| 00:00.33 | Quol | I ran ldd -v and it showed me the requirements and a grabbed all of them... |
| 00:00.36 | bryjen | the nss is to let you switch between backends for lookup. dlopen() the one you've asked for? |
| 00:01.05 | larsl_56k | Ah. |
| 00:01.17 | Quol | I just blew away my /lib and copied just the root of /lib over, and the i686 folder (under RedHat 8), adn everything is still ok |
| 00:01.29 | larsl_56k | Then ldd wouldn't find it, since it's not actually a link-time requirement. |
| 00:01.40 | Quol | probably is the libns files |
| 00:01.43 | bryjen | I Am Not A Programmer. but sometime i play one on IRC ;) |
| 00:02.39 | Quol | be back later...have to put my sone to bed for the night ;) - thanks guys.... |
| 00:03.02 | larsl_56k | I still think it's weird that it needs nameserver stuff in the jail - wouldn't that be handled using system calls? |
| 00:03.13 | Nidhoggr | system calls might require the libraries. |
| 00:03.24 | bryjen | not name _server_ client side of DNS |
| 00:03.36 | larsl_56k | Yes, that's what I meant. =) |
| 00:04.17 | Nidhoggr | I seem to remember same problems, then I just cp -a'd all of /lib and /usr/lib |
| 00:04.39 | larsl_56k | I suppose Mandrake is configured differently. |
| 00:05.20 | learner | anyone seen t3 yet? |
| 00:05.21 | Nidhoggr | I chowned my bzfs to nobody.nobody and suid'd it. |
| 00:05.27 | Nidhoggr | nope |
| 00:05.34 | Nidhoggr | may see it next week. |
| 00:06.08 | *** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-62-11-4-180.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 00:06.14 | bryjen | Just when you think Arnold is getting to old for action flicks, Sean Connery comes out with a new one ;) |
| 00:06.14 | sussudio | ah MF*()$#@$#@ |
| 00:06.25 | sussudio | the new bzedit fcks up my maps |
| 00:07.10 | Patlabor221 | what version?" |
| 00:07.20 | learner | ah.. league of gents.. good to see some creativity -- been a while |
| 00:07.23 | Patlabor221 | there was a bug that would wipe on close |
| 00:07.27 | sussudio | 1.5.9f11 |
| 00:07.30 | Patlabor221 | get 12 |
| 00:07.38 | Patlabor221 | fixes that ( I hope) |
| 00:07.38 | sussudio | is says "do you want to save map" and makes it 0 bytes |
| 00:07.43 | Patlabor221 | yeah |
| 00:07.45 | sussudio | *($)#@ |
| 00:07.48 | Patlabor221 | thats the problem |
| 00:07.51 | Patlabor221 | pissed me off too |
| 00:07.58 | Patlabor221 | killed the bunny map cus of that :( |
| 00:07.59 | sussudio | i worked 2 days on that map |
| 00:08.08 | Patlabor221 | mfc stomps on it :( |
| 00:08.58 | Patlabor221 | cus I wasn't doing it "there" way |
| 00:09.23 | bryjen | This is how you will program today! |
| 00:11.06 | Patlabor221 | well it's the framework, I overrode all the fileIO cept for the close save |
| 00:11.09 | Patlabor221 | was easy to fix |
| 00:11.26 | Patlabor221 | you don't have to use the framework for all things |
| 00:11.33 | DTRemenak | amen |
| 00:11.50 | Patlabor221 | the world class does it's own file IO, it's rather portable. |
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| 00:15.27 | *** part/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@host-225-87.dialup.innercite.com) |
| 00:20.16 | *** part/#bzflag Quol (~QuolSimo@modemcable052.11-203-24.mtl.mc.videotron.ca) |
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| 00:50.39 | Nidhoggr | are there any converters for standard vector formats to bzflag map formats? |
| 00:53.38 | sussudio | ~google for are there any converters for standard vector formats to bzflag map formats |
| 00:53.47 | Nidhoggr | hah! |
| 00:54.19 | Nidhoggr | it'd be cool to write a plugin for visio to save to .map files. :) |
| 00:54.27 | sussudio | :-B |
| 00:54.55 | Nidhoggr | I do a lot of my posters in visio first.. the framework part. |
| 00:55.37 | Nidhoggr | nod |
| 00:55.49 | Nidhoggr | didn't that do bmp files? |
| 00:55.55 | sussudio | png i think |
| 00:56.00 | Nidhoggr | ah |
| 00:56.07 | Nidhoggr | cuz visio is already vector. |
| 00:56.30 | Nidhoggr | it's fun making a big visio drawing and exporting it to .tif :) |
| 00:56.54 | Nidhoggr | then I usually import into painter and photoshop and finish the design. |
| 00:57.48 | Nidhoggr | heh |
| 00:58.18 | sussudio | ever tried bzflag at 1600x1200? |
| 00:58.28 | Nidhoggr | yes |
| 00:58.31 | Nidhoggr | it crashed on me |
| 00:58.33 | Nidhoggr | :) |
| 00:58.34 | sussudio | tiny, tiny flags. |
| 00:58.35 | Nidhoggr | nod |
| 00:58.49 | Nidhoggr | I use 1280x1024 by default. |
| 00:59.07 | sussudio | i'm going for 1024x768 |
| 00:59.12 | Nidhoggr | time to go home. back later. |
| 00:59.15 | Nidhoggr | & |
| 00:59.16 | sussudio | bigger res makes me dizzy. |
| 01:03.08 | sussudio | berlusconi calls german euro politician a nazi. |
| 01:03.20 | sussudio | italians say "sorry if that offended any germans" |
| 01:03.21 | sussudio | ... |
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| 01:09.06 | *** part/#bzflag creeperz (~creeperz@host-11-76-220-24.midco.net) |
| 01:39.57 | sussudio | ~d |
| 01:41.45 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~jeffm@adsl-67-115-245-177.dsl.lsan03.pacbell.net) |
| 01:41.45 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ |
| 01:41.52 | sussudio | \bz |
| 01:42.16 | chickenStew | c++ standard library behavior question... |
| 01:42.48 | chickenStew | will this "do the right thing" and not cause a memory leak: |
| 01:42.59 | chickenStew | string blah = "whatever"; |
| 01:43.18 | chickenStew | blah = blah.substr(3); |
| 01:43.50 | chickenStew | I assume yes, but it's an isoteric detail |
| 01:46.41 | Patlabor221 | you know assume makes an ass out of you and me :) |
| 01:46.52 | chickenStew | lol, heh |
| 01:47.13 | chickenStew | let's just say the code won't move until I know |
| 01:47.17 | Patlabor221 | string dosn't have a trim left method? |
| 01:47.33 | chickenStew | my example was just simplified |
| 01:47.59 | Patlabor221 | it should be ok, cus a copy wold be made for the asignement right? |
| 01:48.19 | chickenStew | that's what i'd "assume".. but ... |
| 01:48.24 | Patlabor221 | substr probably makes a copy |
| 01:48.33 | Patlabor221 | but it may depend on the stl implemenation |
| 01:48.40 | Patlabor221 | there is probably no way to know for sure |
| 01:49.03 | chickenStew | if substr makes a copy, and then the array is overwritten, then I've just leaked |
| 01:49.18 | chickenStew | grr |
| 01:49.28 | Patlabor221 | well I'm sure the arry isn't just "overwiten" |
| 01:49.46 | Patlabor221 | strings have to be able to handle releaseing there mem when they are made shorter |
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| 01:50.32 | *** part/#bzflag Skipp (~Skipp@12-206-137-38.client.attbi.com) |
| 01:51.25 | Patlabor221 | if substr makes a local copy then you are cool ( I would think it would have to ), substr will process, make a local copy, sent that to = and = will do the asignement, and do what ever it does to make the string shorter |
| 01:51.47 | Patlabor221 | ether keep a "real len" around for when it goes out of scope, or free and realloc then |
| 01:52.34 | Patlabor221 | strings in the windows implementation keep a "alloc" len around, that they free when they go outa scope, so they allocate and deallocate in chunks |
| 01:56.53 | chickenStew | i figure that since I never explicitly alloc the string, then = operator should "do the right thing" when it gets a reassignment |
| 01:57.03 | doughecka | hm |
| 01:57.13 | Patlabor221 | it should yes |
| 01:57.21 | Patlabor221 | thats the deal with strings |
| 01:57.25 | Patlabor221 | they take care of there own mem |
| 01:57.30 | Patlabor221 | so you don't have to |
| 01:58.02 | sussudio | ~sud |
| 01:58.02 | | shut up doug |
| 01:58.55 | doughecka | do you think bzflag works over ipv6? what would need to be changed? |
| 01:59.34 | Patlabor221 | ummm all the IP stuff |
| 02:03.42 | *** join/#bzflag Legolas (~Legolas@adsl-68-73-117-113.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 02:09.40 | *** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@host-225-39.dialup.innercite.com) |
| 02:11.23 | bzgirl | ~bzg |
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| 02:15.09 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 02:15.32 | chickenStew | can't find yourself, girl? :) |
| 02:15.52 | TimRiker | ~nslookup ladder.bzflag.org |
| 02:22.42 | JBDiGriz | bzgirl: That was a fun battle on your site. Thanks! |
| 02:22.59 | bzgirl | JBDiGriz: yup, it was good |
| 02:24.19 | JBDiGriz | I see head has joined them, it's going to remain quite competitive for a while! |
| 02:25.07 | bzgirl | is asdf behaving? |
| 02:26.27 | JBDiGriz | most of the people were fairly competent, so he seems to be in his element. |
| 02:27.48 | JBDiGriz | I was a little short with Tux, although hopefully not too bad. |
| 02:40.07 | *** part/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@host-225-39.dialup.innercite.com) |
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| 02:41.44 | *** part/#bzflag sussudio (Suss@81.68.132.217) |
| 03:41.37 | *** join/#bzflag Michaelh (Mouse@172-212.dynamic.visi.com) |
| 03:43.53 | Michaelh | so do we have a non-crashing version of bzflag yet :) |
| 03:44.42 | Michaelh | it's funny of course that when I run it in debug mode -- it doesn't seem to crash on exit |
| 03:51.02 | captain_proton | doughecka: if you payed any attention you'd know that was a TODO item :P |
| 03:51.26 | learner | yea, doughecka |
| 03:53.13 | learner | :) |
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| 03:56.39 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Chestal] by ChanServ |
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| 04:15.15 | *** part/#bzflag bzgirl (~brat@toronto-hs-64-26-176-100.s-ip.magma.ca) |
| 04:18.11 | captain_proton | if diablo-d3 pops in asking about david trowbridge, don't tell him its me |
| 04:18.53 | learner | you're david trowbridge? |
| 04:18.55 | learner | :) |
| 04:18.59 | captain_proton | very good |
| 04:19.14 | stj_MichaelH | what kind of bridge? |
| 04:21.45 | stj_MichaelH | who is diab3dude? |
| 04:22.00 | captain_proton | an idiot from #commits |
| 04:22.22 | captain_proton | i submitted a patch to his crappy game because he was doing a huge amount of unnecessary allocation/deallocation and it offended my sensibilities |
| 04:22.27 | captain_proton | and now he's trying to figure out who it is :) |
| 04:22.58 | stj_MichaelH | what game is that? |
| 04:23.07 | captain_proton | "shadow conflict" - mostly vaporware |
| 04:23.13 | captain_proton | but hey, its got a main menu =) |
| 04:23.39 | stj_MichaelH | so what sort of alloc/dealloc was it? |
| 04:24.04 | captain_proton | he was creating temporary buffers into which he concatenated strings, passed them to a function and then destroyed them |
| 04:24.25 | stj_MichaelH | instead of char buffers? |
| 04:24.27 | stj_MichaelH | perhaps |
| 04:24.29 | stj_MichaelH | ? |
| 04:24.30 | captain_proton | so i just created an array and used the preprocessor to concat - about a 30 second hack |
| 04:24.47 | captain_proton | (it was all const) |
| 04:24.58 | learner | and now you're being stalked. heh |
| 04:25.07 | stj_MichaelH | so what is #commits about? |
| 04:25.11 | captain_proton | he was allocating memory all over to concatenate literal strings! |
| 04:25.23 | captain_proton | stj_MichaelH: its the primary channel for CIA - announces commits for various projects |
| 04:25.34 | stj_MichaelH | woah |
| 04:25.39 | learner | serves you right for straying from the bzpath, young skywalker |
| 04:25.40 | stj_MichaelH | for sourceforge basically? |
| 04:26.13 | Michaelh | that's a weird thing to do :) |
| 04:26.43 | captain_proton | Michaelh: a couple sf projects are on it, but lots aren't |
| 04:27.14 | Michaelh | ah so .. I was imagining thousands of projects dumping into it |
| 04:27.30 | captain_proton | no, its an opt-in type thing :) |
| 04:27.40 | captain_proton | its nice because CIA spits it out here too |
| 04:27.43 | Michaelh | *** Now talking in #commits |
| 04:27.43 | Michaelh | <vinsci> Diablo-D3: there are 59 peopole with that name in the USA, listed |
| 04:27.47 | Michaelh | :) |
| 04:28.12 | Michaelh | I see you are there too :) |
| 04:28.16 | captain_proton | i doubt i'm one of those, need to check |
| 04:29.19 | Michaelh | has he really gone ballistic over a submitted patch? |
| 04:29.32 | Michaelh | did you commit it ? or have that ability? |
| 04:30.48 | captain_proton | yep, none of those are me |
| 04:30.54 | captain_proton | i submitted it to the patch tracker |
| 04:32.19 | learner | lol, cap |
| 04:32.40 | Michaelh | so what did he say? |
| 04:33.05 | captain_proton | well so far he's been trying to find out who this trowbridge character is |
| 04:33.37 | captain_proton | he found the crappy artist, and the microsoft employee (some head honcho .NET guy) |
| 04:34.14 | captain_proton | and he "forgot" how to apply a patch |
| 04:35.20 | learner | is #commit basically a channel to talk about CIA stuff, or all projects and how they commit in general? |
| 04:35.38 | captain_proton | well cia announces everything there |
| 04:35.49 | captain_proton | and its a neat mixing pot of a bunch of different kinds of developers |
| 04:36.35 | learner | "everything" as in every single CIA commit on all projects? |
| 04:36.42 | captain_proton | yes |
| 04:36.50 | Michaelh | " tberman: it's about 1500 lines of code and 2 years " ?? only 1500? |
| 04:36.55 | captain_proton | Michaelh: well...3200 |
| 04:36.57 | captain_proton | =} |
| 04:37.21 | Michaelh | my ftp server (java) I think runs in about 30,000 plus lines of code |
| 04:37.25 | captain_proton | some general infrastructure code and a non-functional main menu |
| 04:37.34 | Michaelh | well maybe 10,000 + |
| 04:37.47 | captain_proton | he doesn't know how to approach projects like these and refuses to listen to all of us when we try to give him the benefit of our experience by telling him things like "prototype it first" |
| 04:38.00 | Michaelh | this is c++? |
| 04:38.15 | captain_proton | C |
| 04:38.21 | Michaelh | eek |
| 04:38.29 | Michaelh | windows or cross platform? |
| 04:38.44 | captain_proton | he seems to fear C++, but at the same time he complains that C "isn' |
| 04:38.48 | captain_proton | t high level enough" |
| 04:38.54 | captain_proton | linux actually |
| 04:38.55 | Michaelh | doh |
| 04:39.03 | captain_proton | claims it'll run on any SDL platform, but he uses POSIXisms |
| 04:39.13 | Michaelh | c++ seems to work well for bzstuff for sure |
| 04:39.30 | captain_proton | i'm a fan of C++ for things that need speed but can be large |
| 04:40.17 | Michaelh | eh.. can you rephrase that? |
| 04:40.31 | Michaelh | so c++ is ok for speed? |
| 04:40.47 | captain_proton | yeah, C++ is just as fast as C |
| 04:41.00 | captain_proton | but its a lot bigger than C in terms of memory usage, etc |
| 04:41.04 | learner | I didn't hear that.. :) |
| 04:41.21 | Michaelh | Did he put up that huge freaking page and story line? And he only has 2000 lines of code? |
| 04:41.28 | DTRemenak | I think the right way to phrase it is C++ CAN BE just as fast as C |
| 04:41.29 | learner | You must not do scientific computing, cap.. :) |
| 04:41.34 | captain_proton | Michaelh: yeah, and he's rendering cutscenes! :) |
| 04:41.49 | captain_proton | learner: actually with template expression stuff, C++ is often faster than C ;-) |
| 04:42.09 | Michaelh | and it's own domain name none the less |
| 04:42.32 | captain_proton | still not quite as fast as fortran |
| 04:42.52 | learner | for core computing, everything boils down to the same assembler. At best they'll be equal |
| 04:43.24 | captain_proton | learner: but the template expressions often optimize beyond what most people can do (unintuitive code) |
| 04:43.30 | learner | though the C version may take twice as long to right, and an order of magnitude longer to maintain for large projects |
| 04:43.54 | learner | "most people" being a choiceful word. |
| 04:43.58 | captain_proton | very |
| 04:46.43 | Michaelh | ah ha |
| 04:46.44 | Michaelh | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:46.44 | Michaelh | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:46.44 | Michaelh | <PROTECTED> |
| 04:46.59 | captain_proton | Michaelh: isn't it disgusting? |
| 04:47.45 | Michaelh | isn't that what the guidelines for GNU suggest? |
| 04:47.51 | Michaelh | that fixed arrays are bad? |
| 04:48.08 | captain_proton | Michaelh: well - yes |
| 04:48.16 | captain_proton | but in this case its completely unnecessary |
| 04:48.21 | Michaelh | I mean sure.. doing it 5 or 10 times over again is a bit too much |
| 04:48.30 | captain_proton | its all const, so he spends a huge amount of allocation time where the preprocessor could be used |
| 04:50.37 | Michaelh | what is this addSearchPath stuff? |
| 04:51.16 | Michaelh | what is he concating? :) |
| 04:52.22 | captain_proton | its a list of directories for his data files |
| 04:52.34 | captain_proton | if you look at the defaultdata array you'll see |
| 04:56.54 | Michaelh | well I suppose he's poed, since you are ripping on his whopping 2000 lines of code :) |
| 04:57.53 | Michaelh | so how can the preprocessor concat strings? |
| 04:59.48 | learner | cap, I'd love to see a bit of template math code that you referred to -- we (work) benchmark that kind of stuff all the time -- do you know of any? |
| 05:01.43 | *** join/#bzflag Diablo-D3 (diablo@iprs1-63-163-41-84.panax.com) |
| 05:01.52 | Michaelh | so if I go post my own little 2-bit project on sf.net -- other people will actually look at it? |
| 05:02.02 | learner | I'd love to see something with an object heirarchy outperform plain macros |
| 05:02.42 | Diablo-D3 | is a david trowbridge here? |
| 05:02.46 | learner | Michaelh: sure.. I'll look at it, once |
| 05:02.50 | learner | who?? |
| 05:02.53 | Michaelh | lol |
| 05:03.14 | Michaelh | Where's waldo? |
| 05:03.19 | Michaelh | is he there? |
| 05:03.42 | learner | you want to tow a bridge, david? |
| 05:03.43 | Michaelh | or am I thinking of that one movie -- Being John Malkovich..... |
| 05:04.51 | Diablo-D3 | learner: thats the dude's name |
| 05:04.58 | learner | ah. |
| 05:04.59 | Michaelh | what dude |
| 05:05.06 | learner | hey, aren't you the guy on #commit? |
| 05:05.21 | Diablo-D3 | Michaelh: david trowbridge |
| 05:05.33 | Diablo-D3 | he seems to be a bzflag developer, so I was checking if he visits irc |
| 05:05.36 | Michaelh | what about him? |
| 05:05.48 | Diablo-D3 | I want to talk to him. |
| 05:06.07 | learner | haven't ever seen anyone by that name |
| 05:06.27 | DTRemenak | I don't think I've ever seen anyone with a nick like that on this channel |
| 05:06.49 | Diablo-D3 | not nick, thats his real name |
| 05:08.00 | DTRemenak | ah, I see...well, I don't know many devs by both their real name and their nicks, so I can't be much help |
| 05:08.06 | CIA | commit by michaelh20: Who is this David T guy? |
| 05:08.22 | DTRemenak | but i'm sure that if he were here, he'd be talking |
| 05:08.33 | Diablo-D3 | is sf.net nick is davidtrowbridge |
| 05:09.44 | learner | I know many by their real names, but that's not ringing any bells |
| 05:09.48 | Diablo-D3 | his sf.net nick is davidtrowbridge |
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| 05:10.28 | *** join/#bzflag evil_enchilada (~blardebla@12-203-245-57.client.attbi.com) |
| 05:10.31 | Michaelh | I love this bash people with commits thing |
| 05:10.33 | learner | wow, lots of vagrants strolling in here today.. |
| 05:10.52 | Michaelh | ah well .. they saw my bogus commit |
| 05:11.04 | Diablo-D3 | heh |
| 05:11.06 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_proton] by ChanServ |
| 05:11.19 | learner | You know you're causing me e-mails with bogus commits like that Michaelh.. grr |
| 05:11.34 | Michaelh | but... I shall not do it a second time :) |
| 05:11.45 | learner | ;) |
| 05:11.57 | Michaelh | It's a space.. whitespace is important |
| 05:14.50 | learner | With commits like that, well outrank kde in no time.. :) |
| 05:15.09 | Michaelh | there are actually some little bugs in bzfquery.pl..... |
| 05:15.15 | Diablo-D3 | hah |
| 05:15.51 | Michaelh | for one.. it doesn't always read the entire buffer in one go.. sometimes it takes two reads or more to work |
| 05:16.04 | captain_proton | Michaelh: it also doesn't speak 1.9 |
| 05:17.17 | Michaelh | shocking..... :) |
| 05:20.09 | learner | ~d |
| 05:23.09 | learner | anyone know of a good reference for "l33t-speak" |
| 05:23.27 | learner | I have the basics in the filter, but I want to make sure I'm not missing anything |
| 05:23.52 | captain_proton | you may find the en-us-l33t translation helpful |
| 05:23.57 | captain_proton | MAC did a good job on it |
| 05:24.36 | learner | source reference point? |
| 05:24.46 | captain_proton | data/l10n/bzflag_en_US_l33t.po |
| 05:25.25 | learner | ah.. I thought you meant some actual code that does it on the fly |
| 05:25.31 | learner | I have those character conversions |
| 05:28.18 | learner | the hardest conversion I've run against was f->ph |
| 05:29.18 | Diablo-D3 | learner: why? |
| 05:30.00 | learner | i build a regular expression for the filter |
| 05:30.12 | learner | single letter conversions were trivial |
| 05:30.23 | learner | f->ph broke the mold, though |
| 05:30.31 | learner | still not too tough |
| 05:30.43 | CIA | commit by michaelh20: sysread doesn't always read the entire 180 bytes -- causes the script to fail... |
| 05:30.43 | learner | if (character == 'f') { |
| 05:30.43 | learner | /* ensure we don't capture garbage at the end */ |
| 05:30.43 | learner | if (i != length - 1) { |
| 05:30.43 | learner | newWord.expression.append("[fp]+[^[:alpha:]]*h?[^[:alpha:]]*"); |
| 05:30.52 | learner | ... |
| 05:30.56 | Diablo-D3 | heh |
| 05:32.12 | learner | you should see the entire expansion for everyones favorite little four letter word |
| 05:32.54 | Michaelh | it's silly but it's a little something I saw fail in my scripting attempts with bzfquery... |
| 05:34.14 | learner | eh, mike? |
| 05:34.48 | Michaelh | somethign to do with bzfquery.pl |
| 05:35.25 | Michaelh | when you run it against a large # of servers -- you see the script sometimes fails |
| 05:35.29 | Michaelh | rather .. dies |
| 05:35.37 | *** part/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@host-224-125.dialup.innercite.com) |
| 05:36.03 | Michaelh | because the sysread of 180 bytes sometimes doesn't get 180 bytes, it gets less and hence it dies right there instead of reading again to fill the buffer |
| 05:38.02 | Michaelh | like I said it was a bit silly |
| 05:39.43 | *** join/#bzflag Noodleman (~tuckerm@bc183148.bendcable.com) |
| 05:39.47 | learner | ah, sucky |
| 05:40.05 | Noodleman | what's so sucky about my logging on? :-) |
| 05:40.19 | learner | hehe :) |
| 05:40.34 | JBDiGriz | m00f |
| 05:40.39 | Noodleman | f00m |
| 05:40.53 | Noodleman | ximian desktop 2 is great |
| 05:40.56 | Noodleman | just installed it |
| 05:41.24 | captain_proton | jetstream had a m00f-type jetcow |
| 05:43.25 | JBDiGriz | learner: another late night? I didn't notice you at work today. |
| 05:43.47 | Michaelh | where ya'll work? |
| 05:44.08 | JBDiGriz | I'm a contractor, I work wherever they pay me. |
| 05:44.23 | learner | nah, jb |
| 05:44.26 | Michaelh | CA? |
| 05:44.29 | learner | didn't feel like going in today |
| 05:44.34 | JBDiGriz | So Cal |
| 05:44.37 | learner | so I took the day off |
| 05:44.56 | JBDiGriz | It's a good time to take the rest of the week off. |
| 05:45.04 | learner | trying to get the filter stuff finished |
| 05:45.27 | learner | it would be nice to take it off... if I weren't such a workaholic |
| 05:45.47 | JBDiGriz | You need someone to take your mind off work occasionally. |
| 05:45.58 | learner | I'd take the week off just to work on work at home.. :) |
| 05:46.36 | JBDiGriz | With an attitude like that, why aren't you joining a startup? |
| 05:47.01 | captain_proton | JBDiGriz: because with that attitude at a start up, you'll soon be out of a job ;) |
| 05:47.01 | learner | hehehe, I almost did on many occasions. |
| 05:47.21 | learner | I'd be more inclined to start my own business |
| 05:47.37 | JBDiGriz | captain_proton: not true, all startups take twice as much work as you can manage to accomplish. |
| 05:48.07 | JBDiGriz | learner: got any good ideas for a business, I've never succeeded beyond grabbing contracts. |
| 05:48.12 | captain_proton | oh wait |
| 05:48.18 | captain_proton | i misread his statement |
| 05:48.38 | *** part/#bzflag Diablo-D3 (diablo@iprs1-63-163-41-84.panax.com) |
| 05:48.47 | learner | finally, he left |
| 05:48.55 | Michaelh | any suggestions for how a newbie college grad can get contract work :) ? |
| 05:49.11 | learner | there's plenty of work iff you are any good |
| 05:49.15 | JBDiGriz | How many professors did you help with their work? |
| 05:49.31 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 05:49.37 | JBDiGriz | plenty of work, but it's not always easy to find |
| 05:49.43 | learner | true |
| 05:50.05 | Michaelh | I really didn't help any professors :) I did do a project or two |
| 05:50.23 | Michaelh | randomly knocking on business' doors? |
| 05:50.27 | JBDiGriz | Professors are good in that they often have outside contracts, but they have to know you can do a good job. |
| 05:50.34 | learner | jb: of course I have business ideas |
| 05:50.54 | JBDiGriz | randomly knocking on doors won't get you very far, you really need to meet people. |
| 05:51.17 | learner | you have to build a relationship or get to know inside people or both |
| 05:51.24 | Michaelh | but would I be correct in that this kind of work could then lead to a "real" job? |
| 05:51.30 | JBDiGriz | Were the projects for yourself, or for someone with contacts? |
| 05:51.55 | Michaelh | one was for a psych prof.. another was a personal/school project |
| 05:52.02 | JBDiGriz | If you want a real job, start applying at dice.com |
| 05:52.31 | JBDiGriz | Is the psych prof well connected? That's the sort of contact which can get you started. |
| 05:52.55 | learner | if you have no contacts, I'd highly recommend putting together a polished portfolio of the projects you've worked on |
| 05:53.41 | JBDiGriz | That helps to focus your efforts, but it also means that you're going to be relying on headhunters. |
| 05:53.43 | Michaelh | does that mean code samples or descriptions? |
| 05:54.07 | learner | both -- put yourself in their shoes and try to impress yourself |
| 05:54.09 | JBDiGriz | Headhunters look for particular buzz words, and ask you to change your resume/cv to include those buzz words. |
| 05:54.32 | learner | ugh.. headhunters |
| 05:54.48 | JBDiGriz | They fill a niche, although I tend to avoid them. |
| 05:54.53 | learner | yep |
| 05:55.20 | learner | I usually get an e-mail or a phonecall from one every few months |
| 05:55.27 | JBDiGriz | Michaelh: what part of the world are you in, and what sort of thing do you like to do? |
| 05:56.53 | Michaelh | MN |
| 05:56.56 | Michaelh | Minneapolis |
| 05:57.02 | learner | ouch :) |
| 05:57.15 | Michaelh | I'm thinking mainline Java, C++, C.. is what I currently know the best |
| 05:57.32 | JBDiGriz | There are a few companys around MN, but it's not a hub. |
| 05:57.50 | learner | but "what" with those languages? |
| 05:57.53 | Michaelh | I'll probably start learning J2EE, jsp, .net asp etc.. more business oriented stuff |
| 05:57.57 | JBDiGriz | Can you afford to get out to the Java developer's conference? |
| 05:58.08 | Michaelh | in CA? |
| 05:58.15 | Michaelh | irk |
| 05:58.43 | learner | hehe, jb... I can't afford to make it out to that meat fest.. :) |
| 05:58.49 | Michaelh | I'd practically settle for anything :) |
| 05:59.01 | learner | though the educational discount was pretty sweet |
| 05:59.21 | JBDiGriz | Usually there is a discount for students, but there's always a job board. Make sure you print up business cards to bring. |
| 05:59.54 | Michaelh | I'd move if I knew I could get a reasonable job...... but would I really be the certain of getting a better job by moving out west? |
| 06:00.45 | learner | I wouldn't think so, michael -- probably even the reverse is true right now |
| 06:00.46 | JBDiGriz | Don't plan on moving until you know where the job will be. It depends on what you will be doing. |
| 06:00.52 | learner | unless you are really that good |
| 06:01.00 | Michaelh | lol ... nope |
| 06:01.10 | learner | :) |
| 06:01.13 | JBDiGriz | Even if you're that good, it won't help until people know you! |
| 06:01.18 | Michaelh | see this is what gets my goat --> Years of Experience Required: 3-5 Years |
| 06:01.41 | JBDiGriz | That's my advantage, 25 years of OS experience. :) |
| 06:01.53 | learner | bah, they have to put that to weed out the boatload of msce trained weenie wannabe programmers |
| 06:02.35 | learner | if you can back up your skills, most places will throw requirements out the window |
| 06:02.41 | learner | except maybe large companies |
| 06:03.03 | JBDiGriz | That doesn't weed them out. They've been trained by those certificate by mail places. |
| 06:03.26 | learner | hehe, you can never weed them out completely |
| 06:03.42 | JBDiGriz | I've dealt with big business. Again it serves a purpose! |
| 06:03.56 | learner | I'm amazed how many people seemingly "acheived" a bs in cs these days |
| 06:04.05 | learner | they graduate barely knowing how to compile |
| 06:04.14 | learner | or how a computer works |
| 06:04.36 | JBDiGriz | I can weed thse guys out in about 5 minutes worth of an interview. They can take the MSCE test, but they can't apply any of their knowledge |
| 06:04.48 | learner | big business is great for making money :) -- a very good purpose indeed... |
| 06:04.58 | Michaelh | cs isn't just about programming -- people usually find that out quickly |
| 06:05.48 | JBDiGriz | For the new programmers just out of college, it's about programming, and understanding what the people who have experience are teaching you. |
| 06:05.53 | captain_proton | real "computer science" is just math :) |
| 06:06.06 | Michaelh | what's funny is a company like Accenture which apparently doesn't care didly squat about whether a person can program |
| 06:06.16 | JBDiGriz | It sounds like captain_proton has been spending time at Stanford. |
| 06:06.36 | captain_proton | JBDiGriz: eh, its true, especially in graphics |
| 06:06.42 | captain_proton | its like linear algebra on a stick |
| 06:06.57 | learner | if you're "new" -- it's more about capability to learn than what you actually know |
| 06:07.04 | captain_proton | with some differential equations and topology thrown in for kicks |
| 06:07.12 | learner | if you are passionate about your work, it will show -- and you should be passionate |
| 06:07.30 | JBDiGriz | That's just one aspect of computer science. When you get into device drivers and networks, the math is important, but you have to understand the physics as well. |
| 06:07.57 | Michaelh | So aren't you saying basically that I have to know the right people? |
| 06:08.18 | JBDiGriz | Being young, you also have to realize how much more there is to learn. |
| 06:08.28 | captain_proton | JBDiGriz: well - i tend to group a lot of the "physics" into software engineering rather than computer science |
| 06:08.30 | Michaelh | I can hardly claim to be any "pro".. I can't really get in the door that way |
| 06:08.30 | JBDiGriz | Knowing the right people will get you there faster. |
| 06:08.37 | captain_proton | but its all one big happy undefinable field |
| 06:09.13 | Michaelh | I am actually 30... finished my degree late :) |
| 06:09.20 | JBDiGriz | Computer Science has split into several separate fields. I barely have anything in common with the people who develop user applications and guis. |
| 06:09.40 | JBDiGriz | bzflag is about as far from hardware as I've gotten lately. |
| 06:09.47 | captain_proton | heh |
| 06:09.53 | learner | heh |
| 06:09.54 | captain_proton | embedded work? |
| 06:10.21 | learner | I wouldn't call a VAX embedded, would you jb? |
| 06:10.29 | JBDiGriz | embedded linux/network device drivers and hardware enhanced ipsec/ printer drivers |
| 06:10.36 | captain_proton | people still use VAXes? :) |
| 06:10.49 | Michaelh | sounds like loads of fun |
| 06:10.50 | JBDiGriz | Back when I was working on a VAX, I was porting Unix for a living. |
| 06:11.07 | learner | that had to be some cool stuff jb |
| 06:11.12 | Noodleman | anyone know of a good, legal music service that doesn't make you download a stupid client |
| 06:11.14 | Noodleman | ? |
| 06:11.21 | captain_proton | Noodleman: mp3.com |
| 06:11.23 | learner | itunes |
| 06:11.23 | JBDiGriz | Only a few large companies actually deal with the kernel anymore. |
| 06:11.50 | Noodleman | captain_proton: they don't do anything to make sure the music they have is legal, tho |
| 06:12.22 | Noodleman | learner: i wish, but i don't have a mac (will soon tho) |
| 06:12.27 | captain_proton | Noodleman: its almost all indie - for a person to put up stuff they have to agree that they own copyright |
| 06:12.29 | learner | good for you :) |
| 06:12.32 | Noodleman | maybe in a month, if i'm lucky |
| 06:12.45 | JBDiGriz | going for a g5? |
| 06:12.49 | Noodleman | maybe |
| 06:13.14 | Noodleman | i doubt the credibility of the benchmarks, but a 64-bit PC is kewl!! |
| 06:13.31 | learner | heh.. he said "kewl" |
| 06:13.35 | captain_proton | Noodleman: well apple skewed the benchmarks :) |
| 06:13.45 | captain_proton | turning off hyperthreading = blah |
| 06:13.46 | Noodleman | i figured that much |
| 06:14.16 | learner | not exactly, proton -- for the benchmark, hyperthreading actually results in slower performance |
| 06:14.41 | learner | for a real system, though -- you would have had it on, of course |
| 06:15.13 | Noodleman | benchmarks are usually just a bunch of hogwash anyways |
| 06:15.22 | JBDiGriz | Microsoft has been spreading lots of FUD about the benchmarks. Benchmarks are only a marketing device and should mostly be ignored in favor of what you want to accomplish with the machine. |
| 06:15.35 | learner | unless your application itself under normal usage is the benchmark.. |
| 06:15.41 | Noodleman | hehe |
| 06:15.55 | captain_proton | learner: well - they turned it on for the "single processor" benchmark (where it has no effect) |
| 06:16.00 | JBDiGriz | I've only run into a couple of places like that, and they need one of each! |
| 06:16.03 | captain_proton | and turned it off on the "multiprocessor" benchmark |
| 06:16.06 | captain_proton | where it would help |
| 06:17.51 | learner | I'll see if I can dig up the reference, cap |
| 06:18.03 | captain_proton | but yes, benchmarks mean pretty much nothing =) |
| 06:18.10 | learner | but at least for the multiprocessor -- it would have not helped |
| 06:18.22 | captain_proton | yes it would |
| 06:18.28 | learner | no it wouldn't |
| 06:18.32 | learner | :P |
| 06:18.39 | JBDiGriz | children, children! |
| 06:18.44 | captain_proton | nuh uh! |
| 06:19.05 | JBDiGriz | if this doesn't stop, you're both sitting in the corner with ibot. |
| 06:19.12 | learner | I like ibot |
| 06:19.49 | JBDiGriz | Maybe that's why you're spending so much time working, and not enough time having a life? |
| 06:20.10 | learner | My work is my life :) |
| 06:20.26 | captain_proton | thats kind of sad... |
| 06:20.58 | JBDiGriz | It's a phase that a number of us go through, lasting from shortly after college until late 20's |
| 06:21.00 | learner | I make little distinction between work and play |
| 06:21.05 | learner | my work is play |
| 06:21.53 | JBDiGriz | I was about 25 when I decided there were a few other things I wanted to do, and started changing my priorities. |
| 06:24.59 | learner | what did you do? |
| 06:25.23 | JBDiGriz | I took a 6 week vacation and went bicycling through China |
| 06:25.46 | learner | Wow. I'm impressed |
| 06:26.21 | JBDiGriz | It was an organized trip through an agency in Australia, but it got me out to realize there was a lot more than work. |
| 06:27.59 | learner | That's what I get out of rowing |
| 06:28.24 | learner | love crew |
| 06:28.44 | JBDiGriz | Try taking a trip through the Grand Canyon, it's not crew, but it's exciting! |
| 06:29.02 | learner | heh |
| 06:29.04 | *** join/#bzflag niksie (~nkist@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 06:29.18 | learner | I've considered a bike trip cross-country |
| 06:29.45 | learner | bike to CA or WA, and fly back |
| 06:30.02 | learner | probably CA -- better food |
| 06:30.35 | captain_proton | hmm... |
| 06:30.41 | JBDiGriz | I took a train up to OR, and biked from Ashland to Coos Bay to Crater Lake. |
| 06:30.46 | captain_proton | that'd only take about a month, with ideal conditions |
| 06:31.11 | learner | do you still bike jb? |
| 06:31.36 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 06:31.38 | JBDiGriz | Occasionally, I'm out in the desert on a mountain bike. My road bike needs some major repairs. |
| 06:31.44 | captain_proton | moz 1.5 sleighted to go alpha in a couple weeks |
| 06:32.05 | learner | that was quick.. wasn't 1.0 like 2 months ago? |
| 06:32.21 | JBDiGriz | 1.4 was out this past week. |
| 06:32.34 | captain_proton | 1.0 was over a year ago |
| 06:32.44 | captain_proton | and 1.5 is based off firebird iirc |
| 06:33.07 | JBDiGriz | I have 1.1 on a secondary disk from 8/26/02 |
| 06:33.46 | learner | I think I'm just confusing it with another project |
| 06:34.50 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 06:34.53 | captain_proton | bzflag needs a tinderbox =) |
| 06:36.17 | captain_proton | in a "that would be neat" context |
| 06:37.17 | captain_proton | =} |
| 06:38.09 | JBDiGriz | I think I'll grow my Snidely Whiplash moustache back this year. |
| 06:38.26 | captain_proton | ooh |
| 06:46.56 | learner | does anyone know if the regexp "bla[h$]?" is valid? can you put a line anchor into a character class? |
| 06:49.02 | JBDiGriz | I'm not sure, I would have to go back to the documents, but I don't think it is valid. |
| 06:49.37 | learner | I need a way to say "match end of word" |
| 06:50.02 | learner | which would normally be [^[:alpha:]] or $ |
| 06:50.34 | learner | I'd rather not double all my expressions just to handle having a match as the last word on a line.. |
| 06:51.11 | *** part/#bzflag niksie (~nkist@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 06:56.21 | captain_proton | hm |
| 06:56.34 | captain_proton | i'd forgotten what a powerful image the train tracks are in spirited away =) |
| 06:59.29 | learner | aha.. |
| 07:02.44 | JBDiGriz | Time for me to catch some z's, g'nite |
| 07:02.51 | captain_proton | 'night |
| 07:03.14 | *** part/#bzflag JBDiGriz (~JBDiGriz@adsl-63-204-118-6.dsl.sndg02.pacbell.net) |
| 07:42.03 | *** join/#bzflag niksie (~nkist@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 08:28.44 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 08:28.53 | captain_proton | someone here was working on a string tokenizer? |
| 08:29.38 | captain_proton | ah i see, there's a very simple one |
| 08:29.53 | learner | eh? |
| 08:30.05 | captain_proton | common.h:190 |
| 08:30.27 | captain_proton | i wonder if i can use that and just do higher-level parsing to handle quoted strings |
| 08:42.46 | captain_proton | hows it work? |
| 08:43.26 | learner | it matches bad words, and slews of combinations with fairly complex regular expressions |
| 08:43.49 | learner | automatic internal expansions l i k e th is |
| 08:43.55 | learner | l33t-speak |
| 08:44.20 | learner | automatic suffix, case, whitespace, and prefix handling |
| 08:45.25 | captain_proton | would it catch "shittah" ? |
| 08:45.50 | learner | yes |
| 08:46.01 | learner | if "shit" was in the bad words list.. |
| 08:46.15 | learner | it would catch the double t expansion |
| 08:46.16 | captain_proton | but shittah isn't a bad word... ;-) |
| 08:46.30 | learner | and "ah" is a slang suffix |
| 08:46.42 | captain_proton | heh, thats kind of neat nonetheless |
| 08:47.52 | learner | basically, you'll have to either be talking about something rather odd (like shittah -- which is questionable) or be trying really hard to get around it |
| 08:48.08 | learner | there's no way to make it solid, but the existing was pathetic |
| 08:48.20 | captain_proton | yes, i doubt people are going to be talking about obscure kinds of trees in bzflag =) |
| 08:48.21 | learner | it was a simple exact match comparison |
| 08:48.53 | learner | ~dict shittah |
| 08:49.06 | learner | :) |
| 08:49.51 | learner | regardless.. that word could be used obscenely -- which is why it's caught ;) |
| 08:50.06 | learner | I'm debating to turn off the suffix matching altogether |
| 08:50.38 | learner | then the admin would specifically have to add shitah to their bad words list if they wanted to match it |
| 08:50.55 | captain_proton | what suffixes does it use? |
| 08:51.16 | learner | there are 42 common suffixes |
| 08:51.20 | learner | for english |
| 08:51.31 | learner | <PROTECTED> |
| 08:51.44 | learner | (ive|en|ic|al|able|y|ous|ful|less) for adjectives |
| 08:51.55 | learner | (en|ize|ate|ify|fy|ed) for verbs |
| 08:52.01 | learner | (ly) for adverbs |
| 08:52.10 | learner | (s|es) for plurality |
| 08:52.16 | learner | (ing|let) for imperfect verb, and diminutive |
| 08:52.23 | learner | (a|z|r|ah|io|rs|rz|in|n|ster|meister) for slang |
| 08:52.25 | learner | ;) |
| 08:53.24 | learner | shitlet fuka b1tchz! |
| 08:53.34 | captain_proton | haha |
| 08:54.52 | learner | that'll turn into "&@#$*#! *@$^ !*$&@#!" |
| 08:55.49 | learner | things get interesting when you consider international obscenities |
| 08:56.25 | learner | many languages have words that are common-place in english, yet vulger in language X |
| 08:56.41 | learner | it'll be up to the admin to decide on their unacceptable list |
| 08:56.55 | captain_proton | there are also some very obscure things |
| 08:57.29 | learner | I compiled a multilengual list that has about 14 or so languages of a couple thousand "bad" words/phrases |
| 08:57.30 | captain_proton | like a negresses vertes song i have, about a fly who flies into people's mouths while they're reading the bible, but the fly's name is 'zobi', which is extremely obscure slang for penis :P |
| 08:58.08 | learner | in what language? |
| 08:58.11 | captain_proton | french |
| 09:00.41 | captain_proton | hrm |
| 09:01.02 | captain_proton | do istreams automatically close their file when they go out of scope? |
| 09:01.05 | learner | here's one I had to comment out.. "sega" |
| 09:01.15 | captain_proton | ooh whats that mean? |
| 09:01.21 | captain_proton | and in what language? |
| 09:01.37 | learner | in italian it means to beat/f*ck off |
| 09:01.46 | captain_proton | ah |
| 09:01.58 | learner | noun |
| 09:02.57 | learner | yes, it will close automatically when it goes out of scope |
| 09:03.43 | learner | at least, that's the behavior of ifstream... |
| 09:04.11 | captain_proton | ok |
| 09:04.29 | captain_proton | but they're enclosed in a block |
| 09:07.39 | learner | there should be no problem calling close() explicitly anyways, though.. just so there's no confusion |
| 09:08.53 | captain_proton | well eventually i'll be getting rid of it |
| 09:15.15 | *** join/#bzflag Riseman (~pretorian@234.Red-217-127-82.pooles.rima-tde.net) |
| 09:15.24 | Riseman | good morning all |
| 09:16.54 | captain_proton | ah neat, the tokenizer works |
| 09:16.58 | Riseman | i think that all of us is in sleep ;) |
| 09:17.02 | captain_proton | but this would be so much easier in python... |
| 09:17.14 | captain_proton | hm, sleep, thats a good idea |
| 09:17.22 | Riseman | :) |
| 09:17.27 | captain_proton | 'night :) |
| 09:17.39 | learner | night |
| 09:17.50 | Riseman | night captain :)) |
| 09:54.25 | Riseman | bye all |
| 11:15.09 | *** join/#bzflag larsl_56k (~larsl@md469072c.utfors.se) |
| 11:23.55 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-31-151.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 11:32.04 | *** join/#bzflag sussudio (Suss@81.68.132.217) |
| 11:40.07 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-31-151.w81-249.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 11:54.20 | sussudio | ~d |
| 11:55.15 | sussudio | ok, what the hell was that. "tbfm" joins as an observer on ducati and bzflag crashes |
| 11:58.41 | sussudio | ~d |
| 13:27.13 | *** part/#bzflag sussudio (Suss@81.68.132.217) |
| 13:39.26 | *** join/#bzflag litlun (~hhommers@fw-nl.baan.com) |
| 13:40.16 | litlun | any idea on where to find a script to log 'bzfs -printscore' to a web page ? |
| 13:41.38 | litlun | anybody here ? |
| 13:43.50 | litlun | big, big silence |
| 13:43.52 | litlun | :-( |
| 13:44.47 | *** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 13:44.59 | litlun | hi |
| 13:45.15 | david_v | hey |
| 13:45.29 | litlun | great |
| 13:45.33 | litlun | sb answering ;-) |
| 13:45.48 | david_v | you sure? it can be a script :) |
| 13:45.58 | litlun | yes |
| 13:46.01 | david_v | i actually made an auto-greet script one day... lol |
| 13:46.04 | litlun | at least it's an answer |
| 13:46.07 | david_v | it was too annoying though, removed it :) |
| 13:46.17 | litlun | bzflag enthusiast ? |
| 13:46.18 | david_v | for one there was no delay |
| 13:46.25 | david_v | so it answered almost before someone said hi :) |
| 13:46.29 | litlun | grin |
| 13:46.32 | david_v | ah yea... play the game often |
| 13:47.02 | litlun | do you have any idea whether there's a script that can be used to process the "-printscore" output |
| 13:47.06 | litlun | to go in a webpage ? |
| 13:47.36 | david_v | no sorry, i haven't looked into the technical aspects of bzflag yet |
| 13:47.42 | litlun | ok |
| 13:47.51 | litlun | nor have I |
| 13:56.39 | *** part/#bzflag litlun (~hhommers@fw-nl.baan.com) |
| 13:58.34 | *** join/#bzflag litlun (~hhommers@fw-nl.baan.com) |
| 14:05.11 | litlun | * wake up |
| 14:05.20 | learner | tryin' |
| 14:05.31 | *** join/#bzflag niksie (foobar@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 14:06.03 | litlun | 01,15d'you know of a script that handles '-printscore' output? |
| 14:06.33 | learner | what was your question about parsing printscore, litlun? |
| 14:07.06 | litlun | 01,1501,00is there a script available somewhere that turns it into nice webpages with statistics ? |
| 14:07.17 | litlun | 01,00I can write my own, but.... |
| 14:07.27 | litlun | 01,00not reinventing the wheel is way cheaper |
| 14:07.31 | learner | I'm seeing empty lines from you... |
| 14:07.38 | litlun | 01,00oops |
| 14:07.41 | litlun | 01,00still? |
| 14:07.42 | learner | something up with your irc client? |
| 14:07.46 | litlun | 01,00I think so |
| 14:07.49 | *** join/#bzflag mmu (~revol@ALyon-209-1-10-125.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 14:07.55 | litlun | 01,0001,15any better ? |
| 14:08.02 | david_v | litlun: your text is black on white... |
| 14:08.12 | david_v | black on white gray now |
| 14:08.16 | david_v | light gray i mean |
| 14:08.19 | litlun | 01,150202,00and now ? |
| 14:08.27 | litlun | 01,0002should be OK |
| 14:08.28 | david_v | yuk, blue on white... why any fixed bg? |
| 14:08.35 | learner | yes.. set it to black on white for goodness sake |
| 14:08.36 | david_v | remove the fixed bg... |
| 14:09.01 | litlun | 01,00020101,99this ? |
| 14:09.13 | david_v | wow, now it's empty instead |
| 14:09.22 | david_v | but that was no text at all, though |
| 14:09.32 | litlun | shows black on white here :-( |
| 14:09.44 | learner | that's better |
| 14:09.51 | niksie | its black on green here |
| 14:09.56 | niksie | use normal text for gods sake |
| 14:09.56 | litlun | hmm |
| 14:09.58 | litlun | nice |
| 14:10.03 | niksie | now its good |
| 14:10.12 | litlun | didn't change a thing |
| 14:10.20 | litlun | i'll cycle my client |
| 14:10.23 | david_v | now it's good... |
| 14:10.23 | litlun | back soon |
| 14:10.24 | niksie | oh, my bad, I was still ooking at your 9this? line |
| 14:10.32 | litlun | ok |
| 14:10.36 | litlun | I'll stay |
| 14:10.45 | litlun | back to the -printscore outpot |
| 14:10.51 | litlun | output |
| 14:10.55 | learner | there are scripts, http://bzflag.baat.dk/new/ |
| 14:11.10 | learner | "scripts" being a very loose word |
| 14:12.06 | learner | there's also http://stats.bzflag.org/score.php |
| 14:12.28 | litlun | those are webpages containing scores |
| 14:12.54 | learner | yes? |
| 14:13.20 | litlun | I'm looking for the scripts that compile those pages |
| 14:13.31 | litlun | (for our 'lunch break games') |
| 14:14.59 | learner | well, both of those guys aren't here right now |
| 14:15.16 | learner | I'm sure one's just a php hack, the other probably a perl hack |
| 14:15.23 | litlun | yes |
| 14:15.29 | litlun | I think so |
| 14:15.45 | litlun | but I'd rather copy than write from scratch ;-) |
| 14:20.12 | learner | you could be done by the time you find them |
| 14:20.19 | learner | there's only like 6 fields |
| 14:21.28 | learner | 9 including markers and 12 including time limit |
| 14:23.12 | learner | parsing the output is trivial, your "hard" part (which still isn't really that hard) is storing the data and formatting it up for web |
| 14:23.41 | learner | but... if you're going to wait |
| 14:23.52 | learner | look for [dmp] and/or patlabor |
| 14:24.36 | learner | er, scratch patlabor, I meant Noodleman or jzaun |
| 14:26.40 | litlun | Tha ;-) |
| 14:34.17 | *** part/#bzflag litlun (~hhommers@fw-nl.baan.com) |
| 14:36.30 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-10-125.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 14:52.12 | *** join/#bzflag larsl_56k (~larsl@md4692412.utfors.se) |
| 15:06.21 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-10-125.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 15:08.54 | *** join/#bzflag sussudio (Suss@81.68.132.217) |
| 15:09.04 | sussudio | ~bzflist |
| 15:48.45 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~jeffm@208.48.199.214) |
| 15:48.45 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ |
| 15:54.54 | *** join/#bzflag niksie (foobar@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 16:03.55 | *** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 16:19.14 | *** join/#bzflag Legolas (~Legolas@adsl-68-73-117-113.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 16:19.56 | *** join/#bzflag sn0w_m0nkey (~sn0w_m0nk@photon.unm.edu) |
| 16:20.06 | sn0w_m0nkey | mornin |
| 16:20.19 | Legolas | sup monkey? |
| 16:21.04 | sn0w_m0nkey | ahh was looking at zee bros website scores |
| 16:21.14 | sn0w_m0nkey | iron foot had a huge score! |
| 16:21.41 | sn0w_m0nkey | over a 1000 |
| 16:23.52 | sussudio | yes, there should be a time limit on pausing. |
| 16:24.18 | Legolas | but i think her was plaing against robots |
| 16:39.09 | *** join/#bzflag JBDiGriz (~JBDiGriz@216.188.65.26) |
| 17:00.44 | *** join/#bzflag Mayhem (~Mayhem@dsl-217-155-141-174.zen.co.uk) |
| 17:04.23 | *** join/#bzflag learnerAtWork (sean@chr160dhcp1675.chrchv01.md.comcast.net) |
| 17:06.51 | *** join/#bzflag MrFish_ (~chatzilla@psc-pc1162.leeds.ac.uk) |
| 17:06.58 | MrFish_ | hello |
| 17:07.41 | *** join/#bzflag Michaelh (Mouse@172-198.dynamic.visi.com) |
| 17:07.45 | *** join/#bzflag MrCooper (~daenzer@dclient80-218-118-173.hispeed.ch) |
| 17:07.57 | Michaelh | is software development supposed to in caps like Software Development? |
| 17:07.59 | Mayhem | Hello Mr University of Ledds :) |
| 17:08.13 | Mayhem | s/Ledds/Leeds/ |
| 17:09.09 | MrFish_ | ooo |
| 17:09.10 | Mayhem | Michaelh: if its a title, I guess so. |
| 17:09.38 | Mayhem | Michaelh: but if you are talking about the process, probably not |
| 17:09.55 | Michaelh | "I am pursuing a career in Software Development" |
| 17:09.56 | Michaelh | ? |
| 17:10.33 | Mayhem | hmm |
| 17:10.35 | Michaelh | one thing for sure -- I will not ask Patl about grammer issues :) |
| 17:10.42 | Michaelh | gramar-- whatever |
| 17:10.45 | Michaelh | eek |
| 17:10.56 | Mayhem | or speelin :) |
| 17:11.03 | Michaelh | yep |
| 17:11.25 | Mayhem | "I am pursuing a career in software development" |
| 17:11.37 | Mayhem | looks ok, caps may be a bit pretentious |
| 17:12.07 | Mayhem | however, you may become a "Software Development Engineer" |
| 17:13.51 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~jeffm@208.48.199.214) |
| 17:13.51 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ |
| 17:14.28 | MrFish_ | is there lots of lag on here? |
| 17:14.41 | Michaelh | hopefully |
| 17:14.54 | MrFish_ | anyway |
| 17:14.57 | MrFish_ | byee |
| 17:14.59 | *** part/#bzflag MrFish_ (~chatzilla@psc-pc1162.leeds.ac.uk) |
| 17:15.08 | Patlabor221 | irc has lag? |
| 17:15.12 | Mayhem | hmm, I wonder what the point of that was? |
| 17:15.41 | JBDiGriz | Of course irc has lag, lag is the distance between you and the servers. |
| 17:16.01 | JBDiGriz | I think the point is that it's summer, and school's out. |
| 17:16.01 | Mayhem | with a distributed network like irc, the lag could vary more than that |
| 17:16.36 | Patlabor221 | ok, perceptable lag :) it is text |
| 17:16.40 | JBDiGriz | Mayhem: True, I'm being overly simplistic |
| 17:16.42 | Mayhem | My isp was screwing with their network yesterday, made my first hop rtt jump by a factor of 8 :( |
| 17:17.07 | Mayhem | that was eight(8) followed by a frown :( |
| 17:17.38 | JBDiGriz | A factor of 8 isn't much, if they get to a couple orders of magnitude, then I would start complaining at them! |
| 17:18.15 | Mayhem | Heh, I think that was enought to have a lot of customers screaming at em, cause they fixed it pretty fast |
| 17:18.58 | JBDiGriz | Your ISP must service technical customers if they even noticed it! I would like an ISP like that. |
| 17:19.40 | Mayhem | Heh. its nice to have an ISP that cares. |
| 17:20.00 | Mayhem | The even dropped their prices by a few quid last month :) |
| 17:20.25 | JBDiGriz | My ISP doesn't understand when I complain about sections of their IP space being on various black lists. |
| 17:21.51 | Mayhem | They say its not their problem that you can't send email cause you are blackholed. |
| 17:22.29 | JBDiGriz | These guys didn't get that far, they wanted to debug why I couldn't get mail working with their servers and Outlook. |
| 17:22.29 | Mayhem | cause you are in their class B dynamip ip pool :( |
| 17:22.55 | JBDiGriz | Of course, I don't run Outlook, so it became my problem. |
| 17:22.55 | Mayhem | Click on start, go to programs... ;) |
| 17:23.27 | JBDiGriz | And they didn't have any mechanism to elevate the situation up to someone who has a clue. |
| 17:23.39 | Mayhem | who's the isp? |
| 17:23.45 | JBDiGriz | SBC Yahoo |
| 17:24.18 | JBDiGriz | Unfortunately, the original deal was for one year, and so I can't switch without heavy penalties until next January! |
| 17:25.30 | JBDiGriz | My previous ISP went out of business with about 30 days notice. |
| 17:26.11 | Mayhem | I shopped around till I found an one with a 30 day contract instead of 12 months, hate being locked in. |
| 17:26.49 | Michaelh | anyone particulary good with grammar / spelling that would like to look over a resume / cover letter that I have? |
| 17:27.05 | Mayhem | Michaelh: yeah, why not :) |
| 17:27.27 | JBDiGriz | Michaelh: Put it on a web site, and post the URL. You want people to read it! |
| 17:37.02 | Michaelh | don't hate me -- it's in word format :) |
| 17:37.03 | Michaelh | http://www.visi.com/~michaelh/files/resume.doc |
| 17:37.31 | Michaelh | http://www.visi.com/~michaelh/files/coverletter.doc |
| 17:37.44 | Michaelh | cover letter is what I care more about...... |
| 17:37.48 | Michaelh | sort of |
| 17:38.07 | Mayhem | a word document?!?!?! |
| 17:38.34 | Mayhem | I'm not gonna hire you if you send me a word document :) |
| 17:39.32 | Michaelh | Yes I'm aware there are people out there like that |
| 17:39.51 | Michaelh | I can conver to happy ascii format too |
| 17:40.18 | Mayhem | HTML would be an improvement at least |
| 17:40.42 | Michaelh | arg... I know word would butcher it in that conversion |
| 17:40.47 | sussudio | dont forget some <blink> tags |
| 17:40.51 | Michaelh | heh |
| 17:41.09 | Michaelh | How do I make a html resume that actually fits on a page, or do I not? |
| 17:41.19 | Michaelh | printed version would be different? |
| 17:42.00 | sussudio | not if you use tracing paper on your monitor |
| 17:42.18 | Michaelh | gee thanks...... |
| 17:42.20 | Michaelh | :) |
| 17:42.27 | Mayhem | ~lart sussudio |
| 17:42.33 | Michaelh | but what if I have to scroll it |
| 17:42.35 | sussudio | ~pig Mayhem |
| 17:42.36 | | Mayhem is 49% pig! |
| 17:42.43 | Mayhem | heh, less than half! |
| 17:44.34 | Mayhem | Michaelh: how picky do you want us to be? |
| 17:44.46 | Michaelh | as much as you like to be |
| 17:45.20 | Michaelh | I know it's not exactly 100% spiffy |
| 17:45.39 | *** join/#bzflag Quol_ (~ianf@65.39.216.155) |
| 17:45.40 | Mayhem | this things are constantly in a process of refinement... |
| 17:45.49 | Michaelh | grammer and spelling -- very picky would be good |
| 17:46.57 | Mayhem | they seem generally ok, would be more focusing on structure and choice of language. |
| 17:47.50 | Michaelh | suggestions suggestions? |
| 17:48.05 | Mayhem | The start of you resume states what job you are after, but the cover letter is sort of for that... |
| 17:48.11 | JBDiGriz | The first sentence isn't really a grabber. It is the most important sentence. |
| 17:48.34 | JBDiGriz | I would start with the second sentence of what you want. |
| 17:48.44 | Mayhem | yes, I agree with JB, gotta make it grab you. |
| 17:49.02 | Michaelh | does "I am seeking an entry-level position in software development " grab ya? :) |
| 17:49.19 | Mayhem | 4 paragraphs in a row that start with 'I' |
| 17:49.32 | Mayhem | not good, need to vary the phrasing |
| 17:49.43 | Michaelh | arg .. making me work ..... |
| 17:49.53 | Mayhem | yes... exactly... |
| 17:50.02 | JBDiGriz | Your accomplishments at the University are well laid out, but the internship at HRB should be the next most important achievement. |
| 17:50.17 | JBDiGriz | No offense to present company! :) |
| 17:50.21 | Michaelh | lol |
| 17:50.53 | Michaelh | You don't think compusa counts as an achievement huh? |
| 17:50.58 | Michaelh | :) |
| 17:51.12 | Mayhem | the compusa stuff looks kinda lame to be honest :) |
| 17:51.32 | JBDiGriz | I wouldn't give more than a passing mention to bzflag, although it is good to bring up the nature of opengl, and realtime. |
| 17:51.36 | Mayhem | if you can detail what you do in an important way. |
| 17:51.41 | JBDiGriz | I'm still working on the cover letter. |
| 17:52.07 | Mayhem | Beware some people might see 'game' and have a negative reaction. |
| 17:52.44 | Michaelh | What am I supposed to do with the CompUSA stuff? I figure mentioned that I have *a* job is somewhat important |
| 17:53.22 | Michaelh | what do I say -- Stuff computer stuff in bags.... |
| 17:53.37 | *** join/#bzflag Carnage (strayer@dyn216-8-173-56.ADSL.mnsi.net) |
| 17:53.38 | Michaelh | Expeditied computer supplies |
| 17:53.51 | JBDiGriz | The CompUSA stuff is proper to have in the resume. |
| 17:55.21 | JBDiGriz | In the resume, internships should be above projects. |
| 17:56.14 | JBDiGriz | You need to rewrite your job duties at Decision 1, I'm not quite sure what you mean. |
| 17:57.23 | Mayhem | 'informed of services' isn't very good grammar. |
| 17:57.24 | JBDiGriz | bzflag is mentioned nicely in the resume. You might want to leave it out of the cover letter, and just mention C++ and opengl. |
| 17:58.50 | JBDiGriz | Overall, it's a very good start. Many companies prefer word format, but I prefer using html or TeX and converting to whatever is necessary. |
| 17:59.09 | Mayhem | drop 'on my end' from description of bzflag project. |
| 17:59.54 | Mayhem | You can always go to HTML to word, but go from word to html and you will be laughed at :) |
| 18:00.02 | Michaelh | My resume has gone through several morphs |
| 18:00.15 | Michaelh | I could put up the original.. you'd laugh |
| 18:00.43 | Mayhem | When I was last applying for a job, I had a different resume for each application. |
| 18:01.08 | JBDiGriz | I have a single resume, but a different list of projects and cover letter. |
| 18:01.15 | Mayhem | Highlighting different areas depending on the job requirements |
| 18:01.50 | Michaelh | I also have different resumes |
| 18:02.08 | Michaelh | So you put projects on a different sheet than the resume? |
| 18:02.10 | JBDiGriz | That makes it more difficult to post a resume. |
| 18:02.23 | Michaelh | That would help me a bit with space and font size issues |
| 18:02.31 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221Work (~jeffm@208.48.199.214) |
| 18:02.37 | JBDiGriz | I'm a contractor, so I have about 4 pages of projects that I've worked on. |
| 18:02.43 | Michaelh | Doh... |
| 18:03.13 | Michaelh | What about the trap of wanting to be a software engineer but wanting to apply also for IT kinds of positions |
| 18:03.25 | Michaelh | do I just always say what I optimally want? |
| 18:04.00 | Michaelh | I mean for gods sake I'm working at compusa...... :) |
| 18:04.04 | JBDiGriz | That goes into the cover letter for the specific job. Always ask to be a software engineer. It won't eliminate you from IT positions. |
| 18:04.26 | Michaelh | You're suggesting wiping out "Objective" ? |
| 18:05.09 | Michaelh | on the resume I mean |
| 18:05.50 | JBDiGriz | Make it simpler. "I am seeking a position in Software Development, using C++ or Java" |
| 18:06.19 | Mayhem | I though you wanted to be an "Objective C software developer" :) |
| 18:06.39 | JBDiGriz | That would certainly narrow down the number of positions available! :) |
| 18:06.42 | Michaelh | doh |
| 18:07.34 | Mayhem | Patlabor221Work: have you considered using a bitfield for shootThrough, driveThrough etc. instead of a byte for each? |
| 18:08.01 | Patlabor221Work | that woudl work |
| 18:08.04 | Michaelh | thanks guys -- that helps quite a bit |
| 18:08.06 | Patlabor221Work | tho bytes are cheap |
| 18:08.33 | Michaelh | I actually managed to crash windows explorer....... cool |
| 18:09.02 | Patlabor221Work | I am looking at other world definition technologys for post 1.9 |
| 18:09.18 | Michaelh | Word is such a nightmare when you cut and paste from one part to another |
| 18:09.24 | Michaelh | chaos just breaks out |
| 18:10.00 | Patlabor221Work | today is a day of chaos |
| 18:10.19 | Mayhem | Patlabor221Work: true, bytes are cheap. I'm updating the wiki with the new object formats. |
| 18:11.36 | Patlabor221Work | formats? |
| 18:11.45 | Patlabor221Work | as in in the world send? |
| 18:11.49 | Patlabor221Work | or as in in the map file? |
| 18:13.11 | JBDiGriz | I thought this Sunday was supposed to be the day of chaos. |
| 18:13.35 | Patlabor221Work | there are many days of chaos |
| 18:14.03 | Mayhem | Patlabor221Work: world send. I know its changing regularly, but its easier to follow in little bits. |
| 18:14.49 | Patlabor221Work | well I did it as bytes |
| 18:15.19 | Patlabor221Work | I would doc is as it is, then if we make it a bitfield, we update the docs |
| 18:16.30 | Mayhem | Heh, my description of flipZ is 'upside-down' :) |
| 18:16.48 | Patlabor221Work | that's what it does |
| 18:17.00 | Patlabor221Work | better then a negitive scale cus it makes you able to drive on them :) |
| 18:19.12 | *** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 18:20.22 | david_v | brb :) |
| 18:20.57 | Mayhem | That was a 'welcome' wave... |
| 18:21.21 | david_v | tears of joy :) |
| 18:21.25 | Michaelh | how is this |
| 18:21.25 | Michaelh | Customer Service Representative (May 99 - November 99): |
| 18:21.26 | Michaelh | Answered and logged inbound phone calls in a call center Served as an intermediary between field service technicians and customers in one position, and answered billing and service questions for an ISP in another position. |
| 18:22.27 | Michaelh | oops missed a . |
| 18:23.02 | Michaelh | is there a #resume ? :) |
| 18:23.55 | Mayhem | maybe drop the 'position' stuff and make it two shorter sentences. |
| 18:24.16 | Mayhem | sounds good though. |
| 18:25.42 | *** join/#bzflag TimRiker (~timr@proxyle02.ext.ti.com) |
| 18:25.42 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o TimRiker] by ChanServ |
| 18:27.19 | Michaelh | perhaps tim can hire me on ... :) |
| 18:28.21 | Mayhem | That would be a good start to your career... |
| 18:28.39 | Mayhem | maybe you could write some linux drivers for the ACX100 chip |
| 18:28.45 | Michaelh | arggggg |
| 18:28.56 | Michaelh | is it VB.NET or is vb.net |
| 18:29.02 | Michaelh | or vb.NET |
| 18:29.04 | Mayhem | its EVIL |
| 18:29.06 | Mayhem | :) |
| 18:29.29 | Michaelh | perhaps that's the over encompassing "namespace" |
| 18:36.49 | Mayhem | Patlabor221Work: can you give me a simple explanation of 'world size'? |
| 18:39.03 | david_v | need to prepare for the Bz Rebels - Fortix battle :) cya |
| 18:56.44 | learnerAtWork | has anyone seen asdf recently? |
| 18:56.49 | learnerAtWork | !bzseen asdf |
| 18:57.05 | learnerAtWork | ~seen [dmp] |
| 18:57.09 | | [dmp] <~dennis@3E6B486F.aalb.stofanet.dk> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 21h 18m 8s ago, saying: 'it didnt work :)'. |
| 18:57.35 | learnerAtWork | ~seen asdf |
| 18:57.36 | | asdf <~ccarroll@39.233.95.24.cfl.rr.com> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 34d 17h 34m 31s ago, saying: 'what is that saying all about anyhow?'. |
| 18:58.48 | Chestal | ~d |
| 18:59.08 | learnerAtWork | hey.. Chika.. haven't seen her in weeks.. |
| 18:59.21 | Michaelh | ~seen Michaelh |
| 18:59.21 | | michaelh is currently on #bzflag (1h 51m 40s). Has said a total of 62 messages. Is idling for 0s |
| 19:01.03 | *** join/#bzflag Carnage (strayer@dyn216-8-172-151.ADSL.mnsi.net) |
| 19:01.21 | Mayhem | ~seen greg1 |
| 19:01.21 | | greg1 <~admin@greghub.net1.nerim.net> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 16d 21h 7m 30s ago, saying: 'hey'. |
| 19:01.37 | Mayhem | learnerAtWork: we are about to match fortix :( |
| 19:01.48 | learnerAtWork | you and chika? |
| 19:01.59 | Mayhem | yeah. I have a baaaaad feeling about this... |
| 19:02.30 | Mayhem | oh well, gotta do my best. feel free to drop by and cheer us on :) |
| 19:02.52 | learnerAtWork | ah.. you should be able to take them! |
| 19:03.05 | learnerAtWork | I'll try to use the bzadmin observer.. |
| 19:03.17 | learnerAtWork | I can't graphically watch |
| 19:03.22 | learnerAtWork | where you matching at? |
| 19:09.16 | *** join/#bzflag captain_pistachi (~blardebla@12-203-245-57.client.attbi.com) |
| 19:09.16 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_pistachi] by ChanServ |
| 19:21.09 | *** join/#bzflag niksie (foobar@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 19:23.19 | learnerAtWork | anyone know if it's possible to specify the team you join in bzadmin? |
| 19:26.04 | *** join/#bzflag sussudio (Suss@81.68.132.217) |
| 19:26.08 | *** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-62-11-11-249.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 19:26.40 | sussudio | Tupone: if you ever see porco berlusconi, would you be so kind to kick him in the crotch area? |
| 19:27.08 | *** join/#bzflag mmu_man (~revol@ALyon-209-1-10-125.w193-251.abo.wanadoo.fr) |
| 19:27.11 | Tupone | sussudio: I'm very pleased to do If I can |
| 19:27.38 | sussudio | Tupone: just make sure he never reproduces again |
| 19:29.12 | Tupone | sussudio: You know Agnelli is dead, and for that reason Juventus has win the Football championship. I hope next year Milan will win! |
| 19:29.27 | learnerAtWork | bzfquery ducati.bzflag.org:59999 |
| 19:31.08 | learnerAtWork | bzfquery ducati.bzflag.org:59999 |
| 19:31.16 | learnerAtWork | oops. |
| 19:31.25 | learnerAtWork | srryyy! :) |
| 19:31.31 | learnerAtWork | wrong window |
| 19:31.46 | *** join/#bzflag larsl_56k (~larsl@md4690b1f.utfors.se) |
| 19:31.48 | learnerAtWork | was wondering what the heck was wrong with ibot |
| 19:32.32 | learnerAtWork | larsl... just the guy I'm looking for |
| 19:32.43 | learnerAtWork | is there a way to specify which team I join with bzadmin? |
| 19:33.10 | learnerAtWork | if not, is there a way I can quickly hack the code to force myself onto a certain team? |
| 19:33.44 | sussudio | learnerAtWork: sleep with the leader? |
| 19:34.19 | larsl_56k | learnerAtWork: Right now it always joins as green. |
| 19:34.25 | larsl_56k | That should be fixed. |
| 19:34.51 | learnerAtWork | eh, sussudio?? |
| 19:35.11 | larsl_56k | A quick hack would be to replace all occurances of "Green" in bzadmin.cxx, v17.cxx and v19.cxx with "Red" or the team you want. |
| 19:35.14 | learnerAtWork | larsl.. is there a quick fix line of code you can refer me to where I'm set to green |
| 19:35.26 | learnerAtWork | ah, perfect.. |
| 19:35.36 | sussudio | learnerAtWork: you weren't asking how to work you way to the top? |
| 19:36.06 | larsl_56k | There might be an ugly numeric value somewhere you have to change too. |
| 19:36.29 | learnerAtWork | sussudio: no.. I was asking about bzadmin |
| 19:36.44 | learnerAtWork | there's only one reference to green right near the top |
| 19:36.54 | *** join/#bzflag Skipp (~Skipp@12-206-137-38.client.attbi.com) |
| 19:37.02 | larsl_56k | Which version do you want to build? |
| 19:37.40 | larsl_56k | For bzadmin17 (1.7 protocol) that change should be enough, for bzadmin (1.9 protocol) you will need to change a numerical value in v19.cxx as well. |
| 19:37.54 | Skipp | how do i find my cable internet ip address in windows 2000, (cable connection is hooked up through a router) |
| 19:38.05 | learnerAtWork | mkay-- it's a 17, so I should be good |
| 19:38.14 | *** join/#bzflag Carnage (strayer@dyn216-8-172-151.ADSL.mnsi.net) |
| 19:40.45 | learnerAtWork | drat.. the game is over just as I built green.. :( |
| 19:40.52 | learnerAtWork | er, red |
| 19:41.11 | larsl_56k | Game is over? |
| 19:41.24 | learnerAtWork | yep |
| 19:41.29 | learnerAtWork | bzr won :) |
| 19:41.37 | learnerAtWork | carny, what was the score? |
| 19:41.46 | larsl_56k | You're not using it to spy on the other team, are you? =) |
| 19:42.04 | learnerAtWork | heh.. all I heard to "ours".. "ours" ... :) |
| 19:42.15 | learnerAtWork | s/to/was/ |
| 19:43.13 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.145) |
| 19:49.26 | *** part/#bzflag Skipp (~Skipp@12-206-137-38.client.attbi.com) |
| 19:51.37 | *** part/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-62-11-11-249.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 19:52.00 | learnerAtWork | larsl, how about team chat -- I noticed arrows will do private player chat |
| 19:52.22 | larsl_56k | Yes? |
| 19:52.36 | larsl_56k | Do you want a "Team" target as well? |
| 19:52.47 | learnerAtWork | of course.. :) |
| 19:55.13 | learnerAtWork | mmmmm... pistachios |
| 19:55.23 | captain_proton | =) |
| 19:55.51 | captain_proton | ya know whats really good? |
| 19:55.53 | learnerAtWork | the hard question is whether one is in a "red" mood or a "plain" mood.. :) |
| 19:55.58 | captain_proton | a hazelnut butter & honey sandwich |
| 19:56.08 | learnerAtWork | hehe.. I've made one of those |
| 19:56.24 | learnerAtWork | I have a jar of hazelnutbutter at home right now :) |
| 19:56.29 | JBDiGriz | I just finished lunch, all of a sudden dessert sounds good! |
| 19:57.07 | JBDiGriz | learnerAtWork: red pistachios have dyed their shell. |
| 19:58.06 | JBDiGriz | We had virtual Friday around here, BBQ on the patio! |
| 19:58.13 | learnerAtWork | and.. ? :) |
| 19:58.45 | JBDiGriz | and now I'm about to fall asleep from eating too much .......... |
| 19:59.29 | learnerAtWork | heheh |
| 19:59.58 | JBDiGriz | If I start snoring, could you nudge me awake? :) |
| 20:01.12 | JBDiGriz | Huh? What? |
| 20:05.10 | *** join/#bzflag BZSpiff (~BZSpiff@12-222-147-141.client.insightBB.com) |
| 20:06.35 | *** join/#bzflag Skipp (~Skipp@12-206-137-38.client.attbi.com) |
| 20:06.50 | Skipp | i am having trouble getting my server to show up on the server list |
| 20:06.57 | Skipp | i can connect to it |
| 20:07.08 | Skipp | but i think i am only displaying my server over my LAN |
| 20:07.28 | Skipp | how do i fix that? |
| 20:07.46 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221 (~jeffm@208.48.199.214) |
| 20:07.46 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o Patlabor221] by ChanServ |
| 20:09.49 | larsl_56k | Are you using -publicaddr ? |
| 20:10.54 | Skipp | yes |
| 20:11.16 | Skipp | and my ip address for my internet connection |
| 20:11.18 | larsl_56k | What address, what description? |
| 20:11.51 | Skipp | 12.206.137.38 |
| 20:11.56 | Skipp | port 5155 |
| 20:12.27 | larsl_56k | Yes, that's not in the list. |
| 20:12.51 | learnerAtWork | what's your "scope" |
| 20:12.51 | Skipp | what about 192.168.1.101 |
| 20:13.01 | Skipp | scope? |
| 20:13.02 | learnerAtWork | I think the flag is mps |
| 20:13.03 | larsl_56k | That's a local IP. |
| 20:13.14 | larsl_56k | I can't connect to your server - do you have a firewall? |
| 20:13.23 | Skipp | yes, but it is disabled |
| 20:13.39 | learnerAtWork | is the server supposedly running now? |
| 20:13.44 | Skipp | yeah |
| 20:14.06 | larsl_56k | Trying telnet... |
| 20:14.37 | learnerAtWork | can't ping it |
| 20:14.39 | JBDiGriz | traceroute doesn't reach your server |
| 20:14.46 | larsl_56k | Can't connect. |
| 20:14.54 | Skipp | what if i took out the cable from the cable modem to my router and then put it in my comp |
| 20:15.01 | larsl_56k | Maybe your ISP has a firewall? |
| 20:15.05 | Skipp | might |
| 20:15.12 | Skipp | does comcast have a firewall? |
| 20:15.18 | larsl_56k | I have no idea. |
| 20:15.19 | learnerAtWork | no, they don't |
| 20:15.20 | captain_proton | no |
| 20:15.34 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (~bryjen@63.147.94.145) |
| 20:15.37 | larsl_56k | If you have a router that is probably the problem. |
| 20:15.41 | Patlabor221 | does skipp have a firewall? |
| 20:15.54 | Skipp | norton antivirus |
| 20:15.58 | learnerAtWork | skipp, try direct connecting taking your router out of the loop |
| 20:16.08 | Patlabor221 | you use a router to share the connection don't you skipp? |
| 20:16.10 | learnerAtWork | make sure you can browse, etc |
| 20:16.29 | JBDiGriz | traceroute is showing through to AT&T WorldNet, the last available hop is12.244.71.34 |
| 20:16.41 | *** join/#bzflag Skipp_ (~Skipp@12-206-137-38.client.attbi.com) |
| 20:16.48 | learnerAtWork | I think that's still backbone |
| 20:17.18 | Skipp_ | so how do i let my server out my LAN to the server list? |
| 20:17.21 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 20:17.29 | JBDiGriz | Skipp is connecting to IRC from the same client though. |
| 20:17.29 | captain_proton | i should call comcast and force them to set up ipv6 routing |
| 20:18.00 | learnerAtWork | ha.. force comcast.. silly |
| 20:18.04 | learnerAtWork | futile |
| 20:18.09 | captain_proton | yeah yeah |
| 20:18.14 | Patlabor221 | skipp are you using a router on your lan? |
| 20:18.17 | Skipp_ | yes |
| 20:18.22 | captain_proton | i guess i could set up a 6to4 tunnel to work :) |
| 20:18.40 | learnerAtWork | skipp, take away the router |
| 20:18.43 | Patlabor221 | is it set to route packets on the right ports to the machine with the server |
| 20:18.50 | Patlabor221 | just set up the router |
| 20:18.54 | Patlabor221 | no need to remove it |
| 20:18.59 | Patlabor221 | or set one machine as DMZ |
| 20:19.06 | Skipp_ | i don't know |
| 20:19.16 | learnerAtWork | that's why I said take it out... |
| 20:19.28 | Patlabor221 | well that's what's geting in the way, you can config it, or as learner says remove it |
| 20:19.39 | learnerAtWork | if it works, then yo uknow that you need to figure out how to set up your router properly |
| 20:19.49 | Skipp_ | how do i config it without removing it |
| 20:19.50 | Patlabor221 | what router is it? |
| 20:19.55 | Skipp_ | linksys |
| 20:19.59 | learnerAtWork | 192.168.1.1 |
| 20:20.09 | learnerAtWork | browser admin |
| 20:20.29 | learnerAtWork | default linksys allows everything though, iirc |
| 20:20.40 | Patlabor221 | there should be an option to set a machine as DMZ, find the LAN IP of the machine with the server and set that IP as the DMZ Ip |
| 20:20.57 | Skipp_ | what is the DMZ ip? |
| 20:20.57 | Patlabor221 | learner it's a nat, you have to tell it where to route incoming unknowns |
| 20:21.09 | Patlabor221 | the LAN ip of the machine with the server |
| 20:21.24 | Patlabor221 | go in the server and type ipconfig in the command prompt |
| 20:21.28 | Patlabor221 | and put that IP in there |
| 20:21.38 | Patlabor221 | it will be 192.168.0.something |
| 20:21.41 | Skipp_ | the ip address is 192.168.1.101 |
| 20:21.42 | Patlabor221 | or .1.something |
| 20:21.51 | Patlabor221 | ok put that in for the DMZ ip |
| 20:21.54 | JBDiGriz | It looks like TCP can make it through to his machine. |
| 20:22.10 | Patlabor221 | that will route all knowns to the server |
| 20:22.10 | JBDiGriz | ICMP isn't reaching it, and drops at a previous hop. |
| 20:22.25 | Patlabor221 | just means tehy are killing pings |
| 20:22.46 | learnerAtWork | they==comcast would not be true |
| 20:22.53 | learnerAtWork | they==linksys, maybe |
| 20:22.53 | Skipp_ | how do i put in the dmz ip? |
| 20:23.05 | learnerAtWork | i think it's under the advanced tab, skipp |
| 20:23.12 | learnerAtWork | all the way on the right |
| 20:23.24 | Patlabor221 | it should be an option in the config for the router that you get by using the browser to go to the .1 IP |
| 20:23.46 | sussudio | bzgirl has a linksyscrapfest thing too |
| 20:23.48 | learnerAtWork | yes.. "Advanced" then "DMZ Host" |
| 20:23.57 | Skipp_ | where is advanced? |
| 20:24.11 | learnerAtWork | did you log in to the router? |
| 20:24.24 | learnerAtWork | it's on the menu on the top all the way on the right |
| 20:24.24 | Skipp_ | i am connected to it |
| 20:24.39 | Patlabor221 | it should have a main configuration page |
| 20:24.43 | JBDiGriz | It should be one of the tabbed entries on the top |
| 20:24.53 | Patlabor221 | or on the side |
| 20:25.09 | Skipp_ | k |
| 20:25.18 | learnerAtWork | linksys has some on the side? yours pat? |
| 20:25.25 | Patlabor221 | I've seen both |
| 20:25.29 | Patlabor221 | depends on what version |
| 20:25.31 | learnerAtWork | interesting |
| 20:25.43 | Patlabor221 | you have the WAP one don't you? |
| 20:25.51 | Skipp_ | there r coalesce buffers, enable pme, link speed & duplec, pci bus efficiency, receive buffers, and transmit control blocks |
| 20:25.59 | learnerAtWork | the 5-port Switch/WAP combo |
| 20:26.08 | Skipp_ | it is a 4 port |
| 20:26.14 | Patlabor221 | yeah learner yours has a difrent config ( slightly ) |
| 20:26.16 | Skipp_ | combo |
| 20:26.30 | bryjen | that sound like the NIC config page in windows |
| 20:26.42 | Patlabor221 | how did you get to that skipp? |
| 20:26.45 | learnerAtWork | wtf, that doesn't sound like the config menu |
| 20:26.50 | Patlabor221 | it's not |
| 20:27.06 | learnerAtWork | skipp, open a browser and go to http://192.168.1.1 |
| 20:27.12 | captain_proton | the router doesn't have a pci bus :) |
| 20:27.19 | Patlabor221 | some do :) |
| 20:27.24 | bryjen | captain_proton: it might |
| 20:27.29 | captain_proton | Patlabor221: oh? |
| 20:27.32 | Patlabor221 | but not a linksys |
| 20:27.32 | learnerAtWork | I hope it wouldn't |
| 20:27.42 | Patlabor221 | you can use a PC as a router |
| 20:27.50 | captain_proton | Patlabor221: well - thats cheating |
| 20:27.58 | Patlabor221 | or being smart :) |
| 20:28.13 | learnerAtWork | more like smart*ss.. :) |
| 20:28.23 | JBDiGriz | Actually a number of device chips will use PCI bus because it's a cheap way of interfacing. |
| 20:28.27 | Patlabor221 | that is a type of smart |
| 20:28.48 | learnerAtWork | find it, skipp? |
| 20:28.51 | Skipp_ | k i am at the 192 site |
| 20:29.02 | Patlabor221 | it shoudl have a place for you to login |
| 20:29.04 | learnerAtWork | you had to feed it a password? |
| 20:29.06 | Patlabor221 | use admin for the password |
| 20:29.10 | Skipp_ | i did login |
| 20:29.19 | learnerAtWork | so you see the menu up top |
| 20:29.21 | Patlabor221 | ok there should be some tabs for difrent options? |
| 20:29.26 | Skipp_ | yes |
| 20:29.34 | Patlabor221 | is one advanced? |
| 20:29.38 | learnerAtWork | on the right, perhaps you see "Advanced"? |
| 20:29.45 | Skipp_ | ok got it |
| 20:30.02 | Patlabor221 | I"ll let you handle it :) |
| 20:30.11 | learnerAtWork | then "DMZ Host" |
| 20:30.25 | learnerAtWork | put your ip address into the field "192.168.1.101" |
| 20:30.52 | Skipp_ | k, and then appy right? |
| 20:30.55 | learnerAtWork | yep |
| 20:31.11 | Skipp_ | said it was succesful |
| 20:31.28 | Patlabor221 | now try your server |
| 20:31.57 | learnerAtWork | still can't ping you.. but that is hopefully something else |
| 20:32.04 | Skipp_ | thanks again guys, got it working |
| 20:32.51 | learnerAtWork | if you want to be a little more safe, you'll eventually want to turn off the dmz host and add your server port to your router's "filter" |
| 20:33.36 | learnerAtWork | er, "forwarding" section |
| 20:33.42 | learnerAtWork | not filter |
| 20:34.11 | learnerAtWork | bz doesn't do passive port reconnects does it? anyone? |
| 20:35.20 | learnerAtWork | i.e. doing data transmissions on some negotiated high port number? |
| 20:36.40 | Chestal | no, the 1.7 server will only use the -p and -pr port |
| 20:36.53 | Chestal | (except for the list server communication I guess) |
| 20:37.05 | learnerAtWork | and 1.9? |
| 20:37.13 | Chestal | only uses 1 port |
| 20:37.13 | learnerAtWork | tbd? |
| 20:37.32 | captain_proton | http://lurgyman.bolognia.net/academic/quadratic-revolution.pdf |
| 20:38.59 | learnerAtWork | heh |
| 20:39.47 | learnerAtWork | I'd like to see his answer to solving superquadric surfaces in implicit form.. |
| 20:39.47 | *** part/#bzflag BZSpiff (~BZSpiff@12-222-147-141.client.insightBB.com) |
| 20:40.57 | captain_proton | you shoulda seen how his high school calculus teacher reacted to some of his "proofs" |
| 20:42.40 | *** join/#bzflag Quol_ (~ianf@65.39.216.155) |
| 20:44.30 | learnerAtWork | taking the day off cap? |
| 20:44.34 | larsl_56k | Does anyone know any tricks to kill zombie processes on Linux? |
| 20:44.46 | learnerAtWork | shutdown -r now |
| 20:44.55 | learnerAtWork | :) |
| 20:44.56 | larsl_56k | Hm. |
| 20:45.11 | *** join/#bzflag ChanServ (ChanServ@services.) |
| 20:45.11 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o ChanServ] by einstein.freenode.net |
| 20:45.12 | Chestal | larsl: check out the parent process of the zombies |
| 20:45.18 | larsl_56k | It's annoying, because XMMS won't start if there's another XMMS running. |
| 20:45.39 | larsl_56k | It's a separate group. |
| 20:45.41 | Chestal | zombies are alraedy dead, so you cannot kill them |
| 20:45.53 | larsl_56k | And I don't want to kill init. =) |
| 20:45.56 | Chestal | it's jsut that they have not been buried by their parents |
| 20:46.05 | Chestal | when they belong to init now, you're hosed |
| 20:46.20 | Chestal | then there's some kernel magic preventing them from beign removed |
| 20:46.38 | larsl_56k | Ugh. |
| 20:46.47 | larsl_56k | Well, there is probably a lock file somewhere... |
| 20:47.39 | captain_proton | learnerAtWork: yeah - decided to do so because i had already hit max hours for this pay period |
| 20:48.37 | learnerAtWork | ah, so the kiddies get to run free in the wild hopefully hosing all your machines by monday.. :) |
| 20:49.23 | captain_proton | hehe |
| 20:51.00 | Patlabor221 | what did he eat a lot and get fat? |
| 20:51.52 | bryjen | that would be mass*ive* mayhem |
| 20:51.53 | Mayhem | you called? |
| 20:52.02 | learnerAtWork | lol |
| 20:52.16 | *** join/#bzflag fiberchunks (~frobozzpf@237.14.252.64.snet.net) |
| 20:52.26 | Mayhem | bryjen: who you calling 'massive'? :p |
| 20:52.46 | bryjen | Not I. Patlabor221 & learnerAtWork. |
| 20:52.49 | learnerAtWork | You are probably the bzr top dog, mayhem :) |
| 20:53.00 | learnerAtWork | you da big one |
| 20:53.09 | Mayhem | nah, you beat me in 1v1s |
| 20:53.21 | learnerAtWork | lol, only cause I had greg distracting you |
| 20:55.05 | Mayhem | david_v was kicking me 1v1 just before (and during) that match, but we still beat them handily |
| 20:57.31 | captain_proton | arg |
| 20:57.42 | captain_proton | i want to do slices on this string but i can't because its C++ |
| 20:59.59 | *** join/#bzflag DTRemenak (~DTRemenak@host-227-164.dialup.innercite.com) |
| 21:00.06 | larsl_56k | Slices? |
| 21:01.25 | captain_proton | its a neat way of selecting parts of an array |
| 21:01.37 | larsl_56k | The [x..y] thing in Python? |
| 21:01.44 | captain_proton | [x:y] |
| 21:01.58 | captain_proton | plus some special indicies, like negative numbers (index from the back) |
| 21:02.23 | captain_proton | for instance, all but the first character: x[1:-1] =) |
| 21:02.44 | Chestal | x[1:] would look better |
| 21:03.13 | captain_proton | Chestal: indeed |
| 21:03.23 | captain_proton | i'm just saying -1 because i want that now |
| 21:03.27 | *** part/#bzflag niksie (foobar@3eea1525.cable.wanadoo.nl) |
| 21:03.28 | learnerAtWork | cap string.substr(1, string.strlen()); |
| 21:03.39 | larsl_56k | Or just string.substr(1); |
| 21:03.47 | captain_proton | if (tokenized[i][tokenized[i].length() - 1] == '"') <-- BLAH |
| 21:04.19 | sussudio | ~hashmark |
| 21:04.34 | sussudio | TimRiker: the cheater using your email is still on there |
| 21:04.48 | learnerAtWork | heh, kp and kernel panic? :) |
| 21:05.35 | bryjen | C-P and k-p |
| 21:06.00 | fiberchunks | not anyone |
| 21:06.04 | fiberchunks | not anymore, rather |
| 21:06.04 | Chestal | who is that shaved ape? heard some complaints about him/her/it |
| 21:06.30 | sussudio | kode is the cheater |
| 21:06.37 | fiberchunks | ~hashmark |
| 21:06.45 | bryjen | someone on BZBB was complaining about being kicked by a "shaved ape" |
| 21:07.08 | learnerAtWork | i see the hammer has landed! |
| 21:07.22 | learnerAtWork | and he's not doing too well.. |
| 21:07.22 | fiberchunks | Colonel Panic, kernel panic -- are you on there cap? |
| 21:07.39 | fiberchunks | or is that an imposter? |
| 21:07.39 | Chestal | where's General Failure? |
| 21:07.53 | bryjen | GPF ? |
| 21:10.13 | captain_proton | i was there - i don't do too well in those 10-shot shoot-wherever-and-hope-you-hit-something situations |
| 21:10.29 | fiberchunks | ah |
| 21:11.09 | bryjen | Two threads in the Servers: General Discussion |
| 21:11.11 | bryjen | http://bzbb.bakadigital.com/viewtopic.php?t=793 |
| 21:11.12 | bryjen | http://bzbb.bakadigital.com/viewtopic.php?t=796 |
| 21:12.29 | Patlabor221 | well if that guy would put them in the right spot I wouldn't have to move them :) |
| 21:16.48 | captain_proton | bah |
| 21:16.56 | captain_proton | i hate doing string parsing in C++ |
| 21:18.19 | larsl_56k | Have to kill off some zombies... |
| 21:18.32 | Chestal | proton: would you prefer to do it in C? ;-) |
| 21:19.23 | JBDiGriz | Chestal: After the first 1000 times you write it in C, it doesn't make that much difference to do it 1001 times. :) |
| 21:20.11 | JBDiGriz | Patlabor221: Did you lend larsl the phosphorus bullets? |
| 21:21.32 | Patlabor221 | they arn't bullets |
| 21:21.35 | Patlabor221 | shot gun shells |
| 21:21.38 | Patlabor221 | bit difrent |
| 21:21.46 | Patlabor221 | and no, he did not requision any |
| 21:22.28 | *** join/#bzflag larsl_56k (~larsl@md46908ae.utfors.se) |
| 21:22.51 | larsl_56k | Appearently XMMS didn't like that I pulled out the network cable while it was reading files over NFS. |
| 21:22.53 | Patlabor221 | he'll have to make do with the pitchforks and torches |
| 21:23.05 | doughecka | heheh |
| 21:23.31 | sussudio | http://home.wanadoo.nl/sussudio/revocation.txt |
| 21:24.51 | Chestal | larsl: NFS is evil when it comes to blocks in kernels |
| 21:25.51 | captain_proton | NFS is evil in a lot of ways |
| 21:25.59 | captain_proton | larsl_56k: make sure you've got locking turned off |
| 21:26.26 | bryjen | there's a mount option to allow operations to fail |
| 21:27.16 | larsl_56k | I'll look that up. |
| 21:27.18 | larsl_56k | Thanks. |
| 21:27.54 | larsl_56k | nolock? |
| 21:28.01 | captain_proton | yep |
| 21:28.55 | bryjen | hard mounts retry indefinitely, soft mounts fail, intr allows signals to interupt the file operation |
| 21:29.48 | bryjen | eh. soft mounts return an error on timeout |
| 21:30.12 | larsl_56k | I had soft already. |
| 21:30.37 | bryjen | hmmm. that sounds like it should have helped. |
| 21:30.52 | bryjen | should is a dirty word tho |
| 21:31.03 | fiberchunks | ahhhhh, herbie hancock headhunters ;) |
| 21:32.52 | bryjen | The NFS-HOWTO recommends using hard, intr |
| 21:32.57 | TimRiker | ~hashmark |
| 21:33.27 | captain_proton | yay for indie pop synth bands =) |
| 21:33.39 | TimRiker | !seen kode |
| 21:33.56 | bryjen | ~seen [dmp] |
| 21:34.02 | | [dmp] <~dennis@3E6B486F.aalb.stofanet.dk> was last seen on IRC in channel #bzflag, 23h 55m 1s ago, saying: 'it didnt work :)'. |
| 21:34.10 | captain_proton | !seen? |
| 21:34.21 | bryjen | [dmp]'s bot used ! |
| 21:34.23 | TimRiker | thought one of the bots did that. |
| 21:34.28 | larsl_56k | !bzseen Lars |
| 21:34.43 | larsl_56k | I think that was [dmp]. |
| 21:34.53 | bryjen | to look for teammates he had !gang |
| 21:34.59 | sussudio | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:34.59 | sussudio | <PROTECTED> |
| 21:35.08 | sussudio | ~bzfquery bzflag.secretplace.us |
| 21:35.17 | sussudio | there it is. |
| 21:35.33 | learnerAtWork | tim hasn't added it to ibot yet |
| 21:35.41 | bryjen | Oooo another Administrator@ |
| 21:35.46 | sussudio | kode is on secretplace now :-P |
| 21:36.15 | bryjen | Someone last night was Administrator@donna |
| 21:36.16 | learnerAtWork | tell him to get his butt over to #bzflag and fix ibot so we can find him on secretplace |
| 21:36.31 | learnerAtWork | lol :) |
| 21:36.32 | bryjen | Made me wonder how much administrating donna needs |
| 21:37.30 | TimRiker | I got the blootbot module, but it does not work on ibot as ibot is using sqlite and it assumes mysql is already loaded |
| 21:37.47 | doughecka | learnerAtWork: yum... |
| 21:37.49 | bryjen | ooops, past time to go home |
| 21:38.02 | TimRiker | ~nslookup bzflag.secretplace.us |
| 21:38.43 | fiberchunks | kode is gone from secretplace |
| 21:38.54 | learnerAtWork | Tim, not trivial to port over? |
| 21:39.31 | doughecka | port it to noodlebot |
| 21:39.48 | doughecka | it would be easyer, since noodlebot is cleaner code |
| 21:41.11 | doughecka | or make a custom noodlebot without all the extra modules, and call it bzlist or somethin |
| 21:41.28 | TimRiker | learnerAtWork: just have not gotten to it. need to add the right DBI connects. it's easy enough, I just have not done it yet. |
| 21:41.31 | sussudio | ~slick |
| 21:41.39 | TimRiker | a web interface would be cleaner imho |
| 21:43.57 | captain_proton | blah |
| 21:44.00 | captain_proton | why does this suck so much |
| 21:44.28 | doughecka | wheres the code for that bzseen code? |
| 21:46.08 | learnerAtWork | tim, [dmp] did make a web interface as well -- it's on his site somewhere |
| 21:50.52 | learnerAtWork | ah, it's on his menu as "Gang" and "Seen" on bzflag.baat.dk |
| 21:51.01 | learnerAtWork | /new/ |
| 21:52.42 | *** join/#bzflag kyleTron (~chatzilla@ppp-67-115-60-181.dialup.scrm01.pacbell.net) |
| 21:53.19 | kyleTron | wOOt! |
| 21:53.38 | *** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 21:53.59 | david_v | ahh... what a bzflag day :) |
| 21:54.10 | kyleTron | mmm, flag |
| 21:54.41 | david_v | played against BzRebels and lost with 7-4, but quite acceptable. then, surprisingly, won against TLZ with 5-4 in an unofficial match |
| 21:54.46 | david_v | not sure what happened there :) |
| 21:55.50 | Chestal | hurrah, Moles back to #1 again, and withotu even playing :-) |
| 21:58.04 | david_v | btw Chestal, what are your comments about the TLZ logo? :) |
| 21:58.45 | Chestal | david: no comment ;-) |
| 21:59.00 | david_v | :) |
| 21:59.08 | doughecka | :) |
| 21:59.27 | david_v | i think Fanta got a bit annoyed with the match today, though |
| 21:59.28 | learnerAtWork | wow, david_ve.. :) |
| 21:59.40 | david_v | Ginku said "grrrr" too on ICQ :) |
| 21:59.45 | learnerAtWork | maybe mayhem and chika should've taken up their offer.. :) |
| 21:59.56 | learnerAtWork | LOL |
| 22:00.12 | learnerAtWork | who on tlz played? |
| 22:02.26 | david_v | BeZee, w339, Ginku and Fanta |
| 22:02.26 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (1000@ky-owensboro1a-242.owboky.adelphia.net) |
| 22:02.26 | learnerAtWork | ok, would everyone stop slamming the league website so I can? mkay? thx |
| 22:02.26 | david_v | lol i would say the same :) |
| 22:02.26 | david_v | it worked before with just one or two reloads, though |
| 22:02.26 | learnerAtWork | that poor little mysql database |
| 22:02.26 | david_v | it's something at sf struggling |
| 22:02.26 | doughecka | the hamsters |
| 22:02.26 | doughecka | in the servers :) |
| 22:02.26 | learnerAtWork | "Save the Hamsters" |
| 22:02.26 | david_v | oh, they forgot to serve them food? |
| 22:02.26 | TimRiker | I'd run it at SF cept that outgoing tcp from the web farm is blocked. |
| 22:02.27 | JBDiGriz | I haven't had any problem with accessing the website today. Must be an east coast thing :) |
| 22:02.27 | david_v | they're busy calming the hamsters down |
| 22:02.29 | doughecka | hehe |
| 22:02.51 | david_v | JBDiGriz: hm :) doesn't work from Europe, it seems |
| 22:03.04 | learnerAtWork | looks like bzr gained about 25 points for beating fortix.. |
| 22:03.11 | JBDiGriz | david_v: From my perspective, that's even farther east! :) |
| 22:03.43 | david_v | JBDiGriz: east yes, not sure what to say about the coast though... except maybe for Östersjön? :) |
| 22:03.58 | learnerAtWork | and zee bros lost about 40 for losing to fireballs |
| 22:03.59 | *** join/#bzflag Tupone (~Tupone@ppp-62-11-14-83.dialup.tiscali.it) |
| 22:04.17 | david_v | asdf and spiff is a dangerous combo |
| 22:04.31 | learnerAtWork | no comment |
| 22:04.39 | JBDiGriz | They have chosen an appropriate name. |
| 22:04.45 | learnerAtWork | heh |
| 22:04.57 | TimRiker | so are we hacking the net code on 1.9 do send player join/leave/kills to the list server(s)? |
| 22:05.15 | david_v | ok, let me make myself clear, asdf and spiff are absolutely no threat whatsoever, and they're hacking the score list |
| 22:05.21 | david_v | better? :) |
| 22:05.31 | learnerAtWork | :) |
| 22:05.35 | TimRiker | and moving user/password tracking over there? the global groups? then.... ;-) |
| 22:05.50 | TimRiker | hacking the score list? |
| 22:06.00 | fiberchunks | took me 13 hours to get 820, I don't see how spiff, imho, got 1120 in 5 :\ |
| 22:06.02 | learnerAtWork | tim, that's a good discussion for next saturday.. unless there's already a major consensus |
| 22:06.03 | david_v | yeah how else could such n00bs get points? :) |
| 22:06.07 | fiberchunks | unless I really suck ;) |
| 22:06.19 | fiberchunks | which is quite probable |
| 22:06.36 | david_v | oh don't even talk about bzflag.stats.org :) |
| 22:06.39 | learnerAtWork | spiff is *very* flag happy, fiber |
| 22:06.39 | larsl_56k | Can the list server handle it? |
| 22:06.39 | Chestal | Tim: ah, hi Tim. On your request, proton got rid of the throws in StateDataBase and replaced it by returning NaN. Now it does not compile on 2.95 anymore |
| 22:06.55 | david_v | stats.bzflag.org i mean |
| 22:07.01 | JBDiGriz | First we're hacking the net code to clean up the interface and speed up the transfer. |
| 22:07.07 | bryjen | david_v: by abusing even newer n00bs ;) |
| 22:07.17 | learnerAtWork | can the local servers spare the bandwidth.. |
| 22:07.26 | david_v | bryjen: sure, TLZ seem a bit rusty :) |
| 22:07.31 | learnerAtWork | I'd rather not be chatting to a potentially unresponsive remote server |
| 22:07.33 | JBDiGriz | During the meeting, we can discuss changes to protocols and anything else related to the net code. |
| 22:07.46 | captain_proton | TimRiker: two options - assemble the NaN by hand, or use exceptions ;-) |
| 22:08.16 | TimRiker | Chestal: ugh. non NaN on 2.95? then we need to avoid that too. |
| 22:08.28 | fiberchunks | why is there such consternation with exceptions? I thought they were 'a good thing' |
| 22:08.32 | TimRiker | why not just return known empty values? |
| 22:08.33 | captain_proton | no <limits> header on 2.95 =P |
| 22:08.37 | Chestal | TimRiker: well, it's numeric_limits<float>::signaling_NaN() or something |
| 22:09.01 | Chestal | exceptions woudl work fine for me :-= |
| 22:09.09 | captain_proton | TimRiker: when talking about floats, NaN is really the only "empty value" there is |
| 22:09.28 | learnerAtWork | What's this about NaN? |
| 22:10.17 | TimRiker | I've not plowed through the code... can't just return 0 ? I don't recall what it's wanting to return. |
| 22:10.29 | captain_proton | TimRiker: this is for evaluating expressions in bzdb |
| 22:10.42 | captain_proton | there are two cases where it errors - variable doesn't exist, or circular reference |
| 22:11.29 | larsl_56k | What is bzdb used for? |
| 22:11.41 | captain_proton | larsl_56k: at the moment, nothing :) |
| 22:12.09 | larsl_56k | What will it be used for? And what is it? =) |
| 22:12.18 | captain_proton | its something nifty that was in 1.8 |
| 22:12.24 | captain_proton | its like the resource database, but a lot more powerful |
| 22:13.12 | larsl_56k | TimRiker: What do you think about starting to add Doxygen comments to all new functions/classes? |
| 22:14.34 | Chestal | we can always use setjmp/longjmp instead ;-) |
| 22:14.50 | TimRiker | larsl_56k: sure. Doxygen patches welcome |
| 22:15.02 | larsl_56k | =) |
| 22:15.29 | Chestal | comments are evil :-) |
| 22:15.39 | TimRiker | captain_proton: or pass a pointer for the result and return 0/1 |
| 22:15.53 | kyleTron | they're for wusses |
| 22:15.56 | larsl_56k | Or a pair<bool, double>. |
| 22:16.09 | Chestal | return DBL_MAX |
| 22:16.24 | captain_proton | Chestal: ewwww |
| 22:16.32 | Chestal | or whatever it is called. non-standard I guess, but works everywhere :-9 |
| 22:16.36 | captain_proton | Chestal: it'd be like the address parsing, except scarier! |
| 22:17.05 | learnerAtWork | comments.... commments would be VERY GOOD.... |
| 22:17.24 | learnerAtWork | especially for newer developers that are trying to wade through |
| 22:17.24 | Chestal | comments tend to contradict the code sooner or later |
| 22:17.31 | Chestal | and 99% of all comments I see in code is worthless |
| 22:17.38 | Chestal | _good_ comments would be useful, though |
| 22:17.40 | learnerAtWork | that's bad code and bad style |
| 22:17.52 | larsl_56k | Only comment classes functions |
| 22:17.54 | sussudio | it's a bad kitty? |
| 22:17.55 | Chestal | but good comments are veen ahrder to write than good code |
| 22:17.58 | larsl_56k | and datatypes in the .h files. |
| 22:18.04 | Chestal | that#s why I do not even try ;-9 |
| 22:18.20 | captain_proton | hehe |
| 22:18.26 | Chestal | comments should comment everythng which is not obvious |
| 22:18.35 | Chestal | never, ever comment obvious things |
| 22:18.40 | Chestal | that#s worse than having no comments |
| 22:18.43 | learnerAtWork | of course |
| 22:19.05 | captain_proton | i like comments explaining the top-level of what something does |
| 22:19.34 | larsl_56k | I would really like doxygen-generated HTML with descriptions of all classes, linked to a source browser, dependency graphs etc. |
| 22:19.38 | captain_proton | // increment i |
| 22:19.40 | captain_proton | i++ |
| 22:19.45 | learnerAtWork | you have to write comments for yourself as if you were coming back a year from now after vacationing in the bahamas -- only what is needed and everything that is needed |
| 22:19.45 | Chestal | hehe |
| 22:20.37 | learnerAtWork | as a relatively new developer, I can say I've spent way too much time decyphering stuff I should not have to! |
| 22:20.51 | learnerAtWork | way too many "wtf"'s |
| 22:21.18 | Chestal | if we do the comments the right way, I'm all for it |
| 22:21.27 | Chestal | I'm not so sure about doygen stuff though |
| 22:21.49 | larsl_56k | No? |
| 22:22.01 | learnerAtWork | for c++, why not? |
| 22:22.15 | Chestal | I don't know very much about it, the things I've seen done with systems liek it didn't impress me |
| 22:22.16 | TimRiker | comments should be in the c++ files, not the h files. |
| 22:22.17 | learnerAtWork | it's by far the most popular/common format |
| 22:22.22 | TimRiker | we are open source after all. |
| 22:22.50 | Chestal | well, a description of a class should precede the class definition I think |
| 22:22.53 | learnerAtWork | not seeing the connection, tim. what do you mean? |
| 22:23.05 | learnerAtWork | yes, ches, I agree |
| 22:23.07 | TimRiker | there is a doxygen tree on the web site, but it's not being autogenerated at present. |
| 22:23.11 | Chestal | I'm not sure whether the top level comments are good to reside in the source at all, though |
| 22:23.16 | captain_proton | TimRiker: thats an old tree of 1.8 |
| 22:23.18 | Chestal | fo rexample, we have docs/protocol.txt |
| 22:23.20 | captain_proton | iirc |
| 22:23.22 | Chestal | this is a comment, too |
| 22:24.18 | Chestal | Tim: apropos, I guess this is part of the net code discussion on next Saturday, but: Want to keep any of the mutlicast stuff? If not, we could really rip it out now |
| 22:26.11 | JBDiGriz | Ask questions which should come up as part of the discussion, just make sure that any answers/commentary comes up during the discussion as well, so we can all share it. |
| 22:26.55 | *** join/#bzflag BZSpiff (~BZSpiff@12-222-147-141.client.insightBB.com) |
| 22:27.05 | BZSpiff | Hey all. :-) |
| 22:27.58 | Chestal | well, good night everyone, will read the backlog. Don't talk too much rubbish this night :-) |
| 22:28.06 | captain_proton | 'night Chestal |
| 22:28.09 | learnerAtWork | lol, Ches |
| 22:28.10 | BZSpiff | C-ya Chestal. :-) |
| 22:28.10 | learnerAtWork | night |
| 22:28.20 | BZSpiff | Rubbish, eh? ;) |
| 22:28.27 | JBDiGriz | g'nite Chestal, we'll make sure to add the juicy stuff tonight! |
| 22:30.09 | TimRiker | captain_proton: we should run a cron on SF to update it. |
| 22:30.26 | captain_proton | TimRiker: hmm |
| 22:30.41 | captain_proton | TimRiker: i could put the tree on sfsnap and make it trigger the rebuild off the same script that creates the snap |
| 22:31.10 | JBDiGriz | I sent an email to the dev mailing list last night about the meeting. It's not showing up in the archives. Did anyone receive it? |
| 22:31.26 | learnerAtWork | not I |
| 22:31.34 | learnerAtWork | but I did read bzbb |
| 22:32.16 | JBDiGriz | There's at least one interested party that doesn't. Harrumph! |
| 22:37.00 | *** join/#bzflag Patlabor221Work (~jeffm@208.48.199.214) |
| 22:40.34 | BZSpiff | I'll brb. |
| 22:44.04 | *** join/#bzflag creeperz (~creeperz@host-11-76-220-24.midco.net) |
| 22:45.14 | *** join/#bzflag BZSpiff (~BZSpiff@12-222-147-141.client.insightBB.com) |
| 22:51.18 | TimRiker | sfsnap? |
| 22:52.38 | Patlabor221Work | since aon cvs is 2 days behind, cap set up a thing that makes a tarball on every commit |
| 22:52.58 | Patlabor221Work | for 1.9 |
| 22:53.22 | Patlabor221Work | I update a windows build every so often too so people can test the new stuff |
| 22:53.38 | TimRiker | Patlabor221Work: where does it do that? |
| 22:54.00 | Patlabor221Work | he does it on his own machine at his house |
| 22:54.13 | *** join/#bzflag captain_proton (~blardebla@12-203-245-57.client.attbi.com) |
| 22:54.13 | *** mode/#bzflag [+o captain_proton] by ChanServ |
| 22:54.15 | Patlabor221Work | it update from his ssh account |
| 22:54.46 | captain_proton | actually its not at my house |
| 22:54.53 | Patlabor221Work | ohh at the school |
| 22:54.53 | captain_proton | its on a server at my old high school ^^ |
| 22:54.59 | Patlabor221Work | yeah jupiter |
| 23:06.37 | TimRiker | I just created a SF virtual user. password is in the group directory and only group readable. Let's try adding cronjobs right on SF, k? |
| 23:07.13 | captain_proton | TimRiker: can sf users recieve sf mail on the shell servers? :P |
| 23:07.52 | captain_proton | one of the neat things about sfsnap is that its triggered off a commit, not a cron job |
| 23:07.53 | TimRiker | yes, but it get's forwarded. the bzflag user is set to forward to Tim@BZFlag.org |
| 23:08.33 | TimRiker | I wonder if SF cvs server can run enough stuff to do it? ;-) |
| 23:08.38 | captain_proton | only forwarding? no way to actually recieve it on the shell server? |
| 23:08.54 | TimRiker | but a cron job could cvs up and check for updates, then run if there are some. |
| 23:08.54 | captain_proton | the cvs server doesn't have access to the web page |
| 23:09.35 | TimRiker | you sure? what if the commit script writes to /home/groups/b/bz/bzflag/htdocs or similar? |
| 23:09.46 | captain_proton | pretty sure |
| 23:10.04 | learnerAtWork | hmm.. that's polling vs. notification -- I'd have to vote for notification to be honest |
| 23:10.05 | TimRiker | well a cron job looking for updates should suffice, no? |
| 23:10.23 | TimRiker | yeah, notification is better, but polling should suffice. |
| 23:10.55 | learnerAtWork | I can't complain.. I do polling to keep my bzfs up to date at the moment (via cron job), etc |
| 23:11.09 | captain_proton | learnerAtWork: but you had me add you to the notify ;) |
| 23:11.27 | learnerAtWork | I know cap.. just haven't rewired everything yet.. :) |
| 23:11.42 | learnerAtWork | cvs update every 10 minutes |
| 23:11.54 | learnerAtWork | less? |
| 23:12.57 | learnerAtWork | Shush you :) |
| 23:13.22 | sussudio | suppository server? |
| 23:13.24 | captain_proton | learnerAtWork: don't you wish you didn't have to remember -kb? ;-) |
| 23:13.38 | captain_proton | sussudio: you may speak when you have something constructive to add |
| 23:13.50 | learnerAtWork | -kb? I don't remember it.. |
| 23:14.11 | captain_proton | learnerAtWork: remember all those sound/image files you added as text? |
| 23:14.17 | learnerAtWork | ah... hehe |
| 23:14.28 | learnerAtWork | exactly why I didn't remember it.. :) |
| 23:14.54 | *** join/#bzflag david_v (~david_v@c213-200-135-241.cm-upc.chello.se) |
| 23:15.13 | sussudio | i may speak whenever i wish. it's called free speech. |
| 23:15.32 | captain_proton | sussudio: free speech doesn't apply here |
| 23:15.48 | Patlabor221Work | and don't you live in one of those other countrys? :) |
| 23:16.05 | sussudio | Patlabor221Work: yes, one where free speech still exists |
| 23:16.28 | Patlabor221Work | well we don't :) |
| 23:22.17 | *** join/#bzflag Legolas (~Legolas@adsl-68-73-117-113.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 23:23.48 | CIA | commit by timriker: stop captain_proton from griping about -kb |
| 23:24.30 | learnerAtWork | heh |
| 23:24.35 | captain_proton | hmm |
| 23:24.54 | larsl_56k | How? |
| 23:25.13 | TimRiker | CVSROOT/cvswrappers can list -kb defaults |
| 23:25.21 | TimRiker | now it does. ;-) |
| 23:25.25 | larsl_56k | Ah, nice. |
| 23:25.31 | larsl_56k | wav, rgb etc? |
| 23:25.43 | *** join/#bzflag trepan (~trepan@CPE0040f42db082-CM00e06f15f704.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com) |
| 23:25.52 | TimRiker | yeah, I just copied from another project. is has doc and xls and ppt etc cruft too. |
| 23:32.34 | BZSpiff | Ow. That's fighting dirty. ;-) |
| 23:32.47 | BZSpiff | Dunno tho.... Win ME might hurt more. :-( |
| 23:33.11 | captain_proton | at least 3.11 has a not-quite-so-broken network stack |
| 23:33.40 | sussudio | right... that's why you had to use a third party one to actually use the internet |
| 23:34.21 | Patlabor221Work | noone used the internet then |
| 23:34.47 | TimRiker | network stack? in 3.11? ugh. |
| 23:35.10 | learnerAtWork | Um.. I did |
| 23:36.06 | learnerAtWork | ouch!.. past tense, past tense... |
| 23:36.14 | TimRiker | hehe |
| 23:36.18 | learnerAtWork | I was young(er) and innocent |
| 23:36.27 | learnerAtWork | and foolish |
| 23:36.36 | sussudio | CONNECT 14400/HST |
| 23:36.47 | learnerAtWork | can I have my hand back, please? :-) |
| 23:36.54 | sussudio | no |
| 23:37.23 | learnerAtWork | no RS bit for you then! |
| 23:37.24 | sussudio | you can have a hook |
| 23:37.32 | captain_proton | everyone hit the deck! bad pun coming!~ |
| 23:37.47 | sussudio | who's bad pun? |
| 23:37.47 | CIA | commit by davidtrowbridge: add ogg, because its the wav of the future |
| 23:38.04 | Patlabor221Work | ouch |
| 23:38.17 | Patlabor221Work | don't make me shoot you with the airzooka |
| 23:38.30 | learnerAtWork | you're so clever, you clever person you |
| 23:39.16 | captain_proton | i did warn you... |
| 23:39.16 | sussudio | what ogg did you add? vorbis? speex? theora? |
| 23:39.16 | Patlabor221Work | so does this mean I have to fix the build system to use the vorbis libs again? |
| 23:39.27 | *** join/#bzflag Legolas (~Legolas@adsl-68-73-117-113.dsl.emhril.ameritech.net) |
| 23:39.30 | BZSpiff | Airzooka? Isn't that a bubblegum brand? ;-) |
| 23:39.33 | captain_proton | sussudio: doesn't matter |
| 23:39.42 | captain_proton | sussudio: this is cvswrappers |
| 23:40.09 | captain_proton | Patlabor221Work: not until mediafile is in |
| 23:40.16 | TimRiker | ftp://ftp.crynwr.com/drivers <- nelson does those now. ;-) |
| 23:40.19 | Patlabor221Work | k |
| 23:40.46 | learnerAtWork | yeay |
| 23:41.06 | Patlabor221Work | should have just grew a newone |
| 23:41.11 | Patlabor221Work | biomass is cheap |
| 23:41.19 | TimRiker | new hand; |
| 23:41.28 | Patlabor221Work | yeah |
| 23:41.30 | BZSpiff | I say you should get a hand like the Terminators have. |
| 23:41.40 | BZSpiff | ;-) |
| 23:41.46 | TimRiker | or like anikin |
| 23:41.51 | Patlabor221Work | how would you ever get on an airplane? |
| 23:42.09 | TimRiker | "Uh, sir, could you step over here please?" |
| 23:42.21 | learnerAtWork | body.arm.addHand(malloc(1 * sizeof(hand_t))); |
| 23:42.25 | BZSpiff | Hmm... dunno. I think that'd be a problem with any sort of artificial joint though. |
| 23:42.57 | Patlabor221Work | only metals and ferics |
| 23:43.23 | JBDiGriz | Being a geek, I had to check the history, Arpanet started splitting in 1983, and ceased to exist in 1990. |
| 23:43.24 | captain_proton | most artificial joints are done with titanium now |
| 23:43.35 | captain_proton | which isn't magnetic |
| 23:43.44 | Patlabor221Work | a yup |
| 23:43.49 | Patlabor221Work | some plastics too |
| 23:43.53 | JBDiGriz | Windows 3.11 came out post 1990, when it was all Internet, so it looks as though many people were using the Internet. |
| 23:43.56 | Patlabor221Work | heard about cermmics too |
| 23:44.15 | BZSpiff | Yes. I live near the world's largest orthopedics manufacturer. |
| 23:44.18 | JBDiGriz | Bill Gates just didn't believe it would last. |
| 23:44.20 | Patlabor221Work | they had the interntet, but they didn't "USE" it :) |
| 23:44.28 | BZSpiff | Or one of the world's largest... can't remember. :) |
| 23:44.31 | Patlabor221Work | mostly it was just pr0n and newsgropps :) |
| 23:44.46 | learnerAtWork | they used it, they just didn't "ABUSE" it like we can now |
| 23:44.48 | JBDiGriz | There was a lot less pr0n in those days. |
| 23:44.54 | learnerAtWork | lol, heh |
| 23:45.00 | sussudio | ascii pr0n |
| 23:45.10 | Patlabor221Work | no, I think they just played with it then, |
| 23:45.29 | JBDiGriz | It was a smaller community, and we tended to know who we were talking to. |
| 23:45.41 | Patlabor221Work | yes |
| 23:45.41 | learnerAtWork | and everyone knew what they were doing |
| 23:45.48 | Patlabor221Work | and there was a lot less info |
| 23:46.00 | Patlabor221Work | like now I can't buy anything with at least using the net |
| 23:46.05 | Patlabor221Work | even lunch |
| 23:46.36 | Patlabor221Work | http://www.togosspeedlunch.com/togosonline/tellmemore.asp?dept_id=&#elunch |
| 23:46.42 | JBDiGriz | I just looked, even facesaver is still around! :-) "Has your face been saved?" |
| 23:46.46 | Patlabor221Work | vons.com delivers to my house |
| 23:46.52 | *** join/#bzflag bryjen (1000@ky-owensboro1a-242.owboky.adelphia.net) |
| 23:46.58 | TimRiker | http://groups.google.com/groups?q=%22tim+riker%22&start=120&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&scoring=d&selm=D2622r.KC6%40london.silverplatter.com&rnum=124 <- oldest usenet for me I can find. |
| 23:47.01 | Patlabor221Work | but was pricewatch around :) |
| 23:47.46 | Patlabor221Work | pregoogle net was just pointless :) |
| 23:47.48 | JBDiGriz | Not only that, but my face is on the front page of the web site! :-) |
| 23:48.59 | learnerAtWork | what?!? pregoogle had it's uses.. |
| 23:49.22 | learnerAtWork | google is worthless for finding obscure information (like independant research) by definition |
| 23:49.36 | learnerAtWork | altavista was good, after you waded through enough pr0n |
| 23:49.58 | learnerAtWork | as well as many of the meta-engines |
| 23:50.14 | BZSpiff | AltaVista is still my home page. :\ |
| 23:50.17 | BZSpiff | :/ |
| 23:50.20 | BZSpiff | LoL |
| 23:50.29 | learnerAtWork | my goodness.. |
| 23:50.51 | TimRiker | ftp://ftp.uu.net/published/usenix/faces |
| 23:51.19 | learnerAtWork | compuserve |
| 23:51.23 | BZSpiff | I'll be setting a new homepage when I have my own PC. :-) |
| 23:51.24 | Patlabor221Work | I remember that |
| 23:51.25 | TimRiker | http://www.metron.com/FaceSaver/imgs/attlist.jpg <- you are there? |
| 23:51.35 | Patlabor221Work | when the serives had there own content and then the internet |
| 23:51.54 | JBDiGriz | I'm on the home page. http://www.metron.com/FaceSaver/ |
| 23:52.10 | TimRiker | JBDiGriz: which are you? |
| 23:52.30 | learnerAtWork | run, jb .. run :) |
| 23:52.36 | JBDiGriz | I'm on the URL you have as well! :-) |
| 23:53.55 | Patlabor221Work | too small to read names |
| 23:54.02 | BZSpiff | C'mon JB... which one are you? :-) |
| 23:54.20 | Patlabor221Work | there are only a couple that posibly start with J |
| 23:54.31 | learnerAtWork | hehehhehe |
| 23:54.39 | JBDiGriz | Maybe I'll have to post that picture on centrum and let people figure it out! |
| 23:54.49 | BZSpiff | Grrr. No fair. :P |
| 23:54.55 | learnerAtWork | oh, that would be perfect, jb :) |
| 23:55.16 | JBDiGriz | It is a rather old picture. |
| 23:55.19 | BZSpiff | I see a James and JR. |
| 23:56.54 | learnerAtWork | jb is really the second image on the first column.. |
| 23:57.00 | JBDiGriz | The developer's should be able to figure it out in no time at all. |
