| 00:48.13 | *** join/#arm-netbook Eigen (~Eigen@S0106b8c75dc9a198.vn.shawcable.net) |
| 01:21.15 | *** join/#arm-netbook Eigen (~Eigen@S0106b8c75dc9a198.vn.shawcable.net) |
| 01:44.36 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: lkcl master * r801fc6d3e4f6 /allwinner_a10/orders/jujigar.mdwn: order processing cleanup |
| 02:09.39 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Dick master * r81a2c18cc8b3 /allwinner_a10/orders/HomebrewStandard.mdwn: |
| 03:01.42 | *** join/#arm-netbook QingPei (~qingpei@114.241.188.122) |
| 05:06.06 | *** join/#arm-netbook hp_ (~kvirc@220-136-76-61.dynamic.hinet.net) |
| 05:56.15 | destinal | wow allwinner a13 available in eLQFP176 .. shame that the RAM's all still only BGA |
| 05:58.49 | destinal | http://olimex.wordpress.com/2012/04/24/cortex-a8-in-tqfp-sure-allwinner-a13/ |
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| 06:47.36 | *** join/#arm-netbook mtd (~martin@chop.xades.com) |
| 06:57.47 | specing | :O |
| 07:07.00 | mtd | hi, just found this group; I'm in HK...anyone else from around here? |
| 07:19.36 | hp_ | mtd, Taiwan, Taipei here |
| 07:39.25 | *** join/#arm-netbook Mufasa (~darkv@xdsl-9290.wroclaw.dialog.net.pl) |
| 07:57.11 | mtd | hp_: cool |
| 07:59.51 | hp_ | mtd check it out: http://i.imgur.com/Sufca.jpg |
| 08:47.53 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Matt master * r6fa506d94d2b /allwinner_a10/orders/Matt.mdwn: smd's should be soldered |
| 08:49.38 | *** join/#arm-netbook rz2k (~rz2k@ilos.rz2k.ru) |
| 09:36.25 | *** join/#arm-netbook eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@212.49.88.79) |
| 09:56.55 | mnemoc | do the colors of the PCB have meaning or it's just.... random |
| 12:05.49 | rz2k | hello |
| 12:08.04 | eebrah | hello rz2k: |
| 12:08.10 | rz2k | is this a place to ask questions about allwinner a10 devices? I recently got a tablet on a10 and trying to get cdc-ethernet device to work. I have usbnet in lsmod both standard and busybox lsmod, but usb0 interface is missing, dmesg doesnt seem to say anything about it too. |
| 12:08.14 | rz2k | any suggestions? |
| 12:31.27 | rz2k | probably I need missing modules, if anyone here have working a10 building setup, may I have cdc-ether/usbgadget kernel modules for 3.0.8 ? if 3.0.8 sources is avialable, of course. |
| 12:43.28 | specing | They are unavailable |
| 12:43.34 | specing | latest are .36 |
| 12:44.02 | specing | the chinese are violating the GPL |
| 12:44.15 | rz2k | damn, thats bad, but how I remember, theres a way to change module magic and load up module from any kernel. |
| 12:46.40 | specing | Don't do that |
| 12:47.03 | specing | especially not if the module is from a 2.* kernel |
| 12:47.15 | specing | they removed a ton of stuff on the break to 3.* |
| 12:50.42 | rz2k | yeah, but 3.0.28 is close to 3.0.8, I had same situation when I had a Rena3 tablet with renesas processor, only sources that was available were NDA'd like hell and outdated. |
| 12:57.47 | specing | Meh |
| 12:58.07 | specing | the vibra motor on my tab is placed directly on the lines leading to the LCD panel... |
| 13:01.45 | rz2k | lol, you dont know how my Rena3 died. I was looking for uart & jtag, found it, desoldered everything and assembled tablet back, in two days my lcd was cracked from *inside* |
| 13:01.52 | rz2k | by a wire that was too long |
| 13:04.20 | specing | ? |
| 13:06.03 | specing | you missplaced a wire inside? |
| 13:06.48 | rz2k | nope, I did everything like it was before, chinese guys just did antenna coax cable for wifi too long |
| 13:07.00 | rz2k | and lcd crack was just a matter of time |
| 13:07.57 | *** join/#arm-netbook eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@212.49.88.76) |
| 13:08.24 | specing | My LCD has a metal casing... |
| 13:10.19 | specing | I think Im going to desolder the vibra motor |
| 13:10.27 | specing | Does it even have a use case? |
| 13:10.59 | rz2k | games maybe? |
| 13:11.27 | *** join/#arm-netbook MaDMaLKaV (~IceChat9@188.86.253.69) |
| 13:14.11 | specing | ... |
| 13:14.21 | specing | Desoldering it is |
| 13:16.07 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: jan master * r1baa4c5f5895 /allwinner_a10/orders/janp1964.mdwn: |
| 13:17.54 | specing | you know it is RoHS when the fucking solder doesen't want to come off |
| 13:18.23 | MaDMaLKaV | cool, got ttl adapter, what screws must I remove for opening? everyone? |
| 13:19.52 | MaDMaLKaV | forget it, done |
| 13:26.15 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Bee master * r48f79661e97b /allwinner_a10/orders/BTHAPF270412.mdwn: |
| 13:36.41 | *** join/#arm-netbook eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@212.49.88.77) |
| 13:53.52 | specing | damn, the battery is superglued to the panel |
| 13:53.59 | specing | silly chinese ;9 |
| 14:04.12 | specing | Dammit, no serial port header on the other side of the board |
| 14:04.25 | specing | another chip though |
| 14:04.36 | specing | SAMSUNG 143 |
| 14:05.00 | specing | K9GBG08U0A |
| 14:05.03 | specing | SCB0 |
| 14:05.23 | specing | probably flash |
| 14:08.53 | specing | http://www.ubmtechinsights.com/reports-and-subscriptions/investigative-analysis/samsung-20-nm-nand-flash/ |
| 14:08.57 | specing | 32 Gb flash |
| 14:09.05 | specing | = 4 GB? |
| 14:09.17 | specing | I think android reports 2GB to me... |
| 14:11.18 | specing | Haha, the "FEL" button is marked "UBOOT" |
| 14:20.17 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Mickael master * rb8239f7bbed5 /allwinner_a10/orders/MisterBell.mdwn: |
| 14:24.12 | hp_ | tomorros i have to buy my an sd card to boot A10 :) |
| 14:25.32 | specing | hp_: board? |
| 14:26.34 | hp_ | specing: melee A2000 |
| 14:26.47 | hp_ | http://i.imgur.com/Sufca.jpg |
| 14:27.59 | specing | Well I have some unnamed chinese tablet that doesen't seem to have a serial port anywhere ;( |
| 14:28.33 | specing | So until someone make a definetely works(tm) solution with graphics included... |
| 14:38.42 | mnemoc | aaaaarg.... is it too hard to hit [reply] instead of composing new mails each time??! ... I hate when people breaks the threads apart |
| 14:39.01 | hp_ | mnemoc: ?? |
| 14:39.34 | mnemoc | moo cow on the ML |
| 14:47.08 | mnemoc | specing: on those tablets you are supposed to get the serial out of the uSD pins |
| 14:47.30 | traeak | a2000 doesn't look that much different |
| 14:48.07 | traeak | vga daughterboard looks ugly |
| 14:48.24 | mnemoc | and the uart connector is horizontal :p |
| 14:48.38 | traeak | yeah see that too |
| 14:48.59 | traeak | any way to snake out twires to the uart on the a1000? |
| 14:49.05 | traeak | i'd really hate to cut holes |
| 14:49.18 | specing | https://93.103.140.50/A10-MID/hardware/back.jpg |
| 14:49.25 | specing | this is how the back looks like |
| 14:49.49 | specing | My usual camera is dead so I had to resort to using the crappy one |
| 14:50.05 | mnemoc | traeak: the ventilation holes on the bottom? |
| 14:51.22 | mnemoc | or umounting the VGA connector and leaving it hanging outside |
| 14:52.03 | mnemoc | specing: is that the ram? |
| 14:52.26 | mnemoc | or flash? |
| 14:52.28 | traeak | hmm....drilling out the air holes would work |
| 14:52.33 | traeak | just need a drill |
| 14:52.38 | specing | mnemoc: flash |
| 14:52.41 | specing | 32Gb |
| 14:52.52 | mnemoc | specing: you got one stolen... |
| 14:52.59 | specing | wut? |
| 14:53.16 | mnemoc | there is place for two chips |
| 14:53.19 | specing | Ah |
| 14:57.30 | hp_ | specing: that picture really loads slow hehe |
| 15:02.22 | specing | torrents ;) |
| 15:02.32 | specing | I should write a QoS but Im lazy |
| 15:02.53 | mnemoc | specing: or use an image sharing service like imgur.com |
| 15:03.07 | mnemoc | no need to register |
| 15:06.06 | hp_ | my a2000 has nearly nothing on the back of the board |
| 15:07.17 | mnemoc | hp_: just like this: http://i.imgur.com/ti5Z2.jpg ? |
| 15:08.10 | hp_ | yes looks similar |
| 15:12.06 | specing | mnemoc: I used to use that, but I cannot guarrante image persistance |
| 15:12.38 | specing | I had to desolder a bunch of stuff to get to the back side |
| 15:12.53 | MaDMaLKaV | the sdcard image also needs to be connected with the serial port ? |
| 15:14.07 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: what do you mean? |
| 15:17.18 | specing | There is a 6-pin unlabeled connector |
| 15:17.23 | specing | unpopulated |
| 15:21.49 | *** join/#arm-netbook eebrah (~Ibrahim_K@212.49.88.71) |
| 15:24.21 | MaDMaLKaV | do I need to connect to the internal serial port to correctly boot the sdcard image that tom uploaded ? |
| 15:25.55 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: nope |
| 15:37.27 | specing | Does the A10 support booting from USB? |
| 15:39.38 | mnemoc | not that I know.... but hno plans to extend his uboot branch to support it there |
| 15:40.17 | specing | Ah cool |
| 15:41.39 | A0Sheds | I seem to recall the A10 had a USB boot mode, where's the link to the boot order mods? |
| 15:43.27 | A0Sheds | http://rhombus-tech.net./allwinner_a10/a10_boot_process/ just reading this over closely for the first time |
| 15:44.09 | A0Sheds | did he post the specs to BROM anywhere? |
| 15:45.00 | A0Sheds | BROM is mask ROM (or equiv) in the A10, this jumps to Boot0 |
| 15:45.21 | A0Sheds | are there Boot0 specs anywhere? |
| 15:46.19 | A0Sheds | BROM checks Boot0 header and gets the hardware config (for what hardware exactly it doesn't say) |
| 15:46.56 | A0Sheds | this makes x86 init look simple :9 |
| 15:48.33 | specing | Maybe I could get UART TX from the speaker... |
| 15:48.44 | specing | there is a spare speaker connection that is not occupied |
| 15:48.49 | A0Sheds | I wonder of we were to propose an open standard hardware boot init for ARM it would just get ignored |
| 15:50.45 | specing | yes |
| 15:50.49 | specing | because embedded |
| 15:51.36 | mnemoc | wild wild embedded world |
| 15:51.44 | specing | I have an ARM9 devkit here which has a similar boot procedure |
| 15:52.18 | specing | first it looks for a SPI dataflash, then falls back to USB |
| 15:53.20 | mnemoc | specing: it's boot0 understand usb-storage?? |
| 15:54.18 | specing | nope |
| 16:13.13 | A0Sheds | one of the few things i actually liked about omap is the pin straps for boot order |
| 16:13.57 | A0Sheds | hunt, only one port possible, hunt here first then in this order, thats kind of handy |
| 16:14.42 | A0Sheds | this order only , sd, usb, mmc2 etc, lots of flexibility |
| 16:17.18 | *** join/#arm-netbook lkcl_ (~lkcl@host86-131-181-225.range86-131.btcentralplus.com) |
| 16:35.44 | specing | Lol, the tablet still works |
| 16:35.58 | specing | even though I desoldered lots of stuff and soldered it back |
| 16:36.07 | specing | and touched everything with my fingers |
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| 16:36.39 | *** join/#arm-netbook A0Sheds (~ly@unaffiliated/l84supper) |
| 16:37.05 | mnemoc | they do build them by hand |
| 16:37.42 | mnemoc | well.... tiny chinese hands |
| 16:37.48 | specing | they used way too many screews on mine |
| 16:38.03 | specing | Anyway, there is nothing usable on the other side |
| 16:42.34 | specing | Hmm |
| 16:42.40 | specing | the A10's RTC sucks |
| 16:46.28 | destinal | specing: how so? |
| 16:48.20 | mnemoc | it probably doesn't like that you disconnect the battery |
| 16:48.36 | traeak | there's no battery on board |
| 16:51.56 | specing | mnemoc, traeak That is understandable |
| 16:52.22 | specing | but if the battery gets drained below safe running charge, the rtc resets itself too |
| 16:52.51 | specing | I'd expect they wired up a cap to the rtc bypass input(if such thing even exists there) |
| 16:53.35 | specing | so the drain on the battery would kill android but the battery would still have enaugh "dead charge" to support the RTC |
| 16:58.00 | *** join/#arm-netbook traeak (~bolsen@75-151-91-165-Colorado.hfc.comcastbusiness.net) |
| 17:59.56 | *** part/#arm-netbook QingPei (~qingpei@114.241.188.122) |
| 18:21.18 | A0Sheds | no battery for which A10 device? |
| 18:21.52 | A0Sheds | too cheap to add a cap, diode and resistor? |
| 18:22.26 | traeak | hmm... |
| 18:22.38 | specing | I guess... |
| 18:22.42 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Craig master * r2dd2fd29b87b /allwinner_a10/orders/CRAIGWHITCOMBE.mdwn: |
| 18:34.44 | *** join/#arm-netbook uwe__ (~uwe_@dslb-088-064-053-066.pools.arcor-ip.net) |
| 18:44.13 | MaDMaLKaV | http://www.linaro.org/linaro-blog/2012/04/26/linaro-12-04-released/ |
| 18:50.02 | MaDMaLKaV | didn't saw that yesterday, that one should have a mali hf module |
| 18:52.41 | mnemoc | sure it's not oneric-based? |
| 18:53.27 | mnemoc | "These new images are built for the ARM hard float (armhf) images and Linaro U-Boot is now based on the latest upstream release – v2012.04.1" |
| 18:53.35 | mnemoc | \o/ |
| 18:53.48 | *** join/#arm-netbook j1nx (02305242@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.48.82.66) |
| 18:53.57 | MaDMaLKaV | hey, I'm not that 1337, but I still now how to read :) |
| 18:54.08 | mnemoc | :p |
| 18:55.08 | mnemoc | I had seen their snapshot images based on precise... but I never expected them to be ready for an LTS release this fast |
| 18:55.44 | MaDMaLKaV | it was Snowball the platform that used a mali gpu right? |
| 18:56.01 | mnemoc | i think so, yes |
| 18:57.00 | MaDMaLKaV | apart of the module, we also need to "sync" the code on our repositories with the open source part of the driver in their kernel release right? |
| 18:57.05 | mnemoc | uhm... linux 3.2 |
| 18:57.13 | MaDMaLKaV | probably I explained myself poorly, but I'm tired |
| 18:57.17 | mnemoc | I expected 3.3 |
| 18:57.20 | MaDMaLKaV | and english is more difficult for me when tired |
| 18:57.39 | mnemoc | you need to match as much as possible with their release |
| 18:57.46 | mnemoc | same ABI and same APIs |
| 19:00.17 | j1nx | hey there! how is it going with the developing. Haven't done shit over here, so ..... |
| 19:01.13 | mnemoc | j1nx: development of what exactly you ask? |
| 19:01.32 | j1nx | any? |
| 19:02.02 | mnemoc | there are several topics here, you need to narrow the question |
| 19:03.05 | MaDMaLKaV | yeah, the files are on the snowball release |
| 19:03.06 | MaDMaLKaV | cool |
| 19:03.07 | j1nx | kernel development: I saw a ubuntu image flying on the internet. Which kernel does it use? |
| 19:03.39 | MaDMaLKaV | mali400_2.1-10_armhf.deb and mali400-dev_2.1-10_armhf.deb |
| 19:03.39 | mnemoc | j1nx: gpl-violating 3.0.8 |
| 19:03.47 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: excelent |
| 19:03.48 | traeak | nice |
| 19:04.12 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: now we need the cedarX for armhf |
| 19:04.33 | j1nx | https://wiki.linaro.org/Resources/HowTo/SamsungOrigenMali |
| 19:04.42 | MaDMaLKaV | gonna start the linux VM, extract them from those fuckin' deb files and upload somewhere |
| 19:06.37 | MaDMaLKaV | j1nx, that link is for android releases |
| 19:06.47 | MaDMaLKaV | android doesn't use libc so it wasn't useful for us |
| 19:06.55 | traeak | bionic |
| 19:07.01 | MaDMaLKaV | now they released linaro linux compiled for hf |
| 19:07.02 | traeak | which i would prefer anyways |
| 19:07.10 | MaDMaLKaV | so now we have the correcto files for video aceleration |
| 19:07.33 | j1nx | you talk about the snowball - ericson files right? |
| 19:07.34 | mnemoc | mali is not for video aceleration, it's for 3D |
| 19:07.41 | mnemoc | cedarX is for video |
| 19:08.06 | MaDMaLKaV | right, 3d acceleration, sorry |
| 19:08.25 | MaDMaLKaV | I'm tired, and my gf just connected to guild wars 2 beta and she can't stop telling me stuff in the background |
| 19:08.33 | mnemoc | well... does 2d too... but without the cedarx driver forget about decoding a video |
| 19:08.42 | mnemoc | even gf |
| 19:08.45 | mnemoc | evil |
| 19:09.22 | j1nx | I would kill to see any woman at the moment ;) |
| 19:09.50 | MaDMaLKaV | shit, my linux vm doesn't want to start |
| 19:09.58 | j1nx | and I will shoot 10 people for a beer |
| 19:10.00 | MaDMaLKaV | mnemoc , you want me to dcc you the deb files? |
| 19:10.45 | mnemoc | nah, not that horny.... I want for fix fbcon first |
| 19:10.47 | MaDMaLKaV | ok |
| 19:10.58 | MaDMaLKaV | should I write to the mailing list about this? |
| 19:11.20 | mnemoc | after that I'll switch to producing a 3.2 .deb to inject in a linaro release |
| 19:11.28 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: sure |
| 19:11.55 | specing | There are mali hardfloat drivers?! |
| 19:12.29 | MaDMaLKaV | yes |
| 19:12.30 | mnemoc | specing: yes, in the latest linaro release |
| 19:15.38 | mnemoc | now everyone to pressure allwinner for a cedarx driver in armhf :) |
| 19:16.06 | j1nx | talk to Tom |
| 19:16.14 | MaDMaLKaV | heh. they can at least tell us what fuckin' license the cedarx code have |
| 19:16.16 | specing | cedarx is for movie playback and such? |
| 19:16.40 | MaDMaLKaV | video decoding and encoding, yeah |
| 19:17.06 | j1nx | but what about the video decode sources on github |
| 19:17.52 | mnemoc | j1nx: that sample client code and a soft-float binary-only library in .a |
| 19:17.55 | MaDMaLKaV | A) we don't know the license. B) is not the complete decoding engine, just an interface to it , so we need a hf binary |
| 19:18.23 | j1nx | oh ok! |
| 19:18.57 | mnemoc | I published there so maybe someone decides to reverse engineer it :p |
| 19:19.38 | j1nx | then indeed it is faster to keep poking Allwinner |
| 19:19.57 | MaDMaLKaV | by the way, and totally offtopic, with the avilable ram on the a1000 , I still think that something e17 based will be a better idea than ubuntu |
| 19:20.28 | j1nx | busybox! |
| 19:21.14 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Alejandro master * rb25db1ca4a47 /allwinner_a10/orders/Alexis.mdwn: |
| 19:21.14 | mnemoc | MaDMaLKaV: because of linaro, it's better to stick with ubuntu unless you love troubles... but you can probably use the e17 daily ppa |
| 19:21.58 | j1nx | how much ram does that ericson board has? |
| 19:22.37 | MaDMaLKaV | no idea, that thinng cost like 300 eur, so I didn't stop to look at specs |
| 19:23.08 | j1nx | lol |
| 19:23.17 | mnemoc | save your coins for cortex-a15 kits ;-) |
| 19:23.53 | MaDMaLKaV | not really. I mean, the fun thing is take this $70 stuff and make it work to their max. expensive stuff isn't that fun |
| 19:24.28 | ManoftheSea | what a15 kits? |
| 19:24.48 | j1nx | you have to get into a delorean for that |
| 19:24.50 | specing | quad core arm |
| 19:25.07 | traeak | there's somethign about doing a lot with little |
| 19:25.20 | traeak | a15 are 64bit right? |
| 19:25.45 | ManoftheSea | I also want a quad core arm with 4 gigs memory, and can fit it in a laptop or tablet |
| 19:26.23 | j1nx | A laptop does not fit in my pocket |
| 19:26.30 | traeak | or in your brain :-p |
| 19:26.36 | ManoftheSea | hmm... |
| 19:28.11 | ManoftheSea | I'm not ready to put a processor in my brain yet. |
| 19:28.15 | ManoftheSea | not yet. |
| 19:28.23 | specing | I am |
| 19:29.53 | ManoftheSea | um, what software would you be using, in your wetware? |
| 19:30.30 | specing | BrainOS 1.0 |
| 19:30.49 | ManoftheSea | well, if it's a one point oh release |
| 19:32.21 | traeak | deep space nine outlines whyyou don't hook your brain into a computer network |
| 19:32.45 | ManoftheSea | oh? I remember a Next Generation where Barclay does so. |
| 19:33.04 | specing | me too |
| 19:33.11 | specing | he became super smart |
| 19:33.42 | traeak | deep waste nine a copule of episodes had folks with neural implants |
| 19:33.54 | traeak | usedthem for crime and mention about getting reverse hacked |
| 19:35.52 | ManoftheSea | hmm, wasn't there a Twilight Zone where nearly everyone had implants? |
| 19:36.04 | ManoftheSea | and the one person who couldn't saved the day? |
| 19:38.36 | ManoftheSea | also, my skull isn't fitted with an EOMA slot |
| 19:47.08 | hno | I don't think EOMA is elecrically compatible with wetware. |
| 19:47.44 | specing | haha |
| 19:47.48 | ManoftheSea | the cerebrengineering mobo |
| 19:48.15 | mnemoc | eoma50 :) |
| 19:48.25 | ManoftheSea | 50? |
| 19:48.33 | mnemoc | CF-like |
| 19:48.37 | hno | Regarding booting, A10 have a "FEL" USB boot mode. But the exact details on the protocol used is still unclear. |
| 19:48.51 | MaDMaLKaV | hno, you read about the mali HF right? |
| 19:49.53 | hno | And the boot0 step is very simple. BROM simply loads up to 20 something KB or code into SRAM from sd/nand/nor/spi and jumps to it. The loaded code then configures hardware as needed. |
| 19:49.55 | MaDMaLKaV | and back to neural implants, Neuromancer and Monalisa Overdrive have heavy use of the topic and are really good books |
| 19:50.05 | hno | have read both. |
| 19:50.06 | MaDMaLKaV | Hyperion also use it in some parts, less heavily but also interesting |
| 19:50.07 | mnemoc | hno: steev said he will try to reverse engineering the FEL protocol after finishing some $work$ |
| 19:50.22 | hno | Have reversed some of it. |
| 19:50.48 | hno | the basic format is simple, but lots of unknown details in the exchanged messages. |
| 19:51.19 | hno | but should not take too long. BROM is very small. |
| 19:51.53 | hno | The FEL part seems to be in the range of 4KB including USB support. |
| 19:52.28 | mnemoc | can't be too complex then |
| 19:53.34 | vgrade | guys, check the license on those mali bits |
| 19:54.03 | mnemoc | summary? |
| 19:54.05 | vgrade | they are licensed only for use on the snowball hardware |
| 19:55.27 | specing | LOL |
| 19:55.38 | specing | fuck that license |
| 19:55.45 | *** join/#arm-netbook Eigen (~Eigen@S0106b8c75dc9a198.vn.shawcable.net) |
| 19:55.46 | specing | they are violating gpl too |
| 19:56.59 | hno | specing, are they? |
| 19:57.29 | specing | well linking a non-gpl module with the kernel is actually a violation |
| 19:57.31 | vgrade | not at all your allowed binary userpace blobs |
| 19:57.57 | mnemoc | the kernel code is all gpl |
| 19:58.30 | mnemoc | but onlt the library knows to use the mmap'ed stuff |
| 19:58.39 | mnemoc | which is perfectly legal |
| 19:58.49 | hno | What did Allwinner include in the Ubuntu image they sent the other day? |
| 19:59.17 | mnemoc | that's Tom's personal project, not allwinner's |
| 19:59.24 | destinal | mnemoc: I think it's undefined. FSF claims that close integration such as mmap makes the two part of the same program. |
| 19:59.37 | specing | the mali kernel driver is gpl? |
| 19:59.42 | specing | the module? |
| 19:59.48 | vgrade | yes |
| 19:59.53 | hno | mnemoc, yes, such design is perfectly legal, and impossible to upstream for other reasons. |
| 20:00.12 | mnemoc | FSF claims selling books about free software is evil... |
| 20:00.13 | vgrade | and the xserver, and dri libs |
| 20:00.22 | hno | destinal, the mmap is just a pipe to the GPU, not the kernel driver. |
| 20:00.25 | vgrade | just not the egl and gles libs |
| 20:00.29 | destinal | hno: ahh |
| 20:01.25 | destinal | mnemoc: heh, what if you sell the book but also GPL the text and release the TeX source code? :) |
| 20:01.35 | hno | mnemoc, do they? So they are illegal themselves? |
| 20:02.02 | ManoftheSea | selling books is illegal? |
| 20:02.04 | mnemoc | hno: stallman has attacked O'Reilly quite a few times |
| 20:02.04 | hno | have never heard FSF saying selling is illegal. |
| 20:02.42 | mnemoc | I said evil, not illegal |
| 20:02.50 | ManoftheSea | er, yeah. Why? |
| 20:02.58 | hno | ah, right. Immoral. |
| 20:03.09 | mnemoc | because he "profits" |
| 20:03.29 | hno | No, because the books are not licensed with a free license. |
| 20:03.37 | ManoftheSea | uh? I didn't think profit was ever a concern |
| 20:04.05 | mnemoc | hno: right |
| 20:04.18 | MaDMaLKaV | easy, we distribute it without the binaries. people will copy/paste them and solved :9 |
| 20:04.21 | MaDMaLKaV | gonna dinner, bbl |
| 20:04.25 | mnemoc | is not fond to fundamentalism anyway |
| 20:04.49 | hno | tries to get license right most of the time. |
| 20:06.23 | mnemoc | http://linuxdevcenter.com/pub/a/linux/2001/08/15/free_software.html |
| 20:06.43 | mnemoc | stallman on Tim O'Reilly's definition of freedom |
| 20:07.21 | vgrade | http://releases.linaro.org/licenses/license.php |
| 20:07.30 | vgrade | only for snowball hardware |
| 20:12.03 | steev_ | mnemoc: hno: yes i want to, it's all a matter of getting time, apparently we got 2 more contracts yesterday so, not sure |
| 20:13.24 | steev_ | that said, it's fiesta for the next week in San Antonio and our building we work in is closed tomorrow (though we're having a party at the CEOs house around 4:45PM) so I might get *some* time this weekend |
| 20:14.29 | mnemoc | steev_: please coordinate with hno as he has already parts of it cracked |
| 20:20.45 | steev_ | that's what is on the wiki right? |
| 20:21.15 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Vyacheslav master * r71798bca2ca4 /allwinner_a10/orders/adeep.mdwn: |
| 20:23.45 | CIA-158 | rhombus-tech: Vyacheslav master * rdfa1a5c2825f /allwinner_a10/orders/adeep.mdwn: |
| 20:29.57 | MaDMaLKaV | vgrade , that link doesn't open ok on my pc borwser, nor my cellular browser |
| 20:29.58 | MaDMaLKaV | :? |
| 20:30.57 | MaDMaLKaV | I want to read it before start trolling arm facebook page |
| 20:30.58 | MaDMaLKaV | XD |
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| 20:35.27 | specing | MaDMaLKaV: loads fine for me |
| 20:36.32 | MaDMaLKaV | weird |
| 20:36.34 | MaDMaLKaV | Linaro's key value is in working on generic ARM technology that is common to all ARM SoC vendors. In this way engineering costs are shared, rather than each vendor having to implement core software technology themselves |
| 20:36.36 | MaDMaLKaV | HAH |
| 20:42.35 | MaDMaLKaV | fuck all this licensing shit |
| 20:42.47 | MaDMaLKaV | later |
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| 20:52.02 | specing | Damn, my phone is *very* messed up |
| 20:52.11 | specing | Bus 002 Device 071: ID 18d1:d00d Google Inc. |
| 20:52.13 | specing | Couldn't open device, some information will be missing |
| 20:52.37 | specing | Couldn't get configuration descriptor 0, some information will be missing |
| 21:14.55 | hno | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y1WDrhL-vUI |
| 21:17.24 | hno | Or actually http://www.cnx-software.com/2012/02/25/binary_blobs_attack-elc-2012/ for the full thing |
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| 21:33.32 | mnemoc | hopefully ARM will wake up |
| 21:35.10 | traeak | why should they? arm is prettymuch kicking everyone around in the embedded market |
| 21:35.24 | traeak | what we're doing is pretty much fringe stuff |
| 21:35.54 | Gumboot | Well don't load that page with confirmation for cookies turned on. |
| 21:37.20 | mnemoc | traeak: because their is no reason to keep the driver closed at all... they are already licensing it to the SoC makers |
| 21:37.44 | mnemoc | traeak: they don't earn anything from keeping the driver closed at all |
| 21:38.16 | mnemoc | meh, ugly symmetry on those lines :< |
| 21:38.27 | traeak | mnemoc: but you are talking sensible things. these are business people runing the show |
| 21:38.33 | traeak | what they see is that arm is wildly successful |
| 21:38.35 | Gumboot | Surely there's no reason to repeat the reasons for keeping closed-source drivers _again_, is there? |
| 21:39.43 | traeak | any and all processors used in the fastest growing market in electronics all are running arm |
| 21:39.44 | traeak | ie: big profits, and they can mostly coast and still pull in big money |
| 21:39.44 | traeak | Gumboot: i'm taking the big picture view, not the "in the trenches" technology view |
| 21:40.48 | Gumboot | You'd have to fix an awful lot of the world before you can start bothering about 'big picture'. |
| 21:41.02 | hno | traeak, not all.. MIPS is still going strong. |
| 21:41.36 | Gumboot | You can only dismiss the "in the trenches" view once you've got rid of the trenches, which pretty much means ending the war. |
| 21:46.19 | A0Sheds | maybe a nice plague or pestilence to shake things up again, it worked 100 years ago and also in the 1300's |
| 21:48.09 | Gumboot | Some kind of virus which is only harmful to patent lawyers? |
| 21:48.34 | hno | the patent system does a good job of harming itself already. |
| 21:48.55 | hno | but notthe lawyers unfortunately, they only get richer in the process. |
| 21:51.46 | traeak | hno: nt in smartphones...IMHO mips is a superior instruction set, etc |
| 21:52.30 | mnemoc | looks at his "see mips run linux" on the shelf |
| 21:52.57 | mnemoc | tries to remember where his Gdium laptop is |
| 21:53.44 | traeak | SGI comes to mind... |
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| 22:37.03 | traeak | hno: lawyers get rich off conflict, and the more escalated the conflict the more $$ they get. pretty sad, very sad |
| 22:37.41 | Gumboot | Just like arms dealers. |
| 22:38.25 | traeak | arms dealers are really small players...it's usually more correct ot blame government for being corrupt. that's what government does best, being corrupt |
| 22:39.20 | traeak | the way you should know that....almost every elected official everywhere is probably a lawyer |
| 23:12.59 | mnemoc | lawyers are usually very good at talking and very good at lying. both important qualities to be elected |
| 23:30.33 | A0Sheds | Gumboot, or only attacks the selfish, greed and control center of the brain |
