| 00:34.01 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 99b16da source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=99b16da |
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| 04:36.10 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 65340d6 source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=65340d6 |
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| 13:49.32 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 21f882e source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=21f882e |
| 14:28.17 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 160716e source community_ideas/laptop_15in/pcbs/pcb3.mdwn add pcb3 doc * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=160716e |
| 16:09.05 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 025473d source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=025473d |
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| 16:51.43 | SPG | Luke Leighton master e854fcf source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=e854fcf |
| 17:08.03 | SPG | Luke Leighton master 79b3bdb source crowdsupply.mdwn add todo oses * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=79b3bdb |
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| 19:00.24 | jay_ | hello |
| 19:00.36 | jay_ | can I ask some questions on the EOMA68 |
| 19:12.20 | lkcl | sure |
| 19:12.33 | lkcl | it's "the EOMA68 standard" |
| 19:15.25 | C-Keen | the campaign is again on the lobste.rs front page lkcl |
| 19:15.31 | C-Keen | without comments atm though |
| 19:18.04 | lkcl | C-Keen: ack |
| 19:24.18 | lkcl | C-Keen: not seeing it... |
| 19:24.53 | lkcl | ok got it |
| 19:26.59 | C-Keen | ;) |
| 19:30.31 | rellla | lkcl: http://linux-sunxi.org/Buying_guide#Rhombus_Tech |
| 19:30.42 | rellla | Oooold, For info... |
| 19:31.36 | rellla | Maybe someone with the card should do a new device page on linux-sunxi.org |
| 19:32.17 | rellla | http://linux-sunxi.org/New_Device_howto |
| 19:33.36 | jay_ | ok my questions are |
| 19:34.04 | jay_ | 1. Is the EOMA68 faster and the rasperrby pi |
| 19:35.12 | jay_ | 2. Not trying to jinx the campaign but what happens if the campaign does not meet its target? do I loose my money |
| 19:36.13 | jay_ | 3. If I buy just the EOMA68 board how hard will it be to source the screen, keyboard/mouse, wifi adapter, etc |
| 19:37.26 | jay_ | 4. will it be possible to cluster more than one EOAM68 for more power/speed? |
| 19:38.19 | jay_ | 5. Besides the listed gnu/linux distros will I be able to load x distro? |
| 19:39.21 | jay_ | for question 1 I meant is the EOMA68 faster/powerful than a raspberry pi 3? |
| 19:39.25 | lkcl | jay_: there is no such thing as "an EOMA68". |
| 19:39.35 | lkcl | rellla: thx |
| 19:39.58 | lkcl | jay_: there is however an EOMA68 compliant Computer Card |
| 19:40.11 | lkcl | jay_: as well as an EOMA68 Pass through Card. |
| 19:40.24 | lkcl | there is also an EOMA68 jz4775 Computer Card |
| 19:40.24 | jelly | the A20 card ought to have a name |
| 19:40.26 | jay_ | that the one im referring to https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68 |
| 19:40.48 | lkcl | and an EOMA68 .... yes it does. the actual hardware is called "EOMA68-A20" |
| 19:40.59 | jay_ | ok all my questions have to do with the complaint computer card |
| 19:41.15 | lkcl | but we had to deal with the FSF's rules so we had to give them names when the OS is installed |
| 19:41.21 | lkcl | ok, great. |
| 19:41.23 | lkcl | so. |
| 19:41.39 | lkcl | which raspberry pi are you comparing to? there are something like four that i know of |
| 19:42.05 | jay_ | raspberry pi 3 model B |
| 19:42.09 | lkcl | the EOMA68-A20 Computer Card has an Allwinner A20 dual-core 1ghz ARM Cortex A7 |
| 19:42.19 | lkcl | that's a quad-core i believe |
| 19:42.34 | lkcl | and probably something like... 1.5ghz? |
| 19:42.42 | lkcl | so... dual-core vs quad-core |
| 19:42.44 | jelly | and has a bit more memory bandwidth than the rpi3 |
| 19:42.53 | lkcl | and 1ghz vs 1.5ghz |
| 19:43.28 | lkcl | jelly: thx. err.... bit more *memory* or a bit more memory *bandwidth*? is it 64-bit-wide memory access or 32-bit-wide? makes a huge difference |
| 19:43.44 | lkcl | both in terms of performance as well as power consumption |
| 19:43.55 | jelly | bandwidth is what's important for "speed" |
| 19:44.53 | lkcl | jay_: the EOMA68-A20 uses 32-bit wide data bus access to DDR3 RAM which means much lower power - we can keep to about a 3.5 watt budget |
| 19:45.08 | jay_ | for question 1, I guess my question is how will the EOMA68-A20 do for everyday task such as bill payment, browsing, editing office documents, in other work will my wife fate the A20? |
| 19:45.33 | jelly | but yeah your thing also has 2GiB RAM vs r.pi3's 1GiB |
| 19:45.42 | lkcl | jelly: the power penalty is about 350mA per 32-bit-wide addressing at around 800mhz DDR3 |
| 19:46.12 | jelly | oh, I misread something then |
| 19:46.16 | lkcl | jay_: it's about the same sort of speed as a budget intel atom system that you could buy abouuut... 3 to 5 years ago (if you upgraded it to 2GB RAM) |
| 19:46.46 | lkcl | jay_: there's some videos online where you can see i'm running some programs (office, firefox) so you can judge for yourself, subjectively |
| 19:46.54 | lkcl | it's not bad, in other words. |
| 19:46.55 | lkcl | give me 1sec |
| 19:47.08 | lkcl | jay_: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68/micro-desktop/updates/speedy-devuan |
| 19:48.49 | lkcl | jay_: bear in mind those demos are done with only 1GB RAM |
| 19:51.27 | jay_ | lkcl_: ok so the one from crowd supply with 2GB should be a bit faster then |
| 19:51.36 | lkcl | so qn 2 the way crowdfunding works is, nobody's credit cards get charged until the target's met |
| 19:52.09 | lkcl | jay_: or... able to do a bit more (run a few more programs simultaneously)... put a bit more of your files into RAM (cache)... yeah. |
| 19:53.07 | lkcl | qn 3 if you *only* get the computer card you'll need the cable set (or to source them yourself) then get a USB2 hub, and USB peripherals, and you're off |
| 19:53.54 | lkcl | qn 4 yes just plug several together on an ethernet switch, just like they do in co-located hosting companies. |
| 19:54.24 | lkcl | but don't expect to do that without having to do quite a lot of work: look up "beowulf clustering". |
| 19:55.08 | lkcl | qn 5 here's a stack of OSes http://linux-sunxi.org/Bootable_OS_images |
| 19:56.15 | jay_ | lkcl_: damn I dont see my OS that I currently run |
| 19:58.03 | lkcl | jay_: does it run on an ARM Cortex A7? |
| 19:58.10 | lkcl | jay_: what's the OS? |
| 19:58.47 | jay_ | lkcl_: slackware |
| 19:59.04 | lkcl | jay_: yes slackware is supported for the ARM Cortex A7. |
| 19:59.10 | lkcl | so yes it will run. |
| 19:59.46 | lkcl | whenever these OSes say "we don't officially support board XYZ" totally ignore that, find out what the processor is, and the answer's "yes". |
| 20:00.01 | lkcl | unless it's a BSD-based OS, which is completely different |
| 20:01.04 | jay_ | lkcl_: ok so I get the cables set but I still want to have a portable computer (laptop) will I be able to source the reaming parts easily? Maybe I could use the hardware from a laptop? |
| 20:02.04 | isacdaavid | jay_: http://arm.slackware.com/ |
| 20:02.17 | lkcl | jay_: you will find it to be a bitch of a job to take components out of a 2nd-hand laptop. it's a reasonable question that comes up surprisingly often... but i tell you, even highly intelligent people have drastically underestimated how much work it is for so little return |
| 20:02.22 | lkcl | isacdaavid: thxman |
| 20:02.55 | lkcl | isacdaavid: i'll put that on the OS list |
| 20:04.28 | jay_ | lkcl_: fair enough but how about purchasing later on a portable screen such as the one from the project? I mean will I be able to source one from lets say ebay? |
| 20:05.06 | lkcl | jay_: http://linux-sunxi.org/Bootable_OS_images#Slackware |
| 20:05.47 | jay_ | that was fast1 |
| 20:06.01 | lkcl | jay_: yes. you want P/N LP156WH4-TLN1 or TLN2 |
| 20:07.06 | lkcl | jay_: welcome to online wikis |
| 20:07.18 | lkcl | jay_: you could have done it. |
| 20:08.23 | jay_ | lkcl_: sweet, do you maybe already have a list of what is needed for part sourcing a laptop, just asking because I dont think I could go for the $450 option, I rather get the board+case+cables try it out and if it works then I would build a laptop |
| 20:09.03 | jay_ | or maybe you could just buy the part later on |
| 20:09.09 | jay_ | from you |
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| 20:11.23 | lkcl | jay_: i've not added the PCBs as an option for that to be possible, but yes later on you'd be able to get the kit |
| 20:12.04 | lkcl | jay_: you'd really need the PCBs, cables and the battery. the LCD and keyboard would be easy enough to get... albeit more expensive overall |
| 20:12.46 | lkcl | jay_: i recommend your next priority be the micro-desktop because that will give you access to the 2 USB2 ports (and the option of a 2nd screen) |
| 20:12.56 | lkcl | and 2 MicroSD card slots |
| 20:14.52 | jay_ | lkcl_: yeah I was thinking the Practically Perfect Computer Card, Micro Desktop Housing for Computer Card and the USB + HDMI Cable Set for Standalone Operation to start |
| 20:16.04 | lkcl | jay_: sensible. the Micro-USB-OTG port is part-hardware part-software implemented USB2 (!!!) :) |
| 20:16.53 | lkcl | jay_: so for example when i plugged in a USB3 Hub then plugged a USB2 hub into *that* then plugged in a USB1 keyboard, it didn't go down too well :) |
| 20:16.55 | jay_ | lkcl_: then if all works I would look into the screen, keyboard and battery, I know it will be more expensive but at least i have a start. |
| 20:17.17 | lkcl | but when i plugged in the same USB keyboard directly into the OTG port it worked perfectly |
| 20:17.36 | lkcl | so, having the micro-desktop board which has 2 full hardware-implemented USB2 ports is a good idea |
| 20:18.06 | lkcl | jay_: you still need the laptop's PCBs to be able to add the laptop screen, laptop keyboard and laptop battery. |
| 20:18.24 | lkcl | jay_: those are custom designed and absolutely NOTHING to do with the micro-desktop housing. |
| 20:18.50 | lkcl | the only thing that's common between the laptop housing and the desktop housing is: they are both compliant with the EOMA68 standard |
| 20:25.49 | jay_ | lkcl_: can you buy the laptop PCB alone? I dont think I see it listed? |
| 20:29.26 | jay_ | lkcl_: hmm it might be easier to buy the $500 option, do you have an actual picture of the PFY Laptop Housing Kit for Computer Card?\ |
| 20:30.47 | lkcl | jay_: you're about the first person to ask! there are 3 PCBs needed. |
| 20:31.11 | lkcl | jay_: there's some pictures of the assembled prototypes that i've done... 1sec |
| 20:32.34 | lkcl | jay_: http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/news/ ok go through that lot |
| 20:32.37 | jay_ | lkcl_: 3 boards hmmm know I think I might go for the PYP option |
| 20:33.27 | lkcl | 3 boards, 4 custom-made cables... |
| 20:33.35 | lkcl | http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/news/EOMA68_Libre_15.6in_Laptop_casework_completed/ |
| 20:34.33 | lkcl | jay_: ha. very bad quality camera but this was the first time i booted the PCBs up |
| 20:34.35 | lkcl | http://rhombus-tech.net/community_ideas/laptop_15in/news/EOMA68_Libre_15.6in_Laptop_Prototype_PCBs_first_boot/ |
| 20:38.23 | jay_ | do you have to get it in purple? |
| 20:45.27 | jay_ | lkcl_: of topic question but based on your curriculum you might be the right person to ask. So im very new to gnu/linux I choose slackware just because its forcing me to do things from a command line and not a GUI, I still struggle with commands and other stuff but can you recommend a good book for a beginner preferably on the desktop environment as that Im using my current machine for |
| 20:49.39 | jay_ | by desktop I dont mean kde or gnome its just most books I pick focus on servers |
| 21:06.36 | *** join/#arm-netbook infobot (ibot@rikers.org) |
| 21:06.36 | *** topic/#arm-netbook is arm-netbook: Don't ask to ask. Just ask! - EOMA68 spec http://bit.ly/ZHqfxA - ML arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk - Logs http://bit.ly/XELKJq or http://bit.ly/15OCYPD - For Allwinner/sunxi discussions prefer #linux-sunxi - iMX6 Card http://bit.ly/XAUGCD - Flying Squirrel http://bit.ly/WgOYaR - Allwinner A10/A20 Card http://bit.ly/zBLAbY - http://rhombus-tech.net |
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| 21:24.24 | lkcl | jay_: no lol there's a few other colours |
| 21:25.16 | lkcl | jay_: hmmm intriguing... honestly i just pick things up as i go along, i don't read many books about computing! |
| 21:25.40 | lkcl | jay_: what i do is, i assume that what i want to know has been asked hundreds maybe thousands of times |
| 21:26.09 | lkcl | jay_: so i just imagine what keywords someone would ask or discuss... type them into google... and ta-daaa up come half a dozen discussions :) |
| 21:28.36 | lkcl | jay_: but you know what you should consider if you want to *really* make yourself work at command-line? use fvwm in the same setup that i do... :) |
| 21:30.09 | jay_ | lkcl_: are you referring to this one http://fvwm.org/ |
| 21:31.11 | lkcl | jay_: yeahman :) |
| 21:32.07 | lkcl | jay_: try this config - http://lkcl.net/fvwm2rc |
| 21:32.13 | lkcl | you'll looove that :) |
| 21:33.12 | lkcl | basically what i do is, i start a single xterm (using the right-mouse-button to bring up the root menu) |
| 21:33.41 | lkcl | then i pretty much don't ever run a GUI app via the menu *ever again* :) |
| 21:33.52 | lkcl | so if i want firefox, i find that xterm, and type "firefox &" |
| 21:33.54 | lkcl | lol |
| 21:34.16 | lkcl | confuses the hell out of people when they see it. |
| 21:35.04 | lkcl | let me take a screenshot for ya.... you can see i've moved the date and shrunk the "Virtual Screens" thing in the bottom right corner down to as tiny as i can practically manage.... |
| 21:35.06 | lkcl | 1sec... |
| 21:35.06 | jay_ | lkcl_: sweet, Ill try it, ok last question so if I just want a desktop all I need is Numero Uno Computer Card (or any computer card), Micro Desktop Housing for Computer Card and USB + HDMI Cable Set for Standalone Operation. And then all I provide is a screen, keyboard and mouse right? |
| 21:36.43 | lkcl | jay_: http://hands.com/~lkcl/scrn.png |
| 21:37.01 | lkcl | but bear in mind this is really hard-core specialist setup okay!! |
| 21:37.48 | lkcl | jay_: yyep. if you've got a monitor with both VGA and HDMI you're set. USB keyboard. USB mouse. oh - find yourself a USB WIFI or USB Ethernet dongle as well |
| 21:38.09 | lkcl | get something from thinkpenguin.com they're my sponsor :) |
| 21:39.31 | jay_ | lkcl_: dude! that is to hard-core I'm still a noob but Ill keep it in mind |
| 21:40.36 | lkcl | jay_: lol. oh btw do look up "devuan trinity desktop" - it's a bit obscure to find but the combination is really nice. a lot less hassle. |
| 21:42.58 | SPG | Luke Leighton master f221be1 source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=f221be1 |
| 21:48.40 | jay_ | lkcl_: ok 2 final questions I swear, if you don't reach your goal but I pledge will I still get the hardware I pledged for? and will the shipping start on Mar 2017 or with luck maybe earlier? |
| 21:49.15 | lkcl | jay_: :) |
| 21:49.27 | lkcl | jay_: update about that shortly |
| 21:50.10 | lkcl | jay_: and i was estimating so i'll try to keep to that schedule but can't promise it'll be exact... i definitely want to aim for the majority of PCB manufacturing in january |
| 21:50.19 | lkcl | when the factory is less busy |
| 21:51.11 | lkcl | jay_: what i will be doing is, just letting people know what's happening, all the time. apart from anything i will need help, so do join the mailing list. |
| 21:51.40 | lkcl | jay_: even the fact that you're a beginner is really *really* useful because if you can't do it, then that needs to be fixed. if that makes sense |
| 22:53.42 | jay_ | lkcl_: thanks for all the info, i can now make an informed decision! |
| 22:54.32 | lkcl | jay_: any time |
| 23:16.42 | SPG | Luke Leighton master bdbc23d source crowdsupply/assess_campaign.py update assessment * http://git.hands.com/?p=rhombus.git;a=commitdiff;h=bdbc23d |
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