| 00:00.05 | Gnurdux | it ricos on the bottom, but not the top |
| 00:00.13 | JeffM2501 | it ricos when it hits the wall part |
| 00:00.20 | Gnurdux | but not above it |
| 00:00.21 | JeffM2501 | it dosnt' when it goes oever it |
| 00:00.22 | JeffM2501 | sure |
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| 00:00.23 | Gnurdux | how do you do that? |
| 00:00.26 | JeffM2501 | a mesh would work the same |
| 00:00.30 | L4m3r | if you die near the outside edge while moving, your camera arcs out of the boundary and you get kicked |
| 00:00.32 | JeffM2501 | it would rico when it hit the mesh |
| 00:00.36 | JeffM2501 | and not when it went over it |
| 00:00.37 | Gnurdux | but then it would go through on the top? |
| 00:00.46 | JeffM2501 | if the mesh was only so high. sure |
| 00:00.48 | JeffM2501 | think about it |
| 00:00.49 | Gnurdux | rather than just die |
| 00:00.55 | JeffM2501 | you can shot OVER meshes right? |
| 00:00.56 | Gnurdux | thats different |
| 00:01.14 | JeffM2501 | if you made a meshbox |
| 00:01.15 | Gnurdux | and you can still shoot yourself above the wall, even though it doesnt rico |
| 00:01.23 | L4m3r | Jeff, I think he's talking about that 2.0.4+ thing where shots end when they hit the outer wall boundary |
| 00:01.32 | JeffM2501 | oh |
| 00:01.33 | JeffM2501 | that's a bug |
| 00:01.34 | JeffM2501 | ish |
| 00:01.36 | JeffM2501 | kinda thing |
| 00:01.40 | JeffM2501 | they'd go over the mesh |
| 00:01.44 | JeffM2501 | and end at that boundry |
| 00:01.47 | JeffM2501 | not that big a deal |
| 00:01.48 | L4m3r | it's a fix for the dispay thing, right? |
| 00:01.53 | Gnurdux | but you couldnt shoot yourslef JeffM2501 |
| 00:02.11 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, you can't shoot yourself when you fire over a wall anyway |
| 00:02.13 | L4m3r | because shots outside can go underground and are visible through the gound plane? |
| 00:02.26 | JeffM2501 | that may be the reason we left it |
| 00:02.32 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, if you are touching above it, and you shoot, you can |
| 00:02.39 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, how? |
| 00:02.42 | L4m3r | I think that was discovered on that hacked 200-shot wings server |
| 00:02.44 | JeffM2501 | the shot should not rico |
| 00:02.46 | JeffM2501 | just end |
| 00:02.51 | L4m3r | it ends but you die anyway |
| 00:02.58 | JeffM2501 | then that's not right |
| 00:02.59 | L4m3r | it's odd. |
| 00:03.03 | JeffM2501 | bz has no splash damage |
| 00:03.17 | L4m3r | I'm guessing it modifies the shot position to be inside |
| 00:03.21 | JeffM2501 | maybe |
| 00:03.23 | L4m3r | since your barrel is out |
| 00:03.27 | JeffM2501 | it's a bug |
| 00:03.31 | JeffM2501 | it can be fixed |
| 00:03.38 | Gnurdux | in the client? |
| 00:03.43 | JeffM2501 | probably |
| 00:03.46 | Gnurdux | but then some client will have an unfair advantagew |
| 00:03.51 | JeffM2501 | but really then the mesh is better |
| 00:03.53 | JeffM2501 | cus you don't die |
| 00:03.57 | L4m3r | they already do |
| 00:04.01 | JeffM2501 | you can just make it shoot thru |
| 00:04.03 | JeffM2501 | and go way up |
| 00:04.11 | JeffM2501 | invisble |
| 00:04.15 | JeffM2501 | but not drive thru |
| 00:04.22 | L4m3r | I make it like 1000 and add a ceiling |
| 00:04.22 | Gnurdux | hmmm |
| 00:04.28 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 00:04.32 | L4m3r | all shootthrough, works great |
| 00:04.34 | JeffM2501 | the game needs a z cap anyway |
| 00:04.39 | L4m3r | yes. |
| 00:04.54 | L4m3r | hm... the more I think about it, the more I think that maybe the wall should be its own object. |
| 00:05.02 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 00:05.03 | Gnurdux | it should |
| 00:05.04 | L4m3r | just define base points |
| 00:05.12 | JeffM2501 | as far as the client is concerned |
| 00:05.19 | JeffM2501 | it's just automaticly generated from the world size |
| 00:05.25 | L4m3r | yeah. |
| 00:05.28 | JeffM2501 | but a lot of other things USE that |
| 00:05.34 | JeffM2501 | like spawns |
| 00:05.44 | JeffM2501 | you'd want them to change to also use your new bounding area |
| 00:05.47 | L4m3r | Add it to BZW, so one doesn't have to muck about with radar and such |
| 00:05.49 | Gnurdux | you should be able to specify world boundary |
| 00:06.02 | Gnurdux | that would apply to everything |
| 00:06.06 | JeffM2501 | best to just define a set of zones that say where the "map" is |
| 00:06.10 | JeffM2501 | the places people can be |
| 00:06.19 | Gnurdux | can zones be obscure shapes? |
| 00:06.23 | L4m3r | that could actually be cooler |
| 00:06.35 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, you can build up complex shapes from more then one zone |
| 00:06.38 | JeffM2501 | that overlaps |
| 00:06.41 | L4m3r | you could have multiple "sub-maps" connected only by teles |
| 00:06.45 | L4m3r | :) |
| 00:06.46 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 00:06.49 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, but then generatign the barriors would be hard |
| 00:06.56 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, use a modeler |
| 00:07.04 | Gnurdux | how would it generate the walls? |
| 00:07.05 | JeffM2501 | define them as solids |
| 00:07.10 | L4m3r | maybe a new sort of "zone plane" object? |
| 00:07.19 | JeffM2501 | it woudl find the hull of it all |
| 00:07.20 | Gnurdux | if the zones were all square, and overlapping |
| 00:07.28 | Gnurdux | wouldnt it make overlapping walls too? |
| 00:07.39 | JeffM2501 | only if it was implemented stupidly |
| 00:07.44 | Gnurdux | L4m3r, then, it could make radar only display the one you are currently in |
| 00:07.48 | L4m3r | no, it would most likely find the "union" of all the zones and make a wall around that |
| 00:07.54 | JeffM2501 | you add them all together into a constructive solid |
| 00:07.55 | JeffM2501 | yeah |
| 00:08.07 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, you think too simple |
| 00:08.10 | Gnurdux | and you could do those 2-in-one and 3-in-one maps properly |
| 00:08.22 | JeffM2501 | you'd build a complex rejon out of the zones |
| 00:08.29 | L4m3r | I can do them semi-properly now just by separating them. |
| 00:08.30 | trepan | L4m3r: add ricochet (weighed?) and nozone/noSB properties |
| 00:08.30 | JeffM2501 | or let the map define it's own graphical walls |
| 00:09.03 | L4m3r | well, the boundary itself is the only important part |
| 00:09.06 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, but once you do that, those graphical walls might as well be interpreted as the boundary |
| 00:09.14 | Gnurdux | so no need for zones anymore |
| 00:09.22 | L4m3r | you can just add your own walls with if you want things to be pretty |
| 00:09.23 | JeffM2501 | walls are not the ful boundry |
| 00:09.29 | JeffM2501 | as you have seen when you try to jump over them |
| 00:09.40 | JeffM2501 | the real boundry is a 3d volume |
| 00:09.44 | JeffM2501 | not a set of 2 walls |
| 00:10.00 | JeffM2501 | the walls are just ways to mark of parts of them |
| 00:10.11 | JeffM2501 | so you don't think you are playing in a box ;) |
| 00:10.13 | JeffM2501 | since you are |
| 00:10.22 | L4m3r | it'd take a lot of changes, since it all operates on one variable |
| 00:10.35 | JeffM2501 | yes it would not be simple |
| 00:10.46 | JeffM2501 | but when done it would be a much more flexable system |
| 00:10.54 | L4m3r | Definitely. |
| 00:11.31 | Gnurdux | you should still have the box-worlds available as a default, so that old mapfiles work and they dont get harder to make |
| 00:11.39 | L4m3r | sure. |
| 00:11.40 | JeffM2501 | sure |
| 00:11.46 | JeffM2501 | you can build them up easy from the one variable |
| 00:11.51 | L4m3r | it's like anything else that's been added, there are defaults |
| 00:11.57 | JeffM2501 | sane defaults |
| 00:12.07 | Gnurdux | hehe imagine a star-shape as the default |
| 00:12.13 | L4m3r | s/sane/boring :P |
| 00:12.17 | JeffM2501 | but Gnurdux thinks we don't know how to program |
| 00:12.29 | JeffM2501 | cus he's such the master at it |
| 00:12.30 | L4m3r | well hell, I don't :P |
| 00:15.37 | L4m3r | how "three dimensional" are zones? |
| 00:19.35 | L4m3r | I mean, they're defined in 3-d but does it actually deal with depth, or is it more about the surface it sits on? |
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| 01:46.08 | brlcad | heh, jeesh you guys can be harsh :) |
| 01:47.25 | brlcad | and he sure does say it like it is.. heh |
| 01:47.38 | Gnurdux | Is anyone interested in a plugin that lets you force players to accept a set of rules before spawning, and svaes their names only if they are verified? |
| 01:48.12 | brlcad | presumably, you mean before joining, not before spawning |
| 01:48.35 | brlcad | and no, not I |
| 01:49.30 | JeffM2501 | realy need to add a message to tell the client when it's ok to even atempt spawn |
| 01:49.35 | JeffM2501 | then we can do more then just kick em |
| 01:50.43 | Gnurdux | its before spawning |
| 01:50.49 | Gnurdux | yeah thats true |
| 01:50.54 | Gnurdux | or, somethign you could do now |
| 01:51.00 | Gnurdux | just not send the MsgAlive message |
| 01:51.07 | Gnurdux | so that the player has to spawn again |
| 01:51.14 | Gnurdux | and send them a message telling why they cant spawn |
| 01:52.09 | JeffM2501 | better to just tell them when it's ok to put up the big spawn messsage |
| 01:52.18 | JeffM2501 | since stuff in the chat is not well seen |
| 01:52.27 | JeffM2501 | consitency is key |
| 01:52.46 | Gnurdux | but in 2.0, my idea could be doen |
| 01:52.53 | JeffM2501 | if you mod the server |
| 01:52.56 | Gnurdux | yes |
| 01:53.06 | Gnurdux | even the same plugin code could work |
| 01:53.09 | JeffM2501 | honestly I don't care much about 2.0.x anymore |
| 01:53.17 | Gnurdux | why not? |
| 01:53.23 | JeffM2501 | cus it's time to think of the future |
| 01:53.28 | JeffM2501 | not dell on the past |
| 01:53.40 | JeffM2501 | the API dosn't let you modify the message alive |
| 01:53.45 | JeffM2501 | so your plugin can't do it all |
| 01:54.08 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501, this would only be a server mod |
| 01:54.29 | JeffM2501 | still a mod |
| 01:54.45 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, doubt it'll be till the weekend |
| 01:55.06 | Gnurdux | removePlayer(playerIndex, "Not allowed to spawn"); |
| 01:55.12 | Gnurdux | you just need to comment out that one line |
| 01:55.16 | JeffM2501 | that is a kick them |
| 01:55.34 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, I'm trying to make the software better, not hack it up |
| 01:56.01 | Gnurdux | but if that line is commented out, thats not a real hack |
| 01:56.05 | Gnurdux | why is that there anyway? |
| 01:57.18 | JeffM2501 | because that's what it's suposed to do |
| 01:57.20 | JeffM2501 | kick them |
| 01:57.29 | JeffM2501 | other things depend on that |
| 01:57.44 | JeffM2501 | it's a hack because you are making a change for one specific reason |
| 01:57.52 | JeffM2501 | and not thinking about how else it may be used |
| 01:58.00 | JeffM2501 | also it needs a mod to the source |
| 01:58.07 | JeffM2501 | so it's not something a plugin can just do right now |
| 01:58.17 | JeffM2501 | so if we have to change source. why not change it RIGHT |
| 01:58.24 | Gnurdux | ture |
| 01:58.25 | Gnurdux | true' |
| 01:58.28 | JeffM2501 | instead of an incosnisten way with all other spawns |
| 01:58.31 | Gnurdux | so you would kill the allowspawn hook? |
| 01:59.05 | JeffM2501 | I would add a message that told the client when to put up the "right click to spawn" |
| 01:59.11 | JeffM2501 | probably even add to the message the text |
| 01:59.16 | JeffM2501 | so you coudl put up more messages |
| 01:59.22 | JeffM2501 | like "read the rules dumbass" |
| 01:59.35 | Gnurdux | hehe |
| 01:59.52 | JeffM2501 | then all spawn related messages also come up in the same place |
| 02:00.00 | Gnurdux | You may not spawn until you read and accept the rules. thats my message |
| 02:00.15 | JeffM2501 | whatever |
| 02:00.26 | JeffM2501 | the specifics of your implemenation don't mater to me |
| 02:00.32 | JeffM2501 | it's the large scale feature |
| 02:00.45 | JeffM2501 | the design |
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| 02:42.31 | Mr_Molez | hmm where is all the documentation on all the texture crap ? |
| 02:43.31 | L4m3r | the bzw man page? |
| 02:44.06 | L4m3r | primarily the material, dynamiccolor, and texturematrix objects |
| 02:44.59 | Mr_Molez | found it |
| 03:02.37 | Mr_Molez | how do i add pictures to walls :p |
| 03:06.58 | *** part/#bzflag romfis (i=user@chello062178107024.8.12.vie.surfer.at) |
| 03:13.04 | L4m3r | texture them on something |
| 03:13.22 | L4m3r | I usually have to use a texturematrix to scale it up, not sure if there's a better way |
| 03:15.03 | Mr_Molez | uhhhuh |
| 03:15.12 | Mr_Molez | how i do that in a text editor :-S |
| 03:15.27 | L4m3r | lots of testing. |
| 03:15.33 | Mr_Molez | o man |
| 03:15.37 | L4m3r | lol |
| 03:15.38 | Mr_Molez | can u give me an example |
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| 03:15.50 | L4m3r | try it at normal scale at first, then estimate a size and fine-tune it |
| 03:17.09 | Mr_Molez | i want http://trepan.bzflag.bz/timriker.png |
| 03:17.16 | Mr_Molez | pasted all over the walls on the ma |
| 03:17.17 | Mr_Molez | p |
| 03:17.23 | L4m3r | lol |
| 03:17.28 | Mr_Molez | hehe |
| 03:17.30 | Mr_Molez | so hmm |
| 03:17.34 | Mr_Molez | will it fix to a wall |
| 03:17.55 | Mr_Molez | or do i write the dimensions of the wall again |
| 03:19.55 | L4m3r | no, just stick it on a mesh face or something |
| 03:20.08 | Mr_Molez | can u give me an example please |
| 03:20.28 | Mr_Molez | i didn't make the walls with meshs |
| 03:30.57 | L4m3r | what'd you make them with? |
| 03:32.07 | Mr_Molez | ? |
| 03:35.22 | SportChick | mol: pm :) |
| 03:35.36 | SportChick | Mr_Molez: pm |
| 03:50.36 | Mr_Molez | I DID IT YAY !! |
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| 04:08.34 | Mr_Molez | L4m3r: ping |
| 04:08.45 | L4m3r | Mr_Molez: pong |
| 04:08.59 | Mr_Molez | L4m3r: can you gimme a clue plz about how to get ground texture |
| 04:09.08 | L4m3r | it's a special name |
| 04:09.26 | L4m3r | define a material called GroundMaterial (case sensitive) |
| 04:09.37 | L4m3r | and whatever you do there will be on the ground |
| 04:10.08 | Mr_Molez | YAY THNX !":) |
| 04:10.23 | Mr_Molez | ~L4m3r++ |
| 04:10.30 | L4m3r | :) |
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| 04:27.28 | JeffM2501 | mmmmm the rawest of fishes :) |
| 04:29.28 | Mr_Molez | eww its you |
| 04:30.19 | L4m3r | tomorrow they serve mediocre sushi at lunch :) |
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| 04:44.52 | SportChick | brlcad: are you upgrading or working on the global reg server again? |
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| 10:00.42 | LePoulpe303 | CBG : ping ? |
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| 10:09.36 | ruskie | gaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh every other bullet was my own teams... |
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| 10:24.11 | ruskie | lo gsnedders |
| 10:24.17 | gsnedders | ruskie: hi |
| 10:24.24 | gsnedders | ruskie: get any tips for killing wasps? |
| 10:24.37 | ruskie | get a cat or two... |
| 10:24.45 | ruskie | they like te hunt down such stuff... |
| 10:24.50 | gsnedders | what if you hate cats as much as you hates wasps? |
| 10:24.56 | gsnedders | *hate |
| 10:25.19 | ruskie | get smoke/shootgun/$random_bludgening weapon |
| 10:25.24 | gsnedders | :D |
| 10:27.05 | gsnedders | why have I over the past days gone insane about website stats? |
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| 11:23.10 | Deepa | now where is gnurdux? |
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| 14:22.48 | TheRedBaron | ~lart JeffM2501 |
| 14:23.27 | TheRedBaron | He needs to learn bzflag Ctf ;) |
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| 14:48.14 | brlcad | he was playing? |
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| 14:49.06 | RatOmeter | I think I saw him play. Once. Last year. |
| 14:54.07 | TheRedBaron | brlcad: no, he was dissing our style of playing :) |
| 14:54.16 | TheRedBaron | He wants to make it more mainstream |
| 14:55.02 | RatOmeter | How you do dat? |
| 14:55.54 | Mr_Molez | is there an easy way to join perfectly two angled boxes together ? |
| 14:56.27 | Mr_Molez | cuz im spending like 2 hours at a time joining boxes together :( |
| 15:00.29 | TheRedBaron | RatOmeter: mostly the handling the of the flag |
| 15:30.35 | Admirarch | Crazy |
| 15:32.27 | TheRedBaron | agreed |
| 15:33.31 | trepan | optional, iirc |
| 15:34.47 | Admirarch | Okay then, optionally crazy. |
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| 16:27.26 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ |
| 16:27.47 | brlcad | orange_away: remember the chatter some long time ago about nils's logging parser thing (cerca feb 2005)? .. did that ever make it's way into cvs? |
| 16:29.19 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, were boards down last night? |
| 16:29.29 | brlcad | not that I know of |
| 16:30.15 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 16:30.17 | orange_away | brlcad: not by me, but the format had changed so dramatically |
| 16:30.22 | JeffM2501 | over the entire night there was one post |
| 16:30.28 | JeffM2501 | that is usualy not so |
| 16:30.45 | JeffM2501 | oh well, just a slow night |
| 16:31.08 | brlcad | JeffM2501: yeah, I see no signs it was down at all |
| 16:31.14 | JeffM2501 | ok |
| 16:31.18 | JeffM2501 | just seemed wiered |
| 16:31.28 | brlcad | checking traffic |
| 16:31.46 | orange_away | I wish phpbb did it's |
| 16:31.51 | orange_away | "new posts" thing differently |
| 16:32.11 | orange | though I realize this is probably the most efficient |
| 16:32.20 | JeffM2501 | I'm open to other boards, as long as we can transition clean.ly |
| 16:32.31 | brlcad | yeah, there's a good bit of traffic, definitely lower.. around 4am it died off a lot then slowly rose through the night |
| 16:33.07 | JeffM2501 | just slow night then |
| 16:33.18 | JeffM2501 | maybe it's cus I was watching robot chicken |
| 16:33.27 | JeffM2501 | god that show is stupid |
| 16:33.40 | orange | I like how vbulletin does post tracking, but it's not free |
| 16:33.50 | JeffM2501 | a lot of people like the gu boards |
| 16:33.57 | JeffM2501 | but thats also not free |
| 16:34.00 | brlcad | hmm.. bandwidth usage is still not even 10% |
| 16:34.00 | JeffM2501 | invision |
| 16:34.06 | brlcad | or just barely 10%.. |
| 16:34.30 | brlcad | up from about 6% before the migration |
| 16:34.40 | JeffM2501 | if I had CVS back I could start checking in the stuff to let bz do media streams ;) |
| 16:34.49 | JeffM2501 | then we could use more of your bandwith ;) |
| 16:35.11 | brlcad | having a popular bzfs had it up to 15% through Feb |
| 16:35.32 | brlcad | but that was rather short-lived |
| 16:35.45 | JeffM2501 | you could run a teamspeak server |
| 16:35.47 | JeffM2501 | or something like that |
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| 16:44.53 | Constitution | Say, is the 2.0.6 or 2.0.7 version of BZFlag available anywhere in CVS? |
| 16:45.05 | JeffM2501 | it woudl be if CVS was up |
| 16:45.17 | Constitution | Okay, in v2_0 branch? |
| 16:45.33 | JeffM2501 | it woudl be if anon CVS was synced to dev cvs |
| 16:45.47 | Constitution | Oh, I see. |
| 16:46.07 | JeffM2501 | SF has major CVS issues right now |
| 16:46.17 | JeffM2501 | 2.0.6 is on the downloads page |
| 16:46.30 | JeffM2501 | .7 is in the folder in ths topic of this channel |
| 16:46.38 | JeffM2501 | (last part of it ) |
| 16:47.04 | Constitution | In the folder in this topic of this channel? I don't understand. |
| 16:47.56 | JeffM2501 | 2.0.7 is at http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/builds |
| 16:48.04 | JeffM2501 | that message is in the topic for this chanenl |
| 16:48.08 | Constitution | Oh, I see. |
| 16:48.13 | Constitution | Okay, thanks for your help. |
| 16:54.12 | Mr_Molez | JeffM2501: that record match plugin u made.. Is it bound to 30 minutes for the match ? |
| 16:55.56 | JeffM2501 | nope |
| 16:56.01 | Mr_Molez | hmm weird |
| 16:56.03 | JeffM2501 | it's how ever long the normal match is |
| 16:56.13 | JeffM2501 | I just tied it to the existing match start and end events |
| 16:56.22 | JeffM2501 | it has no internal limit |
| 16:56.30 | JeffM2501 | now recording may have a limit |
| 16:56.37 | JeffM2501 | but that's not part of the plugin |
| 16:59.51 | Mr_Molez | File transfer terminated with error from libcurl 28 : Operation too slow. Less than 1024 bytes/sec transfered the last 10 seconds |
| 17:00.00 | Mr_Molez | that wont be the problem of global login will it ? |
| 17:00.15 | *** join/#bzflag Birdie (n=Birdie__@d51A46E43.access.telenet.be) |
| 17:00.25 | JeffM2501 | that means you didn't get data back fast enough |
| 17:00.30 | JeffM2501 | could be the server is boged |
| 17:00.37 | JeffM2501 | or your line is boged |
| 17:00.47 | ToughShooter | ~bzflist |
| 17:00.50 | Mr_Molez | ill assume global login server is boged ;) |
| 17:01.01 | JeffM2501 | Mr_Molez, I'll assume your line is boged |
| 17:01.05 | Mr_Molez | nuhuh |
| 17:01.20 | JeffM2501 | how do you know the exact route between you and the server? |
| 17:01.27 | ToughShooter | Global login was broken last 15 minutes.. |
| 17:01.47 | Mr_Molez | ok i dont know |
| 17:01.55 | Mr_Molez | back to what i was saying |
| 17:02.00 | JeffM2501 | but yeah I know, it's NEVER your fault |
| 17:02.08 | Mr_Molez | i am using code on my bzfs to set the -time limit on the fly |
| 17:02.10 | JeffM2501 | it's hard to say what it is |
| 17:02.26 | JeffM2501 | the plugin should pick up the end event when ever it happens |
| 17:02.32 | Mr_Molez | but when i change -time on the fly matches dont record |
| 17:02.39 | JeffM2501 | the same time the clients get the game over, the plugin stops recording |
| 17:02.42 | JeffM2501 | when ever that happens |
| 17:02.50 | Mr_Molez | yeh thats what i thought |
| 17:02.50 | JeffM2501 | you'll have to debug it |
| 17:03.10 | Mr_Molez | can you remind me on the linux debugger again P |
| 17:03.51 | JeffM2501 | nope |
| 17:03.57 | Mr_Molez | ass |
| 17:04.02 | JeffM2501 | google man |
| 17:04.12 | JeffM2501 | if your not going to remember the stuff you ask me, then why should I bother? |
| 17:04.55 | Mr_Molez | you just talk so much crap its hard filtering out the useful stuff |
| 17:05.06 | Mr_Molez | but fine ill google it |
| 17:05.08 | JeffM2501 | your problem, not mine |
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| 17:53.46 | Mr_Molez | *beginning |
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| 18:16.59 | JeffM2501 | well we had no real choice |
| 18:19.19 | JeffM2501 | and we would have been atacked on the old server anyway. I think have a more responsive |
| 18:24.49 | RatOmeter | attacked? |
| 18:25.13 | JeffM2501 | DDOS after we moved |
| 18:27.45 | JeffM2501 | out of all the choices where we could have moved, where we are now I think is the best |
| 18:28.10 | JeffM2501 | mostly due to who runs it and there integration into the project |
| 18:28.26 | JeffM2501 | and they resources available |
| 18:28.29 | Mr_Molez | who runs it ? |
| 18:28.36 | JeffM2501 | brlcad |
| 18:28.40 | Mr_Molez | oh sweet |
| 18:28.45 | JeffM2501 | it's in a real data center |
| 18:28.47 | JeffM2501 | not some DSL |
| 18:28.58 | JeffM2501 | it's just going to take some time to get the setings dialed in |
| 18:29.18 | JeffM2501 | the OS change was the bigest thing |
| 18:29.19 | Mr_Molez | who would put a server that needs to be up 24/7 with hundreds of people connected to it on a home dsl line lol |
| 18:29.42 | JeffM2501 | many many people oferd me "hosting" for the server |
| 18:29.48 | JeffM2501 | that were DSLs |
| 18:29.51 | Mr_Molez | haha |
| 18:29.57 | JeffM2501 | or cable |
| 18:30.04 | JeffM2501 | it was a lot of "thanks but no thanks" |
| 18:30.17 | JeffM2501 | a couple others offerd real dedicated serves |
| 18:30.17 | RatOmeter | Is there any capability for redundancy (or plans for it)? |
| 18:30.24 | JeffM2501 | there are ideas for it |
| 18:30.28 | JeffM2501 | right now it has none |
| 18:30.34 | JeffM2501 | we'd like it to have some |
| 18:30.46 | RatOmeter | it sounds like a needed feature |
| 18:30.52 | JeffM2501 | somone has to come up with a good design and get everyone to implement it |
| 18:30.54 | JeffM2501 | it is |
| 18:31.04 | JeffM2501 | but like all features, it just has to be done by somone |
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| 18:31.34 | RatOmeter | guess it might be tricky to avoid a single point of failure |
| 18:31.45 | JeffM2501 | I'm sure there are ways |
| 18:31.53 | JeffM2501 | other people do spaned databases |
| 18:31.55 | JeffM2501 | like ebay |
| 18:31.59 | JeffM2501 | google |
| 18:32.12 | JeffM2501 | i will just take some research |
| 18:32.17 | RatOmeter | right, but those folks have control of their own DNS |
| 18:32.52 | RatOmeter | maybe a page could be pilfered from the BitTorrent tech |
| 18:32.52 | JeffM2501 | for DNS we figured round robit |
| 18:32.55 | JeffM2501 | robin or something |
| 18:33.04 | RatOmeter | I like robits, too |
| 18:33.11 | JeffM2501 | DNS going down is probably not the bigest concern |
| 18:33.18 | JeffM2501 | since most DNSs systems will cache |
| 18:33.28 | JeffM2501 | bittorent is probalby overkill |
| 18:33.34 | JeffM2501 | or overly complex |
| 18:33.54 | JeffM2501 | it's a game, not a missile defense system ;) |
| 18:34.07 | RatOmeter | right, I wasn't literally meaning use BT tech. Just a loosely coupled, distributed approach |
| 18:34.17 | JeffM2501 | also since it stores passwords we only want authorised servers to have it |
| 18:34.34 | JeffM2501 | but it's lunch time. |
| 18:34.55 | RatOmeter | I think that's a given from the vulnerability aspect across the board (auth'd servers) |
| 18:35.01 | RatOmeter | happy lunching |
| 18:38.45 | amcnabb | brlcad, I just did a CVS update, and it looks like the isnan changes are causing problems on my system. |
| 18:38.48 | amcnabb | CommandsImplementation.cxx: In function 'float parseFloatExpr(const std::string&, bool)': |
| 18:38.51 | amcnabb | CommandsImplementation.cxx:373: error: 'isnan' is not a member of 'std' |
| 18:41.15 | amcnabb | In configure it said, "checking for isnan... yes" |
| 18:42.19 | RatOmeter | that's just insane |
| 18:47.47 | DTRemenak | amcnabb: http://sourceforge.net/docs/A04/ |
| 18:47.54 | DTRemenak | anonymous cvs is out of sync |
| 18:48.00 | DTRemenak | for about five weeks |
| 18:48.13 | amcnabb | Ok. That explains a lot. |
| 18:48.25 | DTRemenak | try http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/builds/bzflag-2.0.7.tar.gz |
| 18:48.39 | DTRemenak | that should be a snapshot as of last week sometime |
| 18:49.04 | amcnabb | Thanks. I'll try that. |
| 18:49.16 | DTRemenak | sorry for the trouble (but it's not our fault) ;) |
| 18:49.51 | amcnabb | Yeah. I haven't been impressed with Sourceforge's CVS server. |
| 18:50.04 | DTRemenak | it works pretty well when it's not broken |
| 18:50.09 | DTRemenak | sure breaks a lot. |
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| 18:51.07 | DTRemenak | can't say I'd do a better job running cvs for ~100,000 projects though :) |
| 18:52.47 | amcnabb | Yeah. That's a ton of projects. |
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| 19:36.24 | Mr_Molez | hmm |
| 19:40.11 | CBG | darn it. global login has been in and out all day :( |
| 19:40.29 | Mr_Molez | how do i get a box to pivot |
| 19:40.45 | orange | shout at it in a really mean way |
| 19:41.05 | CBG | push the top of one side? |
| 19:41.23 | CBG | if necessary, push the bottom of the opposite side too, I guess. |
| 19:41.41 | RatOmeter | Mr_Molez: it ain't just today |
| 19:41.55 | Mr_Molez | CBG: it aint just today |
| 19:41.57 | RatOmeter | er, that should be directed to CBG |
| 19:42.06 | RatOmeter | yeah, like that |
| 19:42.09 | Mr_Molez | CBG: comeon cbg u make maks |
| 19:42.11 | Mr_Molez | maps * |
| 19:42.26 | CBG | :) well, it's much worse today that any other day this week (for me) |
| 19:45.07 | Mr_Molez | or make circles |
| 19:49.28 | CBG | Mr_Molez: hmm? |
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| 20:01.38 | brlcad | Mr_Molez: the current main problem with the current list server behavior is that it seems there are things we are going that MySQL (our database backend) does not like |
| 20:02.21 | brlcad | there were a handful of real issues during the first two weeks while it was migrated, but those are all taken care of -- the problems we're seeing now are problems we had before the move |
| 20:03.24 | brlcad | amcnabb: CVS for you hasn't changed in a long time, you're out of sync unfortunately (and CVS for devs is currently down so I can't get you a recent copy yet) |
| 20:04.04 | brlcad | ahh, danka DTRemenak |
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| 20:15.42 | amcnabb | The new version sure seems to work better than anonymous CVS. :) |
| 20:16.09 | amcnabb | Thanks for the help DTRemenak. |
| 20:16.33 | DTRemenak | np |
| 20:16.40 | JeffM2501 | anon cvs is like 2.0.5 right before the .6 release |
| 20:17.11 | amcnabb | I'll just make sure to grab releases until anonymous CVS is back up. |
| 20:17.48 | DTRemenak | JeffM2501: whatchathinkin for 2.0.8? |
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| 20:18.17 | JeffM2501 | DTRemenak, as soon as we get dev CVS back |
| 20:18.20 | JeffM2501 | we cut it |
| 20:18.22 | JeffM2501 | it's ready |
| 20:18.27 | DTRemenak | dev cvs isn't working? |
| 20:18.30 | JeffM2501 | nope |
| 20:18.33 | JeffM2501 | it's ALL down |
| 20:18.36 | DTRemenak | heh |
| 20:18.38 | DTRemenak | wonderful |
| 20:18.40 | JeffM2501 | a drive blew |
| 20:18.48 | JeffM2501 | they are in the process of doing the new system |
| 20:18.56 | JeffM2501 | so they are just keeping it down till they move it |
| 20:19.05 | JeffM2501 | it's easyer for them |
| 20:19.12 | JeffM2501 | but the suck for us |
| 20:19.28 | JeffM2501 | I wish I had dev CVS back, I could check in changes to sound |
| 20:19.41 | brlcad | heh, DTRemenak .. where have YOU been? :) |
| 20:19.52 | DTRemenak | off in my own little world |
| 20:21.03 | TD-Linux | I've been irritating everyone with my modded date.cxx - 2.0.7 :) |
| 20:21.22 | TD-Linux | unfortunately, the latest source I have segfaults regularily |
| 20:21.34 | JeffM2501 | fix it |
| 20:22.12 | TD-Linux | I'll just wait for sourceforge cvs to be back up - that won't take more than a week, I hope |
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| 20:23.26 | JeffM2501 | the souce in CVS is the same as the 2.0.7 I posted |
| 20:23.31 | JeffM2501 | CVS went down after that |
| 20:24.14 | TD-Linux | the stuff I have I got approximately a week before cvs went down |
| 20:24.21 | TD-Linux | I was busy and didn't update since |
| 20:24.47 | JeffM2501 | then get the one in the topic |
| 20:24.54 | JeffM2501 | it was the last set of changes |
| 20:25.34 | TD-Linux | okay |
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| 20:52.07 | brlcad | i've increased the number of simultaneous maximum connections apache will allow |
| 20:52.20 | brlcad | i think we were hitting the limit (> 100) |
| 20:52.42 | RPG_ | getting DoSed again? |
| 20:52.52 | RPG_ | either that or the board is just super popular :0 |
| 20:52.54 | JeffM2501 | probalby just used |
| 20:53.06 | JeffM2501 | remember that every client hits the server too |
| 20:53.10 | JeffM2501 | as well as every server |
| 20:53.30 | RPG_ | did you ever think of establishing a protocol other than HTTP for list server communication |
| 20:56.05 | brlcad | not DoS's .. just really getting used that much |
| 20:56.30 | brlcad | and client connections remain for about 2-3 minutes after a connection, so it's 100+ players within a 2-3 minute window |
| 20:56.31 | JeffM2501 | RPG_, many others had many ideas |
| 20:56.40 | JeffM2501 | tim did the HTTP stuff |
| 20:56.41 | brlcad | (on non-persistent connections) |
| 20:56.44 | JeffM2501 | it makes sense for some things |
| 20:56.47 | RPG_ | ok, that explains it |
| 20:56.58 | orange | brlcad: do the clients use a specific user agent that can be identified? |
| 20:57.00 | JeffM2501 | it's not a bad way |
| 20:57.03 | JeffM2501 | but there are others |
| 20:57.17 | JeffM2501 | if we did our own thing we'd have to make server software too |
| 20:57.30 | orange | because you can turn off keepalives for them if you can identify them |
| 20:57.35 | orange | and then maybe the connections will close faster |
| 20:57.37 | JeffM2501 | at least with HTTP there are servers and stuff out there for it, and they are kept updated. |
| 20:57.46 | JeffM2501 | and its' easy to integrate to databases |
| 20:58.23 | orange | I think there is even a default rule in the apache conf that turns off keepalives for some versions of IE |
| 20:58.39 | brlcad | orange: undoubtedly |
| 20:59.11 | DTRemenak | RPG_: at one time the list server ran its own protocol. you can probably find the sources for the old bzfls somewhere. we switched away from that for a reason... |
| 20:59.11 | brlcad | orange: it doesn't take up any resources, no problem increasing the limit |
| 20:59.57 | orange | brlcad: well, it does take up *some* resources... just maybe not enough to matter (yet :-) |
| 21:02.26 | brlcad | yeah, 'significant' resources |
| 21:14.24 | Nidhoggr | brlcad, I was having similar problems when it was on my machine. |
| 21:14.42 | Nidhoggr | it really bogs the machine down. apache2 is a bit of a pig, as well. |
| 21:15.14 | brlcad | Nidhoggr: were you using prefork or worker? |
| 21:15.33 | Nidhoggr | dunno the difference. whatever was on sarge. |
| 21:16.21 | Nidhoggr | I had a constant load average of at least .5 just from apache, which is not a small thing compared to my other boxes. |
| 21:16.42 | brlcad | all, looks like it was worker, and you had to increase the limit to 300 |
| 21:16.53 | Nidhoggr | nod |
| 21:17.08 | L4m3r | PING me before sending me random files! |
| 21:17.26 | Gnurdux | oh ok |
| 21:17.36 | L4m3r | what are you sending exactly? |
| 21:17.38 | Gnurdux | that the plugin i was talkign about |
| 21:17.41 | Gnurdux | yesterday |
| 21:17.52 | L4m3r | ok, and I need to see it, why? |
| 21:18.32 | Gnurdux | dunno |
| 21:19.02 | L4m3r | we played with it the other day, that's enough. Good work. Release it if you want. |
| 21:20.00 | brlcad | i suppose I should have read the old config when I converted to worker :) |
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| 21:30.43 | Nidhoggr | :) |
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| 21:47.39 | *** topic/#bzflag by brlcad -> http://BZFlag.org/ || http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag || http://BZFlag.org/wiki/GettingHelp || paste to http://bzflag.pastebin.ca || CVS HEAD is 2.1 UNSTABLE, use for new commits || 2.0.8 to be released as soon as CVS comes back up and stability can be confirmed || Schedule List Server Downtime: 5-15-2006 @ 4:00PM (brief) || 2.0.7 is at http://jeffm.bakadigital.com/temp/builds |
| 21:50.14 | RPG_ | woah, cvs is still down? |
| 21:50.28 | RatOmeter | that's what she said |
| 21:50.33 | Gnurdux | its down AGAIN RPG_ |
| 21:50.43 | Gnurdux | not the one from a month ago |
| 21:50.50 | RPG_ | SF needs to get their act together |
| 21:51.06 | Gnurdux | yep |
| 21:51.12 | L4m3r | well, of all the time it could have taken a crap, I'd say this is one of the best |
| 21:51.37 | Gnurdux | true |
| 21:51.43 | L4m3r | it's not like we're blazing new features into mainline constantly- my two-week old 2.0.7 build still works fine |
| 21:51.56 | Gnurdux | still, it was annoying when it prevented 2.09.6 |
| 21:51.58 | RPG_ | is dev CVS down too? |
| 21:51.59 | Gnurdux | 2.0.6 |
| 21:52.07 | Gnurdux | RPG_, duh |
| 21:52.12 | Gnurdux | otherwise they would release it |
| 21:52.28 | RPG_ | Gnurdux: sometimes anon does down adn dev doesn't |
| 21:52.43 | Gnurdux | but they would still release it RPG_ |
| 21:52.50 | RPG_ | 2.0.6? |
| 21:52.52 | Gnurdux | JeffM2501 doesn't give a crap about dev |
| 21:52.54 | L4m3r | 2.0.8 |
| 21:52.55 | RPG_ | what are you talking about grindducks? |
| 21:52.56 | Gnurdux | 2.0.8 ! |
| 21:53.02 | Gnurdux | 2.0.6 is already out |
| 21:53.04 | RPG_ | oh... what's the hurry with 2.0.8? |
| 21:53.08 | Gnurdux | 2.0.8 to be released as soon as CVS comes back up and stability can be confirmed |
| 21:53.13 | Gnurdux | not too much |
| 21:53.18 | Gnurdux | a couple of bugfixed |
| 21:53.20 | RPG_ | is there a major bugfix or something? |
| 21:53.27 | RPG_ | it seems 2.0.6 had such a short life |
| 21:53.31 | L4m3r | not since 2.0.7 I don't think |
| 21:53.38 | L4m3r | there's that spawn bug... |
| 21:53.43 | RPG_ | never noticed it |
| 21:53.51 | L4m3r | lol really? |
| 21:53.57 | L4m3r | go play at mofo FFA for a new minutes |
| 21:54.05 | Gnurdux | you spawn in front of bullets right? |
| 21:54.16 | RPG_ | oh, well that happneed once |
| 21:54.22 | RPG_ | i figured it was just standard operation |
| 21:54.26 | L4m3r | in front of bullets, in front of people, people spawn behind you, etc etc |
| 21:54.40 | L4m3r | it's happened but now it happens constantly |
| 21:54.56 | L4m3r | like, the server deliberately spawns you in the midst of the fray |
| 21:55.19 | L4m3r | And it causes netsplits too. |
| 21:55.24 | *** join/#bzflag Pimpinella (n=frank@gondolin.pimpi.org) |
| 21:55.24 | *** join/#bzflag wizatcomputer (n=wizatcom@pool-162-83-80-130.culp.east.verizon.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM] |
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| 21:55.30 | Gnurdux | lol |
| 21:56.22 | RPG_ | yay netsplits |
| 21:56.51 | Gnurdux | lol |
| 21:59.25 | brlcad | it's actually random, instead of the usual 'fake' safe random |
| 21:59.36 | brlcad | at least with respect to being near enemies |
| 21:59.38 | L4m3r | whose idea was that? lol |
| 21:59.45 | brlcad | *ahem* |
| 21:59.50 | brlcad | unintentional |
| 22:00.00 | L4m3r | oh, that's okay then :) |
| 22:00.11 | L4m3r | something I would do, heh |
| 22:00.34 | brlcad | it was part of a refactoring I did to make it so that different spawn styles can be written |
| 22:00.43 | brlcad | which is now the case |
| 22:00.54 | L4m3r | different spawn styles? |
| 22:00.55 | brlcad | no new styles were made for 2.0.6, but the code was put in place |
| 22:01.14 | L4m3r | like, styles by game type? |
| 22:01.21 | brlcad | yet the refactoring caused it to not pay attention to players that weren't around after you spawned |
| 22:01.48 | brlcad | so it's fine when you first start playing if you join a busy server.. but if the server was empty you're screwed by random spawns |
| 22:02.13 | brlcad | sure, styles by game type, or just styles for the purposes of making different spawn styles |
| 22:02.28 | brlcad | like completely random (even the 'bugged' one is not _completely_ random) |
| 22:03.10 | brlcad | or always spawn in a dangerous situation, like in a line of fire so you HAVE to dodge immediately |
| 22:03.26 | L4m3r | eek |
| 22:03.54 | L4m3r | that would suck... not only that, but having someone spawn behind you all the time is annoying |
| 22:03.54 | brlcad | or always spawn in some corner of a map on tuesdays, and a different one on wednesdays |
| 22:03.58 | brlcad | it's completely configurable |
| 22:04.14 | L4m3r | thru BZW? |
| 22:04.15 | RPG_ | 09n04e13a09t |
| 22:04.31 | brlcad | annoying, perhaps.. but if it always happened and happened to everyone, it could be interesting |
| 22:05.00 | RPG_ | brlcad: did you get my PM? |
| 22:05.04 | L4m3r | the buggy spawn in 2.0.6 has basically caused an increase in whorish playing |
| 22:05.04 | brlcad | not through bzw.. bzw already can define "spawn zones" but there is no assoicated logic for how you are to spawn |
| 22:05.11 | L4m3r | at planet mofo |
| 22:05.14 | brlcad | RPG_: yes |
| 22:05.26 | L4m3r | people just head for the corners so people won't spawn behind them |
| 22:06.04 | brlcad | RPG_: can you make a tarball that is just dropped in place or do you need an account? |
| 22:06.18 | RPG_ | an account would be nice |
| 22:06.23 | RPG_ | so i could change things if they break |
| 22:06.35 | RPG_ | 'cauze it is only a beta |
| 22:06.53 | brlcad | msg RPG_ what's your OS familiarity? |
| 22:07.04 | RPG_ | windows, linux |
| 22:17.57 | *** part/#bzflag RPG_ (n=darkslac@c-24-15-87-171.hsd1.il.comcast.net) |
| 22:50.07 | *** join/#bzflag wegstar (n=foo@allegro/user/wegstar) |
| 22:50.13 | Gnurdux | hi wegstar |
| 22:50.32 | JeffM2501 | Gnurdux, are you our walmart greeter? |
| 22:50.42 | wegstar | hello Gnurdux |
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