irclog2html for #bzflag on 20050309

`00:00.08`	`brlcad`	`bitmap fonts are probably the easiest means to get that for a lot of them`
`00:00.58`	`DTRemenak`	`bitmap fonts (or at least this implementation) are slower on just about everything. They seem to help software rendering and matrox cards the most.`
`00:01.12`	`DTRemenak`	`they don't help the folks with old ATI cards`
`00:01.33`	`DTRemenak`	`which seem to be the big group of people who are having trouble`
`00:01.39`	`brlcad`	`yep`
`00:02.09`	`DTRemenak`	`I killed a state reset that was being called every time text was drawn, that might help if that's the problem`
`00:02.32`	`brlcad`	`wasn't underlining also a problem?`
`00:02.41`	`DTRemenak`	`I hate not being able to test against anything though...font rendering makes no difference on my machine`
`00:02.52`	`DTRemenak`	`underlining does a full reset on every underline`
`00:02.54`	`brlcad`	`yeah, my machine's mostly fine too`
`00:03.07`	`DTRemenak`	`which ends up being 7 or 8 times per frame max`
`00:03.10`	`brlcad`	`i think it's been fine for most all of us, which is how it snuck out`
`00:03.30`	`brlcad`	`eek`
`00:03.43`	`DTRemenak`	`the one that got nailed in fontmanager was doing it every text draw`
`00:03.51`	`DTRemenak`	`which could be up to 200/frame`
`00:04.13`	`DTRemenak`	`mmm`
`00:04.33`	`brlcad`	`wonder if pulsate does it..`
`00:04.43`	`brlcad`	`or maybe make default undecorated`
`00:04.44`	`DTRemenak`	`if people don't see a big boost from the change I made, then they won't see any change at all from the underlining thing`
`00:04.48`	`DTRemenak`	`pulsate does not`
`00:04.51`	`DTRemenak`	`just changes the colors`
`00:05.06`	`brlcad`	`why does underline need a reset??`
`00:05.20`	`brlcad`	`i suppose I should rtfc`
`00:05.28`	`DTRemenak`	`to draw. not sure why, it was in the old code too.`
`00:05.42`	`DTRemenak`	`that is, the OpenGLTexFont code did the same thing for underline`
`00:05.50`	`brlcad`	`yeah, but we didn't underline by default`
`00:06.11`	`DTRemenak`	`true`
`00:10.48`	`brlcad`	`something to try with SportyGal in a controlled environment`
`00:11.03`	`brlcad`	`if turning it off helps, that'd be worth reverting the change`
`00:11.15`	`brlcad`	`aside from the fact that it looks like ass`
`00:11.24`	`DTRemenak`	`hehe`
`00:15.56`	`*** join/#bzflag wegstar (~foo@adsl-67-122-112-172.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net)`
`00:17.46`	`*** join/#bzflag bz7866 (~44cd8c79@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`00:18.15`	`bz7866`	`hello`
`00:18.22`	`blast007`	`hello :)`
`00:18.55`	`bz7866`	`I have a question. Does bzflag 2.0 support force feedback steering wheels`
`00:19.23`	`brlcad`	`on Linux with the proper drivers`
`00:19.58`	`bz7866`	`I guess I should step back and ask does it support force feedback?`
`00:19.58`	`brlcad`	`the steering wheel itself should work just fine`
`00:20.05`	`brlcad`	`on any OS`
`00:20.05`	`DTRemenak`	`and on windows with the proper drivers, hopefully ;)`
`00:20.41`	`brlcad`	`ahh, that's right .. you added that for win too didn't ya`
`00:20.48`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: my gamepad with rumble feedback doesn't work with the rumble feature in BZFlag :)`
`00:20.49`	`DTRemenak`	`bzflag supports simple force feedback on windows (hopefully) and on recent linux kernels`
`00:21.07`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: well why didn't you say something!? :)`
`00:21.26`	`blast007`	`well, haven't tried it on XP yet`
`00:21.32`	`bz7866`	`let me recall - are the force feedback parameters set in the options pages when you start the client`
`00:21.37`	`blast007`	`might just be a limitation with the 2000 drivers`
`00:22.08`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: if you can get rumble from the control panel then you should be able to from bzflag also`
`00:22.16`	`blast007`	`hmm`
`00:22.34`	`bz7866`	`where do you tell bzflag which input device to use?`
`00:22.35`	`blast007`	`cuz that worked fine`
`00:22.39`	`DTRemenak`	`if not, there's something wrong. I don't have a force feedback device, so I never was able to test it :)`
`00:22.52`	`blast007`	`bz7866: Options > Input Options or something like that`
`00:23.15`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: let me go get it and see if it gave any error or something`
`00:23.25`	`brlcad`	`DTRemenak: hehe`
`00:24.08`	`DTRemenak`	`for all I know the effect might be off by three orders of magnitude or something ;)`
`00:26.37`	`blast007`	`when shooting: "Could not create rumble effect (Invalid paramater)"`
`00:26.38`	`*** join/#bzflag bz3279 (~44cd8c79@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`00:26.46`	`DTRemenak`	`hm, that's interesting :)`
`00:26.59`	`blast007`	`DX9.0c`
`00:27.05`	`DTRemenak`	`I don't suppose it tells you which parameter is invalid....`
`00:27.09`	`bz3279`	`okay, I just checked the input settings, it mentions only joystick, not (steering) wheel`
`00:27.40`	`blast007`	`joystick should work, as the steering wheel is a "joystick" type device`
`00:27.43`	`DTRemenak`	`bz3279: a steering wheel is a joystick`
`00:28.05`	`DTRemenak`	`from the software's perspective anyway`
`00:28.14`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: nope, doesn't tell me which paramater :)`
`00:28.32`	`bz3279`	`an off-topic question, has anyone ever tried using a steering wheel to play games involving planes/jets`
`00:28.40`	`JeffM2501`	`I've seen some do it`
`00:28.51`	`JeffM2501`	`dosnt' usualy work out out well`
`00:29.01`	`JeffM2501`	`since the wheeel usualy only has 1 analog axis`
`00:29.21`	`bz3279`	`no pitch and yaw with a wheel like a joystick`
`00:29.21`	`DTRemenak`	`if it only has 1 axis it can't be used for bzflag, actually`
`00:29.36`	`DTRemenak`	`you need 2 axes`
`00:29.43`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh a 2 axis wheel would work better`
`00:30.01`	`JeffM2501`	`well DTRemenak it could work if you had another axis somewhere else, like a throttle too`
`00:30.02`	`DTRemenak`	`flight-yoke style`
`00:30.03`	`bz3279`	`1 axis being just left & right, not forward & back? is that what you mean`
`00:30.10`	`JeffM2501`	`dono how bz maps across multiple devices tho`
`00:30.12`	`DTRemenak`	`bz3279: yeah.`
`00:30.16`	`brlcad`	`foot pedals`
`00:30.26`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah if it shows as the same device it could work`
`00:30.29`	`brlcad`	`where break reverses :)`
`00:30.33`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`00:30.35`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: it takes the first two axes to be forward and back`
`00:30.35`	`JeffM2501`	`seen that`
`00:30.44`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, weak :)`
`00:30.50`	`DTRemenak`	`err, forward and back and left and right`
`00:30.52`	`JeffM2501`	`it should let you map per device :)`
`00:30.57`	`bz3279`	`well, not sure about that, car games with wheels do have forward and reverse "gears"`
`00:31.06`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: that would require a level of complication heretofore unforeseen`
`00:31.08`	`JeffM2501`	`so you can do a wheel for left and right, and a throttle for forwared/back :)`
`00:31.17`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, my input manager supports it :)`
`00:31.20`	`DTRemenak`	`you can as it is`
`00:31.27`	`DTRemenak`	`if windows sees them as one device`
`00:31.33`	`JeffM2501`	`I mean across devices`
`00:31.39`	`JeffM2501`	`most wheels don't have throtles`
`00:31.48`	`JeffM2501`	`by throtle I mean like from a flight sim`
`00:32.07`	`bz3279`	`sorry, forget to mention that I have a wheel and pedals`
`00:32.11`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: yeah, I know. one of my friends has a wheel with separate throttle that plugs into it`
`00:32.16`	`JeffM2501`	`nice`
`00:32.46`	`DTRemenak`	`bz3279: if the pedals are recognized as analog axes it will work. if they're just recognized as buttons or hats it won't.`
`00:32.47`	`JeffM2501`	`bz3279, what are the first 2 axes on the device ( that show up in the game controllers pannel in windows ).`
`00:33.03`	`JeffM2501`	`if you had my input manager it would ;)`
`00:33.32`	`bz3279`	`Not sure Jeff, mainly use the wheel/pedals for NASCAR games, and haven't ventured into setup since I loaded the stuff up some time back`
`00:33.36`	`JeffM2501`	`but then last time you used one of my managers it sucked`
`00:33.39`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`00:33.44`	`DTRemenak`	`I'll make you do the work this time :)`
`00:33.46`	`JeffM2501`	`poor poor font manager`
`00:33.52`	`JeffM2501`	`TM worked out ok tho`
`00:33.57`	`DTRemenak`	`yup`
`00:34.08`	`JeffM2501`	`I may have been drunk when I did FM`
`00:34.20`	`JeffM2501`	`now sound manager... that is a piece of work`
`00:34.31`	`JeffM2501`	`freaking winamp in a class`
`00:34.39`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: if you were to do FM again, what would you change?`
`00:35.15`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd make it render strings to textures`
`00:35.19`	`JeffM2501`	`then keep a string cache`
`00:35.32`	`DTRemenak`	`wouldn't that be rather texture-memory heavy?`
`00:35.33`	`JeffM2501`	`and render out fonts per size the first time they were used`
`00:35.40`	`JeffM2501`	`it would be more so yeah`
`00:35.47`	`JeffM2501`	`but it would look a lot better`
`00:36.13`	`JeffM2501`	`right now to make it good, you got to load up a bunch of textures`
`00:36.28`	`JeffM2501`	`and the new Texture manager supports time based unloading`
`00:36.36`	`JeffM2501`	`so as they went out of scope they would automaticly unload`
`00:37.20`	`JeffM2501`	`tho if I did it ALL over again I'd just use G3D's texture system`
`00:37.46`	`JeffM2501`	`and it's font system`
`00:37.56`	`JeffM2501`	`foudn out there is allready a bitmap font generation tool`
`00:39.02`	`JeffM2501`	`I think the guy who made G3D is my long lost good twin brother. it is allmost everyting I was doing in OGF`
`00:39.04`	`*** join/#bzflag Sgeo (~Sgeo@ool-182e9882.dyn.optonline.net)`
`00:40.02`	`brlcad`	`wooo, looks like the delay between anonymous and nonanon cvs should be gone in about 2 weeks`
`00:40.14`	`JeffM2501`	`finaly`
`00:40.58`	`brlcad`	`and site stats should be back on-line in "a few days"`
`00:41.24`	`JeffM2501`	`amazing`
`00:41.33`	`JeffM2501`	`I asume still no word from "the man" ?`
`00:42.08`	`brlcad`	`nope`
`00:42.20`	`JeffM2501`	`then I think it's time for plan b`
`00:42.47`	`brlcad`	`beer?`
`00:43.18`	`JeffM2501`	`mmmmm plan b`
`00:44.04`	`JeffM2501`	`hmmm plan b will cost too much money`
`00:44.07`	`JeffM2501`	`time for plan C`
`00:45.25`	`JeffM2501`	`and what would I do with an O2 anyway?`
`00:45.39`	`DTRemenak`	`could run a bzflag server on it :)`
`00:45.47`	`JeffM2501`	`why?`
`00:45.49`	`JeffM2501`	`sasami can do that`
`00:46.13`	`DTRemenak`	`my point had more to do with bzflag and less to do with the o2`
`00:46.27`	`JeffM2501`	`sasami would be better for bzflag :)`
`00:46.32`	`DTRemenak`	`in other words, it's not actually a relevant answer to your question :)`
`00:46.41`	`JeffM2501`	`there isn't like an SGI emulator around is there?`
`00:46.55`	`DTRemenak`	`you could use it to fix the MIPSPro support :)`
`00:47.02`	`JeffM2501`	`riiiiiggghhht`
`00:47.08`	`DTRemenak`	`hehe`
`00:47.29`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd just as soon port bzflag over to G3d and give it a total rewrite`
`00:47.44`	`DTRemenak`	`go for it`
`00:51.24`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/readme: plan C`
`00:51.41`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`00:52.12`	`JeffM2501`	`you asked for it`
`00:52.26`	`blast007`	`:)`
`00:52.52`	`JeffM2501`	`maybe it'll motivate me`
`00:52.55`	`DTRemenak`	`hah`
`00:53.01`	`DTRemenak`	`I'll believe that when I see it :P`
`00:53.09`	`JeffM2501`	`and maybe get some help on it :)`
`00:53.19`	`JeffM2501`	`ya never know`
`00:57.05`	`JeffM2501`	`snifff maybe I'd do beter if DTRemenak was more suportive`
`00:57.15`	`JeffM2501`	`but now he's doomed the project`
`00:57.36`	`DTRemenak`	`hahaha, not at all`
`00:57.48`	`DTRemenak`	`I think that if you got motivated, it could be a really cool thing.`
`00:57.58`	`JeffM2501`	`they sky class for G3D even allready supports the sun and moon thing`
`00:58.10`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah and for some reason I only become rather motivated on other people's code`
`00:58.14`	`JeffM2501`	`never my own`
`00:58.28`	`JeffM2501`	`I busted out the client side of lib IRC like mad`
`00:58.30`	`JeffM2501`	`and it was fun`
`00:58.43`	`JeffM2501`	`not that anyone ever used it`
`00:59.48`	`DTRemenak`	`not yet`
`00:59.50`	`JeffM2501`	`you should see the classes in G3d tho, they are rather cool`
`01:00.02`	`JeffM2501`	`they even have wrapers for reading and writing binary files`
`01:00.08`	`JeffM2501`	`that take care of the endianness`
`01:08.38`	`*** join/#bzflag SportChick (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c5b-b-192.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`01:08.44`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (lan56@h-68-165-20-212.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)`
`01:11.37`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: ping`
`01:11.41`	`SportChick`	`DTRemenak: ping`
`01:11.45`	`SportChick`	`JeffM2501: ping`
`01:11.47`	`SportChick`	`what am I to do?`
`01:11.48`	`JeffM2501`	`well I haven't done a build yet`
`01:11.54`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't have "the stuff" here`
`01:11.56`	`JeffM2501`	`need to go home`
`01:12.02`	`JeffM2501`	`when I do I'll make you one.`
`01:12.17`	`SportChick`	`JeffM2501: oh, is that what I'm waiting for? I saw brlcad say something earlier that I was supposed to try, but never saw what it was`
`01:12.23`	`SportChick`	`JeffM2501: unping :)`
`01:12.23`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh I dono`
`01:12.44`	`JeffM2501`	`I just know what I was gonna try for ya`
`01:14.23`	`*** join/#bzflag Engelchen (~bitter@adsl-68-22-206-82.dsl.chcgil.ameritech.net)`
`01:15.00`	`Engelchen`	`i don't suppose anyone might have some idea how to force BZ to generate a crash log on failure (MacOS X)?`
`01:15.22`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, got any idea why the default VC71 project allways links the runtimes in static, and single thread?`
`01:15.49`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: what default project?`
`01:15.57`	`JeffM2501`	`when you make a new C++ app`
`01:15.59`	`Engelchen`	`ah wwait... found something...`
`01:16.01`	`Engelchen`	`Exception: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (0x0001)`
`01:16.01`	`Engelchen`	`Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE (0x0002) at 0x00000112`
`01:16.10`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: nope, no idea`
`01:16.20`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd think multi thread DLL would be the best`
`01:16.23`	`SportChick`	`DTRemenak: you ignoring me again?`
`01:16.27`	`SportChick`	`:(`
`01:19.13`	`DTRemenak`	`SportChick: never!`
`01:19.30`	`Engelchen`	`Mar 8 19:05:08 localhost kernel: ATIRadeon::submit_buffer: Overflowed block waiting for FIFO space. Have 4, need 6. RBBM_STATUS 0x80116100. VAP_CNTL_STATUS 0xfcf40002`
`01:19.30`	`JeffM2501`	`(pssst) dude blame it on lag`
`01:19.49`	`Engelchen`	`ok, any ideas on that one? this was logged at the time of a bz 2.x crash on OSX`
`01:20.05`	`JeffM2501`	`looks like the ATI driver pooped`
`01:20.15`	`Engelchen`	`hmm`
`01:20.25`	`JeffM2501`	`what card is in the mac?`
`01:20.33`	`SportChick`	`DTRemenak: do you know what he was talking about? I thought he was talking to YOU`
`01:20.40`	`DTRemenak`	`who what?`
`01:20.48`	`JeffM2501`	`:)`
`01:20.57`	`Engelchen`	`all I see in the system info is just ATI`
`01:21.20`	`JeffM2501`	`Engelchen, have you ever installed the ATI mac bios update?`
`01:21.27`	`Noodle-sensei`	`i had too many girl scouts`
`01:21.30`	`Noodle-sensei`	`o.O`
`01:21.32`	`Engelchen`	`no... but if i don't know what model it is...`
`01:22.08`	`JeffM2501`	`same update for all ATI radeons`
`01:22.11`	`JeffM2501`	`same driver too`
`01:22.21`	`JeffM2501`	`the update auto detects`
`01:22.22`	`Engelchen`	`right, i'll have a go at it`
`01:22.25`	`Engelchen`	`thanks`
`01:22.41`	`orange`	`mmmm thin mints`
`01:22.44`	`JeffM2501`	`may not help`
`01:22.48`	`JeffM2501`	`damn right thin mints!!!`
`01:22.52`	`Engelchen`	`worth a tr`
`01:22.53`	`Engelchen`	`try`
`01:23.49`	`JeffM2501`	`mmm minty thinness`
`01:24.15`	`*** join/#bzflag BuNTy (~44ed0f26@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`01:24.42`	`BuNTy`	`hmm`
`01:24.49`	`BuNTy`	`can I connect to another server?`
`01:24.51`	`JeffM2501`	`ooo dude brave man... to glare and run`
`01:24.59`	`JeffM2501`	`BuNTy, IRC server?`
`01:25.15`	`BuNTy`	`yes`
`01:25.18`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`01:25.22`	`BuNTy`	`my irc client is not working..`
`01:25.24`	`BuNTy`	`oh`
`01:25.25`	`BuNTy`	`ok`
`01:25.26`	`BuNTy`	`thank you`
`01:25.30`	`JeffM2501`	`the bzflag webchat is only for chating on bzflag`
`01:25.54`	`SportChick`	`DTRemenak: can you post (in pm) the logs from irc to me from about an hour or so ago`
`01:25.57`	`SportChick`	`~seen brlcad`
`01:25.59`	`ibot`	`brlcad is currently on #brlcad #bzflag. Has said a total of 31 messages. Is idling for 43m 12s`
`01:27.38`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/ (9 files in 3 dirs): client dir framework ( stubbed )`
`01:27.49`	`DTRemenak`	`oh, you mean _that_`
`01:27.52`	`DTRemenak`	`I have no idea what he meant`
`01:28.42`	`*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@2002:45a6:8281:0:0:0:0:1)`
`01:32.01`	`DTRemenak`	`you still want the backlog even though I have no idea what he meant?`
`01:32.28`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/server/ (4 files in 3 dirs): server dir framework ( stubbed )`
`01:33.06`	`SportChick`	`oh, I thought you mean bunty`
`01:33.10`	`SportChick`	`hehe`
`01:33.15`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/VC71/BZFlagG3D.sln: "build all" project`
`01:33.21`	`DTRemenak`	`who?`
`01:33.26`	`SportChick`	`no, cuz if you don't know, then I won't know`
`01:33.29`	`SportChick`	`DTRemenak: you`
`01:33.48`	`Sgeo`	`How would BZFlag be affected by the Software-Patent thing?`
`01:34.23`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/readme: look real info!`
`01:34.49`	`DTRemenak`	`Sgeo: bzflag does not make use of any patented routines that we know of`
`01:34.57`	`DTRemenak`	`but software patents suck anyway`
`01:45.44`	`JeffM2501`	`DTRemenak, think this is enough default fonts?`
`01:45.44`	`JeffM2501`	`http://g3d-cpp.sourceforge.net/html/font.png`
`01:46.15`	`Sgeo`	`seen LummoxJR`
`01:46.22`	`Sgeo`	`seen`
`01:46.28`	`Sgeo`	`Ami`
`01:46.29`	`JeffM2501`	`ask the bot`
`01:46.33`	`Sgeo`	`Sorry`
`01:46.35`	`JeffM2501`	`put ! infront`
`01:46.38`	`Sgeo`	`Wrong channel`
`01:46.38`	`JeffM2501`	`it'll tell you`
`01:46.38`	`JeffM2501`	`:)`
`01:46.43`	`JeffM2501`	`!ww`
`01:46.43`	`guu`	`wrong window JeffM2501`
`01:48.07`	`*** join/#bzflag bzflagwiz (~wiz@12-217-167-129.client.mchsi.com)`
`01:49.30`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/data/font/ (85 files): fonts for the masses`
`01:50.18`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/data/ (g3d.png libirc.png linux.png osx.png win32.png): menu logos`
`01:51.09`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/data/world/ (brick.png clean_grass.png mush.png): basic world textures`
`02:05.05`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: ping ping a ling`
`02:05.19`	`Aribeth`	`hi SP`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`if (foo) {`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`} else {`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`<PROTECTED>`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`}`
`02:09.34`	`bzflagwiz`	`myProduct = x * myFloat;`
`02:09.51`	`bzflagwiz`	`can anyone tell me why i get a compile error with that?`
`02:10.05`	`JeffM2501`	`define myfloat outside your if`
`02:10.14`	`JeffM2501`	`your scoping it inside`
`02:10.35`	`bzflagwiz`	`Is it important that I won't be using a const then?`
`02:10.42`	`JeffM2501`	`it's not const`
`02:10.44`	`JeffM2501`	`your changing it`
`02:10.48`	`JeffM2501`	`based on foo`
`02:11.00`	`bzflagwiz`	`Ok - Thanks`
`02:11.16`	`*** join/#bzflag wheel (~44cd8c79@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`02:12.01`	`wheel`	`okay, got the wheel loaded and working, however, no rumble - getting "invalid paramter" in the window`
`02:12.51`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-84.caltech.edu)`
`02:13.37`	`wheel`	`hey DTR - see my previous comment`
`02:13.54`	`DTRemenak`	`what previous comment?`
`02:14.11`	`wheel`	`HERE: okay, got the wheel loaded and working, however, no rumble - getting "invalid paramter" in the window`
`02:14.20`	`DTRemenak`	`ahh, ok`
`02:14.26`	`wheel`	`any ideas`
`02:14.33`	`DTRemenak`	`same as blast007 was getting`
`02:14.41`	`DTRemenak`	`uh, yeah, the code is probably broken :)`
`02:14.59`	`wheel`	`I just upgraded to the lastest Logitech software too`
`02:15.10`	`JeffM2501`	`that stuff never got tested`
`02:15.22`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, it's not anything you can do anything about. I have to figure out why it's doing it, and try to fix it`
`02:15.47`	`Sgeo`	`(Completely random comment)`
`02:15.49`	`*** join/#bzflag sgk284 (~stevek@AC8F04FB.ipt.aol.com)`
`02:15.53`	`wheel`	`well.. after playing so long with a mouse, a wheel is hard to get used to`
`02:15.56`	`Sgeo`	`hi sgk284.`
`02:16.10`	`sgk284`	`hi`
`02:16.37`	`wheel`	`are there any feedback devices working? how about Logitech FFB mouse?`
`02:16.52`	`DTRemenak`	`mice are not supported with ff`
`02:17.13`	`DTRemenak`	`as far as bzflag is concerned, only joysticks can have ff`
`02:17.22`	`wheel`	`Logitech did make 1 ff mouse a few years ago -- didn't see it long on the market though`
`02:17.33`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah, I have one in a box somewhere :)`
`02:17.53`	`wheel`	`The one you have - did it work well?`
`02:18.01`	`DTRemenak`	`I never used it with ff turned on`
`02:18.04`	`*** join/#bzflag MeBigFatGuy (dave@balt-209-150-117-30.dynamic-dial.qis.net)`
`02:18.34`	`DTRemenak`	`an old guy was using it because he couldn't see the screen very well...then he got a new computer and gave me his old one`
`02:18.59`	`DTRemenak`	`come to think of it, I don't think I ever used it at all`
`02:19.21`	`wheel`	`don't know what it would have been good far, seems kind of hard to use a mouse for "flying" games, and maybe not too easy for race games`
`02:19.32`	`DTRemenak`	`why is VS7.1 so freaking huge? takes forever to install...`
`02:19.43`	`JeffM2501`	`cus of C#`
`02:19.53`	`DTRemenak`	`why is that so big though?`
`02:19.59`	`JeffM2501`	`cus it's EVIL`
`02:20.03`	`DTRemenak`	`hahaha`
`02:20.04`	`JeffM2501`	`evil is allways fat`
`02:20.10`	`wheel`	`let's go back to standard C, forget all this other stuff`
`02:20.25`	`JeffM2501`	`you can have my ++ when you pry it from my cold dead hands`
`02:20.32`	`Sgeo`	`Isn't C# a proprietary M$ Invention?`
`02:20.32`	`DTRemenak`	`naw, let's go back to COBOL!`
`02:20.46`	`JeffM2501`	`no C# is somewhat open ish`
`02:20.51`	`wheel`	`FORTRAN?!?! Pascal?!?!`
`02:20.53`	`JeffM2501`	`but is is a MS language`
`02:21.09`	`DTRemenak`	`FORTRAN is still used quite a bit in scientific circles, actually`
`02:21.11`	`JeffM2501`	`it's basicly J++ 2.0 with .net bindings and some crap cleaned up`
`02:21.17`	`*** join/#bzflag Jormungandr (~consus@user-69-1-42-120.knology.net)`
`02:21.17`	`wheel`	`MS = their own standard`
`02:21.20`	`DTRemenak`	`Pascal turned into Delphi, which is used quite a bit`
`02:21.27`	`Sgeo`	`And are there free compilers for C#?`
`02:21.27`	`DTRemenak`	`COBOL just...died.`
`02:21.31`	`JeffM2501`	`there are non MS implemenations of it`
`02:21.33`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah there are`
`02:21.34`	`wheel`	`didn't know that about Pascal`
`02:21.35`	`JeffM2501`	`for linux even`
`02:21.50`	`wheel`	`Unix/C rules`
`02:21.54`	`Jormungandr`	`~bzfquery jormungandr.homedns.org:9001`
`02:21.54`	`Aribeth`	`Pascal was cool`
`02:22.01`	`JeffM2501`	`refrence counted pointers!`
`02:22.08`	`bzflagwiz`	`COBOL is alive and (unfortunately) well in corporate America`
`02:22.09`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: I'm trying to hunt down where the "Invalid Paramater" error is happening :)`
`02:22.19`	`wheel`	`taught myself C just knowing Pascal`
`02:22.33`	`orange`	`MeBigFatGuy: I tested out /kill today... after getting /kill-ed the person cannot respawn`
`02:22.34`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: as soon as I finish installing VS, I'll help :)`
`02:22.39`	`blast007`	`:)`
`02:22.42`	`wheel`	`blast007 - do you have the whole error message`
`02:22.48`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`that will teach-um`
`02:23.04`	`DTRemenak`	`wheel: oh yeah? well I taught myself C knowing only BASIC :)`
`02:23.04`	`orange`	`interesting side effect :-)`
`02:23.14`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`have to wait till dbrosius shows up, and you can see if he'll fix it`
`02:23.17`	`wheel`	`BASIC - talk about going way back`
`02:23.18`	`blast007`	`"Could not create rumble effect (Invalid paramater)"`
`02:23.42`	`wheel`	`blast007 - you've got it, do you need to know what type of wheel`
`02:24.03`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: does VS ship with the whole DX SDK or do you still have to download it separately?`
`02:24.17`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/data/sky/ (30 files in 5 dirs): I see sky's of blue and clouds of white,`
`02:24.17`	`JeffM2501`	`it has the DX3 SDK at least`
`02:24.24`	`JeffM2501`	`71 may have updated that to 7`
`02:24.35`	`JeffM2501`	`I'd update to 9 tho`
`02:24.43`	`blast007`	`I think I saw a header for 8 in my includes`
`02:25.00`	`JeffM2501`	`8 comes with XP, they may have done that`
`02:25.10`	`DTRemenak`	`k`
`02:25.19`	`JeffM2501`	`6 came with DX3`
`02:25.21`	`wheel`	`04blast007 just an FYI, I'm using a Logitech Formula Force GP whee;`
`02:25.26`	`JeffM2501`	`ahhhh color`
`02:25.27`	`DTRemenak`	`eek`
`02:25.28`	`JeffM2501`	`make it stop`
`02:25.31`	`JeffM2501`	`BURN IT!`
`02:25.40`	`wheel`	`burn it! hehe`
`02:26.14`	`blast007`	`wheel: I'm using a gamepad, and getting the same error`
`02:26.17`	`DTRemenak`	`VC5 installed in like 30 seconds :)`
`02:26.25`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`02:26.45`	`wheel`	`burn my wheel, then I can't drive my NASCAR games`
`02:26.55`	`JeffM2501`	`no burn the color`
`02:27.03`	`wheel`	`oh`
`02:27.15`	`JeffM2501`	`knowing the type realy isn't going to help him`
`02:27.24`	`wheel`	`sorry, misunderstood`
`02:27.26`	`JeffM2501`	`the problem is not going to be specific to your system`
`02:27.36`	`JeffM2501`	`the FF stuff was kinda not all the way done`
`02:27.42`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`02:27.43`	`*** join/#bzflag Timpson (~Timpson@adsl-69-153-133-251.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net)`
`02:27.46`	`JeffM2501`	`IIRC DTRemenak never got it to work`
`02:27.46`	`DTRemenak`	`it was done, just...not tested`
`02:27.53`	`JeffM2501`	`done == works :)`
`02:28.02`	`wheel`	`rumble or no rumble, bzflag still a cool game`
`02:28.05`	`DTRemenak`	`then I never knew if it was done or not :)`
`02:28.18`	`wheel`	`is rumble working on anything`
`02:28.20`	`Timpson`	`hello folks`
`02:28.32`	`DTRemenak`	`wheel: rumble supposedly works on linux with the evdev joystick driver`
`02:28.34`	`wheel`	`hey Timpson`
`02:28.36`	`JeffM2501`	`I don't think anyone ever tried, not even the dev who made it.`
`02:28.45`	`JeffM2501`	`it was kinda droped`
`02:28.50`	`JBdiGriz`	`It's not working on MacOS X`
`02:29.00`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: I'm betting he did. he had some variables that were commented as "picked by experimentation"`
`02:29.10`	`DTRemenak`	`which would imply that it worked :)`
`02:29.17`	`wheel`	`well, don't know if it 's worth login sleep over, I was just kind of curious`
`02:29.18`	`JeffM2501`	`well that makes sense, since I think it's only implemented on windows with direct X`
`02:29.29`	`DTRemenak`	`JBdiGriz: nobody's written the back end for OSX`
`02:29.32`	`DTRemenak`	`patches welcome`
`02:29.34`	`JeffM2501`	`and last I checked OSX didn't have no direct X`
`02:29.40`	`JeffM2501`	`does OSX even have a FF api?`
`02:29.46`	`DTRemenak`	`or evdev`
`02:29.52`	`wheel`	`that us to say, don't lose any sleep over it, I was just curious to see it work with my wheel`
`02:30.01`	`DTRemenak`	`wheel: I intend to lose sleep over it`
`02:30.08`	`wheel`	`I can't type for crap tonight`
`02:30.11`	`DTRemenak`	`that's the only way to write code, is when you should be sleeping`
`02:30.17`	`brlcad`	`good grief it's COLD!`
`02:30.19`	`JBdiGriz`	`Gamepads are working on OSX through SDL. I didn't bother with writing the backend for the force feedback.`
`02:30.21`	`brlcad`	`and windy!`
`02:30.43`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/3d/ (inc/G3DTextureManager.h src/G3DTextureManager.cpp): new texture manager that allows for time and group based unloading of textures.`
`02:30.45`	`wheel`	`okay DTR, "if"s and "case" statements run all through your head`
`02:31.00`	`JeffM2501`	`does SDL even have a FF API?`
`02:31.00`	`brlcad`	`~weather kbwi`
`02:31.06`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: not yet`
`02:31.23`	`JeffM2501`	`hmm I need license files`
`02:31.26`	`DTRemenak`	`that's why it's hacked into all the native joystick drivers instead of the SDL layer`
`02:31.30`	`JBdiGriz`	`It looked like there was a way of putting it in, but I didn't investigate beyond that.`
`02:31.33`	`brlcad`	`that 17mph wind is bs .. it's at least 30 something up here`
`02:31.52`	`DTRemenak`	`~weather KBUR`
`02:31.59`	`wheel`	`56 here at 9:30pm`
`02:32.07`	`orchid`	`!weather cyyz`
`02:32.08`	`guu`	`orchid: The current temperature in Toronto-Pearson International, Ontario is 12�F (9:00 PM EST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Partly Cloudy. Humidity: 62%. Dew Point: 1�F. Wind: WNW at 13 mph (20 km/h). Pressure: 29.80 in (1009 hPa). Visibility: 15.0 miles (24.1 kilometers). UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:32.20`	`Aribeth`	`~weather 94087`
`02:32.24`	`JBdiGriz`	`DTRemenak: What are you doing down in Burbank?`
`02:32.28`	`JeffM2501`	`what do I need, just the COPYING file?`
`02:32.32`	`DTRemenak`	`JBdiGriz: Pasadena`
`02:32.36`	`Aribeth`	`!weather 94087`
`02:32.37`	`*** join/#bzflag AndyIII (~AndyII@dcn242-33.dcn.davis.ca.us)`
`02:32.38`	`guu`	`Aribeth: The current temperature in Sunnyvale, California is 64�F (5:56 PM PST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 77%. Dew Point: 57�F. Pressure: 30.15 in (1021 hPa). Visibility: 10.0 miles (16.1 kilometers). UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:32.44`	`brlcad`	`mm.. 12F`
`02:32.44`	`wheel`	`~weather 32796`
`02:32.53`	`brlcad`	`toronto wins`
`02:32.57`	`DTRemenak`	`JBdiGriz: Caltech is my drug, er, university, of choice`
`02:33.23`	`brlcad`	`i don't mind the cold but the wind is horrid right now`
`02:33.48`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/COPYING: that LGPL thingy`
`02:33.49`	`JBdiGriz`	`There's a large pass between Pasadena and Burbank. The weather tends to be different in those valleys.`
`02:34.27`	`DTRemenak`	`JBdiGriz: it's the closest weather code`
`02:34.27`	`brlcad`	`yep.. weather.com confirms gusts up to 30mph "feels like 10F"`
`02:35.22`	`brlcad`	`heh.. weather.com says toronto "feels like 1F" :)`
`02:35.33`	`JBdiGriz`	`!weather 91105`
`02:35.36`	`guu`	`JBdiGriz: The current temperature in Pasadena, California is 54�F (6:30 PM PST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 84%. Dew Point: 54�F. UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:35.41`	`wheel`	`~weather 24653`
`02:35.46`	`DTRemenak`	`!weather 91126`
`02:35.48`	`guu`	`DTRemenak: The current temperature in Pasadena, California is 56�F (6:30 PM PST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 70%. Dew Point: 56�F. UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:35.53`	`JeffM2501`	`!weather 93021`
`02:35.55`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: The current temperature in Moorpark, California is 50�F (6:32 PM PST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 84%. Dew Point: 50�F. UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:36.00`	`JeffM2501`	`wheel, ibot dosn't do zip codes`
`02:36.01`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/common/inc/singleton.h: there can be only 1`
`02:36.02`	`JeffM2501`	`guu does`
`02:36.03`	`guu`	`and does it with STYLE!`
`02:36.18`	`wheel`	`~weather 72205`
`02:36.21`	`JBdiGriz`	`guu, Thank you`
`02:36.22`	`guu`	`you are quite welcome`
`02:36.22`	`DTRemenak`	`91105 is a few miles west of here`
`02:36.29`	`JeffM2501`	`wheel, use ! not ~`
`02:36.38`	`JeffM2501`	`! == guu ~ == ibot`
`02:36.38`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: I'm sorry, I was listening to AirSupply.`
`02:36.51`	`JBdiGriz`	`Burbank is a whole lot of miles west of Pasadena.`
`02:37.06`	`DTRemenak`	`JBdiGriz: but it has a weather code that ibot knows :)`
`02:37.11`	`DTRemenak`	`ibot rocks`
`02:37.12`	`ibot`	`you bet your perl modules I do!`
`02:37.22`	`JeffM2501`	`now... libs, DLLs or just compile the code right in?`
`02:38.04`	`wheel`	`~weather KTIX`
`02:39.08`	`wheel`	`~weather KX68`
`02:39.14`	`JBdiGriz`	`~weather KPOC`
`02:39.20`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: hmm, I should install MSDN too...only did that on my Server 2003 partition :)`
`02:39.37`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: it's nice to have around`
`02:39.47`	`JeffM2501`	`it's BIG too`
`02:39.48`	`DTRemenak`	`especially when muddling with directx`
`02:39.53`	`blast007`	`yeah...`
`02:39.53`	`DTRemenak`	`heck yes it's big`
`02:40.06`	`DTRemenak`	`takes up 5% of my windows partition`
`02:40.07`	`JeffM2501`	`I wish you could tell it "dude, just ignore windows CE, I don't use it"`
`02:40.12`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: you can`
`02:40.20`	`JeffM2501`	`no you can not install it`
`02:40.29`	`JeffM2501`	`that dosn't make it NOT show in index searches`
`02:40.29`	`DTRemenak`	`yeah...`
`02:40.37`	`JeffM2501`	`when you hit F1 on a subject`
`02:40.38`	`DTRemenak`	`ah`
`02:40.47`	`JeffM2501`	`since it shares method names with MANY windows functions`
`02:41.05`	`JeffM2501`	`that just makes it ask for a disk when you hit the wrong ShowWindow entry`
`02:41.15`	`DTRemenak`	`heh :)`
`02:41.48`	`JBdiGriz`	`DTRemenak: La Verne is about as far east as Burbank is west, but at least you're in the right valley.`
`02:41.54`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/common/ (inc/TextUtils.h src/TextUtils.cxx): strings are our friends.`
`02:42.28`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (lan56@h-68-167-2-234.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)`
`02:42.38`	`DTRemenak`	`~weather KPOC`
`02:43.02`	`DTRemenak`	`almost no information though`
`02:43.20`	`JBdiGriz`	`so ask guu, she'll give you the right information.`
`02:43.27`	`DTRemenak`	`!weather 91126`
`02:43.30`	`guu`	`DTRemenak: The current temperature in Pasadena, California is 56�F (6:30 PM PST on March 08, 2005). Conditions: Clear. Humidity: 70%. Dew Point: 56�F. UV: 0 out of 16`
`02:43.36`	`blast007`	`oh, that's nice...."Your system is low on virtual memory. Windows is increasing the size bla bla bla"`
`02:43.37`	`blast007`	`;)`
`02:43.41`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`02:44.15`	`blast007`	`seems I need more RAM for Visual Studio .NET`
`02:44.31`	`blast007`	`or maybe it's just cuz I'm running two copies of VS...`
`02:44.51`	`DTRemenak`	`heh`
`02:45.55`	`DTRemenak`	`nice fresh windows partition and already 1/4 full, and not even any games on it yet :(`
`02:46.29`	`JeffM2501`	`how small is that parition?`
`02:46.30`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/VC71/client.ico: put a tank on the icon`
`02:46.32`	`blast007`	`heh`
`02:46.38`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: 40Gb`
`02:46.42`	`JeffM2501`	`well duch`
`02:46.45`	`JeffM2501`	`that's all small`
`02:47.02`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: all a matter of perspective`
`02:47.06`	`blast007`	`this partition is only 30GB :)`
`02:47.15`	`DTRemenak`	`the 2GB W2k partition I was using was getting a wee bit cramped`
`02:47.21`	`Sgeo`	`I'm using WinXP`
`02:47.29`	`JeffM2501`	`well from my perspective of 120 gig drives being cheaper then a night out on the town.. that is smalll :)`
`02:47.39`	`DTRemenak`	`JeffM2501: this is a 120Gb drive`
`02:47.45`	`JeffM2501`	`one per OS :)`
`02:47.53`	`DTRemenak`	`need a bigger case :)`
`02:47.54`	`Sgeo`	`In Fullscreen mode (which doesn't go to fullscreen), I can use the mouse but not the keyboard. In Windowed mode, I can use neither`
`02:48.00`	`DTRemenak`	`and more IDE controllers`
`02:48.10`	`JeffM2501`	`IDe card... 12$`
`02:48.21`	`JeffM2501`	`and everyone needs a bigger case`
`02:48.42`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: my 250GB Maxtor drive came with a EIDE/SATA card ;)`
`02:48.52`	`JeffM2501`	`cus your mobo probaly can't do it`
`02:49.14`	`JeffM2501`	`my new dual boot second PC has a nice raid controller right on it`
`02:49.17`	`lan56`	`mmm, dinner--food`
`02:49.40`	`blast007`	`yeah...when I get a real system, it's gonna have SATA raid`
`02:49.43`	`JeffM2501`	`dinner -- food == just sitting`
`02:50.01`	`lan56`	`dinner + food`
`02:50.18`	`JeffM2501`	`dinner + food = overeating cus dinner = food`
`02:50.23`	`retro`	`we have a 5.6 Terabyte SATA raid at work. :)`
`02:50.32`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/VC71/ (Resource.h client.rc small.ico): take out little icon`
`02:50.32`	`lan56`	`jeffm2501: I guess :)`
`02:50.39`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`wow thats a lot of directories :)`
`02:50.57`	`brlcad`	`that's a lot of e-mail :)`
`02:50.58`	`blast007`	`retro: wow, I could back up a lot of CDs with that ;)`
`02:51.00`	`Sgeo`	`Any help`
`02:51.02`	`Sgeo`	`?`
`02:51.06`	`retro`	`it's currently 61% full!`
`02:51.17`	`brlcad`	`Sgeo: qué cosa?`
`02:51.23`	`retro`	`It's also only about 2.5 months old.`
`02:51.31`	`JeffM2501`	`Sgeo, what OS/build type?`
`02:51.43`	`blast007`	`JeffM2501: he's on XP`
`02:51.47`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`02:51.50`	`JeffM2501`	`wierd`
`02:51.54`	`Sgeo`	`WinXP/BZFlag 2.0.0 (If that's what you mean by build type)`
`02:52.02`	`JeffM2501`	`XP == not SDL`
`02:52.26`	`Sgeo`	`Could it have anything at all to do with my color settings?`
`02:52.28`	`JeffM2501`	`should be using normal windows input stuff, no focus issues there I know of`
`02:52.29`	`retro`	`blast007, it's a Promise raid unit, 15 400 Gb SATA drives. It spits SCSI U160 out the back.`
`02:52.31`	`JeffM2501`	`color?`
`02:52.44`	`Sgeo`	`Was using 16-bit`
`02:52.56`	`JeffM2501`	`that should not affect the input handaling`
`02:53.01`	`JeffM2501`	`it could affect rendering`
`02:53.02`	`blast007`	`retro: cool`
`02:53.03`	`JeffM2501`	`and frame rate`
`02:53.08`	`JeffM2501`	`what card?`
`02:53.46`	`retro`	`Sustained transfer rate of over 100 Mb/s to the raid too. We like it very much.`
`02:53.58`	`retro`	`OK, back to work...`
`02:55.04`	`Sgeo`	`NVIDIA RIVA TNT2 Model64/Model 64 Pro`
`02:55.47`	`JeffM2501`	`16 is probably a lot faster for you then`
`02:55.55`	`JeffM2501`	`helps the poor little fillrate card out`
`02:57.28`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03dbrosius * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/commands.cxx: MeBigFatGuy reports that players can't respawn after admin-killed... fixed.`
`02:58.50`	`orange`	`so I'll show you:`
`02:58.54`	`orange`	`~dbrosius++`
`02:58.58`	`orange`	`~mebigfatguy++`
`03:00.09`	`Thumper_`	`is there currently a problem with global login authentication?`
`03:01.22`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`03:02.13`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`hmm?`
`03:02.31`	`Sgeo`	`All I know for sure is that personally, I'm having a problem with input`
`03:03.16`	`Thumper_`	`it works but it takes a long time`
`03:03.58`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (lan56@h-68-167-2-234.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)`
`03:04.03`	`brlcad`	`~memo lan56 it's way past feb 28, the baby seal died from clubbing so maybe your depart message can too now ;)`
`03:05.11`	`Sgeo`	`~memo`
`03:05.18`	`Sgeo`	`~memo Sgeo test`
`03:05.37`	`Sgeo`	`What's ~memo?`
`03:05.45`	`brlcad`	`who knows`
`03:05.47`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`off line messages to registerd users`
`03:06.21`	`brlcad`	`i just made it up/guessed actually -- is that what it's supposed to do? :)`
`03:06.36`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`well, there is memoserv`
`03:06.45`	`brlcad`	`i know there's a command that does something like that.. not sure if it's actually "memo"`
`03:07.07`	`brlcad`	`or i'm just playing ignorant tonight because I'm a little wired`
`03:07.16`	`JeffM2501`	`ibot message for brlcad, you can also say ibot message for....`
`03:07.21`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`brlcad there you go`
`03:07.26`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`should have a message`
`03:07.35`	`Aribeth`	`wired?`
`03:07.50`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`<PROTECTED>`
`03:08.37`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`heh ok`
`03:08.41`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (4 files in 4 dirs): let there be a window`
`03:08.47`	`brlcad`	`ibot has some memo thing too`
`03:08.52`	`brlcad`	`of lesser utility`
`03:09.37`	`brlcad`	`hmm.. we could get the bots to e-mail flood tim now...`
`03:09.46`	`brlcad`	`that would be fun`
`03:10.01`	`DTRemenak`	`hahaha`
`03:10.18`	`blast007`	`sigh....my explorer.exe keeps locking up when I exit bzflag :/`
`03:10.33`	`brlcad`	`blast007: have you tried linux.exe?`
`03:10.37`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`03:10.39`	`JeffM2501`	`firefox.exe`
`03:10.41`	`JeffM2501`	`much better`
`03:10.50`	`Aribeth`	`or just linux?`
`03:10.58`	`JeffM2501`	`./linux`
`03:11.05`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: figured out anything with the Invalid Parameter?`
`03:11.05`	`brlcad`	`Aribeth: a mix of caffeine, wind chill, and good mood`
`03:11.05`	`blast007`	`JeffM2501: explorer.exe, not iexplore.exe :) a.k.a. my GUI`
`03:11.24`	`JeffM2501`	`oh`
`03:11.25`	`JeffM2501`	`2k`
`03:11.27`	`Aribeth`	`brlcad, that works`
`03:11.32`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: could just set emacs to be your shell ;)`
`03:11.33`	`JeffM2501`	`XP.exe`
`03:11.34`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: not yet...'fraid I've never done any DX`
`03:12.26`	`DTRemenak`	`"An invalid parameter was passed to the returning function, or the object was not in a state that permitted the function to be called. This value is equal to the E_INVALIDARG standard COM return value. "`
`03:12.31`	`blast007`	`hmm, list server is down?`
`03:12.49`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`but i'm feeling much better`
`03:13.16`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah it's timing out`
`03:13.29`	`brlcad`	`http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7113`
`03:13.47`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/scene/ (inc/scene.h src/scene.cpp): simple scene manager`
`03:15.37`	`lan56`	`brlcad: that's quite stunning`
`03:16.25`	`DTRemenak`	`I like this line..."Unfortunately, as it turned out, it only started to work a few minutes after its match had ended."`
`03:16.48`	`DTRemenak`	`seems so familiar :)`
`03:17.04`	`brlcad`	`heh`
`03:17.52`	`blast007`	`my client just sits at "Searching", even after letting it go for over a minute`
`03:18.01`	`blast007`	`is it supposed to give up and display the cache eventually?`
`03:21.23`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`vc is reporting stack corruption when exiting`
`03:21.23`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`voidHUDRenderer::drawPlayerScore(const Player* player,`
`03:21.24`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`<PROTECTED>`
`03:21.37`	`*** join/#bzflag Jormungandr (~consus@user-69-1-42-120.knology.net)`
`03:22.55`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`this look bad to me`
`03:22.57`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`<PROTECTED>`
`03:22.57`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`<PROTECTED>`
`03:23.14`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`HudRenderer.cxx line 1600`
`03:23.17`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`someone care to look?`
`03:24.58`	`orange`	`+ char s[5];`
`03:25.00`	`orange`	`+ snprintf(s,sizeof(s),"%3d",player->getId());`
`03:25.08`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03dbrosius * 10bzflag/src/bzflag/HUDRenderer.cxx: fix stack corruption due to too small of an array`
`03:25.23`	`orange`	`that's the method I used when doing a similar patch`
`03:26.32`	`orange`	`(omitting the "+ " of course)`
`03:29.52`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56_ (lan56@h-68-165-21-200.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)`
`03:35.19`	`DTRemenak`	`ahh, bzflag compiles now`
`03:35.22`	`DTRemenak`	`that's always nice`
`03:38.07`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~jeffm@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`03:38.07`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ`
`03:43.03`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak_ (~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-84.caltech.edu)`
`03:56.45`	`*** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@DHCP-170-84.caltech.edu)`
`03:59.40`	`*** join/#bzflag Quol (~QS@modemcable103.129-200-24.mc.videotron.ca)`
`04:02.04`	`DTRemenak`	`that's quite a ponderage`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag learner (~brlcad@brlcad.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag cods (~admin@tuxee.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag retro (~ken@gateway-1237.mvista.com) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag Nidhoggr (mandrake@dragon.org) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag gonkulator (~brandon@c-24-9-235-7.client.comcast.net) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`04:02.08`	`*** join/#bzflag jpa_ (jpa@box.kapsi.fi) [NETSPLIT VICTIM]`
`04:02.08`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+oov learner Nidhoggr Nidhoggr] by irc.freenode.net`
`04:02.29`	`brlcad`	`mmhmm`
`04:02.29`	`DTRemenak`	`be more careful with your pondering next time!`
`04:02.29`	`orange`	`it caused a split personality`
`04:02.39`	`brlcad`	`the 05 mustang gt is sweet`
`04:04.23`	`brlcad`	`of course the ford gt would be a dream sweetness`
`04:04.36`	`brlcad`	`but i could get 2 vipers for that price`
`04:05.56`	`orange`	`or a house`
`04:07.27`	`brlcad`	`they make cars? :)`
`04:07.44`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`heh`
`04:10.07`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`altho doin' donuts in a hurricane, is also picturable`
`04:10.36`	`brlcad`	`a motocycle is under high consideration too`
`04:12.11`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`awww top speed is only 199... couldn't squeeze out one more?`
`04:12.33`	`brlcad`	`i know`
`04:12.44`	`orange`	`200 sounds too made up`
`04:12.53`	`orange`	`approximated`
`04:12.59`	`brlcad`	`300 horses could take it faster than that i think`
`04:13.07`	`brlcad`	`but that'd be a lot of depooing`
`04:13.32`	`DTRemenak`	`hmph, crazy. I have a CD image, that works fine when mounted directly`
`04:13.40`	`DTRemenak`	`If I burn it to a CD, not a single drive I have will read it`
`04:13.54`	`DTRemenak`	`But if I take the CD I burned, and rip the image off of it, the resulting image works`
`04:13.57`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`have you tried a married drive?`
`04:14.41`	`orange`	`DTRemenak: speed issues?`
`04:14.50`	`DTRemenak`	`orange: speed?`
`04:15.03`	`DTRemenak`	`I don't do illegal substances, thanks anyway ;)`
`04:15.05`	`orange`	`well, is it a timing issue, you can read from hd faster`
`04:15.12`	`DTRemenak`	`I don't think so`
`04:15.14`	`DTRemenak`	`might be`
`04:15.42`	`DTRemenak`	`the original disc (that I ripped the image off of in the first place) works in just about everything`
`04:18.14`	`orange`	`copy protection?`
`04:18.19`	`DTRemenak`	`probably`
`04:18.33`	`DTRemenak`	`but that doesn't explain why the images off the cd that doesn't work, work`
`04:18.58`	`brlcad`	`oh sweet, base viper is only 85`
`04:20.38`	`orange`	`could be the program is looking at the drive for certain cd characteristics... doesn't find them on the image files`
`04:21.15`	`*** join/#bzflag Grumbler (~Grumbler@grumbler.bronze.supporter.pdpc)`
`04:32.42`	`SportChick`	`mmmmmmmmmmmmm sushi!`
`04:33.37`	`Aribeth`	`mmmmm......no....no sushi for me.....not a chance`
`04:36.43`	`SportChick`	`Aribeth: hehe`
`04:36.56`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: woah, I got rumble working...now to figure out what fixed it...`
`04:36.57`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: ping`
`04:37.10`	`blast007`	`something with the effect variable`
`04:37.37`	`Aribeth`	`hi SP`
`04:37.53`	`SportChick`	`hiya aribeth`
`04:38.17`	`*** join/#bzflag wegstar (~foo@adsl-67-123-175-134.dsl.sntc01.pacbell.net)`
`04:38.32`	`brlcad`	`SportChick: just want to rub it in, dontcha`
`04:38.55`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: we ate at the same place you all met us for dinner last summer`
`04:39.06`	`SportChick`	`it was yummy - and yes, I felt like a little rubbing`
`04:39.11`	`brlcad`	`:P`
`04:39.42`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: so, what was it you were talking about earlier that you wanted me to try`
`04:40.14`	`SportChick`	`JEEP?! :)`
`04:40.23`	`brlcad`	`jep`
`04:40.25`	`SportChick`	`or a new bicycle?`
`04:40.28`	`*** join/#bzflag MeBigFatGuy (dave@balt-209-150-117-30.dynamic-dial.qis.net)`
`04:40.48`	`brlcad`	`motorcycle is on the menu too`
`04:41.34`	`SportChick`	`BIcycle, not MOTORcycle`
`04:41.47`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: okay okay - get yourself a jeep - they rock!`
`04:42.06`	`SportChick`	`brlcad: and in the meantime, what WHAT WHAT did you want me to try to become free of my jitterbug`
`04:48.04`	`blast007`	`DTRemenak: Found what it was. in DXJoystick.cxx, function ffRumble, it doesn't like effect.cAxes being set to 3. changing it to 2 works (then, of course, removing the 3rd items from DWORD axes and LONG dir)`
`04:53.46`	`jpa_`	`morning sportchick`
`04:53.50`	`jpa_`	`bye SportChick`
`04:53.54`	`SportChick`	`gmorning jpa`
`04:55.36`	`SportChick`	`jpa_: you're leaving?`
`04:57.55`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`sure, why %bshouldn't%b a tank game have a built in calculator?`
`04:58.52`	`purple_cow`	`heh`
`04:59.30`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`altho first i think we should put a spell checker in for the messages you send`
`04:59.41`	`purple_cow`	`he could have at least reused the BZDB expression code :P`
`05:01.13`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`doesn't seem to handle diff eqs... what good is it`
`05:01.40`	`blast007`	`threw a patch for force feedback up on SF:`
`05:01.41`	`blast007`	`http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=1159585&group_id=3248&atid=303248`
`05:01.44`	`brlcad`	`and no polynomial root solving.. pfft`
`05:02.47`	`purple_cow`	`a cursory glance over the code looked like it didn't even handle parentheses?`
`05:03.11`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`he says it does`
`05:05.25`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`can't use variables tho`
`05:06.11`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`kiddie version - "your tank will self destruct unless you enter what 6 * 8 = ?"`
`05:09.09`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`blast007, my mouse fell off the table while testing your patch`
`05:09.19`	`blast007`	`:)`
`05:15.02`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`hmmm perhaps seer should be able to hear everyone's messages (even private)`
`05:16.33`	`bryjen`	`why should /seer/ be able to /hear/ better?`
`05:16.39`	`Grumbler`	`what are you complaining about now mac`
`05:16.42`	`brlcad`	`oh snizzle.. /me finds a new favorite`
`05:16.47`	`orange`	`because messages are typed, not spoken :-)`
`05:17.41`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`thar ya go`
`05:17.47`	`bryjen`	`pffft`
`05:17.59`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`just grumblin'`
`05:18.11`	`Grumbler`	`leave that to the professionals`
`05:18.44`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`:)`
`05:18.56`	`Grumbler`	`like, i want an anti bryjen weapon`
`05:19.09`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`what would it do?`
`05:19.20`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`--the weapon, no the lotus`
`05:19.40`	`bryjen`	`its a spreadsheet, no?`
`05:19.41`	`Grumbler`	`if you have the flag it kills bryjen no matter where he is on the field.....especially if he is sneaking up on you`
`05:20.13`	`Grumbler`	`..and an anti wings flag..... a de-feather-er`
`05:20.13`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`ooo bzflag spreadsheet`
`05:20.42`	`Grumbler`	`scoreboard going crazy again`
`05:25.42`	`DTRemenak`	`blast007: cool. you have commit access, right?`
`05:25.52`	`blast007`	`nope`
`05:26.22`	`DTRemenak`	`no!? hmph.`
`05:26.48`	`Grumbler`	`blast was a little crazy in the old days`
`05:27.00`	`blast007`	`I'm still crazy`
`05:27.02`	`Grumbler`	`a calculator in the HUD?`
`05:33.58`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03dtremenak * 10bzflag/ (ChangeLog src/platform/DXJoystick.cxx): Apply patch 1159585: Fix force feedback support on windows, from blast007`
`05:38.33`	`MeBigFatGuy`	`grumbler... apparently`
`05:40.52`	`brlcad`	`hmmph.. such a hard choice.. lotus, mustang, z4, vette, or bike`
`05:41.53`	`*** join/#bzflag lan56 (lan56@h-68-165-238-22.lsanca54.dynamic.covad.net)`
`05:48.34`	`jpa_`	`SportChick: yes, and i'm back too :)`
`05:50.33`	`jpa_`	`morning`
`05:53.40`	`*** join/#bzflag kyelewis[3] (~kyelewis@kyelewis.user)`
`05:58.43`	`*** join/#bzflag gvdm (~gvdm@210-246-12-226.paradise.net.nz)`
`06:05.04`	`*** join/#bzflag jgrreex (UNIX@c-67-181-51-20.client.comcast.net)`
`06:37.17`	`*** join/#bzflag bzflagwiz (~wiz@12-217-167-129.client.mchsi.com)`
`06:55.35`	`SportChick`	`Nidhoggr: ping`
`06:55.46`	`jpa_`	`hi SportChick`
`06:55.52`	`SportChick`	`hi jpa`
`06:56.04`	`jpa_`	`ibot SportChick++`
`07:00.39`	`jpa_`	`hmph`
`07:01.01`	`jpa_`	`i've been karming people a lot in past few days, and haven't got anything in return`
`07:01.25`	`Pimpinella`	`~jpa++`
`07:01.31`	`jpa_`	`:)`
`07:01.34`	`jpa_`	`ibot Pimpinella++`
`07:02.22`	`Pimpinella`	`~jpa_++`
`07:02.27`	`Pimpinella`	`might fit better`
`07:02.44`	`jpa_`	`:)`
`07:04.21`	`Pimpinella`	`but don't worry, you need to _loose_ al your karme to escape the circle of reincarnation ;)`
`07:05.52`	`jpa_`	`~karma jpa-`
`07:05.52`	`ibot`	`jpa- has karma of -9`
`07:05.56`	`jpa_`	`done that already`
`07:07.25`	`*** join/#bzflag _Manu_ (~jujibo@98.Red-80-36-59.pooles.rima-tde.net)`
`10:15.57`	`*** join/#bzflag ibot (ibot@apt.bot.TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`10:15.57`	`*** topic/#bzflag is http://BZFlag.org/ \|\| http://my.BZFlag.org/bb/ \|\| http://my.BZFlag.org/ \|\| http://cia.navi.cx/stats/project/BZFlag \|\| Shellshock is revived http://shellshock.bzflag.bz \|\| Simple Map Help - http://bzflag.org/wiki/MapMaking \|\| BZFlag 2.0.0 is Released! - Go to http://sf.net/projects/bzflag http://bzflag.org/wiki/Download \|`
`10:15.57`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o ibot] by ChanServ`
`10:27.31`	`*** join/#bzflag \|zongo\| (~zongo@lsn-boi-catv-c120-p061.vtx.ch)`
`10:38.26`	`*** part/#bzflag \|zongo\| (~zongo@lsn-boi-catv-c120-p061.vtx.ch)`
`10:50.06`	`*** join/#bzflag cristi (~cristb@82.137.26.35)`
`10:50.37`	`cristi`	`hi all`
`10:53.19`	`cristi`	`~say <cristi`
`10:53.22`	`ibot`	`<cristi`
`10:53.22`	`cristi`	`;D`
`10:53.25`	`cristi`	`:D`
`11:16.38`	`*** join/#bzflag Sgeo (~Sgeo@ool-182e9882.dyn.optonline.net)`
`13:23.45`	`uidzero`	`~say Get on bzflag.bsdhacker.org`
`13:23.47`	`ibot`	`Get on bzflag.bsdhacker.org`
`13:24.23`	`uidzero`	`~say ~bzfquery bzflag.bsdhacker.org`
`13:24.26`	`ibot`	`~bzfquery bzflag.bsdhacker.org`
`13:31.19`	`Sgeo`	`~say test`
`13:31.21`	`ibot`	`test`
`13:31.38`	`Sgeo`	`~say What if I told it to say something it shouldn't`
`13:31.41`	`ibot`	`What if I told it to say something it shouldn't`
`13:31.53`	`Sgeo`	`~say ~say It won't happen.`
`13:31.56`	`ibot`	`~say It won't happen.`
`13:35.21`	`uidzero`	`Bug in the bot. :\|`
`13:38.59`	`Sgeo`	`That it doesn't loop like crazy?`
`13:48.05`	*** join/#bzflag crko` (jan@crko.user)
`13:49.13`	`Grumbler`	`mornin all`
`13:53.33`	`uidzero`	`hehe :P`
`13:53.57`	`uidzero`	`Sgeo: It would be fun to watch. :)`
`14:00.35`	`brlcad`	`http://www.zdnet.com.au/news/0,39023165,39183867,00.htm`
`14:07.16`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`14:19.58`	`orchid`	`"Oh, and part of it is that I got the machine for free,"`
`14:23.30`	`cods`	`well, if just creating a full Unix kernel from scratch allow to get Mac for free, it's interesting. I will try that.`
`14:23.42`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: are you familiar with the server side networking stuff?`
`14:24.26`	`Pimpi`	`if not, who is?`
`14:25.36`	`*** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.151)`
`14:25.49`	`*** join/#bzflag newbie_dont (~janko@dkk118.neoplus.adsl.tpnet.pl)`
`14:48.52`	`jpa_`	`afternoon people`
`14:49.04`	`brlcad`	`Pimpi: depends specifically which part, but for the most part yes`
`14:49.13`	`_Manu_`	`jpa_, :)`
`14:49.25`	`jpa_`	`ew`
`14:49.31`	`menotume`	`mornin' jpa`
`14:49.33`	`Pimpi`	`i think i have a hint about the occupied slots bug`
`14:49.53`	`jpa_`	`i'm away for like 7 hours and when i come back, every single number in activity list is purple :)`
`14:50.54`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: i saw in logs, that a havily rejoining player made one of those lost slots`
`14:51.23`	`Pimpi`	`he had inbound udp up, but not outbound yet`
`14:51.49`	`brlcad`	`"one of those lost slots"`
`14:51.55`	`_Manu_`	`yep`
`14:52.01`	`brlcad`	`orchid: :)`
`14:52.09`	`Pimpi`	`then i had a new accept from him and no further logs from that slot`
`14:52.10`	`brlcad`	`and he's running linux on it`
`14:52.19`	`jpa_`	`hi brlcad`
`14:52.25`	`jpa_`	`hi menotume`
`14:53.23`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: well, they are lost to us, because nobody is playing on them and nobody can use them`
`14:53.26`	`brlcad`	`Pimpi: sounds like client was modified to not send outbound udp, or (more likely) there was a firewall`
`14:54.13`	`Pimpi`	`the same player tried to rejoin about 10 times before and was aleays rejected because of rejoin time`
`14:54.26`	`Pimpi`	`1-2 times per second`
`14:54.45`	`Pimpi`	`then one time he might have been _too_ fast?`
`14:55.23`	`Pimpi`	`and a half setup connection isn't closed on client side?`
`14:55.30`	`Pimpi`	`any idea how this might happen?`
`14:55.46`	`jpa_`	`hmm.. like if it pinged back, and bzflag answered, but it thought that it was the old connection, instead of he new one?`
`14:55.59`	`*** join/#bzflag ToughShooter (~ts@pD9EA6962.dip.t-dialin.net)`
`14:58.34`	`*** join/#bzflag Fuddl (~fuddl@tittchen.saustall.busn.org)`
`15:00.36`	`Pimpi`	`if the server looks for a matching connection for a MsgUDPLinkRequest it only looks for ip`
`15:01.09`	`Pimpi`	`what if we have 2 connections from an ip?`
`15:05.43`	`*** join/#bzflag stevek (~sgk284@ws50.cs.drexel.edu)`
`15:05.50`	`Nidhoggr`	`hi stevek`
`15:06.12`	`stevek`	`g' morning`
`15:06.40`	`stevek`	`hey jeff did quite a commit, i hope it all works out`
`15:06.59`	`ruskie`	`wtf just happend... connected playing then I drop off... and now can't reconnect...`
`15:07.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`what did he do?`
`15:07.32`	`jpa_`	`hi stevek`
`15:07.44`	`ruskie`	`~bzfquery viper.pimpi.org:5158`
`15:07.44`	`Nidhoggr`	`what is bzflagg3d?`
`15:07.52`	`stevek`	`added a ton to cvs in anticipation of using g3d (http://g3d-cpp.sourceforge.net) for bzflag's engine`
`15:07.55`	`ruskie`	`that could explain it...`
`15:07.59`	`Nidhoggr`	`hrm.`
`15:08.05`	`stevek`	`hey jpa`
`15:08.10`	`Nidhoggr`	`so, he changed his mind about ogre?`
`15:08.29`	`stevek`	`i guess`
`15:08.37`	`stevek`	`g3d seemsto be a good choice`
`15:08.38`	`brlcad`	`Pimpi: firewall can cause that`
`15:08.42`	`brlcad`	`or a modified client`
`15:08.48`	`stevek`	`hey brlcad`
`15:08.57`	`brlcad`	`there's sufficient tcp activity to get the connection established`
`15:08.59`	`Nidhoggr`	`hiya brlcad`
`15:09.03`	`brlcad`	`pings are tcp`
`15:09.05`	`brlcad`	`iirc`
`15:09.10`	`brlcad`	`mornin' Nidhoggr`
`15:09.11`	`Pimpi`	`~bzfquery viper.pimpi.org:5158`
`15:14.18`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: what would be a safe timeout value between inbound and outbound udp up?`
`15:14.23`	`Pimpi`	`1 second?`
`15:14.28`	`Pimpi`	`or 5?`
`15:15.03`	`brlcad`	`timeout should be greater than absolute worst possible unreliable latency`
`15:15.16`	`Pimpi`	`so probably 5`
`15:15.17`	`brlcad`	`1s would be way too low`
`15:15.26`	`brlcad`	`yeah, at least 5 probably`
`15:15.34`	`Grumbler`	`3.6578`
`15:15.41`	`brlcad`	`3.14157`
`15:16.16`	`Pimpi`	`42`
`15:16.36`	`Grumbler`	`base 10 or base 6`
`15:17.13`	`Pimpi`	`;)`
`15:19.40`	`brlcad`	`Pimpi: are the crashes related to the new ban cmd or the slots filling up?`
`15:20.08`	`brlcad`	`a bit curious the crashes correspond to the new cmd provision`
`15:20.48`	`*** join/#bzflag ep (~ep@ip68-97-124-161.ok.ok.cox.net)`
`15:21.02`	`_Manu_`	`reading the code..`
`15:23.27`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: was caused after a ban, so might be related to the ban comd`
`15:23.45`	`_Manu_`	`yes.. it's related :-/`
`15:24.02`	`_Manu_`	`in /nban conversion... fixing..`
`15:24.03`	`Pimpi`	`found it?`
`15:24.29`	`_Manu_`	`yes... a wrong patch..`
`15:27.31`	`orange`	`I'm not sure where this bug comes in, but if one of the groups you are in (as an admin) has hideAdmin permission (to hide the @), then the call to isAdmin() in the HUDRenderer.cxx patch that shows slot ID seem to return false, meaning you don't get to see the slot ID in the HUD.`
`15:28.03`	`_Manu_`	`yes.. because hidden`
`15:28.09`	`_Manu_`	`the client don't know it`
`15:28.24`	`_Manu_`	`if you are hidden.. also hidded for your client ;-P`
`15:28.37`	`_Manu_`	`but can use /playerlist for get the slots numbers`
`15:29.01`	`_Manu_`	`this is not a bug`
`15:29.06`	`orange`	`well, the slot numbers are not a secret, right?`
`15:29.15`	`_Manu_`	`not usefull for non admins`
`15:29.31`	`_Manu_`	`and only making ppl asking what those numbers means`
`15:29.46`	`orange`	`agreed, but just because I'm a hidden admin doesn't mean I shouldn't be able to get them in the scoreboard for convenience`
`15:29.49`	`*** join/#bzflag bz7490 (~d86eef56@webchat.bzflag.bz)`
`15:30.02`	`_Manu_`	`you can with /playerlist`
`15:32.13`	`JBdiGriz`	`brlcad, Pimpi: I noticed that viper died after a poll ban command the other day. I didn't think much of it at the time.`
`15:33.14`	`_Manu_`	`poll bans are disabled..`
`15:33.27`	`_Manu_`	`:)`
`15:34.52`	`ruskie`	`what's wrong wit the server...`
`15:35.12`	`_Manu_`	`a bug..`
`15:35.50`	`_Manu_`	`causing a server crash when banning a player that just left.. but fixing.`
`15:37.09`	`*** join/#bzflag bendy24 (~slb@50.tender.1meg.golden.net)`
`15:39.15`	`bendy24`	`ElectricElf: :P`
`15:39.39`	`Pimpi`	`_Manu_: no, poll bans are enabled again`
`15:40.14`	`_Manu_`	`well.. polls not related to the new code..`
`15:40.58`	`Sgeo`	`I can't use the keyboard in fullscreen mode, and I can't use either the keyboard or the mouse in WIndowed mod`
`15:41.01`	`Sgeo`	`*mode`
`15:41.10`	`Sgeo`	`~say Sgeo rules!`
`15:41.12`	`ibot`	`Sgeo rules!`
`15:41.29`	`Pimpi`	`i can't use the numpad`
`15:41.41`	`Grumbler`	`easy on the energy Sgeo, what OS, SDL enabled?`
`15:41.45`	`jpa_`	`Sgeo: ibot has the ability of lying..`
`15:41.46`	`ruskie`	`<-- simply doesn't use sdl and get's full keyboard support :))`
`15:41.51`	`Sgeo`	`WinXP`
`15:42.22`	`Grumbler`	`standard release, or did you build it yourself`
`15:42.27`	`ruskie`	`really hate it grabbing full keyboard focus in sdl... but I'm thinking it might be usefull`
`15:42.28`	`Sgeo`	`Standard release`
`15:42.42`	`Grumbler`	`2.0 version`
`15:42.43`	`Grumbler`	`?`
`15:42.46`	`Sgeo`	`Yes`
`15:42.58`	`Sgeo`	`THe keyboard works in menues`
`15:43.11`	`Sgeo`	`But not in a game`
`15:43.25`	`Grumbler`	`xp pro, or XP home`
`15:43.30`	`Sgeo`	`XP Home`
`15:43.58`	`Pimpi`	`can i use "int seconds = (TimeKeeper::getCurrent() - someTKobject) to get elapsed time?`
`15:44.27`	`Pimpi`	`no, float, not int of course`
`15:46.27`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jujibo * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/commands.cxx: Fixing adminmessage causing server crash if the banned player left`
`15:46.43`	`Grumbler`	`well, SDL is not enabled in the default release as i remember, so i dont think its an issue there.`
`15:47.28`	`bendy24`	`!google sdl`
`15:47.28`	`guu`	`bendy24: WTF?`
`15:47.34`	`bendy24`	`stupid bot`
`15:47.42`	`Grumbler`	`~google SDL`
`15:48.46`	`Sgeo`	`~wikipedia SDL`
`15:49.15`	`Grumbler`	`sgeo, not sure i can offer much more insight. if you wait 2-3 hours more, some of the more windows knowledgable people usually check in.`
`15:49.27`	`ruskie`	`:))`
`15:50.30`	`Sgeo`	`THis is just great. Screwy DNS service again`
`15:50.43`	`ToughShooter`	`Can bans be done on DNS-resolution of IP-adress?`
`15:50.50`	`Nidhoggr`	`what's up with DNS?`
`15:50.59`	`bendy24`	`Nidhoggr: you broke it`
`15:51.03`	`Nidhoggr`	`ToughShooter: if you compile adns.`
`15:51.08`	`Sgeo`	`Occasionally, I'm unable to resolve Hosts`
`15:51.19`	`ToughShooter`	`I saw these trouble makers from ba-ravensburg.de came back today, so I banned IP-adress-range`
`15:51.31`	`Nidhoggr`	`bendy24: that can be arranged. ;) btw... ltns.`
`15:51.40`	`bendy24`	`ltns?`
`15:51.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`~ltns`
`15:51.48`	`ibot`	`"Long Time No See"`
`15:51.55`	`bendy24`	`ahh :)`
`15:52.00`	`Sgeo`	`~wp`
`15:52.02`	`ibot`	`a word processor is to words as a food processor is to food. Use LaTeX instead!`
`15:52.02`	`bendy24`	`yes, you too`
`15:52.20`	`Sgeo`	`~LaTeX`
`15:52.21`	`ibot`	`latex is probably nice on a woman, but LaTeX (pronounced la tech) is a set of macros for the TeX document formatting system. awesome, or http://directory.google.com/Top/Computers/Software/Typesetting/TeX/LaTeX/, or read The Not-So-Short Guide to LaTeX : http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/info/lshort/english/, or http://www.tex.ac.uk/`
`15:52.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`what's been going on with you, bendy?`
`15:52.39`	`bendy24`	`what do you mean?`
`15:52.46`	`Sgeo`	`~latex`
`15:52.48`	`ibot`	`well, latex is nice on a woman, but LaTeX (pronounced la tech) is a set of macros for the TeX document formatting system. awesome, or http://directory.google.com/Top/Computers/Software/Typesetting/TeX/LaTeX/, or read The Not-So-Short Guide to LaTeX : http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/info/lshort/english/, or http://www.tex.ac.uk/`
`15:52.50`	`Nidhoggr`	`any news?`
`15:52.55`	`bendy24`	`my absence from spirals?`
`15:53.00`	`brlcad`	`Sgeo: ...`
`15:53.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`that, too.`
`15:53.06`	`bendy24`	`i just got tired of the map`
`15:53.14`	`Nidhoggr`	`even the newer map?`
`15:53.20`	`bendy24`	`yeah`
`15:53.23`	`Nidhoggr`	`aaw.`
`15:53.25`	`ToughShooter`	`brlcad: Did you experienced freezes of client with DEVEL-builds?`
`15:53.27`	`Nidhoggr`	`bummer.`
`15:53.37`	`bendy24`	`i tried to send an email to the list i was on`
`15:53.41`	`bendy24`	`but it bounced`
`15:53.46`	`Nidhoggr`	`hrm.`
`15:53.48`	`bendy24`	`was it ever fixed?`
`15:54.02`	`Nidhoggr`	`didn't know it was bouncing. I'll have to test it in a few.`
`15:54.10`	`Nidhoggr`	`did it give an error?`
`15:54.19`	`bendy24`	`that was a while ago`
`15:54.23`	`*** join/#bzflag SportChick (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c5b-b-192.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`15:54.24`	`bendy24`	`i havent tired since`
`15:54.30`	`bendy24`	`i think junker looked into it`
`15:54.54`	`bendy24`	`i think the error was unknown user or soemthing`
`15:55.29`	`bendy24`	`but anyway, i was suggesting some 2.0 map features`
`15:55.29`	`Nidhoggr`	`aaah. you might have sent from an unsubscribed address.`
`15:55.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`hi SportChick`
`15:55.55`	`bendy24`	`i thought i was still subscribed`
`15:55.57`	`ToughShooter`	`brlcad: Client freezes after long time (hours) of playing or watching, running STABLE build fixes it again. A diff between the prefs before running STABLE build gave me no differences. So something in rendering code seems to be wrong now in DEVEL and not it STABLE.`
`15:56.07`	`bendy24`	`SportChick: hi baby`
`15:56.16`	`bendy24`	`;P`
`15:56.29`	`bendy24`	`er i meant ;)`
`15:56.39`	`Nidhoggr`	`I didn't unsubscribe you, so you might have sent it from an address different from the one you subscribed from originally.`
`15:56.42`	`SportChick`	`hi all`
`15:56.53`	`bendy24`	`Nidhoggr: yeah probably`
`15:57.09`	`ToughShooter`	`Nidhoggr: How can DNS-resolution based bans be done on secretplace?`
`15:57.12`	`bendy24`	`i havent recieved anything from that list in months though`
`15:57.16`	`brlcad`	`ToughShooter: I haven't tried the devel version in quite a while so I can't say`
`15:57.42`	`_Manu_`	`ToughShooter, try the latest cvs.. fixed`
`15:57.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`ToughShooter: I already told you. you need to install adns first and make sure you configure with adns when you compile.`
`15:58.33`	`bendy24`	`--with-adns`
`15:58.34`	`ToughShooter`	`Nidhoggr: I was talking about banning on _secreplace_ and the syntax`
`15:58.44`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@198.150.76.4)`
`15:58.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`aaaah. hrm.`
`15:58.57`	`Nidhoggr`	`I thought that was in the text file. hang on.`
`15:59.07`	`ToughShooter`	`I think I catched a player with the name "Jade", too accidently :(`
`15:59.28`	`bendy24`	`silly admins`
`15:59.35`	`bendy24`	`... always banning good people`
`15:59.40`	`bendy24`	`:)`
`15:59.51`	`ToughShooter`	`_Manu_: Was it the change in "HUDRenderer.cxx"?`
`15:59.57`	`Grumbler`	`ban'em, ban'em all`
`16:00.05`	`_Manu_`	`yes..`
`16:00.27`	`bendy24`	`to quote the nid:`
`16:00.36`	`ToughShooter`	`_Manu_: Yes to what?`
`16:00.43`	`bendy24`	`"this is simulated warefare, dont be sissies"`
`16:00.51`	`_Manu_`	`it's fixed in HuDRenderer.cxx`
`16:01.00`	`_Manu_`	`a short index..`
`16:01.07`	`ToughShooter`	`Thanks for clarification`
`16:01.37`	`SportChick`	`bendy=mindbender?`
`16:01.44`	`bendy24`	`yes`
`16:01.52`	`bendy24`	`=das_bender`
`16:01.58`	`bendy24`	`most recently`
`16:03.47`	`Grumbler`	`SportChick< hows the jitter?`
`16:03.57`	`bendy24`	`anyone seen hoon around?`
`16:04.20`	`SportChick`	`Grumbler: I still have it`
`16:04.33`	`SportChick`	`bendy24: hoon is working like a fiend`
`16:04.40`	`bendy24`	`still?`
`16:04.44`	`SportChick`	`he hurt his shoulder a while ago and had surgery`
`16:04.45`	`bendy24`	`sheesh`
`16:04.53`	`bendy24`	`hes going to get burned out`
`16:04.55`	`SportChick`	`AND his gf doesn't play, so....`
`16:05.01`	`bendy24`	`ahhh`
`16:05.06`	`bendy24`	`the real reason comes out`
`16:05.34`	`brlcad`	`Grumbler: the personal +q list? :)`
`16:07.18`	`Grumbler`	`brlcad< the "hunt" list......along with SportChick, vicious, bryjen(two stars), High karate Kitty, Texas Timpson(2 stars), Razzberry, kp, Gerbil(3 stars)`
`16:08.18`	`Grumbler`	`unfortuneately, do to my own slipping skills, the hunt list is getting longer`
`16:08.27`	`bendy24`	`heh`
`16:08.53`	`bendy24`	`yes, timpson must die`
`16:09.17`	`Grumbler`	`...the blasted wings flag is not helping`
`16:10.40`	`bendy24`	`it does mess with your mind`
`16:11.39`	`Grumbler`	`the instanteneous nature of the jump back up is what hurts.......it should lag a little to overcome the momentum of falling`
`16:13.01`	`bendy24`	`whatever happened to the carrying two flags feature?`
`16:13.12`	`bendy24`	`wings + gm`
`16:13.13`	`bendy24`	`:)`
`16:13.40`	`Grumbler`	`the patch is there if you want it`
`16:13.41`	`orange`	`someone is working on such a patch... not two flags, but 'permanent' wings`
`16:14.05`	`bryjen`	`perhaps at that point they should be helicopters and not tanks`
`16:14.14`	`blast007`	`:)`
`16:14.23`	`bendy24`	`i thought i read soemthing about two flags in cvs somewhere...`
`16:14.30`	`Grumbler`	`what and start going for realism`
`16:16.01`	`Sgeo`	`I hope my Colored Flag (CF) was changed to -`
`16:16.12`	`Sgeo`	`It isn't a good flag`
`16:16.15`	`Sgeo`	`(I think)`
`16:16.36`	`Sgeo`	`Unless it serves as a distraction?`
`16:17.39`	`blast007`	`yup`
`16:17.56`	`bryjen`	`wings really changes the game`
`16:18.03`	`Grumbler`	`yup`
`16:18.24`	`blast007`	`that's the main flag I don't like`
`16:18.30`	`jpa_`	`but one does not have to add it`
`16:18.36`	`Sgeo`	`The WinGS flag?`
`16:18.47`	`jpa_`	`and it gives interesting possibilities :)`
`16:19.05`	`bryjen`	`the lack of control in-air was a basic principle. you had to be careful when jumping`
`16:19.05`	`Grumbler`	`i think the implementation needs work`
`16:19.46`	`blast007`	`I hate how they can instantly launch upwards, no matter how fast they are falling...`
`16:19.48`	`bendy24`	`gm helps though`
`16:20.00`	`Grumbler`	`~blast007++`
`16:20.20`	`DTRemenak`	`I for one welcome our new wings-flag overlords`
`16:20.24`	`jpa_`	`blast007: limiting _wingsJumpVelocity helps for that :)`
`16:20.31`	`Grumbler`	`~DTRemenak--`
`16:20.32`	`bryjen`	`hehe @ DTRemenak`
`16:20.54`	`DTRemenak`	`If you don't like it, don't put it on your servers :)`
`16:21.01`	`Grumbler`	`~DTRemenak--`
`16:21.05`	`blast007`	`jpa_: still, as long on the value is positive, they can instantly either stop, or move upwards`
`16:21.12`	`jpa_`	`~DTRemenak++`
`16:21.18`	`Grumbler`	`~blast007++`
`16:21.20`	`DTRemenak`	`Grumbler: I've got karma to burn, and I will stand up for my beliefs! :)`
`16:21.22`	`jpa_`	`blast007: well, true`
`16:21.27`	`bryjen`	`that is a thin arguement, DTRemenak`
`16:21.27`	`bendy24`	`i wish someone would bring back trepan's snowmen map`
`16:21.31`	`jpa_`	`blast007: we could add vertical inertia :)`
`16:21.37`	`jpa_`	`~DTRemenak++`
`16:21.40`	`blast007`	`maybe change it so that instead of an in-air jump, it fires the thrusters and slowly increases they vertical velocity`
`16:21.48`	`Grumbler`	`~jpa_++`
`16:21.49`	`blast007`	`the*`
`16:21.54`	`bryjen`	`half of nobody plays on all but the top few servers. starting your own server doesn't do anything.`
`16:22.06`	`Grumbler`	`~DTRemenak--`
`16:22.10`	`DTRemenak`	`bryjen: now that's a different problem entirely`
`16:22.25`	`DTRemenak`	`and a very real problem`
`16:22.30`	`bryjen`	`yes, but it negates your solution`
`16:22.31`	`Grumbler`	`its a common problem with games like this though`
`16:22.54`	`jpa_`	`and really obvious, if there are players on your server, it is one of the top few servers :)`
`16:23.09`	`bryjen`	`feedback loop`
`16:23.29`	`jpa_`	`but, yes, just putting some random map on does not work anymore`
`16:23.41`	`jpa_`	`we have one ducati, no-one cares about the copies`
`16:25.44`	`orange`	`but popular servers come and go sometimes`
`16:25.59`	`orange`	`they have a run of 6 months or something, then fizzle out`
`16:26.42`	`jpa_`	`yup`
`16:27.05`	`bendy24`	`i found that when you start a server, you have to stay with it and play`
`16:27.12`	`orange`	`it takes a group of maybe 3-4 players determinedly playing on a new server to bring it to life`
`16:27.19`	`orange`	`if it is good, it will get followers`
`16:27.21`	`bendy24`	`even two players generally put you higher on the list`
`16:27.32`	`bendy24`	`usually on the sencond page`
`16:27.46`	`Grumbler`	`or give away free food and drink.....maybe some free dvds, or escorts...`
`16:27.47`	`jpa_`	`even having bzadmin client running puts you higher`
`16:27.55`	`bendy24`	`Grumbler++`
`16:28.04`	`bendy24`	`yep`
`16:28.09`	`jpa_`	`while, http://www.kapsi.fi/~jpa/stuff/bzfs/players-monthly.png`
`16:28.43`	`jpa_`	`i'm not doing much to get the secondary one higher on the list.. and still there are some players there`
`16:29.18`	`*** join/#bzflag RoMy (~none@cs181034245.pp.htv.fi)`
`16:43.22`	`*** join/#bzflag JeffM2501 (~JeffM@Patlabor221.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`16:43.22`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o JeffM2501] by ChanServ`
`17:02.31`	`uidzero`	`As an admin, using bzadmin, how do I "even" thee teams?`
`17:03.27`	`jpa_`	`umm?`
`17:03.28`	`uidzero`	`~bzquery bzflag.bsdhacker.org`
`17:03.42`	`uidzero`	`Uhm`
`17:07.32`	`orchid`	`uidzero: you use the /swaplayer command, swaps the lowest score in one team with the highest in the other`
`17:07.43`	`orchid`	`it hasnt been written yet though :)`
`17:08.29`	`uidzero`	`Oh?`
`17:08.31`	`Grumbler`	`!lart orchid for giving out misleading information`
`17:09.10`	`uidzero`	`haha`
`17:13.58`	`menotume`	`JeffM2501: ping`
`17:14.40`	`Sgeo`	`~lart`
`17:15.18`	`Sgeo`	`~lart Sgeo for being silly`
`17:15.31`	`Sgeo`	`~help`
`17:15.59`	`Sgeo`	`~scramble BZFla`
`17:16.25`	`JeffM2501`	`menotume, pong`
`17:16.36`	`Sgeo`	`Where can I play with the ibot?`
`17:16.41`	`Sgeo`	`~play`
`17:16.42`	`ibot`	`and now, for something completely different`
`17:16.45`	`menotume`	`hi. I am dropping the #guleague channel`
`17:16.48`	`JeffM2501`	`in #botpark`
`17:16.51`	`Sgeo`	`Thanks`
`17:17.06`	`menotume`	`JeffM2501 you can remove guu from it if you wish`
`17:17.14`	`JeffM2501`	`guu part #guleague`
`17:17.15`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: okay`
`17:17.18`	`JeffM2501`	`guu flush`
`17:17.18`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: okay`
`17:17.20`	`menotume`	`thank you`
`17:17.24`	`JeffM2501`	`np`
`17:17.29`	`Sgeo`	`Err... Where's the ibot in that channel?`
`17:17.38`	`JeffM2501`	`they are generaly all bots`
`17:17.55`	`Sgeo`	`But they're different bots`
`17:17.58`	`JeffM2501`	`yes`
`17:18.01`	`Grumbler`	`JeffM2501< you should tell guu to lower the seat lid, or at least turn on the fan after it flushes`
`17:18.05`	`JeffM2501`	`it's a bot testing channel`
`17:18.07`	`*** join/#bzflag RoMy (~none@cs181034245.pp.htv.fi)`
`17:18.11`	`Sgeo`	`n/m`
`17:18.12`	`JeffM2501`	`guu lart Grumbler`
`17:18.20`	`orchid`	`hi RoMy`
`17:18.27`	`RoMy`	`hellos orchid`
`17:18.28`	`Sgeo`	`~lart didn't realise it was purl`
`17:18.43`	`JeffM2501`	`yes ibot is perl`
`17:18.47`	`JeffM2501`	`guu is not`
`17:18.47`	`guu`	`Wish I knew!`
`17:22.31`	`*** join/#bzflag SportyGal (sportygali@67-21-174-30.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`17:24.30`	`JeffM2501`	`wtf... mysql errors on bzbb`
`17:24.45`	`Sgeo`	`~Sgeo`
`17:24.46`	`ibot`	`somebody said sgeo was conceeded`
`17:24.49`	`JeffM2501`	`did nid say anything about hardware or drive problems last night?`
`17:24.53`	`JeffM2501`	`when it went down?`
`17:24.57`	`Sgeo`	`~guu`
`17:24.58`	`ibot`	`from memory, guu is a cute little girl... BAFU, or cool and hip, or way better than me. a bot, or dead`
`17:24.58`	`guu`	`Bugger all, I dunno.`
`17:25.05`	`Nidhoggr`	`just found out we had routing issues last night.`
`17:25.12`	`JeffM2501`	`hmm`
`17:25.15`	`JeffM2501`	`someting is amiss`
`17:25.16`	`Nidhoggr`	`didn't even know about it until this morning.`
`17:25.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`?`
`17:25.23`	`JeffM2501`	`it just deleted an account`
`17:25.24`	`menotume`	`JeffM2501: the leasgue site is ok (same server i think)`
`17:25.27`	`Nidhoggr`	`huh?`
`17:25.33`	`Nidhoggr`	`it, as in what?`
`17:25.36`	`JeffM2501`	`I was changin a rank`
`17:25.43`	`JeffM2501`	`got a mysql error`
`17:25.49`	`JeffM2501`	`and now it says it can't find the guy`
`17:25.54`	`menotume`	`what was the error?`
`17:26.04`	`JeffM2501`	`record ID not found`
`17:26.15`	`JeffM2501`	`gonna run a scan on the db`
`17:26.19`	`menotume`	`someone else deleted is first ?`
`17:26.20`	`Sgeo`	`~ibot`
`17:26.21`	`ibot`	from memory, ibot is a blootbot written in perl run by TimRiker on his server. logs on http://ibot.rikers.org/<chan>/ , ibot, jbot, apt are all the same process. It uses sqlite, but mysql or other SQL storage is also supported. a bigot, or the man, or a girl, or ``a filthy scum bag''
`17:26.30`	`JeffM2501`	`noone else shoudl be deleting them`
`17:26.38`	`JeffM2501`	`I wasn't trying to delete it`
`17:26.50`	`JeffM2501`	`Sgeo, please pay with the bot in a /msg or in botpart`
`17:26.51`	`menotume`	`hmmm`
`17:26.54`	`JeffM2501`	`not in this channel`
`17:27.14`	`JeffM2501`	`anyone know how to get ahold of call of honor ?`
`17:27.27`	`Thumper_`	`JeffM2501: do you know what data type the _wingsJumpCount variable is stored in?`
`17:27.33`	`menotume`	`buy it ?`
`17:27.51`	`Nidhoggr`	`when did it happen, JeffM2501 ?`
`17:27.57`	`JeffM2501`	`Thumper_, it's a db var`
`17:28.00`	`JeffM2501`	`Nidhoggr, like right now`
`17:28.45`	`Nidhoggr`	`what was error?`
`17:28.54`	`Thumper_`	`JeffM2501: it's a number... looking for max possible size - setting it REALLY big seems to = 0`
`17:28.55`	`JeffM2501`	`don't recall the exact number`
`17:29.00`	`Nidhoggr`	`I don't see any error in errorlog`
`17:29.06`	`JeffM2501`	`Thumper_, it's stored as a string`
`17:29.10`	*** join/#bzflag blast007` (~blast007@198.150.76.4)
`17:29.15`	`JeffM2501`	`but it's probalby evealed as an int`
`17:29.18`	`Nidhoggr`	`what was user?`
`17:29.19`	`menotume`	`record ID not found probably wouldn't be an error`
`17:29.20`	`JeffM2501`	`so 2 billion`
`17:29.23`	`JeffM2501`	`call of honor`
`17:29.38`	`Thumper_`	`JeffM2501: ok thx.`
`17:30.10`	`JeffM2501`	`sending him mail now.`
`17:36.15`	`menotume`	`JeffM2501: call of honor is in the database (id 1901)`
`17:36.21`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah I readded him`
`17:36.24`	`JeffM2501`	`his old ID was 1528`
`17:36.26`	`menotume`	`ahhh`
`17:36.27`	`menotume`	`:)`
`17:36.28`	`JeffM2501`	`trying to fix him`
`17:36.36`	`menotume`	`okies, i'll stay out`
`17:36.40`	`JeffM2501`	`maybe I accedently deleted him when trying to fix his rank`
`17:36.42`	`JeffM2501`	`that would suck :(`
`17:36.53`	`menotume`	`hmmm - do we have backups ?`
`17:37.32`	`jpa_`	`backups are for losers`
`17:37.45`	`jpa_`	`real hackers do not make mistakes`
`17:37.47`	`menotume`	`jpa_: :D`
`17:37.52`	`menotume`	`lol`
`17:38.09`	`menotume`	`or, they fix things the hard way b4 any1 finds out`
`17:38.20`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh I can fix it`
`17:38.38`	`JeffM2501`	`all I have to do is set his new ID to his old one`
`17:38.50`	`JeffM2501`	`and tell him his password needs to be reset`
`17:39.31`	`jpa_`	`no, we shall hack the system to log the password he tries to log on with and set it to that`
`17:39.38`	`JeffM2501`	`umm`
`17:39.39`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`17:39.43`	`jpa_`	`:(`
`17:39.47`	`menotume`	`hmmm, how places point to his ID ?`
`17:39.53`	`menotume`	`how many`
`17:39.54`	`JeffM2501`	`I think 1`
`17:40.00`	`JeffM2501`	`and all his posts`
`17:40.08`	`JeffM2501`	`so If I make his new user have his old ID`
`17:40.19`	`JeffM2501`	`all his old posts shoudl point to his new record and be ok`
`17:41.15`	`menotume`	`hmmm, user_id is not an auto_increment`
`17:41.31`	`[dmp]`	`hi menotume`
`17:41.41`	`menotume`	`hellos Mr. [dmp]`
`17:41.51`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah so I should be able to fix it`
`17:41.56`	`Sgeo`	`[dmp]?`
`17:42.05`	`[dmp]`	`Sgeo: yes?`
`17:42.27`	`menotume`	`JeffM2501: probably yes, but I wonder how new ids are allocated`
`17:42.34`	`menotume`	`do you know these tables well ?`
`17:43.22`	`JeffM2501`	`I've done some stuff in em`
`17:43.27`	`JeffM2501`	`IIRC it has a "last ID"`
`17:43.30`	`JeffM2501`	`that it uses`
`17:43.36`	`JeffM2501`	`since it has to handle gaps`
`17:44.39`	`menotume`	`okies`
`18:01.21`	`*** join/#bzflag stevek (~sgk284@ws46.cs.drexel.edu)`
`18:05.18`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`18:07.31`	`Grumbler`	`bryjen , blast007 --> BZDB_WINGSSLIDETIME`
`18:08.21`	`blast007`	`think that just affects horizonal motion, giving them momentum`
`18:08.40`	`*** join/#bzflag crko (~jan@cmb27-47.dial-up.arnes.si)`
`18:09.03`	`blast007`	`I don't really mind the in-air driving/turning...it's the jumping I don't care for`
`18:09.43`	`stevek`	`~JeffM2501++`
`18:09.46`	`Grumbler`	`is it just horizontal...`
`18:09.53`	`JeffM2501`	`what'd I do now?`
`18:10.02`	`stevek`	`heh g3d :)`
`18:10.02`	`JeffM2501`	`heck I shoudl probably get a --`
`18:10.03`	`Grumbler`	`if so, yeah, we need a vertical equivalent`
`18:10.48`	`stevek`	`JeffM2501, for adding g3d to cvs, hopefully it goes somewhere`
`18:10.56`	`JeffM2501`	`ahh`
`18:10.59`	`JeffM2501`	`well maybe it will`
`18:11.04`	`JeffM2501`	`I'll give it a go`
`18:11.11`	`blast007`	`Grumbler: I would rather see a "thruster" type effect, that increased their vertical velocity, and then instead of how many "jumps" they get, it's how many seconds of thrust they can use`
`18:11.27`	`*** join/#bzflag \|zongo\| (~zongo@lsn-boi-catv-c120-p061.vtx.ch)`
`18:11.41`	`stevek`	`itd be interesting to through in a physics engine too eventually (i.e. http://www.ode.org/)`
`18:11.42`	`blast007`	`course that would have to wait, as it changes gameplay`
`18:11.44`	`Grumbler`	`i could go either way.....so if you needed a quicker escape you could use up more jumps`
`18:11.48`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`18:11.49`	`stevek`	`its save trepan some trouble :)`
`18:12.02`	`JeffM2501`	`the plan is to have a "world" class that does all that`
`18:12.06`	`stevek`	`s/throughthrow`
`18:12.08`	`JeffM2501`	`and can use like ODE or coldet`
`18:12.10`	`stevek`	`err you get the idea:)`
`18:12.23`	`stevek`	`sounds good`
`18:13.01`	`JeffM2501`	`probalby even just an abstract colison system that can have any backend`
`18:15.02`	`*** join/#bzflag sgk284 (~sgk284@ws80.cs.drexel.edu)`
`18:15.32`	`sgk284`	`ugh... someone just kicked out the plug to my 'puter :/`
`18:15.45`	`sgk284`	`err i mean...`
`18:15.59`	`sgk284`	`kill is such a violent word`
`18:16.02`	`sgk284`	`~kill`
`18:16.31`	`jpa_`	`killing is ok`
`18:16.40`	`jpa_`	`as long as i'm not the object`
`18:16.50`	`sgk284`	`hehe`
`18:19.44`	`sgk284`	`about time he quit`
`18:20.14`	`jpa_`	`how can you speak about yourself as "he"`
`18:21.31`	`sgk284`	`i dont like to talk about him much`
`18:21.50`	`sgk284`	`(he gets angry at me)`
`18:21.55`	`jpa_`	`is he an idiot?`
`18:22.23`	`sgk284`	`some would argue yes`
`18:22.57`	`jpa_`	`i know that he is`
`18:23.06`	`jpa_`	`he uses aol, too :D`
`18:23.12`	`sgk284`	`haha`
`18:23.15`	`sgk284`	`;)`
`18:23.24`	`sgk284`	`keep that between the 3 of us`
`18:23.45`	`Grumbler`	`when is bzflag going to branch`
`18:24.36`	`sgk284`	`i believe tim doesnt want to yet for fear that people will stop working on 2.0`
`18:24.56`	`JeffM2501`	`he dosn't want to have to make changes in 2 places.`
`18:25.15`	`jpa_`	`and 2.0 still has bugs`
`18:25.17`	`JeffM2501`	`so he hasn't made a 2.0.x maintance branch yet`
`18:26.15`	`Grumbler`	`bummer`
`18:29.36`	`menotume`	`would be nice to fix a few kinda nasty bugs first`
`18:36.01`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/readme: remove evil indexed arrays`
`18:36.11`	`jpa_`	`;D`
`18:37.15`	`jpa_`	`and remove the objects and focus on mesh support`
`18:38.05`	`blast007`	`hehe`
`18:38.14`	`JeffM2501`	`meshes are objects`
`18:38.27`	`*** join/#bzflag Sgeo (~Sgeo@ool-182e9882.dyn.optonline.net)`
`18:40.24`	`*** join/#bzflag Fuddl (~fuddl@tittchen.saustall.busn.org)`
`18:40.41`	`*** join/#bzflag Birdie (~birdie@d54C34D0B.access.telenet.be)`
`18:52.58`	`cods`	`what's BZFlagG3D ?`
`18:53.20`	`cods`	`I tried google and bzflag wiki, but not bzbb however`
`18:53.28`	`jpa_`	`something to use g3d.sf.net with bzflag`
`18:53.59`	`jpa_`	`http://g3d-cpp.sourceforge.net/ that is`
`18:54.08`	`JeffM2501`	`rad the readme :)`
`18:54.13`	`JeffM2501`	`read even :)`
`18:56.25`	`cods`	`not a little project :)`
`18:57.13`	`JeffM2501`	`nope`
`18:57.25`	`*** join/#bzflag TheRedBaron (~d8ada652@rw08.de)`
`18:57.39`	`cods`	`an interesting thing would be to be able to script game mode (not sure if it's planned according to your list in the readme) So that rabbit mode, CTF,.. are just script allowing to create easily new mode.`
`18:58.01`	`JeffM2501`	`each mode is a class the code`
`18:58.06`	`JeffM2501`	`so yes it's easy to add a new mode`
`18:58.13`	`JeffM2501`	`kinda like a plugin`
`18:59.16`	`*** join/#bzflag sgk284 (~sgk284@ws46.cs.drexel.edu)`
`18:59.35`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007_ (~blast@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`18:59.59`	`	`hm :)`
`19:00.06`	`	`how about this? :)`
`19:01.07`	`cods`	`JeffM2501: interesting`
`19:01.26`	`JeffM2501`	`you could even eventualy expose that class thru something like python`
`19:02.07`	`cods`	`heh, that would be perfect :)`
`19:02.13`	`*** join/#bzflag stevek (~sgk284@ws46.cs.drexel.edu)`
`19:02.44`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm not concerned with the python part right now, but I want to make the design able to handle it later.`
`19:03.23`	`stevek`	`err i just came in, but that wouldnt by any chance reference python being embedded in bzflag, would it?`
`19:03.31`	`bryjen`	`oh noes, then the munchkins' would go from "help me make a map" to "help me make a game mode" ;)`
`19:03.41`	`JeffM2501`	`that they would`
`19:03.55`	`ruskie`	`uuuggghhhh python...`
`19:04.08`	`stevek`	`ruskie! python is awesome`
`19:04.10`	`JeffM2501`	`or any other embedable scriping language`
`19:04.10`	`bryjen`	`or does that fall under the "No, we will not help you make your stupid game" rule?`
`19:04.15`	`ruskie`	`stevek, try ruby...`
`19:04.21`	`JeffM2501`	`bryjen, yes.. yes it does.`
`19:04.21`	`stevek`	`i have`
`19:04.28`	`stevek`	`not half as good :)`
`19:04.37`	`ruskie`	`stevek, compared to ruby python is a dinosaur...`
`19:04.39`	`stevek`	`although i prefer perl ofver python i think.. its a close call`
`19:04.45`	`bryjen`	`s/thay/that`
`19:04.55`	`JeffM2501`	`from cell`
`19:04.59`	`ruskie`	`but anyways.... I do plenty of bash scripts.... so I enjoy all my scripting with bash and stuff...`
`19:05.01`	`JeffM2501`	`his sheep killing game`
`19:05.01`	`stevek`	`ruskie, thats like saying C++ is extinct then`
`19:05.10`	`ruskie`	`stevek, it mostly is...`
`19:05.24`	`stevek`	`and now you've shown your ignorance`
`19:05.26`	`ruskie`	`not even a 10th of my system has an c++ code..`
`19:05.27`	`JeffM2501`	`except for all those OSs and Apps made in it :)`
`19:05.27`	`Thumper_`	`this isn't the place for a language flame-war`
`19:05.37`	`ruskie`	`yeah...`
`19:05.56`	`stevek`	`true but anyone who thinks c++ is extinct should be enlightened :)`
`19:05.57`	`ruskie`	`stevek, only reason python is not yet extinct is cause all those gentoo kiddies use it...`
`19:06.04`	`stevek`	`ruskie, enough`
`19:06.11`	`ruskie`	`rotlf`
`19:06.17`	`ruskie`	`enlightend and c++ don't go togheter`
`19:06.21`	`JeffM2501`	`dude you don't want python, then fine, hook up what ever language you want.`
`19:06.22`	`ruskie`	`enlightenment only uses C :))`
`19:06.27`	`ruskie`	`:))`
`19:06.27`	`stevek`	`ruskie, not here`
`19:06.34`	`JeffM2501`	`C is a subset of C++`
`19:06.48`	`stevek`	`take it to a pm if my choice of languages matters that much to you`
`19:06.50`	`JeffM2501`	`but yeah go to #lamelanguagflames if you want to confinue`
`19:07.11`	`ruskie`	`<-- goes to do something else.... got bored of lame base campers and am not in the mood for a flame war...`
`19:08.01`	`stevek`	`anyway... python is a good choice, i think there is a boost library that would help make it easier`
`19:08.02`	`JeffM2501`	`me`
`19:08.17`	`Birdie`	`can you make him join to #guleague again?`
`19:08.19`	`Birdie`	`her*`
`19:08.20`	`JeffM2501`	`there are many langs that could be imbeded, it woudln't even have to be liminted to one.`
`19:08.34`	`JeffM2501`	`Birdie, I was just told the channel was closed`
`19:08.40`	`Birdie`	`closed?`
`19:08.43`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`19:08.46`	`JeffM2501`	`aka done with`
`19:08.49`	`JeffM2501`	`no more`
`19:08.51`	`JeffM2501`	`poof`
`19:08.55`	`JeffM2501`	`asploded`
`19:09.02`	`Birdie`	`ah`
`19:09.04`	`TheRedBaron`	`hmmm who told you that jeff?`
`19:09.09`	`bryjen`	`ah, http://my.bzflag.org/bb/viewtopic.php?t=891 , almost to the bottom`
`19:09.15`	`JeffM2501`	`menotume`
`19:09.20`	`Birdie`	`:(`
`19:09.54`	`jpa_`	`i want to sleep`
`19:09.57`	`jpa_`	`i need sleep`
`19:10.02`	`jpa_`	`i'm tired :/`
`19:10.56`	`stevek`	`go to sleep then`
`19:10.58`	`stevek`	`:)`
`19:11.00`	`orchid`	`dvpijpp`
`19:11.10`	`stevek`	`~rot13 dvpijpp`
`19:11.10`	`ibot`	`qicvwcc`
`19:11.13`	`jpa_`	`but it is only 21:12.. i can't go sleep this early`
`19:11.19`	`stevek`	`thought i was on to something ;)`
`19:11.27`	`orchid`	`heh, oops`
`19:11.54`	`stevek`	`21:12? you crazy finns`
`19:11.57`	`stevek`	`;)`
`19:12.05`	`jpa_`	`crazy? why?`
`19:12.14`	`jpa_`	`yes, but why? :)`
`19:12.26`	`stevek`	`in Americaland, that would be 9:21 PM`
`19:12.44`	`stevek`	`and the military is on a 24 hour clock`
`19:12.44`	`Sgeo`	`Where do I play w/ botas`
`19:12.48`	`Sgeo`	`bots`
`19:12.52`	`stevek`	`botpark`
`19:12.56`	`Sgeo`	`Thankies`
`19:13.00`	`stevek`	`sure`
`19:13.01`	`JeffM2501`	`like we told you last time`
`19:13.04`	`stevek`	`lol`
`19:13.06`	`Sgeo`	`I forgot`
`19:14.14`	`jpa_`	`have.. to.. sleep...`
`19:14.30`	`jpa_`	`gnight stevewhousesaolk`
`19:14.51`	`Pimpi`	`orange: ping`
`19:15.27`	`jpa_`	`(I got spam from you, btw, 2 Mar 2 Steve (3688) ***SPAM*** Vi-agr-a! New lower price!)`
`19:15.29`	`stevek`	`g night jpa`
`19:15.41`	`stevek`	`oops sorry ;)`
`19:15.41`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`19:15.47`	`blast007`	`:)`
`19:15.50`	`stevek`	`i was just trying to help`
`19:15.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`hahahahahahaaha`
`19:16.07`	`stevek`	`hehe`
`19:16.11`	`jpa_`	`:(`
`19:16.14`	`stevek`	`how goes it Nidhoggr?`
`19:16.24`	`stevek`	`jpa_ go to sleep, it'll be all better in the morning`
`19:16.28`	`Nidhoggr`	`just got back from lunch. chili and corn bread.`
`19:16.40`	`Nidhoggr`	`so I'm feeling well.`
`19:16.44`	`stevek`	`good to hear:)`
`19:16.44`	`Birdie`	`hm chili`
`19:16.56`	`jpa_`	`i'm feeling bad. now that even stevek knows about my money problems :S`
`19:17.50`	`stevek`	`heh i didnt think the money was the problem ;)`
`19:18.08`	`stevek`	`~sgk284--`
`19:18.16`	`jpa_`	`~sgk284++`
`19:18.24`	`TheRedBaron`	`figures, like likes like.`
`19:18.24`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jujibo * 10bzflag/src/bzfs/commands.cxx: Fixing servers hangs because overflow, when sending very long messages`
`19:18.30`	`stevek`	`~karma sgk284`
`19:18.30`	`ibot`	`sgk284 has karma of 45`
`19:18.35`	`stevek`	`~karma stevek`
`19:18.35`	`ibot`	`stevek has karma of 3`
`19:18.44`	`Noodle-sensei`	`jpa_ must really like me`
`19:18.48`	`stevek`	`haha`
`19:18.55`	`jpa_`	`no`
`19:18.59`	`Noodle-sensei`	`i'm much more evil than stevek`
`19:19.02`	`jpa_`	`noodles are nice and taste good`
`19:19.06`	`jpa_`	`they're not evil`
`19:19.18`	`Noodle-sensei`	`jpa_: noodles are nice and taste good, yes`
`19:19.22`	`stevek`	`i'm only evil when i'm in stevek mode, in sgk284 mode jpa hates me`
`19:19.23`	`Noodle-sensei`	`but so are jpa_'s`
`19:19.28`	`TheRedBaron`	`dang, you guys are always in this mood when i forget my flame proof undies...`
`19:19.32`	`jpa_`	`:S`
`19:19.37`	`Noodle-sensei`	`jpa_'s are good with ketchup`
`19:19.47`	`jpa_`	`no`
`19:19.47`	`stevek`	`what?!`
`19:19.51`	`jpa_`	`with chili`
`19:19.51`	`jpa_`	`no kethcup`
`19:20.35`	`stevek`	`jpa, go to sleep`
`19:20.36`	`jpa_`	`mmmmm.. tastes like nutella`
`19:20.37`	`stevek`	`:)`
`19:20.43`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/client/ (7 files in 3 dirs): add menu and game applet classes`
`19:20.58`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh just go get a room`
`19:21.07`	`Noodle-sensei`	`we won't need a room`
`19:21.15`	`Noodle-sensei`	`he'll die from blood loss soon`
`19:21.29`	`JeffM2501`	`call it what you want`
`19:21.32`	`Pimpi`	`orange: i might have found a fix for the messed up server counts`
`19:21.34`	`stevek`	`so JeffM2501, all this will be fully functional by this evening right? and we can dump the legacy code by tomorrow so by friday everything will be g3d?`
`19:21.45`	`stevek`	`;)`
`19:21.53`	`JeffM2501`	`sure`
`19:21.57`	`stevek`	`haha`
`19:22.03`	`JeffM2501`	`if you like black screens`
`19:22.07`	`stevek`	`:)`
`19:22.08`	`JeffM2501`	`Noodle-sensei, I had it replaced`
`19:22.13`	`JeffM2501`	`it's now posotronic`
`19:22.41`	`Noodle-sensei`	`ugh, positronic brains give me indigestion`
`19:23.06`	`jpa_`	`ok.. i'm going to sleep now`
`19:23.20`	`Sgeo`	`back all`
`19:23.34`	`jpa_`	`stevek: don't let them eat all of your toes.. save some for me`
`19:25.18`	`TheRedBaron`	`JeffM2501: did you write the FAQ at the forum?`
`19:25.36`	`JeffM2501`	`the FAQ post`
`19:25.36`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`19:26.06`	`TheRedBaron`	`I keep reading them for the humor...`
`19:27.09`	`TheRedBaron`	`You've got a dam good sense of humor.`
`19:27.22`	`JeffM2501`	`but I was beting totaly serious there`
`19:28.30`	`TheRedBaron`	`aggreed,`
`19:28.32`	`TheRedBaron`	`Q) You can't spell can you?`
`19:28.32`	`TheRedBaron`	`A) Nope, thanks for pointing it out.`
`19:28.45`	`JeffM2501`	`see`
`19:29.43`	`TheRedBaron`	`reminds me of these FAQ, but not so random or corny...`
`19:29.44`	`TheRedBaron`	`http://www.redvsblue.com/faq/`
`19:30.06`	`JeffM2501`	`never said I was origonal`
`19:31.07`	`TheRedBaron`	`never said you had to be...`
`19:31.26`	`bryjen`	`JeffM2501: the image link in your bzbb sig is broken`
`19:31.30`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`19:31.34`	`JeffM2501`	`httpd is off at home`
`19:32.40`	`JeffM2501`	`it often sucks up too much bandwith when I'm playing WoW`
`19:37.25`	`Grumbler`	`~WoW`
`19:37.26`	`ibot`	`i guess wow is a word begging with a 'w', then an 'o'. It ends with a 'w'. This means that it is reversible. It is a useful word for situations in which you wish to imply a feeling of general wow-ness. Best used in brackets following some other statement, like this: Debian is the best linux distro (wow). Also combine with exclamation marks for added wow-ity ...`
`19:37.38`	`JeffM2501`	`guu google wow`
`19:37.39`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: Buy me dinner first.`
`19:37.50`	`JeffM2501`	`okeydokey`
`19:37.56`	`JeffM2501`	`World of Warcraft`
`19:37.58`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`19:38.12`	`JeffM2501`	`gotta love guu`
`19:38.12`	`guu`	`I don't have a clue!`
`19:38.20`	`Nidhoggr`	`of course not`
`19:38.21`	`Nidhoggr`	`;)`
`19:38.27`	`Thumper_`	`guu is blonde?`
`19:38.31`	`Thumper_`	`:D`
`19:38.33`	`JeffM2501`	`ask her`
`19:38.42`	`Thumper_`	`isn't it obvious?`
`19:38.47`	`JeffM2501`	`she knows an awefull lot of chinese tho`
`19:38.49`	`Thumper_`	`since she doesn't have a clue`
`19:38.50`	`Birdie`	`what picuture did you looked at while giving her things like, how she looks etc`
`19:38.55`	`JeffM2501`	`I think she just likes messing with people.`
`19:39.00`	`Thumper_`	`hmm a chinese blonde...`
`19:39.09`	`Birdie`	`the dream of every man`
`19:39.11`	`JeffM2501`	`guu do a little dance`
`19:39.11`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: I'm sorry, I was listening to AirSupply.`
`19:39.22`	`JeffM2501`	`guu do a little dance for real this time`
`19:39.23`	`guu`	`JeffM2501: I'm sorry, I was listening to this tiny violin.`
`19:39.29`	`JeffM2501`	`she's very musical`
`19:40.08`	`stevek`	`guu do a little dance`
`19:40.08`	`guu`	`stevek: Buy me dinner first.`
`19:40.18`	`stevek`	`typical woman`
`19:40.25`	`JeffM2501`	`I think shes hungry`
`19:41.04`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007_ (~blast@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`19:41.46`	`JeffM2501`	`I know I am`
`19:42.41`	`bryjen`	`guu: botsnack`
`19:42.42`	`guu`	`No thanks`
`19:42.55`	`JeffM2501`	`he's not an animal`
`19:43.07`	`bryjen`	`takes more than a big of chips to impress guu`
`19:43.08`	`guu`	`Wish I knew, bryjen.`
`19:43.18`	`bryjen`	`s/big/bag/`
`19:44.28`	`bryjen`	`Hmm`
`19:44.41`	`JeffM2501`	`are you saying guu is fat?`
`19:44.48`	`Pimpi`	`does TimeKeeper::getCurrent() take much time?`
`19:45.02`	`Tupone`	`depends`
`19:45.31`	`Pimpi`	`e.g. calling it in every server main loop once for every player?`
`19:45.32`	`Tupone`	`is a system call on some`
`19:46.19`	`stevek`	`pimpi a quick profiling would let you know`
`19:46.25`	`Tupone`	`I won't call it, I'd just call that once and then use getTick`
`19:46.45`	`Pimpi`	`ic`
`19:47.01`	`orchid`	`!lart stevek and Thumper_`
`19:47.01`	`Tupone`	`stevek: his profiling could be very different from mine, if that is for a patch to go public`
`19:47.51`	`stevek`	`true, but generally speaking profling isnt a bad thing :)`
`19:47.55`	`stevek`	`orchid, whatd i do? :)`
`19:47.56`	`Pimpi`	`it doesn't slow the server noticable down, nor does it take more cpu than before, just wondering`
`19:48.23`	`Tupone`	`I removed that from the client, to get only one time of reference`
`19:48.35`	`orchid`	`stevek: "typical women"? :)`
`19:48.44`	`stevek`	`oh hehe :)`
`19:48.48`	`stevek`	`the truth hurts`
`19:48.56`	`Pimpi`	`but i'll look at getTick`
`19:49.04`	`orchid`	`somebody op me`
`19:49.06`	`JeffM2501`	`only because your about to be smacked in the head`
`19:49.09`	`TheRedBaron`	`stevek, you're confused...`
`19:49.11`	`stevek`	`haha`
`19:49.12`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o orchid] by JeffM2501`
`19:49.18`	`stevek`	`~orchid++`
`19:49.18`	`*** kick/#bzflag [stevek!orchid@orchid.user] by orchid (orchid)`
`19:49.25`	`*** join/#bzflag stevek (~sgk284@ws46.cs.drexel.edu)`
`19:49.27`	`stevek`	`:(`
`19:49.33`	`TheRedBaron`	`stevek, no typical women says "buy me lunch"`
`19:49.38`	`*** mode/#bzflag [-o orchid] by orchid`
`19:49.42`	`TheRedBaron`	`that's dreaming too small...`
`19:50.05`	`JeffM2501`	`some say "where shoudl we go to eat?" and that can mean the same thing`
`19:51.01`	`stevek`	`yea usually its some kind of an like dinner,house,car,perfume,jewelry,etc...`
`19:51.06`	`stevek`	`list*`
`19:51.16`	`orchid`	`heh`
`19:51.23`	`JeffM2501`	`no I think it's because they are hungry`
`19:51.27`	`*** join/#bzflag Birdie (~birdie@d54C34D0B.access.telenet.be)`
`19:51.28`	`JeffM2501`	`and they think you are too`
`19:51.37`	`TheRedBaron`	`it would be a typical man thing to say "buy me lunch"`
`19:51.59`	`orchid`	`hi Birdie`
`19:52.03`	`JeffM2501`	`no we say "FEED ME"`
`19:52.12`	`Birdie`	`hi orchid, nice to see you`
`19:53.02`	`Grumbler`	`ug, people with the sterotypes again...`
`19:53.06`	`stevek`	`okay well thats enough gender bashing for one day... off to fail another midterm`
`19:53.46`	`TheRedBaron`	`Grumbler, oh come on, you're unique, just like everyone else...`
`19:54.35`	`Grumbler`	`...suicide blonde...`
`19:58.44`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (data/logo.png misc/art/logo.psd): bad bad logo`
`19:59.50`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/3d/ (inc/drawlist.h src/drawlist.cpp): material sorting class`
`20:12.04`	`*** part/#bzflag trepan_away (~trepan@trepan.user)`
`20:22.47`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@ACCB2A23.ipt.aol.com)`
`20:30.20`	`*** join/#bzflag Ronny (~birdie@d54C34D0B.access.telenet.be)`
`20:30.23`	`Ronny`	`how to ghost some one?`
`20:30.37`	`Grumbler`	`<PROTECTED>`
`20:30.44`	`Ronny`	`thx`
`20:30.56`	`Grumbler`	`unless you are talkign about bzflag client`
`20:31.01`	`Ronny`	`no no irc`
`20:31.11`	`*** join/#bzflag crko (jan@cmb27-47.dial-up.arnes.si)`
`20:31.36`	`Ronny`	`(meaned with that: irc)`
`20:32.09`	`Grumbler`	`gotcha, the ghost help should ....well, help`
`20:32.10`	`Ronny`	`says: password incorrect when i do what you said`
`20:32.24`	`brlcad`	`help ghost, not ghost help`
`20:32.30`	`Ronny`	`ah`
`20:32.45`	`Grumbler`	`that'll teach you to listen to me`
`20:33.43`	`brlcad`	`unless your username is help and your password is empty :)`
`20:34.15`	`Grumbler`	`well, yeah, thats what i was thinking....yeah, thats the ticket.`
`20:35.06`	`Ronny`	`i'm registered`
`20:35.16`	`Ronny`	`(with other nick)`
`20:35.35`	`Tupone`	`hey brlcad :)`
`20:36.07`	`brlcad`	`howdy`
`20:36.30`	`Grumbler`	`<PROTECTED>`
`20:36.57`	`Birdie`	`nthx:)`
`20:37.02`	`Birdie`	`how did you know who i was..`
`20:37.14`	`Grumbler`	`Ronny (~birdie@d54C34D0B.access.telenet.be) has joined #bzflag`
`20:37.22`	`bendy24`	`puwhahaha`
`20:37.24`	`Birdie`	`hehe`
`20:37.33`	`brlcad`	`<PROTECTED>`
`20:37.35`	`brlcad`	`~ww`
`20:37.36`	`ibot`	`Was the window wrong or are you wrong?`
`20:37.51`	`brlcad`	`;)`
`20:38.18`	`Grumbler`	`hey, dont be giving my password away`
`20:39.05`	`orange`	`what does this mean "too many incorrect password attempts -- account locked, contact an admin in #freenode for assistance"`
`20:39.29`	`*** join/#bzflag rabbit25 (~rabbit25@pcp03852369pcs.martnz01.ga.comcast.net)`
`20:39.33`	`rabbit25`	`hi`
`20:40.40`	`TheRedBaron`	`ho`
`20:41.01`	`rabbit25`	`?`
`20:41.01`	`Grumbler`	`he`
`20:41.12`	`rabbit25`	`lol`
`20:41.37`	`TheRedBaron`	`and off to work I go...`
`20:41.42`	`rabbit25`	`:(`
`20:41.47`	`rabbit25`	`no work...`
`20:41.53`	`rabbit25`	`ebleh`
`20:42.04`	`rabbit25`	`lol`
`20:55.36`	`brlcad`	`orange: hehe`
`21:03.22`	`*** join/#bzflag mmu_man (revol@ALyon-112-1-18-243.w81-49.abo.wanadoo.fr)`
`21:05.47`	`*** join/#bzflag SC (~SportChic@ca-redbch-cuda1-c5b-b-192.stmnca.adelphia.net)`
`21:06.42`	`blast007`	`heh`
`21:09.06`	`*** join/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (~fly_for_y@62.211.152.51)`
`21:09.15`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@ACD47B53.ipt.aol.com)`
`21:18.53`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`21:18.53`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`21:25.40`	`bendy24`	`almost time to go home...`
`21:25.51`	`bendy24`	`get some bzflag in...`
`21:27.03`	`*** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@TimRiker.active.supporter.pdpc)`
`21:27.03`	`*** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ`
`21:27.14`	`Pimpi`	`somebody knows a player named artboy?`
`21:27.31`	`Pimpi`	`or similar?`
`21:27.37`	`bendy24`	`never saw him myself`
`21:27.41`	`TheRedBaron`	`I've seen him`
`21:27.49`	`TheRedBaron`	`but do i know him... no`
`21:27.56`	`bendy24`	`which server?`
`21:28.06`	`Pimpi`	`viper and 1vs1`
`21:28.33`	`Pimpi`	`seems to use some kind of automated rejoining`
`21:28.52`	`TheRedBaron`	`pimpi: i've seen him at viper and gu`
`21:29.09`	`Pimpi`	`he occupied 80! slots at once`
`21:29.24`	`bendy24`	`wha?`
`21:29.40`	`bendy24`	`80 bots?`
`21:29.50`	`Pimpi`	`no, 80 connections`
`21:30.05`	`bendy24`	`wierd`
`21:30.16`	`blast007`	`how were the names formatted?`
`21:30.45`	`Pimpi`	`no name, and no MSGaddPlayer`
`21:30.53`	`TheRedBaron`	`pimpi: school connection?`
`21:30.55`	`blast007`	`oh...`
`21:31.00`	`JeffM2501`	`php script probably then`
`21:31.14`	`Pimpi`	`adsl-63-197-19-8.dsl.snfc21.pacbell.net`
`21:32.00`	`blast007`	`heh, they're running a website :)`
`21:32.27`	`JeffM2501`	`probably a stat scaner that has gone wrong`
`21:33.38`	`blast007`	`http://my.bzflag.org/playersearch.php?callsign=artboy`
`21:33.44`	`blast007`	`seems he does bots...`
`21:34.28`	`bendy24`	`thats what i suspected`
`21:34.31`	`blast007`	`maybe he tried to add 80 bots, but something couldn't handle all the connections, so it never got any further then it did`
`21:35.09`	`Pimpi`	`the server won't take more than 2 regular players ;)`
`21:35.10`	`*** join/#bzflag gina (~gigi@108.166-136-217.adsl.skynet.be)`
`21:35.19`	`blast007`	`:)`
`21:38.27`	`Grumbler`	`so are you saying get rid of the command line switches completely and just do a config file`
`21:38.31`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`21:38.47`	`JeffM2501`	`so it would be server.exe config`
`21:38.56`	`JeffM2501`	`then the config has all the "stuff"`
`21:39.08`	`JeffM2501`	`but no in the live codebase`
`21:39.41`	`Grumbler`	`it allows more options for the format of the config file`
`21:39.48`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`21:39.54`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/common/src/ (TextUtils.cpp TextUtils.cxx): we are doing pp not xx`
`21:39.58`	`JeffM2501`	`the file would not need to be a bunch of -whatevers`
`21:40.08`	`JeffM2501`	`and options could have more then one paramater`
`21:41.01`	`Grumbler`	`i am not against it. (like that holds any weight here)`
`21:41.21`	`JeffM2501`	`well your the only one speaking up :)`
`21:41.34`	`JeffM2501`	`and that counts for something`
`21:41.54`	`TheRedBaron`	`would it make the kiddies happy?`
`21:42.03`	`JeffM2501`	`kiddies?`
`21:42.21`	`JeffM2501`	`it would make explaining how to start a server more consitent`
`21:42.43`	`Grumbler`	`i like the idea from the standpoint that it could be in a nice format, instead of -<mess>`
`21:42.48`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`21:43.02`	`JeffM2501`	`could make it easyer to make the server into a daemon or service on windows`
`21:43.14`	`Grumbler`	`and i know that a few of us server runners, only use the config file`
`21:43.15`	`JeffM2501`	`since it would just need the config`
`21:43.30`	`JeffM2501`	`I think most of the server ops use config`
`21:43.38`	`JeffM2501`	`since it's the best way to hold the settings`
`21:43.43`	`Grumbler`	`yep`
`21:44.50`	`JeffM2501`	`figure the config will just fill out an initalisation struct`
`21:45.04`	`JeffM2501`	`then send it to a server class that does the actual serving`
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`21:51.07`	`TheRedBaron`	`for clarification purposes, we are talking about simplifying the whole "start server" method right?`
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`21:51.35`	`JeffM2501`	`I am talking about the server application itself`
`21:51.41`	`JeffM2501`	`basicly how it runs`
`21:52.03`	`JeffM2501`	`and how it gets it's startup paramaters`
`21:52.29`	`JeffM2501`	`tho I guess if I do it with an init class/struct, somone could easaly make a command line parser that filled all that out too.`
`21:52.49`	`bendy24`	`but...`
`21:52.58`	`bendy24`	`all you need to specify is the config file`
`21:53.03`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah`
`21:53.12`	`bendy24`	`easy nuff?`
`21:53.13`	`JeffM2501`	`or even have it use a default one if it exists`
`21:53.16`	`Grumbler`	`<PROTECTED>`
`21:53.18`	`JeffM2501`	`one would think it would be`
`21:53.46`	`SportChick`	`aribeth: ping`
`21:53.53`	`bendy24`	`i havent had problems running a server in the past`
`21:54.08`	`JeffM2501`	`this isn't for the live codebase`
`21:54.16`	`JeffM2501`	`so it's not to "solve" any problem`
`21:54.33`	`JeffM2501`	`it's to see if there is a need for command line AND config`
`21:54.36`	`orange`	`you could name the config file .bzs or some other thing, and associate it with the bzfs binary on windows, so clicking on or opening the config file would start the server`
`21:54.45`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah you could`
`21:54.52`	`orange`	`would make things a ton easier`
`21:55.12`	`bendy24`	`batch file?`
`21:55.17`	`JeffM2501`	`no`
`21:55.20`	`JeffM2501`	`a real document`
`21:55.30`	`bendy24`	`yeah, i understand orange`
`21:55.32`	`orange`	`edit would be notepad, open would be bzfs.exe`
`21:55.35`	`JeffM2501`	`would have to make the thing not be a command line thing`
`21:55.38`	`bendy24`	`but i was suggesting a batch file`
`21:55.53`	`JeffM2501`	`batch file is just a way of doing command line args`
`21:55.58`	`bendy24`	`yes`
`21:55.59`	`bendy24`	`but`
`21:56.03`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm wondering if I have to support args AND config`
`21:56.06`	`bendy24`	`command line options are good...`
`21:56.09`	`bendy24`	`or so i thought`
`21:56.13`	`JeffM2501`	`if your making a bat, why not do a config`
`21:56.16`	`JeffM2501`	`the config has less limits`
`21:56.21`	`JeffM2501`	`and your still editing a file`
`21:56.29`	`JeffM2501`	`bat files are also windows specific`
`21:56.33`	`JeffM2501`	`configs are not`
`21:56.35`	`orange`	`no worries about shell escapes, etc.`
`21:56.38`	`bendy24`	`sure`
`21:56.48`	`bendy24`	`bat files, shell scripts, all the same`
`21:57.48`	`bendy24`	`once you have your command down pat, just put it in a batch file and you dont lose your settings`
`21:57.54`	`JeffM2501`	`code wise the server would be encapuslated in a class, so it could be built as any number of application types, regular app, windows service, unix daemon.. etc...`
`22:00.24`	`Grumbler`	`config files are contained and easily transportable across multiple OSes`
`22:01.00`	`Grumbler`	`....so long as you dont have to worry about /n /cr differences`
`22:02.10`	`blast007`	`almost had it working, but I couldn't get it to find the data directory, even if I used -directory`
`22:07.28`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@ACD47B53.ipt.aol.com)`
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`22:10.54`	`JeffM2501`	`world will more then likely be XMLish at start with proper heiarchys`
`22:10.55`	`Grumbler`	`...just pointing out that in your modifications, there might be some fudge in the map reader.`
`22:11.06`	`JeffM2501`	`you asume I'm modifying`
`22:11.17`	`Grumbler`	`point taken`
`22:11.43`	`Grumbler`	`i defer the floor to the gentleman from the west.`
`22:12.06`	`JeffM2501`	`but yes options should be able to come from the map too`
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`22:22.05`	`*** part/#bzflag tupone_laptop (~atupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:29.24`	`gina`	`right`
`22:29.30`	`Birdie`	`hi gina`
`22:29.31`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:31.32`	`*** join/#bzflag brad2901 (brad2901@ACD47B53.ipt.aol.com)`
`22:39.43`	`*** join/#bzflag triclops (~triclops@c211-31-49-112.rivrw7.nsw.optusnet.com.au)`
`22:42.49`	`gina`	`again`
`22:43.12`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:43.14`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone_ (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:43.28`	`brlcad`	`again`
`22:43.37`	`Grumbler`	`invasion of the tupone clones : Is it safe?`
`22:43.47`	`brlcad`	`it's never safe`
`22:44.02`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone_ (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:44.04`	`Grumbler`	`they eat their own`
`22:45.01`	`Tupone`	`lol`
`22:50.34`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:50.35`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone_ (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:50.39`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone__ (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:50.50`	`Tupone_`	`argh`
`22:51.00`	`Tupone`	`lol`
`22:52.51`	`Tupone`	`this pc is as unstable as gina`
`22:52.58`	`gina`	`hey!`
`22:53.05`	`gina`	`:p`
`22:54.08`	`brlcad`	`windows I`
`22:54.14`	`brlcad`	`iWindows?`
`22:54.43`	`Grumbler`	`does iWindows run iLife`
`22:55.11`	`gina`	`grumbler...`
`22:55.16`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:55.17`	`*** join/#bzflag Tupone_ (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`22:55.42`	`gina`	`rofl`
`22:55.50`	`gina`	`revenge`
`22:55.53`	`gina`	`sweet revenge`
`22:55.54`	`brlcad`	`better than Life ME`
`22:56.02`	`Tupone`	`:(`
`22:56.17`	`Tupone`	`I should come with my usual way of chatting then :/`
`22:56.35`	`Pimpi`	`Tupone: what and where is getTick()`
`22:56.48`	`brlcad`	`Pimpi: TimeKeeper`
`22:56.54`	`brlcad`	`src/common`
`22:58.02`	`Pimpi`	`yep, found it`
`22:58.17`	`Pimpi`	`doxygen must have overseen it`
`22:59.21`	`Pimpi`	`how often is it updated?`
`22:59.34`	`JeffM2501`	`iLife rocks`
`23:02.44`	`JeffM2501`	`how long till you get your mini?`
`23:02.52`	`Nidhoggr`	`ages`
`23:02.56`	`Nidhoggr`	`another few months.`
`23:02.57`	`JeffM2501`	`:(`
`23:03.30`	`Nidhoggr`	`I have to save up for the 3rd weekend in April for my consecration to bishop.`
`23:04.11`	`JeffM2501`	`what video is in your mac now?`
`23:04.21`	`JeffM2501`	`I'm not using my radeon 7k`
`23:04.23`	`Nidhoggr`	`my desktop mac is icky.`
`23:04.35`	`Nidhoggr`	`I have decent vid in my powerbook`
`23:04.38`	`Pimpi`	`brlcad: timeout for a connection if udpin and !udpout after 5 seconds worksfine`
`23:04.44`	`JeffM2501`	`what's in your dekstop`
`23:04.44`	`Nidhoggr`	`it likes to heat up when playing bz though.`
`23:04.59`	`JeffM2501`	`if the 7k is better you want it?`
`23:05.13`	`JeffM2501`	`the G3 is just siting there`
`23:05.22`	`Nidhoggr`	`my desktop is radeon rage pro or something.`
`23:05.29`	`JeffM2501`	`ohh`
`23:05.30`	`JeffM2501`	`rage`
`23:05.31`	`JeffM2501`	`wow`
`23:05.35`	`JeffM2501`	`not even radeon`
`23:05.42`	`JeffM2501`	`yeah a 7k would be better`
`23:05.46`	`JeffM2501`	`you have a free PCI slot?`
`23:05.47`	`Nidhoggr`	`well, I am scrapping my desktop at some point.`
`23:06.01`	`Nidhoggr`	`probably.`
`23:06.03`	`JeffM2501`	`well when you scrap it, send the 7k back`
`23:06.06`	`Nidhoggr`	`heh`
`23:06.40`	`JeffM2501`	`make sure you have a slot, and let me know, I'll send it to you`
`23:06.43`	`JeffM2501`	`may help a bit`
`23:08.17`	`Nidhoggr`	`I actually unplugged my desktop mac for now.`
`23:08.22`	`JeffM2501`	`ok`
`23:08.25`	`Nidhoggr`	`it's going unused.`
`23:08.30`	`JeffM2501`	`well if you want it the offer stands`
`23:08.38`	`Nidhoggr`	`thanks :) I appreciate it.`
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`23:15.23`	`CIA-10`	`BZFlag: 03jeffm2501 * 10BZFlagG3D/ (12 files in 6 dirs): common is now a lib. everyone needs common`
`23:18.42`	`*** join/#bzflag blast007 (~blast007@24-196-92-143.jvl.wi.charter.com)`
`23:19.28`	`*** part/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@host-84-222-136-110.cust-adsl.tiscali.it)`
`23:19.58`	`*** part/#bzflag Blue_Eyes (~fly_for_y@62.211.152.51)`
`23:21.57`	`*** join/#bzflag Carnage__ (~d8088485@rw08.de)`
`23:59.54`	`JeffM2501`	`hmmm I could make the configs be "Whitespace Terminated Files", and then give them the extension "WTF" :)`

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