| 15:10.04 | *** join/#arm-netbook ibot (~ibot@rikers.org) |
| 15:10.04 | *** topic/#arm-netbook is EOMA: Embedded Open Modular Architecture - Don't ask to ask. Just ask! - http://elinux.org/Embedded_Open_Modular_Architecture/EOMA-68 - ML arm-netbook@lists.phcomp.co.uk - Logs http://ibot.rikers.org/%23arm-netbook or http://irclog.whitequark.org/arm-netbook/ - http://rhombus-tech.net/ |
| 15:10.08 | markvandenborre | getting this serial console may sound like nothing to you, but I'm really grateful for your help! |
| 15:12.04 | WarheadsSE | not a problem |
| 15:12.09 | WarheadsSE | I remember when i was new to ARM |
| 15:12.20 | WarheadsSE | Wasn't that long ago.. Oct 2010 |
| 15:13.36 | markvandenborre | oh, that's not so long ago indeed |
| 15:14.24 | markvandenborre | is looking at why it wouldn't grab a dhcp lease in the first place, while /etc/init.d/networking restart from the serial console did give it one... |
| 15:15.56 | markvandenborre | hm, this is strange |
| 15:16.07 | markvandenborre | now when I reboot it the nic comes up perfectly |
| 15:18.36 | WarheadsSE | "magic" |
| 15:18.52 | WarheadsSE | (I dev Arch, so not sure why it would have misbehaved on Debian) |
| 15:19.09 | rm | I haven't had any problem with that debian image |
| 15:22.40 | markvandenborre | I didn't change a thing |
| 15:22.51 | markvandenborre | can only see that it works where it didn't before |
| 15:22.57 | markvandenborre | (didn't get a dhcp lease) |
| 15:28.45 | markvandenborre | is there a way to install debian to the internal flash too? |
| 15:28.59 | gnexus | mnemoc: does spdif work with 3.0.36? |
| 15:32.25 | mnemoc | gnexus: it compiles... |
| 15:32.35 | mnemoc | haven't touched it |
| 15:33.15 | gnexus | mnemoc: dmesg - sun4i-spdif cannot find any using configuration for controllers |
| 15:33.35 | mnemoc | those are usually related to missing stuff in script.fex |
| 15:33.51 | gnexus | mnemoc: aha! |
| 15:34.13 | mnemoc | grep for "fetch" in the driver to see what keys it expects |
| 15:34.31 | gnexus | menmoc: why no ThumbEE is the defconfig? |
| 15:35.35 | gnexus | mnemoc: in the defconfig |
| 15:36.16 | gnexus | anybody tried Thumb2? |
| 15:37.05 | mnemoc | i haven't played with anything of that, started from the defconfig in Qware's release |
| 15:37.14 | mnemoc | try and see :) |
| 15:37.53 | gnexus | i tried. I didn't see. . . :( |
| 15:38.17 | gnexus | ThumbEE works fine though! |
| 15:38.32 | gnexus | need that in there. |
| 15:38.59 | mnemoc | gnexus: there is a ticket about defconfig improvements |
| 15:39.22 | mnemoc | gnexus: can you comment there and hopefully add a patch? |
| 15:39.42 | gnexus | mnemoc: yes. np |
| 15:40.22 | gnexus | people will like this config ;) |
| 15:41.10 | mnemoc | gnexus: split the diff into likable chunks :) |
| 15:42.00 | mnemoc | sun4i_defconfig = linux, sun4i_crane_defconfig = android. but both generic and without controversial stuff |
| 15:44.10 | gnexus | mnemoc: my current config would probably be controversial |
| 15:44.34 | gnexus | it enables all drivers like a mainstream distro |
| 15:44.47 | WarheadsSE | :) |
| 15:44.54 | WarheadsSE | I'll be doing that soon |
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| 15:45.01 | WarheadsSE | not the defconfig need though.. |
| 15:45.58 | gnexus | WarheadsSE: don't waste effort though. I'll get you a copy of my config. it is very stable and fast. |
| 15:46.20 | xxiao | anyone intested in a minipc-like device: VGA+2USB |
| 15:46.26 | gnexus | then you can use that as a template |
| 15:46.32 | xxiao | replacing hdmi with vga, 2 usb for keyboard/mouse, |
| 15:46.45 | xxiao | then you can hook to any computer screen and got a wifi-able computer? |
| 15:47.18 | xxiao | or thin-client for schools etc |
| 15:47.43 | *** join/#arm-netbook gimli (~gimli@xbmc/staff/gimli) |
| 15:50.33 | xxiao | wants to buy one of that, if it exists |
| 15:51.53 | WarheadsSE | There are several out there, varying boards |
| 15:52.04 | xxiao | WarheadsSE: a pointer? |
| 15:53.15 | WarheadsSE | Are you looking for something that is *only* vga, 2 usb and wifi? |
| 15:54.00 | xxiao | WarheadsSE: i want to run ubuntu on it, small size, wifi/2usb |
| 15:54.09 | xxiao | basically a small ubuntu pc for kids |
| 15:54.26 | xxiao | A10 if it exists :0 |
| 15:54.33 | traeak | xxiao that's a hard one...personally everything i have here has digital inputs |
| 15:54.42 | traeak | xxiao: but for kiosks, POS applications |
| 15:54.50 | traeak | vga is probably still the way to go |
| 15:54.54 | WarheadsSE | xxiao: sure, that A100 is tiny |
| 15:55.23 | traeak | xxiao: vga, 2usb, sata, ethernet :-p |
| 15:55.26 | WarheadsSE | There are also some HP thinclients that run Marvell |
| 15:55.29 | xxiao | hdmi/dvi are good for home TV, but on many apps VGA-analog still prevail |
| 15:55.41 | WarheadsSE | yeah |
| 15:55.53 | xxiao | traeak: i don't need sata, i will let my kids using my server, so it will be like a thin-client |
| 15:56.52 | xxiao | basically, they got a normal LCD, with a minipc-dongle, keyboard/mouse, that's it |
| 15:56.56 | traeak | xxiao: sure...then you need the full ethernet |
| 15:57.02 | xxiao | wifi .... |
| 15:57.28 | traeak | i guess, then again these things aren't that blisteringly fast |
| 15:58.28 | xxiao | it won't, but it should be fine |
| 15:58.50 | xxiao | wonders when quad-core arm minipc will come out... |
| 16:00.05 | traeak | if the mips giuys lckl luke pointed to pulls off their SOC i want that to win |
| 16:01.59 | traeak | i see the a1000 is toast now |
| 16:02.03 | traeak | just a2000 left, which is fine |
| 16:02.46 | xxiao | i got my a2000 last Fri, it's 2.3.4 android, not 4.x as advertised |
| 16:03.00 | xxiao | will start hacking it 3 weeks later, too busy now |
| 16:04.18 | WarheadsSE | heh |
| 16:05.41 | traeak | xxiao: just download the newest android |
| 16:06.09 | xxiao | traeak: from where, github or allwinner's site? |
| 16:06.11 | traeak | unbearable from the mele site, and i'm not sure where the ICS link is |
| 16:06.20 | xxiao | guess it's the latter |
| 16:06.26 | traeak | neither |
| 16:06.33 | traeak | mele if you dont' mind waiting 1 day or so for download |
| 16:06.40 | traeak | someone else has it mirrored i forget where |
| 16:07.33 | xxiao | http://www.mele.cn/en/web/down_list.aspx?cid=GJS |
| 16:07.38 | xxiao | v1.6 is there |
| 16:07.50 | traeak | http://pushbroom.org/mele/ should be uploaded in another 10 mins or so |
| 16:07.56 | traeak | Mele_HTPC_Android_4.0_V1.ddimg.bin |
| 16:08.01 | traeak | probalby should zip that up, wait one |
| 16:09.09 | xxiao | i'm downloading from mele.cn |
| 16:09.12 | traeak | http://pushbroom.org/mele/Mele_HTPC_Android_4.0_V1.ddimg.bin.gz about 10 mins |
| 16:09.14 | xxiao | are they the same image? |
| 16:09.33 | traeak | xxiao: yeah, it just was going to take 1+ days to download from there |
| 16:09.34 | xxiao | add a md5sum plz |
| 16:09.45 | traeak | for the internal? |
| 16:09.46 | xxiao | traeak: i will download from your link |
| 16:10.05 | xxiao | what's that v1.6 release, still 2.3.4? |
| 16:10.12 | traeak | i'll generate the md5sum on the site when it's uploaded |
| 16:10.32 | traeak | i believe that's true, the 1.6 i think is ... |
| 16:10.50 | traeak | hostmonster isn't exactly fast |
| 16:11.04 | traeak | i'll md5sum the gz file |
| 16:28.34 | traeak | xxiao: okay |
| 16:28.45 | traeak | http://pushbroom.org/mele/Mele_HTPC_Android_4.0_V1.ddimg.bin.gz.md5sum as well |
| 16:29.42 | xxiao | traeak: thanks. downloading, 800KB/s here |
| 16:29.53 | xxiao | 10x faster than mele's site |
| 16:30.07 | xxiao | 20x faster, just checked |
| 16:34.36 | markvandenborre | xxiao: if you're into checksumming (good practice!), you might get a safer checksum |
| 16:34.51 | markvandenborre | md5 collisions... |
| 16:35.05 | xxiao | markvandenborre: i know...sha sum is better |
| 16:35.11 | xxiao | but md5sum is good enough i feel |
| 16:38.59 | traeak | just verifying the download rihgt? |
| 16:39.04 | traeak | this is a "dd" image processed |
| 16:39.06 | traeak | wait one |
| 16:42.53 | xxiao | traeak: done, checked for md5sum, thanks! |
| 16:43.18 | Turl | mnemoc: no, I didn't change anything on my config |
| 16:45.14 | markvandenborre | I'm trying to compile ptpcam on an allwinner a10 |
| 16:46.24 | markvandenborre | http://pastebin.com/FAicMAPd is the error I get |
| 16:46.31 | markvandenborre | it's quite clear what's missing |
| 16:46.43 | markvandenborre | but not from which package I should get it |
| 16:46.51 | rm | libusb-dev |
| 16:47.44 | markvandenborre | thx, I was looking at http://packages.debian.org/search?suite=wheezy&arch=armhf&mode=exactfilename&searchon=contents&keywords=usb.h |
| 16:47.53 | markvandenborre | so that was what confused me a little |
| 16:48.11 | markvandenborre | it all referenced specific armhf kernels |
| 16:53.56 | rm | http://packages.debian.org/wheezy/armhf/libusb-dev/filelist /usr/include/usb.h |
| 16:54.35 | mnemoc | Turl: `make` should have asked you for the new option. you need to set it to Y as you have 1GB and using the stock bootloader |
| 16:54.55 | furan | anybody doing jtag with the a10? |
| 16:55.40 | Turl | mnemoc: I don't build it manually though, if an option is set, that's what it uses, otherwise it defaults |
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| 16:57.07 | *** part/#arm-netbook QingPei (~qingpei@114.241.189.192) |
| 16:58.04 | mnemoc | Turl: when you have time please update the wip/3.0/mem branch and set the IGNORE_ATAG_MEM to Y |
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| 17:04.45 | *** join/#arm-netbook t0dbld|work (~t0dbld@unaffiliated/t0dbld) |
| 17:07.25 | traeak | xxiao: sorry, here's the original place: http://lundman.net/wiki/index.php/MeLe_A2000 |
| 17:08.30 | xxiao | traeak: great! |
| 17:10.17 | Turl | mnemoc: ok |
| 17:10.27 | Turl | mnemoc: shouldn't the other one work but give me less ram though? |
| 17:11.20 | mnemoc | Turl: depends on what info your bootloader provides |
| 17:17.05 | gnexus | Turl: hey thanks for pointing me to your defconfig. that got my hdmi working. |
| 17:17.31 | Turl | on what device? |
| 17:17.37 | gnexus | a2000 |
| 17:17.48 | Turl | stock android? |
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| 17:27.04 | traeak | mnemoc: did the forward branch get killt? |
| 17:27.17 | mnemoc | traeak: yes |
| 17:27.23 | traeak | which one is favored now? |
| 17:27.40 | mnemoc | there is a top-level 3.4 now |
| 17:28.02 | mnemoc | without my failed script.h stuff |
| 17:28.32 | traeak | k |
| 17:28.47 | traeak | looks like that's essentialy the same as forward was |
| 17:28.52 | mnemoc | yes |
| 17:29.18 | mnemoc | I only removed some commits of doubtful quality |
| 17:29.52 | mnemoc | the TODO still the same |
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| 18:35.40 | RITRedbeard | I finally have all the correct dohickeys to connect my MK802 to Atrix Lapdock! |
| 18:36.37 | mnemoc | kudos :) |
| 18:36.50 | mnemoc | hno: /q ? |
| 18:38.15 | RITRedbeard | The android distro seems to be slow :\ |
| 18:38.18 | hno | ? |
| 18:38.50 | mnemoc | hno: hi, do you have some minutes? |
| 18:39.00 | hno | sort of yes. |
| 18:39.40 | hno | Only need to relocate a sleeping kid to her bed first. She fell asleep at the dinner table. |
| 18:40.02 | mnemoc | hno: :) |
| 18:43.08 | hno | back |
| 18:43.20 | specing | hno: hahaha |
| 18:44.04 | specing | hno: Did you compile her with -fpic? |
| 18:45.09 | hno | specing, almost. |
| 18:45.17 | specing | :S |
| 18:45.20 | hno | mnemoc, what did you want to ask |
| 18:45.32 | furan | is there a good tutorial somewhere for building android distros for the a10? |
| 18:45.39 | furan | s/distros// |
| 18:45.40 | hno | furan, yes |
| 18:45.50 | mnemoc | hno: on /q |
| 18:45.56 | hno | ah |
| 18:46.01 | specing | Oh no, another android distro |
| 18:46.11 | furan | I just want to build for a specific device |
| 18:46.19 | furan | and that device requires some special drivers/etc |
| 18:46.27 | furan | not sure how to do that without starting my own branch or whatever |
| 18:46.31 | specing | the gods kill a kitten every time a new android distro comes out |
| 18:46.41 | furan | then tell me how to do it the right way :) |
| 18:46.55 | furan | overlay? |
| 18:47.13 | mnemoc | furan: http://linux-sunxi.org/Starting_a_CyanogenMod_device_tree |
| 18:47.23 | furan | thanks |
| 18:48.01 | mnemoc | hopefully at the end you can make a page for your device, and make the device tree public for others to use |
| 18:48.42 | furan | will try |
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| 18:52.13 | furan | how do .ko drivers that you can't build from source work with different android builds? |
| 18:52.20 | furan | e.g. if the magic doesn't match/etc? how do you get around that? |
| 18:53.07 | furan | looks like the copy proprietary files step does this somehow |
| 18:53.23 | Turl | nah, that just copies mali stuff |
| 18:53.42 | furan | how does mali work across distributions? does it have something that doesn't require the magic to match? |
| 18:53.51 | Turl | it's an userspace library |
| 18:54.02 | furan | oh |
| 18:54.05 | furan | ok |
| 18:54.41 | furan | for the device I'm working with all the kernel objects have sources apart from the keypad support, and it's based off an sun5ix_ir.c or something, so should be easy to RE |
| 18:55.18 | furan | also why did you guys go with cyanogenmod and not linaro? |
| 18:56.19 | Turl | because CM is better feature wise |
| 18:56.54 | Turl | and as far as I thought, the linaro optimizations bring along a crapton of new obscure bugs too |
| 18:56.59 | Turl | s/thought/saw/ |
| 18:57.39 | Turl | besides I'm naturally biased, being a CM contributor & device maintainer :P |
| 19:04.50 | WarheadsSE | ? for many: How can I set the memory avaialble to mali ? |
| 19:06.13 | traeak | 64mb or bust? |
| 19:06.39 | WarheadsSE | yeah, going to do some compiling, would like access to more than 300M of the ram. |
| 19:07.57 | mnemoc | WarheadsSE: try the wip/3.0/mem branch |
| 19:08.11 | mnemoc | WarheadsSE: there if you disable mali you won't get that memory reserved |
| 19:08.32 | WarheadsSE | mk |
| 19:08.46 | WarheadsSE | Yeah, I need mali in a bit, so I guess I'll make due |
| 19:09.02 | mnemoc | yw |
| 19:09.56 | j1nx | does anybody have documentation (or know where to find it) about the possible mali kernel parameters? |
| 19:10.26 | j1nx | like "mali.mem=64M@128M" etc.. |
| 19:10.48 | j1nx | kernel boot parameters, I am talking about |
| 19:12.39 | mnemoc | that won't work on our current implementation. but sure sounds like a nice goal |
| 19:13.25 | j1nx | Nah, was just an example, but want to know if we can configure the framebuffer mode at the boot parameters |
| 19:14.20 | mnemoc | the driver is designed to start from script.bin data and then be configured with ioctl()s |
| 19:16.22 | j1nx | I want to load the kernel drivers quickly from initrd and then place the boot splash on the framebuffer, but I am failing in understanding the framebuffer parameters |
| 19:16.45 | j1nx | and for that reason failing to get the boot splash drawed early in the boor process |
| 19:17.11 | Turl | I don't think you need mali to have a fb though? |
| 19:17.34 | j1nx | And we are not working with common stuff here, where I can just (mis)use a VESA driver |
| 19:17.52 | j1nx | or can I? |
| 19:18.02 | Turl | you can ioctl the disp thing some framebuffer to show it I think |
| 19:18.13 | mnemoc | Turl: mali has references to the fb address, so i bet it needs it |
| 19:18.42 | j1nx | (hmm, wonders how snowball is doing it) |
| 19:18.43 | Turl | look at the video demo stuff, I think it's used there |
| 19:18.51 | Turl | (cedar stuff) |
| 19:53.03 | RITRedbeard | recommendation for MK802 image? |
| 19:58.55 | WarheadsSE | linux/android? |
| 20:28.33 | mnemoc | you can mostly use any image for A10, the key is to use the right script.bin for your device |
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| 21:47.42 | fullofSheds | http://emea.kontron.com/products/boards+and+mezzanines/embedded+motherboards/miniitx+motherboards/ktt30mitx.html any news on the price for this?? |
| 21:48.25 | mnemoc | by rule, kontron = absurdly expensive |
| 21:49.07 | fullofSheds | "DRAM Up to 2 GB DDR3L memory down" as opposed to memory up? |
| 21:55.03 | fullofSheds | http://hksunlike.com/ArticleShow.asp?ArticleID=654 whoever decided than Android on this was a good idea should seriously consider a new line of work in the fast food industry |
| 21:55.14 | fullofSheds | than/that |
| 21:56.17 | fullofSheds | but the Windows key does come in handy |
| 21:57.51 | mnemoc | the best part of android with keyboard is pressing enter and getting a 'q' |
| 21:58.04 | mnemoc | (first character of the virtual keyboard) |
| 21:58.45 | fullofSheds | the touchpad buttons make a nice loud snapping sound so you know that you have pressed them |
| 22:02.10 | DonkeyHotei | fullofSheds: http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/pipermail/arm-netbook/2012-July/004853.html |
| 22:04.09 | fullofSheds | oh joy Marvell |
| 22:04.17 | WarheadsSE | :) aren't they fun |
| 22:05.57 | fullofSheds | lets see, why don't I just waste my time belt sanding my nipples? |
| 22:06.38 | fullofSheds | do any of their devices actually work as intended? |
| 22:09.57 | WarheadsSE | marvells? |
| 22:10.10 | ZaEarl | Has anyone built a LiveSuit image? I think I'm going to try using this walkthrough: https://www.miniand.com/forums/forums/2/topics/73, |
| 22:10.12 | WarheadsSE | I use a lot of devices based on their SoCs |
| 22:10.40 | fullofSheds | every part is broken, they really don't want just anyones money, they even say they aren't set up to write drivers or anything software related |
| 22:11.24 | fullofSheds | OLPC did manage to get the one SOC working well |
| 22:12.06 | DonkeyHotei | ZaEarl: i'm going to be trying that after i have a working adb cable for the mele |
| 22:13.15 | WarheadsSE | We've got several working well... |
| 22:16.06 | fullofSheds | WarheadsSE, which ones? |
| 22:16.28 | fullofSheds | old PXA? |
| 22:19.48 | WarheadsSE | Most of the sheevas & variants |
| 22:19.52 | WarheadsSE | armadas, etc |
| 22:20.03 | WarheadsSE | "old" PXA you have to be a bit more specific |
| 22:20.33 | WarheadsSE | We've got decent support for some of the PXAs, not a tonne of devices with those |
| 22:20.45 | fullofSheds | nevermind, no real future with marvell anyway |
| 22:23.03 | WarheadsSE | Some of their new SoCs arent bad. Yeah, the old old PXAs are shit. |
| 22:23.30 | fullofSheds | DonkeyHotei, maybe he should check with Warheads? |
| 22:24.10 | DonkeyHotei | no idea; i merely saw that in the archives and pasted to you |
| 22:34.59 | WarheadsSE | looks around |
| 22:35.07 | WarheadsSE | I might have the stage1 docs somewhere.. |
| 22:35.55 | rz2k | some A10/A13 stuff on sale on aliexpress http://www.aliexpress.com/activities/aliexpress-promotion/single-store.html?promotionId=100009908,100009909&storeId=102048 |
| 22:36.11 | rz2k | $40 for ly-f1 http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/7-AllWinner-A10-Android-4-0-capacitive-5-point-touch-tablet-pc-1-5GHZ/102048_556450542.html?promotionId=100009909 |
| 22:36.13 | furan | whoa |
| 22:37.53 | DonkeyHotei | seems like all the ones that say sold out were allwinner |
| 22:39.44 | rz2k | its 16 - 20 july sale, so probably restock will be available. |
| 22:43.44 | Turl | 7 bucks and you get a kbrd case too |
| 22:44.39 | Turl | but, as always |
| 22:44.52 | Turl | they move the rest of the price to the shipping cost |
| 22:45.28 | traeak | which 10" would you suggest? |
| 22:46.09 | traeak | crap superpad is toast |
| 22:46.43 | Turl | I'd skip the aluminium back ones |
| 22:46.49 | Turl | they look good & all |
| 22:47.07 | Turl | but they're not well isolated from the connectors or something |
| 22:47.23 | traeak | seems like no more 10" ones available on there |
| 22:47.34 | Turl | when you charge or use usb on your tablet you get shocked :P |
| 22:48.24 | Turl | http://www.aliexpress.com/store/section/Best-Selling-9-7-10-Tablets/102048_500041672.html?sortType=price_asc |
| 22:48.37 | Turl | superpad lol :P |
| 22:49.22 | Turl | ha http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/10-1-Dual-core-Intel-Atom-N570-1-66GHz-Windows-7-tablet-pc-2G-32G-1366/102048_459855327.html |
| 22:49.28 | Turl | x86 tablet |
| 22:50.46 | traeak | no thx :-p |
| 22:51.03 | rz2k | Turl: this is rather old tablet, I had it for review for some days. |
| 22:51.14 | rz2k | I can say that its not that bad |
| 22:51.23 | traeak | superpad you mean? |
| 22:51.27 | traeak | OOS for that price |
| 22:51.28 | traeak | sux |
| 22:51.32 | rz2k | x86 |
| 22:51.35 | traeak | need one for my parents |
| 22:51.42 | traeak | not intereted in MS tax |
| 22:52.41 | Turl | chinese tab? ms tax? |
| 22:52.44 | Turl | laughs :P |
| 22:57.38 | ZaEarl | My favorite OEM quote, "you don't need to pay for a windows license, it is a free software." |
| 22:57.50 | furan | boo |
| 23:01.22 | Turl | is it me or is the nand ultra slow? |
| 23:01.43 | Turl | I'd swear even my 2yo phone flashes stuff faster :| |
| 23:04.36 | Turl | mnemoc: still killing my kitten |
| 23:04.42 | Turl | even with that flag on |
| 23:06.03 | WarheadsSE | Interesting: compiled 3.0.36 from tag 23e5456, wifi = no more 0o |
| 23:08.01 | WarheadsSE | and.. its back |
| 23:08.16 | WarheadsSE | oy. |
| 23:10.06 | WarheadsSE | lol, needed a reboot apparently |
| 23:14.35 | ManoftheSea | Turl: killing your kitten? Are you domo-kun? |
| 23:14.55 | Turl | ManoftheSea: :P |
| 23:15.07 | ManoftheSea | I don't want to hear about it. |
| 23:15.25 | Turl | ManoftheSea: mnemoc's mem patch is domo-kun |
| 23:17.41 | Turl | mnemoc: http://paste.debian.net/179422/ |
| 23:34.00 | ZaEarl | DonkeyHotei, I give up. I can't build a working LiveSuit img. |
| 23:36.39 | ZaEarl | The walkthrough says Windows in a VM won't work. The tools require native Windows, and all I've got is a VM. |
| 23:37.26 | Turl | mnemoc: proposed counter-patch http://paste.ubuntu.com/1095822/ |
| 23:37.32 | Turl | mnemoc: worksforme :P |