| 00:00.55 | *** part/#bzflag Tupone (n=Tupone@pdpc/supporter/active/Tupone) |
| 00:01.56 | wegstar | ;) |
| 00:07.34 | silverfox | in perl, how do I store x minutes after now in unix timestamp? |
| 00:36.49 | jcape | Any viper admins, there's another tker: "OsirisGod" |
| 00:48.56 | blast007 | http://bz.porteighty.org/downloads/highlag/ :/ Is this even possible without modifying a client? |
| 00:49.51 | blast007 | clientquery said was running 2.0.4 Gentoo Linux Unstable |
| 00:50.09 | lan56 | no |
| 00:50.16 | blast007 | iirc, this guy said he was in Iran, playing behind a proxy...his lagstats ranged from half an hour to 2.6 hours |
| 00:50.18 | lan56 | bzfs gives up at 10000ms |
| 00:50.43 | blast007 | hmm |
| 00:51.04 | lan56 | it assumes it is lost by that time |
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| 02:10.59 | orange_away | silverfox: $whatever = time + ( 60 * $x ); |
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| 05:26.49 | SportChick | orchid_: ping |
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| 08:00.01 | LePoulpe303 | hi all |
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| 13:01.52 | LePoulpe303 | brlcad : ping ? |
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| 13:47.35 | raytek2 | hey |
| 13:48.43 | raytek2 | does anyone here know how to "make" an IRC channel? |
| 13:48.52 | raytek2 | like this one |
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| 15:50.48 | brlcad | LePoulpe303: pong |
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| 16:00.01 | I_Died_Once | where can one find listings of other chat channels on freenode? |
| 16:02.57 | BearPerson | there's kindof a lot ;-) |
| 16:03.30 | BearPerson | maybe your client can request a list and allow you to filter it for whatever you need |
| 16:03.50 | BearPerson | -!- 10437 channels formed |
| 16:04.13 | BearPerson | the important word being "filter" ;-) |
| 16:12.57 | LePoulpe303 | brlcad : hi ! i've lost my moderator status on bzmanager section on the bb :'( |
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| 17:16.18 | Teppic | When you define mesh normals in a map file, are they vertex of face normals? |
| 17:16.27 | Teppic | or* |
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| 17:40.01 | trepan | Teppic: vertex |
| 17:40.11 | Teppic | Thx |
| 17:40.17 | trepan | specifically, lighting normals |
| 17:40.34 | trepan | (also used for physics if smoothbounce is enabled) |
| 17:44.29 | Teppic | Makes ense when you think, you wouldn't define more than one face normal for a flat surface, DOH. |
| 17:46.01 | trepan | the next version of drawInfo's also allows you to specify per-vertex attribs (ex: colors, tangents, binormals, deformation weights...) |
| 17:47.23 | Teppic | I was thinking about that the other day, would it be possible to make a door 'appear' to open by specifying different vertices for different lod levels? |
| 17:47.35 | Teppic | Sliding door obviously. |
| 17:48.26 | trepan | lod's aren't computed based on distance, so it would appear diferently for different setups |
| 17:48.47 | trepan | they're based on length per pixel (depends on resolution, fov, dist.) |
| 17:48.54 | Teppic | But in essence, as you got closer it could apper to open for you? |
| 17:49.13 | trepan | yup, but it'd probably look like crap |
| 17:50.12 | trepan | try it, find out :) |
| 17:50.31 | Teppic | Well, you have to try to push the bounds of the engine, or learn C++, and that ain't gonna happen. |
| 17:51.47 | Teppic | Maybe when I'm not so busy. |
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| 18:07.13 | JeffM2501 | hmmm real work..or break bzfs more? |
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| 18:11.28 | Teppic | Both, |
| 18:11.47 | JeffM2501 | sadly breaking bzfs dosn't get the post regresions done |
| 18:12.32 | Teppic | Yeah, but it makes me feel better about threatening poeple for money. |
| 18:12.52 | JeffM2501 | huh? |
| 18:13.53 | Teppic | Getting invoices paid, I spend more time doing that that 'actual' work. |
| 18:14.11 | JeffM2501 | we have a departement for that |
| 18:15.26 | brlcad | woot |
| 18:17.24 | JeffM2501 | fly me to the moon... and let me play amongst the stars |
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| 20:01.47 | Teppic | Trepan? |
| 20:02.32 | trepan | Teppic: just ask, someone else may be able to help |
| 20:03.01 | Teppic | The vertex normals, relative to the vertex ie a vector, or a real world space co-odrinate |
| 20:04.19 | trepan | relative to their local coord sys, they are transformed when grouped |
| 20:06.10 | Teppic | So if i have a vector relative to the vertex, i have to add the vertex position for bzfs? |
| 20:06.27 | trepan | normals are directional, not positional, and are not related to vertex locations |
| 20:06.59 | Teppic | Vector in relation to the objects origin then? |
| 20:07.38 | trepan | yes, what else would make sense? |
| 20:08.02 | Teppic | It's just smooth bounce is doing strange things and I wondered if I defined them wrong |
| 20:08.23 | trepan | heh, no one has used smoothbounce much, it could simply be broken ;) |
| 20:08.28 | Teppic | lol |
| 20:08.30 | trepan | have an example? |
| 20:08.44 | Teppic | Whole map or description? |
| 20:09.14 | trepan | relevant map piece, (pastebin'ed |
| 20:09.32 | Teppic | ok, 1 min. |
| 20:12.19 | Teppic | http://pastebin.com/542104 |
| 20:14.00 | trepan | from looking at the mesh and the sun's dir, your normals look jacked |
| 20:15.30 | Teppic | I'll check, but they were taken from each vert of each face as they were written. |
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| 20:16.43 | trepan | http://trepan.bzflag.bz/noshow/badnorms.jpg |
| 20:17.30 | trepan | you apply you object's transform to the normals? (it needs a special version too, normals are transformed a little differently then positions) |
| 20:17.37 | trepan | s/are/aren't |
| 20:17.40 | trepan | oops :) |
| 20:19.10 | Teppic | The normals appear back to front, but on the same mesh on the other side it's ok. |
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| 20:21.43 | trepan | other side? |
| 20:22.06 | gsnedders | what's the easiest way to get my CVS back to 20060127? |
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| 20:23.58 | Teppic | I have the (more or less) same mesh duplicated and transformed within the moddler, it looks ok and shots rico fine |
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| 20:25.30 | Teppic | DOH, I think i have it. |
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| 20:31.23 | Teppic | No, the code it right |
| 20:31.58 | trepan | that probably won't help =) |
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| 21:40.57 | bz26 | hi :) |
| 21:41.48 | bz26 | i have an echo statement inside a user-defined function and it doesnt work can anybody help? |
| 21:41.58 | bz26 | in a php script |
| 21:42.19 | bz26 | outside the user defined functions it works fine |
| 21:42.29 | Tupone | /join #php |
| 21:58.25 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, got any idea why the proto version is part of the "date" project? |
| 21:58.32 | JeffM2501 | and not just in the version stuff? |
| 21:58.53 | Tupone | I remember Tim melted, but I can be wrong |
| 21:59.00 | JeffM2501 | melted? |
| 21:59.03 | JeffM2501 | like got hot |
| 21:59.06 | JeffM2501 | became soft |
| 21:59.13 | JeffM2501 | and turned into a fluid? |
| 21:59.13 | Tupone | I remember they were in different place |
| 21:59.27 | JeffM2501 | just seems wierd to me |
| 21:59.37 | Tupone | and project is an hard term in linux |
| 21:59.44 | Tupone | just same file |
| 22:00.06 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 22:00.14 | Tupone | why you need to associate directory to project |
| 22:00.21 | JeffM2501 | we don't have to |
| 22:00.25 | JeffM2501 | it's just how it was done |
| 22:00.33 | JeffM2501 | here it builds a date.lib |
| 22:00.56 | JeffM2501 | it was easyer to invaldate the entire proejct on each release build to redo the date |
| 22:00.59 | JeffM2501 | since we don't have config |
| 22:01.03 | JeffM2501 | or automake |
| 22:01.04 | Tupone | i knew you did not have to. I wonder why we actually do that way |
| 22:01.05 | JeffM2501 | or anything like that |
| 22:01.28 | JeffM2501 | personaly I do not like how it's split on windows |
| 22:01.55 | Tupone | I like just one project, or 2 if you get the plugin in the build |
| 22:02.08 | Tupone | but I'm very ignorant |
| 22:02.19 | JeffM2501 | well you HAVE to have one project per executable or lib |
| 22:02.22 | JeffM2501 | that's how VC does it |
| 22:02.31 | JeffM2501 | then you have a workspace that includes them all |
| 22:02.34 | JeffM2501 | and we are set up like that |
| 22:02.42 | JeffM2501 | I just don't like our lib breakdown |
| 22:03.19 | JeffM2501 | I would actualy like to make a workspace per exe |
| 22:03.21 | Tupone | as you don't use the make buildinf tool, you don't need to have the same structure, if that is hurting you |
| 22:03.29 | JeffM2501 | cus when I'm working on bzfs, I don't want to seven see client |
| 22:03.47 | JeffM2501 | Tupone, it's not 'hurting" I just don't like it :) |
| 22:03.51 | JeffM2501 | it does work |
| 22:03.54 | Tupone | :) |
| 22:04.10 | Tupone | I wonder if the same is valid for mingw |
| 22:04.18 | JeffM2501 | yay, lookit the server crash :) |
| 22:05.21 | Tupone | hmm, mingw is only building libxxx.a IIRC |
| 22:05.44 | Tupone | not .LIB ... Am I wrong? |
| 22:06.14 | JeffM2501 | I don't know |
| 22:06.17 | JeffM2501 | never used it |
| 22:06.21 | JeffM2501 | what is a .a? |
| 22:06.31 | JeffM2501 | and how is it difrent from a .lib? |
| 22:07.35 | Tupone | I think is just a collection of .o |
| 22:07.46 | Tupone | in unix is that |
| 22:07.49 | JeffM2501 | so like a temp lib |
| 22:07.58 | JeffM2501 | just to be used during building |
| 22:08.02 | Tupone | yep |
| 22:08.26 | JeffM2501 | don't know if VC has anything like that |
| 22:10.48 | JeffM2501 | yay, no more crashy :) |
| 22:11.07 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/ (5 files): continue down the path of enligtenment, leaving the path of chaos to the past. |
| 22:13.56 | JeffM2501 | and so bzfs becomes slightly smaller |
| 22:24.54 | JeffM2501 | I'm thinking server side bots don't need to do flag negotiation |
| 22:26.36 | Tupone | I wonder why you need to do bots via plugins. I get you can have a local connection too. But I'm not questioning :) |
| 22:27.04 | JeffM2501 | I feel it is a little cleaner |
| 22:27.13 | JeffM2501 | and easyer to implement |
| 22:27.18 | JeffM2501 | there are manyways |
| 22:27.36 | JeffM2501 | mostly this is an excuse to make the server know more about the game |
| 22:27.52 | JeffM2501 | as many of the hooks I'm adding can be used for anti-cheat stuff |
| 22:27.52 | Tupone | well, but they are already implemented, all classes are there, you just need to give them a feeling |
| 22:28.13 | JeffM2501 | I mean easyer for the bot developer, not for me |
| 22:28.18 | Tupone | ok, anti-cheat is ok |
| 22:28.38 | JeffM2501 | I'm doing the work once, so that every bot dev dosn't to it again |
| 22:29.16 | Tupone | well, if they want to make a context for bot agains bot, they need net |
| 22:29.22 | Tupone | contest |
| 22:29.31 | JeffM2501 | true |
| 22:29.35 | JeffM2501 | this is not for a context |
| 22:29.38 | JeffM2501 | contest |
| 22:29.39 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 22:29.57 | JeffM2501 | this is to provide a way for real playable server side bots |
| 22:30.00 | Tupone | but I like the idea, so I would like to have bot coded the same |
| 22:30.05 | JeffM2501 | that can be added and removed based on the number of real players |
| 22:30.34 | JeffM2501 | my goal is to give the plugin a minium number of players, and have it try to fill in the rest with bot variants |
| 22:30.43 | JeffM2501 | one plugin can define multiple bots as well |
| 22:30.46 | Tupone | that is good even for player, making staying in a room before joining if the game is full |
| 22:31.23 | JeffM2501 | this can also make DTRs chron plugin easyer |
| 22:31.29 | Tupone | I mean some of the code to let bots join when there is space should be given to bzflag client even |
| 22:31.42 | JeffM2501 | since now with the bot API, the plugin can do any / command, since it has real player data behind it |
| 22:32.07 | JeffM2501 | net bots just seem to be a waste of net data, and overhead |
| 22:32.20 | JeffM2501 | and ties them to the protocoll |
| 22:32.25 | Tupone | could that be used as a socket for net players, even ? |
| 22:32.54 | JeffM2501 | the plugin coudl redirect the stuff to it's own net socket I guess |
| 22:33.11 | JeffM2501 | the other reason is when this is done, and once it's exposed to the python plugin, then bots can be made in python :) |
| 22:33.45 | JeffM2501 | and I get to clean up the code a bit as I walk thru it |
| 22:34.13 | Tupone | use the correct tab spacing when you cleanup the code :) |
| 22:34.25 | JeffM2501 | why? then tim would have no WS commits to do :) |
| 22:35.12 | JeffM2501 | I think I'm cleaning up small security holes on the way too |
| 22:35.26 | JeffM2501 | making sure data allways comes from the player state, not just blindly relaying packets |
| 22:35.28 | JeffM2501 | stuff like that |
| 22:35.46 | JeffM2501 | there are a couple places we do spooky things with buffers :\ |
| 22:36.36 | Tupone | I received some lesson today. hmm wonder that: word communication bring juts 7 % of the information. Others are way of talking, dressing ... I did not talk about the IRC :) |
| 22:37.03 | JeffM2501 | ohh yeah most info transfer is best face to face |
| 22:37.13 | JeffM2501 | over a beer or nice dinner |
| 22:38.16 | Tupone | I would have said "depend on the communication channel", that in IRC you got 100% from words :) But too techincal :) |
| 22:39.29 | JeffM2501 | heh |
| 22:39.36 | JeffM2501 | no beer in IRC |
| 22:40.07 | Tupone | :( |
| 22:43.02 | Birdie | beer, did i heard beer? |
| 22:43.03 | Birdie | :) |
| 22:43.41 | Thumper_ | hey JeffM2501 |
| 22:45.11 | Thumper_ | The new plugin API in Head ... is the intention to create new classes (*V2) based on the *V1 classes for new things we want to add? |
| 22:45.28 | *** join/#bzflag triclops (n=triclops@203-206-244-91.dyn.iinet.net.au) |
| 22:46.02 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 22:46.18 | Thumper_ | ok and we don't need to bump the API protocol anymore unless we totally change the API ? |
| 22:46.22 | JeffM2501 | and to do an update in the old functions |
| 22:46.24 | JeffM2501 | yes |
| 22:46.28 | JeffM2501 | shoudl make it easyer |
| 22:46.31 | Thumper_ | ie just subclassing won't require API proto bump |
| 22:46.36 | Thumper_ | ok |
| 22:49.07 | *** join/#bzflag bz55 (n=502ab3cb@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 22:49.07 | JeffM2501 | yeah I figured that was a better way |
| 22:49.30 | JeffM2501 | at least to let old plugins still working |
| 22:49.30 | Thumper_ | yeah I think so |
| 22:49.36 | bz55 | hi |
| 22:49.46 | JeffM2501 | we'll have to see how it works when we do the first class bump |
| 22:49.52 | JeffM2501 | how well the update code works out |
| 22:49.57 | bz55 | i wonder, where can i get the latest info on compiling bzflag for intel macs? |
| 22:50.30 | bz55 | at least one person seems to have succeeded in doing this, but there's no hint on the forum about how he did i |
| 22:51.25 | *** join/#bzflag zee186 (n=80f0e503@zeebrothers.net) |
| 22:51.35 | bz55 | any ideas? |
| 22:52.11 | Thumper_ | bz55: hunt down someone who's done it ? |
| 22:52.22 | Thumper_ | bz55: or just try it and see what happens |
| 22:52.30 | bz55 | is there not some sort of repository for this sort of info? |
| 22:52.49 | *** join/#bzflag BeerPerson (i=karsten@sourcemage/wizard/pdpc.sustaining.BearPerson) |
| 22:53.02 | bz55 | i mean, rather than several people all trying the same thing... |
| 22:53.36 | Thumper_ | I haven't heard of one, but then I don't have a Mac so that wouldn't interest me much |
| 22:54.51 | *** join/#bzflag zee339 (n=8b14a767@zeebrothers.net) |
| 22:54.54 | *** part/#bzflag zee339 (n=8b14a767@zeebrothers.net) |
| 22:58.28 | brlcad | hmm, zee has a cgi:irc too now apparently |
| 22:58.47 | brlcad | i think that makes .. 4? |
| 23:03.11 | JeffM2501 | impresive |
| 23:03.49 | JeffM2501 | brlcad, you get your work to get you a macbook yet? |
| 23:04.41 | wizatcomputer | i don't think they're shipping yet |
| 23:04.49 | JeffM2501 | ahh |
| 23:05.20 | JeffM2501 | has anyone goten the intel OSX to run on non apple hardware? |
| 23:05.38 | BenUrban | i have't, but i know someone has |
| 23:05.45 | BenUrban | no clue who |
| 23:05.46 | BenUrban | lol |
| 23:05.47 | I_Died_Once | that rates up there with running windows on an intel mac |
| 23:06.02 | BenUrban | I_Died_Once: how hard would that be? |
| 23:06.18 | I_Died_Once | BenUrban: I dunno, yo |
| 23:06.21 | JeffM2501 | vista should run on them fine |
| 23:06.33 | JeffM2501 | any windows that can boot to EFI |
| 23:06.33 | BenUrban | i wouldn't expect it to be particularly difficult |
| 23:06.45 | JeffM2501 | XP wont |
| 23:06.46 | I_Died_Once | "proprietary piece of ****" |
| 23:06.48 | purple_cow | hehe, yay EFI |
| 23:07.04 | JeffM2501 | EFI does sound like a good thing |
| 23:07.08 | BenUrban | what is efi? |
| 23:07.20 | JeffM2501 | the replacement for BIOS |
| 23:07.24 | JeffM2501 | aka bios that sucks less |
| 23:07.31 | BenUrban | i see |
| 23:07.37 | JeffM2501 | lets it have like net drivers in the firmware |
| 23:08.35 | BenUrban | EFI:BIOS::OpenFirmware:OldWorld booting? |
| 23:12.38 | brlcad | JeffM2501: they're being ordered |
| 23:12.48 | brlcad | they are shipping already |
| 23:13.16 | JeffM2501 | cool |
| 23:17.43 | wizatcomputer | brlcad: they're shiping already? |
| 23:17.45 | wizatcomputer | didn't know that |
| 23:22.43 | brlcad | yep |
| 23:22.54 | bri3d | I've got it working on non-mac hardware. |
| 23:22.54 | brlcad | know some folks that already ahve one |
| 23:23.12 | bri3d | 10.4.3. build 8f1111. maxxuss.hotbox.ru has everything you need. |
| 23:23.16 | BenUrban | whereever he is |
| 23:23.16 | CIA-3 | BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/ (6 files): smaller and smaller bzfs becomes. |
| 23:23.38 | bri3d | On my box it's running fairly well, my ATI card has full hardware accelleration but only 1280x1024 |
| 23:23.38 | JeffM2501 | time to do the nasty |
| 23:44.43 | JeffM2501 | anyone got current 2.0.x sources? |
| 23:45.46 | *** join/#bzflag wizatcomp (i=wizatcom@pool-70-104-231-9.fred.east.verizon.net) |
| 23:46.02 | trepan | i've got current + mod'ed 2.0.x sources |
| 23:46.44 | JeffM2501 | does your bzfsAPI.cxx have an implemnentation for bz_getReports() ? |
| 23:47.11 | trepan | yup |
| 23:47.19 | JeffM2501 | k |
| 23:47.21 | JeffM2501 | thanks |
| 23:47.29 | JeffM2501 | only the header part made it to 2.1 |
| 23:47.49 | JeffM2501 | and it's done like wrong |
| 23:48.55 | *** join/#bzflag frodo (n=51e3cf1e@webchat.bzflag.bz) |
| 23:51.14 | frodo | help needed "sever warning your lag is too high (570) what to do?? |
| 23:51.32 | JeffM2501 | you running anything else when your playing? |
| 23:52.12 | frodo | not usually |
| 23:52.18 | JeffM2501 | what kind of net connection are you on? |
| 23:52.45 | frodo | adsl but it works on another PC |
| 23:52.52 | JeffM2501 | what is your frame rate like? |
| 23:53.13 | frodo | ? explanation please |
| 23:54.41 | JeffM2501 | your frame rate |
| 23:54.44 | JeffM2501 | on that computer |
| 23:54.47 | JeffM2501 | is it very low? |
| 23:55.02 | JeffM2501 | hit T when playing and see a FPS counter |
| 23:55.29 | frodo | ok will try that |
| 23:56.31 | frodo | have been kicked out for that warning |
| 23:57.28 | JeffM2501 | many servers have a lag kick |
| 23:57.34 | JeffM2501 | if your FPS is very low that can add fake lag |
| 23:59.06 | frodo | fps beetween 60 and 75 going up and down |
| 23:59.21 | JeffM2501 | then that computer is just laggy for some reason |
| 23:59.32 | JeffM2501 | you'll have to see if anything else is eating it's bandwith |
| 23:59.45 | JeffM2501 | or pick a less lagy server closer to you |
