 22:26.02 | Deepa | found it |
| 22:26.06 | Macrosoft | huh |
| 22:26.07 | Deepa | blast007: http://www.superwarehouse.com/CATALYST_2940_8PT_10_100_1PT_100FX_1PT_SFP/WS-C2940-8TF-S/p/300522 |
| 22:26.14 | blast007 | ah, a Cisco one |
| 22:26.16 | Deepa | one of those :) |
| 22:26.29 | blast007 | mine are both Nortel ;) |
| 22:26.32 | Deepa | :) |
| 22:26.40 | Macrosoft | thats kinda expensive |
| 22:26.48 | Deepa | I had a linksys small square 4port switch before that one |
| 22:26.53 | Deepa | Macrosoft: Yea, But I got at at like 400$ |
| 22:27.00 | Macrosoft | how |
| 22:27.11 | Deepa | bought it off a company that declared bancrupt |
| 22:27.20 | Deepa | or however its spelled |
| 22:27.24 | Macrosoft | why does the picture show 2 boxes |
| 22:27.25 | Deepa | out of money |
| 22:27.38 | Deepa | they differ slightly |
| 22:27.41 | Deepa | 2 differend models I guess |
| 22:27.42 | blast007 | Deepa: two example of uplink ports |
| 22:27.55 | Macrosoft | so they are different models |
| 22:28.10 | *** part/#bzflag onami (n=ionut@89.136.135.138) |
| 22:28.18 | blast007 | the one described in the specs is the top one, since it has fiber |
| 22:28.19 | Macrosoft | why so expensive |
| 22:28.31 | *** part/#bzflag a_temp_dist (n=a_temp_d@about/essy/alarming/a-temp-dist) |
| 22:28.50 | blast007 | FX is fiber, right? |
| 22:29.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14285 10/trunk/bzflag/src/bzadmin/Makefile.am: hrm, thought I committed this. need libcares for libcurl. |
| 22:29.13 | Macrosoft | thats a big price jump from 100Mb switches |
| 22:29.38 | blast007 | 100Mb switches, from who? |
| 22:30.23 | Macrosoft | what features does it have that make it worth that much (other than link speed) |
| 22:30.30 | brlcad | blast007: I know you write a lot of code.. whence why I was wondering :) |
| 22:30.47 | brlcad | you could take over the whole web integration side of things :P |
| 22:30.56 | blast007 | heh |
| 22:31.02 | brlcad | certainly know how everything works |
| 22:31.18 | brlcad | pay no attention, i'm just thoughtmongering today |
| 22:32.18 | Deepa | I just realized something |
| 22:32.36 | Deepa | I have forgotten my password (again) :D |
| 22:32.42 | blast007 | hehe |
| 22:33.02 | FarkSimmons | Deepa, what's your server if i may ask? is it running now? |
| 22:33.11 | Deepa | Debian Lenny |
| 22:33.22 | Deepa | or wait, it's running etch |
| 22:33.22 | FarkSimmons | oh no... your BZFlag server |
| 22:33.30 | Deepa | Home computer is running lenny |
| 22:33.40 | FarkSimmons | hmm i dont much about debian |
| 22:33.45 | FarkSimmons | that's a linux distro right? |
| 22:33.48 | Deepa | hmm my screen has died |
| 22:33.50 | jude- | damn strait |
| 22:33.53 | Deepa | no wait it hasn't server still up |
| 22:33.53 | CBG | yes FarkSimmons |
| 22:33.56 | Deepa | aye |
| 22:33.57 | jude- | *straight |
| 22:34.00 | Deepa | armchairs.be:5154 |
| 22:34.02 | CBG | the best! :P |
| 22:34.04 | blast007 | debian is okay |
| 22:34.05 | jude- | ~debian |
| 22:34.17 | ibot | i guess debian is a free software GNU/Linux distribution. Debian 3.1 contains KDE 3.3.2 |
| 22:34.20 | FarkSimmons | debian is the best you say? |
| 22:34.24 | blast007 | there was one time Debian scared me |
| 22:34.27 | Deepa | blast007: I haven't done anything except plugin the switch :( |
| 22:34.30 | jude- | heh |
| 22:34.32 | jude- | ~install debian |
| 22:34.35 | ibot | i guess install debian is use the knoppix live cd installer |
| 22:34.35 | Deepa | Everything is perfect setup, I havent even touched it yet |
| 22:34.45 | FarkSimmons | oh i hate live cds |
| 22:34.48 | CBG | Well, my vote doesn't count for much, never used any linux distro bar Noobuntu. |
| 22:34.57 | Deepa | Isn't knoppix based on debian? |
| 22:35.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14286 10/trunk/bzflag/ (4 files in 3 dirs): |
| 22:35.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: turn CacheManager into a singleton since that's how it's being used anyways -- |
| 22:35.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: being provided from libMediaFile. this removes two more dependencies for |
| 22:35.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: cleaning up libPlatform (namely isCacheFileType() and getLocalName() in the |
| 22:35.09 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: CacheManager). |
| 22:35.10 | FarkSimmons | yeah not a fan of Ubuntu so much either |
| 22:35.15 | FarkSimmons | no matter though.... |
| 22:35.17 | Deepa | I prefer Debian over Ubuntu |
| 22:35.29 | CBG | ;) |
| 22:35.30 | FarkSimmons | Ubuntu seems to be geared towards noobies |
| 22:35.32 | jude- | yes--Knoppix is a Debian derivative |
| 22:35.36 | FarkSimmons | which is cool i suppose |
| 22:35.39 | CBG | FarkSimmons: hence "Noobuntu" :D |
| 22:35.46 | FarkSimmons | of course :-) |
| 22:35.48 | jude- | there are over 125 debian derivative |
| 22:35.49 | FarkSimmons | ;-) |
| 22:36.02 | FarkSimmons | i still prefer Slackware only because of the way it's set up |
| 22:36.07 | FarkSimmons | it really is very slack |
| 22:36.11 | FarkSimmons | just enough to get it running |
| 22:36.14 | FarkSimmons | you do the rest |
| 22:36.14 | Deepa | heh |
| 22:36.17 | CBG | :) |
| 22:36.18 | blast007 | there was this one time when I tried to install valgrind... debian wanted to remove my kernel.... I didn't install valgrind |
| 22:36.20 | jude- | sounds like the base debian install |
| 22:36.21 | FarkSimmons | very similar to AIX |
| 22:36.36 | *** part/#bzflag jwir3 (n=scottj@c-66-41-249-30.hsd1.mn.comcast.net) |
| 22:36.38 | FarkSimmons | dang... wish i could get my hands on some PSeries hardware |
| 22:36.43 | jude- | blast007: weird |
| 22:36.47 | jude- | probably fixed nwo |
| 22:36.52 | jude- | *now |
| 22:38.04 | brlcad | hehe, blast007 |
| 22:38.07 | brlcad | why not? :) |
| 22:38.18 | blast007 | :) |
| 22:38.31 | Deepa | blast007: If by any odds the very most likely thing to happen while happen: |
| 22:38.36 | Deepa | My sister kills my switch while I'm on vacation |
| 22:38.50 | Deepa | What switch would you recommend? |
| 22:40.40 | Deepa | I'm gonna cry blood if it happens |
| 22:40.56 | Deepa | And then I'll collect the blood, donate it, and buy a switch |
| 22:41.06 | CBG | this one looks good! http://www.smarthome.com:80/images/2032.jpg |
| 22:41.46 | a_meteorite | CBG: PERFECT! I'll take it |
| 22:45.29 | *** join/#bzflag TimRiker (n=timr@rikers.org) |
| 22:45.30 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 22:47.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14287 10/trunk/bzflag/include/ (DirectoryNames.h common.h): move directory separator from DirectoryNames (i.e. part of libGame) to common |
| 22:48.20 | CBG | a_meteorite: Congrats on purchasing this fantastic THREE-position switch! |
| 22:48.31 | a_meteorite | SWEET! |
| 22:52.22 | *** part/#bzflag LongDon (n=LongDon@dyndsl-085-016-204-127.ewe-ip-backbone.de) |
| 22:53.25 | blast007 | heh |
| 23:02.18 | *** join/#bzflag orchid (n=bzgirl@ottawa-hs-206-191-56-69.d-ip.magma.ca) |
| 23:02.18 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v orchid] by ChanServ |
| 23:06.35 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03brlcad * r14288 10/trunk/bzflag/src/mediafile/CacheManager.cxx: use DirectorySeparator instead of _WIN32 sections, decouple from libGame call to getConfigDirName() |
| 23:14.28 | *** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (n=dtremena@about/essy/CrazyCoder/DTRemenak) |
| 23:14.30 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ |
| 23:15.39 | *** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (n=dtremena@about/essy/CrazyCoder/DTRemenak) |
| 23:15.39 | *** mode/#bzflag [+v DTRemenak] by ChanServ |
| 23:32.14 | *** join/#bzflag triclops (n=triclops@124-168-3-131.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 23:46.37 | *** join/#bzflag eTangenT_ (n=tangent@65.167.130.121) |
| 23:46.55 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03judecn * r14289 10/trunk/bzworkbench/ (12 files in 6 dirs): The first bit of functionality is here! You can right-click the main window, select "Configure World...", and use the dialog to generate world, waterLevel, and options BZW objects. |
| 23:48.35 | purple_cow | yes? |
| 23:48.58 | jude- | we have some functionality in BZWorkbench |
| 23:49.19 | jude- | what do you think? |
| 23:51.19 | purple_cow | hmm, it doesn't link |
| 23:51.19 | brlcad | heh |
| 23:51.59 | jude- | O.o |
| 23:52.03 | jude- | what's the error? |
| 23:52.51 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03davidtrowbridge * r14290 10/trunk/bzworkbench/Debug/model/subdir.mk: Add BZWParser.cpp to the build |
| 23:53.34 | purple_cow | hey look, it does something |
| 23:53.59 | jude- | it's not much, but a lot of back-end had to be in place for that to happen |
| 23:54.17 | jude- | try clicking "Configure World..." |
