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| 11:21.46 | mnemoc | moin |
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| 12:11.35 | penguin42 | hmph, internal server error off digikey |
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| 18:25.36 | leviathanch | focus: hi |
| 18:26.08 | leviathanch | I've sent you an updated A31 symbol, with S0 and S1 split into two separate subunits |
| 18:26.23 | leviathanch | this way you can connect the SDRAM much easier |
| 18:26.59 | leviathanch | I also added some text into the subunits |
| 18:27.09 | leviathanch | so that it's obvious which subpart is what |
| 18:27.11 | leviathanch | :-) |
| 18:27.36 | focus_it | thanks I got it |
| 18:27.42 | leviathanch | great! |
| 18:28.26 | leviathanch | something's a little bit fail: kicad would support drawings which are only visible within subunits, but you have to define it manually with a textedito. ther isn't an UI option for it >_> |
| 18:29.20 | leviathanch | so at the end I had to edit the a31.lib with vim in order to only draw the squares and the text within one specific subsymbol |
| 18:29.22 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 18:29.53 | leviathanch | let's make this board as an opensource project, together |
| 18:30.07 | leviathanch | as long as I have my pads for soldering random stuff onto it |
| 18:30.09 | leviathanch | I'm happy |
| 18:30.12 | leviathanch | squee |
| 18:30.13 | leviathanch | :-D |
| 18:30.24 | focus_it | yup! |
| 18:31.08 | focus_it | do you get the kicad project with 3D for A31 and the expeyes + SODIMM joined together? |
| 18:31.46 | focus_it | the file also has the correction for pad size - needs to up it to 0.3mm |
| 18:32.11 | leviathanch | ah, did you receive my python script I wrote? |
| 18:32.26 | leviathanch | which updates the pad sizes automatically if you set the right parameter? |
| 18:32.47 | leviathanch | simplyfies everything a lot :-) |
| 18:33.04 | focus_it | hard to tell - the web mail i use out of hours is not same as evolution |
| 18:33.22 | focus_it | at work - so I can't see back too far |
| 18:36.03 | leviathanch | uhm |
| 18:36.12 | leviathanch | focus_it: I've sent you a tar.gz file |
| 18:36.20 | leviathanch | which contains some python scripts |
| 18:36.21 | leviathanch | :-) |
| 18:36.31 | leviathanch | otherwise I'll send it to you again |
| 18:36.38 | leviathanch | but you need a csv |
| 18:36.44 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 18:36.57 | leviathanch | wait I'll just send you the tar.gz once again |
| 18:36.59 | leviathanch | ;-) |
| 18:40.29 | leviathanch | focus_it: you've got email :-) |
| 18:40.45 | focus_it | ok thanks - the pads easily adjusted in pcbnew - right click pad > (select pad) > edit all pads > and then work with the option from there |
| 18:40.57 | focus_it | got it thanks |
| 18:45.25 | leviathanch | focus_it: no problem :-) |
| 18:48.06 | focus_it | brilliant start preparing it as a proper project for release some time monday / tuesday |
| 18:49.57 | focus_it | I note the new cubieboard uses tiny cylinder for xtal - may be you want to do that, its a big space and cost saver |
| 18:50.35 | focus_it | the expeyes used smt - a bit expensive compared to watch type cylinder xtal |
| 18:51.26 | focus_it | what chip do you plan for the power? AXP209? |
| 18:57.54 | focus_it | leviathanch: if using AXP209, the expeyes project has it done and you can download it and copy/paste that into your schematic and save a lot of time |
| 19:00.39 | focus_it | The DDR parts also identical http://www.gplsquared.com/SoM2/NTC-DDR3-4Gb-B-R10.pdf NT5CB256M16BP-DI 256*16 to GT memory because it is JDEC compatible memory - so can copy schematic and bga footprint to save time |
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| 20:12.16 | leviathanch | focus_it: sorry, I was having dinner |
| 20:12.47 | leviathanch | no, the newer one, AXP221 |
| 20:14.01 | leviathanch | focus_it: is the schematics symbol for the DDR contained within the tar.gz you've uploaded? |
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| 20:41.27 | leviathanch | focus_it: I was warned the PowerVR might give us some problems with the GPL |
| 20:41.29 | leviathanch | ... |
| 20:42.41 | leviathanch | would be ironic if I'd get f**ed because my board commits a GPL violation after having shouted against companies commiting such myself |
| 20:42.42 | leviathanch | >_> |
| 20:42.55 | leviathanch | we really have to check that |
| 20:44.57 | leviathanch | focus_it: hehe, http://airlied.livejournal.com/39506.html |
| 20:45.08 | leviathanch | a loop hole |
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| 21:02.10 | focus_it | leviathanch: "copyright holder do not need the permission granted by the GPL to distribute their own work, so they do not need to satisfy the GPL's requirements" |
| 21:02.24 | focus_it | it sez there - pro |
| 21:02.45 | focus_it | probably how they get around it |
| 21:06.34 | leviathanch | hehe |
| 21:06.36 | leviathanch | yes |
| 21:06.40 | leviathanch | what I ment |
| 21:06.47 | leviathanch | so we don't have a GPL violation at least |
| 21:06.49 | leviathanch | puh |
| 21:06.59 | leviathanch | it's still not nice |
| 21:07.01 | focus_it | The DDR is in this older file: http://www.gplsquared.com/SoM2/SoM2_expeyes_2013_06_03.tar.bz2 |
| 21:07.09 | leviathanch | ok |
| 21:07.10 | leviathanch | thx! |
| 21:14.04 | leviathanch | focus_it: is this RTL chip still recent? |
| 21:15.07 | leviathanch | focus_it: RTL8201CP |
| 21:15.54 | leviathanch | because I can remember some years ago I was using the exact same in order to provide ethernet for my RepRap electronics |
| 21:16.14 | leviathanch | but never got to develop an effective web interface for it |
| 21:16.41 | leviathanch | it did print some design for the tablet with it recently though |
| 21:16.48 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 21:17.31 | buZz | reprap \o/ |
| 21:17.33 | buZz | :) |
| 21:17.45 | buZz | just designed and printed a custom case part for a cubieboard |
| 21:17.46 | buZz | http://www.thingiverse.com/thing:117439 |
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| 21:22.59 | focus_it | leviathanch: The RTL8201CP chip is still selling and very cheap and supported by Linux |
| 21:23.07 | focus_it | http://www.aliexpress.com/wholesale/wholesale-RTL8201CP.html?SearchText=RTL8201CP&CatId=0&initiative_id=SB_20130713132030&SortType=price_asc&filterCat=4099,400103,200004721&groupsort=1 |
| 21:24.45 | focus_it | This guy asks for $0.3 + shipping http://www.aliexpress.com/item/RTL8201CP/1001866633.html |
| 21:30.30 | leviathanch | O_o |
| 21:30.39 | leviathanch | unbelievable cheap! |
| 21:31.01 | leviathanch | awesome ^_^ |
| 21:31.55 | focus_it | Allwinner sez AXP221 - but datasheet in CN - google translate can help - but do you have a proper English translated datasheet of AXP221 to work with? |
| 21:33.31 | leviathanch | uhm, the most important information is the value table and the reference schematic |
| 21:33.56 | leviathanch | and I could even guess without google translate which of the rows and columns is the minimum and maximum voltage |
| 21:33.57 | leviathanch | ;-) |
| 21:34.28 | focus_it | ok understand but one or two items hard to guess |
| 21:34.29 | leviathanch | our luck that nearly every CAD has been written by English speaking people |
| 21:34.38 | leviathanch | same for EDA |
| 21:34.54 | leviathanch | so they are forced to at least name the pins in European alphabet |
| 21:34.55 | leviathanch | xD |
| 21:35.08 | leviathanch | focus_it: yeah |
| 21:35.15 | leviathanch | focus_it: you don't understand Chinese? |
| 21:35.28 | leviathanch | or do you? |
| 21:35.57 | focus_it | i been in CN 2yr but not understand CN, also they have cad but obviously they can't export to here |
| 21:38.48 | focus_it | in cn they also have huge varieties of cheap dev systems but not export to here because its all in cn |
| 21:39.23 | focus_it | also numerous ultra cheap cpus costing $0.1 but as good as PICs and ARM cortex without the price |
| 21:40.32 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 21:41.01 | leviathanch | did you hear of this octa-core which should be released soon by some Chinese company? |
| 21:41.08 | leviathanch | low cost SoC |
| 21:41.15 | buZz | My new cubiecase with built-in PSU : http://www.thingiverse.com/make:41781 |
| 21:42.01 | leviathanch | buZz: nice! |
| 21:42.12 | focus_it | buZz: envy! |
| 21:42.15 | leviathanch | buZz: you've got a RepRap as well? |
| 21:42.18 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 21:42.40 | buZz | yeah |
| 21:42.49 | buZz | made one last year |
| 21:42.54 | buZz | its such nice tech ;) |
| 21:43.08 | leviathanch | buZz: hehe |
| 21:43.13 | focus_it | buZz: I'm gonna beat you boyeee! I bought this http://formlabs.com/ |
| 21:43.20 | leviathanch | built mine some years ago |
| 21:43.49 | focus_it | I ordered it half paid for by my company |
| 21:43.55 | leviathanch | most of it has been printed or is recycled iron |
| 21:44.03 | buZz | focus_it: resin prints are fragile |
| 21:44.04 | leviathanch | the threded rods and so |
| 21:44.05 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 21:44.19 | leviathanch | focus_it: what does RMB mean btw? |
| 21:44.25 | leviathanch | which current? |
| 21:44.28 | buZz | right mouse button |
| 21:44.29 | buZz | :P |
| 21:44.38 | leviathanch | ahh |
| 21:44.44 | leviathanch | I've googled |
| 21:44.45 | leviathanch | xD |
| 21:44.46 | leviathanch | sorry |
| 21:45.02 | focus_it | RMB means CN currency |
| 21:45.07 | leviathanch | ok |
| 21:45.10 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 21:46.07 | focus_it | formlabs is 25 micron accuracy which is good enough for production run models in $ company which is why my boss agreed to buy it |
| 21:46.10 | leviathanch | that's cheap for so much RAM |
| 21:46.18 | leviathanch | wow |
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| 21:46.32 | buZz | focus_it: i am not talking about accuracy, that is great |
| 21:46.44 | buZz | focus_it: i am talking about being able to crush the prints with your hands |
| 21:46.45 | leviathanch | focus_it: I'll use both RAM slots, ok? |
| 21:47.13 | focus_it | leviathanch: ok |
| 21:47.18 | leviathanch | ok |
| 21:47.35 | leviathanch | focus_it: it's not the target which counted for me when building my prusa mendel out of recycling material |
| 21:47.38 | leviathanch | it was the way |
| 21:47.53 | focus_it | buZz: this for sales guys who need something to show to customers |
| 21:47.57 | leviathanch | cuting iron, debugging electronics, screwing and measuring |
| 21:48.03 | leviathanch | is as good as Zen meditation |
| 21:48.04 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 21:48.18 | buZz | focus_it: ah yeah its fine for pointless demos, not for production work |
| 21:48.24 | buZz | reprap ownes production work |
| 21:49.05 | focus_it | i bought a reprarap but after 80% assembly I gave up - and then ordered parts to build my own one better designed - still haven't done it yet - shame on me |
| 21:50.13 | focus_it | i have a laser cutter and it makes parts in minutes such as boxes - but not proper 3d shapes with high definition |
| 21:52.04 | leviathanch | focus_it: you've got a laser cutter? |
| 21:52.14 | focus_it | 80W |
| 21:52.27 | leviathanch | focus_it: can you also cut thin iron parts? around 2mm thick? |
| 21:52.30 | focus_it | 600x400mm |
| 21:52.33 | leviathanch | oh |
| 21:52.34 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 21:52.48 | leviathanch | damn 80W won't cut iron |
| 21:52.49 | leviathanch | ... |
| 21:52.59 | focus_it | metal cutting needs oxygen and 150W |
| 21:53.04 | leviathanch | yes |
| 21:53.10 | focus_it | or a 500W fiber laser |
| 21:53.13 | leviathanch | well, we have one at the hackerspace in Basel |
| 21:53.14 | focus_it | 100k! |
| 21:53.42 | focus_it | cool |
| 21:53.43 | leviathanch | I'll ask folken if he can cut it for me |
| 21:53.46 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 21:54.15 | leviathanch | focus_it: where are you usually, when you're not in CN? |
| 21:54.23 | focus_it | in uk |
| 21:54.40 | leviathanch | oh, damn that's also far from Switzerland |
| 21:54.44 | leviathanch | still too far for a beer |
| 21:54.45 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 21:55.12 | focus_it | i have travelled the world - may be some day i be there |
| 21:55.54 | focus_it | i was in geneva a few years back on an exhibition |
| 22:05.30 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 22:05.38 | leviathanch | focus_it: which one? |
| 22:05.49 | leviathanch | maybe I've been there as well |
| 22:05.50 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:08.34 | focus_it | buZz: I order this 3D scanner as well for future work http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/the-matterform-3d-scanner |
| 22:08.56 | focus_it | leviathanch: the swiss invention show |
| 22:09.14 | focus_it | i can't remember its full name but it is one of the biggest |
| 22:10.39 | leviathanch | focus_it: we have a hacked kinect sensor in our hackerspace xD |
| 22:11.29 | leviathanch | and also some low power plasma thruster based on Chen Diazs VASIMR200 design |
| 22:11.32 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:11.42 | leviathanch | but really home brew and low power |
| 22:11.50 | leviathanch | with a recycled magnetron |
| 22:12.19 | leviathanch | 3D printing, some basic physics experiments |
| 22:12.25 | leviathanch | what just cam to my mind |
| 22:12.28 | focus_it | wow - dangerous them magnetrons |
| 22:12.41 | leviathanch | you just need to shield it right |
| 22:12.59 | leviathanch | basically I couple all the energy into the plasma, so there's not much leakage |
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| 22:13.48 | buZz | focus_it: we are building a 3d scanner around a kinect setup |
| 22:13.52 | focus_it | i took apart a new microwave to get to the magnetron. My idea was to put it inside a transparent double wall box. The double wall will be filled with water and the microwaves can't then escape |
| 22:14.21 | focus_it | not enough time to go finish that project |
| 22:15.22 | focus_it | buZz: the matter form one is very supportive of open source - which is why I went for that |
| 22:17.43 | penguin42 | focus_it: It's an interesting way to try and build a kettle |
| 22:17.45 | buZz | nice nice |
| 22:18.07 | focus_it | matter form sent me one of their high definition scans - it was very high definition - then I imported it into meshlabs and then into wings3d and it worked flawlessly importing end exporting |
| 22:19.00 | buZz | i think we are soon receiving someones line scanner |
| 22:19.08 | buZz | just a laserline + webcam + rotational platform |
| 22:19.52 | penguin42 | meshlab is very neat - I've played with 3d fractals in that a few times |
| 22:20.02 | focus_it | penguin42: interesting way to experiment with microwaves without getting cancer. Need to see the experiment and what it is doing while experimenting to take the experiment forward - hence the double wall made of water |
| 22:20.04 | buZz | meshlab is really fast |
| 22:20.15 | leviathanch | focus_it: I've just tinkered around a lot with fundamental physics projects |
| 22:20.28 | leviathanch | you know, when something pops up in my head I have to finish it |
| 22:20.30 | penguin42 | focus_it: I'm not sure I'd trust it to keep all the microwaves in |
| 22:20.37 | leviathanch | took me more then a year to finish the RepRap |
| 22:20.47 | leviathanch | but I invested every free minute into it |
| 22:20.52 | leviathanch | same for the thruster |
| 22:21.05 | leviathanch | it's my way to escape the daily problems |
| 22:21.13 | leviathanch | or hacking embedded devices |
| 22:21.15 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:21.18 | focus_it | penguin42: which is why I never finished the project - need a microwave detector and more in case it penetrated the shielding |
| 22:21.37 | leviathanch | I borrowed one from my professor of physics |
| 22:21.41 | leviathanch | ;-) |
| 22:21.53 | leviathanch | did cost me a beer |
| 22:22.08 | penguin42 | focus_it: Well you could always build it inside the case of the microwave you extracted the magnetron from |
| 22:22.15 | leviathanch | yes |
| 22:22.29 | focus_it | levianthanch: that is great this persistance to get things done - I dabble but too much in too many pies |
| 22:22.41 | leviathanch | but I needed a long channel were the longer wave subharmonies can travel through and bear the plasma with'em |
| 22:22.53 | leviathanch | and the material of the original oven isn't enough |
| 22:22.54 | focus_it | penguin42: this experiment must not have metal objects other than experiment near it |
| 22:23.15 | leviathanch | so I had to use a fine looped iron web |
| 22:23.26 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 22:23.33 | leviathanch | sometime a small spark |
| 22:23.42 | leviathanch | otherwise all the microwaves stay within the plasma |
| 22:23.54 | leviathanch | nearly no emmision along the tube |
| 22:24.04 | leviathanch | 10mN thrust |
| 22:24.07 | leviathanch | yeepee |
| 22:24.09 | leviathanch | 1.2kW |
| 22:24.10 | leviathanch | >_> |
| 22:24.47 | penguin42 | sorry - did you just say thrust? |
| 22:24.54 | leviathanch | oops |
| 22:25.10 | leviathanch | sorry, you got me, I'm not a native speaker ^_^" |
| 22:25.29 | leviathanch | uhh |
| 22:25.31 | leviathanch | it's right |
| 22:25.37 | leviathanch | ahh you mean because it's that weak |
| 22:25.42 | leviathanch | yeah |
| 22:25.42 | leviathanch | hihi |
| 22:25.57 | penguin42 | but you did say mN so that's consistent with thrust - I've never thought of a radio source as producing thrust |
| 22:25.57 | leviathanch | at it's not blowing up |
| 22:26.02 | leviathanch | *at least |
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| 22:26.17 | leviathanch | penguin42: yes |
| 22:26.19 | leviathanch | thrust |
| 22:26.22 | leviathanch | plasma thrusters |
| 22:26.26 | leviathanch | produce thrust |
| 22:26.27 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:26.43 | leviathanch | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Variable_Specific_Impulse_Magnetoplasma_Rocket |
| 22:27.14 | penguin42 | wow - that's a good title |
| 22:27.44 | penguin42 | oh, right it's not the radio waves themselves that are giving the thrust - that's ionising some gas |
| 22:27.57 | leviathanch | it just tickled me within my fingers to build it when I had read Chen Diazs scientifc paper |
| 22:28.05 | leviathanch | yeah |
| 22:28.07 | leviathanch | Argon |
| 22:28.28 | leviathanch | you can get 5 liters for around 20$ at Pangas |
| 22:28.46 | penguin42 | hmm but it only works in a vacuum doesn't it? |
| 22:28.48 | focus_it | I'm trying to verify this guy http://www.emdrive.com/ |
| 22:29.45 | leviathanch | focus_it: they forgot to mention that it fries everything beneath it, uhum |
| 22:29.49 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:30.05 | leviathanch | but yeah, radiation pressure is a well known phenomenon |
| 22:30.21 | leviathanch | take your 70W laser and point it towards a black colored pinpong ball |
| 22:30.27 | leviathanch | it will start to move |
| 22:30.36 | penguin42 | has no idea if that makes sense or not |
| 22:30.43 | leviathanch | since E=mc²=hv |
| 22:30.47 | focus_it | i don't believe in it - but the experimentation and its difficulty keeps nagging away to build something and test it |
| 22:31.00 | leviathanch | E=mc²=hv ;-) |
| 22:31.22 | leviathanch | since p=m*v |
| 22:31.40 | leviathanch | you can calculate the momentum of a photone |
| 22:31.46 | focus_it | the guy has a video (fake?) on youtube with his machine spinning on a turntable and nothing to make it turn that way |
| 22:32.44 | leviathanch | Dr.Harold White from NASA space centers Eagle Lab is working on a faster then light drive, seriously |
| 22:32.48 | focus_it | he claims about 50mN+ and the latest is 0.1N or better - can't scoff at such claims - got UK funding from government |
| 22:32.50 | leviathanch | and he's not a nut case |
| 22:32.51 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:32.53 | leviathanch | hmm? |
| 22:33.17 | leviathanch | focus_it: 50mN isn't far from realistic |
| 22:33.25 | leviathanch | you only need a high radiation intensity |
| 22:33.44 | leviathanch | just fill it into the formula for the radiation pressure |
| 22:33.50 | leviathanch | calculate the area |
| 22:33.59 | leviathanch | woosh you've got such a value |
| 22:35.04 | focus_it | hmm... the wall of water would block the radiation |
| 22:36.06 | focus_it | so it would have to work inside the transparent box of water before i believe in it |
| 22:36.48 | focus_it | which is where I think this guy is going wrong |
| 22:38.28 | focus_it | i got the plastic to make the double wall and microwave is just a household microwave but still haven't got round to experimenting with it |
| 22:39.27 | leviathanch | I'd stick to a good old fashio shielding with fine looped iron |
| 22:39.36 | leviathanch | hmm |
| 22:39.49 | leviathanch | grate |
| 22:39.58 | leviathanch | it is called |
| 22:39.59 | leviathanch | ^^ |
| 22:40.10 | leviathanch | sometimes has to loop up words |
| 22:40.32 | focus_it | the guy might turn that around and say the mesh interfered with his experiment by reflecting microwaves back - water - no chance! |
| 22:41.53 | focus_it | its crap anyway! :) |
| 22:44.44 | focus_it | I was going to make some plastic structures and stick down copper tape to get the metal structures I needed. |
| 22:46.15 | focus_it | If I understood my university lectures in electromagnetism, I would be able to really play with microwaves for the first time without risking injury. Build microwave devices, test them, etc. |
| 22:47.07 | focus_it | Even build plasma engines of low power - even a cross polaroid to block plasma penetration |
| 22:52.05 | penguin42 | focus_it: Generally it's probably a bad idea to play with kW microwave sources unless you did understand it! |
| 22:52.43 | focus_it | I agree - which is why i stop |
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| 23:04.35 | leviathanch | focus_it: well if you are very unlucky a magnetron can actually already cause blindness |
| 23:04.39 | leviathanch | quickly |
| 23:04.44 | leviathanch | so take care |
| 23:05.10 | leviathanch | I had a special face protection on the first time I measured it |
| 23:05.14 | leviathanch | just to make sure |
| 23:05.54 | leviathanch | some students who were watching my laboratory and already knew a bit about mircowaves had the opinion I'd be too careful |
| 23:06.13 | leviathanch | but my sight is relevant for what I'm doing :-) |
| 23:06.36 | focus_it | true - the experimenter in me says I am trained to handle microwaves so I should do it all - but because microwaves are off the menu in science experiements, the practical experience is nil in classroom and in labs |
| 23:07.14 | focus_it | at our university you would have to head on down to the physics department to get to microwaves |
| 23:07.36 | focus_it | despite it being electronics department subject |
| 23:09.03 | focus_it | tooo dangerous - leave it for some time in the future |
| 23:11.55 | focus_it | good night folks :) |
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